January 6, 2025 • 52 mins
Rosaena is always dressed to the nines with her hair curled and her signature pink lipstick on. Aging hasn’t changed her desire to look beautiful. I want her to feel her best, but she’s almost 90. Doesn’t she deserve a break from putting on eyeliner to go to the grocery store?! This is one of the questions I decided to finally ask her point blank when she came with me to the recording studio.
My abuela has lived with my family part of the year since she was in her 50s so we’ve always been close. But, this interview was an opportunity to talk about topics we don’t touch on every day - like where her beliefs about womanhood come from or her views on aging and death. We’ll also hear her life story and the many twists of fate it entails. My mom Claudia returns to the show too to help translate and to reflect with me about her mother’s life. You’re in for a silly, heartfelt, sweet, and surprising intergenerational episode!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
The wustaria ramos como familia or familiar city alien mazarandi.
What would you like us as your family to know
or families that have an elder to know?
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Comosa. I said that.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
That they treat them with all the love in their hearts. Yes,
we may be old, but we feel and not that
just because we are at this age in life, we
don't have feelings.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Welcome to when You're Invisible. My name is Maria Fernanda. Yes,
but I know not everyone can roll there are, so
it's fine to call me Maria. When You're Invisible is
mind love letter to the working class and others who
are seemingly invisible in our society. I hope to build
a community here that will inspire you to have generous
(01:01):
conversations with others that are different from you, conversations that
might help you see life in an entirely different way.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Hi, I'm Claudia Boso de Diez. I am Maria's mother.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
You might remember my mom from our first season of
When You're Invisible. She came on with my dad to
talk about their immigration journey and their thoughts on Latini.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Dads and hello to everybody again today.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
Though she's actually not here to be interviewed. She's here
to help translate for her mom, Ma Avuela. She only
speaks Spanish, but I really wanted all our listeners to
be able to hear her story.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
So you Rosena my Coats.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
So I am Rosina my Coat. I am eighty eight
years old, and I am the grandmother of these girl.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
You're getting three generations of women today. So it's definitely
going to be intimate and silly and heartfelt, and I'm
so excited to share it with you. My mom is
going to do some direct translation, and at other times
she'll summarize what mya boy lies saying. Will also reflect
together and Rosa Aina's experiences and how her beliefs about
(02:21):
the world have impacted our own. How do you feel
about translating for your mom?
Speaker 3 (02:27):
It will be interesting And I don't know how accurate
times and hs and things like that are coming out
on her interview, because as we all know, as we
get old remembering, things could be a little bit different
or change. But the most important thing for me is
(02:49):
that you heard her voice and her own story as
it is in her own mind.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Right now, me and my grandmother have a great relationship
We're very different from each other, but we've always been close.
One of the things that I think bonds us is
our playfulness. We are both always willing to laugh, and
I grew up alongside her. She lived with my family
for three to six months every year, and you'll hear
(03:17):
how close we are in our conversation. We may not
translate every time she calls me mirrena.
Speaker 3 (03:25):
H.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
The list goes on. She's always using terms of endearment
to talk to me, and these phrases mean my queen, divinity, beauty, basically,
all the beautiful things that you would say to someone
you love, we say in Spanish. I always feel her
love that way. But as close and loving of a
(03:45):
relationship as we have, there are many things we haven't
talked about before. Sometimes she can seem like this silly,
sweet old woman, and maybe her full humanity goes and
see there's more to unpack. I assume a lot of
grandmother granddaughter relationships are like this. Your grandmother probably isn't
(04:06):
the first person you can finde in about dating or sex,
or how you should dress or wear your makeup. If
she is, that's awesome. My grandmother, however, does have very
traditional ideas and sometimes that's been a source of conflict
between us. But I wanted to use this interview as
a chance to push our relationship, to ask her questions
(04:28):
I've never asked before. So let's get into this intergenerational
episode camera. What memory do you have of me?
Speaker 3 (04:39):
Of you? Uh? Huh, any man?
Speaker 1 (04:44):
But which ones stand out?
Speaker 3 (04:46):
I think she's remembering if you experienced with you like
the corner apartment of Cornell. Yeah, they had here right
next to it, and you coming down the tricycles, your
hair blow back by the way, yes allah, Or when
(05:13):
we took you to the fair and you made her
ride all the rides see, or even when several times
during the summer will take you to Cornell ice cream
and how meticulous you were eating your cone, comparably with
your brother that will have stains of chocolate all over
(05:34):
his face.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
I love the fact that some of her fondest memory
is involved dessert. No matter her age, or her health
or what's happening in life, her sweet teeth always helps
her find a bright spot. Rosana Francisco and me, we
were like the three Musketeers growing up. A short Mexican
woman with no English and her two tiny grandchildren. We'd
(05:57):
go exploring with her when my parents were working, whether
it would be to the library or sledding, or she'd
also go on bigger adventures like road trips with the
whole family, whether we were living in student housing in
waterfall filled Ehica, New York, or in an apartment or
a duplex, or later a house in freezing but beautiful Minnesota,
(06:18):
or in rural Georgia with its breath taking sunsets through
it all. Maya Buela has been a long for the ride.
Having her stay with us has been for as long
as I can remember. I believe my grandmother was in
her fifties when that started, right, Mom.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
Yes, she was fifty six when she came towards the
first time.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
Not all the apartments we lived in had two rooms
for me and my brother, so sometimes my grandmother would
stay in the living room or the basement, or when
we did have to either she'd have one of our
rooms or she'd share with me.
Speaker 3 (06:54):
That before I was in a little house that belonged
to my brother, and when I went to Rekaia the
four of my kids, Mom, what do you want to
do in the house you have? You will have to
pay rent, electricity, water, telephone, everything, all the services. With
(07:15):
those you can spend a season with each of us
and that's it. You won't have to worry. And that's
how it's started. So I knew all of your grandchildren as.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Newborns presents.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
And did you want to do that or no?
Speaker 3 (07:34):
Yeah? Actor, well, I mean yes, I agree because it
was a realistic and a good agreement. You understand me.
But I would have wanted to have my small.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
House nor those cases aficat right now.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
It was the right decision, but of course it was
a big adjustment, especially because she'd be going between three
different cities in a year, not to mention two different countries.
When do you feel invisible.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
When everyone here is s tucking in English?
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Mayauila never really learned English. There were times when we
would encourage it or try to teach her. Mostly though
my family would communicate in Spanish, but of course sometimes
we'd host people who spoke English. And now my brother
is Maryton, American who only speaks English. On these occasions
I try to translate, but she feels bad that we
(08:34):
even have to. When do you feel most visible.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
On birthdays in Mexico and Pristmas New Year's Eves. Really
everyone's birthdays here too, but only when they speak to me.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Fast for Maya Boila Spanish is her comfort zone. This
is where she feels seen. It's a little weird to
hear that she feels most visible when she's not at
my family home, but that's her truth. Personally, I've been
in situations where I'm communicating across a language barrier, and
(09:12):
I do think it's possible to have real moments of
connection even if you don't share a language. But visibility
is complex, and sometimes it truly is in the eye
of the beholder or the beheld. After the break, we're
going to dive deeper into Roseana's belief system, including ideas
(09:33):
we may not agree on.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
Will be right back, Welcome back.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
To when You're invisible. When I think about Rosayana, there
are two more obvious sides to her. There's the one
side of my boy lad that is joyful and silly
and love sell librating, and then there's another side, the
one that's very conforming, risk adverse, and more judgmental. One
(10:08):
way I see this side come out is how she
views appearance, no matter where my aila is, how many
people she knows or what she's going through. She always
looks beyond put together. It's different than our standard in
the US. People think my grandmother is dressed for a
wedding or a formal event. That's the Mexican standard we're
(10:31):
talking about here. My grandma always needs to be made
up before anyone comes over to visit or she leaves
the house, even if it's just to the grocery store.
She curls her short hair and dons one of her
signature lip colors, pink or orange. We don't see Eida
eye on these things. If it were up to my Aboila,
(10:53):
I would be in a dress with heels and makeup
every day and spoiler.
Speaker 4 (10:59):
Alone, listeners, that's not me.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Some of the greatest pressure from her I faced growing
up was to look nice, meaning ladylike and hyper feminine.
It's something that I've really had to figure out, and
it's one of the reasons I'm grateful to have two
cultures and be a part of a younger generation because
it's created space to question what I want for myself,
(11:26):
space that I'm not sure Mayaboila ever had, and that's
something I wanted to make room for in our conversation Sempres,
You've always been like this, always put together, you know,
made up. You've always painted your lips, your eyes, have
your hair done, the works, made up, same flaty coming.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Yes. Around sixteen lighteen, I went to work when I
had to go very well groove together.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
But even now, for example, with age, that hasn't changed.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
I know, am I going to go without makeup? Well?
Speaker 1 (12:09):
There are people who stop as they get older.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
I would die without looking put together.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
I'm just curious. Do you feel confident in your own skin?
Speaker 3 (12:20):
Well?
Speaker 1 (12:21):
To me, it's interesting because for me, you should be
able to not wear it and feel good.
Speaker 3 (12:26):
But I like it in this way.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
It's so interesting to hear this concept that Mauilla says that, yeah,
I'm confident in my own skin, but I would never
go outside without makeup. I worked really hard to unpack
and understand why I dress and look the way I do.
Over the years, I found that I need the freedom
to express who I am, however I am in any
given day or moment in my life, and I've had
(12:50):
to break out of these rigid expectations of womanhood and
femininity in more ways than one. What are the differences
you noticed between your generation and mine.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
Or a hemp your quest answer? Okay.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
Through all this laughter, my Auila is basically saying that
she would never established relations aka have sex. That's what
she's hinting at right now, that she would never have
dreamed of having sex with my grandfather outside of marriage.
And yet me now in this generation, I'm experiencing something
very different. I know it's hard for her to be
(13:34):
straightforward about this, especially because we don't normally talk about
this together. It's just too awkward and taboo. But I
figured this is my one chance to find out what
she really thought. Would you have liked to have had relations?
Speaker 3 (13:49):
No? I mean it wasn't the norm in my culture
because of my religion, part of society that I belong to.
Do you understand me today?
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Of course, cultural feelings have shifted, and she knows that, but.
Speaker 3 (14:07):
But I don't love that about my granddaughters.
Speaker 4 (14:11):
Oh wait, what do you mean?
Speaker 3 (14:14):
You have one person and then you experiment have another
and then more an experiment. I don't know if you
have done it.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
At this point in the interview, Mayo Boila started just
naming my cousins and guessing who's had sex. So we're
not playing that tape for the sake of their privacy,
but my jaw was on the floor. I told her
that I sure would hope that by thirty I would
(14:47):
have already have had sex. I say things like this
at times to challenge her.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
You know, you know, it's a perfect What I do
not like is having so many? Why so many?
Speaker 1 (15:01):
Why not so many?
Speaker 3 (15:03):
I know?
Speaker 1 (15:06):
But literally the question is why why do you think.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
That because I would like it to be for one,
not for three, four or five?
Speaker 1 (15:18):
But why Because my Wela speculates that it's because of
the religious ideals or concerns about safety that leads to
some of her perspectives. There were times when I felt
like this conversation was really pushing her, and then I
would come up against this wall. I couldn't totally get
(15:39):
her to explore this question of why these expectations exist
and whether they're unfair to me. It speaks to how
rigid the norms were for women when she was growing up,
and even how it still is in Mexico. I think
my family has held this way of thinking for a
long time, and I wasn't sure how she would judge
me if I didn't conform to her. Her standards, But
(16:01):
does your opinion of me change knowing that I've had
sex with more than one person?
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Hey, no, no, it hated to be that.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
It's your life and you know what you do, and
I'm happy to perfect then perfect and I know, yeah,
I'm very happy.
Speaker 3 (16:21):
Yeah me, Moore, I wouldn't change my love for you
depending on that.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
This is the first time I've heard this sentiment and
ideas from her. I feel like I thought this was
going to be a toss up on how she'd respond,
so it was refreshing to hear her say that. My
mom also shared her thoughts on the progress that Rosanna
has made.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
I think also for her having experience of living with
all sung with you guys that you have grown up,
you have helped her in many ways change the wage
she thought. Right, you have opened her eyes and even
our eyes, to a different way of thinking, to a
(17:08):
different way of accepting, to a different way of openness.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
Sex and sexuality are complex subjects in many families. Mexico
has just within the past decade developed support for gay
pride and pride parades and the like. I remember witnessing
a change and how sexuality was discussed within my extended family,
even within the last few years. And if any of
(17:37):
us were gay, would you mind?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
I don't know if I know what to answer.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
Why not?
Speaker 3 (17:45):
Well, maybe I wouldn't care because I know it's something
from birth.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Interesting.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
Yes, that's where we agree.
Speaker 1 (17:57):
This is as far as I would personally go. My
grandmother is very kind and accepting, but I've never personally
talked openly about my sexuality with most people, let alone
most people in my family. Identifying as by would be
orgn territory. Being gay feels simpler to most people in
my family than seeing sexuality as a spectrum. Do you
(18:20):
think that women should be a specific way?
Speaker 3 (18:23):
Everyone is different? You are different from different from your mother,
even though you are her daughters.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
And if I don't get married, but if I don't
have a partner, what do you worry about me?
Speaker 3 (18:38):
No? No, because you are already fool You are yourself
and completely ground since that's why I don't worry. If
I have a little worry, I will let you know.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
I think she normally worries about me, But hearing this
conversation means a lot that even for a moment, she
could hold space for deeper exploration and trust me in
my own happiness. We'll be right back. Welcome back to
(19:16):
when you're invisible. After talking about our generational differences, I
wanted to hear more about the world Maabela grew up in.
What were the conditions that shaped this woman who helped
trace me.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
My mother was born in Mexico City, but when she
was very young, they moved to Monterey. My grandfather had
a transportation business, and what I understood is that they
were going to open another branch in Monterey, so they
moved there. And because she was so young when she
moved there, now she considered herself from Monterey Regia Resia.
(19:54):
People from Monterey are called Rechia Montanos.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
So Regia for sure. And way for those who don't know,
it's a big city that's in a valley of mountains.
It's super commercial and it's I think a city where
the rich have a rep for being too bougie. Fressa
up in this tape, I call her fressa. Fresa literally
(20:19):
means strawberry, mom. Can you explain what fressa means?
Speaker 3 (20:23):
For one reason of another, the women from that part
of the north are called fressas. We are the bougie
of society.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Especially like wealthy women. Yep, Fressa, and then she responds
with that she's not really, she's.
Speaker 3 (20:54):
Half and half because she was born Fressa but went
down the hill. My grandparents lost their fortune.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Okay, so it was growing up that Mayaboila was considered Fresa.
It's super interesting how her wealth changed a lot over
her lifetime, but starting with when she was young, she
had two siblings, lived in a nice house with her
two parents. Her mother was a housewife who was given
(21:23):
enough money by her husband to not only take care
of the house and kids, but to buy jewelry, nice clothes,
and even plots of land. Rosina went to a private
Catholic school called the Sacred.
Speaker 4 (21:36):
Heart in.
Speaker 1 (21:44):
Her school was very traditional. It was all girls then
and they wore uniforms every day.
Speaker 3 (21:53):
And we will walk uphill to get to the school
because it was at the top of a mountain. It
was a very old school and we will walk there
to the top or take the car there. I remember
back then that there was an ice cream car which
will come and we will buy popsicles from the man
(22:15):
that brought the ice cream. While we were at school,
we will hear the ice cream bells and everyone will
look out, and he had to throw the popsicles up
to us.
Speaker 1 (22:26):
Here is another cour dessert memory, of course, one of
her most cherished recollections from childhood. It would be about popsicles. Yes, yes,
what did you do for fun?
Speaker 3 (22:37):
No, we had a very wholesome fun. We had fun
with roller skaters and bicycles. We all went to the movies.
We will hang out on my house. We were friends
from the same neighborhood. Okay, the girls formed a clue,
(23:00):
the Club twenty one because they were twenty one girls.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
This club of twenty one girls started at Catholic school
when they were ten years old and it lasted until
until now.
Speaker 3 (23:11):
Yes, I am eighty eight right now, and we still
get together, sometimes not as frequent because some have lost
their memory or they cannot move very well.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
It's funny because I've heard about this group of friends before.
It's part of the myth and the zegeist of the
life of my grandmother because all of these women, as
they got married, became an even bigger group. Actually didn't
know the origin stories of Club twenty one, and it's
really impressive and beautiful to me. They've been friends for
seventy eight plus years. This is rare, but honestly, I
(23:50):
hope I get that where I have friends who have
had for most of my life and care deeply about.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
I don't know if you know, Maria, but that club
may possy our wedding reception, your dad's and that really yes,
without them, we had not had a wedding reception. Wow.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
So these women really were like almost like twenty twenty
one fairy godmothers to each other's families.
Speaker 3 (24:15):
Yes, yes, yes, the wedding was held in one of
their houses, in that beautiful garden they decorated. They did
amazing work through friendship. Yeah, looking after each other and
each other's family if it was necessary.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
It's beautiful because I think we as a family carry
that legacy on. I think of my cousin Daniels Kintana.
We decorated and baked everything for her party. It's almost
like we continued this beautiful tradition that these women created.
So how were you raised?
Speaker 3 (24:55):
They raised me a little strictly in that everything had
to be done the right way. Nothing about arriving at
midnight from a date or gathering no way.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
A long day.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
My Willa says. The good thing is they would hang
out at her friend's houses or a lot of the
time at her house. It wasn't about going out out.
They never went to clubs. My Willa was surrounded by
strict rules and a deep concern for what was proper.
And you can see how all this translates back to
the beliefs about women and femininity that she raised me with.
(25:32):
Wealth wasn't necessarily freedom, and even though appearance mattered so
much in the world she came up in, by the
time she was a young woman, a lot had changed
for her and her family.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
I think my mom was around nineteen years old when
they lost their fortune. What I understand is that my
grandfather had a business partner and made him, or not
make him, but he allow himself to sign some paper
for a very bad business did made him be the
(26:06):
only one responsible for that deal, so he lost everything.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
Things changed virtually overnight. Rosana's mother had to sell the
plts of landa she bought and many of her possessions
to help her husband. And of course, my grandmother had
a certain vision of her life before this, and it
didn't involve having a job.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
When she had to start looking for jobs, cousins of
her said, you know what, Rosita, I will take you
to an engineer that I know that have jobs that right,
So I thought was that she could work with the
engineer at her as his secretary, and she head out
(26:49):
to meet him. He was the owner of a large
construction company. I guess it was the first construction company
in Monterey.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
Was terrified to start this job though she had no
idea what to expect. She had to take a test
first and really didn't know what to do. But she
got the job and she succeeded. She started from the bottom,
but because she was really good at math, she worked
her way up and became the secretary of the head engineer,
the owner of the company. And how long did you
(27:23):
work there?
Speaker 3 (27:25):
For? Seven years? Yes?
Speaker 1 (27:27):
Yes, you made your own money.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Cci.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
Actually, though my grandmother was never paid directly, the money
she earned went to her parents because women couldn't even
have their own accounts at this point, which is crazy
to think about. Women were just expected to be at
home under their father's roofs until they got married.
Speaker 3 (27:47):
I got married at twenty five, and it was when
I left and stopped working.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
Yes, did you know that when you got married you
were going to stop working?
Speaker 3 (27:59):
Passing because Fernando, my husband, told me I will no longer.
Speaker 1 (28:06):
Work And how did you feel about that?
Speaker 3 (28:10):
Well, I didn't feel liberated because I was very comfortable.
I was already the lead engineer secretary, and it made
me sad because I got along very well with all
of the engineers and the staff maintains.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Again, here's the point where my grandmother's lifestyle and class
status is changing dramatically, and all of a sudden, I
am sad that she had to give up one good
thing for another. But this is what marriage meant at
the time, and luckily there was a happy one. Tell
us the story of how you met.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
A friend of mine was hosting a party at her
house and another friend of mine tells me, fro Sienna,
let's go. But I had to invite someone, so I
told her, No.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
You needed to write someone. You cann't go along.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
No, we all required to go with someone.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
So that's another difference between my time and yours. I
don't need a plus one to attend an event.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
I did. Oh yes. Then she tells me, look, my boyfriend.
He lives in a boarding house, and at the boarding
house is a boy who is from Mexico City. I
can invite him for you. I say, well, but with
one condition. I will look through the window and if
(29:33):
I like him, I will go out. But if I don't,
you will tell him that I got sick. Okay, Well,
then the time comes for the dance and Fernando gets
out of the car, goes up the two steps to
the front door. He stops at the window and I
(29:53):
see him.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
Maria's a.
Speaker 3 (30:00):
Fernande. I shot up weekly and decided immediately he was
very handsome, very handsome, very handsome.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
What Mayauilla literally says is that she shot out like
a cork of a champagne bottle, which is so beautiful
and accurate for this moment of immediate love and celebration.
They got married and had four kids, including my mom
of course the eldest, and after five years of living
together in Monterrey, they moved to Mexico City. But just
(30:34):
a few months after moving to embark on a new
chapter of their lives, as she was still unpacking boxes,
her husband Fernando passed away.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
I was thirty one and your grandfather was thirty three.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
So at my age you were already a widow.
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Thirty one years old and with four children.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
How did he die.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
Das senamo Mndrico de Yeah, it was.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
Tragically. Fernando died in the middle of the night on
New Year's Eve. My grandmother says she went running into
the street for help, you know, barefoot and wearing only
a nightgown. People thought she was crazy. By the time
she came back with help, though, it was too late,
and it was.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
Very, very painful. Even up until now, there are many
things that I do not remember. After your grandfather's death.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
And it's shortly after his death, her parents convinced her
to move back to montetheree.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Oh, yes, they went to the funeral, and yes, immediately
after he passed, we pack everything and we moved back
to their home.
Speaker 1 (32:14):
So Senna and the kids returned to Monterey to be
with her family and friends. They moved into my great grandparents' apartment.
They lived all together in a small home above a shop.
Speaker 3 (32:26):
Can you imagine how many we were seven people in
two bedroom a very large bedroom apartment, but just two Yeah,
so it was just the four girls in one bedroom
and my grandfather, grandmother and my brother in the other one.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
Through the darkness, my grandmother still thought to provide the
best for her kids. Then yes, I suspect that did
you have expectations for your children?
Speaker 2 (32:50):
See?
Speaker 3 (32:51):
Okay, like what well? I want them to grow up
with ambition.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
To causuon brote, moral and intel education.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
Even though she had no money, she allowed herself to
be vulnerable and asked her community for help. They came through.
Speaker 3 (33:08):
So I tried by all means to get them educated
in good schools, which scholarship. One of my friends from
the club twenty one, she's just a beautiful woman. She
paid for all of Fernando's my son in primari and
secondary school. Wow.
Speaker 1 (33:29):
I didn't know that public schools in Mexico are not
really an option and the way that they are here.
Her son received a donation for his education. For her daughters,
she found support in getting them scholarships. As a single
mother of four, she also joined the workforce.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
A friend of the family had a junior store and said, Rosita,
why don't you come and work with me? Loness, I
had to work from Monday through Sara from nine am
until seven point thirty at night, with one hour lunch break.
So when I got home, I will just tell the kids,
(34:10):
let me just rest for fifteen minutes and I will
be with you. I rested for fifteen minutes and I
was with us.
Speaker 1 (34:18):
Do you remember what your mam was like during this time?
Speaker 3 (34:21):
You know she had to work right. So Sundays will
be the joyful locations for us as a family. We
will take the Boss, the city Boss, the four of
us and we'll meet her at the jewelry store from
where she asked permission, and we will all go to
our coffee shop and ask for the chocolate cake. So
(34:46):
chocolate cake has a sweet memory for the five Boss.
Speaker 1 (34:51):
Do you remember her as happy during this time or
do you feel like she was more solemn? What was
she like comparatively?
Speaker 3 (35:00):
Definitely, sometimes she will lose herself in another place and
like become solemn, as you say, But I have good
memories of her. Something that characterized your grandmother, and you
know that is a woman with a big smile. Everybody
that missed her said that it's like a walking heart, really,
(35:24):
you know, with a huge heart.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Taking the time to look back at my grandmother's life.
She really has been through so much hardship, and yeah,
it's amazing to hear aunt witness her warmth and kindness.
For that, I'm so grateful. We'll be right back, and
(35:50):
we're back. This episode has become so many things, but
one of the first reasons I wanted to sit down
with an elder was because I wanted to address that caretaking,
which we don't often deal with and at times it
makes people feel invisible. It's something I've actually heard my
will say that as you lose faculties, people start disregarding you.
(36:13):
What has it been like getting older?
Speaker 3 (36:16):
I guess I am happy. I am happy because I
see what I have had a hand in building all
around me. Do you do you understand me? And I
feel blessed?
Speaker 1 (36:30):
What are the biggest changes and.
Speaker 3 (36:36):
The wrinkles that I see in the mirror? Since I
am a little bit bay and I see myself with
more and more and more. You don't like that, well,
I guess they come from lots of experiences, good experiences too,
(36:57):
so that's why it's okay.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Since Mexican culture is one that takes care of its
elders at home, this is a particularly beautiful moment to
me to hear what it's like from the inside, because
with aging and relationships and family, it's a complicated dance
of respect, love and yet the stress that comes with it.
(37:21):
It was a little jarring to recognize how pervasive nursing
homes are in the US, and strange for me to
hear that young people don't see their grandparents very often
any either, situation, responsibility, finances, and bandwidth are huge considerations.
It's not easy to talk directly about these things, or
(37:42):
about dignity, loneliness, or the fear of being a burden.
Do you like that you're still with your family or
would you prefer retirement home?
Speaker 3 (37:53):
No? No, no, no, no no. I am happy to
be with family because I see them every time. I
can't how they have evolved, how they feel, their marriage,
their partners, their thinking, their jobs.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
What do you think of nursing homes?
Speaker 3 (38:16):
I don't like them. I mean it depends on the
nursing home, Like if you know people who are there,
then maybe it will be okay. But also I have
always gotten along with everyone, so there's such chance that
I will have been okay with being at one. But
thinking about it, I wouldn't like to be in one
(38:38):
of them.
Speaker 1 (38:39):
Don't you like about them?
Speaker 3 (38:45):
They seem cold to me.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
For my mom, taking care of a parent who is
a good parent is something she feels is a natural
responsibility and part of life when.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
You have had a parent like my When I asked
her at one time, why do you get married again,
she said, because I lost the love of my life
and after losing him, I became a mother first. Yeah,
no longer a woman. That why for me is an
(39:20):
honor to be able to take care of her.
Speaker 1 (39:23):
This responsibility has intensified over time as my grandmother has
gotten older, and in the last few years she's needed
more medical care and even been hospitalized more than once.
Her children have all chipped in to pay for the
care she needs and to provide it themselves. Yet even
when she's healthy, Rosaina talks about life as if it's ended.
Speaker 4 (39:47):
For the past ten.
Speaker 1 (39:48):
Years, my grandmother has been so aware of her aging
that she's been assuming that she would die every single year.
She literally cries about it every time we say goodbye.
Speaker 4 (39:59):
It's pretty much.
Speaker 1 (40:00):
Become a running joke. And what do you think about
your life? Like, for example, for the last ten years,
you've been saying that, like, this is the end, that
you're going to die this year, I always say that, yeah,
that this is the last time you're going to see me.
Speaker 3 (40:20):
Because who knows. I thought that maybe the girl who
was going to take me, but no, from what I see,
he already put in a peacemaker for another ten years.
Speaker 2 (40:32):
So here I am is he story.
Speaker 1 (40:36):
The peacemaker that she mentions was put in this past
year and when this happened, the doctor literally told her
you have another ten to fifteen years to live. And
the shock on this woman's face. She literally did not
say anything for a full minute, and I was like,
are you okay? And she was like, I need one
(40:56):
more second to process. It was amazing and hilarious moment.
I'm sure it's a shock. You're in the sunset of
your life and then you're like, I have fifteen more
miles ago.
Speaker 4 (41:12):
What are you happy about that?
Speaker 3 (41:16):
I'm very happy, but I want a great grandchild. You
hurry up or you fuck.
Speaker 1 (41:28):
I love how she talks to me. Sometimes this is
the Mexican SaaS coming in, and I love that she
feels free to be straight up with these feelings and listeners.
By the time this airs, she will have a great grandchild,
so her wish will be completed. Congratulations to my brother
and his wife on their baby girl. What is your
(41:51):
relationship to death?
Speaker 3 (41:54):
Is my companion? Since when? Since I had emergency her. Yes,
I said to her, you take me whenever you want to.
Speaker 1 (42:05):
It doesn't scare you.
Speaker 3 (42:07):
I am at peace with God and I am at
peace with everyone. Everyone loves me. Bless God. My grandchildress
adore me, my children too, my sons in law too,
my daughter in law? How much could I ask for?
Speaker 1 (42:24):
Is it hard to lose your friends?
Speaker 2 (42:26):
See?
Speaker 1 (42:26):
What is the most difficult.
Speaker 3 (42:33):
The junion that we have with them, the drawth that
you have having grown since you were little back then,
and growing up together because we were all always together.
It hurts, It really hurts, and.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
Says see.
Speaker 3 (42:55):
Maya.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
Willa's closest friends have always been the women of club.
Twenty one are in nursing homes now, and six of
them have passed away. One of them was the Patricia,
who was the anonymous owner from my uncle's scholarship which
covered his entire schooling. That one hurt a lot because
Patricia died while Rosa and I was abroad and she
(43:16):
couldn't be there. It broke her heart.
Speaker 5 (43:19):
Common how do you carry the pains.
Speaker 3 (43:33):
With humility? I have to be humble and at ease
because I know that they are in heaven.
Speaker 1 (43:40):
Jose, And what was it like to lose your brother
and to watch him have Alzheimer's.
Speaker 3 (43:50):
Tremendous, tremendously difficult. I mean I went to see him
every night because in the last few months of his
illness I already saw it was very bad seeing him
with the aggressiveness only sometimes being the man who was
(44:10):
so novel and so beautiful affected me deeply. You don't
know how much I admire Selvia and thank her. Yeah,
Selvia is my uncle's Memo's wife.
Speaker 1 (44:25):
The pain and grief of losing someone is one of
the hardest things we carry in our lives. But sometimes,
if you're lucky, going through this with another person can
bring you closer together. Maiauela and her brother's wife Selvia
forged a beautiful friendship in the wake of their loss,
and his wife, Selvia has always been way more reserved
(44:46):
than Memmo. And now it's really sweet. It's like Selvia
and my grandmother have become the best of friends.
Speaker 3 (44:55):
They are like sisters.
Speaker 1 (44:57):
Now, Yeah, they are like sisters, and it's so cute
because they'll play cards together, they'll watch TV together, and to.
Speaker 3 (45:07):
Kia, Alejandra found tas Selvia standing by the door of
the bedroom the guest bedroom, and he's Tia, what are
you doing? And she said, I'm waiting for Rosianna. Dis
Selba is Roseaienna's legs, and Rosienna is t s Selba's mind.
Speaker 1 (45:28):
As they've aged, different parts of them have been going
my grandma her legs, my aunt her mind. Together they
work as a unit to help guide each other. It's
a precious understanding of vulnerability and care. Actually have a
video of the two of them. I recorded it a
couple of years ago after one of my grandmother's emergency surgeries.
(45:49):
She and Selvia hadn't seen each other, and the video
captures their reunion. They press their foreheads together and hold
each other tight, almost steadying one another. They cry and
tell each other how grateful they are to see the other.
Sylvia understands Marbuela in a way that I never will,
because they share a stage of life and are truly
(46:11):
going through it as a team, deeply interconnected. How does
it feel to go from a caretaker to being cared for?
Speaker 3 (46:20):
Well, I feel all right because I am old enough.
Speaker 4 (46:25):
She used to be.
Speaker 3 (46:26):
If I were stronger, more inclined to do things myself,
more independent, I will feel bad.
Speaker 1 (46:35):
Independent I remember one thing you say sometimes is that
you don't want to be a burden.
Speaker 3 (46:48):
Yes, and I mean it. I don't want to be
a burden, especially a very long illness. That's why I
pray God for not to be in bed for months
and months like my o. Their memo was.
Speaker 2 (47:02):
No care.
Speaker 1 (47:05):
It's hard to hear her say that because she's old
or fragile, it's okay to be taken care of, as
if under any other circumstances it wouldn't be. I know
it has more to do with her wanting her independence,
but it's still tough. We can't control when or how
we need care, and hopefully, if we're lucky, there are
people who are willing and able to help us. But
(47:28):
it's scary to think of the pain emotional or physical
that we might go through or cause others to go through.
It's not easy, and I want to acknowledge that whether
you're being taken care of or a caretaker, all the
fears and feelings are valid. But I also wish that
we could ease up on the guilt over something that
(47:50):
is so out of our control and so deeply human.
What would you say to someone my age.
Speaker 2 (48:02):
Gavi ra romasque fell more. He can respect me.
Speaker 3 (48:10):
To leave as long as you can with happiness, We
love and we respect.
Speaker 1 (48:17):
These values happiness, love, respect are so basic, and yet
they require daily practice, and sometimes we fail. But if
I've learned anything from my grandmother, it's to get up
every time you fall again and again and trust that
these tenants will help keep her moving forward. It's been
(48:39):
an honor for me and my mom to hear and
share her story with all of you.
Speaker 3 (48:45):
It's beautiful to listen and translating some of the stories
that I already know. The only thing that I can
tell you is that I am honored to be her
doing because she has lived her life with all the
(49:05):
strength that she could, the best the way she could,
and always with kindness and a smile.
Speaker 2 (49:12):
On her face.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
I've always known that my grandmother is courageous, and she's
been able to adapt to so many challenges, even at
times when she's lost everything, including the love of her life.
In this conversation, though, I saw that adaptability in a
new light. I noticed truly how much she has grown,
even if it's been baby steps. She's not the same
(49:35):
person she was when I was a kid, pushing myself
to ask her new questions showed me that she's been
listening to me and actually letting me and my ideas
in all these years. It's huge that she was willing
to have this honest conversation publicly too. Even if we
still don't agree on everything, and we definitely don't, this
(49:57):
conversation allowed us to witness each other in new ways.
After the interview, in fact, we went and had lunch
together and Maya Weila decided to ask me some point
blank questions that she's never worked up the courage to
ask before. There's this new layer that's now become added
to our relationship. Asking hard questions and making space for
(50:21):
honest answers is something that I've had to learn and
I still practice. It doesn't always happen easy. This season,
talking to West Virginia coal miners, a blackmail teacher in Baltimore,
an artist with an invisible disability, a teen mom in
New York, an indigenous leader, a LATINX trans teen, I
(50:43):
was reminded again and again how much people can surprise you.
That is, if you're able to set aside assumptions and
biases that we all have and actually hold space for
a person's owl humanity. Trying to do this, you will
make mistakes. I make so many mistakes. Building bridges can
(51:08):
sound like such a cliche, and sometimes it is hard
to know what that really means. But I think admitting
that you don't know is kind of actually the key.
It's not just I'm here to build a bridge to you,
it's something we actually have to figure out with another person.
Let's build a bridge together for us. It's hard work,
(51:34):
but I hope listening to these conversations provides a rough
roadmap for you to try too. I hope that this
podcast shows that the effort can really pay off. If
you feel inspired, connected, or curious the season, I hope
you'll pass on one of these stories. That's what makes
(51:54):
my work worthwhile and what allows me to continue doing it.
Thank you so much for listening to When You're Invisible.
Please leave us a rating and a review to let
us know what you think. You can find this episode
and future ones on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or
wherever you get your podcasts. When You're Invisible is a
(52:16):
production of iHeart Podcasts and my Podura podcast Network. I'm
your creator and host, Maria Fernanda Viees. Our story editor
is Dylan Hoyer. This season was produced by Me with
additional production from Dylan Hoyer. Sound designed by Me Maria
Fernandadiez with additional support from Dylan Hoyer. Mixing and mastering
(52:38):
by Laurence Stump. Original theme music by Tony Bruno. Our
executive producers are Anna Stump and Gistel Bantes. Special thanks
to Pablo Cabrera and Arlene Santana.
The wustaria ramos como familia or familiar city alien mazarandi.
What would you like us as your family to know
or families that have an elder to know?
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Comosa. I said that.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
That they treat them with all the love in their hearts. Yes,
we may be old, but we feel and not that
just because we are at this age in life, we
don't have feelings.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Welcome to when You're Invisible. My name is Maria Fernanda. Yes,
but I know not everyone can roll there are, so
it's fine to call me Maria. When You're Invisible is
mind love letter to the working class and others who
are seemingly invisible in our society. I hope to build
a community here that will inspire you to have generous
(01:01):
conversations with others that are different from you, conversations that
might help you see life in an entirely different way.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Hi, I'm Claudia Boso de Diez. I am Maria's mother.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
You might remember my mom from our first season of
When You're Invisible. She came on with my dad to
talk about their immigration journey and their thoughts on Latini.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Dads and hello to everybody again today.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
Though she's actually not here to be interviewed. She's here
to help translate for her mom, Ma Avuela. She only
speaks Spanish, but I really wanted all our listeners to
be able to hear her story.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
So you Rosena my Coats.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
So I am Rosina my Coat. I am eighty eight
years old, and I am the grandmother of these girl.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
You're getting three generations of women today. So it's definitely
going to be intimate and silly and heartfelt, and I'm
so excited to share it with you. My mom is
going to do some direct translation, and at other times
she'll summarize what mya boy lies saying. Will also reflect
together and Rosa Aina's experiences and how her beliefs about
(02:21):
the world have impacted our own. How do you feel
about translating for your mom?
Speaker 3 (02:27):
It will be interesting And I don't know how accurate
times and hs and things like that are coming out
on her interview, because as we all know, as we
get old remembering, things could be a little bit different
or change. But the most important thing for me is
(02:49):
that you heard her voice and her own story as
it is in her own mind.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Right now, me and my grandmother have a great relationship
We're very different from each other, but we've always been close.
One of the things that I think bonds us is
our playfulness. We are both always willing to laugh, and
I grew up alongside her. She lived with my family
for three to six months every year, and you'll hear
(03:17):
how close we are in our conversation. We may not
translate every time she calls me mirrena.
Speaker 3 (03:25):
H.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
The list goes on. She's always using terms of endearment
to talk to me, and these phrases mean my queen, divinity, beauty, basically,
all the beautiful things that you would say to someone
you love, we say in Spanish. I always feel her
love that way. But as close and loving of a
(03:45):
relationship as we have, there are many things we haven't
talked about before. Sometimes she can seem like this silly,
sweet old woman, and maybe her full humanity goes and
see there's more to unpack. I assume a lot of
grandmother granddaughter relationships are like this. Your grandmother probably isn't
(04:06):
the first person you can finde in about dating or sex,
or how you should dress or wear your makeup. If
she is, that's awesome. My grandmother, however, does have very
traditional ideas and sometimes that's been a source of conflict
between us. But I wanted to use this interview as
a chance to push our relationship, to ask her questions
(04:28):
I've never asked before. So let's get into this intergenerational
episode camera. What memory do you have of me?
Speaker 3 (04:39):
Of you? Uh? Huh, any man?
Speaker 1 (04:44):
But which ones stand out?
Speaker 3 (04:46):
I think she's remembering if you experienced with you like
the corner apartment of Cornell. Yeah, they had here right
next to it, and you coming down the tricycles, your
hair blow back by the way, yes allah, Or when
(05:13):
we took you to the fair and you made her
ride all the rides see, or even when several times
during the summer will take you to Cornell ice cream
and how meticulous you were eating your cone, comparably with
your brother that will have stains of chocolate all over
(05:34):
his face.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
I love the fact that some of her fondest memory
is involved dessert. No matter her age, or her health
or what's happening in life, her sweet teeth always helps
her find a bright spot. Rosana Francisco and me, we
were like the three Musketeers growing up. A short Mexican
woman with no English and her two tiny grandchildren. We'd
(05:57):
go exploring with her when my parents were working, whether
it would be to the library or sledding, or she'd
also go on bigger adventures like road trips with the
whole family, whether we were living in student housing in
waterfall filled Ehica, New York, or in an apartment or
a duplex, or later a house in freezing but beautiful Minnesota,
(06:18):
or in rural Georgia with its breath taking sunsets through
it all. Maya Buela has been a long for the ride.
Having her stay with us has been for as long
as I can remember. I believe my grandmother was in
her fifties when that started, right, Mom.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
Yes, she was fifty six when she came towards the
first time.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
Not all the apartments we lived in had two rooms
for me and my brother, so sometimes my grandmother would
stay in the living room or the basement, or when
we did have to either she'd have one of our
rooms or she'd share with me.
Speaker 3 (06:54):
That before I was in a little house that belonged
to my brother, and when I went to Rekaia the
four of my kids, Mom, what do you want to
do in the house you have? You will have to
pay rent, electricity, water, telephone, everything, all the services. With
(07:15):
those you can spend a season with each of us
and that's it. You won't have to worry. And that's
how it's started. So I knew all of your grandchildren as.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Newborns presents.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
And did you want to do that or no?
Speaker 3 (07:34):
Yeah? Actor, well, I mean yes, I agree because it
was a realistic and a good agreement. You understand me.
But I would have wanted to have my small.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
House nor those cases aficat right now.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
It was the right decision, but of course it was
a big adjustment, especially because she'd be going between three
different cities in a year, not to mention two different countries.
When do you feel invisible.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
When everyone here is s tucking in English?
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Mayauila never really learned English. There were times when we
would encourage it or try to teach her. Mostly though
my family would communicate in Spanish, but of course sometimes
we'd host people who spoke English. And now my brother
is Maryton, American who only speaks English. On these occasions
I try to translate, but she feels bad that we
(08:34):
even have to. When do you feel most visible.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
On birthdays in Mexico and Pristmas New Year's Eves. Really
everyone's birthdays here too, but only when they speak to me.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Fast for Maya Boila Spanish is her comfort zone. This
is where she feels seen. It's a little weird to
hear that she feels most visible when she's not at
my family home, but that's her truth. Personally, I've been
in situations where I'm communicating across a language barrier, and
(09:12):
I do think it's possible to have real moments of
connection even if you don't share a language. But visibility
is complex, and sometimes it truly is in the eye
of the beholder or the beheld. After the break, we're
going to dive deeper into Roseana's belief system, including ideas
(09:33):
we may not agree on.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
Will be right back, Welcome back.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
To when You're invisible. When I think about Rosayana, there
are two more obvious sides to her. There's the one
side of my boy lad that is joyful and silly
and love sell librating, and then there's another side, the
one that's very conforming, risk adverse, and more judgmental. One
(10:08):
way I see this side come out is how she
views appearance, no matter where my aila is, how many
people she knows or what she's going through. She always
looks beyond put together. It's different than our standard in
the US. People think my grandmother is dressed for a
wedding or a formal event. That's the Mexican standard we're
(10:31):
talking about here. My grandma always needs to be made
up before anyone comes over to visit or she leaves
the house, even if it's just to the grocery store.
She curls her short hair and dons one of her
signature lip colors, pink or orange. We don't see Eida
eye on these things. If it were up to my Aboila,
(10:53):
I would be in a dress with heels and makeup
every day and spoiler.
Speaker 4 (10:59):
Alone, listeners, that's not me.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Some of the greatest pressure from her I faced growing
up was to look nice, meaning ladylike and hyper feminine.
It's something that I've really had to figure out, and
it's one of the reasons I'm grateful to have two
cultures and be a part of a younger generation because
it's created space to question what I want for myself,
(11:26):
space that I'm not sure Mayaboila ever had, and that's
something I wanted to make room for in our conversation Sempres,
You've always been like this, always put together, you know,
made up. You've always painted your lips, your eyes, have
your hair done, the works, made up, same flaty coming.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Yes. Around sixteen lighteen, I went to work when I
had to go very well groove together.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
But even now, for example, with age, that hasn't changed.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
I know, am I going to go without makeup? Well?
Speaker 1 (12:09):
There are people who stop as they get older.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
I would die without looking put together.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
I'm just curious. Do you feel confident in your own skin?
Speaker 3 (12:20):
Well?
Speaker 1 (12:21):
To me, it's interesting because for me, you should be
able to not wear it and feel good.
Speaker 3 (12:26):
But I like it in this way.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
It's so interesting to hear this concept that Mauilla says that, yeah,
I'm confident in my own skin, but I would never
go outside without makeup. I worked really hard to unpack
and understand why I dress and look the way I do.
Over the years, I found that I need the freedom
to express who I am, however I am in any
given day or moment in my life, and I've had
(12:50):
to break out of these rigid expectations of womanhood and
femininity in more ways than one. What are the differences
you noticed between your generation and mine.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
Or a hemp your quest answer? Okay.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
Through all this laughter, my Auila is basically saying that
she would never established relations aka have sex. That's what
she's hinting at right now, that she would never have
dreamed of having sex with my grandfather outside of marriage.
And yet me now in this generation, I'm experiencing something
very different. I know it's hard for her to be
(13:34):
straightforward about this, especially because we don't normally talk about
this together. It's just too awkward and taboo. But I
figured this is my one chance to find out what
she really thought. Would you have liked to have had relations?
Speaker 3 (13:49):
No? I mean it wasn't the norm in my culture
because of my religion, part of society that I belong to.
Do you understand me today?
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Of course, cultural feelings have shifted, and she knows that, but.
Speaker 3 (14:07):
But I don't love that about my granddaughters.
Speaker 4 (14:11):
Oh wait, what do you mean?
Speaker 3 (14:14):
You have one person and then you experiment have another
and then more an experiment. I don't know if you
have done it.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
At this point in the interview, Mayo Boila started just
naming my cousins and guessing who's had sex. So we're
not playing that tape for the sake of their privacy,
but my jaw was on the floor. I told her
that I sure would hope that by thirty I would
(14:47):
have already have had sex. I say things like this
at times to challenge her.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
You know, you know, it's a perfect What I do
not like is having so many? Why so many?
Speaker 1 (15:01):
Why not so many?
Speaker 3 (15:03):
I know?
Speaker 1 (15:06):
But literally the question is why why do you think.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
That because I would like it to be for one,
not for three, four or five?
Speaker 1 (15:18):
But why Because my Wela speculates that it's because of
the religious ideals or concerns about safety that leads to
some of her perspectives. There were times when I felt
like this conversation was really pushing her, and then I
would come up against this wall. I couldn't totally get
(15:39):
her to explore this question of why these expectations exist
and whether they're unfair to me. It speaks to how
rigid the norms were for women when she was growing up,
and even how it still is in Mexico. I think
my family has held this way of thinking for a
long time, and I wasn't sure how she would judge
me if I didn't conform to her. Her standards, But
(16:01):
does your opinion of me change knowing that I've had
sex with more than one person?
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Hey, no, no, it hated to be that.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
It's your life and you know what you do, and
I'm happy to perfect then perfect and I know, yeah,
I'm very happy.
Speaker 3 (16:21):
Yeah me, Moore, I wouldn't change my love for you
depending on that.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
This is the first time I've heard this sentiment and
ideas from her. I feel like I thought this was
going to be a toss up on how she'd respond,
so it was refreshing to hear her say that. My
mom also shared her thoughts on the progress that Rosanna
has made.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
I think also for her having experience of living with
all sung with you guys that you have grown up,
you have helped her in many ways change the wage
she thought. Right, you have opened her eyes and even
our eyes, to a different way of thinking, to a
(17:08):
different way of accepting, to a different way of openness.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
Sex and sexuality are complex subjects in many families. Mexico
has just within the past decade developed support for gay
pride and pride parades and the like. I remember witnessing
a change and how sexuality was discussed within my extended family,
even within the last few years. And if any of
(17:37):
us were gay, would you mind?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
I don't know if I know what to answer.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
Why not?
Speaker 3 (17:45):
Well, maybe I wouldn't care because I know it's something
from birth.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Interesting.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
Yes, that's where we agree.
Speaker 1 (17:57):
This is as far as I would personally go. My
grandmother is very kind and accepting, but I've never personally
talked openly about my sexuality with most people, let alone
most people in my family. Identifying as by would be
orgn territory. Being gay feels simpler to most people in
my family than seeing sexuality as a spectrum. Do you
(18:20):
think that women should be a specific way?
Speaker 3 (18:23):
Everyone is different? You are different from different from your mother,
even though you are her daughters.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
And if I don't get married, but if I don't
have a partner, what do you worry about me?
Speaker 3 (18:38):
No? No, because you are already fool You are yourself
and completely ground since that's why I don't worry. If
I have a little worry, I will let you know.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
I think she normally worries about me, But hearing this
conversation means a lot that even for a moment, she
could hold space for deeper exploration and trust me in
my own happiness. We'll be right back. Welcome back to
(19:16):
when you're invisible. After talking about our generational differences, I
wanted to hear more about the world Maabela grew up in.
What were the conditions that shaped this woman who helped
trace me.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
My mother was born in Mexico City, but when she
was very young, they moved to Monterey. My grandfather had
a transportation business, and what I understood is that they
were going to open another branch in Monterey, so they
moved there. And because she was so young when she
moved there, now she considered herself from Monterey Regia Resia.
(19:54):
People from Monterey are called Rechia Montanos.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
So Regia for sure. And way for those who don't know,
it's a big city that's in a valley of mountains.
It's super commercial and it's I think a city where
the rich have a rep for being too bougie. Fressa
up in this tape, I call her fressa. Fresa literally
(20:19):
means strawberry, mom. Can you explain what fressa means?
Speaker 3 (20:23):
For one reason of another, the women from that part
of the north are called fressas. We are the bougie
of society.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Especially like wealthy women. Yep, Fressa, and then she responds
with that she's not really, she's.
Speaker 3 (20:54):
Half and half because she was born Fressa but went
down the hill. My grandparents lost their fortune.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Okay, so it was growing up that Mayaboila was considered Fresa.
It's super interesting how her wealth changed a lot over
her lifetime, but starting with when she was young, she
had two siblings, lived in a nice house with her
two parents. Her mother was a housewife who was given
(21:23):
enough money by her husband to not only take care
of the house and kids, but to buy jewelry, nice clothes,
and even plots of land. Rosina went to a private
Catholic school called the Sacred.
Speaker 4 (21:36):
Heart in.
Speaker 1 (21:44):
Her school was very traditional. It was all girls then
and they wore uniforms every day.
Speaker 3 (21:53):
And we will walk uphill to get to the school
because it was at the top of a mountain. It
was a very old school and we will walk there
to the top or take the car there. I remember
back then that there was an ice cream car which
will come and we will buy popsicles from the man
(22:15):
that brought the ice cream. While we were at school,
we will hear the ice cream bells and everyone will
look out, and he had to throw the popsicles up
to us.
Speaker 1 (22:26):
Here is another cour dessert memory, of course, one of
her most cherished recollections from childhood. It would be about popsicles. Yes, yes,
what did you do for fun?
Speaker 3 (22:37):
No, we had a very wholesome fun. We had fun
with roller skaters and bicycles. We all went to the movies.
We will hang out on my house. We were friends
from the same neighborhood. Okay, the girls formed a clue,
(23:00):
the Club twenty one because they were twenty one girls.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
This club of twenty one girls started at Catholic school
when they were ten years old and it lasted until
until now.
Speaker 3 (23:11):
Yes, I am eighty eight right now, and we still
get together, sometimes not as frequent because some have lost
their memory or they cannot move very well.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
It's funny because I've heard about this group of friends before.
It's part of the myth and the zegeist of the
life of my grandmother because all of these women, as
they got married, became an even bigger group. Actually didn't
know the origin stories of Club twenty one, and it's
really impressive and beautiful to me. They've been friends for
seventy eight plus years. This is rare, but honestly, I
(23:50):
hope I get that where I have friends who have
had for most of my life and care deeply about.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
I don't know if you know, Maria, but that club
may possy our wedding reception, your dad's and that really yes,
without them, we had not had a wedding reception. Wow.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
So these women really were like almost like twenty twenty
one fairy godmothers to each other's families.
Speaker 3 (24:15):
Yes, yes, yes, the wedding was held in one of
their houses, in that beautiful garden they decorated. They did
amazing work through friendship. Yeah, looking after each other and
each other's family if it was necessary.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
It's beautiful because I think we as a family carry
that legacy on. I think of my cousin Daniels Kintana.
We decorated and baked everything for her party. It's almost
like we continued this beautiful tradition that these women created.
So how were you raised?
Speaker 3 (24:55):
They raised me a little strictly in that everything had
to be done the right way. Nothing about arriving at
midnight from a date or gathering no way.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
A long day.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
My Willa says. The good thing is they would hang
out at her friend's houses or a lot of the
time at her house. It wasn't about going out out.
They never went to clubs. My Willa was surrounded by
strict rules and a deep concern for what was proper.
And you can see how all this translates back to
the beliefs about women and femininity that she raised me with.
(25:32):
Wealth wasn't necessarily freedom, and even though appearance mattered so
much in the world she came up in, by the
time she was a young woman, a lot had changed
for her and her family.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
I think my mom was around nineteen years old when
they lost their fortune. What I understand is that my
grandfather had a business partner and made him, or not
make him, but he allow himself to sign some paper
for a very bad business did made him be the
(26:06):
only one responsible for that deal, so he lost everything.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
Things changed virtually overnight. Rosana's mother had to sell the
plts of landa she bought and many of her possessions
to help her husband. And of course, my grandmother had
a certain vision of her life before this, and it
didn't involve having a job.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
When she had to start looking for jobs, cousins of
her said, you know what, Rosita, I will take you
to an engineer that I know that have jobs that right,
So I thought was that she could work with the
engineer at her as his secretary, and she head out
(26:49):
to meet him. He was the owner of a large
construction company. I guess it was the first construction company
in Monterey.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
Was terrified to start this job though she had no
idea what to expect. She had to take a test
first and really didn't know what to do. But she
got the job and she succeeded. She started from the bottom,
but because she was really good at math, she worked
her way up and became the secretary of the head engineer,
the owner of the company. And how long did you
(27:23):
work there?
Speaker 3 (27:25):
For? Seven years? Yes?
Speaker 1 (27:27):
Yes, you made your own money.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Cci.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
Actually, though my grandmother was never paid directly, the money
she earned went to her parents because women couldn't even
have their own accounts at this point, which is crazy
to think about. Women were just expected to be at
home under their father's roofs until they got married.
Speaker 3 (27:47):
I got married at twenty five, and it was when
I left and stopped working.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
Yes, did you know that when you got married you
were going to stop working?
Speaker 3 (27:59):
Passing because Fernando, my husband, told me I will no longer.
Speaker 1 (28:06):
Work And how did you feel about that?
Speaker 3 (28:10):
Well, I didn't feel liberated because I was very comfortable.
I was already the lead engineer secretary, and it made
me sad because I got along very well with all
of the engineers and the staff maintains.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Again, here's the point where my grandmother's lifestyle and class
status is changing dramatically, and all of a sudden, I
am sad that she had to give up one good
thing for another. But this is what marriage meant at
the time, and luckily there was a happy one. Tell
us the story of how you met.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
A friend of mine was hosting a party at her
house and another friend of mine tells me, fro Sienna,
let's go. But I had to invite someone, so I
told her, No.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
You needed to write someone. You cann't go along.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
No, we all required to go with someone.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
So that's another difference between my time and yours. I
don't need a plus one to attend an event.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
I did. Oh yes. Then she tells me, look, my boyfriend.
He lives in a boarding house, and at the boarding
house is a boy who is from Mexico City. I
can invite him for you. I say, well, but with
one condition. I will look through the window and if
(29:33):
I like him, I will go out. But if I don't,
you will tell him that I got sick. Okay, Well,
then the time comes for the dance and Fernando gets
out of the car, goes up the two steps to
the front door. He stops at the window and I
(29:53):
see him.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
Maria's a.
Speaker 3 (30:00):
Fernande. I shot up weekly and decided immediately he was
very handsome, very handsome, very handsome.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
What Mayauilla literally says is that she shot out like
a cork of a champagne bottle, which is so beautiful
and accurate for this moment of immediate love and celebration.
They got married and had four kids, including my mom
of course the eldest, and after five years of living
together in Monterrey, they moved to Mexico City. But just
(30:34):
a few months after moving to embark on a new
chapter of their lives, as she was still unpacking boxes,
her husband Fernando passed away.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
I was thirty one and your grandfather was thirty three.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
So at my age you were already a widow.
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Thirty one years old and with four children.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
How did he die.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
Das senamo Mndrico de Yeah, it was.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
Tragically. Fernando died in the middle of the night on
New Year's Eve. My grandmother says she went running into
the street for help, you know, barefoot and wearing only
a nightgown. People thought she was crazy. By the time
she came back with help, though, it was too late,
and it was.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
Very, very painful. Even up until now, there are many
things that I do not remember. After your grandfather's death.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
And it's shortly after his death, her parents convinced her
to move back to montetheree.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Oh, yes, they went to the funeral, and yes, immediately
after he passed, we pack everything and we moved back
to their home.
Speaker 1 (32:14):
So Senna and the kids returned to Monterey to be
with her family and friends. They moved into my great grandparents' apartment.
They lived all together in a small home above a shop.
Speaker 3 (32:26):
Can you imagine how many we were seven people in
two bedroom a very large bedroom apartment, but just two Yeah,
so it was just the four girls in one bedroom
and my grandfather, grandmother and my brother in the other one.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
Through the darkness, my grandmother still thought to provide the
best for her kids. Then yes, I suspect that did
you have expectations for your children?
Speaker 2 (32:50):
See?
Speaker 3 (32:51):
Okay, like what well? I want them to grow up
with ambition.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
To causuon brote, moral and intel education.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
Even though she had no money, she allowed herself to
be vulnerable and asked her community for help. They came through.
Speaker 3 (33:08):
So I tried by all means to get them educated
in good schools, which scholarship. One of my friends from
the club twenty one, she's just a beautiful woman. She
paid for all of Fernando's my son in primari and
secondary school. Wow.
Speaker 1 (33:29):
I didn't know that public schools in Mexico are not
really an option and the way that they are here.
Her son received a donation for his education. For her daughters,
she found support in getting them scholarships. As a single
mother of four, she also joined the workforce.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
A friend of the family had a junior store and said, Rosita,
why don't you come and work with me? Loness, I
had to work from Monday through Sara from nine am
until seven point thirty at night, with one hour lunch break.
So when I got home, I will just tell the kids,
(34:10):
let me just rest for fifteen minutes and I will
be with you. I rested for fifteen minutes and I
was with us.
Speaker 1 (34:18):
Do you remember what your mam was like during this time?
Speaker 3 (34:21):
You know she had to work right. So Sundays will
be the joyful locations for us as a family. We
will take the Boss, the city Boss, the four of
us and we'll meet her at the jewelry store from
where she asked permission, and we will all go to
our coffee shop and ask for the chocolate cake. So
(34:46):
chocolate cake has a sweet memory for the five Boss.
Speaker 1 (34:51):
Do you remember her as happy during this time or
do you feel like she was more solemn? What was
she like comparatively?
Speaker 3 (35:00):
Definitely, sometimes she will lose herself in another place and
like become solemn, as you say, But I have good
memories of her. Something that characterized your grandmother, and you
know that is a woman with a big smile. Everybody
that missed her said that it's like a walking heart, really,
(35:24):
you know, with a huge heart.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Taking the time to look back at my grandmother's life.
She really has been through so much hardship, and yeah,
it's amazing to hear aunt witness her warmth and kindness.
For that, I'm so grateful. We'll be right back, and
(35:50):
we're back. This episode has become so many things, but
one of the first reasons I wanted to sit down
with an elder was because I wanted to address that caretaking,
which we don't often deal with and at times it
makes people feel invisible. It's something I've actually heard my
will say that as you lose faculties, people start disregarding you.
(36:13):
What has it been like getting older?
Speaker 3 (36:16):
I guess I am happy. I am happy because I
see what I have had a hand in building all
around me. Do you do you understand me? And I
feel blessed?
Speaker 1 (36:30):
What are the biggest changes and.
Speaker 3 (36:36):
The wrinkles that I see in the mirror? Since I
am a little bit bay and I see myself with
more and more and more. You don't like that, well,
I guess they come from lots of experiences, good experiences too,
(36:57):
so that's why it's okay.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Since Mexican culture is one that takes care of its
elders at home, this is a particularly beautiful moment to
me to hear what it's like from the inside, because
with aging and relationships and family, it's a complicated dance
of respect, love and yet the stress that comes with it.
(37:21):
It was a little jarring to recognize how pervasive nursing
homes are in the US, and strange for me to
hear that young people don't see their grandparents very often
any either, situation, responsibility, finances, and bandwidth are huge considerations.
It's not easy to talk directly about these things, or
(37:42):
about dignity, loneliness, or the fear of being a burden.
Do you like that you're still with your family or
would you prefer retirement home?
Speaker 3 (37:53):
No? No, no, no, no no. I am happy to
be with family because I see them every time. I
can't how they have evolved, how they feel, their marriage,
their partners, their thinking, their jobs.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
What do you think of nursing homes?
Speaker 3 (38:16):
I don't like them. I mean it depends on the
nursing home, Like if you know people who are there,
then maybe it will be okay. But also I have
always gotten along with everyone, so there's such chance that
I will have been okay with being at one. But
thinking about it, I wouldn't like to be in one
(38:38):
of them.
Speaker 1 (38:39):
Don't you like about them?
Speaker 3 (38:45):
They seem cold to me.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
For my mom, taking care of a parent who is
a good parent is something she feels is a natural
responsibility and part of life when.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
You have had a parent like my When I asked
her at one time, why do you get married again,
she said, because I lost the love of my life
and after losing him, I became a mother first. Yeah,
no longer a woman. That why for me is an
(39:20):
honor to be able to take care of her.
Speaker 1 (39:23):
This responsibility has intensified over time as my grandmother has
gotten older, and in the last few years she's needed
more medical care and even been hospitalized more than once.
Her children have all chipped in to pay for the
care she needs and to provide it themselves. Yet even
when she's healthy, Rosaina talks about life as if it's ended.
Speaker 4 (39:47):
For the past ten.
Speaker 1 (39:48):
Years, my grandmother has been so aware of her aging
that she's been assuming that she would die every single year.
She literally cries about it every time we say goodbye.
Speaker 4 (39:59):
It's pretty much.
Speaker 1 (40:00):
Become a running joke. And what do you think about
your life? Like, for example, for the last ten years,
you've been saying that, like, this is the end, that
you're going to die this year, I always say that, yeah,
that this is the last time you're going to see me.
Speaker 3 (40:20):
Because who knows. I thought that maybe the girl who
was going to take me, but no, from what I see,
he already put in a peacemaker for another ten years.
Speaker 2 (40:32):
So here I am is he story.
Speaker 1 (40:36):
The peacemaker that she mentions was put in this past
year and when this happened, the doctor literally told her
you have another ten to fifteen years to live. And
the shock on this woman's face. She literally did not
say anything for a full minute, and I was like,
are you okay? And she was like, I need one
(40:56):
more second to process. It was amazing and hilarious moment.
I'm sure it's a shock. You're in the sunset of
your life and then you're like, I have fifteen more
miles ago.
Speaker 4 (41:12):
What are you happy about that?
Speaker 3 (41:16):
I'm very happy, but I want a great grandchild. You
hurry up or you fuck.
Speaker 1 (41:28):
I love how she talks to me. Sometimes this is
the Mexican SaaS coming in, and I love that she
feels free to be straight up with these feelings and listeners.
By the time this airs, she will have a great grandchild,
so her wish will be completed. Congratulations to my brother
and his wife on their baby girl. What is your
(41:51):
relationship to death?
Speaker 3 (41:54):
Is my companion? Since when? Since I had emergency her. Yes,
I said to her, you take me whenever you want to.
Speaker 1 (42:05):
It doesn't scare you.
Speaker 3 (42:07):
I am at peace with God and I am at
peace with everyone. Everyone loves me. Bless God. My grandchildress
adore me, my children too, my sons in law too,
my daughter in law? How much could I ask for?
Speaker 1 (42:24):
Is it hard to lose your friends?
Speaker 2 (42:26):
See?
Speaker 1 (42:26):
What is the most difficult.
Speaker 3 (42:33):
The junion that we have with them, the drawth that
you have having grown since you were little back then,
and growing up together because we were all always together.
It hurts, It really hurts, and.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
Says see.
Speaker 3 (42:55):
Maya.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
Willa's closest friends have always been the women of club.
Twenty one are in nursing homes now, and six of
them have passed away. One of them was the Patricia,
who was the anonymous owner from my uncle's scholarship which
covered his entire schooling. That one hurt a lot because
Patricia died while Rosa and I was abroad and she
(43:16):
couldn't be there. It broke her heart.
Speaker 5 (43:19):
Common how do you carry the pains.
Speaker 3 (43:33):
With humility? I have to be humble and at ease
because I know that they are in heaven.
Speaker 1 (43:40):
Jose, And what was it like to lose your brother
and to watch him have Alzheimer's.
Speaker 3 (43:50):
Tremendous, tremendously difficult. I mean I went to see him
every night because in the last few months of his
illness I already saw it was very bad seeing him
with the aggressiveness only sometimes being the man who was
(44:10):
so novel and so beautiful affected me deeply. You don't
know how much I admire Selvia and thank her. Yeah,
Selvia is my uncle's Memo's wife.
Speaker 1 (44:25):
The pain and grief of losing someone is one of
the hardest things we carry in our lives. But sometimes,
if you're lucky, going through this with another person can
bring you closer together. Maiauela and her brother's wife Selvia
forged a beautiful friendship in the wake of their loss,
and his wife, Selvia has always been way more reserved
(44:46):
than Memmo. And now it's really sweet. It's like Selvia
and my grandmother have become the best of friends.
Speaker 3 (44:55):
They are like sisters.
Speaker 1 (44:57):
Now, Yeah, they are like sisters, and it's so cute
because they'll play cards together, they'll watch TV together, and to.
Speaker 3 (45:07):
Kia, Alejandra found tas Selvia standing by the door of
the bedroom the guest bedroom, and he's Tia, what are
you doing? And she said, I'm waiting for Rosianna. Dis
Selba is Roseaienna's legs, and Rosienna is t s Selba's mind.
Speaker 1 (45:28):
As they've aged, different parts of them have been going
my grandma her legs, my aunt her mind. Together they
work as a unit to help guide each other. It's
a precious understanding of vulnerability and care. Actually have a
video of the two of them. I recorded it a
couple of years ago after one of my grandmother's emergency surgeries.
(45:49):
She and Selvia hadn't seen each other, and the video
captures their reunion. They press their foreheads together and hold
each other tight, almost steadying one another. They cry and
tell each other how grateful they are to see the other.
Sylvia understands Marbuela in a way that I never will,
because they share a stage of life and are truly
(46:11):
going through it as a team, deeply interconnected. How does
it feel to go from a caretaker to being cared for?
Speaker 3 (46:20):
Well, I feel all right because I am old enough.
Speaker 4 (46:25):
She used to be.
Speaker 3 (46:26):
If I were stronger, more inclined to do things myself,
more independent, I will feel bad.
Speaker 1 (46:35):
Independent I remember one thing you say sometimes is that
you don't want to be a burden.
Speaker 3 (46:48):
Yes, and I mean it. I don't want to be
a burden, especially a very long illness. That's why I
pray God for not to be in bed for months
and months like my o. Their memo was.
Speaker 2 (47:02):
No care.
Speaker 1 (47:05):
It's hard to hear her say that because she's old
or fragile, it's okay to be taken care of, as
if under any other circumstances it wouldn't be. I know
it has more to do with her wanting her independence,
but it's still tough. We can't control when or how
we need care, and hopefully, if we're lucky, there are
people who are willing and able to help us. But
(47:28):
it's scary to think of the pain emotional or physical
that we might go through or cause others to go through.
It's not easy, and I want to acknowledge that whether
you're being taken care of or a caretaker, all the
fears and feelings are valid. But I also wish that
we could ease up on the guilt over something that
(47:50):
is so out of our control and so deeply human.
What would you say to someone my age.
Speaker 2 (48:02):
Gavi ra romasque fell more. He can respect me.
Speaker 3 (48:10):
To leave as long as you can with happiness, We
love and we respect.
Speaker 1 (48:17):
These values happiness, love, respect are so basic, and yet
they require daily practice, and sometimes we fail. But if
I've learned anything from my grandmother, it's to get up
every time you fall again and again and trust that
these tenants will help keep her moving forward. It's been
(48:39):
an honor for me and my mom to hear and
share her story with all of you.
Speaker 3 (48:45):
It's beautiful to listen and translating some of the stories
that I already know. The only thing that I can
tell you is that I am honored to be her
doing because she has lived her life with all the
(49:05):
strength that she could, the best the way she could,
and always with kindness and a smile.
Speaker 2 (49:12):
On her face.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
I've always known that my grandmother is courageous, and she's
been able to adapt to so many challenges, even at
times when she's lost everything, including the love of her life.
In this conversation, though, I saw that adaptability in a
new light. I noticed truly how much she has grown,
even if it's been baby steps. She's not the same
(49:35):
person she was when I was a kid, pushing myself
to ask her new questions showed me that she's been
listening to me and actually letting me and my ideas
in all these years. It's huge that she was willing
to have this honest conversation publicly too. Even if we
still don't agree on everything, and we definitely don't, this
(49:57):
conversation allowed us to witness each other in new ways.
After the interview, in fact, we went and had lunch
together and Maya Weila decided to ask me some point
blank questions that she's never worked up the courage to
ask before. There's this new layer that's now become added
to our relationship. Asking hard questions and making space for
(50:21):
honest answers is something that I've had to learn and
I still practice. It doesn't always happen easy. This season,
talking to West Virginia coal miners, a blackmail teacher in Baltimore,
an artist with an invisible disability, a teen mom in
New York, an indigenous leader, a LATINX trans teen, I
(50:43):
was reminded again and again how much people can surprise you.
That is, if you're able to set aside assumptions and
biases that we all have and actually hold space for
a person's owl humanity. Trying to do this, you will
make mistakes. I make so many mistakes. Building bridges can
(51:08):
sound like such a cliche, and sometimes it is hard
to know what that really means. But I think admitting
that you don't know is kind of actually the key.
It's not just I'm here to build a bridge to you,
it's something we actually have to figure out with another person.
Let's build a bridge together for us. It's hard work,
(51:34):
but I hope listening to these conversations provides a rough
roadmap for you to try too. I hope that this
podcast shows that the effort can really pay off. If
you feel inspired, connected, or curious the season, I hope
you'll pass on one of these stories. That's what makes
(51:54):
my work worthwhile and what allows me to continue doing it.
Thank you so much for listening to When You're Invisible.
Please leave us a rating and a review to let
us know what you think. You can find this episode
and future ones on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or
wherever you get your podcasts. When You're Invisible is a
(52:16):
production of iHeart Podcasts and my Podura podcast Network. I'm
your creator and host, Maria Fernanda Viees. Our story editor
is Dylan Hoyer. This season was produced by Me with
additional production from Dylan Hoyer. Sound designed by Me Maria
Fernandadiez with additional support from Dylan Hoyer. Mixing and mastering
(52:38):
by Laurence Stump. Original theme music by Tony Bruno. Our
executive producers are Anna Stump and Gistel Bantes. Special thanks
to Pablo Cabrera and Arlene Santana.
Host
Maria Fernanda Diez
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