February 17, 2025 • 51 mins
In today’s episode, Ashlyn talks to relationship coach, teacher, podcaster, and writer Jillian Turecki about her new book It Begins With YOU. Jillian breaks down the nine hard truths about love that form the backbone of her practice and breaks down her own life story as it relates to her work. The two chat about prioritizing their own needs, finding empathy in their relationships, and evolving to be the best version of themselves.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hello, and welcome to another episode of Wide Open with
Ashlyn Harris. Today we are joined by the relationship coach, teacher, writer,
and fellow podcaster Jillian Tareki.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Jillian, welcome to the show. So nice to have you.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Oh, thank you for having me. I'm honored to be here.
Speaker 4 (00:27):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Well, if you don't know, Jillian has her own show,
Jillian on Love. She also just launched just your new
book actually just came out maybe not too long ago,
right a week.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Two weeks, two weeks ago, and I hit the New
York Times bestseller list.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Congrats that think you absolutely incredible. The title of the
book is it begins with you the Nine Hard Truths
about Love that will change your life. So just to
start off, please, you know, tell me, tell me about
this book, tell me about the nine hard truths that
some of our listeners who haven't read. Maybe just a
(01:04):
quick little summary of what you're doing, why you chose
to do.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
It, and then we can kind of dive in from there.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Okay, great. So twenty six years ago I discovered yoga
and became an avid practitioner and have been ever since.
And I wanted to teach it, so I started teaching
it I realized that, you know, I wasn't just helping
people do these things with their body. I was helping
(01:34):
people heal their relationship with themselves and to change their
relationship with themselves. Because the practice of yoga is really
the study of the mind, and so so my curiosity
and really what became an obsession of the mind and
relationships started many years ago, and so I didn't really
(01:59):
know where this was going to take me. And I
also wanted to at the traditional route. I wanted to
get married and have kids and do that whole thing.
And so I met the man who would become my
husband and then later on my ex husband. And I
always say that our relationship was about ninety percent on
(02:21):
point and great before we got married, and ten percent problematic.
And you could think, or you could say, well, ten percent,
that's actually, that's not that large, but the ten percent
was so profound and so problematic, and so when we
got married, the ten percent became the ninety percent. Wow,
(02:42):
and it flipped and the ninety percent became the ten percent,
And it was a very difficult two years of marriage.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
And the story.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
That led me to the book and led me to
why I'm sitting here today is because one June second
in twenty fourteen, I woke up to a miscarriage and
he texted me from work saying that he wasn't coming home,
so he broke up with me over text. At the
same time, I just learned that my mom had about
(03:12):
two months to live because she had terminal accountcer. So
I entered a very depressive, dark night of the soul,
and I became obsessed with two questions. One was how
the hell am I going to get myself out of
this hole that I'm in? And then two, what does
it take to make a relationship thrive? I became obsessed
(03:36):
because I was obsessed, and by the fact that I
was in this position, I felt like my world was ending.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
And it was.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
And so I went on this journey and got certified
as a coach and started working with thousands of people
just because I had to create some meaning out of
the catastrophe that was my life at the time. And
so I worked with many, many people, couples, singles. I
(04:07):
worked like a crazy person.
Speaker 4 (04:11):
And then someone.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Said you should write a book, and I was like,
you know what, maybe I should And here we are.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
Wow, that is beautiful, and I thank you for your
vulnerability and saying that because I'm sure that's not easy
to share your life.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Struggles with the world.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
But you're healing people as you discover yourself, which I
think is admirable and I'm grateful for as someone who
recently just went through a divorce, your teachings and your
dedication to your craft touches me very.
Speaker 2 (04:44):
Deeply, and.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
I am so happy to be able to dive into
some of these, you know, discussing relationships, their challenges, and
how we actually work on ourselves to better who we are,
but how we show up in terms of our relationships
and our partners. You know, I'm a very firm believe
advocate for sharing your scars so other people don't have
(05:09):
to experience.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
The same pain.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Yes, and with that, I always ask a very important
question at the top of the show, which I know
you just shared so beautifully. But maybe I'll be wrong
and that's not the moment that broke you wide open.
But the reason why this show is called wide Open
is really expressing the vulnerability of the moments that made us.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
Who we are today.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
Clearly, your pain and struggle throughout what you have experienced
has made your lessons and your teachings real and that's
what makes you so great. But I am curious and
I ask this often.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
What moment in your.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Life really split you wide open that changed everything?
Speaker 4 (05:57):
I would say that.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
I would probably say the death of my mom. Yeah,
I think that changed everything in my life. And obviously
waited by the fact that I was also going through
the separation and divorce and sort of mourning the fact
that I would never have a family, and then also
making the decision to not have a family because I
(06:21):
could have really gotten more. I could have just said,
you know, when you want something, you kind of go
for it. But yeah, I would say the death of
my mom changed everything. I grew up with a very
mentally ill father. I mean, he was very accomplished in
his field, in the field of psychiatry, but he had
(06:45):
severe bipolar He actually was, you know, diagnosed with narcissistic
personality disorder.
Speaker 5 (06:52):
And he was very.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
It was very hard growing up with him because I
was also very sensitive, and so I grew up very
attached to my mom and so losing her at too
young of an age felt like I had no choice
(07:19):
but to really learn how to take care of myself
in multiple ways. And that's a good thing in many ways.
Speaker 4 (07:31):
But that's the thing that that changed my life forever.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
Oh wow. And I would love for you to expand
on that a little bit because I have a feeling
your life story and your journey has built you for
this moment of teaching, yes, and profound teaching. So I'm curious, like,
what was it like growing up as a child of
(07:55):
two immigrants who put all of this focus.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
On the American dream. You've got to do this, You've
got to do that, and here you are.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
You know, your life changed very quickly, and not by
your own merit, unfortunately, by someone else's.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
I'm curious of your how you.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Were as a child, how these life experiences built you
for this moment and time.
Speaker 4 (08:20):
Yeah, it's a good question.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
Well I think well, one of my strengths since I
was a child was beating to my own drum. So
I the American dream. You know, when you're raised by immigrants,
and especially of a specific generation that my parents were,
(08:43):
it's about security. That's that's that's the goal is security.
It's not high achievement. It's be safe, which I understand.
Speaker 4 (08:55):
And so.
Speaker 3 (08:58):
Being safe is you have your form one K, you
have your you know, your job with benefits and and
mind you this this new world that we live in
where people like myself can become experts and spread our knowledge.
Speaker 4 (09:14):
Through social media.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
This was this did not exist when we were kids, right,
So there there there wasn't even like, well maybe you
can like, you know, do this on YouTube like that,
that does didn't exist.
Speaker 4 (09:27):
And so.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
I so when you asked about my childhood, I mean
there's two different things. One is, I was just a
very sensitive kid with a very sensitive nervous system.
Speaker 4 (09:39):
And I grew up in a.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
Household where my father was manic depressive and my mom,
not mentally ill at all, still was an immigrant. She
grew up in South Africa in a time where there
were no rights, and she didn't have any self worth
and she didn't have it.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
She was a housewife.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
She was a model turned to housewife.
Speaker 4 (10:01):
And so I grew up.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
So she was depressed because she was with my father
and she felt powerless. And I was the kid who
felt everything.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
Yeah, and so.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
But I also had a lot of my own desires
and dreams, and so the expectation was graduate, go to college.
Graduate were corporate, and it was like dying a slow
death for me, I could not stand it.
Speaker 4 (10:34):
I hate authority.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
I don't like waking up early in the morning and
having to go to like a corporate office. And I
always felt completely sad about Yeah, not always sad, but
sad when it came to work. Yes, And then I
just I felt really lost, and I said, I'm going
to be a yoga teacher.
Speaker 4 (10:57):
So my mom accepted it.
Speaker 3 (11:01):
She accepted it, but I went through a lot of
turmoil and inner conflict about.
Speaker 4 (11:08):
What I'm supposed to be and do in this life.
Speaker 3 (11:13):
Yeah, for many, many, many years. It plagued me throughout
my twenties.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Oh, and I resonate and I relate a lot because
it brings me back to my you know, the things
in my life that we're crippling, the things that I
experienced and watched within my own walls, and how it's
really affected how I.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
Move as an adult.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
The learning and the process of unlearning is I guess,
a lifelong journey we're probably all going through.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
So with that, I'm curious, So how did you how
do you feel.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
Your upbringing really shaped your work now that you've really
you're really diving into this, you first this relationship coach
I'm curious by all of this. You know, you're talking
about your journey as a child and what you experienced
in your home.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Really, how did that upbringing shape your work now?
Speaker 3 (12:09):
Okay, in many different ways. Well, one is, my father
really always had a strong work ethic, and I have
a strong work ethic. I was expected to always try
my best. It's not like I never was expected to
be perfect, but I was expected to try my best
(12:29):
and always put in my best in everything. I would
not be sitting here today. Had I had the father
that I always wanted to have.
Speaker 4 (12:40):
Wow, there's no way.
Speaker 5 (12:43):
I wouldn't be sitting here today.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
If my mom had perfect self worth, and you know
my father was a great man or a great father,
I wouldn't be here today.
Speaker 4 (12:55):
I had to. So I had to.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
Go through many difficult relationships, and I went through some
beautiful relationships. I don't want to misrepresent myself. I was
not someone who was just always in bad relationships. I wasn't,
but I definitely want to. But I definitely had a
handful and so and I had to learn how to
love myself when it came to being in a romantic relationship.
(13:25):
And I think it's important to note that getting everything
you want doesn't guarantee a good life.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Oh that's power, that's powerful.
Speaker 4 (13:37):
It just doesn't wow.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
Because, first of all, our life is how we see it.
It's not really what's happening. So you could still get
everything you want, but you're not necessarily getting what you
need in life, and.
Speaker 4 (13:52):
So your perspective is skewed.
Speaker 3 (13:56):
And so I really like to emphasize the people that, Yeah,
if you had a difficult relationship with a parent, or
you had a difficult childhood, that's really hard and there's
a lot of hard things that come from that. But
can you can you see that there's good things that
(14:17):
came from that too.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
And that's the reframing your mindset part for me. Yes,
I think it's too often, and I love that you
said that.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
I think too often we make excuses for ourselves. You know,
life is hard in general, and to unpack years and
years of trauma and childhood experiences, it's it's hard and
it's a commitment, yes, and I don't think people dive
enough into it. They bring their baggage into every relationship
(14:47):
and then when they don't unpack it there, they unpack
it on their children. And it's really this vicious cycle,
and that is one of the things that my upbringing
taught me. My like in sports, I'll be very honest,
I have learned so much more from my failures than
I ever did from my successful moments of winning championships,
(15:07):
and I've won at every level, but the failures are
what always stick with me the most, and it helps
me become a better person because I realize that that.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
Family dynamic didn't work.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
Now, let's really figure out why that relationship didn't work.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
Let's not make excuses for it. Let's really dive in.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
And what I love that you're so openly talking about
and what I love so much about your book is
one of the truths is you must make peace with
your parents.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
When that was one of I mean, I.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Have so many questions because I'll be very honest, I
grew up in a really tough home, and so was
my outlet.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
It was it was my survival.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
I ticked very differently than most people because I didn't
want It was literally life or death for me. I
was not going back to what I experienced as a child.
I had to make a better life for myself and
my children and my family.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
One day, but reading through a lot of your work.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
As soon as I hit this, you must make peace
with your parents. I like almost fell out of my skin, huh, truthfully,
because I'm going to say something that was very profound
for me and I really want you to dive into it.
As soon as I became a mother to my two children,
I forgave my mom. I have the best relationship with
(16:46):
my mom now than I ever have, and it all
everything was put in perspective for me when I became
a mom and I forgave her and realized she did
the best she could with what she had. Because I
have been tested at every level. I am an exceptional
athlete who have who has done things that it's honestly unthinkable.
(17:10):
And I have access to so much more than my
parents ever did. And that's money, resources, a village, you
name it. And it is the hardest thing I've ever
done in my life is raising a child. And I'm
talking the mental load, the emotional load, the physical load.
(17:31):
I am constantly scared to death. I'm failing them like
it is a real thing, and it affects everything in
my life.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
The way I move, the way I show up for myself.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
And the people around me, So what I'm trying to
say is this is such an important piece not enough
people talk about. And I'm curious in the book what
you mean about this the ninth Truth.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
Yes, well I love that. First of all, I love
that you share that. And the first thing I thought
of was empathy. You know, maybe that's you know empathy
is is is the ability to stand in someone else's
shoes and experience life through and and when you became
a mom, maybe that was the moment that you were
able to experience some sort of empathy. And when we
(18:19):
can feel empathy for someone, that's that's when a relationship
has the power to change. So I knew when I
wrote that that it was going to be like it was.
Speaker 4 (18:31):
That's why it was the last truth. I was like,
if I start with this, no one will read the book.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
But exactly, you know, so and I and I say
in the chapter, if you've been molested terribly abused, this
isn't about making peace with your parents at all. And
and and also the chapter is about you could have
(18:58):
a great relationship with your parents.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
It's about examining the story.
Speaker 3 (19:04):
That you have about this parent, one or both of
your parents, about your childhood and acknowledging how that story
is controlling your life and your love life in a
way that is holding you back, that is tethering you.
(19:25):
And so the making peace with your parent is really
re examining the story and learning how.
Speaker 4 (19:32):
To let go of some stuff.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
And so I've had a difficult, challenging relationship with my
father since birth, since birth, and he actually passed away
when I was writing that chapter.
Speaker 2 (19:45):
Oh wow.
Speaker 4 (19:47):
Yeah, And so my.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
Journey really has been about making peace with the fact
that he is my father and letting go of the
fear and the and the and the hate that I
experience for most of my life when I even thought
of him, and I had to really I had to
(20:14):
really examine and explore how much that had a choke
hold on me and how much it was it was
ruining my life in some way, And so I had
to start to look at him through a different lens.
I had to start to look at the story through
a different lens. And part of that is empathy, as
(20:38):
you describe. Part of that is compassion, and part of
that is recognizing that you that you're not a helpless
child anymore, and so you can start to look at
this person through the filter of your wiser, more adult self,
and so you see the person's humanity. Now, I'm not
going to suggest that to someone who was severely abused
(21:01):
or molested. However, you can still make you can still,
with very very targeted therapy, make peace with that.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
Maybe. You know, I've worked with someone who.
Speaker 3 (21:14):
Now counsels survivors of childhood severe childhood abuse, and so
she's found a way to use what happened to her
to give back. But in general, most people are walking around.
You know, I was a strange from my father for
many years, and estrangement does not solve things.
Speaker 4 (21:34):
And sometimes you have.
Speaker 3 (21:35):
To be a strange because it is literally a matter
of life or death. But a lot of most people
are strange because they're holding on to a story and
they think and they're avoiding what really needs to be
looked at. And if that's the case, the estrangement is
not going to heal you.
Speaker 4 (21:53):
It's going to make things worse.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
That's a really great point.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
And I just am thinking, and you know, as you're speaking,
I'm reflecting, and so much of the work that I'm
doing with this podcast is actually healing me. You know,
being able to interview people like yourself and really dive
into so much good work. While I am going to therapy,
(22:19):
I just find that this work I'm doing and this
openness I'm now sharing, I think is really healing me
in a lot of ways. So I'm curious when you
made this huge pivot in your life. You know, you
were a yoga teacher. All of these things were happening
in real time, that were, you know, changing what you.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
Thought life looked like.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Did you become a relationship coach to help heal yourself
in this way as well? Because it was so close
to you and you directly, you were directly impacted by
so much of what was happening so quickly, all at once.
Speaker 4 (23:00):
Yes, I believe. So. I believe that we.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
I do believe that the things that we teachers decide
to teach our lessons that we need to learn or
have or have been processing ourselves.
Speaker 5 (23:21):
I think, well, there's two parts to it.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
One is helping others helps me just heal my story, yes, right,
and so and it makes me feel like my life
that everything that happened to me has a deeper purpose.
And then and then it gives some context to why
we exist. So so I think that for me, and
(23:47):
I think for people who do this, we sort of
derive our understanding of what the meaning of life is
through helping others heal from things that you needed to
heal from yourself.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
Yes, this is wide open and I'm your host, Ashlyn Harris.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
We'll be right back. The title of the.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
Book is it begins with you, and it's one of
the core truths. How did that moment of darkness really
connect you with your truth?
Speaker 3 (24:28):
Yeah, well, I realized that every relationship I've ever been
and has one common denominator, and that's mean. And that
doesn't mean it's not the platitude of like, oh, I
guess the problem is me. It doesn't mean that you're
the problem. It means that you are part of a dynamic.
You know, we are all We do not exist in
(24:50):
a vacuum, and that we need to be the change
that we wish to see in our lives and our
love lives. I think when I when I realized that
it's so important to have help, but your therapist can't
get you to the other side of how your parents
(25:12):
can't get you to the others, Like no one can
do it, Like ultimately the onus is on you and
I think that that's a lovely thing because there's so
little that we have control over in this life. I mean,
most things are completely out of our control, but we
do have some control. And that's what I wanted to
point out with that core truth, it begins with.
Speaker 2 (25:34):
You, and that really leads us to no one will
come to save you.
Speaker 4 (25:38):
Yeah, no one is coming to save you.
Speaker 1 (25:40):
No one is coming to save us. And you know,
that's such a beautiful thing to say, But like, how
do you even dive into that of owning that responsibility?
Speaker 3 (25:57):
You know? I think it's about understanding that we are
responsible for our own happiness.
Speaker 4 (26:06):
And that that part, yeah, that part are we are.
Speaker 3 (26:11):
And the point is surround yourself with people, places, and
things that add to your happiness that make it easier
for you to access your joy or your contentment or
your fulfillment. And so I think a lot of people
believe that once they find that right person and they
(26:35):
have that right relationship, that all their problems are going
to go away. And the thing is, no, for me,
the aim of a relationship, the point of a relationship
is to have an ally as you go through life.
(26:56):
But they can't actually do the work for you.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Yeah, absolutely, yeah, And it's such an important thing that
makes me think about how so much of what I
did as a player has now carried into my personal
life and it's a really hard thing for me to separate.
(27:22):
As I moved through the world as an athlete, I
was very good at a very young age, and I
played in a team sport, and everyone knows for you
to be successful, you put your team before yourself.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
You're in service to other people because the.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
Sum is only as good as all the moving parts, right,
and for us to be extraordinary, my ego was left
at the door.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
My selfishness was left at the door.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
When it came to being a successful team, it didn't
matter what my wants and needs were. However, I carried
that into my mind life, in my personal life, and
that has affected a lot of probably my failed marriage,
my failed relationships, because it was too hard for me
to say, but wait, what about what I need?
Speaker 2 (28:15):
What about what I want?
Speaker 1 (28:17):
And it was an uncomfortable place to be in to
ask for those but the only person that was hurting
in the process was me. In turn, it was creating
an extreme amount of resentment in the relationship.
Speaker 4 (28:32):
I was waiting for that one yeahah.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
Because I didn't felt I didn't feel seen or heard,
and that is my fault. That is no one else's
fault but mine. So I'm having to unlearn this part
of me that I don't always have to give, give, give, give,
give until I have nothing left. There has to be
this balance of what do you want and need?
Speaker 2 (28:57):
How do you communicate that? And it's so much.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
It's a lot in your work, yes, and it makes
me reflect a lot. Even as we're sitting here now,
I'm curious of do you hear that a lot when
you're doing your teaching and you're coaching for relationships?
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Is that very common?
Speaker 3 (29:19):
It's yeah, it's very common for people to not speak
up and ask for what they need because they don't
I think they're worthy of getting their needs met. You know,
you described your conditioning of being an athlete and being
part of a team. For others, it's, you know, good
girls don't speak up, or nice guys don't speak up,
(29:42):
whatever it is, there's all this conditioning.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
For sure.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
I see a lot more selfishness, if I'm being honest,
people getting so obsessed with their needs that they forget
that they're in a relationship with someone who has needs to.
I see that more often and and you know, it's
it's an interesting thing that you describe because you're you're
(30:07):
giving nature and the fact that you are that quote
unquote team player. That's a good thing that in it
of itself is not a problem. It's about balancing that
and understanding that the team gets stronger when you are
able to be an advocate for yourself inside of the team.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
That's power. I love that.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
Wow. That yeah, And I'm learning that right now in
real time and really like unpacking a lot of my
life and my lessons and the things I've been taught
in conditioned to be. So it's such a it's it's
we're constantly evolving, right, yes, always, We're always learning about ourselves.
(30:52):
And that brings me to my next question, because it's
it's really important for me during a time of such
dark during the process of my divorce, I ended up
finding someone someone came into my life that really changed
a lot for me.
Speaker 2 (31:12):
And the best ways, and I.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Talk about this with my therapist often. Often is if
am I in a place to give and receive what
is necessary for a very good dynamic in terms of
a relationship when I'm in the hardest season of my life.
So you know, it's interesting because a lot of what
you're talking about is it begins with you. But I
(31:35):
found the most incredible, profound love in the process of unlearning.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
The biggest like hardship of my life.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
But if I wasn't open to receive, I would have
shut that door.
Speaker 4 (31:55):
I know, And that would have been tragic.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
It would have been you know, life is based on time.
I mean, if I would have shut that door, it
could have been that would have been it.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Yeah, and love comes at very in very unexpected ways,
and you don't have to perfectly process everything to be
ready for a relationship.
Speaker 4 (32:13):
In fact, it's better.
Speaker 3 (32:15):
I mean, you know what I find tragic is people
going years and years and years not opening themselves up
to love again because because of their divorce.
Speaker 4 (32:25):
And it's like, Okay, well you just gave all your.
Speaker 3 (32:28):
Power to that relationship and to that and your ex spouse.
They just basically control your life. So yeah, I think
that's a beautiful thing, and I'm glad that you're open
to it.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
Yeah, and I it was. It's the best decision I
ever made. I do think people are constantly in this
grief bubble and they're not willing to open that side
of their heart up to say, even in the hardest
season of my life, I'm worthy enough to receive that
(33:02):
type of love. Yes, And I think that's the hardest part,
is feeling worthy enough to receive it. So I've been
trying this new technique of even when someone not someone,
even when my partner.
Speaker 2 (33:17):
Says I'm so proud of you, like.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
It's such a foreign thing to hear from me, I
don't receive it well because that's my own issues of
self worth. Yeah, so I am this new thing I'm saying,
is I receive that thank you because it's hard. It's
hard to be open to receive love. But also I'm
curious because your teachings talk about it begins with you. Yes,
(33:45):
So how do we become better receivers and sit with
that and say, Okay, I am enough. I am worthy
of this kind of love. I am worthy of this
type of connection not only with myself, which is first
and foremost, but this connection with this other person. I
am worthy of that kind of love and relationship and care.
Speaker 4 (34:09):
That's a good question.
Speaker 3 (34:12):
Well, first, it's important to note that relationships do not
thrive unless there's vulnerability, and we need to be able
to receive. We need to be that being receptive to
love is what creates emotional intimacy. If there's a wall
up and you're you know, the not receiving is just
(34:33):
a wall, and you can't really you can't can't make
a relationship work with walls. I think at first it's
about noticing. It all boils down to self awareness. So
if you have the awareness, it's really hard for me
to receive a compliment. And then a compliment comes your way,
(34:56):
it's noticing, where do I feel that's in my body?
Where do I feel there is a Do I feel
it in my chest? Do I feel it in my belly?
Do I feel it in my neck?
Speaker 4 (35:04):
You know what?
Speaker 3 (35:05):
Where do I feel the tension where I'm sort of
recoiling from this compliment from this person?
Speaker 4 (35:13):
Right?
Speaker 3 (35:14):
And then you take some deep breath and you let
it go and you soften because you have to. You
have to embrace yourself, right, You have to like soften
your physiology to be able to receive it. And that's
how you do it. You can't really talk yourself into it.
(35:36):
You need to practice it, and you need to bring
your body into it.
Speaker 1 (35:41):
Which is where your yoga teachings probably come in too
great use.
Speaker 5 (35:45):
I'm sure, yes, very much so, very much so.
Speaker 3 (35:48):
And that's it's very it's important, it's hard, and it's
a very good thing for you to recognize.
Speaker 4 (35:52):
And I would imagine maybe I'm wrong, but to.
Speaker 3 (35:58):
Achieve at the level that you have as an athlete,
it's almost like nothing is ever good enough, like you
have to keep pushing yourself and pushing yourself and pushing
yourself and pushing yourself and pushing yourself and so nothing
is ever like you're just like you're never getting the excellence.
So for someone to say I'm proud of you, it's like,
(36:19):
what do you mean I didn't I? No, no, no,
if I if I, if I give into that, then
where does my drive go?
Speaker 1 (36:29):
It's like a like a participation award, like what did
I What did I get to deserve that? And it's
really it's because I experience in my life. You win
a championship, there's one like second place is.
Speaker 5 (36:43):
Failure, Yes exactly, So there you go.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
You're always and then you you know, they teach you
as an athlete to have this really great sense of
short term memory because when you fail even in the
moment on the field, you got to bounce back very quickly, yes,
which really fucks with your emotional needs in the real
world because you just become robotic to everything. It's like, oh,
(37:08):
that felt like shit, I'm gonna move on because I
have to have short term memory, and I'm like, oh god,
that's not good.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
We have to unpack that.
Speaker 4 (37:16):
Yes, exactly.
Speaker 1 (37:18):
But having that understanding internally is just as important as
having it externally when it comes to relationships. So I'm curious,
what's the biggest misconception about love? Oh that's heavy, I know,
but I'm.
Speaker 4 (37:35):
Just yeah, it's a good.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (37:38):
The biggest misconception about love is that it's just a
feeling and not also a practice and a verb. M
that I would say is the biggest misconception of love,
that love is that thing that we feel with all
the butterflies and all that excitement, when really that's lust
and love is not something that we just feel.
Speaker 4 (37:59):
It's thing that we do.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
It's because sometimes to be in a relationship with someone
isn't entirely convenient. Sometimes we're just not in the mood,
or our old stuff comes up and our ego gets
in the way. So the pursuit of trying to overcome
that and to give love when maybe it's hard to
(38:22):
give love. That's love, That's what it's all about. And
so love is not just a feeling.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
I love that, and it really love is not just
a feeling. And I think the other big misconception people
always think the feeling of the attachment and the lust
at the beginning of the honeymoon stage that they're supposed
to experience, experience that through this lifetime commitment with another partner.
(38:55):
I'm like, I'm not the same fucking human I was
a year ago.
Speaker 4 (38:59):
Yeah, no, absolutely not, actually not.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
How does this evolution of change as we continue to
grow as people? Things happen to us where we carry
it and our bodies, and then of course we always
shit dump it on the most important people in our lives,
which most often our partners.
Speaker 3 (39:18):
Yes, the most important thing about growing together is a couples,
you must always have a shared vision.
Speaker 5 (39:24):
Now that doesn't mean that both of you have.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
Every goal has to be the same and every vision
has to be the same. You're two separate humans with
autonomous beings. But couples really need a shared goal, They
need a shared vision of the life that they want
to lead, and then they can be teammates, alliesied, unified
front in moving towards their shared vision. That's how people
(39:52):
grow together.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
I'll be back in just a moment after this brief
message from our sponsors. I always kind of think, you know,
because I'm a very very big sports buff. I always
think in like passing the baton, you know, like when
(40:15):
you're running right. I think in relationships, one part you
never Everyone always said like, no one's going to be
fifty to fifty in a relationship, Like I don't know
where that comes.
Speaker 5 (40:25):
Like that's ridiculous, It's ridiculous.
Speaker 1 (40:28):
There's never a time we show up as equals in
a relationship. In a marriage and a friendship, someone's always
in front of the other and then something will happen
and it'll shift. So I always, like am thinking in
real time, is if I'm ahead of someone in this
moment of one moment of my life and journey, I
don't want my partner to get out of reach. I
(40:51):
don't want them to not I don't want to be
in a place where I can't see them, where I
can't lend my arm back pass that baton off right.
Speaker 4 (41:01):
So I like that metaphor.
Speaker 1 (41:04):
I do because it's like, eventually, there's going to be
a time where I'm very I'm struggling and.
Speaker 2 (41:10):
She's way ahead of me. But if she keeps.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
Running and I'm walking, that fucking distance is going to
break us, right.
Speaker 4 (41:16):
Yeah, yeah, a hundred percent.
Speaker 3 (41:19):
It's in it's in reaction to how relationships used to
be in the fifties and before the fifties, where there
was a lot of imbalance. And obviously that in those
days it was more heterosexual relationships, but it was this
idea of you know, the man having all the power
(41:40):
and the woman staying home and these very very acute
gender roles, right, And so as we evolved as a species,
it's okay, we're not doing that anymore.
Speaker 4 (41:53):
We're going to be fifty to fifty. But but that.
Speaker 3 (41:57):
Doesn't work because then it makes love transaction.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
Say again, Say that again, say that it.
Speaker 3 (42:04):
Makes love a transaction, And you know, it's so funny,
it's like this idea.
Speaker 4 (42:08):
It's so because the word.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
Partner has become very popular, Like people don't say boyfriend
or girlfriend or spousing, where they say partner, and I
say too, just because it's part of the zeitgeist. But
sometimes I have issue with that word because it's so
it sounds so business y, you know, it sounds so
fifty to fifty, it sounds so transactional. But really, truly
(42:33):
what we want to be doing is putting one hundred
percent into the relationship. But the reality is that yes,
sometimes you're going to be at ten percent and you're
going to need that support. And it's not about meeting
each other in the middle. It's about going the distance,
and it's it's it's looking at the sum total.
Speaker 4 (42:51):
Right.
Speaker 3 (42:52):
Obviously, if you're in a relationship and one person is
just always at ten percent, then there's going to be
anal But the idea is there's an ebb and a flow.
Sometimes you'll be at twenty percent, sometimes they'll be at
eighty percent. But when you look at the totality, if
you look at the whole relationship as a whole, it
(43:12):
balances out. But this, I'll scratch your back if you
scratch my back, and people are doing that all the
time very specifically. Well one is there's just societal thinking
and conditioning of well, I don't want to be taking
advantage of and so we have to split the chores
it's just a new way of thinking. But then there's
the fear of I'm not going to open my heart.
(43:34):
I'm only going to open my heart when I know
that you're totally opening your heart. And then when two
people have that mentality, guess what, No one's opening up
their heart.
Speaker 2 (43:43):
Nope, totally shutting down.
Speaker 4 (43:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
And I say this often and my previous relationships. It's
the notion of keeping score. Yes, it fucking drives me nuts.
Speaker 4 (43:56):
Yes, it drives me nuts too.
Speaker 2 (43:57):
Oh my god.
Speaker 1 (43:58):
And this constant I think, especially as an athlete and
an elite high level athlete, the keeping score and the
competition is so toxic it real relationships.
Speaker 3 (44:14):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (44:15):
Can you elaborate on that a little bit?
Speaker 3 (44:18):
Yeah, I mean, so the keeping score is all about
one upmanship, right, and so it's about I'm not going
to do this for you unless you are doing this
for me, and that mentality destroys a relationship.
Speaker 5 (44:36):
It really has to Love has to.
Speaker 4 (44:38):
Be something that you give freely.
Speaker 3 (44:41):
Now, you don't want to give love to the point
where you don't fill your own tank, but it's still
something that needs to be given freely. You're not giving
it out of out of fear you're not giving it
out of manipulation, like you're a pleaser. The point is
to become a true giver. And and the thing is
is that you have to be an advocate for your
(45:04):
in your relationship. You have to be an advocate for
your needs. And it is also true that love should
be given abundantly.
Speaker 2 (45:16):
Especially in this new landscape.
Speaker 3 (45:19):
Absolutely, And so the idea of keeping score is withholding love,
you can decide to leave a relationship because you're not
because it's so imbalanced. You give and you never receive.
But you can't make a relationship work.
Speaker 4 (45:41):
By being a withholder.
Speaker 1 (45:44):
And that's where ego, Yeah, steps into the picture, which
we've all experienced at some point in a relationship.
Speaker 4 (45:52):
Oh, we experience it all the time.
Speaker 3 (45:54):
I mean, our greatest task in a relationship is always
to overcome the ego.
Speaker 1 (46:01):
And that's in sports, and that's in business, and that's
in life.
Speaker 5 (46:04):
And that's every percent everything.
Speaker 1 (46:07):
So that's that connects me to my last question for you.
And and you know, we are in a unique climate
with social media, with more dating apps than under you know,
there's a million under the sun at this point, yes, Like,
what is your thoughts about social media? The new modern
(46:29):
day era, like what how does that hurt or help
us in relationships in this day and age.
Speaker 3 (46:38):
So I recently heard a very very smart and modern
rabbi speak on YouTube and he said, and he was
answering a question, has the phones the phones? Have they
destroyed relationships or destroyed life? And he offered a perspective
(46:58):
that I believe, I believe in one hundred percent and
I'll share it.
Speaker 4 (47:03):
No, the phone is not the problem.
Speaker 3 (47:06):
Technology is not the problem our human beings. Our weakness
as a human being is that we are easily distracted
and that we are always looking for some sort of
escape from our pain.
Speaker 2 (47:23):
Wow, that's powerful.
Speaker 3 (47:25):
And so the phone or technology is just the thing
that makes our weakness easier for us to.
Speaker 5 (47:35):
Give into our weakness.
Speaker 3 (47:38):
So we have to use technology rather than have technology
use us. And so recognize that part of our weakness
is that we can we can treat others as if
they're disposable, we can use scrolling as a distraction, we
(47:59):
can be.
Speaker 4 (48:01):
Slaves to dopamine.
Speaker 3 (48:03):
And so, yes, has it impacted dating, absolutely, But remember
if we just blame the dating apps, if we just
blame technology, it's never been easy to find love it's
if it were easy, there would be no movies or
songs written about it. And so knowing that, can you
(48:28):
approach technology and dating and social media in such a
way that you have more control over yourself so that
you don't so you keep it in check, whether that
is scrolling or on swiping on a dating app and
being like, you know what, I'm only doing it for
(48:49):
one hour a day, that's it, and then I'm putting
the phone away, or I'm not going to just endlessly
text this person, this stranger and develop some false sense
of intimacy with the stranger.
Speaker 4 (49:03):
Who could be who could.
Speaker 3 (49:05):
Be Not to sound so pessimistic, but who could be married?
Speaker 4 (49:09):
You know, you just never know. I'm not going to
do that.
Speaker 3 (49:13):
I'm actually gonna get on a phone call or I'm
just gonna or I'm just going to meet them in
person if I find it appropriate, just to figure this out.
So it's about self control. Oh wow, that's how I
see it.
Speaker 2 (49:27):
That's it is. It's about self control.
Speaker 4 (49:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (49:31):
And it's about you, yeah, and.
Speaker 1 (49:33):
Seeing it and understanding it and knowing it's it's really
and this is where it dives into sports and yoga.
It's really knowing yourself and holding yourself accountable.
Speaker 4 (49:44):
Yes, a one hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (49:46):
That's the biggest thing for me in life is if
I don't hold myself accountable and if I in my failures,
I don't really.
Speaker 2 (49:57):
Deep dive into it. Am I ever gonna make myself better?
Speaker 1 (50:00):
Or am I going to constantly keep saying it's everyone else's.
Speaker 2 (50:04):
Fault but my own? Yes, exactly, and that's it.
Speaker 4 (50:07):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (50:09):
Thank you so much for coming on this week. Thank
you for having me.
Speaker 1 (50:14):
The work you do and the way you show up
in this space and the way you dedicate your life
to your craft, we are all better for it, and
we are all grateful. So thank you so much, and
for the listeners and anyone tuning in.
Speaker 2 (50:31):
If you want to.
Speaker 1 (50:32):
Dive further into Julian's work on love and self acceptance,
make sure you check out her book. It begins with you.
Thank you again for coming on Wide Open. I hope
our paths cross again.
Speaker 3 (50:45):
I hope so too, And thank you so much for
having me. This was a lovely conversation and I'm sure
we our paths will cross.
Speaker 2 (50:51):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (50:51):
Well, it's good to see you as always, and good
luck with the new book and all of our viewers
and listeners out there, go check it out.
Speaker 2 (51:00):
It begins with you. Thank you so much. Thanks.
Speaker 1 (51:05):
Wide Open with Ashlan Harris is an iHeart women's sports production.
Speaker 2 (51:09):
You can find us on.
Speaker 1 (51:10):
The iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Our producers are Carmen Borca Correo, Emily Maronov, and Lucy Jones.
Production assistants from Malia Aguidello. Our executive producers are Jesse Katz,
Jenny Kaplan and Emily Rudder. Our editors are Jenny Kaplan
(51:32):
and Emily Rudder and I'm your host, Ashlan Harris
Hello, and welcome to another episode of Wide Open with
Ashlyn Harris. Today we are joined by the relationship coach, teacher, writer,
and fellow podcaster Jillian Tareki.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Jillian, welcome to the show. So nice to have you.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Oh, thank you for having me. I'm honored to be here.
Speaker 4 (00:27):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Well, if you don't know, Jillian has her own show,
Jillian on Love. She also just launched just your new
book actually just came out maybe not too long ago,
right a week.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Two weeks, two weeks ago, and I hit the New
York Times bestseller list.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Congrats that think you absolutely incredible. The title of the
book is it begins with you the Nine Hard Truths
about Love that will change your life. So just to
start off, please, you know, tell me, tell me about
this book, tell me about the nine hard truths that
some of our listeners who haven't read. Maybe just a
(01:04):
quick little summary of what you're doing, why you chose
to do.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
It, and then we can kind of dive in from there.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Okay, great. So twenty six years ago I discovered yoga
and became an avid practitioner and have been ever since.
And I wanted to teach it, so I started teaching
it I realized that, you know, I wasn't just helping
people do these things with their body. I was helping
(01:34):
people heal their relationship with themselves and to change their
relationship with themselves. Because the practice of yoga is really
the study of the mind, and so so my curiosity
and really what became an obsession of the mind and
relationships started many years ago, and so I didn't really
(01:59):
know where this was going to take me. And I
also wanted to at the traditional route. I wanted to
get married and have kids and do that whole thing.
And so I met the man who would become my
husband and then later on my ex husband. And I
always say that our relationship was about ninety percent on
(02:21):
point and great before we got married, and ten percent problematic.
And you could think, or you could say, well, ten percent,
that's actually, that's not that large, but the ten percent
was so profound and so problematic, and so when we
got married, the ten percent became the ninety percent. Wow,
(02:42):
and it flipped and the ninety percent became the ten percent,
And it was a very difficult two years of marriage.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
And the story.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
That led me to the book and led me to
why I'm sitting here today is because one June second
in twenty fourteen, I woke up to a miscarriage and
he texted me from work saying that he wasn't coming home,
so he broke up with me over text. At the
same time, I just learned that my mom had about
(03:12):
two months to live because she had terminal accountcer. So
I entered a very depressive, dark night of the soul,
and I became obsessed with two questions. One was how
the hell am I going to get myself out of
this hole that I'm in? And then two, what does
it take to make a relationship thrive? I became obsessed
(03:36):
because I was obsessed, and by the fact that I
was in this position, I felt like my world was ending.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
And it was.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
And so I went on this journey and got certified
as a coach and started working with thousands of people
just because I had to create some meaning out of
the catastrophe that was my life at the time. And
so I worked with many, many people, couples, singles. I
(04:07):
worked like a crazy person.
Speaker 4 (04:11):
And then someone.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Said you should write a book, and I was like,
you know what, maybe I should And here we are.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
Wow, that is beautiful, and I thank you for your
vulnerability and saying that because I'm sure that's not easy
to share your life.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Struggles with the world.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
But you're healing people as you discover yourself, which I
think is admirable and I'm grateful for as someone who
recently just went through a divorce, your teachings and your
dedication to your craft touches me very.
Speaker 2 (04:44):
Deeply, and.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
I am so happy to be able to dive into
some of these, you know, discussing relationships, their challenges, and
how we actually work on ourselves to better who we are,
but how we show up in terms of our relationships
and our partners. You know, I'm a very firm believe
advocate for sharing your scars so other people don't have
(05:09):
to experience.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
The same pain.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Yes, and with that, I always ask a very important
question at the top of the show, which I know
you just shared so beautifully. But maybe I'll be wrong
and that's not the moment that broke you wide open.
But the reason why this show is called wide Open
is really expressing the vulnerability of the moments that made us.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
Who we are today.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
Clearly, your pain and struggle throughout what you have experienced
has made your lessons and your teachings real and that's
what makes you so great. But I am curious and
I ask this often.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
What moment in your.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Life really split you wide open that changed everything?
Speaker 4 (05:57):
I would say that.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
I would probably say the death of my mom. Yeah,
I think that changed everything in my life. And obviously
waited by the fact that I was also going through
the separation and divorce and sort of mourning the fact
that I would never have a family, and then also
making the decision to not have a family because I
(06:21):
could have really gotten more. I could have just said,
you know, when you want something, you kind of go
for it. But yeah, I would say the death of
my mom changed everything. I grew up with a very
mentally ill father. I mean, he was very accomplished in
his field, in the field of psychiatry, but he had
(06:45):
severe bipolar He actually was, you know, diagnosed with narcissistic
personality disorder.
Speaker 5 (06:52):
And he was very.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
It was very hard growing up with him because I
was also very sensitive, and so I grew up very
attached to my mom and so losing her at too
young of an age felt like I had no choice
(07:19):
but to really learn how to take care of myself
in multiple ways. And that's a good thing in many ways.
Speaker 4 (07:31):
But that's the thing that that changed my life forever.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
Oh wow. And I would love for you to expand
on that a little bit because I have a feeling
your life story and your journey has built you for
this moment of teaching, yes, and profound teaching. So I'm curious, like,
what was it like growing up as a child of
(07:55):
two immigrants who put all of this focus.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
On the American dream. You've got to do this, You've
got to do that, and here you are.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
You know, your life changed very quickly, and not by
your own merit, unfortunately, by someone else's.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
I'm curious of your how you.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Were as a child, how these life experiences built you
for this moment and time.
Speaker 4 (08:20):
Yeah, it's a good question.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
Well I think well, one of my strengths since I
was a child was beating to my own drum. So
I the American dream. You know, when you're raised by immigrants,
and especially of a specific generation that my parents were,
(08:43):
it's about security. That's that's that's the goal is security.
It's not high achievement. It's be safe, which I understand.
Speaker 4 (08:55):
And so.
Speaker 3 (08:58):
Being safe is you have your form one K, you
have your you know, your job with benefits and and
mind you this this new world that we live in
where people like myself can become experts and spread our knowledge.
Speaker 4 (09:14):
Through social media.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
This was this did not exist when we were kids, right,
So there there there wasn't even like, well maybe you
can like, you know, do this on YouTube like that,
that does didn't exist.
Speaker 4 (09:27):
And so.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
I so when you asked about my childhood, I mean
there's two different things. One is, I was just a
very sensitive kid with a very sensitive nervous system.
Speaker 4 (09:39):
And I grew up in a.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
Household where my father was manic depressive and my mom,
not mentally ill at all, still was an immigrant. She
grew up in South Africa in a time where there
were no rights, and she didn't have any self worth
and she didn't have it.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
She was a housewife.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
She was a model turned to housewife.
Speaker 4 (10:01):
And so I grew up.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
So she was depressed because she was with my father
and she felt powerless. And I was the kid who
felt everything.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
Yeah, and so.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
But I also had a lot of my own desires
and dreams, and so the expectation was graduate, go to college.
Graduate were corporate, and it was like dying a slow
death for me, I could not stand it.
Speaker 4 (10:34):
I hate authority.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
I don't like waking up early in the morning and
having to go to like a corporate office. And I
always felt completely sad about Yeah, not always sad, but
sad when it came to work. Yes, And then I
just I felt really lost, and I said, I'm going
to be a yoga teacher.
Speaker 4 (10:57):
So my mom accepted it.
Speaker 3 (11:01):
She accepted it, but I went through a lot of
turmoil and inner conflict about.
Speaker 4 (11:08):
What I'm supposed to be and do in this life.
Speaker 3 (11:13):
Yeah, for many, many, many years. It plagued me throughout
my twenties.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Oh, and I resonate and I relate a lot because
it brings me back to my you know, the things
in my life that we're crippling, the things that I
experienced and watched within my own walls, and how it's
really affected how I.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
Move as an adult.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
The learning and the process of unlearning is I guess,
a lifelong journey we're probably all going through.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
So with that, I'm curious, So how did you how
do you feel.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
Your upbringing really shaped your work now that you've really
you're really diving into this, you first this relationship coach
I'm curious by all of this. You know, you're talking
about your journey as a child and what you experienced
in your home.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Really, how did that upbringing shape your work now?
Speaker 3 (12:09):
Okay, in many different ways. Well, one is, my father
really always had a strong work ethic, and I have
a strong work ethic. I was expected to always try
my best. It's not like I never was expected to
be perfect, but I was expected to try my best
(12:29):
and always put in my best in everything. I would
not be sitting here today. Had I had the father
that I always wanted to have.
Speaker 4 (12:40):
Wow, there's no way.
Speaker 5 (12:43):
I wouldn't be sitting here today.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
If my mom had perfect self worth, and you know
my father was a great man or a great father,
I wouldn't be here today.
Speaker 4 (12:55):
I had to. So I had to.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
Go through many difficult relationships, and I went through some
beautiful relationships. I don't want to misrepresent myself. I was
not someone who was just always in bad relationships. I wasn't,
but I definitely want to. But I definitely had a
handful and so and I had to learn how to
love myself when it came to being in a romantic relationship.
(13:25):
And I think it's important to note that getting everything
you want doesn't guarantee a good life.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Oh that's power, that's powerful.
Speaker 4 (13:37):
It just doesn't wow.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
Because, first of all, our life is how we see it.
It's not really what's happening. So you could still get
everything you want, but you're not necessarily getting what you
need in life, and.
Speaker 4 (13:52):
So your perspective is skewed.
Speaker 3 (13:56):
And so I really like to emphasize the people that, Yeah,
if you had a difficult relationship with a parent, or
you had a difficult childhood, that's really hard and there's
a lot of hard things that come from that. But
can you can you see that there's good things that
(14:17):
came from that too.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
And that's the reframing your mindset part for me. Yes,
I think it's too often, and I love that you
said that.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
I think too often we make excuses for ourselves. You know,
life is hard in general, and to unpack years and
years of trauma and childhood experiences, it's it's hard and
it's a commitment, yes, and I don't think people dive
enough into it. They bring their baggage into every relationship
(14:47):
and then when they don't unpack it there, they unpack
it on their children. And it's really this vicious cycle,
and that is one of the things that my upbringing
taught me. My like in sports, I'll be very honest,
I have learned so much more from my failures than
I ever did from my successful moments of winning championships,
(15:07):
and I've won at every level, but the failures are
what always stick with me the most, and it helps
me become a better person because I realize that that.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
Family dynamic didn't work.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
Now, let's really figure out why that relationship didn't work.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
Let's not make excuses for it. Let's really dive in.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
And what I love that you're so openly talking about
and what I love so much about your book is
one of the truths is you must make peace with
your parents.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
When that was one of I mean, I.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Have so many questions because I'll be very honest, I
grew up in a really tough home, and so was
my outlet.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
It was it was my survival.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
I ticked very differently than most people because I didn't
want It was literally life or death for me. I
was not going back to what I experienced as a child.
I had to make a better life for myself and
my children and my family.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
One day, but reading through a lot of your work.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
As soon as I hit this, you must make peace
with your parents. I like almost fell out of my skin, huh, truthfully,
because I'm going to say something that was very profound
for me and I really want you to dive into it.
As soon as I became a mother to my two children,
I forgave my mom. I have the best relationship with
(16:46):
my mom now than I ever have, and it all
everything was put in perspective for me when I became
a mom and I forgave her and realized she did
the best she could with what she had. Because I
have been tested at every level. I am an exceptional
athlete who have who has done things that it's honestly unthinkable.
(17:10):
And I have access to so much more than my
parents ever did. And that's money, resources, a village, you
name it. And it is the hardest thing I've ever
done in my life is raising a child. And I'm
talking the mental load, the emotional load, the physical load.
(17:31):
I am constantly scared to death. I'm failing them like
it is a real thing, and it affects everything in
my life.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
The way I move, the way I show up for myself.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
And the people around me, So what I'm trying to
say is this is such an important piece not enough
people talk about. And I'm curious in the book what
you mean about this the ninth Truth.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
Yes, well I love that. First of all, I love
that you share that. And the first thing I thought
of was empathy. You know, maybe that's you know empathy
is is is the ability to stand in someone else's
shoes and experience life through and and when you became
a mom, maybe that was the moment that you were
able to experience some sort of empathy. And when we
(18:19):
can feel empathy for someone, that's that's when a relationship
has the power to change. So I knew when I
wrote that that it was going to be like it was.
Speaker 4 (18:31):
That's why it was the last truth. I was like,
if I start with this, no one will read the book.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
But exactly, you know, so and I and I say
in the chapter, if you've been molested terribly abused, this
isn't about making peace with your parents at all. And
and and also the chapter is about you could have
(18:58):
a great relationship with your parents.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
It's about examining the story.
Speaker 3 (19:04):
That you have about this parent, one or both of
your parents, about your childhood and acknowledging how that story
is controlling your life and your love life in a
way that is holding you back, that is tethering you.
(19:25):
And so the making peace with your parent is really
re examining the story and learning how.
Speaker 4 (19:32):
To let go of some stuff.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
And so I've had a difficult, challenging relationship with my
father since birth, since birth, and he actually passed away
when I was writing that chapter.
Speaker 2 (19:45):
Oh wow.
Speaker 4 (19:47):
Yeah, And so my.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
Journey really has been about making peace with the fact
that he is my father and letting go of the
fear and the and the and the hate that I
experience for most of my life when I even thought
of him, and I had to really I had to
(20:14):
really examine and explore how much that had a choke
hold on me and how much it was it was
ruining my life in some way, And so I had
to start to look at him through a different lens.
I had to start to look at the story through
a different lens. And part of that is empathy, as
(20:38):
you describe. Part of that is compassion, and part of
that is recognizing that you that you're not a helpless
child anymore, and so you can start to look at
this person through the filter of your wiser, more adult self,
and so you see the person's humanity. Now, I'm not
going to suggest that to someone who was severely abused
(21:01):
or molested. However, you can still make you can still,
with very very targeted therapy, make peace with that.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
Maybe. You know, I've worked with someone who.
Speaker 3 (21:14):
Now counsels survivors of childhood severe childhood abuse, and so
she's found a way to use what happened to her
to give back. But in general, most people are walking around.
You know, I was a strange from my father for
many years, and estrangement does not solve things.
Speaker 4 (21:34):
And sometimes you have.
Speaker 3 (21:35):
To be a strange because it is literally a matter
of life or death. But a lot of most people
are strange because they're holding on to a story and
they think and they're avoiding what really needs to be
looked at. And if that's the case, the estrangement is
not going to heal you.
Speaker 4 (21:53):
It's going to make things worse.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
That's a really great point.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
And I just am thinking, and you know, as you're speaking,
I'm reflecting, and so much of the work that I'm
doing with this podcast is actually healing me. You know,
being able to interview people like yourself and really dive
into so much good work. While I am going to therapy,
(22:19):
I just find that this work I'm doing and this
openness I'm now sharing, I think is really healing me
in a lot of ways. So I'm curious when you
made this huge pivot in your life. You know, you
were a yoga teacher. All of these things were happening
in real time, that were, you know, changing what you.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
Thought life looked like.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Did you become a relationship coach to help heal yourself
in this way as well? Because it was so close
to you and you directly, you were directly impacted by
so much of what was happening so quickly, all at once.
Speaker 4 (23:00):
Yes, I believe. So. I believe that we.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
I do believe that the things that we teachers decide
to teach our lessons that we need to learn or
have or have been processing ourselves.
Speaker 5 (23:21):
I think, well, there's two parts to it.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
One is helping others helps me just heal my story, yes, right,
and so and it makes me feel like my life
that everything that happened to me has a deeper purpose.
And then and then it gives some context to why
we exist. So so I think that for me, and
(23:47):
I think for people who do this, we sort of
derive our understanding of what the meaning of life is
through helping others heal from things that you needed to
heal from yourself.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
Yes, this is wide open and I'm your host, Ashlyn Harris.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
We'll be right back. The title of the.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
Book is it begins with you, and it's one of
the core truths. How did that moment of darkness really
connect you with your truth?
Speaker 3 (24:28):
Yeah, well, I realized that every relationship I've ever been
and has one common denominator, and that's mean. And that
doesn't mean it's not the platitude of like, oh, I
guess the problem is me. It doesn't mean that you're
the problem. It means that you are part of a dynamic.
You know, we are all We do not exist in
(24:50):
a vacuum, and that we need to be the change
that we wish to see in our lives and our
love lives. I think when I when I realized that
it's so important to have help, but your therapist can't
get you to the other side of how your parents
(25:12):
can't get you to the others, Like no one can
do it, Like ultimately the onus is on you and
I think that that's a lovely thing because there's so
little that we have control over in this life. I mean,
most things are completely out of our control, but we
do have some control. And that's what I wanted to
point out with that core truth, it begins with.
Speaker 2 (25:34):
You, and that really leads us to no one will
come to save you.
Speaker 4 (25:38):
Yeah, no one is coming to save you.
Speaker 1 (25:40):
No one is coming to save us. And you know,
that's such a beautiful thing to say, But like, how
do you even dive into that of owning that responsibility?
Speaker 3 (25:57):
You know? I think it's about understanding that we are
responsible for our own happiness.
Speaker 4 (26:06):
And that that part, yeah, that part are we are.
Speaker 3 (26:11):
And the point is surround yourself with people, places, and
things that add to your happiness that make it easier
for you to access your joy or your contentment or
your fulfillment. And so I think a lot of people
believe that once they find that right person and they
(26:35):
have that right relationship, that all their problems are going
to go away. And the thing is, no, for me,
the aim of a relationship, the point of a relationship
is to have an ally as you go through life.
(26:56):
But they can't actually do the work for you.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Yeah, absolutely, yeah, And it's such an important thing that
makes me think about how so much of what I
did as a player has now carried into my personal
life and it's a really hard thing for me to separate.
(27:22):
As I moved through the world as an athlete, I
was very good at a very young age, and I
played in a team sport, and everyone knows for you
to be successful, you put your team before yourself.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
You're in service to other people because the.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
Sum is only as good as all the moving parts, right,
and for us to be extraordinary, my ego was left
at the door.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
My selfishness was left at the door.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
When it came to being a successful team, it didn't
matter what my wants and needs were. However, I carried
that into my mind life, in my personal life, and
that has affected a lot of probably my failed marriage,
my failed relationships, because it was too hard for me
to say, but wait, what about what I need?
Speaker 2 (28:15):
What about what I want?
Speaker 1 (28:17):
And it was an uncomfortable place to be in to
ask for those but the only person that was hurting
in the process was me. In turn, it was creating
an extreme amount of resentment in the relationship.
Speaker 4 (28:32):
I was waiting for that one yeahah.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
Because I didn't felt I didn't feel seen or heard,
and that is my fault. That is no one else's
fault but mine. So I'm having to unlearn this part
of me that I don't always have to give, give, give, give,
give until I have nothing left. There has to be
this balance of what do you want and need?
Speaker 2 (28:57):
How do you communicate that? And it's so much.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
It's a lot in your work, yes, and it makes
me reflect a lot. Even as we're sitting here now,
I'm curious of do you hear that a lot when
you're doing your teaching and you're coaching for relationships?
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Is that very common?
Speaker 3 (29:19):
It's yeah, it's very common for people to not speak
up and ask for what they need because they don't
I think they're worthy of getting their needs met. You know,
you described your conditioning of being an athlete and being
part of a team. For others, it's, you know, good
girls don't speak up, or nice guys don't speak up,
(29:42):
whatever it is, there's all this conditioning.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
For sure.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
I see a lot more selfishness, if I'm being honest,
people getting so obsessed with their needs that they forget
that they're in a relationship with someone who has needs to.
I see that more often and and you know, it's
it's an interesting thing that you describe because you're you're
(30:07):
giving nature and the fact that you are that quote
unquote team player. That's a good thing that in it
of itself is not a problem. It's about balancing that
and understanding that the team gets stronger when you are
able to be an advocate for yourself inside of the team.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
That's power. I love that.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
Wow. That yeah, And I'm learning that right now in
real time and really like unpacking a lot of my
life and my lessons and the things I've been taught
in conditioned to be. So it's such a it's it's
we're constantly evolving, right, yes, always, We're always learning about ourselves.
(30:52):
And that brings me to my next question, because it's
it's really important for me during a time of such
dark during the process of my divorce, I ended up
finding someone someone came into my life that really changed
a lot for me.
Speaker 2 (31:12):
And the best ways, and I.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Talk about this with my therapist often. Often is if
am I in a place to give and receive what
is necessary for a very good dynamic in terms of
a relationship when I'm in the hardest season of my life.
So you know, it's interesting because a lot of what
you're talking about is it begins with you. But I
(31:35):
found the most incredible, profound love in the process of unlearning.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
The biggest like hardship of my life.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
But if I wasn't open to receive, I would have
shut that door.
Speaker 4 (31:55):
I know, And that would have been tragic.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
It would have been you know, life is based on time.
I mean, if I would have shut that door, it
could have been that would have been it.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Yeah, and love comes at very in very unexpected ways,
and you don't have to perfectly process everything to be
ready for a relationship.
Speaker 4 (32:13):
In fact, it's better.
Speaker 3 (32:15):
I mean, you know what I find tragic is people
going years and years and years not opening themselves up
to love again because because of their divorce.
Speaker 4 (32:25):
And it's like, Okay, well you just gave all your.
Speaker 3 (32:28):
Power to that relationship and to that and your ex spouse.
They just basically control your life. So yeah, I think
that's a beautiful thing, and I'm glad that you're open
to it.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
Yeah, and I it was. It's the best decision I
ever made. I do think people are constantly in this
grief bubble and they're not willing to open that side
of their heart up to say, even in the hardest
season of my life, I'm worthy enough to receive that
(33:02):
type of love. Yes, And I think that's the hardest part,
is feeling worthy enough to receive it. So I've been
trying this new technique of even when someone not someone,
even when my partner.
Speaker 2 (33:17):
Says I'm so proud of you, like.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
It's such a foreign thing to hear from me, I
don't receive it well because that's my own issues of
self worth. Yeah, so I am this new thing I'm saying,
is I receive that thank you because it's hard. It's
hard to be open to receive love. But also I'm
curious because your teachings talk about it begins with you. Yes,
(33:45):
So how do we become better receivers and sit with
that and say, Okay, I am enough. I am worthy
of this kind of love. I am worthy of this
type of connection not only with myself, which is first
and foremost, but this connection with this other person. I
am worthy of that kind of love and relationship and care.
Speaker 4 (34:09):
That's a good question.
Speaker 3 (34:12):
Well, first, it's important to note that relationships do not
thrive unless there's vulnerability, and we need to be able
to receive. We need to be that being receptive to
love is what creates emotional intimacy. If there's a wall
up and you're you know, the not receiving is just
(34:33):
a wall, and you can't really you can't can't make
a relationship work with walls. I think at first it's
about noticing. It all boils down to self awareness. So
if you have the awareness, it's really hard for me
to receive a compliment. And then a compliment comes your way,
(34:56):
it's noticing, where do I feel that's in my body?
Where do I feel there is a Do I feel
it in my chest? Do I feel it in my belly?
Do I feel it in my neck?
Speaker 4 (35:04):
You know what?
Speaker 3 (35:05):
Where do I feel the tension where I'm sort of
recoiling from this compliment from this person?
Speaker 4 (35:13):
Right?
Speaker 3 (35:14):
And then you take some deep breath and you let
it go and you soften because you have to. You
have to embrace yourself, right, You have to like soften
your physiology to be able to receive it. And that's
how you do it. You can't really talk yourself into it.
(35:36):
You need to practice it, and you need to bring
your body into it.
Speaker 1 (35:41):
Which is where your yoga teachings probably come in too
great use.
Speaker 5 (35:45):
I'm sure, yes, very much so, very much so.
Speaker 3 (35:48):
And that's it's very it's important, it's hard, and it's
a very good thing for you to recognize.
Speaker 4 (35:52):
And I would imagine maybe I'm wrong, but to.
Speaker 3 (35:58):
Achieve at the level that you have as an athlete,
it's almost like nothing is ever good enough, like you
have to keep pushing yourself and pushing yourself and pushing
yourself and pushing yourself and pushing yourself and so nothing
is ever like you're just like you're never getting the excellence.
So for someone to say I'm proud of you, it's like,
(36:19):
what do you mean I didn't I? No, no, no,
if I if I, if I give into that, then
where does my drive go?
Speaker 1 (36:29):
It's like a like a participation award, like what did
I What did I get to deserve that? And it's
really it's because I experience in my life. You win
a championship, there's one like second place is.
Speaker 5 (36:43):
Failure, Yes exactly, So there you go.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
You're always and then you you know, they teach you
as an athlete to have this really great sense of
short term memory because when you fail even in the
moment on the field, you got to bounce back very quickly, yes,
which really fucks with your emotional needs in the real
world because you just become robotic to everything. It's like, oh,
(37:08):
that felt like shit, I'm gonna move on because I
have to have short term memory, and I'm like, oh god,
that's not good.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
We have to unpack that.
Speaker 4 (37:16):
Yes, exactly.
Speaker 1 (37:18):
But having that understanding internally is just as important as
having it externally when it comes to relationships. So I'm curious,
what's the biggest misconception about love? Oh that's heavy, I know,
but I'm.
Speaker 4 (37:35):
Just yeah, it's a good.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (37:38):
The biggest misconception about love is that it's just a
feeling and not also a practice and a verb. M
that I would say is the biggest misconception of love,
that love is that thing that we feel with all
the butterflies and all that excitement, when really that's lust
and love is not something that we just feel.
Speaker 4 (37:59):
It's thing that we do.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
It's because sometimes to be in a relationship with someone
isn't entirely convenient. Sometimes we're just not in the mood,
or our old stuff comes up and our ego gets
in the way. So the pursuit of trying to overcome
that and to give love when maybe it's hard to
(38:22):
give love. That's love, That's what it's all about. And
so love is not just a feeling.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
I love that, and it really love is not just
a feeling. And I think the other big misconception people
always think the feeling of the attachment and the lust
at the beginning of the honeymoon stage that they're supposed
to experience, experience that through this lifetime commitment with another partner.
(38:55):
I'm like, I'm not the same fucking human I was
a year ago.
Speaker 4 (38:59):
Yeah, no, absolutely not, actually not.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
How does this evolution of change as we continue to
grow as people? Things happen to us where we carry
it and our bodies, and then of course we always
shit dump it on the most important people in our lives,
which most often our partners.
Speaker 3 (39:18):
Yes, the most important thing about growing together is a couples,
you must always have a shared vision.
Speaker 5 (39:24):
Now that doesn't mean that both of you have.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
Every goal has to be the same and every vision
has to be the same. You're two separate humans with
autonomous beings. But couples really need a shared goal, They
need a shared vision of the life that they want
to lead, and then they can be teammates, alliesied, unified
front in moving towards their shared vision. That's how people
(39:52):
grow together.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
I'll be back in just a moment after this brief
message from our sponsors. I always kind of think, you know,
because I'm a very very big sports buff. I always
think in like passing the baton, you know, like when
(40:15):
you're running right. I think in relationships, one part you
never Everyone always said like, no one's going to be
fifty to fifty in a relationship, Like I don't know
where that comes.
Speaker 5 (40:25):
Like that's ridiculous, It's ridiculous.
Speaker 1 (40:28):
There's never a time we show up as equals in
a relationship. In a marriage and a friendship, someone's always
in front of the other and then something will happen
and it'll shift. So I always, like am thinking in
real time, is if I'm ahead of someone in this
moment of one moment of my life and journey, I
don't want my partner to get out of reach. I
(40:51):
don't want them to not I don't want to be
in a place where I can't see them, where I
can't lend my arm back pass that baton off right.
Speaker 4 (41:01):
So I like that metaphor.
Speaker 1 (41:04):
I do because it's like, eventually, there's going to be
a time where I'm very I'm struggling and.
Speaker 2 (41:10):
She's way ahead of me. But if she keeps.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
Running and I'm walking, that fucking distance is going to
break us, right.
Speaker 4 (41:16):
Yeah, yeah, a hundred percent.
Speaker 3 (41:19):
It's in it's in reaction to how relationships used to
be in the fifties and before the fifties, where there
was a lot of imbalance. And obviously that in those
days it was more heterosexual relationships, but it was this
idea of you know, the man having all the power
(41:40):
and the woman staying home and these very very acute
gender roles, right, And so as we evolved as a species,
it's okay, we're not doing that anymore.
Speaker 4 (41:53):
We're going to be fifty to fifty. But but that.
Speaker 3 (41:57):
Doesn't work because then it makes love transaction.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
Say again, Say that again, say that it.
Speaker 3 (42:04):
Makes love a transaction, And you know, it's so funny,
it's like this idea.
Speaker 4 (42:08):
It's so because the word.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
Partner has become very popular, Like people don't say boyfriend
or girlfriend or spousing, where they say partner, and I
say too, just because it's part of the zeitgeist. But
sometimes I have issue with that word because it's so
it sounds so business y, you know, it sounds so
fifty to fifty, it sounds so transactional. But really, truly
(42:33):
what we want to be doing is putting one hundred
percent into the relationship. But the reality is that yes,
sometimes you're going to be at ten percent and you're
going to need that support. And it's not about meeting
each other in the middle. It's about going the distance,
and it's it's it's looking at the sum total.
Speaker 4 (42:51):
Right.
Speaker 3 (42:52):
Obviously, if you're in a relationship and one person is
just always at ten percent, then there's going to be
anal But the idea is there's an ebb and a flow.
Sometimes you'll be at twenty percent, sometimes they'll be at
eighty percent. But when you look at the totality, if
you look at the whole relationship as a whole, it
(43:12):
balances out. But this, I'll scratch your back if you
scratch my back, and people are doing that all the
time very specifically. Well one is there's just societal thinking
and conditioning of well, I don't want to be taking
advantage of and so we have to split the chores
it's just a new way of thinking. But then there's
the fear of I'm not going to open my heart.
(43:34):
I'm only going to open my heart when I know
that you're totally opening your heart. And then when two
people have that mentality, guess what, No one's opening up
their heart.
Speaker 2 (43:43):
Nope, totally shutting down.
Speaker 4 (43:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
And I say this often and my previous relationships. It's
the notion of keeping score. Yes, it fucking drives me nuts.
Speaker 4 (43:56):
Yes, it drives me nuts too.
Speaker 2 (43:57):
Oh my god.
Speaker 1 (43:58):
And this constant I think, especially as an athlete and
an elite high level athlete, the keeping score and the
competition is so toxic it real relationships.
Speaker 3 (44:14):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (44:15):
Can you elaborate on that a little bit?
Speaker 3 (44:18):
Yeah, I mean, so the keeping score is all about
one upmanship, right, and so it's about I'm not going
to do this for you unless you are doing this
for me, and that mentality destroys a relationship.
Speaker 5 (44:36):
It really has to Love has to.
Speaker 4 (44:38):
Be something that you give freely.
Speaker 3 (44:41):
Now, you don't want to give love to the point
where you don't fill your own tank, but it's still
something that needs to be given freely. You're not giving
it out of out of fear you're not giving it
out of manipulation, like you're a pleaser. The point is
to become a true giver. And and the thing is
is that you have to be an advocate for your
(45:04):
in your relationship. You have to be an advocate for
your needs. And it is also true that love should
be given abundantly.
Speaker 2 (45:16):
Especially in this new landscape.
Speaker 3 (45:19):
Absolutely, And so the idea of keeping score is withholding love,
you can decide to leave a relationship because you're not
because it's so imbalanced. You give and you never receive.
But you can't make a relationship work.
Speaker 4 (45:41):
By being a withholder.
Speaker 1 (45:44):
And that's where ego, Yeah, steps into the picture, which
we've all experienced at some point in a relationship.
Speaker 4 (45:52):
Oh, we experience it all the time.
Speaker 3 (45:54):
I mean, our greatest task in a relationship is always
to overcome the ego.
Speaker 1 (46:01):
And that's in sports, and that's in business, and that's
in life.
Speaker 5 (46:04):
And that's every percent everything.
Speaker 1 (46:07):
So that's that connects me to my last question for you.
And and you know, we are in a unique climate
with social media, with more dating apps than under you know,
there's a million under the sun at this point, yes, Like,
what is your thoughts about social media? The new modern
(46:29):
day era, like what how does that hurt or help
us in relationships in this day and age.
Speaker 3 (46:38):
So I recently heard a very very smart and modern
rabbi speak on YouTube and he said, and he was
answering a question, has the phones the phones? Have they
destroyed relationships or destroyed life? And he offered a perspective
(46:58):
that I believe, I believe in one hundred percent and
I'll share it.
Speaker 4 (47:03):
No, the phone is not the problem.
Speaker 3 (47:06):
Technology is not the problem our human beings. Our weakness
as a human being is that we are easily distracted
and that we are always looking for some sort of
escape from our pain.
Speaker 2 (47:23):
Wow, that's powerful.
Speaker 3 (47:25):
And so the phone or technology is just the thing
that makes our weakness easier for us to.
Speaker 5 (47:35):
Give into our weakness.
Speaker 3 (47:38):
So we have to use technology rather than have technology
use us. And so recognize that part of our weakness
is that we can we can treat others as if
they're disposable, we can use scrolling as a distraction, we
(47:59):
can be.
Speaker 4 (48:01):
Slaves to dopamine.
Speaker 3 (48:03):
And so, yes, has it impacted dating, absolutely, But remember
if we just blame the dating apps, if we just
blame technology, it's never been easy to find love it's
if it were easy, there would be no movies or
songs written about it. And so knowing that, can you
(48:28):
approach technology and dating and social media in such a
way that you have more control over yourself so that
you don't so you keep it in check, whether that
is scrolling or on swiping on a dating app and
being like, you know what, I'm only doing it for
(48:49):
one hour a day, that's it, and then I'm putting
the phone away, or I'm not going to just endlessly
text this person, this stranger and develop some false sense
of intimacy with the stranger.
Speaker 4 (49:03):
Who could be who could.
Speaker 3 (49:05):
Be Not to sound so pessimistic, but who could be married?
Speaker 4 (49:09):
You know, you just never know. I'm not going to
do that.
Speaker 3 (49:13):
I'm actually gonna get on a phone call or I'm
just gonna or I'm just going to meet them in
person if I find it appropriate, just to figure this out.
So it's about self control. Oh wow, that's how I
see it.
Speaker 2 (49:27):
That's it is. It's about self control.
Speaker 4 (49:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (49:31):
And it's about you, yeah, and.
Speaker 1 (49:33):
Seeing it and understanding it and knowing it's it's really
and this is where it dives into sports and yoga.
It's really knowing yourself and holding yourself accountable.
Speaker 4 (49:44):
Yes, a one hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (49:46):
That's the biggest thing for me in life is if
I don't hold myself accountable and if I in my failures,
I don't really.
Speaker 2 (49:57):
Deep dive into it. Am I ever gonna make myself better?
Speaker 1 (50:00):
Or am I going to constantly keep saying it's everyone else's.
Speaker 2 (50:04):
Fault but my own? Yes, exactly, and that's it.
Speaker 4 (50:07):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (50:09):
Thank you so much for coming on this week. Thank
you for having me.
Speaker 1 (50:14):
The work you do and the way you show up
in this space and the way you dedicate your life
to your craft, we are all better for it, and
we are all grateful. So thank you so much, and
for the listeners and anyone tuning in.
Speaker 2 (50:31):
If you want to.
Speaker 1 (50:32):
Dive further into Julian's work on love and self acceptance,
make sure you check out her book. It begins with you.
Thank you again for coming on Wide Open. I hope
our paths cross again.
Speaker 3 (50:45):
I hope so too, And thank you so much for
having me. This was a lovely conversation and I'm sure
we our paths will cross.
Speaker 2 (50:51):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (50:51):
Well, it's good to see you as always, and good
luck with the new book and all of our viewers
and listeners out there, go check it out.
Speaker 2 (51:00):
It begins with you. Thank you so much. Thanks.
Speaker 1 (51:05):
Wide Open with Ashlan Harris is an iHeart women's sports production.
Speaker 2 (51:09):
You can find us on.
Speaker 1 (51:10):
The iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Our producers are Carmen Borca Correo, Emily Maronov, and Lucy Jones.
Production assistants from Malia Aguidello. Our executive producers are Jesse Katz,
Jenny Kaplan and Emily Rudder. Our editors are Jenny Kaplan
(51:32):
and Emily Rudder and I'm your host, Ashlan Harris
Host
Ashlyn Harris
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