April 8, 2025 • 28 mins
Michelle Obama reveals her TV guilty (and not so guilty) pleasures, her love of tennis, a good martini, motherhood and marriage.
Listen to Michelle's podcast, IMO with Michelle Obama and Craig Robinson, here.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
Welcome back everyone. Our conversation with Michelle Obama continues. I
think your point about the fear, you know, it's so
human to not want your children to hurt. And it's interesting,
I've never talked about this, but you're illuminating something for
me that in my adulthood, my mom and I have
(00:32):
been healing because my mom went through a really you know,
my mom did not grow up the way I did.
She did not have, you know, the life that I did.
She went through you know, immigration with her own mother,
the classic beautiful Elis Island story, but the reality was hard,
and you know, she lived in a housing project in
(00:53):
the Bronx and sometimes had nothing to eat but a
piece of bread and salt that she would make into
a sandwich. And my mom had such fear about me
suffering the way she suffered, that there were ways she
tried to protect me. And it took a while for
us to come back around, for her to not understand
(01:13):
why I was doubting myself in this really important moment,
and for us to unpack that.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
I knew she.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
Loved me, but I didn't always think she trusted me. Yeah,
And so I hadn't really learned how to trust myself.
And in that moment, we had this breakthrough as two women,
and I learned about these things that happened in her
childhood that she had shame about, that she never wanted
to tell me about because she never wanted me to
be scared that it would happen to us, because come
(01:43):
hell or high water, she wouldn't let it. And it
was this moment where she saw me as more human,
I saw her as more human, and we both were like,
whoa you know? And then what will the next generation
of children have? Because we have these tools? And I
think there's such beauty in your willingness to share it
(02:04):
in the stories you've told us, in the books, in
the stories you're telling right now. Can I ask you
a bit of a humorous question, only because I am
now lucky enough to not only love the best person
in the world, but the best person in the world
came with the two best kids.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
In the world.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
And like Toddler, math is crazy, you know, And there
are moments where I'm like, how.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Do I I am an actor?
Speaker 1 (02:29):
I can make up a story, right, Like, how do
I tell a story that is going to get this
child to survive or sleep through the night or whatever.
So if you don't mind me asking now that they're
grown ish, like, what's the craziest lie or tall tale
you and Barack had to tell your kids to get
(02:50):
them to do something when they were little.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Oh my goodness, that is a great question.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
So like, I don't know if there was a monster
under the bed.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
You know. Again, some of the you know, Robinson wisdom
was that our parents talk to us pretty straight about things.
My kids will tell you I am a notorious lecturer.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Right.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
Sometimes they'd be like, oh my god, I'm in trouble,
and we would it's a sit down and you have
a conversation about what happened, you know. So a bedtime
conversation would be first of all, you have to sleep
in your bed because you can't sleep with me forever,
(03:37):
and none of us get any sleep, so we all
have to go to sleep. You're right down the hall.
I know you're going to be scared, but guess what
you can get through. I mean, these are the kind
of conversation. So I didn't tend to tell a tale.
I actually talked about why it was important. And my
(03:58):
mom always says this. Sometimes we don't give our kids
credit for just really being able to hear the truth
that you know, and because sometimes that takes time, you know,
there was often that because I said so for sure,
But I tended to try to explain why do we
have to eat vegetables? I mean, you really do neat
(04:20):
fiber and roffage, and you don't like it because your
taste buds haven't, but you have to take a couple
of bites. You have to eat some of it, and
you're gonna sit there until you do. And I'm going
to try to make vegetables that you like. But part
of dinner is the vegetable and if you don't eat
the vegetable, you don't get the dessert. And then sticking
(04:42):
with it. So I tended to, you know, as my
kids would say, we would have conversations about everything because
I just assume that I really explained it. I gave
my kids credit for being bright, not brighter than most,
but I think all kids are really smart, and I
think that they can understand explain it at their age,
(05:05):
their terms, their what have you, their their way of
seeing the world. You know your kid better than anyone.
You know what they know, You know how to talk
to them. And I always felt Barack and I always
felt like we could talk to the girls and just
explain the bigger picture because I think if they I
always felt like if they understood the context, then at
(05:25):
least they could work with all the information. You know,
I love that, So I tended not to make up
too much stuff. But I'm sure there's something that I'm
just not remembering. Well, I'll have to check with Malia
and Sasha and get back to you on Oh.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
I can't wait to hear if they if they have
any stories. Well, and now that you know, as you mentioned,
they're in LA, they're out having careers in the world.
It must be so incredible to watch, you know, as
a mom these adults they have grown into. And I
also bet being an empty nester is kind of because like,
(06:01):
you get to do whatever you want.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
What is your nine to five? Who are you going
to cocktails with?
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Like I want to know what your life and your
social life looks like right now?
Speaker 3 (06:10):
Man, it is whatever I want, Sophia, It's whatever I want.
It's the f I love it for you in my
life that all of my choices are for me. But
it's also a little scary because as a mom and
a busy person I always had. It was somebody else's excuse.
Why didn't I do this? Why haven't I gone there? Well,
(06:32):
I have to make sure the girls are okay, or
my husband's president, so I can't. I can't do that.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
That's a good get out of jail free card. I'm
so sorry, I can't come. I'm married to the president.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
Yeah, it's like so, so now you know, I can't
blame my decisions and indecisions on anyone other than me.
And I don't know about a lot of your listeners,
but as a woman, I think if I'm honest with myself,
I could have made a lot of these decisions years ago.
But I didn't give myself that freedom, you know, I
(07:08):
you know, maybe I maybe even as much as I
let my kids live their own lives, I use their
lives as an excuse for why I couldn't do something.
And now that's gone, and so now I have to
look at my I get to look at my calendar,
which I did this year was a real big example
(07:31):
of me myself looking at something that I was supposed
to do, you know, without naming names, and I chose
to do what was best for me, not what I
had to do, not what I thought other people wanted
me to do. And between you and me, that was
(07:52):
an important test for me just as a woman, as
an independent person, because like all women on all a
lot of people, I operate from guilt. What should I do?
What is the best thing for everybody else? Right? Because
it's easier for me to say, well, I did this
because it was what I was supposed to do. Right.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
Yes, we'll be back in just a minute. But here's
a word from our sponsors.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
My therapist gave me this trick that has really illuminated
this for me because we were talking about stress and
busy and this and that, and I said, you know,
and I need to do this and I need to
do that.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
And he said, stop saying.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Need to What do you want to do? What do
you do that you want to do? And how many
things that you actually want to do? Do you tell
yourself you need to do so you guilt yourself into
doing them on time? And that was like a woe
for me. Yeah, yeah, is tennis one of your wants
to dos on your calendar.
Speaker 3 (08:57):
Is an absolute want to do? Because first I don't
want to do cardio and you know I have just
realized I don't like just straight cardio, but I love
learning how to do something else right, and I love
getting cardio. I'm trying to figure out how to hit
a two handed backhand with top spin. Right. The time
(09:20):
goes by, right, and before you know it, I've sweated
for ninety minutes and I've had to unpack something, and
I've been able to take my mind off of everything
else other than watch that ball. Watch the ball, hit
it low, swing up, finish your swing state facing sideways.
I mean, I just find that to be a bit meditative. Right,
(09:44):
So tennis is look right now, this podcast, I amo
is what I want to do. It's not what I
have to do, It's what I want to do. And
I think a lot of this also has to do
with me losing my mom this year, right, and they
is just she was our last elder, right, and now
(10:04):
we're it and me and Craig, my brother, are looking
at each other like, oh okay, we ready for this.
But I feel like it's time for me to make
some big girl decisions about my life and to own
it fully, right, because if not now, when what am
I waiting for? What am I going to spend the
next twenty years, you know, because look the you know,
(10:27):
the summers are. We're in summer countdown at sixty one, right,
it's not so tragic, you know if something happens to
you and you're eighty, right, So you know, now is
the time for me to start asking myself these hard
questions of who do I want? Who do I truly
want to be every day? And that changes? So who
(10:51):
do I want to have a lunch with? How long
do I want to stay in a place? Do I
want to travel? If a girlfriend calls and says let's
go here, I can say yes, I can't. And I'm
trying to do that more and more. So what does
it look like? It looks like whatever I want it
to look like. And I still find time to you know,
(11:12):
give speeches, to be out there in the world, to
work on projects. I still care about girls' education. We
you know, the library is opening in a year from now.
Certain things I am and am not doing with the library.
But the interesting thing is that when I say no,
for the most part, people are like, I get it,
(11:34):
and I'm okay, right, And that's the thing that we
as women, I think we struggle with, like disappointing people. Yeah,
you know, I mean so much so that this year
people were you know, they couldn't even fathom that I
was making a choice for myself. That they had to
assume that my husband and I are divorcing, you know,
(11:54):
that this couldn't be a grown woman just making a
set of decisions herself, right right. But that's what that's
what society does to us. We start actually finally like going,
what am I? What am I doing? You know, what
am I doing this for? And if it doesn't fit
into the sort of stereotype of what people think we
(12:18):
should do, then it gets labeled as something negative and horrible.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
Yeah, well, there's always got to be drama if it
doesn't look like other people's choices.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
And I think for you, really, for both of you
as a as a you know, viewer from the outside,
but a person who's been honored to know you for
a long time.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
I'm just like, God, look at them being happy. I
love this. You're back and forth to Hawaii. Please let my.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Life be so dramatic on my sixty first birthday. Can
I just tell you, speaking of life choices and the
irony is you reminded me of my own. You are
telling so many amazing stories. You're producing so much beautiful content.
The books are gorgeous. I can't wait to come to
the library. I will sob you know this about a
(13:12):
week and you will be like, it's not even your
library came down, But I will cry. But one of
the things that has tickled me and touched me so
immensely in the last year is one of your many projects.
It's The Later Daters. I have sobbed every episode. And
let me tell you something. It's because it takes what
(13:35):
we should do and gives us what we could do.
It is a story turning love on its head. And
I did the thing that we do as women, and
I did everything I was supposed to do for everybody else.
And I did the checklist that Steve Harvey told me
to make, and I showed up and I did the coaching,
and I did the classes, and I did the therapy,
and I built the life. And I got to the
(13:57):
end of the list and I was like, I am
so sad and miserable. I am going to exit my
own life stage left and I'm going to start over.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
And I was like, can I do this at forty Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:07):
And then you're out here making the show about people
in their elder years finding love.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
And I was like, we can do it anytime.
Speaker 3 (14:13):
Man, How fly are these people?
Speaker 2 (14:15):
I mean they're amazing.
Speaker 3 (14:16):
They are just you know, and full of confidence, especially
the women.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Yes, what made you want to do this?
Speaker 3 (14:25):
Well? You know higher ground our production company, you know,
we are all things. You know, that's the whole point
of storytelling is embracing all types of storytelling, not just
sort of the tear jerker, serious kind of documentary things,
which are very important. We've done some amazing stuff in
that category. But it's about touching everyone in every way.
(14:48):
And unscripted programming is it's an important genre now. Reality
TV is a part of life, and I'm a fan
of reality TV, and so it was very important for
our company to reflect not just my husband's taste, but
mine as well. But I said to our team, but
(15:11):
there's a way that I want to do it. You know,
it's got to be about learning, it's got to be
about that adding value. And at my age, my friends
who are not married, they are the later daters. And
we spent a lot of time sitting around talking about
how do you get back out there? What do you do?
(15:33):
You know, and so I'm just so pleased with the
production team. We worked with the folks who create Love
on the Spectrum and another Netflix unscripted show, and it's
one of my favorites, that Queer So when I talked
on my team about the kind of unscripted stuff that
I love, you know, I wanted to walk away crying
(15:55):
and feeling whole. Right. I talked about Queer Eye, you know,
that was those were the models I talked about Love
on the Spectrum, and I think that our team, you know,
delivered with later daters. And it's such a fun show
for everyone to watch. I mean, I've sat around watching
it with my girlfriends. I've sat around watching it with
my girlfriends and their daughters and they're just it just
(16:16):
sparks the kind of conversation and it reminds us that
life goes on. We are we in our fifties and sixties,
plus we are entering our best years, and I want
women in particular to embrace that part of themselves. So
I'm very excited. We're hoping that Netflix will renew it.
You know, we're in conversations now for what a second
(16:38):
season is. So I will tell all the listeners let
Netflix know if you like it. It's up to them
to whether we do a second seases.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
So okay, let's get the people listening to the podcast
posting about this. That's a good side of social media. Yes,
and now a word from our sponsors that I really
enjoy and I think you will too. This is a
perfect segue into a few rapid fires. I want to
(17:07):
ask you what is it? Can be a guilty pleasure
or just a pleasurable TV show? Is it reality?
Speaker 3 (17:13):
Oh? Oftentimes it is reality, you know, because when I
go to TV, I just want to turn off. I
am a you know, well, white Lotus is not reality,
but I am a White Lotus er. I am a
real housewives person. I love the dating shows, you know. Okay,
(17:36):
I don't agree with them all, but you know I
love to watch. My kids will have me watching the girls.
What's the one where they're all on it in a
I'm forgetting the name of it, but I only watch
it with them when the couples are on an island.
Is it Love Island?
Speaker 2 (17:54):
Love Island?
Speaker 3 (17:55):
Yeah? Where they have the British version and an American version. Yes,
I watched that only with them because I'm as amused
at their feedback and their commentary as I am with
what's going on? Oh that's so fun, So I'll go
to reality TV if if but I loved uh what
(18:20):
was this? Is my my menopause? Bring? Uh uh uh?
Running Point? The new Basketball?
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Yes, so good?
Speaker 3 (18:30):
And what was the one about the see I'm so
bad with names. The nobody wants.
Speaker 1 (18:37):
This fabulous And the resurgence of Adam Brody I mean
my our early Aunts boyfriend. That felt really really nice
for me for sure, And I love.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
Shrinking my favorite favorite with Harrison Forward. That whole past
is amazing. I love that showrunner. I'm a ted Lasso fan.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
To me too, me too, So those.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Are that the kind of I need light. And Barack
and I we sometimes argue over what can we watch
jointly because he likes death and darkness and then every
I said, you know, you like the plots where everybody's
sad and then they die.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
Wait, but this is like Ashland and I.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
I want to watch a rom com because I'm exhausted
at all she wants to watch is murder dyline, Yeah,
documentaries about murder.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
I'm like, this is a trauma response. I don't know
what we're.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
Doing to break.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
I want to have a cocktail and laugh while we
watch TV.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
And I'm also like a big HGTV fan because that's
like my golf. Okay, Barrock puts on golf, like to
have the sound off if I just need the TV
on at home, Reno, I love all of them.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
Do you watch In with the Old on HBO Max?
Speaker 3 (19:52):
No, I haven't seen that. Tell me about that.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Oh, it is a home renovation show. The whole thing
is that an every episode they go to some different
city in the country and you watch a couple, a family,
parent and child renovate an old historic property.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
I've seen the previews. I have to watch one of those.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
I'm obsessed.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
Okay, all right, I'm obsessed with it. Okay, we've stayed
on TV for a day. Sorry, Okay, are you coffee
or tea, tea caffeinated or cam a meal in.
Speaker 3 (20:24):
The morning and then like once a week I'll do
an espresso.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
Oh oh, she spices it up a little bit.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
I'm not I'm not a big I don't need caffeine.
I don't you know. What I will do is like
if I'm doing a speech or I need a pick
me up, I literally take a sip of a diet
doctor pepper or a diet coke. I can't drink a
whole one, so I don't need caffeine or sugar that much.
(20:51):
I don't find that I drag in the morning, you know,
So I drink tea because it's I put honey in it,
and it's like it's a little okay.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
That's that that you don't need coffee in the morning.
That's that Robinson motivation, early alarm clock training. She's got
it up. What is your go to cocktail or? Is
it a glass of wine?
Speaker 3 (21:11):
Oh, vodka? Martini? Dry, straight up olives all very cold,
very girl barely any vermouth. I love very dry. He
introduced me to that drink. I didn't drink drinks until
I started dating him, and then he dated or ordered
a martini in one of our first dates, and I thought, ooh,
(21:33):
so fancicated. He's a man about town.
Speaker 2 (21:39):
Martini is also such a sexy date drink.
Speaker 3 (21:41):
It is, and it's so clean, and I love the glass.
And olives aren't bad if you're hungry.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
They're really not. It's nice to have a snack and
a cocktail.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
Just before the pandemic started, I was on this trip,
I went to Paris for a week with my best
gay with my best gay guy friend, and we were
like having a time being like, oh, wouldn't it be
cute if we were in love with each other?
Speaker 2 (22:00):
We are but not like that.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
And we were having martinis and we were like, should
we move here this summer? Are we going to meet
the loves of our lives in Paris? And then the
world shut down. We were like, well, well, well we'll
always have Paris. Like in the movies, if there were
to be a museum about you and your life, what
would the merchant the gift shop to be, Oh, you know,
(22:24):
other than a nice martini shaker.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
It would be well, you know, it's too soon, but
there will be a gift book in our museum, especially
for me, But really too soon to announce it, but okay,
at some point we'll talk about it. But okay, it
would probably be be something wearable, right, I mean, yeah,
(22:49):
I'm a fashion girl, and I think that everybody would.
Everybody loves a cute T shirt that's kind of with
a nice saying, that was kind of cool and edgy,
you know that that was fitted. You know, it was
something that I would want to wear right, Yeah, it'd
probably be a T shirt.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Speaking of speaking of the fashion girlies, did you see
that collab that Micheleen Thomas did with Marfa Stance, that
jacket company.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Yes, I was like, well, I'm ordering myself to trench goat. Okay,
I want to talk to you forever. I also want
you to go to the beach because you're doing whatever
you want and you deserve it.
Speaker 3 (23:31):
Well. Right now I want to talk to you so well.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
But this has just been absolutely lovely. Until I can
take you for a martini somewhere we're in the same city.
I will let you go back to your day, but
not before I get to ask you my favorite question
to ask everyone who graces me with their time. As
you look at the world ahead, the year ahead, for you,
(23:58):
what feels like you're working progress?
Speaker 2 (24:02):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (24:02):
For me personally, it.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
Can be personal, professional, anything you want.
Speaker 3 (24:08):
I think I'll stick with personal because right now that's
what I think I have control over, right and and
that's what the work is. It's me focusing on being
the best me that I can be. Because when the
world feels out of control, when the problems seemed big,
as I've said, in the light, the best thing is
(24:29):
to go a little small and to start with what
you can control. And for me, it's my health, it's
my mental health, it's my choices, my decisions in life.
I think I will continue to offer my advice, my
direction to people. I will tell people to vote, I
will I will express what I what I think when
(24:52):
the time comes. But I've learned that I really can
only control me, and if we all kind of do that,
control me, my orbit, the girls that I brought into
the world, my daughter's helping them become amazing people who
were thoughtful and empathetic and not afraid. You know, if
we all just did that, we'd be in a good place.
(25:16):
So I'm gonna keep keep working on the me that
is always the work in progress, because we are always
still becoming and that won't change.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
So yeah, I mean, that's the hope, right if we
if we stop becoming, we're probably dying.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Yeah yeah, So how lucky are we to be on
the adventure.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
Let's let's continue to be blessed, to feel blessed and
grateful for that and find our happiness and joy there
and not rely on things that are external that we
don't have control over. We got to redefine what happiness
is these days, right, And I'm having a lot of
(26:00):
those conversations with the young people in my life as well.
It's like, I think we've kind of gotten not a whack.
And when Craig and I were growing up and your
mom was growing up, happiness was you got ice cream,
you know, every now and then, right, you got maybe
one birthday party your entire life. We were happy because
(26:22):
we got three toys at Christmas, you know, and we
were happy. So I'm trying to teach my girls how
to right size their happiness and not to base it
on external stuff and likes and influencing and money. It's
(26:43):
steering us in the wrong direction and it's not making
us kinder and more empathetic. And I want to lead
with that and for the people in my orbit, I
want them to practice that. So I got to keep
working on it too.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
Yeah, that's beautiful. Thank you.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
Thanks for having me, babe.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
An absolute joy. It's so nice to see you too.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
Now you have to reciprocate, so you got to come
and hang out with me and Craig.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
I'd love to.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
And make sure you're We want listeners, we want your
your folks to listen in and in questions and tell
us what they think. And you know, if for no
other reason, they're making me happy because I get to
talk to them, so it keeps me connected. So I'm
looking forward to it.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
Oh well, we can't wait.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
We'll play, we'll do more things.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
All right, indeed, I'm here.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
Thanks so much. It's great to be with you.
Welcome back everyone. Our conversation with Michelle Obama continues. I
think your point about the fear, you know, it's so
human to not want your children to hurt. And it's interesting,
I've never talked about this, but you're illuminating something for
me that in my adulthood, my mom and I have
(00:32):
been healing because my mom went through a really you know,
my mom did not grow up the way I did.
She did not have, you know, the life that I did.
She went through you know, immigration with her own mother,
the classic beautiful Elis Island story, but the reality was hard,
and you know, she lived in a housing project in
(00:53):
the Bronx and sometimes had nothing to eat but a
piece of bread and salt that she would make into
a sandwich. And my mom had such fear about me
suffering the way she suffered, that there were ways she
tried to protect me. And it took a while for
us to come back around, for her to not understand
(01:13):
why I was doubting myself in this really important moment,
and for us to unpack that.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
I knew she.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
Loved me, but I didn't always think she trusted me. Yeah,
And so I hadn't really learned how to trust myself.
And in that moment, we had this breakthrough as two women,
and I learned about these things that happened in her
childhood that she had shame about, that she never wanted
to tell me about because she never wanted me to
be scared that it would happen to us, because come
(01:43):
hell or high water, she wouldn't let it. And it
was this moment where she saw me as more human,
I saw her as more human, and we both were like,
whoa you know? And then what will the next generation
of children have? Because we have these tools? And I
think there's such beauty in your willingness to share it
(02:04):
in the stories you've told us, in the books, in
the stories you're telling right now. Can I ask you
a bit of a humorous question, only because I am
now lucky enough to not only love the best person
in the world, but the best person in the world
came with the two best kids.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
In the world.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
And like Toddler, math is crazy, you know, And there
are moments where I'm like, how.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Do I I am an actor?
Speaker 1 (02:29):
I can make up a story, right, Like, how do
I tell a story that is going to get this
child to survive or sleep through the night or whatever.
So if you don't mind me asking now that they're
grown ish, like, what's the craziest lie or tall tale
you and Barack had to tell your kids to get
(02:50):
them to do something when they were little.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Oh my goodness, that is a great question.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
So like, I don't know if there was a monster
under the bed.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
You know. Again, some of the you know, Robinson wisdom
was that our parents talk to us pretty straight about things.
My kids will tell you I am a notorious lecturer.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Right.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
Sometimes they'd be like, oh my god, I'm in trouble,
and we would it's a sit down and you have
a conversation about what happened, you know. So a bedtime
conversation would be first of all, you have to sleep
in your bed because you can't sleep with me forever,
(03:37):
and none of us get any sleep, so we all
have to go to sleep. You're right down the hall.
I know you're going to be scared, but guess what
you can get through. I mean, these are the kind
of conversation. So I didn't tend to tell a tale.
I actually talked about why it was important. And my
(03:58):
mom always says this. Sometimes we don't give our kids
credit for just really being able to hear the truth
that you know, and because sometimes that takes time, you know,
there was often that because I said so for sure,
But I tended to try to explain why do we
have to eat vegetables? I mean, you really do neat
(04:20):
fiber and roffage, and you don't like it because your
taste buds haven't, but you have to take a couple
of bites. You have to eat some of it, and
you're gonna sit there until you do. And I'm going
to try to make vegetables that you like. But part
of dinner is the vegetable and if you don't eat
the vegetable, you don't get the dessert. And then sticking
(04:42):
with it. So I tended to, you know, as my
kids would say, we would have conversations about everything because
I just assume that I really explained it. I gave
my kids credit for being bright, not brighter than most,
but I think all kids are really smart, and I
think that they can understand explain it at their age,
(05:05):
their terms, their what have you, their their way of
seeing the world. You know your kid better than anyone.
You know what they know, You know how to talk
to them. And I always felt Barack and I always
felt like we could talk to the girls and just
explain the bigger picture because I think if they I
always felt like if they understood the context, then at
(05:25):
least they could work with all the information. You know,
I love that, So I tended not to make up
too much stuff. But I'm sure there's something that I'm
just not remembering. Well, I'll have to check with Malia
and Sasha and get back to you on Oh.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
I can't wait to hear if they if they have
any stories. Well, and now that you know, as you mentioned,
they're in LA, they're out having careers in the world.
It must be so incredible to watch, you know, as
a mom these adults they have grown into. And I
also bet being an empty nester is kind of because like,
(06:01):
you get to do whatever you want.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
What is your nine to five? Who are you going
to cocktails with?
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Like I want to know what your life and your
social life looks like right now?
Speaker 3 (06:10):
Man, it is whatever I want, Sophia, It's whatever I want.
It's the f I love it for you in my
life that all of my choices are for me. But
it's also a little scary because as a mom and
a busy person I always had. It was somebody else's excuse.
Why didn't I do this? Why haven't I gone there? Well,
(06:32):
I have to make sure the girls are okay, or
my husband's president, so I can't. I can't do that.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
That's a good get out of jail free card. I'm
so sorry, I can't come. I'm married to the president.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
Yeah, it's like so, so now you know, I can't
blame my decisions and indecisions on anyone other than me.
And I don't know about a lot of your listeners,
but as a woman, I think if I'm honest with myself,
I could have made a lot of these decisions years ago.
But I didn't give myself that freedom, you know, I
(07:08):
you know, maybe I maybe even as much as I
let my kids live their own lives, I use their
lives as an excuse for why I couldn't do something.
And now that's gone, and so now I have to
look at my I get to look at my calendar,
which I did this year was a real big example
(07:31):
of me myself looking at something that I was supposed
to do, you know, without naming names, and I chose
to do what was best for me, not what I
had to do, not what I thought other people wanted
me to do. And between you and me, that was
(07:52):
an important test for me just as a woman, as
an independent person, because like all women on all a
lot of people, I operate from guilt. What should I do?
What is the best thing for everybody else? Right? Because
it's easier for me to say, well, I did this
because it was what I was supposed to do. Right.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
Yes, we'll be back in just a minute. But here's
a word from our sponsors.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
My therapist gave me this trick that has really illuminated
this for me because we were talking about stress and
busy and this and that, and I said, you know,
and I need to do this and I need to
do that.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
And he said, stop saying.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Need to What do you want to do? What do
you do that you want to do? And how many
things that you actually want to do? Do you tell
yourself you need to do so you guilt yourself into
doing them on time? And that was like a woe
for me. Yeah, yeah, is tennis one of your wants
to dos on your calendar.
Speaker 3 (08:57):
Is an absolute want to do? Because first I don't
want to do cardio and you know I have just
realized I don't like just straight cardio, but I love
learning how to do something else right, and I love
getting cardio. I'm trying to figure out how to hit
a two handed backhand with top spin. Right. The time
(09:20):
goes by, right, and before you know it, I've sweated
for ninety minutes and I've had to unpack something, and
I've been able to take my mind off of everything
else other than watch that ball. Watch the ball, hit
it low, swing up, finish your swing state facing sideways.
I mean, I just find that to be a bit meditative. Right,
(09:44):
So tennis is look right now, this podcast, I amo
is what I want to do. It's not what I
have to do, It's what I want to do. And
I think a lot of this also has to do
with me losing my mom this year, right, and they
is just she was our last elder, right, and now
(10:04):
we're it and me and Craig, my brother, are looking
at each other like, oh okay, we ready for this.
But I feel like it's time for me to make
some big girl decisions about my life and to own
it fully, right, because if not now, when what am
I waiting for? What am I going to spend the
next twenty years, you know, because look the you know,
(10:27):
the summers are. We're in summer countdown at sixty one, right,
it's not so tragic, you know if something happens to
you and you're eighty, right, So you know, now is
the time for me to start asking myself these hard
questions of who do I want? Who do I truly
want to be every day? And that changes? So who
(10:51):
do I want to have a lunch with? How long
do I want to stay in a place? Do I
want to travel? If a girlfriend calls and says let's
go here, I can say yes, I can't. And I'm
trying to do that more and more. So what does
it look like? It looks like whatever I want it
to look like. And I still find time to you know,
(11:12):
give speeches, to be out there in the world, to
work on projects. I still care about girls' education. We
you know, the library is opening in a year from now.
Certain things I am and am not doing with the library.
But the interesting thing is that when I say no,
for the most part, people are like, I get it,
(11:34):
and I'm okay, right, And that's the thing that we
as women, I think we struggle with, like disappointing people. Yeah,
you know, I mean so much so that this year
people were you know, they couldn't even fathom that I
was making a choice for myself. That they had to
assume that my husband and I are divorcing, you know,
(11:54):
that this couldn't be a grown woman just making a
set of decisions herself, right right. But that's what that's
what society does to us. We start actually finally like going,
what am I? What am I doing? You know, what
am I doing this for? And if it doesn't fit
into the sort of stereotype of what people think we
(12:18):
should do, then it gets labeled as something negative and horrible.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
Yeah, well, there's always got to be drama if it
doesn't look like other people's choices.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
And I think for you, really, for both of you
as a as a you know, viewer from the outside,
but a person who's been honored to know you for
a long time.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
I'm just like, God, look at them being happy. I
love this. You're back and forth to Hawaii. Please let my.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Life be so dramatic on my sixty first birthday. Can
I just tell you, speaking of life choices and the
irony is you reminded me of my own. You are
telling so many amazing stories. You're producing so much beautiful content.
The books are gorgeous. I can't wait to come to
the library. I will sob you know this about a
(13:12):
week and you will be like, it's not even your
library came down, But I will cry. But one of
the things that has tickled me and touched me so
immensely in the last year is one of your many projects.
It's The Later Daters. I have sobbed every episode. And
let me tell you something. It's because it takes what
(13:35):
we should do and gives us what we could do.
It is a story turning love on its head. And
I did the thing that we do as women, and
I did everything I was supposed to do for everybody else.
And I did the checklist that Steve Harvey told me
to make, and I showed up and I did the coaching,
and I did the classes, and I did the therapy,
and I built the life. And I got to the
(13:57):
end of the list and I was like, I am
so sad and miserable. I am going to exit my
own life stage left and I'm going to start over.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
And I was like, can I do this at forty Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:07):
And then you're out here making the show about people
in their elder years finding love.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
And I was like, we can do it anytime.
Speaker 3 (14:13):
Man, How fly are these people?
Speaker 2 (14:15):
I mean they're amazing.
Speaker 3 (14:16):
They are just you know, and full of confidence, especially
the women.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Yes, what made you want to do this?
Speaker 3 (14:25):
Well? You know higher ground our production company, you know,
we are all things. You know, that's the whole point
of storytelling is embracing all types of storytelling, not just
sort of the tear jerker, serious kind of documentary things,
which are very important. We've done some amazing stuff in
that category. But it's about touching everyone in every way.
(14:48):
And unscripted programming is it's an important genre now. Reality
TV is a part of life, and I'm a fan
of reality TV, and so it was very important for
our company to reflect not just my husband's taste, but
mine as well. But I said to our team, but
(15:11):
there's a way that I want to do it. You know,
it's got to be about learning, it's got to be
about that adding value. And at my age, my friends
who are not married, they are the later daters. And
we spent a lot of time sitting around talking about
how do you get back out there? What do you do?
(15:33):
You know, and so I'm just so pleased with the
production team. We worked with the folks who create Love
on the Spectrum and another Netflix unscripted show, and it's
one of my favorites, that Queer So when I talked
on my team about the kind of unscripted stuff that
I love, you know, I wanted to walk away crying
(15:55):
and feeling whole. Right. I talked about Queer Eye, you know,
that was those were the models I talked about Love
on the Spectrum, and I think that our team, you know,
delivered with later daters. And it's such a fun show
for everyone to watch. I mean, I've sat around watching
it with my girlfriends. I've sat around watching it with
my girlfriends and their daughters and they're just it just
(16:16):
sparks the kind of conversation and it reminds us that
life goes on. We are we in our fifties and sixties,
plus we are entering our best years, and I want
women in particular to embrace that part of themselves. So
I'm very excited. We're hoping that Netflix will renew it.
You know, we're in conversations now for what a second
(16:38):
season is. So I will tell all the listeners let
Netflix know if you like it. It's up to them
to whether we do a second seases.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
So okay, let's get the people listening to the podcast
posting about this. That's a good side of social media. Yes,
and now a word from our sponsors that I really
enjoy and I think you will too. This is a
perfect segue into a few rapid fires. I want to
(17:07):
ask you what is it? Can be a guilty pleasure
or just a pleasurable TV show? Is it reality?
Speaker 3 (17:13):
Oh? Oftentimes it is reality, you know, because when I
go to TV, I just want to turn off. I
am a you know, well, white Lotus is not reality,
but I am a White Lotus er. I am a
real housewives person. I love the dating shows, you know. Okay,
(17:36):
I don't agree with them all, but you know I
love to watch. My kids will have me watching the girls.
What's the one where they're all on it in a
I'm forgetting the name of it, but I only watch
it with them when the couples are on an island.
Is it Love Island?
Speaker 2 (17:54):
Love Island?
Speaker 3 (17:55):
Yeah? Where they have the British version and an American version. Yes,
I watched that only with them because I'm as amused
at their feedback and their commentary as I am with
what's going on? Oh that's so fun, So I'll go
to reality TV if if but I loved uh what
(18:20):
was this? Is my my menopause? Bring? Uh uh uh?
Running Point? The new Basketball?
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Yes, so good?
Speaker 3 (18:30):
And what was the one about the see I'm so
bad with names. The nobody wants.
Speaker 1 (18:37):
This fabulous And the resurgence of Adam Brody I mean
my our early Aunts boyfriend. That felt really really nice
for me for sure, And I love.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
Shrinking my favorite favorite with Harrison Forward. That whole past
is amazing. I love that showrunner. I'm a ted Lasso fan.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
To me too, me too, So those.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Are that the kind of I need light. And Barack
and I we sometimes argue over what can we watch
jointly because he likes death and darkness and then every
I said, you know, you like the plots where everybody's
sad and then they die.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
Wait, but this is like Ashland and I.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
I want to watch a rom com because I'm exhausted
at all she wants to watch is murder dyline, Yeah,
documentaries about murder.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
I'm like, this is a trauma response. I don't know
what we're.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
Doing to break.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
I want to have a cocktail and laugh while we
watch TV.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
And I'm also like a big HGTV fan because that's
like my golf. Okay, Barrock puts on golf, like to
have the sound off if I just need the TV
on at home, Reno, I love all of them.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
Do you watch In with the Old on HBO Max?
Speaker 3 (19:52):
No, I haven't seen that. Tell me about that.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Oh, it is a home renovation show. The whole thing
is that an every episode they go to some different
city in the country and you watch a couple, a family,
parent and child renovate an old historic property.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
I've seen the previews. I have to watch one of those.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
I'm obsessed.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
Okay, all right, I'm obsessed with it. Okay, we've stayed
on TV for a day. Sorry, Okay, are you coffee
or tea, tea caffeinated or cam a meal in.
Speaker 3 (20:24):
The morning and then like once a week I'll do
an espresso.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
Oh oh, she spices it up a little bit.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
I'm not I'm not a big I don't need caffeine.
I don't you know. What I will do is like
if I'm doing a speech or I need a pick
me up, I literally take a sip of a diet
doctor pepper or a diet coke. I can't drink a
whole one, so I don't need caffeine or sugar that much.
(20:51):
I don't find that I drag in the morning, you know,
So I drink tea because it's I put honey in it,
and it's like it's a little okay.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
That's that that you don't need coffee in the morning.
That's that Robinson motivation, early alarm clock training. She's got
it up. What is your go to cocktail or? Is
it a glass of wine?
Speaker 3 (21:11):
Oh, vodka? Martini? Dry, straight up olives all very cold,
very girl barely any vermouth. I love very dry. He
introduced me to that drink. I didn't drink drinks until
I started dating him, and then he dated or ordered
a martini in one of our first dates, and I thought, ooh,
(21:33):
so fancicated. He's a man about town.
Speaker 2 (21:39):
Martini is also such a sexy date drink.
Speaker 3 (21:41):
It is, and it's so clean, and I love the glass.
And olives aren't bad if you're hungry.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
They're really not. It's nice to have a snack and
a cocktail.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
Just before the pandemic started, I was on this trip,
I went to Paris for a week with my best
gay with my best gay guy friend, and we were
like having a time being like, oh, wouldn't it be
cute if we were in love with each other?
Speaker 2 (22:00):
We are but not like that.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
And we were having martinis and we were like, should
we move here this summer? Are we going to meet
the loves of our lives in Paris? And then the
world shut down. We were like, well, well, well we'll
always have Paris. Like in the movies, if there were
to be a museum about you and your life, what
would the merchant the gift shop to be, Oh, you know,
(22:24):
other than a nice martini shaker.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
It would be well, you know, it's too soon, but
there will be a gift book in our museum, especially
for me, But really too soon to announce it, but okay,
at some point we'll talk about it. But okay, it
would probably be be something wearable, right, I mean, yeah,
(22:49):
I'm a fashion girl, and I think that everybody would.
Everybody loves a cute T shirt that's kind of with
a nice saying, that was kind of cool and edgy,
you know that that was fitted. You know, it was
something that I would want to wear right, Yeah, it'd
probably be a T shirt.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Speaking of speaking of the fashion girlies, did you see
that collab that Micheleen Thomas did with Marfa Stance, that
jacket company.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Yes, I was like, well, I'm ordering myself to trench goat. Okay,
I want to talk to you forever. I also want
you to go to the beach because you're doing whatever
you want and you deserve it.
Speaker 3 (23:31):
Well. Right now I want to talk to you so well.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
But this has just been absolutely lovely. Until I can
take you for a martini somewhere we're in the same city.
I will let you go back to your day, but
not before I get to ask you my favorite question
to ask everyone who graces me with their time. As
you look at the world ahead, the year ahead, for you,
(23:58):
what feels like you're working progress?
Speaker 2 (24:02):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (24:02):
For me personally, it.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
Can be personal, professional, anything you want.
Speaker 3 (24:08):
I think I'll stick with personal because right now that's
what I think I have control over, right and and
that's what the work is. It's me focusing on being
the best me that I can be. Because when the
world feels out of control, when the problems seemed big,
as I've said, in the light, the best thing is
(24:29):
to go a little small and to start with what
you can control. And for me, it's my health, it's
my mental health, it's my choices, my decisions in life.
I think I will continue to offer my advice, my
direction to people. I will tell people to vote, I
will I will express what I what I think when
(24:52):
the time comes. But I've learned that I really can
only control me, and if we all kind of do that,
control me, my orbit, the girls that I brought into
the world, my daughter's helping them become amazing people who
were thoughtful and empathetic and not afraid. You know, if
we all just did that, we'd be in a good place.
(25:16):
So I'm gonna keep keep working on the me that
is always the work in progress, because we are always
still becoming and that won't change.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
So yeah, I mean, that's the hope, right if we
if we stop becoming, we're probably dying.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Yeah yeah, So how lucky are we to be on
the adventure.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
Let's let's continue to be blessed, to feel blessed and
grateful for that and find our happiness and joy there
and not rely on things that are external that we
don't have control over. We got to redefine what happiness
is these days, right, And I'm having a lot of
(26:00):
those conversations with the young people in my life as well.
It's like, I think we've kind of gotten not a whack.
And when Craig and I were growing up and your
mom was growing up, happiness was you got ice cream,
you know, every now and then, right, you got maybe
one birthday party your entire life. We were happy because
(26:22):
we got three toys at Christmas, you know, and we
were happy. So I'm trying to teach my girls how
to right size their happiness and not to base it
on external stuff and likes and influencing and money. It's
(26:43):
steering us in the wrong direction and it's not making
us kinder and more empathetic. And I want to lead
with that and for the people in my orbit, I
want them to practice that. So I got to keep
working on it too.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
Yeah, that's beautiful. Thank you.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
Thanks for having me, babe.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
An absolute joy. It's so nice to see you too.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
Now you have to reciprocate, so you got to come
and hang out with me and Craig.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
I'd love to.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
And make sure you're We want listeners, we want your
your folks to listen in and in questions and tell
us what they think. And you know, if for no
other reason, they're making me happy because I get to
talk to them, so it keeps me connected. So I'm
looking forward to it.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
Oh well, we can't wait.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
We'll play, we'll do more things.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
All right, indeed, I'm here.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
Thanks so much. It's great to be with you.
Host
Sophia Bush
Popular Podcasts
40s and Free Agents: NFL Draft Season
Daniel Jeremiah of Move the Sticks and Gregg Rosenthal of NFL Daily join forces to break down every team's needs this offseason.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.