November 18, 2024 • 48 mins
In preparation for the upcoming Gladiator 2, Jason and Rosie enter the Coliseum to revisit Gladiator. They discuss what makes Commodus such a great villain, the creative and brutal violence, and why this film stands among the best films of 2000. Then in the Omnibus, Jason cracks open the history books to share some Rome Facts.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Warning. Today's episode contains spoilers for the twenty five year
old movie Gladiator of I Ridly Scott. Well Gladier two
in theater soon. Be warned if you have out watched Gladiator,
then watch it before listening to this before seeing Gladiator
too and aply connected guys. Hello, my name is Jason
(00:37):
Casepsiote co host to a pod and I will have
my revenge in this life of the next.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
I weesday night. Are you not entertained?
Speaker 1 (00:46):
And welcome back to x me vision of the podcast
where we dive deep. It's your favorite shows, movies, comics
and pop culture coming from My Heart podcast where we
bring you between two and three and sometimes war episodes
every week Tuesday Thursday, with extra episodes on Wednesday.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
In today's episode, in the air Lock, we are revisiting
the five time Oscar winning film Gladiator by Ridley Scott
starring Russell Crowe, and in the omnibus, we are going
to dig into some of the history, both real life
and production wise, that gave us Gladiator and we'll lead
us in to the eagerly awaited Gladiator two.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Dun dundun all right. Gladiator the year two thousand, directed
by Ridley Scott, Gosh, what a film. I saw it
in the theaters. This is when I was working in
movie theaters, saw every movie and my reaction was, Wow,
what an insanely violent and good movie that.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Was so violent, like when I rewatched it for the pod.
So let me set this up. When I was a kid,
I saw this movie on VHS at my dad's house
and I was so upset when one of the guys
walks out to fight in the gladiatorial ring and just
before he goes out, he pisses himself, and I I
was so upset for how scared that guy was. I
(02:02):
think I just disassociated for the rest of the movie.
I've watched it since, but on this watch, I was
just blown away by the violence and also like, as
a horror fan, how inventive it is, Like Ridley Scott's like, really,
what are the craziest ways that people could die in
the Roman Empire? We're gonna do tiger fight shooting like
huge steaks into people's chests from shields. Yeah, Like I'm
(02:26):
gonna catapult a glass ball full of fire like a
hyper Molotov cocktail. Like there's so much invention in this movie.
When it comes to that and it is my little crew.
We always talk about like a dude's rock movie, and
this is definitely in that vein. Oh, this is a
dude's a rockin.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
This is a dude's being dudes hanging out with dudes
type movie where their dudes come together as a team
to accomplish the goal of reforming.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
Their rob That shit hit me really really hard when
I was rewatching it this morning. One because I love
Gime Hansu, who's so fantastic love. But also I have
to say, for such a violent movie that seems to
have a pretty simple premise, it actually does a really
interesting job of crafting those male friendships, those male connections,
the way that these men come together against the face
(03:16):
of this evil, maniacal sociopath leader of Rome. This movie
hit a lot harder for me this time. I'm really
glad that we're talking about it.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
It has a what I consider to be an iconic
soundtrack by Hans zimmer Yes that I still listen to,
particularly when I'm on a walk or running or trying.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Is really good walking music, main character musicastic.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
This is the breakout role for Russell Crowe, who got
the role off The Power of his performance in La Confidential,
where he plays a extremely angry cop, and looking back
at this movie after my now billion three watch, the
thing I like about Russell Crowe in this movie is
he looks like obviously he looks quite fit and big,
(04:02):
but he's also it's not the eighties and nineties where
guys were like no Sylvester Stallone Schwartz in it.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
And it's not like the MCU where you've got do
the diet.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Like yeah, he looks like just a guy.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
He looks like a guy who could probably win in
a fight.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
And I love that about this people. So Russell Crowe
plays Maximus Decimus Meridius, a general the Roman Army currently
on campaign in Germania. It is one eighty a d
in the Emperor Marcus Aurelius's reign is coming to an end.
He's quite old, and his campaign against the Germans is
also coming to an end. With this victory at Vinda Bona,
(04:37):
it appears that the Roman Empire's northern border will be solidified.
Marcus Aurelius is so taken by maximus goodness, his loyalty,
his dedication, his low family, his love of family, his
rejection of power. He really just wants to like get
this war done with and go home. He doesn't want
a politic in Rome. He doesn't want to do any
(04:57):
of that kind of stuff. And Mark this is so
impressed by this that he decides to overstep his own son,
the extremely immoral Commonists, and raise up Maximists in his stead.
But unfortunately he makes the grave mistake.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Rosie, why does he do that?
Speaker 1 (05:14):
Grave?
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Why does he do that?
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Grave?
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Your son is evil, bro Like, don't do that.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
Of telling his son alone. Don't, of course tell him,
but you gotta tell him in this take your door, yeah,
in the presence of your daughter and your guards and
probably Maximus, and just say, hey, Commonist, here's what's up.
You're not gonna be emperor. It's gonna be Maximus. Does
everybody see this?
Speaker 2 (05:37):
And guess what though, You're still gonna be living the
life of luxury. Yes, nothing bad's gonna happen to you.
You just don't have to be in control.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Commonists played with wonderful beta energy from Jaque Phoenix break.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Out role really here for Joaquin in this terrifying, terrify, terrifying.
It's kind of like, well, if Caligula was an Inceel
it's this really specific enjoyment of violence and cruelty. Yeah,
but he's got this sniveling there's a weakness, hatred and
resentment and weakness. Yea. The ironically is just of his
(06:12):
own making.
Speaker 1 (06:12):
And it makes him so effective as a villain. This
is a conversation I was having with my Coast of
Six Trophies, Chase Rano. I think that there are basically
three ways to do a great villain. I say two
ways on that pod, but having thought about it, I
think there's three ways.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Tell me what you think exclusive third way?
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Right? I think that the first way is even match
Batman and the Joker. They're evenly matched in different ways,
and it's a twelve round about the whole way through
who's gonna win? Second way is overpowering villain Darth Vader. Right,
he's so powerful and so scary Michael Myers, Sadie always
(06:49):
come back. You just don't understand how the hero could
possibly beat this person. How could they do it? This
villain is so scary. And then the third way, which
they do here is weak villain who has all the
cards in his favor. He's the leader of Rome, he's
got the army in his disposal. He's got any number
(07:11):
of minions that will do his will. But at the
same time, if you go one on one versus the hero,
there's no way this guy wins. Yeah, because he's such
a coward. He's weak. And I think that is so
effective in this movie, because you just are like, God,
let Maximus get this guy one on one.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Yeah, I know, right, And every time something I think
Ridley Scott does incredibly well narratively. Here he sets up
multiple moments where you think he will be able to
do it, but then something happens. A child attends, there's gods,
there's he misses the moment, commodist stands up, and they
really have you like chomping at the bit, like just
(07:48):
fucking get this guy. But I think you're right. I
think that's a really great read on those three and
I bet you and Shae could do a great little
mini book about that, like how to make a great villain.
But also as well, I think for me, this is
the scariest type of villain, and I think because it
is relatable, I agree to real life. It's also a
nightmare scenario where like the guy who bullied you at
(08:11):
school is the guy in charge gets all the power
in the world and is in charge, but never changes,
never grows, never learns anything, and instead is just so
furious and resentful that all they can do is just
create more cruelty.
Speaker 1 (08:27):
Maximus refuses to serve Commonists, who he suspects of killing Marcus,
and so Commonists basically says, well, this guy's gonna die.
He orders Maximus's execution, and he orders the execution of
his entire family. But Maximus escapes. Oh and he rides
his horse from Germania to Spain, which I will talk
(08:48):
about later. How long that probably took.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Yes, let's put like an asterisk like that, because we
are definitely going to be doing some extra vision of footnotes,
because that's a really good point. Is he Also something
that I've found really profound about this segment of the movie,
especially as it moves on, is you see Marcus's second
in command, Brutus, who's been there, who's been his ally,
who's been on the war with him, he just turns
(09:13):
on him and he's like, chopped this motherfucker's head off.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
Immediately is like I can see which way the wind
is blowing, I'm going that way.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
And that lack of loyalty is becomes so profound when
he then finds this community in the gladiatorial realms of fighting,
and I just thought that hits so hard. And also
this is one of my favorite parts where they're walking
him and he's gonna escape and it's cold, it's really cold,
and the guy tries to pull out the sword to
(09:39):
kill him and it gets stuck in Maximus goues sometimes
they get stuck in the cold and then just kills
them all because he has the moment. And that's when
you realize that this has almost like a proto John
Wick element to it, where it's like Maximus is like
a very good fighter, he's a killing machine and also
crazy in of deaths. In this moment as well, like
(10:02):
you already see what this man can do, just and
throwing swords.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
On the like on the movie.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
He throws the sword at him and hits him in
the chest. I was like screaming. I was like, put
this back in the fit as guys the modern cinema
audience would be like yelling and yelling.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
After his epic ride, he is exhausted and he finds
that his wife and child have been executed and his
farm is burned and now exhausted by his journey, he
collapses where he's found by slave traders who take him
to North Africa. He wakes up there. He's also was
(10:38):
injured when he escaped the Praetorian guards. He's got this
nasty injury, and when he comes to he realizes that
he is at a gladiatorial school, basically where they take
these enslaved folks and then make them fight for the
entrainment of people out here in the provinces of North Africa.
Guess what Maximus is good at. That he's really good.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
At and also because he has history as a soldier
and as a lieutenant and stuff. Sorry if I got
the wrong name wrong, but basically as a leader, right,
he trains his fellow gladiators in how to protect themselves
and how to fight together and win against these ever
growing threats that they throw into the ring. I have
(11:19):
to say, I just thought this was like an exceptionally
cool and interesting take. You know, we're recording this on Wednesday,
November six, so I think I was moved by some
of the moments of solidarity and community that they find.
And also I just thought it's unexpected when you think
about movies about men and the idea of lone wolf heroes.
But Maximus actually saves himself by helping other people and
(11:43):
teaching them how to save themselves, and I thought that
was It's really interesting and cool. And in one of
the earliest fights, we get what is maybe my favorite
fight in the movie, which is when Maximus and the
character played by jam and Hansuba Juba they're chained together
and they have to fight, and it's so amazing to
see the way that they learn each other's moves on
(12:05):
the go. It's you and you are just rooting for
them instantly. It's really really cool. And also I have
to I almost texted you this days, but I was like,
this is going to be so out of context if
I just randomly text you this. I was watching this
movie and I was like, man, I love Oliver Reed
in this. I fucking love Oliver Reed. Oliver Reed Proximo
the leader of the kind of gladiator.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
Guys during the movie, and they have to do some
CG stuff yea allow him to finish out his scenes.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
And that was one of the first times I think
they really did.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
One of the first times that was done, and it
was done quite seamlessly for the day. Even now watching
that scene, it works, It doesn't bump at all, and
he is just chewing the scenery.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
I love his energy. I feel like you need something
like that in one of these movies because if you
think back to the movies that this hearkens back to, right,
like Spartacus, those Sword and Sandals esque era movies, even
like Lawrence of Arabier Eve, like just movies that old
Hollywood epic scale. You're going to have at least one
scene Chua and I feel like Oliver Reed is delivering
(13:08):
in this role and it's kind of amazing to see
that against Jaimon and Russell, who are just doing these
really like straight down the line serious performances where you
really believe they have to survive.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
Maximus and the team, because of their success out here
in North Africa get taken by Proximo to Rome. They
called up to the big leagues, and there takes place
my favorite fight, Rosie, which is the fight in which
they are cast as the barbarian, these Hannibal's barbarians that
are supposed to lose the climactic battle between Rome and Carthage,
(13:44):
I think the Third Punic War or whatever, and instead
they turn the table. I love this because it gets
them all to work as a team. He's like, has
anybody been here in the army? One guy's like, I
fought with you, and he says, Okay, here's how we're
going to do it.
Speaker 2 (13:58):
And he understands the Battle of Carthage and what happens,
so he can basically use his knowledge to defeat. Yeah,
that is one of the coolest moments. I also love
how this is one of the moments I think Ridley
Scott does so well in this movie that often we
don't get nowadays in like a historical epic, the moment
when everyone in the audience is like cheering for them
(14:19):
and the gladiators start to realize that they won, and
you get these looks on the face of like pure joy.
And actually when they first go to Rome, there's this
really great, slightly dated but in a way that I
really love bit that Ridley Scott does where he overlays
all different people like cheering and talking and it feels
very very nineties, but it just fits so well. Like
(14:40):
it's ironic because there is a lot of violence in
this movie, but it's classical Hollywood energy. Does give me
like a kind of nostalgic feel. If this comes on TV,
I will always just put it on.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
There's a great moment in this fight where Hagen, who
is the big german guy, yeah, who doesn't immediately warm
to Maximus. Certainly during the time that they were at
the gladiator school, he's always been like, Hagen's a huge,
muscly guy, and I think he in some way looks
at Maximus and is like I could do what you're doing,
Like whatever.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
What can you do?
Speaker 1 (15:14):
And so he goes off on his own to try
and fight, separate from the group, and Maximus risks his
life to save him after he's injured, brings him back.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
And it's that moment that seals Hagen's loyalty to Maximus
and shows the value of everybody working to so they
win this exactly. They win this massive fight. Commonists comes down,
everybody's cheering, and Communist loves to be popular, so he
comes down to meet the gladiators.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
He's like, these guys seem cool. I should get them
on my side. That definitely couldn't be any weird connection
between us.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
Yeah, And it's there that Maximus reveals his identity, which
how many people could you think could actually hear it
in the arena, Like, definitely the people right on the ground,
but I don't think that.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
But otherwise, no one else, no one else, You're just
hearing cheering, scream people taking bets. I also love this
because this is another great moment in the woaquin Phoenix
kind of weak villain. He gets himself into this problem
because Maximus is happy to not reveal his identity, right,
He's got his little MF Doom mask on, he's hiding, and.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
He makes him do it. He's like, hey, he makes him.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
Do it, and then it's like, okay, bro, okay, you're
setting yourself up for a very big issue here, especially
because obviously your sister Lucilla played by Connie Nielsen the Legend,
she is a fan of Maximus and she thinks he's dead,
and nobody else is gonna be on your side if
you want to get rid of this man who knows
what you did, and obviously he does.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
Commonist then really really wants to order the execution of
all of these gladiators, including uh Maximus who spurred him.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
He's trying to do the thumbs down kill us.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
But again, he loves being popular and everybody, and he
can tell the crowd would immediately be really upset if
they did that, so he very begrudgingly goes thumbs up.
Speaker 2 (17:15):
Yeah, that must have been the hardest thumbs up that
man had ever done in his life. He was resembling.
Speaker 1 (17:20):
He was very resentabul This leads to one of the
funniest scenes I think in the entire movie, where they
immediately smashed cut commonist. It is palous and he's just like, oh,
oh my goodness, him, what are we gonna do? This
is so sad about crying.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
And you know what's really interesting is, like I think
it's a very interesting performance by Waki and who really
goes very hard on the villainy of it all. Because
actually this scene which is hilarious and I was cracking up,
But like, if you read this scene a different way,
or you had a different act to portray it, this
could be a scene that would give you empathy towards
this Carria who, no matter what he does, he's never
(18:02):
good enough for his dad, he's never good enough for
his people. Everyone else always comes above him. There's a
version of this character who that at least a certain
part of the audience would find relatability in but Joaquin
allows none of that. He is like, I'm going to
make this the most vile, hateful, loser character. And he
does a great job, honestly, and you just won't hand.
(18:23):
You're like, everybody conspire to get this motherfucker out because
he is not the one so communist.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Then sets up a rigged fight that Maximus has to
take part in against the retired greatest gladiator ever and
there's tigers that are waiting to attack him in the
moment he steps outside of the squared circle, but hears anyway.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
This is that stuff where I think when you think
about Gladiator, where when they're having this kind of climactic
fight and the rose petals are falling. Yeah, that's the
kind of stuff that Ridley Scott does well. I mean,
I'm very excited for Gladiator too, because I've seen some
hilarious Ridley Scott quotes. Because in the trailer they teased
that they flood the Colosseum and then the historians, since
(19:08):
historians were like, this wouldn't happen, and then this is
what Ridley Scott said. He said, if they can build
the Colosseum, they can flood it, and find a couple
of sharks. That's what he said, and I was like, yes,
Ridley Scott, I want to see Prescal punching a shark.
I really do that cinema to me.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
As Maximus's popularity grows, a cadre of disgruntled senators who
want to return Rome back to the Republic that it
once was, basically conspire with Maximus to try and elevate
him and bring back the Republic. Before any of that
can happen, Communist sets up the big fight between him
personally and Maximus.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
Absolutely unbelievable gumption.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
What told you?
Speaker 2 (19:47):
How did you ever think this was gonna work? Bro?
Of all the terrible plans in Hollywood movies, this is
probably the worst plan. I get it, you want to
look like you're stronger than him, But to me, I'm like,
my guy, just get some more gladia as somebody can
kill him, like someone can do it.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
Yes, somebody will eventually, and then.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
You can go down and chop off his head or
whatever you want to do. But this was a terrible plan, Commodist.
It was always going to end badly for you.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
Before the fight, you know, he's got Maximus chained up
and he's telling him we're gonna fight, but then he
like stabs him in the armpit a wound, like a
steadily bleeding wound from which and obviously disabled slowly die. Yeah.
They go into the ring and there's Maximus. He's wounded,
but he manages to fucking beat commedists. Yeah, and he
(20:36):
dies on the floor of the arena with his old
lieutenant and Connie Nielsen and the body of the Emperor
next to him and all these other people watching, and.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
He can see the afterlife and he's thinking about his family.
He's walking back in to.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
The afterlife and that actually you mentioned it, the fwalling petals.
There's all these moments. This is why Ridley Scott is
Realley Scott. There's all these poetic moments that enhance the vibe,
oh yeah, the charm and the themes of the movie.
And one of those is this scene that was actually
filmed by Russell Crows stunt double, the scene of like
(21:13):
touching the wee.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Yeah yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
He saw at one point Ridley saw this guy doing
this and was like, get the steady cam and follow
this guy. That's a cool oh.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Wow, And that became such a huge image.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
To touch back on and It's this moment of a
wonderful spirituality that is threaded throughout the film, and it
gives the film the weight. It's the beyond, just like
a John Wick this guy Kills Everybody type of movie.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
Also as well, I think that it is a rare
kind of hopefulness for a movie like this, because you're
going for the tragic ending. Maximus dies, but the end of.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
The movie they do not overthrow the rumin Emperor.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
Shocks. But the most important thing is not the fact
that Lucilla recognizes him as a hero in Rome and
they try and regain their freedom. The most important thing
is you get to see him walking back to his family.
Another one of the scenes that just devastated me when
I saw this as a kid was when he goes
back to his family, he sees their like burnt feet
where they've been hanged. And but yes, I really love
(22:13):
that if you watch the movie and you watch the
brutality and you follow this story, you actually get to
see him reunite with them in that same space, in
this kind of almost like black and white limon or
space that Ridley created. And I think that's very rare
for a movie like this to have that poetic nature,
that spirituality, that moment of hope, of like, actually he
(22:33):
does get to do the thing that he wanted the most,
we don't snatch it away from him. His death is
not the end, it's actually the beginning. I think that's
very beautiful. I will also say as well, I like
your use of the term poetic because in that moment
when he's Maximus is on the floor and he is
struggling to breathe and Lucilla's looking down on him, the
color of the sky behind her is just the brightest blue,
(22:56):
the brightest blue you've ever seen. Like, the way that
he uses color and con trass is so interesting. And also,
you know what, Jaimenhns, who's there at the end, Jubi
is there. You know I would have watched Gladiator two
with him. We're gonna talk about the many Gladiator two options,
actually because I'm obsessed with one of them. But yeah,
what a movie. I'm actually so so glad that we
(23:17):
got to revisit this because I don't know in twenty
twenty four, Man, this just hit so hard for me
and just spoke to me as a fun like dude's
rock bros hanging out almost slice of life. Like a
lot of times they're just like, this is what it's
hanging out the life of a gladiator. It's like a
lot of this movie is actually like very character based,
very slow, lots of waiting, lots of talking, lots of
(23:40):
not even much scheming or plotting. More just like we
might die what is important to you? And I think
that's really really cool and actually unusual and makes the
film age well. Also visually it looks so good. I
feel like if the kids on TikTok and it's watch
(24:01):
this movie, I feel like they're gonna do like comparisons
between how washed out modern cinema looks and the like
absolute saturated, beautiful color, big colors. Yes, is so appealing
to watch. Ridley Scott, you did it man, this is a.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
Well this is two thousand and it's on film correct.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's And that's why it looks so good. Yeah,
I mean it's beautiful.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
That'll lead us to Gladier two, which is set fifteen
years after the events of the original film and is
focused on the adventure of the son of Lucilla played
by Connie Nilsen, the nephew of Commedis.
Speaker 2 (24:37):
Who is the main part of this movie, he is
essentially commedist almost uses him as like a human shield.
Most times we see him brought out as if he's worried,
he wants to look good, but he doesn't really care
about him. But Lucias did grow up in this very
royal regal household, so I'm very interested to see how
they set it up where he ends up in a
(24:58):
similar situation. Because also something I want to say about
this movie that I do also love. I love Alexander Dumas,
and I love the Count of Montey Cristo, and this
is essentially a Count of Monty Cristo's story, revenge story.
It's like and also the idea that you can rise
up the ranks and hide your identity until you need
to reveal it and get your revenge, just very Count
(25:18):
of Monty Cristo.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Early superhero archetype.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
But yeah, so he's gonna be basically he loved Maximus
and now that's gonna be the person who's fighting his
way up through the trials. Jason, I got to ask
you an important question. Yes, does Paul Mescal have the juice?
Speaker 1 (25:35):
We were gonna fuck, We're gonna find out, We're gonna
apparently they're saying that he has the juice. He's the juice.
Here's your top ten movies of the year two thousand.
Number one Mission Impossible Too, John wu.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
Probably lots of slow mo.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
Lots of SlowMo. Sadly one of the weakest. I think,
Oh it is.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
It's a Vibes movie, and you can enjoy a Vibes movie,
but it's definitely not the high point of a very
very high point filled franchise.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
That made half a billion dollar. Number two Gladiator. There
we are just under half a billion dollars. Number three Castaway,
Oh incredible Tour de fource by Tom Hanks, who's basically
in that movie alone.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
That is another movie. I will say, even though it's
just him and his beach ball, his football, I should
say that is a dude's rock movie. Dudes love Costaway
and they love to see this dude just chill him
on his own on the Costaway Beach.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Number three What Women Want starring the terrible Awful Mel
Gibson and Helen Hunt. The Wonderful Helen Hunt, The Wonderful
Mersey Tome, in which mel Gibson can hear women's thoughts.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
Creepy.
Speaker 1 (26:35):
Next up, Dinosaur, Oh, Dinosaur DNA. We've never spoken about
Dinosaur the movie ever.
Speaker 2 (26:43):
Ever. The only reason that it's still relevant to people
is it has a very terrifying ride in Animal Kingdom
that has traumatized many people, which I believe they're about
to take away. So good on Dinosaur. Who knew that
that was one of the top five biggest movies. I
would never have seen it coming.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
Next Jim Carrey, Oh, how the Grinch Stole Christmas? Number six, the.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
Loved Christmas movie. Still people love it to this day.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
Number seven, and you forget what a huge smash this
was and the sequels that came from it. Meet the Parents,
Robert de Niro and Ben Stiller.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
Dude, that was a time when a mid range comedy
could become a full quadrant success.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Yes, could be the number seven movie for the year. Wow.
Number eight The Perfect Storm, Oh my Gosh, starring a
Wahlberg and Clooney and about the fishing boat that goes
up the wave CG Wave, The CG Wave. I saw
it in the theater and I thought, what was what's
the fuss about?
Speaker 2 (27:32):
What's the fuss about? It's just okay?
Speaker 1 (27:35):
Number nine, Get this X Men. Number nine what imagine that?
Speaker 2 (27:40):
What turn around for the books, especially because X Men
was still seen as a massive success.
Speaker 1 (27:45):
That's right, and number ten rounding out the top ten,
Harrison Ford, Michelle Pfeiffer, What Lies Beneath?
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Okay, I love that movie. I love a good weird
eroic thrill.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
I do like that movie as well.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
Wow, what crazy year, and honestly Gladiates to be up there.
I'm glad that people went to see it.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
Other notable films of that period Crashing Tiger, Oh Hidden,
Dragon Love.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
It should have been on that Love that traffic, Oh.
Speaker 1 (28:10):
Love It almost famous, bombed at the theater, but cleaned
up critically.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
Became a full cult classic.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
Aaron Brockovich, Julia Roberts has come Back.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
That's a truly groundbreaking movie for ha and also just
for like the waste in a mock perceived like a
true story movie. So that's huge.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
And file this one under another movie that they don't
make any more, wonder Boys. Oh wow, the Curtis Hansen
Steve Cloves production. That's I think one. An Oscar for
Best Original Song, starring Michael Douglas and a young Tobey
Maguire has his kind of acolyte, who loves Michael Douglas,
who plays an author his writing. Next up, Rome Facts.
Speaker 4 (29:05):
Welcome back, and it's time for Rome Facts Room facts
in the omnip Facts about Rome.
Speaker 2 (29:10):
This is what men love. They love a fact about
Jack And how often do you think about the Vermin
Empire a little bit.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
I'm looking back at my I'm looking back at my
bookshelf right now. There's a recent book on the history
of Ravenna, which became the second capital of the Western
Roman Empire. There's a bunch of other stuff, the history
of Byzantine emperors. I think about it a bit as
a person who loves history.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
You are history love.
Speaker 1 (29:35):
I'm a history lover. So let's start at the very
beginning for Rome. You know what I love. I love
foundational myths.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
Oh yeah, and love a good man.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
And Rome has a really cool foundational myth. They thought
of their history as like part legend and part history,
which is really cool. According to Roman foundational myth, one
day during the reign of the seventh and last King
of Rome, Tarquinis, tarquin Is the star Wars fans now
came before the king, and she had nine big books
(30:04):
of Greek oracular poetry, which she offered to the king
at like an insane price, like whatever, like the GDP
of Rome for a year like this was when Rome
was just like a middling kingdom, not a big deal.
But she offered it to them at like a price
that would bankrupt the kingdom. The King's like, no, are
you kidding? It's too much.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Get away, I don't need these books.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
She goes off, burns three of the books, comes back
with six, and says, here's the six remaining books for
the original price. The king refused again, but this time
he was a little concerned.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
He was stress.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
He's like, hold on a second, Okay, I'm still gonna
decline it.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
It seems like maybe something is important in these maybe
she goes off.
Speaker 1 (30:44):
She burns three more books, comes back with the remaining three,
again offering at the original break the bank price. Now
the king, probably very anxiously, goes to the priests and says, hey,
what do we do about this? These books? Do we
need these books? The priests are absolutely alarmed that six
(31:05):
of the books have already been burned and says buy them.
Let over the price, buy them. So Tarkanis buys the books,
and they contained We actually don't know what the prophecies.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
Were, how they the text didn't like survive, that's.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
Right, But it's generally thought that the poems were in
hexamin or Greek verse, and then written in an acrostic
form where the first letter of each line read down
vertically down spelled the first line of the prophecy. And
these prophecies dealt with things like twins are born, or
(31:40):
a calf with two heads are born, or there's wildfires
a comet, and when Rome would face an emergency, they
would go down. These were kept in the temple of Jupiter.
We know they really existed because they were kept in
secrecy for hundreds of years, and only they were a
state secret, and they were referenced like when Rome really
needed them, so they would go down. The priests would
(32:02):
go down there and look up the thing in the
book and see what the prescription would be, and it
would be some sort of ritual that would offset disaster.
Now we again we know that they really existed. They
were kept under the temporal of Jupiter until they were
destroyed by a fire in a three BC. And this
tells you how valuable the Romans considered these books. They
then sent emissaries out all across the known world looking
(32:26):
for copies of the books, and one of the ways
they were able to kind of in their minds authenticate
like the real pages was if they were also acrostic. Yeah,
so they were prioritizing other acrostic poetry from books that
were similar, and they kind of reassembled the tone, but
that they were lost for good, like in the fifth
(32:46):
century sometime they were burned again. Wild, Let's talk about emperors.
There's a lot of emperor talk. Let's go down the
line with the emperors.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
If you've ever read like a history book or even
just Greek and Rahman myth. So you've watched the movie
with Elizabeth Taylor and Darren come up in Gladiate Away,
You're like, oh, I understand as a real history. That's
the hang out passed. So Jason tell us some emperor
fact Emperor facts.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
We start with the first emperor ever, Augustus, the adopted
son of Julius Caesar. He ascended in twenty seven BC
and basically Rome was still used to the Senate playing
an important role in political life, and so Augustus slow
played it. He accrued power very gradually, and he didn't
put himself forward as an emperor. He basically said, no,
(33:29):
I'm just a senator, but I'm like kind of the
best one. But I'm still part of the Senate.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
I mean, it's the chill guy, but I am in control.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
That's right. He died of old age, and then his
adopted son Tiberius came in. This is fourteen eighty to
thirty seven eighty that he reigned. He was a general,
he was an abled diplomat. The Senate really didn't like
him for various reasons, and he spent his last years
basically in seclusion on his estate on the island of Capri.
(33:55):
If you read people who really hated him from that period,
he was doing all kinds of perverted in evil things
on the island of Capri. We don't know if that
was true, but he left romean control of his top
assistant during this time, and then he died.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
I just want to say, as well, Augustus, shout out
to you, because it's very rare that you get to
live and die of old age in ancient Rome.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
In this format. That's true.
Speaker 2 (34:17):
Julius Caesa stabbed obviously. I just want to say, I
think you did a good job of Augustus Tiberius, I
probably should have done a little bit more leading, a
little bit less chilling on your weird island.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
And by the way, there's a lot of Roman emperors,
some of which have been forgotten and some of which
are like recently discovered, like oh, here's a guy that
reigned for a little while. Anyway. Next up Caligula, son
of the famed Roman general Germanicus, who that was the
honorific name given to him. His name was like Gaius,
something like they all are, but he went to Germany
and had many great victories, and so they named in Germanicus.
(34:49):
His wife was Agrippina, Augustus's granddaughter as z Agrippina the elder,
So Coligilia is their son. And his name is actually
a nickname because his name also is like Gaya Caesar
or whatever, and it meant little boots, and it's a
reference to the little soldiers boots kids size soldier's boots
that he would wear when he was on campaign with Dad.
The soldiers gave him this nickname and it stuck. He
(35:11):
went insane with power and was assassinated by an alliance.
Speaker 2 (35:15):
Did the craziest, wildest stuff.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
He just went mad, If.
Speaker 2 (35:19):
You've never seen the movie Caligula, there was a recent
four K re released very good.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
Caligula tried to, according to a probably a Procerpal story,
tried to elevate his horse in status to senatorial ring.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
I gotta say that's hilarious, though, thanks for the jokes
on that one. I mean, not sensible, but.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Hilarious praturing guards and other power players assassinated him and
proclaimed Claudius, yes, the next emperor. Claudius was sidelined. Watch
I Claudius for another great movie about this. Was sidelined
and underestimated for most of his life because he had
a lisp and a limp, and these physical disabilities basically
made him look weak in everybody's mind. This is probably
(35:58):
why he survived as long as he did. The Praetorian Guard,
according to legend, found him hiding behind a drape after
they killed Caligula, and as the last surviving member of
the Julia Claudian family, they immediately were like, okay him,
Harry is the emperor and they proclaimed emperor, probably thinking
this guy's going to be very controllable. Claudius, it turned out,
(36:18):
was good at the job, but he had a lot
of enemies. The Senate was always on his ass, and
his wife Agrippina the Younger uh uh also somehow a
granddaughter of Augustus, who is one of the most influential
women of the age. Apparently, according to legend Lanny contemporarious sources,
allegedly poisoned him so that her son stepson Nero could
(36:40):
take over Nero. You probably know that, Pela.
Speaker 2 (36:43):
That's why I was gonna say, you're getting into some
famous empress head. I feel like people will recognize you.
Speaker 1 (36:47):
Probably know Nero. Nero gradually turned the empire against him
because he became insane and created an extreme personality cult
around himself.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Well, he is the one who was very famous that
when the Great Fire Room happened, they say he was
like playing a fiddle.
Speaker 1 (37:01):
That's right. The Great Fire Rome happened on his watch,
burned a huge portion of the city. The fiddle, by
the way, was not invented during this time. Yeah, so
it was apar Yeah, but it gives you an idea
of how people viewed him, which is like this tyrant
who didn't care.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
He was like a pan style like chaos mango.
Speaker 1 (37:17):
Yeah. Eventually he turned everyone against him to such a
degree that the senate sentenced him to death, and everybody
abandoned him, and he realized the end was near, but
he didn't have the courage to take his own life,
so he ordered like his servant to kill him, and
they stabbed him, and then he bled out and died.
That led to the chaos known as the Year of
(37:38):
the Four Emperors from sixty eight to sixty nine, when
four different emperors reigned for a few months each. First
there was Galba, who's too old, too passive. He was
murdered by Atho. Then there was Atho, who committed suicide
after losing to Vitellius in battle. Then there was Vitellius,
whoigs executed by a Vespasian after getting into a war
(37:58):
with Vespasian. And then there was vespace And who ran
things for a while. Vespatian was a soldier. He was
one of these rags richest stories that kind of became
more common. He was a late comer to public life.
We don't have a lot of records of his time
as emperor. Reigned for ten years, but he's best known
for beginning the construction of the famed Colisseum of Room.
(38:20):
Then came his son Titus, He was ruler during the
eruption of Mauna Vesuvius, which you've probably seen on the
television series Loki.
Speaker 2 (38:27):
Yeah, that's definitely where I not from.
Speaker 1 (38:29):
Yeah, he is best known for finishing the Coliseum. You're
not only ruled for two years before dying at forty one.
I think a stroke or something I forget. Then came
to a mission, also Vespatian's son. He was like a
hardcore dictator and artocrat. He effectively sidelined the Senate, took
all of its traditional and at that point the accouterments
(38:52):
of their position that didn't really have any real power
but still were like culturally important. He stripped those things
away as well, and that led to his assassination by
a conspiracy of senators and other artificials.
Speaker 2 (39:05):
So many assassinations, many many manuyes. This was a society
that loved an assassination, loved it.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
There's no other way to get the person out. Then
came Nerva. This is the revenge of the Senate. So
after the Senate had its power stripped away, the Senate went, oh, yeah,
watch this, we proclaim this guy Emperor Nerva. Nerva then
dutifully promised to return to the Senate all of its
traditional stuff, its power, and its influence. He was forced
(39:31):
by the military, who did not trust him at all,
to adopt an air from the military who adopted Trajan
young general, who turned out to be his probably his
best decision, because when Nerva died of a stroke less
than two years later, Trajan ascended, and along with Nerva,
Trajan became part of this era known as the Five
Good Emperors, when they got five solid emperors in a row,
(39:53):
who all except for Nerva, ruled for a long time.
So Trajan was considered by his contemporary and by historians
of the age to be the goat. Like this guy's
the greatest, Like oh, my god, Trajan. This is how
he used to say of emperors that followed Trajan. May
he be as lucky as Augustus and as good as Trajan.
Because Trajan was so good. W Trajan grew the empire
(40:14):
to its greatest geographical limit, and the Pax Romana, the
fame Pox Romana, which is probably something you learned in school, begins,
which is this piece of Rome that lasted like a
century plus. Then came Hadrian, Trajan's cousin basically said, okay,
enough with the expanding. We're huge, We're a huge empire.
Let's just defend these borders and solidify them. This gives
(40:35):
us Hadrian's wall in northern England famous wall.
Speaker 2 (40:39):
I've been the legendary.
Speaker 1 (40:40):
He was a very active ruler. He visited almost every
Roman province except we think the ones in Spain and
then Dacia, which they had to give up and they
died after twenty years in office. Wow, He's got that
famous column which you can go see in Rome, which
has a bunch of his feats and famously shows the
sack of the Temple of Jerusalem. That gives Us Antoninus Pious,
(41:04):
Adrian's adopted son, husband to his niece Faustina. He was
an efficient ruler. He left the emperor rich. He died
after twenty two years in office. Everybody was happy. He
was succeeded by his adopted sons, Marcus Aurelius and Lucius
Verus as co emperors. Oh interesting, Lucius Verus dies after
nine years of co empering, and this allows Marcus Riis
(41:25):
to become the sole emperor. As we see in this film,
Marcus Aurelius the last of the five good emperors. We
kind of forget about Lucius Verus as one of the
five good Emperors, and it's really about Marcus Aurelius. Of course,
we see him in Gladiator, the wonderful Richard Harris in
one of his final roles. He's just fantastic as Marcus.
And Marcus Relius was a student of philosophy of the
(41:48):
Greek school of Stoicism. He kept a journal of notes
to himself, kind of like advice about how to rule
and live wisely and honorably and with restraint, and these
became collective in a book called the Meditations Marcus Relis's Meditations,
and there's still people that follow his philosophy today. It
remains in circulation. He died after a very long ill illness,
(42:11):
probably of natural causes, but there was some speculation at
the time that he might have been killed by his
son Communists, and it was cyinar a pax romana after that,
because he was the last of.
Speaker 2 (42:20):
The fires, was crazy.
Speaker 1 (42:22):
He was crazy, and everybody after that was bad. So
then comes Communists. He was co emperor for three years
under his father, but then as his father died, he
became the sole ruler and immediately became paranoid, dictatorial, increasingly megamoniacal,
drunk on power of fame, he created a personality cult
around himself which basically said that he was like the
source of everything Roman. He was the epitome of pure Rome, and.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
Everything that happened from Rome was from him.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
All good things in Rome spraying from him. And this
culminated in a slate of games for the public, the
plebeing games during which in the mornings commonists would slay
animals with arrows, and in the afternoon he would fight
rigged gladiator man, which he always won.
Speaker 2 (43:03):
Like we start in the movie.
Speaker 1 (43:04):
That's all right, His mistress Marcia probably killed him with poison,
we think, after she discovered the communists had like a
death list at his desk, and.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
Her name was on it, making like a death though,
and he was like putting my wife on the end.
Speaker 1 (43:16):
Put her on it. When the poison didn't take, Marsha's
co conspirators sent Narcissus, the Emperor's wrestling coach, in to
kill him.
Speaker 2 (43:24):
Oh, incredibly, he died that.
Speaker 1 (43:25):
Way, General Maximus, he's not a real guy, not a
real guy. But let's talk about how long it would
have taken him to ride that horse from Germaania. Okay,
so according to what we know about Marcus Relius, historically
he died in Vindebona, Germania, which they mentioned in the
film several times. And you hear in that fight in
the arena one of the soldier who says, I fought
(43:47):
with you at Vinda Bona. That's that battle we see.
Vinda Bona is basically around modern day Vienna. And Maximus
says at one point, I am Maximus Meridith. And he
also tells Marcus that his home is in the hills
above Truchillo, and that early scene, which is about fifty
five kilometers about an hour driving distance from Mereda in Spain.
(44:07):
So assuming that the farm homestead is like somewhere in
that area Truhuilo Mereda, that's about a twenty six hour
drive by car or a six day bike ride according
to Google a map. So if we say that a
bike is about the same as riding a horse, which
gets tired, and we can say that Maximus was going
with great haste. So let's say I don't know four
(44:30):
or five days, I'm sure the horse died right after this, I.
Speaker 2 (44:32):
Would say that the horse is definitely dying. I would
say maybe closer to a week because I don't know
if the horse could keep it going at high speed
the whole.
Speaker 1 (44:40):
I agree with you. The course, I guess we could
assume like he stole horses. Whatever the case.
Speaker 2 (44:46):
Multiple it was dated several days time.
Speaker 1 (44:49):
Yeah, Vienna to Spain. That's a long time last Gladator fact. Wow,
as we get ready for Gladiator two, thank you famously,
Now you're talking about stuff I know about. Yes famously
made script famously. Australian rock musician Nick Cave, best known
for his group Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds, mentioned
(45:09):
on the Mark Marin podcast back in twenty thirteen that, apparently,
at the personal request of his countryman Russell Crowe, he
wrote a spec script for Gladiator two titled Gladiator two
Gladiator two.
Speaker 2 (45:26):
Christ Killer Yes, and it would have focused on I'm
obsessed with this script. I've actually read some versions that
are online of this script. It is based on the
idea that Maximus would have to like fight his way
out of hell, yes, to find a space where he
(45:47):
could then kill like a god. And it's because he
has to get his family out of hell or something
I think was the general like.
Speaker 1 (45:53):
Well, what happens is apparently what he says in this interview,
is that the old gods are impressed with Maximus's death
and the way he took on power, and so they go, Okay,
you're the guy that we have hand picked for a
mission that we have specifically for you. You will return
to life, you will fight your way out of hell,
take over the body of apparently an old man, and
(46:14):
then go and kill this guy named Hephestos, who is
apparently like a messiah like christ like figure who the
old guys were very threatened by, and they wanted Maximus
to go kill that guy.
Speaker 2 (46:25):
And so that's so good.
Speaker 1 (46:26):
What a crazy story.
Speaker 2 (46:28):
I have to tell you something, guys, that's even crazier, right.
I actually thought that was the version of Gladiata two
we were getting until the trailer came out. It has
been such a big part of my life, this insane,
unmade gladiat sequel. I thought, well, why would they make
any other version? Now I will say something that makes
it a little bit less crazy, And if you haven't
(46:48):
seen this movie, go watch it. Nick Cave is actually
a fantastic film writer. In two thousand and five, he
wrote this movie called The Proposition with Guy Piss and
Ray Winston and Danny Houston, and it's about a guy
who is a notorious outlaw and he gets caught by
a law man and they say, okay, we'll let you
go if you go and find your brother and kill
him because he is a really bad guy. And if
(47:12):
you don't do it, we'll execute your younger brother. And
it is so interesting. It's such a weird Western. I
used to watch it all the time. But yeah, Nick Cave,
He's written interesting, weird, dark films, so I definitely thought
there was a world where somebody would want to make
Gladiator to Christ Killer. Alas that is not the movie.
We're getting there. I have to say, at this point
in Russell Crowe's career, I believe he would be in
(47:34):
that movie. Have you seen The Pope's Exorcist? I believe
Russell Crowe would fight his way out of hell in
the gladiat But yeah, Jason, thank you for this incredible
ride through Roman history.
Speaker 1 (47:45):
Well thank you, And on the next couple of episodes
of Export Vision, we're diving into our Kane season two,
Act two and doing prophecy on HBO Max. That's it
through this episode. Thanks for listening, folks. Bite x Ray
Vision is hosted by Jason Kencepcion and Rosie Knight and
(48:06):
is a production of iHeart Podcasts. Our executive producers are
Joelle Smith and Aaron Kaufman. Our supervising producer is a
Boo Zafar. Our producers are Carmen Laurent and Mia Taylor.
Our theme song is by Brian Basquez.
Speaker 2 (48:22):
Special thanks to Soul Rubin and Chris Laude, Kenny Goodman
and Heidi A disco moderata
Warning. Today's episode contains spoilers for the twenty five year
old movie Gladiator of I Ridly Scott. Well Gladier two
in theater soon. Be warned if you have out watched Gladiator,
then watch it before listening to this before seeing Gladiator
too and aply connected guys. Hello, my name is Jason
(00:37):
Casepsiote co host to a pod and I will have
my revenge in this life of the next.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
I weesday night. Are you not entertained?
Speaker 1 (00:46):
And welcome back to x me vision of the podcast
where we dive deep. It's your favorite shows, movies, comics
and pop culture coming from My Heart podcast where we
bring you between two and three and sometimes war episodes
every week Tuesday Thursday, with extra episodes on Wednesday.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
In today's episode, in the air Lock, we are revisiting
the five time Oscar winning film Gladiator by Ridley Scott
starring Russell Crowe, and in the omnibus, we are going
to dig into some of the history, both real life
and production wise, that gave us Gladiator and we'll lead
us in to the eagerly awaited Gladiator two.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Dun dundun all right. Gladiator the year two thousand, directed
by Ridley Scott, Gosh, what a film. I saw it
in the theaters. This is when I was working in
movie theaters, saw every movie and my reaction was, Wow,
what an insanely violent and good movie that.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Was so violent, like when I rewatched it for the pod.
So let me set this up. When I was a kid,
I saw this movie on VHS at my dad's house
and I was so upset when one of the guys
walks out to fight in the gladiatorial ring and just
before he goes out, he pisses himself, and I I
was so upset for how scared that guy was. I
(02:02):
think I just disassociated for the rest of the movie.
I've watched it since, but on this watch, I was
just blown away by the violence and also like, as
a horror fan, how inventive it is, Like Ridley Scott's like, really,
what are the craziest ways that people could die in
the Roman Empire? We're gonna do tiger fight shooting like
huge steaks into people's chests from shields. Yeah, Like I'm
(02:26):
gonna catapult a glass ball full of fire like a
hyper Molotov cocktail. Like there's so much invention in this movie.
When it comes to that and it is my little crew.
We always talk about like a dude's rock movie, and
this is definitely in that vein. Oh, this is a
dude's a rockin.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
This is a dude's being dudes hanging out with dudes
type movie where their dudes come together as a team
to accomplish the goal of reforming.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
Their rob That shit hit me really really hard when
I was rewatching it this morning. One because I love
Gime Hansu, who's so fantastic love. But also I have
to say, for such a violent movie that seems to
have a pretty simple premise, it actually does a really
interesting job of crafting those male friendships, those male connections,
the way that these men come together against the face
(03:16):
of this evil, maniacal sociopath leader of Rome. This movie
hit a lot harder for me this time. I'm really
glad that we're talking about it.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
It has a what I consider to be an iconic
soundtrack by Hans zimmer Yes that I still listen to,
particularly when I'm on a walk or running or trying.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Is really good walking music, main character musicastic.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
This is the breakout role for Russell Crowe, who got
the role off The Power of his performance in La Confidential,
where he plays a extremely angry cop, and looking back
at this movie after my now billion three watch, the
thing I like about Russell Crowe in this movie is
he looks like obviously he looks quite fit and big,
(04:02):
but he's also it's not the eighties and nineties where
guys were like no Sylvester Stallone Schwartz in it.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
And it's not like the MCU where you've got do
the diet.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Like yeah, he looks like just a guy.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
He looks like a guy who could probably win in
a fight.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
And I love that about this people. So Russell Crowe
plays Maximus Decimus Meridius, a general the Roman Army currently
on campaign in Germania. It is one eighty a d
in the Emperor Marcus Aurelius's reign is coming to an end.
He's quite old, and his campaign against the Germans is
also coming to an end. With this victory at Vinda Bona,
(04:37):
it appears that the Roman Empire's northern border will be solidified.
Marcus Aurelius is so taken by maximus goodness, his loyalty,
his dedication, his low family, his love of family, his
rejection of power. He really just wants to like get
this war done with and go home. He doesn't want
a politic in Rome. He doesn't want to do any
(04:57):
of that kind of stuff. And Mark this is so
impressed by this that he decides to overstep his own son,
the extremely immoral Commonists, and raise up Maximists in his stead.
But unfortunately he makes the grave mistake.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Rosie, why does he do that?
Speaker 1 (05:14):
Grave?
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Why does he do that?
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Grave?
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Your son is evil, bro Like, don't do that.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
Of telling his son alone. Don't, of course tell him,
but you gotta tell him in this take your door, yeah,
in the presence of your daughter and your guards and
probably Maximus, and just say, hey, Commonist, here's what's up.
You're not gonna be emperor. It's gonna be Maximus. Does
everybody see this?
Speaker 2 (05:37):
And guess what though, You're still gonna be living the
life of luxury. Yes, nothing bad's gonna happen to you.
You just don't have to be in control.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Commonists played with wonderful beta energy from Jaque Phoenix break.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Out role really here for Joaquin in this terrifying, terrify, terrifying.
It's kind of like, well, if Caligula was an Inceel
it's this really specific enjoyment of violence and cruelty. Yeah,
but he's got this sniveling there's a weakness, hatred and
resentment and weakness. Yea. The ironically is just of his
(06:12):
own making.
Speaker 1 (06:12):
And it makes him so effective as a villain. This
is a conversation I was having with my Coast of
Six Trophies, Chase Rano. I think that there are basically
three ways to do a great villain. I say two
ways on that pod, but having thought about it, I
think there's three ways.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Tell me what you think exclusive third way?
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Right? I think that the first way is even match
Batman and the Joker. They're evenly matched in different ways,
and it's a twelve round about the whole way through
who's gonna win? Second way is overpowering villain Darth Vader. Right,
he's so powerful and so scary Michael Myers, Sadie always
(06:49):
come back. You just don't understand how the hero could
possibly beat this person. How could they do it? This
villain is so scary. And then the third way, which
they do here is weak villain who has all the
cards in his favor. He's the leader of Rome, he's
got the army in his disposal. He's got any number
(07:11):
of minions that will do his will. But at the
same time, if you go one on one versus the hero,
there's no way this guy wins. Yeah, because he's such
a coward. He's weak. And I think that is so
effective in this movie, because you just are like, God,
let Maximus get this guy one on one.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Yeah, I know, right, And every time something I think
Ridley Scott does incredibly well narratively. Here he sets up
multiple moments where you think he will be able to
do it, but then something happens. A child attends, there's gods,
there's he misses the moment, commodist stands up, and they
really have you like chomping at the bit, like just
(07:48):
fucking get this guy. But I think you're right. I
think that's a really great read on those three and
I bet you and Shae could do a great little
mini book about that, like how to make a great villain.
But also as well, I think for me, this is
the scariest type of villain, and I think because it
is relatable, I agree to real life. It's also a
nightmare scenario where like the guy who bullied you at
(08:11):
school is the guy in charge gets all the power
in the world and is in charge, but never changes,
never grows, never learns anything, and instead is just so
furious and resentful that all they can do is just
create more cruelty.
Speaker 1 (08:27):
Maximus refuses to serve Commonists, who he suspects of killing Marcus,
and so Commonists basically says, well, this guy's gonna die.
He orders Maximus's execution, and he orders the execution of
his entire family. But Maximus escapes. Oh and he rides
his horse from Germania to Spain, which I will talk
(08:48):
about later. How long that probably took.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Yes, let's put like an asterisk like that, because we
are definitely going to be doing some extra vision of footnotes,
because that's a really good point. Is he Also something
that I've found really profound about this segment of the movie,
especially as it moves on, is you see Marcus's second
in command, Brutus, who's been there, who's been his ally,
who's been on the war with him, he just turns
(09:13):
on him and he's like, chopped this motherfucker's head off.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
Immediately is like I can see which way the wind
is blowing, I'm going that way.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
And that lack of loyalty is becomes so profound when
he then finds this community in the gladiatorial realms of fighting,
and I just thought that hits so hard. And also
this is one of my favorite parts where they're walking
him and he's gonna escape and it's cold, it's really cold,
and the guy tries to pull out the sword to
(09:39):
kill him and it gets stuck in Maximus goues sometimes
they get stuck in the cold and then just kills
them all because he has the moment. And that's when
you realize that this has almost like a proto John
Wick element to it, where it's like Maximus is like
a very good fighter, he's a killing machine and also
crazy in of deaths. In this moment as well, like
(10:02):
you already see what this man can do, just and
throwing swords.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
On the like on the movie.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
He throws the sword at him and hits him in
the chest. I was like screaming. I was like, put
this back in the fit as guys the modern cinema
audience would be like yelling and yelling.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
After his epic ride, he is exhausted and he finds
that his wife and child have been executed and his
farm is burned and now exhausted by his journey, he
collapses where he's found by slave traders who take him
to North Africa. He wakes up there. He's also was
(10:38):
injured when he escaped the Praetorian guards. He's got this
nasty injury, and when he comes to he realizes that
he is at a gladiatorial school, basically where they take
these enslaved folks and then make them fight for the
entrainment of people out here in the provinces of North Africa.
Guess what Maximus is good at. That he's really good.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
At and also because he has history as a soldier
and as a lieutenant and stuff. Sorry if I got
the wrong name wrong, but basically as a leader, right,
he trains his fellow gladiators in how to protect themselves
and how to fight together and win against these ever
growing threats that they throw into the ring. I have
(11:19):
to say, I just thought this was like an exceptionally
cool and interesting take. You know, we're recording this on Wednesday,
November six, so I think I was moved by some
of the moments of solidarity and community that they find.
And also I just thought it's unexpected when you think
about movies about men and the idea of lone wolf heroes.
But Maximus actually saves himself by helping other people and
(11:43):
teaching them how to save themselves, and I thought that
was It's really interesting and cool. And in one of
the earliest fights, we get what is maybe my favorite
fight in the movie, which is when Maximus and the
character played by jam and Hansuba Juba they're chained together
and they have to fight, and it's so amazing to
see the way that they learn each other's moves on
(12:05):
the go. It's you and you are just rooting for
them instantly. It's really really cool. And also I have
to I almost texted you this days, but I was like,
this is going to be so out of context if
I just randomly text you this. I was watching this
movie and I was like, man, I love Oliver Reed
in this. I fucking love Oliver Reed. Oliver Reed Proximo
the leader of the kind of gladiator.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
Guys during the movie, and they have to do some
CG stuff yea allow him to finish out his scenes.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
And that was one of the first times I think
they really did.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
One of the first times that was done, and it
was done quite seamlessly for the day. Even now watching
that scene, it works, It doesn't bump at all, and
he is just chewing the scenery.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
I love his energy. I feel like you need something
like that in one of these movies because if you
think back to the movies that this hearkens back to, right,
like Spartacus, those Sword and Sandals esque era movies, even
like Lawrence of Arabier Eve, like just movies that old
Hollywood epic scale. You're going to have at least one
scene Chua and I feel like Oliver Reed is delivering
(13:08):
in this role and it's kind of amazing to see
that against Jaimon and Russell, who are just doing these
really like straight down the line serious performances where you
really believe they have to survive.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
Maximus and the team, because of their success out here
in North Africa get taken by Proximo to Rome. They
called up to the big leagues, and there takes place
my favorite fight, Rosie, which is the fight in which
they are cast as the barbarian, these Hannibal's barbarians that
are supposed to lose the climactic battle between Rome and Carthage,
(13:44):
I think the Third Punic War or whatever, and instead
they turn the table. I love this because it gets
them all to work as a team. He's like, has
anybody been here in the army? One guy's like, I
fought with you, and he says, Okay, here's how we're
going to do it.
Speaker 2 (13:58):
And he understands the Battle of Carthage and what happens,
so he can basically use his knowledge to defeat. Yeah,
that is one of the coolest moments. I also love
how this is one of the moments I think Ridley
Scott does so well in this movie that often we
don't get nowadays in like a historical epic, the moment
when everyone in the audience is like cheering for them
(14:19):
and the gladiators start to realize that they won, and
you get these looks on the face of like pure joy.
And actually when they first go to Rome, there's this
really great, slightly dated but in a way that I
really love bit that Ridley Scott does where he overlays
all different people like cheering and talking and it feels
very very nineties, but it just fits so well. Like
(14:40):
it's ironic because there is a lot of violence in
this movie, but it's classical Hollywood energy. Does give me
like a kind of nostalgic feel. If this comes on TV,
I will always just put it on.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
There's a great moment in this fight where Hagen, who
is the big german guy, yeah, who doesn't immediately warm
to Maximus. Certainly during the time that they were at
the gladiator school, he's always been like, Hagen's a huge,
muscly guy, and I think he in some way looks
at Maximus and is like I could do what you're doing,
Like whatever.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
What can you do?
Speaker 1 (15:14):
And so he goes off on his own to try
and fight, separate from the group, and Maximus risks his
life to save him after he's injured, brings him back.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
And it's that moment that seals Hagen's loyalty to Maximus
and shows the value of everybody working to so they
win this exactly. They win this massive fight. Commonists comes down,
everybody's cheering, and Communist loves to be popular, so he
comes down to meet the gladiators.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
He's like, these guys seem cool. I should get them
on my side. That definitely couldn't be any weird connection
between us.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
Yeah, And it's there that Maximus reveals his identity, which
how many people could you think could actually hear it
in the arena, Like, definitely the people right on the ground,
but I don't think that.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
But otherwise, no one else, no one else, You're just
hearing cheering, scream people taking bets. I also love this
because this is another great moment in the woaquin Phoenix
kind of weak villain. He gets himself into this problem
because Maximus is happy to not reveal his identity, right,
He's got his little MF Doom mask on, he's hiding, and.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
He makes him do it. He's like, hey, he makes him.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
Do it, and then it's like, okay, bro, okay, you're
setting yourself up for a very big issue here, especially
because obviously your sister Lucilla played by Connie Nielsen the Legend,
she is a fan of Maximus and she thinks he's dead,
and nobody else is gonna be on your side if
you want to get rid of this man who knows
what you did, and obviously he does.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
Commonist then really really wants to order the execution of
all of these gladiators, including uh Maximus who spurred him.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
He's trying to do the thumbs down kill us.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
But again, he loves being popular and everybody, and he
can tell the crowd would immediately be really upset if
they did that, so he very begrudgingly goes thumbs up.
Speaker 2 (17:15):
Yeah, that must have been the hardest thumbs up that
man had ever done in his life. He was resembling.
Speaker 1 (17:20):
He was very resentabul This leads to one of the
funniest scenes I think in the entire movie, where they
immediately smashed cut commonist. It is palous and he's just like, oh,
oh my goodness, him, what are we gonna do? This
is so sad about crying.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
And you know what's really interesting is, like I think
it's a very interesting performance by Waki and who really
goes very hard on the villainy of it all. Because
actually this scene which is hilarious and I was cracking up,
But like, if you read this scene a different way,
or you had a different act to portray it, this
could be a scene that would give you empathy towards
this Carria who, no matter what he does, he's never
(18:02):
good enough for his dad, he's never good enough for
his people. Everyone else always comes above him. There's a
version of this character who that at least a certain
part of the audience would find relatability in but Joaquin
allows none of that. He is like, I'm going to
make this the most vile, hateful, loser character. And he
does a great job, honestly, and you just won't hand.
(18:23):
You're like, everybody conspire to get this motherfucker out because
he is not the one so communist.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Then sets up a rigged fight that Maximus has to
take part in against the retired greatest gladiator ever and
there's tigers that are waiting to attack him in the
moment he steps outside of the squared circle, but hears anyway.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
This is that stuff where I think when you think
about Gladiator, where when they're having this kind of climactic
fight and the rose petals are falling. Yeah, that's the
kind of stuff that Ridley Scott does well. I mean,
I'm very excited for Gladiator too, because I've seen some
hilarious Ridley Scott quotes. Because in the trailer they teased
that they flood the Colosseum and then the historians, since
(19:08):
historians were like, this wouldn't happen, and then this is
what Ridley Scott said. He said, if they can build
the Colosseum, they can flood it, and find a couple
of sharks. That's what he said, and I was like, yes,
Ridley Scott, I want to see Prescal punching a shark.
I really do that cinema to me.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
As Maximus's popularity grows, a cadre of disgruntled senators who
want to return Rome back to the Republic that it
once was, basically conspire with Maximus to try and elevate
him and bring back the Republic. Before any of that
can happen, Communist sets up the big fight between him
personally and Maximus.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
Absolutely unbelievable gumption.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
What told you?
Speaker 2 (19:47):
How did you ever think this was gonna work? Bro?
Of all the terrible plans in Hollywood movies, this is
probably the worst plan. I get it, you want to
look like you're stronger than him, But to me, I'm like,
my guy, just get some more gladia as somebody can
kill him, like someone can do it.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
Yes, somebody will eventually, and then.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
You can go down and chop off his head or
whatever you want to do. But this was a terrible plan, Commodist.
It was always going to end badly for you.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
Before the fight, you know, he's got Maximus chained up
and he's telling him we're gonna fight, but then he
like stabs him in the armpit a wound, like a
steadily bleeding wound from which and obviously disabled slowly die. Yeah.
They go into the ring and there's Maximus. He's wounded,
but he manages to fucking beat commedists. Yeah, and he
(20:36):
dies on the floor of the arena with his old
lieutenant and Connie Nielsen and the body of the Emperor
next to him and all these other people watching, and.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
He can see the afterlife and he's thinking about his family.
He's walking back in to.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
The afterlife and that actually you mentioned it, the fwalling petals.
There's all these moments. This is why Ridley Scott is
Realley Scott. There's all these poetic moments that enhance the vibe,
oh yeah, the charm and the themes of the movie.
And one of those is this scene that was actually
filmed by Russell Crows stunt double, the scene of like
(21:13):
touching the wee.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Yeah yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
He saw at one point Ridley saw this guy doing
this and was like, get the steady cam and follow
this guy. That's a cool oh.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Wow, And that became such a huge image.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
To touch back on and It's this moment of a
wonderful spirituality that is threaded throughout the film, and it
gives the film the weight. It's the beyond, just like
a John Wick this guy Kills Everybody type of movie.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
Also as well, I think that it is a rare
kind of hopefulness for a movie like this, because you're
going for the tragic ending. Maximus dies, but the end of.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
The movie they do not overthrow the rumin Emperor.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
Shocks. But the most important thing is not the fact
that Lucilla recognizes him as a hero in Rome and
they try and regain their freedom. The most important thing
is you get to see him walking back to his family.
Another one of the scenes that just devastated me when
I saw this as a kid was when he goes
back to his family, he sees their like burnt feet
where they've been hanged. And but yes, I really love
(22:13):
that if you watch the movie and you watch the
brutality and you follow this story, you actually get to
see him reunite with them in that same space, in
this kind of almost like black and white limon or
space that Ridley created. And I think that's very rare
for a movie like this to have that poetic nature,
that spirituality, that moment of hope, of like, actually he
(22:33):
does get to do the thing that he wanted the most,
we don't snatch it away from him. His death is
not the end, it's actually the beginning. I think that's
very beautiful. I will also say as well, I like
your use of the term poetic because in that moment
when he's Maximus is on the floor and he is
struggling to breathe and Lucilla's looking down on him, the
color of the sky behind her is just the brightest blue,
(22:56):
the brightest blue you've ever seen. Like, the way that
he uses color and con trass is so interesting. And also,
you know what, Jaimenhns, who's there at the end, Jubi
is there. You know I would have watched Gladiator two
with him. We're gonna talk about the many Gladiator two options,
actually because I'm obsessed with one of them. But yeah,
what a movie. I'm actually so so glad that we
(23:17):
got to revisit this because I don't know in twenty
twenty four, Man, this just hit so hard for me
and just spoke to me as a fun like dude's
rock bros hanging out almost slice of life. Like a
lot of times they're just like, this is what it's
hanging out the life of a gladiator. It's like a
lot of this movie is actually like very character based,
very slow, lots of waiting, lots of talking, lots of
(23:40):
not even much scheming or plotting. More just like we
might die what is important to you? And I think
that's really really cool and actually unusual and makes the
film age well. Also visually it looks so good. I
feel like if the kids on TikTok and it's watch
(24:01):
this movie, I feel like they're gonna do like comparisons
between how washed out modern cinema looks and the like
absolute saturated, beautiful color, big colors. Yes, is so appealing
to watch. Ridley Scott, you did it man, this is a.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
Well this is two thousand and it's on film correct.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's And that's why it looks so good. Yeah,
I mean it's beautiful.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
That'll lead us to Gladier two, which is set fifteen
years after the events of the original film and is
focused on the adventure of the son of Lucilla played
by Connie Nilsen, the nephew of Commedis.
Speaker 2 (24:37):
Who is the main part of this movie, he is
essentially commedist almost uses him as like a human shield.
Most times we see him brought out as if he's worried,
he wants to look good, but he doesn't really care
about him. But Lucias did grow up in this very
royal regal household, so I'm very interested to see how
they set it up where he ends up in a
(24:58):
similar situation. Because also something I want to say about
this movie that I do also love. I love Alexander Dumas,
and I love the Count of Montey Cristo, and this
is essentially a Count of Monty Cristo's story, revenge story.
It's like and also the idea that you can rise
up the ranks and hide your identity until you need
to reveal it and get your revenge, just very Count
(25:18):
of Monty Cristo.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Early superhero archetype.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
But yeah, so he's gonna be basically he loved Maximus
and now that's gonna be the person who's fighting his
way up through the trials. Jason, I got to ask
you an important question. Yes, does Paul Mescal have the juice?
Speaker 1 (25:35):
We were gonna fuck, We're gonna find out, We're gonna
apparently they're saying that he has the juice. He's the juice.
Here's your top ten movies of the year two thousand.
Number one Mission Impossible Too, John wu.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
Probably lots of slow mo.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
Lots of SlowMo. Sadly one of the weakest. I think,
Oh it is.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
It's a Vibes movie, and you can enjoy a Vibes movie,
but it's definitely not the high point of a very
very high point filled franchise.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
That made half a billion dollar. Number two Gladiator. There
we are just under half a billion dollars. Number three Castaway,
Oh incredible Tour de fource by Tom Hanks, who's basically
in that movie alone.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
That is another movie. I will say, even though it's
just him and his beach ball, his football, I should
say that is a dude's rock movie. Dudes love Costaway
and they love to see this dude just chill him
on his own on the Costaway Beach.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Number three What Women Want starring the terrible Awful Mel
Gibson and Helen Hunt. The Wonderful Helen Hunt, The Wonderful
Mersey Tome, in which mel Gibson can hear women's thoughts.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
Creepy.
Speaker 1 (26:35):
Next up, Dinosaur, Oh, Dinosaur DNA. We've never spoken about
Dinosaur the movie ever.
Speaker 2 (26:43):
Ever. The only reason that it's still relevant to people
is it has a very terrifying ride in Animal Kingdom
that has traumatized many people, which I believe they're about
to take away. So good on Dinosaur. Who knew that
that was one of the top five biggest movies. I
would never have seen it coming.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
Next Jim Carrey, Oh, how the Grinch Stole Christmas? Number six, the.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
Loved Christmas movie. Still people love it to this day.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
Number seven, and you forget what a huge smash this
was and the sequels that came from it. Meet the Parents,
Robert de Niro and Ben Stiller.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
Dude, that was a time when a mid range comedy
could become a full quadrant success.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Yes, could be the number seven movie for the year. Wow.
Number eight The Perfect Storm, Oh my Gosh, starring a
Wahlberg and Clooney and about the fishing boat that goes
up the wave CG Wave, The CG Wave. I saw
it in the theater and I thought, what was what's
the fuss about?
Speaker 2 (27:32):
What's the fuss about? It's just okay?
Speaker 1 (27:35):
Number nine, Get this X Men. Number nine what imagine that?
Speaker 2 (27:40):
What turn around for the books, especially because X Men
was still seen as a massive success.
Speaker 1 (27:45):
That's right, and number ten rounding out the top ten,
Harrison Ford, Michelle Pfeiffer, What Lies Beneath?
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Okay, I love that movie. I love a good weird
eroic thrill.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
I do like that movie as well.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
Wow, what crazy year, and honestly Gladiates to be up there.
I'm glad that people went to see it.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
Other notable films of that period Crashing Tiger, Oh Hidden,
Dragon Love.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
It should have been on that Love that traffic, Oh.
Speaker 1 (28:10):
Love It almost famous, bombed at the theater, but cleaned
up critically.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
Became a full cult classic.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
Aaron Brockovich, Julia Roberts has come Back.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
That's a truly groundbreaking movie for ha and also just
for like the waste in a mock perceived like a
true story movie. So that's huge.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
And file this one under another movie that they don't
make any more, wonder Boys. Oh wow, the Curtis Hansen
Steve Cloves production. That's I think one. An Oscar for
Best Original Song, starring Michael Douglas and a young Tobey
Maguire has his kind of acolyte, who loves Michael Douglas,
who plays an author his writing. Next up, Rome Facts.
Speaker 4 (29:05):
Welcome back, and it's time for Rome Facts Room facts
in the omnip Facts about Rome.
Speaker 2 (29:10):
This is what men love. They love a fact about
Jack And how often do you think about the Vermin
Empire a little bit.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
I'm looking back at my I'm looking back at my
bookshelf right now. There's a recent book on the history
of Ravenna, which became the second capital of the Western
Roman Empire. There's a bunch of other stuff, the history
of Byzantine emperors. I think about it a bit as
a person who loves history.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
You are history love.
Speaker 1 (29:35):
I'm a history lover. So let's start at the very
beginning for Rome. You know what I love. I love
foundational myths.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
Oh yeah, and love a good man.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
And Rome has a really cool foundational myth. They thought
of their history as like part legend and part history,
which is really cool. According to Roman foundational myth, one
day during the reign of the seventh and last King
of Rome, Tarquinis, tarquin Is the star Wars fans now
came before the king, and she had nine big books
(30:04):
of Greek oracular poetry, which she offered to the king
at like an insane price, like whatever, like the GDP
of Rome for a year like this was when Rome
was just like a middling kingdom, not a big deal.
But she offered it to them at like a price
that would bankrupt the kingdom. The King's like, no, are
you kidding? It's too much.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Get away, I don't need these books.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
She goes off, burns three of the books, comes back
with six, and says, here's the six remaining books for
the original price. The king refused again, but this time
he was a little concerned.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
He was stress.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
He's like, hold on a second, Okay, I'm still gonna
decline it.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
It seems like maybe something is important in these maybe
she goes off.
Speaker 1 (30:44):
She burns three more books, comes back with the remaining three,
again offering at the original break the bank price. Now
the king, probably very anxiously, goes to the priests and says, hey,
what do we do about this? These books? Do we
need these books? The priests are absolutely alarmed that six
(31:05):
of the books have already been burned and says buy them.
Let over the price, buy them. So Tarkanis buys the books,
and they contained We actually don't know what the prophecies.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
Were, how they the text didn't like survive, that's.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
Right, But it's generally thought that the poems were in
hexamin or Greek verse, and then written in an acrostic
form where the first letter of each line read down
vertically down spelled the first line of the prophecy. And
these prophecies dealt with things like twins are born, or
(31:40):
a calf with two heads are born, or there's wildfires
a comet, and when Rome would face an emergency, they
would go down. These were kept in the temple of Jupiter.
We know they really existed because they were kept in
secrecy for hundreds of years, and only they were a
state secret, and they were referenced like when Rome really
needed them, so they would go down. The priests would
(32:02):
go down there and look up the thing in the
book and see what the prescription would be, and it
would be some sort of ritual that would offset disaster.
Now we again we know that they really existed. They
were kept under the temporal of Jupiter until they were
destroyed by a fire in a three BC. And this
tells you how valuable the Romans considered these books. They
then sent emissaries out all across the known world looking
(32:26):
for copies of the books, and one of the ways
they were able to kind of in their minds authenticate
like the real pages was if they were also acrostic. Yeah,
so they were prioritizing other acrostic poetry from books that
were similar, and they kind of reassembled the tone, but
that they were lost for good, like in the fifth
(32:46):
century sometime they were burned again. Wild, Let's talk about emperors.
There's a lot of emperor talk. Let's go down the
line with the emperors.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
If you've ever read like a history book or even
just Greek and Rahman myth. So you've watched the movie
with Elizabeth Taylor and Darren come up in Gladiate Away,
You're like, oh, I understand as a real history. That's
the hang out passed. So Jason tell us some emperor
fact Emperor facts.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
We start with the first emperor ever, Augustus, the adopted
son of Julius Caesar. He ascended in twenty seven BC
and basically Rome was still used to the Senate playing
an important role in political life, and so Augustus slow
played it. He accrued power very gradually, and he didn't
put himself forward as an emperor. He basically said, no,
(33:29):
I'm just a senator, but I'm like kind of the
best one. But I'm still part of the Senate.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
I mean, it's the chill guy, but I am in control.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
That's right. He died of old age, and then his
adopted son Tiberius came in. This is fourteen eighty to
thirty seven eighty that he reigned. He was a general,
he was an abled diplomat. The Senate really didn't like
him for various reasons, and he spent his last years
basically in seclusion on his estate on the island of Capri.
(33:55):
If you read people who really hated him from that period,
he was doing all kinds of perverted in evil things
on the island of Capri. We don't know if that
was true, but he left romean control of his top
assistant during this time, and then he died.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
I just want to say, as well, Augustus, shout out
to you, because it's very rare that you get to
live and die of old age in ancient Rome.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
In this format. That's true.
Speaker 2 (34:17):
Julius Caesa stabbed obviously. I just want to say, I
think you did a good job of Augustus Tiberius, I
probably should have done a little bit more leading, a
little bit less chilling on your weird island.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
And by the way, there's a lot of Roman emperors,
some of which have been forgotten and some of which
are like recently discovered, like oh, here's a guy that
reigned for a little while. Anyway. Next up Caligula, son
of the famed Roman general Germanicus, who that was the
honorific name given to him. His name was like Gaius,
something like they all are, but he went to Germany
and had many great victories, and so they named in Germanicus.
(34:49):
His wife was Agrippina, Augustus's granddaughter as z Agrippina the elder,
So Coligilia is their son. And his name is actually
a nickname because his name also is like Gaya Caesar
or whatever, and it meant little boots, and it's a
reference to the little soldiers boots kids size soldier's boots
that he would wear when he was on campaign with Dad.
The soldiers gave him this nickname and it stuck. He
(35:11):
went insane with power and was assassinated by an alliance.
Speaker 2 (35:15):
Did the craziest, wildest stuff.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
He just went mad, If.
Speaker 2 (35:19):
You've never seen the movie Caligula, there was a recent
four K re released very good.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
Caligula tried to, according to a probably a Procerpal story,
tried to elevate his horse in status to senatorial ring.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
I gotta say that's hilarious, though, thanks for the jokes
on that one. I mean, not sensible, but.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Hilarious praturing guards and other power players assassinated him and
proclaimed Claudius, yes, the next emperor. Claudius was sidelined. Watch
I Claudius for another great movie about this. Was sidelined
and underestimated for most of his life because he had
a lisp and a limp, and these physical disabilities basically
made him look weak in everybody's mind. This is probably
(35:58):
why he survived as long as he did. The Praetorian Guard,
according to legend, found him hiding behind a drape after
they killed Caligula, and as the last surviving member of
the Julia Claudian family, they immediately were like, okay him,
Harry is the emperor and they proclaimed emperor, probably thinking
this guy's going to be very controllable. Claudius, it turned out,
(36:18):
was good at the job, but he had a lot
of enemies. The Senate was always on his ass, and
his wife Agrippina the Younger uh uh also somehow a
granddaughter of Augustus, who is one of the most influential
women of the age. Apparently, according to legend Lanny contemporarious sources,
allegedly poisoned him so that her son stepson Nero could
(36:40):
take over Nero. You probably know that, Pela.
Speaker 2 (36:43):
That's why I was gonna say, you're getting into some
famous empress head. I feel like people will recognize you.
Speaker 1 (36:47):
Probably know Nero. Nero gradually turned the empire against him
because he became insane and created an extreme personality cult
around himself.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Well, he is the one who was very famous that
when the Great Fire Room happened, they say he was
like playing a fiddle.
Speaker 1 (37:01):
That's right. The Great Fire Rome happened on his watch,
burned a huge portion of the city. The fiddle, by
the way, was not invented during this time. Yeah, so
it was apar Yeah, but it gives you an idea
of how people viewed him, which is like this tyrant
who didn't care.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
He was like a pan style like chaos mango.
Speaker 1 (37:17):
Yeah. Eventually he turned everyone against him to such a
degree that the senate sentenced him to death, and everybody
abandoned him, and he realized the end was near, but
he didn't have the courage to take his own life,
so he ordered like his servant to kill him, and
they stabbed him, and then he bled out and died.
That led to the chaos known as the Year of
(37:38):
the Four Emperors from sixty eight to sixty nine, when
four different emperors reigned for a few months each. First
there was Galba, who's too old, too passive. He was
murdered by Atho. Then there was Atho, who committed suicide
after losing to Vitellius in battle. Then there was Vitellius,
whoigs executed by a Vespasian after getting into a war
(37:58):
with Vespasian. And then there was vespace And who ran
things for a while. Vespatian was a soldier. He was
one of these rags richest stories that kind of became
more common. He was a late comer to public life.
We don't have a lot of records of his time
as emperor. Reigned for ten years, but he's best known
for beginning the construction of the famed Colisseum of Room.
(38:20):
Then came his son Titus, He was ruler during the
eruption of Mauna Vesuvius, which you've probably seen on the
television series Loki.
Speaker 2 (38:27):
Yeah, that's definitely where I not from.
Speaker 1 (38:29):
Yeah, he is best known for finishing the Coliseum. You're
not only ruled for two years before dying at forty one.
I think a stroke or something I forget. Then came
to a mission, also Vespatian's son. He was like a
hardcore dictator and artocrat. He effectively sidelined the Senate, took
all of its traditional and at that point the accouterments
(38:52):
of their position that didn't really have any real power
but still were like culturally important. He stripped those things
away as well, and that led to his assassination by
a conspiracy of senators and other artificials.
Speaker 2 (39:05):
So many assassinations, many many manuyes. This was a society
that loved an assassination, loved it.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
There's no other way to get the person out. Then
came Nerva. This is the revenge of the Senate. So
after the Senate had its power stripped away, the Senate went, oh, yeah,
watch this, we proclaim this guy Emperor Nerva. Nerva then
dutifully promised to return to the Senate all of its
traditional stuff, its power, and its influence. He was forced
(39:31):
by the military, who did not trust him at all,
to adopt an air from the military who adopted Trajan
young general, who turned out to be his probably his
best decision, because when Nerva died of a stroke less
than two years later, Trajan ascended, and along with Nerva,
Trajan became part of this era known as the Five
Good Emperors, when they got five solid emperors in a row,
(39:53):
who all except for Nerva, ruled for a long time.
So Trajan was considered by his contemporary and by historians
of the age to be the goat. Like this guy's
the greatest, Like oh, my god, Trajan. This is how
he used to say of emperors that followed Trajan. May
he be as lucky as Augustus and as good as Trajan.
Because Trajan was so good. W Trajan grew the empire
(40:14):
to its greatest geographical limit, and the Pax Romana, the
fame Pox Romana, which is probably something you learned in school, begins,
which is this piece of Rome that lasted like a
century plus. Then came Hadrian, Trajan's cousin basically said, okay,
enough with the expanding. We're huge, We're a huge empire.
Let's just defend these borders and solidify them. This gives
(40:35):
us Hadrian's wall in northern England famous wall.
Speaker 2 (40:39):
I've been the legendary.
Speaker 1 (40:40):
He was a very active ruler. He visited almost every
Roman province except we think the ones in Spain and
then Dacia, which they had to give up and they
died after twenty years in office. Wow, He's got that
famous column which you can go see in Rome, which
has a bunch of his feats and famously shows the
sack of the Temple of Jerusalem. That gives Us Antoninus Pious,
(41:04):
Adrian's adopted son, husband to his niece Faustina. He was
an efficient ruler. He left the emperor rich. He died
after twenty two years in office. Everybody was happy. He
was succeeded by his adopted sons, Marcus Aurelius and Lucius
Verus as co emperors. Oh interesting, Lucius Verus dies after
nine years of co empering, and this allows Marcus Riis
(41:25):
to become the sole emperor. As we see in this film,
Marcus Aurelius the last of the five good emperors. We
kind of forget about Lucius Verus as one of the
five good Emperors, and it's really about Marcus Aurelius. Of course,
we see him in Gladiator, the wonderful Richard Harris in
one of his final roles. He's just fantastic as Marcus.
And Marcus Relius was a student of philosophy of the
(41:48):
Greek school of Stoicism. He kept a journal of notes
to himself, kind of like advice about how to rule
and live wisely and honorably and with restraint, and these
became collective in a book called the Meditations Marcus Relis's Meditations,
and there's still people that follow his philosophy today. It
remains in circulation. He died after a very long ill illness,
(42:11):
probably of natural causes, but there was some speculation at
the time that he might have been killed by his
son Communists, and it was cyinar a pax romana after that,
because he was the last of.
Speaker 2 (42:20):
The fires, was crazy.
Speaker 1 (42:22):
He was crazy, and everybody after that was bad. So
then comes Communists. He was co emperor for three years
under his father, but then as his father died, he
became the sole ruler and immediately became paranoid, dictatorial, increasingly megamoniacal,
drunk on power of fame, he created a personality cult
around himself which basically said that he was like the
source of everything Roman. He was the epitome of pure Rome, and.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
Everything that happened from Rome was from him.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
All good things in Rome spraying from him. And this
culminated in a slate of games for the public, the
plebeing games during which in the mornings commonists would slay
animals with arrows, and in the afternoon he would fight
rigged gladiator man, which he always won.
Speaker 2 (43:03):
Like we start in the movie.
Speaker 1 (43:04):
That's all right, His mistress Marcia probably killed him with poison,
we think, after she discovered the communists had like a
death list at his desk, and.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
Her name was on it, making like a death though,
and he was like putting my wife on the end.
Speaker 1 (43:16):
Put her on it. When the poison didn't take, Marsha's
co conspirators sent Narcissus, the Emperor's wrestling coach, in to
kill him.
Speaker 2 (43:24):
Oh, incredibly, he died that.
Speaker 1 (43:25):
Way, General Maximus, he's not a real guy, not a
real guy. But let's talk about how long it would
have taken him to ride that horse from Germaania. Okay,
so according to what we know about Marcus Relius, historically
he died in Vindebona, Germania, which they mentioned in the
film several times. And you hear in that fight in
the arena one of the soldier who says, I fought
(43:47):
with you at Vinda Bona. That's that battle we see.
Vinda Bona is basically around modern day Vienna. And Maximus
says at one point, I am Maximus Meridith. And he
also tells Marcus that his home is in the hills
above Truchillo, and that early scene, which is about fifty
five kilometers about an hour driving distance from Mereda in Spain.
(44:07):
So assuming that the farm homestead is like somewhere in
that area Truhuilo Mereda, that's about a twenty six hour
drive by car or a six day bike ride according
to Google a map. So if we say that a
bike is about the same as riding a horse, which
gets tired, and we can say that Maximus was going
with great haste. So let's say I don't know four
(44:30):
or five days, I'm sure the horse died right after this, I.
Speaker 2 (44:32):
Would say that the horse is definitely dying. I would
say maybe closer to a week because I don't know
if the horse could keep it going at high speed
the whole.
Speaker 1 (44:40):
I agree with you. The course, I guess we could
assume like he stole horses. Whatever the case.
Speaker 2 (44:46):
Multiple it was dated several days time.
Speaker 1 (44:49):
Yeah, Vienna to Spain. That's a long time last Gladator fact. Wow,
as we get ready for Gladiator two, thank you famously,
Now you're talking about stuff I know about. Yes famously
made script famously. Australian rock musician Nick Cave, best known
for his group Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds, mentioned
(45:09):
on the Mark Marin podcast back in twenty thirteen that, apparently,
at the personal request of his countryman Russell Crowe, he
wrote a spec script for Gladiator two titled Gladiator two
Gladiator two.
Speaker 2 (45:26):
Christ Killer Yes, and it would have focused on I'm
obsessed with this script. I've actually read some versions that
are online of this script. It is based on the
idea that Maximus would have to like fight his way
out of hell, yes, to find a space where he
(45:47):
could then kill like a god. And it's because he
has to get his family out of hell or something
I think was the general like.
Speaker 1 (45:53):
Well, what happens is apparently what he says in this interview,
is that the old gods are impressed with Maximus's death
and the way he took on power, and so they go, Okay,
you're the guy that we have hand picked for a
mission that we have specifically for you. You will return
to life, you will fight your way out of hell,
take over the body of apparently an old man, and
(46:14):
then go and kill this guy named Hephestos, who is
apparently like a messiah like christ like figure who the
old guys were very threatened by, and they wanted Maximus
to go kill that guy.
Speaker 2 (46:25):
And so that's so good.
Speaker 1 (46:26):
What a crazy story.
Speaker 2 (46:28):
I have to tell you something, guys, that's even crazier, right.
I actually thought that was the version of Gladiata two
we were getting until the trailer came out. It has
been such a big part of my life, this insane,
unmade gladiat sequel. I thought, well, why would they make
any other version? Now I will say something that makes
it a little bit less crazy, And if you haven't
(46:48):
seen this movie, go watch it. Nick Cave is actually
a fantastic film writer. In two thousand and five, he
wrote this movie called The Proposition with Guy Piss and
Ray Winston and Danny Houston, and it's about a guy
who is a notorious outlaw and he gets caught by
a law man and they say, okay, we'll let you
go if you go and find your brother and kill
him because he is a really bad guy. And if
(47:12):
you don't do it, we'll execute your younger brother. And
it is so interesting. It's such a weird Western. I
used to watch it all the time. But yeah, Nick Cave,
He's written interesting, weird, dark films, so I definitely thought
there was a world where somebody would want to make
Gladiator to Christ Killer. Alas that is not the movie.
We're getting there. I have to say, at this point
in Russell Crowe's career, I believe he would be in
(47:34):
that movie. Have you seen The Pope's Exorcist? I believe
Russell Crowe would fight his way out of hell in
the gladiat But yeah, Jason, thank you for this incredible
ride through Roman history.
Speaker 1 (47:45):
Well thank you, And on the next couple of episodes
of Export Vision, we're diving into our Kane season two,
Act two and doing prophecy on HBO Max. That's it
through this episode. Thanks for listening, folks. Bite x Ray
Vision is hosted by Jason Kencepcion and Rosie Knight and
(48:06):
is a production of iHeart Podcasts. Our executive producers are
Joelle Smith and Aaron Kaufman. Our supervising producer is a
Boo Zafar. Our producers are Carmen Laurent and Mia Taylor.
Our theme song is by Brian Basquez.
Speaker 2 (48:22):
Special thanks to Soul Rubin and Chris Laude, Kenny Goodman
and Heidi A disco moderata
Hosts And Creators
Jason Concepcion
Rosie Knight
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