April 9, 2025 • 40 mins
On this episode of Move the Sticks, Daniel Jeremiah and Bucky Brooks open up the show with a detailed explanation on how they watch a prospect’s tape and what their draft grades really mean. Then, they analyze the teams with the most draft capital in the upcoming NFL Draft and predict how it’ll impact their maneuvers. (13:19) Finally, DJ and Bucky take a look at some player comps for top draft prospects! (23:54)
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
And now move the sticks with Daniel, Jeremiah and Bucky Brooks.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
What's up? Everybody?
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome to move to stacks, DJ Buck with you Buck,
what's happening man Man?
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Not too much? Djy.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
I got this question that I didn't ask you when
we were talking, having our little happy chat before we started,
But I wanted to ask you just because so many
of the people that listen to the show are either
scouts or aspiring scouts, and so I'm just curious about
your process. And part of this comes out of I
was listening to a podcast and people were kind of
reading a report and they were kind of like pointing
(00:34):
out certain plays on a player, and I was thinking
when I watched tape the first part of when I
watched tape, I have my pen down and I'm just
trying to get a feel for what the player is,
how he moves, how he does stuff whatever.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
I don't start taking notes. If we were doing like
a four game.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
Thing, I probably don't start taking notes until about the
third quarter of the first game.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
I just kind of want to watch and get a
feel for it, and then I make.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
General observations on athleticism and movement and things that flash
or whatever. And then I'm trying to see trends. So
I'm trying to see like what happens, what shows up
a few different times, and those things, so I can
kind of get an array of like who he is. So,
for instance, I'm looking at a pass rusher and I
see him dipping rip.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Okay, that's one time. Oh different rip, Oh that's Oh.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
This is his move, this is this is what he does,
this is his signature. Okay, I got that. Oh, what's
the counter?
Speaker 2 (01:30):
What does he have? Problems with? Those things?
Speaker 3 (01:32):
And then when it comes to writing the report or
getting down to the final thing, right, you call them
one liners. We talk about like, hey, what's the bullet
point that I'm gonna say on TV when they asked
me to describe this player in ten to fifteen seconds?
Speaker 2 (01:50):
And so that's always at the bottom of the thing.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
But I just wanted to know a little bit about
like your process when you're watching tape, because you and
I different, because you are a multi pin guy, use
multiple colors when it comes to it. I've always just
been a one color guy. So like quickly like a
two minute thing, like when you watch tate, like how
do you break it down? How do you take notes?
How do you kind of figure out what you want
to do with them when it comes to evaluating.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
I just jotted it down, so, uh, I just put
three questions down. And this is kind of like I
like doing everything and kind of the same, the same
way you do it. We all have different ways of
doing it, but we all have a process. So like
my process, and I know guys and I've actually had
people that you know, have advised me when I was young, like, hey,
don't write anything the first game. Just just soak it
(02:34):
in and then you get it. Then start taking notes
as you go forward. But the way I look at
it is my first thing the most. The first question
I ask is where is he? So like, if I'm
watching it, where is he lined up? If I'm watching
a defensive lineman, is he in a five tech? Is
he in a three tech? Is he in a shade?
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Like?
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Is he kicked out? Is he is he you know,
off the ball linebacker? Is he playing over the slot?
So I always start with the first question is where
is he? And I can start taking notes on that.
The first play. I just want to know is he
the left corner?
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Is he?
Speaker 1 (03:02):
You know? How are they using him, So that's the
first question is where is he? Then that transition to
what is he? Like what is he as a player?
This is how they use him, this is what he does.
This is kind of you get the strengths, weaknesses, how
does he move? You know, you know, all that gets
wrapped into how competitive he is? Is the effort, all
those things, that's all part of the notes that you're taking.
(03:24):
So it's where is he?
Speaker 2 (03:25):
What is he?
Speaker 1 (03:26):
And then the last one is who is he going
to be? So like where is he lined up? What's
he doing? And then what's the vision? Like what do
you look forward? And what's the vision for this player?
And that's where also, you know, I try and write
down some names or comps like it. I always like
to say, what if it all goes right, you know,
like if it all goes right for this player, he's
going to be doing this in this system and he
(03:48):
can be similar to this player. So that's kind of
the that's a quick version there.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
It's not.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
It's such an interesting thing because when I hear people
and then I love to like listen to scouts. I
love to call other scouts and I love to like
one of the things I missed about being in the
league is like scrimmaging out processes, right, and what you
learn from other people. I remember as a young scout
people telling me when you go watch someone live, don't
(04:15):
have a notebook, have a voice recorded, so that way
your eyes never leave the field. You can see it,
you can make I mean, now it's easy with your phone.
You can just say, oh, dictate it. Yeah, you can
just dictate it, do your little thing, and you never
have to like take your eyes off of it.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
So like the little tips and the little tidbits.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
That we all kind of acquired along the way. So
I was just curious about your process. And then the
last thing I had. I love hearing the conversation right
where everyone has like a different grading scale. But I
think what sometimes can be challenging to the general public is, well,
what is a great what does your grading scale mean?
(04:53):
So right now, when when a conversation where people talk
about like, oh I have a first round grade, I'm
have a second round grade, I'm on whatever. But you
and I have worked in buildings where there's a value
to what it means when I say, oh I put
a bottom of the first round grade on someone, Some
people may so for insan, let's just use your doorstanders, right.
So some people will say like, hey, I got a
(05:14):
bottom of the first round grade, top of the second
round grade on him, and people would think that that
is being dismissive of him as a player, like how
can you have a second round grade? Well, when you've
worked for a team, everybody defines what that first round
grade means. So like, if it's a top ten pick,
we're talking about future all start, future all pro, perennial
(05:37):
pro bowler, maybe a Hall of Fame type player. If
it's like a middle of the first round grade, like
day one starter, expectation is he would evolve into being
a Pro Bowl the bottom of the first round, could
start Day one, might evolve to a starter later in
his rookie season, but we expect him to be a
long term starter with Pro Bowl potential. Top of the
(05:59):
second round. Some similar like, hey, may not start first year,
but we expect him to be a.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Starter after year one or whatever.
Speaker 3 (06:06):
And I think for us, because everyone has a board,
everyone talks about the draft because we all love the draft.
But I do think sometimes because of TV, we do
people a disservice. When we talked about first, second, and
third round grade. We don't really tell them what that
means when we say, like, oh, I see him as
a third round player, Like, hey, he's a developmental player.
(06:27):
I think by year two he'll be heavy in the rotation,
maybe start by year three.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
Yeah, And you know, I was with a team where
we looked at it and not with rounds, but it
was by you know, what their roles would be. So
you had like you talked about an impact pro Bowl
level player, like you were saying, we would have an
immediate starter and eventual starter. So maybe he's not gonna
start year one, but he's going to start by year two,
like I'm saying he is going to start. I'm planning
(06:53):
us like there's a potential starter, which usually that usually
those guys are like fourth round, like third, fourth round,
Like I think he has a potential to be a starter.
Then you have your you know, your your solid backup
players that you know, like your sixth offensive lineman, your
fifth dB, fourth dB, Like he's gonna make the team
and he's going to be a backup, you know, role
player you have. Then like you get down below, you
(07:14):
have your practice squad type player, and then you get
down to the free agents you're talking about, you know,
more rosters or than anything else. But then you also
have this other set of you've got your boom or
bust high end guys, which are the developmental guys. You
put a D at the end of the grade and
that's the you know, big time like I always think
of to me, like in a six five D is
the highest developmental grade you can give. And on my
(07:36):
uh one of my ultimate like guys that just come
right to mind, Vince Young was a six five D
when he came out like way back in the day,
Like if he hit what you saw at early in
his career, like, man, he was dynamic and he you know,
but there's risk, there's risk and involved there developmental player
and then you have kind of that mid tier developmental
player like Okay, this guy's really raw, you know. I
(07:57):
think he's got the upside though that maybe he could
into a starter, but we're gonna have it's going to
require some patience. So that's how we kind of had
that conversation. And it's why when you hear people say,
oh there's you know, I know, like what I interviewed
for a job in New England, bazillion years ago when
I was in between spots, and one of the pieces
of advice I got from somebody in the building was like,
(08:18):
do not mention rounds, like that'll get that'll be a
major turnoff. And I was I was talking with Cassara
when I was in there, and uh, and we didn't.
We didn't use that where I was. It wasn't attempting
thing there. But they said, like they do not like
that at all because they're like, what is the first
round player? Second round player? I don't care is does
he start? Does he backup?
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Is? You know?
Speaker 1 (08:39):
So they almost took a fence to it. So people
are very beholden to the way that they're trained in
this whole thing.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
Yeah, And it's funny.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
I feel like I was blessed enough that like we
had round value while also having the thing did you
talk about day one started eventual starter, potential starter, developmental
prospect and so it married like the roundway matched up
with like whatever their projection is. And the reason why
I kind of get to all of this is only
because like there was a lot of conversation after Jalen
(09:07):
Milroe got invited to the draft and people were wondering, well,
is he gonna be a first round player? Like, is
someone gonna take him in the first round? Why would he
go to the draft? They're only taking fifteen guys. I
would be there, And it made me think about like draft,
like scouting, grading, putting the thing on and what it means.
(09:28):
And when I think about Jalen Millro to me and
I have in my notes, I have Jalen Milroe great
as like a top of the second round player because
of the tools and the reason why I said, like, hey,
potential starter, eventual starter in that rim, depending upon where
he lands. And to me, I just think the draft
(09:50):
process and scouting is so unique, particularly when we're not
associated with the team, is because there are thirty two
different teams who have thirty two different missions when it
comes to how they evaluate and select players.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
And all it takes is one team to say that
Jalen mill Row, he might be our Jalen Hurts type.
We can take him, we can craft something for him,
we can put him in a position to be successful,
and for us, he could be an eventual starter, whereas
another team is like, yeah, we're not going to do
any of that, so he doesn't have the same value.
(10:23):
It's just a fascinating thing, and I just wanted to
have that exchange because I think sometimes as we get close,
everyone is in such a hurry to be right about
their assessment that sometimes we ignore and overlook the nuance
that comes with evaluating players and being able to say, oh, okay,
I can see why Cleveland may take this player at
(10:43):
this point because for them, he can do X, Y
and Z, whereas somebody else they don't see him in
that light, and they also don't have the scheme that
will allow him to be able to be successful in
the same way.
Speaker 1 (10:55):
Yeah, it's a great point. It's a good call. And
I always also want to remind people on along these
lines is I've talked to a bunch of people over
the last week, like this is the time of year,
everybody's kind of getting in meetings and so everybody's in
the office, so you can have some conversations with the
personnel guys and coaches. And one of the things I
have learned in this for doing it, being on this
(11:15):
side of it for thirteen years is it's amazing buck
the teams that need players at a certain position. Man,
they feel like they've created some and they can find some.
And then you talk to other teams who are set
at those positions and they'll tell you those positions stink
in this year's draft. It's like you always it's a
line that you've always used. It's a line that you've
always used. You never want to go to the grocery
(11:36):
store hunger right it closed. There are some people talking
themselves into some stuff this time of year, and it
happens all the time.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
It clouds your focus and you begin to believe like
the stuff. And that is really why man I would
occur as like young scouts to have a high standard,
like a high standard when it comes to what your
idea a particularly when we're talking about like whatever a
Pro Bowl player, a first round player or whatever like
(12:06):
that bar needs to be really high because if it's
not high, if it waivers.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
Every year, what happens You end up having an uneven team.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
When you make it. When you keep making exceptions, you
end up with the team of exceptions.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
And that's why you have to have amused.
Speaker 3 (12:20):
I think you talked about early in your career being
able to look at Jonathan Ogden, and so Jonathan Ogden
kind of became the standard by which everybody else that
you look for as an offensive lineman was graded, and
so you're like, yeah, like he's good, but Jonathan Ogden
is like this, so I definitely can't give whatever that
top of the market grade is because he's not Jonathan Orkis,
(12:42):
so it falls down. And I think that's how people
have to look at the things. And that's why it's
important to look at protape, to go at Collin State,
because you need to see what the best players look like,
how they perform, because it then gives you an opportunity
to be like, oh, yeah, he doesn't match that, so
I can't give him that, Like this class may be
(13:03):
weak there, but let's make sure we understand exactly what
we're doing so we don't get disappointed when this player
walks in and he can't pass us like Miles Garrett.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
Yeah, no, it's it's it's one hundred percent. A great point, Buck,
I want to get into some other things here. Let's
let's kick things off. This is our lead block, presented
by T Mobile four Business. Football needs a network willing
to go the extra yard? So do you go further
with T Mobile four business. I tease this with you
before we came on. But I wanted to get your
thoughts on the powerbrokers in this draft, and one of
(13:34):
the ways you can do that is by going It's
the website. It's it's a great website by the way,
if you're keeping up with it during the year, which
is Tankthon, which kind of keeps you updated on where
you know the order of the picks, and this is
this is who has the most value in terms of
the value of their picks. This is a chart they
put together. It is it's it's off the study from
the Harvard Sports Analysis Collective. So looking at total value,
(13:58):
the team with the most values not the team with
the first pick. When you look at all their collection
of picks, it's actually the Cleveland Browns number one, It's
the Jacksonville Jaguars two. Then it's the Titans at three.
Patriots are four both in the draft and in terms
of value. Then how about the fifth team, the San
Francisco forty nine ers Because of some of the trades
that they've made, they have a boatload of picks. But
(14:20):
I want to start first of all, you know Cleveland,
we've talked a lot about them being up there with
the second overall pick. But I want to get to
your Jags as someone who's on the broadcast there. If
I was going to tell you these these objectives need
to be hit in this draft where they have the
second most value in terms of draft capital. What do
they need to accomplish in this draft?
Speaker 2 (14:41):
Man?
Speaker 3 (14:42):
That is such a good question, and it is one
of the things that as they're flipping regimes, going from
Trent Balky to James Gladstone and lie and Cohen, I
think they are trying to figure out how to maximize
the currency that they have, to change the coach and
to change the composition of the team DJ I would
tell you that the first thing before we even talk
about position, I think they want a team that is
(15:05):
super competitive, tough, minded, and physical. So if those things
are talked about constantly, every player has to exhibit those
things regardless of position. I would say from a roster standpoint,
in terms of where they need to get better, I
would say they need another corner, someone that can line
up opposite Tyson Campbell and be a high level player.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
I think Jerry and Jones is better suited to be
a nickel.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
I think they need another line of scrimmage player that
is a trench warrior.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
I believe they need an inside pass rusher.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
They may believe that they can get an outside rusher
and kick Traymon walking down inside and sub packages and
get away with that. I would say another weapon on
the outside on offense. Brian Thomas Junior was a revelation.
He has been terrific as a first year player. They
are intent on making him the wide receiver one. They
(15:58):
have a lot of hopes and a slot receiver park
At Washington, who's flash coming out of Penn State last year.
He did some things when Christian Kirk was absent, But
they still need another guy because as the contract flips
for Trevor Lawrence and he begins to make major money
like the fifty million thing kicks in next year, you
got to have young talented people around him on the
(16:20):
cheap relatively speaking, and so they need to find I think,
another playmaker opposite Brian Thomas. So you have a young
wide receiver Cord that can grow on the cheap while
the quarterback is commanding made your money, and then eventually
you may have to make that situation like Cincinnati. And
then the last thing that I would say is needed
someone up front on the offensive line, even though they
(16:42):
made moves in free agency, but someone that is a
tailkicker at the lone of scrimmage, because you can talk
about being a rough and tumble team, but if your
personnel doesn't match your words or your ethos, it's not
going to work out because then when you face a bullet,
you don't have the personnel to attack the bully the
way that you have to hit the bully in them out.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
And I look at some of their numbers last year defensively,
they were dead last in passing yards per game, dead last,
and takeaways twenty seventh, and points per game twenty eighth
and sacks. So I just think coming when Glassdom comes
from the Rams where he saw that young defense transform
quickly and get those guys up and running. To me,
(17:25):
it wouldn't shock me at all if they said, look,
if we're going to do one thing in this draft,
we're going to get deep and talented upfront, which a
lot of those stats I just read you. You become
a dominant front that covers up a lot of those weaknesses.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (17:39):
I think the other thing is that we just saw
this happen in basketball with the Denmer Nuggets, fire, Mike Malone,
Calvin Booth, the general manager, wanted the young guys to
get in the field. Mike Malone, the head coach, was
more comfortable playing to veterans, and Jacksonville liked the Rams.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
The Rams were very comfortable playing young players.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
And that works because the front office finds the players,
but the coaches have to play them. You have to
give them opportunities. And so that changes the way that
you attack free agency, because you don't want to have
log jams where you have veterans that aren't quite good
enough to be difference makers, but they're good enough to
get into rotation. You have to clear the way, clear
(18:17):
the path for the young guys to play. And so
as you talk about young dynamic players, be it and
the line of scrimmage or in the secondary, you have
to have entry ways for those guys to get onto
the field, and you have to make sure that you
have the patients and the discipline to play them as
they work through some of the miscuse and mistakes that
(18:39):
ultimately happen when you play young guys.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
One of the things too, when you look at the Rams,
and I need to talk to less need about this
and more in depth. But then everybody looks at the
turnaround they've had in terms of that side of the
ball and all the hits that they've had, their batting
eye which has been extremely high, and you know, they
had guys that tested well and guys that were productive.
But if you look at kind of the thread that
we've through that whole group, they drafted a bunch of
(19:03):
psychotic competitive guys like ultra ultra competitive wiring, elite elite wiring.
I'm curious to see if that's going to make its
way to Jacksonville.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
I think the acronym that they've been using has been
like DTA or stuff like that, like discipline, toughness, accountability,
like just making sure like the discipline and the details
is there because you got to have that away from
the field to be able to do it. Many you focus,
you do all the work that you need to do
to prepare, you have the toughness to deal with things
(19:35):
physically and mentally, and then just overall accountable, holding everybody
accountable to the performance and the standards that you have
to meet each.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
And every day. DJ.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
We've worked for teams that we talked about the critical factors.
You know, Hey, these players before we even talk about
what they do on the field.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
They have to have these things, They have to be
wired the right way.
Speaker 3 (19:56):
They have to exhibit these things on tape before we
can even consider them.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
When you were in Baltimore, everyone coined the phrase and
people have since told it, you got to play like
a raven like.
Speaker 3 (20:05):
There was a very specific vision for how the players
had to perform to be able to come into this
locker room and put on the jersey. And if you
don't have those trades like you can't you can't play
for them. I think it's really clear that we don't
get caught up in like a these are the words,
this is what we say we're about, and it doesn't
match with the kind of players that you bring into
(20:27):
the building.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Yeah, that's a great point. I wrote that down Tta.
I did like that discipline, toughness and accountable. The one
other team there in the top five that I wanted
to hit you on because I do think it's kind
of a sneaky big year for them, and I want
to keep coming back to the Rams. But the Rams
flipped it. They flipped the roster, they got younger, and
(20:48):
they're in really really good shape there now the forty
nine ers coming off of you know, I would say
just maybe a little lethargic, just because of all the
success they've had, the long postseason runs caught up to
him a little bit massive exodus in the offseason. They're
gonna end up paying Brock here pretty soon. They have
a lot of draft capital. Man, they got a lot
(21:09):
they need to accomplish here.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Yeah, they do. And you know what's funny. The Niners
are in a weird spot right.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
They are good and even though like they had a
down year this year, but they were just old enough
to begin to show some signs of decline. But those
older players were still good enough that you didn't want
to move off of them. So it requires some discipline
to be able to make some of these hard decisions.
And I'll say this, they've been I would say in
(21:37):
a way, and I know they have some years that
haven't been as great, but they've been so good for
so long. The DJ I think sometimes you can have
not an arrogance, but you can turn a blind eye
to having to make some of the decisions that you
need to make to sustain it. At a high level.
We're seeing in Philadelphia where Howie Roseman and those guys
like they are not emotionally attached to some of the
(21:59):
guy that really helped them win their last Super Bowl.
Speaker 2 (22:02):
But because they knew they had to stay.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
Disciplined in that regard to allow them to continue to
build upon what they've established, the Niners have to make
sure they get back to that.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
I feel like they lost.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
A little bit of their way and a little bit
of the identity that really made them the team that
people did not like playing, meaning when they were at
their best, I felt like they could whip you with
waves of defensive linemen, multiple guys up front that could
wear you down. And then on offense, they had a
(22:35):
bunch of versatile playmakers that were tough, multi purpose, dynamic
that they could create explosive plays in so many different
ways that it took a lot of the pressure off
the quarterback. It wasn't necessarily a quarterback driven team, even
though you had to have the right guy managing it.
I don't know if they I don't know if they
(22:58):
brought those same kind of players in in the last
couple of years to sustain what they established a few
years ago.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
Yeah, well, they've got to get it right this year.
They've got to get some young pieces. You look at
the exodus there, Deebo, Samuel Dre Greenlaw, Hargrave, funga Ward Corner,
the tackle, got a ton of money more in free agency,
Leonard Floyd's gone. I mean, they've got a lot of
guys that have left and not a lot of guys
that came in, so they were going to rely on
(23:25):
these young guys, which Robert Sala being back there I
think is big because teaching developing is going to be big.
You know, get a lot of young guys are going
to get on the field next year. So it's a
big year. It's a big draft for the San Francisco
forty nine ers. All right, that's a wrap for the
lead block presented by T Mobile for Business. Football needs
a network willing to go the extra yard? And so
do you go further with T Mobile for Business? Quick
(23:48):
pause and we will be right.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Back, all right, Buck.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
I feel like we have this conversation on a yearly
basis because if there's one thing that I've learned about
folks that are paying attention to the draft, that there
seems to be for the most part, I would say
a universal criticism is that I think there's a disconnect
between what we do on personnel side and the and
(24:17):
then the consumption side that they don't like comparisons. Oh
stop comparing guys, Like everybody's their own person. And I
think that's maybe that's kind of like the New Age
worldview or whatever. You know, Hey, just be your own person.
Nobody's everybody's a snowflake. There's no two things that are
the same. Like, yeah, we get it, we know that
you're no such thing as perfect you know, comparisons here,
(24:39):
But it's context and when you've been doing it for
a long time, there's value in context, and it gives
a vision. If you haven't seen a player, and I
tell you this player, if he hits his upside, you're
looking at somebody that's got, you know, Fred Warner type tools.
So maybe he's not gonna be as good as Fred Warner,
but you can utilize him in that way. He's got
that type of skill set. I I think it's it's
(25:00):
incredibly important in the process.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Let's make sure we explain to people the process.
Speaker 3 (25:05):
So I want everyone to understand that when you're working
for a team and we're in meetings, When we're in meetings,
videos not necessarily playing. We are doing what we used
to do, read reports. So part of the reason why
you had to give a comparison is as I'm reading
the report and everyone is sitting around, particularly the head coach,
because when I was in Carolina, John Fox was there,
(25:27):
and John Fox is very visual, and so for me,
I knew that if I wanted him to understand a
player that I liked, I had to give him a
visual of someone who was having success so he could
be like, oh, okay, I got it.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
And so that's where the comparisons started from. We're reading
these reports. It's all this verbiage, but finally the coach
wants to know, well, who is he going to be?
Who is he like?
Speaker 3 (25:52):
And then you say, hey, coach, he's kind of like
such and such on our team. Oh okay, okay, I
can get around that. And then when I go then
when he goes and looks at the tape, he'll kind
and say, oh, hey, you know what, You're right, he
is like that, but.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
He has this better. He needs that, but it gives
him a starting point of what the player is and
what he could be in the league, because you've given
him a comparison to someone that he knows. And that's
why point of reference and experience is so important, because
you can throw those comparisons out there to help your coaches,
your general manager understand who this player is.
Speaker 1 (26:27):
And who he could be at the next level, no doubt.
And again, some of these comparisons you hear Hall of
Fame level players and you go, I'm not saying this
guy's a Hall of Famer, but I'm saying this is
how he's going to be utilized. These are his strengths,
these are the similarities. So I'm gonna rip through some
of these, buck and I just want to get your
immediate reaction and then we'll go to the next ones.
You ready, yep, let's do it all right. Well, I'm
gonna start right there at the top here, Abdul Carter,
(26:49):
and I wrote down a guy that you've seen a
lot of we all have over the years, Von Miller.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
This is a really good one.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
And it's a really good one because I think people
need to go back when we talked about the comparison
is von Miller coming out of Texas a and m
and his explosiveness, how bindy he was turning the corner
and that move that he perfected as a pro, he
showed flashes of being able to perfect it as a collegiate.
Abdua Carter also has that. So when I see that,
(27:18):
it speaks to the speed, the explosiveness, the bindieness that
he displays, but also the ability to turn that speed
and to power when he needs to take someone right
down the middle.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:28):
So I mean, again, that's the lofty praise there, lofty comparison,
but that's the style at which he plays. So this
was an interesting one with Travis Hunter. You got to
do two. So I had thrown out different names over
the years, and I've settled on Garrett Wilson as my
wide receiver comedy just watching how smooth and easy he moved.
But the defensive one is a guy that you liked
(27:50):
back in the day, but as someone who was just
a prolific ball skills take it away and sees the
game really really well. Not the body comparison, but just
how they stylistically played the game.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
Marcus Peters, Oh, I did I did have a thing.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
You were a Marcus Peters guy.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
Marcus Peters.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Peters took the ball away a lot, and he wasn't
a long long run.
Speaker 2 (28:15):
But he did. He did take the ball away a lot.
He did have a nice run.
Speaker 3 (28:18):
I mean, he had a couple of Pro Bowls on
this thing or whatever, and he was an interception ball
hockey magnet. Uh, Travis has elite ballhawking skills. And I
know when we talk about him DJ And that's that's
why it's funny you talk about like Marcus Peters, because
Marcus Peters did his damage playing off in a way
from see everything see I firmly believe that Travis Hunter
(28:42):
would be better suited to play in a defense that
played zone, that allowed him to see the wall so
he could get interceptions off tips and overthrows and educated guesses.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
I like the comparison because.
Speaker 3 (28:56):
This dude is really good. And I know people we
had this debate. People talk about him lockdown corner whatever.
I don't know if he's a lockdown corner. I think
he's a playmaker on defense more so than a lockdown
corner in terms of someone that's gonna defend one after
field and no one's gonna catch your pass.
Speaker 2 (29:10):
I agree with that.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
All right, we'll go a little rapid fire here.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Gent mjd oh mj d y MJD give me the MJD.
Speaker 1 (29:21):
Same body type, same balance, Like you couldn't get to MJD.
I felt like guys couldn't get their arms around MJD
when he was running.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
They definitely couldn't tackle him. I feel like.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
Jent's the same guy, just people to bounce off of him,
and then he does have that burst. He has that
little burst now MJD with a little faster, but he
does have that just initial suddenness to pop burst out.
I saw JD.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
You know it's funny man, when I go back and
I look at because you know, sometimes you look at
the top guys early than you put them in the bed.
You spend a lot of time on the guys at
a blow uh the line.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
And DJ he's such.
Speaker 3 (29:52):
A rare combination of everything right, strength and power, balanced
body control, bursts, this says to take it the house.
Competitive stamina where like nine games with thirty plus carries
that is crazy in today's game.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
He looked m j D. I remember watching m D
g at U c l A.
Speaker 3 (30:13):
He gets so mad at me because I was like,
I you looked short. Didn't love it, you know, but
so good and so dynamic for a long time in
Jacksonville then with the Raiders and those things. Look, I
think Gents is a star and we can say they
look m j D was a star in the league.
I think I think I think mj D is a
(30:34):
I mean, I think Asten Genty has star power written
all over him. Right situation, He's gonna be terrific. This
one's interesting.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Mason Graham, Kyle Williams is the first name that popped in,
but then I ended up going with Luis Castill, remember
him oho Northwestern? Yes, yes, that's Castille. I think he
got He might have got popped for a drug testing.
But he was a good young player in the and
that defense at Merriman, all those guys back in the day.
Speaker 3 (31:02):
Good player. But you know what the thing about that
defense talk boy Merriman. He was a glue guy down there,
but a very talented glue guy on the interior where
you had to pay attention to him. To me, Mason Graham,
is that when when Mason Graham walks in, you won't
be impressed with like the physique, you won't be impressed
with like the lenk or whatever. But when you turn
on the tape, which is why you have to look
(31:23):
at the tape man. It's hard to find a better
quote unquote football player than Mason Graham.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
He does all that and Louis can see it. That's man,
that's a blast from the past. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
So that's why I'm grabbing some I'm grabbing Yeah, Jalen Walker.
I got this from a decordinator. We talked about this
the other day with Dante hight Tower.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
Oh yeah, physical.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
I mean, you're talking about a grown man who can
play spots, play multiple spots, heavy handed, could pass rush
when you needed him, the pass rush.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
Coming off the edge.
Speaker 3 (31:56):
But if you need to get into that rocking SoC
can roll by game in the bo he could do that.
Jayden Walker is that And to me, Jdaen Walker is
now the version of linebacker that everyone is looking for.
I wanted the early down linebacker that could be my
guy that can run in the box. But then on
sub packages, man, I need another guy that can enhance
(32:17):
the pass rush. And that's what Donte hot Tower could do.
And it's definitely what Jalen Walker is able to bring
to the table.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
All right, I'm gonna go grab a couple more here.
This one was I did this one at the combine
and then came back to it here. But Will Campbell,
Michael Ruse, oh Man.
Speaker 3 (32:36):
Man going up to Eastern Washington watching Michael rus who
donated red in fru Field.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
Now, yeah, like he man, he was.
Speaker 3 (32:45):
He was so good. He was a small school standard.
He was so solid and steady or whatever. And Will
Campbell has that. People will talking about the length or
whatever when you turn on the tape, DJ, he's steady.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Eddy. Now he's productive. You've got to grade him on
what he's able to do.
Speaker 3 (32:58):
And he has held his own and very competitively, and
he's held his own for a long time.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
At LSU young stepping into the starting line, if it
held his own, Yeah, it's solid.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
Will Johnson went with I went with Richard Sherman on
this one. Someone who's got to play. I like him
better playing top down than someone who you're just gonna
leave alone and press him and not give him any help.
I like him being able to see, similar to what
we were talking about earlier with Travis Hunter. I think
when he can do that, he's smooth, he sees things,
(33:29):
he's smart. I was talking to a coach who was
tight with Sherman, and I know Richard a little bit
and you've talked to him over the years, but I
would love to have this conversation with him because he
brought up a great point. He said, if you just
put me out there in one on ones, which is
me and one other guy on the field, he said,
probably wouldn't do very good. But he said, you put
the number two receiver out there, and I can see
(33:51):
what he was doing, I'll be just fine. He could
see and he knew route combinations, and he knew if
he had a feel for it, if he's releasing here,
I know what this guy is doing. Based off what
that guy's doing, Like I think Will Johnson from what
I watched, I see some of that similarities to him.
I think he's got a good processor. I think he's
more The way it was, the way that it was
(34:11):
used to explain to me, was like he wins, he's
gonna win more with his brain than with his engine.
Something along those lines. I thought that was interesting.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
I believe one that's who he is. To me, He's
a high IQ corner who needs to play in the defense.
That really leverages that out. His strengths are his ability
the key in diagnose, his ability to playoff and understand
down distant situation and to make the appropriate play based
on the situation and circumstance.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
To me, you put him in on a team with
a veteran.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Defense with a lot of like in a perfect world,
I would love to see him go to Minnesota and
play with Brian Flores where they ask and allow them
guys to play off and see stuff they're doing, all
these different exotic pre snap designs and then they do it.
To me, he's a hot IQ player that needs to
play in a high IQ defense to really max out
what he can bring.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
Yeah, so that was kind of an old school one
there for you. I'll give you two more here. Let's go.
Matthew Golden on Brandon Cook's oh.
Speaker 3 (35:13):
Man, another one of my favorites coming out and very
similar when Brandon Cooks was at Oregon State.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
It was a tricky.
Speaker 1 (35:22):
Evaluation low four three, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
Because you're trying to figure out can someone of that
statue be the anchor of a passing game? And that's
the question that many people are gonna have with Matthew Golden.
A is her wide receiver one or wide receiver two?
The speed is real, but any anchor a passing game,
Matthew Golden is super smooth, very fluid people that talk
about the time, and that led to maybe like him
(35:45):
kind of surging up the charts. But when you really
got to it, I think coaches tell you everything you
need to know. Sar keys in these guys when it
got down to it and when they started needing to
have in plays the back after the year, Matthew Golden
became the guy that was featured more in Isaiah Bond,
but the expectation was that Bond was gonna be that guy.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
I could see similarities between Brandon Cooks and Matthew Golden
because stature, speed, explosives, but also potential role as a pro.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
Yeah, and you mentioned that climb. I looked it up.
So when I did my first list in January, he
was my twenty fourth player. So he ended up right now,
he's at sixteen. He'll land somewhere between sixteen and eighteen.
So yeah, he moved up a little bit. I wouldn't
say that it was, you know, he didn't move up
a whole round or anything like that, but he did
get a little bit of a pop through how he
(36:33):
handled everything. And the more you learn about the kid
in terms of where he was training, what he was doing, interviews,
all that stuff have all been very very positive with him.
All right, let me give you want way to finish
up with one more here, last one buck Trayveon Henderson,
Jamal Charles.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
Ooh, good pool. That's a really good pool. Jamal Charles
was so great man. He was so good at Texas.
But then when he got to the league in Kansas
City with Andy Reid and had they unlocked him in
the screen.
Speaker 3 (37:01):
Game and catching passes and doing all the other stuff,
big playmaker and had the stamina and the ability to
anchor it down. Trevan Henderson has that there could be
some questions going in because last year they split the baby.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
Shared the lode.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
He I think he got a lot more that he
can do than what he displayed at Ohio State.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
Not a bad call, man, Jamal Charles. Man. Wait, I'm
just trying.
Speaker 1 (37:25):
To go random on it, because these are the ones
that I when I was doing these and looking up
different body types of different than what my notes were
on these guys coming out. Last one, last one Landon
Jackson from Arkansas, who I think we both really like.
I'm a Landam Jackson guy. Ziggy Ansa coming out of
by you.
Speaker 3 (37:41):
I just was talking about like he was he tested
really well nowhere mugget and out of nowhere, Hey, pro
Bowl player in Detroit. Though, Yeah, like that's a that's
a good one. And landing is it. Like it's not
always going to be pretty. It's not going to be
aesthetically pleased to the eye. But man, his physicality is
(38:02):
tough and even the athleticism.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
Explosive ran really well. Yeah, it shows up.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
He's not for everybody, much like Ziggy wasn't for everybody
doing the evaluations because.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
He went did I think he was five?
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Yeah, he went he went high. I think that was
twenty thirteen.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
Was that that?
Speaker 1 (38:18):
That was a terrible draft if I'm not mistaken, but.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
It might have been. I do remember.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
I think he played eight games. I think he was
an eight game starter. And because van Oy, I think
van Oy was on that BYU team. Those two guys.
Speaker 2 (38:30):
How about how about by you having some guys that
have come out there through the years.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
I know, all right, thanks for playing along with me there,
but it is again, I like doing comps. I like
looking at guys. I like seeing other guys that they
reminded me of. And when these guys get picked a
good bit of them. I'll have I'll have a compound
there for you that you can chew on. People get
upset about it, but I do think there's value there.
Speaker 2 (38:51):
Oh, that's always value. I mean, there's always value. And
being able to have some of this stuff.
Speaker 1 (38:56):
Well buck, I mean, pods are in first place. I
got started to get excited. I didn't say anything because
I didn't want to jinx it. But apparently I jinked
it without jinxing it, because within twenty four hours, Jackson
Merrill's on the ten dail. Tatis is a bad shoulder,
he's out. Crona Wort's got a back issue, he's out.
Speaker 2 (39:14):
You do this, it's a great you this great as
you do this every year. You get so excited.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
This year, I didn't. I didn't verbalize it.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
This year. You had the seatboot on, like you just
try not to get and then boom it comes out
and like you jinx it, Like come on, man, just Tatis's.
Speaker 1 (39:36):
Shoulders messed up. We're screwed. But anyways, that h I'll
enjoy it. Enjoyed the first twelve games. That was fun.
Speaker 2 (39:43):
All right, anything want to.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Before we get out of here, box.
Speaker 2 (39:46):
I mean it is a nice star for the Pridets.
Speaker 1 (39:50):
Yeah, well, see what happens. Hopefully they get healthy. I
hope you guys have enjoyed this one. We are getting close.
We will have all your needs covered here and there's
a we've got another pod coming up later this week.
Got a forty in free agents pod with Rosenthal that'll
be up. That gets dropped in there as well, so
if you have to look out for that stuff. And
we'll see you next time right here on movie sticks.
And now move the sticks with Daniel, Jeremiah and Bucky Brooks.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
What's up? Everybody?
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome to move to stacks, DJ Buck with you Buck,
what's happening man Man?
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Not too much? Djy.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
I got this question that I didn't ask you when
we were talking, having our little happy chat before we started,
But I wanted to ask you just because so many
of the people that listen to the show are either
scouts or aspiring scouts, and so I'm just curious about
your process. And part of this comes out of I
was listening to a podcast and people were kind of
reading a report and they were kind of like pointing
(00:34):
out certain plays on a player, and I was thinking
when I watched tape the first part of when I
watched tape, I have my pen down and I'm just
trying to get a feel for what the player is,
how he moves, how he does stuff whatever.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
I don't start taking notes. If we were doing like
a four game.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
Thing, I probably don't start taking notes until about the
third quarter of the first game.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
I just kind of want to watch and get a
feel for it, and then I make.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
General observations on athleticism and movement and things that flash
or whatever. And then I'm trying to see trends. So
I'm trying to see like what happens, what shows up
a few different times, and those things, so I can
kind of get an array of like who he is. So,
for instance, I'm looking at a pass rusher and I
see him dipping rip.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Okay, that's one time. Oh different rip, Oh that's Oh.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
This is his move, this is this is what he does,
this is his signature. Okay, I got that. Oh, what's
the counter?
Speaker 2 (01:30):
What does he have? Problems with? Those things?
Speaker 3 (01:32):
And then when it comes to writing the report or
getting down to the final thing, right, you call them
one liners. We talk about like, hey, what's the bullet
point that I'm gonna say on TV when they asked
me to describe this player in ten to fifteen seconds?
Speaker 2 (01:50):
And so that's always at the bottom of the thing.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
But I just wanted to know a little bit about
like your process when you're watching tape, because you and
I different, because you are a multi pin guy, use
multiple colors when it comes to it. I've always just
been a one color guy. So like quickly like a
two minute thing, like when you watch tate, like how
do you break it down? How do you take notes?
How do you kind of figure out what you want
to do with them when it comes to evaluating.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
I just jotted it down, so, uh, I just put
three questions down. And this is kind of like I
like doing everything and kind of the same, the same
way you do it. We all have different ways of
doing it, but we all have a process. So like
my process, and I know guys and I've actually had
people that you know, have advised me when I was young, like, hey,
don't write anything the first game. Just just soak it
(02:34):
in and then you get it. Then start taking notes
as you go forward. But the way I look at
it is my first thing the most. The first question
I ask is where is he? So like, if I'm
watching it, where is he lined up? If I'm watching
a defensive lineman, is he in a five tech? Is
he in a three tech? Is he in a shade?
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Like?
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Is he kicked out? Is he is he you know,
off the ball linebacker? Is he playing over the slot?
So I always start with the first question is where
is he? And I can start taking notes on that.
The first play. I just want to know is he
the left corner?
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Is he?
Speaker 1 (03:02):
You know? How are they using him, So that's the
first question is where is he? Then that transition to
what is he? Like what is he as a player?
This is how they use him, this is what he does.
This is kind of you get the strengths, weaknesses, how
does he move? You know, you know, all that gets
wrapped into how competitive he is? Is the effort, all
those things, that's all part of the notes that you're taking.
(03:24):
So it's where is he?
Speaker 2 (03:25):
What is he?
Speaker 1 (03:26):
And then the last one is who is he going
to be? So like where is he lined up? What's
he doing? And then what's the vision? Like what do
you look forward? And what's the vision for this player?
And that's where also, you know, I try and write
down some names or comps like it. I always like
to say, what if it all goes right, you know,
like if it all goes right for this player, he's
going to be doing this in this system and he
(03:48):
can be similar to this player. So that's kind of
the that's a quick version there.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
It's not.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
It's such an interesting thing because when I hear people
and then I love to like listen to scouts. I
love to call other scouts and I love to like
one of the things I missed about being in the
league is like scrimmaging out processes, right, and what you
learn from other people. I remember as a young scout
people telling me when you go watch someone live, don't
(04:15):
have a notebook, have a voice recorded, so that way
your eyes never leave the field. You can see it,
you can make I mean, now it's easy with your phone.
You can just say, oh, dictate it. Yeah, you can
just dictate it, do your little thing, and you never
have to like take your eyes off of it.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
So like the little tips and the little tidbits.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
That we all kind of acquired along the way. So
I was just curious about your process. And then the
last thing I had. I love hearing the conversation right
where everyone has like a different grading scale. But I
think what sometimes can be challenging to the general public is, well,
what is a great what does your grading scale mean?
(04:53):
So right now, when when a conversation where people talk
about like, oh I have a first round grade, I'm
have a second round grade, I'm on whatever. But you
and I have worked in buildings where there's a value
to what it means when I say, oh I put
a bottom of the first round grade on someone, Some
people may so for insan, let's just use your doorstanders, right.
So some people will say like, hey, I got a
(05:14):
bottom of the first round grade, top of the second
round grade on him, and people would think that that
is being dismissive of him as a player, like how
can you have a second round grade? Well, when you've
worked for a team, everybody defines what that first round
grade means. So like, if it's a top ten pick,
we're talking about future all start, future all pro, perennial
(05:37):
pro bowler, maybe a Hall of Fame type player. If
it's like a middle of the first round grade, like
day one starter, expectation is he would evolve into being
a Pro Bowl the bottom of the first round, could
start Day one, might evolve to a starter later in
his rookie season, but we expect him to be a
long term starter with Pro Bowl potential. Top of the
(05:59):
second round. Some similar like, hey, may not start first year,
but we expect him to be a.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Starter after year one or whatever.
Speaker 3 (06:06):
And I think for us, because everyone has a board,
everyone talks about the draft because we all love the draft.
But I do think sometimes because of TV, we do
people a disservice. When we talked about first, second, and
third round grade. We don't really tell them what that
means when we say, like, oh, I see him as
a third round player, Like, hey, he's a developmental player.
(06:27):
I think by year two he'll be heavy in the rotation,
maybe start by year three.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
Yeah, And you know, I was with a team where
we looked at it and not with rounds, but it
was by you know, what their roles would be. So
you had like you talked about an impact pro Bowl
level player, like you were saying, we would have an
immediate starter and eventual starter. So maybe he's not gonna
start year one, but he's going to start by year two,
like I'm saying he is going to start. I'm planning
(06:53):
us like there's a potential starter, which usually that usually
those guys are like fourth round, like third, fourth round,
Like I think he has a potential to be a starter.
Then you have your you know, your your solid backup
players that you know, like your sixth offensive lineman, your
fifth dB, fourth dB, Like he's gonna make the team
and he's going to be a backup, you know, role
player you have. Then like you get down below, you
(07:14):
have your practice squad type player, and then you get
down to the free agents you're talking about, you know,
more rosters or than anything else. But then you also
have this other set of you've got your boom or
bust high end guys, which are the developmental guys. You
put a D at the end of the grade and
that's the you know, big time like I always think
of to me, like in a six five D is
the highest developmental grade you can give. And on my
(07:36):
uh one of my ultimate like guys that just come
right to mind, Vince Young was a six five D
when he came out like way back in the day,
Like if he hit what you saw at early in
his career, like, man, he was dynamic and he you know,
but there's risk, there's risk and involved there developmental player
and then you have kind of that mid tier developmental
player like Okay, this guy's really raw, you know. I
(07:57):
think he's got the upside though that maybe he could
into a starter, but we're gonna have it's going to
require some patience. So that's how we kind of had
that conversation. And it's why when you hear people say,
oh there's you know, I know, like what I interviewed
for a job in New England, bazillion years ago when
I was in between spots, and one of the pieces
of advice I got from somebody in the building was like,
(08:18):
do not mention rounds, like that'll get that'll be a
major turnoff. And I was I was talking with Cassara
when I was in there, and uh, and we didn't.
We didn't use that where I was. It wasn't attempting
thing there. But they said, like they do not like
that at all because they're like, what is the first
round player? Second round player? I don't care is does
he start? Does he backup?
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Is? You know?
Speaker 1 (08:39):
So they almost took a fence to it. So people
are very beholden to the way that they're trained in
this whole thing.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
Yeah, And it's funny.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
I feel like I was blessed enough that like we
had round value while also having the thing did you
talk about day one started eventual starter, potential starter, developmental
prospect and so it married like the roundway matched up
with like whatever their projection is. And the reason why
I kind of get to all of this is only
because like there was a lot of conversation after Jalen
(09:07):
Milroe got invited to the draft and people were wondering, well,
is he gonna be a first round player? Like, is
someone gonna take him in the first round? Why would he
go to the draft? They're only taking fifteen guys. I
would be there, And it made me think about like draft,
like scouting, grading, putting the thing on and what it means.
(09:28):
And when I think about Jalen Millro to me and
I have in my notes, I have Jalen Milroe great
as like a top of the second round player because
of the tools and the reason why I said, like, hey,
potential starter, eventual starter in that rim, depending upon where
he lands. And to me, I just think the draft
(09:50):
process and scouting is so unique, particularly when we're not
associated with the team, is because there are thirty two
different teams who have thirty two different missions when it
comes to how they evaluate and select players.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
And all it takes is one team to say that
Jalen mill Row, he might be our Jalen Hurts type.
We can take him, we can craft something for him,
we can put him in a position to be successful,
and for us, he could be an eventual starter, whereas
another team is like, yeah, we're not going to do
any of that, so he doesn't have the same value.
(10:23):
It's just a fascinating thing, and I just wanted to
have that exchange because I think sometimes as we get close,
everyone is in such a hurry to be right about
their assessment that sometimes we ignore and overlook the nuance
that comes with evaluating players and being able to say, oh, okay,
I can see why Cleveland may take this player at
(10:43):
this point because for them, he can do X, Y
and Z, whereas somebody else they don't see him in
that light, and they also don't have the scheme that
will allow him to be able to be successful in
the same way.
Speaker 1 (10:55):
Yeah, it's a great point. It's a good call. And
I always also want to remind people on along these
lines is I've talked to a bunch of people over
the last week, like this is the time of year,
everybody's kind of getting in meetings and so everybody's in
the office, so you can have some conversations with the
personnel guys and coaches. And one of the things I
have learned in this for doing it, being on this
(11:15):
side of it for thirteen years is it's amazing buck
the teams that need players at a certain position. Man,
they feel like they've created some and they can find some.
And then you talk to other teams who are set
at those positions and they'll tell you those positions stink
in this year's draft. It's like you always it's a
line that you've always used. It's a line that you've
always used. You never want to go to the grocery
(11:36):
store hunger right it closed. There are some people talking
themselves into some stuff this time of year, and it
happens all the time.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
It clouds your focus and you begin to believe like
the stuff. And that is really why man I would
occur as like young scouts to have a high standard,
like a high standard when it comes to what your
idea a particularly when we're talking about like whatever a
Pro Bowl player, a first round player or whatever like
(12:06):
that bar needs to be really high because if it's
not high, if it waivers.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
Every year, what happens You end up having an uneven team.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
When you make it. When you keep making exceptions, you
end up with the team of exceptions.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
And that's why you have to have amused.
Speaker 3 (12:20):
I think you talked about early in your career being
able to look at Jonathan Ogden, and so Jonathan Ogden
kind of became the standard by which everybody else that
you look for as an offensive lineman was graded, and
so you're like, yeah, like he's good, but Jonathan Ogden
is like this, so I definitely can't give whatever that
top of the market grade is because he's not Jonathan Orkis,
(12:42):
so it falls down. And I think that's how people
have to look at the things. And that's why it's
important to look at protape, to go at Collin State,
because you need to see what the best players look like,
how they perform, because it then gives you an opportunity
to be like, oh, yeah, he doesn't match that, so
I can't give him that, Like this class may be
(13:03):
weak there, but let's make sure we understand exactly what
we're doing so we don't get disappointed when this player
walks in and he can't pass us like Miles Garrett.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
Yeah, no, it's it's it's one hundred percent. A great point, Buck,
I want to get into some other things here. Let's
let's kick things off. This is our lead block, presented
by T Mobile four Business. Football needs a network willing
to go the extra yard? So do you go further
with T Mobile four business. I tease this with you
before we came on. But I wanted to get your
thoughts on the powerbrokers in this draft, and one of
(13:34):
the ways you can do that is by going It's
the website. It's it's a great website by the way,
if you're keeping up with it during the year, which
is Tankthon, which kind of keeps you updated on where
you know the order of the picks, and this is
this is who has the most value in terms of
the value of their picks. This is a chart they
put together. It is it's it's off the study from
the Harvard Sports Analysis Collective. So looking at total value,
(13:58):
the team with the most values not the team with
the first pick. When you look at all their collection
of picks, it's actually the Cleveland Browns number one, It's
the Jacksonville Jaguars two. Then it's the Titans at three.
Patriots are four both in the draft and in terms
of value. Then how about the fifth team, the San
Francisco forty nine ers Because of some of the trades
that they've made, they have a boatload of picks. But
(14:20):
I want to start first of all, you know Cleveland,
we've talked a lot about them being up there with
the second overall pick. But I want to get to
your Jags as someone who's on the broadcast there. If
I was going to tell you these these objectives need
to be hit in this draft where they have the
second most value in terms of draft capital. What do
they need to accomplish in this draft?
Speaker 2 (14:41):
Man?
Speaker 3 (14:42):
That is such a good question, and it is one
of the things that as they're flipping regimes, going from
Trent Balky to James Gladstone and lie and Cohen, I
think they are trying to figure out how to maximize
the currency that they have, to change the coach and
to change the composition of the team DJ I would
tell you that the first thing before we even talk
about position, I think they want a team that is
(15:05):
super competitive, tough, minded, and physical. So if those things
are talked about constantly, every player has to exhibit those
things regardless of position. I would say from a roster standpoint,
in terms of where they need to get better, I
would say they need another corner, someone that can line
up opposite Tyson Campbell and be a high level player.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
I think Jerry and Jones is better suited to be
a nickel.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
I think they need another line of scrimmage player that
is a trench warrior.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
I believe they need an inside pass rusher.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
They may believe that they can get an outside rusher
and kick Traymon walking down inside and sub packages and
get away with that. I would say another weapon on
the outside on offense. Brian Thomas Junior was a revelation.
He has been terrific as a first year player. They
are intent on making him the wide receiver one. They
(15:58):
have a lot of hopes and a slot receiver park
At Washington, who's flash coming out of Penn State last year.
He did some things when Christian Kirk was absent, But
they still need another guy because as the contract flips
for Trevor Lawrence and he begins to make major money
like the fifty million thing kicks in next year, you
got to have young talented people around him on the
(16:20):
cheap relatively speaking, and so they need to find I think,
another playmaker opposite Brian Thomas. So you have a young
wide receiver Cord that can grow on the cheap while
the quarterback is commanding made your money, and then eventually
you may have to make that situation like Cincinnati. And
then the last thing that I would say is needed
someone up front on the offensive line, even though they
(16:42):
made moves in free agency, but someone that is a
tailkicker at the lone of scrimmage, because you can talk
about being a rough and tumble team, but if your
personnel doesn't match your words or your ethos, it's not
going to work out because then when you face a bullet,
you don't have the personnel to attack the bully the
way that you have to hit the bully in them out.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
And I look at some of their numbers last year defensively,
they were dead last in passing yards per game, dead last,
and takeaways twenty seventh, and points per game twenty eighth
and sacks. So I just think coming when Glassdom comes
from the Rams where he saw that young defense transform
quickly and get those guys up and running. To me,
(17:25):
it wouldn't shock me at all if they said, look,
if we're going to do one thing in this draft,
we're going to get deep and talented upfront, which a
lot of those stats I just read you. You become
a dominant front that covers up a lot of those weaknesses.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (17:39):
I think the other thing is that we just saw
this happen in basketball with the Denmer Nuggets, fire, Mike Malone,
Calvin Booth, the general manager, wanted the young guys to
get in the field. Mike Malone, the head coach, was
more comfortable playing to veterans, and Jacksonville liked the Rams.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
The Rams were very comfortable playing young players.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
And that works because the front office finds the players,
but the coaches have to play them. You have to
give them opportunities. And so that changes the way that
you attack free agency, because you don't want to have
log jams where you have veterans that aren't quite good
enough to be difference makers, but they're good enough to
get into rotation. You have to clear the way, clear
(18:17):
the path for the young guys to play. And so
as you talk about young dynamic players, be it and
the line of scrimmage or in the secondary, you have
to have entry ways for those guys to get onto
the field, and you have to make sure that you
have the patients and the discipline to play them as
they work through some of the miscuse and mistakes that
(18:39):
ultimately happen when you play young guys.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
One of the things too, when you look at the Rams,
and I need to talk to less need about this
and more in depth. But then everybody looks at the
turnaround they've had in terms of that side of the
ball and all the hits that they've had, their batting
eye which has been extremely high, and you know, they
had guys that tested well and guys that were productive.
But if you look at kind of the thread that
we've through that whole group, they drafted a bunch of
(19:03):
psychotic competitive guys like ultra ultra competitive wiring, elite elite wiring.
I'm curious to see if that's going to make its
way to Jacksonville.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
I think the acronym that they've been using has been
like DTA or stuff like that, like discipline, toughness, accountability,
like just making sure like the discipline and the details
is there because you got to have that away from
the field to be able to do it. Many you focus,
you do all the work that you need to do
to prepare, you have the toughness to deal with things
(19:35):
physically and mentally, and then just overall accountable, holding everybody
accountable to the performance and the standards that you have
to meet each.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
And every day. DJ.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
We've worked for teams that we talked about the critical factors.
You know, Hey, these players before we even talk about
what they do on the field.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
They have to have these things, They have to be
wired the right way.
Speaker 3 (19:56):
They have to exhibit these things on tape before we
can even consider them.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
When you were in Baltimore, everyone coined the phrase and
people have since told it, you got to play like
a raven like.
Speaker 3 (20:05):
There was a very specific vision for how the players
had to perform to be able to come into this
locker room and put on the jersey. And if you
don't have those trades like you can't you can't play
for them. I think it's really clear that we don't
get caught up in like a these are the words,
this is what we say we're about, and it doesn't
match with the kind of players that you bring into
(20:27):
the building.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Yeah, that's a great point. I wrote that down Tta.
I did like that discipline, toughness and accountable. The one
other team there in the top five that I wanted
to hit you on because I do think it's kind
of a sneaky big year for them, and I want
to keep coming back to the Rams. But the Rams
flipped it. They flipped the roster, they got younger, and
(20:48):
they're in really really good shape there now the forty
nine ers coming off of you know, I would say
just maybe a little lethargic, just because of all the
success they've had, the long postseason runs caught up to
him a little bit massive exodus in the offseason. They're
gonna end up paying Brock here pretty soon. They have
a lot of draft capital. Man, they got a lot
(21:09):
they need to accomplish here.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Yeah, they do. And you know what's funny. The Niners
are in a weird spot right.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
They are good and even though like they had a
down year this year, but they were just old enough
to begin to show some signs of decline. But those
older players were still good enough that you didn't want
to move off of them. So it requires some discipline
to be able to make some of these hard decisions.
And I'll say this, they've been I would say in
(21:37):
a way, and I know they have some years that
haven't been as great, but they've been so good for
so long. The DJ I think sometimes you can have
not an arrogance, but you can turn a blind eye
to having to make some of the decisions that you
need to make to sustain it. At a high level.
We're seeing in Philadelphia where Howie Roseman and those guys
like they are not emotionally attached to some of the
(21:59):
guy that really helped them win their last Super Bowl.
Speaker 2 (22:02):
But because they knew they had to stay.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
Disciplined in that regard to allow them to continue to
build upon what they've established, the Niners have to make
sure they get back to that.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
I feel like they lost.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
A little bit of their way and a little bit
of the identity that really made them the team that
people did not like playing, meaning when they were at
their best, I felt like they could whip you with
waves of defensive linemen, multiple guys up front that could
wear you down. And then on offense, they had a
(22:35):
bunch of versatile playmakers that were tough, multi purpose, dynamic
that they could create explosive plays in so many different
ways that it took a lot of the pressure off
the quarterback. It wasn't necessarily a quarterback driven team, even
though you had to have the right guy managing it.
I don't know if they I don't know if they
(22:58):
brought those same kind of players in in the last
couple of years to sustain what they established a few
years ago.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
Yeah, well, they've got to get it right this year.
They've got to get some young pieces. You look at
the exodus there, Deebo, Samuel Dre Greenlaw, Hargrave, funga Ward Corner,
the tackle, got a ton of money more in free agency,
Leonard Floyd's gone. I mean, they've got a lot of
guys that have left and not a lot of guys
that came in, so they were going to rely on
(23:25):
these young guys, which Robert Sala being back there I
think is big because teaching developing is going to be big.
You know, get a lot of young guys are going
to get on the field next year. So it's a
big year. It's a big draft for the San Francisco
forty nine ers. All right, that's a wrap for the
lead block presented by T Mobile for Business. Football needs
a network willing to go the extra yard? And so
do you go further with T Mobile for Business? Quick
(23:48):
pause and we will be right.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Back, all right, Buck.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
I feel like we have this conversation on a yearly
basis because if there's one thing that I've learned about
folks that are paying attention to the draft, that there
seems to be for the most part, I would say
a universal criticism is that I think there's a disconnect
between what we do on personnel side and the and
(24:17):
then the consumption side that they don't like comparisons. Oh
stop comparing guys, Like everybody's their own person. And I
think that's maybe that's kind of like the New Age
worldview or whatever. You know, Hey, just be your own person.
Nobody's everybody's a snowflake. There's no two things that are
the same. Like, yeah, we get it, we know that
you're no such thing as perfect you know, comparisons here,
(24:39):
But it's context and when you've been doing it for
a long time, there's value in context, and it gives
a vision. If you haven't seen a player, and I
tell you this player, if he hits his upside, you're
looking at somebody that's got, you know, Fred Warner type tools.
So maybe he's not gonna be as good as Fred Warner,
but you can utilize him in that way. He's got
that type of skill set. I I think it's it's
(25:00):
incredibly important in the process.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Let's make sure we explain to people the process.
Speaker 3 (25:05):
So I want everyone to understand that when you're working
for a team and we're in meetings, When we're in meetings,
videos not necessarily playing. We are doing what we used
to do, read reports. So part of the reason why
you had to give a comparison is as I'm reading
the report and everyone is sitting around, particularly the head coach,
because when I was in Carolina, John Fox was there,
(25:27):
and John Fox is very visual, and so for me,
I knew that if I wanted him to understand a
player that I liked, I had to give him a
visual of someone who was having success so he could
be like, oh, okay, I got it.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
And so that's where the comparisons started from. We're reading
these reports. It's all this verbiage, but finally the coach
wants to know, well, who is he going to be?
Who is he like?
Speaker 3 (25:52):
And then you say, hey, coach, he's kind of like
such and such on our team. Oh okay, okay, I
can get around that. And then when I go then
when he goes and looks at the tape, he'll kind
and say, oh, hey, you know what, You're right, he
is like that, but.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
He has this better. He needs that, but it gives
him a starting point of what the player is and
what he could be in the league, because you've given
him a comparison to someone that he knows. And that's
why point of reference and experience is so important, because
you can throw those comparisons out there to help your coaches,
your general manager understand who this player is.
Speaker 1 (26:27):
And who he could be at the next level, no doubt.
And again, some of these comparisons you hear Hall of
Fame level players and you go, I'm not saying this
guy's a Hall of Famer, but I'm saying this is
how he's going to be utilized. These are his strengths,
these are the similarities. So I'm gonna rip through some
of these, buck and I just want to get your
immediate reaction and then we'll go to the next ones.
You ready, yep, let's do it all right. Well, I'm
gonna start right there at the top here, Abdul Carter,
(26:49):
and I wrote down a guy that you've seen a
lot of we all have over the years, Von Miller.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
This is a really good one.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
And it's a really good one because I think people
need to go back when we talked about the comparison
is von Miller coming out of Texas a and m
and his explosiveness, how bindy he was turning the corner
and that move that he perfected as a pro, he
showed flashes of being able to perfect it as a collegiate.
Abdua Carter also has that. So when I see that,
(27:18):
it speaks to the speed, the explosiveness, the bindieness that
he displays, but also the ability to turn that speed
and to power when he needs to take someone right
down the middle.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:28):
So I mean, again, that's the lofty praise there, lofty comparison,
but that's the style at which he plays. So this
was an interesting one with Travis Hunter. You got to
do two. So I had thrown out different names over
the years, and I've settled on Garrett Wilson as my
wide receiver comedy just watching how smooth and easy he moved.
But the defensive one is a guy that you liked
(27:50):
back in the day, but as someone who was just
a prolific ball skills take it away and sees the
game really really well. Not the body comparison, but just
how they stylistically played the game.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
Marcus Peters, Oh, I did I did have a thing.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
You were a Marcus Peters guy.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
Marcus Peters.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Peters took the ball away a lot, and he wasn't
a long long run.
Speaker 2 (28:15):
But he did. He did take the ball away a lot.
He did have a nice run.
Speaker 3 (28:18):
I mean, he had a couple of Pro Bowls on
this thing or whatever, and he was an interception ball
hockey magnet. Uh, Travis has elite ballhawking skills. And I
know when we talk about him DJ And that's that's
why it's funny you talk about like Marcus Peters, because
Marcus Peters did his damage playing off in a way
from see everything see I firmly believe that Travis Hunter
(28:42):
would be better suited to play in a defense that
played zone, that allowed him to see the wall so
he could get interceptions off tips and overthrows and educated guesses.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
I like the comparison because.
Speaker 3 (28:56):
This dude is really good. And I know people we
had this debate. People talk about him lockdown corner whatever.
I don't know if he's a lockdown corner. I think
he's a playmaker on defense more so than a lockdown
corner in terms of someone that's gonna defend one after
field and no one's gonna catch your pass.
Speaker 2 (29:10):
I agree with that.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
All right, we'll go a little rapid fire here.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Gent mjd oh mj d y MJD give me the MJD.
Speaker 1 (29:21):
Same body type, same balance, Like you couldn't get to MJD.
I felt like guys couldn't get their arms around MJD
when he was running.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
They definitely couldn't tackle him. I feel like.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
Jent's the same guy, just people to bounce off of him,
and then he does have that burst. He has that
little burst now MJD with a little faster, but he
does have that just initial suddenness to pop burst out.
I saw JD.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
You know it's funny man, when I go back and
I look at because you know, sometimes you look at
the top guys early than you put them in the bed.
You spend a lot of time on the guys at
a blow uh the line.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
And DJ he's such.
Speaker 3 (29:52):
A rare combination of everything right, strength and power, balanced
body control, bursts, this says to take it the house.
Competitive stamina where like nine games with thirty plus carries
that is crazy in today's game.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
He looked m j D. I remember watching m D
g at U c l A.
Speaker 3 (30:13):
He gets so mad at me because I was like,
I you looked short. Didn't love it, you know, but
so good and so dynamic for a long time in
Jacksonville then with the Raiders and those things. Look, I
think Gents is a star and we can say they
look m j D was a star in the league.
I think I think I think mj D is a
(30:34):
I mean, I think Asten Genty has star power written
all over him. Right situation, He's gonna be terrific. This
one's interesting.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Mason Graham, Kyle Williams is the first name that popped in,
but then I ended up going with Luis Castill, remember
him oho Northwestern? Yes, yes, that's Castille. I think he
got He might have got popped for a drug testing.
But he was a good young player in the and
that defense at Merriman, all those guys back in the day.
Speaker 3 (31:02):
Good player. But you know what the thing about that
defense talk boy Merriman. He was a glue guy down there,
but a very talented glue guy on the interior where
you had to pay attention to him. To me, Mason Graham,
is that when when Mason Graham walks in, you won't
be impressed with like the physique, you won't be impressed
with like the lenk or whatever. But when you turn
on the tape, which is why you have to look
(31:23):
at the tape man. It's hard to find a better
quote unquote football player than Mason Graham.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
He does all that and Louis can see it. That's man,
that's a blast from the past. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
So that's why I'm grabbing some I'm grabbing Yeah, Jalen Walker.
I got this from a decordinator. We talked about this
the other day with Dante hight Tower.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
Oh yeah, physical.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
I mean, you're talking about a grown man who can
play spots, play multiple spots, heavy handed, could pass rush
when you needed him, the pass rush.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
Coming off the edge.
Speaker 3 (31:56):
But if you need to get into that rocking SoC
can roll by game in the bo he could do that.
Jayden Walker is that And to me, Jdaen Walker is
now the version of linebacker that everyone is looking for.
I wanted the early down linebacker that could be my
guy that can run in the box. But then on
sub packages, man, I need another guy that can enhance
(32:17):
the pass rush. And that's what Donte hot Tower could do.
And it's definitely what Jalen Walker is able to bring
to the table.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
All right, I'm gonna go grab a couple more here.
This one was I did this one at the combine
and then came back to it here. But Will Campbell,
Michael Ruse, oh Man.
Speaker 3 (32:36):
Man going up to Eastern Washington watching Michael rus who
donated red in fru Field.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
Now, yeah, like he man, he was.
Speaker 3 (32:45):
He was so good. He was a small school standard.
He was so solid and steady or whatever. And Will
Campbell has that. People will talking about the length or
whatever when you turn on the tape, DJ, he's steady.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Eddy. Now he's productive. You've got to grade him on
what he's able to do.
Speaker 3 (32:58):
And he has held his own and very competitively, and
he's held his own for a long time.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
At LSU young stepping into the starting line, if it
held his own, Yeah, it's solid.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
Will Johnson went with I went with Richard Sherman on
this one. Someone who's got to play. I like him
better playing top down than someone who you're just gonna
leave alone and press him and not give him any help.
I like him being able to see, similar to what
we were talking about earlier with Travis Hunter. I think
when he can do that, he's smooth, he sees things,
(33:29):
he's smart. I was talking to a coach who was
tight with Sherman, and I know Richard a little bit
and you've talked to him over the years, but I
would love to have this conversation with him because he
brought up a great point. He said, if you just
put me out there in one on ones, which is
me and one other guy on the field, he said,
probably wouldn't do very good. But he said, you put
the number two receiver out there, and I can see
(33:51):
what he was doing, I'll be just fine. He could
see and he knew route combinations, and he knew if
he had a feel for it, if he's releasing here,
I know what this guy is doing. Based off what
that guy's doing, Like I think Will Johnson from what
I watched, I see some of that similarities to him.
I think he's got a good processor. I think he's
more The way it was, the way that it was
(34:11):
used to explain to me, was like he wins, he's
gonna win more with his brain than with his engine.
Something along those lines. I thought that was interesting.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
I believe one that's who he is. To me, He's
a high IQ corner who needs to play in the defense.
That really leverages that out. His strengths are his ability
the key in diagnose, his ability to playoff and understand
down distant situation and to make the appropriate play based
on the situation and circumstance.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
To me, you put him in on a team with
a veteran.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Defense with a lot of like in a perfect world,
I would love to see him go to Minnesota and
play with Brian Flores where they ask and allow them
guys to play off and see stuff they're doing, all
these different exotic pre snap designs and then they do it.
To me, he's a hot IQ player that needs to
play in a high IQ defense to really max out
what he can bring.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
Yeah, so that was kind of an old school one
there for you. I'll give you two more here. Let's go.
Matthew Golden on Brandon Cook's oh.
Speaker 3 (35:13):
Man, another one of my favorites coming out and very
similar when Brandon Cooks was at Oregon State.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
It was a tricky.
Speaker 1 (35:22):
Evaluation low four three, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
Because you're trying to figure out can someone of that
statue be the anchor of a passing game? And that's
the question that many people are gonna have with Matthew Golden.
A is her wide receiver one or wide receiver two?
The speed is real, but any anchor a passing game,
Matthew Golden is super smooth, very fluid people that talk
about the time, and that led to maybe like him
(35:45):
kind of surging up the charts. But when you really
got to it, I think coaches tell you everything you
need to know. Sar keys in these guys when it
got down to it and when they started needing to
have in plays the back after the year, Matthew Golden
became the guy that was featured more in Isaiah Bond,
but the expectation was that Bond was gonna be that guy.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
I could see similarities between Brandon Cooks and Matthew Golden
because stature, speed, explosives, but also potential role as a pro.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
Yeah, and you mentioned that climb. I looked it up.
So when I did my first list in January, he
was my twenty fourth player. So he ended up right now,
he's at sixteen. He'll land somewhere between sixteen and eighteen.
So yeah, he moved up a little bit. I wouldn't
say that it was, you know, he didn't move up
a whole round or anything like that, but he did
get a little bit of a pop through how he
(36:33):
handled everything. And the more you learn about the kid
in terms of where he was training, what he was doing, interviews,
all that stuff have all been very very positive with him.
All right, let me give you want way to finish
up with one more here, last one buck Trayveon Henderson,
Jamal Charles.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
Ooh, good pool. That's a really good pool. Jamal Charles
was so great man. He was so good at Texas.
But then when he got to the league in Kansas
City with Andy Reid and had they unlocked him in
the screen.
Speaker 3 (37:01):
Game and catching passes and doing all the other stuff,
big playmaker and had the stamina and the ability to
anchor it down. Trevan Henderson has that there could be
some questions going in because last year they split the baby.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
Shared the lode.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
He I think he got a lot more that he
can do than what he displayed at Ohio State.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
Not a bad call, man, Jamal Charles. Man. Wait, I'm
just trying.
Speaker 1 (37:25):
To go random on it, because these are the ones
that I when I was doing these and looking up
different body types of different than what my notes were
on these guys coming out. Last one, last one Landon
Jackson from Arkansas, who I think we both really like.
I'm a Landam Jackson guy. Ziggy Ansa coming out of
by you.
Speaker 3 (37:41):
I just was talking about like he was he tested
really well nowhere mugget and out of nowhere, Hey, pro
Bowl player in Detroit. Though, Yeah, like that's a that's
a good one. And landing is it. Like it's not
always going to be pretty. It's not going to be
aesthetically pleased to the eye. But man, his physicality is
(38:02):
tough and even the athleticism.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
Explosive ran really well. Yeah, it shows up.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
He's not for everybody, much like Ziggy wasn't for everybody
doing the evaluations because.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
He went did I think he was five?
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Yeah, he went he went high. I think that was
twenty thirteen.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
Was that that?
Speaker 1 (38:18):
That was a terrible draft if I'm not mistaken, but.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
It might have been. I do remember.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
I think he played eight games. I think he was
an eight game starter. And because van Oy, I think
van Oy was on that BYU team. Those two guys.
Speaker 2 (38:30):
How about how about by you having some guys that
have come out there through the years.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
I know, all right, thanks for playing along with me there,
but it is again, I like doing comps. I like
looking at guys. I like seeing other guys that they
reminded me of. And when these guys get picked a
good bit of them. I'll have I'll have a compound
there for you that you can chew on. People get
upset about it, but I do think there's value there.
Speaker 2 (38:51):
Oh, that's always value. I mean, there's always value. And
being able to have some of this stuff.
Speaker 1 (38:56):
Well buck, I mean, pods are in first place. I
got started to get excited. I didn't say anything because
I didn't want to jinx it. But apparently I jinked
it without jinxing it, because within twenty four hours, Jackson
Merrill's on the ten dail. Tatis is a bad shoulder,
he's out. Crona Wort's got a back issue, he's out.
Speaker 2 (39:14):
You do this, it's a great you this great as
you do this every year. You get so excited.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
This year, I didn't. I didn't verbalize it.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
This year. You had the seatboot on, like you just
try not to get and then boom it comes out
and like you jinx it, Like come on, man, just Tatis's.
Speaker 1 (39:36):
Shoulders messed up. We're screwed. But anyways, that h I'll
enjoy it. Enjoyed the first twelve games. That was fun.
Speaker 2 (39:43):
All right, anything want to.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Before we get out of here, box.
Speaker 2 (39:46):
I mean it is a nice star for the Pridets.
Speaker 1 (39:50):
Yeah, well, see what happens. Hopefully they get healthy. I
hope you guys have enjoyed this one. We are getting close.
We will have all your needs covered here and there's
a we've got another pod coming up later this week.
Got a forty in free agents pod with Rosenthal that'll
be up. That gets dropped in there as well, so
if you have to look out for that stuff. And
we'll see you next time right here on movie sticks.
Hosts And Creators
Daniel Jeremiah
Bucky Brooks
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