4 - Go Forth and Murder

The girls touch on Making A Murderer theories before delving into child killer Cropsey and the murder of Michele Wallace. Plus listener hometown stories including Adam Walsh, the girl in the box, and the Petaluma Tickler.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:16):
Welcome to my favorite murder. Welcome, that's Karen. I'm Georgia.
That's Georgia thanks to Girls one murder.

Speaker 2 (00:25):
Obsessed with true crime, both of us with bad things,
bad things happening. We love it.

Speaker 1 (00:32):
We want to know all about it so will never
happen to us.

Speaker 3 (00:35):
And it turns out so to a lot of other people. Yeah,
because lots of people have been telling us about how
much they like it.

Speaker 2 (00:42):
We've got a lot of emails from the last episodes
of people telling us their town murders, which I love
and is like so exciting, and we haven't read them
yet because we want to surprise each other with it.

Speaker 1 (00:51):
Yes, but so many I would look at the first.

Speaker 2 (00:53):
Line in Gmail and I would say, like these little
things because I'm fucking curious and I want to know
what they say.

Speaker 1 (00:59):
But so many people like I didn't. Uh, I'm so.

Speaker 2 (01:02):
I was always so embarrassed that this is a thing
that I was into, which I'm like, what you trying
to talk to everyone about it? I know, Well that's
how I felt when I was younger. Yeah, like that
I was like crazy or people would think that you
wanted to murder people right exactly, And then the second
I started doing stand up and every other stand up
comic knew every serial killer backwards and forth.

Speaker 1 (01:20):
I was like, oh, I get it. I wonder what
it is anxious people.

Speaker 3 (01:25):
Yeah, it's probably and it's so fascinating. Yeah, it's like
the worst of humanity.

Speaker 2 (01:33):
Yeah. I wonder if it's a little OCD is too,
where you're like, oh, I need to know everything about
this now, yeah, and everything that's related to it.

Speaker 1 (01:41):
Yeah, please help help me prepare for when I run
face to face right into John Wayne Gacy, because now
you and I already to be able to fucking beat
up any serial killer murderer.

Speaker 2 (01:51):
I found a new podcast, not new, it's really old,
but they talk about murders and stuff a lot, and
maybe I shouldn't plug it because then it's like, go ahead, No,
it's really good.

Speaker 1 (01:59):
It's called are You Thinking Sideways Podcasts? No, I've never
heard of that.

Speaker 2 (02:02):
It's like a girl and shudos and they just talk
about like weird shit and a lot of it is murder.
It's great.

Speaker 1 (02:09):
I like it.

Speaker 3 (02:09):
I started listening to Jo de Rosa and Pat Walsh's
podcast I'll See You and How Oh my God, which
because I had to drive home from San Francisco yesterday
six hours so I listened to many and it was
really hilarious. I recommend that what are they talking about?
They talk about They put on a horror movie, but
then they just talk over it. You can't hear it
or anything. They just tell you what movie it is,
and they talk about it incidentally as they have conversations.

Speaker 1 (02:31):
It sounds like it shouldn't work, but I bet it's
fucking great.

Speaker 2 (02:34):
Well, it's so.

Speaker 3 (02:34):
Great because they both have these insane comprehensive encyclopedic cumulage
of movies, so any tangent they go on, they know
exactly who and what they're talking about, which of course
was a real sore spot for me, as I anytime
I bring up a subject.

Speaker 2 (02:50):
I'm like, you know that thing that happened that time?
Hold on, hold on, Well, you need like the right
person to fill in the bank the blanks, and you're
just like, oh, this is why I'm friends with you
is because you you like I was just rambling and
you were and you filled it in And that's the best.
That's what we do, right, It's totally what we do. Oh,
I was gonna make you say the last part I

(03:11):
guess they're not good at that far to do.

Speaker 3 (03:16):
I'm really excited, audience, because Georgia got no couches. And
when I was listening to our first episode, there's a
sound in the background at the entire time. It's it's
me squeaking on my couch, like I'm just constantly moving
around the couch.

Speaker 1 (03:33):
It was making me laugh so hard for so that's well, no,
it's all cleared up.

Speaker 2 (03:37):
I got these for podcasting, so you don't make background
noise in podcasting. Perfect podcasting couch. You can write them off. Wait,
not that I make any money on podcasts. This is
not a money making venture. Everyone, don't quit your job.
You never know, You don't ever know. You don't ever
don't ever know. Like getting murdered, yep. Uh, should we

(03:58):
jump into it or should we talk about making a murder?

Speaker 1 (04:01):
Have you been reading all the making a murderer theories?

Speaker 2 (04:03):
Well, the natural backlash has happened.

Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah, I'm pretty sure he's guilty, now, are you? I'm
pretty sure it's guilty.

Speaker 2 (04:11):
Now are you really?

Speaker 1 (04:12):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (04:15):
I think that's very adult of you to be able
to change positions. Really, doesn't it feel good? Well, look,
here's the thing and this is the This is the
one thing I agree with in general. I think he's innocent,
and I think very bad things are happening in that state.
I think people there's a natural backlash when you get
kind of spoon fed and ants not an answer but

(04:36):
like a villain and like, here's here's really what happened,
and they're leaving just enough pieces free so you can
put the mystery together yourself, and then everyone thinks they
got it and they're on it. Well, so there's always
the hot take of like, no, actually.

Speaker 2 (04:49):
Right, because everyone wants to know details. That's the problem
is that people who are looking up details are like, oh,
this documentary was really one sided, and you guys left
so much shit out, which makes me suspect of you, yeah,
and suspect of your conclusion.

Speaker 3 (05:03):
Even none of the details that I read, and I
admittedly only read maybe two articles skimmed half skimmed while
I was doing two other things. But the piece of
evidence that they brought up didn't sway me.

Speaker 1 (05:17):
Toward him.

Speaker 2 (05:18):
They didn't.

Speaker 3 (05:19):
It was like that thing of like, where was it?
I don't think it's proof. The things that they mention
that was evidence that got left out was not stronger
evidence than like bones in the fire pit or do.

Speaker 2 (05:33):
You know what, I think that someone on that property
someone's did it, but maybe it wasn't Steve. And I
think Brendan Darcy knows or participated in it. Really.

Speaker 1 (05:45):
Yeah, because if you go.

Speaker 2 (05:46):
Back, which I've done now and read his whole ten
hours of transcript shit, they're not feeding him that are too.

Speaker 1 (05:55):
It's too much of a narrative.

Speaker 2 (05:57):
But he said it's from Kiss the Girls. I remember
that part in the end in the courtrooms, like it's
from Kiss the Girls.

Speaker 1 (06:05):
Yeah, No, he might have made that up.

Speaker 2 (06:06):
There's some ship that it's like this, really, this is
a narrative you're telling, and you're too stupid to like
make up this story that sounds this this much of
a narrative, right. It's just that no zero blood anywhere.
I know that, which is why I'm like, it probably
happened somewhere else and it wasn't. Maybe it wasn't Steven.
I just like it's been three minutes and I've already

(06:28):
changed my mind.

Speaker 1 (06:29):
Family.

Speaker 3 (06:29):
Well, No, I mean I think that's good. You have
to continually reapproach it. Uh, like the District Circuit court
judge that you are in now I state.

Speaker 1 (06:38):
Did you know I went to school?

Speaker 3 (06:39):
Yeah, but I I don't know. I I'm much more
interested in, like, you can tell that there's a very
real systemic problem.

Speaker 2 (06:49):
Oh that's not even I'm not talking about that.

Speaker 3 (06:52):
Yeah, that's shits. Those people do whatever they want. You
can tell that that that district attorney just does whatever
he wants.

Speaker 2 (06:59):
I think the key was planted. I think that probably
maybe the blood was planted. I don't think that he
got a fair trial and everything.

Speaker 1 (07:07):
It's what's interesting.

Speaker 2 (07:08):
One of the things that I kind of let me
down a rabbit hole is people are saying that the
key that they found, that's a spare key. That's like
maybe the brother. They're like, we know it's Stephen Avery
and he gave him the spare key. The brother gave
her spare key to him to like plant. And there's
like a photo that they keep showing of her standing
by her car with her camera and stuff, and you
can see her big old keychain for holding it in there.

(07:30):
It's like so that her purse wasn't found, nothing was found.

Speaker 3 (07:34):
So and then the ex boyfriend, there's the picture where
he has a scratch on his hand right like like
a human fingernails scratched.

Speaker 2 (07:42):
That's really long. Yeah, I don't think they had anything
to do with I think they probably found the car,
but they bet they like trespassed onto the steve. This
is all based on shit that I've read on Reddit too.
By the way, I'm not taking any fucking credit for this.
Found the car because they knew that she was going there,
called the cops up and it was an illegal fucking fine,

(08:02):
and so they made that the woman who's in the
search party go find the car.

Speaker 1 (08:07):
Right?

Speaker 2 (08:08):
Does this make anybody anyone who's listening who hasn't watched it.
Everyone's watched it.

Speaker 3 (08:13):
Everyone's watched it in America and decided it's gonna be
interesting to see if anything actually really what happened with that?
Were you reading these papers off of that Anonymous? Uh
like file dump? No, you know Anonymous went in and
like released all those files.

Speaker 1 (08:28):
I'm interested.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
I don't know. But then there was a thing today
that that was it today or yesterday that was there's
a serial killer that they think is good for her.
Molder told he's in the background of a in the video. Yeah,
and he was. There's a serialciller. He was known for
going to the trials of the people he would frame.

Speaker 3 (08:47):
Yep, but he's a big, old, fat, unhealthy dude. Sorry,
what's the problem.

Speaker 2 (08:53):
Well, how could he like a young, sprite woman? Although
I guess if you're like, help me, I need help
and you just push her on that. Yeah, it's a
classic Buffalo Bill scenario. Yeah, you totally.

Speaker 1 (09:07):
He says for big old girl, big old fat girl,
big old f get me me and my sister. Just
watch this lambs.

Speaker 3 (09:18):
And I was saying Clarice Starling's lines two seconds before
she would say them.

Speaker 1 (09:22):
And this is how I know my sister loves me.

Speaker 3 (09:24):
She never told me to show up because we've been
watching TV together for so long. She's just used to
my insanity. But I couldn't not do it.

Speaker 1 (09:30):
That's nice.

Speaker 2 (09:31):
I do that and then I apologize the whole time,
but I still keep doing it, Beth, But I like,
just keep sucking doing it.

Speaker 3 (09:39):
Tell me his name, doctor Lecter. How do you not
do that when you know that that's what she's gonna say,
and you can.

Speaker 2 (09:43):
Do it just like her. That's the best movie.

Speaker 1 (09:46):
It's really.

Speaker 2 (09:46):
Did your niece watch it with you?

Speaker 1 (09:47):
No?

Speaker 2 (09:48):
No?

Speaker 3 (09:48):
Oh god?

Speaker 2 (09:48):
I was like, she's gonna have a nightmare for the
rest of her life.

Speaker 1 (09:51):
She was only nine.

Speaker 2 (09:53):
No, I think I think I had seen it by that.
I think I'm ruined. I think I saw it when
you were nine. I think I saw it when I
was very young. I don't know whatever.

Speaker 3 (10:01):
I read the book in college, and actually I was
home alone all day and began to think I was
Clarice Starling. As I was reading the book, I was
so into it. I went insane. Probably were I kind
of was? Did I already tell you that story?

Speaker 2 (10:14):
No?

Speaker 1 (10:15):
Well, it's true.

Speaker 2 (10:19):
Hey Karen, Hey, what's your favorite murder?

Speaker 3 (10:22):
Well, I thought it would be good that I would
do a little damage control since on our last episode
I was so like sloppy and inaccurate talking about Cropsy.
That was one of the ones we were literally guessing
what the name of the thing was.

Speaker 1 (10:38):
I was trying to talk about.

Speaker 2 (10:39):
We've let everyone know that this is not an official
report of anything that's happened.

Speaker 1 (10:45):
We're not doctors.

Speaker 2 (10:46):
You're looking in the wrong place. We're not therapists. But
the story has all of the.

Speaker 3 (10:51):
Elements of murder, you know, creeper, urban legend story, everything
I love. It's got a mental hospital it's got the woods.

Speaker 2 (11:01):
It's almost like that's you. That's too much. If someone
had written this thing. Yeah, it's like you can pick
one or the other. But you can't have a mental
hospital in the woods.

Speaker 1 (11:09):
It's crazy and tell me everything. Okay, So this is
the story of Cropsy.

Speaker 3 (11:14):
Was an urban legend on Staten Island, and it was
there was a hospital named Willowbrook and it is a
hospital for mentally challenged children. And they built it and
say like the early forties, and.

Speaker 2 (11:30):
It is on Staten Island and set in the woods,
and it was a state institution.

Speaker 3 (11:38):
And it was built for four thousand patients, but by
nineteen sixty five it had six thousand children in it.
It was built for how many four thousand, so it's
way over capacity. And this was back when people used
to dump their children, so in it didn't matter if
they had down syndrome or if they were very very

(11:59):
you know, know there was something really wrong with it,
like cere they would just like tons of polity. Kids
were completely intelligent and one hundred percent there just dumped.
And so what ended up happening was, of course because
it's like a state funded hospital, so it's over it's over,
overflowing with patients.

Speaker 1 (12:21):
What's the word I'm looking for? Us got it's good going.

Speaker 3 (12:24):
Understaffed, overpopulated, and so they end up uh a reporter
finally goes in. When we talked about it on the
last episode, I said something really grandiose, like Robert shut
it down. But Heraldo Rivera, so Kennedy saw it in
the seventy sixty eight and said, this is a snake

(12:45):
pit and this is a disgrace.

Speaker 1 (12:47):
And they started doing all these reviews.

Speaker 3 (12:49):
And what had happened was all these children being in
this close proximity. They found out it was like they
were just in rooms naked, being hosed down. Horrible, there's
no lighting, it's crazy. And the bunch of them started
getting hepatitis. So then they had medical studies where they
were testing hepatitis on these children.

Speaker 2 (13:06):
They might as well do some fucking scientific testing.

Speaker 3 (13:08):
Exactly, and they were basically giving them all hepatitis.

Speaker 1 (13:11):
They were getting it.

Speaker 3 (13:12):
It was so anyway, with all of this, these social
workers finally went in there, saw the conditions. They got
a reporter in there, and that's what led So a
woman started writing expose's for like a local newspaper, and
then that's how Coraldo got on the scene. He worked
as an investigative reporter for WABC in New York, so

(13:35):
he went there and they did they did an expose
story that ended up winning a Peabody because it was.

Speaker 2 (13:40):
So and it was kind of like they went when
there were doctors were gone and stuff right, or the
doctors let them in.

Speaker 3 (13:45):
That So I don't know about the Coraldo part. I
don't know how he got in, but the we talked
about this before. When you see the videotape, and there
is a documentary called Willowbrook, like it's something like The
Great Shame or something like something like that. It's it
gets mentioned a lot in all the research. But he

(14:08):
basically went in and like the only lighting was the
light on the camera.

Speaker 2 (14:12):
It's so like creepy. It looks like like American horror story,
like asylum, like totally just exactly what you think it's
supposed to be.

Speaker 3 (14:21):
Like it would be like thirty kids in a room naked,
sitting on the cement floor, walking back and forth.

Speaker 2 (14:26):
Then they talked to one guy and he was like
one of the patients and he's like, I have cerebral
parl palsy and I am completely mentally functioning on one
hundred percent. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (14:34):
Yeah, and I'm trapped in here. Nightmare. Okay.

Speaker 3 (14:37):
So right, so that alone is a nightmare. That's Willowbrook nightmare.
Geraldo being in it isn't great, but it ends up.
They had it with all that in the XPOS. They
passed legislation, but you know about like the rights of
uh civil rights thing for patients and stuff, all this stuff. Well,
so then the urban legend. So they ended up closing

(15:01):
it in nineteen eighty seven, but they basically closed it
in seventy two or four after this EXPOS came out.
They shipped all of the patients to all different hospitals
around and there was only like two hundred patients. Wow,
So it was basically empty. And that's when the urban
legends started. Where it was there's a mental patient that's
still on the grounds because there's a tunnel system underneath

(15:23):
the hospital and he's living in the tunnels. At night,
he comes out and steals children. And that was the
big thing on Staten Island in the eighties.

Speaker 2 (15:30):
Oh my god, how I fucking terrifying to live in
Staten Island?

Speaker 3 (15:33):
Crazy, right, And so the high school kids, the big
thing was go through the woods and get to the
mental hospital and like touch the wall of it or whatever.
Absolutely not and cross Cropsy's out there with you. So
and there's a great documentary called Cropsy where they go
into all this that they have all the information that
you need if you're fascinated, because it's really good and fascinating.

Speaker 2 (15:54):
So I just imagine like parents in the eighties being like,
you'd be good, or a crop he's going to come
get you. Yeah, in Staten Island. You're like, actually, that
could happen. Actually it's happening. My mom would it, you'd
be good. I'm gonna call the Indian Reservation. I'm having
to come get you, which is like so racist.

Speaker 3 (16:09):
My grandmother used to say, don't put like if you
were holding money, yeah, she'd say, don't put it, don't
put it in your mouth. That could have been in
a chinaman's ear.

Speaker 1 (16:19):
What like you're hey, you're gonna put money in your
fucking mouth? Oh my god? Racist in it?

Speaker 3 (16:24):
Just in like a chip or grandma way right. So anyway,
so now now we're going to introduce a new character
in this story, and it's a man named Andre Rand
and he was he's described in one of the pages
that I read as a mentally incompetent convicted sex offender.

Speaker 1 (16:41):
That's fun. So he's got it all.

Speaker 3 (16:43):
Yeah, and he was a janitor at Willowbrook from nineteen
sixty six six Tonight.

Speaker 2 (16:49):
I feel like anyone you're gonna hire it to be
a janitor there, you have to be like, no, you're
fired because why, like you're crazy?

Speaker 1 (16:54):
Clearly yes.

Speaker 3 (16:56):
Well, and you've got to think if these children were
being housed like animals, like not no better than animals,
probably worse in some ways. The staff that were there
letting this happen and looking at it every day. Not
the greatest people you're gonna want. Let's say they're not.

Speaker 1 (17:12):
Around, we can fruity show.

Speaker 2 (17:15):
I'm sure there's a couple of gems and they're like,
I'm staying because they need me and I'm the only
hope they have. But the majority probably, I mean in life,
there's probably one out of one hundred people who we
were in like that. Yeah, so you get you're gonna
get people who are real good with throwing a bucket
of water on a bunch of mentally ill children and
walking out of the room. You got, you good with
that Andre, Okay, great, you've got the job. So in

(17:38):
the so this guy gets the job in.

Speaker 3 (17:40):
Sixty six will in sixty nine he so he works
there from sixty.

Speaker 2 (17:46):
Six to sixty eight.

Speaker 3 (17:47):
In sixty nine, he attempts to rape a nine year
old girl and just by chance, a cop car is
driving by. He takes a nine year old girl into
his car and to an empty lot and takes.

Speaker 2 (17:59):
Up closes her clothes are off, a cop car drives by.
He gets in.

Speaker 1 (18:03):
Life works well, you know, I mean, yeah, go on.

Speaker 3 (18:06):
This is an upside. This is one upside in this
hideous story. He gets sense to four years, he only
serves ten months. You know, the classic scenario.

Speaker 2 (18:19):
This is why we have to do this podcast is
because our fucking penal system blows. Because we got to
talk about it. We get we're gonna affect change. Oh clearly,
if by laying on these couches, I would have gotten
eleven months if it was today, because of us.

Speaker 3 (18:31):
So he gets out and then that would be sixty
nine to seventy one. In seventy two, a nine year
old girl named Alice Prera disappears off Staten Island. Then
in nineteen eighty one, nine years later, a seven year
old girl named Hollyanne Hughes goes missing and the eyewitnesses

(18:56):
saw her with Rand no way, and she's never seen again.
And then in nineteen eighty three, this is this is
a real highlight for me. He picks up eleven children
from a YMCA in a school bus, takes them the
White Castle and then drives them to the Newark Airport
for five hours. And when he gets back he gets

(19:16):
arrested for kidnapping.

Speaker 2 (19:17):
Who the fuck is letting a guy who's been in
prison for attempted rape driving a bus, a school bus,
he's got the eighties.

Speaker 3 (19:26):
He raps a nine year old, tries to rape a
nine year old, and then goes ahead and gets some
job driving.

Speaker 2 (19:30):
Is in the eighties, needs to go to prison for
fucking So this was back before we realized children were
constantly in danger. So in eighty three, an eleven year
old name to HEAs Jackson disappears walking to the store.

Speaker 1 (19:46):
And this is twelve days after Rand is released. I've
bet he was buying cigarettes for his mom, Like, I
bet that's what you know? Yeah, that's the eighties. I
think that's what all of it.

Speaker 3 (19:53):
This is Kastaten Island is not that big, and I
think it's like run down to the store from on
me and it's probably at one of the girls lived
in a hotel.

Speaker 1 (20:00):
Is bad news anyway.

Speaker 2 (20:02):
Okay, So that was eleven days after I got out
of person for the kidnapping. Twelve days. Twelve days he
does that, And that's the same year he did the
Oh so he did the YMC a school bus trick
and then gets out of prison. Twelve days later.

Speaker 3 (20:15):
This kid goes missing, a girl, it's a girl. And
then in eighty four a twenty two year old guy
who is a really low IQ goes missing. And then
in eighty seven a girl named Jennifer Schweiger goes missing
and she has down syndrome, and several eyewitnesses saw this

(20:37):
guy Andrey Rand leading her by the hand toward the woods.

Speaker 1 (20:42):
I mean that willone. There's your poster for the horror movie.

Speaker 2 (20:45):
Heay.

Speaker 3 (20:46):
So they start searching for her, and after thirty five
days they find her nude body and a shallow grave
on the willow Brook property. And then a couple feet
you know, several feet away, Andre Rand has a makeshift campsite.
He's been living on the willow Brook rounds and the

(21:08):
whole urban legend is true. And they eventually they charge
him with kidnapping and first degree murder, but they can't
make the murder stick.

Speaker 1 (21:16):
I think it's two years.

Speaker 3 (21:17):
No, no, no, They get him for first degree kidnapping and
then they bring back and then once he's in jail
for that, he gets like twenty years. Then in two
thousand and four he put him on trial for the
Holly Hughes disappearance, and he's convicted of kidnapping and he
gets Now he's set to get out in twenty thirty
five or something like that when he's ninety five. So

(21:38):
he's in. He's in for good. They also linked him
to the disappearance of epel Atwell and the rape murder
of Shinley, who are both Hollowbrook.

Speaker 1 (21:45):
Willowbrook aides, so, oh my god, that sucks.

Speaker 3 (21:49):
He's a beast and he's and like it's basically the
most fascinating story of that.

Speaker 1 (21:54):
It all was true.

Speaker 2 (21:55):
What a bummer to go to work and then that
they get killed, Like, don't go in the wood, don't
walk to the store by yourself. But you're like, I'm
just going to work.

Speaker 3 (22:03):
Just going to work, just trying to pay my rent.
So that's that's Cropsy. That's a good murder.

Speaker 1 (22:09):
I mean, it's that's what's good about is the what's the.

Speaker 2 (22:12):
Worst thing I've ever heard in my life? You know?
That's the that's the stats on this show is like,
what's the worst thing you've ever heard in your life?

Speaker 3 (22:18):
I mean, don't you want to Why hasn't anyone gone
into the tunnels in that hospital and like dug around
archaeologically and tried to find Sharon?

Speaker 2 (22:27):
One hundredth episode, let's fuck, do.

Speaker 3 (22:29):
We get a school boost full of eleven children and
drive them to Staten Island?

Speaker 2 (22:33):
Hey, palace the money to get plane tickets to Staten
Island and to not stand Staten Island because fuck that
we're standing Manhattan.

Speaker 3 (22:39):
We got to stand Manhattan. We got to see Hamilton. Yeah,
we gotta go to the to the shoot stores.

Speaker 2 (22:47):
Yeah. And Cropsy and Cropsy yeah?

Speaker 1 (22:50):
Oh brother, Yeah that was mine?

Speaker 2 (22:53):
What's yours? Georgu? Well, well, what's interesting about both of
ours is that the murderer in question still alive in prison?
Oh still alive? How are these Isn't it weird that
this person It's like in your mind, I like, oh,
they did these awful things that long ago.

Speaker 1 (23:10):
They're dead.

Speaker 2 (23:11):
Nope, no live.

Speaker 1 (23:12):
They had dinner tonight. They watched some TV.

Speaker 2 (23:14):
They watched some TV. You had a conversation with the guard.
Perhaps they played some bones. Probably play bones out what
people do in prison. I don't know what bones is.
It's dominance. I've got the Yeah, what do you think
you had for dinner? Something grow chicken that gut? Yeah, yeah,
you had dinner. You got That's better than what I've
had for dinner.

Speaker 1 (23:31):
And he's a monster.

Speaker 2 (23:33):
And he's a monster.

Speaker 1 (23:34):
He's a monster.

Speaker 2 (23:36):
Speaking of monsters, Okay, my favorite murder is that of
Michelle Wallace, Michelle with one now and I remember seeing
I love cold cases, like that's I love when murders
get solt of course. Yeah, but cold cases are my
like passion in my dream, the passion every people getting
away with shit because it's just so curious. I'm just

(23:58):
so curious. Yeah, but I also like that the answer
is never like satisfying. It's always like, that's just some
fucking janitor, asshole did this to all these people.

Speaker 1 (24:05):
That's such a bummer. I wanted to be like a
monster or something.

Speaker 2 (24:09):
Okay, So and I remember watching a cold casee of
this a long time ago, and two things that stuck
out to me. Okay, she's a twenty five year old photographer.
This is nineteen seventy four. She lives in Chicago. She's
like this free spirit photographer and she travels the world
and taking photos and taking odd jobs and stuff. And
she goes to in ninety seventy four, goes to Oregon,

(24:32):
spends a couple of days in the Rocky Mountains just
taking some photos. I think I've seen this one. Yeah,
is it a forensic files? I think there's a Forensic
Files on it. She's leaving the Rocky Mountains and she
does the classic nineteen seventies I want to get murdered moves.

Speaker 1 (24:49):
Do you know what that is? Is it hitchhikers? It's
fucking hitchhikers. She picks up hitchhikers.

Speaker 2 (24:53):
Oh, she picks them, picks up two dudes.

Speaker 1 (24:56):
Oh no, what one girl alone picks up two dudes?

Speaker 2 (25:00):
What the seventies and eighties go? They're going to fucking prison?

Speaker 1 (25:05):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (25:05):
What did they look like? I wondered that she was
like this is fine. Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (25:10):
Was one really short or something so short?

Speaker 2 (25:13):
Guys are strong, don't pick up anyone, and they're mad
and they're angry. Yeah, so we're gonna get a lot
of hate mail for this. No, No, it's fine. I'm
sure it's fine.

Speaker 1 (25:21):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (25:21):
So she drops one of them off at the bar,
this one dude, and then of course she has never
seen again. Then the guy who she dropped off a
couple like, finds out this girl's missing and he's like,
wait a second, she dropped me off. And then the
guy I was with, who I barely knew, said I'm
gonna can you take me to my car?

Speaker 1 (25:42):
Actually?

Speaker 2 (25:43):
And the guy was like, I didn't think he had
a car, So I thought that was strange. So they
start looking. His name is Roy. Sorry, the guy that
got dropped off of the bar is the one that
says that. Yeah, He's like, okay, I didn't think Roy
is his name had a car? Okay, And he's like, yo,
why did you let early with them?

Speaker 3 (26:00):
Fuck?

Speaker 1 (26:01):
You know, like right there, you could have fucking fixed anyways.

Speaker 2 (26:04):
Roy Meelsen me Melonson, Mellonson should have looked that up before.
Roy Mellinson he's a drifter and a convicted rapist, so
but he got out after very short time.

Speaker 1 (26:18):
Sure, why are we men?

Speaker 2 (26:19):
But yeah, he knows to kill the person, so they can't.
I be him, you know, it's like, that's how you do,
that's you progress. I'm having a panic attack. He's found
with her driver's license, camping equipment, car keys, and pon
tickets for her camera. And this is one of my
favorite parts of why it's stuck with me, And I
can't fucking find this online now some reason it's not

(26:41):
up there anymore. They find the camera at the pawnshop
the lat they developed the film. It's all her photos
in the Rocky Mountains. The very last photo is Roy
sitting on a bed behind him laying down as a
naked woman, and it's it's not her. So he has
her camera, you know, it's like, that's the proof. Yep,
she's missing, and you robbed her and you took a

(27:03):
photo of yourself, you fucking idiot. And I can't find
that photo my line. I know it was in the
forensic files or whatever. I totally remember remember this because yeah,
because it's so freaky, so freaky. But and this guy
never got caught. No, Okay, here's my other favorite.

Speaker 1 (27:19):
Part about this. Okay, Okay, Well, it's an awful story.

Speaker 2 (27:21):
Okay, five weeks later, Michelle's mom just kills herself because
she can't even do It's like my daughter didn't come back.

Speaker 1 (27:28):
I know she's dead, kills herself.

Speaker 2 (27:32):
And then in seventy nine, so what is that five
six years later, five years later, this is the other
part that's really fucked up, and the stuck with me.
They find just a scalp with two brown haired braids
on it, like a scalp only or did some hiker
found it near where near where she had picked up

(27:52):
the hitchhikers? So just a fucking scalp, I'm gonna keep saying,
because it was fucking off. Just you think it was
like sitting on a log or definitely from a branch.

Speaker 1 (28:03):
Probably they showed it.

Speaker 2 (28:05):
There's a photo which they're hanging from a branch. Sorry, well,
you got to think like he didn't He definitely didn't
scalp her.

Speaker 1 (28:13):
Probably this is animal work. Oh you think so? Well,
I guess if it's that clean. Maybe not, but I
would think so. No, I don't. I mean, I have
no idea.

Speaker 3 (28:24):
But my first guess is doesn't it all decompose at
the same time? Like why would the scalp still be
there if nothing else is there.

Speaker 2 (28:32):
Well, and maybe an animal pulled it off, like was
chewing at the Everyone is who's listening right now and
freaking out at us hates us so much, and we've
just lost half our listeners.

Speaker 3 (28:42):
Here's the thing though, It's like, that's kind of part
of what's interesting about serial killers is when they do things.

Speaker 1 (28:48):
It's those markets utilation. But yeah, they're.

Speaker 2 (28:50):
Not a lot of them.

Speaker 1 (28:51):
I don't think that's a normal fit, like a I
don't know, what do you think.

Speaker 3 (28:56):
Well, sometimes it's like a calling card of like, oh,
that's thing is he wants to keep their hair or
remove their hair. I don't know whatever it makes me
think of that of like a scalping serial killer.

Speaker 2 (29:07):
There's a way I've read way too much about cutting
off nipples. I just can't really cuts anymore. I know
your face is telling, is it is? I'm just picturing it.

Speaker 1 (29:17):
I thought of it hurt, really, it hurts to think
about it.

Speaker 2 (29:20):
So the thought of someone doing it, you have to
be just a complete socio bad Yeah, clearly you're a
psychopathy anyways, Okay.

Speaker 1 (29:27):
Clearly have a problem with your mother.

Speaker 2 (29:28):
Sorry, that's fair. It's true.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
That's fair.

Speaker 2 (29:32):
Okay, they find a scalp, but that's but you know,
it's nineteen seventy nine, and so they don't have a body,
so they can't pros so they.

Speaker 1 (29:38):
Put in a brown cardboard box.

Speaker 2 (29:40):
You can't put it up on the shelf right in
a hot room. Yeah, but like there's like there's no body,
so they can't prosecute. But it's like, well, I feel
like nowadays you can prosecute without a body much more easily.

Speaker 1 (29:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (29:54):
And then so twelve years goes by no body. This
woman Kathy Young who becomes like the sheriff in town
or I'm sure I'm saying that incorrect.

Speaker 1 (30:05):
She's not. I'm sure she's much higher up.

Speaker 2 (30:07):
She hires this this company called necro search, which I
remember thinking at the time, that's what I want to do.

Speaker 1 (30:15):
I want to work there for a living, like I
just want to.

Speaker 2 (30:17):
I want to like the name all yeah, I just
want to.

Speaker 1 (30:21):
I want to follow them like the grateful dead.

Speaker 2 (30:22):
I want to be the receptionists as neck Research, I
could be like necro Searching can help you, what's your
what's your emergency? It's going crossbones. But they like they
like they have uncovered what they what they do is
they find and they're really good at uncovering clandestine grave sites.

Speaker 1 (30:40):
So it's like, you badass motherfuckers?

Speaker 2 (30:43):
Is that?

Speaker 1 (30:43):
How like they have like a.

Speaker 2 (30:46):
Farm, They have a farm where they like bury pigs
dead pigs and kind of understand the soil changes, and
like what you know, what does it? What doesn't look
right out in the in nature? What is man made?
What is placed there these sorts of things? And like
what is the decomposition of this pile of soil or

(31:08):
dirt or like you know, these these kinds of things.
What has been dug up in the past ten years?
Even that's different from the soil next to it?

Speaker 3 (31:15):
Do animals scalp people and keep the braids for themselves?

Speaker 1 (31:19):
Exact stuff like that?

Speaker 2 (31:20):
Well, here's what happened is they took her braids and
did some forensic analysis on them and found the leaves
of a tree in that that was in a certain
area of that those mountains. So they went there, they
spread out on that area where the trees are day.

Speaker 1 (31:39):
Too fucking find her bones what was left of them? Wow?

Speaker 2 (31:44):
I know these guys, they've uncovered over two hundred oh,
they've taken on over two hundred and thirty five cases.
I don't know how many they've found, but these are
the good guys necro search.

Speaker 1 (31:56):
I love that.

Speaker 2 (31:57):
I know. I bet at a party we would corner
these people, but they get kicked out of parties a
lot of them.

Speaker 1 (32:01):
Oh my god.

Speaker 2 (32:02):
Yeah, I would never leave a neckro searcher alone. Now
can we get Can we have a request if anyone
knows a neckro searcher to I think they're in San Francisco,
to please have them be on the podcast.

Speaker 3 (32:12):
I just think that's insanely fascinating. It's almost like having
X ray vision, Like you can look at a forest
or a like what a you know, a ditch and
know what's wrong and what you know what's off.

Speaker 2 (32:24):
Well, the woman who found the bones was like they
were all they were all searching for two days. She
goes off the trail to take a piss in the woods,
which last thing. It shouldn't be allowed if you're looking
for us.

Speaker 1 (32:35):
Hey, she's still human.

Speaker 2 (32:36):
Yeah, And she looks and there's a ray of light
flashing on a gold tooth.

Speaker 3 (32:43):
She minds the skull. Oh, that's the that's the lord's work. Yeah,
and it's worry This is where my Christian part comes in.
This is it I know that before she dies.

Speaker 1 (32:54):
And when he no, no, it doesn't belong there.

Speaker 2 (32:57):
Well, it's at the bottom of a ravine. So like
someone straight tossed.

Speaker 1 (33:02):
Like didn't even didn't even bury her, just threw an
toss her over.

Speaker 2 (33:07):
So they take Roy Mielnson to trial. He is found
guilty in ninety three. So she gets killed in ninety
and seventy four, found guilty in ninety three. Since then,
and I didn't know this test looking up to it,
he's been convicted for another murder, which happened fifty days

(33:28):
before Michelle's murder in Napa in nineteen seventy four. Yeah,
woman who was stabbed to death at bar she owned,
and they found a cigarette butt that had his DNA
on it. Put it through the fucking cotis the most
amazing thing in the world. Found a DNA match another
woman in Louisiana, who fucking Oh, it's gruesome. So he's

(33:52):
done it multiple times, Yeah, at least twice that they
know of through DNA, but they're not they're not taking
the third one to trial because it's too expensive to
do all these things, which sucks for that.

Speaker 1 (34:05):
Family, Yes, you know, but they know it's him.

Speaker 3 (34:08):
Yeah, this now they know it's him, but he's going
to go to jail anyway, so their their rationale is
he's there, right.

Speaker 2 (34:14):
Which is why NAPA took them took him to trial,
is because he's on he can be eligible for parole,
which I think is fucking hilarious for the Michelle's murder
in like the next ten years eligible for parole. So
they convicted him to make sure that if that ever happens, Oh,
that's good, he has to be extradited to California. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (34:33):
It's very strange the way the laws still work like that,
where it's just kind of like, oh and then we
let him out again, right, and then you know what,
he was real good inside, so we let him out again.

Speaker 1 (34:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (34:45):
We're like, well, at the trial, like one of this
jer sneezed wrong, so he's out. Yeah, and we don't
have enough money to try him again, and we think
we're going to lose.

Speaker 3 (34:53):
And well, probably won't warn anybody, just to keep it interesting.
The good thing about all of us is that hitchhiking
pretty much doesn't exist anymore.

Speaker 2 (35:01):
Thank god. We've talked about this before, Like I don't
even understand. Like I know it's like an innocent time
and shit, but like I don't think that's common sense
anytime in your life, No, any point in history. No.

Speaker 3 (35:15):
I mean think of like if you were at a
party with your friend's friends, you probably wouldn't want to
be in a car with.

Speaker 1 (35:21):
Any of those people.

Speaker 3 (35:22):
Yeah, and those are like cold, So imagine if it's
just anybody.

Speaker 1 (35:27):
Driving down the street. Have you ever hitched tip? Is
that negative of me? No, you don't want to be
at a party with your friends.

Speaker 2 (35:35):
No, I've never hitchhiped. I've never done anything like that.
I think I have when I was a kid, but
like with a friend, and I think the person like
it was like an irvine where it's just like the
safest place more but it was idiotic, and I think
the person who picked us up like yelled at us.

Speaker 3 (35:50):
I did pick up two girls who were in junior high.
We were driving home. We were driving up to Petaluma
from La me and my ex, and we stopped it
gas station and there were two little girls that were
couldn't have been more than fourteen years old sitting at
this gas station. It was two in the morning, and
they were they were trying to make phone calls. The

(36:11):
whole time we were getting gas, I was watching them
and they were trying to make phone calls, and they
were doing this stuff morning two in the morning, and
I was watching them, and the guy that worked there
wasn't seemed a little creepy, yeah, and he was kind
of like coming out and looking at them and going
back in, and people would pull in and I was
just the whole time staring at them. And finally when
we went to leave, I was like, drive over there,

(36:32):
and we pulled up and I was like, do you
guys need a ride home? And they were like yep,
and immediately got in the car. And I was like,
first of all, never get into a car with people.
And then secondly, did you go to Loose Sutton Grammar School?
And they both went to my sister's grammar school. And
I got names and they kind of smelled. It was
like clearly they were from the bad side of town.
And they got like they probably snuck out and then

(36:54):
got stuck somewhere and then ended up at this gas
station out by the freeway, where I was like, no,
it was it was it's like five miles away from
any neighborhood.

Speaker 1 (37:02):
And it's all farmland and shit.

Speaker 2 (37:04):
Yeah, So we dropped them off and I was like,
don't ever do this again, and they were like.

Speaker 1 (37:09):
Yeah, man, and they will. But where are they now?

Speaker 2 (37:12):
I wonder if they remember you.

Speaker 3 (37:16):
No, they both own that gas station because of my
setting them on their way. Yeah, correctly, thank you. Well,
I just want to take a second to brag about
something good I did for the community.

Speaker 1 (37:29):
Do you mind?

Speaker 4 (37:29):
No?

Speaker 1 (37:30):
I thank you? What if they went home and killed
their mom? Can I turn this into.

Speaker 2 (37:34):
A them a real quick? They were the ones that
were all along.

Speaker 1 (37:38):
Yeah, that's a good twister roo it is.

Speaker 2 (37:40):
Let's write a book they went on and killed their mom.

Speaker 1 (37:45):
Oh I'm dead inside.

Speaker 2 (37:47):
I want to read one of our So at the
end of the show, we like to do your favorite
or your town No wait, do your town murder. Yeah.
So either we'll have a guest tell us a story,
or we're asking you guys to send us your stories.
Should we started my favorite Murder Gmail? I probably should. Sure,

(38:08):
let's do It's my favorite Murder Gmail. And then there's
also there's also a Facebook group, so you can start
this book page. We call it Facebook page group page.
I don't know what the last time, you just called
it plain old facebook page and it made me laugh
really hard. We have Facebook page. We have Facebook page

(38:30):
called my Favorite Murder and you can tell your story
on the front page on the front like tell everyone
your shit and like you guy should like bond over
it and stuff. I feel like I should also start
a Twitter account. Maybe this is business that you guys
want to hear about, but I should because it seems
like that's also a good way for you. You're really
good at that, and it stresses me out to start
from zero, like from zero followers. I'm really good at

(38:51):
starting Twitter. Now you're good at Twitter? Oh thanks, It's
my passion, really bad. I started like a year ago
because I hate it and I hate it now because
it's a difficult exercise. It's just it's can you handle
putting things out there and wanting something in return and
not getting it? No? Well, or can you because you

(39:14):
do it and then you get stuff.

Speaker 1 (39:16):
It's true, I do get stuff out of it. Okay, yeah,
start one. Let's do that.

Speaker 2 (39:21):
Okay, by this, by this point that people are listening,
it's going to be up anyways.

Speaker 1 (39:25):
Okay, we I've made a whole file. Should we Let's see,
all right.

Speaker 2 (39:30):
I'm just gonna I'm gonna close my eyes and scroll
and pick one great and if it sucks, then we'll
delete it and start over. Okay, okay, all right, this
is from Todd Deck Todd. You ready for this?

Speaker 1 (39:41):
Thanks Todd.

Speaker 2 (39:42):
It starts the Girl in the Box. Hell yeah, hello,
Thank you both for sharing your love of true crime.
Truth be told. If I was all enjoyed, always enjoyed
the genre, and never really got the opportunity to chat
about it with people, blobby blah blah blah blah blahs.

Speaker 1 (39:55):
Not out of time for my true crime story.

Speaker 2 (39:57):
I am a new public librarian and a rule already
sounds awesome.

Speaker 1 (40:01):
Thank you, dude, Thank you for your service.

Speaker 2 (40:03):
When I first heard it on the job, my first
reference question was where is the Girl in the Box?
And my initial thought was what the fuck? After some
amateur sleuthing, I quickly learned that this patron was asking
for a book called Perfect Victim. It's a true crime
story detailing the story of a young female hit. We
fucking talked about this before, Yes, this guy did not.
Oh no, has it gone up yet?

Speaker 1 (40:24):
That one?

Speaker 2 (40:25):
Yeah, well we didn't it wasn't one of our favorite
murders that it was a sidebar story. Okay, so I'm
not going to get that at him. They later, Okay, well,
maybe you don't know what he knows about it. Is
he just talking about the story itself, or does he
have some personal con I think it happened in the
small town he lives in. Oh oh yeah, should we
let's do another one?

Speaker 1 (40:44):
Okay, but Todd, thanks, because we love that.

Speaker 2 (40:46):
Thanks Todd.

Speaker 1 (40:47):
Now, I really appreciate it. We uh, you know, it's
a that story.

Speaker 3 (40:51):
That's one of the earlier ones that I ever heard about,
And I just couldn't picture. I remember being like twelve
or thirteen and hearing that story, and I couldn't picture
what it meant, Like, how do you keep a.

Speaker 1 (41:01):
Person in a box under your bed? Yeah? How did how?

Speaker 3 (41:04):
Well?

Speaker 2 (41:04):
I had one of the zychea bed that had drawers, and.

Speaker 1 (41:07):
So I totally get it. You got it.

Speaker 2 (41:09):
But they also put a box on her head. That
was when they trapped her. That's when they first had
her in the car. They're all about boxes in that family.
The boxes weirdos very weird. Not that they also tortured
a woman. But yeah, but the boxes man. All Right,
there was one that had something about John Walsh, and
so I really want to read that one to you.

Speaker 1 (41:29):
Because of my yeries that I've been reading.

Speaker 2 (41:32):
Oh my favorite murder, Adam Walsh. Case here we go.
Oh yes, this is from e. Allen, very fucking long.

Speaker 1 (41:38):
Ethan Allen, the furniture maker.

Speaker 2 (41:39):
Ethan Allen, Hello, ran, big fan, what I write podcasts?
My info relates to Adam Walsh, who was abducted in
eighty one from a mall in Hollywood, Florida. In nineteen
seventy eight, my dad had this great idea to move
our family to Florida to get away from the brutal
cold of western Pennsylvania's growing paranoia and black icephobias that
killed my social life. Oh.

Speaker 1 (42:01):
I thought he was going to say, killed my We're
not allowed to leave the house.

Speaker 2 (42:04):
Da da da Dad?

Speaker 1 (42:06):
Can I skip over? Shit? Does that?

Speaker 2 (42:07):
Do?

Speaker 3 (42:07):
I think?

Speaker 1 (42:07):
So? Okay?

Speaker 2 (42:08):
By nineteen eighty I found my first job at the
Hollywood mall uh oh in Woolworths, working at the snack bar,
free pretzels and ice cream, but sadly the icing machine
was always on the fritz. The mall was close enough
to our house that I could ride my bike to
it in about fifteen minutes. And remember that it was
an indoor mall with a lot of tropical plants, pastel colors,
herds of seniors, and totally eighties vibe. The location of

(42:30):
Adam Walsh's abduction was the Sears department store at the
Hollywood Mall. Now I wasn't working July twenty seventh, nineteen
eighty one, the day when six year old Adam was abducted,
but the news coverage was NonStop beginning that evening. From
what I remember, Adam's dad, John Walsh, was the police
top suspect to begin with. M HM. There was lots
of silent and not silent judgments from neighbors and community
people being got him and his wife Reeves right by

(42:54):
the way, they are still married with new replacement kids.
He says, Oh no, that's the joke though, right, Yeah,
we made that about Jean.

Speaker 1 (43:03):
I think we opened the door on that. Yeah right,
I have some replace my kids. Oh my yeah, oh right,
don't help pretty hard. So when you read it back, yeah, okay,
So here's the freaky part. He says.

Speaker 2 (43:14):
My mom worked locally and came home for lunch that day.
On her way back to work that afternoon, when she
had to drive right by the mall, she remembers being
tailgated towards the freeway. The person eventually pulled around her
to get by. It was to the point of her
getting a good look at the vehicle and thinking the
person was really in a big hurry. When the news
of Adam's disappearance was on every local TV station, the
police begged anyone with in photo call a tip reported

(43:36):
by a witness that they saw Adam being pushed into
a blue van by a blonde man when he was abducted.
When we heard the info about the blue van in news,
my mom started screaming that the blue van had been
tailgating her that day. I can remember how crazy and
gross and creepy it felt. She ended up calling the
police and giving them the information. It's like a month
later they find Adam's head in a canal, chopped off

(43:58):
with the machete and another part of Florida somewhere a
deviant felon otis tool to have you read about this.

Speaker 1 (44:05):
He's the guy that was him and Gary. Yeah. Now
I was going to say Gary Bridgeway.

Speaker 2 (44:10):
With them, No, yeah, him and him and the class,
the guy that just murdered everybody. Yeah, fucked everybody. Yeah,
we someone's yelling at home. We need a third person
to be the person to tell us. His name is
hold On. I just saw it today. He's he had
a glass eye. I just listened to the last podcast
of the Left House Left did an episode A really
good was let me find.

Speaker 3 (44:31):
It so weird too. It's but I also have a
sidebar theory on this. If this person doesn't talk about it, Okay,
I want to hear this. Hold On because Otis is
the one that says he did it. You think the
other guy did it?

Speaker 2 (44:48):
Or Otis because he has to teas, right Henry Le Lucas, Yes, right, yes, yeah,
Henry Le Lucas another SERI Okay, Toole says he drove
around with adams headnes his car for a few days
before disposing it. Tool confesses to killing Adam, but he
told the police he snatched him in his car, which
was an old Cadillac. Let's see here he totally checks

(45:09):
every box and then know your serial killer study. He
then recanted his confession, but in ninety six, while dying
in prison, again admitted to killing Adam. However, there's no
actual evidence to link Tool to Adam. So what about
the blue van? Is this what you're gonna saying? Yes,
go go, he says, so what about the blue van?
In two thousand and seven, there was another investigation and
witnesses linking Jeffrey Dahmer to Adam Walsh's disappearance. Is this

(45:30):
what you're gonna say?

Speaker 1 (45:32):
He was in Florida at the time and drove a
blue van for work.

Speaker 2 (45:36):
Yeah, if he read that info on he read info
on Dahmer. He didn't cut off victims heads. He did
cut off victim's head, often boys, but none as young
as Adam. But Dahmer denied killing Adam. Is Dahmer still alive? No,
they killed him in Joe Good. The police and John
Walsh believed that Tool was the killer of Adam. Police
closed the case. Yeah, here's another thing. If he is

(45:58):
that done?

Speaker 1 (45:59):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (45:59):
Because oh wait no, he says, Karen, you are hilarious
on Twitter and I loved your Mark Narewn interview. Oh thanks,
This was Ethan Allen. Allen, yeah, Alan, And then he says, wait, Georgia,
I don't really know your work.

Speaker 1 (46:12):
Post.

Speaker 2 (46:13):
I think you're cool. Thanks, nice.

Speaker 1 (46:15):
Thanks.

Speaker 3 (46:18):
So I was reading all those, like the Jeffrey Dahmer
thing came out of the blue.

Speaker 1 (46:23):
I was like, what, which is.

Speaker 2 (46:25):
Kind of amazing, but it but it didn't seem like
that was his. He's not a kid. Yeah, but cutting
off the head and driving a blue van are so
much closer than just to some guy being like yeah,
I totally did.

Speaker 3 (46:36):
Yeah, absolutely, and blonde and like young and blonde, and.

Speaker 1 (46:39):
They had a really clear description. But here's the thing.

Speaker 3 (46:44):
Adam Walsh, both of his front teeth were missing the
day that he was there at the mall. He's there
his picture I think he says, baseball picture that they
used of, like have you seen this boy had only
been taken like a week or two before, and he
has no front and the head that they found in
the canal had one front too.

Speaker 2 (47:05):
So there's my whole body is shivering a whole theory
that the boy in the canal was not at am
all minute. I'm like literally gonna start crying right now.
Oh no, is it too? Is the most life is
so crazy.

Speaker 3 (47:19):
It's so crazy, and like the answers were being given
aren't necessarily now they're just used to playcatus or the
bad part of me telling you that is that in
learning it, And I was just this was me because
I was home at my family, so I spent tons
of time just staring at my phone, like in my room,
and I clicked on one too many links. Because I'm

(47:40):
very good at avoiding upsetting things. I never, like you know,
never listened to nine one one calls. I try not
to look at too many pictures. But I clicked on
this thing and they had the picture of the retrieved No,
they did not decapitated head that they found in the canal.

Speaker 2 (47:54):
And why is that? Like the public It's like a
it's a.

Speaker 3 (47:58):
You can tell it's a crime scene photo black and white.
But I wish I hadn't seen it.

Speaker 2 (48:02):
But yeah, see the tooth.

Speaker 1 (48:04):
Yep, did it look like Adam? I don't.

Speaker 2 (48:07):
I mean, you can only see part of the here's
the thing. I truly only looked at it for like
four seconds, because you.

Speaker 3 (48:12):
Know the you know how in a movie when there's
a dick capitated head and they look like they're kind
of selting capitated.

Speaker 1 (48:18):
By the way dick.

Speaker 2 (48:21):
I thought it was just an accident, but you just did.
I don't think I normally say this, that's what you do.
It's I always try to get a little sexual with
stuff like this. I think it's appropriate just to get
just to remind everybody stay sexy.

Speaker 1 (48:35):
Just like not to get too fucked up.

Speaker 2 (48:37):
Yeah, don't get don't remember dix. Yeah, oh do that
at all.

Speaker 3 (48:43):
It's such an upsetting looking picture that I only looked
for a second. But there's one big like child's grown
in front tooth absolutely in the front. So there's no
way in twelve days that boy grew that tooth in.
And one of the most upsetting things I read when
I was reading that story is he was standing at

(49:03):
the at like a PlayStation or a tari stand in
sears with his mom, and his mom went away to
go get something and he was he was twenty feet away,
if not less, and she just want to go over
here to like return something. And then there was a fight.
The kids started fighting about the video game, and a
security guard came and kicked them all out, pushed them

(49:26):
out of the sears, made them all leave. So a
six year old is standing out on the sidewalk alone,
kicked out of the seers and like shy to go
back inside or be like, no, my mom's there, have
to be in there.

Speaker 1 (49:39):
He just goes where.

Speaker 2 (49:40):
They tell him to go, and he basically is standing
out on the street alone. I'm gonna throw up. Sorry, No,
it's incredible. Like that to me is like this is
what it felt like to be in the eighties. Like
you just always felt like you were about to be
fucking snatched off the goddamn street. Yeah, like this story specifically, Yeah,
people didn't know to tell their kids if like a
security guard is not a cop, and you can tell

(50:00):
an adult, no, my mom's over there, you can do things.

Speaker 1 (50:04):
But he was so little six. Oh he's a baby.

Speaker 2 (50:08):
He's a baby.

Speaker 1 (50:10):
Oh, people are awful, super gross. Why is life so?

Speaker 2 (50:17):
But that was a that was a good one. His
mom potentially could be supporting the Dahmer.

Speaker 1 (50:23):
Theory of the Adam Washing.

Speaker 2 (50:24):
I wonder, I mean, I wonder why John is sticking
tool o tool tool oh tool honest tool. Yeah, I
wonder why he like wants he doesn't want to change it.
He probably they want to be over He's got to
be intense, right John Wall Yeah, Oh you mean like
at dinner, Yeah, yeah, like nobody wants to talk to

(50:46):
him at a party. No, I don't think it's how sure?

Speaker 1 (50:49):
How are you?

Speaker 3 (50:50):
I honestly feel like the couple of times I've like
let my mind slightly wander into the possibility of that,
and like I would just be on pills the day
from the day had happened until the day.

Speaker 2 (51:00):
Why would you ever like this? Like fucking Michelle's mom
just by used check out.

Speaker 1 (51:05):
Yep, can't. I can't so much. Fuck?

Speaker 2 (51:08):
Please don't kill us everyone? How do we end this
on a positive note? Uh?

Speaker 3 (51:13):
Please don't kill us? Everyone is as positive as one
could get.

Speaker 2 (51:18):
This gets by the way, this is a comedy podcast, right,
Like technically that's what they say.

Speaker 3 (51:25):
I mean, it's more like a slumber party where things
happen that are great and then things happen against your
will and that's just junior high.

Speaker 2 (51:34):
Too bad in life, man, that's too bad. So is
that counting as our hometown?

Speaker 1 (51:40):
Yeah, unless you have one that you want to well.

Speaker 4 (51:42):
I have.

Speaker 2 (51:43):
I have my friend Audrey's from when I went home.

Speaker 1 (51:45):
Oh my god.

Speaker 2 (51:45):
Yes, it's just that I recorded it at my niece's
ninth birthday party. So that's sick.

Speaker 3 (51:52):
Yeah, we were in the other room. We were far
away from any childs. I just love that it was
mostly adults.

Speaker 2 (51:58):
Let's go into the room and this is my friend Audrey,
who I've been friends with since sixth grade. I love it.
And it's about my hometown too. Yeah, equal it saday, Okay,
let me make this work, all right.

Speaker 5 (52:10):
So my favorite story, it's not really a murder, but
it's something that happens here in Pataluma. And it was
like two thousand and three, and the guy was known
as the pedal Trowler aka to the local atticular. So
this guy put in sweatshirt, whole thing, you know, creaker
in the.

Speaker 4 (52:30):
Summertime, would go round to a certain section of town
and look for open doors and windows, and he would
sneak in at night and he would broke women or
couples or whatever, tickle their feet.

Speaker 5 (52:43):
And they would scream and then he would run away.
So it kept happening weekend night after weekend night, like Friday, Saturday.

Speaker 2 (52:50):
Maybe he'd take a Saturday off.

Speaker 1 (52:51):
To a Sunday.

Speaker 5 (52:52):
So everyone was getting so freaked out. They had community
center meetings about it. When are we going to catch
this guy? So one night my friend and I, coming
home from the bars, were driving down our street and
we see that there's this whole police line kind of
cordening off the area.

Speaker 4 (53:10):
So we know that something big is gonna pap.

Speaker 5 (53:16):
And so we go and we talked to Nipop of
what's going on, and he said, oh, I can't really
tell you, but you know, make sure you lock your
door when you go inside. So we thought for sure
we're going to see him bust out of the bushes
in any second.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
But they never caught him.

Speaker 5 (53:28):
But they think they knew who it was, and they
sent him off like shipp him out of town Sacramento.

Speaker 2 (53:32):
So it's a.

Speaker 1 (53:33):
Great thing I ever had.

Speaker 5 (53:35):
It was very exciting and terrifying at the same time,
because you know today put him in the night that
he decided to murder.

Speaker 2 (53:40):
Somebody, you don't know, he had to keep doing.

Speaker 1 (53:45):
That's a great story.

Speaker 2 (53:46):
I love that they just ran him out of town
like Well West style instead of just like Sacramento's problem.
Now yep, go up there, hush, that's I wonder. Yeah,
that's a good story.

Speaker 1 (53:56):
Like you wake up because someone's tickling your feet.

Speaker 2 (54:00):
You know what. Here's the thing though, don't hitchhike, as
we've said, but don't leave your windows and doors open.

Speaker 1 (54:04):
At night. I don't care how hot it is, Sweat
your fucking balls off, or move upstairs.

Speaker 2 (54:09):
Literally, I would never live on the ground floor because
of because I have a terrifying, anxiety filled human being.

Speaker 3 (54:15):
I mean, it makes sense, but also there's it's like
that thing of people getting in people wanting to get
into your house. Yeah, they'll do it if they want
to do it. When I walk by, this is awful.
I shouldn't admit this. When I walk by a house,
I'm like, I could get into the house. Like I'm
just like, this is what's wrong with this person?

Speaker 1 (54:33):
I could?

Speaker 2 (54:34):
I could.

Speaker 1 (54:34):
I want to get into their house to be like,
look it, I'm in here?

Speaker 2 (54:37):
Should I be in here? No?

Speaker 4 (54:38):
No?

Speaker 2 (54:39):
Should you be?

Speaker 1 (54:39):
And you live on a busy street and I snuck
right in. I have that feeling in New York all
the time.

Speaker 3 (54:44):
But it's almost like the opposite where you can look
into people's like a part of windows in the front.

Speaker 1 (54:48):
But it almost feels like the because it's so common.

Speaker 2 (54:53):
Yeah, it's not as it's not as inviting because it
just happens all the time. Yeah, people are used to
being able to see right into someone's life. Don't don't
do that well, ticking tickling is much funnier thing to
end on that toothless. I mean, it's it's slightly up.
I think he was a little molestier than you know.

Speaker 3 (55:09):
The the pedal whin tickler is kind of a fun
It's like the hambler burglar where it's like, yeah.

Speaker 1 (55:14):
Actually it was did you say the Hamburgler?

Speaker 2 (55:16):
Yeah, but I messed it up.

Speaker 1 (55:19):
I tried to put the word dick in there. I
was laughing over capitated.

Speaker 2 (55:26):
Send us to my favorite murder. Send us your hometown stories.
We fucking love them. Yeah, it doesn't have to be
a murder, even like crime, like crazy crimes, something creepy
like a cropsy story the woods.

Speaker 3 (55:38):
Oh and people who live near the woods of creepy woods. Yeah,
and then go to iTunes and review us and subscribe
and do those things that help us.

Speaker 2 (55:48):
Please rate, review, rate, review, subscribe, Yeah, yeah, please do that, because, like,
you know, two women hosting a podcast, let's please just
beat the men making this feminist out of nowhere. You're
gonna because like you didn't believe in us, like two
women housing a podcast.

Speaker 1 (56:05):
This thing's bullshit. I mean, like, don't you guys want
us to do well?

Speaker 2 (56:08):
Because we're two women.

Speaker 1 (56:09):
And we're like, yeah, Hillary, do you hear us?

Speaker 2 (56:12):
Yeah, I'm making this feminist immediately, don't kill women? Ah,
it really is, ultimately, yeah, yeah, it's a feminist movement.

Speaker 1 (56:21):
It is. I'm talking about murder sucking. We're feminists.

Speaker 2 (56:25):
Uh? Is that all? Yes? I know. Any final thoughts,
don't murder us. This really seems like a concern of yours.
I was just saying it like I don't want to talk
about it because I'm just gonna convince someone to kill
me by telling them why I think it's possible, like
they should do it, because I have to say I
feel ready. I've been prepared for so long. It was Karen,

(56:47):
by the way, so every want to know. That was
Karen who said that, Oh my god, I'm I'm going
to prepare my speech for what happens like to the
news like I just didn't we didn't know.

Speaker 1 (56:56):
Here's your speech.

Speaker 2 (56:57):
She asked for it, straight up intentionally recorded it, set
it into a market.

Speaker 1 (57:03):
Oh all right, thanks for listening, guys,