April 21, 2025 • 8 mins
"How did the Mavericks go from finals contenders to a chaotic free fall?" This episode of The Ben and Skin Show dives deep into the tumultuous end of the Mavericks' season, featuring hosts Ben Rogers, Jeff “Skin” Wade, Kevin “KT” Turner, and Krystina Ray.Join us as we unpack the bombshell articles from Tim McMahon, Tim Cato, and Mark Stein, and dissect Nico Harrison's controversial press conference. The episode kicks off with a thought-provoking question about the Mavericks' dramatic decline, setting the stage for a riveting discussion.Explore the shocking details of Casey Smith's dismissal and its impact on team morale and relationships with key players like Dirk Nowitzki and Luka Dončić, and delve into the complex dynamics between media coverage and fan reactions, highlighting Tim McMahon's role in shaping the narrative.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Quick Win evan Quin.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
I'll show you're going rub ahead, except with sim Wee
pursuing it. Donld out Shaw Shank through the sewer.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Kid.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Now we're chilling at the Eagle. Yeah, we're doing it.
Three a clock on the doc. Got a habit on
my house.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
A goat status. Howard's starting to get cratic.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Shows that up multiply like a rabbit tuned in, so out,
prink it up, beat the habit.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
I'm hang out with.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
Rocking on the radiot Christine, all of them, lady Ah, Yes,
Hello to welcome everybody, Happy Monday. It's the world famous
Ben and Skin Show. Glad to have you in the mix.
Thanks for making us a part of your routine. Goodness.
We've got some serious MAVs content to discuss and we'll
(00:51):
do that throughout the presentation. Bombshell article dropped by Tim McMahon.
Tim Cato has an article, Mark Stein has an article,
and then Nico has a press conference.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Lots lots is that your is that your computer going?
What are you doing? Like? What's happening with this noise
floor right now? Are you getting my computer down? Ready
to go? We're good now.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Getting ready to kick over an amp do you need
me to ground your computer? We're fine, okay, Okay, So look,
mav season ended, or actually the eve before the mav
season ended, A bizarre press conference happens where Nico and
Rick Welts have a closed door, secret not secret meeting
that you can't film. Then the season ends, right Friday night,
(01:36):
did you guys watch the game? I actually went to
a concert and had an awesome time. Didn't think about the game.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
What did you go to soul Coughing on Friday night?
Speaker 3 (01:44):
Ben?
Speaker 1 (01:45):
No? I did not. I can't.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
I don't know a single person on earth that knows
of that band, and that place was packed.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
They sing that song I'm loving it. Yeah, yeah, they
do the McDonalds donald so I don't know the lyrics.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
So yeah, when all that happens, like the Despair, it
just hit rock bottom, It's like, okay, well it's over.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
But it's really a good thing that it's over.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
It was obviously a painful season, just the biggest self
induced free fall I've ever seen from a sports organization
that I rooted for. And I'm prone to harp hyperbole.
Maybe there's some something else, but I mean, they were
in the finals. They had a twenty five year old
global icon leading the way. Then they're in the play
in tournament and everybody's hurt and it's it's over, and
(02:32):
it's just like it's just been so bad. But it
was like, okay, and now we wait for Monday morning.
It was just the idea that this McMahon article is
going to drop. Certainly seem that McMahon was out talking
about a divide between Novitzky and the Mavericks as well,
and so we're all going, wait a second, you traded
Luca and you lost Dirk, Like, how have you lost
(02:54):
Luca and Dirk? Those are our MAVs whoobies? How has
that happened? And so the article drops today from McMahon again.
Cato wrote a piece, Mark Stein wrote a piece, and
then Nico holds a press conference today. So how are
you feeling in the aftermath of this rush of MAVs news? Skin,
I probably feel about like I mean, this sounds weird
(03:16):
to say. I probably feel about like the players. Dude,
did you guys see any of the players comments from
Friday night and Saturday day?
Speaker 1 (03:22):
They seemed exhausted.
Speaker 3 (03:23):
Yeah, I mean they all pretty much acknowledged we've been
carrying a heavy burden. And it's like I thought, they
all said the right things. Gafford was probably the most
descriptive of Man, it's just hard when he I think
even said, no one came at us directly, but we
could feel it like they knew. I mean they It's funny, man,
(03:46):
It's like it's just energy. Humans feel energy, and when
all the energy is negative, a human's gonna feel it,
whether you say something directly to him or not. Yeah,
and so it's just the back half basically since February. Yeah,
February second, that was that day that the trade went
down and they played Cleveland. Uh, there has been nothing
(04:07):
but negative energy surrounding this team, and even when something
good would happen, it would be immediately followed by an
avalanche of negative energy.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
Right like the Houston game. They we couldn't even make
it through an entire game.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
Yeah, and so you know, I think all those players
are they're happy that it's over. None of them want
their season to end by getting your ass kicked on
national TV. But also, man, they are ready to decompress
and move away and try to come back next year healthy. Yeah,
that's the key, and god, you look at it. I
(04:41):
just if if it appears that Nico is going to
stick around. I mean, there he is doing the early
press conference, doing this press conference. It appears that they're
going to stay the course and see that through and
and see if this team that he put together is
what he hopes it will be. So I don't anticipate
a change there. Let me say something about that. I
don't know if you guys got to hear his pressure today,
(05:02):
and it's like, I don't think that he would go
out there and go I don't know, guys, it seems
like I'm on thin ice right now, like he's not
going to say that. But one of the things he
pointed out is that the reason they did what they
did last Tuesday and what was a private media session,
it was not open to the public. Originally they said
you couldn't even record it, and then at the last
(05:23):
minute they let reporters record it, but originally weren't going
to be able to do that. Is he said that
Patrick wanted him and Rick, who are the forward moving
faces of the franchise, to get out there and talk
to media. That's I'm paraphrasing, That's basically what he said.
And so to Ben's point there Again, if Patrick Dumont
(05:45):
is sitting there going I can't wait to get rid
of Nico, He's probably not going to have Nico go
out there and say, Hey, we're going to get rid
of me. But the way that Nico communicated that, from
my perspective, it made it seem like to me that
all of their internal dialogue is about how they are
going to move forward with this current incarnation of the
front office, the coaching staff, the players, etc. That's what
(06:07):
it seemed like to me. Well, the McMahon piece was incredible,
and he is the straw that stirs the drink. And
it's so weird to see the perception that fans have
thinking that God, I mean, this guy that asks all
the toughest questions and has the hardest hitting facts from
all this is also mis identified as being a plant
like helping with Nico.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
It's so bizarre to see the way all that works.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
But the McMahon article really hammered home this idea that
you know, Dirk's Hall of Fame ceremony, Casey Smith very
involved in that. He's there, He's you know, highly respected.
I guess what was his title, head of Yeah, he
was I don't remember the exact title, but I mean
he was basically the highest ranking medical staffer on the team.
(06:53):
After that, Nico reaches out to him after the Hall
of Fame festivities, reaches out to him to say we
need to meet.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
He says, I can. I'm with my dying mother.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
And you know, McMahon paints this picture of Okay, Nico
fired him over a zoom call after all that that's
the you know, I'm just you know, paraphrasing or whatever.
And in that move, you removed a guy who Luca loved,
who Dirk loved, who the whole organization loved. And it's
the way the picture that McMahon is painting is that
(07:22):
Nico viewed him as a threat and got rid of
him in a corporate environment because he didn't want anybody there.
He wanted everything to be very structured. He doesn't how
do I deal with a guy who's a medical guy
that has this much power whatever. But by that move,
firing Casey Smith could have cost you Dirk and Luca. Yeah,
I mean, it's certainly the picture that Tim is painting broadly.
(07:45):
And the thing that was I guess, I don't want
to say frustrating but I was intrigued by is that
Tim is in Oklahoma City covering a playoff series. So
Tim wasn't there today? Yeah, And so Tim Cato wrote
a similar article, different details, but kind of focusing in
on some of the similar things. And Cato's article is
more along the lines of what Patrick Dumont might be thinking.
(08:06):
In fact, why don't we talk about that? On the
other side, be it based on all these articles, what
does Patrick Dumont think about all this? Why don't we
talk about that?
Speaker 2 (08:14):
Next?
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Right here? In four short minutes on ninety seven point one,
The Eagle
Quick Win evan Quin.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
I'll show you're going rub ahead, except with sim Wee
pursuing it. Donld out Shaw Shank through the sewer.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Kid.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Now we're chilling at the Eagle. Yeah, we're doing it.
Three a clock on the doc. Got a habit on
my house.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
A goat status. Howard's starting to get cratic.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Shows that up multiply like a rabbit tuned in, so out,
prink it up, beat the habit.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
I'm hang out with.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
Rocking on the radiot Christine, all of them, lady Ah, Yes,
Hello to welcome everybody, Happy Monday. It's the world famous
Ben and Skin Show. Glad to have you in the mix.
Thanks for making us a part of your routine. Goodness.
We've got some serious MAVs content to discuss and we'll
(00:51):
do that throughout the presentation. Bombshell article dropped by Tim McMahon.
Tim Cato has an article, Mark Stein has an article,
and then Nico has a press conference.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Lots lots is that your is that your computer going?
What are you doing? Like? What's happening with this noise
floor right now? Are you getting my computer down? Ready
to go? We're good now.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Getting ready to kick over an amp do you need
me to ground your computer? We're fine, okay, Okay, So look,
mav season ended, or actually the eve before the mav
season ended, A bizarre press conference happens where Nico and
Rick Welts have a closed door, secret not secret meeting
that you can't film. Then the season ends, right Friday night,
(01:36):
did you guys watch the game? I actually went to
a concert and had an awesome time. Didn't think about the game.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
What did you go to soul Coughing on Friday night?
Speaker 3 (01:44):
Ben?
Speaker 1 (01:45):
No? I did not. I can't.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
I don't know a single person on earth that knows
of that band, and that place was packed.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
They sing that song I'm loving it. Yeah, yeah, they
do the McDonalds donald so I don't know the lyrics.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
So yeah, when all that happens, like the Despair, it
just hit rock bottom, It's like, okay, well it's over.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
But it's really a good thing that it's over.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
It was obviously a painful season, just the biggest self
induced free fall I've ever seen from a sports organization
that I rooted for. And I'm prone to harp hyperbole.
Maybe there's some something else, but I mean, they were
in the finals. They had a twenty five year old
global icon leading the way. Then they're in the play
in tournament and everybody's hurt and it's it's over, and
(02:32):
it's just like it's just been so bad. But it
was like, okay, and now we wait for Monday morning.
It was just the idea that this McMahon article is
going to drop. Certainly seem that McMahon was out talking
about a divide between Novitzky and the Mavericks as well,
and so we're all going, wait a second, you traded
Luca and you lost Dirk, Like, how have you lost
(02:54):
Luca and Dirk? Those are our MAVs whoobies? How has
that happened? And so the article drops today from McMahon again.
Cato wrote a piece, Mark Stein wrote a piece, and
then Nico holds a press conference today. So how are
you feeling in the aftermath of this rush of MAVs news? Skin,
I probably feel about like I mean, this sounds weird
(03:16):
to say. I probably feel about like the players. Dude,
did you guys see any of the players comments from
Friday night and Saturday day?
Speaker 1 (03:22):
They seemed exhausted.
Speaker 3 (03:23):
Yeah, I mean they all pretty much acknowledged we've been
carrying a heavy burden. And it's like I thought, they
all said the right things. Gafford was probably the most
descriptive of Man, it's just hard when he I think
even said, no one came at us directly, but we
could feel it like they knew. I mean they It's funny, man,
(03:46):
It's like it's just energy. Humans feel energy, and when
all the energy is negative, a human's gonna feel it,
whether you say something directly to him or not. Yeah,
and so it's just the back half basically since February. Yeah,
February second, that was that day that the trade went
down and they played Cleveland. Uh, there has been nothing
(04:07):
but negative energy surrounding this team, and even when something
good would happen, it would be immediately followed by an
avalanche of negative energy.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
Right like the Houston game. They we couldn't even make
it through an entire game.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
Yeah, and so you know, I think all those players
are they're happy that it's over. None of them want
their season to end by getting your ass kicked on
national TV. But also, man, they are ready to decompress
and move away and try to come back next year healthy. Yeah,
that's the key, and god, you look at it. I
(04:41):
just if if it appears that Nico is going to
stick around. I mean, there he is doing the early
press conference, doing this press conference. It appears that they're
going to stay the course and see that through and
and see if this team that he put together is
what he hopes it will be. So I don't anticipate
a change there. Let me say something about that. I
don't know if you guys got to hear his pressure today,
(05:02):
and it's like, I don't think that he would go
out there and go I don't know, guys, it seems
like I'm on thin ice right now, like he's not
going to say that. But one of the things he
pointed out is that the reason they did what they
did last Tuesday and what was a private media session,
it was not open to the public. Originally they said
you couldn't even record it, and then at the last
(05:23):
minute they let reporters record it, but originally weren't going
to be able to do that. Is he said that
Patrick wanted him and Rick, who are the forward moving
faces of the franchise, to get out there and talk
to media. That's I'm paraphrasing, That's basically what he said.
And so to Ben's point there Again, if Patrick Dumont
(05:45):
is sitting there going I can't wait to get rid
of Nico, He's probably not going to have Nico go
out there and say, Hey, we're going to get rid
of me. But the way that Nico communicated that, from
my perspective, it made it seem like to me that
all of their internal dialogue is about how they are
going to move forward with this current incarnation of the
front office, the coaching staff, the players, etc. That's what
(06:07):
it seemed like to me. Well, the McMahon piece was incredible,
and he is the straw that stirs the drink. And
it's so weird to see the perception that fans have
thinking that God, I mean, this guy that asks all
the toughest questions and has the hardest hitting facts from
all this is also mis identified as being a plant
like helping with Nico.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
It's so bizarre to see the way all that works.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
But the McMahon article really hammered home this idea that
you know, Dirk's Hall of Fame ceremony, Casey Smith very
involved in that. He's there, He's you know, highly respected.
I guess what was his title, head of Yeah, he
was I don't remember the exact title, but I mean
he was basically the highest ranking medical staffer on the team.
(06:53):
After that, Nico reaches out to him after the Hall
of Fame festivities, reaches out to him to say we
need to meet.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
He says, I can. I'm with my dying mother.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
And you know, McMahon paints this picture of Okay, Nico
fired him over a zoom call after all that that's
the you know, I'm just you know, paraphrasing or whatever.
And in that move, you removed a guy who Luca loved,
who Dirk loved, who the whole organization loved. And it's
the way the picture that McMahon is painting is that
(07:22):
Nico viewed him as a threat and got rid of
him in a corporate environment because he didn't want anybody there.
He wanted everything to be very structured. He doesn't how
do I deal with a guy who's a medical guy
that has this much power whatever. But by that move,
firing Casey Smith could have cost you Dirk and Luca. Yeah,
I mean, it's certainly the picture that Tim is painting broadly.
(07:45):
And the thing that was I guess, I don't want
to say frustrating but I was intrigued by is that
Tim is in Oklahoma City covering a playoff series. So
Tim wasn't there today? Yeah, And so Tim Cato wrote
a similar article, different details, but kind of focusing in
on some of the similar things. And Cato's article is
more along the lines of what Patrick Dumont might be thinking.
(08:06):
In fact, why don't we talk about that? On the
other side, be it based on all these articles, what
does Patrick Dumont think about all this? Why don't we
talk about that?
Speaker 2 (08:14):
Next?
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Right here? In four short minutes on ninety seven point one,
The Eagle
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