April 7, 2025 • 30 mins
When it comes to coffee, there's so much conflicting information about whether it's good or bad for our health. So, what or who should we believe? In this week's episode of The FIT(ish) Podcast, Phoebe Parsons chats with accredited dietician Jono Steedman from Bite Me Nutrition to debunk some of the most common health myths about our beloved coffee.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Apodjay production. Before we get into the episode, it has
come to my attention that majority of you listening right
now are not actually subscribed to the show. So if
that is you jump on give me a follow or
a subscribe on Apple or Spotify or wherever you listen
to your podcasts, because the more subscribers I have, the
(00:27):
more free content I can give you. Guys, enjoy the
episode Welcome to Fit Dish. I'm Phoebie Parsons, and this
is the podcast that proves that you don't have to
choose between staying fit and having fun. I love my
morning coffee. Some days it's coffees, and I honestly think
(00:48):
it's one of the most enjoyable parts of my entire day.
And the good news is it turns out it isn't
as bad for us as we may have originally thought.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Fun fact, it's actually probably less depressing than a lot
of people.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
See according to my guest this week, who's no creditor Dietitian,
it even has hell benefits.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Coffee is contains caffeine, but also contains like thousands of
other what we call bioactive compound you don't need to get.
There's nothing something good happens at zero right.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Welcome to the podcast. John o' steadman from Bite Me Nutrition.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
You are actually a requested guest and I had a
listener actually send me through your Instagram, so shout out
to you, Christy. I don't fuck around proof that I
do listen to what you guys want. So welcome to
the podcast, John O.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
That's a I didn't know that it's free. That's a
nice way to start.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
We've got quite the fan base over here. Let's always
start the way we always start, and that is to
ask my guest what makes you fit ish? And I
particularly love asking dietitians this question.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
I let's go from fit. That's it's a kind I
like waste training. I like training pre regularly. I'm very
fortunate just that end of my big shed is sort
of a pretty nifty home gym set up, so it's
pretty easy for me in the spirit of things, to train,
which is nice and I enjoy it. So I guess
(02:12):
that's the fit component. And I like food, and I like,
you know, eating healthy and that sort of stuff, but
also like our logo is literally a burger, so hopefully
that's a bit of an insight as well into you know,
like it's such a like NAF saying, like all foods fit,
but it's it's the truth, you know, in terms of
a healthy diet, everything can be included and should be included.
(02:33):
I think so burgers are my favorite food. I like
a sneaky craft wanker beer, Like the wankier the better,
Like if it's some like you know, I don't know,
like me so roasted sesame stout or something, then like
I'm there, Yeah, like the wankier the better.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
So my partner is exactly the same. Yeah. We live
near a wine bar and he every weekend we go
there and he's like, oh, I'm gonna get like the
tamari roasted with sabi sour beer. I'm like that sounds
dis but you do you boo? You do you?
Speaker 2 (03:07):
I'm in, I'm in. That sounds great. Yeah yeah, and
like honestly just a good old four x as well.
But yes, stop it so is he?
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Oh you men new men easy to please.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
They're different. You just you appreciate each other all.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
Also, guys, the macros of four x golds are like
pretty wild, like like in terms of if you're gonna
drink alcohol, for x golds are pretty much pretty mint.
So what I want to chat to you today about
is coffee, which is such a huge part of most
of our lives and our mornings, but it is one
of those topics that there is so much controversy and
conflicting information around, and I just kind of want for
(03:43):
you to set the record straight from a nutrition standpoint.
So first they want to start by asking, this is
probably going to offend and offside a lot of people,
but what would you describe as a healthy or moderate
caffeine intake per day?
Speaker 2 (03:57):
So fun fact, it's actually probably less depressing than a
lot of people think. The actual kind of safe recommendations are.
The upper limit of the moment is set at around
four hundred milligrams, which, for context, a shot of espresso
is probably seventy to eighty milligrams on average. Right, Oh wow,
it's like a solid amount. Now, that's not necessarily saying
that everyone should go out and smash four hundred milligrams
(04:18):
caffeine to day, because everyone's tolerance, as I'm sure we've
all just you know, anecdotally noticed, is very different. That's
largely based on your genetics and how well you metabolize caffeine.
So if a second shot makes you feel rubbish, don't go.
Oh look John who said that like five shots is safe,
so I should like up my game. No, it's fine.
(04:39):
But if you ask someone that likes to have a
few coffees in the day, there's some other things which
I'm sure we'll get to, that you need to be
mindful of, But in terms of like safe upper limits,
it's actually it's pretty high.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Wow, what a way to start on a positive note.
I think a lot of people are signing an absolute
breath of relief right now just to hear that. But
I also think it's important, particularly if people listening to
this podcast, to bring in other forms of caffeine here too,
because if I look at my day in terms of
my caffeine can sumption I think more of my caffeine
consumption comes from pre workouts and things like that than
it does from coffee and things like diet coke. So
(05:12):
how do those stuck up in terms of the milligrams
of caffeine in them as well?
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Yeah, totally. Other forms of caffeine can vary wildly, like
a diet coke or pepsi or something No, no, one drinks,
Pepsi max right rend.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Drinks, Oh, I think they do.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
Well anyway, can't probably can't help you, but about forty
to fifty milligrams in those, so you know, not nothing
but also a bit lower. But yeah, pre workouts and
energy drinks in particular, really really important that you check
the label, just because you can have pre workouts that
are averaging one hundred to one hundred and fifty milligrams.
(05:51):
I've seen ones that have up to five hundred actually
on hundred, one hundred and fifties low for pre workout
these days. To be honest, I'd say it they probably
average closer to two fifty to three hundred milligrams. So
as you can see, it is to kind of exceed
that av is about ninety milligrams. That's the two fifty
(06:11):
mil kind of most two fifty mili energy drinks sit
around that ninety milligrams. So yeah, definitely, definitely if you're
a pre workout drinker and a coffee drinker, maybe do
a bit of quick maths to see where that is
in the day and where that's adding up to, because I'm.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
Going to blame maths not being at my my strong
point for that because I have never once checked the
back of my pre workout that I take twice a
day every day for probably the last five years. But
that could account to why my anxiety is through the roof.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
No time like the present, right, Like.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Yeah, okay, So on that note, then, what are some
of the implications of going over the moderate amount or
the recommended amount of caffeine in a day?
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Yeah, well, I would even just say what what is
over your threshold? Because you know, like I said, for
someone that might be one hundred milligrams, for someone that
might be four hundred milligrams, But you'll it's generally pretty
pretty obvious, you know, things like higher heartbeat, like a
faster heartbeat, a bit sweaty, more anxious. Absolutely, those are
(07:15):
probably the three main things that we see with excessive
not excessive, but just with getting over the edge of
that caffeine consumption. It can definitely be an appetite suppressant
as well, so that's also something to be mindful of.
I've got lots of clients who don't need to eat
breakfast till one pm, but that's because they've just mainlined
(07:36):
four coffees throughout the morning. So you know, being mindful
of its appetites, spress and effect as well. But yeah,
from a symptom perspective, if you're flirting with danger, you're
probably going to notice a bit sweat, heart rate up,
and definitely that increased anxiety.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
Are there any long term implications because I feel like
those are all things that you can kind of notice
as they're happening to you, Like a lot of people
do talk about the anxiety piece and things like that,
But are there any longer lasting or maybe more silent.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Not really, we haven't tested giving someone five hundred milligrams
a day for ten years, right, so there is a
degree of you know, probably coffee as reasons, but be
hard to get that approves, So we do have to
be mindful of Hey, probably don't exceed this because it's
almost like an unknown. But there's been some noise out
there about higher intakes of caffeine increase your risk of
(08:32):
like cardiovascular disease, so like heart disease and things. But again,
when we see people staying under that four hundred milligrams, ironically,
coffee which is important to separate from caffeine, and a
little bit coffee can actually reduce your risk of heart disease.
It appears, so yeah, I would say if you're noticing
(08:53):
those symptoms, don't push past that all day every day,
mostly because we just don't know, but it probably won't
be good. That would be my guess.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Listen to your body, guys, isn't your buddy? Okay, you
just said something that really piqued my interest there that
there are health benefits to coffee. So let's flip the
narrative here and talk about some of the positive health
effects and we can leave kind of pre work out
and diet, coca and all that in the background for
now and just focus on actual coffee totally.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
So coffee contains caffeine, but also contains like thousands of
other what we call bioactive compounds, so in other words,
things like antioxidants, polyphenols, a few fatty acids, and basically
all of these things which have been linked with improvements
in a bit of gut health, improvements in reducing your
risk of heart disease and things. So it's kind of
(09:41):
I guess there's sort of similar things that you find
in fruits and vegetables, because coffee is a plant food. Like, sorry,
not saying like you don't need to eat fruits and vegetables.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Just have a coffee, guys, get you two and five
from your cups of coffee.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
I'm always so terrified at being misquoted and taken out
of context, which I'm sure it won't be happening here on.
But like you know, oh yeah, I heard John O
say just have a coffee. You know anyway, But it's
that similar sort of antioxidants and those sorts of things.
So look, because of that, you see some people kind
of forcing coffee upon themselves if they don't like it,
(10:17):
or if they don't tolerate caffeine very well and don't
do that. You can get those same benefits from lots
of other foods, and it is a minor bump, Like
a lot of the things in tea, for example, are
going to give you similar sorts of things. But from
a if you if you enjoy coffee, then yeah, the
good news is the bioactive compounds in that can actually
(10:38):
be pretty good for you. We probably also need to
be mindful of the form of the coffee that you're having,
you know, coffee, it's probably more a bigger discussion around
like how much milk, what other things are in there?
Are their sugars are their syrups, is their cream, you know,
is it what type of milk? Those sorts of things.
So those are all things to be mindful of. And
(11:00):
I'm not saying you need to drink black coffee to
get the benefits. I maybe like one week of the
year I'm like, oh, I'm going to drink black coffee,
and then like by day three, I'm like, oh, I
hate this. So I'm not not recommending everyone goes out
and does that. It is the black coffee itself that
is the healthy bit, and then we just need to
(11:22):
be mindful of everything else.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
That is so good to know, because I feel like
with some of the weaponry that coffee gets in the media,
sometimes I was of the assumption that coffee is kind
of like alcohol and then it's just one of those
dead things where there's actually nothing good in them. But
to hear that there's actual health benefits of the coffee itself,
that is phenomenal news totally.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
And it's sort of like even you hear red wine
being good for you because you might have heard of
like resveratrol, which is the thing, but like, yes, red
wine has resveratrol, but it also has alcohol in it.
Still whereas coffee you kind of have the same sort
of style of thing as resveratrol. I'm going to stop
saying that word. Sorry that without the like toxin, which
(12:03):
I hesitate to use the word toxins. It gets used
and abused in my industry. But when we're talking about.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Alcohol, I feel like that's a very fair point though,
because particularly in the fitness industry, you do see people
going on these like cleanses or challenges, and I know
that forty five years to do it, where for the
first two weeks of the challenge they'd make you null
and void all of your caffeine and just like hate
waking up every morning. And now all these years down
the track they were like, oh, sorry, that was actually
a waste of time. But I feel like it's all
(12:29):
that unlearning that we're having to do now because of
what we were seeing and what we were told to
believe about things like coffee and caffeine.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Yeah, I don't think I mean, detoxing is probably a
whole other podcast, But any kind of program or you know,
challenge that has some kind of cleanse phase, yeah, coffee,
get red of that, right, That's always the first protocol,
which is kind of interesting given that there's actually linked.
It's actually linked with quite a few health benefits. It
(12:59):
can also be a band aids solution to poor sleep
and poor nutrition and poor recovery, so that's also something
to be mindful of. You know, I love coffee, a
coffee drinker, and as we've discussed, coffee can be really
healthy for you. But if you are not sleeping properly,
or you know, having poor sleep hygeene, or you're not
kind of fueling yourself relatively effectively throughout the day and
(13:22):
spacing that out, and those resulting energy levels are crashing.
But you're kind of, like I said, taping over it
with a coffee, that's sort of a bigger problem. I
would still argue that coffee isn't the problem there. It's
more just like, hey, let's get to the root of
that problem, okay, and maybe not blame the coffee.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
It's never coffee as fault. It's just there to help.
So let's talk about sleep while we're on it, because
I know that personally for me, if I have caffeine
after lunchtime, it really hinders my ability to fall asleep.
And I don't know why, because my whole life have
drink and like drunk. Sorry, quite a bit of caffeine.
But then I know some people on the other hand,
like my mum, can have a cup of coffee after
(14:02):
dinner and just fall asleep as soon as I head
hits the p So as a baseline, what time of
the day should people stop drinking coffee or if that's
not a fair way to ask that question, how long
do the effects of caffeine averagely last in our systems?
Speaker 2 (14:16):
For yeah, that is probably a better way to ask
that question. Like you said, how far from sleep? Because
you know, cut off at midday is kind of arbitrary
if you're a shift work and you're going to sleep
at one am, right, So this is where the news
get slightly less good. Sorry about ten hours away from bedtime? Yeah,
(14:36):
sometimes more. And the way to think about it is caffeine,
which is the thing that keeps us awake and disrupts sleep,
has a half life of can be five to six
hours for some people, can be up to seven to
eight hours. And so what that means is if you
had let's say your pre workout is two hundred milligrams,
which I think when you go check the label is
probably a fair guess. So let's say that at eight
(14:58):
am or six you're going to jumail. At six am,
you've had two hundred milligrams of coffee, two hundred milligrams
of caf By about one to two pm, you've probably
still got about one hundred eighty to one hundred milligrams
of caffeine in your system. So the equivalent of having
a coffee at one pm, you know. And so then
(15:19):
if you have had another coffee at ten am, and
maybe you have one more sneaky coffee with lunch or something,
then you've stacked all of this creep, all of this
caffeine up, and that half life is like the metabolization
of caffeine still going on in the background. But even
if you stopped your caffeine at ten am, if you've
had like four hundred milligrams by ten am, you know,
(15:41):
six hours later you've got two hundred milligrams. Six hours
after that you've got one hundred milligrams, and that's taken
you through tool like, you know, one am. So that's
also really important when we talk about total daily amounts.
You know, don't just go like, ah, four hundred milligrams
are safe. That's fine. If you are spacing that out
across the morning and it's getting you know, within that
(16:04):
eight ten hours of sleep, it can very definitely disrupt
your ability to get to sleep. As you said, everyone's
experience is a little bit different. There's a very small
percentage of people who seem to be not affected by it.
But what you don't want to do is use your
ability to get to sleep as your yardstick, because caffeine
(16:26):
won't necessarily affect your ability to get to sleep, but
it can absolutely affect your abilities you get into those
third and fourth sleep cycles, you deep and your rem sleep.
It's the good stuff. And so I had heaps of
clients who you know, well, first meet them and they'll
have you know, pre workout before gym at five pm,
and like, yeah, but I can get to sleep fine.
And my next question was always like, do you wake
(16:48):
up the next day feeling like you haven't slept? And yes,
So if that's you, it may not be stopping you
getting to sleep, but it could absolutely be you know,
hurting that sleep quality, which is a bar.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Honestly, that's one of my favorite things about my fitbit
is I don't use it for anything else. I've disabled
all notifications. I don't give a fuck about tracking my workouts.
All I care about is waking up and seeing my sleep.
Speaker 2 (17:15):
I love it amazing. Do you notice how have you tracked?
Speaker 1 (17:19):
I haven't done that because I just I've never had
caffeine post. I guess midday since I was in my
early twenties, because I used to have so much trouble
with my sleep, and I guess. I put two and
two together and I was like, oh, what's doing that?
Oh it must be my five PM diet coke. And
then I got my shit together. But how can I
ask you from a dietitian's perspective, how many coffees do
you drink in a day? And what time would you
(17:41):
drink those? And do you drink any other forms of caffee?
Speaker 2 (17:43):
I feel like I should preface this by saying I
have two children under six, So put that out there.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
There's no judgment on this show.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
I try to stick to two caffeine to drinks a day.
Usually it's coffee. Occasionally, oh not occasionally. Maybe half of
the week I'll swap the second coffee out for an
energy drink some kind. My first coffee is anywhere from
four to six am. Depending on when I get up,
and then my second coffee will be three eight to
(18:14):
nine am. Ten AM's like my cutoff I try to find.
And then occasionally I'll sub that out for a pre workout.
If it's a day where I'm training, I get to
train in the morning and I'll stob that second coffee
for pre workout. I don't actually feel that bad when
I acceed it, so it's also probably not a good
yardstick to go, well, I feel fine when I have
(18:34):
five hundred MILLI games, I must be special. The sad
us is like, not as many of us as special
as we think.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
So the harsh truth, the har's truth. Okay, so if
someone's listening, they're like, fuck, I've got to cut down
on my caffeine consumption. Is caffeine addiction real? Because I
know sometimes if I wake up a little bit later
that I normally would, if it's like a weekend or
something and I haven't had my pre work out on
my coffee, I have been known to get a little
headache before. Is that actually a caffeine withdrawal or is
(19:01):
that a myth?
Speaker 2 (19:03):
No? It is it is, Sorry, it is not a myth.
Caffeine habitual caffeine consumption makes us a little bit more
sensitive to something called a dentisine. A dentasine makes us
feel sleepy and tied. That's why, you know, having caffeine
can kind of stop that feeling, but excess to dentisine
can also give us headaches. So I'm sure you can
(19:24):
even think of later in the day, if you've had
a really big day, you know, you can feel that
headache kind of start to come on as well. It's
sort of a similar similar concept. So I think for
most people using the word addiction is real to be
careful because obviously there's a whole host of other I
guess associations with a word like that. I think an
(19:45):
over reliance on it can definitely be a thing. And
so when if you are looking to reduce I think
it's important to prepare to be a little bit uncomfortable.
And again, I know that's not fine, but I think
it's better to know that that's coming rather than just
just get sort of blindsided by it. Also probably why
I wouldn't recommend going cold turkey. I know that everyone
(20:06):
likes to go you know, or nothing, but ideally if
you're a double shot person twice day go to a
single shot twice day, or you know, you try to
tie track, try to just gradually bring it down rather
than cutting yourself off completely. Focus on sleep, focus on hydration,
you know, try and try and patch up all those
other things as well. But yeah, you might for it
(20:32):
seems to be about two to nine days is what
I've seen in the various studies. So hopefully you're a
two day person, not a nine day person. But blame
your parents and guys.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Just be kind to yourself. Like if you if you
are going cold turkey in cutting yourself down from four
cups to none, how long realistically do you think you're
going to sustain that for what two days max? Then
you're going to throw in the towel and have another
five and you're back to the starting point one hundred.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
Yeah, And like we've said, you don't need to get
there's nothing. Nothing good happens at zero, right.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
So the opposit everything bad happens.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
For you and everyone around you.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
Now I know you touched on before that caffeine can
affect your hunger cues. Is there any correlation between coffee
and our metabolism? Because again, I feel like this is
something that's spoken about a lot in media and the news,
and then it's confusing because so often will hear people
say like, oh, don't drink coffee on an empty stomach,
that's gonna hurt your guts. And then some people are like, no,
you need to fast and only drink plat coffee on
(21:32):
an empty stomach. But like what to who do we believe?
What do we listen to?
Speaker 2 (21:39):
Just do both of those things every day at the
same time, somehow look slight tangent. Anyone who speaks in absolutes.
Just be careful. I think that's a really good red
flag if someone's saying you must or you should only
there's a whole lot of different things that can come
from caffeine. In terms of metabolism, it has a slight
(21:59):
impact on increasing metabolism. Yes, so that's why you'll see
a lot of fat burning products make these claims about
burning fat and they contain caffeine because it does slightly
increase your metabolism above baseline. But it's so small, it's
so it's it's like it's like five cherry tomatoes or something,
So it's not going to have this significant impact on
(22:20):
you know, dropping all of this body fat in terms
of that, don't have it first thing in the morning.
The main rationale for that claim comes from something to
do without cortisol. So, cortisol is a stress hormone which
is often misrepresented as a bad hormone. Instead it's actually
(22:41):
it wakes you up in the morning. It's the thing
that gets you going in the gym, right, Like everyone
associates it with the saber tooth tiger. That's the thing
I hear all the time, like you're a caveman, and
there's the same yes, yes, yes, yeah, yeah, And cortisol
spikes because you know, and it turns all these systems on.
But that's what we want in the morning, like I
want to wake up in the morning, you know. And sure,
(23:02):
we don't want cortzole to be excessively raised or raised
for longer than we want. But we see in studies
for habitual so people who drink a cafe to drink
every day, their body kind of the first week, yes,
their quarters all goes a little bit higher than normal,
but then it comes back down to normal baselines as
they adapt. Anyway, So if getting up and having coffee
(23:23):
on an empty stomach works for you, works for your routine,
it's what brings you joy at four am in the morning, perfectly,
perfectly fine. It can increase your risk some people of
brief acid reflux, and so if you struggle with heartburn,
you know, be mindful of that. But for most people,
(23:44):
having caffeine on an empty stomach is perfectly fine.
Speaker 1 (23:48):
It's again good to know. Just do what feels good
for you, I guess is the essence of most of
life that we just don't listen to because it seems
too easy.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Yeah. Yeah, and you want to overcomplicate it, right, you
want to find a problem that you didn't know you have, Like,
that's what we're all excited.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
Spend hundreds of dollars trying to solve it.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
So then what are some of the biggest misconceptions of
bullshit myths you've heard or or sorry you've heard or
seen in your clients around coffee and its impact on
their health.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
I think the biggest one, like we touched on, is
that it's just that it's bad and that it would
be better for you to get it to zero. That's
by far the biggest one. I've got lots of people
who come to me, well, no, they don't come to
me specifically for cutting out coffee. But one of their
like side goals is on and I'd like to get
off the coffee kick, that coffee habit. But yeah, it's
it's kind of nice to be able to go, oh well,
(24:38):
the coffee itself is not necessarily a problem. We'll investigate.
You know, are you having do you have fat loss
goals and you're drinking two tall lattes a day with milk? Right,
that's not the coffee. That's the extra six hundred calories
that's coming from those strengths, right, And so yeah, talking
them through that, how it can be included, how we
(25:00):
can adjust a few things. The definitely the morning thing
that that I went wild like eighteen months ago. I
feel like of you know, like that's causing you to
gain weight because it's spiking your cords all and YadA, YadA, YadA,
and all of these I.
Speaker 1 (25:13):
Would I definitely agree with that. Now, I want to
finish with a little rapid fire fact or fiction coffee addition.
So number one, will coffee stunt your growth?
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Fiction?
Speaker 1 (25:23):
Does decaf coffee have no caffeine in it?
Speaker 2 (25:27):
Fiction? I would check the label because it would depend
on the amount of the way that it's been processed,
it's definitely got a significantly lower amount of caffeine. And
I know you said fact or fiction, but I'm talking. Sorry,
all of the health benefits we talked about with coffee
are in decaf coffee as well, because all of those
other compounds remain. Yeah, they washed the coffre the caffeine out,
(25:48):
but most of the other things are there, so maybe
you could use that to work it in.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
Well, I'm going to have to make a formal apology then,
because I talk decaf caffee decaf coffee, sorry a lot,
because I don't understand the point. But I'm sorry, guys,
I stand corrected. I've ever said something bad about your
decaf coffee. I take it back.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
Look, I definitely understand why coffee plus caffeine is the
preferred combo for most superior Yeah, I've also heard that.
Apparently it's because like decaf coffee, even like roasters and
barristas don't take it seriously, so they get like they
roasted poorly. They don't make a good decaff coffee. They
don't try. And I think there is this sort of
(26:29):
I reckon it's coming off the back of that, Like
you know how alcohol free drinks have exploded. Yes, you've
heard it here, maybe not first, but I reckon there's
going to be a big like decaf coffee kind of
you know, but like niche you know, small batch brewised roasteries,
cold brew all of the loving care and attention that
(26:49):
regular coffee gets. I feel like, do you I hope.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
So because it is really nice to go Yeah, I
hope so. Because it is nice to go out now.
And if you want a mocktail or something an alcoholic
they used to bring you out like a juice and
you're like, oh no, I would have just ordered a juice.
But now you can actually go out and have like
a non alcoholic beer or a non alcoholic cocktail that
actually has the spirits and it's like a similar experience.
So that would be really nice if that came out
with the decaf coffee, not for me, but for you know,
(27:14):
the people who enjoyed the decap for me. Yeah. Next
myth and this is a big one. Will coffee sober
you up?
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Ah? Sorry? Fiction With the hash with the asterisk, you
might feel a little bit more sober because it increases
your feeling of alertness and maybe blunts some of the sleepiness,
but it doesn't decrease your blood alcohol concentration, right, so
it might give you a false sense of, you know,
(27:47):
feeling sober, which is probably almost worse. So no, a
bye by all the normal things. You know, if you're
feeling hungover and you're going to have a coffee to
make you get going a little bit better, sure, but no,
it won't you increase your ability to the tabloid.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
Next is coffee dehydrating fiction.
Speaker 2 (28:08):
I'm trying so hard to just say one word fiction.
That's good, cool fiction, So all right, oh you can say.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
More, say more. You're going to elaborate on that one
because that needs explanation.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
Is something called a diuretic in that it does get
you to excrete a little bit more water, but the
amount of water it gets you to get rid of
is very much replaced by the amount of fluid in
the coffee. So I wouldn't recommend you hydrate yourself with coffees.
You know water, water is always important, and you know
(28:38):
you're probably not getting three hundred miles of fluid from
your coffee whereas you're going to get three hundred mills
of water from water. But know that the dehydration effect
has definitely been blown kind of way out of proportion. However,
if all you've had for the last four hours is
to coffees, yeah you're going to be dehydrated, but probably
not the coffee's fault.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
Next, dark Rose coffee has more caffeine than not dark
Rose coffee.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
I don't think so. I think I think the and
I've falled for it with like buying the intense espresso
pods in the past, because intense must mean more. But
I think it is just a darker roast, a more
intense flavor, not a more intense.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
Because that gets me sometimes too. When I go to
a coffee shop and I order a coffee, they're like, oh,
do what the dark roast or the blonde roast or
I'm just give me a coffee. I don't know what.
I don't care about the different roasts, just something that's
going to do.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
It you make the fastest. Maybe you could ask them
next time, because yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
And then the last myth this is not even absolutely
nutrition related, but it just says it here on this
word document. Coffee is the world's second most valuable commodity.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Maybe sure, yeah, nonfiction.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
I would argue fiction, because I think it's the first commodity.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
It'd be like the export.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
Would be I've made a gross segue. A gross segue anyway,
Thank you so so much, John. I always finish every
episode the exact same way, and that is to ask
my guest, what is one piece of advice you would
give to everybody listening to this episode?
Speaker 2 (30:06):
Oh, I should have prepared okay, eat more vegetables. I
do not care how stereotypical it is for a dietician
to say eat more vegetables, but just see more dopid.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
Love that simple, simple. Thank you so much for listening. Guys.
I really hope you enjoyed the episode, and don't forget
to help a sister out by following the podcast on Apple,
on Spotify or wherever you listen to your podcasts. Rate it,
write me a review, and if you want more Finish,
we do have a private Facebook group. There is going
(30:40):
to be exclusive Q and A is happening with my
guests in that group. That's going to be events, going
life first, so much fun stuff happening. Just look up
fit Ish in brackets on Facebook and you can be
part of the Finish online community.
Apodjay production. Before we get into the episode, it has
come to my attention that majority of you listening right
now are not actually subscribed to the show. So if
that is you jump on give me a follow or
a subscribe on Apple or Spotify or wherever you listen
to your podcasts, because the more subscribers I have, the
(00:27):
more free content I can give you. Guys, enjoy the
episode Welcome to Fit Dish. I'm Phoebie Parsons, and this
is the podcast that proves that you don't have to
choose between staying fit and having fun. I love my
morning coffee. Some days it's coffees, and I honestly think
(00:48):
it's one of the most enjoyable parts of my entire day.
And the good news is it turns out it isn't
as bad for us as we may have originally thought.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Fun fact, it's actually probably less depressing than a lot
of people.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
See according to my guest this week, who's no creditor Dietitian,
it even has hell benefits.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Coffee is contains caffeine, but also contains like thousands of
other what we call bioactive compound you don't need to get.
There's nothing something good happens at zero right.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Welcome to the podcast. John o' steadman from Bite Me Nutrition.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
You are actually a requested guest and I had a
listener actually send me through your Instagram, so shout out
to you, Christy. I don't fuck around proof that I
do listen to what you guys want. So welcome to
the podcast, John O.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
That's a I didn't know that it's free. That's a
nice way to start.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
We've got quite the fan base over here. Let's always
start the way we always start, and that is to
ask my guest what makes you fit ish? And I
particularly love asking dietitians this question.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
I let's go from fit. That's it's a kind I
like waste training. I like training pre regularly. I'm very
fortunate just that end of my big shed is sort
of a pretty nifty home gym set up, so it's
pretty easy for me in the spirit of things, to train,
which is nice and I enjoy it. So I guess
(02:12):
that's the fit component. And I like food, and I like,
you know, eating healthy and that sort of stuff, but
also like our logo is literally a burger, so hopefully
that's a bit of an insight as well into you know,
like it's such a like NAF saying, like all foods fit,
but it's it's the truth, you know, in terms of
a healthy diet, everything can be included and should be included.
(02:33):
I think so burgers are my favorite food. I like
a sneaky craft wanker beer, Like the wankier the better,
Like if it's some like you know, I don't know,
like me so roasted sesame stout or something, then like
I'm there, Yeah, like the wankier the better.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
So my partner is exactly the same. Yeah. We live
near a wine bar and he every weekend we go
there and he's like, oh, I'm gonna get like the
tamari roasted with sabi sour beer. I'm like that sounds
dis but you do you boo? You do you?
Speaker 2 (03:07):
I'm in, I'm in. That sounds great. Yeah yeah, and
like honestly just a good old four x as well.
But yes, stop it so is he?
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Oh you men new men easy to please.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
They're different. You just you appreciate each other all.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
Also, guys, the macros of four x golds are like
pretty wild, like like in terms of if you're gonna
drink alcohol, for x golds are pretty much pretty mint.
So what I want to chat to you today about
is coffee, which is such a huge part of most
of our lives and our mornings, but it is one
of those topics that there is so much controversy and
conflicting information around, and I just kind of want for
(03:43):
you to set the record straight from a nutrition standpoint.
So first they want to start by asking, this is
probably going to offend and offside a lot of people,
but what would you describe as a healthy or moderate
caffeine intake per day?
Speaker 2 (03:57):
So fun fact, it's actually probably less depressing than a
lot of people think. The actual kind of safe recommendations are.
The upper limit of the moment is set at around
four hundred milligrams, which, for context, a shot of espresso
is probably seventy to eighty milligrams on average. Right, Oh wow,
it's like a solid amount. Now, that's not necessarily saying
that everyone should go out and smash four hundred milligrams
(04:18):
caffeine to day, because everyone's tolerance, as I'm sure we've
all just you know, anecdotally noticed, is very different. That's
largely based on your genetics and how well you metabolize caffeine.
So if a second shot makes you feel rubbish, don't go.
Oh look John who said that like five shots is safe,
so I should like up my game. No, it's fine.
(04:39):
But if you ask someone that likes to have a
few coffees in the day, there's some other things which
I'm sure we'll get to, that you need to be
mindful of, But in terms of like safe upper limits,
it's actually it's pretty high.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Wow, what a way to start on a positive note.
I think a lot of people are signing an absolute
breath of relief right now just to hear that. But
I also think it's important, particularly if people listening to
this podcast, to bring in other forms of caffeine here too,
because if I look at my day in terms of
my caffeine can sumption I think more of my caffeine
consumption comes from pre workouts and things like that than
it does from coffee and things like diet coke. So
(05:12):
how do those stuck up in terms of the milligrams
of caffeine in them as well?
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Yeah, totally. Other forms of caffeine can vary wildly, like
a diet coke or pepsi or something No, no, one drinks,
Pepsi max right rend.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Drinks, Oh, I think they do.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
Well anyway, can't probably can't help you, but about forty
to fifty milligrams in those, so you know, not nothing
but also a bit lower. But yeah, pre workouts and
energy drinks in particular, really really important that you check
the label, just because you can have pre workouts that
are averaging one hundred to one hundred and fifty milligrams.
(05:51):
I've seen ones that have up to five hundred actually
on hundred, one hundred and fifties low for pre workout
these days. To be honest, I'd say it they probably
average closer to two fifty to three hundred milligrams. So
as you can see, it is to kind of exceed
that av is about ninety milligrams. That's the two fifty
(06:11):
mil kind of most two fifty mili energy drinks sit
around that ninety milligrams. So yeah, definitely, definitely if you're
a pre workout drinker and a coffee drinker, maybe do
a bit of quick maths to see where that is
in the day and where that's adding up to, because I'm.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
Going to blame maths not being at my my strong
point for that because I have never once checked the
back of my pre workout that I take twice a
day every day for probably the last five years. But
that could account to why my anxiety is through the roof.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
No time like the present, right, Like.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Yeah, okay, So on that note, then, what are some
of the implications of going over the moderate amount or
the recommended amount of caffeine in a day?
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Yeah, well, I would even just say what what is
over your threshold? Because you know, like I said, for
someone that might be one hundred milligrams, for someone that
might be four hundred milligrams, But you'll it's generally pretty
pretty obvious, you know, things like higher heartbeat, like a
faster heartbeat, a bit sweaty, more anxious. Absolutely, those are
(07:15):
probably the three main things that we see with excessive
not excessive, but just with getting over the edge of
that caffeine consumption. It can definitely be an appetite suppressant
as well, so that's also something to be mindful of.
I've got lots of clients who don't need to eat
breakfast till one pm, but that's because they've just mainlined
(07:36):
four coffees throughout the morning. So you know, being mindful
of its appetites, spress and effect as well. But yeah,
from a symptom perspective, if you're flirting with danger, you're
probably going to notice a bit sweat, heart rate up,
and definitely that increased anxiety.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
Are there any long term implications because I feel like
those are all things that you can kind of notice
as they're happening to you, Like a lot of people
do talk about the anxiety piece and things like that,
But are there any longer lasting or maybe more silent.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Not really, we haven't tested giving someone five hundred milligrams
a day for ten years, right, so there is a
degree of you know, probably coffee as reasons, but be
hard to get that approves, So we do have to
be mindful of Hey, probably don't exceed this because it's
almost like an unknown. But there's been some noise out
there about higher intakes of caffeine increase your risk of
(08:32):
like cardiovascular disease, so like heart disease and things. But again,
when we see people staying under that four hundred milligrams, ironically,
coffee which is important to separate from caffeine, and a
little bit coffee can actually reduce your risk of heart disease.
It appears, so yeah, I would say if you're noticing
(08:53):
those symptoms, don't push past that all day every day,
mostly because we just don't know, but it probably won't
be good. That would be my guess.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Listen to your body, guys, isn't your buddy? Okay, you
just said something that really piqued my interest there that
there are health benefits to coffee. So let's flip the
narrative here and talk about some of the positive health
effects and we can leave kind of pre work out
and diet, coca and all that in the background for
now and just focus on actual coffee totally.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
So coffee contains caffeine, but also contains like thousands of
other what we call bioactive compounds, so in other words,
things like antioxidants, polyphenols, a few fatty acids, and basically
all of these things which have been linked with improvements
in a bit of gut health, improvements in reducing your
risk of heart disease and things. So it's kind of
(09:41):
I guess there's sort of similar things that you find
in fruits and vegetables, because coffee is a plant food. Like, sorry,
not saying like you don't need to eat fruits and vegetables.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Just have a coffee, guys, get you two and five
from your cups of coffee.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
I'm always so terrified at being misquoted and taken out
of context, which I'm sure it won't be happening here on.
But like you know, oh yeah, I heard John O
say just have a coffee. You know anyway, But it's
that similar sort of antioxidants and those sorts of things.
So look, because of that, you see some people kind
of forcing coffee upon themselves if they don't like it,
(10:17):
or if they don't tolerate caffeine very well and don't
do that. You can get those same benefits from lots
of other foods, and it is a minor bump, Like
a lot of the things in tea, for example, are
going to give you similar sorts of things. But from
a if you if you enjoy coffee, then yeah, the
good news is the bioactive compounds in that can actually
(10:38):
be pretty good for you. We probably also need to
be mindful of the form of the coffee that you're having,
you know, coffee, it's probably more a bigger discussion around
like how much milk, what other things are in there?
Are their sugars are their syrups, is their cream, you know,
is it what type of milk? Those sorts of things.
So those are all things to be mindful of. And
(11:00):
I'm not saying you need to drink black coffee to
get the benefits. I maybe like one week of the
year I'm like, oh, I'm going to drink black coffee,
and then like by day three, I'm like, oh, I
hate this. So I'm not not recommending everyone goes out
and does that. It is the black coffee itself that
is the healthy bit, and then we just need to
(11:22):
be mindful of everything else.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
That is so good to know, because I feel like
with some of the weaponry that coffee gets in the media,
sometimes I was of the assumption that coffee is kind
of like alcohol and then it's just one of those
dead things where there's actually nothing good in them. But
to hear that there's actual health benefits of the coffee itself,
that is phenomenal news totally.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
And it's sort of like even you hear red wine
being good for you because you might have heard of
like resveratrol, which is the thing, but like, yes, red
wine has resveratrol, but it also has alcohol in it.
Still whereas coffee you kind of have the same sort
of style of thing as resveratrol. I'm going to stop
saying that word. Sorry that without the like toxin, which
(12:03):
I hesitate to use the word toxins. It gets used
and abused in my industry. But when we're talking about.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Alcohol, I feel like that's a very fair point though,
because particularly in the fitness industry, you do see people
going on these like cleanses or challenges, and I know
that forty five years to do it, where for the
first two weeks of the challenge they'd make you null
and void all of your caffeine and just like hate
waking up every morning. And now all these years down
the track they were like, oh, sorry, that was actually
a waste of time. But I feel like it's all
(12:29):
that unlearning that we're having to do now because of
what we were seeing and what we were told to
believe about things like coffee and caffeine.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Yeah, I don't think I mean, detoxing is probably a
whole other podcast, But any kind of program or you know,
challenge that has some kind of cleanse phase, yeah, coffee,
get red of that, right, That's always the first protocol,
which is kind of interesting given that there's actually linked.
It's actually linked with quite a few health benefits. It
(12:59):
can also be a band aids solution to poor sleep
and poor nutrition and poor recovery, so that's also something
to be mindful of. You know, I love coffee, a
coffee drinker, and as we've discussed, coffee can be really
healthy for you. But if you are not sleeping properly,
or you know, having poor sleep hygeene, or you're not
kind of fueling yourself relatively effectively throughout the day and
(13:22):
spacing that out, and those resulting energy levels are crashing.
But you're kind of, like I said, taping over it
with a coffee, that's sort of a bigger problem. I
would still argue that coffee isn't the problem there. It's
more just like, hey, let's get to the root of
that problem, okay, and maybe not blame the coffee.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
It's never coffee as fault. It's just there to help.
So let's talk about sleep while we're on it, because
I know that personally for me, if I have caffeine
after lunchtime, it really hinders my ability to fall asleep.
And I don't know why, because my whole life have
drink and like drunk. Sorry, quite a bit of caffeine.
But then I know some people on the other hand,
like my mum, can have a cup of coffee after
(14:02):
dinner and just fall asleep as soon as I head
hits the p So as a baseline, what time of
the day should people stop drinking coffee or if that's
not a fair way to ask that question, how long
do the effects of caffeine averagely last in our systems?
Speaker 2 (14:16):
For yeah, that is probably a better way to ask
that question. Like you said, how far from sleep? Because
you know, cut off at midday is kind of arbitrary
if you're a shift work and you're going to sleep
at one am, right, So this is where the news
get slightly less good. Sorry about ten hours away from bedtime? Yeah,
(14:36):
sometimes more. And the way to think about it is caffeine,
which is the thing that keeps us awake and disrupts sleep,
has a half life of can be five to six
hours for some people, can be up to seven to
eight hours. And so what that means is if you
had let's say your pre workout is two hundred milligrams,
which I think when you go check the label is
probably a fair guess. So let's say that at eight
(14:58):
am or six you're going to jumail. At six am,
you've had two hundred milligrams of coffee, two hundred milligrams
of caf By about one to two pm, you've probably
still got about one hundred eighty to one hundred milligrams
of caffeine in your system. So the equivalent of having
a coffee at one pm, you know. And so then
(15:19):
if you have had another coffee at ten am, and
maybe you have one more sneaky coffee with lunch or something,
then you've stacked all of this creep, all of this
caffeine up, and that half life is like the metabolization
of caffeine still going on in the background. But even
if you stopped your caffeine at ten am, if you've
had like four hundred milligrams by ten am, you know,
(15:41):
six hours later you've got two hundred milligrams. Six hours
after that you've got one hundred milligrams, and that's taken
you through tool like, you know, one am. So that's
also really important when we talk about total daily amounts.
You know, don't just go like, ah, four hundred milligrams
are safe. That's fine. If you are spacing that out
across the morning and it's getting you know, within that
(16:04):
eight ten hours of sleep, it can very definitely disrupt
your ability to get to sleep. As you said, everyone's
experience is a little bit different. There's a very small
percentage of people who seem to be not affected by it.
But what you don't want to do is use your
ability to get to sleep as your yardstick, because caffeine
(16:26):
won't necessarily affect your ability to get to sleep, but
it can absolutely affect your abilities you get into those
third and fourth sleep cycles, you deep and your rem sleep.
It's the good stuff. And so I had heaps of
clients who you know, well, first meet them and they'll
have you know, pre workout before gym at five pm,
and like, yeah, but I can get to sleep fine.
And my next question was always like, do you wake
(16:48):
up the next day feeling like you haven't slept? And yes,
So if that's you, it may not be stopping you
getting to sleep, but it could absolutely be you know,
hurting that sleep quality, which is a bar.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Honestly, that's one of my favorite things about my fitbit
is I don't use it for anything else. I've disabled
all notifications. I don't give a fuck about tracking my workouts.
All I care about is waking up and seeing my sleep.
Speaker 2 (17:15):
I love it amazing. Do you notice how have you tracked?
Speaker 1 (17:19):
I haven't done that because I just I've never had
caffeine post. I guess midday since I was in my
early twenties, because I used to have so much trouble
with my sleep, and I guess. I put two and
two together and I was like, oh, what's doing that?
Oh it must be my five PM diet coke. And
then I got my shit together. But how can I
ask you from a dietitian's perspective, how many coffees do
you drink in a day? And what time would you
(17:41):
drink those? And do you drink any other forms of caffee?
Speaker 2 (17:43):
I feel like I should preface this by saying I
have two children under six, So put that out there.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
There's no judgment on this show.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
I try to stick to two caffeine to drinks a day.
Usually it's coffee. Occasionally, oh not occasionally. Maybe half of
the week I'll swap the second coffee out for an
energy drink some kind. My first coffee is anywhere from
four to six am. Depending on when I get up,
and then my second coffee will be three eight to
(18:14):
nine am. Ten AM's like my cutoff I try to find.
And then occasionally I'll sub that out for a pre workout.
If it's a day where I'm training, I get to
train in the morning and I'll stob that second coffee
for pre workout. I don't actually feel that bad when
I acceed it, so it's also probably not a good
yardstick to go, well, I feel fine when I have
(18:34):
five hundred MILLI games, I must be special. The sad
us is like, not as many of us as special
as we think.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
So the harsh truth, the har's truth. Okay, so if
someone's listening, they're like, fuck, I've got to cut down
on my caffeine consumption. Is caffeine addiction real? Because I
know sometimes if I wake up a little bit later
that I normally would, if it's like a weekend or
something and I haven't had my pre work out on
my coffee, I have been known to get a little
headache before. Is that actually a caffeine withdrawal or is
(19:01):
that a myth?
Speaker 2 (19:03):
No? It is it is, Sorry, it is not a myth.
Caffeine habitual caffeine consumption makes us a little bit more
sensitive to something called a dentisine. A dentasine makes us
feel sleepy and tied. That's why, you know, having caffeine
can kind of stop that feeling, but excess to dentisine
can also give us headaches. So I'm sure you can
(19:24):
even think of later in the day, if you've had
a really big day, you know, you can feel that
headache kind of start to come on as well. It's
sort of a similar similar concept. So I think for
most people using the word addiction is real to be
careful because obviously there's a whole host of other I
guess associations with a word like that. I think an
(19:45):
over reliance on it can definitely be a thing. And
so when if you are looking to reduce I think
it's important to prepare to be a little bit uncomfortable.
And again, I know that's not fine, but I think
it's better to know that that's coming rather than just
just get sort of blindsided by it. Also probably why
I wouldn't recommend going cold turkey. I know that everyone
(20:06):
likes to go you know, or nothing, but ideally if
you're a double shot person twice day go to a
single shot twice day, or you know, you try to
tie track, try to just gradually bring it down rather
than cutting yourself off completely. Focus on sleep, focus on hydration,
you know, try and try and patch up all those
other things as well. But yeah, you might for it
(20:32):
seems to be about two to nine days is what
I've seen in the various studies. So hopefully you're a
two day person, not a nine day person. But blame
your parents and guys.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Just be kind to yourself. Like if you if you
are going cold turkey in cutting yourself down from four
cups to none, how long realistically do you think you're
going to sustain that for what two days max? Then
you're going to throw in the towel and have another
five and you're back to the starting point one hundred.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
Yeah, And like we've said, you don't need to get
there's nothing. Nothing good happens at zero, right.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
So the opposit everything bad happens.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
For you and everyone around you.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
Now I know you touched on before that caffeine can
affect your hunger cues. Is there any correlation between coffee
and our metabolism? Because again, I feel like this is
something that's spoken about a lot in media and the news,
and then it's confusing because so often will hear people
say like, oh, don't drink coffee on an empty stomach,
that's gonna hurt your guts. And then some people are like, no,
you need to fast and only drink plat coffee on
(21:32):
an empty stomach. But like what to who do we believe?
What do we listen to?
Speaker 2 (21:39):
Just do both of those things every day at the
same time, somehow look slight tangent. Anyone who speaks in absolutes.
Just be careful. I think that's a really good red
flag if someone's saying you must or you should only
there's a whole lot of different things that can come
from caffeine. In terms of metabolism, it has a slight
(21:59):
impact on increasing metabolism. Yes, so that's why you'll see
a lot of fat burning products make these claims about
burning fat and they contain caffeine because it does slightly
increase your metabolism above baseline. But it's so small, it's
so it's it's like it's like five cherry tomatoes or something,
So it's not going to have this significant impact on
(22:20):
you know, dropping all of this body fat in terms
of that, don't have it first thing in the morning.
The main rationale for that claim comes from something to
do without cortisol. So, cortisol is a stress hormone which
is often misrepresented as a bad hormone. Instead it's actually
(22:41):
it wakes you up in the morning. It's the thing
that gets you going in the gym, right, Like everyone
associates it with the saber tooth tiger. That's the thing
I hear all the time, like you're a caveman, and
there's the same yes, yes, yes, yeah, yeah, And cortisol
spikes because you know, and it turns all these systems on.
But that's what we want in the morning, like I
want to wake up in the morning, you know. And sure,
(23:02):
we don't want cortzole to be excessively raised or raised
for longer than we want. But we see in studies
for habitual so people who drink a cafe to drink
every day, their body kind of the first week, yes,
their quarters all goes a little bit higher than normal,
but then it comes back down to normal baselines as
they adapt. Anyway, So if getting up and having coffee
(23:23):
on an empty stomach works for you, works for your routine,
it's what brings you joy at four am in the morning, perfectly,
perfectly fine. It can increase your risk some people of
brief acid reflux, and so if you struggle with heartburn,
you know, be mindful of that. But for most people,
(23:44):
having caffeine on an empty stomach is perfectly fine.
Speaker 1 (23:48):
It's again good to know. Just do what feels good
for you, I guess is the essence of most of
life that we just don't listen to because it seems
too easy.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Yeah. Yeah, and you want to overcomplicate it, right, you
want to find a problem that you didn't know you have, Like,
that's what we're all excited.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
Spend hundreds of dollars trying to solve it.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
So then what are some of the biggest misconceptions of
bullshit myths you've heard or or sorry you've heard or
seen in your clients around coffee and its impact on
their health.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
I think the biggest one, like we touched on, is
that it's just that it's bad and that it would
be better for you to get it to zero. That's
by far the biggest one. I've got lots of people
who come to me, well, no, they don't come to
me specifically for cutting out coffee. But one of their
like side goals is on and I'd like to get
off the coffee kick, that coffee habit. But yeah, it's
it's kind of nice to be able to go, oh well,
(24:38):
the coffee itself is not necessarily a problem. We'll investigate.
You know, are you having do you have fat loss
goals and you're drinking two tall lattes a day with milk? Right,
that's not the coffee. That's the extra six hundred calories
that's coming from those strengths, right, And so yeah, talking
them through that, how it can be included, how we
(25:00):
can adjust a few things. The definitely the morning thing
that that I went wild like eighteen months ago. I
feel like of you know, like that's causing you to
gain weight because it's spiking your cords all and YadA, YadA, YadA,
and all of these I.
Speaker 1 (25:13):
Would I definitely agree with that. Now, I want to
finish with a little rapid fire fact or fiction coffee addition.
So number one, will coffee stunt your growth?
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Fiction?
Speaker 1 (25:23):
Does decaf coffee have no caffeine in it?
Speaker 2 (25:27):
Fiction? I would check the label because it would depend
on the amount of the way that it's been processed,
it's definitely got a significantly lower amount of caffeine. And
I know you said fact or fiction, but I'm talking. Sorry,
all of the health benefits we talked about with coffee
are in decaf coffee as well, because all of those
other compounds remain. Yeah, they washed the coffre the caffeine out,
(25:48):
but most of the other things are there, so maybe
you could use that to work it in.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
Well, I'm going to have to make a formal apology then,
because I talk decaf caffee decaf coffee, sorry a lot,
because I don't understand the point. But I'm sorry, guys,
I stand corrected. I've ever said something bad about your
decaf coffee. I take it back.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
Look, I definitely understand why coffee plus caffeine is the
preferred combo for most superior Yeah, I've also heard that.
Apparently it's because like decaf coffee, even like roasters and
barristas don't take it seriously, so they get like they
roasted poorly. They don't make a good decaff coffee. They
don't try. And I think there is this sort of
(26:29):
I reckon it's coming off the back of that, Like
you know how alcohol free drinks have exploded. Yes, you've
heard it here, maybe not first, but I reckon there's
going to be a big like decaf coffee kind of
you know, but like niche you know, small batch brewised roasteries,
cold brew all of the loving care and attention that
(26:49):
regular coffee gets. I feel like, do you I hope.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
So because it is really nice to go Yeah, I
hope so. Because it is nice to go out now.
And if you want a mocktail or something an alcoholic
they used to bring you out like a juice and
you're like, oh no, I would have just ordered a juice.
But now you can actually go out and have like
a non alcoholic beer or a non alcoholic cocktail that
actually has the spirits and it's like a similar experience.
So that would be really nice if that came out
with the decaf coffee, not for me, but for you know,
(27:14):
the people who enjoyed the decap for me. Yeah. Next
myth and this is a big one. Will coffee sober
you up?
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Ah? Sorry? Fiction With the hash with the asterisk, you
might feel a little bit more sober because it increases
your feeling of alertness and maybe blunts some of the sleepiness,
but it doesn't decrease your blood alcohol concentration, right, so
it might give you a false sense of, you know,
(27:47):
feeling sober, which is probably almost worse. So no, a
bye by all the normal things. You know, if you're
feeling hungover and you're going to have a coffee to
make you get going a little bit better, sure, but no,
it won't you increase your ability to the tabloid.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
Next is coffee dehydrating fiction.
Speaker 2 (28:08):
I'm trying so hard to just say one word fiction.
That's good, cool fiction, So all right, oh you can say.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
More, say more. You're going to elaborate on that one
because that needs explanation.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
Is something called a diuretic in that it does get
you to excrete a little bit more water, but the
amount of water it gets you to get rid of
is very much replaced by the amount of fluid in
the coffee. So I wouldn't recommend you hydrate yourself with coffees.
You know water, water is always important, and you know
(28:38):
you're probably not getting three hundred miles of fluid from
your coffee whereas you're going to get three hundred mills
of water from water. But know that the dehydration effect
has definitely been blown kind of way out of proportion. However,
if all you've had for the last four hours is
to coffees, yeah you're going to be dehydrated, but probably
not the coffee's fault.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
Next, dark Rose coffee has more caffeine than not dark
Rose coffee.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
I don't think so. I think I think the and
I've falled for it with like buying the intense espresso
pods in the past, because intense must mean more. But
I think it is just a darker roast, a more
intense flavor, not a more intense.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
Because that gets me sometimes too. When I go to
a coffee shop and I order a coffee, they're like, oh,
do what the dark roast or the blonde roast or
I'm just give me a coffee. I don't know what.
I don't care about the different roasts, just something that's
going to do.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
It you make the fastest. Maybe you could ask them
next time, because yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
And then the last myth this is not even absolutely
nutrition related, but it just says it here on this
word document. Coffee is the world's second most valuable commodity.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Maybe sure, yeah, nonfiction.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
I would argue fiction, because I think it's the first commodity.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
It'd be like the export.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
Would be I've made a gross segue. A gross segue anyway,
Thank you so so much, John. I always finish every
episode the exact same way, and that is to ask
my guest, what is one piece of advice you would
give to everybody listening to this episode?
Speaker 2 (30:06):
Oh, I should have prepared okay, eat more vegetables. I
do not care how stereotypical it is for a dietician
to say eat more vegetables, but just see more dopid.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
Love that simple, simple. Thank you so much for listening. Guys.
I really hope you enjoyed the episode, and don't forget
to help a sister out by following the podcast on Apple,
on Spotify or wherever you listen to your podcasts. Rate it,
write me a review, and if you want more Finish,
we do have a private Facebook group. There is going
(30:40):
to be exclusive Q and A is happening with my
guests in that group. That's going to be events, going
life first, so much fun stuff happening. Just look up
fit Ish in brackets on Facebook and you can be
part of the Finish online community.
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