Episode 5 | The Rise and Fall of Sega's Iconic Consoles

Welcome to another great episode of the Gamepad Saga podcast! In today's episode, we dive deep into the history and impact of two legendary Sega consoles: the Sega Saturn and the Sega Dreamcast. Our hosts share personal stories, technical insights, and discuss what made these systems great, as well as the challenges they faced.

The conversation begins with a nostalgic look at the Sega Genesis and its role in setting the stage for the Saturn and Dreamcast. We explore the innovative features and groundbreaking games that made these consoles iconic, from the superior 2D capabilities of the Saturn to the ahead-of-its-time Dreamcast.

We also examine the internal struggles within Sega, the competition with other gaming giants like PlayStation and Nintendo, and the unfortunate reasons why these consoles didn't achieve the long-term success they deserved. Our hosts don't shy away from discussing the missed opportunities and the impact of corporate decisions on Sega's fate.

Whether you're a long-time Sega fan or new to these classic consoles, this episode is packed with insights, memories, and a deep appreciation for what Sega brought to the gaming world. Tune in and join us on this nostalgic journey through the highs and lows of Sega's console history.

Thank you for listening to the Gamepad Saga podcast! Stay tuned for our next episode as we continue to explore the rich history of video games and the stories behind the consoles we love.

 

Website | GamePad Saga

https://gamepadsaga.podbean.com/

Click HERE to join our Discord.

https://discord.gg/QRK7GSxqvW

Where you can listen: Apple | YouTube | Spotify | Amazon | Audacy | Boomplay | Goodpods | iHeartRadio | PlayerFM | Podchaser | Podcast Addict | Podfollow

Follow us on Social Media: Facebook | Instagram |TikTok | X (Twitter) 

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Alright, welcome to another great episode of the Gamepad Saga podcast.
Sir, are you okay over there? Are you okay? I just got over COVID,
so I'm good. Well, glad that you're feeling better.
Today's episode, we are, make sure I get my R's in there, we are going to talk
about the Sega Saturn and the Sega Dreamcast.

(00:24):
Great systems. Great systems. yes i
would agree did you own any of them
in their original run i guess or whenever they were
so we we owned when mom
and dad first started seeing each other we owned the uh sega genesis over at
900 right when the sega genesis we had the super nintendo we did not have a

(00:46):
saturn however you had the saturn yeah that we we talked about in our podcast
with fighting games and we'll touch
a little bit more on that i'm sure but no the
sega genesis was the only one that we had but
i feel we need to start with the sega genesis first because i
feel start there that leads up to

(01:06):
the saturn in the dreamcast right also at one point the sega genesis did go
by mega drive but yeah we can go ahead and start with the sega genesis yeah
the sega genesis was well i guess I guess I'll go into that for a little bit
and give it a little synopsis on this.
So, Sega Genesis was by far superior than the NES and Super Nintendo at one point.

(01:28):
Now, the Super Nintendo, now don't get me wrong, the Nintendo itself made home
consoles popular once again.
Because, you know, you had the Atari and ColecoVision and all the rest of that good stuff.
And, you know, they were good for the time, right?
But they lacked a lot. very
limited and as opposed to you having

(01:49):
now a game system that can
play multiple games can give you really good
graphics good visuals good gameplay you know you had you had nintendo at that
time where i believe nintendo kind of started adopting some of the arcade stuff
right right yes and you know now you're able to play the arcade games at home but they weren't the

(02:14):
greatest because of the boards and whatnot.
Super Nintendo, the same thing. Super Nintendo revolutionized everything a little bit.
But when Sega Genesis came, Sega was basically.
Blow everybody out the water when it comes to arcade ports
and they did they did a really good job like you look

(02:35):
at some of the ninja turtles games that came out on arcade that
was at sega genesis look at streets of rage you look
at all those beat-em-ups all i mean pretty much that's what the arcade
was beat-em-ups and and one v one
fighters and shoot-em-ups like grandia not
grandia gradius and all rest of good stuff they're
super r-type those type games the sega

(02:57):
genesis was just founded on making
sure the arcade port is not perfect
but good enough to where
when it's here it's like oh you know what like i'm not missing out on the arcade
right i'm not and by our home console instead of going to the arcade right right
right and they they did a really good job although let's let's be real the arcade

(03:22):
is is always going to be the real deal it's always
going to be the real deal more much more powerful obviously you'll
have to pay money to play it but you
know that's that's the thing but yeah yeah battle pass yeah thanks thanks obama
appreciate the battle pass that was a good one but yeah they they specialize and they did really

(03:49):
well with the arcade ports and more with the Sega Genesis.
They also started getting a lot of exclusive, like the Batman games were exclusive.
Really? Yeah. Yeah. Batman games were getting exclusivity for it.
Actually, you know what? Let me, let me take that back.
Because I know there were some Batman games on Super Nintendo,

(04:11):
but I think it was Batman the Movie that was exclusive for Sega Genesis.
And then a lot of these companies started to see the steam that Sega was getting.
And then not only that, they were also not cool with the licensing fees that
Nintendo was giving out between the NES and the Super Nintendo.

(04:31):
So they were like, no, we're just jumping ship. We're just going to go ahead
and put everything on all platforms.
Right. And the Sega Genesis really stepped up in making the games,
I wouldn't say slightly better, but significantly better.
Like, the Sega Genesis at one point was on top of the world.
And then you had Sonic, which was the mascot of it all. Right, right.

(04:54):
So, like, you had someone who was out beating Mario, and Mario had been out for years.
Yeah. Well, we go back mid-80s. yeah
but early early to mid 80s early like 1984 yeah
right where you were born yeah somewhere around there like 80
80 82 84 somewhere around there but yeah

(05:15):
the sega genesis had a lot going forward
until it was like it was around 19 around
86 88 to about 94 was
when sega was like really like yeah like having
its real like big break right yeah so
they were they were pumping out game after game vector man

(05:35):
vector man 2 earthworm jim like the
list goes on especially vector vector
man was great how was it i never played vector man vector man
so it was like a it was a side scroller and basically
vector man had this little like machine gun he had in
his hand and you just like would shoot things but it was like it
was the first like 2d game that was 3d that

(05:57):
you could play that that was like really that was well made yeah
it was really good sega was
also good for their sports once madden started
coming from super nintendo over to over to sega genesis sega had its own sports
line like these games were pretty pretty decent pretty decent a lot of people

(06:17):
were liking them a lot especially out in the west here basketball and football
were huge things yes I mean, they're still huge.
I don't think they're, I think money-wise they're huge now, right?
But I don't think there's much of a following as it was back in the day, if that makes sense.
Yeah, it makes sense. Yeah. Because like you look at Madden now,

(06:38):
you look at NBA 2K now, right?
You get the same people buying them every year. I'm one of them, right?
But I'm also the same person that's like, these games suck.
Like, why are they doing this? Why are they doing that? Instead of just me not buying it.
You know, it happens. Yeah. I'm, I'm dumb. I remember, what was it? 2k.

(07:00):
What was it? 21 or 22.
And they had the game for like three bucks. I was like, damn,
that's a steal. It is a steal. It is.
Even with having to buy your pay to win to upgrade your creative player, it was still worth it.
It's a fun game when your character's great. And you can throw off some circus-ass shots and make it.

(07:26):
Right? Yes. Well, we're not going to get into that right now because I'm going to have a fit.
If that's okay. All right, we'll stay on track. So we are, are we still talking about Sega?
Yeah, so the sports line for Sega was top tier when it came to sports,
whether it be on any system. I think it was called Sega Sports.

(07:47):
Yeah, you know, Sega Sports, and that was the tagline that they used for their games.
And they came out football basketball soccer and
came out with fifa at one point so they were they were the they
were the king of fifa at one point they had golf
i think they came out with one for sega saturn actually it was called the pebble
beach pebble beach uh golf tour or something like that actually i do have one

(08:11):
yeah it was a release title they probably could have released more but one of
the release titles for the saturn was a yeah pebble beach golf links yeah Yeah,
and then they had FIFA Golden Goal Edition or something like that.
I'm not necessarily sure, but.
Worldwide Soccer. Yeah, Worldwide Soccer. Sega International Victory Goal Edition.
Yes. Goal, goal, goal, goal.

(08:35):
So, yeah, Sega was there. Sega
was there. Sega pretty much had everything in the palm of their hands.
Until, until. We're still in the genesis. We're still in the genesis.
So you do know that there was two different corporations for Sega, right?
As far as North America and... Japan. Japan, yeah.
So Japan was now trying to figure out, what are we going to do for the Mega

(08:58):
Drive? What is the next best thing, which was going to be the Saturn at that point?
And they left America. Yes, I know we live in America.
Let's be real here. We're not all perfect, okay? We're not all perfect. Right.
They left Sega of America to publish games. Mm-hmm.
And this is where it all went downhill. Because they put out mediocre to terrible games by then.

(09:25):
So with both Sega of America and Sega of Japan working together to make great content, they did.
Because they had that run from 86 to 94.
Anything after that was just, yeah.
It was downhill. Yeah. they it was downhill
i don't think disappeared but well then

(09:47):
you had the rise of playstation but yeah but i
mean this so that's that's the other thing that's gonna that's gonna tie into what
we're talking about with the rise of playstation but you know
i think if they were to if if
japan and sega america were to work on that specific
system together which would be the sega saturn and i
believe that was the system that they had issues with with the

(10:08):
chipset i believe that was that was and
we'll get another minute near the end of its life cycle games
were not what they were coming in that
reign of that reign of terror they had over the
gaming community and the gaming world it's
just completely shattered and it's and
i don't know how you do that i don't know how

(10:30):
you do that there's a formula right if
it's not broke don't fix it and the the
gentleman the ceo at the time for a
seg of america i don't remember his name i think it was like tom mcclensky
or something like that he made some pretty good
decisions but also when it came to the gaming portion of it he didn't see quality

(10:53):
he saw quantity so he just wanted to push games out and that's all they did
that's all they did was push games out whether it was good or mediocre there
was or even bad and And there was more mediocre and bad games than there were good games.
So this was the start of the fall for Sega, for a home console.

(11:14):
This was the start. America sabotaged it.
It's all your fault. I mean, yeah, yeah. I mean, anyone listening, I'm sorry.
You know, like, you know, I don't know. We got hardcore American people here.
You know, hey, I live in America. I love this country, too. But I'm okay with
admitting when we just didn't do the best and we didn't do the best on this. We didn't.

(11:39):
Because, I'll tell you what, today, Sega would have been, Sega would still be
a household name today instead of a software company.
We would still have Sega systems in here. So many people have grown up on Sega.
So many people, especially in that era, kind of people our age,
more or less, were owning Segas at that time.

(12:01):
Because we're all, what, between 10, 15, 20 years old.
Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, not only that, again, these are the same people that grew up.
In arcades so you got a whole demographic
of people who are now like having kids and then
showing their kids these things and they're like
oh i'm a sega fan too and here you

(12:21):
are creating more sega people how about that how about well folks what do you
know i'm a daddy so but yeah this was the start of it but now we're gonna go
to the saturn so saturn was announced in 94 was it or did it come out in 94? Let's see.
Development, well, development released November 22nd, 94 in Japan.

(12:45):
Then in May 11th, 1995, it was released in North America.
Then July of 95 it was released in Europe. Mm-hmm.
So apparently the Saturn was released earlier in the US? Mm-hmm.
What was it like a, so it was released first in the US?
No, no, no. Japan first. Okay. It was successful there. Mm-hmm.

(13:07):
But for the U.S., it was supposed to release in the fall, but they changed the,
they moved up the date. So I guess they felt threatened by Nintendo.
So they were like, let me put our system out first.
No, you want to know why they felt threatened by Nintendo? Because we fucked
it up. We fucked it up. How'd they do that?

(13:27):
All those sorry-ass games Sega was putting out.
Sorry. I'm still upset about that. That's okay. That's okay.
We forgive you. Well, thank you.
So my thing is now we we
put it we moved it we moved it up and what were you worried
about then well what was i'm not gonna say we but i mean
i say we as because it's sega right now that's what we're representing what

(13:49):
was sega worried about at that time when it came to nintendo because what 94
95 what came out then was it the 64 64 came out like 98 right 97 the n64 did not come out until,
late 96.

(14:10):
Late 96. Okay, I do remember that because I remember going to school and people talking about Mario 64.
I'm like, I got this many stars and I'm like, I don't know what the hell y'all talking about.
I've still got Sega Genesis at home.
So, they released it early because they were scared of what PlayStation were going to do.
PlayStation. You know what PlayStation did. PlayStation. Okay,

(14:31):
let's get into this now. Let's get into this.
So, with the Saturn.
Sega of Japan and Sega of America, once again, going at it. The internal feud
between the two. Was it a power struggle?
You would think. You would think. Somebody wanted to piss further than the other
person. Somebody wanted to do something.

(14:53):
So there was a particular way they wanted to make the Saturn.
I'm not going to get into specifics because I don't know all the specifics when it comes to the chipset.
But there was a specific chipset that Japan wanted to do.
And it was just specific chipset that america wanted
to do the ultimate went with the one that america
wanted i mean for reasons i guess you know yeah and

(15:14):
performance wise not a bad
system again sega was built on bringing
over arcade ports home you don't
have to get up and pay quarters all the time but you gotta pay another 60
70 for a game that's for sure and mind you everyone's getting
up on these games that were like that are
now 70 dollars and 70 dollars a game

(15:35):
they were that's how yeah they were like that years
ago so i mean we we lived
it we didn't know because apparently right right and
we were like we didn't know why they were getting so mad right right
so us us dealing with in the ps4
and xbox one and in that
era of video games where things were between 40 and

(15:58):
60 bucks and now they're back up to 70 well that's
why yeah all right it's always been there i mean
what was it there was a i can't remember what game system
it was neo geo i'm gonna just go off topic real
quick say the neo geo neo geo he said the neo geo neo geo you know how much
that was when it dropped let me go 500 650 wow 650 when it dropped and we're

(16:23):
talking about we're We're complaining about a $500 console that's coming out right now,
and it's more powerful than the Neo Geo. Y'all stop.
Stop. Right now. Stop. Speaking of $399.
$399. So $400. So, again, I mean.
I don't know. I don't know if it would be much superior than a Neo Geo.
But a Neo Geo was $650 as opposed to a $400 console.

(16:48):
Think about that, ladies and gentlemen. Think about it.
$650. $400. I mean, I never looked at whatever was contained in a Neo Geo.
I think I knew one person who owned one.
No, I think it's the same person that also introduced me to the Sega as well.

(17:08):
Oh it's altered beast on neo geo yes yes it was okay that's the game that i
remember they were playing was it the was it the fighting one or was it the
beat them up i'll beat them up okay yeah alter beast also beast on there yep
i believe that was the second game too second game.
But yeah that neo geo if you at

(17:29):
that time if you wanted to look at arcade arcade perfect or
damn near neo geo was it neo geo was it and the the formula was like very close
to the arcade cabinets well that's why it was so much money but you could play
so many different games and there were so many different ram carts that you
could use to expand your ram to play bigger games yeah,

(17:52):
and we'll actually get to that too because the saturn was very big into ram
carts so yeah so So 90, so we're, again, I say we as we're representing Sega,
because that's what we're talking about right now.
So we look at it, PlayStation comes out. We have, we get a battle in the chipsets
on who was going to be superior, what's going to be superior.

(18:16):
America thought this was going to be superior, so it was.
So performance-wise, anything 2D, amazing.
And I said this in the last podcast when we did the fighting games.
Anything 2D, it was amazing.
Anything that was remotely into the beat them up, fighting games,
shoot them up, which is like a super R-type. Mm-hmm.

(18:39):
Adventure rpg anything that was somewhat
polygonal with the rpgs with a mixture of like
a i guess a 2.5 hd at that well i mean
now it would be that but a 2.5 hd then damn near perfect damn near if you got
it from the arcade and you brought it over it was it was damn near there the
only difference is is the aspect ratio it was like closer closer in on the home

(19:03):
console than it was in the arcade Okay,
with all that info that we have now.
Anything that was fully polygonal, like Panzer Dragoon, or Panzer Dragon,
which was a... Dragoon? Dragoon. Dragoon, okay.
So that was a launch title, I believe. Yes.

(19:24):
Probably one of the best 3D polygonal games that came out at that time,
not only that, but for the console itself.
There was a lot of good 3D polygonal
games that came out that were amazing however when
it came to third parties the ports
were not as good i couldn't tell

(19:44):
you why because i know virtual
fighters suffered from this it did and
that's why they had the remix version that you
could get by the end of that year when it was released you
just let them know yeah um
yeah i just when the
virtual fight 2 came out it was a much much better game much polished

(20:06):
although virtual fight was a really fun game that was a great game but yeah
anything that you could think of the arcade ports or anything for the saturn
it was it that was it but then you had playstation playstation was known for
its polygons playstation was superior in its polygons.
Most games were polygons. I think...

(20:29):
Between the both playstation and saturn
you had to have a ram cart in order to play certain 3d
fighting games yes on the saturn because i
was looking at some city actually and you needed the ram cart so low some city
that's actually a pretty big game but yeah the ram carts were really it's a
it was a really good addition although unfortunately it was an extra accessory

(20:51):
you had to get but as i had said in the last podcast that we did with the fighting games.
The saturn was it when it came to fighting games it
was it if you had that ram cart it was over with it was
damn near arcade perfect damn near
i mean it if you had if you
looked at it on a graph you couldn't you could miss

(21:12):
it by a centimeter that's how good it was that's how good those
carts were but then you got
you got playstation beat them out on every other aspect suspect
and then you know you had some you had
some biases or now what they call glazing have
you heard of this term oh okay well i just got schooled the other day easy huh

(21:34):
shout out to rocky mount boys so these guys i used to play with i mean i still
do play play games with rocky they're from rocky mountain north carolina and
one of them has a nephew by the name of jerry.
And jerry was like hey keo
do you know what glazing is and i
was like it's something you do with donuts right that's what

(21:56):
it sounds like to me he said to me no
it's like something about being biased about something you're
glazing so oh
and then i saw it somewhere i saw that same thing somewhere
in the headline and i was like oh no people are just going
way too far with this now making things up yeah right now now now bias we all

(22:17):
knew what we all knew what a and i say this i say this obviously in the terms
of the word but fag right that was a bundle of sticks and or a cigarette yeah
and and then it turned into something else it shouldn't have turned into.
Right i'm not gonna we're not gonna be guilty of i mean we're not gonna be innocent
of this we called each other that all the time yeah and it was acceptable when

(22:40):
it was acceptable yes when But it was like, oh, yeah, you know,
you just. Times have changed.
Yes. And rightfully so. Like, we understand people have feelings and stuff. Yes.
But, yeah, now it's glazing?
It's glazing? Like, oh, to be biased about something?
Glazing? I don't know. Is it Urban Dictionary now? It probably is.

(23:01):
All right. So, I'm going to say
this right now. I don't think you're being biased about something. Yeah.
No, you're being glazing. You're glazing right now, bro. You're glazing.
That's the sentence I got.
So, Jerry, thank you for this because now it gives us content on the pod to
figure out what this is and we can actually use it. Yeah.

(23:24):
So, Jerry, I'm probably going to hook you up with something.
I don't know what I'm going to do, but I'm going to find something for you.
But, yeah, so there was some glazing going on when it came to this process.
So, one of the biggest things, especially in the fighting game community,
was that X-Men vs. Street Fighter.

(23:44):
And we talked about this a little bit when we were talking about the fighting game podcast.
X-men versus street fighter was originally going to be was going
to come out on the saturn and the saturn only just because it ran better right
not saying that not saying that not throwing playstation out the water because
we played the playstation version and it was actually a pretty good port however

(24:05):
if you were someone that came from the arcade and then played it at home
you would have been very disappointed what is this
yeah yeah like oh why is this response time so bad
are they glazing what's going on so you
had that ram cart that four megabyte ram cart yeah for the saturn and that game

(24:26):
again damn near arcade perfect i i sound like a broken record but i mean it's
truth but you want to know what the issue was the the huge issue about it so
So in, I believe it was the arcade version, huh?
Tell me what happened. Oh, well, so I believe in the arcade version when you did Supers, right?
When you did your Super Arts and I think it was, was it that, that game?

(24:50):
And then Street Fighter Alpha or Street Fighter Zero for those,
those that played the Japanese version.
When you did Supers, I'll give the Street Fighter Zero one.
If you did Supers in the arcade, it was, you know, you had a blue trail silhouette of your character.
Right on PlayStation it's the same thing you have a blue trail silhouette of
your character you have like a purplish bluish hue for Saturn and that turned everybody off.

(25:20):
It's not a true blue. Oh my gosh. So it's not the same. Yeah.
That, I mean, that little small, that little small, like, I guess I wouldn't say assumption, but.
I don't want to say minor, because it's probably big for other people.
Yeah. They were like, it's not blue. That thing, that thing took it out of the

(25:41):
fighting game community. Wow.
That little thing right there. Well, one of them anyway. Yeah.
But yeah, how crazy is that?
You have a console that was much more superior in that genre.
And just because of that little thing, somebody who, again, wanted to piss further

(26:02):
than somebody else was like, oh, let me come up with this stupid excuse.
And it really wrecked the
saturn in that genre it really did
so then now you got you got
people talking bad about it you got very little advertisement on the eat on
the west but i mean obviously it was successful in the east and then now you

(26:28):
gotta you gotta compete with coming out with games and then over on the other
side of the country or not country but the world you got
all this negativity, how can you do that?
How can companies believe in a system that they can make games for and still make money?
Well, EA didn't go with Saturn, they didn't go with the Dreamcast,

(26:50):
we'll go with that in a little bit.
Yeah, I just saw that, I was like, oh, that's interesting. Yeah,
it was very interesting.
So I think EA was on the Saturn at one point, I think Madden 97 came out on the Saturn.
I wanna see it, dude. And Madden 98, I think, Madden 97 and 98.
There wasn't very many sports games until about a year later.
I think it was like NFL 97 or something like that. It was a Sega sports game.

(27:15):
It just wasn't good. It wasn't good at all.
They had a basketball game that came out. It wasn't good.
And then we had the Pebble Beach Golf, which sold pretty well.
So speaking of Saturn, released 1144 different games. That's not bad.
The launch games were Clockwork Knight, Daytona USA, USA, Panzer Dragoon,

(27:36):
Pebble Beach Golf Links, Virtual Fighter, and then the World Wide Soccer Sega
International Victory Goal Edition.
Like I stated earlier, Sega Saturn was released in 94 in Japan,
then 95 in the US, but then they were discontinued in 2000 in Japan and in 98.

(27:57):
And the U.N. 98? Yeah. It was only out for two years.
We're done. done estimated units sold
9.26 million but yeah
that's a short lifespan i mean
for it to sell 9 million 9.26 million
that's not bad for two years i mean is that that's an

(28:18):
accumulation okay yeah apparently i
only have a lifespan of six years from 94 to 2000
oh my god the playstation so
the playstation the n64 and
then the next year after that would have been the xbox the original xbox yes
yeah so you're telling me you're telling me that this system despite let's let's

(28:46):
just take out all the negatives right let's just take that out this system could completely still,
i mean i think the dreamcast was out of that time too this system could.
99 okay so only because i know the 9999 thing yeah
that's right that's right and then it came out i think was it
was it august of that that following year yeah august august

(29:07):
and then did it come out the next year or
no october october it came out in something i can't remember november or in
japan well when we have the dreamcast okay gotcha we'll finish up saturn but
saturn could definitely have competed with playstation could compete with the
n64 because N64 was kind of its own thing. Yes.

(29:28):
Yeah, if it would have came out on its original date, I guess they didn't want
a crowded marketplace, but yeah, I believe it would have.
That's crazy. That's crazy. And it's, oh my God.
And just to think how, again, I mean, I'm not trying to be a Sega fan boy,
but I'm just going with facts.
Like how much superior in some of those genres that the Saturn was.

(29:49):
Like what? All because of glazing.
Oh, because of glazing. Yes. What?
And then, obviously, again, just bad marketing. But, yeah, so two years here.
It came out with very good games. And if you try to collect for a Saturn now,

(30:09):
because I got you a Saturn for your birthday last year.
Thank you. Yeah, you're welcome. You're welcome. Because, I mean,
I was like, oh, yeah, we don't even know what happened to the last one.
So, let's get another one. so when i
was younger not knowing the value of things
oh you fucking sold it you dirtbag no i didn't
sell it it stopped working on me oh did it yeah i think

(30:31):
it like stopped loading and then i didn't know any better so
i just chucked it no sir sir no but that was a life with the saturn yeah so
i mean i guess that's how it worked i had no clue about this I just remember
one day it was gone. So, here we are.

(30:52):
Yeah. Thinking back on it, I wouldn't have done that. I mean,
you got one now, so it doesn't matter.
But yeah, the games, I don't see they're expensive, but. Oh,
they're expensive. Get out of here.
Well, it depends on which one you're getting. Oh, well, I was just thinking
of a virtual fighter, virtual cop.
I think they're like 30, 40 bucks. I mean, that's quite a bit of money.

(31:15):
You know how much chicken you can get with $30? Probably a couple of them.
Probably a couple of them. And then we get that 12 piece. Yeah.
When we get that 12 piece and the three, four biscuits.
Make sure they're not dry, please. Yes.
But yeah, I mean, you can get repros for a good price for sure.
About $30, $40 for repros.

(31:35):
And even still, if you get repros of a game that's pretty up there,
like Panzer Dragoon, you're still looking at paying $70, $80 for it. For them, yeah.
Okay, so let me take that back. Maybe you're paying like $70,
$80 for the actual case, complete in box, all the rest of that good stuff.
But if you're looking for a repro, you're probably looking at $50, $60.

(31:57):
If that. that maybe even more for the original but but yeah there's there are games that i've seen,
like again x-men versus street fighter that's like over a hundred dollars for the saturn,
it's like over 180 bucks that's crazy holy cow what i mean it's a good game
i'll take it back i did pay 80 bucks for ncaa 14 before you did two years ago

(32:21):
you you i finally broke down you He broke down and did it.
I had stayed away for like nine years. Then all of a sudden I was like,
what? I want to play that again. I mean, it's a good game.
And then as soon as I got it, then reports started coming out.
Oh, we're making another college football game.
Yeah. It took them, what, four years to get that done? I mean,
I'm glad they did because that game is great. The game is phenomenal.

(32:43):
I'm first Madden-esque game that I've played in a while that I'm having a great
time with. Glad you enjoy it.
But yeah the saturn's still a viable system in
my mind i think again i don't think it got
its fair shake because of the internal struggles that are right and
it didn't last long i don't want to say two years three years that is
that isn't we're done providing the u.s with this thing that

(33:05):
is insane i'm trying to think if i
played any race well we have daytona usa yeah and
then virtual cop virtual fighter but i didn't really play any
did i no there's one game called d
that i played i remember you were always talking
about that but we never played it so i remember you're talking
about it look i looked on youtube and i guess

(33:27):
it's not really a playable game it's more cut scene base
from what i've seen but it
was a weird game well i mean was it didn't i
know the meg was the mega drive or was the sega cd it was sega cd which i mean
we're regressing a bit but the sega cd was the one that did the home motion

(33:47):
picture video games where they were like cut scenes and then there were some
things that you would do gameplay wise and then you go to another cut scene
kind of like similar to playing middle gear solid 4.
That was actually a knock to Metal Gear Solid 4. That was a comparison, but it was also a knock.
Because damn it, that game could have been so much better. I mean,

(34:10):
great game though, but that could have been so much better.
Nine hours of freaking cut scenes.
Get out of here. It's a good background. It is. Yeah, it is. It is.
All right. So anything else on the Sega Saturn?
No, other than it didn't get its fair shake. and, you know, all the other stuff that's been going on.
So we're now falling from grace here. We are falling from the heavens.

(34:35):
So the Sega Dreamcast? Sorry, cut you off. No, no, no, you're good.
I'm just saying we're falling from the heavens and we're about halfway to Earth.
So this is the final, for now anyway, manufactured console by Sega.
The Sega Dreamcast was released in Japan on November 27th, 1998.
1998, it came to North America, September 9th, 1999.

(35:00):
Like I said, always remember the 9-9-99 thing. I mean, that was like everywhere you went.
I do remember that, yeah. Then in Europe, it was released October 14th in 1999.
The release or the launch titles for the Dreamcast. Sonic Adventure, baby!
For Soul Calibur. Yep. Powerstone. Powerstone was good, too.

(35:25):
Mortal Kombat Gold, Sonic Adventure, Expendable, Blue Stinger,
Trickstyle, Hydro Thunder,
Tokyo Extreme Racer.
Okay, that was your jam. Yes, Sega Sports, Flag to Flag, Monaco Grand Prix,

(35:49):
Pin Pin, Felician, what?
What is it? Tri-Trocellion. I think you're right. I think you're right.
Then we have TNN, Motorsports Hardcore Heat.
Okay. House of the Dead 2, Air Force Delta, Arrow Wings, Sega Sports, NFL 2K. Yes.

(36:12):
NFL Blitz 2000, and then Ready to Rumble Boxing.
All those, there's a lot of them in there are pretty solid ones.
Ones a lot of them in there are pretty solid i had a lot of a lot of a lot of time with you playing,
ready to rumble and sonic adventure do we
do we have sonic adventure yeah we did we did did we we acquired it through

(36:37):
means that we shouldn't have but we did i remember ready to rumble but i don't
think we got that to like way later way later yeah way later did we ever get
nfl too we We had to, because I'm sure Dad would have picked it up.
We rented Blitz. Are you talking about Blitz or 2K? 2K. Yeah,
Dad, that was the first game we got was NFL 2K.
NFL 2K, yep. NFL 2K and NBA 2K.

(37:01):
Okay. Because I don't think NBA
came out at the same time, but I know shortly after we got NBA as well.
Yeah, I remember Dad came out. I remember that. He came home with it,
and he was like, I got something. And I'm like, oh, what's this?
And then you go, oh, it's a new game system. I'm putting it in my room.
And I'm like, all right, well, I guess it's in his room now. oh my god we
we had the 64 so it was all good it was

(37:22):
all good we had the 64 we had
some pretty good pretty good bangers on that one you know as much as i give
donkey kong diddy kong crap diddy kong racer was fun oh my gentle jesus like
yes diddy kong racing the soundtrack alone in that That game was amazing.

(37:44):
I'm like, you know, like, I mean, and again, I'm getting a little off topic,
but I'm going to do this anyway.
So, like, when you did the adventure thing, like, you had this whole world that
you drove in and all the rest.
Like, kind of very similar to the hub for Mario 64.
Okay. Yeah, very similar to the hub. Remember, you had to, like,
drive to certain places and stuff like that.

(38:05):
And if you had this many, like, coins or something, you can go into that area.
Then you had to race and beat some dinosaur bad guy or something like that if that was it I don't know,
but yeah that game was ahead of it's guys darn
time for sure that was a good game Tim Bear that's who I picked the tiger I

(38:25):
liked him that was my boy I don't know who I picked I think you picked Diddy
you were a Diddy guy through and through if I remember correctly pause us with us.
Why are we pausing because we're talking
about one separate ditty we're not talking about the other
one oh my

(38:47):
gosh where did i see that uh they had
to say something i'd be like pause oh i think it was jay pharaoh oh jay pharaoh
he was doing something did you want that one no you can go ahead and take it
i think it was doing impressions or something we were talking about beer and
we are of age to drink beer you could look at us and be like these guys aren't of age or at least me,

(39:09):
brother on the other hand here oh my gosh we've got
a full goatee a bird and a
fro when he grows it my fro all
right back to the dreamcast yeah solid
so that was solid lineup coming out very solid i believe ready to rumble was
also on playstation or in 64 if i'm not mistaken had it been playstation ready

(39:34):
to rumble yeah i think it was on both well on all three it made it to 64 let's
see but yeah i remember we played a lot of sonic adventure together,
more me watching a lot of you play it from the most part you know what you're
right it was on a 64 holy cow we played i remember playing on all three systems
because i remember one time remember one time we we had played it on the dreamcast

(39:56):
and i know like knockout kings came out.
And that was on playstation that was also
on n64 too and i remember you're
like oh ready to rumble on playstation and i remember i gave you
shit for it because i was like why would you rent this when we've already played
it on the dreamcast already and it was
i'll tell you it was not the greatest ran game for sure but yeah on the playstation

(40:20):
it was horrible what the heck yeah it was it was bad i think that was kind of
like the first time we actually seen a difference in video games or at least
for me it was i was like because it didn't feel right it didn't god it's been so long,
probably didn't run as smooth no it didn't it didn't even look as smooth either i was like,
that's like it was like playing in again i

(40:41):
love i love ps2 madden ps2 madden will always
be it but if you compare ps2 madden to
original xbox madden it is night and day original xbox man looks so much better
but you know we were playstation fanboys so we'll play the grainy the grainy
graphics and win super bowls as opposed to actually being able to see what we're
playing with then eventually i was like all right yeah and then the xbox man is probably the best one,

(41:06):
i thought it was like that handful of games like certain for me playstation
games kind of felt darker than xbox a little lighter yeah more live less saturation
for sure well yeah so we had sonic adventure.
Was some other games but there was a dip remember there was a demo crazy demo

(41:27):
i just purchased it on steam the other day did you i just purchased i just bought
a elite series 2 controller,
and so i was like oh yeah i can go ahead and play the games i can actually play
on controller now instead of doing mouse keyboard stuff right and then i saw
i have like a i had 50 on my account i was like man i haven't even spent this
yet let me go see what's up so i bought under night and And then I bought, saw Crazy Taxi.

(41:51):
It only was like four bucks. I was like, that's a no-brainer.
That's a no-brainer. So I got that. So now I got like all the Sega selection
on my Steam. I got Jet Set Radio.
Also a great game. Jet Set Radio, Crazy Taxi, and Sonic Adventure.
Sonic Adventure. I just need Sonic Adventure 2 now. That's probably on Steam

(42:11):
somewhere, but it's neither here nor there.
But yeah, what else did we play? We played Crazy Taxi.
Dreamcast. So I'm sure we played football games on that. Yeah, we played NFL 2K.
Oh, bad thing. We only have one controller. We had one controller to start out.
All right. Was this one? No, because I think they started separating controllers during the N64?

(42:38):
Or did they always include one? They included one. They always included one.
I know there was a time period they started having the controller not included.
Oh, well, they're terrible for doing that.
Was it the Dreamcast? Maybe not. No, I think most systems had a controller.
Why do I feel like there was a system that did not include a controller?

(43:00):
I don't know. Yeah, we only had one controller at that time.
That was kind of stupid, but that's how things worked. Maybe it was the whole
where they used to come with two controllers and they went down to one.
That's what I'm probably thinking of. Yeah, because I remember the Super Nintendo
one came with two. Sega Genesis only came with one.
The the original nintendo came

(43:21):
with one i think but i
mean i think you had to buy like a certain pack though i think
they still sold separate ones that they came with two controllers
and stuff like that i remember getting a super nintendo and
we had two controllers that came with it you know
then 64 i know came with one because i remember we had
gotten an extra an extra controller there was three of us and only two controllers

(43:45):
i don't know what mom and dad were thinking and then when they hear this podcast
they're gonna be like oh what we were thinking was how the hell we're gonna
be paying our bills after all this stuff you dirtbag you better be satisfied
i was i was thanks mom and dad i appreciate it i love you both.
They definitely took care of me this last week, for sure. I was sick as a dog.

(44:07):
But yeah, so we only had one controller at that time, so we were always watching
each other play. Well, we were watching you play, more or less, than anything.
So speaking of the price, the Dreamcast was released with a $200 price tag.
Again, a lot cheaper than the Neo Geo, but much more superior than the Neo Geo.
They sold 9.13 million

(44:30):
units it was discontinued
worldwide march 31st 2001 it's
another console that did not really last long and you want to know why was it
a power struggle no well i mean obviously that was probably the thing too but

(44:51):
the reason behind it is from what the end of what What Sega Genesis did,
the whole life cycle of what Sega Saturn was going through in the West, again,
not very much marketing.
And then what Sega Saturn was going through, then this is where EA was like, I don't know.

(45:13):
And EA was the sports thing at the time. Yes.
And Sega was the sports system at that time.
If you don't if you're not going to get the big hitters on
there and you've already you've already put put yourself
in a hole in in more than one way and that was it that was a wrap but i'll tell

(45:35):
you what though that system came out and it was way ahead of its time oh yeah
it was way ahead of its time i would agree that that system i forgot what they
called it the device that went It went into the controller.
Oh, the VMU. The VMU, yes. The VMU.
I think, I had it for one, well, I guess it also acted as a memory card.
But it had a screen on it. I don't think it showed much info. Mm-mm.

(45:59):
But I thought that was cool. Yeah. You can, like, take care of your little shows. Yeah.
Yeah, that was, that was, that was, I mean, again, way ahead of its time.
I don't think, I don't think the Dreamcast was appreciated for what it was.
No. every arcade game was like people were probably still mad about the Saturn

(46:20):
so they were like what is this yeah and every arcade that was ported over there was,
literally damn near the arcade game at this point they came off the Naomi system which,
most arcade games were doing at that time obviously it's a little bit less powerful
just because it's a smaller chipset that you're using but that I mean you just

(46:42):
couldn't go wrong with the Dreamcast You couldn't, but it was still competing with the PlayStation,
still competing with the original Xbox at that point, because that came out
two years later, but that was near the end of the cycle.
Wait, no, it came out a year later, which, no, two years, which was the end
of the life cycle. Mm-hmm.
Speaking of life cycles, just to talk about the PS2, it was in production from 2000 to 2013.

(47:09):
Jesus Christ. 13 years. I mean, probably one of the best, I mean,
I think it's the best-selling system out there. Yes.
And PS2 was where it was at. I mean, it was like, what, 20, 30-plus thousand
games that came out? Mm-hmm.
And those games were not going to finish, well, no, I guess not finish.
But I was just going to say, like, with the PS2, I mean, and I say this for

(47:34):
the Dreamcast and the Saturn, too.
I believe, especially the Dreamcast, I believe the Dreamcast and PS2 in correlation
of the two, and this is just my opinion, they had some love in those games.
They did. They did. Look at another running back. Let him get rained on. He'll be all right.
Just kidding. but yeah i and i

(47:57):
think that's that's the correlation of those two games they had some
love now original xbox had some love in their games too there was
there was a lot of systems out there that that had some great
potentials untapped potential untapped potential but the dreamcast i believe
was one that just didn't get a fair shake same with saturn but there was just

(48:17):
too much stuff going on yeah there was just too much stuff sega couldn't deal
sega couldn't handle they couldn't keep the title of being the sports console,
and the rest was history I think when they lost that title it was over with that's when we hit earth,
that's yeah that's when we hit it and I mean the Dreamcast was,

(48:43):
where it's at because I enjoyed that system that was probably one of my favorites now now,
other words i mean we're wrapping up the dreamcast i mean there's really not
much to talk about because i wasn't out for a while no but a lot of games they
did have they had a lot of ports from.
What what game the ps2 and and i guess what was the other system that was out at that time,

(49:09):
ps2 i think um no was it the ps2 or the ps1 99
2000 2001 oh we
don't know the ps2 and the original xbox because i mean it's still they still
made games they just didn't have the protection for the systems yes but yeah
they were still getting ports and everything like that but a lot of the ports
just weren't that good well you had dino crisis that came over one of the best

(49:30):
like capcom resident evil dinosaur horror games and didn't play well at all
didn't look well either i never,
well i probably did played in the arcade but never
on the consoles okay yeah it
didn't look well I mean which you would
think was something that's a bit more powerful that it would look

(49:51):
well it didn't yeah it didn't at all so it
just it just lacked everywhere at that point so I
can see where that came from but all that glazing all that goddamn glazing man
just ruined that system ruined that company and then now we know it is today
Sega the software company Super X still makes good games I mean look at look

(50:11):
at Yakuza Yakuza is a great series look at they're still So coming out with Sonic games,
the last two Sonic games, last three Sonic games actually they came out with
were actually pretty good.
I don't count Sonic Forces, so anyone that's a big Sonic fan, I'm sorry.
Sonic Forces, all I have to do is hold the boost button and I'm good. You're good.
That's all I have to do in most of the levels there. You had Sonic Mania,

(50:33):
which was really good, which again starts Sonic Mania, if you did not know,
with a whole new timeline.
Did not know. I stopped playing Sonic after, let's see.
We have sonic and knuckles what came after that
that was actually that was actually technically sonic 3 okay
really i thought they had sonic they so they had

(50:54):
okay so did you so you know
they came out with the sonic origins plus collection just a little just a couple
summers ago right no okay so they came out with that so it's sonic 1 sonic 2
sonic 3 and knuckles and then it was sonic cd so okay so sonic and knuckles
had its own separate cartridge right Yeah, I remember that I remember having that too.

(51:17):
Yeah, and then you had Sonic 3 Well Sonic 3 was actually a Sonic and Knuckles
the only reason why they had a separate cartridge was because Sega had a sponsorship with ramen and.
They had a sponsorship with set with ramen so they split the
game yeah so they were i think they
were waiting on the finalization of the sponsorship or something if

(51:37):
i'm not if i remember correctly so they had finished the production of sonic
3 and then they were ready to get that out or they were ready to add the sonic
and knuckles portion and they were like no we need this out now because now
that we've got this finalized we want this out for the sponsorship and everything so So,
it's not actually two separate games. It's actually one huge game.

(51:59):
Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
A little known fact to find out about stupid stuff like that.
Then they're like, let's just do this regularly. Mm-hmm. We have the game,
chop it up, have it make no sense.
Right. Right. Because it's like, wait a minute, what?
But, yeah. So, that's that. But, yeah. Sonic Mania is actually sort of the Neo timeline.

(52:22):
Line okay and sonic mania and sonic forces
actually go together they actually came out not too
far apart from one another i think it was like maybe a couple
months or something like that but yeah sonic mania great
that's good to know sonic plus origins great
sonic frontiers great they they they're
sonic is stepping up their game they're not as bad

(52:44):
as they used to be i think sonic forces was like the last bad one
but now you got shadow shadow cross
generations now any of you did you play sonic generations no i did not okay
so it's basically a remake of sonic generations better graphics blah blah but
they're just now adding a shadow storyline to it interesting yeah it's actually
pretty cool i like i like both i like both sonic and shadow but i do like the,

(53:07):
i do like that they're remaking that game because that game was amazing soundtrack
i mean had games i had soundtracks from all the other games and stuff like that
but it was it was a good game It was a well-built game for Sega.
But, I mean, yeah, I don't know if it's a software company. Right.
I mean, it is what it is. But now...
Was going to talk to you about earlier and i was like i'll just wait for the

(53:28):
podcast there's a third party sega machine that is that is slated to come out
soon it's called the super sega,
oh i think you heard about that yeah yeah mr mr rgt 80s 85.
But they were he wasn't or he stated they weren't sure if
they could use the super sega portion or something no they

(53:49):
couldn't the the 32x the 32x portion
you had to okay you had to actually use the
32x itself somehow but i mean
i don't know how it ties into the system itself which doesn't
make sense yeah right that's right that's what
it was they left the 32x from that's right
yeah so i mean i don't know 32x again

(54:10):
that was all like the motion picture thing
it was just enhance things right yeah it wasn't really or
optimize things yeah but i
mean not i mean you got to be
an artist to see that you know there's a
few games that i played i didn't really notice a difference but
so yeah now i got this whole

(54:32):
thing coming out what do you think about this super sega i was
interested i was trying to remember did it include all the
games no no i don't think it
does and you can they they said that you can use the physical copies of whatever
system that it's on there that you can use it with so it doesn't come with games

(54:52):
but it will come with every port that you can use for all the sega.
Okay games so like the sg 1000 and the mega drive all the rest of that good
stuff so So, how I feel about it? No.
No. I think it's just a money grab. I think it's not going to be. If it hits, it hits.

(55:18):
I've got no problems with that. I just don't think the quality is going to be
great. I can see that. You've got so many different components on this thing.
Especially with most of them being optimized to work on a CRT TV. Mm-hmm.
They said something about if it being FPGA. I don't know what that actually means.
Never heard of it. Yeah. I'll have to go down the rabbit hole for that one.

(55:39):
Yeah, let me look that up. But anyway, go ahead. I'm listening.
Oh, no. I'm just curious.
I just watched that portion of what he talked about the game.
I didn't really dive into what the system was, but that you could just play all the games.
In FPGA, it's a field programmable gate array, which is...

(56:01):
So field programmable gate arrays are integrated circuits often sold off the shelf.
They're referred as field programmable because they provide customers the ability
to reconfigure the hardware to meet specific use case requirements after the
manufacturing process.

(56:22):
I kind of have an idea but i don't at the same time it's making me think what is it retro,
tink this is
kind of one of those things where i guess you
know modernized retro gaming yeah a
retro tink which one the 4k

(56:44):
one where it can optimize whatever console
you plug into to it optimize it for
whatever tv that you have so it presents it in
that true form also kind of like
a converter in a sense yeah okay that makes sense $750 price tag yeah yeah not

(57:05):
doing that but but yeah super sega nope hard no he's not sold not sold i mean
if i'm gonna do that i might as well find something.
I mean, even though basically it is a mod, I'm gonna find something that,
you know, I can maybe get a Sega Saturn or something like that,
use an SSD or an HDD, put the games on there, and then put like a little...

(57:32):
Say a chip but i know you got to change the lens out something i think the
the dreamcast is like that where you change the lens out you
put something else in there and it has an sd slot
you put the sd card in the sd card has all the games and
the program and everything like that for a dreamcast it's a
real easy it's a real easy do do it yourself that's

(57:53):
something i've been trying to do i was i was trying to look into seeing if playstation
2 has that and it has something similar too so i'm
gonna probably try to look into doing something like that so my
library is getting big but i mean there's
just some systems that i have i'd just rather just get
games like that way for you know what i mean instead of
having to track them all down like ps4 ps5 like i'm still buying a bunch of

(58:15):
games for that right because those are relevant things yeah i don't have an
original xbox but i have some original xbox games we all know that you can burn
discs for that so i mean you probably find something or some some little chip
or something i can put it in
there solder it in bam call it a day yeah you know
i mean yeah call me cheap call me like oh you're

(58:36):
not doing it right you're not doing it right that's fine i'm gonna have
to do it right but i gotta do it a way where it's gonna be affordable for me
right you know you got all that money to go ahead and spend 30 40 a pop 20 a
pop 9.99 here five dollars there be my guess i mean i've been in that boat and
i'm just starting to get to a point where it's like still you know Call it a day. Yeah.

(58:59):
Yeah. I mean, there's one specific collection I want to get as a PlayStation
collection, but I think right now with the modern systems at the moment,
I think that's what I'm going to do. Everything else.
I'm just going to probably try to find some way to, I wouldn't say pirate.
But however you want to code it. Yeah. Cause I ain't calling you for dinner. So yeah,

(59:24):
Yeah, I think that'd probably be the best way to do it. Save money.
Live better. Walmart. That's a good way to do it.
Oh, my God. Well, yeah, do you have any... I mean, the Super Sega.
So what was your take on that? Was that something you'd get?
I'll have to look at it again. Like I said, I was only introduced to it by RGTV,

(59:45):
a Washington's episode.
God, so many plugs that were given out. We need to stop doing that.
Yeah, well, I mean, shoot. Shoot, like, we don't even, I need to get back on
my streaming and I'll start plugging myself in there. There you go.
But, I mean, you know, we give, I mean, I know we give out these plugs and we
don't, I mean, obviously we're not paid to do this by any means.
But, you know, people that do YouTube and stuff like that.

(01:00:06):
We respect what they do. Yeah, they're honest people. Like, you know,
they work hard. I like putting out there.
I like putting their stuff out there. You can go ahead and check them out.
Check them out, as you know.
Because, I mean, you're checking us out. So, I mean, obviously,
obviously we're doing something right.
We appreciate you listeners. thank you for sticking with this but no
i'll go down check it out again because you know it

(01:00:26):
perked my ears maybe when i looked like hey what is this yeah no
i'm like if you can't have everything on it
we can't give you everything we can give you
this we'll give you this we'll let you play the dreamcast but
the other inferior 32x you'll just need a
32x for itself it's like well then
why am i supposed to get this then like it's supposed you saying this is

(01:00:47):
an all-encompassing little little thing that i need to use now
i understand right but i'm not gonna have it's
not burger king i can't have everything my way i can't but
i mean you're gonna advertise this but then all of a sudden you
just put this disclaimer like oh this this won't work
you'll have to have its own thing but everything else does right i mean well

(01:01:08):
that's how i felt about college football 25 but what do you mean oh there was
a certain thing that they weren't including that 2014 had so oh i mean that's
a different story. Yeah, that is a different story, but.
That's just one of those things. But thank you guys for listening.

(01:01:28):
Be on the lookout for the next episode. And again, thank you for listening to
us talk about Sega Dreamcast, Sega Saturn, and see you guys on the next episode. Deuces.