October 28, 2024 • 36 mins
While overcoming mental and physical setbacks, author Lauren Ling Brown turned to writing to get through one of the toughest times in her life. In the latest edition of Shelf Life, Lauren discusses her debut novel and October pick for Reese’s Book Club, “Society of Lies.” She talks lessons of perseverance in times of doubt and believing in your ideas—how they come to life just might surprise you.
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hey Bessies, Hello Sunshine. Today on the bright Side, it's
time for another edition of shelf Life. We're joined by
author Lauren Lingk Brown, whose debut novel, Society of Lies,
is the October pick for Reese's Book Club. It's Monday,
October twenty eighth. I'm Danielle Robe.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
And I'm Smoane Voice, and this is the bright Side
from Hello Sunshine, a daily show where we come together
to share women's stories, laugh, learn and brighten your day.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
On My Mind Monday is brought to you by Missus
Meyers Clean Day, inspired by the goodness of the garden.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
All right, chall you know what time it is. It
is On my Mind Monday, kicking off the week with
a good source of inspiration and motivation. Oh yeah, okay,
what's inspiring you today?
Speaker 1 (00:44):
All right?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Well, I recently came across an article in the Atlantic
about the power of music, and you know, I'm like
all over that. And it's written by one of our
favorite voices, Arthur C. Brooks, and he explains how music
is quote one of the greatest ways to understand life
more deeply. He cites studies that show how our brains
(01:05):
are actually built to enjoy music and how music can
also be used to help us heal.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
I've actually heard so many stories about how music helps people,
specifically in the hospital. Arthur C. Brooks is sort of
known as one of the grandfathers of happiness. Is there
a specific genre of music that elicits the most happiness?
Speaker 2 (01:24):
So? To be fair, he says that the research findings
are inconclusive on that particular point. But he says that
there was one study that found that the world's happiest
song is actually I want you to guess what's the
happiest song?
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Happy by Pharrell? That's what I was thinking too, Right,
It's gotta be a ceeviee Wonder song or got this feeling?
Uh can't sound the feeling?
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (01:46):
Yes, justin Timberlake.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Okay, so the world's happiest song is actually Good Vibrations
by the Beach Boys.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
WHOA. I kind of get that.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
I feel like we need an update on that one though.
There's been a lot of time, a lot of music
that's passed.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
And then I like that you're wanting to look at
the scientific research behind this. I could be updated. When
was the last study done? What year? Yeah? Exactly? Yeah?
What song makes you the happiest. Hmm okay. I think
a lot of the songs that make me the happiest
are tied to memories. So like in my house growing up,
or in my dad's car, we would listen to a
(02:21):
lot of Elvis, a lot of Tina Turner, My mom
loves Carol King like, kind of the oldies, Stevie Wonder.
They make me really happy. Oh that's so cute. I
love that. How about you mind changes all the time?
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Yeah, I think there's something to what you're saying that
the songs that are tied to these core formative memories
are often the ones that shift our mood in the
most impactful way.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
You also love a Chapel Roone bop?
Speaker 2 (02:47):
I am. I am so deep into Chapel Roone at
the moment. I was at my friend Donovan's house the
other day and I hadn't seen it in a while
and found out that he's equally obsessed with Chaperone. We
really spend an hour, like on Spotify just listening to
all of her songs, dissecting everything, discussing why she is
the voice of our generation.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
So I am obsessed. I just saw the Pharrell Lego
movie m H and I realized how many of his beats,
not even his songs, have made people happy, Like his
song Happy was the culmination of it all.
Speaker 3 (03:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Yeah, Do you have a sad girl song? Like a
song that you put on when you're in your feels?
Speaker 4 (03:25):
Oh my god?
Speaker 1 (03:26):
Who is it? Well, you're gonna love this song because
you love this play. But if you want me to
cry on command, if you put on for Good from Wicked,
I'm a mess. That's so sweet. Yeah, sad girl for real.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
I'm gonna have to agree that one of my favorite
sad girl music choices is musical theater, especially like Tic
Tick Boom or Rent. Yeah, those are the songs that
get me in my feels. It's a great one, and
there is something to this. The article says that not
only can sad music soothe you, but research have also
(04:00):
found that it can help you understand your feelings and
sit with them and find meaning in them.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
It can help you understand your feelings. That's really cool.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
Well, it makes sense, right, especially if you're listening to
an emotionally evocative song. An incredible musician is able to
use music as a conduit for emotion. Yeah, you know,
so it makes sense. You're able to tap into whatever
emotional state they were in when they were writing it.
Adele is a great example of that.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
Oh yeah, Celine Dion, all those big vocalists.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
One last thing I want to leave everyone with. From
this article, Arthur C. Brooks listed out some ways that
we can use music to heighten our emotional experiences and
better understand ourselves. So one strategy that he notes is
decide what you want from your music. So he says,
if you want to use music as a way to
bond socially, listen with friends, like maybe you have a
(04:49):
chapel Ron listening party with your friends. If you want
to use it as a means of intensifying your emotions,
listen by yourself. And then if you want both, go
to a concert with friends. That's an amalgamation of them all.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Going to a concert with friends is one of the
best experiences in life. It doesn't get any better than that.
So music and storytelling share a common thread. They both
have the power to transport us, to evoke emotion and
connect us to something deeper.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
You know.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
Just as a song can tell a story through rhythm
and melody, a great book can weave a tale that
stays with you long after you've finished reading. I know
if you're listening to this, there's books that you're thinking
about right now, books that have stayed with you. And
our guest today has been mastering her love of storytelling
for the past decade. Lauren Ling Brown is the author
(05:38):
of Society of Lies, the October pick for Reese's Book
Club and a USA Today bestseller. Society of Lies is
Lauren's debut novel. Prior to publishing it, she worked as
an editor in TV, film, documentaries and commercials, and she
had nearly given up on writing when she decided to
pen Society of Lies. The idea for the novel actually
(05:59):
started as a screenplay that she'd written about a decade earlier,
and over the pandemic, as Lauren was in what she
calls a low point in her life, she rediscovered her
love for writing, and she actually wrote three novels, Society
of Lies among them.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
The novel is actually a super suspenseful murder mystery that
follows two biracial sisters, Maya and Naomi, as they navigate
dark academia and the underground world of secret societies at Princeton.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
I love anything about secret societies. There's so much mystery there.
Laura Ling Brown's book is particularly delicious. Stay with us,
We'll be right back after the break. Thanks to our
partners at missus Myers, you can learn a lot about
a person by their dish soap. Missus Meyers's collection of
household products are inspired by the garden and pack a
(06:47):
punch against dirt and grime. Visit missus meyers dot com.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Welcome to the bright Side, Lauren, Thank you, thanks so
much for having me.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
We're so happy to have you. Simone and I both
love any book about a secret society. Oh yeah, oh yeah,
I'm all in. You know it's a quick win. But
this is your debut novel, Society of Lies. It's the
October pick for Reese's Book Club, and I have to say,
I think it's pretty rare for a debut book to
(07:27):
have such a long journey.
Speaker 4 (07:28):
Oh you mean the ten years.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Ten years in the making. After all of that time
and persistence and passion, how does it feel to finally
see your story celebrated on a Reese's book Club stage
and beyond?
Speaker 3 (07:46):
It feels like this dream that was so far off
that I never thought would actually be here is actually
coming true, and Reese has been a role model for
me growing up, and so it's just totally wild, all
the emotion. It was just, you know, one of those
things that you think, oh, that would be incredible if
that happened someday. But I'm just really grateful.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
We can tell. But it's it's so deserving. The book
is awesome, and we noticed a recognizable name on the
book cover. There's an endorsement from Courtney Cox. Simone and
I both need to understand how this came about.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
Well, in film school, I met someone who is now
a dear friend named Alex Jackson, and she is close
with Courtney and we all worked on a film together
where I edited, Alex directed, and Courtney was the executive producer.
Speaker 4 (08:39):
And so.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
Alex just offered to send my book to her, show
it to her, being like, I don't know if she's
going to read it, but maybe, and then she read
it and loved it and offered to blurb, which was
so kind of her.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Blurbs really help, especially from notable names on a book,
especially as a debut.
Speaker 4 (09:00):
Yeah, it was just really kind of her to do
that generous.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
So Lauren, at its core, Society of Lies is a
murder mystery that's set in the world of secret societies
at Princeton. What was it about this particular story and
setting that you just couldn't shake.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
I think just remembering who I was when I was
at age eighteen to twenty two and stepping off the
train and I'm from California, I'm from northern California, and
then stepping off the train in this beautiful East Coast
gothic campus. It was just incredible, such a culture shock,
but also an incredible experience over four years and really
(09:41):
something that had a big impact on me. So I've
been returning to this story over and over again, and
that's sort of the ten years that we were talking
about earlier.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
So can you set the record straight for me? Are
there secret societies at Princeton? Is my friend lying to me?
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Well, the major There aren't really many secret societies at Princeton.
Really everything revolves around the eating clubs, and there's about
eleven eating clubs. Some of them are signing and some
are bicker, meaning you have to rush, you have to
apply to get in.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Is this like a sorority fraternity? Like what's an eating club? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (10:17):
Yeah, I know, it's a weird word. My partner thought
it was like an eating competition club.
Speaker 1 (10:22):
I think of it's like a dinner table where it's like, Okay,
this is who you're having dinner with in the cafeteria.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Well, yeah, it is kind of like that.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
They're these historic mansions, right that are independent of the
school on a street near campus, and you do eat there,
you have your your meals there, and it's for upper
classmen and at night they clear all the tables out
and have parties with DJs, and it's where most of
(10:51):
like seventy percent I think of the students are in
an eating club.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
Were you in one?
Speaker 4 (10:57):
I was? Which one are you in? I was in Coe?
Speaker 1 (11:01):
What does that mean? What do you eat in the
Cottage Club?
Speaker 2 (11:04):
And how do you get in? Like what is the
initiation process?
Speaker 3 (11:07):
Okay, so the food varies, but it's all really good.
We have who's cooking, They have chefs and it was
a lot of Southern comfort food at Cottage, really delicious.
And I don't know, Cottage just kind of has athletes
in it. I played soccer freshman year, so the soccer
team was in it.
Speaker 4 (11:29):
Cool.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
Yeah, what were the people like?
Speaker 3 (11:32):
Well, because it's about seventy percent of Princeton, you know undergrads.
It really is similar to the people who are in
your classes.
Speaker 4 (11:41):
So it's these high achieving.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Students, and it's not all super wealthy people. It's everyone
who's at Princeton. But the eating clubs each had their
own personality, their own identity, so it really varies by
eating club.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
I think this is a story about identity, about belonging,
about the upper crost of society. And you've said that
this story really evolved over time. You had been sitting
with it for a long time. And when it comes
to a murder mystery, you've got to fit all these pieces,
these puzzle pieces together.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
What is the secret to writing the perfect murder mystery?
Speaker 3 (12:24):
I don't know if I know the secret turning the
perfect mystery, because it took me a lot of dress
to get to this one, and I still don't think
it's perfect by any means. But uh, I guess ten
years ago I wrote it as a screenplay because I
was just interested in this idea of an outsider at
Princeton getting involved in a secret society and dealing with
(12:45):
this moral dilemma, like is she going to take a
golden ticket that promises her the life of her dreams,
and will she stay even when she learns that the
secret society is her someone else. So that's the question
that I thought of when I wrote that screenplay and
then abandoned that idea and wrote this as a novel
(13:09):
over the pandemic. It was really just having that theme.
I guess that core idea in mind as the mystery
came to be as I did different drafts and crafted
the story.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
I guess there's some intriguing parallels between your own story
and the book. Both of you are navigating life at Princeton.
What was it specifically about your own experiences that really
sparked the idea of the murder mystery being on campus
at Princeton. Hm.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
I think I.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
Drew from my experience as a multiracial Black and Chinese
young woman throughout my entire life, so from growing up
in a mostly white high school in northern California, also
at Princeton, navigating different spaces. I was also in BAC,
like Naomi, the younger sister, the Black Arts Company, which
(14:05):
is this great dance group. And then I also drew
from my life after Princeton, working in post production and
also oftentimes being the only woman or person of color.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
Simone and I were actually just talking before the interview
that so many of the guests we've had on, particularly
authors that have mixed identity points, really make that a
focal point of their writing, and it seems like everyone's
trying to figure out what it means themselves, and the
writing is part of that process. You're nodding your head, Yeah, totally,
(14:39):
what do you think it is?
Speaker 3 (14:41):
I think for me, so, I have been a big
journaler for my whole life.
Speaker 4 (14:45):
Since I was a kid.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
I always kept so many journals, and I would write
down just the most emotional things that happened. So whether
it was a breakup or someone cutting me in line
at the grocery store, it was just little things that
happened during the day. And I like to go back
to those journals entries and sort of use them in
my writing as a way to make give it power
(15:08):
and just find something good, use them for something good.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Well, I think there's a lot of truth to what
you're saying, Danielle. It is really interesting that this theme
keeps coming up, not just you know, on our show,
but in Reese's book Club, Like these stories about mixed
race characters are being celebrated and elevated and amplified. And
I'm not an author, but I am someone who has
lived experience as a biracial woman. And I think the
(15:34):
reason why these characters are so compelling is because they
exist in the gray area and the complexity and there's
just so much nuance to this experience.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Yeah, I would agree with that, and I just want
to center more stories around our experiences and show that,
I don't know, we're not just one note that there's
so much nuance and complexity.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Yeah, there's something really compelling about a character who's like
straddling two worlds, which is exactly what the characters in
this book are going through.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
Can I ask you one more question about identity? What
do you think you were specifically trying to sift through personally?
Speaker 4 (16:18):
M good, That is such a good question.
Speaker 1 (16:21):
Hmmm.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
I think for me, just the key thing about this
character Maya, the older sister, is that she wants to
belong and trying to figure out like in what way
she's conforming to this world versus rejecting it. And then
the younger sister, Naomi, who's more secure, She's confident in
her identity and loves everything that makes her who she is,
(16:47):
and so she is, you know, the positive version of
this multiracial experience.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
I think that is really interesting. I want to touch
on the sister dynamic because it's a huge part of
the plot. You said that this book improved your relationship
with your sister personally, how so.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
Yeah, So my sister is four years younger than me,
and we were very close growing up in high school
before that, but then when I went to college and
she went to a different school, and then we started
our careers, we were just living in different cities, not
communicating in the best way. I'm the older sister, so
I'm always giving advice when it's not always needed.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
It's like you're a parent sister. Yes, I'm the same,
I get it.
Speaker 4 (17:32):
I try not to.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
But then now that we're in our thirties, and when
I was writing this book over the pandemic, going through
a really hard time in my life, like a bad
breakup and also different surgeries, she was really there for me.
And I think she got to know me through this
writing too, because I would read chapters to her. And
(17:54):
now she's reading the finished version of Society of Lives
and she called me saying that she really liked it
and like got more insight into my experience, I guess.
And we just had a really nice moment talking about that,
and it really meant a lot to me.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
Sounds like she almost flipped the script on you during
that time, like she became the caretaker a little and
it changed things.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
Yeah, definitely, I want to circle back to this theme
of belonging because it really feels like an engine throughout
this story that drives the characters forward. You've said that
your book is based on the question how far would
you go to belong? How much of yourself do you
see in Maya? How much of yourself do you see
(18:38):
in Naomi? And as you were writing this, what did
this book bring up for you in terms of how
far you went to try to fit in?
Speaker 4 (18:48):
Yeah, that's a good question.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
So Maya I see as who I was in high school,
this very guarded, shy, bookish kid who didn't feel like
she fit in in any space is But then when
I went to Princeton, luckily, I you know, there wasn't
a grace done society. So I joined BAC, the Black
Arts Company, which is this dance group that was very
(19:12):
inclusive and welcoming and had friends who embraced me and
helped me celebrate, you know, my identity. And so then
I feel like I evolved into Naomi the younger sister
through that experience, and I identify with her more now.
Speaker 1 (19:29):
I'd say, what do you think you would go back
and tell Princeton College Lauren about fitting in?
Speaker 3 (19:37):
Ooh about fitting in? Yeah, you asked how far I'd
go to belong Hmm. I would tell her not to
worry so much. Who cares? Like, now that I'm in
my thirties, I don't care what people think. I'm just
trying to make my art and help other people and
help my friends, you know, and my family. It doesn't matter.
(19:58):
I and when I was in school, I really wanted
to write. I wanted to be a novelist, but I
didn't have the confidence to really pursue it. And I
was you know, I started off as an econ major.
I thought I was doing this path that felt more stable.
So my whole life, I've been sort of struggling between
(20:19):
do I do the thing that is stable, or do
I go for my dreams.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
I think that's a question that resonates with a lot
of people. You know, you mentioned surgeries Earlier, You've been
pretty open about the personal struggles that you experienced with
your health and relationships while you've been writing this book.
Are you willing to share some specifics for our listeners
to understand sort of the headspace that you were in.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
Yeah, of course, So I guess going back to high school,
I played soccer and I had this injury when I
was fifteen. A girl just purposely ran through my knee
and tore everything. And it was just a high school game.
And then since then, I've had five surgeries on that
knee and over the pandemic, I had to have one
(21:07):
a cartilage replacement, and then also both hips label tears.
So I spent over a year on crutches, off and on.
Each time it was like somewhere between four and seven months,
depending on the surgery. And it was just a really
hard time for me because I was also I had
(21:27):
been with someone for six years and then got married
and divorced, and it just was a really low point
in my life. Like my mental health definitely suffered, and
so I turned to writing as a way to like
work through some of that.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
When you're a physical person and some of your physicality
feels stripped from you. It's debilitating physically and mentally.
Speaker 4 (21:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
Are there other books that you read during that time
that you found?
Speaker 3 (22:00):
Yeah, you know what, I read a lot of Reese's
book Club books because it was around. It was right
after twenty seventeen. Yeah, I was twenty nineteen when I
had my first surgery, So I read Celeste Ing, I
read Kylie Reid, Taylor Jenkins read just so many good
(22:21):
books during that time. Americana Never Let Me Go by
Kazuishu Guro is another one I love.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
I feel like, at the lowest points of my life
when therapy didn't feel comforting, women's stories, whether they were
fictional or nonfiction, helped me.
Speaker 4 (22:37):
Yes, totally.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
And then when the world shoot down during the pandemic,
there was this bookstagram community that I found and everyone
loved reading. We were all I was in this book
club actually with people women all over the world. One
person was in Australia, someone was in the UK. We
were all spread out over the US too, and it
was just a really cool experience.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
That's interesting because you're kind of talking about belonging again,
like you almost formed your own new eating club. Yeah,
it's just around books, not food.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
It's time for another short break, but don't go anywhere.
We'll be right back to shelf Life with Lauren ling Brown.
And we're back with Lauren ling Brown. Okay, this next
question that I have for you is a little weird
for me to say, but I'm going to try my
(23:32):
best to say it. Okay, So, we heard from our
team that our recent episode on imposter syndrome resonated with
you in a big way.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
What was it that stuck out to you about that conversation? Yeah,
so I was at Shinaway. I went to your live
recording and it was awesome. You actually someone. You said
something that really resonated with me. You said, we can
reframe imposterson to thinking of it as if we are
taking the next leap in our career, so we're pushing
(24:07):
ourselves to our limits. And I don't remember exactly how
you said it, you said it so beautifully.
Speaker 1 (24:12):
No, that's it.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
But I really love that, and that resonated with me
because I've been someone who's been actively fighting against imposter
syndrome in my career in editing the whole time, you know,
for the past ten years. And so yeah, to hear
you say that was really nice, and I like that idea.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
I also find that imposter syndrome is exacerbated when you're
underrepresented in your context. And there's just not a lot
of women editors out there, so I can imagine it's
just sort of multiplied.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
Absolutely not to tell too many of these stories, but
I was editing something and my assistant editor was a
white guy who's a little bit older than me. And
I was at the editing desk and he was at
the assistant editing desk, and the client walked in and
they shook his hand, assuming he was the editor, you know,
(25:06):
and I sat back down and I was like, oh
my god, and it just epitomized everything I was feeling.
So I think sometimes imposter syndrome can come from small interactions.
And of course that person didn't mean anything by it.
He just assumed.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
It's interesting to me to hear you talk about imposter
syndrome because I believe that you experienced it, but you
found a way to push through it, like talk about
mastering a pivot. You started out Society of Lives started
out as a screenplay, and then you decided to turn
it into a novel because you felt like it had
(25:47):
more possibility there. You know, we often hear about authors
doing it the other way around, right, like the novel
then gets adapted.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
Take me into that calculus.
Speaker 3 (25:58):
Yeah, well it wasn't intentional. I wish I could say
it was. But I wrote it as a screenplay sort
of as my thesis at USC when I was in
film school. And then I didn't know anyone in the industry,
so I was trying to sell it, trying to I
was doing internships around Hollywood, around the entertainment industry, and
(26:21):
you know, would send it to my bosses or anyone
who would be willing to read it. But I didn't
know anyone. I didn't know how to find my way
into a writer's room. So I sort of just gave
up on the dream of writing. And I needed to
pay my rent, so I got a job as a
vault manager at a post house, meaning it was mostly
commercials and music videos and documentaries, and I was responsible
(26:45):
for sending and shipping and packaging the drives, the hard
drives that came from set. And so then I worked
my way up, became an assistant editor and an editor,
and I wrote as a hobby just on the side.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Wow, I do think that some of those tours, even
though they're not exactly what we had in mind, I
think they can be super instructional for us. What do
you think you learned from those experiences that's still serving
you today.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
Oh, it's so helpful.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
I mean being an assistant editor and an editor, you
have to be so organized, and I think that that
really helps in my writing and just not being afraid
to scrap scenes. I'm a big rewriter, so I love
to just sketch out the whole story and then just
go back and rewrite forever and just layer more mystery,
(27:31):
more threads, and more depth on top of what I
started with. So I think that really helps. And also
just in editing, you really have to tell a story
visually because you have your sound, you have the music,
you have that the dailies, the clips from set, and
(27:51):
you get to use all these pieces like a puzzle
and put together the scene to have tension and emotion.
And so I try to think of that when I'm
approaching my writing as well.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Wow, Simone and I love when we have authors on
and they read to us. Would you be willing to
read a section of your story?
Speaker 4 (28:11):
I'd love to.
Speaker 3 (28:13):
Okay, So this is from chapter twenty three, and don't worry,
there's no spoilers, but it's Maya the older sister's timeline,
and we're back in November twenty eleven when she is
first getting into the secret society, Grace Stone Society.
Speaker 4 (28:32):
From that point on, I felt different. I was different.
Speaker 3 (28:35):
Something changed in the way I carried myself, looked people
in the eye. Heads turned when Daisy and I walked
into a room, and I knew they were watching us
with envy. In the weeks following initiation, we spent languid
days wandering to and from class night's cross legged on
someone's dorm room floor, spilling secrets by candlelight until our
lips were stained purple with wine. We laughed hysterically, danced
(28:58):
until sunrise, drank and studied, and ate at sterling absorbed
into her womb. We had Graystone Society meetings every Sunday,
the location in time of which would vary, where all
twenty one of us would gather around candle at dinners
in a sheltered corner of campus to discuss poetry, art
and politics and ways in which we could benefit the society.
(29:19):
There was a hum running through everything, then a feeling
like we were living in a world within a world
within a world, one to which only we had access.
Most important, I'd been able to send money back to Naomi.
My plan was to do whatever it took to make
it for her, for us, and Greystone Society was the
start of it. Still, at night, when I was drifting
(29:40):
to sleep, the question lingered why had they chosen me?
And because I couldn't answer, this new life felt temporary.
I suspected one day it would vanish and I'd wake
up and realize it had been nothing but a dream.
One night, after dinner, Daisy and I were walking back
to her dorm when the sound of tires on gravel
came up behind me. We turned to see Cecily and
(30:02):
Kai in a decked out golf cart. This was it.
I had made it. I was part of their inner circle.
I was friends with the most beautiful, successful and envied
girls on campus.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Hmmm, Lauren, you have an incredible voice too.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
No, you just no take take it okay, because you
just snapped into something there, Like she opened the book
and then she got on the mic and she was like,
She's like the drama came through the voice. I'm I'm
here for it that was so immersive. Well, our bright
side besties have loved your book just as much as
Danielle and I have, and they have some questions about
(30:38):
Society of Lies. So first up is Emma. She's actually
fresh out of college herself and she's curious about your
own Princeton experience.
Speaker 1 (30:46):
Hi.
Speaker 5 (30:47):
My name is Emma and I am from Minnesota. I
absolutely love Society of Lies and the complexities of all
the mysteries that were involved. As soon as I started
reading this book, I was hooked and just could not
put it down until I had figured everything out. I
also thought I was really refreshing to have themes of friendship, class,
sisterhood in college. I've recently graduated college and since then
(31:09):
I've been really nostalgic. I've noticed I've been really drawn
in novels with college themes to relive those days, which
was why I was really excited to read Society of Lies.
My question is, when you were writing this book, even
though it is largely fictitious, like you mentioned in your acknowledgments,
what were the best moments of your college years of
Princeton that you wanted readers to gain a little bit
(31:30):
of insight into.
Speaker 4 (31:32):
Hi Emma.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Thank you so much for your question. I love that,
and thank you for reading the book. My favorite moments
were being in BAC the Black Arts Company and dancing
on the stage in the first auditorium with so many
of my friends, and there would be two hundred or
more of our friends in the crowd just cheering for us.
(31:54):
It was just such a welcoming, supportive environment and I
just really miss those days. And then I also loved
being an English major and getting to read all day
in these beautiful libraries and sit in these incredible classrooms
like Macosh fifty, which is referenced in the book too.
Speaker 4 (32:14):
So yeah, I had a great time.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
We were just talking with our producer about how much
we love just walking around college campuses and pretending like
we're still in There's something so magical about like that environment.
There's so much possibility there.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
I also love the creativity there, like all the big
ideas usually come from young people.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Yes, the youthful energy. There's something really energizing and inspiring
about it.
Speaker 1 (32:43):
Yeah, you feel less. I can't. It's like the world
hasn't hit you with the you can't. Yeah, yeah as much. Okay, Well,
next up. We have Ali, so we all know Society
of Lies is about the elite secret societies of Princeton,
and she wants you to spill the tea on just
how real they are.
Speaker 6 (33:03):
Hi there, my name is Ali Lauren. I loved your book.
It gave me total school movie vibes. I wanted to
ask you today a bit about the Princeton eating clubs
and the secret societies that you wrote so well. At
the beginning of your book, you mentioned that the first
Princeton eating club came about in eighteen seventy nine. At
the end of the book, in your author's note, you
(33:23):
mentioned how Graystone and Sterling were made up secret societies
that you created. I want to know how you wrote
them so well. They felt so realistic. Where did you
get your inspiration from?
Speaker 3 (33:35):
That's such a good question. I did a lot of
research on secret societies in general, so I read a
lot of nonfiction books about secret societies, just you know,
studying the history of them.
Speaker 4 (33:47):
And then Sterling.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
Club is a fictional eating club, but inspired by a
more thriller version of what some of the eating clubs
felt like.
Speaker 4 (33:57):
To me.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
See, everybody is ab obsessed with these secret societies. You
have tapped into some primal human nature stuff here.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
We're all so fascinated by it. I just think there's
so much that's already there for intrigue, like symbolism, ritual power,
and influence. Like, there's so many themes that exist within
secret societies that make for a great mystery.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
So, Lauren, you've said that you hope Society of Lies
inspires some harder conversations. What do you hope those conversations
look like for your readers?
Speaker 3 (34:32):
Well, some of the themes in Society of Lies are privilege,
multiracial identity, sisterhood, and belonging, like we talked about. And
I think that, you know, instead of wanting to insert
my opinion and my idea into my writing, my goal
is to get people talking about these ideas in these
(34:53):
situations that the characters are in, to hopefully get us
to understand where the other person is coming from and
realize that we're probably more alike than different, even if
we think that we are on opposite sides of a
certain conversation. So, I just think that there's so much nuance,
there's so much gray area between these difficult questions that
(35:16):
we've been talking a lot about lately.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
I think it's a little poetic that we started talking
about questions and ended talking about questions too.
Speaker 4 (35:28):
Come full circle.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Yeah, thank you so much for joining us today, Lauren.
Speaker 4 (35:32):
Thanks for having me. It was so nice talking with
you both.
Speaker 1 (35:36):
You're a bright light.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
Lauren ling Brown is the author of Society of Lives,
the October pick for Reese's Book Club.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
That's it for today's show. Tomorrow, it's spooky season and
we're talking all about ghosting with dating coach Sabrina zohar Boom.
Speaker 2 (35:58):
Join the conversation using hashtag the bright Side and connect
with us on social media at Hello Sunshine on Instagram
and at the bright Side Pod on TikTok oh, and
feel free to tag us at Simone Boyce and at
Danielle Robe.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
Listen and follow The bright Side on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
See you tomorrow, folks, Keep looking on the bright side.
Hey Bessies, Hello Sunshine. Today on the bright Side, it's
time for another edition of shelf Life. We're joined by
author Lauren Lingk Brown, whose debut novel, Society of Lies,
is the October pick for Reese's Book Club. It's Monday,
October twenty eighth. I'm Danielle Robe.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
And I'm Smoane Voice, and this is the bright Side
from Hello Sunshine, a daily show where we come together
to share women's stories, laugh, learn and brighten your day.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
On My Mind Monday is brought to you by Missus
Meyers Clean Day, inspired by the goodness of the garden.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
All right, chall you know what time it is. It
is On my Mind Monday, kicking off the week with
a good source of inspiration and motivation. Oh yeah, okay,
what's inspiring you today?
Speaker 1 (00:44):
All right?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Well, I recently came across an article in the Atlantic
about the power of music, and you know, I'm like
all over that. And it's written by one of our
favorite voices, Arthur C. Brooks, and he explains how music
is quote one of the greatest ways to understand life
more deeply. He cites studies that show how our brains
(01:05):
are actually built to enjoy music and how music can
also be used to help us heal.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
I've actually heard so many stories about how music helps people,
specifically in the hospital. Arthur C. Brooks is sort of
known as one of the grandfathers of happiness. Is there
a specific genre of music that elicits the most happiness?
Speaker 2 (01:24):
So? To be fair, he says that the research findings
are inconclusive on that particular point. But he says that
there was one study that found that the world's happiest
song is actually I want you to guess what's the
happiest song?
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Happy by Pharrell? That's what I was thinking too, Right,
It's gotta be a ceeviee Wonder song or got this feeling?
Uh can't sound the feeling?
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (01:46):
Yes, justin Timberlake.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Okay, so the world's happiest song is actually Good Vibrations
by the Beach Boys.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
WHOA. I kind of get that.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
I feel like we need an update on that one though.
There's been a lot of time, a lot of music
that's passed.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
And then I like that you're wanting to look at
the scientific research behind this. I could be updated. When
was the last study done? What year? Yeah? Exactly? Yeah?
What song makes you the happiest. Hmm okay. I think
a lot of the songs that make me the happiest
are tied to memories. So like in my house growing up,
or in my dad's car, we would listen to a
(02:21):
lot of Elvis, a lot of Tina Turner, My mom
loves Carol King like, kind of the oldies, Stevie Wonder.
They make me really happy. Oh that's so cute. I
love that. How about you mind changes all the time?
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Yeah, I think there's something to what you're saying that
the songs that are tied to these core formative memories
are often the ones that shift our mood in the
most impactful way.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
You also love a Chapel Roone bop?
Speaker 2 (02:47):
I am. I am so deep into Chapel Roone at
the moment. I was at my friend Donovan's house the
other day and I hadn't seen it in a while
and found out that he's equally obsessed with Chaperone. We
really spend an hour, like on Spotify just listening to
all of her songs, dissecting everything, discussing why she is
the voice of our generation.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
So I am obsessed. I just saw the Pharrell Lego
movie m H and I realized how many of his beats,
not even his songs, have made people happy, Like his
song Happy was the culmination of it all.
Speaker 3 (03:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Yeah, Do you have a sad girl song? Like a
song that you put on when you're in your feels?
Speaker 4 (03:25):
Oh my god?
Speaker 1 (03:26):
Who is it? Well, you're gonna love this song because
you love this play. But if you want me to
cry on command, if you put on for Good from Wicked,
I'm a mess. That's so sweet. Yeah, sad girl for real.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
I'm gonna have to agree that one of my favorite
sad girl music choices is musical theater, especially like Tic
Tick Boom or Rent. Yeah, those are the songs that
get me in my feels. It's a great one, and
there is something to this. The article says that not
only can sad music soothe you, but research have also
(04:00):
found that it can help you understand your feelings and
sit with them and find meaning in them.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
It can help you understand your feelings. That's really cool.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
Well, it makes sense, right, especially if you're listening to
an emotionally evocative song. An incredible musician is able to
use music as a conduit for emotion. Yeah, you know,
so it makes sense. You're able to tap into whatever
emotional state they were in when they were writing it.
Adele is a great example of that.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
Oh yeah, Celine Dion, all those big vocalists.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
One last thing I want to leave everyone with. From
this article, Arthur C. Brooks listed out some ways that
we can use music to heighten our emotional experiences and
better understand ourselves. So one strategy that he notes is
decide what you want from your music. So he says,
if you want to use music as a way to
bond socially, listen with friends, like maybe you have a
(04:49):
chapel Ron listening party with your friends. If you want
to use it as a means of intensifying your emotions,
listen by yourself. And then if you want both, go
to a concert with friends. That's an amalgamation of them all.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Going to a concert with friends is one of the
best experiences in life. It doesn't get any better than that.
So music and storytelling share a common thread. They both
have the power to transport us, to evoke emotion and
connect us to something deeper.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
You know.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
Just as a song can tell a story through rhythm
and melody, a great book can weave a tale that
stays with you long after you've finished reading. I know
if you're listening to this, there's books that you're thinking
about right now, books that have stayed with you. And
our guest today has been mastering her love of storytelling
for the past decade. Lauren Ling Brown is the author
(05:38):
of Society of Lies, the October pick for Reese's Book
Club and a USA Today bestseller. Society of Lies is
Lauren's debut novel. Prior to publishing it, she worked as
an editor in TV, film, documentaries and commercials, and she
had nearly given up on writing when she decided to
pen Society of Lies. The idea for the novel actually
(05:59):
started as a screenplay that she'd written about a decade earlier,
and over the pandemic, as Lauren was in what she
calls a low point in her life, she rediscovered her
love for writing, and she actually wrote three novels, Society
of Lies among them.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
The novel is actually a super suspenseful murder mystery that
follows two biracial sisters, Maya and Naomi, as they navigate
dark academia and the underground world of secret societies at Princeton.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
I love anything about secret societies. There's so much mystery there.
Laura Ling Brown's book is particularly delicious. Stay with us,
We'll be right back after the break. Thanks to our
partners at missus Myers, you can learn a lot about
a person by their dish soap. Missus Meyers's collection of
household products are inspired by the garden and pack a
(06:47):
punch against dirt and grime. Visit missus meyers dot com.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Welcome to the bright Side, Lauren, Thank you, thanks so
much for having me.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
We're so happy to have you. Simone and I both
love any book about a secret society. Oh yeah, oh yeah,
I'm all in. You know it's a quick win. But
this is your debut novel, Society of Lies. It's the
October pick for Reese's Book Club, and I have to say,
I think it's pretty rare for a debut book to
(07:27):
have such a long journey.
Speaker 4 (07:28):
Oh you mean the ten years.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Ten years in the making. After all of that time
and persistence and passion, how does it feel to finally
see your story celebrated on a Reese's book Club stage
and beyond?
Speaker 3 (07:46):
It feels like this dream that was so far off
that I never thought would actually be here is actually
coming true, and Reese has been a role model for
me growing up, and so it's just totally wild, all
the emotion. It was just, you know, one of those
things that you think, oh, that would be incredible if
that happened someday. But I'm just really grateful.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
We can tell. But it's it's so deserving. The book
is awesome, and we noticed a recognizable name on the
book cover. There's an endorsement from Courtney Cox. Simone and
I both need to understand how this came about.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
Well, in film school, I met someone who is now
a dear friend named Alex Jackson, and she is close
with Courtney and we all worked on a film together
where I edited, Alex directed, and Courtney was the executive producer.
Speaker 4 (08:39):
And so.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
Alex just offered to send my book to her, show
it to her, being like, I don't know if she's
going to read it, but maybe, and then she read
it and loved it and offered to blurb, which was
so kind of her.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Blurbs really help, especially from notable names on a book,
especially as a debut.
Speaker 4 (09:00):
Yeah, it was just really kind of her to do
that generous.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
So Lauren, at its core, Society of Lies is a
murder mystery that's set in the world of secret societies
at Princeton. What was it about this particular story and
setting that you just couldn't shake.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
I think just remembering who I was when I was
at age eighteen to twenty two and stepping off the
train and I'm from California, I'm from northern California, and
then stepping off the train in this beautiful East Coast
gothic campus. It was just incredible, such a culture shock,
but also an incredible experience over four years and really
(09:41):
something that had a big impact on me. So I've
been returning to this story over and over again, and
that's sort of the ten years that we were talking
about earlier.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
So can you set the record straight for me? Are
there secret societies at Princeton? Is my friend lying to me?
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Well, the major There aren't really many secret societies at Princeton.
Really everything revolves around the eating clubs, and there's about
eleven eating clubs. Some of them are signing and some
are bicker, meaning you have to rush, you have to
apply to get in.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Is this like a sorority fraternity? Like what's an eating club? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (10:17):
Yeah, I know, it's a weird word. My partner thought
it was like an eating competition club.
Speaker 1 (10:22):
I think of it's like a dinner table where it's like, Okay,
this is who you're having dinner with in the cafeteria.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Well, yeah, it is kind of like that.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
They're these historic mansions, right that are independent of the
school on a street near campus, and you do eat there,
you have your your meals there, and it's for upper
classmen and at night they clear all the tables out
and have parties with DJs, and it's where most of
(10:51):
like seventy percent I think of the students are in
an eating club.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
Were you in one?
Speaker 4 (10:57):
I was? Which one are you in? I was in Coe?
Speaker 1 (11:01):
What does that mean? What do you eat in the
Cottage Club?
Speaker 2 (11:04):
And how do you get in? Like what is the
initiation process?
Speaker 3 (11:07):
Okay, so the food varies, but it's all really good.
We have who's cooking, They have chefs and it was
a lot of Southern comfort food at Cottage, really delicious.
And I don't know, Cottage just kind of has athletes
in it. I played soccer freshman year, so the soccer
team was in it.
Speaker 4 (11:29):
Cool.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
Yeah, what were the people like?
Speaker 3 (11:32):
Well, because it's about seventy percent of Princeton, you know undergrads.
It really is similar to the people who are in
your classes.
Speaker 4 (11:41):
So it's these high achieving.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Students, and it's not all super wealthy people. It's everyone
who's at Princeton. But the eating clubs each had their
own personality, their own identity, so it really varies by
eating club.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
I think this is a story about identity, about belonging,
about the upper crost of society. And you've said that
this story really evolved over time. You had been sitting
with it for a long time. And when it comes
to a murder mystery, you've got to fit all these pieces,
these puzzle pieces together.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
What is the secret to writing the perfect murder mystery?
Speaker 3 (12:24):
I don't know if I know the secret turning the
perfect mystery, because it took me a lot of dress
to get to this one, and I still don't think
it's perfect by any means. But uh, I guess ten
years ago I wrote it as a screenplay because I
was just interested in this idea of an outsider at
Princeton getting involved in a secret society and dealing with
(12:45):
this moral dilemma, like is she going to take a
golden ticket that promises her the life of her dreams,
and will she stay even when she learns that the
secret society is her someone else. So that's the question
that I thought of when I wrote that screenplay and
then abandoned that idea and wrote this as a novel
(13:09):
over the pandemic. It was really just having that theme.
I guess that core idea in mind as the mystery
came to be as I did different drafts and crafted
the story.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
I guess there's some intriguing parallels between your own story
and the book. Both of you are navigating life at Princeton.
What was it specifically about your own experiences that really
sparked the idea of the murder mystery being on campus
at Princeton. Hm.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
I think I.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
Drew from my experience as a multiracial Black and Chinese
young woman throughout my entire life, so from growing up
in a mostly white high school in northern California, also
at Princeton, navigating different spaces. I was also in BAC,
like Naomi, the younger sister, the Black Arts Company, which
(14:05):
is this great dance group. And then I also drew
from my life after Princeton, working in post production and
also oftentimes being the only woman or person of color.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
Simone and I were actually just talking before the interview
that so many of the guests we've had on, particularly
authors that have mixed identity points, really make that a
focal point of their writing, and it seems like everyone's
trying to figure out what it means themselves, and the
writing is part of that process. You're nodding your head, Yeah, totally,
(14:39):
what do you think it is?
Speaker 3 (14:41):
I think for me, so, I have been a big
journaler for my whole life.
Speaker 4 (14:45):
Since I was a kid.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
I always kept so many journals, and I would write
down just the most emotional things that happened. So whether
it was a breakup or someone cutting me in line
at the grocery store, it was just little things that
happened during the day. And I like to go back
to those journals entries and sort of use them in
my writing as a way to make give it power
(15:08):
and just find something good, use them for something good.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Well, I think there's a lot of truth to what
you're saying, Danielle. It is really interesting that this theme
keeps coming up, not just you know, on our show,
but in Reese's book Club, Like these stories about mixed
race characters are being celebrated and elevated and amplified. And
I'm not an author, but I am someone who has
lived experience as a biracial woman. And I think the
(15:34):
reason why these characters are so compelling is because they
exist in the gray area and the complexity and there's
just so much nuance to this experience.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Yeah, I would agree with that, and I just want
to center more stories around our experiences and show that,
I don't know, we're not just one note that there's
so much nuance and complexity.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Yeah, there's something really compelling about a character who's like
straddling two worlds, which is exactly what the characters in
this book are going through.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
Can I ask you one more question about identity? What
do you think you were specifically trying to sift through personally?
Speaker 4 (16:18):
M good, That is such a good question.
Speaker 1 (16:21):
Hmmm.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
I think for me, just the key thing about this
character Maya, the older sister, is that she wants to
belong and trying to figure out like in what way
she's conforming to this world versus rejecting it. And then
the younger sister, Naomi, who's more secure, She's confident in
her identity and loves everything that makes her who she is,
(16:47):
and so she is, you know, the positive version of
this multiracial experience.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
I think that is really interesting. I want to touch
on the sister dynamic because it's a huge part of
the plot. You said that this book improved your relationship
with your sister personally, how so.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
Yeah, So my sister is four years younger than me,
and we were very close growing up in high school
before that, but then when I went to college and
she went to a different school, and then we started
our careers, we were just living in different cities, not
communicating in the best way. I'm the older sister, so
I'm always giving advice when it's not always needed.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
It's like you're a parent sister. Yes, I'm the same,
I get it.
Speaker 4 (17:32):
I try not to.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
But then now that we're in our thirties, and when
I was writing this book over the pandemic, going through
a really hard time in my life, like a bad
breakup and also different surgeries, she was really there for me.
And I think she got to know me through this
writing too, because I would read chapters to her. And
(17:54):
now she's reading the finished version of Society of Lives
and she called me saying that she really liked it
and like got more insight into my experience, I guess.
And we just had a really nice moment talking about that,
and it really meant a lot to me.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
Sounds like she almost flipped the script on you during
that time, like she became the caretaker a little and
it changed things.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
Yeah, definitely, I want to circle back to this theme
of belonging because it really feels like an engine throughout
this story that drives the characters forward. You've said that
your book is based on the question how far would
you go to belong? How much of yourself do you
see in Maya? How much of yourself do you see
(18:38):
in Naomi? And as you were writing this, what did
this book bring up for you in terms of how
far you went to try to fit in?
Speaker 4 (18:48):
Yeah, that's a good question.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
So Maya I see as who I was in high school,
this very guarded, shy, bookish kid who didn't feel like
she fit in in any space is But then when
I went to Princeton, luckily, I you know, there wasn't
a grace done society. So I joined BAC, the Black
Arts Company, which is this dance group that was very
(19:12):
inclusive and welcoming and had friends who embraced me and
helped me celebrate, you know, my identity. And so then
I feel like I evolved into Naomi the younger sister
through that experience, and I identify with her more now.
Speaker 1 (19:29):
I'd say, what do you think you would go back
and tell Princeton College Lauren about fitting in?
Speaker 3 (19:37):
Ooh about fitting in? Yeah, you asked how far I'd
go to belong Hmm. I would tell her not to
worry so much. Who cares? Like, now that I'm in
my thirties, I don't care what people think. I'm just
trying to make my art and help other people and
help my friends, you know, and my family. It doesn't matter.
(19:58):
I and when I was in school, I really wanted
to write. I wanted to be a novelist, but I
didn't have the confidence to really pursue it. And I
was you know, I started off as an econ major.
I thought I was doing this path that felt more stable.
So my whole life, I've been sort of struggling between
(20:19):
do I do the thing that is stable, or do
I go for my dreams.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
I think that's a question that resonates with a lot
of people. You know, you mentioned surgeries Earlier, You've been
pretty open about the personal struggles that you experienced with
your health and relationships while you've been writing this book.
Are you willing to share some specifics for our listeners
to understand sort of the headspace that you were in.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
Yeah, of course, So I guess going back to high school,
I played soccer and I had this injury when I
was fifteen. A girl just purposely ran through my knee
and tore everything. And it was just a high school game.
And then since then, I've had five surgeries on that
knee and over the pandemic, I had to have one
(21:07):
a cartilage replacement, and then also both hips label tears.
So I spent over a year on crutches, off and on.
Each time it was like somewhere between four and seven months,
depending on the surgery. And it was just a really
hard time for me because I was also I had
(21:27):
been with someone for six years and then got married
and divorced, and it just was a really low point
in my life. Like my mental health definitely suffered, and
so I turned to writing as a way to like
work through some of that.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
When you're a physical person and some of your physicality
feels stripped from you. It's debilitating physically and mentally.
Speaker 4 (21:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
Are there other books that you read during that time
that you found?
Speaker 3 (22:00):
Yeah, you know what, I read a lot of Reese's
book Club books because it was around. It was right
after twenty seventeen. Yeah, I was twenty nineteen when I
had my first surgery, So I read Celeste Ing, I
read Kylie Reid, Taylor Jenkins read just so many good
(22:21):
books during that time. Americana Never Let Me Go by
Kazuishu Guro is another one I love.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
I feel like, at the lowest points of my life
when therapy didn't feel comforting, women's stories, whether they were
fictional or nonfiction, helped me.
Speaker 4 (22:37):
Yes, totally.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
And then when the world shoot down during the pandemic,
there was this bookstagram community that I found and everyone
loved reading. We were all I was in this book
club actually with people women all over the world. One
person was in Australia, someone was in the UK. We
were all spread out over the US too, and it
was just a really cool experience.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
That's interesting because you're kind of talking about belonging again,
like you almost formed your own new eating club. Yeah,
it's just around books, not food.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
It's time for another short break, but don't go anywhere.
We'll be right back to shelf Life with Lauren ling Brown.
And we're back with Lauren ling Brown. Okay, this next
question that I have for you is a little weird
for me to say, but I'm going to try my
(23:32):
best to say it. Okay, So, we heard from our
team that our recent episode on imposter syndrome resonated with
you in a big way.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
What was it that stuck out to you about that conversation? Yeah,
so I was at Shinaway. I went to your live
recording and it was awesome. You actually someone. You said
something that really resonated with me. You said, we can
reframe imposterson to thinking of it as if we are
taking the next leap in our career, so we're pushing
(24:07):
ourselves to our limits. And I don't remember exactly how
you said it, you said it so beautifully.
Speaker 1 (24:12):
No, that's it.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
But I really love that, and that resonated with me
because I've been someone who's been actively fighting against imposter
syndrome in my career in editing the whole time, you know,
for the past ten years. And so yeah, to hear
you say that was really nice, and I like that idea.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
I also find that imposter syndrome is exacerbated when you're
underrepresented in your context. And there's just not a lot
of women editors out there, so I can imagine it's
just sort of multiplied.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
Absolutely not to tell too many of these stories, but
I was editing something and my assistant editor was a
white guy who's a little bit older than me. And
I was at the editing desk and he was at
the assistant editing desk, and the client walked in and
they shook his hand, assuming he was the editor, you know,
(25:06):
and I sat back down and I was like, oh
my god, and it just epitomized everything I was feeling.
So I think sometimes imposter syndrome can come from small interactions.
And of course that person didn't mean anything by it.
He just assumed.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
It's interesting to me to hear you talk about imposter
syndrome because I believe that you experienced it, but you
found a way to push through it, like talk about
mastering a pivot. You started out Society of Lives started
out as a screenplay, and then you decided to turn
it into a novel because you felt like it had
(25:47):
more possibility there. You know, we often hear about authors
doing it the other way around, right, like the novel
then gets adapted.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
Take me into that calculus.
Speaker 3 (25:58):
Yeah, well it wasn't intentional. I wish I could say
it was. But I wrote it as a screenplay sort
of as my thesis at USC when I was in
film school. And then I didn't know anyone in the industry,
so I was trying to sell it, trying to I
was doing internships around Hollywood, around the entertainment industry, and
(26:21):
you know, would send it to my bosses or anyone
who would be willing to read it. But I didn't
know anyone. I didn't know how to find my way
into a writer's room. So I sort of just gave
up on the dream of writing. And I needed to
pay my rent, so I got a job as a
vault manager at a post house, meaning it was mostly
commercials and music videos and documentaries, and I was responsible
(26:45):
for sending and shipping and packaging the drives, the hard
drives that came from set. And so then I worked
my way up, became an assistant editor and an editor,
and I wrote as a hobby just on the side.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Wow, I do think that some of those tours, even
though they're not exactly what we had in mind, I
think they can be super instructional for us. What do
you think you learned from those experiences that's still serving
you today.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
Oh, it's so helpful.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
I mean being an assistant editor and an editor, you
have to be so organized, and I think that that
really helps in my writing and just not being afraid
to scrap scenes. I'm a big rewriter, so I love
to just sketch out the whole story and then just
go back and rewrite forever and just layer more mystery,
(27:31):
more threads, and more depth on top of what I
started with. So I think that really helps. And also
just in editing, you really have to tell a story
visually because you have your sound, you have the music,
you have that the dailies, the clips from set, and
(27:51):
you get to use all these pieces like a puzzle
and put together the scene to have tension and emotion.
And so I try to think of that when I'm
approaching my writing as well.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Wow, Simone and I love when we have authors on
and they read to us. Would you be willing to
read a section of your story?
Speaker 4 (28:11):
I'd love to.
Speaker 3 (28:13):
Okay, So this is from chapter twenty three, and don't worry,
there's no spoilers, but it's Maya the older sister's timeline,
and we're back in November twenty eleven when she is
first getting into the secret society, Grace Stone Society.
Speaker 4 (28:32):
From that point on, I felt different. I was different.
Speaker 3 (28:35):
Something changed in the way I carried myself, looked people
in the eye. Heads turned when Daisy and I walked
into a room, and I knew they were watching us
with envy. In the weeks following initiation, we spent languid
days wandering to and from class night's cross legged on
someone's dorm room floor, spilling secrets by candlelight until our
lips were stained purple with wine. We laughed hysterically, danced
(28:58):
until sunrise, drank and studied, and ate at sterling absorbed
into her womb. We had Graystone Society meetings every Sunday,
the location in time of which would vary, where all
twenty one of us would gather around candle at dinners
in a sheltered corner of campus to discuss poetry, art
and politics and ways in which we could benefit the society.
(29:19):
There was a hum running through everything, then a feeling
like we were living in a world within a world
within a world, one to which only we had access.
Most important, I'd been able to send money back to Naomi.
My plan was to do whatever it took to make
it for her, for us, and Greystone Society was the
start of it. Still, at night, when I was drifting
(29:40):
to sleep, the question lingered why had they chosen me?
And because I couldn't answer, this new life felt temporary.
I suspected one day it would vanish and I'd wake
up and realize it had been nothing but a dream.
One night, after dinner, Daisy and I were walking back
to her dorm when the sound of tires on gravel
came up behind me. We turned to see Cecily and
(30:02):
Kai in a decked out golf cart. This was it.
I had made it. I was part of their inner circle.
I was friends with the most beautiful, successful and envied
girls on campus.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Hmmm, Lauren, you have an incredible voice too.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
No, you just no take take it okay, because you
just snapped into something there, Like she opened the book
and then she got on the mic and she was like,
She's like the drama came through the voice. I'm I'm
here for it that was so immersive. Well, our bright
side besties have loved your book just as much as
Danielle and I have, and they have some questions about
(30:38):
Society of Lies. So first up is Emma. She's actually
fresh out of college herself and she's curious about your
own Princeton experience.
Speaker 1 (30:46):
Hi.
Speaker 5 (30:47):
My name is Emma and I am from Minnesota. I
absolutely love Society of Lies and the complexities of all
the mysteries that were involved. As soon as I started
reading this book, I was hooked and just could not
put it down until I had figured everything out. I
also thought I was really refreshing to have themes of friendship, class,
sisterhood in college. I've recently graduated college and since then
(31:09):
I've been really nostalgic. I've noticed I've been really drawn
in novels with college themes to relive those days, which
was why I was really excited to read Society of Lies.
My question is, when you were writing this book, even
though it is largely fictitious, like you mentioned in your acknowledgments,
what were the best moments of your college years of
Princeton that you wanted readers to gain a little bit
(31:30):
of insight into.
Speaker 4 (31:32):
Hi Emma.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Thank you so much for your question. I love that,
and thank you for reading the book. My favorite moments
were being in BAC the Black Arts Company and dancing
on the stage in the first auditorium with so many
of my friends, and there would be two hundred or
more of our friends in the crowd just cheering for us.
(31:54):
It was just such a welcoming, supportive environment and I
just really miss those days. And then I also loved
being an English major and getting to read all day
in these beautiful libraries and sit in these incredible classrooms
like Macosh fifty, which is referenced in the book too.
Speaker 4 (32:14):
So yeah, I had a great time.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
We were just talking with our producer about how much
we love just walking around college campuses and pretending like
we're still in There's something so magical about like that environment.
There's so much possibility there.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
I also love the creativity there, like all the big
ideas usually come from young people.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Yes, the youthful energy. There's something really energizing and inspiring
about it.
Speaker 1 (32:43):
Yeah, you feel less. I can't. It's like the world
hasn't hit you with the you can't. Yeah, yeah as much. Okay, Well,
next up. We have Ali, so we all know Society
of Lies is about the elite secret societies of Princeton,
and she wants you to spill the tea on just
how real they are.
Speaker 6 (33:03):
Hi there, my name is Ali Lauren. I loved your book.
It gave me total school movie vibes. I wanted to
ask you today a bit about the Princeton eating clubs
and the secret societies that you wrote so well. At
the beginning of your book, you mentioned that the first
Princeton eating club came about in eighteen seventy nine. At
the end of the book, in your author's note, you
(33:23):
mentioned how Graystone and Sterling were made up secret societies
that you created. I want to know how you wrote
them so well. They felt so realistic. Where did you
get your inspiration from?
Speaker 3 (33:35):
That's such a good question. I did a lot of
research on secret societies in general, so I read a
lot of nonfiction books about secret societies, just you know,
studying the history of them.
Speaker 4 (33:47):
And then Sterling.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
Club is a fictional eating club, but inspired by a
more thriller version of what some of the eating clubs
felt like.
Speaker 4 (33:57):
To me.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
See, everybody is ab obsessed with these secret societies. You
have tapped into some primal human nature stuff here.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
We're all so fascinated by it. I just think there's
so much that's already there for intrigue, like symbolism, ritual power,
and influence. Like, there's so many themes that exist within
secret societies that make for a great mystery.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
So, Lauren, you've said that you hope Society of Lies
inspires some harder conversations. What do you hope those conversations
look like for your readers?
Speaker 3 (34:32):
Well, some of the themes in Society of Lies are privilege,
multiracial identity, sisterhood, and belonging, like we talked about. And
I think that, you know, instead of wanting to insert
my opinion and my idea into my writing, my goal
is to get people talking about these ideas in these
(34:53):
situations that the characters are in, to hopefully get us
to understand where the other person is coming from and
realize that we're probably more alike than different, even if
we think that we are on opposite sides of a
certain conversation. So, I just think that there's so much nuance,
there's so much gray area between these difficult questions that
(35:16):
we've been talking a lot about lately.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
I think it's a little poetic that we started talking
about questions and ended talking about questions too.
Speaker 4 (35:28):
Come full circle.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Yeah, thank you so much for joining us today, Lauren.
Speaker 4 (35:32):
Thanks for having me. It was so nice talking with
you both.
Speaker 1 (35:36):
You're a bright light.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
Lauren ling Brown is the author of Society of Lives,
the October pick for Reese's Book Club.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
That's it for today's show. Tomorrow, it's spooky season and
we're talking all about ghosting with dating coach Sabrina zohar Boom.
Speaker 2 (35:58):
Join the conversation using hashtag the bright Side and connect
with us on social media at Hello Sunshine on Instagram
and at the bright Side Pod on TikTok oh, and
feel free to tag us at Simone Boyce and at
Danielle Robe.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
Listen and follow The bright Side on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
See you tomorrow, folks, Keep looking on the bright side.
Hosts And Creators
Simone Boyce
Danielle Robay
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