April 17, 2025 • 45 mins
In this episode of The Deal, Alex Rodriguez and Jason Kelly talk about Rory McIlroy’s historic win at the 2025 Masters at Augusta National. Then, they speak with Richard Jefferson about how he made the transition from NBA star forward to ESPN analyst. Jefferson tells the hosts why work ethic is important to him, the lessons he learned from being robbed by his former manager, and why he’s never been more nervous than at the 2004 slam dunk contest with Amar'e Stoudemire.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Hi everyone, welcome back to the Deal.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
I'm your host, Jason Kelly alongside my partner Alex Rodriguez.
All right, I'm only a few miles from you. I'm
one spring break, but you know, I miss you too much.
I can't not be on this podcast. Plus, there's way
too much happening in the world of sports to take
a break. So I'm at Miami Beach. I'm on Miami Beach.
I get her on Sunday with my family.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
We land. Everybody wants to go to the beach.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
I'm not going to the beach Sunday afternoon because I'm
watching the Masters.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Holy guacamole. What a tournament you must have been watching.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
I think everybody who's watching.
Speaker 4 (00:48):
And look, I know we're going to talk a little
bit about the numbers, but whatever these numbers are, I
would double at a triple because every human that I've
spoken to, every office on Monday was talking about the
Masters and Rory and the and the comeback, and it
had a little bit of everything.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
It's painful to say.
Speaker 4 (01:05):
It reminded me of the slow train wreck we had
in two thousand and four against the Red SOX because
the fans, the players, the media, everyone knew where it
was going and we were not able to do. What
Rory McElroy did was turned this whole thing around like
a Titanic, like an avalanche, and to go off on
eighteen and then to do an absolute gem for Birdie
(01:25):
to win it.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
That was awesome.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
It was unbelievable.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
I mean, I was like standing up, sitting down, I'm
like shouting at the TV. You know, my wife and
I were totally engaged. Our daughter wants to go have dinner.
We're like, no, no, no, no, we can't go.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
We can't go.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
But as you say, like the drama of it unbelievably
good for the game of golf and the business of golf.
It couldn't have happened at a better place. The Masters
obviously beyond iconic. So here are the numbers that are
really important in this case, highest rating, highest number of viewership,
or highest viewership in seven years. It was the best
(02:00):
performing non NFL sporting event for Paramount Plus ever.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
And as you say, everyone who's watching, and I think you're.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Right to say double or triple because I've probably watched
the highlight on ESPN on the espn app like fifty
times of him winning it. So I have to ask you,
from an athlete's perspective, how do you pull it together?
Because he made some pretty bad mistakes over the course
of that round, and especially that putt that he missed
(02:29):
toward the end. As someone who has been in a
position to have to like pick yourself up and like,
in your case, go back to the plate, how do
you do it?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
What's in your head?
Speaker 4 (02:39):
It's very hard, Jason, And look, he is ironic that
his worst two holes could have been one and eighteen,
a double one one to let you know, Bryson the shamba,
get back in the race and par right away.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
There were even after one.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
And then to close with what looked like a very
simple shot one hundred twenty five out put the ball
on the green two putt and you have the green jacket,
and he could not do that. I think it tells
you a lot about his makeup. It tells you a
lot about the pattern recognition, the reps. And here's the
guy who's thirty five, who's been there. And when you
(03:15):
look at his press conference and you heard him, you
felt the agony, but what you really saw was someone
who had more relief than happiness. And I felt the
same way when we finally got it done in O nine.
But I think it's just a lot of mental strength,
fortitude and willpower. And it was impressive to do because
most people would fold and they'll get him next.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Year, I know, and I mean and just like the
ability to be essentially be a goldfish and just forget
what happened before and just go out and hit the
next shot. And by the way, on that first playoff hole,
I know we're going really deep on this, but I'm
so obsessed with it. But it's like on that first
playoff hole, like from a competitive perspective, Rose hits an
(03:56):
unbelievable approach himself, and then McElroy hits an even better way. Anyway,
it was just amazing. It was amazing to see the
history around all of it. You and I both love golf.
We want what's best for the game. This is going
to help grow the game, and I just think it's great.
Speaker 4 (04:12):
There was a lot of anxiety. I don't know if
you felt anxiety. I felt anxiety for Rory. That's one.
Oh yeah, and the great Marianna Rivera, my former teammate,
who was the greatest close of all time, Jason. He
would always say to me, great closers must have short
term memory, and that's exactly applies for what Rory had
to do. Short term memory with an off fight team
(04:33):
and to come back and shoot at Dart and then
make Birdie pretty awesome.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Unbelievable, really really unbelievable. All right.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
So I came to Miami, of course via Swarthworeris watched
my son play lacrosse, because as you know, that's like
every weekend this spring. It's my last spring. You won't
have to hear me talk about it anymore after this season.
After just a few weeks, the senior games coming up
this weekend. I can't believe it anyway, but I went
to Swarthmore after going to the Duke Sports Business Conference.
This is something you had participated and I believe virtually
(05:01):
very first year that they did it. Back in twenty twenty,
I was at the fifth edition. Listen to the lineup.
It was unbelievable. Larry Fitzgerald opens, Rich Climban closed. I'm
sort of in there in the middle, but I was
with laurigeent Tilley. She founded espnW. She was the chief
marketing officer for ESPN. She was unbelievable. Andrew Yaffi, who's
the CEO of Dude Perfect, was also a longtime NBA executive,
(05:24):
did the whole social media strategy for the NBA.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
He was on the panel as well. It was super fun.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
It's amazing how much you and I both see this
so much. It's amazing the interest at the undergraduate and
the graduate level. People want to work in sports. And
of course these duke students, they're very smart, as we know,
and they are ready to go in the world of sports.
So it was really fun to be there. So you
and I need to be there at the same time.
At some point, maybe we'll get Coach k or Grant
(05:52):
Hill or somebody to join us there one day.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
I would love that.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
And look, I think there's nothing like being on campus.
I loved that as a IF annual. I think there's
a vibration in these colleges that are awesome. I'm on
my way, by the way on Thursday to Michigan because
my daughter has a Titanic play I gotta go watch,
and this morning she gave me the cliff.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Notes, so I'm not lost, so I can relate with that.
Speaker 4 (06:14):
But I think when we grew up, Jason and you
grew up in Atlanta, I grew up in Miami. You
looked at the major three sports, basketball, football, and baseball.
Today there's like a fourth or fifth sport, and that's
the business of media, sports and culture, exactly what we
cover here on the Deal. And there's more interest. Everywhere
I travel there's someone that says you and Jason love
(06:35):
the Deal. They talk about it more than like the
Yankees or the Masters. It's really impressive the young people,
how much interest they have in this world that we're
trying to, you know, collect every every single week.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Yeah, no, it is.
Speaker 3 (06:46):
It is interesting to hear people and to talk about
the ecosystem and everything that's happening around that. For sure,
you're in Minnesota watching your temper Wolves close out the
regular season with a nice win over the Jazz. Sunday
was insane going into Sunday, like seeing everything that was
at stake, all the seeding, especially in the West that
was happening. What was it like in the Target Center,
(07:06):
Like what was the vibe as it was all coming together?
Speaker 1 (07:10):
Yeah, in a weird way.
Speaker 4 (07:11):
I Mean, we've talked about the NCAA brackets and obviously
the great work you do for charity. It felt like
a Final four vibe, or at least a bracket NC
doublea basketball. There was so much excitement. This is the
first weekend that I've ever been involved in sports where
on Thursday we.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
Didn't know if we're going to be the eighth seed
or the third seed.
Speaker 4 (07:30):
Right usually that's defined months before, and it was so exciting.
Our fan base was awesome. They showed up in a
big way. Thank goodness. We were able to win Friday
and Sunday, but the big highlight game was Clippers versus
Golden State and that went into overtime. I'm sure the
ratings you saw go from like seven eight million people
watching the Masters to like.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Nineteen at peak. I bet that a big audience.
Speaker 4 (07:55):
Once Golden State lost that game, they kind of flipped
over to the Masters and it was like the perfect storm.
But it was a great weekend for sports, great weekend
for the NBA, great weekend for golf, and we were
all lucky to watch it.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
Yeah, totally all right, so many more sports to come.
We're getting into the heart of the heart of the season,
where you know, baseball is really getting underway in a
meaningful way. You know, one thing we should note our
friend Kaitlyn goo Over at League one volleyball.
Speaker 2 (08:20):
They closed out.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
Their season the first inaur Guriral season we talked earlier.
Go back and listen to that. They did a great
job Austin the champions for League one Volleyball.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
WNBA is going to be getting underway.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
Your links looking really good as well, and some interesting
things happening with the draft. A lot of attention paid
to the draft. So speaking of basketball coming up in
the deal, we have Richard Jefferson. He is the perfect
person to talk about as we get deep into playoff basketball.
He's now on the number one team for ESPN. I
love this guy. He is so fun he is. He's
(08:53):
a young guy, played seventeen years in the league, has
really made his way in a big way in the
broadcasting world. I mean, what a grinder, what a student
and a guy you've gotten to know a little bit.
Speaker 4 (09:03):
Yes, and Richard is a really really good guy. He's
a very talented person. We talked about the three headed
monster with him really mastering basketball, played in the NBA
for seventeen years, him now mastering media. He's now in
the first team at ESPN, which is incredible, and now
he's trying to tackle the third part, which is what
we cover his business. And I think because of his
(09:24):
communicating skills, because he's a guy that builds bridges, I
think he has an incredible opportunity to be as successful
as business as the prior to media in sports.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
Yeah, totally and interesting, you know to talk to him.
He's a very real guy.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
So hope you enjoyed this conversation coming up with Richard Jefferson.
We're so excited to have Richard Jefferson here with us.
Of course, former NBA player turned broadcaster, turned entorepreneur turned
(10:01):
empire builder.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Welcome to the show.
Speaker 5 (10:03):
Thanks for having me, guys, I'm excited. This is not
my normal podcast format, so that makes a little bit
more fun.
Speaker 3 (10:10):
I know we're putting you in the hot seat because
you're a podcaster as well. You know, you are a
jack of all trades, and you know, Alex, I feel
like it's such an interesting opportunity for both of us,
but especially you because is it like looking in a
mirror here, It really is.
Speaker 4 (10:24):
And you know, rich and I've become good friends and
I've really admired or the way he's gone about his
seventeen year career. He's got so many wonderful relationships in
the game, and he's the ultimate catalyst for building bridges,
not burning bridges, and I think that's going to help
him and serve him well in his career also in business.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
Wow, first of all, let's just slow down here, right,
that's a rod right there. I understand this. Like, I'm
not a New Yorker.
Speaker 5 (10:51):
I was drafted there, I lived there for a lot
of years. So to have a legend speak so highly
somebody that I've looked up to and watched and tracked,
and just watch all the moves that he's made on
you know, on and off the floor, court, field, whatever
the hell we're going to call it. Yeah, on and off.
It's been impressive. So thank you, Thank you well Rich.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
That's an interesting place to start because you come up
through a storied college program at University of Arizona.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
You you come into the.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
League, it feels like from the beginning you are thinking
of yourself very holistically, thinking of yourself as someone who
obviously has a lot of ambition on the court, but
because of what you were exposed to from a business perspective,
like was that the case that you were looking to
the A Rods and others of the world, and who
were you looking at.
Speaker 5 (11:39):
Well, you know, at that time, Alex and I didn't
really know each other, but it was one of those
things that when I got drafted, you get to New
York City. New York City is just the financial capital
of the world, and accidentally you meet people and you
have conversations with them, and you start to pick up things.
And I'm a twenty one year old kid with no
financial history, parent have no financial history, and all of
(12:01):
a sudden you're just put in rooms and you're friends
with owners. Now, how did this guy own the team?
And it's like, well he sold this, So all of
a sudden you start to get into rooms accidentally, and
then it's kind of what you do when you're in
those rooms that can kind of dictate your learning. I
learned very quickly, and a Rod knows this is that
when you are in the New York media, you don't
(12:25):
really say a lot. You don't say a lot, you
keep it very vanilla. And from there so you kind
of watch people and how they navigate and how they
kind of keep their stuff separate. But for me, individually.
The people that I look to were the people that
I had the luxury of getting to know. Ardie Rabin
is one of the people just being in rooms with him.
The Landises that were former owners of the Net still
(12:47):
friends with their family to this day. So it was
really just being in those rooms and getting to know
some people that have had tremendous amount of success in
random fields that you start to pick up tidbits from them.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
So, Richard, you have two.
Speaker 4 (13:01):
Of the great ingredients you need in business. That's wonderful
relationships and a really good communicator. When and how early
did you start thinking about relationships and communicating skills do matter?
Speaker 5 (13:13):
Probably in high school when we talk about just communication relationships.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
That's just who I was as a person.
Speaker 5 (13:18):
And then you kind of when you start to formulate
yourself as a young man, you're like, who do I
want to be? How do I want to be? How
do I want to walk in rooms? And everybody has
a different vibe. Some people want to walk into rooms
and be respected. Some people want to walk into rooms
and leave a mark. For me. When I want to
walk into a room, I want people to have a
good energy when I walk in because I like the
(13:41):
energy like that in the room. As a young man,
I kind of got into that, and then I started
to see over many years how that has now looking
back on my life, me just having good energy and
just being a good person and communicator. Fifteen years later,
people are coming up to me now with opportunities, saying, hey,
Rich you were so cool in two thousand and four
(14:04):
and now I'm the head of XYZ. I'd love to
do something with you, just because you were, you know,
a good dude.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
In that moment.
Speaker 5 (14:11):
You might not see these things in year one, year two,
but over multiple years, the relationships and the energy that
you've brought into rooms typically gets fed back to you.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
I'd love to talk about the transition, you know, out
of the league and into broadcasting. Was that something you
always wanted to do? Did opportunities immediately present themselves? How
does that transition happen? Because I know a little bit
about how it happened with Alex, but would love to
hear your story.
Speaker 5 (14:37):
Yeah, well, you know, Alex knows these things. It's a
lot about relationships. My guy, Flip, his guy from the
Yes Network who just retired. Flip had watched me with
the Yes Network. Frank de Grace who runs the NETS,
and so I had worked with him since I was.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
A rookie and for five straight years.
Speaker 5 (14:54):
When I was about to retire from year twelve on
flip and Frank de Grace would be like, Richard, we
want you to come back to the Yes Network. We
want you to come back here. And so for me,
I kind of had an idea like, Hey, I'm going
to retire. What am I going to do next? I
think I can go do this. You know, there's an insecurity,
but a curiosity and confidence, right, It's like you're not
afraid to fail, but like this is something that I
(15:15):
want to pursue. And so we talk about this the
relationships that I had built. I hadn't been with the
NETS for over a decade, but over those six years,
just being you know, a good person to the media,
being supportive of what they were trying to do. They
were the first to give me an opportunity. The Yes
Network and the NETS were the first like broadcast contract
that i'd signed.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
You're talking about John Philippelli right when you say.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
Yes, John Philippelli. Yeah, John, Yeah, for audience.
Speaker 5 (15:40):
He's just retired, but he's legend one of the first
people to be like, Richard, you could be great at this, right.
You know, you have those people that are like, reach,
would you be good? Frank DeGrace is one of those
people say you're good. But when it's just I guess
it's different from somebody that you feel like, oh, you're
just kind of fluffing me. You're just kind of messing
with me. You're not not messing with me, but you're
just kind of like telling me this in a manner
(16:01):
that's like you want me to work with you. So
Flip was a guy that I didn't know well, but
I knew he had been you.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Know, the guy.
Speaker 5 (16:09):
So for him to step out like Richard, I think
you can be amazing at this. You're like, well, this
guy's seen it all, so like I'm going to believe him.
And you know, like Alex, he's talked about his relationship
with you and how you probably have to speak a
little bit more to who Flip is because he's kind
of like this urban legend, right. People talk about him,
(16:29):
but people don't really get to see him often. But
he knows everything about that industry, in the broadcasting space
and the producing and all those things.
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Yeah, I mean John Philippelli we call him Flip. I
mean what he is is basically the Michael Jordan of producers.
He has over one hundred and twenty Emmy's, He's done
many world series. He kind of discovered Bob Costas and
many many others like you. He's given me a lot
of tips and encouragement. There's no one better. I mean,
he is the guy.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
But Rich.
Speaker 4 (16:58):
Going back to you, what was the common thread that
took you from Flip telling you, hey, Rich, you can
do this to I know I can do this and
I can actually make a.
Speaker 1 (17:08):
Career out of it.
Speaker 5 (17:09):
From there, it was there's a couple of things. One
being an athlete coming into this space. This is I
hate to say these things because I don't want to
be negative, but the bar was very very low. Not
from like a talent ability skill set, but like from
a level of let's say professionalism.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Do they show up on time? Will they work hard? Yes?
Speaker 5 (17:30):
They made one hundred million dollars? Are they going to
show up for this? You know, like five k date
on time and locked in and sharp. And then the
more I started to be like, okay, well you know this.
If you're going to do something, be great at it.
Don't don't just kind of do something casually unless it's
a hobby. If you're going to spend time on it,
try and be great. And once I kind of got that, Okay, Well,
(17:51):
people that I respect and see the industry respects are
saying that I have a chance to be good. I
have my own level of confidence, and now it's all
about my work ethic talent. If you don't work hard,
people will outwork you. So for me, once I got
into this industry, I approached it kind of like it
being an athlete and just like, how hard can I
work to see how great I can be?
Speaker 4 (18:13):
I love that rich But for our audience, let's bring
up behind the currents a little bit. We know what
working hard looks like in basketball, right, you do your drills,
you go to the gym.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
That's pretty common.
Speaker 4 (18:23):
But tell us what working hard means and really prepping
and elevating yourself in the world broadcasting. Are you're watching
more games? Is it relationships? Is it conversations? Tell me
a little bit about that.
Speaker 5 (18:33):
That's a great question because there's so many things and
there's a difference in learning how to be great in
a different field. You can bring a work ethic, but
you also have to learn where to channel it, Let's say,
from work ethic for me is watching people that I
respect and that I think are good at the job
or better at the job than I am, are in
a place where I want to get. I would say
(18:54):
Nate Burlison is one of the guys that I've gotten
to know. Awesome, awesome guy over at CB. There's people
in this space that I've worked again, Michael Strahan. He
was another New York guy around the same time of us,
so I've gotten to know him a little bit when
I was younger. I've watched his ascension Ryan Clark at ESPN,
with those guys that you're like, oh, those guys are
(19:16):
putting in the time, whether it's how they speak, whether
that how they communicate. So that to me, watching those
guys and saying, Okay, what are they doing? Well, why
did they win the Emmy? All of these things, that's
for me is work ethics. The same that when you
watch Michael Jordan, you're like, oh, I want to go
practice my fade away to be like him, because that's
an unstoppable move. So the work ethic then changes to Okay,
(19:39):
who's great at this job? How do I learn from
them what do they do well? So that's one step
of just the skill level of the professional. The next
part is obviously your prep, your prep, your reference understanding. Like, Okay,
I'm watching all the games, I'm reading articles, I'm reading
books about past grades and what impacted them. So you
(20:01):
can have reference points for the viewer. Right, you can
know basketball, but if you're like, hey, in Bill Russell's
book it said X, and this is something that Jalen
Brown has talked about, like that reference point just carries
so much weight. And then the next part I would be,
there's a cadence. There's a cadence to how you speak.
How you speak on a podcast is different than if
(20:23):
you're hosting a show. It's different than if you're being
an analyst. It's different than if you're calling a game.
All of them have different cadences. How long you have
to speak, how clear and concise, don't use twelve words
when you can use nine. Those are things that now
that's a different skill. And then you start to watch
the people that are great at it. Like I said again,
I mentioned Nate and Ryan and some of these guys.
(20:46):
Those are the guys that I'm like, oh, those guys,
I see exactly what they're doing. One random talk. Ryan
Clark won the m ME a couple of years ago,
and I'm giving him some love because he's outstanding and
he's somebody that I'm like, Oh, he's putting in the time,
putting in the work. I noticed that he took out
every filler word. I was watching his two minute segments
on Scott van Pelt and I was like, he didn't
(21:09):
say one um, he didn't say one ah, he didn't
say you know, there was no filler words. So I
texted him and I know that there's no way to
do that without work. If you study this, this job,
if you study this, there's no way to do that
without work. So I go, I see what you're doing.
That's really impressive. How did you do it? He said Richard,
I had to slow down the way I speak every
(21:31):
single day, and sometimes it makes you feel like an idiot,
but I had to slow down the way I speak.
So I don't speak on air one way, speak on
like just with my people one way. Right, there's a difference.
But that was one of the things. And so to
watch a guy like that, notice what he was doing
and how he was doing it and him to say,
if this is what you want, you have to change
(21:51):
the way you speak across all platforms, and that can
help you get rid of the ums in the ohs.
And that stuff to me is like next level that
people don't even really process in this industry.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Yeah, that's amazing.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
And Richard, one thing that I'm always interested in and
Alex and I've talked a lot about this on this
show and offline is the idea of getting into the
booth or getting on the sideline and you know, having
to be critical, having to you know, talk about people
that you know, people that you're friends with, people that
(22:24):
you played with, you know, former teammates, people you admire,
and you know, being truthful. That's what I want to hear.
I want to hear the real stuff from someone like you.
Was that easy for you to do? Was it hard
for you to do? How do you master the art
of being honest without coming off like a jerk?
Speaker 5 (22:43):
This is where I will say I have an advantage,
and I recognize my advantage. I try and acknowledge it.
I've always been crazy. I've always been this person. So
whether if I was on your team, while the media
might not have known it while like I wasn't really
on social media, so they might. Every teammate of mine
has always known, oh that's Richard. You just know he's
gonna say some whiles, even opponents, because I never really
(23:05):
talked trash on the court. I might say sarcastic things,
but I was never so when the NBA community knows
you as such, and I played in the league for
seventeen years, the people in the NBA know that, all
my teammates over the years and coaches, it was just
I was always just that, like sarcastic, like ball breaker.
So now when I get into the media space, I
(23:26):
only talk on television like I would talk to a
player if I was sitting next to him on a bench.
That's always my rule. What would I say to you
if I was sitting next to the bench. And sometimes
I would sit next to people on the bench and
be like that was a trash shot like that.
Speaker 1 (23:41):
Come on you, come on you, And they know.
Speaker 5 (23:44):
That it's coming from a place of like sarcasm and funny.
So when you get grandfathered in to kind of that.
And I would never compare it to Charles and would
never compare it to Shaq. But like Charles's reputation preceded
him and then the media got to get a hold
of that. That's just always who's Charles's been. I've always
been just like a sarcastic joker. So it doesn't matter
if you knew me at Arizona, if you knew me
(24:07):
in the McDonald's game, if you knew me you know
at year fifteen. I was always that person. I'm just
now being able to convey that to the public and
do it in a joking way.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
I want to shift a little bit if we can, to.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
Life sort of beyond basketball, because you've you've taken on
a lot of entrepreneurial activities as well.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
How do you pick and choose?
Speaker 3 (24:29):
I know this is something Alex thinks about a lot
in terms of his portfolio and the diversity of that,
Like how do you go about it?
Speaker 5 (24:36):
I'm still learning right and now I have a much
I have more time. Like sports can be all consuming,
We're like you're consumed, Biden, you have a couple other
side projects. Alex's next level because he was building an
empire while also being super locked in. I was more
locked in and just had other interests. I think for me,
(24:56):
I've picked up on trends here and there. I started
doing some social media stuff when I was with the Cavs,
and I noticed how much people were loving the behind
the scenes, and that kind of let me say, maybe
I should start a podcast, Maybe I should do this.
Now this was in twenty sixteen, but not a lot
of people knew what it was. And we started on
the road. Channing fry, Ally Clifton and myself. We were
(25:17):
one of the first like sports podcasts, and people were
what is this And it was a changing of the media, and.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
We were one of the first.
Speaker 5 (25:24):
And then I'll say even with like my yoga studio,
because you kind of pick up on trends. I was
living in Santa Monica, and if you got people know La,
there's kind of like a bubble. There's a Hermosa Manhattan
Redondo Beach bubble, then there's Santa Monica, Venice. So I
was living in Santa Monica, Venice and there's a beautiful
yoga studio there, and you know, I was training doing that.
More and more athletes were loving yoga. I really got
(25:46):
into it, and I had multiple friends that were driving
from Hermosa Manhattan Beach up to Santa Monica, and I'm like,
what are you guys coming up here for? There's like, well,
there's no nice yoga studio down in the South Bank.
Then I was on a plane and somebody there was
a young lady that oh, I go to Hot eight
up in here in Santa Mona, and I was just
like wow. More and more people, I was like, why
(26:08):
not open this business? It seems like an opportunity LA.
For most of Manhattan Beach Reredondo Beach, that's the most
fit area of LA. And LA is the most fit
city in the world. So I looked at it from like, wait,
there's an opportunity here. So me and my friend we
started doing the numbers. We started trying to see what
this would look like.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
It was.
Speaker 5 (26:28):
I don't know anything about a small business. I didn't
know anything about yoga or running a I didn't know anything.
But I recognized an opportunity, and I recognized that there
was somewhat of a hole in the market of the
most fit area of LA, in the most fit city
in the world. They didn't have something that I think
the community could really like, and so we opened it.
(26:49):
We went through, you know, years of research, and we
did all this stuff. We found the location, and there
was so much success, and we were very blessed and
very fortunate because of the community. But there was success
because I truly felt like we were solving a problem
that did exist. If people didn't have to drive thirty
minutes anymore and they could drive ten, they could drive five,
(27:10):
that's what we offered to them. And then from there
I learned so much. We've been blessed with the success
there as a small business, but that has been probably
the single greatest thing, and probably my most proudest is
that I took something that I knew nothing about. I
recognize an opportunity and then obviously came through and had
(27:30):
success with it.
Speaker 4 (27:31):
Rich I love that, and I really admire guys like
you where I call them three dimensional career and where
you've mastered hoops, you've mastered media, and now you're trying
to master the third leg, which is business and entrepreneurship.
You know, Warren Buffett always taught me that eighty percent
is planning and showing up and twenty percent is execution.
(27:54):
When you think about Rich Jefferson, Inc. Five sevent ten
years from now, what are your dreams? What are you for?
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Casting man?
Speaker 5 (28:01):
There truly, And this is where you know I've really gravitated.
And I'm appreciative of you, Alex, because I've always watched,
you know me now personally as an observer. So when
I tell you I've observed for a very long time,
that's just kind of like how my brain works. I'm
always constantly observing different things in different places. For me,
(28:21):
in five to ten years, it's just a well rounded portfolio.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
To say.
Speaker 5 (28:25):
At least I've owned some apartment buildings with good friends,
and there's been talks of a possible development there, but
just some sing you know, some multifamily units. I have
my own podcast, which I own. I have a business,
and you know, one of those things is I've heard
there's a bunch of business sayings. But it's like, you're
not really making money unless you're making money while you're
(28:47):
not working, right or while you're sleeping.
Speaker 1 (28:50):
And I think about the yoga studio.
Speaker 5 (28:52):
I go in there twice a week, I take yoga,
but I'm not a part of the everyday infrastructure, so
that thing is just an income that I get to.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
And so then you're like, oh.
Speaker 5 (29:03):
I see this, How can I duplicate this, whether it's
a chain of that, whether it's finding another hole in
the market, the same kind of like listening to the
community of what was lacking, That same kind of conversation
is out there about other things. I didn't know anything
about yoga and we were able to be successful. So
for me, I just look at it like in five
ten years, I want a level of growth. I want
(29:24):
to be able to be even more well rounded in
the financial space and just a better understanding of what's
going on in the world. As you know, just understanding
the world right now is a very financially dangerous or
financially beneficial place, depending on how you're observing it and
how you're interacting with it.
Speaker 4 (29:43):
So rich when it comes to some of the players
that you coming out of Arizona mirrored and admired and
perhaps mentor to you, maybe give me a name or
two there. My guy in the business world was Magic
and he has had such a print in my business career,
post pre and post retirement. Who are some of the
(30:04):
guys that you've looked up in your sport.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
Man, There's so many. That's a good one.
Speaker 5 (30:09):
I think if you're really trying to improve yourself as
a human being, you take something from everyone. It doesn't
matter if it's a quote, it doesn't matter if it's
a line. It's like I take something like Alex, I'll
give you your flowers, like I look to you and
just people don't. I had a meeting and let me
just give out Alex some flowers. We had worked with
the same social media team, even though we had known
(30:30):
each other, but that was the first time we were
able to start having more interactions and went to Alex's
house to have a meeting with them, just talk. We
talked tubes, we hung out, and he had a business
meeting that he was doing right after, and he was like, Richard,
I think you should stay for this business meeting. And
it was just on their deck they were having lunch,
and it was didn't know anything that these human beings
(30:50):
were saying. It was so outside. I knew what they
were discussing, but it was the connections. And they spent
fifteen minutes talking, Oh do you know so and so,
Oh yeah, I've worked with them and we've in this
And all of a sudden, I'm getting a bird's eye
view of this amazing conversation that Alex not only like
allowed me, invited me to and knew that I would
(31:11):
like just be blown away and that impact. Like again, Alex,
I don't know if you if I've really conveyed. I
know I said thank you and I appreciate it, but
just to be here in this moment and say thank
you for that and like that to me is when
you get yourself in these positions. And then to have
a guy like Alex, say, Richard a great talking basketball
(31:31):
would you like to sit in on this meeting that
I'm about to have on some investments, and You're like, yeah,
I would love to. And then to learn so much
in such a short conversation, and I didn't say a word.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
I just stood on the side.
Speaker 5 (31:45):
And was just like, Okay, they're talking about numbers that
I have not really talked about before in my life.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Those are the things that like.
Speaker 5 (31:53):
I'm appreciative of view Alex, because that opened my mind.
That opened my thirst and hunger even more for wanting
to understand more of the business side and the financial
side and really just improving what I feel like I
can accomplish there. So when I say people that I've
looked to like You're one of those people. And that's
why when you invited me to that next level. Oh
(32:15):
it was. It was a very very special special time.
Speaker 4 (32:19):
Oh well, that was my pleasure, Jason. I got to
tell you The one thing about rich just to give
them a little props back, is most athletes will come in,
they got three other things to do and they move on,
or they may say I'll catch the next meeting. But
for him to sit there and stand there and put
into time, that's why I think rich is going to
have such a phenomenal career in that third leg, which
(32:39):
is business and entrepreneurship.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
So, Richard, one thing that you know you've been open
and honest about is a bad experience, which is basically
someone who worked with you completely took advantage of you.
Now under you know, criminal indictment. You know, Alex talks
all the time about, you know, the team he surrounds
himself with. Athletes are very vulnerable candidly because of the
(33:15):
amount of money that you guys make. I know it
is it has brought you to really want to help
people with financial literacy.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Can you tell us a little bit about you.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
Have to dance around it?
Speaker 2 (33:25):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (33:25):
Yes, stole a bunch of money and swindled me. Right,
you don't have to dance around here.
Speaker 1 (33:29):
I can see.
Speaker 5 (33:29):
It's like, so you've been it's okay, okay, it's okay.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
No, no, no, yeah it was.
Speaker 2 (33:36):
But someone stole a bunch of money from you, a.
Speaker 5 (33:38):
Lot of money. They sold a lot of money. There's
two things, and again everybody's different. So I just say
from my experience, one, I look at myself from like,
how did I get over it? One? I was fortunate
where I had another five seven years left of my career,
so like, obviously my saving and my spending was never crazy.
But I also look at it when it went down
and the stuff I look at it from a sp
(34:01):
If you would have told me the day I got
drafted that I would own my home, my mom and
dad would own their home, and neither of us would
have to work again, I would sign up. It doesn't
matter if you got one hundred million in the bank,
you got five million in the bank, you got twenty
doesn't matter.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
If that's the goal is to change your life.
Speaker 5 (34:19):
My life was changed, right, That's how I kept myself
not being like woe with me. I believe that I
had future earning potentials, and honestly, sometimes it's about your ls.
Speaker 1 (34:30):
So that situation.
Speaker 5 (34:31):
I was a very young man and he had forged
the power of attorney, and he was kind of cooking
the books. And my parents with no financial really understanding
me with very little because I just knew my spending
it was under control given the amounts of money that
I was making. So he was more cooking the books,
cooking the books. And just like a lot of people,
when two thousand and eight and that financial crisis hit
(34:54):
and everyone started checking their books to make sure everything
was good, it was like, wait a second, something's not right,
and you know again. I think athletes also one of
the reasons why I like talking about it is because
I think athletes are afraid to say there's an ego,
there's a machismo of like, hey, I got taken, I
got swindled, something happened. I think it's better to talk
(35:16):
about it. I think it's better to have these discussions
of how this happened. And so for me, that's what happened.
I was a part of an FBI investigation and wirefraud,
and we were doing wire taps and it was all
sorts of stuff to see what this individual was doing
and what I probably learned most from that and I
value that because you can make mistakes twenty to thirty,
(35:38):
you don't want to make mistakes fifty to sixty. You
don't want to know. Those are the areas where you
want to be a lot less risky. You don't want
to be so for me to be like, hey, I
made these mistakes. What did I learn? I tell everybody this,
all the young men. Always have two financial advisors. You
make enough money, right, have two financial advisors. Have them
check each other's work. If you don't know about this,
(36:00):
someone could be cooking the books. You can be looking
at it. This is what your bank account says this
and you have no idea. But if you have two
different people from two different places that maybe you send
seventy percent, maybe you send thirty percent, whatever it is,
at least they're able to check each other's work and
hold each other accountable because they don't benefit from each other.
That's the one thing that I learned. I'm like, oh,
(36:21):
all of my situation, all of my money, will, all
of my portfolio will not be with one person because
if that person goes Bernie made off, if that person
goes crazy, And.
Speaker 1 (36:30):
That's what I would tell people.
Speaker 5 (36:31):
As an athlete, It's like, if Bernie made Off can
steal forty billion dollars from the richest, smartest, most intelligent
financial people in the world, Who the hell am I
to think that I can't get my money taken? Everyone can,
So you learn your financial literacy starts to go up
and understanding of it.
Speaker 1 (36:48):
So that's really you know, it was a terrible situation.
Speaker 5 (36:51):
I've kept a blessed perspective about it and the lessons
that it learned, and I just try and help give
people information about it.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
So we're going to get to our lightning round in
the second.
Speaker 3 (37:00):
But one thing I before before we get to that,
I did want to talk about, because it's sort of
dovetails with all of this, is you know, rich you
went to a story you.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Know, college and played basketball.
Speaker 3 (37:12):
You know Ludelson obviously like a legendary coach at the
University of Arizona. As you look back at the college game, now,
I have to think about a lot of the warnings
that you're giving with Nil with the transfer portal. How
much do you worry about sort of the state of
the college basketball business at this point, and is there
(37:33):
anything that we can do in your mind to ensure
that those players remain financially safe. I'm sort of leading
you here because I'm giving you some of my own
feelings obviously, like what needs to happen here to ensure
that you know everybody turns out okay?
Speaker 5 (37:50):
Well, one great question, Jason. I think people sometimes like, oh, well,
why do you?
Speaker 2 (37:55):
Why do you?
Speaker 5 (37:55):
Why are people I wouldn't say like, for my opinion,
it's because basketball change my life. The sport changed my life.
So I care about how the sport is not only played,
but the environment in which the younger athletes are navigating.
I care about that because I know what it meant
for me and what it did for me, and I
(38:16):
wanted to do that for other young men and women.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
I think the nil thing is scary.
Speaker 5 (38:21):
I'll tell you just again from my own financial space,
my biggest worry is taxes.
Speaker 1 (38:25):
Right, all these kids.
Speaker 5 (38:26):
Are getting all this money, and we know the IRS
doesn't come until all the money's gone. And they're like, oh,
by the way, you owe s two hundred fifty thousand
dollars in taxes. That's the part that I want to
make sure that is being communicated. When you're getting one
hundred thousand dollars check and you're getting this and you
just you're twenty one, twenty two, and if your parents
don't come from that, like even if schools are teaching
(38:47):
you financial literacy, if you don't fully have experience and understand,
and then I just don't think there's enough good people
to help navigate them. Do they have the right financials advisors?
Speaker 1 (38:57):
Do they have? And we know it's just littered with crooks. Actually,
because you have.
Speaker 5 (39:00):
A new two hundred three hundred people that now can
get millions of dollars, that brings in all the crooks
and all the jerks and all those idiots. For me,
I think there still needs to be regulation. I think
the NCUBA they dropped the ball. They had a monopoly,
they wanted to continue using that monopoly. The Supreme Court
said okay, enough is enough, and then all the right
(39:22):
wheels and regulations just came off and it just became
the wild wide West. Well that's not good either. The
way the nc DOUBLEA had it before is not good.
The way it is now is not good. They need
to come up with some sort of regulation, some sort
of group that says, hey, this is what you can.
We can't have kids transferring from schools. Every single year
to try and get the highest bidder, and then all
(39:44):
of a sudden they don't graduate college. That's not that's
not the goal of this. And so I don't know
baseball has a good formula where if you go to college,
you got to be there for three years, even though
a team can draft you and hold your rights. There's
a lot of different things, and I think the nc DOUBLEA,
because it is a feeder for the NBA, the NBA
should have some sort of idea or work with the
(40:07):
NCAA is like, we don't want all of this chaos
that's going on. I love that the players are making money,
but Alex you know this, Jason, you know this. Just
because everyone's making money doesn't mean it's a good environment.
It could be a toxic environment that can lead to
things ten to fifteen years down the road.
Speaker 2 (40:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
Well, I mean my own view of it, you know,
having done a little bit of work around this is
candidly what we actually need and what could help solve
this problem.
Speaker 2 (40:34):
And not to put more work on your shoulders.
Speaker 3 (40:36):
Rich is like, I think we need more former athletes
involved in this who actually understand the rigors of it
and the traps and the cons and also the upside.
So hopefully that comes to fruition because it's it's a
tough position.
Speaker 5 (40:51):
Another thing where Alex might know. Recently Arizona just left
and went to the Big twelve.
Speaker 1 (40:56):
Big twelve. Yeah, Big twelve.
Speaker 3 (40:58):
It's still confusing to me, right because I know and
and honestly, it could change tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (41:03):
It could change tomorrow.
Speaker 5 (41:04):
But the commissioner there is Brett Yormark, who used to
work in New York, used to work with the Nets,
and so yeah, he invited me to be a part
of the alumni council as a representative for Arizona. It
was myself and Jenny Finch as representatives from Arizona to
be a part of an alumni council to kind of
bring that The goal is to give that former athlete
(41:24):
opinion and to be in that space. So I'm not
just talking about it. I'm being about it, and I'm
trying to be a part of these panels and I'm
working these things so that I can have a positive
voice and an impact when the time does come.
Speaker 2 (41:47):
All right, let's do the lightning ground.
Speaker 1 (41:49):
Let's go.
Speaker 2 (41:51):
Let's do it, all right, So five questions. You know
how to do this. I'll start and then now so
we'll pick it up.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
All right, here we go go.
Speaker 3 (41:58):
What's the best piece of ad you've ever received on
deal making your business?
Speaker 5 (42:03):
Rob Mayler, one of my brothers, said, set your price
and live your life. Don't argue, don't fight on this.
If this is your number, if this is your mark,
set it. Maybe you have to adjust it at times,
but set your price and live your life.
Speaker 4 (42:16):
Don't stress. Who's your dream deal making partner?
Speaker 1 (42:21):
Oh that's a good one, dream deal making partner. Espn. Okay, okay.
Speaker 2 (42:29):
What's the most nervous you've ever been?
Speaker 5 (42:31):
Most nervous I've ever been was actually in the slam
dunk contest that I did in two thousand and four.
Speaker 1 (42:36):
It was horrific.
Speaker 5 (42:36):
I was terrible, but that spotlight and that was the
first you know, you've done some of these things. But
then all of a sudden, it's like, all right, Richard
jeffersonid lights go down, all of the arenas there and.
Speaker 1 (42:48):
It's just like, whoa this is?
Speaker 5 (42:51):
This is kind of intense, and Amari I apologize, right,
we're gonna I'm gonna tell him storry. So Mari's Sidemeyer.
We were both in the Dunk Contest and we were
sitting next week and he was even I was twenty three,
he was even younger than me, and he was like,
I don't think I've ever been so nervous.
Speaker 1 (43:05):
I'm like, bro me neither. This is trippy.
Speaker 5 (43:07):
This, you know, because you're still a kid, You're still
a fan. Right when you're twenty three, you can't even
believe you're in the NBA and all of a sudden
you're in the Dunk Contest that you've watched your whole life,
and you're like, yeah, this has been intense, so that
might be high high.
Speaker 2 (43:19):
It's amazing.
Speaker 4 (43:20):
Speaking of intents, what's your hype song before a big
meeting or negotiation?
Speaker 5 (43:25):
Ooh Dreams Nightmares by meek Mail meek Mail Dreams Nightmares.
Speaker 1 (43:31):
That that just is like, let's go, let's go, all right.
Speaker 3 (43:34):
Last question, what's your advice for someone who wants a
career like yours?
Speaker 5 (43:38):
Don't be afraid to fail, Like My confidence comes because
I have no problem taking an l getting back up
on my feed. I come from nothing. I'm from Glendale, Arizona.
My parents didn't play sports, my brothers didn't play sports.
I found basketball. I liked it believed in myself, and
then once you believed in yourself, you should just continue
(43:58):
doing that and whatever field or whatever thing that you do.
So that's all I've done. I don't know. I don't
have any broadcasting background, but if you've listened to this,
you know, I study people, I learn from people, I
support people and say, hey, you're doing a great job.
If you've kind of followed that blueprint over a long
period of time, in stack days and weeks and hours
and months and years, you will have success.
Speaker 1 (44:20):
It's literally impossible.
Speaker 5 (44:23):
To not have success, but it is possible to not
put in the work.
Speaker 3 (44:29):
Well, great, great stuff. Thank you so much, Richard Jefferson.
You are a legend. We love watching and listening to you,
and it was great to go deep in your career
and get a sense of your ambition.
Speaker 2 (44:40):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 5 (44:40):
Thanks rich Thank you. Thank you both seriously man that
I appreciate you both.
Speaker 3 (44:53):
The Deal is hosted by Alex Rodriguez and me Jason Kelly.
This episode was made by Animazarakus, Stacey Wong, and Lizzie
Philip Amy. Keen is our editor and Will Connelly is
our video editor. Our theme music is made by Blake Maples.
Our executive producers are Kelly Leferrier, Ashley Hoenig, and Brendan
neonham Sage Bauman is the head of Bloomberg Podcasts. Additional
(45:15):
support from Rachel Carnivale and Elena Los Angeles. Thanks so
much for listening to the deal. If you have a minute, subscribe,
rate and review our show. It'll help other listeners find us.
I'm Jason Kelly. See you next week.
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Hi everyone, welcome back to the Deal.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
I'm your host, Jason Kelly alongside my partner Alex Rodriguez.
All right, I'm only a few miles from you. I'm
one spring break, but you know, I miss you too much.
I can't not be on this podcast. Plus, there's way
too much happening in the world of sports to take
a break. So I'm at Miami Beach. I'm on Miami Beach.
I get her on Sunday with my family.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
We land. Everybody wants to go to the beach.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
I'm not going to the beach Sunday afternoon because I'm
watching the Masters.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Holy guacamole. What a tournament you must have been watching.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
I think everybody who's watching.
Speaker 4 (00:48):
And look, I know we're going to talk a little
bit about the numbers, but whatever these numbers are, I
would double at a triple because every human that I've
spoken to, every office on Monday was talking about the
Masters and Rory and the and the comeback, and it
had a little bit of everything.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
It's painful to say.
Speaker 4 (01:05):
It reminded me of the slow train wreck we had
in two thousand and four against the Red SOX because
the fans, the players, the media, everyone knew where it
was going and we were not able to do. What
Rory McElroy did was turned this whole thing around like
a Titanic, like an avalanche, and to go off on
eighteen and then to do an absolute gem for Birdie
(01:25):
to win it.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
That was awesome.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
It was unbelievable.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
I mean, I was like standing up, sitting down, I'm
like shouting at the TV. You know, my wife and
I were totally engaged. Our daughter wants to go have dinner.
We're like, no, no, no, no, we can't go.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
We can't go.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
But as you say, like the drama of it unbelievably
good for the game of golf and the business of golf.
It couldn't have happened at a better place. The Masters
obviously beyond iconic. So here are the numbers that are
really important in this case, highest rating, highest number of viewership,
or highest viewership in seven years. It was the best
(02:00):
performing non NFL sporting event for Paramount Plus ever.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
And as you say, everyone who's watching, and I think you're.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Right to say double or triple because I've probably watched
the highlight on ESPN on the espn app like fifty
times of him winning it. So I have to ask you,
from an athlete's perspective, how do you pull it together?
Because he made some pretty bad mistakes over the course
of that round, and especially that putt that he missed
(02:29):
toward the end. As someone who has been in a
position to have to like pick yourself up and like,
in your case, go back to the plate, how do
you do it?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
What's in your head?
Speaker 4 (02:39):
It's very hard, Jason, And look, he is ironic that
his worst two holes could have been one and eighteen,
a double one one to let you know, Bryson the shamba,
get back in the race and par right away.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
There were even after one.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
And then to close with what looked like a very
simple shot one hundred twenty five out put the ball
on the green two putt and you have the green jacket,
and he could not do that. I think it tells
you a lot about his makeup. It tells you a
lot about the pattern recognition, the reps. And here's the
guy who's thirty five, who's been there. And when you
(03:15):
look at his press conference and you heard him, you
felt the agony, but what you really saw was someone
who had more relief than happiness. And I felt the
same way when we finally got it done in O nine.
But I think it's just a lot of mental strength,
fortitude and willpower. And it was impressive to do because
most people would fold and they'll get him next.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Year, I know, and I mean and just like the
ability to be essentially be a goldfish and just forget
what happened before and just go out and hit the
next shot. And by the way, on that first playoff hole,
I know we're going really deep on this, but I'm
so obsessed with it. But it's like on that first
playoff hole, like from a competitive perspective, Rose hits an
(03:56):
unbelievable approach himself, and then McElroy hits an even better way. Anyway,
it was just amazing. It was amazing to see the
history around all of it. You and I both love golf.
We want what's best for the game. This is going
to help grow the game, and I just think it's great.
Speaker 4 (04:12):
There was a lot of anxiety. I don't know if
you felt anxiety. I felt anxiety for Rory. That's one.
Oh yeah, and the great Marianna Rivera, my former teammate,
who was the greatest close of all time, Jason. He
would always say to me, great closers must have short
term memory, and that's exactly applies for what Rory had
to do. Short term memory with an off fight team
(04:33):
and to come back and shoot at Dart and then
make Birdie pretty awesome.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Unbelievable, really really unbelievable. All right.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
So I came to Miami, of course via Swarthworeris watched
my son play lacrosse, because as you know, that's like
every weekend this spring. It's my last spring. You won't
have to hear me talk about it anymore after this season.
After just a few weeks, the senior games coming up
this weekend. I can't believe it anyway, but I went
to Swarthmore after going to the Duke Sports Business Conference.
This is something you had participated and I believe virtually
(05:01):
very first year that they did it. Back in twenty twenty,
I was at the fifth edition. Listen to the lineup.
It was unbelievable. Larry Fitzgerald opens, Rich Climban closed. I'm
sort of in there in the middle, but I was
with laurigeent Tilley. She founded espnW. She was the chief
marketing officer for ESPN. She was unbelievable. Andrew Yaffi, who's
the CEO of Dude Perfect, was also a longtime NBA executive,
(05:24):
did the whole social media strategy for the NBA.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
He was on the panel as well. It was super fun.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
It's amazing how much you and I both see this
so much. It's amazing the interest at the undergraduate and
the graduate level. People want to work in sports. And
of course these duke students, they're very smart, as we know,
and they are ready to go in the world of sports.
So it was really fun to be there. So you
and I need to be there at the same time.
At some point, maybe we'll get Coach k or Grant
(05:52):
Hill or somebody to join us there one day.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
I would love that.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
And look, I think there's nothing like being on campus.
I loved that as a IF annual. I think there's
a vibration in these colleges that are awesome. I'm on
my way, by the way on Thursday to Michigan because
my daughter has a Titanic play I gotta go watch,
and this morning she gave me the cliff.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Notes, so I'm not lost, so I can relate with that.
Speaker 4 (06:14):
But I think when we grew up, Jason and you
grew up in Atlanta, I grew up in Miami. You
looked at the major three sports, basketball, football, and baseball.
Today there's like a fourth or fifth sport, and that's
the business of media, sports and culture, exactly what we
cover here on the Deal. And there's more interest. Everywhere
I travel there's someone that says you and Jason love
(06:35):
the Deal. They talk about it more than like the
Yankees or the Masters. It's really impressive the young people,
how much interest they have in this world that we're
trying to, you know, collect every every single week.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Yeah, no, it is.
Speaker 3 (06:46):
It is interesting to hear people and to talk about
the ecosystem and everything that's happening around that. For sure,
you're in Minnesota watching your temper Wolves close out the
regular season with a nice win over the Jazz. Sunday
was insane going into Sunday, like seeing everything that was
at stake, all the seeding, especially in the West that
was happening. What was it like in the Target Center,
(07:06):
Like what was the vibe as it was all coming together?
Speaker 1 (07:10):
Yeah, in a weird way.
Speaker 4 (07:11):
I Mean, we've talked about the NCAA brackets and obviously
the great work you do for charity. It felt like
a Final four vibe, or at least a bracket NC
doublea basketball. There was so much excitement. This is the
first weekend that I've ever been involved in sports where
on Thursday we.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
Didn't know if we're going to be the eighth seed
or the third seed.
Speaker 4 (07:30):
Right usually that's defined months before, and it was so exciting.
Our fan base was awesome. They showed up in a
big way. Thank goodness. We were able to win Friday
and Sunday, but the big highlight game was Clippers versus
Golden State and that went into overtime. I'm sure the
ratings you saw go from like seven eight million people
watching the Masters to like.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Nineteen at peak. I bet that a big audience.
Speaker 4 (07:55):
Once Golden State lost that game, they kind of flipped
over to the Masters and it was like the perfect storm.
But it was a great weekend for sports, great weekend
for the NBA, great weekend for golf, and we were
all lucky to watch it.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
Yeah, totally all right, so many more sports to come.
We're getting into the heart of the heart of the season,
where you know, baseball is really getting underway in a
meaningful way. You know, one thing we should note our
friend Kaitlyn goo Over at League one volleyball.
Speaker 2 (08:20):
They closed out.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
Their season the first inaur Guriral season we talked earlier.
Go back and listen to that. They did a great
job Austin the champions for League one Volleyball.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
WNBA is going to be getting underway.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
Your links looking really good as well, and some interesting
things happening with the draft. A lot of attention paid
to the draft. So speaking of basketball coming up in
the deal, we have Richard Jefferson. He is the perfect
person to talk about as we get deep into playoff basketball.
He's now on the number one team for ESPN. I
love this guy. He is so fun he is. He's
(08:53):
a young guy, played seventeen years in the league, has
really made his way in a big way in the
broadcasting world. I mean, what a grinder, what a student
and a guy you've gotten to know a little bit.
Speaker 4 (09:03):
Yes, and Richard is a really really good guy. He's
a very talented person. We talked about the three headed
monster with him really mastering basketball, played in the NBA
for seventeen years, him now mastering media. He's now in
the first team at ESPN, which is incredible, and now
he's trying to tackle the third part, which is what
we cover his business. And I think because of his
(09:24):
communicating skills, because he's a guy that builds bridges, I
think he has an incredible opportunity to be as successful
as business as the prior to media in sports.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
Yeah, totally and interesting, you know to talk to him.
He's a very real guy.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
So hope you enjoyed this conversation coming up with Richard Jefferson.
We're so excited to have Richard Jefferson here with us.
Of course, former NBA player turned broadcaster, turned entorepreneur turned
(10:01):
empire builder.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Welcome to the show.
Speaker 5 (10:03):
Thanks for having me, guys, I'm excited. This is not
my normal podcast format, so that makes a little bit
more fun.
Speaker 3 (10:10):
I know we're putting you in the hot seat because
you're a podcaster as well. You know, you are a
jack of all trades, and you know, Alex, I feel
like it's such an interesting opportunity for both of us,
but especially you because is it like looking in a
mirror here, It really is.
Speaker 4 (10:24):
And you know, rich and I've become good friends and
I've really admired or the way he's gone about his
seventeen year career. He's got so many wonderful relationships in
the game, and he's the ultimate catalyst for building bridges,
not burning bridges, and I think that's going to help
him and serve him well in his career also in business.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
Wow, first of all, let's just slow down here, right,
that's a rod right there. I understand this. Like, I'm
not a New Yorker.
Speaker 5 (10:51):
I was drafted there, I lived there for a lot
of years. So to have a legend speak so highly
somebody that I've looked up to and watched and tracked,
and just watch all the moves that he's made on
you know, on and off the floor, court, field, whatever
the hell we're going to call it. Yeah, on and off.
It's been impressive. So thank you, Thank you well Rich.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
That's an interesting place to start because you come up
through a storied college program at University of Arizona.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
You you come into the.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
League, it feels like from the beginning you are thinking
of yourself very holistically, thinking of yourself as someone who
obviously has a lot of ambition on the court, but
because of what you were exposed to from a business perspective,
like was that the case that you were looking to
the A Rods and others of the world, and who
were you looking at.
Speaker 5 (11:39):
Well, you know, at that time, Alex and I didn't
really know each other, but it was one of those
things that when I got drafted, you get to New
York City. New York City is just the financial capital
of the world, and accidentally you meet people and you
have conversations with them, and you start to pick up things.
And I'm a twenty one year old kid with no
financial history, parent have no financial history, and all of
(12:01):
a sudden you're just put in rooms and you're friends
with owners. Now, how did this guy own the team?
And it's like, well he sold this, So all of
a sudden you start to get into rooms accidentally, and
then it's kind of what you do when you're in
those rooms that can kind of dictate your learning. I
learned very quickly, and a Rod knows this is that
when you are in the New York media, you don't
(12:25):
really say a lot. You don't say a lot, you
keep it very vanilla. And from there so you kind
of watch people and how they navigate and how they
kind of keep their stuff separate. But for me, individually.
The people that I look to were the people that
I had the luxury of getting to know. Ardie Rabin
is one of the people just being in rooms with him.
The Landises that were former owners of the Net still
(12:47):
friends with their family to this day. So it was
really just being in those rooms and getting to know
some people that have had tremendous amount of success in
random fields that you start to pick up tidbits from them.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
So, Richard, you have two.
Speaker 4 (13:01):
Of the great ingredients you need in business. That's wonderful
relationships and a really good communicator. When and how early
did you start thinking about relationships and communicating skills do matter?
Speaker 5 (13:13):
Probably in high school when we talk about just communication relationships.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
That's just who I was as a person.
Speaker 5 (13:18):
And then you kind of when you start to formulate
yourself as a young man, you're like, who do I
want to be? How do I want to be? How
do I want to walk in rooms? And everybody has
a different vibe. Some people want to walk into rooms
and be respected. Some people want to walk into rooms
and leave a mark. For me. When I want to
walk into a room, I want people to have a
good energy when I walk in because I like the
(13:41):
energy like that in the room. As a young man,
I kind of got into that, and then I started
to see over many years how that has now looking
back on my life, me just having good energy and
just being a good person and communicator. Fifteen years later,
people are coming up to me now with opportunities, saying, hey,
Rich you were so cool in two thousand and four
(14:04):
and now I'm the head of XYZ. I'd love to
do something with you, just because you were, you know,
a good dude.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
In that moment.
Speaker 5 (14:11):
You might not see these things in year one, year two,
but over multiple years, the relationships and the energy that
you've brought into rooms typically gets fed back to you.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
I'd love to talk about the transition, you know, out
of the league and into broadcasting. Was that something you
always wanted to do? Did opportunities immediately present themselves? How
does that transition happen? Because I know a little bit
about how it happened with Alex, but would love to
hear your story.
Speaker 5 (14:37):
Yeah, well, you know, Alex knows these things. It's a
lot about relationships. My guy, Flip, his guy from the
Yes Network who just retired. Flip had watched me with
the Yes Network. Frank de Grace who runs the NETS,
and so I had worked with him since I was.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
A rookie and for five straight years.
Speaker 5 (14:54):
When I was about to retire from year twelve on
flip and Frank de Grace would be like, Richard, we
want you to come back to the Yes Network. We
want you to come back here. And so for me,
I kind of had an idea like, Hey, I'm going
to retire. What am I going to do next? I
think I can go do this. You know, there's an insecurity,
but a curiosity and confidence, right, It's like you're not
afraid to fail, but like this is something that I
(15:15):
want to pursue. And so we talk about this the
relationships that I had built. I hadn't been with the
NETS for over a decade, but over those six years,
just being you know, a good person to the media,
being supportive of what they were trying to do. They
were the first to give me an opportunity. The Yes
Network and the NETS were the first like broadcast contract
that i'd signed.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
You're talking about John Philippelli right when you say.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
Yes, John Philippelli. Yeah, John, Yeah, for audience.
Speaker 5 (15:40):
He's just retired, but he's legend one of the first
people to be like, Richard, you could be great at this, right.
You know, you have those people that are like, reach,
would you be good? Frank DeGrace is one of those
people say you're good. But when it's just I guess
it's different from somebody that you feel like, oh, you're
just kind of fluffing me. You're just kind of messing
with me. You're not not messing with me, but you're
just kind of like telling me this in a manner
(16:01):
that's like you want me to work with you. So
Flip was a guy that I didn't know well, but
I knew he had been you.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Know, the guy.
Speaker 5 (16:09):
So for him to step out like Richard, I think
you can be amazing at this. You're like, well, this
guy's seen it all, so like I'm going to believe him.
And you know, like Alex, he's talked about his relationship
with you and how you probably have to speak a
little bit more to who Flip is because he's kind
of like this urban legend, right. People talk about him,
(16:29):
but people don't really get to see him often. But
he knows everything about that industry, in the broadcasting space
and the producing and all those things.
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Yeah, I mean John Philippelli we call him Flip. I
mean what he is is basically the Michael Jordan of producers.
He has over one hundred and twenty Emmy's, He's done
many world series. He kind of discovered Bob Costas and
many many others like you. He's given me a lot
of tips and encouragement. There's no one better. I mean,
he is the guy.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
But Rich.
Speaker 4 (16:58):
Going back to you, what was the common thread that
took you from Flip telling you, hey, Rich, you can
do this to I know I can do this and
I can actually make a.
Speaker 1 (17:08):
Career out of it.
Speaker 5 (17:09):
From there, it was there's a couple of things. One
being an athlete coming into this space. This is I
hate to say these things because I don't want to
be negative, but the bar was very very low. Not
from like a talent ability skill set, but like from
a level of let's say professionalism.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Do they show up on time? Will they work hard? Yes?
Speaker 5 (17:30):
They made one hundred million dollars? Are they going to
show up for this? You know, like five k date
on time and locked in and sharp. And then the
more I started to be like, okay, well you know this.
If you're going to do something, be great at it.
Don't don't just kind of do something casually unless it's
a hobby. If you're going to spend time on it,
try and be great. And once I kind of got that, Okay, Well,
(17:51):
people that I respect and see the industry respects are
saying that I have a chance to be good. I
have my own level of confidence, and now it's all
about my work ethic talent. If you don't work hard,
people will outwork you. So for me, once I got
into this industry, I approached it kind of like it
being an athlete and just like, how hard can I
work to see how great I can be?
Speaker 4 (18:13):
I love that rich But for our audience, let's bring
up behind the currents a little bit. We know what
working hard looks like in basketball, right, you do your drills,
you go to the gym.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
That's pretty common.
Speaker 4 (18:23):
But tell us what working hard means and really prepping
and elevating yourself in the world broadcasting. Are you're watching
more games? Is it relationships? Is it conversations? Tell me
a little bit about that.
Speaker 5 (18:33):
That's a great question because there's so many things and
there's a difference in learning how to be great in
a different field. You can bring a work ethic, but
you also have to learn where to channel it, Let's say,
from work ethic for me is watching people that I
respect and that I think are good at the job
or better at the job than I am, are in
a place where I want to get. I would say
(18:54):
Nate Burlison is one of the guys that I've gotten
to know. Awesome, awesome guy over at CB. There's people
in this space that I've worked again, Michael Strahan. He
was another New York guy around the same time of us,
so I've gotten to know him a little bit when
I was younger. I've watched his ascension Ryan Clark at ESPN,
with those guys that you're like, oh, those guys are
(19:16):
putting in the time, whether it's how they speak, whether
that how they communicate. So that to me, watching those
guys and saying, Okay, what are they doing? Well, why
did they win the Emmy? All of these things, that's
for me is work ethics. The same that when you
watch Michael Jordan, you're like, oh, I want to go
practice my fade away to be like him, because that's
an unstoppable move. So the work ethic then changes to Okay,
(19:39):
who's great at this job? How do I learn from
them what do they do well? So that's one step
of just the skill level of the professional. The next
part is obviously your prep, your prep, your reference understanding. Like, Okay,
I'm watching all the games, I'm reading articles, I'm reading
books about past grades and what impacted them. So you
(20:01):
can have reference points for the viewer. Right, you can
know basketball, but if you're like, hey, in Bill Russell's
book it said X, and this is something that Jalen
Brown has talked about, like that reference point just carries
so much weight. And then the next part I would be,
there's a cadence. There's a cadence to how you speak.
How you speak on a podcast is different than if
(20:23):
you're hosting a show. It's different than if you're being
an analyst. It's different than if you're calling a game.
All of them have different cadences. How long you have
to speak, how clear and concise, don't use twelve words
when you can use nine. Those are things that now
that's a different skill. And then you start to watch
the people that are great at it. Like I said again,
I mentioned Nate and Ryan and some of these guys.
(20:46):
Those are the guys that I'm like, oh, those guys,
I see exactly what they're doing. One random talk. Ryan
Clark won the m ME a couple of years ago,
and I'm giving him some love because he's outstanding and
he's somebody that I'm like, Oh, he's putting in the time,
putting in the work. I noticed that he took out
every filler word. I was watching his two minute segments
on Scott van Pelt and I was like, he didn't
(21:09):
say one um, he didn't say one ah, he didn't
say you know, there was no filler words. So I
texted him and I know that there's no way to
do that without work. If you study this, this job,
if you study this, there's no way to do that
without work. So I go, I see what you're doing.
That's really impressive. How did you do it? He said Richard,
I had to slow down the way I speak every
(21:31):
single day, and sometimes it makes you feel like an idiot,
but I had to slow down the way I speak.
So I don't speak on air one way, speak on
like just with my people one way. Right, there's a difference.
But that was one of the things. And so to
watch a guy like that, notice what he was doing
and how he was doing it and him to say,
if this is what you want, you have to change
(21:51):
the way you speak across all platforms, and that can
help you get rid of the ums in the ohs.
And that stuff to me is like next level that
people don't even really process in this industry.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Yeah, that's amazing.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
And Richard, one thing that I'm always interested in and
Alex and I've talked a lot about this on this
show and offline is the idea of getting into the
booth or getting on the sideline and you know, having
to be critical, having to you know, talk about people
that you know, people that you're friends with, people that
(22:24):
you played with, you know, former teammates, people you admire,
and you know, being truthful. That's what I want to hear.
I want to hear the real stuff from someone like you.
Was that easy for you to do? Was it hard
for you to do? How do you master the art
of being honest without coming off like a jerk?
Speaker 5 (22:43):
This is where I will say I have an advantage,
and I recognize my advantage. I try and acknowledge it.
I've always been crazy. I've always been this person. So
whether if I was on your team, while the media
might not have known it while like I wasn't really
on social media, so they might. Every teammate of mine
has always known, oh that's Richard. You just know he's
gonna say some whiles, even opponents, because I never really
(23:05):
talked trash on the court. I might say sarcastic things,
but I was never so when the NBA community knows
you as such, and I played in the league for
seventeen years, the people in the NBA know that, all
my teammates over the years and coaches, it was just
I was always just that, like sarcastic, like ball breaker.
So now when I get into the media space, I
(23:26):
only talk on television like I would talk to a
player if I was sitting next to him on a bench.
That's always my rule. What would I say to you
if I was sitting next to the bench. And sometimes
I would sit next to people on the bench and
be like that was a trash shot like that.
Speaker 1 (23:41):
Come on you, come on you, And they know.
Speaker 5 (23:44):
That it's coming from a place of like sarcasm and funny.
So when you get grandfathered in to kind of that.
And I would never compare it to Charles and would
never compare it to Shaq. But like Charles's reputation preceded
him and then the media got to get a hold
of that. That's just always who's Charles's been. I've always
been just like a sarcastic joker. So it doesn't matter
if you knew me at Arizona, if you knew me
(24:07):
in the McDonald's game, if you knew me you know
at year fifteen. I was always that person. I'm just
now being able to convey that to the public and
do it in a joking way.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
I want to shift a little bit if we can, to.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
Life sort of beyond basketball, because you've you've taken on
a lot of entrepreneurial activities as well.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
How do you pick and choose?
Speaker 3 (24:29):
I know this is something Alex thinks about a lot
in terms of his portfolio and the diversity of that,
Like how do you go about it?
Speaker 5 (24:36):
I'm still learning right and now I have a much
I have more time. Like sports can be all consuming,
We're like you're consumed, Biden, you have a couple other
side projects. Alex's next level because he was building an
empire while also being super locked in. I was more
locked in and just had other interests. I think for me,
(24:56):
I've picked up on trends here and there. I started
doing some social media stuff when I was with the Cavs,
and I noticed how much people were loving the behind
the scenes, and that kind of let me say, maybe
I should start a podcast, Maybe I should do this.
Now this was in twenty sixteen, but not a lot
of people knew what it was. And we started on
the road. Channing fry, Ally Clifton and myself. We were
(25:17):
one of the first like sports podcasts, and people were
what is this And it was a changing of the media, and.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
We were one of the first.
Speaker 5 (25:24):
And then I'll say even with like my yoga studio,
because you kind of pick up on trends. I was
living in Santa Monica, and if you got people know La,
there's kind of like a bubble. There's a Hermosa Manhattan
Redondo Beach bubble, then there's Santa Monica, Venice. So I
was living in Santa Monica, Venice and there's a beautiful
yoga studio there, and you know, I was training doing that.
More and more athletes were loving yoga. I really got
(25:46):
into it, and I had multiple friends that were driving
from Hermosa Manhattan Beach up to Santa Monica, and I'm like,
what are you guys coming up here for? There's like, well,
there's no nice yoga studio down in the South Bank.
Then I was on a plane and somebody there was
a young lady that oh, I go to Hot eight
up in here in Santa Mona, and I was just
like wow. More and more people, I was like, why
(26:08):
not open this business? It seems like an opportunity LA.
For most of Manhattan Beach Reredondo Beach, that's the most
fit area of LA. And LA is the most fit
city in the world. So I looked at it from like, wait,
there's an opportunity here. So me and my friend we
started doing the numbers. We started trying to see what
this would look like.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
It was.
Speaker 5 (26:28):
I don't know anything about a small business. I didn't
know anything about yoga or running a I didn't know anything.
But I recognized an opportunity, and I recognized that there
was somewhat of a hole in the market of the
most fit area of LA, in the most fit city
in the world. They didn't have something that I think
the community could really like, and so we opened it.
(26:49):
We went through, you know, years of research, and we
did all this stuff. We found the location, and there
was so much success, and we were very blessed and
very fortunate because of the community. But there was success
because I truly felt like we were solving a problem
that did exist. If people didn't have to drive thirty
minutes anymore and they could drive ten, they could drive five,
(27:10):
that's what we offered to them. And then from there
I learned so much. We've been blessed with the success
there as a small business, but that has been probably
the single greatest thing, and probably my most proudest is
that I took something that I knew nothing about. I
recognize an opportunity and then obviously came through and had
(27:30):
success with it.
Speaker 4 (27:31):
Rich I love that, and I really admire guys like
you where I call them three dimensional career and where
you've mastered hoops, you've mastered media, and now you're trying
to master the third leg, which is business and entrepreneurship.
You know, Warren Buffett always taught me that eighty percent
is planning and showing up and twenty percent is execution.
(27:54):
When you think about Rich Jefferson, Inc. Five sevent ten
years from now, what are your dreams? What are you for?
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Casting man?
Speaker 5 (28:01):
There truly, And this is where you know I've really gravitated.
And I'm appreciative of you, Alex, because I've always watched,
you know me now personally as an observer. So when
I tell you I've observed for a very long time,
that's just kind of like how my brain works. I'm
always constantly observing different things in different places. For me,
(28:21):
in five to ten years, it's just a well rounded portfolio.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
To say.
Speaker 5 (28:25):
At least I've owned some apartment buildings with good friends,
and there's been talks of a possible development there, but
just some sing you know, some multifamily units. I have
my own podcast, which I own. I have a business,
and you know, one of those things is I've heard
there's a bunch of business sayings. But it's like, you're
not really making money unless you're making money while you're
(28:47):
not working, right or while you're sleeping.
Speaker 1 (28:50):
And I think about the yoga studio.
Speaker 5 (28:52):
I go in there twice a week, I take yoga,
but I'm not a part of the everyday infrastructure, so
that thing is just an income that I get to.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
And so then you're like, oh.
Speaker 5 (29:03):
I see this, How can I duplicate this, whether it's
a chain of that, whether it's finding another hole in
the market, the same kind of like listening to the
community of what was lacking, That same kind of conversation
is out there about other things. I didn't know anything
about yoga and we were able to be successful. So
for me, I just look at it like in five
ten years, I want a level of growth. I want
(29:24):
to be able to be even more well rounded in
the financial space and just a better understanding of what's
going on in the world. As you know, just understanding
the world right now is a very financially dangerous or
financially beneficial place, depending on how you're observing it and
how you're interacting with it.
Speaker 4 (29:43):
So rich when it comes to some of the players
that you coming out of Arizona mirrored and admired and
perhaps mentor to you, maybe give me a name or
two there. My guy in the business world was Magic
and he has had such a print in my business career,
post pre and post retirement. Who are some of the
(30:04):
guys that you've looked up in your sport.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
Man, There's so many. That's a good one.
Speaker 5 (30:09):
I think if you're really trying to improve yourself as
a human being, you take something from everyone. It doesn't
matter if it's a quote, it doesn't matter if it's
a line. It's like I take something like Alex, I'll
give you your flowers, like I look to you and
just people don't. I had a meeting and let me
just give out Alex some flowers. We had worked with
the same social media team, even though we had known
(30:30):
each other, but that was the first time we were
able to start having more interactions and went to Alex's
house to have a meeting with them, just talk. We
talked tubes, we hung out, and he had a business
meeting that he was doing right after, and he was like, Richard,
I think you should stay for this business meeting. And
it was just on their deck they were having lunch,
and it was didn't know anything that these human beings
(30:50):
were saying. It was so outside. I knew what they
were discussing, but it was the connections. And they spent
fifteen minutes talking, Oh do you know so and so,
Oh yeah, I've worked with them and we've in this
And all of a sudden, I'm getting a bird's eye
view of this amazing conversation that Alex not only like
allowed me, invited me to and knew that I would
(31:11):
like just be blown away and that impact. Like again, Alex,
I don't know if you if I've really conveyed. I
know I said thank you and I appreciate it, but
just to be here in this moment and say thank
you for that and like that to me is when
you get yourself in these positions. And then to have
a guy like Alex, say, Richard a great talking basketball
(31:31):
would you like to sit in on this meeting that
I'm about to have on some investments, and You're like, yeah,
I would love to. And then to learn so much
in such a short conversation, and I didn't say a word.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
I just stood on the side.
Speaker 5 (31:45):
And was just like, Okay, they're talking about numbers that
I have not really talked about before in my life.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Those are the things that like.
Speaker 5 (31:53):
I'm appreciative of view Alex, because that opened my mind.
That opened my thirst and hunger even more for wanting
to understand more of the business side and the financial
side and really just improving what I feel like I
can accomplish there. So when I say people that I've
looked to like You're one of those people. And that's
why when you invited me to that next level. Oh
(32:15):
it was. It was a very very special special time.
Speaker 4 (32:19):
Oh well, that was my pleasure, Jason. I got to
tell you The one thing about rich just to give
them a little props back, is most athletes will come in,
they got three other things to do and they move on,
or they may say I'll catch the next meeting. But
for him to sit there and stand there and put
into time, that's why I think rich is going to
have such a phenomenal career in that third leg, which
(32:39):
is business and entrepreneurship.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
So, Richard, one thing that you know you've been open
and honest about is a bad experience, which is basically
someone who worked with you completely took advantage of you.
Now under you know, criminal indictment. You know, Alex talks
all the time about, you know, the team he surrounds
himself with. Athletes are very vulnerable candidly because of the
(33:15):
amount of money that you guys make. I know it
is it has brought you to really want to help
people with financial literacy.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Can you tell us a little bit about you.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
Have to dance around it?
Speaker 2 (33:25):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (33:25):
Yes, stole a bunch of money and swindled me. Right,
you don't have to dance around here.
Speaker 1 (33:29):
I can see.
Speaker 5 (33:29):
It's like, so you've been it's okay, okay, it's okay.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
No, no, no, yeah it was.
Speaker 2 (33:36):
But someone stole a bunch of money from you, a.
Speaker 5 (33:38):
Lot of money. They sold a lot of money. There's
two things, and again everybody's different. So I just say
from my experience, one, I look at myself from like,
how did I get over it? One? I was fortunate
where I had another five seven years left of my career,
so like, obviously my saving and my spending was never crazy.
But I also look at it when it went down
and the stuff I look at it from a sp
(34:01):
If you would have told me the day I got
drafted that I would own my home, my mom and
dad would own their home, and neither of us would
have to work again, I would sign up. It doesn't
matter if you got one hundred million in the bank,
you got five million in the bank, you got twenty
doesn't matter.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
If that's the goal is to change your life.
Speaker 5 (34:19):
My life was changed, right, That's how I kept myself
not being like woe with me. I believe that I
had future earning potentials, and honestly, sometimes it's about your ls.
Speaker 1 (34:30):
So that situation.
Speaker 5 (34:31):
I was a very young man and he had forged
the power of attorney, and he was kind of cooking
the books. And my parents with no financial really understanding
me with very little because I just knew my spending
it was under control given the amounts of money that
I was making. So he was more cooking the books,
cooking the books. And just like a lot of people,
when two thousand and eight and that financial crisis hit
(34:54):
and everyone started checking their books to make sure everything
was good, it was like, wait a second, something's not right,
and you know again. I think athletes also one of
the reasons why I like talking about it is because
I think athletes are afraid to say there's an ego,
there's a machismo of like, hey, I got taken, I
got swindled, something happened. I think it's better to talk
(35:16):
about it. I think it's better to have these discussions
of how this happened. And so for me, that's what happened.
I was a part of an FBI investigation and wirefraud,
and we were doing wire taps and it was all
sorts of stuff to see what this individual was doing
and what I probably learned most from that and I
value that because you can make mistakes twenty to thirty,
(35:38):
you don't want to make mistakes fifty to sixty. You
don't want to know. Those are the areas where you
want to be a lot less risky. You don't want
to be so for me to be like, hey, I
made these mistakes. What did I learn? I tell everybody this,
all the young men. Always have two financial advisors. You
make enough money, right, have two financial advisors. Have them
check each other's work. If you don't know about this,
(36:00):
someone could be cooking the books. You can be looking
at it. This is what your bank account says this
and you have no idea. But if you have two
different people from two different places that maybe you send
seventy percent, maybe you send thirty percent, whatever it is,
at least they're able to check each other's work and
hold each other accountable because they don't benefit from each other.
That's the one thing that I learned. I'm like, oh,
(36:21):
all of my situation, all of my money, will, all
of my portfolio will not be with one person because
if that person goes Bernie made off, if that person
goes crazy, And.
Speaker 1 (36:30):
That's what I would tell people.
Speaker 5 (36:31):
As an athlete, It's like, if Bernie made Off can
steal forty billion dollars from the richest, smartest, most intelligent
financial people in the world, Who the hell am I
to think that I can't get my money taken? Everyone can,
So you learn your financial literacy starts to go up
and understanding of it.
Speaker 1 (36:48):
So that's really you know, it was a terrible situation.
Speaker 5 (36:51):
I've kept a blessed perspective about it and the lessons
that it learned, and I just try and help give
people information about it.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
So we're going to get to our lightning round in
the second.
Speaker 3 (37:00):
But one thing I before before we get to that,
I did want to talk about, because it's sort of
dovetails with all of this, is you know, rich you
went to a story you.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Know, college and played basketball.
Speaker 3 (37:12):
You know Ludelson obviously like a legendary coach at the
University of Arizona. As you look back at the college game, now,
I have to think about a lot of the warnings
that you're giving with Nil with the transfer portal. How
much do you worry about sort of the state of
the college basketball business at this point, and is there
(37:33):
anything that we can do in your mind to ensure
that those players remain financially safe. I'm sort of leading
you here because I'm giving you some of my own
feelings obviously, like what needs to happen here to ensure
that you know everybody turns out okay?
Speaker 5 (37:50):
Well, one great question, Jason. I think people sometimes like, oh, well,
why do you?
Speaker 2 (37:55):
Why do you?
Speaker 5 (37:55):
Why are people I wouldn't say like, for my opinion,
it's because basketball change my life. The sport changed my life.
So I care about how the sport is not only played,
but the environment in which the younger athletes are navigating.
I care about that because I know what it meant
for me and what it did for me, and I
(38:16):
wanted to do that for other young men and women.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
I think the nil thing is scary.
Speaker 5 (38:21):
I'll tell you just again from my own financial space,
my biggest worry is taxes.
Speaker 1 (38:25):
Right, all these kids.
Speaker 5 (38:26):
Are getting all this money, and we know the IRS
doesn't come until all the money's gone. And they're like, oh,
by the way, you owe s two hundred fifty thousand
dollars in taxes. That's the part that I want to
make sure that is being communicated. When you're getting one
hundred thousand dollars check and you're getting this and you
just you're twenty one, twenty two, and if your parents
don't come from that, like even if schools are teaching
(38:47):
you financial literacy, if you don't fully have experience and understand,
and then I just don't think there's enough good people
to help navigate them. Do they have the right financials advisors?
Speaker 1 (38:57):
Do they have? And we know it's just littered with crooks. Actually,
because you have.
Speaker 5 (39:00):
A new two hundred three hundred people that now can
get millions of dollars, that brings in all the crooks
and all the jerks and all those idiots. For me,
I think there still needs to be regulation. I think
the NCUBA they dropped the ball. They had a monopoly,
they wanted to continue using that monopoly. The Supreme Court
said okay, enough is enough, and then all the right
(39:22):
wheels and regulations just came off and it just became
the wild wide West. Well that's not good either. The
way the nc DOUBLEA had it before is not good.
The way it is now is not good. They need
to come up with some sort of regulation, some sort
of group that says, hey, this is what you can.
We can't have kids transferring from schools. Every single year
to try and get the highest bidder, and then all
(39:44):
of a sudden they don't graduate college. That's not that's
not the goal of this. And so I don't know
baseball has a good formula where if you go to college,
you got to be there for three years, even though
a team can draft you and hold your rights. There's
a lot of different things, and I think the nc DOUBLEA,
because it is a feeder for the NBA, the NBA
should have some sort of idea or work with the
(40:07):
NCAA is like, we don't want all of this chaos
that's going on. I love that the players are making money,
but Alex you know this, Jason, you know this. Just
because everyone's making money doesn't mean it's a good environment.
It could be a toxic environment that can lead to
things ten to fifteen years down the road.
Speaker 2 (40:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
Well, I mean my own view of it, you know,
having done a little bit of work around this is
candidly what we actually need and what could help solve
this problem.
Speaker 2 (40:34):
And not to put more work on your shoulders.
Speaker 3 (40:36):
Rich is like, I think we need more former athletes
involved in this who actually understand the rigors of it
and the traps and the cons and also the upside.
So hopefully that comes to fruition because it's it's a
tough position.
Speaker 5 (40:51):
Another thing where Alex might know. Recently Arizona just left
and went to the Big twelve.
Speaker 1 (40:56):
Big twelve. Yeah, Big twelve.
Speaker 3 (40:58):
It's still confusing to me, right because I know and
and honestly, it could change tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (41:03):
It could change tomorrow.
Speaker 5 (41:04):
But the commissioner there is Brett Yormark, who used to
work in New York, used to work with the Nets,
and so yeah, he invited me to be a part
of the alumni council as a representative for Arizona. It
was myself and Jenny Finch as representatives from Arizona to
be a part of an alumni council to kind of
bring that The goal is to give that former athlete
(41:24):
opinion and to be in that space. So I'm not
just talking about it. I'm being about it, and I'm
trying to be a part of these panels and I'm
working these things so that I can have a positive
voice and an impact when the time does come.
Speaker 2 (41:47):
All right, let's do the lightning ground.
Speaker 1 (41:49):
Let's go.
Speaker 2 (41:51):
Let's do it, all right, So five questions. You know
how to do this. I'll start and then now so
we'll pick it up.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
All right, here we go go.
Speaker 3 (41:58):
What's the best piece of ad you've ever received on
deal making your business?
Speaker 5 (42:03):
Rob Mayler, one of my brothers, said, set your price
and live your life. Don't argue, don't fight on this.
If this is your number, if this is your mark,
set it. Maybe you have to adjust it at times,
but set your price and live your life.
Speaker 4 (42:16):
Don't stress. Who's your dream deal making partner?
Speaker 1 (42:21):
Oh that's a good one, dream deal making partner. Espn. Okay, okay.
Speaker 2 (42:29):
What's the most nervous you've ever been?
Speaker 5 (42:31):
Most nervous I've ever been was actually in the slam
dunk contest that I did in two thousand and four.
Speaker 1 (42:36):
It was horrific.
Speaker 5 (42:36):
I was terrible, but that spotlight and that was the
first you know, you've done some of these things. But
then all of a sudden, it's like, all right, Richard
jeffersonid lights go down, all of the arenas there and.
Speaker 1 (42:48):
It's just like, whoa this is?
Speaker 5 (42:51):
This is kind of intense, and Amari I apologize, right,
we're gonna I'm gonna tell him storry. So Mari's Sidemeyer.
We were both in the Dunk Contest and we were
sitting next week and he was even I was twenty three,
he was even younger than me, and he was like,
I don't think I've ever been so nervous.
Speaker 1 (43:05):
I'm like, bro me neither. This is trippy.
Speaker 5 (43:07):
This, you know, because you're still a kid, You're still
a fan. Right when you're twenty three, you can't even
believe you're in the NBA and all of a sudden
you're in the Dunk Contest that you've watched your whole life,
and you're like, yeah, this has been intense, so that
might be high high.
Speaker 2 (43:19):
It's amazing.
Speaker 4 (43:20):
Speaking of intents, what's your hype song before a big
meeting or negotiation?
Speaker 5 (43:25):
Ooh Dreams Nightmares by meek Mail meek Mail Dreams Nightmares.
Speaker 1 (43:31):
That that just is like, let's go, let's go, all right.
Speaker 3 (43:34):
Last question, what's your advice for someone who wants a
career like yours?
Speaker 5 (43:38):
Don't be afraid to fail, Like My confidence comes because
I have no problem taking an l getting back up
on my feed. I come from nothing. I'm from Glendale, Arizona.
My parents didn't play sports, my brothers didn't play sports.
I found basketball. I liked it believed in myself, and
then once you believed in yourself, you should just continue
(43:58):
doing that and whatever field or whatever thing that you do.
So that's all I've done. I don't know. I don't
have any broadcasting background, but if you've listened to this,
you know, I study people, I learn from people, I
support people and say, hey, you're doing a great job.
If you've kind of followed that blueprint over a long
period of time, in stack days and weeks and hours
and months and years, you will have success.
Speaker 1 (44:20):
It's literally impossible.
Speaker 5 (44:23):
To not have success, but it is possible to not
put in the work.
Speaker 3 (44:29):
Well, great, great stuff. Thank you so much, Richard Jefferson.
You are a legend. We love watching and listening to you,
and it was great to go deep in your career
and get a sense of your ambition.
Speaker 2 (44:40):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 5 (44:40):
Thanks rich Thank you. Thank you both seriously man that
I appreciate you both.
Speaker 3 (44:53):
The Deal is hosted by Alex Rodriguez and me Jason Kelly.
This episode was made by Animazarakus, Stacey Wong, and Lizzie
Philip Amy. Keen is our editor and Will Connelly is
our video editor. Our theme music is made by Blake Maples.
Our executive producers are Kelly Leferrier, Ashley Hoenig, and Brendan
neonham Sage Bauman is the head of Bloomberg Podcasts. Additional
(45:15):
support from Rachel Carnivale and Elena Los Angeles. Thanks so
much for listening to the deal. If you have a minute, subscribe,
rate and review our show. It'll help other listeners find us.
I'm Jason Kelly. See you next week.
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