One expert is warning people to do their research ahead of a significant change set to impact older devices.
One NZ, Spark and 2degrees are all due to shut down their 3G mobile networks by late 2025 - early 2026 at the latest.
Associate Professor of Engineering at the Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology Mark Gregory says Australia did the same thing at the end of last year - and it sparked mass confusion.
"In quite a few areas, customers lost coverage. So we had pictures of farmers standing in the middle of their farm where they used to have coverage...they've got 3G devices including farming sensors, farm equipment and their own devices."
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now heads up, if you were running some old technology,
it might pay to double check that your phone or
whatever else you're running could still work at the end
of the year when the three G networks get turned off,
because all major talcos are planning to turn off their
three G either at the end of the year or
possibly early next year. Australia did the same thing last
year and early this year and it did lean to
a bit of a problem over there. Or Associate Professor
(00:22):
of Engineering at the Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology, Mark
Gregory is with us. Hey Mark, Hello, how bad did
it get with you guys?
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Very bad? There were more problems than you could wish
for over here.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Okay, So some of the problems, from what I understand,
is that when the three G network was turned off,
everybody thought there would be four G coverage or five
G coverage. But that wasn't always the case, was it.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
No, Most certainly because the antenna systems were changed at
the same time. So we need to remember that signal propagation,
in other words, the direction and the distance the signal
moves from the towers are affected by the transmission system,
the antennas and the way that they're tuned and during
(01:09):
the changeover, many of the towers actually changed their characteristics,
and so what happened was that in quite a few
areas customers lost coverage. So we had pictures of farmers
standing in the middle of their farm where they used
to have coverage and now they've not got coverage, and
(01:31):
so they've got three G or now that' upgraded to
four G. Devices you know, including farming sensors, farm equipment,
and you know, their own devices and their vehicles and
no connectivity. And so we're still struggling with this problem today.
So the number of complaints has gone up quite significantly
(01:54):
in relation to telecommunications, and we need to keep that
in mind that there's no guarantee at the end of
the turnover that customers will have coverage.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Not always the I mean some of us. It sounds
like some of the devices cell phones, for example, can
actually be switched. I mean they may say the four
G five G compatible, but they still need three G
to make the phone call. But it sounds like they
can be reprogrammed slightly to be able to do without
three G.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Yeah, well, some devices. So what happened, of course, was
that we had three G and there were three G
devices being sold, and then they announced they were going
to start migrating the four G and so what happened,
of course, was a lot of companies rushed out what
they called or branded four G devices and four G phones,
(02:44):
and of course they weren't and so these devices were
really three G devices with four G on the cover,
and so they were using like a four G for data,
but they were still using three G for phone calls. Now,
that's all very good, but the most important thing, of
course is safety. And so what they found over here
(03:07):
after a bit of investigation and a bit of a
prompt in the media from myself, was that there are
a large number of devices that, even with them saying
that they were able to make four G phone calls,
they weren't able to connect to the TRIPLEO emergency service
that we have in Australia. And so there was another
whole group of phones that were going to be a problem.
(03:32):
Because at the end of the day, the telecommunications network
should be all about safety. We need to be able
to call the emergency services. So there are different groups
of phones. There were three G phones, there were four
G phones without the voiceover LTE. There were four G
phones that couldn't be used to make calls to triple
zero services, and there were devices that were not seven
(03:55):
hundred megaherts capable. Now, seven hundred megahertz band was used
in Australia for the digital for the analog television channels,
and so when the analog television was moved to digital,
that freed that band up for telephone for mobile. Yeah,
and that was called the digital dividend. Now, what happened,
(04:17):
of course, was that there was a whole group of
phones at that time that were not seven hundred megaherts capable.
So even though they claimed Black and Blue that are
four G phones wouldn't work for seven hundred megahurts. Problem is,
so a large number of our sites, we still.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
Have some of these phones available for sale in New
Zealand that are basically going to rely the three G network.
How do you tell, I'll give you a consumer going
out there and wanting to buy a cheap phone, how
do you know it's still going to work?
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Well, this is where this is where the confusion came in.
So this was really phase two of the problem here, right.
So you had a safety problem, you had a consumer problem,
you had farming problem, you had manufacturing problems, you had
health problems medical devices again, you know, you had all
the same problems with medical devices devices people have in
their homes, the emergency call devices, and the sea path
(05:09):
machines that many males and you know many people use,
not just males, but but you know that many people
used today. And the list just goes on and on.
So what happened, of course, over here was that the
government had to step in and they announced that there
was going to be a delay between the two major networks,
(05:30):
Telstra and Optists being able to turn off their networks.
Votaphone got through by being the early mover and turned
theirs off the year before, and with the smaller number
of customers on Votaphone and the fact that they don't
really at that time didn't really offer services and rural areas,
they escaped through the process. But Tellstre and Optus a
(05:51):
whole new kettle of fish. Governments that had to step
in announced that there was going to be a delay
before that the shutdown, the fact that it ended up
being months or more. They had to have helplines, they
had to do an advertising campaign, they had to start
talking about it in the media. And they really had
to get off their backsides because it was going to
(06:13):
be a major disasters.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
Well, you put in the frighteners up me. Mark, here's
hoping it doesn't happen here. Appreciate it. Mark Gregory, Associate
Professor of Engineering at the Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Game For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, Listen live
to news talks they'd be from four pm weekdays, or
follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
Now heads up, if you were running some old technology,
it might pay to double check that your phone or
whatever else you're running could still work at the end
of the year when the three G networks get turned off,
because all major talcos are planning to turn off their
three G either at the end of the year or
possibly early next year. Australia did the same thing last
year and early this year and it did lean to
a bit of a problem over there. Or Associate Professor
(00:22):
of Engineering at the Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology, Mark
Gregory is with us. Hey Mark, Hello, how bad did
it get with you guys?
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Very bad? There were more problems than you could wish
for over here.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Okay, So some of the problems, from what I understand,
is that when the three G network was turned off,
everybody thought there would be four G coverage or five
G coverage. But that wasn't always the case, was it.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
No, Most certainly because the antenna systems were changed at
the same time. So we need to remember that signal propagation,
in other words, the direction and the distance the signal
moves from the towers are affected by the transmission system,
the antennas and the way that they're tuned and during
(01:09):
the changeover, many of the towers actually changed their characteristics,
and so what happened was that in quite a few
areas customers lost coverage. So we had pictures of farmers
standing in the middle of their farm where they used
to have coverage and now they've not got coverage, and
(01:31):
so they've got three G or now that' upgraded to
four G. Devices you know, including farming sensors, farm equipment,
and you know, their own devices and their vehicles and
no connectivity. And so we're still struggling with this problem today.
So the number of complaints has gone up quite significantly
(01:54):
in relation to telecommunications, and we need to keep that
in mind that there's no guarantee at the end of
the turnover that customers will have coverage.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Not always the I mean some of us. It sounds
like some of the devices cell phones, for example, can
actually be switched. I mean they may say the four
G five G compatible, but they still need three G
to make the phone call. But it sounds like they
can be reprogrammed slightly to be able to do without
three G.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Yeah, well, some devices. So what happened, of course, was
that we had three G and there were three G
devices being sold, and then they announced they were going
to start migrating the four G and so what happened,
of course, was a lot of companies rushed out what
they called or branded four G devices and four G phones,
(02:44):
and of course they weren't and so these devices were
really three G devices with four G on the cover,
and so they were using like a four G for data,
but they were still using three G for phone calls. Now,
that's all very good, but the most important thing, of
course is safety. And so what they found over here
(03:07):
after a bit of investigation and a bit of a
prompt in the media from myself, was that there are
a large number of devices that, even with them saying
that they were able to make four G phone calls,
they weren't able to connect to the TRIPLEO emergency service
that we have in Australia. And so there was another
whole group of phones that were going to be a problem.
(03:32):
Because at the end of the day, the telecommunications network
should be all about safety. We need to be able
to call the emergency services. So there are different groups
of phones. There were three G phones, there were four
G phones without the voiceover LTE. There were four G
phones that couldn't be used to make calls to triple
zero services, and there were devices that were not seven
(03:55):
hundred megaherts capable. Now, seven hundred megahertz band was used
in Australia for the digital for the analog television channels,
and so when the analog television was moved to digital,
that freed that band up for telephone for mobile. Yeah,
and that was called the digital dividend. Now, what happened,
(04:17):
of course, was that there was a whole group of
phones at that time that were not seven hundred megaherts capable.
So even though they claimed Black and Blue that are
four G phones wouldn't work for seven hundred megahurts. Problem is,
so a large number of our sites, we still.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
Have some of these phones available for sale in New
Zealand that are basically going to rely the three G network.
How do you tell, I'll give you a consumer going
out there and wanting to buy a cheap phone, how
do you know it's still going to work?
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Well, this is where this is where the confusion came in.
So this was really phase two of the problem here, right.
So you had a safety problem, you had a consumer problem,
you had farming problem, you had manufacturing problems, you had
health problems medical devices again, you know, you had all
the same problems with medical devices devices people have in
their homes, the emergency call devices, and the sea path
(05:09):
machines that many males and you know many people use,
not just males, but but you know that many people
used today. And the list just goes on and on.
So what happened, of course, over here was that the
government had to step in and they announced that there
was going to be a delay between the two major networks,
(05:30):
Telstra and Optists being able to turn off their networks.
Votaphone got through by being the early mover and turned
theirs off the year before, and with the smaller number
of customers on Votaphone and the fact that they don't
really at that time didn't really offer services and rural areas,
they escaped through the process. But Tellstre and Optus a
(05:51):
whole new kettle of fish. Governments that had to step
in announced that there was going to be a delay
before that the shutdown, the fact that it ended up
being months or more. They had to have helplines, they
had to do an advertising campaign, they had to start
talking about it in the media. And they really had
to get off their backsides because it was going to
(06:13):
be a major disasters.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
Well, you put in the frighteners up me. Mark, here's
hoping it doesn't happen here. Appreciate it. Mark Gregory, Associate
Professor of Engineering at the Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Game For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, Listen live
to news talks they'd be from four pm weekdays, or
follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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