February 13, 2025 • 10 mins
Former Australian Prime Minister Scott Morrison is sharing his advice on how to deal with an imminent tariff announcement from Donald Trump.
The US President has teased another round of sweeping reciprocal tariffs following the announcement of steel and aluminium tariffs earlier this week.
Morrison told Mike Hosking governments just need to make their case, as Mexico, Canada, and Australia did.
He says the current Australian government secured the same exemptions he did last time, and Trump will hear a good argument.
Morrison celebrated New Years with the President at his Mar-a-Lago property.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The New Zealand Economic Forum. This youre being held at
Wake out of University, brings together a bunch of heavy
hitters and big brains. The focus this year is on
economic constraints, future challenges and emerging opportunities. Former Australian Prime
Minister Scott Morrison is your star of the show and
he as well as very good morning to you.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
You get a mike. It's great to be with you again.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
It's great to have you on the program. Are you
reveling in life post politics?
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Yes, it's you know, there is certainly life after politics.
It's it's wonderful to have that opportunity and very grateful
for it. But from a family and otherwise point of view,
it's a very nice life on the other side.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
No, I know you traveling because I saw a photo
and I can't remember whether it was post Christmas or
pre Christmas, but it was with the new president at
Mari Lago. So you've been with them.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Yeah, yeah, we were down there. Jenny and I were
down there on New Ye's Eve at Mari Lago, which
was great to see him again and the first lady
of course, and had been a while since Jenny and
she had caught up, but that was love to see
them red.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
What are your observations of him so far?
Speaker 2 (01:03):
I'm not surprised. I mean, he is a disruptor and
that's not a bad thing when you're trying to change things.
And he's an unorthodox politician and he's playing to form
and there's a lot he wants to get done in
a very short period of time and he's getting about it.
And the way that he does things now that's you know,
that's not what people are used to, but that's sort
(01:24):
of the point.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
So give us an insight into this work ethic. I mean,
he works all day. How does he do it?
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Well, It's hard to know. I don't think it's just
a coke and the hamburgers. It's all any number of things.
I think it's the disciplines of a lifetime. But you're right,
he's always full of energy. He loves what he's doing.
He's very motivated by it, and he's totally invested. And
he's one of those characters that I mean, he'd be
like that if he was running the country, running his companies,
(01:50):
or anything else he was engaged in. He's just that
type of a guy, and that creates a lot of
energy I think around his ministration and you've got all
of his advisors and the secretaries of state and so on,
who frankly running as hard as they can to keep up.
So he's out there leading by example.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
And what do you make of the tariffs? And how
do you handle these things? I mean you've been there before,
of course.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Yeah, well, you're just got to make your case. I mean,
what often happens with a number of these initiatives is
you know, there's a general sort of position and he
moves and then if there are things to modify or
moderate or fine tune along the way, then that's what
they'll do. And we've already seen that in the case
of Mexico and Canada. Our government, wiston well is a
(02:34):
full support bipartisan to secure the same exemptions that we
did last time on two occasions, and that was done.
What I know about the President is, you know, he
will hear a good argument from people who you know
aren't passengers. And there's one thing he doesn't like. It's
where a relationship is, where the US is carrying and
(02:55):
everyone else is riding on the back. Now, you know,
I always used to say about relationship with the US
on security, and I've said it on the White House lawn.
We looked at the US, but we don't leave it
to the US. We do our part. We carry out
our share of the relationship and that's who gets on
best with the US.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
So that relationship with Australia, how's that gone so fast
that they've had the phone call with Alban Easy Miles
has gone and talked to Orcus with Hissketh and handed
over a fairly large check. Penny Wong was at the inauguration.
Are they all good science?
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Yeah, look they are, and it's early days. The Orcus
announcement I wasn't surprised by because I never thought it
was in any doubt. I'd spoken to him last May
when I saw him in New York. So you know,
sometimes a bit of mediusaria builds up around these things.
It's because someone doesn't confirm something, they assume that they're
(03:47):
opposed to it. No, they're just not talking about it.
And so I think it was totally on trajectory for
them to do that. And what was announced in terms
of our investment, well that was part of the plan
from a long time ago, So you know that was
just in a form taking its route. But no, I
think it was good. I'm pleased that people were there
at the inauguration. Penny was there, and I think the
(04:10):
relationship with Excess and Richard Marles is a very important one,
and I think Richard has applied himself strongly to Orcus.
But you know, from here on in, I mean it's
too early to tell on the leader level engagement. There
just hasn't really been any of any great substance yet.
So you know, you've got to work through a few issues.
You've got to deal with a few problems. I mean,
we had many many calls when I was Prime Minister,
(04:30):
as did my predecessor, and you talk about a lot
of different things, and you've got to work through those
challenges together and share a like mindedness. And that's not
always I mean for us it was, you know, we're
sort of politically of the same feather and but you know, similarly,
I used to deal with President Biden, and you know
we actually signed aucus under President Biden, started under President Trump,
(04:53):
but yeah, it was it was concluded under President Biden.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
You're of course part of a company these days with
Mike Pompeo, who's an investor in Orcus. Are you as
passionate about that as you ever were? And will it
come to fruition and will it be a good thing?
Speaker 2 (05:06):
Yes, yes on all counts. And I'm also now working
as vice chair ever think called American Global Strategies, which
is chaired by Robert O'Brien, who was the President's National
Security advisor the first time around. And you know, we're
very involved in trying to support all of those things
around Aucust. And whether I'm here or in New Zealand
or in the UK where i'll be next week, or
(05:29):
the US, you know, you've got to keep tending to
the garden on this and I'm pleased that. Well, you know,
there's been change of governments. I wish one hadn't changed
to Barron part but you know that happens in politics.
There's one that's changed in the US, there's one that's
changed in the UK since the founding partners put it together,
and it is just it has been stronger than it
(05:50):
was then, and I'm pleased about that. It's beyond partisan politics.
And that is the thing that I think concerns, you know,
potential advases or advasaries like China, because they know this
thing hasn't gone away. It has gone at cross party
lines and has become part of the security architecture of globally,
but particularly of the Indo Pacific.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Speaking of change of government, we've got an election at
your place in Australia, have got possibly even next month.
So this story of Dutton who seems to have come
from nowhere to be a real contender, does he stand
a chance of that? Fair?
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Are you certainly a contender and highly competitive? And I
think it's becoming very close to a coin toss for
the election, which it can be as late as May,
and if they do a budget it will probably more
likely be in May. But Peters and the team have
been united right from the outset, and to be fair,
they inherited that from Josh and I as a parliamentary party.
(06:47):
The coalition was strong, so we haven't there's been no
infighting on our side of politics, which is very rare
in the first term after losing election, and so they've
kept that all together. They steady, incremental and they've just
built and built and built, and the government has got
itself into a lot of trouble by its own hand.
So I can't see the I can't see the government
(07:07):
being returned to the majority. I can't see a circumstance
where that happens. I think Peter does have the chance
that lives in the NATS have the chance to potentially
win a majority government. But you know, it's a big
hill to climb, but they've been climbing it.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Well, is it in competence that sunk labor in that sense?
I mean, you never lose after one term. History shows
us that, and yet they.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Might well, it hasn't happened since nineteen thirty one, So
I think that says things. I mean, I think political
cycles these days are contracting compared to those times. But
that said, well, you know, governments are going to get
measured on what they said they were going to do.
And they said, you know, they'd make costs of living cheaper,
(07:48):
they said that energy cost would be lower, They said
a whole bunch of things which I knew wasn't true
at the time and they couldn't do, but they still
said them. And I think that's left people wondering where
they where the outcome is.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
Of course, you're in the country to talk about economics,
which we're deeply interested in at the moment, and trying
to grow the economy. So give us some advice from Australia,
particularly international investment, money flowing in from overseas, things like students.
You've got huge numbers of students. They bring a fortune
to the country. But there's the political aspect of it
because they take people's houses. Everyone gets upset that whole thing.
(08:23):
How do you deal with the world in foreign investment
and immigrants and their money without blowing it up politically.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Well, it's it's a tough equation to balance. And the
most important thing is people need to understand that your
immigration program has strong rules and they're enforced, and that
your borders are secure. In our experience in Australia, going
back to twenty thirteen when I was Immigration Ministry and
we had the boats charging across the waters up there
and people dying every week, people felt that the country
(08:52):
had lost control of its borders and its security. And
you can't run a successful immigration program in that environment.
People just lose all confidence in it. And so you've
got to build that trust up again that the people
you're letting the country are coming to add value, to
make a contribution, not take one. And you've got to
demonstrate what those where they be temporary migrants who are
here for studying or on schools, visas or things like that,
(09:16):
or otherwise. If people don't think the rules are being
followed and the systems being gained, well you know they
won't buy it. But more broadly on attracting foreign investment,
I mean the playbook that you know I've heard set
out here in like Cato by the Finance Minister and others,
is really that similar game plan that so you can
do in the United States remove the barriers that are
(09:39):
coming through regulation, most importantly to improve competitiveness. It's really
not rocket science. You've just got to focus on removing
as many impediments to investment and business activity as you can.
And you've got to get access to labor. And you know,
you've got to be able to make a quid at
the end of the day, because if you don't, people
(10:00):
an't going to invest. I'll just go somewhere else.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
That's true. It's always good to catch up with you
appreciate it very much. Go well, Scott Morrison, former Prime
Minister of Austrike. You're always a pleasure to have him
on the program.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
For more from the My Asking Breakfast listen live to
news talks it'd be from six am weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio
The New Zealand Economic Forum. This youre being held at
Wake out of University, brings together a bunch of heavy
hitters and big brains. The focus this year is on
economic constraints, future challenges and emerging opportunities. Former Australian Prime
Minister Scott Morrison is your star of the show and
he as well as very good morning to you.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
You get a mike. It's great to be with you again.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
It's great to have you on the program. Are you
reveling in life post politics?
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Yes, it's you know, there is certainly life after politics.
It's it's wonderful to have that opportunity and very grateful
for it. But from a family and otherwise point of view,
it's a very nice life on the other side.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
No, I know you traveling because I saw a photo
and I can't remember whether it was post Christmas or
pre Christmas, but it was with the new president at
Mari Lago. So you've been with them.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Yeah, yeah, we were down there. Jenny and I were
down there on New Ye's Eve at Mari Lago, which
was great to see him again and the first lady
of course, and had been a while since Jenny and
she had caught up, but that was love to see
them red.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
What are your observations of him so far?
Speaker 2 (01:03):
I'm not surprised. I mean, he is a disruptor and
that's not a bad thing when you're trying to change things.
And he's an unorthodox politician and he's playing to form
and there's a lot he wants to get done in
a very short period of time and he's getting about it.
And the way that he does things now that's you know,
that's not what people are used to, but that's sort
(01:24):
of the point.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
So give us an insight into this work ethic. I mean,
he works all day. How does he do it?
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Well, It's hard to know. I don't think it's just
a coke and the hamburgers. It's all any number of things.
I think it's the disciplines of a lifetime. But you're right,
he's always full of energy. He loves what he's doing.
He's very motivated by it, and he's totally invested. And
he's one of those characters that I mean, he'd be
like that if he was running the country, running his companies,
(01:50):
or anything else he was engaged in. He's just that
type of a guy, and that creates a lot of
energy I think around his ministration and you've got all
of his advisors and the secretaries of state and so on,
who frankly running as hard as they can to keep up.
So he's out there leading by example.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
And what do you make of the tariffs? And how
do you handle these things? I mean you've been there before,
of course.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Yeah, well, you're just got to make your case. I mean,
what often happens with a number of these initiatives is
you know, there's a general sort of position and he
moves and then if there are things to modify or
moderate or fine tune along the way, then that's what
they'll do. And we've already seen that in the case
of Mexico and Canada. Our government, wiston well is a
(02:34):
full support bipartisan to secure the same exemptions that we
did last time on two occasions, and that was done.
What I know about the President is, you know, he
will hear a good argument from people who you know
aren't passengers. And there's one thing he doesn't like. It's
where a relationship is, where the US is carrying and
(02:55):
everyone else is riding on the back. Now, you know,
I always used to say about relationship with the US
on security, and I've said it on the White House lawn.
We looked at the US, but we don't leave it
to the US. We do our part. We carry out
our share of the relationship and that's who gets on
best with the US.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
So that relationship with Australia, how's that gone so fast
that they've had the phone call with Alban Easy Miles
has gone and talked to Orcus with Hissketh and handed
over a fairly large check. Penny Wong was at the inauguration.
Are they all good science?
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Yeah, look they are, and it's early days. The Orcus
announcement I wasn't surprised by because I never thought it
was in any doubt. I'd spoken to him last May
when I saw him in New York. So you know,
sometimes a bit of mediusaria builds up around these things.
It's because someone doesn't confirm something, they assume that they're
(03:47):
opposed to it. No, they're just not talking about it.
And so I think it was totally on trajectory for
them to do that. And what was announced in terms
of our investment, well that was part of the plan
from a long time ago, So you know that was
just in a form taking its route. But no, I
think it was good. I'm pleased that people were there
at the inauguration. Penny was there, and I think the
(04:10):
relationship with Excess and Richard Marles is a very important one,
and I think Richard has applied himself strongly to Orcus.
But you know, from here on in, I mean it's
too early to tell on the leader level engagement. There
just hasn't really been any of any great substance yet.
So you know, you've got to work through a few issues.
You've got to deal with a few problems. I mean,
we had many many calls when I was Prime Minister,
(04:30):
as did my predecessor, and you talk about a lot
of different things, and you've got to work through those
challenges together and share a like mindedness. And that's not
always I mean for us it was, you know, we're
sort of politically of the same feather and but you know, similarly,
I used to deal with President Biden, and you know
we actually signed aucus under President Biden, started under President Trump,
(04:53):
but yeah, it was it was concluded under President Biden.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
You're of course part of a company these days with
Mike Pompeo, who's an investor in Orcus. Are you as
passionate about that as you ever were? And will it
come to fruition and will it be a good thing?
Speaker 2 (05:06):
Yes, yes on all counts. And I'm also now working
as vice chair ever think called American Global Strategies, which
is chaired by Robert O'Brien, who was the President's National
Security advisor the first time around. And you know, we're
very involved in trying to support all of those things
around Aucust. And whether I'm here or in New Zealand
or in the UK where i'll be next week, or
(05:29):
the US, you know, you've got to keep tending to
the garden on this and I'm pleased that. Well, you know,
there's been change of governments. I wish one hadn't changed
to Barron part but you know that happens in politics.
There's one that's changed in the US, there's one that's
changed in the UK since the founding partners put it together,
and it is just it has been stronger than it
(05:50):
was then, and I'm pleased about that. It's beyond partisan politics.
And that is the thing that I think concerns, you know,
potential advases or advasaries like China, because they know this
thing hasn't gone away. It has gone at cross party
lines and has become part of the security architecture of globally,
but particularly of the Indo Pacific.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Speaking of change of government, we've got an election at
your place in Australia, have got possibly even next month.
So this story of Dutton who seems to have come
from nowhere to be a real contender, does he stand
a chance of that? Fair?
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Are you certainly a contender and highly competitive? And I
think it's becoming very close to a coin toss for
the election, which it can be as late as May,
and if they do a budget it will probably more
likely be in May. But Peters and the team have
been united right from the outset, and to be fair,
they inherited that from Josh and I as a parliamentary party.
(06:47):
The coalition was strong, so we haven't there's been no
infighting on our side of politics, which is very rare
in the first term after losing election, and so they've
kept that all together. They steady, incremental and they've just
built and built and built, and the government has got
itself into a lot of trouble by its own hand.
So I can't see the I can't see the government
(07:07):
being returned to the majority. I can't see a circumstance
where that happens. I think Peter does have the chance
that lives in the NATS have the chance to potentially
win a majority government. But you know, it's a big
hill to climb, but they've been climbing it.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Well, is it in competence that sunk labor in that sense?
I mean, you never lose after one term. History shows
us that, and yet they.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Might well, it hasn't happened since nineteen thirty one, So
I think that says things. I mean, I think political
cycles these days are contracting compared to those times. But
that said, well, you know, governments are going to get
measured on what they said they were going to do.
And they said, you know, they'd make costs of living cheaper,
(07:48):
they said that energy cost would be lower, They said
a whole bunch of things which I knew wasn't true
at the time and they couldn't do, but they still
said them. And I think that's left people wondering where
they where the outcome is.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
Of course, you're in the country to talk about economics,
which we're deeply interested in at the moment, and trying
to grow the economy. So give us some advice from Australia,
particularly international investment, money flowing in from overseas, things like students.
You've got huge numbers of students. They bring a fortune
to the country. But there's the political aspect of it
because they take people's houses. Everyone gets upset that whole thing.
(08:23):
How do you deal with the world in foreign investment
and immigrants and their money without blowing it up politically.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Well, it's it's a tough equation to balance. And the
most important thing is people need to understand that your
immigration program has strong rules and they're enforced, and that
your borders are secure. In our experience in Australia, going
back to twenty thirteen when I was Immigration Ministry and
we had the boats charging across the waters up there
and people dying every week, people felt that the country
(08:52):
had lost control of its borders and its security. And
you can't run a successful immigration program in that environment.
People just lose all confidence in it. And so you've
got to build that trust up again that the people
you're letting the country are coming to add value, to
make a contribution, not take one. And you've got to
demonstrate what those where they be temporary migrants who are
here for studying or on schools, visas or things like that,
(09:16):
or otherwise. If people don't think the rules are being
followed and the systems being gained, well you know they
won't buy it. But more broadly on attracting foreign investment,
I mean the playbook that you know I've heard set
out here in like Cato by the Finance Minister and others,
is really that similar game plan that so you can
do in the United States remove the barriers that are
(09:39):
coming through regulation, most importantly to improve competitiveness. It's really
not rocket science. You've just got to focus on removing
as many impediments to investment and business activity as you can.
And you've got to get access to labor. And you know,
you've got to be able to make a quid at
the end of the day, because if you don't, people
(10:00):
an't going to invest. I'll just go somewhere else.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
That's true. It's always good to catch up with you
appreciate it very much. Go well, Scott Morrison, former Prime
Minister of Austrike. You're always a pleasure to have him
on the program.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
For more from the My Asking Breakfast listen live to
news talks it'd be from six am weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio
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