September 3, 2022 • 35 mins
Ron starts this episode talking about diagnosis and the importance of such : takes a call on a 12 Lexus with a check engine light – mechanic did a tune up – check engine light came back on – took it to the dealership who said it needs an engine : takes a call on an 04 Mitsubishi Galant with AC issues : takes a call on an 07 Escape with intermittent electric door locks and alarms.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Well, I need somebody, not just anybody, you know, I
need someone Ron and Anian. You get outside of New Jersey,
the variety of cars shrinks down to the trucks and
SUVs and very little electric vehicles that I saw even
on the road traveling, I did not see a lot
of electric vehicles that car doctor. So I ended up
(00:20):
taking it back apart and putting that transmission control module in,
which is all part of the same, you know, just
on the Solinois pack, in the whole nine yard. That
ended up solving it. You know, life is good. So
cool thousand dollars got her back on the road and
cheaper than Welcome to the radio home of Ron and
Anian the Car Doctor, since this is where car owners
(00:42):
the world overturned to for their definitive opinion on automotive repair.
If your mechanics giving you a busy signal, pick up
the phone and call in the garage doors are open,
but I am here to take your call at eight five,
five five six, and now he is running. I want
(01:03):
to start the hour off talking to you about diagnosis
and the value of it and why it's so expensive,
and maybe it's so expensive is a good thing because
maybe it has to be expensive to be good. I
don't know. The conversation has been buzzing around in my
head for a while and it sort of came to
fruition this week at the shop. And here's how it unfolded. So,
(01:28):
you know, there's only there's only one thing I really
have to sell anybody, and that's time, okay, And it's
either time where I'm doing a physical repair or time
where I'm diagnosing something. And when I say me, I
mean the shop. You know, it's it's as as as
a business entity. You have to look at what it
is you're trying to do. You're exchanging dollars for minutes,
and contained within those minutes really is the value of
(01:51):
what you know, of what you've put into practice, of
what you've sat down and said, here's how I'm gonna
make it work, and here's what I'm gonna do to
complete the operation and and and be done with it.
You know, it's no different than any other store. I'm sure. Well,
I'd like to think that guy was running the bagel
stores this down and says, well, I've got to make
so many bagels in an hour, and then I've got
to sell so many of those bagels and they have
to cost me this and sell them for that, and
(02:12):
it's a business. It's gotten busy at the shop this year,
very busy at the shop, more so than any other
time that I can remember in recent history. Maybe the
eighties or the seventies were this busy, and I wasn't
really there in the seventies the eighties, So how to
be the eighties when I remember being this busy Because
there's no cars out there for you, there's nothing out
there for you to buy. There's a vehicle shortage. We
(02:33):
know that there's no there's no mystery to that, and
we're not gonna get into the house and the wise.
I've got my own theories, but that's, you know, not
what this is about. So you know, I've got a
limit how much I get on the phone. I've got
a limit getting on the phone. I've got a limit,
you know, down to what's the payback? Is there a payback?
And it's not. I'm not trying to pinch pennies and
count Nichols and diamonds, but I'm trying to be effective
(02:55):
and efficient. And that's really what order repairs about it
A lot of the time, right, the more efficient and
effective I am. The better it is for you because
you get a good repair, usually at a lower cost.
Someone called the shop this week. I haven't seen this
gentleman in six years, and it's funny I look back
(03:17):
on service history. I've seen him three times. This was
the third time I've seen him. I saw him in
two thousand eleven, two thousand sixteen, and now today two
thousand twenty two. So we're six going on seven years.
And it was always for some of too obscure problem
that we didn't fix. We hadn't fixed it prior, and
(03:39):
not that that has any bearing on it. Everybody's you know,
free will. You can do whatever you want. But I
don't understand what you get out of having me diagnose something. Um, okay,
I get it. I fixed it. I tell you what's wrong,
and I guess I fixed because in each case it
never came back with what you said it was gonna
be this, and it wasn't. It was something else. But
you know, you can't cherry pick anymore, is what I'm
(04:00):
trying to get to. Diagnostics are getting too complicated and
to involved, too involved, and there's there's you know, diagnostics
and the procedures I use have changed in the last
seven or eight months, never mind the last six or
seven years. So procedures change, technology changes, Costs go up
to me, costs go up to you. That's economics, that's
(04:21):
how the economy works, right. But I'm very upfront about it.
I explained it to everybody. Say listen, and I look
at the problem, and I think about the problem, and
I listened to their story, and you know what the
rationale is. And I say, okay, you know what minimum
diagnostic charge at the shop is two hours, And it's
usually what it takes by the time I go through evaluate,
look at do the normal drill, do what I have
(04:42):
to do, Prove what's good, prove what's bad. All that
solve the problem. Sometimes we have to go further. Sometimes
we have to do more. Sometimes it can't be solved
in two hours. Sometimes it's an intermittent, random thing that
requires multiple road tests. And uh, you know, there are
days you'll come to the shop and I've got you know,
four s and tools out because this one give me
this information, this one give me that information, this one
(05:03):
give me what I wanted, and that one broke. You know,
it happens, right, that one doesn't talk to the car
the way it's supposed to because the less software update
it got. Uh, something's jarable, and now we have to
talk to the manufacturer to get us straightened out. Diagnostics
is not easy, bottom line. So many of you think
we just plug a tool in and the tool stands
up and says, hey, it's the pink black wire coming
(05:24):
out of connector one oh three in the left rear
corner of the vehicle, and that's what's wrong with it.
Uh gives you a code. It tells you something it
didn't see in binary or digital language that the computer
analyzes and says, hey, this my programming tells me the
fault is somewhere in this circuit. Now you have to
go find it. And that's the trick, right, That's that's
a lot of what it's about. But there's one gentleman
(05:44):
in particularly. He brought us an oh eight jeep. So
it's already it's you know, let's call it what it is.
It's fourteen fifteen years old, and you know it was
missing a grill and headlights, which I kind of was
the tip off, like what are we getting into here?
And he's trying to restore it and put it back
together for his daughter, and yeah, that's great. You know,
I'm real happy for you. But you know, somebody else
(06:05):
has been working on it, whether it was him and
a few other people had seemed had their hand in
the pot. You know, a lot of things go wrong
when everybody's trying to put the yeast in the bread.
Who put the yeast in the bread? I always think
of that episode. I love Lucy. I'm dating myself, I know,
so you know, I looked at it. I said, this
is easily three hours of shop time. This is three
(06:25):
hours of diagnostic procedure. You know, I'm sure I'm going
to spend an hour just doing some research and trying
to catch up on what's been done, after looking at
all his notes or whatever notes he might give me,
and trying to verify the vehicle it had to check
engine light on in an intermittent no crank condition. Not
saying that both are related. They could be related. I
didn't think so, not from his description, and I kind
of treated it as I've got a problem and a
(06:46):
problem b I looked at him, Charlie, it's five dollars,
it's four and five bucks at three hours of shop time.
I'm going to begin a diagnosis plus tax and he
sawt of bork balked. You know, you could see the
hesitancy in them, and yeah, listen, I don't tell you
where to go eat, I don't tell you what to drive.
I just tell you how I'm gonna fix it. This
is what it is to me. This is the value
(07:06):
of it for me, This is what I have to do.
This is how I'm gonna get to solve your problem.
It's not my truck. My truck runs signed off on it,
said thank you very much, I'll see you soon. Let
me know what happens. He left. You know, there's a
mechanics intuition. There's just something that you just know. I
don't know when you're When you're on, you're on, and
(07:27):
when you're when you're Spidy senses up. It's up. And
I said, I'm not gonna get to this right away.
I've got other cars this Monday morning. Let me let
me put this on the side and let it take
a break for a minute. Let me see what else
I've got to get into. And I did that. In
about an hour or fifteen minutes later, the phone rang
and it was Charlie. You know, ron I can't really
justify a five diagnosis, especially when none of it's gonna
(07:48):
count towards the repair. You know, there's a lot wrong
with that. I said to myself, why would a diagnostic
procedure count towards the repair? You know, you don't go
to the doctor and he gives you a shot or
sick your heart rate, blood pressure, weighs you stick at
(08:08):
your tongue, say I it doesn't go. Well, that was
on the twenty dollars, But we're gonna apply that towards
the physical that we're gonna give you, or the diet
we're gonna put you on, or the repair we're gonna
make to your stomach for the ulcer. Time is time.
It's all a business has to sell. And in the
case of order repair, it's counted in minutes. And I said,
no problem, pick it up. Well, you know, no problem,
(08:30):
pick it up. Came by, I picked it up. I
don't know where it went. And I just felt compelled
to tell you this story because it's gonna go somewhere
where I'm guessing no diagnosis will be made. Um Charlie
thinks he already has some of the answers on what
it was. It had been to somebody else before me.
Somebody else told him it was a battery was the
(08:51):
cause of the problem, which I didn't believe that was
the cause of the check engine light. It might have
been the cause of the no crank, but it didn't
sound like it to me. It sounded like the battery
was fine, that it had a had a an intermittent
starter or ignition switch or something else going on. And
it's said, because that vehicle is now going to get
bounced around, and Charlie's gonna get bounced around, and he's
gonna go from shop to shop, or he's gonna try
and fix it himself, and he's gonna put a thousand
(09:13):
dollars worth of parts in it or whatever he's gonna do,
and then I don't know, maybe it'll come back in
five years, maybe not. Because there is value in a diagnosis,
and there's strength in knowing that procedures have been made
and taken and and and that's the real value of it.
I Uh, I shocked somebody this week. I guess I
(09:35):
was a good boy scout and someone had called the
shop from Connecticut and um, sure her Lexus had a
misfire on it, you know, what. I'm not going to
continue this story because I can see that she is
on the line. Suddenly pull over and take the pause.
When we come back, we're gonna continue talking about the
value of diagnostics and steps taken as we uh go
(09:57):
to Connecticut. The car doct will return right after this.
Don't go away down when you get keep Ron's number
(10:17):
handy eight five five five six zero nine nine zero
zero for when you really need advice on your car.
Here's rock. You know, I was in boy scout mode
midweek this paste week, and I'm always in boy scout mode,
I guess, but there was a there was an email
in the form of an e voice when someone calls
the zero phone number, every every one of those calls
(10:38):
comes through my email account, and I read them, you know,
and this was clearly a help me Obi wan Kenobi,
You're my only hope. And um, I guess I surprised
her because I called her and I think I caught
her at home, and um, as it turns out, I
think she's here to give us an update on where
this vehicle stands. A sorrow? Is that correct? From Connecticut?
H Yes, it's all sorrow. A sorrow. So how did
(11:01):
you want to be maybe you want to backfill everybody?
Would you like me you backfill everybody? Tell us about
the experience you had this week with getting the tune
up on the Lexus. Okay, yeah, so the show. Okay,
so Um, I brought my car in because I had
a check engine light. So I brought it into a
local mechanic. I recently moved here to Windsor and my
(11:22):
husband Um looked up this mechanic, so I went there
the check engine light. They said they did the codes
and the code showed that one of the cylinders was misfiring,
so the the next step would be to do a
tune up. So I said, okay, I did the tune up.
I picked it up the next day and the light
came on when I was two minutes down the road.
So I turned back around told him the light had
(11:43):
came back on and the car was sputtering a little bit.
So they did continue diagnostics, they said, m for the
rest of the week, and then come Friday, they told
me that there were multiple cylinders firing, multiple misfires, and
they couldn't figure out why or what was going on.
So they recommended that I get it to Hoffman lexus
um for them to do a diagnostic. I did that,
(12:04):
I was not able to drive the car. I had
to get a tod to Hoffman and then long story short,
Hoffman did their diagnostic. They also saw codes P zero
three hundred. I know you said to get the codes
P zero three oh one, P zero three oh five.
There was a high misfire on cylinder one and they
eventually found coolant pooling in between the intake manifold cylinder
(12:24):
head and they recommended a new engine and head gasket.
It's basically what happened well and what bothered me when
we were when we initially talked, and this is for
everyone's benefit. When I asked you what the codes were
you you didn't know. They hadn't given you a report. Correct,
they hadn't given you any information. And you know that's
a problem. You're paying for your paying for a diagnosis.
(12:45):
You should get formal information. Here's the list of codes.
Here's the print out. You know, sometimes we'll even give
somebody a flow chart saying here a P zero three hundred,
here's the possibilities. Now, a lot of shops might sit
there and say, ron, nobody ever reads codes. Nobody ever
reads flow charts. You don't know though, And to me,
you know what if you go to a doctor and
you get an X ray and you take that X
(13:07):
ray home, I don't look at the x ray. I
give it to the next doctor and say here, what
does this mean? Um? Right? Uh, you're you're paying for
an X ray. I want a copy of the diagnosis.
You're paying for a diagnosis. Don't you want a copy
of it? Uh? You know? And I felt really good
that we were able to have that conversation, and I,
you know, I think, uh, I think, now the next
time you walk into a repair shop, you're gonna be
(13:29):
better armed that you'll you'll you'll know what to say
and what to do. What ended up happening with this?
Or you're gonna put it? Are you gonna put an
engine in it? Or is it time to go car shopping?
So we are balancing both options. We're car shopping. We're
thinking of My dad has a reliable mechanic that he
uses in water Bary, So he's recommending that I towe
it to them, and so they can take a look
(13:50):
at it and get a third opinion and then take
take it from there as to what to do right
Oh yeah, the my dad mechanics said, you know, he
could fix it. He read the report from how Men
about the whole um, you know, the engine and all
that what they recommended, and he said he could do it,
for he has an engine there somewhere, so right, and
I liked I like that. I like the idea of
(14:11):
the third opinion from a known entity. You know that
the value of the known entity is what makes this
the big deal. Not knocking the first shop. I think
the first shop missed a couple of steps, all right.
I was so, you know, I was surprised when it
was well, it had full coats for misfires. It's time
for a tune up. And we we talked about that, right,
and we went through the lawnmower scenario about it takes ignition,
(14:35):
it takes fuel, it takes mechanical integrity, and you know,
we talked about moving ignition coils around and spark plugs around,
trying to pin down which cylinder and doesn't follow the
ignition or is it still stuck on cylinder four. The
The strange thing is that the first tune up shop
never mentioned coolant or added coolant, you know to the ticket,
(14:57):
which and you know, and I thought of this after
we hung up the last time. I said, I wonder
if there was coolant on any of your bills. I
wonder if they just randomly added coolant not realizing that
you know, it was low on coolant. There was a
reason why they just added cool and said that was
just low on coolant. No big deal, you know. So
you may want to go back and look at some
of your invoices because Toyota Alexis coolant is not cheap.
(15:18):
I can't imagine any shop giving it away. Well I
can just I can't imagine I'm giving it away and
staying in business for any length of time. Uh so
you know that gets to be an issue. Um, you know,
I go ahead? No, go ahead. Would there be any
recourse that I can go back for the first shop
to say, hey, you know I brought in my car.
(15:39):
You know I had no out covert symptoms of my
car other than this check engine light. I came in
for this. You diagnosed it that I needed a tune up.
I did this tune up, and my car is now
worth than when I drove it in. I well, let's see, Okay,
if there's something that the third entity comes up with
and says, gee, you know they did this wrong or
that wrong. I think that's a core of a conversation
(16:01):
if they if the third entity comes back and says, hey,
we've got a we've got a we really do have
a failed engine. It's hard to believe that a vehicle
would go in for a check engine line. I'm not
saying it's impossible. I've seen some strange things in my career,
but a vehicle would go in for a misfire, have
it legitimately be spark plugs or an ignition coil because
(16:23):
you had said they put six plugs in it and
one coil, and we talked a little bit about the
dangers of that on a Toyota vs. Six why that's
not sometimes best policy. It's hard to believe it would
go from ignition to getting tuned to getting towed and
at the next shop it's an engine and that's It's
like we missed a step, we missed something in between.
It didn't go. It probably didn't go five miles between
(16:46):
the time they did their parts replacement and the time
you took it home and turned around and came back
right correct, I didn't even make it home, right, So yeah,
did did somebody miss a step? So I think once
you know what was wrong with this, I think it's
time to go back and have a conversation and say, listen,
everybody makes a mistake, everybody has a bad day. But
(17:06):
I just paid I don't know what did you pay five? Right?
Nine to find out that didn't fix it? You know?
And and and your argument is gonna be, shouldn't you
have diagnosed this a little more than just putting spark
plugs and an ignition coil in it? Because isn't there
And here's here's the key sentence. I want you to
(17:27):
remember this. And I know your husband's listening, so I
know hill between the two of you, Um, you know
the key the key sentence here, well, you, your husband
and the baby, right, the key sentences that you want
to say, isn't it possible that there's more than one
reason why a vehicle will misfire other than ignition? Right?
(17:49):
And And why wasn't diagnosis made after it was determined
that had a misfire? There's nowhere in a float chart
I know of no float chart for any vehicle or
any manufacturer where it says P zero three oh four
misfire changed spark plugs and a coil. They all talk
about doing diagnosis. They all talk about doing some sort
(18:11):
of continued steps of analysis. And that's where I think
that shop dropped the ball. I think they jumped the
gun too soon and they were too quick in their decision.
So that's how I would approach it. That's how i'd
attack it. Do this for us, though, because we're all
kind of curious. Call us back next week or the
week after when you know more. We'd like to hear
what the end result is. Did you end up putting
an engine in this and how you made out once
and for all. Good luck and stay in touch. I'm
(18:32):
on any of the guard doctor. We'll be back right
after this. Don't go away. Welcome back. We're in the
(19:02):
car doctor. Let's get over and talk to Dennis in Connecticut.
Oh for a Mitsubishi. Go on, Dennis, Welcome to the
car doctor, sir, How can I help? Yeah? How are
you doing? Okay? What's cooking? So? Early early spring the
a C went out, so it brought it to a
reputable shop they've been around for many years. They put
dyeing in it, you know, they checked it. They put
(19:25):
dying and they said, the trader rails were leaked, so
they changed those, sent me on my way. They said,
come back in a week or so, we'll check it.
You know, with the check we can find any die.
I did that, No, no die, Okay, fine. Three weeks later,
it's blowing potier again. So I go back to them. Oh,
(19:49):
now we think it might be the pressure valve, but
we're gonna check farther, so our pressure switch. I'm sorry.
So then now it's to come press or the seal
is leaking. Wait wait, wait, wait, wait a minute, wait
a minute. Was the refrigerant in it? No, it went
it went warm again. Okay, so went warm again. And
(20:12):
they're saying it's oh, it's a pressure switch on the
high side line for the compressor. Well at first they did,
but then when they checked into it even further, they
were like, no, we found that the shaft seal is
leaking on the compressor, so you need a compressor. So
I'm like, you let me get a second opinion, because
I didn't like the fact that they you know, I
couldn't find the leak, and now they're telling me there
(20:34):
is a leak. So and go to the next job,
he says, I can't find any oil, he goes, so
he put free on in the system and he said, uh,
you know, see how it it pens out again. So
I get in the vehicle and it's blown warm here
right in the parking lot. So I go back in
(20:58):
and there is another repertulce shopping around for many years. Um.
He goes, Yeah, the compressor is not kicking on the clutch,
so put the gauges on it. And I'm standing there
right next to him. It's full. So then he checks
for powering ground to the compressor and there's powering ground.
He says, your compressor is bad. Okay, So I changed
(21:21):
the compressor out and then this is the funny thing.
It was blowing nice cold air around forty two um.
Every sometimes when I would go through the car wash,
it would start blowing warm air again, and then within
a minute or two it would be blown. I would say,
(21:43):
it would start blowing warm here after I went through
the car wash, and then a minute or two later
it started blowing cold are again. I'm like, what's going on?
So I went to a third shop and they took
the free on out, put it back in enough pressors
started working again. They said, you have a bad compressor.
(22:04):
So another thing that was going on was after we
had changed the compressor, I noticed a noise and I
thought it was coming from the compressor. But when I
opened the hood, depending on what time of the kind
of day, it was not a very real humid day,
but you know, a hot day, you got the A
(22:25):
C colle. The fans would shut off. The two fans
would shut off for like four seconds, and before they
would even stop spinning, they were kicking back on. And
that third shop was saying that the compressor is telling
the fans to shut off and come right back on,
And that was another reason they were saying, the compressor
(22:47):
is back now. The fans are actually reacting to a
pressure switch somewhere in the system. So if the compressor
is not on, but if high sight pressure is still
over the line, it'll turn on the cooling fans for
the condensed or trying to pull it down to lower
high side pressure. So they're they're they're they're they're not right,
but they're not wrong. They're they're kind of putting the
(23:08):
car before the horse if the compressors. If the compressor
is running and it's creating high pressure because of a
defect somewhere else in the system, or just because of
the environment or the ambient temperature heat load, it'll turn
the condenser fans on. So that's not incorrect. Let's go
back to the car wash issue. All right. Uh, you know,
did anybody consider the possibility that water is getting on
(23:30):
the belt, the compressor is slipping and that's why it's
blowing hot air, or did they physically see the compressor
not turned on for some reason going through a car
wash when it started blowing warm air. I opened the
hood on one of those occasions and the clutch was
not engaged. So here's the other third shop. I went
(23:52):
through the car wash, it started blowing warm air and
it then never came back to blowing cold. Here that's
when I went to a shop and actually, no, this
is what I thought. This is what I did. I
thought it was low on free on it that I
physically had a leak, because that's what happened in the springtime.
(24:13):
So I had a can of free on and I
tried to because I did that earlier in the spring.
I put some free on in it and the compressor
kicked on, So then I knew it was low on
free on so I did that. The last time I
went through the car washing, it never came back on.
So I put a little free on in and then
it wouldn't It wouldn't kick on. So I'm like, well,
(24:35):
then something else is going on. And then when I
went there, they were like, well, you overcharged it. I'm like, well,
but it stopped working before I even tried to attempt
to put any free on in. And I don't even
know if I was able to get any free on
in it because it was full. Okay, a couple of questions,
are these new compressors used compressors, reman compressors, new compressor?
(24:57):
But here, let me let me go on. So this
week I went out of state. I had a little
train in seminar thirty more. It's blown air. I get
in the car four o'clock, it's blown warm air. So
I ended up finding a mitch Bsi dealer in that state.
(25:19):
They were able to look at it on Saturday, and
they said, which he showed me, I have a leak
in a leak in the compressor, I mean a leak
in the condenser. And they said there was really not
much free on left in it. That's why your compressor
wasn't kicking in, so they put free on in it.
(25:41):
It's still blown cold air now, so it's got to
be a small leak. He showed me where it's leaking.
I see the you know, the discoloration. Um. But I'm
still concerned with the fans why they're uh, it's almost
(26:01):
like a grinding noise when they shut off. And well,
is it a noise or is it the fact that
they shut off? Dennis, which is it? I think it's
because they're shutting off. But I've never heard that noise
before after since we changed the compressor. That's the strange
part of it. You don't hear the noise anymore? Or
(26:23):
do now? You do? Here? I never heard it, now
I do hear it. Okay, let's do this. You're it
sounds like you're a hand kind of guy, right, I
could do some things. Okay, can you get to the
compressor clutch feed, the electrical wiring? Is it accessible? I
possibly could? Yeah. Okay, go down to your local lotoparts store.
(26:43):
You ever see a one side marker bulb, you know,
just a side marker an exterior bulb for a vehicle.
I want you to go buy a one. I don't
care what the socket is work because they're usually rubber
basse and you can zip tie into things. I want
you to wire a bulb across the wired connector for
the compressor clutch. You gotta hot in the ground there, right,
(27:06):
and every time the compressor comes on, that bulb was
gonna light, all right. So the first thing you're gonna
do is if this goes hot and it doesn't blow
cold air anymore. Um, yeah, it doesn't blow cold air anymore,
you're gonna go look at that compressor. Is the bulb
is the bull bond or not? If the bulb is
not on and you're commanding it on, and then we've
(27:27):
got to figure out why. So the next thing is,
maybe we do have low refrigerant at that moment, all right,
and maybe that's why the compressor is not coming on.
That's not so much the end of the road for you,
but it just would be a good tell tale because
this seems to be happening so sporadically from your description
from my seat here, I think you've got or had
one more than one problem, all right, and now you're
(27:50):
just trying to catch up to the consequences. So I'll
tell you what sit tight, Dennis, I don't want to
rush this. Let me pull over, take a poise. When
I come back, we'll have about a minute ago and
then I gotta get on the phone. But um, let
me just for sh up with you real quick. When
I returned the car doctors coming back right after this.
Don't go away, welcome back, run name the car doctor, Dennis,
(28:14):
you're still there, sir, real quick? Is this an automatic
or manual a C system? It's automatic automatic? Okay. So
the next thing I would do once I see what
the compressor is doing when it doesn't work, or when
you see it blowing hot air, if the compressor has
that bulb is lit and the compressor is not on
(28:35):
either somehow the compressor is not grounded, all right? Could
we have a bad engine ground, a bad chassis ground,
something like that, or unfortunately you've got a third bad compressor,
which brings me to one quick question. What are you
paying for these compressors? Any idea? Actually that I only
put one compressor in R R and Y compressors out
of Florida, okay, And what are you paying for him?
(28:58):
That one? I didn't pay much for that one, just
over two, um, I questioned, I just listen. I'm not
knocking them. I just question cheap a C compressors. All right,
you know it's an O four Mitsubishi. It's a lot
of this stuff seems to come from one one, one
vendor in in China. I'll say it like it is,
(29:20):
and then they get spread out amongst the various manufacturers
that say here in the United States. So is it new, Yes,
it made the Mitsubishi spects. Well, you know, so it
may have to become a completely different brand from a
completely different vendor. All right. I did. I did pick up.
I did pick up one from O'Reilly's. It was sitting
in the trunk when I was at the deal around Saturday.
(29:42):
You know, I told him, I said, listen, if you
if we have a bad compressor, there's one in the trunk.
And you know there diagnosic was you got a leak
and so and you might have a leak. Listen anything. Well,
I can see see where he pointed out where the
oil is, right. You know, I gotta kind of take
it with a grain of salt. But let me ask
you a question. When those fans are shutting, When I'm
(30:06):
seeing that fan shut off, they're both cutting off is
that correct, because isn't one just for the cooling system
and the other one is for the A C. No,
I believe, I believe they double duty. One of those.
I believe there's a low on the high side, and
I'd have to look at a wiring diagram to be certain,
but generally when you see two, they do double duty.
One of them will be a bigger one will be
(30:28):
cooling system and low side a C. And then the
smaller one or the next one will be high side
a C. So when pressure exceeds a certain point, there's
probably a two step relay in here somewhere that it
will turn on both fans or one, depending upon what
it's seeing. I know more looking at a wiring diagram.
What I want to leave you with is this, Okay,
(30:49):
once you wire up that side marker ball to the compressor,
and again we're just looking for tell me what's good,
I'll tell you what's bad. Right, We're gonna play that game, agreed,
all right? If we If we do that with that,
it then the next thing I want to do is
I want you to go find the low side or
the high side pressure switch, the switch that controls the fans,
and I want you to wire that bulb in there,
(31:11):
and I want to see when the fans cycle, does
that bulb flash on and off? Could I have a
bad high side pressure switch? Because it sounds like we're
all over the place with this. So now I've got
a baseline this system. I've got to know what's failing. Yes,
I agree, it sounds like you've got a bad condenser.
But now I want to understand the electrical side. Does
that make sense right? But you know what's funny, and
(31:34):
this could be a coincidence, maybe just because the cars
getting you know, it's got some miles on and got
some ears on it. When I shut the fan the
A C off with the you know, inside control, it
makes the same exact noise, which never I never heard
that noise before. So I'm like, is it was it
just a coincidence that we changed the compressor and now
(31:54):
just you know, and your noise. You're sure the noise
is coming from the fans? Yes, yep, yep. Exactly To
defend somebody was one of the mechanics was saying that
those Oh here's the other thing. Why he said the
compressor was bad, which didn't make any sense to me.
He said, when you shut the when the compressor shuts off,
(32:18):
it should like stop immediately, the clutch stop immediately. And
he says it's spinning, and I'm Michael, what is that.
That doesn't make sense. It's a free spinning clutch. Well,
I've seen I disagree with that. I've seen compressors that
when they're shut off, they'll actually the compressor face plate
will actually rotate and revolve until it settles down. It
(32:38):
won't do it continuously. I wouldn't judge the system on that.
I'd wire in a side marker. I'd get the condenser fixed.
I would find a way to activate those condenser fans
by themselves are just powering ground and see if they
make noise. And if they do, then unfortunately you've got
bad condenser fans as well. But go one step at
a time. They've thrown enough parts at this car for it.
(32:59):
Let me know what happens and us I'm here if
you need me. Ran a need in the car, doctor,
I'll be back right after this. Welcome back running in
the car. Doctor. Let's take a quick ride over to
Virginia and talk to Craig about as those seven escaped. Craig,
I got about two minutes, brother, what's going on? Um? Thanks? First?
(33:22):
Taking my car rn uh My wife's two thousand and
seven four escape with electric door locks has two issues.
The first is that the door open light an alarm
bell goes off sporadically when the car is being driven,
and we can knock and unlock the doors and it'll
stop for a few seconds and starts right back up again.
(33:44):
The second issue is that if we parked the car
and lock it many times, the car alarm goes off
for no reason, the horn blowing and all that, which
is also very annoying. Just curious what you would suggest
for us to get this thing fixed. First thing I
do is do a complete vehicle skin. I look at
all the computers. There's a there's a module on that
(34:05):
vehicle called the GEM or general uh generic electric module,
Generic electronic module, the GEM module. It's probably under the
left foot of the driver on the driver's side corner
of the passenger compartment. I bet the GEM module is
going to show us a fault code for either door
a jar switch circuits or latch or hood a jar
(34:26):
switch circuits. If the hood is loose, for example, and
it has optional anti theft on it. Which from the
sounds of it, it does. If the hooded jar switch
is rattled and it thinks while the vehicle is locked
going down the road, perhaps something's happening where it's gonna
pop open and set off the alarm. Uh, it's going
to activate that. So it sounds like one of the
(34:47):
micro switches on one of either the four doors if
this is a four door, or the engine compartment and
the trunk latch has got an issue and it's got
to be dealt with now. It may be something as
simple as scanning for a code. It's telling you it's
it's it's got a uh, you know, it's got something
along the lines of the left rear door has a
(35:07):
fault in it, and it may just need a switch
for that corner. The switch, by the way, is part
of the door latch assembly, and the door panel has
to come apart. It's a bit of a michigust to
get to um. But do that. Do that first. I'm
sorry for the short time we ran out of time.
Do that first, get it scanned. Call me back if
you need more, but that should give you a direction
on where to go until the next time. I'm on
a nating in the car Doctor. Mechanics aren't expensive, they're priceless.
(35:31):
See you
Well, I need somebody, not just anybody, you know, I
need someone Ron and Anian. You get outside of New Jersey,
the variety of cars shrinks down to the trucks and
SUVs and very little electric vehicles that I saw even
on the road traveling, I did not see a lot
of electric vehicles that car doctor. So I ended up
(00:20):
taking it back apart and putting that transmission control module in,
which is all part of the same, you know, just
on the Solinois pack, in the whole nine yard. That
ended up solving it. You know, life is good. So
cool thousand dollars got her back on the road and
cheaper than Welcome to the radio home of Ron and
Anian the Car Doctor, since this is where car owners
(00:42):
the world overturned to for their definitive opinion on automotive repair.
If your mechanics giving you a busy signal, pick up
the phone and call in the garage doors are open,
but I am here to take your call at eight five,
five five six, and now he is running. I want
(01:03):
to start the hour off talking to you about diagnosis
and the value of it and why it's so expensive,
and maybe it's so expensive is a good thing because
maybe it has to be expensive to be good. I
don't know. The conversation has been buzzing around in my
head for a while and it sort of came to
fruition this week at the shop. And here's how it unfolded. So,
(01:28):
you know, there's only there's only one thing I really
have to sell anybody, and that's time, okay, And it's
either time where I'm doing a physical repair or time
where I'm diagnosing something. And when I say me, I
mean the shop. You know, it's it's as as as
a business entity. You have to look at what it
is you're trying to do. You're exchanging dollars for minutes,
and contained within those minutes really is the value of
(01:51):
what you know, of what you've put into practice, of
what you've sat down and said, here's how I'm gonna
make it work, and here's what I'm gonna do to
complete the operation and and and be done with it.
You know, it's no different than any other store. I'm sure. Well,
I'd like to think that guy was running the bagel
stores this down and says, well, I've got to make
so many bagels in an hour, and then I've got
to sell so many of those bagels and they have
to cost me this and sell them for that, and
(02:12):
it's a business. It's gotten busy at the shop this year,
very busy at the shop, more so than any other
time that I can remember in recent history. Maybe the
eighties or the seventies were this busy, and I wasn't
really there in the seventies the eighties, So how to
be the eighties when I remember being this busy Because
there's no cars out there for you, there's nothing out
there for you to buy. There's a vehicle shortage. We
(02:33):
know that there's no there's no mystery to that, and
we're not gonna get into the house and the wise.
I've got my own theories, but that's, you know, not
what this is about. So you know, I've got a
limit how much I get on the phone. I've got
a limit getting on the phone. I've got a limit,
you know, down to what's the payback? Is there a payback?
And it's not. I'm not trying to pinch pennies and
count Nichols and diamonds, but I'm trying to be effective
(02:55):
and efficient. And that's really what order repairs about it
A lot of the time, right, the more efficient and
effective I am. The better it is for you because
you get a good repair, usually at a lower cost.
Someone called the shop this week. I haven't seen this
gentleman in six years, and it's funny I look back
(03:17):
on service history. I've seen him three times. This was
the third time I've seen him. I saw him in
two thousand eleven, two thousand sixteen, and now today two
thousand twenty two. So we're six going on seven years.
And it was always for some of too obscure problem
that we didn't fix. We hadn't fixed it prior, and
(03:39):
not that that has any bearing on it. Everybody's you know,
free will. You can do whatever you want. But I
don't understand what you get out of having me diagnose something. Um, okay,
I get it. I fixed it. I tell you what's wrong,
and I guess I fixed because in each case it
never came back with what you said it was gonna
be this, and it wasn't. It was something else. But
you know, you can't cherry pick anymore, is what I'm
(04:00):
trying to get to. Diagnostics are getting too complicated and
to involved, too involved, and there's there's you know, diagnostics
and the procedures I use have changed in the last
seven or eight months, never mind the last six or
seven years. So procedures change, technology changes, Costs go up
to me, costs go up to you. That's economics, that's
(04:21):
how the economy works, right. But I'm very upfront about it.
I explained it to everybody. Say listen, and I look
at the problem, and I think about the problem, and
I listened to their story, and you know what the
rationale is. And I say, okay, you know what minimum
diagnostic charge at the shop is two hours, And it's
usually what it takes by the time I go through evaluate,
look at do the normal drill, do what I have
(04:42):
to do, Prove what's good, prove what's bad. All that
solve the problem. Sometimes we have to go further. Sometimes
we have to do more. Sometimes it can't be solved
in two hours. Sometimes it's an intermittent, random thing that
requires multiple road tests. And uh, you know, there are
days you'll come to the shop and I've got you know,
four s and tools out because this one give me
this information, this one give me that information, this one
(05:03):
give me what I wanted, and that one broke. You know,
it happens, right, that one doesn't talk to the car
the way it's supposed to because the less software update
it got. Uh, something's jarable, and now we have to
talk to the manufacturer to get us straightened out. Diagnostics
is not easy, bottom line. So many of you think
we just plug a tool in and the tool stands
up and says, hey, it's the pink black wire coming
(05:24):
out of connector one oh three in the left rear
corner of the vehicle, and that's what's wrong with it.
Uh gives you a code. It tells you something it
didn't see in binary or digital language that the computer
analyzes and says, hey, this my programming tells me the
fault is somewhere in this circuit. Now you have to
go find it. And that's the trick, right, That's that's
a lot of what it's about. But there's one gentleman
(05:44):
in particularly. He brought us an oh eight jeep. So
it's already it's you know, let's call it what it is.
It's fourteen fifteen years old, and you know it was
missing a grill and headlights, which I kind of was
the tip off, like what are we getting into here?
And he's trying to restore it and put it back
together for his daughter, and yeah, that's great. You know,
I'm real happy for you. But you know, somebody else
(06:05):
has been working on it, whether it was him and
a few other people had seemed had their hand in
the pot. You know, a lot of things go wrong
when everybody's trying to put the yeast in the bread.
Who put the yeast in the bread? I always think
of that episode. I love Lucy. I'm dating myself, I know,
so you know, I looked at it. I said, this
is easily three hours of shop time. This is three
(06:25):
hours of diagnostic procedure. You know, I'm sure I'm going
to spend an hour just doing some research and trying
to catch up on what's been done, after looking at
all his notes or whatever notes he might give me,
and trying to verify the vehicle it had to check
engine light on in an intermittent no crank condition. Not
saying that both are related. They could be related. I
didn't think so, not from his description, and I kind
of treated it as I've got a problem and a
(06:46):
problem b I looked at him, Charlie, it's five dollars,
it's four and five bucks at three hours of shop time.
I'm going to begin a diagnosis plus tax and he
sawt of bork balked. You know, you could see the
hesitancy in them, and yeah, listen, I don't tell you
where to go eat, I don't tell you what to drive.
I just tell you how I'm gonna fix it. This
is what it is to me. This is the value
(07:06):
of it for me, This is what I have to do.
This is how I'm gonna get to solve your problem.
It's not my truck. My truck runs signed off on it,
said thank you very much, I'll see you soon. Let
me know what happens. He left. You know, there's a
mechanics intuition. There's just something that you just know. I
don't know when you're When you're on, you're on, and
(07:27):
when you're when you're Spidy senses up. It's up. And
I said, I'm not gonna get to this right away.
I've got other cars this Monday morning. Let me let
me put this on the side and let it take
a break for a minute. Let me see what else
I've got to get into. And I did that. In
about an hour or fifteen minutes later, the phone rang
and it was Charlie. You know, ron I can't really
justify a five diagnosis, especially when none of it's gonna
(07:48):
count towards the repair. You know, there's a lot wrong
with that. I said to myself, why would a diagnostic
procedure count towards the repair? You know, you don't go
to the doctor and he gives you a shot or
sick your heart rate, blood pressure, weighs you stick at
(08:08):
your tongue, say I it doesn't go. Well, that was
on the twenty dollars, But we're gonna apply that towards
the physical that we're gonna give you, or the diet
we're gonna put you on, or the repair we're gonna
make to your stomach for the ulcer. Time is time.
It's all a business has to sell. And in the
case of order repair, it's counted in minutes. And I said,
no problem, pick it up. Well, you know, no problem,
(08:30):
pick it up. Came by, I picked it up. I
don't know where it went. And I just felt compelled
to tell you this story because it's gonna go somewhere
where I'm guessing no diagnosis will be made. Um Charlie
thinks he already has some of the answers on what
it was. It had been to somebody else before me.
Somebody else told him it was a battery was the
(08:51):
cause of the problem, which I didn't believe that was
the cause of the check engine light. It might have
been the cause of the no crank, but it didn't
sound like it to me. It sounded like the battery
was fine, that it had a had a an intermittent
starter or ignition switch or something else going on. And
it's said, because that vehicle is now going to get
bounced around, and Charlie's gonna get bounced around, and he's
gonna go from shop to shop, or he's gonna try
and fix it himself, and he's gonna put a thousand
(09:13):
dollars worth of parts in it or whatever he's gonna do,
and then I don't know, maybe it'll come back in
five years, maybe not. Because there is value in a diagnosis,
and there's strength in knowing that procedures have been made
and taken and and and that's the real value of it.
I Uh, I shocked somebody this week. I guess I
(09:35):
was a good boy scout and someone had called the
shop from Connecticut and um, sure her Lexus had a
misfire on it, you know, what. I'm not going to
continue this story because I can see that she is
on the line. Suddenly pull over and take the pause.
When we come back, we're gonna continue talking about the
value of diagnostics and steps taken as we uh go
(09:57):
to Connecticut. The car doct will return right after this.
Don't go away down when you get keep Ron's number
(10:17):
handy eight five five five six zero nine nine zero
zero for when you really need advice on your car.
Here's rock. You know, I was in boy scout mode
midweek this paste week, and I'm always in boy scout mode,
I guess, but there was a there was an email
in the form of an e voice when someone calls
the zero phone number, every every one of those calls
(10:38):
comes through my email account, and I read them, you know,
and this was clearly a help me Obi wan Kenobi,
You're my only hope. And um, I guess I surprised
her because I called her and I think I caught
her at home, and um, as it turns out, I
think she's here to give us an update on where
this vehicle stands. A sorrow? Is that correct? From Connecticut?
H Yes, it's all sorrow. A sorrow. So how did
(11:01):
you want to be maybe you want to backfill everybody?
Would you like me you backfill everybody? Tell us about
the experience you had this week with getting the tune
up on the Lexus. Okay, yeah, so the show. Okay,
so Um, I brought my car in because I had
a check engine light. So I brought it into a
local mechanic. I recently moved here to Windsor and my
(11:22):
husband Um looked up this mechanic, so I went there
the check engine light. They said they did the codes
and the code showed that one of the cylinders was misfiring,
so the the next step would be to do a
tune up. So I said, okay, I did the tune up.
I picked it up the next day and the light
came on when I was two minutes down the road.
So I turned back around told him the light had
(11:43):
came back on and the car was sputtering a little bit.
So they did continue diagnostics, they said, m for the
rest of the week, and then come Friday, they told
me that there were multiple cylinders firing, multiple misfires, and
they couldn't figure out why or what was going on.
So they recommended that I get it to Hoffman lexus
um for them to do a diagnostic. I did that,
(12:04):
I was not able to drive the car. I had
to get a tod to Hoffman and then long story short,
Hoffman did their diagnostic. They also saw codes P zero
three hundred. I know you said to get the codes
P zero three oh one, P zero three oh five.
There was a high misfire on cylinder one and they
eventually found coolant pooling in between the intake manifold cylinder
(12:24):
head and they recommended a new engine and head gasket.
It's basically what happened well and what bothered me when
we were when we initially talked, and this is for
everyone's benefit. When I asked you what the codes were
you you didn't know. They hadn't given you a report. Correct,
they hadn't given you any information. And you know that's
a problem. You're paying for your paying for a diagnosis.
(12:45):
You should get formal information. Here's the list of codes.
Here's the print out. You know, sometimes we'll even give
somebody a flow chart saying here a P zero three hundred,
here's the possibilities. Now, a lot of shops might sit
there and say, ron, nobody ever reads codes. Nobody ever
reads flow charts. You don't know though, And to me,
you know what if you go to a doctor and
you get an X ray and you take that X
(13:07):
ray home, I don't look at the x ray. I
give it to the next doctor and say here, what
does this mean? Um? Right? Uh, you're you're paying for
an X ray. I want a copy of the diagnosis.
You're paying for a diagnosis. Don't you want a copy
of it? Uh? You know? And I felt really good
that we were able to have that conversation, and I,
you know, I think, uh, I think, now the next
time you walk into a repair shop, you're gonna be
(13:29):
better armed that you'll you'll you'll know what to say
and what to do. What ended up happening with this?
Or you're gonna put it? Are you gonna put an
engine in it? Or is it time to go car shopping?
So we are balancing both options. We're car shopping. We're
thinking of My dad has a reliable mechanic that he
uses in water Bary, So he's recommending that I towe
it to them, and so they can take a look
(13:50):
at it and get a third opinion and then take
take it from there as to what to do right
Oh yeah, the my dad mechanics said, you know, he
could fix it. He read the report from how Men
about the whole um, you know, the engine and all
that what they recommended, and he said he could do it,
for he has an engine there somewhere, so right, and
I liked I like that. I like the idea of
(14:11):
the third opinion from a known entity. You know that
the value of the known entity is what makes this
the big deal. Not knocking the first shop. I think
the first shop missed a couple of steps, all right.
I was so, you know, I was surprised when it
was well, it had full coats for misfires. It's time
for a tune up. And we we talked about that, right,
and we went through the lawnmower scenario about it takes ignition,
(14:35):
it takes fuel, it takes mechanical integrity, and you know,
we talked about moving ignition coils around and spark plugs around,
trying to pin down which cylinder and doesn't follow the
ignition or is it still stuck on cylinder four. The
The strange thing is that the first tune up shop
never mentioned coolant or added coolant, you know to the ticket,
(14:57):
which and you know, and I thought of this after
we hung up the last time. I said, I wonder
if there was coolant on any of your bills. I
wonder if they just randomly added coolant not realizing that
you know, it was low on coolant. There was a
reason why they just added cool and said that was
just low on coolant. No big deal, you know. So
you may want to go back and look at some
of your invoices because Toyota Alexis coolant is not cheap.
(15:18):
I can't imagine any shop giving it away. Well I
can just I can't imagine I'm giving it away and
staying in business for any length of time. Uh so
you know that gets to be an issue. Um, you know,
I go ahead? No, go ahead. Would there be any
recourse that I can go back for the first shop
to say, hey, you know I brought in my car.
(15:39):
You know I had no out covert symptoms of my
car other than this check engine light. I came in
for this. You diagnosed it that I needed a tune up.
I did this tune up, and my car is now
worth than when I drove it in. I well, let's see, Okay,
if there's something that the third entity comes up with
and says, gee, you know they did this wrong or
that wrong. I think that's a core of a conversation
(16:01):
if they if the third entity comes back and says, hey,
we've got a we've got a we really do have
a failed engine. It's hard to believe that a vehicle
would go in for a check engine line. I'm not
saying it's impossible. I've seen some strange things in my career,
but a vehicle would go in for a misfire, have
it legitimately be spark plugs or an ignition coil because
(16:23):
you had said they put six plugs in it and
one coil, and we talked a little bit about the
dangers of that on a Toyota vs. Six why that's
not sometimes best policy. It's hard to believe it would
go from ignition to getting tuned to getting towed and
at the next shop it's an engine and that's It's
like we missed a step, we missed something in between.
It didn't go. It probably didn't go five miles between
(16:46):
the time they did their parts replacement and the time
you took it home and turned around and came back
right correct, I didn't even make it home, right, So yeah,
did did somebody miss a step? So I think once
you know what was wrong with this, I think it's
time to go back and have a conversation and say, listen,
everybody makes a mistake, everybody has a bad day. But
(17:06):
I just paid I don't know what did you pay five? Right?
Nine to find out that didn't fix it? You know?
And and and your argument is gonna be, shouldn't you
have diagnosed this a little more than just putting spark
plugs and an ignition coil in it? Because isn't there
And here's here's the key sentence. I want you to
(17:27):
remember this. And I know your husband's listening, so I
know hill between the two of you, Um, you know
the key the key sentence here, well, you, your husband
and the baby, right, the key sentences that you want
to say, isn't it possible that there's more than one
reason why a vehicle will misfire other than ignition? Right?
(17:49):
And And why wasn't diagnosis made after it was determined
that had a misfire? There's nowhere in a float chart
I know of no float chart for any vehicle or
any manufacturer where it says P zero three oh four
misfire changed spark plugs and a coil. They all talk
about doing diagnosis. They all talk about doing some sort
(18:11):
of continued steps of analysis. And that's where I think
that shop dropped the ball. I think they jumped the
gun too soon and they were too quick in their decision.
So that's how I would approach it. That's how i'd
attack it. Do this for us, though, because we're all
kind of curious. Call us back next week or the
week after when you know more. We'd like to hear
what the end result is. Did you end up putting
an engine in this and how you made out once
and for all. Good luck and stay in touch. I'm
(18:32):
on any of the guard doctor. We'll be back right
after this. Don't go away. Welcome back. We're in the
(19:02):
car doctor. Let's get over and talk to Dennis in Connecticut.
Oh for a Mitsubishi. Go on, Dennis, Welcome to the
car doctor, sir, How can I help? Yeah? How are
you doing? Okay? What's cooking? So? Early early spring the
a C went out, so it brought it to a
reputable shop they've been around for many years. They put
dyeing in it, you know, they checked it. They put
(19:25):
dying and they said, the trader rails were leaked, so
they changed those, sent me on my way. They said,
come back in a week or so, we'll check it.
You know, with the check we can find any die.
I did that, No, no die, Okay, fine. Three weeks later,
it's blowing potier again. So I go back to them. Oh,
(19:49):
now we think it might be the pressure valve, but
we're gonna check farther, so our pressure switch. I'm sorry.
So then now it's to come press or the seal
is leaking. Wait wait, wait, wait, wait a minute, wait
a minute. Was the refrigerant in it? No, it went
it went warm again. Okay, so went warm again. And
(20:12):
they're saying it's oh, it's a pressure switch on the
high side line for the compressor. Well at first they did,
but then when they checked into it even further, they
were like, no, we found that the shaft seal is
leaking on the compressor, so you need a compressor. So
I'm like, you let me get a second opinion, because
I didn't like the fact that they you know, I
couldn't find the leak, and now they're telling me there
(20:34):
is a leak. So and go to the next job,
he says, I can't find any oil, he goes, so
he put free on in the system and he said, uh,
you know, see how it it pens out again. So
I get in the vehicle and it's blown warm here
right in the parking lot. So I go back in
(20:58):
and there is another repertulce shopping around for many years. Um.
He goes, Yeah, the compressor is not kicking on the clutch,
so put the gauges on it. And I'm standing there
right next to him. It's full. So then he checks
for powering ground to the compressor and there's powering ground.
He says, your compressor is bad. Okay, So I changed
(21:21):
the compressor out and then this is the funny thing.
It was blowing nice cold air around forty two um.
Every sometimes when I would go through the car wash,
it would start blowing warm air again, and then within
a minute or two it would be blown. I would say,
(21:43):
it would start blowing warm here after I went through
the car wash, and then a minute or two later
it started blowing cold are again. I'm like, what's going on?
So I went to a third shop and they took
the free on out, put it back in enough pressors
started working again. They said, you have a bad compressor.
(22:04):
So another thing that was going on was after we
had changed the compressor, I noticed a noise and I
thought it was coming from the compressor. But when I
opened the hood, depending on what time of the kind
of day, it was not a very real humid day,
but you know, a hot day, you got the A
(22:25):
C colle. The fans would shut off. The two fans
would shut off for like four seconds, and before they
would even stop spinning, they were kicking back on. And
that third shop was saying that the compressor is telling
the fans to shut off and come right back on,
And that was another reason they were saying, the compressor
(22:47):
is back now. The fans are actually reacting to a
pressure switch somewhere in the system. So if the compressor
is not on, but if high sight pressure is still
over the line, it'll turn on the cooling fans for
the condensed or trying to pull it down to lower
high side pressure. So they're they're they're they're they're not right,
but they're not wrong. They're they're kind of putting the
(23:08):
car before the horse if the compressors. If the compressor
is running and it's creating high pressure because of a
defect somewhere else in the system, or just because of
the environment or the ambient temperature heat load, it'll turn
the condenser fans on. So that's not incorrect. Let's go
back to the car wash issue. All right. Uh, you know,
did anybody consider the possibility that water is getting on
(23:30):
the belt, the compressor is slipping and that's why it's
blowing hot air, or did they physically see the compressor
not turned on for some reason going through a car
wash when it started blowing warm air. I opened the
hood on one of those occasions and the clutch was
not engaged. So here's the other third shop. I went
(23:52):
through the car wash, it started blowing warm air and
it then never came back to blowing cold. Here that's
when I went to a shop and actually, no, this
is what I thought. This is what I did. I
thought it was low on free on it that I
physically had a leak, because that's what happened in the springtime.
(24:13):
So I had a can of free on and I
tried to because I did that earlier in the spring.
I put some free on in it and the compressor
kicked on, So then I knew it was low on
free on so I did that. The last time I
went through the car washing, it never came back on.
So I put a little free on in and then
it wouldn't It wouldn't kick on. So I'm like, well,
(24:35):
then something else is going on. And then when I
went there, they were like, well, you overcharged it. I'm like, well,
but it stopped working before I even tried to attempt
to put any free on in. And I don't even
know if I was able to get any free on
in it because it was full. Okay, a couple of questions,
are these new compressors used compressors, reman compressors, new compressor?
(24:57):
But here, let me let me go on. So this
week I went out of state. I had a little
train in seminar thirty more. It's blown air. I get
in the car four o'clock, it's blown warm air. So
I ended up finding a mitch Bsi dealer in that state.
(25:19):
They were able to look at it on Saturday, and
they said, which he showed me, I have a leak
in a leak in the compressor, I mean a leak
in the condenser. And they said there was really not
much free on left in it. That's why your compressor
wasn't kicking in, so they put free on in it.
(25:41):
It's still blown cold air now, so it's got to
be a small leak. He showed me where it's leaking.
I see the you know, the discoloration. Um. But I'm
still concerned with the fans why they're uh, it's almost
(26:01):
like a grinding noise when they shut off. And well,
is it a noise or is it the fact that
they shut off? Dennis, which is it? I think it's
because they're shutting off. But I've never heard that noise
before after since we changed the compressor. That's the strange
part of it. You don't hear the noise anymore? Or
(26:23):
do now? You do? Here? I never heard it, now
I do hear it. Okay, let's do this. You're it
sounds like you're a hand kind of guy, right, I
could do some things. Okay, can you get to the
compressor clutch feed, the electrical wiring? Is it accessible? I
possibly could? Yeah. Okay, go down to your local lotoparts store.
(26:43):
You ever see a one side marker bulb, you know,
just a side marker an exterior bulb for a vehicle.
I want you to go buy a one. I don't
care what the socket is work because they're usually rubber
basse and you can zip tie into things. I want
you to wire a bulb across the wired connector for
the compressor clutch. You gotta hot in the ground there, right,
(27:06):
and every time the compressor comes on, that bulb was
gonna light, all right. So the first thing you're gonna
do is if this goes hot and it doesn't blow
cold air anymore. Um, yeah, it doesn't blow cold air anymore,
you're gonna go look at that compressor. Is the bulb
is the bull bond or not? If the bulb is
not on and you're commanding it on, and then we've
(27:27):
got to figure out why. So the next thing is,
maybe we do have low refrigerant at that moment, all right,
and maybe that's why the compressor is not coming on.
That's not so much the end of the road for you,
but it just would be a good tell tale because
this seems to be happening so sporadically from your description
from my seat here, I think you've got or had
one more than one problem, all right, and now you're
(27:50):
just trying to catch up to the consequences. So I'll
tell you what sit tight, Dennis, I don't want to
rush this. Let me pull over, take a poise. When
I come back, we'll have about a minute ago and
then I gotta get on the phone. But um, let
me just for sh up with you real quick. When
I returned the car doctors coming back right after this.
Don't go away, welcome back, run name the car doctor, Dennis,
(28:14):
you're still there, sir, real quick? Is this an automatic
or manual a C system? It's automatic automatic? Okay. So
the next thing I would do once I see what
the compressor is doing when it doesn't work, or when
you see it blowing hot air, if the compressor has
that bulb is lit and the compressor is not on
(28:35):
either somehow the compressor is not grounded, all right? Could
we have a bad engine ground, a bad chassis ground,
something like that, or unfortunately you've got a third bad compressor,
which brings me to one quick question. What are you
paying for these compressors? Any idea? Actually that I only
put one compressor in R R and Y compressors out
of Florida, okay, And what are you paying for him?
(28:58):
That one? I didn't pay much for that one, just
over two, um, I questioned, I just listen. I'm not
knocking them. I just question cheap a C compressors. All right,
you know it's an O four Mitsubishi. It's a lot
of this stuff seems to come from one one, one
vendor in in China. I'll say it like it is,
(29:20):
and then they get spread out amongst the various manufacturers
that say here in the United States. So is it new, Yes,
it made the Mitsubishi spects. Well, you know, so it
may have to become a completely different brand from a
completely different vendor. All right. I did. I did pick up.
I did pick up one from O'Reilly's. It was sitting
in the trunk when I was at the deal around Saturday.
(29:42):
You know, I told him, I said, listen, if you
if we have a bad compressor, there's one in the trunk.
And you know there diagnosic was you got a leak
and so and you might have a leak. Listen anything. Well,
I can see see where he pointed out where the
oil is, right. You know, I gotta kind of take
it with a grain of salt. But let me ask
you a question. When those fans are shutting, When I'm
(30:06):
seeing that fan shut off, they're both cutting off is
that correct, because isn't one just for the cooling system
and the other one is for the A C. No,
I believe, I believe they double duty. One of those.
I believe there's a low on the high side, and
I'd have to look at a wiring diagram to be certain,
but generally when you see two, they do double duty.
One of them will be a bigger one will be
(30:28):
cooling system and low side a C. And then the
smaller one or the next one will be high side
a C. So when pressure exceeds a certain point, there's
probably a two step relay in here somewhere that it
will turn on both fans or one, depending upon what
it's seeing. I know more looking at a wiring diagram.
What I want to leave you with is this, Okay,
(30:49):
once you wire up that side marker ball to the compressor,
and again we're just looking for tell me what's good,
I'll tell you what's bad. Right, We're gonna play that game, agreed,
all right? If we If we do that with that,
it then the next thing I want to do is
I want you to go find the low side or
the high side pressure switch, the switch that controls the fans,
and I want you to wire that bulb in there,
(31:11):
and I want to see when the fans cycle, does
that bulb flash on and off? Could I have a
bad high side pressure switch? Because it sounds like we're
all over the place with this. So now I've got
a baseline this system. I've got to know what's failing. Yes,
I agree, it sounds like you've got a bad condenser.
But now I want to understand the electrical side. Does
that make sense right? But you know what's funny, and
(31:34):
this could be a coincidence, maybe just because the cars
getting you know, it's got some miles on and got
some ears on it. When I shut the fan the
A C off with the you know, inside control, it
makes the same exact noise, which never I never heard
that noise before. So I'm like, is it was it
just a coincidence that we changed the compressor and now
(31:54):
just you know, and your noise. You're sure the noise
is coming from the fans? Yes, yep, yep. Exactly To
defend somebody was one of the mechanics was saying that
those Oh here's the other thing. Why he said the
compressor was bad, which didn't make any sense to me.
He said, when you shut the when the compressor shuts off,
(32:18):
it should like stop immediately, the clutch stop immediately. And
he says it's spinning, and I'm Michael, what is that.
That doesn't make sense. It's a free spinning clutch. Well,
I've seen I disagree with that. I've seen compressors that
when they're shut off, they'll actually the compressor face plate
will actually rotate and revolve until it settles down. It
(32:38):
won't do it continuously. I wouldn't judge the system on that.
I'd wire in a side marker. I'd get the condenser fixed.
I would find a way to activate those condenser fans
by themselves are just powering ground and see if they
make noise. And if they do, then unfortunately you've got
bad condenser fans as well. But go one step at
a time. They've thrown enough parts at this car for it.
(32:59):
Let me know what happens and us I'm here if
you need me. Ran a need in the car, doctor,
I'll be back right after this. Welcome back running in
the car. Doctor. Let's take a quick ride over to
Virginia and talk to Craig about as those seven escaped. Craig,
I got about two minutes, brother, what's going on? Um? Thanks? First?
(33:22):
Taking my car rn uh My wife's two thousand and
seven four escape with electric door locks has two issues.
The first is that the door open light an alarm
bell goes off sporadically when the car is being driven,
and we can knock and unlock the doors and it'll
stop for a few seconds and starts right back up again.
(33:44):
The second issue is that if we parked the car
and lock it many times, the car alarm goes off
for no reason, the horn blowing and all that, which
is also very annoying. Just curious what you would suggest
for us to get this thing fixed. First thing I
do is do a complete vehicle skin. I look at
all the computers. There's a there's a module on that
(34:05):
vehicle called the GEM or general uh generic electric module,
Generic electronic module, the GEM module. It's probably under the
left foot of the driver on the driver's side corner
of the passenger compartment. I bet the GEM module is
going to show us a fault code for either door
a jar switch circuits or latch or hood a jar
(34:26):
switch circuits. If the hood is loose, for example, and
it has optional anti theft on it. Which from the
sounds of it, it does. If the hooded jar switch
is rattled and it thinks while the vehicle is locked
going down the road, perhaps something's happening where it's gonna
pop open and set off the alarm. Uh, it's going
to activate that. So it sounds like one of the
(34:47):
micro switches on one of either the four doors if
this is a four door, or the engine compartment and
the trunk latch has got an issue and it's got
to be dealt with now. It may be something as
simple as scanning for a code. It's telling you it's
it's it's got a uh, you know, it's got something
along the lines of the left rear door has a
(35:07):
fault in it, and it may just need a switch
for that corner. The switch, by the way, is part
of the door latch assembly, and the door panel has
to come apart. It's a bit of a michigust to
get to um. But do that. Do that first. I'm
sorry for the short time we ran out of time.
Do that first, get it scanned. Call me back if
you need more, but that should give you a direction
on where to go until the next time. I'm on
a nating in the car Doctor. Mechanics aren't expensive, they're priceless.
(35:31):
See you
Host
Ron Ananian
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