January 26, 2025 • 56 mins
The disappearance of The Beaumont Children is burned into the collective conscious of Australia. It’s one of the longest-running cases in the nation’s history and has baffled law enforcement for more than half a century.
Stuart Mullins grew up down the road from the Beaumont children in Adelaide. Over the years he has researched and co-authored investigative writing into their disappearance. He walks us through the case, and why he believes he knows just who is responsible for the disappearance of Jane, Arnna and Grant on Australia Day in 1966.
For photos, maps and further details on the case you can join our closed Facebook group dedicated to the podcast. Just search for True Crime Conversations on Facebook.
GUEST: Stuart Mullins
HOST: Jessie Stephens
PRODUCER: Elise Cooper
RESEARCH
- The Satin Man: Uncovering the mystery of the Beaumont Children, Alan Whiticker and Stuart Mullins https://bit.ly/2leQGNx
- Mother of missing Beaumont children, Nancy Beaumont, dies aged 92 - ABC News https://ab.co/2lfjDsE
- The Beaumont Children: What Really Happened, Channel 7 https://bit.ly/2lNMVyE
- The Beaumont Children Mystery: Crime Investigation Australia, Channel 7 https://bit.ly/2mIlwyu
- Beaumont children search: Police end today’s dig, having found no human remains, The Adelaide Advertiser https://bit.ly/2lbGUvr
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
You're listening to Amma Mea podcast. Mama Mea acknowledges the
traditional owners of land and waters. This podcast was recorded
on Hello and Welcome to a special episode of True
Crime Conversations. I'm your host Jemma Bath. Today I'm sharing
an episode from over five years ago. One of the
first cases we ever covered on the podcast. Yesterday marked
(00:35):
of the disappearance of the Beaumont children, Jane, Anna and Grant,
who vanished without a trace. Their case remains one of
Australia's most enduring and heartbreaking mysteries. On January twenty sixth,
nineteen sixty six, the children, aged nine, seven and four,
left their Somerton Park home for a day at Glenelg Beach,
(00:57):
but never returned. In this episode, you'll hear from Jesse Stevens,
former host of True Crime Conversations, interviewing Stuart Mullins, a
man who grew up just streets away from the Beaumont family,
believes he knows exactly what happened to the children and
who is responsible.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
This episode of True Crime Conversations contains discussions of alleged
child abuse, abduction, murder, and the recounting of traumatic events
listener discretion is advised. It was Australia Day nineteen sixty
six when Nancy Beaumont was awoken by two of her children,
(01:36):
seven year old Anna and four year old Grant, jumping
on her bed. As the temperature climbed into the forties.
They begged their mum to go to the beach. There
were only a few days left of school holidays, and
the Beaumont children wanted to make the most of it.
They lived only two and a half kilometers or so
from Glenelg Beach near Adelaide, South Australia. The cool water
(02:00):
and surrounding sprinklers were a respite from the almost unbearable
heat of summer. The beach was just about their favorite
place in the world. Nine year old Jane, the eldest,
was put in charge of taking her younger brother and
sister to the beach, up the road and ensuring they
were all back by lunchtime. Nancy walked her three children
(02:23):
up the road to the bus stop and placed some
money in Jane's hand, instructing her to bring home some lunch.
She ferewelled them, sure she'd see them again in just
a few hours. She never did, though Apart from a
few critical sightings at the beach, no one would ever
see the three Beaumont children again. I'm Jesse Stephens and
(02:53):
this is True Crime Conversations, exploring the world's most notorious
crimes by speaking to the people who know the most
about them. In this episode, I'm talking to Stuart Mullins,
co author of the book The Satin Man, uncovering the
mystery of the Missing Beaumont Children. Stuart is more than
(03:13):
a researcher. He grew up only streets away from the
three Beaumont children. He's also working on a new book
due for release early next year. Stuart believes wholeheartedly that
he knows exactly what happened to Jane, Anna and Grant
on that fateful day in nineteen sixty six. It was
(03:38):
January twenty sixth, nineteen sixty six, when Nancy Beaumont kissed
her three kids goodbye at the bus stop as they
set off to go to the beach. The eldest, Jane,
was nine. I wanted to ask you, was that unusual
for her to sort of be in charge of a
seven year old and a four year old sibling as
they went to the beach.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
No, this was usual back in the nineteen sixties. I
can I can tell you firsthand. I was born in
glenel I was the same age as Anna and I
lived about three and a half lives. What is up
the road? Children had the responsibility. We went on buses,
We walked to the beach, which was Collobinan's. We rode
(04:19):
our bikes pretty well anywhere, as long as you were
home before the street lights came on. That was the
mother's rule which went right throughout the nineteen fifties and
nineteen sixties. And for me personally, I was seven years
old at the time I took the bus to Glenelg.
I took the bus to the Gleenelg by myself. This
was not unusual. So what Jane was doing was what
(04:42):
other families were doing.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
And what can you tell us about the Beaumont family.
So there were three kids and the parents. The father
worked and the mother was at home. What do we
know about what kind of people they were.
Speaker 3 (04:54):
I've spoken to Jane's best friend who sat with her
at school. She knew Jane for around four years. They
were nearly inseparable. She described that the children as latch key,
meaning that Jane was more of a parentified child, as
(05:15):
most of us were. Mister Beaumont was a traveling salesman
for Lynn Coop's linen industry that took him out to
the countryside. He wasn't happy that he was away from
the children, but the money he earned paid mortgage. Missus
Beaumont was a stay at home mum, but she was
as this friend said, she wasn't there. She was usually
(05:37):
at friends places or away. This friend said that she
had never seen mister and Missus Beaumont at home. It
was Jane looking after Grant looking after Anna. But again
it is not unusual. I came from a family of six.
I just lived up the road. I very rarely saw
mom and dad until the evening. We were out all
(05:59):
day at the school holidays. That's what we did, and
then we returned for dinner. So Jane's and Anna and
Grant's childhood was exactly the thing. The beach were very
close by. There was Somerton Beach, Brighton Beach, and the
very very popular Glenelg Beach. That's where we spent most
of our time, either Brighton which had the Jetty or
(06:21):
Glenelg Collie Reserve, and we would spend all day there
and Jane was the mother hen she was very mature
for her age. She loved reading. She would go through
several books per month and so she was very avid,
very learned. She was nearly top of her class and
very independent.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
So that was during the school holidays and they've jumped
on the bus in the morning and they were expected
home at around midday, weren't they.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
That's correct. They took the bus roughly about nine forty
five ten o'clock. It was a very hot day. It
was going to reach one hundred degrees fahrenheit in days
terms around forty two forty three degrees celsius. And in
South Australia, most of South Australia is a desert, so
you've got this strong northerly wind coming down from the desert,
(07:15):
and so your only respite is either the Adelaide Hills,
adventuring the streams or the Torrens River, or you would
go down the beach. Obviously, this day the children wanted
to go down the beach. Their friends were down there,
and it was the last day or the last few
days of the school holidays. So you would catch the bus.
(07:36):
Usually Jane, Anna and Grant would walk to the beach.
It was only two and a half kilometers from their
place at Somerton Park. Because it was so hot, Grant
wasn't wearing a t shirt. They said, we'll take the
bus and I'll let you go to the beach as
long as you're home by lunchtime. And here's some money
for the bus ride, and some pies and some cakes
(07:58):
and some fizzy drink for us to bring home.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
So what did Nancy do when she's waiting for the
kids at twelve and they don't come? What was her
next move?
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Is all parents, you are always worried about your children
once they go, especially if they don't come back on time.
These days, you're frantically on your iPhone. You'll be texting
them or calling them. With missus Beaumont. They didn't come
home on the twelve o'clock bus. Her natural reaction was, Okay,
(08:32):
well they missed that bus. They're on the next one now.
The next one came within about forty minutes, maybe a
bit longer. When they weren't on that bus, that's when
she got worried. That's where the motherly instinct kicks in.
She spoke to a friend, a friend of course said, look,
they've just missed the bus. They might be walking home,
(08:54):
but Nancy didn't want to follow the usual path they take,
just in case they did come back by a bus.
They lied and got home and she was out there
looking for them. But the next bus. It was that
next one that really set the alarms off. They weren't
on the next bus. This was completely unusual. Where were they.
(09:16):
That's when she became very frantic. And that was around
two o'clock. So you can imagine as parents, if you
got children, then the two hours and they're still not home.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
And Jim unexpectedly came home, didn't He was meant to
be away, and then he turned up.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
He was away. He left very early in the morning.
He was working for Lyncott Linen and he was servicing
country towns of South Australia. He was out near Snowtown
and he did come back early that day and he
could see that his wife was very distraught because it
was around three four o'clock and they still had not returned.
(09:56):
So of course Jim and Nancy got in the car
and went around the streets looking for them, but of
course couldn't find them.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
Both of them are living in hope that the children
had ever stayed there, stay at the beach, or that
they'd gone to their friend's places and stay there to play.
I'm still living in that hope that everything was all right,
because naturally, as time went on, they became more and
more concerned. And that was the situation.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
And so when they decided to eventually contact police, what
was the first response of the police force.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Mister and missus Beaumont went to the Glenelg Police station
in the late afternoon. They met the detective constable on
duty that day, which was Moss and Matters Moston is
in fact my cousin. He recollects that day very vividly.
In fact, he'll never forget it. They were very distraught.
They reported that their children were missing. Now the detectives
(10:57):
at the station would tell them that they will turn up,
so they could be hiding, they could have done this
or kind of done that. They weren't put down as
missing children. Now this is not unusually. In nineteen sixty six,
it was always they'll turn up soon. The abduction of
three children had never happened before, and never happened since,
(11:18):
not just in Australia, but around the world. The idea
of abduction never entered anybody's mind. This did not happen, and.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
It had only been a few hours at that point,
So what did they think had happened? What did they
say to the parents.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
The first thing Moston said was don't worry, they will
turn up soon, or put a call out to the
police vehicle because they had a two way radio, to
just have a look around for them. Mister Beaumont again
got in his car and looked around for them. But
as the time ticked on thirty minutes and then an hour,
that was when the alarm bell started to ring. Even
(11:56):
for Moston Madison the team, they had a problem. These
children weren't home. They said, look, they could be hiding
at your house, which was highly unlikely. They could still
be playing down the sandhills. They could be at an
the friends place, but mister and missus Beaumont were very
say disbelieving of that because it was their own children.
(12:18):
It got to about five o'clock and that's when panic
station set in.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
And so did police sort of speak to people on
the beach and see if anyone had cited the children.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Well, once the call came out and the children were
termed missing. It did hit the papers, but to see
the papers you had the evening paper. It was too
late for that, so it only hit the papers the
advertiser in the next morning. So it was only radio
and TV. TV news bulletins would come on, but not
(12:50):
too many people would watch black and white TV, especially
in the afternoon or that if you know, they were
listening to the radio. Other than that, you really had
difficulty getting the word out that these children were missing. However,
by about six pm we'd definitely got out through a
word of mouth and people started looking the children. And
(13:11):
in fact, mister Boem previously worked for Adelaide taxi company
and the call went out to them and they got
into their taxis and went around the suburbs of Gleneal
and further to see if they could spot the children,
but they had just disappeared off the place of the planet.
Speaker 4 (13:29):
Deployment of uniform police came down later that evening about
thirty police officer uniform police officers and it was organized
that we do a thorough search of the surrounding area,
the beach area to sand Hills north and south of
Canald and all the drains and paddocks and surrounding areas.
Sal Research Savannas was put on the airport and on
(13:52):
the interstate rail line in case someone was everything to
take them away. All my arterial rays leading out of
the state. Roadblocks were set up there in case. Unfortunately,
there could have been a time lapse of some six
or eight hours before the public really became a the
children were missing, and that time, okay, that the offender
(14:14):
quite a lot of time to get away.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
Was there any sort of, you know, items that they
dropped or any sign of them that the police were
able to recover.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
There was no items that they recovered. There's never been
any physical evidence regarding their disappearance. However, as reports started
coming in, people were lining up at the police station
where moston and the detectives were taking statements from well
meaning public. But that line started to snake quite extensively,
(14:50):
and in the police station they had would you believe,
it's hard to fathom now, they had one phone, one
line in and that ran hot, and the detectives had
to do their own typing. They had to type each report,
and there was hundreds of them. They were completely inundated.
As Matters said to me back when I first interviewed him.
(15:14):
He said, we didn't know what we were looking for.
We didn't know what had occurred. Now this occurred. They
just didn't know. They were like everybody else. What happened
to the Beaumont children. They were completely inundated. But over
the next few days some credible information came in. Apart
from all the well meaning public that came in trying
(15:36):
to help with that, there was some really interesting information
that came forward. We know when the children alighted from
the bus, they walked across the Collie Reserve. Collie Reserve
is a beautiful, sweeping green lawns that nearly go down
to the water's edge and glenel Beach and the others
(15:58):
faced the Gulf of Saint Vincent's and Kanger Island that
locks the waves really coming in, so it's dead, calm
and beautiful to swim out, especially for children. They laid
their towels out near some benches that certain people sitting on.
They laid their towels out and they ran down to
the water's edge and they played frolict in the water.
(16:19):
Although Grant could not swim, so he was only allowed
to go out to his belly button. According to Jane's
best friend, who had been to the beach with him
several times. They came back and then played under the
Collie Reserve sprinklers, which every child did. I did when
I was young, and that was usually to get the
sea water off you.
Speaker 5 (16:40):
The thing that I'd like to impress on you all
is that everyone make sure that they're familiar with the
descriptions of the three missing children. That is absolutely important.
And also make sure your friends are aware of the
descriptions of these children. And also if you have any
new Australian friends, perhaps you can you can assist them
in describing the children to them.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
And there was a sense that the children had seen
a man there, and there were a few witness says
who said they'd sort of been conversing with someone, but
it appeared that he wasn't a stranger, like it hadn't
alerted them. They weren't worried, but they'd sort of been
speaking to a man. What were the details about that man?
That was sort of significant.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
I think you hit the nail on the head there,
because what we now know we didn't know in nineteen
sixty six. Week can look at this and sort of
put yourself in an aerial view and see what had happened. See,
those children were very eager to go to the beach
if we can retrace just back, and this would add
into what you were saying. They were really eager to
(17:46):
go to the beach. For a few reasons. It was
a stinking hot day, it was one of the last
days of the school holidays. But also Anna and Grant
were teasing Jane, saying, Jane's got a boyfriend. Jane's got
a boyfriend. And of course it hadn't even hurt, but
a mother didn't take much notice of it. So they
(18:08):
got on the Worthley's bus got down to the beach.
When they were at the beach, Jane was given some
money by her mother to buy pies and some pasties
and some drink to bring back for lunch. That was
eight shillings and sixpence in pre decimal currency about eighty
five cents now, however, you're spending power back in nineteen
sixty six. Was a lot more. That was to buy
(18:30):
lunch and bring home for Nancy and the kids to enjoy. Now.
She placed that money in her bathed clip purse and
she placed it into a light blue airline type bag.
Because it's very important, this into mason that has been
messed for over fifty years. And yet when we start
(18:53):
looking at it differently, we start to realize that maybe
this perpetrator to live very close to Collide Reserve. Jane
was dressed in her pink one piece bathers and she
had pale green shorts and canvas san fos with white sols.
She took with her a paperback copy of Louisa may
Or Cots Little Women, and she also carried three drying towels,
(19:16):
which he placed inside the ace type bag. Now Arna
wore a one piece red and white striped bather, tan
shorts and tan sandals, and she sported a bright orange
hair pin in her hair. Now Grant wore swimming trunks
with vertical white stripes under green striped shorts and red sandals.
(19:40):
He was not wearing a short. Now that description most
people know it these days. However, we're going to look
at this very differently. Shortly, now, the children arrived at
Mosley Street, Glenelg. Their bus stop was straight across from
the very iconic Wenzel's Bakery, and everybody knew Wenswele's Bakery.
(20:00):
It was the place to go and buy your pies
and pasties and cakes, and I sort walked across the
Collie Reserve. There was a few bits of misinformation here.
As they were walking across to Collie Reserve, they noticed
the posting everybody had. Everybody knew their posting back in
(20:20):
nineteen sixty six, and that was Tom Patterson. Where Jane
called out, it's the post he gets the posty. Now.
I met Tom Patterson before he passed away, back in
two thousand and eight, and he still remembers that day
very vividly. He did initially say to police that he
had seen the children in the afternoon, but he was
(20:41):
a bit confused because you could imagine, my god, he
knew these children so well. He saw them twice a day,
five days a week. Why twice a day because the
posty delivered letters twice a day. He later said to
the detectives that no, he actually did see them in
the morning, and that was around ten am, which works
(21:03):
in well, when they got off the bus, he spotted them,
and then they walked across and placed their towels and
so forth. To write, you said that the children must
have known this man. One. The first thing is Jane's
got a boyfriend. What did they mean by that? Now,
a boyfriend to a child can be you know, we're
(21:23):
thinking as an adult, but we're not thinking as a child.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
It could any been an innocent sort of a conversation
she had with a you know, a man or a
boy at the beach.
Speaker 3 (21:34):
And it would indicate that they had met this person previously.
There is another reason. They put their towels near the
whole Fast Bay Sailing Club, and this was the usual
place that they did put their towels, according to Jane's
best friend, it was their usual spot. But who else
was already there? It was the man i as has said.
(21:55):
The man was lying on the towel near the same
not too far from where the children were, and he
was watching them. He watched them come up from the
beach and run underneath the Sprenklass. So there's two. It
was already and the boyfriend it'd been there obviously. Well
(22:15):
it looked like he'd been there previously. This was starting
to look like a set up. And this is what
predators do. They're grooming. They started playing under the sprinklers,
and you're right, they can't back, and they walk over
to him and start jumping over him. Grant Boumont first
started jumping over him and they were laughing, followed by
(22:36):
Anna and then later Jane.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
It's interesting too, because you were saying that sort of
Jane was quite bookish and shy, so the fact that
she was speaking to this person at all suggests that
there'd been some sort of rapport built.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
That surprised Missus Beaumont because he had told the children,
you know, don't talk to strangers, take care of one another.
It was like, you wouldn't go over to this individual
if you didn't know him. They don't do that, and
Jane being such a mature girl, and she was quite
shock for her to go over. This is Ockham's raiser.
(23:14):
The simplest solution is usually the best. They knew him.
There was Grant flicking him with towels, but the man
was laughing. The children were laughing and they went back
to play under the sprinklers. This man went over to
when it was only about ten feet away, over to
the bench where he had laid his clothes, which was
a shirt, trousers, and he already had the towel, that's
(23:37):
all he had. He had no carry bag. He goes
over to a couple sitting there and said, he is
very chilling. Somebody has taken our money, he said, or
another couple overheard him and thought he said, somebody has
taken some of our money. Whichever it is, their money
had been taken. How in the hell did this man
(24:00):
know Jane Beaumont had any money? Where was her purse?
It was inside her bag. You come to conclusion very quickly.
Is compan knew because he looked inside Jane's bag? He
took her purse. What does he have? He's now got them,
(24:24):
He's in control. He is setting this up. They can't leave.
He's got them. And he's so nice, he's friendly, and
he's charming, but also he's very cunning and manipulate. He's
manipulating these children without their knowledge. In fact, you could
do this to adults and they wouldn't know.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
And was that a physical description of him at all?
Were these people able to give an approximate age or
what he looked.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
Like the man seen at the beach he was mid
thirties to mid forties. Some had called him middle aged. Initially,
and this has permeated the media for decades, is that
it was a blonde haired surfey type looking guy. It
was not. It never was, and I was speaking to
(25:10):
mosten Matters and also Peter Vogel, who has now passed away.
Peter Vogel was also a detective at the Glenelk police
station that day I met them both. They reiterated it
was not a long blonde headed surfey where his hair
was in need of cutting, and if you go on
to the end ofnet you can still read this it
(25:31):
is incorrect. He was mid thirties to mid forties, middle aged.
He was approximately six foot to six foot one with
an athletic build, longish face, high forehead. He was clean
shaven and sun tanned complexion. The next we have he
has swept back, light brown short hair parted to the
(25:53):
left side, so he's clean shaven. He's nicely sunturned, and
he's got nicely combed back, swept back hair. He was
wearing light blue bathers with a single white stripe down
either side. He only had with him a towel, a
shirt and trousers that he placed on the park bench.
There was no carry bag.
Speaker 6 (26:16):
What sort of a girl as Jane the nine year old,
as she.
Speaker 7 (26:21):
Oh very intelligent, very intelligent. You've only got to tell
her a thing once, and she always does what she's told.
Never to talk to any trainers on the beach when
she swims there, always in groups.
Speaker 6 (26:35):
Be quite able to look after the other two.
Speaker 7 (26:38):
Oh, quite capable, quite capable.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
And so was that the last sighting of the children
sort of that when they were playing with this man.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
After the man went over to this couple and said
their money was stolen, he walked back over to the children.
Can you imagine what he said to the children, our
money has been stolen. Now, Jane, it is smart, but
she's only nine years old. She's not going to say, well, no, hell,
did you know I had any money that was inside
my bag? That didn't enter her mind. What are we
(27:12):
going to do? Our money's been stolen, so we look
at it. He has no money, They have no money.
What are we going to do? I tell you what, kids,
come with me. I'll be able to get you some money.
I just live up there. They happily follow him. He's
the pied piper. He is setting this up. He is
(27:32):
grooming them perfectly. Now before the children go, he dresses
each one of them. Now, the people sitting on the
park bench thought this was highly unusual, especially Jane. She's
nine years old. She didn't need anybody dressing. Now, I
want you to keep in mind what colors the children
(27:55):
were wearing. They follow this man in a northerly direction
away from their bus stop and Wenzel's Bakery where they
were last seen when they wait for him outside the
change room. From there, they were not seen walking back
along Collie Reserve by the eyewitnesses. So what happened? And
(28:19):
also they've got no money. Now, there's a few things.
People think that Jane got the pound note and she
was given a pound note. We'll get onto that shortly.
She got this pound note that she was seen at
Wensworn's Bakery at Collie Reserve. She did not very simply,
they didn't have any money. So where did they go? Oh,
(28:41):
they got into a car. No wallet, No car keys
were seen, There was no carry bag. This man traveled
very light. If he was out of town, you would
have expected that. Well, let's say nobody saw the car keys,
but he did have them. He still doesn't have any money.
They get in the car, the three children in the back,
(29:04):
and then they have to drive to his place. He
would have lived at least a suburb a way. Now
he has to go through the train and then he's
got to end up at Wensley's Bakery. Why because they
were seen at Wensley's Bakery within twenty to twenty five
minutes later. And Wensley's Bakeries which is just off Jetty Road,
which is the main thoroughfare on Mostly Street, across from
(29:26):
their bus stop. So he does that the time blows
out because by the time they left Collie Reserve and
ended up at Wensley's Bakery, the maximum time that had
passed was twenty five minutes. Now, remember they're walking with
grant bone on a four year old walking at a
four year old's pace. The time factor with a car
(29:47):
doesn't compute. Even police back in nineteen sixty six said
it is highly improbable that a car was used, but
they weren't thinking. They didn't take it a step forward.
There was no car. The person must have lived within
close proximity. That never entered anybody's mind. And I don't
know why.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Because that would really limit the suspects.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Pull wouldn't it you hit it on the head, wouldn't
that limit What are you looking for? I mean, what
would you be looking for? If that's the case, what
would the police should have been looking for. It's not
their fault in nineteen sixty six, and there's many reasons why.
You go, Well, we're looking for somebody that fits the
description's mail. Okay, it doesn't live too far from Collie
Reserve and he hands out pound notes. Why is the
(30:33):
pound note so important? Okay, the guy's not from out
of town. He must live close by. They walk to
the perpetrator's house. Jane collects the pound note. Wow, a
pound note in nineteen sixty six. The buying power of
a pound note for a child. You could have buckets
and buckets and buckets of lollies. That's the way I
(30:55):
thought of a pound note. I did see one in
my mum's purse, but I'd never think of taking one.
Very noticeable. Remember, your average weekly weighed was about eight
pounds a week. That was hard earned money. Jane got
a power, not a pound equated to wealth. This man
was wealthy to easily give to a child that supposedly
(31:17):
he hardly knew. Jane walks to the person's house with
the children with grant and toe. She ends up down
at Wensle's Bakery on Moseley Street, just off Jenny Road.
It was very iconic. Everybody knew Wensley's Bakery. The lady there,
her name was Kath. She remembered Jane. She bought one pie,
(31:41):
five pastis six fingerbuts two large bottles of fizzy drink.
That's more than enough for four and she paid that
with a pound note, which really surprised this lady. Now,
this lady is the auntie of Mosston Matters.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
It's all sort of connected that town in the mid
nineteen sixties.
Speaker 3 (32:03):
We're all connected to that. Everybody knew everybody. Nobody thought
anything was afoot except this lady thought, she that's unusual.
She's paying with a pound note. Now, what didn't Jane
have in Wenzel's bakery? Where was her towels? And where
was a carry bag?
Speaker 2 (32:19):
And so the man didn't accompany her into the bakery.
She was just seen on her own or with her siblings.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
With the siblings, but he wasn't seen. Now we could say,
well he was sitting in the car. We ruled out
a car. If he gives Jane a pound note. And
she's a great girl, she's mature, and he's in his
home just up the road. That's it. That's his sort
of bait. If she doesn't come back and she keeps
it and Saul walks home, hey he's lost a pound note. However,
(32:49):
if Jane comes back with the lunch, he's on a
win win situation. I know people are going, oh, that's
terrible to think. Just put yourself in the shoes of
what he's doing and the way he's thinking, not the
way we're thinking.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
It's Jane's shoes as well, because if she feels indebted
to this man and that he's sort of paid when
they've lost their money, I can see how you then
feel obliged to go back to him and maybe buy
him some fish.
Speaker 3 (33:15):
And what a nice man, go and buy some fizzy
drinks and come back here. It's beautifully set up until
they go back to his place. Now where the perpetrator lives.
And we now know that the perpetrator we believe is
Harry Phipps. He lives at the corner of Sussex Street
(33:36):
and Augusta Street. Everything happened in a very limited space.
Where does Harry Phipps live. He lives straight up or
Gusta Street. You can see his house from Collie Reserve.
It's next to the Anglican Church, and you go, my god,
that's close. It is. It's one hundred and ninety meters
in direct side of Collie Reserve, and if you go
(33:58):
at right angles, it's two hundred meters to Wenzyls. It
is the Bermuda Triangle. I've walked that, and I've walked
it very slowly. I even waited where the change rooms were,
and I waited there because this is what the kids did.
And I walked what I believed as Grant Beaumont's pace.
I go to Harry Phipps's house, snand out the side, wait,
(34:21):
and then I walked to Wendsl's. It took me, at
a slow pace, nineteen minutes.
Speaker 6 (34:28):
The spot where mister Patterson last saw the three Beaumont children.
He was riding his bicycle down Moseley Street and he
saw them standing right where I am. He stopped his
bicycle just here. He said hello to them. Then he
turned around the corner into Jetty Road and went down
towards the post office. Now the children after he passed by,
(34:52):
the children walked across the road.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
Am I right in saying that you were the first
person to actually identify this particular suspect, Yes, because that
was twenty thirteen in your book, and this man, I
believe you didn't name him, but it was you had
a wealth of evidence that this person was responsible. What
was the other evidence that you had about Harry Phipps?
Speaker 3 (35:18):
Oh? Where do we start? Alan Whittaker I've known since
university days, the University of Western Sydney back in the
ninth late nineteen eighties. I've known him since then. He
was teaching for a while and then he got into
authoring books with New Holland Publishing, and he had just
finished his I think he'sa his first true crime book,
(35:40):
the Wonder Beach Murders, where two teenage girls were raped
and murdered in the sand dunes on wander Beach, which
is just down the south of Cronulla, not too bar Sydney.
It doesn't really interest me, only because I'm not New
South Welshman. I'm South Australian. As much as the Beaumont
Children's story wasn't of great interest to him because his
(36:01):
heart's in New South Wales. However, he sent me the book,
which he usually did when he did books. He had
sent them to me and a few friends from university days.
I called him back and said, mate, if you ever
get a chance to do the Beaumont children, I'm in.
And he said, oh, that's right, you were born now,
I said, I was born in Glenelg. I would like
to know what happened to the children. Alan called me
(36:22):
a week later and said, you would not believe this.
My publishers just asked me can I do a book
on the Beaumont children? And he said are you in?
And I said absolutely. So we went off down to
glenel and Alan did most of the research because he
was employed by the publishers, and I helped him. I
showed him the lay of the land and Glenelg and
(36:44):
where I lived and where the Beaumonts lived, and it
was very easy to get around. Knew those suburbs now.
At that time, the head of major crime who we met,
was not really forthcoming. Oh what do you have to
know to write? You're after publicity? He said, plenty of
books have been written about the Beaumont children. We said,
nothing's been written about the Beaumont children. Oh what good
(37:07):
is that going to do? If you write a book,
people read it, of course, and they come out and say, listen,
I might know this. I might know that this did
happen with the book Alan got. I feel for him.
HIC cut most of him. He called me, I remember this,
he said, you know what? A guy came to my
place and knocked on the door and he was adamant
that the Beaumont children were living in Western Australia and
(37:29):
he wanted me to go and follow that up. I
feel for you. He received calls with theories. Look, this
is what the police have to put up with. Have
you ever thought of looking into you know, bill blogs
or whatever? And look, I've had these calls and you say,
will you look into them? Why do I have to
look into them? You know? Oh, well I don't have
the time. Why would I have the time? I said,
(37:51):
Just go to the police. I did, I said, And
what did they say? They're not interested? I wonder why.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
So was there any sort of credible evidence that came
out of it?
Speaker 3 (38:00):
Yeah? There was. There was one call. Alan called me
and he said, mate, are you sitting down every now
and there? You get that chill that goes up your
spine or down your spine. This was one moment he said, mate,
I've just had this lady call. Her name is Angela Fife,
and she lives up near you, so you might be
able to see it. She said. She read the book
(38:22):
and there was a few things she didn't know about
the story, one that Jane was given a pound note,
and the actual description of the man. Angela said, I
was married to a guy called Hayden Phipps. I'm not
married to him anymore. And we did live in South Australia,
and then we lived up in Queensland. He said to
(38:43):
me one night when he was watching a documentary on
the Beaumont children, he turned to Angela and said, I
think my father had something to do with that. Now
that shuts down her spine. Because she worked at the
correctional centers and she was dealing with the sexually abused.
(39:03):
She had classes for the sexually abused prisoners, and a
lot of people that have been sexually abused, especially males,
end up in prison for a minute of other reasons
associated with their sexual abuse. She had inklings that her
husband Hayden had been sexually abused by his father, who
was Harry Phipps. And she called Allen called me and
(39:25):
because she lived in Queensland, I set up a time
to meet her, which was quite happy to do so,
and she was only about two hours up the road. Now,
in my job, I've got my own company for the
last twenty years, and I think this is important, is
that I do recruitment for seeing your hospitality worldwide, and
I have to be very thorough in my research, especially
(39:46):
when I'm placing somebody for three hundred thousand or four
hundred thousand dollars. If I don't thoroughly research this individual
and do reference checks on him very thoroughly, I won't
have this client anymore. So I'm going to make sure
that I'm very thorough with Angela. The first thing I
needed to do was to meet her on not doing
(40:08):
anything over the phone. I was happy to meet her,
she was happy to meet me. I found her amazingly credible,
and I asked her, I'm going to have to do
reference checks on you, and she said, by all means,
call the head of the correctional facilities here all there,
I will tell them that you're calling. What she did
say that I didn't know about the pound note. Harry Phipps,
(40:32):
Hayden's father was known to hand out pound notes. He
was a very wealthy very respected, charming, very well connected individual.
He ran his own company called Castelloid, which is at
North Limpton. They made Harley Davidson rims for the motorbikes.
(40:52):
They made parts for holden Ford and later on with
Missen and Mitsubishi. So he was very wealthy and he
always carried a wad of cash. And she said, I
know that he gave out pound notes. I said, what
about the description, because really, excuse me, this is not
politically correct. If he was sure fat and squat, that's
it that ruings him out. But he wasn't. She said, Look,
(41:15):
I didn't know him back in the sixties, but he
was around six foot tall. I know back in the
sixties he had light brushed back hair and he still does,
and that he was a regular swimer. She said, I
know that, and I believe that he did sexually abuse
his own son. And I thought, oh, we've got somebody
that fits the description, hands out pound notes and looks
(41:37):
like he's an alleged pedophile.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
We go, oh wow, were you able to get in
contact with the sun?
Speaker 3 (41:43):
Yes? Now, because he had been or allegedly sexually abused,
you can imagine a lot of sexually abused people do
not want to meet. They do not want to talk
about their abuse. And this is in the high percentages.
And I know some people said, oh, you know, if
he was abused, he would have told me he would
have No, they don't. Some commit suicide, they suffer from
(42:05):
severe depression, they have anxiety, you know, alcoholism, drug abuse,
you know, self harm. They have all that. So it's
not so easy to go in and meet them. With Angela,
she hadn't been in contact with Hayden. It was too difficult.
His moods would swing and she didn't want anything more
to do with him. However, she gave me the number
(42:27):
of Hayden's son. I sent the book Searching for the
Bone Children. I had his address though Hayden's address, and
I sent the book by registered mail to the post
office and I just said in there, my name is
Stuart Marlins. I'd like to talk to you about somebody.
Would you mind giving me a call. I never heard
from him with his son. I sent the same thing.
(42:50):
I found his address and he called and he lived
up in Broadbeach, which was just up from in Queensland.
So and Hayden lived at also Broadbeach. So I thought, well,
they are. They're very close. Anyway, the son called me. Now,
I didn't say anything in this book. I just said
I'd like to talk to you about something. He called
(43:11):
and he introduced himself. He said, mate, I know what
this has to do with It's to do with my dad,
grandfather and the Beaumont children, obviously because he got the book. Yeah,
and I believe my grandfather was involved. I thought, oh,
you didn't know. How did you know I was going
to talk about this? And he said, mate, I know
(43:33):
when I get this. My father always said that his father, Harry,
had something to do with the case. Anyway, I went
around to meet the son. He played to me a
recording he recorded his father when he went around and
all he did, he didn't say anything. He just handed
(43:53):
his father, Hayden, the book because Hayden hadn't been to
the post office, so he didn't receive it, he recorded.
I listened to this recorded. Hayden's verse was where, Oh
my god, I knew this day would come. What do
we do? What do we do? We've got to go
to the police. Now, that is a very unusual response,
if you don't think there's anything untoward. The son was
(44:14):
telling me he said, I believe my father was sexually
abused over many years, that Harry Phipps had a satin fetish.
I saw this Saturn and when he was around Satney
became sexually aroused. I thought, oh God, and this is
living what one hundred and ninety meters in direct side
of poly reserve. I had to keep coming.
Speaker 8 (44:34):
This interview relates to I three while zero eight zero
five nine five m between Bill Hayes and Hayden HYDN
Troops Hayden measure a web.
Speaker 9 (44:47):
I've been asked to speak to you in relation to
certain matters involving the disappearance of the Beaumont children. Did
you understand what we're came to talk about? Did you
see the talking to Harry Well?
Speaker 8 (45:01):
I saw him coming out of the backyard from the
Curry house the currents car.
Speaker 9 (45:07):
I think they were inside the house and that's did
you hear what they're saying?
Speaker 2 (45:20):
Had there been any sightings or anything? Had there been
anything for Hayden that sort of solidified to him. My
father was the man who did this.
Speaker 3 (45:32):
Very good question, Very good question. I did get to
meet Hayden and I spent a few hours with him,
and he was getting it all up his chest. But
there was a few things he said. I met him
at his Broadbeach unit. I started to chat with him,
made him feel comfortable. But the story was that, yes,
(45:53):
he was sexually abused in his words, and I don't
believe he's lying. And in fact, to your listeners, you
know they're going so he could be like studies have
found that less than five percent of allegations of child
sexual abuse brought by the children hal fictitious. There is
a ninety five percent chance that Hayden Phipps is telling
(46:14):
the truth. You know what, if I'm a betting man
on the horses and my horse has got a ninety
five percent chance of winning, I think I'm going to
put my money on that one. Yeah. Absolutely, Now, Hayden,
I remember him banging down his hand on the armchair
and he said, mate, I swear I saw these children
in my backyard that day. And I said, well, how
(46:36):
do you know they were the Beatmont children? He said, mate,
it was around lunchtime. They came into the backyard around lunchtime.
Now that's a lucky guest. Look at the timing oft
Collie Reserve when they left. And I said, how would
you know he said, well, initially I thought they were
all boys and I thought, well, that's a bit strange.
He said, the haircuts are all the same. I tell
(46:58):
you what, have a look at a photo. Ah. And
I was like, Mane, your memory is incredible, because when
you have something called traumatic that you experience and you
remember it for the rest of your life. And I said, okay,
well what a part He said, Look, I don't remember
much about what they're wearing. I do remember the oldest
(47:20):
girl and the way he was thinking. And I was
looking at him. I thought, my god, you're telling the truth.
She had a sort of bag, a sort of bag.
And I said what kind of bag? He's like, I
just know she had a bag with it. She did.
If he's lying, he's going to go into a lot
of detail. Oh yeah. And they extrapidate the extrapolate the story. Yes,
(47:44):
and then they've got to have a good memory. Now,
if you lie, you've gotta have a good memory.
Speaker 2 (47:48):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (47:49):
So that's where you picked them up. And I thought, jeez,
this is this is good. He went on to talk
about his dad, satin Fettish, that he couldn't stop making
satin dresses. I asked him, I said, well, what color?
What colors? And he said, oh, I've got lime. Green,
pink was his favorite, red and orange and purple. Had
(48:14):
a look at the first few colors and never look
at it. And if you go back to what the
children were wearing at the beach, Wow, this was a
bee to a honeypot.
Speaker 2 (48:25):
What do you think happened to the Beaumont children that day?
Speaker 3 (48:32):
They followed him, They walked to his house. Hayden said
he saw them come in the backyard. The back door
was open. He said, they went into the back door.
Dad came out later, put four sort of surf tight
bags in the back of the car and drove off. Now,
his timing or his timeline could be a little wonkey.
(48:53):
He saw the children and he saw the father. If
they followed him, that would be correct. They would ord
of come in around lunchtime. So Hayden's correct. They go inside,
Harry gives them the pound. Note they walk out the
front door, because Hayden said they didn't come out the back.
And again, if that's lying, that story would change over
(49:14):
over a few years, and it never did. Yeah, the
children walk out the front. Now that front of his house,
the front door looks straight down Sussex Street to Jetty
Road and if you hit Jetty Roading you turn just
the fraction right and then left you're at Wensley's Bakery.
It fits like a glove. Now, what happened from Wenswell's Bakery,
(49:35):
we don't know. We know that Harry Phipps drove off
in the car now he had a very large he
had a Cadillac with fins, was very noticeable. Went and
from there we don't know.
Speaker 2 (49:50):
Have you got a sense of where, if they were murdered,
where their bodies might lie.
Speaker 3 (49:58):
The bodies are at Castelli factory.
Speaker 2 (50:01):
And why do you believe that.
Speaker 3 (50:03):
There's been two digs there at the back of the
factory when Bill Hayes. I hired Bill Hayes because I
wasn't getting anywhere with the police. In fact, I was
told I'm beating my head up against the brick wall.
This is very early on. I'm beating my head up
against the brick wall and I'm chasing my tail. I
was told that by the detective, even though there was
(50:25):
mounting circumstantial evidence. I was told that, however, I'm it
doesn't take a detective to the term me and I
didn't and I'll be honest with you. I'd done reference
checks on him. I'd done five and they were interesting.
Put it that way. So I hired Bill Hayes and
he recorded the conversation and sent it to Australia's best
(50:51):
light detection expert, which is Steve Van Naprin, and I
also sent it to Holland to statement analysis experts. They
didn't know each other. They sent back their findings and
said Hayden Phipps is telling the truth but hiding more.
They were nearly identical. There was a whole lot. One
in particular was when Hayden said to Bill Hayes, they
came into the car. Both statement analysis experts because most
(51:14):
probably your listeners will pick up, what do you mean
they came into the car. They got into the car
if you were standing outside, they came into the car
if you're in the car. And this is why Hayden
only goes so far and won't say anymore after. At
the end of the conversation with Bill Hayes, Bill was
(51:37):
helping him in the car. He was really sort of
he was naked his expression, but he was naked. He
was tired. He had spoken about his sexual abuse again
and that takes a lot about him. As he was
getting into his car, he looked up to Bill. Now,
Bill was twelve years as a detective and he was
several years in major crime in South Australia. He looked
(51:59):
up at Bill and said, Bill, they're in the sand pit.
Bill called me. He said, mate, I have been a detective.
I was in the Federal Police. I was a soldier
with the British Armed Services and a Special Forces. And
he said, this guy is telling the truth. These children
(52:20):
are in the sandpit, a sandpit as a cast ely.
When the police did the first dig and they did,
which was we're very grateful for Hayden Phipps called his
cousin who called me and he said, mate, they're digging
in the fucking wrong spot. And I said to Peter,
how does he know? That's his cousin. How does he know?
He said, he must have been there. He has mentioned
(52:44):
the sandpit to his son, to me, to Bill, to
his wife, to his cousin five separate occasions. The one
to Bill was the one that really startled. They are there.
We were just digging in the wrong spot the sandpit.
In his recorded interview that's been analyzed the sandpit he's
talking about is in front of the two workmen's cottage
(53:07):
at carst Ellly. If you can look at an aerial
you'll get that on Google. By the way, you get
it on my website. You can see where the two
cottages are now. The two cottages are very important to
this case. So in front of those I checked with
some workers from the cast that Wow factory from the
nineteen fifties and nineteen sixties, there was a sand pit
(53:27):
in front of those cottages and as they filled it
up with metal filings, they would move the sand pit
further up the factory to the end of the back gate,
so it kept moving that fill it in over a
period of time with sand. It was beautiful sand, like
beat sand, and then they would move towards the back
of the factory.
Speaker 2 (53:47):
That's so interesting. I just hope that one day they
are recovered. And earlier this month, Nancy Beaumont passed away,
not knowing what happened to her children.
Speaker 3 (53:59):
And I just told you she did. You hit it
right on the head. They not knowing she was living
a nightmare for fifty two years. And I think she's
with her children.
Speaker 2 (54:11):
You know, it's a case that changed Australia and to
have a conclusion and to perhaps one day actually recover
those bodies would would mean an awful lot to a
lot of people. So thank you so much for all
the hard work you're doing on this case. And it's
something that I think will you know, stay in the
public mind and our curiosity until it is solved. Thank
(54:34):
you again for your time.
Speaker 3 (54:36):
Thank you for having me. Jim. What sort of question
is one asked at a time like this? Well, what
can you say?
Speaker 10 (54:44):
Actually, I mean I know many people have Australia really
feel feel for us. Well, what can you say at
this moment? I mean, we've been hanging on for nine
months and fourteen days now and just wait and hope
and pray. I suppose there's been several false alarms over
these past harrowing nine months for you. Oh yes, it
(55:05):
raises their hopes and were let down again. And by
the way, I would like to say it the stage
that I will thank you all the radio, television stations
and the press for what.
Speaker 3 (55:19):
They have been doing.
Speaker 10 (55:20):
I mean, I mean, I know I've got a fields
for us, but here all over Australia, well, thank you
very much.
Speaker 2 (55:43):
Stewart's book The Satin Man, Uncovering the Mystery of the
Missing Beaumont Children is available at all good bookstores and online.
We'll keep you updated on the release of his new
book about the case. For photos, maps, and extra reading
on the Beaumont Children, don't forget to join our closed
Facebook group. Just search True Crime Conversations on Facebook. You
(56:08):
can also contact the show by emailing true Crime at
momamea dot com dot au. True Crime Conversations is a
Mummamea podcast hosted by me Jesse Stevens and produced by
Alice Cooper.
Speaker 1 (56:28):
We hope you found this episode compelling. If you missed
Thursday's release, we encourage you to go back and have
a listen. It explores the chilling story of Clifford Buftholomew,
an Adelaide man who killed ten members of his family.
Was later released from prison and started a completely new
life under a new identity.
Speaker 3 (56:47):
Thanks so much for listening.
Speaker 1 (56:48):
We'll be back with more later this week.
You're listening to Amma Mea podcast. Mama Mea acknowledges the
traditional owners of land and waters. This podcast was recorded
on Hello and Welcome to a special episode of True
Crime Conversations. I'm your host Jemma Bath. Today I'm sharing
an episode from over five years ago. One of the
first cases we ever covered on the podcast. Yesterday marked
(00:35):
of the disappearance of the Beaumont children, Jane, Anna and Grant,
who vanished without a trace. Their case remains one of
Australia's most enduring and heartbreaking mysteries. On January twenty sixth,
nineteen sixty six, the children, aged nine, seven and four,
left their Somerton Park home for a day at Glenelg Beach,
(00:57):
but never returned. In this episode, you'll hear from Jesse Stevens,
former host of True Crime Conversations, interviewing Stuart Mullins, a
man who grew up just streets away from the Beaumont family,
believes he knows exactly what happened to the children and
who is responsible.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
This episode of True Crime Conversations contains discussions of alleged
child abuse, abduction, murder, and the recounting of traumatic events
listener discretion is advised. It was Australia Day nineteen sixty
six when Nancy Beaumont was awoken by two of her children,
(01:36):
seven year old Anna and four year old Grant, jumping
on her bed. As the temperature climbed into the forties.
They begged their mum to go to the beach. There
were only a few days left of school holidays, and
the Beaumont children wanted to make the most of it.
They lived only two and a half kilometers or so
from Glenelg Beach near Adelaide, South Australia. The cool water
(02:00):
and surrounding sprinklers were a respite from the almost unbearable
heat of summer. The beach was just about their favorite
place in the world. Nine year old Jane, the eldest,
was put in charge of taking her younger brother and
sister to the beach, up the road and ensuring they
were all back by lunchtime. Nancy walked her three children
(02:23):
up the road to the bus stop and placed some
money in Jane's hand, instructing her to bring home some lunch.
She ferewelled them, sure she'd see them again in just
a few hours. She never did, though Apart from a
few critical sightings at the beach, no one would ever
see the three Beaumont children again. I'm Jesse Stephens and
(02:53):
this is True Crime Conversations, exploring the world's most notorious
crimes by speaking to the people who know the most
about them. In this episode, I'm talking to Stuart Mullins,
co author of the book The Satin Man, uncovering the
mystery of the Missing Beaumont Children. Stuart is more than
(03:13):
a researcher. He grew up only streets away from the
three Beaumont children. He's also working on a new book
due for release early next year. Stuart believes wholeheartedly that
he knows exactly what happened to Jane, Anna and Grant
on that fateful day in nineteen sixty six. It was
(03:38):
January twenty sixth, nineteen sixty six, when Nancy Beaumont kissed
her three kids goodbye at the bus stop as they
set off to go to the beach. The eldest, Jane,
was nine. I wanted to ask you, was that unusual
for her to sort of be in charge of a
seven year old and a four year old sibling as
they went to the beach.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
No, this was usual back in the nineteen sixties. I
can I can tell you firsthand. I was born in
glenel I was the same age as Anna and I
lived about three and a half lives. What is up
the road? Children had the responsibility. We went on buses,
We walked to the beach, which was Collobinan's. We rode
(04:19):
our bikes pretty well anywhere, as long as you were
home before the street lights came on. That was the
mother's rule which went right throughout the nineteen fifties and
nineteen sixties. And for me personally, I was seven years
old at the time I took the bus to Glenelg.
I took the bus to the Gleenelg by myself. This
was not unusual. So what Jane was doing was what
(04:42):
other families were doing.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
And what can you tell us about the Beaumont family.
So there were three kids and the parents. The father
worked and the mother was at home. What do we
know about what kind of people they were.
Speaker 3 (04:54):
I've spoken to Jane's best friend who sat with her
at school. She knew Jane for around four years. They
were nearly inseparable. She described that the children as latch key,
meaning that Jane was more of a parentified child, as
(05:15):
most of us were. Mister Beaumont was a traveling salesman
for Lynn Coop's linen industry that took him out to
the countryside. He wasn't happy that he was away from
the children, but the money he earned paid mortgage. Missus
Beaumont was a stay at home mum, but she was
as this friend said, she wasn't there. She was usually
(05:37):
at friends places or away. This friend said that she
had never seen mister and Missus Beaumont at home. It
was Jane looking after Grant looking after Anna. But again
it is not unusual. I came from a family of six.
I just lived up the road. I very rarely saw
mom and dad until the evening. We were out all
(05:59):
day at the school holidays. That's what we did, and
then we returned for dinner. So Jane's and Anna and
Grant's childhood was exactly the thing. The beach were very
close by. There was Somerton Beach, Brighton Beach, and the
very very popular Glenelg Beach. That's where we spent most
of our time, either Brighton which had the Jetty or
(06:21):
Glenelg Collie Reserve, and we would spend all day there
and Jane was the mother hen she was very mature
for her age. She loved reading. She would go through
several books per month and so she was very avid,
very learned. She was nearly top of her class and
very independent.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
So that was during the school holidays and they've jumped
on the bus in the morning and they were expected
home at around midday, weren't they.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
That's correct. They took the bus roughly about nine forty
five ten o'clock. It was a very hot day. It
was going to reach one hundred degrees fahrenheit in days
terms around forty two forty three degrees celsius. And in
South Australia, most of South Australia is a desert, so
you've got this strong northerly wind coming down from the desert,
(07:15):
and so your only respite is either the Adelaide Hills,
adventuring the streams or the Torrens River, or you would
go down the beach. Obviously, this day the children wanted
to go down the beach. Their friends were down there,
and it was the last day or the last few
days of the school holidays. So you would catch the bus.
(07:36):
Usually Jane, Anna and Grant would walk to the beach.
It was only two and a half kilometers from their
place at Somerton Park. Because it was so hot, Grant
wasn't wearing a t shirt. They said, we'll take the
bus and I'll let you go to the beach as
long as you're home by lunchtime. And here's some money
for the bus ride, and some pies and some cakes
(07:58):
and some fizzy drink for us to bring home.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
So what did Nancy do when she's waiting for the
kids at twelve and they don't come? What was her
next move?
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Is all parents, you are always worried about your children
once they go, especially if they don't come back on time.
These days, you're frantically on your iPhone. You'll be texting
them or calling them. With missus Beaumont. They didn't come
home on the twelve o'clock bus. Her natural reaction was, Okay,
(08:32):
well they missed that bus. They're on the next one now.
The next one came within about forty minutes, maybe a
bit longer. When they weren't on that bus, that's when
she got worried. That's where the motherly instinct kicks in.
She spoke to a friend, a friend of course said, look,
they've just missed the bus. They might be walking home,
(08:54):
but Nancy didn't want to follow the usual path they take,
just in case they did come back by a bus.
They lied and got home and she was out there
looking for them. But the next bus. It was that
next one that really set the alarms off. They weren't
on the next bus. This was completely unusual. Where were they.
(09:16):
That's when she became very frantic. And that was around
two o'clock. So you can imagine as parents, if you
got children, then the two hours and they're still not home.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
And Jim unexpectedly came home, didn't He was meant to
be away, and then he turned up.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
He was away. He left very early in the morning.
He was working for Lyncott Linen and he was servicing
country towns of South Australia. He was out near Snowtown
and he did come back early that day and he
could see that his wife was very distraught because it
was around three four o'clock and they still had not returned.
(09:56):
So of course Jim and Nancy got in the car
and went around the streets looking for them, but of
course couldn't find them.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
Both of them are living in hope that the children
had ever stayed there, stay at the beach, or that
they'd gone to their friend's places and stay there to play.
I'm still living in that hope that everything was all right,
because naturally, as time went on, they became more and
more concerned. And that was the situation.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
And so when they decided to eventually contact police, what
was the first response of the police force.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Mister and missus Beaumont went to the Glenelg Police station
in the late afternoon. They met the detective constable on
duty that day, which was Moss and Matters Moston is
in fact my cousin. He recollects that day very vividly.
In fact, he'll never forget it. They were very distraught.
They reported that their children were missing. Now the detectives
(10:57):
at the station would tell them that they will turn up,
so they could be hiding, they could have done this
or kind of done that. They weren't put down as
missing children. Now this is not unusually. In nineteen sixty six,
it was always they'll turn up soon. The abduction of
three children had never happened before, and never happened since,
(11:18):
not just in Australia, but around the world. The idea
of abduction never entered anybody's mind. This did not happen, and.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
It had only been a few hours at that point,
So what did they think had happened? What did they
say to the parents.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
The first thing Moston said was don't worry, they will
turn up soon, or put a call out to the
police vehicle because they had a two way radio, to
just have a look around for them. Mister Beaumont again
got in his car and looked around for them. But
as the time ticked on thirty minutes and then an hour,
that was when the alarm bell started to ring. Even
(11:56):
for Moston Madison the team, they had a problem. These
children weren't home. They said, look, they could be hiding
at your house, which was highly unlikely. They could still
be playing down the sandhills. They could be at an
the friends place, but mister and missus Beaumont were very
say disbelieving of that because it was their own children.
(12:18):
It got to about five o'clock and that's when panic
station set in.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
And so did police sort of speak to people on
the beach and see if anyone had cited the children.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Well, once the call came out and the children were
termed missing. It did hit the papers, but to see
the papers you had the evening paper. It was too
late for that, so it only hit the papers the
advertiser in the next morning. So it was only radio
and TV. TV news bulletins would come on, but not
(12:50):
too many people would watch black and white TV, especially
in the afternoon or that if you know, they were
listening to the radio. Other than that, you really had
difficulty getting the word out that these children were missing. However,
by about six pm we'd definitely got out through a
word of mouth and people started looking the children. And
(13:11):
in fact, mister Boem previously worked for Adelaide taxi company
and the call went out to them and they got
into their taxis and went around the suburbs of Gleneal
and further to see if they could spot the children,
but they had just disappeared off the place of the planet.
Speaker 4 (13:29):
Deployment of uniform police came down later that evening about
thirty police officer uniform police officers and it was organized
that we do a thorough search of the surrounding area,
the beach area to sand Hills north and south of
Canald and all the drains and paddocks and surrounding areas.
Sal Research Savannas was put on the airport and on
(13:52):
the interstate rail line in case someone was everything to
take them away. All my arterial rays leading out of
the state. Roadblocks were set up there in case. Unfortunately,
there could have been a time lapse of some six
or eight hours before the public really became a the
children were missing, and that time, okay, that the offender
(14:14):
quite a lot of time to get away.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
Was there any sort of, you know, items that they
dropped or any sign of them that the police were
able to recover.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
There was no items that they recovered. There's never been
any physical evidence regarding their disappearance. However, as reports started
coming in, people were lining up at the police station
where moston and the detectives were taking statements from well
meaning public. But that line started to snake quite extensively,
(14:50):
and in the police station they had would you believe,
it's hard to fathom now, they had one phone, one
line in and that ran hot, and the detectives had
to do their own typing. They had to type each report,
and there was hundreds of them. They were completely inundated.
As Matters said to me back when I first interviewed him.
(15:14):
He said, we didn't know what we were looking for.
We didn't know what had occurred. Now this occurred. They
just didn't know. They were like everybody else. What happened
to the Beaumont children. They were completely inundated. But over
the next few days some credible information came in. Apart
from all the well meaning public that came in trying
(15:36):
to help with that, there was some really interesting information
that came forward. We know when the children alighted from
the bus, they walked across the Collie Reserve. Collie Reserve
is a beautiful, sweeping green lawns that nearly go down
to the water's edge and glenel Beach and the others
(15:58):
faced the Gulf of Saint Vincent's and Kanger Island that
locks the waves really coming in, so it's dead, calm
and beautiful to swim out, especially for children. They laid
their towels out near some benches that certain people sitting on.
They laid their towels out and they ran down to
the water's edge and they played frolict in the water.
(16:19):
Although Grant could not swim, so he was only allowed
to go out to his belly button. According to Jane's
best friend, who had been to the beach with him
several times. They came back and then played under the
Collie Reserve sprinklers, which every child did. I did when
I was young, and that was usually to get the
sea water off you.
Speaker 5 (16:40):
The thing that I'd like to impress on you all
is that everyone make sure that they're familiar with the
descriptions of the three missing children. That is absolutely important.
And also make sure your friends are aware of the
descriptions of these children. And also if you have any
new Australian friends, perhaps you can you can assist them
in describing the children to them.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
And there was a sense that the children had seen
a man there, and there were a few witness says
who said they'd sort of been conversing with someone, but
it appeared that he wasn't a stranger, like it hadn't
alerted them. They weren't worried, but they'd sort of been
speaking to a man. What were the details about that man?
That was sort of significant.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
I think you hit the nail on the head there,
because what we now know we didn't know in nineteen
sixty six. Week can look at this and sort of
put yourself in an aerial view and see what had happened. See,
those children were very eager to go to the beach
if we can retrace just back, and this would add
into what you were saying. They were really eager to
(17:46):
go to the beach. For a few reasons. It was
a stinking hot day, it was one of the last
days of the school holidays. But also Anna and Grant
were teasing Jane, saying, Jane's got a boyfriend. Jane's got
a boyfriend. And of course it hadn't even hurt, but
a mother didn't take much notice of it. So they
(18:08):
got on the Worthley's bus got down to the beach.
When they were at the beach, Jane was given some
money by her mother to buy pies and some pasties
and some drink to bring back for lunch. That was
eight shillings and sixpence in pre decimal currency about eighty
five cents now, however, you're spending power back in nineteen
sixty six. Was a lot more. That was to buy
(18:30):
lunch and bring home for Nancy and the kids to enjoy. Now.
She placed that money in her bathed clip purse and
she placed it into a light blue airline type bag.
Because it's very important, this into mason that has been
messed for over fifty years. And yet when we start
(18:53):
looking at it differently, we start to realize that maybe
this perpetrator to live very close to Collide Reserve. Jane
was dressed in her pink one piece bathers and she
had pale green shorts and canvas san fos with white sols.
She took with her a paperback copy of Louisa may
Or Cots Little Women, and she also carried three drying towels,
(19:16):
which he placed inside the ace type bag. Now Arna
wore a one piece red and white striped bather, tan
shorts and tan sandals, and she sported a bright orange
hair pin in her hair. Now Grant wore swimming trunks
with vertical white stripes under green striped shorts and red sandals.
(19:40):
He was not wearing a short. Now that description most
people know it these days. However, we're going to look
at this very differently. Shortly, now, the children arrived at
Mosley Street, Glenelg. Their bus stop was straight across from
the very iconic Wenzel's Bakery, and everybody knew Wenswele's Bakery.
(20:00):
It was the place to go and buy your pies
and pasties and cakes, and I sort walked across the
Collie Reserve. There was a few bits of misinformation here.
As they were walking across to Collie Reserve, they noticed
the posting everybody had. Everybody knew their posting back in
(20:20):
nineteen sixty six, and that was Tom Patterson. Where Jane
called out, it's the post he gets the posty. Now.
I met Tom Patterson before he passed away, back in
two thousand and eight, and he still remembers that day
very vividly. He did initially say to police that he
had seen the children in the afternoon, but he was
(20:41):
a bit confused because you could imagine, my god, he
knew these children so well. He saw them twice a day,
five days a week. Why twice a day because the
posty delivered letters twice a day. He later said to
the detectives that no, he actually did see them in
the morning, and that was around ten am, which works
(21:03):
in well, when they got off the bus, he spotted them,
and then they walked across and placed their towels and
so forth. To write, you said that the children must
have known this man. One. The first thing is Jane's
got a boyfriend. What did they mean by that? Now,
a boyfriend to a child can be you know, we're
(21:23):
thinking as an adult, but we're not thinking as a child.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
It could any been an innocent sort of a conversation
she had with a you know, a man or a
boy at the beach.
Speaker 3 (21:34):
And it would indicate that they had met this person previously.
There is another reason. They put their towels near the
whole Fast Bay Sailing Club, and this was the usual
place that they did put their towels, according to Jane's
best friend, it was their usual spot. But who else
was already there? It was the man i as has said.
(21:55):
The man was lying on the towel near the same
not too far from where the children were, and he
was watching them. He watched them come up from the
beach and run underneath the Sprenklass. So there's two. It
was already and the boyfriend it'd been there obviously. Well
(22:15):
it looked like he'd been there previously. This was starting
to look like a set up. And this is what
predators do. They're grooming. They started playing under the sprinklers,
and you're right, they can't back, and they walk over
to him and start jumping over him. Grant Boumont first
started jumping over him and they were laughing, followed by
(22:36):
Anna and then later Jane.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
It's interesting too, because you were saying that sort of
Jane was quite bookish and shy, so the fact that
she was speaking to this person at all suggests that
there'd been some sort of rapport built.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
That surprised Missus Beaumont because he had told the children,
you know, don't talk to strangers, take care of one another.
It was like, you wouldn't go over to this individual
if you didn't know him. They don't do that, and
Jane being such a mature girl, and she was quite
shock for her to go over. This is Ockham's raiser.
(23:14):
The simplest solution is usually the best. They knew him.
There was Grant flicking him with towels, but the man
was laughing. The children were laughing and they went back
to play under the sprinklers. This man went over to
when it was only about ten feet away, over to
the bench where he had laid his clothes, which was
a shirt, trousers, and he already had the towel, that's
(23:37):
all he had. He had no carry bag. He goes
over to a couple sitting there and said, he is
very chilling. Somebody has taken our money, he said, or
another couple overheard him and thought he said, somebody has
taken some of our money. Whichever it is, their money
had been taken. How in the hell did this man
(24:00):
know Jane Beaumont had any money? Where was her purse?
It was inside her bag. You come to conclusion very quickly.
Is compan knew because he looked inside Jane's bag? He
took her purse. What does he have? He's now got them,
(24:24):
He's in control. He is setting this up. They can't leave.
He's got them. And he's so nice, he's friendly, and
he's charming, but also he's very cunning and manipulate. He's
manipulating these children without their knowledge. In fact, you could
do this to adults and they wouldn't know.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
And was that a physical description of him at all?
Were these people able to give an approximate age or
what he looked.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
Like the man seen at the beach he was mid
thirties to mid forties. Some had called him middle aged. Initially,
and this has permeated the media for decades, is that
it was a blonde haired surfey type looking guy. It
was not. It never was, and I was speaking to
(25:10):
mosten Matters and also Peter Vogel, who has now passed away.
Peter Vogel was also a detective at the Glenelk police
station that day I met them both. They reiterated it
was not a long blonde headed surfey where his hair
was in need of cutting, and if you go on
to the end ofnet you can still read this it
(25:31):
is incorrect. He was mid thirties to mid forties, middle aged.
He was approximately six foot to six foot one with
an athletic build, longish face, high forehead. He was clean
shaven and sun tanned complexion. The next we have he
has swept back, light brown short hair parted to the
(25:53):
left side, so he's clean shaven. He's nicely sunturned, and
he's got nicely combed back, swept back hair. He was
wearing light blue bathers with a single white stripe down
either side. He only had with him a towel, a
shirt and trousers that he placed on the park bench.
There was no carry bag.
Speaker 6 (26:16):
What sort of a girl as Jane the nine year old,
as she.
Speaker 7 (26:21):
Oh very intelligent, very intelligent. You've only got to tell
her a thing once, and she always does what she's told.
Never to talk to any trainers on the beach when
she swims there, always in groups.
Speaker 6 (26:35):
Be quite able to look after the other two.
Speaker 7 (26:38):
Oh, quite capable, quite capable.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
And so was that the last sighting of the children
sort of that when they were playing with this man.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
After the man went over to this couple and said
their money was stolen, he walked back over to the children.
Can you imagine what he said to the children, our
money has been stolen. Now, Jane, it is smart, but
she's only nine years old. She's not going to say, well, no, hell,
did you know I had any money that was inside
my bag? That didn't enter her mind. What are we
(27:12):
going to do? Our money's been stolen, so we look
at it. He has no money, They have no money.
What are we going to do? I tell you what, kids,
come with me. I'll be able to get you some money.
I just live up there. They happily follow him. He's
the pied piper. He is setting this up. He is
(27:32):
grooming them perfectly. Now before the children go, he dresses
each one of them. Now, the people sitting on the
park bench thought this was highly unusual, especially Jane. She's
nine years old. She didn't need anybody dressing. Now, I
want you to keep in mind what colors the children
(27:55):
were wearing. They follow this man in a northerly direction
away from their bus stop and Wenzel's Bakery where they
were last seen when they wait for him outside the
change room. From there, they were not seen walking back
along Collie Reserve by the eyewitnesses. So what happened? And
(28:19):
also they've got no money. Now, there's a few things.
People think that Jane got the pound note and she
was given a pound note. We'll get onto that shortly.
She got this pound note that she was seen at
Wensworn's Bakery at Collie Reserve. She did not very simply,
they didn't have any money. So where did they go? Oh,
(28:41):
they got into a car. No wallet, No car keys
were seen, There was no carry bag. This man traveled
very light. If he was out of town, you would
have expected that. Well, let's say nobody saw the car keys,
but he did have them. He still doesn't have any money.
They get in the car, the three children in the back,
(29:04):
and then they have to drive to his place. He
would have lived at least a suburb a way. Now
he has to go through the train and then he's
got to end up at Wensley's Bakery. Why because they
were seen at Wensley's Bakery within twenty to twenty five
minutes later. And Wensley's Bakeries which is just off Jetty Road,
which is the main thoroughfare on Mostly Street, across from
(29:26):
their bus stop. So he does that the time blows
out because by the time they left Collie Reserve and
ended up at Wensley's Bakery, the maximum time that had
passed was twenty five minutes. Now, remember they're walking with
grant bone on a four year old walking at a
four year old's pace. The time factor with a car
(29:47):
doesn't compute. Even police back in nineteen sixty six said
it is highly improbable that a car was used, but
they weren't thinking. They didn't take it a step forward.
There was no car. The person must have lived within
close proximity. That never entered anybody's mind. And I don't
know why.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Because that would really limit the suspects.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Pull wouldn't it you hit it on the head, wouldn't
that limit What are you looking for? I mean, what
would you be looking for? If that's the case, what
would the police should have been looking for. It's not
their fault in nineteen sixty six, and there's many reasons why.
You go, Well, we're looking for somebody that fits the
description's mail. Okay, it doesn't live too far from Collie
Reserve and he hands out pound notes. Why is the
(30:33):
pound note so important? Okay, the guy's not from out
of town. He must live close by. They walk to
the perpetrator's house. Jane collects the pound note. Wow, a
pound note in nineteen sixty six. The buying power of
a pound note for a child. You could have buckets
and buckets and buckets of lollies. That's the way I
(30:55):
thought of a pound note. I did see one in
my mum's purse, but I'd never think of taking one.
Very noticeable. Remember, your average weekly weighed was about eight
pounds a week. That was hard earned money. Jane got
a power, not a pound equated to wealth. This man
was wealthy to easily give to a child that supposedly
(31:17):
he hardly knew. Jane walks to the person's house with
the children with grant and toe. She ends up down
at Wensle's Bakery on Moseley Street, just off Jenny Road.
It was very iconic. Everybody knew Wensley's Bakery. The lady there,
her name was Kath. She remembered Jane. She bought one pie,
(31:41):
five pastis six fingerbuts two large bottles of fizzy drink.
That's more than enough for four and she paid that
with a pound note, which really surprised this lady. Now,
this lady is the auntie of Mosston Matters.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
It's all sort of connected that town in the mid
nineteen sixties.
Speaker 3 (32:03):
We're all connected to that. Everybody knew everybody. Nobody thought
anything was afoot except this lady thought, she that's unusual.
She's paying with a pound note. Now, what didn't Jane
have in Wenzel's bakery? Where was her towels? And where
was a carry bag?
Speaker 2 (32:19):
And so the man didn't accompany her into the bakery.
She was just seen on her own or with her siblings.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
With the siblings, but he wasn't seen. Now we could say,
well he was sitting in the car. We ruled out
a car. If he gives Jane a pound note. And
she's a great girl, she's mature, and he's in his
home just up the road. That's it. That's his sort
of bait. If she doesn't come back and she keeps
it and Saul walks home, hey he's lost a pound note. However,
(32:49):
if Jane comes back with the lunch, he's on a
win win situation. I know people are going, oh, that's
terrible to think. Just put yourself in the shoes of
what he's doing and the way he's thinking, not the
way we're thinking.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
It's Jane's shoes as well, because if she feels indebted
to this man and that he's sort of paid when
they've lost their money, I can see how you then
feel obliged to go back to him and maybe buy
him some fish.
Speaker 3 (33:15):
And what a nice man, go and buy some fizzy
drinks and come back here. It's beautifully set up until
they go back to his place. Now where the perpetrator lives.
And we now know that the perpetrator we believe is
Harry Phipps. He lives at the corner of Sussex Street
(33:36):
and Augusta Street. Everything happened in a very limited space.
Where does Harry Phipps live. He lives straight up or
Gusta Street. You can see his house from Collie Reserve.
It's next to the Anglican Church, and you go, my god,
that's close. It is. It's one hundred and ninety meters
in direct side of Collie Reserve, and if you go
(33:58):
at right angles, it's two hundred meters to Wenzyls. It
is the Bermuda Triangle. I've walked that, and I've walked
it very slowly. I even waited where the change rooms were,
and I waited there because this is what the kids did.
And I walked what I believed as Grant Beaumont's pace.
I go to Harry Phipps's house, snand out the side, wait,
(34:21):
and then I walked to Wendsl's. It took me, at
a slow pace, nineteen minutes.
Speaker 6 (34:28):
The spot where mister Patterson last saw the three Beaumont children.
He was riding his bicycle down Moseley Street and he
saw them standing right where I am. He stopped his
bicycle just here. He said hello to them. Then he
turned around the corner into Jetty Road and went down
towards the post office. Now the children after he passed by,
(34:52):
the children walked across the road.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
Am I right in saying that you were the first
person to actually identify this particular suspect, Yes, because that
was twenty thirteen in your book, and this man, I
believe you didn't name him, but it was you had
a wealth of evidence that this person was responsible. What
was the other evidence that you had about Harry Phipps?
Speaker 3 (35:18):
Oh? Where do we start? Alan Whittaker I've known since
university days, the University of Western Sydney back in the
ninth late nineteen eighties. I've known him since then. He
was teaching for a while and then he got into
authoring books with New Holland Publishing, and he had just
finished his I think he'sa his first true crime book,
(35:40):
the Wonder Beach Murders, where two teenage girls were raped
and murdered in the sand dunes on wander Beach, which
is just down the south of Cronulla, not too bar Sydney.
It doesn't really interest me, only because I'm not New
South Welshman. I'm South Australian. As much as the Beaumont
Children's story wasn't of great interest to him because his
(36:01):
heart's in New South Wales. However, he sent me the book,
which he usually did when he did books. He had
sent them to me and a few friends from university days.
I called him back and said, mate, if you ever
get a chance to do the Beaumont children, I'm in.
And he said, oh, that's right, you were born now,
I said, I was born in Glenelg. I would like
to know what happened to the children. Alan called me
(36:22):
a week later and said, you would not believe this.
My publishers just asked me can I do a book
on the Beaumont children? And he said are you in?
And I said absolutely. So we went off down to
glenel and Alan did most of the research because he
was employed by the publishers, and I helped him. I
showed him the lay of the land and Glenelg and
(36:44):
where I lived and where the Beaumonts lived, and it
was very easy to get around. Knew those suburbs now.
At that time, the head of major crime who we met,
was not really forthcoming. Oh what do you have to
know to write? You're after publicity? He said, plenty of
books have been written about the Beaumont children. We said,
nothing's been written about the Beaumont children. Oh what good
(37:07):
is that going to do? If you write a book,
people read it, of course, and they come out and say, listen,
I might know this. I might know that this did
happen with the book Alan got. I feel for him.
HIC cut most of him. He called me, I remember this,
he said, you know what? A guy came to my
place and knocked on the door and he was adamant
that the Beaumont children were living in Western Australia and
(37:29):
he wanted me to go and follow that up. I
feel for you. He received calls with theories. Look, this
is what the police have to put up with. Have
you ever thought of looking into you know, bill blogs
or whatever? And look, I've had these calls and you say,
will you look into them? Why do I have to
look into them? You know? Oh, well I don't have
the time. Why would I have the time? I said,
(37:51):
Just go to the police. I did, I said, And
what did they say? They're not interested? I wonder why.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
So was there any sort of credible evidence that came
out of it?
Speaker 3 (38:00):
Yeah? There was. There was one call. Alan called me
and he said, mate, are you sitting down every now
and there? You get that chill that goes up your
spine or down your spine. This was one moment he said, mate,
I've just had this lady call. Her name is Angela Fife,
and she lives up near you, so you might be
able to see it. She said. She read the book
(38:22):
and there was a few things she didn't know about
the story, one that Jane was given a pound note,
and the actual description of the man. Angela said, I
was married to a guy called Hayden Phipps. I'm not
married to him anymore. And we did live in South Australia,
and then we lived up in Queensland. He said to
(38:43):
me one night when he was watching a documentary on
the Beaumont children, he turned to Angela and said, I
think my father had something to do with that. Now
that shuts down her spine. Because she worked at the
correctional centers and she was dealing with the sexually abused.
(39:03):
She had classes for the sexually abused prisoners, and a
lot of people that have been sexually abused, especially males,
end up in prison for a minute of other reasons
associated with their sexual abuse. She had inklings that her
husband Hayden had been sexually abused by his father, who
was Harry Phipps. And she called Allen called me and
(39:25):
because she lived in Queensland, I set up a time
to meet her, which was quite happy to do so,
and she was only about two hours up the road. Now,
in my job, I've got my own company for the
last twenty years, and I think this is important, is
that I do recruitment for seeing your hospitality worldwide, and
I have to be very thorough in my research, especially
(39:46):
when I'm placing somebody for three hundred thousand or four
hundred thousand dollars. If I don't thoroughly research this individual
and do reference checks on him very thoroughly, I won't
have this client anymore. So I'm going to make sure
that I'm very thorough with Angela. The first thing I
needed to do was to meet her on not doing
(40:08):
anything over the phone. I was happy to meet her,
she was happy to meet me. I found her amazingly credible,
and I asked her, I'm going to have to do
reference checks on you, and she said, by all means,
call the head of the correctional facilities here all there,
I will tell them that you're calling. What she did
say that I didn't know about the pound note. Harry Phipps,
(40:32):
Hayden's father was known to hand out pound notes. He
was a very wealthy very respected, charming, very well connected individual.
He ran his own company called Castelloid, which is at
North Limpton. They made Harley Davidson rims for the motorbikes.
(40:52):
They made parts for holden Ford and later on with
Missen and Mitsubishi. So he was very wealthy and he
always carried a wad of cash. And she said, I
know that he gave out pound notes. I said, what
about the description, because really, excuse me, this is not
politically correct. If he was sure fat and squat, that's
it that ruings him out. But he wasn't. She said, Look,
(41:15):
I didn't know him back in the sixties, but he
was around six foot tall. I know back in the
sixties he had light brushed back hair and he still does,
and that he was a regular swimer. She said, I
know that, and I believe that he did sexually abuse
his own son. And I thought, oh, we've got somebody
that fits the description, hands out pound notes and looks
(41:37):
like he's an alleged pedophile.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
We go, oh wow, were you able to get in
contact with the sun?
Speaker 3 (41:43):
Yes? Now, because he had been or allegedly sexually abused,
you can imagine a lot of sexually abused people do
not want to meet. They do not want to talk
about their abuse. And this is in the high percentages.
And I know some people said, oh, you know, if
he was abused, he would have told me he would
have No, they don't. Some commit suicide, they suffer from
(42:05):
severe depression, they have anxiety, you know, alcoholism, drug abuse,
you know, self harm. They have all that. So it's
not so easy to go in and meet them. With Angela,
she hadn't been in contact with Hayden. It was too difficult.
His moods would swing and she didn't want anything more
to do with him. However, she gave me the number
(42:27):
of Hayden's son. I sent the book Searching for the
Bone Children. I had his address though Hayden's address, and
I sent the book by registered mail to the post
office and I just said in there, my name is
Stuart Marlins. I'd like to talk to you about somebody.
Would you mind giving me a call. I never heard
from him with his son. I sent the same thing.
(42:50):
I found his address and he called and he lived
up in Broadbeach, which was just up from in Queensland.
So and Hayden lived at also Broadbeach. So I thought, well,
they are. They're very close. Anyway, the son called me. Now,
I didn't say anything in this book. I just said
I'd like to talk to you about something. He called
(43:11):
and he introduced himself. He said, mate, I know what
this has to do with It's to do with my dad,
grandfather and the Beaumont children, obviously because he got the book. Yeah,
and I believe my grandfather was involved. I thought, oh,
you didn't know. How did you know I was going
to talk about this? And he said, mate, I know
(43:33):
when I get this. My father always said that his father, Harry,
had something to do with the case. Anyway, I went
around to meet the son. He played to me a
recording he recorded his father when he went around and
all he did, he didn't say anything. He just handed
(43:53):
his father, Hayden, the book because Hayden hadn't been to
the post office, so he didn't receive it, he recorded.
I listened to this recorded. Hayden's verse was where, Oh
my god, I knew this day would come. What do
we do? What do we do? We've got to go
to the police. Now, that is a very unusual response,
if you don't think there's anything untoward. The son was
(44:14):
telling me he said, I believe my father was sexually
abused over many years, that Harry Phipps had a satin fetish.
I saw this Saturn and when he was around Satney
became sexually aroused. I thought, oh God, and this is
living what one hundred and ninety meters in direct side
of poly reserve. I had to keep coming.
Speaker 8 (44:34):
This interview relates to I three while zero eight zero
five nine five m between Bill Hayes and Hayden HYDN
Troops Hayden measure a web.
Speaker 9 (44:47):
I've been asked to speak to you in relation to
certain matters involving the disappearance of the Beaumont children. Did
you understand what we're came to talk about? Did you
see the talking to Harry Well?
Speaker 8 (45:01):
I saw him coming out of the backyard from the
Curry house the currents car.
Speaker 9 (45:07):
I think they were inside the house and that's did
you hear what they're saying?
Speaker 2 (45:20):
Had there been any sightings or anything? Had there been
anything for Hayden that sort of solidified to him. My
father was the man who did this.
Speaker 3 (45:32):
Very good question, Very good question. I did get to
meet Hayden and I spent a few hours with him,
and he was getting it all up his chest. But
there was a few things he said. I met him
at his Broadbeach unit. I started to chat with him,
made him feel comfortable. But the story was that, yes,
(45:53):
he was sexually abused in his words, and I don't
believe he's lying. And in fact, to your listeners, you
know they're going so he could be like studies have
found that less than five percent of allegations of child
sexual abuse brought by the children hal fictitious. There is
a ninety five percent chance that Hayden Phipps is telling
(46:14):
the truth. You know what, if I'm a betting man
on the horses and my horse has got a ninety
five percent chance of winning, I think I'm going to
put my money on that one. Yeah. Absolutely, Now, Hayden,
I remember him banging down his hand on the armchair
and he said, mate, I swear I saw these children
in my backyard that day. And I said, well, how
(46:36):
do you know they were the Beatmont children? He said, mate,
it was around lunchtime. They came into the backyard around lunchtime.
Now that's a lucky guest. Look at the timing oft
Collie Reserve when they left. And I said, how would
you know he said, well, initially I thought they were
all boys and I thought, well, that's a bit strange.
He said, the haircuts are all the same. I tell
(46:58):
you what, have a look at a photo. Ah. And
I was like, Mane, your memory is incredible, because when
you have something called traumatic that you experience and you
remember it for the rest of your life. And I said, okay,
well what a part He said, Look, I don't remember
much about what they're wearing. I do remember the oldest
(47:20):
girl and the way he was thinking. And I was
looking at him. I thought, my god, you're telling the truth.
She had a sort of bag, a sort of bag.
And I said what kind of bag? He's like, I
just know she had a bag with it. She did.
If he's lying, he's going to go into a lot
of detail. Oh yeah. And they extrapidate the extrapolate the story. Yes,
(47:44):
and then they've got to have a good memory. Now,
if you lie, you've gotta have a good memory.
Speaker 2 (47:48):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (47:49):
So that's where you picked them up. And I thought, jeez,
this is this is good. He went on to talk
about his dad, satin Fettish, that he couldn't stop making
satin dresses. I asked him, I said, well, what color?
What colors? And he said, oh, I've got lime. Green,
pink was his favorite, red and orange and purple. Had
(48:14):
a look at the first few colors and never look
at it. And if you go back to what the
children were wearing at the beach, Wow, this was a
bee to a honeypot.
Speaker 2 (48:25):
What do you think happened to the Beaumont children that day?
Speaker 3 (48:32):
They followed him, They walked to his house. Hayden said
he saw them come in the backyard. The back door
was open. He said, they went into the back door.
Dad came out later, put four sort of surf tight
bags in the back of the car and drove off. Now,
his timing or his timeline could be a little wonkey.
(48:53):
He saw the children and he saw the father. If
they followed him, that would be correct. They would ord
of come in around lunchtime. So Hayden's correct. They go inside,
Harry gives them the pound. Note they walk out the
front door, because Hayden said they didn't come out the back.
And again, if that's lying, that story would change over
(49:14):
over a few years, and it never did. Yeah, the
children walk out the front. Now that front of his house,
the front door looks straight down Sussex Street to Jetty
Road and if you hit Jetty Roading you turn just
the fraction right and then left you're at Wensley's Bakery.
It fits like a glove. Now, what happened from Wenswell's Bakery,
(49:35):
we don't know. We know that Harry Phipps drove off
in the car now he had a very large he
had a Cadillac with fins, was very noticeable. Went and
from there we don't know.
Speaker 2 (49:50):
Have you got a sense of where, if they were murdered,
where their bodies might lie.
Speaker 3 (49:58):
The bodies are at Castelli factory.
Speaker 2 (50:01):
And why do you believe that.
Speaker 3 (50:03):
There's been two digs there at the back of the
factory when Bill Hayes. I hired Bill Hayes because I
wasn't getting anywhere with the police. In fact, I was
told I'm beating my head up against the brick wall.
This is very early on. I'm beating my head up
against the brick wall and I'm chasing my tail. I
was told that by the detective, even though there was
(50:25):
mounting circumstantial evidence. I was told that, however, I'm it
doesn't take a detective to the term me and I
didn't and I'll be honest with you. I'd done reference
checks on him. I'd done five and they were interesting.
Put it that way. So I hired Bill Hayes and
he recorded the conversation and sent it to Australia's best
(50:51):
light detection expert, which is Steve Van Naprin, and I
also sent it to Holland to statement analysis experts. They
didn't know each other. They sent back their findings and
said Hayden Phipps is telling the truth but hiding more.
They were nearly identical. There was a whole lot. One
in particular was when Hayden said to Bill Hayes, they
came into the car. Both statement analysis experts because most
(51:14):
probably your listeners will pick up, what do you mean
they came into the car. They got into the car
if you were standing outside, they came into the car
if you're in the car. And this is why Hayden
only goes so far and won't say anymore after. At
the end of the conversation with Bill Hayes, Bill was
(51:37):
helping him in the car. He was really sort of
he was naked his expression, but he was naked. He
was tired. He had spoken about his sexual abuse again
and that takes a lot about him. As he was
getting into his car, he looked up to Bill. Now,
Bill was twelve years as a detective and he was
several years in major crime in South Australia. He looked
(51:59):
up at Bill and said, Bill, they're in the sand pit.
Bill called me. He said, mate, I have been a detective.
I was in the Federal Police. I was a soldier
with the British Armed Services and a Special Forces. And
he said, this guy is telling the truth. These children
(52:20):
are in the sandpit, a sandpit as a cast ely.
When the police did the first dig and they did,
which was we're very grateful for Hayden Phipps called his
cousin who called me and he said, mate, they're digging
in the fucking wrong spot. And I said to Peter,
how does he know? That's his cousin. How does he know?
He said, he must have been there. He has mentioned
(52:44):
the sandpit to his son, to me, to Bill, to
his wife, to his cousin five separate occasions. The one
to Bill was the one that really startled. They are there.
We were just digging in the wrong spot the sandpit.
In his recorded interview that's been analyzed the sandpit he's
talking about is in front of the two workmen's cottage
(53:07):
at carst Ellly. If you can look at an aerial
you'll get that on Google. By the way, you get
it on my website. You can see where the two
cottages are now. The two cottages are very important to
this case. So in front of those I checked with
some workers from the cast that Wow factory from the
nineteen fifties and nineteen sixties, there was a sand pit
(53:27):
in front of those cottages and as they filled it
up with metal filings, they would move the sand pit
further up the factory to the end of the back gate,
so it kept moving that fill it in over a
period of time with sand. It was beautiful sand, like
beat sand, and then they would move towards the back
of the factory.
Speaker 2 (53:47):
That's so interesting. I just hope that one day they
are recovered. And earlier this month, Nancy Beaumont passed away,
not knowing what happened to her children.
Speaker 3 (53:59):
And I just told you she did. You hit it
right on the head. They not knowing she was living
a nightmare for fifty two years. And I think she's
with her children.
Speaker 2 (54:11):
You know, it's a case that changed Australia and to
have a conclusion and to perhaps one day actually recover
those bodies would would mean an awful lot to a
lot of people. So thank you so much for all
the hard work you're doing on this case. And it's
something that I think will you know, stay in the
public mind and our curiosity until it is solved. Thank
(54:34):
you again for your time.
Speaker 3 (54:36):
Thank you for having me. Jim. What sort of question
is one asked at a time like this? Well, what
can you say?
Speaker 10 (54:44):
Actually, I mean I know many people have Australia really
feel feel for us. Well, what can you say at
this moment? I mean, we've been hanging on for nine
months and fourteen days now and just wait and hope
and pray. I suppose there's been several false alarms over
these past harrowing nine months for you. Oh yes, it
(55:05):
raises their hopes and were let down again. And by
the way, I would like to say it the stage
that I will thank you all the radio, television stations
and the press for what.
Speaker 3 (55:19):
They have been doing.
Speaker 10 (55:20):
I mean, I mean, I know I've got a fields
for us, but here all over Australia, well, thank you
very much.
Speaker 2 (55:43):
Stewart's book The Satin Man, Uncovering the Mystery of the
Missing Beaumont Children is available at all good bookstores and online.
We'll keep you updated on the release of his new
book about the case. For photos, maps, and extra reading
on the Beaumont Children, don't forget to join our closed
Facebook group. Just search True Crime Conversations on Facebook. You
(56:08):
can also contact the show by emailing true Crime at
momamea dot com dot au. True Crime Conversations is a
Mummamea podcast hosted by me Jesse Stevens and produced by
Alice Cooper.
Speaker 1 (56:28):
We hope you found this episode compelling. If you missed
Thursday's release, we encourage you to go back and have
a listen. It explores the chilling story of Clifford Buftholomew,
an Adelaide man who killed ten members of his family.
Was later released from prison and started a completely new
life under a new identity.
Speaker 3 (56:47):
Thanks so much for listening.
Speaker 1 (56:48):
We'll be back with more later this week.
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