Birds of Prey vs A-Force

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• 0:00:00 - Introduction 
• 0:03:25 - No-Prize Time 
• 0:09:16 - Question of the Week 
• 0:10:00 - Birds of Prey vs A-Force intro 
• 0:14:21 - Birds of Prey history and roster 
• 0:25:03 - A-Force history and roster 
• 0:36:14 - Fight speculation 
• 0:48:38 - Duel results 
• 0:54:10 - Sign off 
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Executive producers: John Starosky, Zachary Hepburn, Miggy Matanguihan, Brandon Estergard, Nathaniel Wagner, Levi Yeaton, Austin Wesolowski, AJ Dunkerley, Nic Abanto, Scott Camacho, Gil Camacho, Adam Speas, Dean Maleski, Devin Davis, Joseph Kersting, Josh Liner, Mike Williams, and Oscar Galvez
"Take a Chance" "Clash Defiant" "Blip Stream" "Nowhere Land" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com), Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
#BirdsOfPrey #AForce #MarvelVsDC


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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
This is a DynaMic Network Podcast. Hi, welcome tothe Dynamic Duel Podcast, a weekly show where we

(00:27):
review superhero films and debate thesuperiority between Marvel and DC by comparing
their characters in stat-based battlesimulations. I'm Johnny DC. And I'm his twin
brother, Marvelous Joe. And in this episode, weare doing a surprise Team Duel episode between
DC's Birds of Prey and Marvel's A-Force. Yeah,we're doing this special team duel in honor of

(00:50):
Women's History Month, so to celebrate all thewomen's out there, here's your duel of badass
female superhero teams. Not gonna lie, I'm alittle nervous about this because I know A-Force
is essentially female Avengers and Birds of Preytends to be a little bit more street level, so we'll
see how it goes later on in this episode. Beforethat, we are not going to break down the comic book

(01:13):
movie news from this past week because there isn'tany, not anything concrete anyway. Yeah, we did
get news that Sadie Sink has been cast in the newSpider-Man movie, but there's nothing really to
discuss there because we don't know who she'splaying. But we will be having a question of the
week later on this episode. As always, we list oursegment times and our episode description, so
feel free to check out the show notes if you want toskip ahead to a particular topic. Our

(01:37):
artificially intelligent duel simulator, AJ9K,has a quick message for our listeners, so listen
up. Why hello there. Do you want even more from thispodcast? Then become a part of the Dynamic Duel
community on Patreon where you can choose fromthree tiers. The Dynamic 2.0 tier gives you access
to our Discord chat server, the Fantastic Fourtier gives you two bonus episodes each month, and

(02:01):
the X-Force tier makes you an executive producerof this show. Lastly, the Diner Mike podcast
network tier lets you create your own podcastusing this Monte Carlo simulator. Johnny and Joe
will help you develop your show, provide graphicsupport and consultation, and get you simulation
results. Pitch the twins your ideas via email atdynamicduelpodcast at gmail.com. Check it out at

(02:22):
patreon.com/dynamicduel. Pip pip cheerio.Thanks AJ9K and thanks to everyone who supports
the podcast. Guys, be sure to tune into the othershows on the Dynamite podcast network this week,
including Max Destruction, which pits yourfavorite action heroes from film and television
against each other. This Wednesday, host Scottyand Gilly are finding out who would win in a fight

(02:43):
between Disney's Hercules and Maui from Moana. Onthe Send Your World podcast, host Zachary Hepburn
speculates on fights between fan favorite animeand manga characters. On Thursday, Zach is going
to discuss who would win between Vasto LordeIchigo from Bleach and Six Tail Kyuubi from Naruto.
And on the Konsole Kombat podcast, host John andDean simulate battles between popular video game

(03:08):
characters. In yesterday's episode, theyreviewed Dungeons and Dragons, Honor Among
Thieves. Visit dynamicpodcasts.com or click thelink in our show notes to listen to all of the shows
in the DynaMic podcast network. But with that outof the way, quick to the no prize. A no prize is an
award Marvel used to give out to fans. Our version,the Dynamic Dual No Prize, is a digital award we

(03:33):
post on Instagram for the person that we feel gavethe best answer to our question of the week. Last
week, we asked you guys, what is your favoriteMarvel and DC comics crossover and why? And this is
coming off the news that Marvel and DC are going toput out two one shot crossover issues later on this
year sometime in 2025. We don't have any of thespecific details on it, but we love the idea and

(03:55):
thought it was worth asking about. Yeah, we gotthree answers for this question. So let's break
down our two honorable mentions before revealingthis week's no prize winner. Our first honorable
mention goes to by DearBangora who said, Hello,Dynamic Dual. I think the best Marvel DC crossover
is Batman versus Punisher. The fact that bothcharacters have strict codes that are vastly

(04:19):
different, but that unites them as well. I alsolike that we can see the creation of Red Hood coming
from this crossover being a mix of bothcharacters. So for me, Punisher versus Batman,
the dichotomy and the difference between thecharacters and their code and their will makes
this comic book. Yeah, it looks like he got cut offthere, but he's referring to the Punisher Batman

(04:42):
deadly knights crossover comic book in whichPunisher pays a visit to Gotham City. And if that
concept sounds intriguing to you, hell yeah, itwas. I really like that comic book, even though,
you know, Batman kind of beats a shit out ofPunisher towards the end and kind of like humbles
him. Punisher does get in a good line where he tellsBatman that he and the Joker deserve each other. So

(05:04):
I like that. Yeah, Punisher also makes Jokeressentially shit himself, too. So that was also a
great moment from the comic. Yeah, it was a greatlook at just like the two moralities of the
character. You know, Punisher, he kills his badguys and he basically saw Batman as liable and all
of the Joker's murders because he wouldn't killthe Joker. You know, it's always been an

(05:25):
interesting debate. And it was one that wasexplored in that comic. So that philosophical
aspect alone, I think, sets it a level above quite afew DC Marvel crossovers. Great answer by
DearBangora. Our next honorable mention goes toMason Thompson. Who said? Hey, what's up? It's
Mason. And I would have to say if it was my favoriteMarvel and DC crossover, I'd just do the two,

(05:49):
probably be one Batman Humboldt Punisher,because I was stuff and or one if it's just DC, then
it would be Batman when he went over to NinjaTurtles. Because that is always so cool to see him
fight with like all the turtles and yeah. Yeah, I'mnot sure if Mason is referring again to the

(06:12):
Punisher Batman deadly knights crossover,because I'm kind of ashamed to say that Batman has
actually beat the shit out of Punisher in multiplecrossovers. I remember in J.L .A. Avengers,
Punisher was in the middle of killing some bad guyswhile Batman was doing reconnaissance in the
Marvel Universe. And then Batman saw him doingthis and then broke through the warehouse and then
beat the shit out of Punisher to keep him fromkilling everybody. I mean, is it any surprise,

(06:36):
though? Like Punisher is not at the level ofmartial arts finesse that Batman is. He doesn't
need to when he has bullets. And plus, he's he's apretty damn good fighter. He's a really good
fighter, but he's also like 70. And Batman's likenot anymore. But no, Batman and the Teenage Mutant
Ninja Turtles crossover was also awesome. Theymade a movie about it. And we actually did a review

(06:58):
of that film on a guest spot for the Ready to Retropodcast where we talk all about that movie and the
comic. It was good time. So make sure to check thatout if you haven't. Yeah, we love the Ready to
Retro, guys. So great answer, Mason Thompson. Thewinner of this week's No Prize is Christopher
Minotti, who said. Hi, guys, this is ChristopherMinotti. My favorite would have to be the four

(07:20):
issues of Marvel vs. DC, because it's exactly whatcomic book fans love. The discussion of which side
is stronger, whose characters would win morefights. And I feel like those four issues, it
showed that while sometimes DC character will winand sometimes a Marvel character will win. In the
end, Marvel will always lose to Superman. Now, if Iremember correctly in that miniseries, Marvel

(07:46):
actually won a majority of those matches, but itwas total bullshit because a few of the winners
were determined by fan votes and there's no wayWolverine at Storm would have beaten Lobo and
Wonder Woman. Yeah, they would have. It showed inthe comic just how that would have happened. It
literally didn't, though. Like Wolverine andLobo go behind a bar and then Wolverine just stands

(08:08):
up and smokes a cigar. It's like, what happenedbehind that bar? He gutted him like he said he
would. That's what happened. OK, so he didsomething that wouldn't kill Lobo. Gotcha. You
sound like a fucking whiny loser. Maybe don't be sojealous about Marvel's victories. I'm super
bitter about it. I don't care. No, that crossoverevent was a defining moment, I think, for my

(08:31):
Jonathan's childhood. I remember going to thecomic book store and getting the big Marvel versus
DC poster that they were selling there along withthe comic books. And it was just a magical time,
really. And in many ways, influenced us into doingthis podcast like 20 years later. Oh, absolutely.
Yeah, if you guys haven't listened to our guestspot on the Rankers, where we talk about why DC or

(08:55):
Marvel is better, definitely check that episodeout as well, because I talk about how the DC versus
Marvel mini series influenced us when we firststarted reading comics. But great answer,
Christopher. You win this week's No Prize. Ifyou're the listener who won a shot at winning your
own No Prize, stay tuned to later on in this episodewhen we'll be asking another question of the week
and know that that's done onto the question of theweek. What character do you think Sadie Sink will

(09:24):
be playing in the upcoming fourth Spider-Man filmfrom Marvel Studios? And we received a word over
this past week that Sadie Sink has been cast. Wejust don't know what role she's playing. There's a
lot of conjecture out there, but we want to hearwhat you guys think and why. Record your answer at
dynamicdool.com by clicking on the redmicrophone button in the bottom right hand corner
of the screen, which will prompt you to leave us avoicemail. Your message could be up to 30 seconds

(09:48):
long and don't forget to leave your name in case weinclude you on the podcast. We'll pick our
favorite answer and award that person a dynamicdual No Prize that will post to Instagram. Be sure
to answer before March 22nd. But let's go ahead andmove on to the main event of this episode, where we

(10:11):
find out who would win in a battle between the allfemale teams of Birds of Prey and a force. OK, Birds

(10:35):
of Prey versus a force. As we mentioned earlier,these are two all female teams from DC and Marvel
respectively. Birds of Prey, notoriously, youcould say, had a live action film, but it was really
just a Harley Quinn film. A force has not had its ownmovie. No, but they also notoriously had a moment

(10:55):
in Avengers Endgame where a lot of the femalesuperheroes that were fighting against Thanos in
the climactic battle joined together to help getthe Infinity Gauntlet over to Ant-Man and the Wasp
as they were powering up the Quantum Tunnel. A lotof people found it pandering, but I actually loved
it as a comic book fan because I was like, it'sfucking a force. They're like doing an Easter egg

(11:18):
for that. I guess if you didn't know the comics andjust thought that they were doing it for girl
power, then I can maybe see where they were comingfrom. But I personally enjoyed that moment in that
movie. Yeah, I didn't know what a force was at thetime when I saw that. So I definitely was like, oh,
look, they're all posing together. Girl power.Yeah, I think the boys' television show made fun of

(11:40):
it, too, at some point. But they don't know they'rejust fucking cynical. I mean, let's be real. That
scene was kind of better than the entirety of Birdsof Prey, though. You're not wrong. And Birds of
Prey wasn't even that bad. It was just a really badBirds of Prey film. Right. I mean, the movie should
have been called Harley Quinn and the Birds ofPrey. The Birds of Prey team shouldn't have taken

(12:01):
center stage because they really weren't thefocus and they weren't really adapted that well.
Right, exactly. So if the only thing you know aboutthe Birds of Prey is the movie, forget everything
you know about the Birds of Prey. Yeah, the originfor Birds of Prey in the comic books is way
different from the film. But I got to say the originfor a force is almost non-existent in the comic

(12:21):
books. They just manifested as a team within thealternate reality of battle worlds that Dr. Doom
created. So there's no real origin story for aforce, but they do have, you know, a history. OK,
well, that's almost like Birds of Prey, too,because they didn't even call themselves Birds of
Prey or think of themselves as an official teamuntil like issue 80. Oh, wow. Well, I can't wait to
hear all about their backstory as we go into that ina bit here. But to explain the methodology behind

(12:45):
our duels, let's go to our sentient dualsimulator, Alfred Jarvis, 9000. Adrian and I, K
tell our listeners how you go about determining awinner in our dual matchups. Yes, of course, sir.
The way I determine a winner between the two teamsis by running 1000 Monte Carlo simulations
between every character on each team using theirstatistics. A Monte Carlo simulation is a

(13:06):
probabilistic model used to determine outcomesthrough random sampling. In this case, I
randomize the statistics along a normaldistribution as a way to simulate the many
variables that can occur during battle. The statparameters are based on the official Marvel power
grid from which the DC characters statistics areextrapolated. Additional stat categories are
included such as range, damage potential,versatility and perception in order to create a

(13:31):
more detailed and accurate simulation. Theresults of the 49,000 simulations provide a
percentage of wins for each character on bothteams. The team with the higher average win rate is
declared the victor as they have a higherprobability to win any given battle. In an
equitable pairing, neither team should win 100%of the matches. The comic book stories have shown
that there's even a way for Batman to defeatSuperman, so the confidence rate of my method

(13:55):
falls in line with the precedents that have beenestablished in the source material. My
mathematical simulations are withoutsubjectivity or bias. Feats are not the sole
consideration, nor are fan votes tabulated fordetermination of the winner. Thanks to J9K.
Before we run the simulations, though, we like tobreak down each team's histories and rosters
before improvising a scenario on how we imagineone of the many simulations would play out beat for

(14:21):
beat. And I believe it's my turn to go first with theDC team's backstory. So let me tell you about Birds
of Prey. The Birds of Prey began as a partnershipbetween Barbara Gordon, the former Batgirl, now
operating as the information broker known asOracle, and Dynal Lance, the martial arts expert
and vigilante known as Black Canary, each of whomyou can learn more about in their respective duels

(14:44):
against Hawkeye, Kate Bishop, and Black Widow.Now after suffering a spinal injury at the hands of
the Joker, Barbara reinvented herself as Oracle,creating a vast intelligence network that
provided real-time information to superheroesworldwide. Initially, she sought out Powergirl
as her first field agent, but after an earlymission resulted in tragic casualties,

(15:08):
Powergirl severed ties with Oracle, leavingBarbara searching for a more compatible
operative. Oracle eventually turned to BlackCanary, a veteran crime fighter who had lost her
Canary cry, but continued patrolling the streetsas a highly skilled combatant. Operating from the
Gotham City clock tower, Oracle and Black Canaryformed a formidable duo, with Dynah handling

(15:30):
field operations and Barbara coordinatingcommissions behind the scenes. Their
partnership thrived, despite occasionalideological differences, and over time, Oracle
expanded her intelligence network to include agrowing roster of agents. The team solidified
when Black Canary was captured by the villainousSavant, an information broker and former

(15:51):
vigilante who sought to control Gotham'sunderworld. Unable to call upon the Bat Family for
assistance, Oracle reached out to Huntress, abrutal and relentless vigilante with ties to the
city's criminal underbelly. Working together,Oracle and Huntress successfully rescued Black
Canary, leading Barbara to formally recruitHuntress as a full-time agent. And you, of course,

(16:13):
can learn more about Huntress in her dual episodeagainst Jessica Jones. Soon after, Lady Black
Hawk, a time-displaced World War II pilot andformer member of the Black Hawk Squadron, joined
the team after a mission involving a hijackedaircraft. Though she was originally an outlier
due to her outdated views and hard drinkingdemeanor, Lady Black Hawk quickly became an

(16:36):
invaluable member, serving as the team's pilotand transport specialist. With its core trio of
Oracle, Black Canary and Huntress, along withLady Black Hawk providing air support, the Birds
of Prey expanded their operations, tacklingthreats that other hero teams ignored or were
unable to address. They faced off againstcriminals such as Cheshire, Senator Pullman, and

(16:58):
the Blackmailer Savant while also dealing withespionage, human trafficking, and
international crime syndicates. For years, theBirds of Prey operated from Oracle's Command
Center inside the Gotham Clock Tower, but theirheadquarters came under attack during a
full-scale gang war. Black Mask, the crime lordwho had taken control of Gotham's underworld,

(17:19):
targeted Oracle's operations, leading anassault that resulted in the Clock Tower's
destruction. Forced to abandon Gotham, Barbaratemporarily disbanded the team and went into
hiding. After a brief time operating covertly,Oracle reassembled the Birds of Prey, now
stationed aboard the ARE-1, a high-tech mobilecommand aircraft outfitted with cutting-edge

(17:42):
surveillance and tactical equipment. Fromthere, they took on high-risk missions across the
globe, tackling threats ranging fromsuper-powered crime syndicates to political
conspiracies. Seeking a more stable base ofoperations, Oracle relocated the team to
Metropolis, but their presence in Superman'scity led to clashes with local authorities and

(18:03):
rival vigilante groups. Eventually, theysettled in Platinum Flats, a high-tech city on the
West Coast with deep ties to organized crime andcorporate corruption. With a growing roster that
now included Big Barda, Manhunter, Gypsy, andJudo Master, the Birds of Prey fought against the
city's underground syndicates while facingopposition from the metahuman criminal

(18:25):
underworld. During their time in Platinum Flats,the team found themselves targeted by Spy
Smasher, the alias of Katarina Armstrong, aformer government operative and Barbara's
childhood rival. Katarina sought to take controlof the Birds of Prey, leveraging her influence to
force Oracle out. This led to a dramaticconfrontation where Barbara challenged the Spy

(18:47):
Smasher to a one-on-one fight, with the winnertaking control of the organization. Despite her
physical limitations, Oracle outmaneuvered SpySmasher and won the fight. However, Katarina
refused to honor their agreement. Before shecould make a move against Oracle, the Birds of Prey
assembled in full force alongside numerousallies including Black Canary, Wildcat, and even

(19:10):
the assassin Lady Shiva. Overwhelmed andoutmatched, Spy Smasher had no choice but to back
down, and Oracle secured the Birds of Prey'sindependence once and for all. As Oracle's
intelligence network grew, so did her list ofenemies. Chief among them was the Calculator, a
cyber-criminal and information broker whosought to unmask Oracle and eliminate her as a

(19:33):
threat. Their ongoing digital war escalated whenthe Calculator attempted to harness fragments of
the Anti-Life Equation, a cosmic formula capableof controlling minds. To counter his growing
power, Oracle led an all-out cyber assaultenlisting allies such as Cassandra Kane,
Huntress, and even members of the Justice Leagueto dismantle his operations. Though she

(19:54):
successfully thwarted Calculator's plans, thebattle left her questioning her own
effectiveness, leading her to temporarilydisband the Birds of Prey once again to reassess
her role. Following Batman's apparent death,Oracle resumed operations in Gotham City,
assisting Nightwing in maintaining order ascriminals seized the opportunity to expand their

(20:15):
influence. She reassembled the Birds of Prey witha new lineup that included the Medi-Human Bruiser
Hawk, the Pacifist Warrior Dove, and a returningCountress. Establishing a new headquarters in
Cord Tower, during this time, Black Canary leftthe team to raise her adopted daughter, Sin, but
eventually returned when the Birds faced aresurgence of organized crime in Gotham. The team

(20:38):
also recruited two new members, Black Alice, ateenage sorceress with the ability to
temporarily steal magical powers, and Misfit, ahomeless runaway with teleportation abilities
whom Oracle took under her wing. As the Birds ofPrey continued to expand, they took on major
players in the criminal underworld, including anunderground Medi-Human trafficking gang and the

(21:00):
growing influence of the villainousorganization known as the Secret Six. Their
battles led to high stakes confrontationsagainst figures like Harley Quinn, Talia El Ghul,
and her League of Assassins. Following theFlashpoint event, the history of the Birds of Prey
was rebooted, and the team was reestablished as acovert operations unit based in Gotham City.

(21:21):
Black Canary formed a new incarnation of thegroup, recruiting Starling, Batgirl, Katana,
and Poison Ivy for a series of high-risk missions.Their early cases involved stopping a villain
known as Choke, who used nanotechnology to turnpeople into living bombs. The team faced internal
strife when Poison Ivy attempted to manipulatethem into joining her crusade against

(21:43):
environmental criminals. Katana ultimatelykilled Ivy in self-defense, leaving the team
shaken. Shortly after, Starling betrayed them toboth Mr. Freeze and the Court leading to further
fractures within the group. After learning thather presumed dead ex-husband, Kurt Lance, was
being held captive by the terrorist organizationBasilisk, Black Canary went rogue to rescue him.

(22:08):
This put her at odds with Amanda Waller, who hadmanipulated the team from behind the scenes. When
Ras Al Ghul entered the conflict offering BlackCanary a Lazarus pet serum in exchange for her
cooperation, she turned him down, setting off achain of events that nearly led to the team's
destruction. In the latest incarnation of theteam, Black Canary has once again taken charge,

(22:30):
forming a new squad consisting of Cassandra Kane,Big Barda, Zellet, and Harley Quinn. Now
team-wise, I knew that Barbara Gordon would be ano-brainer to include on my 7-person roster,
since she's the entire reason the team exists.She's joining as Batgirl, not Oracle though, as
Batgirl has been a member in recent years in thecomics. Black Canary and Huntress were also

(22:54):
Shoe-ins considering they and Barbara form thecore team of Birds of Prey. I decided to also go with
Powergirl, since she was technically Barbara'sfirst field agent prior to recruiting Black
Canary, as well as Dove, one half of Hawk and Dove,though replacing Hawk will be Hawk Girl, who has
helped the team against the Seeker 6 and is a bird ofprey in her own right. For my 7th and final team

(23:18):
member, I could have gone with Lady Black Hawk, whoI would consider to be a 4th core member if there
ever was one, but there have been much moreinteresting characters on the Birds of Prey team,
especially ones that I knew wouldn't drag down theteam's stats like Lady Black Hawk would, who's
pretty weak. In the end, I decided to go with Vixenas my final team member, as she's a powerhouse that

(23:42):
I believe will help raise what is traditionally astreet level team like Birds of Prey to a force
level. So that's my team. Batgirl, Black Canary,Huntress, Powergirl, Dove, Hawk Girl, and Vixen.
Has Vixen ever been associated with the team? Yes,she has been a field agent for Oracle in the past.

(24:03):
She helped Huntress bring down some cults in thePacific Northwest. Okay, all right. That's a
pretty damn good lineup. It was interesting tohear how for the majority of their existence, the
Birds of Prey were supported and founded byBarbara Gordon as Oracle. It's kind of hard to know
what the team functions like when Barbara Gordonis Batgirl as opposed to Oracle. Well, she just

(24:26):
does all of her information brokering in thefield. She still has computer gadgets attached to
her suit and stuff like that. She's definitelystill like the brains of the team, just that now
she's fighting alongside them. That's prettycool. I like that. It was also interesting to see
that Harley Quinn has become a member of the team. Ifeel like they only did that because of the movie. I
agree. Yeah, 100%. That's the case. I was actuallythinking of including Harley Quinn on this team

(24:51):
since she does have that tie in in the generalpublic's mind considering she was in the movie.
But I already used Harley Quinn in the SuicideSquad versus Defenders team doled that we did
earlier. Yeah, that's right. Well, let me go aheadand get into a forces backstory. A Force was an all
female superhero team that emerged in thealternate reality of Battle World, a patchwork

(25:13):
planet created by Dr. Doom following thedestruction of the multiverse. They operated as
the defenders of Arcadia, a utopian islandterritory within Battle World under the
leadership of She-Hulk, who also served asArcadia's appointed Baroness. Wait, is Arcadia
an all female island? No, they had dudes there, butit was just run by women. But it's an island utopia.

(25:36):
Yeah. Oh, just like them. It's not like them. RIPoff. Anyway, the founding roster included over 40
women heroes, including Captain Marvel, Ms.Marvel, Spider Woman, Medusa, Dazzler, Nico
Minoru, and Mockingbird to The team protectedArcadia from a Megalodon attack off the island's

(25:56):
coast. They successfully subdued the creature,but Miss America hurled it beyond the massive
shield wall that separated Arcadia from thezombie infested Deadlands and inadvertently
damaging the barrier. This act violated Dr.Doom's laws and despite She-Hulk's protests, the
Thor core, who were the elite enforcers of Doom'srule, arrived to arrest America Chavez. She was

(26:20):
sentenced to exile, forced to serve as guardian ofthe shield for the rest of her life. In response,
She-Hulk tasked Arcadia's undersea residents,including Namor, Namorita, and Namora, with
investigating the origins of the Megalodonattack. Meanwhile, Nico Minoru discovered a
mysterious girl who had fallen from the sky. Afemale variant of Loki advised Nico to bring the

(26:42):
mysterious girl to Ape Horse for furtherexamination. As the team tried to determine her
origins, portals began opening across Arcadia,allowing dangerous creatures to enter the
territory. One such portal unleashed a mutantSentinel, which Ape Horse managed to destroy with
the unexpected help of the mysterious girl.Medusa immediately accused her of being
responsible for the portals, but She-Hulkrefused to accept this claim without proof. When

(27:07):
another portal opened, She-Hulk chose to travelthrough it, seeking answers. She-Hulk arrived in
the Sentinel territories where she was pursued bythe robots and confronted by members of the Thor
Corps for trespassing across battleworld'sborders. She fought off the Thors and returned to
Arcadia, realizing that the portals were createdwith magic from Arcadia, suggesting that someone

(27:28):
within Ape Horse had betrayed them. Before theteam could investigate further, the Thor Corps
arrived in Arcadia, demanding She-Hulk'ssurrender. Medusa sacrificed herself to repel
the Thors, buying time for She-Hulk and her alliesto regroup. With the team now branded outlaws,
Loki seized the opportunity to climb the portal.A-Force quickly deduced that Loki was the true

(27:50):
traitor responsible for creating the portals todestabilize She-Hulk's rule. Before she could be
crowned Baroness, A-Force launched an attackexposing her deception. In retaliation, Loki
unleashed one final assault, using her powers tobreach the shield barrier, allowing the hordes of
undead from the deadlands to invade Arcadia.A-Force joined by the remaining forces of

(28:12):
Arcadia, including the members of the Thorkor,the X-Men and the Submariner's forces, mounted a
desperate defense against the undead. As thezombies overwhelmed them, the mysterious girl,
now named Singularity, sacrificed herself tosave her new friends. She absorbed the horde into
the pocket dimension within herself and ascendedinto the sky before exploding in a flash of light.

(28:34):
The battle was won, but Arcadia had suffered heavylosses, and A-Force was left forever changed.
Following the end of Battleworld and therestoration of the multiverse, Singularity
re-emerged in the primary reality of Earth 616,but none of the heroes she had known on Battleworld
remembered her. Her arrival was detected by AlphaFlight, whom it took her for a threat. Seeking

(28:56):
familiarity, Singularity located CaptainMarvel, believing her to be the same version she
had known back in Arcadia. However, before CarolDanvers could comprehend what was happening,
another cosmic entity named Antimatter arrived,pursuing Singularity across Earth. Singularity
fled to New York City where she encounteredShe-Hulk. Recognizing her from Arcadia, she

(29:16):
sought her aid, but Antimatter attacked themboth. The Inhuman Queen Medusa intervened with a
force of Inhuman soldiers and detainedSingularity, believing her to be a danger. But
when Antimatter killed one of the Inhumans,Medusa, along with She-Hulk, fought back, using
Inhuman technology to teleport Antimatter to themoon to buy themselves time. Realizing the need

(29:38):
for a stronger force, Singularity brought thegroup to Japan where they enlisted the aid of Niko
Minoru. As Antimatter reappeared, Niko used thestaff of one to temporarily banish him. Seeking a
more effective means of defeating their foe,Captain Marvel devised a plan to use concentrated
light energy against Antimatter. To implementthis strategy, they sought out Dazzler in Miami

(29:59):
and recruited her to join them. Dazzler struckAntimatter with a powerful burst of light while
She-Hulk and Medusa attempted to contain him,allowing Captain Marvel time to charge a
containment device. However, Antimatter provedtoo powerful, overloading the system and
escaping. Niko then cast a spell to removeAntimatter's ability to track Singularity,
allowing them to regroup aboard the Alpha FlightSpace Station. There, scientists analyzed the

(30:24):
data from their Miami battle and developed adevice capable of dismantling Antimatter.
However, it was discovered that Antimatter andSingularity were quantum entangled, meaning
that destroying him would also destroy her. Due tothis revelation, She-Hulk attempted to reason
with Antimatter, but their negotiations failed.In retaliation, Antimatter critically wounded

(30:44):
Dazzler. Enraged, Singularity blamed herselfand left to confront Antimatter alone. She-Hulk,
Minoru, and Captain Marvel followed her to theBlue Area of the Moon where Medusa planted a bomb
that would destroy Antimatter. As the devicedetonated, Dazzler appeared, teleporting
Singularity to safety in an act that severed theirentanglement. Antimatter was finally defeated,

(31:06):
but the battle had left A-Force shaken. A-Forceremained active for some time, but their battles
grew increasingly dire. A-Force found itselfdivided by ideological differences during the
Second Superhero Civil War. Captain Marvel,siding with Ulysses Cain's ability to predict
future crimes, turned against Nico Minoru whenthe Inhuman Prophet foresaw that she would one day

(31:27):
kill a woman named Alice. Nico fled to Ure,Colorado, where she encountered Elsa
Bloodstone, who was battling a monstrousinfestation that was transforming the town's
residents into insects. When Alice was found, itwas revealed that she had inadvertently caused
the outbreak, and only her death could reverse thetransformation. Nico refused to kill Alice,

(31:48):
leading to a deadly confrontation in which herA-Force teammates, who tracked her to Colorado,
were also infected. Ultimately, Nico cast a spellthat took Alice's life undoing the infection. The
moral and ideological rift between CaptainMarvel and Nico Minoru deepened following this
incident. The strain within the team, coupledwith She-Hulk's temporary retirement and

(32:09):
Medusa's departure into space, led to A-Force'seventual dissolution, and the remaining members
drifted apart. Though A-Force no longer operatedas a formal team, their legacy remains to this day
in comics as a testament to the strength of the deepbonds they forged while together. And that's
their backstory. For this team duel,seven-person roster, I'll be going with some of

(32:29):
the primary members of A-Force, along with some ofthe members from the team's start and battle
worlds that pairs best with your Birds of Preyteam. This was pretty easy, since almost every
Marvel superhero was part of A-Force at that time.To start with, I went with She-Hulk, Captain
Marvel, Spider Woman, Jessica Drew, I should say,Nico Minoru, and Miss Marvel. All of whom you can

(32:50):
learn more about in their own individual duels. Ishould note that since our Miss Marvel duel, the
character underwent a slight power upgrade tomatch her abilities in the movies and shows. It was
revealed that Kamala Khan was an inhuman whounderwent pterogenesis prior to the awakening of
her mutant gene, which is the power to createpurple hard-light constructs. Wait, really?

(33:13):
Yeah, so she'll be having that power in this duel.For the final two spots on the A-Force roster, I
went with characters who haven't had their ownindividual duels, but were prominent heroes that
paired well with your team. The first one isDazzler, who I'm pairing with your Black Canary.
Dazzler is a mutant whose real name is Alice inBlair, who has the ability to absorb sound

(33:35):
vibrations and convert them into light energy,including lasers, strobes, and all kinds of light
effects. She's a singing pop star in the books,basically the Taylor Swift of comics, and she's
famous for using her powers to generate laserlight shows during her concerts. She's been a part
of the X-Men and X-Factor, and was shown in liveaction in the Dark Phoenix movie played by Halston

(33:58):
Sage. For the final spot on the A-Force team, I'mgoing with Mockingbird, who I'm pairing against
your Huntress. Now Mockingbird is one of Shield'stop spies and scientists with a skill set similar
to Black Widows. She's an expert biochemist andmartial artist who famously uses two steel alloy
battle staves, or billy clubs, that she can screwtogether to extend into a bow staff or vaulting

(34:22):
pole. She was a founding member of the West CoastAvengers, and she's been depicted a few times in
live action, first as Hawkeye's Wife, played byLaura Cardellini in the MCU. The character was
also played more accurately, and really toperfection, in the Agents of Shield television
show by Adrian Palakie. So to reiterate, my7-person roster for A-Force is She-Hulk, Captain

(34:45):
Marvel, Ms. Marvel, Spider Woman, Nico Minoru,Dazzler, and Mockingbird. And since we like to
create pairings for these team duels in order tokeep things on an even kill basically and make sure
that the matches are fair, the pairings go asfollows. Captain Marvel and Power Girl, She-Hulk
and Hawke Girl, Dazzler and Black Canary, NicoMinoru and Batgirl, Mockingbird and Huntress,

(35:08):
Ms. Marvel and Vixen, and Spider Woman and Dove.Yeah, the Batgirl, Nico pairing kind of throws me,
but the rest of them are great, I think. Well, Ifigured what Batgirl lacks in powers she makes up
in intelligence, and what Nico lacks inexperience she makes up in having a really cool
power set. Yeah, well, we'll see how it goes. So youhaven't done duels with Dazzler and Mockingbird.

(35:31):
I know about Dazzler, but I didn't know much aboutMockingbird. It sounds like she's essentially
just Black Widow who also uses battle staves. Notcommonly, though. Like, I know that in Avengers
Age of Ultron, the director, Joss Whedon, gaveScarlett Johansson's Black Widow these Billy
Clubs, and she's really used them in all theAvengers movies since then, you know, until

(35:52):
Avengers Endgame. I feel like he kind of stole themfrom Mockingbird in order to make Black Widow a
more physical threat against characters likeUltron. But the Batons, those are typically known
to be used by Mockingbird, not Black Widow. I won'tsay that she hasn't used, like, tonfas from time to
time, but that's really Mockingbird's signatureweapon. Okay, well, I can't wait to find out how

(36:14):
this turns out. So, here's where we're at. We're atthe final stage of the game. Now that we've got

(37:09):
their histories and abilities out of the way,let's speculate on how one of the thousands of
simulated matches will go. The winner isdetermined by simulations, not the speculation,
but it's fun to imagine how this fight could playout. Agent NK, what are the rules of our
speculation? Well, I should say there are norules. The teams must earn victory on their own

(37:50):
merit. Alright, then let's get into it. Birds ofPrey and A-Force meet on the battlefield. Who goes
first? I think Black Canary would go first. So,right away, she's gonna blast all of them with a
Canary cry, sending all of them flying backward.No, because Dazzler, she's at the front of the team
when this happens, and she's gonna absorb theentirety of Black Canary's Canary cry. And, like,

(38:16):
you just amped Dazzler up to, like, 11. She turnsall of that sound energy into light energy, and she
spins around on her roller skates and, you know,strikes a pose, and she's like, let's go, girls!
And, like, cue the EDM music, because this fightjust turned into a dance rave, and A-Force is gonna
charge at the Birds of Prey while Dazzler isshooting out these laser lights, and these lasers

(38:40):
are gonna, like, cut Black Girl's utility belt inhalf, and one of Hawk Girl's wings just gets
clipped, and I'm pretty sure that Power Girl isbald now. She was given a laser haircut. Okay, I saw
this coming. Not the haircut. I mean, Power Girlhas Kryptonian hair, so... But you're dealing

(39:01):
with some of the most agile characters in DC withthe Birds of Prey team. So they're actually
dodging Dazzler's lasers with, like, flips andshit, and Black Girl's gonna counter with a smoke
pellet, hiding her team, so Dazzler and the rest ofA-Force can't see where the Birds of Prey are. All
they're gonna see is a set of glowing tiger eyesjust before Vixen leaps out of the smoke with a

(39:27):
tiger aura, pouncing on Niko Minoru and justslashing her ribbons. Okay, alright, well, okay.
Niko gets hurt, but before she gets turned intoribbons, that's when She-Hulk leaps in, just
straight up grabs Vixen by her waistband andthrows her into space. Okay. And then Niko casts a
healing spell on herself using the Staff of One.She's gonna say, like, Medic, and she's good to go.

(39:52):
She's back in this fight. Meanwhile, CaptainMarvel is gonna energize her body to, like, light
her way through this smoke screen that Batgirlcreated, and she sees Power Girl, and she's gonna
give her one of those good old-fashionedenergy-powered punches right in her face,
sending her reeling backward. Oh, it's PowerGirl, so yeah, she'll take the punch and then she's

(40:13):
gonna give as good as she got right back towardsCaptain Marvel, so they're just gonna start
trading blows in the sky, I guess. Okay, alright.Speaking of sky, Miss Marvel is gonna stretch,
like, 50 feet tall, and with this embigged hand,she's just gonna backhand Hawk Girl and swat her
out of the sky, sending her crashing into theground. Okay, well, yeah, Hawk Girl probably was

(40:36):
in the sky, but her enhanced senses actuallyalerted her to Miss Marvel's attack, so she's just
gonna loop right around that giant hand and slamMiss Marvel right in the face with her energized
mace that's gonna cause her giant body to fall andcrash into the ground. Alright, Miss Marvel's
nose is probably caved in, but she's elastic,right? So she's gonna topple down to the ground,

(41:02):
she catches her fall by creating a purpleconstruct to cushion it, and while she's, like,
reforming her nose, healing that up, she's gonnathrow up another purple energy construct in the
air, like a wall that Hawk Girl just flies into,like a bird into a window, alright, and it just
cracks her neck, probably one of her wings. Jeez.Hawk Girl falls to the ground, like, splat, and she

(41:23):
is out of this match. What? Dang, okay. Um, I guessshe's out. Meanwhile, Huntress, she fires a bolt
from her crossbow at Mockingbird right throughher foot, and that's gonna pin Mockingbird right
to the ground. No, because Mockingbird knocksthis crossbow bolt out of the air with one of her
battle staves, and then she's gonna screw herclubs together to form one long staff that she's

(41:48):
gonna use to vault herself over to Huntress and,like, leap, snap, kick her right in the back of her
head. Yeah, except Huntress blocksMockingbird's kick with her own bow staff, and the
two face off using their own staffs. It's like twowindmills fighting against each other.
Eventually, though, Huntress is gonna get inclose enough to fire a quick crossbow bolt point

(42:08):
blank into Mockingbird's chest, eliminating herfrom the match. And now Huntress has two staffs
that she can dual-wheel like a badass.Dual-wielding two staffs? Like a badass. But I
would really love to see what those bow staffs cando against someone as durable and strong as Spider
Woman, who glides in and she's gonna blockHuntress' staff attack with just her forearm

(42:32):
before backflip kicking Huntress right in thechin with enough strength to knock her
unconscious, and now Huntress is out of thismatch. So sorry about that fancy dual-wield.
Didn't go anywhere. All right, well, I mean, BlackCanary saw what happened to her friend, so she's
gonna blast Spider Woman with a targeted Canarycry that's gonna obliterate her eardrums and just

(42:55):
disorient her. And then Black Canary's gonna grabSpider Woman with this like Sonia Blade-esque
forward handspring leg grapple, and she's gonnadrive Spider Woman's head right into the ground
right before she chokes Spider Woman out betweenher fishnet clad thighs. Yeah, all right. I think
that is statistically the best way to go out of thismatch, except that Spider Woman doesn't get

(43:19):
choked out because she emits these pheromones,right, that pacify Black Canary into loosening
her grip. And then Spider Woman just venom blastsher, stunning her with enough electricity to take
her out of the match. Okay, well, Power Girl andCaptain Marvel, you know, they're probably still
brawling above the battlefield. And when MissMarvel tries to intervene to help her mentor,

(43:44):
Power Girl freezes her with her super breath andthen dashes right through Miss Marvel,
shattering her into a thousand pieces. She's out.Damn, that's a bold move. Like Captain Marvel,
she's gonna be shocked by that and enraged andshe's gonna straight up super sane Kamehameha
Power Girl's ass with a blast that's gonna knockher down to the ground right into She-Hulk's

(44:06):
fists. Okay, that's some A-Force teamwork rightthere. And Captain Marvel and She-Hulk are gonna
team up and lay a straight up beatdown on PowerGirl, knocking her further and further into a
crater that gets deeper with each hit and PowerGirl eventually just goes limp. She can't take any
more. She's out. No, dang. All right, well, whileCaptain Marvel and She-Hulk are in the hole,

(44:27):
Dove's gonna swoop in and emit her pacifying lightaura, which is gonna cause She-Hulk to transform
back into Jennifer Walters and Captain Marveljust, you know, to calm the fuck down. At which
point, Batgirl's gonna drop down a bat grenadeinto the crater, which detonates right after Dove
flies out of the hole, killing Jennifer. That'sBird's a prey teamwork. Yeah, I don't like that

(44:52):
teamwork. But, uh, Nico, in retaliation for whatBatgirl did, she's gonna yell out, Basubius, with
her staff of one, which is gonna erupt a littlemini-volcano from the ground that's beneath
Batgirl and it's gonna explode Batgirl up into theair and just burn her alive within the fountain of
lava. Wait, so there's like lava around theenvironment now? Oh, just a pool of it where the

(45:15):
mini-volcano was. Okay. All right, well, Vixen,she managed to survive space by summoning the
survival abilities of a tardigrade and so she'sfallen back to Earth after She-Hulk's throw and
she's gonna summon the power of a falcon to quicklydive right toward Nico and then at the last minute,

(45:38):
harness the weight of a whale to land on Nico whojust splatters everywhere. And meanwhile,
Dove's going to blind Spider-Woman with a flash oflight. So now Spider-Woman's blind and deaf, you
know, thanks to Black Canaries attack earlier. SoSpider-Woman, she's gonna stubble into that pool
of lava from the mini-volcano created by Nico andjust burn to death. Uh, Dazzler then is gonna skate

(46:06):
over on her roller skates and we'll say that sheabsorbed the sound of the mini-volcano eruption.
So she's juiced, you know, and she fires a lightbeam that just punches the hole straight through
Dove's torso and now Dove's out. Now actually,Dove has a danger sense. So she's gonna dodge
Dazzler's attack and then quickly like slidetackle her legs to trip Dazzler on her skates. So

(46:31):
Dazzler just topples face first right onto Hawkegirl's mace and knocks herself out. What? Why are
all my guys going out like punk asses? Like, why isDove only getting people to take themselves out?
Well, she's a pacifist. Okay. Well, you know who'snot a pacifist? Captain Marvel and she's had it
with Dove's shit. She's gonna swoop in like a cometsuper fast, lift Dove into the sky with her arms

(46:56):
above her head and then straight up dive power bombDove into the ground. She's dead. No, no, Dove has a
pacifying aura. Yeah, but Captain Marvel alreadyknew that from earlier with She-Hulk. So Captain
Marvel acted quickly, like I said, a comet likeswoop slam. Whatever. Okay. Captain Marvel, you
know, she's gonna look around for the final bird ofprey, which is Vixen. But oh no, looks like she

(47:22):
doesn't see her. That's because Vixen is using thecamouflage powers of a squid to make yourself
basically invisible. And when Captain Marvelisn't looking, that's when Vixen combines the
abilities of a dung beetle, which is reallystrong, like it could lift over 1000 times its
weight and a mantis shrimp, which could strike atthe speed of a bullet to land a killing blow right in

(47:46):
the back of Captain Marvel's head. Boom, matchover. How many animals is Vixen using for this move
here? Three. Mantis shrimp and a dung beetle?Yeah, it's pretty shitty. Literally. Okay.
Captain Marvel feels this little love tap on theback of her head and she's gonna turn around like,
bitch. And then she's gonna fly and uppercut Vixeninto Red Mist. That's how the match ends. Love tap.

(48:13):
Dude, do not underestimate the power of the mantisshrimp. It's called a shrimp for a reason. All
right. It's shrimpy. Right. It's not going to hurtCaptain Marvel proportionately. Yes, the hell it
is. Okay. Well, we'll go ahead and leave the matchthere. Either Vixen mantis shrimp dung beetle
punches Captain Marvel on the back of the head, orCaptain Marvel literally just uppercuts Vixen,

(48:37):
exploding her into oblivion. Let's go ahead andinput the stats for these teams, run the
simulations and find out which scenario happens.Agenenke, hit it. Inputting data, running
calculations, processing results, simulationscomplete. All right. Full disclosure, guys. For
this particular matchup, a lot of the executiveproducers weren't convinced that the Birds of

(49:00):
Prey were going to be powerful enough to go upagainst a force. So at one point, we thought it
might work to have Jessica Cruz on the Birds of Preyteam, which I didn't love because Jessica Cruz has
never been a member of the Birds of Prey. But wethought it would help balance things out. Yeah.
When we ran the stats though, like Green Lanternsare so impressive statistically that not only did

(49:22):
Jessica Cruz end up being the most powerful memberout of either of the teams, but she also raised the
value of the team to the point where it was unfair.Because despite what people may think, Birds of
Prey are quite impressive statistically, atleast when it comes to fighting skill and
intelligence and perception. Yeah, they'repretty well rounded characters, which was

(49:43):
surprising to see. Like you definitely had themost powerful character out of either team in
Captain Marvel. And for the most part, like yourcharacters were way stronger than mine in terms of
strength and damage. Yeah, that's definitelywhat my team excelled at, especially with
characters like Dazzler and Nico Minoru and Ms.Marvel. They were really good in terms of like

(50:03):
range and damage potential and not a whole lotelse. Although because of Ms. Marvel's construct
shielding and Dazzler's energy shielding andNico Minoru's magic shields, A-Force did come out
slightly ahead in evasiveness. I didn't usenearly enough shields in that speculation. But
thankfully my team was faster and moreperceptive. Yeah, in terms of speed, you had Power

(50:28):
Girl and Dove who are like really fucking fast.Also, Hawk Girl was really fast and so was Vixen.
Really the fastest person on my team was CaptainMarvel and everybody else was just okay in terms of
movement speed. When it came to perception, likeyou said, Power Girl has multiple advanced
senses. So does Vixen. Dove has her dangeroussense. And the ladies in A-Force, you know, you

(50:50):
have Spider Woman with her acute hearing andCaptain Marvel with her cosmic awareness. But
everybody else on my team basically just had theireyes and ears. Right. So taking all of this into
account, Joseph, who do you think came out on top?A-Force. Final answer. I think Instagram is
backing me up on this one too. They are. I put thepoll up pretty late, but so far it looks like 62% of

(51:14):
our Instagram followers who voted are siding withA-Force. But let's see if they actually get the
win. NK, the results please. Here you are, sir. Thewinner of the TeamDuel matchup between Birds of
Prey and A-Force is Birds of Prey. Bullshit.Bullshit. Birds of Prey, motherfucker. Run the

(51:39):
stats again. Run them again. We already ranthousands. How is that possible? I am as surprised
as you are. But it looks like based on theseresults, Birds of Prey wins 51.4% of the matches
compared to A-Force who won 48.6. That's reallyclose. I still don't buy it. Not going to lie, I did

(52:04):
not see this coming. My guys are powerful. Yeah,your guys are smarter, but what are they going to
do? Just like outsmart my guys? Well, it looks likethe biggest discrepancy came down to fighting
skill. Like, my guys are way better fighters. Someof the best fighters in DC with characters like
Black Canary. Well, I have Mockingbird on my team.And? She's the best fighter on my team. But why do

(52:29):
you need fighting skill when you have raw energypower? Why do you need raw energy power when you
have raw intelligence? Backroll was by far thesmartest member out of either team. She really
leveled up my team in that regard. And actually,one of Dove's superpowers is that she has enhanced
intelligence. It just makes me think that whilethe final results were close, Birds of Prey were

(52:53):
able to execute teamwork, cheap shot tactics overthe A-Force who isn't quite as cohesive a team,
maybe. Yeah, well, I mean, if I had to choose a teamleader between Batgirl and She-Hulk, it would
definitely be Batgirl. She's much more of astrategic mind. Well, She-Hulk won a little over
half of all of her matches, whereas Batgirl wonjust over a third of her matches. Actually, the

(53:18):
person with the highest win rate was CaptainMarvel, winning a little over 84% of all of her
fights, followed by Powergirl, who won 80%. Whichmakes sense, because like I have She-Hulk on my
team, Captain Marvel, they'll definitely put upmore of a fight than some of my other characters.
You also had the character with the lowest winrate, which was Mockingbird. That's right, she

(53:38):
really dragged down my team, for sure. I thinkmaybe I should have replaced her with someone
else. How am I going to bring a chicken to this fightwith two metal poles going up against essentially
Supergirl? Yeah, the original Supergirl. I don'tknow what to say, man. I eeked this one out, but boy,
am I glad I did. Here's to all the Lady DC fans. Thisone's for you. For Women's History Month, DC is

(54:01):
going down in history as the winners. It's nothistory in March, man. It's called herstory.
Okay? Get it right. That does it for this duel. A.J.and N.K. help close us out. Don't forget to listen

(54:37):
to the other shows in the Dynamite podcastnetwork, including Max Destruction, Senjo
World, and Console Combat. In our next episode, wewill be doing a review. This time of the
direct-to-video DC animated film Batman Ninjavs. Yakuza League. I cannot wait to see it. I've
been looking forward to this for a long time. Ithink it's going to be fun. I hope it sucks, but that

(55:01):
does it for this episode. We want to give a bigthanks to our executive producers, John
Strausky, Zachary Hepburn, Mickey Mata-Gian,Brandon Essigard, Nathaniel Wagner, Levi Aitin,
Austin Wieselowski, A.J. Dunkerly, Nick Abonto,Scott Camacho, Gil Camacho, Adam Spees, Dean
Moleski, Devin Davis, Joseph Kirsting, JoshLeiner, Mike Williams, and Oscar Galvez for

(55:23):
helping make this podcast possible. We'll talk toyou guys next week. Up up and away. True believers.
I love women's.