May 30, 2025 • 44 mins
In this episode of the Supra Human Show, we unpack extreme bodybuilding mistakes, unsustainable nutrition habits, and outdated supplement myths.
Hosts Ben Oliver and Dr. Taylor Waters sit down with elite hybrid coach Paul “Sully” Sullivan to share raw, hilarious, and brutally honest confessions from their early years in bodybuilding. From cutting to absurd lows, abusing supplements, and chasing shredded physiques at any cost, they reveal how their approach evolved into something smarter, more intuitive, and actually sustainable.
Chapters
(00:00) Introduction
(08:00) Mental Challenges and Extreme Contest Prep Stories
(14:50) Misconceptions About Calories Timing and Supplements
(28:30) The Stress and Realities of Making Weight
(31:00) Extreme Contest Prep Habits and Personal Sacrifices
(36:30) Why Bodybuilding Extremes Inform General Fitness Coaching
(37:30) Confessions on Current Training and Nutrition Habits
(42:00) Reflecting on Coaching Early Mistakes and Growth
(43:45) Closing Remarks
To learn more about Supra Human programs: www.suprahuman.com
Follow us on Instagram: www.instagram.com/suprahumanofficial
Interested in joining the team? We are always looking for high performers to join our mission to achieve elite level performance in fitness, nutrition and mindset. View our current career opportunities: www.suprahuman.com/careers
Results may vary depending on your condition, starting weight, and commitment to the program.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Mum, don't watch this, yeah? Bodybuilding is a game of
extremes. Here's how to save five years of
your life spinning your wheels. Because I've done all of this.
Common mistake over reliance on supplements.
It was unnecessarily hard. Yeah, it was the.
Harder you go. The better the results get so.
Training. It was like I genuinely believed
(00:20):
I had to do certain movements ina particular order or it
wouldn't work. Like I ate so much check in over
the several months. The thought of eating check in.
I used to be like, I could feel like I'm going to be sick here.
I'll eat less on purpose to avoid doing my steps.
And so. I'm Ryan Stevens.
Doctor Taylor Waters, I'm Ben Oliver.
(00:40):
Welcome to the Superhuman show, Yeah?
What's up guys? Welcome to the Superhuman Show
with your host Ben Oliver, the Doc Taylor Waters and special
guest Sully Yes, Sullivan Sulley.
I'm back. I'll take Captain for the dog.
(01:00):
And the cat, I'm back. So today, Coach Confessions,
forgive me Father, for. I have sinned by God.
I've sinned a lot. You've screwed me on this topic
for this for this. It was a pivot.
I mean could. Could only Or Sally.
We'll get Sally. On this Yeah, Mum, don't watch
(01:21):
this. Yeah, but no.
So we'll, we'll, we'll keep it. We'll keep it PG, but just, you
know, going through some things that we've done when it comes to
training, nutrition, supplementsand just like the random things,
I, I guess like competing is a good one because it's just such
(01:42):
a bizarre spectacle. But I think you take it for
granted, don't you? Like we're all really
experienced now, but as people think, oh, these guys know what
they talk about. Some people might these guys
know what they're talking about.But we've gone through the
ringer from like we've gone through the whole complete
novice and we, we just spent thetime and gone through and
looking back, there's been loadsof mistakes along.
(02:04):
The way obviously you can, you can read books and you can, you
know, get PhD master's degrees degrees.
But I think the way that we've accumulated the approach that we
use at Superhuman. Now, of course we stay up to
date with latest research and things, but it's we've
accumulated that by making everymistake and then learning how
(02:26):
not to do something. And so it's almost like here's
how to save five years of your life spinning your wheels
because I've done all of this dumb crap and I'm trying to save
you the time, even though most people will still do it anyway
and have to see it for themselves.
But let's we'll do, we'll do nutrition first.
(02:47):
Like just some like I don't wantto say like silly things, but it
it can even be like the bro, howhow bro did you go?
I guess, do you want me to go? Do we go first?
I can take you. This go on.
I had one of my like philosophies when I was sort of
in my like early bodybuilding stint was very much like, it had
(03:10):
to be hard. Like it had to be difficult.
It couldn't be like easy or it couldn't be, it couldn't taste
good. Like it had to be tough.
So like things like, you know, chicken breast, plain rice,
broccoli, like that philosophy was like, I was like really
rigid with that. And I remember like some guy was
(03:30):
like drinking like Diet Coke. And I was like, what are you
drinking there? Like either this guy's trying to
get in shape, but you can't be drinking Diet Coke.
And I remember giving him like this big lecture about how like,
you can't drink this. And looking back, I'm like, you
were so sucked into that lifestyle of like, it's got to
be water. And if it tastes somewhat good,
you know, you're never going to get in shape doing that.
(03:52):
And then I was like, how? In 500 grams of rice, like Oh
yeah, I'm going to bring the catand chip doing this.
You've got to you've got to cut reduced fat and sugar tomato
ketchup 4 weeks out from your show because that's going to be
the difference maker. That 5 cows.
Like as soon as someone was doing something somewhat
enjoyable in their diet, Nah Nahthat's not.
It, I think that was, that was similar to me like the nutrition
(04:16):
thing. It's like it was the whole in
order to get lean, your carbs need to go that low.
And it's like, OK, so I'll just eat fish and green beans.
Yeah, fish and broccoli. This was I, I, I definitely had
the belief for a while, like sugar makes you fat.
Like, because I think it might have even been like precision
nutrition, but they would alwaystalk about like not eating carbs
(04:38):
and fats at the same meal. Yeah.
And it was, it was the old like insulin hypothesis theory where
it's like if you eat fat and carbs at the same time, insulin
spikes and then you store the store the fat when, when really
it was if they had just said, don't eat your carbs and your
fats with the same meal, spread them out so you got bigger
meals. There's no point having like a
real calorie dense meal and thennothing on the on the next one.
(04:59):
It's like, yeah, that's reasonable.
So I was always low carb in, in terms of my diets and, and it
would, it would be to the point that I was so used to low carbs.
If I had like a bowl of like oats or like porridge before
training, I'd have to take a napwithin 30 minutes.
Like I was so sensitive to, to carbs that I would just like get
this big insulin dump and just be like, I need to take a nap.
(05:20):
And so I'd never eat carbs before I trained or always kept
them really, really low. And my protein was like 400
grams from solid food. No, no shakes.
Because like again, I thought shakes, spam shakes is not
really got to get it from home foods.
And so it would be like 6 meals a day, you know, 60 to 70 grams
of protein per meal without fail.
(05:41):
And if I missed the meal, I'd bestressing and like I, I'd be
annoyed and I'd be like, I need to double up on the next meal.
I was like, how much chicken is that?
Me, I am, but I used to buy fromlike Costco or something like
that. It was a 5K box of chicken of
like raw chicken breast and I used to fly through it so fast.
(06:01):
Again, I was like minimum 350 grams of protein a day.
And normally it would shoot because I was like the more
protein I'm having the better. And I remember I ate so much
chicken over the period of like several months.
I remember the thought of eatingchicken.
I used to be like, like, I couldfeel like I'm going to be sick
here like this is. And it's like you've overcooked
chicken so bad that it's like, there's no way that I can do
(06:24):
this. It's, you know, you, you look
back and you go, what was I thinking?
Yeah, yeah. Like it's a classic situation.
It's what you said. It's like, why did I need that
much chicken? Why did I have to eat on, on the
half an hour every two hours? Yeah.
Like so like that's another one for me is like those meal
timings that you like it has. To you were like a Pavlov's dog
(06:47):
like you can salivate in 5 minutes before yeah and if you
missed the meal you go hypo yeah, because you're you're so
you. Condition yourself.
It's like I have to get 178g of chicken in at 11:30 or the
world's going to end. Yeah, it's like, no, you'll be
all right. Yeah, I did the the first the
first show I did my I didn't didn't really weigh my food,
(07:12):
didn't track it, didn't really understand macros.
All all I knew was like, I'm going to cut my carbs, like not
eat any white foods, you know, it was like no rice, no pasta,
no breads. And it was basically like
chicken and veg, you know, for the majority of it.
And then about six weeks out from the show, again, I was the
(07:32):
leanest I'd ever been because I'm not naturally lean.
But then I was also thinking, like, I'm not ready.
Like I'm not. I'm behind.
And I saw a YouTube video of Kevin Laroney and he in fishing
green beans and he's like, yeah,I like it was tilapia, but it's
like we don't really have tilapia in the UK.
Like there's white whitefish andgreen beans like five times a
(07:54):
day. And I said, I'm going to do
that. If I, if he does that, I'm going
to do that. And so I, I ate white like I
would get frozen Pollock, which was like £1.50 for the, for the
UK, for the US guys, $2.00, like$2.00 a frozen pack of it, which
is like 500 grams frozen. I would.
(08:16):
I put it in like boiling water to cook it.
And then I would cook my boiled green beans and I would eat that
four times a day with no seasoning, no salt, because I
thought salt was bad. I don't want to hold water or
anything. And so I was probably eating
about 650 calories a day, maybe 750.
(08:36):
And I did have a six weeks straight and at the time I was
working 12 hour security shifts days and then to like 3 days and
then three nights do my cardio in a car park, just walk around.
But the one thing that I always admired of myself back then was
like, fuck me, you were willing to do what it took.
Because if I had to do that to get in shape now, I'd throw in
the towel. I'll go fuck it.
(08:57):
It's not worth it. But I wanted it so bad because I
would have not eaten for a week like if it meant that I was
going to going to do well. It's almost like that ignorance
and it being. Ignorant.
Right. It was absolutely, because I was
the same. It's like what you've just said.
It's like you almost thought it had to be hard.
It's like, well, if I want to get on that stage, it's got to
be hard. And I was similar to you.
(09:19):
It was like 4 to six weeks of just that.
And if I look back at those calories, 6700 calories across
the day, working full 12 hour shift.
And I had, like, living in an apartment at the time, a storage
unit down in the car park that was probably, like, 6 foot by
three foot. Nothing else fitted in there
apart from the elliptical, Right.
And it was freezing cold in the mornings.
(09:40):
And I would go down before work at, like, 5:00 AM, shut the door
in there and be on that for an hour.
And then you're eating fish and green beans for the rest of the
day. Yeah.
And it was just like, it was unnecessarily hard.
It was so dark. But the harder you go, the
better the results get. So it's just like in your head,
you're like, I'm just gonna. And then, but then The funny
thing was I, I looked like the leanest I'd ever looked.
I. Think you look like a string
(10:01):
bean as. Well, oh, completely wasted
away, couldn't get a pump like again, just like kind of pump
and a fish and bean. But then so my, my dad competed
in natural bodybuilding. And so I was like, you know, a
week out and I was like, what doI do for my like peak?
Because I've, I've read, you know, you carb up, you cut your
water and all these things. And he gave me a plan, which I,
I love you dad, but it was the completely wrong plan.
(10:23):
Bear in mind that I'd had like no carbs.
I did like 3 days drinking dextrose and like eating like
rice every meal and I think I gained like 9 lbs or something
and I was still lean on show a day but I was like I look bad
last week and I literally drinking like 100 gram dextrose
drink I. Used to do that post week.
(10:43):
Yeah, but I was, I was just likelike, but again, I was, I was so
carb deprived. It actually tasted nice because
I had anything sweet in so long.But like to my point when you
were saying about the chicken, Icouldn't eat whitefish or green
beans for about 6 years after that.
Like the thought of green beans.I was like.
I just don't. You can almost feel like in your
throat. You're like.
(11:03):
Yeah, I'm the same with Jack Daniels, but that's a different
compression. It's like that's I can't go near
that. Stuff.
Yeah, yeah, it's because I overcooked that for six.
Weeks, I overcooked that for about 10 years, six weeks.
But what you said there, I thinkthat's another really kind of
common mistake what you said about like dextro, like
supplements, like over reliance on supplements, right?
(11:25):
Like when I first started it waslike I have to have BCA as I
have to have CLAI have to have all.
Of the Yeah. God, I remember I have to have
all of these different supplements, and if I didn't
have that in during the workout,if I didn't have that 10 minutes
after the workout, if I didn't sleep, like it's just over
reliance on stuff that I was eating.
Whole Foods, I was good. Yeah.
(11:47):
And the, some of these, there's going to be crossover because
we've all come from a bodybuilding background.
So like there's going to be crossover and the the bulk in
one. So it was like, you've got to
eat big to get big. Like if you want to get big,
you've got to eat big. I used to put away some food, my
Lord. You still do.
Yeah, me, I used to have this thing in the morning that I used
(12:08):
to call the pie and it was it was gross.
It was like I basically get a blender and I would put whole
eggs, like 2 scoops of whey, 2 bananas, peanut butter, like 100
grams of oats, blast the thing up with whole milk and just
blend it. It was 3 shakers A litre and a
(12:31):
half. And I would it was it was rank.
It used to taste. Oh well.
And I'd chin all three. I did the exact same thing but
without the whey and I would adddouble cream to it for the for
the extra calories. I mean, if you put it in the
oven, it would have been a pie. It would have cooked and gone I.
Would have. I would, yeah.
I literally did 2 shakes a day and it would be like 200 grams
of oats, like a pint of a pint, a pint of whole milk, 2 bananas,
(12:55):
six whole eggs and like 2 massive tablespoons of peanut
butter twice a day. I would train and then I'd go to
Mackey's and have 6 double cheeseburgers, 6 or some.
Cheese. We were calling you Double
Cheese. Yeah, the.
Funny thing is there is like my digestion was fine like and I
like I could eat those 6 double cheeseburgers and feel fine.
(13:17):
I could. I could like go.
Train, you didn't look fine. Go on like but then.
You're like a pregnant snake. Oh, health was great.
Even even now, like if I if I ate like McDonald's on 2 days in
a row, I know I've eaten McDonald's.
I can, I feel, I feel feel it. My body and my pants are
saturated so like. I'm walking around in a day but.
We can also. Smell it.
(13:39):
But like I I just. I genuinely didn't care about
like all all I thought was like,eat, eat more food.
Yeah, like all you have to. Do as long as it was clean.
Yeah, it was clean. You're good.
Well, no, I didn't give a shit about that.
I was just like, no, I would just, I would, I would eat
anything. It's really common because
again, it's like, it's almost that comparison to pros or
comparison to people that you see online.
(14:00):
It's like I'm smashing 6000 calories a day.
Yeah. Like but if I eat 6000 I'd be
like him. Yeah, it's completely irrelevant
to you and your individual, likelifestyle, like what you
consume, what you actually need.Like people think they need, you
know, in every aspect to do way more than what they need to do.
It's like you don't need to be in that much of A surplus to be
gaining good quality muscle tissue and staying lean.
(14:22):
I remember they just. Pick an arbitrary #5000 Cal a
day. It's like, where's that come
from? When when when I was at
university, it's when like T nation was really popular on
online and they were trying to sell their this.
So this was when like casein hydrolysate had just come out
and like, I think the, the brandwas like Peptopro, which is like
(14:45):
basically like essential amino acids, but a complete protein
that, you know, mixes like waterreally, really fast absorbed
because they were trying to selltheir product.
And he came up with like the pulse feast diet, which was you
had two shakes during the day ofPepto pro and then you eat
whatever you want a night and it's like you're trying to lose
weight. Then it's like your meal is
(15:05):
like, you know, vegetables and protein 1st and then dessert.
And if you're trying to gain, you eat whatever you want.
And, and I did it for like 8 weeks at university, lost like
30 lbs like work great. And in my head I was like, it's
because I'm doing these protein pulses and I'm eating when it's
like, you know, anabolic at night and all of this stuff.
And, and really it was just, I was eating 1500 calories a day
(15:26):
and I just got used to it. But one, I wasn't putting salt
or electrolytes in my drinks. So I was getting really cold and
fatigued during the day. But the funny, The funny thing
is in the UK we have what's called double concentrate
squash, which is like, it's likethe equivalent of like Myo
flavoring for water, like you, like, you guys have it over
(15:48):
here. It's like a syrup, like a like a
grenadine layup here, isn't it? Yeah, kind of like.
That and so I would have to mix the the peptopro with that
because it was so bitter. You need to put double
concentrate with it just to get rid of the taste.
And so I would make and I would use a double concentrate bottle
like a used one for my drinks totake to university because it
(16:10):
was the amount of water that I needed.
And and then I got to universityand I was drinking with them and
I was like, so it's a bit bit sharp that one.
I was like, I'm sorry. I added a bit of water to it and
I was like sipping it. I was like, oh, stupid, like
quite really can't taste the bitterness.
This one, I was like, oh, drank it and then, you know, 30
minutes I was like and I was like, oh, fuck.
And then anyway, like to proceeded to just the world fell
(16:32):
out of my ass like you know, forhours afterwards.
And then I get home and then I go to make my next one and I'm
looking at the double concentrate bottle and I was
like, that's a bit pale. And I had realized I had drank a
litre and a half of double concentrate squash.
That's so right. So like if you if you can
imagine filling up a litre and ahalf of myoflea like flavouring
(16:55):
and just drinking it and just chinning it, that's evidence to
show that. Sweeteners aren't going to kill
you. Yeah, because if you drink it, I
would, I would, I would have been one of the rats of the
aspartame for the boys studies. But it was, it was horrendous.
That that concept of like thoughthe late night you turn when car
back loading came round. That was John Keefer, Yeah.
(17:18):
So just vanished by the way. Yeah, completely disappeared.
You would go basically protein and fats during the day.
There were other like more specific concepts like you know
you would train at a certain time.
MCT or caffeine and yeah. But in general it's protein and
fats in the day, in the evening.Then you do a big carb load and
again it was similar. Like if trying to bulk you can
(17:38):
eat pretty bracey whatever as many carbs.
Cherry turnovers was his his thing.
Yeah, and my mate was following.This isn't my my confession, but
I'm going to confess for him. I remember he would like he was
falling to a tea. He was having like the
bulletproof coffees. You have coffee with the coconut
oil and all the day. And then he'd get and even just
like blast the box of like Krispy Kremes, just smash them.
(18:01):
And then like one day we were like, oh, we're going to get a
Curry. And he was like, oh, I really
want a Curry. But he because on days you don't
train, you don't you don't back load.
Yeah, yeah. And he was like, oh fuck, I'm
dying for a Curry. He went God damn, did three sets
of press up. So yeah, I'll have a Curry go
and I was like, mate, that cheatin the system justify three sets
(18:21):
of press and a lamb buna with a naan bread.
I think mates, no way, you ain'thaving that.
I, I did that for a while as well, but it but it was, it's
funny because then and I, I genuinely thought that that was
legit like because, because he, he put like 400 studies at the
end of his. Either science it was.
Very bad and and when you actually look at it, all of
those studies are completely irrelevant to what he was
(18:42):
talking about. But then Alex Fiada, the the OG
hybrid Alex, who will never listen to this podcast, but he
debunked it. And he was like, you're
basically describing every sorority girl's diet at
university, drink coffee all day, eat pizza at night.
(19:02):
Like that's how they stayed thin.
And and I was like, huh. And then he's like this calories
in, calories out, like you're just choosing to eat your carbs
at night. And I was like, yeah, that does
make sense. Yeah.
And then so, but I, I think fromlike a practical standpoint,
it's quite good. Like if you want to manage your
intake and have a bigger meal atnight, like cool.
But it was, it was the belief that you had.
It's like, if I have carbs for breakfast, I'm going to get fat.
(19:25):
Yeah. And I genuinely believed in,
it's like it would ruin my day if I have carbs before my last
meal. Like it was like the, and it's
like you, I would take that to my grave.
Like I genuinely believe that somuch.
But I, I think like the, the good thing about all of us is
that we've been like willing to be educated and like I've always
(19:46):
been open to changing my opinionon something if there's evidence
there or I try it and it works or whatever.
Otherwise I'd still be, you know, drinking Coke, coconut,
Bulletproof coffee and Pepto Proand double concentrate.
But like, yeah, I mean, I think most of the.
The diet ones have just been like extremes because that's
(20:07):
just how you thought that it hadto be.
But. Again, bodybuilding is a game of
extremes. So it's like there's always, but
it's a game of extremes and no offense, stupid people.
So there's stupid people doing extreme things, but then because
they're good at it, you listen to them and you're like, oh,
well, maybe that's what I need to do.
And then you realize then this is.
I think that was one of the first things on a training side
(20:29):
of things. When you go like confessions, it
is again is more is better. It was like the longer I spend
in the gym, the more progress I'm going to make.
That was like, and, and now it'sjust like get your minimal
effective dose, get in and get out and do you like, do you work
as quick as you can? I've had tendonitis in so many
tendons like my shoulders, my myelbows, my knees everywhere,
(20:53):
just like because I've just my volume was so high because
again, it was the harder I trainand I make the the train harder,
say, Oh well, I'll just go to failure on every set and I'll do
like 40 sets and I'll just keep going and going.
I. Think like my it's not even like
a confession, but again, it's like most of my things have just
been silly beliefs. Yeah, well, like the actual
(21:14):
execution. It's like I wasn't doing
something completely bizarre, but it was just like the you
drunk. 1 1/2 liters of double concentrated squad.
I wasn't doing anything bizarre.Accidents happen, but training,
it was like, I genuinely believed I had to do certain
movements in a particular order or it like or it wouldn't work
(21:35):
like kind of thing. And it was like you had to do
push downs and skull crushes andsingle arm reverse tricep
extensions and you had to do bench and then incline and then
decline and then you fly and then you cable.
And it was like a set thing like, and if, oh, heaven forbid,
I miss my incline and my upper chest isn't going to grow.
And I would, I would like sit inthe gym for like 40 minutes
(21:57):
waiting for a piece of equipment.
It's like, well, I can't do my Flyers because I've got incline
next. And I would like be like real
OCD over it. Like, and it, it took quite a
while to break that. And I think, and it was probably
from accident of like, oh, like I haven't been able to do this
because I've injured myself and nothing's changed.
Maybe I don't need to do it. But.
And like like now it's like I'm pretty flexible with my
(22:18):
training. Like even if I feel off on a
certain day or I do one set and I'm like, that feels like shit
today I'm going to do something else.
But like I had 0 auto regulationor like intuitiveness like even
like when I was doing the fishing green beans and I
couldn't even get a pump in the gym.
It's like 20 sets of chest today.
So I mean, there's nothing there.
Like it's like you're, you're barely.
(22:38):
Benching the bar you're doing. 20 sets of chest and living off
green beans and one whitefish. There's not a pump.
There's nothing. There's nothing you can get.
Yeah, I think we're we're all onthe same page in terms of like
we've had us all off off camera discussions in terms of like
cringy things. We were chatting up on this, on
this travel thing. Oh God.
(22:58):
So I guess you could start with this.
So cringy things that like looking back like Oh no, like
what was I doing? Got to go back to the, the the
bodybuilding days because I think that's when you just most
blinkered and just like head in the sand.
It's just that's all I think about.
It's all I do. It's all I'm focused.
(23:19):
On you forget that it's a very. It's so niche.
Sport. Like we even as of late it's
become way more popular with Instagram, you just go back like
8 years and it was a lot even more niche there as well.
Like I, I remember like travelling up to London for a
show or travelling somewhere andit's like you're stopping in the
service station like we did the other day and you're going in
(23:39):
the bathroom, dropping your pants, pulling up your top and
taking a picture, going along. I'm going to check my condition.
You've left the house 45 minutesago.
You've got no bladder control because you're doing 8 years of
water. You've not changed in that 45
minutes. But it's like, I must check
you're in the I've got so many selfies or like pictures.
On the front, like Milton Keynes, with your pants on your
(24:00):
ankles, posing in the toilets. What are you doing?
It is walking through with fake tan all over you.
Yeah, like it's completely normal.
And then and then you're like, why is everyone staring at me?
Yeah, it's like, because you like an Oompa Loompa the first.
So. When I applied for my PHDI had
to do an interview with the professors at the UNI and the
interview was like on a Wednesday.
I competed on the SAT or the Sunday so and like I I wasn't
(24:24):
one of these to scrub my tan off.
I would just leave it fall off over time.
That's because you don't show. So I literally walked into the
interview like with patches of tan, like a cow.
I've gone in like that with patches and just walked in, sat
down. So this big like that, all
right. And they're like, this cow wants
(24:44):
to do a PhD, Like what's going on here?
And you've probably put some cows on between the show and the
and. The.
Little moon faces walked in. My my supervisor told me about a
year later, she was like, I thought you had that skin
condition where what's it calledwhen you?
Got pigments? Yeah, your pigment is all off.
And I was like, oh, no, that wasjust like parts of tan had
(25:05):
peeled off me and I'd walked into an interview.
Now I was like, this is your, this is your life we're going
for here. And I just walked in like, yeah,
whatever. Like they don't care.
It's so. I had a, when I was doing my
undergrad in sports biomedicine,I, I competed twice and I, and
after the second show I binged and I and it was, it was like on
(25:25):
a Saturday and I had lectures onlike the Monday or the Tuesday
and I'd already gained about 15 lbs, but it was like all water.
And I went in and my like, like my face was like, I look Asian
like. And I and I sat down and
everyone was just like, what thefuck?
Because literally on the Friday,it was like, like, you know,
sucked in. And they're like, then what have
(25:46):
you done? Like you had an allergic
reaction to something. I was like, no, I've just eaten
16 cheesecakes. Like his face is full of bee
sting it. Was like, but it oh, it felt so
uncomfortable. But I, I mean, I used to have I
had one. I can't remember what show this
was and I was go. It was one of the shows where
(26:07):
you get tanned at the venue because normally I'd do Dream
Town or something else, put on layers and stuff.
And so you would obviously like shave and everything prior.
And I must have had like such bad diet fatigue that I had like
shaved and I completely forgot to shave my pubes.
And then I literally got in my car to go to the show and I was
(26:28):
like, hang on a minute. And I was like, if I put on
these pants, it's like, you're going to look like Borat.
Like, and I, I literally, I literally had to rush back home
and be like, right. Have I actually like prepped for
this show? Oh, but then I was thinking and
I was literally having nightmares like for this show
after that of like rocking up, having not shaved and wearing my
(26:49):
socks on stage. And I would have nightmares over
it. And I'd like check and be like,
I've got socks on. There's ah, it's horrendous.
We'd say about posing, I remember like when you are
bodybuilding, you think posing is like normal.
You think that like everyone does pose in practice.
And I remember going in in the gym, we used to train that this
(27:10):
is in Excise Filesis was in the in the room upstairs.
So I walked into like basically it's like a, it's like a room
that they've. Got Exercise Studio, isn't it?
Yeah. It's studio, so there's big
mirrors. The lighting's good.
I'll just go up there and pose and you walk in there and there
was like a woman in there, you know, like in her 40s.
I'm just like, you mind if I do some pose in practice?
And she's obviously like, yeah, whatever.
(27:31):
Like, what the hell is that? Just said, yeah, so go in like,
pants right around the ankles, like, not the top off.
She's probably like, oh, my, what the hell is going on here?
And she left not long after. Oh, there next to the manager
comes up and he's like, oh, we've got a complaint about you.
And I'm like, what? And I'm standing there in my
pants and he, I'm like, what? I'm like a woman came downstairs
(27:52):
and said, you walked in and justpulled out your ass.
And I was like, no, like I'm posing like, like, see.
And I was like, oh, man. And in my head I was like, what
an idiot that woman is. Like, what do you mean?
Just show it in my ass? But like in, in hindsight,
looking back, like a bloke's come in and said, like, do you
mind if I do pose in practice? She's gone like, yeah, not
(28:13):
really knowing. And I've whipped my kit off,
like pulled my pants up my butt because I'm trying to get like,
shredded glutes. And I'm like flats in it.
Like so like in hindsight I'm like, yeah, you are an absolute
moron of a bloke. But in hindsight, we changed
gyms quite quickly after that. That's why we changed.
Swiftly. Left, you've got banned.
(28:35):
That's right. I love it.
Yeah. Did you, did you have any?
Because I remember 1 like 1 showI had to make weight because I
was in, I was in the middle weights and that was like I was
like spitting into a cup And I because I was already
dehydrated. I already had my tan on so I
couldn't sweat. Otherwise I would have just like
worn a bin bag or something. Fine.
But I couldn't spitting into a cup had like no more water to
(28:58):
pass. Literally had to Ryan had to
hold a towel around me whilst I weighed because I was like even
my shorts of like, did you have pee with the latest?
Yeah, I literally made, I made weight by 100 grams, like, and
so it was like even my shorts for like, like even even your
posing trunks weighed that. It was like after that whole
ordeal, I didn't even want to step on stage.
(29:19):
I was like, I, I feel for fighters that have to make
weight because that was so horrendous.
And then I, I was like, I just want to go home now and, and
drink like drink water. You you are to stand there doing
5 minutes opposing. They've got to go 12 rounds or
something in the. Face literally like horrendous.
I used to make weight for for classic.
That was a stress. That was because it's that like
if I'm because my clap was like 82 kegs or whatever, it's like
(29:42):
if I miss weight by a kilo and I'm 83 kegs, you're in there.
I'm now in the under 90s open bodybuilding class where I'm
going to look like a small child.
So I'm like it. It was, it was such a, a panic
every now, even though like I was on weight like 3 weeks out,
it would still just weigh on you.
Like, but what if I miss? What if I miss because you don't
(30:03):
want to go down too low? Otherwise you're, you're looking
small. So you want to be close to
weight. But then it's like, but what if
their scales are a bit differentto mine and I end up going over
and oh God, yeah, the stress that I used to cause was a
shambles. I tell you, one of this is again
and it all ties to bodybuilding.I remember I used to because
(30:25):
you're drinking so much water constantly, you always go into
the bathroom and my toilet was downstairs so it would disrupt
my sleep all the time because I've got to get up at night to
go to the. Bathroom.
I know where this is. Going this is TAZ, I shouldn't
be saying this on camera, but I'm going to anyway.
So basically, what if I can actually show you?
I used to do this. I used to lie in bed like this.
(30:46):
Oh no. And I used to have, I used to
have a bottle here like this. So I'd sleep like this.
And then when I need to go to the toilet, I used to go on to
my side like this. We because if I got up because,
because, because if I got up, I would obviously break my sleep.
So I'm trying to stay like semi sleeping.
(31:09):
I've got the bottle here and I'mweaning into the bottle like
this. And then I would go put it back
down. I would go back to sleep.
I just basically filled this bigbottle up overnight and walked
downstairs in the morning. One of the.
(31:29):
Worst things I've ever. I was really single at the time.
Really single. How bad is that?
Yeah, I shouldn't have told anyone that.
I don't know. I have.
The last The last episode. I tell my clients to do that
when they're like mate, I can't think this is what I'm like.
Take a bottle to bed with you mate.
Just pissing it bro. Roll into the recovery position
(31:51):
you. Don't even have to get up mate
you. Sully you because you.
I can't top that. Yeah, I think that one, that one
caps it off because I think you've done more shows than
Yeah, the Me and the Me and Taylor.
Yeah, I think I've done about. What's the what's the most kind
of like bizarre thing you've tried to like improve your look
(32:18):
or so because I know because some guys would be like drink
white wine or vodka before you pump up.
And there used to be loads of like there was old wives tale
was like steak and red wine before or like, you know,
dehydrate and have you done anything which you're kind of
like you look back and you're like like who come up with that
to? Or definitely I I've done the
(32:41):
steak and red wine the night before, I've done the the shot
of vodka or two before going outon stage.
That's a. Bizarre one.
Just before going out, we need to start it's. 10 minutes before
you go out on. Stage I've, I've seen a bloke do
that and he almost, he, he almost threw up on stage man.
His tan was sweating off his face into his mouth.
(33:04):
And so when he was posed and he was like, just like splitting
out this like fake tan. And I was like, he's had a
stink. I was I.
Was genuinely sat in the crowd and I literally pointed out I
said he's had a howler for this one.
And it was just like he just hadstreaks coming down him and I
(33:25):
was just like, I don't know whatyou've done, but it's not right.
I've seen a guy, I've seen a guybackstage and this was because I
was helping out one of my friends who was like enhanced
body, but 1A natural bodybuilder.
There's a guy backstage and as he was pumping up, he had one of
his friends feeding him doughnuts and the other one
(33:47):
pinning him with insulin just like in like what a tea about
about 3 different shots of insulin.
He had about four Krispy Kremes.I'll tell you what, you look
fucking class. Anyone and I.
Was like, I was like, who taughtyou that?
What a trick. Yeah.
I I wasn't that invested. I mean, for me, because like, I
(34:07):
mean, back then I was like a natural bodybuilder and I had
like a massive like, because youknow, the way my dad kind of
brought me, I was kind of like that we're just cheating.
And and so when I saw that, I was like, this is another level.
You know, all I see backstage ispeople eating rice cakes and
it's like this guy's eating Donuts and injections, like
(34:27):
ridiculous. But you see some crazy shit.
Yeah. Yeah, it's it's a bizarre world.
It's a very, very bizarre world.Like I just, it's just one of
those things that you kind of like when you you step away from
it and you look back. I remember it's just one funny
story. We competed, I think it was one
of the first shows we did. And I'm standing there and
you're in your trunks and I'm posing and all I hear from like
(34:49):
the audience because you can't see because all the lights are
on you and you went cracking physique 116.
I'm just like, that's just a grown bloke shouting at me from
a crowd, like just admiring my body.
And it's just like you go away going.
That's weird. Like, yeah, I don't know.
It's just, it's a strange. World.
The chance you hear from the crowd, there was a guy like when
guys do a back shot and then they haven't tensed their glutes
(35:12):
and you've got like like 50. 8 glutes, yeah.
Glutes. It's like shouting like your
ass. Tense your ass.
Tense your ass. Yeah, I think like, but I, I
think the, the reason why we always kind of go back to body
when is because it's such an extreme.
That's where the, it's like obviously the, the, the clients
that we work with the gem pop and, you know, they might be
(35:33):
looking to get like subtemps andbody fat or they're doing a
photo shoot or something like bodybuilding is like the extreme
of that. And so you're always going to
look at like the extremes and almost take like a regression of
that. And it's like, well, if they're
doing it at the extreme, then there's probably something that
works for like the guys that wonlike the next level down.
(35:54):
Like if Olympic weight lifters or like Sprint cyclists, like
even at the amateur level, they've got big legs.
And so like there's probably something to do in lots of
cycling, you're going to probably get bigger legs.
And you always like, because bodybuilding, it's like, well,
they've got the most muscle and the lowest levels of body fat.
All of our clients are looking for more muscle and lower levels
of body fat. So you just kind of like regress
(36:14):
it. Like we don't want to go that
extreme, but there's probably something.
But then we've been to that, youknow, we're not £300 mass
monsters, but we've like had a taste of that environment.
And pushed it as far as we can go for us.
Yeah, but then when you look at it, you're just like, it is
weird. Oh really?
Let's flip this from past confessions to confessions now
(36:36):
that you do in your own trainingor nutrition.
What's something that you've gotnow?
I'll go, I'll go and I'll go You.
Go and give me a prompt. I don't train hard.
Yeah, OK. I don't.
I don't train like I used to train like I'll do 2 to 3 weight
(36:56):
sessions a week but I won't be going anywhere near failure.
My RP probably is like A6 or A7.It's like I'll do the minimum I
can to maintain current physique.
Yeah, without pushing it like too hard.
Yeah, I will. I'll I'll eat less on purpose to
avoid doing my steps. And so.
(37:19):
I'll like, so I'll like in my head, I'm like, well, you're
probably getting about 4050 calories per 1000 steps and I'll
be like, I'm at 5000. Then it's 8:00 PM and I'm like
250 calories just to fucking eatthe like just cut back on my
last meal down to the steps then.
And it's like, obviously you getloads of other benefits of doing
the steps, but I'm just like, inmy head, I'm just doing the
math. And I mean, that's, that's
(37:40):
probably one of them. I under eat protein quite often.
It probably all balances out when I'm eating enough, but I
used to eat 250 with ease and I'll have some days now where I
might scrape 100 and then, but then I might have a day where I
have a steak or something I'm atlike 300 or something.
So it kind of bounce out. But I don't pay attention to it
(38:02):
unless I'm like actively prepping for something in my
head. It's like I'm going to assume
that my habits and behaviours are enough now to not be
deficient in protein, but I'm not aiming for like 1g per pound
of body weight. Like I just I don't need it like
at this at this point. But that's what it's also having
that knowledge that like, if youare going to die, it's like I'll
(38:25):
put it up mainly for the benefitof keeping me satiated and
keeping me. Full and I'll put it you.
Know when, when to. Use it, when to use it and when
to use that tool to put it back in, Yeah.
I've got I don't mind. I've got a really poor ability
to stop when I'm full and I'll just go, I'm like a lab.
I'll just go past like like lastnight we went, we went for pizza
last night. This is a confession for you
(38:46):
now. And and I was like 9 full after
two slices, but I want 8 slices.Wait.
And every slice was you don't need another one.
But there's that difference between need and want.
Yeah, yeah. But you want another one.
And I'm like, yeah, keep going. And then I'm like, I'm in a coma
again. And I'm like, yeah, it's so for
(39:07):
me, like I that's why if you go to my house, I almost buy just
enough food to survive the week.Because if I, if I stocked up
for an apocalypse, I would be like 300 lbs in a week because
I'm like, oh, well then I blasted the whole, I blasted
everything I got. But it's.
It's a really good thing that you brought up because I think a
(39:29):
lot of clients will assume we'reperfect, that you're just like,
you don't have cravings for bad food.
Like we were talking like when we had pizza, like Codoni was
talking about with one of his clients where it's like, oh man,
I just got cravings. And so it's like what you and
think you think I don't like, like we all, we all have
cravings. Like we all want to not train
sometimes and not do cardio and,you know, skip legs and like eat
(39:51):
the Donuts. But like, the difference is we
for the majority of the time don't act on those impulses.
But it, it's like a, it's completely silly to think that
coaches don't have those same, like, I mean, everyone, everyone
does. And, and so it's like we're,
we're never, we're not perfect all the time.
(40:13):
It's just the but the the other major difference that I would
say is like if I choose to eat Popeyes one night and not and go
over my calories. At no point do I go, I'm really
annoyed that I'm not losing weight because you fucking ain't
Popeyes. Like, you know, like I'm
perfectly OK with not making progress.
(40:34):
If all of my decisions on like going to put me in that
position, I can take ownership and accountability and go, yeah,
I've been fucking off my diet. Like, of course I'm not going to
like be making progress. And then if I want to do it, I
can. It's just at the moment I
clearly don't want to and I'm cool with that.
And then if I, if my weight goesup and I'm like, yeah, I don't
want to be here, then I turn it on, bring it back down.
(40:56):
And then, but it's it's, you've got full control.
That's that, that's that. Years of experience though, of
going through those mistakes, those trials, those errors,
knowing your body, knowing what you essentially can get away
with or your your your sort of parameters for where you want to
sit. You, you what, you waive your
right to be frustrated when it'slike, yeah, you know, if, if,
if, like, if Taylor, like if youwere like, I'm just really
(41:18):
annoyed, like my, my front squat's not going up and I'd be
like, you're fucking on the bikelike 10 hours a week.
What do you expect? But like you're intelligent
enough to go, but I'm not going to be at peak leg strength
because I'm doing 10 hours on the bike.
And if I, if I'm, if I get to a point that I'm so unhappy with
my leg strength, I'll cut back on the bike and I'll improve my
leg strength. But it's, it's like, you know,
(41:39):
you have guys that'd be like, well, I want to be an elite
level powerlifter, but I want to, I want to be shredded, you
know, and I want to do this at the same time, I don't want to
gain some muscle. And it's like, bro, like you
pick, pick one and be OK with it.
You've got to be and if and and don't get frustrated when you're
chasing one of them and the other things aren't happening.
It's like, like what you hoping to happen?
Yeah, yeah, no, they're, they'regood confessions.
(42:00):
I'm sure they'll be more in the future.
Yeah. But I, I, I sorry, I think we'll
do a we'll do a future episode on coach confessions or like
coaching confessions. What have you said to clients
where maybe you were like first starting out as a personal
trainer? That was just dog shit advice.
And you look back and you're like, why did I, why did I
recommend that person do that? Because I'm sure there'll be
(42:20):
some absolute caucus there. Because when you first start
your job, you're not good. At it.
You don't know anything, No, butif you still have the same
practices and beliefs that you did 10 years ago, you are no
better. Like if you don't, I could.
Give you an answer to that is essentially like A1 size fits
all yeah, it's like every bloke that came through the door, it's
like he's going to get that training plan, he's going to get
(42:41):
that and I'm going to put him onabout those calories where it's
like you realise oh, there's differences in they.
Should all be on push pull eggs?They should all have high
proteins. They should all be in five times
a day. They should.
All because that's what I believe in at the moment.
That's what worked for me. That's what's going to work for
them. Like that's the, I think that is
one of the biggest things when you starting off coaching.
Yeah, yeah. But but yeah, like if you, if
(43:03):
you can't look back and like, you know, 10/10/15 years ago and
we kind of got into this and you're like, why on earth was I
doing that even Like if I look back at my first loom check
insurance, I'm like, like this is beyond bad.
Like, you know, even with, you know, maybe like new coaches
that we're training up or something and they got I'm like,
yeah, pretty good. We can just change a couple of
(43:25):
these things. I was miles off and it's just
like the worst thing I've ever seen.
But then I can look back and go,well, I've improved.
Whereas if I look back and go, yeah, pretty much the same as
what I do now, it's like what's going on?
So yeah, that would be a good episode to to cover for sure.
But thank you guys. Please forgive us for our for
(43:46):
our cinage. And whilst you're doing that, be
sure to like and subscribe on iTunes, Spotify and YouTube and
we'll see you next time. If you love this show, please
like, share and leave us a five star review so that we can help
(44:06):
more people. I'm John Matson, Superhuman CEO,
reminding you to always go get what's yours.
Mum, don't watch this, yeah? Bodybuilding is a game of
extremes. Here's how to save five years of
your life spinning your wheels. Because I've done all of this.
Common mistake over reliance on supplements.
It was unnecessarily hard. Yeah, it was the.
Harder you go. The better the results get so.
Training. It was like I genuinely believed
(00:20):
I had to do certain movements ina particular order or it
wouldn't work. Like I ate so much check in over
the several months. The thought of eating check in.
I used to be like, I could feel like I'm going to be sick here.
I'll eat less on purpose to avoid doing my steps.
And so. I'm Ryan Stevens.
Doctor Taylor Waters, I'm Ben Oliver.
(00:40):
Welcome to the Superhuman show, Yeah?
What's up guys? Welcome to the Superhuman Show
with your host Ben Oliver, the Doc Taylor Waters and special
guest Sully Yes, Sullivan Sulley.
I'm back. I'll take Captain for the dog.
(01:00):
And the cat, I'm back. So today, Coach Confessions,
forgive me Father, for. I have sinned by God.
I've sinned a lot. You've screwed me on this topic
for this for this. It was a pivot.
I mean could. Could only Or Sally.
We'll get Sally. On this Yeah, Mum, don't watch
(01:21):
this. Yeah, but no.
So we'll, we'll, we'll keep it. We'll keep it PG, but just, you
know, going through some things that we've done when it comes to
training, nutrition, supplementsand just like the random things,
I, I guess like competing is a good one because it's just such
(01:42):
a bizarre spectacle. But I think you take it for
granted, don't you? Like we're all really
experienced now, but as people think, oh, these guys know what
they talk about. Some people might these guys
know what they're talking about.But we've gone through the
ringer from like we've gone through the whole complete
novice and we, we just spent thetime and gone through and
looking back, there's been loadsof mistakes along.
(02:04):
The way obviously you can, you can read books and you can, you
know, get PhD master's degrees degrees.
But I think the way that we've accumulated the approach that we
use at Superhuman. Now, of course we stay up to
date with latest research and things, but it's we've
accumulated that by making everymistake and then learning how
(02:26):
not to do something. And so it's almost like here's
how to save five years of your life spinning your wheels
because I've done all of this dumb crap and I'm trying to save
you the time, even though most people will still do it anyway
and have to see it for themselves.
But let's we'll do, we'll do nutrition first.
(02:47):
Like just some like I don't wantto say like silly things, but it
it can even be like the bro, howhow bro did you go?
I guess, do you want me to go? Do we go first?
I can take you. This go on.
I had one of my like philosophies when I was sort of
in my like early bodybuilding stint was very much like, it had
(03:10):
to be hard. Like it had to be difficult.
It couldn't be like easy or it couldn't be, it couldn't taste
good. Like it had to be tough.
So like things like, you know, chicken breast, plain rice,
broccoli, like that philosophy was like, I was like really
rigid with that. And I remember like some guy was
(03:30):
like drinking like Diet Coke. And I was like, what are you
drinking there? Like either this guy's trying to
get in shape, but you can't be drinking Diet Coke.
And I remember giving him like this big lecture about how like,
you can't drink this. And looking back, I'm like, you
were so sucked into that lifestyle of like, it's got to
be water. And if it tastes somewhat good,
you know, you're never going to get in shape doing that.
(03:52):
And then I was like, how? In 500 grams of rice, like Oh
yeah, I'm going to bring the catand chip doing this.
You've got to you've got to cut reduced fat and sugar tomato
ketchup 4 weeks out from your show because that's going to be
the difference maker. That 5 cows.
Like as soon as someone was doing something somewhat
enjoyable in their diet, Nah Nahthat's not.
It, I think that was, that was similar to me like the nutrition
(04:16):
thing. It's like it was the whole in
order to get lean, your carbs need to go that low.
And it's like, OK, so I'll just eat fish and green beans.
Yeah, fish and broccoli. This was I, I, I definitely had
the belief for a while, like sugar makes you fat.
Like, because I think it might have even been like precision
nutrition, but they would alwaystalk about like not eating carbs
(04:38):
and fats at the same meal. Yeah.
And it was, it was the old like insulin hypothesis theory where
it's like if you eat fat and carbs at the same time, insulin
spikes and then you store the store the fat when, when really
it was if they had just said, don't eat your carbs and your
fats with the same meal, spread them out so you got bigger
meals. There's no point having like a
real calorie dense meal and thennothing on the on the next one.
(04:59):
It's like, yeah, that's reasonable.
So I was always low carb in, in terms of my diets and, and it
would, it would be to the point that I was so used to low carbs.
If I had like a bowl of like oats or like porridge before
training, I'd have to take a napwithin 30 minutes.
Like I was so sensitive to, to carbs that I would just like get
this big insulin dump and just be like, I need to take a nap.
(05:20):
And so I'd never eat carbs before I trained or always kept
them really, really low. And my protein was like 400
grams from solid food. No, no shakes.
Because like again, I thought shakes, spam shakes is not
really got to get it from home foods.
And so it would be like 6 meals a day, you know, 60 to 70 grams
of protein per meal without fail.
(05:41):
And if I missed the meal, I'd bestressing and like I, I'd be
annoyed and I'd be like, I need to double up on the next meal.
I was like, how much chicken is that?
Me, I am, but I used to buy fromlike Costco or something like
that. It was a 5K box of chicken of
like raw chicken breast and I used to fly through it so fast.
(06:01):
Again, I was like minimum 350 grams of protein a day.
And normally it would shoot because I was like the more
protein I'm having the better. And I remember I ate so much
chicken over the period of like several months.
I remember the thought of eatingchicken.
I used to be like, like, I couldfeel like I'm going to be sick
here like this is. And it's like you've overcooked
chicken so bad that it's like, there's no way that I can do
(06:24):
this. It's, you know, you, you look
back and you go, what was I thinking?
Yeah, yeah. Like it's a classic situation.
It's what you said. It's like, why did I need that
much chicken? Why did I have to eat on, on the
half an hour every two hours? Yeah.
Like so like that's another one for me is like those meal
timings that you like it has. To you were like a Pavlov's dog
(06:47):
like you can salivate in 5 minutes before yeah and if you
missed the meal you go hypo yeah, because you're you're so
you. Condition yourself.
It's like I have to get 178g of chicken in at 11:30 or the
world's going to end. Yeah, it's like, no, you'll be
all right. Yeah, I did the the first the
first show I did my I didn't didn't really weigh my food,
(07:12):
didn't track it, didn't really understand macros.
All all I knew was like, I'm going to cut my carbs, like not
eat any white foods, you know, it was like no rice, no pasta,
no breads. And it was basically like
chicken and veg, you know, for the majority of it.
And then about six weeks out from the show, again, I was the
(07:32):
leanest I'd ever been because I'm not naturally lean.
But then I was also thinking, like, I'm not ready.
Like I'm not. I'm behind.
And I saw a YouTube video of Kevin Laroney and he in fishing
green beans and he's like, yeah,I like it was tilapia, but it's
like we don't really have tilapia in the UK.
Like there's white whitefish andgreen beans like five times a
(07:54):
day. And I said, I'm going to do
that. If I, if he does that, I'm going
to do that. And so I, I ate white like I
would get frozen Pollock, which was like £1.50 for the, for the
UK, for the US guys, $2.00, like$2.00 a frozen pack of it, which
is like 500 grams frozen. I would.
(08:16):
I put it in like boiling water to cook it.
And then I would cook my boiled green beans and I would eat that
four times a day with no seasoning, no salt, because I
thought salt was bad. I don't want to hold water or
anything. And so I was probably eating
about 650 calories a day, maybe 750.
(08:36):
And I did have a six weeks straight and at the time I was
working 12 hour security shifts days and then to like 3 days and
then three nights do my cardio in a car park, just walk around.
But the one thing that I always admired of myself back then was
like, fuck me, you were willing to do what it took.
Because if I had to do that to get in shape now, I'd throw in
the towel. I'll go fuck it.
(08:57):
It's not worth it. But I wanted it so bad because I
would have not eaten for a week like if it meant that I was
going to going to do well. It's almost like that ignorance
and it being. Ignorant.
Right. It was absolutely, because I was
the same. It's like what you've just said.
It's like you almost thought it had to be hard.
It's like, well, if I want to get on that stage, it's got to
be hard. And I was similar to you.
(09:19):
It was like 4 to six weeks of just that.
And if I look back at those calories, 6700 calories across
the day, working full 12 hour shift.
And I had, like, living in an apartment at the time, a storage
unit down in the car park that was probably, like, 6 foot by
three foot. Nothing else fitted in there
apart from the elliptical, Right.
And it was freezing cold in the mornings.
(09:40):
And I would go down before work at, like, 5:00 AM, shut the door
in there and be on that for an hour.
And then you're eating fish and green beans for the rest of the
day. Yeah.
And it was just like, it was unnecessarily hard.
It was so dark. But the harder you go, the
better the results get. So it's just like in your head,
you're like, I'm just gonna. And then, but then The funny
thing was I, I looked like the leanest I'd ever looked.
I. Think you look like a string
(10:01):
bean as. Well, oh, completely wasted
away, couldn't get a pump like again, just like kind of pump
and a fish and bean. But then so my, my dad competed
in natural bodybuilding. And so I was like, you know, a
week out and I was like, what doI do for my like peak?
Because I've, I've read, you know, you carb up, you cut your
water and all these things. And he gave me a plan, which I,
I love you dad, but it was the completely wrong plan.
(10:23):
Bear in mind that I'd had like no carbs.
I did like 3 days drinking dextrose and like eating like
rice every meal and I think I gained like 9 lbs or something
and I was still lean on show a day but I was like I look bad
last week and I literally drinking like 100 gram dextrose
drink I. Used to do that post week.
(10:43):
Yeah, but I was, I was just likelike, but again, I was, I was so
carb deprived. It actually tasted nice because
I had anything sweet in so long.But like to my point when you
were saying about the chicken, Icouldn't eat whitefish or green
beans for about 6 years after that.
Like the thought of green beans.I was like.
I just don't. You can almost feel like in your
throat. You're like.
(11:03):
Yeah, I'm the same with Jack Daniels, but that's a different
compression. It's like that's I can't go near
that. Stuff.
Yeah, yeah, it's because I overcooked that for six.
Weeks, I overcooked that for about 10 years, six weeks.
But what you said there, I thinkthat's another really kind of
common mistake what you said about like dextro, like
supplements, like over reliance on supplements, right?
(11:25):
Like when I first started it waslike I have to have BCA as I
have to have CLAI have to have all.
Of the Yeah. God, I remember I have to have
all of these different supplements, and if I didn't
have that in during the workout,if I didn't have that 10 minutes
after the workout, if I didn't sleep, like it's just over
reliance on stuff that I was eating.
Whole Foods, I was good. Yeah.
(11:47):
And the, some of these, there's going to be crossover because
we've all come from a bodybuilding background.
So like there's going to be crossover and the the bulk in
one. So it was like, you've got to
eat big to get big. Like if you want to get big,
you've got to eat big. I used to put away some food, my
Lord. You still do.
Yeah, me, I used to have this thing in the morning that I used
(12:08):
to call the pie and it was it was gross.
It was like I basically get a blender and I would put whole
eggs, like 2 scoops of whey, 2 bananas, peanut butter, like 100
grams of oats, blast the thing up with whole milk and just
blend it. It was 3 shakers A litre and a
(12:31):
half. And I would it was it was rank.
It used to taste. Oh well.
And I'd chin all three. I did the exact same thing but
without the whey and I would adddouble cream to it for the for
the extra calories. I mean, if you put it in the
oven, it would have been a pie. It would have cooked and gone I.
Would have. I would, yeah.
I literally did 2 shakes a day and it would be like 200 grams
of oats, like a pint of a pint, a pint of whole milk, 2 bananas,
(12:55):
six whole eggs and like 2 massive tablespoons of peanut
butter twice a day. I would train and then I'd go to
Mackey's and have 6 double cheeseburgers, 6 or some.
Cheese. We were calling you Double
Cheese. Yeah, the.
Funny thing is there is like my digestion was fine like and I
like I could eat those 6 double cheeseburgers and feel fine.
(13:17):
I could. I could like go.
Train, you didn't look fine. Go on like but then.
You're like a pregnant snake. Oh, health was great.
Even even now, like if I if I ate like McDonald's on 2 days in
a row, I know I've eaten McDonald's.
I can, I feel, I feel feel it. My body and my pants are
saturated so like. I'm walking around in a day but.
We can also. Smell it.
(13:39):
But like I I just. I genuinely didn't care about
like all all I thought was like,eat, eat more food.
Yeah, like all you have to. Do as long as it was clean.
Yeah, it was clean. You're good.
Well, no, I didn't give a shit about that.
I was just like, no, I would just, I would, I would eat
anything. It's really common because
again, it's like, it's almost that comparison to pros or
comparison to people that you see online.
(14:00):
It's like I'm smashing 6000 calories a day.
Yeah. Like but if I eat 6000 I'd be
like him. Yeah, it's completely irrelevant
to you and your individual, likelifestyle, like what you
consume, what you actually need.Like people think they need, you
know, in every aspect to do way more than what they need to do.
It's like you don't need to be in that much of A surplus to be
gaining good quality muscle tissue and staying lean.
(14:22):
I remember they just. Pick an arbitrary #5000 Cal a
day. It's like, where's that come
from? When when when I was at
university, it's when like T nation was really popular on
online and they were trying to sell their this.
So this was when like casein hydrolysate had just come out
and like, I think the, the brandwas like Peptopro, which is like
(14:45):
basically like essential amino acids, but a complete protein
that, you know, mixes like waterreally, really fast absorbed
because they were trying to selltheir product.
And he came up with like the pulse feast diet, which was you
had two shakes during the day ofPepto pro and then you eat
whatever you want a night and it's like you're trying to lose
weight. Then it's like your meal is
(15:05):
like, you know, vegetables and protein 1st and then dessert.
And if you're trying to gain, you eat whatever you want.
And, and I did it for like 8 weeks at university, lost like
30 lbs like work great. And in my head I was like, it's
because I'm doing these protein pulses and I'm eating when it's
like, you know, anabolic at night and all of this stuff.
And, and really it was just, I was eating 1500 calories a day
(15:26):
and I just got used to it. But one, I wasn't putting salt
or electrolytes in my drinks. So I was getting really cold and
fatigued during the day. But the funny, The funny thing
is in the UK we have what's called double concentrate
squash, which is like, it's likethe equivalent of like Myo
flavoring for water, like you, like, you guys have it over
(15:48):
here. It's like a syrup, like a like a
grenadine layup here, isn't it? Yeah, kind of like.
That and so I would have to mix the the peptopro with that
because it was so bitter. You need to put double
concentrate with it just to get rid of the taste.
And so I would make and I would use a double concentrate bottle
like a used one for my drinks totake to university because it
(16:10):
was the amount of water that I needed.
And and then I got to universityand I was drinking with them and
I was like, so it's a bit bit sharp that one.
I was like, I'm sorry. I added a bit of water to it and
I was like sipping it. I was like, oh, stupid, like
quite really can't taste the bitterness.
This one, I was like, oh, drank it and then, you know, 30
minutes I was like and I was like, oh, fuck.
And then anyway, like to proceeded to just the world fell
(16:32):
out of my ass like you know, forhours afterwards.
And then I get home and then I go to make my next one and I'm
looking at the double concentrate bottle and I was
like, that's a bit pale. And I had realized I had drank a
litre and a half of double concentrate squash.
That's so right. So like if you if you can
imagine filling up a litre and ahalf of myoflea like flavouring
(16:55):
and just drinking it and just chinning it, that's evidence to
show that. Sweeteners aren't going to kill
you. Yeah, because if you drink it, I
would, I would, I would have been one of the rats of the
aspartame for the boys studies. But it was, it was horrendous.
That that concept of like thoughthe late night you turn when car
back loading came round. That was John Keefer, Yeah.
(17:18):
So just vanished by the way. Yeah, completely disappeared.
You would go basically protein and fats during the day.
There were other like more specific concepts like you know
you would train at a certain time.
MCT or caffeine and yeah. But in general it's protein and
fats in the day, in the evening.Then you do a big carb load and
again it was similar. Like if trying to bulk you can
(17:38):
eat pretty bracey whatever as many carbs.
Cherry turnovers was his his thing.
Yeah, and my mate was following.This isn't my my confession, but
I'm going to confess for him. I remember he would like he was
falling to a tea. He was having like the
bulletproof coffees. You have coffee with the coconut
oil and all the day. And then he'd get and even just
like blast the box of like Krispy Kremes, just smash them.
(18:01):
And then like one day we were like, oh, we're going to get a
Curry. And he was like, oh, I really
want a Curry. But he because on days you don't
train, you don't you don't back load.
Yeah, yeah. And he was like, oh fuck, I'm
dying for a Curry. He went God damn, did three sets
of press up. So yeah, I'll have a Curry go
and I was like, mate, that cheatin the system justify three sets
(18:21):
of press and a lamb buna with a naan bread.
I think mates, no way, you ain'thaving that.
I, I did that for a while as well, but it but it was, it's
funny because then and I, I genuinely thought that that was
legit like because, because he, he put like 400 studies at the
end of his. Either science it was.
Very bad and and when you actually look at it, all of
those studies are completely irrelevant to what he was
(18:42):
talking about. But then Alex Fiada, the the OG
hybrid Alex, who will never listen to this podcast, but he
debunked it. And he was like, you're
basically describing every sorority girl's diet at
university, drink coffee all day, eat pizza at night.
(19:02):
Like that's how they stayed thin.
And and I was like, huh. And then he's like this calories
in, calories out, like you're just choosing to eat your carbs
at night. And I was like, yeah, that does
make sense. Yeah.
And then so, but I, I think fromlike a practical standpoint,
it's quite good. Like if you want to manage your
intake and have a bigger meal atnight, like cool.
But it was, it was the belief that you had.
It's like, if I have carbs for breakfast, I'm going to get fat.
(19:25):
Yeah. And I genuinely believed in,
it's like it would ruin my day if I have carbs before my last
meal. Like it was like the, and it's
like you, I would take that to my grave.
Like I genuinely believe that somuch.
But I, I think like the, the good thing about all of us is
that we've been like willing to be educated and like I've always
(19:46):
been open to changing my opinionon something if there's evidence
there or I try it and it works or whatever.
Otherwise I'd still be, you know, drinking Coke, coconut,
Bulletproof coffee and Pepto Proand double concentrate.
But like, yeah, I mean, I think most of the.
The diet ones have just been like extremes because that's
(20:07):
just how you thought that it hadto be.
But. Again, bodybuilding is a game of
extremes. So it's like there's always, but
it's a game of extremes and no offense, stupid people.
So there's stupid people doing extreme things, but then because
they're good at it, you listen to them and you're like, oh,
well, maybe that's what I need to do.
And then you realize then this is.
I think that was one of the first things on a training side
(20:29):
of things. When you go like confessions, it
is again is more is better. It was like the longer I spend
in the gym, the more progress I'm going to make.
That was like, and, and now it'sjust like get your minimal
effective dose, get in and get out and do you like, do you work
as quick as you can? I've had tendonitis in so many
tendons like my shoulders, my myelbows, my knees everywhere,
(20:53):
just like because I've just my volume was so high because
again, it was the harder I trainand I make the the train harder,
say, Oh well, I'll just go to failure on every set and I'll do
like 40 sets and I'll just keep going and going.
I. Think like my it's not even like
a confession, but again, it's like most of my things have just
been silly beliefs. Yeah, well, like the actual
(21:14):
execution. It's like I wasn't doing
something completely bizarre, but it was just like the you
drunk. 1 1/2 liters of double concentrated squad.
I wasn't doing anything bizarre.Accidents happen, but training,
it was like, I genuinely believed I had to do certain
movements in a particular order or it like or it wouldn't work
(21:35):
like kind of thing. And it was like you had to do
push downs and skull crushes andsingle arm reverse tricep
extensions and you had to do bench and then incline and then
decline and then you fly and then you cable.
And it was like a set thing like, and if, oh, heaven forbid,
I miss my incline and my upper chest isn't going to grow.
And I would, I would like sit inthe gym for like 40 minutes
(21:57):
waiting for a piece of equipment.
It's like, well, I can't do my Flyers because I've got incline
next. And I would like be like real
OCD over it. Like, and it, it took quite a
while to break that. And I think, and it was probably
from accident of like, oh, like I haven't been able to do this
because I've injured myself and nothing's changed.
Maybe I don't need to do it. But.
And like like now it's like I'm pretty flexible with my
(22:18):
training. Like even if I feel off on a
certain day or I do one set and I'm like, that feels like shit
today I'm going to do something else.
But like I had 0 auto regulationor like intuitiveness like even
like when I was doing the fishing green beans and I
couldn't even get a pump in the gym.
It's like 20 sets of chest today.
So I mean, there's nothing there.
Like it's like you're, you're barely.
(22:38):
Benching the bar you're doing. 20 sets of chest and living off
green beans and one whitefish. There's not a pump.
There's nothing. There's nothing you can get.
Yeah, I think we're we're all onthe same page in terms of like
we've had us all off off camera discussions in terms of like
cringy things. We were chatting up on this, on
this travel thing. Oh God.
(22:58):
So I guess you could start with this.
So cringy things that like looking back like Oh no, like
what was I doing? Got to go back to the, the the
bodybuilding days because I think that's when you just most
blinkered and just like head in the sand.
It's just that's all I think about.
It's all I do. It's all I'm focused.
(23:19):
On you forget that it's a very. It's so niche.
Sport. Like we even as of late it's
become way more popular with Instagram, you just go back like
8 years and it was a lot even more niche there as well.
Like I, I remember like travelling up to London for a
show or travelling somewhere andit's like you're stopping in the
service station like we did the other day and you're going in
(23:39):
the bathroom, dropping your pants, pulling up your top and
taking a picture, going along. I'm going to check my condition.
You've left the house 45 minutesago.
You've got no bladder control because you're doing 8 years of
water. You've not changed in that 45
minutes. But it's like, I must check
you're in the I've got so many selfies or like pictures.
On the front, like Milton Keynes, with your pants on your
(24:00):
ankles, posing in the toilets. What are you doing?
It is walking through with fake tan all over you.
Yeah, like it's completely normal.
And then and then you're like, why is everyone staring at me?
Yeah, it's like, because you like an Oompa Loompa the first.
So. When I applied for my PHDI had
to do an interview with the professors at the UNI and the
interview was like on a Wednesday.
I competed on the SAT or the Sunday so and like I I wasn't
(24:24):
one of these to scrub my tan off.
I would just leave it fall off over time.
That's because you don't show. So I literally walked into the
interview like with patches of tan, like a cow.
I've gone in like that with patches and just walked in, sat
down. So this big like that, all
right. And they're like, this cow wants
(24:44):
to do a PhD, Like what's going on here?
And you've probably put some cows on between the show and the
and. The.
Little moon faces walked in. My my supervisor told me about a
year later, she was like, I thought you had that skin
condition where what's it calledwhen you?
Got pigments? Yeah, your pigment is all off.
And I was like, oh, no, that wasjust like parts of tan had
(25:05):
peeled off me and I'd walked into an interview.
Now I was like, this is your, this is your life we're going
for here. And I just walked in like, yeah,
whatever. Like they don't care.
It's so. I had a, when I was doing my
undergrad in sports biomedicine,I, I competed twice and I, and
after the second show I binged and I and it was, it was like on
(25:25):
a Saturday and I had lectures onlike the Monday or the Tuesday
and I'd already gained about 15 lbs, but it was like all water.
And I went in and my like, like my face was like, I look Asian
like. And I and I sat down and
everyone was just like, what thefuck?
Because literally on the Friday,it was like, like, you know,
sucked in. And they're like, then what have
(25:46):
you done? Like you had an allergic
reaction to something. I was like, no, I've just eaten
16 cheesecakes. Like his face is full of bee
sting it. Was like, but it oh, it felt so
uncomfortable. But I, I mean, I used to have I
had one. I can't remember what show this
was and I was go. It was one of the shows where
(26:07):
you get tanned at the venue because normally I'd do Dream
Town or something else, put on layers and stuff.
And so you would obviously like shave and everything prior.
And I must have had like such bad diet fatigue that I had like
shaved and I completely forgot to shave my pubes.
And then I literally got in my car to go to the show and I was
(26:28):
like, hang on a minute. And I was like, if I put on
these pants, it's like, you're going to look like Borat.
Like, and I, I literally, I literally had to rush back home
and be like, right. Have I actually like prepped for
this show? Oh, but then I was thinking and
I was literally having nightmares like for this show
after that of like rocking up, having not shaved and wearing my
(26:49):
socks on stage. And I would have nightmares over
it. And I'd like check and be like,
I've got socks on. There's ah, it's horrendous.
We'd say about posing, I remember like when you are
bodybuilding, you think posing is like normal.
You think that like everyone does pose in practice.
And I remember going in in the gym, we used to train that this
(27:10):
is in Excise Filesis was in the in the room upstairs.
So I walked into like basically it's like a, it's like a room
that they've. Got Exercise Studio, isn't it?
Yeah. It's studio, so there's big
mirrors. The lighting's good.
I'll just go up there and pose and you walk in there and there
was like a woman in there, you know, like in her 40s.
I'm just like, you mind if I do some pose in practice?
And she's obviously like, yeah, whatever.
(27:31):
Like, what the hell is that? Just said, yeah, so go in like,
pants right around the ankles, like, not the top off.
She's probably like, oh, my, what the hell is going on here?
And she left not long after. Oh, there next to the manager
comes up and he's like, oh, we've got a complaint about you.
And I'm like, what? And I'm standing there in my
pants and he, I'm like, what? I'm like a woman came downstairs
(27:52):
and said, you walked in and justpulled out your ass.
And I was like, no, like I'm posing like, like, see.
And I was like, oh, man. And in my head I was like, what
an idiot that woman is. Like, what do you mean?
Just show it in my ass? But like in, in hindsight,
looking back, like a bloke's come in and said, like, do you
mind if I do pose in practice? She's gone like, yeah, not
(28:13):
really knowing. And I've whipped my kit off,
like pulled my pants up my butt because I'm trying to get like,
shredded glutes. And I'm like flats in it.
Like so like in hindsight I'm like, yeah, you are an absolute
moron of a bloke. But in hindsight, we changed
gyms quite quickly after that. That's why we changed.
Swiftly. Left, you've got banned.
(28:35):
That's right. I love it.
Yeah. Did you, did you have any?
Because I remember 1 like 1 showI had to make weight because I
was in, I was in the middle weights and that was like I was
like spitting into a cup And I because I was already
dehydrated. I already had my tan on so I
couldn't sweat. Otherwise I would have just like
worn a bin bag or something. Fine.
But I couldn't spitting into a cup had like no more water to
(28:58):
pass. Literally had to Ryan had to
hold a towel around me whilst I weighed because I was like even
my shorts of like, did you have pee with the latest?
Yeah, I literally made, I made weight by 100 grams, like, and
so it was like even my shorts for like, like even even your
posing trunks weighed that. It was like after that whole
ordeal, I didn't even want to step on stage.
(29:19):
I was like, I, I feel for fighters that have to make
weight because that was so horrendous.
And then I, I was like, I just want to go home now and, and
drink like drink water. You you are to stand there doing
5 minutes opposing. They've got to go 12 rounds or
something in the. Face literally like horrendous.
I used to make weight for for classic.
That was a stress. That was because it's that like
if I'm because my clap was like 82 kegs or whatever, it's like
(29:42):
if I miss weight by a kilo and I'm 83 kegs, you're in there.
I'm now in the under 90s open bodybuilding class where I'm
going to look like a small child.
So I'm like it. It was, it was such a, a panic
every now, even though like I was on weight like 3 weeks out,
it would still just weigh on you.
Like, but what if I miss? What if I miss because you don't
(30:03):
want to go down too low? Otherwise you're, you're looking
small. So you want to be close to
weight. But then it's like, but what if
their scales are a bit differentto mine and I end up going over
and oh God, yeah, the stress that I used to cause was a
shambles. I tell you, one of this is again
and it all ties to bodybuilding.I remember I used to because
(30:25):
you're drinking so much water constantly, you always go into
the bathroom and my toilet was downstairs so it would disrupt
my sleep all the time because I've got to get up at night to
go to the. Bathroom.
I know where this is. Going this is TAZ, I shouldn't
be saying this on camera, but I'm going to anyway.
So basically, what if I can actually show you?
I used to do this. I used to lie in bed like this.
(30:46):
Oh no. And I used to have, I used to
have a bottle here like this. So I'd sleep like this.
And then when I need to go to the toilet, I used to go on to
my side like this. We because if I got up because,
because, because if I got up, I would obviously break my sleep.
So I'm trying to stay like semi sleeping.
(31:09):
I've got the bottle here and I'mweaning into the bottle like
this. And then I would go put it back
down. I would go back to sleep.
I just basically filled this bigbottle up overnight and walked
downstairs in the morning. One of the.
(31:29):
Worst things I've ever. I was really single at the time.
Really single. How bad is that?
Yeah, I shouldn't have told anyone that.
I don't know. I have.
The last The last episode. I tell my clients to do that
when they're like mate, I can't think this is what I'm like.
Take a bottle to bed with you mate.
Just pissing it bro. Roll into the recovery position
(31:51):
you. Don't even have to get up mate
you. Sully you because you.
I can't top that. Yeah, I think that one, that one
caps it off because I think you've done more shows than
Yeah, the Me and the Me and Taylor.
Yeah, I think I've done about. What's the what's the most kind
of like bizarre thing you've tried to like improve your look
(32:18):
or so because I know because some guys would be like drink
white wine or vodka before you pump up.
And there used to be loads of like there was old wives tale
was like steak and red wine before or like, you know,
dehydrate and have you done anything which you're kind of
like you look back and you're like like who come up with that
to? Or definitely I I've done the
(32:41):
steak and red wine the night before, I've done the the shot
of vodka or two before going outon stage.
That's a. Bizarre one.
Just before going out, we need to start it's. 10 minutes before
you go out on. Stage I've, I've seen a bloke do
that and he almost, he, he almost threw up on stage man.
His tan was sweating off his face into his mouth.
(33:04):
And so when he was posed and he was like, just like splitting
out this like fake tan. And I was like, he's had a
stink. I was I.
Was genuinely sat in the crowd and I literally pointed out I
said he's had a howler for this one.
And it was just like he just hadstreaks coming down him and I
(33:25):
was just like, I don't know whatyou've done, but it's not right.
I've seen a guy, I've seen a guybackstage and this was because I
was helping out one of my friends who was like enhanced
body, but 1A natural bodybuilder.
There's a guy backstage and as he was pumping up, he had one of
his friends feeding him doughnuts and the other one
(33:47):
pinning him with insulin just like in like what a tea about
about 3 different shots of insulin.
He had about four Krispy Kremes.I'll tell you what, you look
fucking class. Anyone and I.
Was like, I was like, who taughtyou that?
What a trick. Yeah.
I I wasn't that invested. I mean, for me, because like, I
(34:07):
mean, back then I was like a natural bodybuilder and I had
like a massive like, because youknow, the way my dad kind of
brought me, I was kind of like that we're just cheating.
And and so when I saw that, I was like, this is another level.
You know, all I see backstage ispeople eating rice cakes and
it's like this guy's eating Donuts and injections, like
(34:27):
ridiculous. But you see some crazy shit.
Yeah. Yeah, it's it's a bizarre world.
It's a very, very bizarre world.Like I just, it's just one of
those things that you kind of like when you you step away from
it and you look back. I remember it's just one funny
story. We competed, I think it was one
of the first shows we did. And I'm standing there and
you're in your trunks and I'm posing and all I hear from like
(34:49):
the audience because you can't see because all the lights are
on you and you went cracking physique 116.
I'm just like, that's just a grown bloke shouting at me from
a crowd, like just admiring my body.
And it's just like you go away going.
That's weird. Like, yeah, I don't know.
It's just, it's a strange. World.
The chance you hear from the crowd, there was a guy like when
guys do a back shot and then they haven't tensed their glutes
(35:12):
and you've got like like 50. 8 glutes, yeah.
Glutes. It's like shouting like your
ass. Tense your ass.
Tense your ass. Yeah, I think like, but I, I
think the, the reason why we always kind of go back to body
when is because it's such an extreme.
That's where the, it's like obviously the, the, the clients
that we work with the gem pop and, you know, they might be
(35:33):
looking to get like subtemps andbody fat or they're doing a
photo shoot or something like bodybuilding is like the extreme
of that. And so you're always going to
look at like the extremes and almost take like a regression of
that. And it's like, well, if they're
doing it at the extreme, then there's probably something that
works for like the guys that wonlike the next level down.
(35:54):
Like if Olympic weight lifters or like Sprint cyclists, like
even at the amateur level, they've got big legs.
And so like there's probably something to do in lots of
cycling, you're going to probably get bigger legs.
And you always like, because bodybuilding, it's like, well,
they've got the most muscle and the lowest levels of body fat.
All of our clients are looking for more muscle and lower levels
of body fat. So you just kind of like regress
(36:14):
it. Like we don't want to go that
extreme, but there's probably something.
But then we've been to that, youknow, we're not £300 mass
monsters, but we've like had a taste of that environment.
And pushed it as far as we can go for us.
Yeah, but then when you look at it, you're just like, it is
weird. Oh really?
Let's flip this from past confessions to confessions now
(36:36):
that you do in your own trainingor nutrition.
What's something that you've gotnow?
I'll go, I'll go and I'll go You.
Go and give me a prompt. I don't train hard.
Yeah, OK. I don't.
I don't train like I used to train like I'll do 2 to 3 weight
(36:56):
sessions a week but I won't be going anywhere near failure.
My RP probably is like A6 or A7.It's like I'll do the minimum I
can to maintain current physique.
Yeah, without pushing it like too hard.
Yeah, I will. I'll I'll eat less on purpose to
avoid doing my steps. And so.
(37:19):
I'll like, so I'll like in my head, I'm like, well, you're
probably getting about 4050 calories per 1000 steps and I'll
be like, I'm at 5000. Then it's 8:00 PM and I'm like
250 calories just to fucking eatthe like just cut back on my
last meal down to the steps then.
And it's like, obviously you getloads of other benefits of doing
the steps, but I'm just like, inmy head, I'm just doing the
math. And I mean, that's, that's
(37:40):
probably one of them. I under eat protein quite often.
It probably all balances out when I'm eating enough, but I
used to eat 250 with ease and I'll have some days now where I
might scrape 100 and then, but then I might have a day where I
have a steak or something I'm atlike 300 or something.
So it kind of bounce out. But I don't pay attention to it
(38:02):
unless I'm like actively prepping for something in my
head. It's like I'm going to assume
that my habits and behaviours are enough now to not be
deficient in protein, but I'm not aiming for like 1g per pound
of body weight. Like I just I don't need it like
at this at this point. But that's what it's also having
that knowledge that like, if youare going to die, it's like I'll
(38:25):
put it up mainly for the benefitof keeping me satiated and
keeping me. Full and I'll put it you.
Know when, when to. Use it, when to use it and when
to use that tool to put it back in, Yeah.
I've got I don't mind. I've got a really poor ability
to stop when I'm full and I'll just go, I'm like a lab.
I'll just go past like like lastnight we went, we went for pizza
last night. This is a confession for you
(38:46):
now. And and I was like 9 full after
two slices, but I want 8 slices.Wait.
And every slice was you don't need another one.
But there's that difference between need and want.
Yeah, yeah. But you want another one.
And I'm like, yeah, keep going. And then I'm like, I'm in a coma
again. And I'm like, yeah, it's so for
(39:07):
me, like I that's why if you go to my house, I almost buy just
enough food to survive the week.Because if I, if I stocked up
for an apocalypse, I would be like 300 lbs in a week because
I'm like, oh, well then I blasted the whole, I blasted
everything I got. But it's.
It's a really good thing that you brought up because I think a
(39:29):
lot of clients will assume we'reperfect, that you're just like,
you don't have cravings for bad food.
Like we were talking like when we had pizza, like Codoni was
talking about with one of his clients where it's like, oh man,
I just got cravings. And so it's like what you and
think you think I don't like, like we all, we all have
cravings. Like we all want to not train
sometimes and not do cardio and,you know, skip legs and like eat
(39:51):
the Donuts. But like, the difference is we
for the majority of the time don't act on those impulses.
But it, it's like a, it's completely silly to think that
coaches don't have those same, like, I mean, everyone, everyone
does. And, and so it's like we're,
we're never, we're not perfect all the time.
(40:13):
It's just the but the the other major difference that I would
say is like if I choose to eat Popeyes one night and not and go
over my calories. At no point do I go, I'm really
annoyed that I'm not losing weight because you fucking ain't
Popeyes. Like, you know, like I'm
perfectly OK with not making progress.
(40:34):
If all of my decisions on like going to put me in that
position, I can take ownership and accountability and go, yeah,
I've been fucking off my diet. Like, of course I'm not going to
like be making progress. And then if I want to do it, I
can. It's just at the moment I
clearly don't want to and I'm cool with that.
And then if I, if my weight goesup and I'm like, yeah, I don't
want to be here, then I turn it on, bring it back down.
(40:56):
And then, but it's it's, you've got full control.
That's that, that's that. Years of experience though, of
going through those mistakes, those trials, those errors,
knowing your body, knowing what you essentially can get away
with or your your your sort of parameters for where you want to
sit. You, you what, you waive your
right to be frustrated when it'slike, yeah, you know, if, if,
if, like, if Taylor, like if youwere like, I'm just really
(41:18):
annoyed, like my, my front squat's not going up and I'd be
like, you're fucking on the bikelike 10 hours a week.
What do you expect? But like you're intelligent
enough to go, but I'm not going to be at peak leg strength
because I'm doing 10 hours on the bike.
And if I, if I'm, if I get to a point that I'm so unhappy with
my leg strength, I'll cut back on the bike and I'll improve my
leg strength. But it's, it's like, you know,
(41:39):
you have guys that'd be like, well, I want to be an elite
level powerlifter, but I want to, I want to be shredded, you
know, and I want to do this at the same time, I don't want to
gain some muscle. And it's like, bro, like you
pick, pick one and be OK with it.
You've got to be and if and and don't get frustrated when you're
chasing one of them and the other things aren't happening.
It's like, like what you hoping to happen?
Yeah, yeah, no, they're, they'regood confessions.
(42:00):
I'm sure they'll be more in the future.
Yeah. But I, I, I sorry, I think we'll
do a we'll do a future episode on coach confessions or like
coaching confessions. What have you said to clients
where maybe you were like first starting out as a personal
trainer? That was just dog shit advice.
And you look back and you're like, why did I, why did I
recommend that person do that? Because I'm sure there'll be
(42:20):
some absolute caucus there. Because when you first start
your job, you're not good. At it.
You don't know anything, No, butif you still have the same
practices and beliefs that you did 10 years ago, you are no
better. Like if you don't, I could.
Give you an answer to that is essentially like A1 size fits
all yeah, it's like every bloke that came through the door, it's
like he's going to get that training plan, he's going to get
(42:41):
that and I'm going to put him onabout those calories where it's
like you realise oh, there's differences in they.
Should all be on push pull eggs?They should all have high
proteins. They should all be in five times
a day. They should.
All because that's what I believe in at the moment.
That's what worked for me. That's what's going to work for
them. Like that's the, I think that is
one of the biggest things when you starting off coaching.
Yeah, yeah. But but yeah, like if you, if
(43:03):
you can't look back and like, you know, 10/10/15 years ago and
we kind of got into this and you're like, why on earth was I
doing that even Like if I look back at my first loom check
insurance, I'm like, like this is beyond bad.
Like, you know, even with, you know, maybe like new coaches
that we're training up or something and they got I'm like,
yeah, pretty good. We can just change a couple of
(43:25):
these things. I was miles off and it's just
like the worst thing I've ever seen.
But then I can look back and go,well, I've improved.
Whereas if I look back and go, yeah, pretty much the same as
what I do now, it's like what's going on?
So yeah, that would be a good episode to to cover for sure.
But thank you guys. Please forgive us for our for
(43:46):
our cinage. And whilst you're doing that, be
sure to like and subscribe on iTunes, Spotify and YouTube and
we'll see you next time. If you love this show, please
like, share and leave us a five star review so that we can help
(44:06):
more people. I'm John Matson, Superhuman CEO,
reminding you to always go get what's yours.
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