Avatar Nation: S1 E04 — "Into the Dark"

In this episode of AVATAR NATION, Pauline and Wes focus on episode 4 of Netflix’s Avatar: The Last Airbender. They discuss the episode's themes of loss and difficult decisions in the backdrop of war, plus the emotional impact of flashbacks. They also explore various elements, including the implication of choices made by characters such as Aang, Zuko, Iroh, Sai, and more.

00:31 Intro

01:11 Opening

03:31 Episode Tea

06:22 Cabbage Rating

08:57 Personal Key Moments

13:09 Episode Analysis

55:01 Favorite Bending Moment

56:38 Favorite Character

57:32 Animal Watch

59:33 Memorable Quotes

01:02:00 Question of the Week

01:05:24 Closing Thoughts

01:07:08 Outro

__________

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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
You have to make choices likethat day after day, year after
year, and that's just to savethis one city.
You have to save the wholeworld, let it fall, Aang, and
learn what it means to be theAvatar.

(00:22):
No! Then the world is doomed.

Pauline (00:34):
Welcome to Avatar Nation, a podcast, all about the
Netflix live adaptation ofAvatar: the Last Airbender.
Whether you're a longtime fanlike us, or you're new to the
Avatarverse, join us as we diveinto each episode and analyze
the retelling of TV's greatestadventure.

(01:11):
Hey guys, I'm your host,Pauline.

Wes (01:14):
And I'm Wes.

Pauline (01:16):
Guess what?
We officially have listeners onall continents.
Well, okay, minus Antarctica forobvious reasons, but What?

Wes (01:27):
have,

Pauline (01:29):
we have Listeners on each of the other six
continents.
So that's pretty cool.
I didn't think that, we wouldget a whole lot of international
listeners.
So

Wes (01:38):
Thank you.

Pauline (01:39):
Yes.
Thank you to everybody that haslistened so far.
Are you excited to get into this

Wes (01:44):
I am super excited.

Pauline (01:46):
We don't want to delay too much because we have a lot
to talk about today, but beforewe get started, I do want to go
ahead and read a comment that wegot on Spotify.
It's not a review, because Idon't think you can leave
reviews on Spotify, but we didget a comment from somebody
named Neville B.

Wes (02:02):
Hi Neville!

Pauline (02:03):
And they said,"Loving your podcast.
This was not my favorite episodeof the series." And they're
meaning the episode Omashubefore this one.
And they said,"I preferredepisode 2.

Wes (02:13):
Oh, Well, thank you, Neville, for backing me up.

Pauline (02:15):
Yes.
It sounds like Neville hasagreed with you.

Wes (02:18):
Yeah, sorry, Pauline.

Pauline (02:20):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaking of the episode Omashu,I just want to say real quick,
something I need to get off ofmy chest, okay?
We didn't mention this lasttime, but the Fire Nation spy
that was wearing red.
Didn't that bother you?
Because if you're a spy,

Wes (02:36):
why are you wearing red?
Yes, why are you wearing

Pauline (02:40):
suspicious, is he?
Yes, why are you wearing red ina city that is wearing mostly
green?
Come on

Wes (02:45):
just wanted to get that off of my

Pauline (02:49):
So I just wanted to get that off of my chest because
that's been bothering me, and wedidn't get to talk about it last
time, so.
okay, whew.
Exhale, deep breaths.
Before we get started witheverything quick reminder to
follow and subscribe to thispodcast so that way you don't
miss out on any future episodeof ours, and it helps us a lot
too,

Wes (03:09):
And save those airbenders.
all you have to do.

Pauline (03:12):
save, we said before the last couple episodes, the
more you guys engage with thispodcast, the more winged lemurs
and airbenders you get to save.
We'll include badger moles thistime too.
Save them all, engage with us.
Yeah!

Wes (03:26):
let's start it.
Okay, so

Pauline (03:29):
Okay, let's start it! Okay, so this episode, as we
mentioned already, this istitled Into the Dark.
And it's directed once again byJabbar Raisani, same director as
the previous episode.
He's our Game of Thrones andStranger Things guy.

(03:49):
Writing credits go to KeeleyMacdonald Most known for He Man
and the Masters of the Universeon Netflix, which I haven't
watched.

Wes (03:57):
I Have not

Pauline (03:57):
that?
No?
I've never really gone into anyHe Man stuff in the

Wes (04:01):
I'm sorry

Pauline (04:02):
Wes, do you want to go ahead and read our episode recap
just to catch us up on whathappened in this episode?

Wes (04:08):
Let's do it! Episode 4 begins in a tense moment, with
Aang and Iroh imprisoned, buttheir fates quickly diverge.
Iroh, known far and wide as theDragon of the West, finds
himself being taken to The Pit,an Earth Kingdom labor camp for
prisoners of war, during whichhis reputation earns him harsh

(04:28):
treatment from an Earth Kingdomsoldier.
Not all hope is lost, for Zukosuccessfully tracks him down,
and comes to his rescue.
Working together to take downthe Earth Kingdom soldiers, the
two are able to escape, thoughit results in Zuko giving up his
lead on the Avatar.
Meanwhile, Aang faces a blastfrom the past when he's brought
before Omashu's king.

(04:49):
To his shock, the king is noneother than his childhood friend,
Bumi! But time and war have madeBumi bitter and a little mad,
and he forces Aang toparticipate in a number of
challenges, including a duel tothe death to prove his worth as
the Avatar.
With help from Teo and Sai,Sokka and Katara set out to find
Aang by navigating secrettunnels underneath the palace,

(05:12):
which are believed to behaunted.
They encounter the minstrels whoshare the tunnel's origins in
the tragic story of Oma and Shu.
Sokka and Katara soon discoverthat the tunnels are occupied by
a colossal Badgermole, notspirits and it becomes their
unlikely guide out of thetunnels and into the palace.
Their timely arrival allows themto intervene in Aang and Bumi's

(05:33):
deadly duel, and Aang is able tochange Bumi's heart and rekindle
his hope.
Inspired by Aang's unwaveringtrust in his friends, Bumi makes
the pivotal decision to standwith Aang against the Fire
Nation's tyranny.
Another turn of events sees Saibetraying the Fire Nation,
exposing its insidious spynetwork, and potentially saving

(05:53):
Omashu from an upcoming attack.
The episode ends with Zukospotting Appa flying overhead as
he and Iroh row away on a boat,and Zuko choosing his uncle's
safety over chasing down theAvatar.

Pauline (06:06):
Thank you.
Do you like that I made that oneshorter than the last episode
recap?

Wes (06:11):
Yeah, I'm not out of breath,

Pauline (06:13):
of breath.
Alrighty, so with the recap outof the way, are you ready to
discuss our cabbage

Wes (06:19):
rating?
Let's go! Do it.

Pauline (06:22):
Okay, so our cabbage rating.
Our rating from 1 to 10, 1 beingthe worst, 10 being the best.
We each have one and do you wantto go first or do you want me

Wes (06:30):
I can go first.

Pauline (06:32):
you go first.
What was your cabbage rating?

Wes (06:34):
Can you tell how excited I am?
This episode was AMAZING!

Pauline (06:39):
What was your rating?

Wes (06:40):
8.
5.

Pauline (06:42):
Oh, wow! That's

Wes (06:43):
That's the best rating I've ever

Pauline (06:44):
gotten.
That

Wes (06:45):
the best one.
So

Pauline (06:46):
So far, this is your favorite episode.
Why?
Yeah.

Wes (06:49):
why?
Because, I I re watched thisepisode three times uh, went to
take notes and forgot to takenotes because

Pauline (06:58):
it

Wes (06:59):
was good.
No joke.

Pauline (07:02):
The beginning

Wes (07:03):
I guess just pulling everyone together everyone
making decisions, basically.
Decisions, that are starting toaffect the narrative of the
story.

Pauline (07:13):
Yeah, that's a good point.
Do you remember what I gave mylast one the last

Wes (07:17):
Yeah, you gave, you were pretty high on

Pauline (07:19):
I think I gave the last one an eight.
So let me just preface mycabbage rating with this, okay?
This episode had me on a rollercoaster of emotions good and
bad.
I started off pumped and thenwent to frustrated and shocked
and the next thing I wasdisappointed and then I was in
tears and

Wes (07:36):
I she was

Pauline (07:37):
the edge of my seat.
And then I was in tears again.
It was just like so up and downfor me.
So the rating was really hardbecause I started out thinking I
was going to give this episode afive.
I seriously thought, okay, thismight be my least favorite
episode when I would sayprobably within the first 10, 15

(07:58):
minutes of the episode.
But I'm coming away with a Oh,so hard! I'm also going to give
it an 8.5.

Wes (08:09):
Oh my gosh, did you just

Pauline (08:10):
come up with that?
I was teetering between 8 and 8.
5 because I think the lastepisode I gave it an 8.

Wes (08:16):
8.

Pauline (08:18):
Why Because overall, I did enjoy it more than the last
episode.
The back half of the episode iswhat saved it.
It go from a 5 to an 8 and ahalf, and it was mostly because
of Zuko and Iroh's moments.
So if it wasn't for any of thosemoments, this episode would have
been my least favorite episode.

(08:40):
But Their interactions reallypulled it up that much that I
would actually be more excitedto re watch this episode than
the last episode.
And if I were to re watch itagain, I think I would just
start from the halfway point andgo from there, because that's
where everything really pivotedfor me.
Let's quickly go over our picks.
Personal key moments, so theseare our favorite moments, our

(09:02):
worst moments, and an honorablemention.
So for our best moment, or ourAvatar State moment, no surprise
to you, probably, but my AvatarState moment was a flashback to
Lu Ten's funeral, because I knowI'm not the only one.
I was in tears.
I'm not generally one to to cryeasily in shows and movies, but
this one got me, let me tellyou.

(09:24):
It just had to be my AvatarState moment.
There was no contest.
It good.
What about you?

Wes (09:31):
I'm gonna go everyone the cartoon and the did an awesome
job with this and it is theminstrels

Pauline (09:41):
Secret

Wes (09:42):
Secret tunnel secret tunnel

Pauline (09:46):
Both of our Avatar State moments included two
iconic songs, which we willdefinitely talk about here in
just a minute.
But let's

Wes (09:54):
have more

Pauline (09:55):
Oh, yeah,

Wes (09:55):
can I add more?
like it's like moments as plural

Pauline (09:58):
Yeah,

Wes (09:58):
okay, so another key moment for me in this episode was
Katara finding her water bottleor, what she was going to store
her water

Pauline (10:07):
in.
Yes.
The

Wes (10:07):
So that was big.

Pauline (10:09):
Was that your avatar?
Was that a tie for your avatarstate moment?

Wes (10:12):
No, it's just a key moment for It's one of

Pauline (10:14):
my, it was an honorable mention then.
No.

Wes (10:17):
No I, you have, you have written key moments, right?

Pauline (10:21):
Yeah.
Are three key

Wes (10:22):
Avatar state moments?

Pauline (10:24):
No, look, there's no s It's not plural, but go

Wes (10:28):
my, geez.
So I shouldn't be talking aboutthis right What about my last
one was Bumi, totally Bolin-ing?
Which I

Pauline (10:37):
can, what do you mean?

Wes (10:38):
Bolin from Korra, right?
So he takes the rocks and thenhe starts cutting them into disc
and throwing them at Aang.

Pauline (10:44):
Oh,

Wes (10:45):
That was awesome.
Right?
You know how they do that withthe where they're competing?
We should know

Pauline (10:50):
The uh, the, oh my gosh, my brain is mush right
now.
The Bending Arena.
That was a cool moment.
What was your That's Rough Buddymoment?
So this is your least favorite.

Wes (11:00):
This is your least favorite.
My least this is very picky,because I love this episode, but
the, when The thing that I'mlike gosh dang Was when they
reveal Bumi's body, right?
So yes, he's super old, but Ilove what the cartoon, he's
ripped the dude is stacked likethe Empire State Building and

Pauline (11:25):
Considering his

Wes (11:26):
his old age, I mean, it's considered ripped, but yeah.
I have some thoughts on

Pauline (11:35):
I have some thoughts on

Wes (11:37):
I've heard the saying, I

Pauline (11:40):
I've heard the saying, but I really don't know what
that means.
Okay, so my rough buddy momentwas, it also has to do with King
Bumi but it was that momentduring his second challenge with
the crystals in the hallway.
It just did not, it just didn'tmake sense to me.
I have some gripes with thatscene and really with all of
Aang's interactions with KingBumi, but I will save it for our

(12:02):
analysis.
And then do you have any otherhonorable mentions?
I do.
The Earth Kingdom soldier thatinteracted with Uncle Iroh
throughout the episode reallyadded some layers to both just
Earth Kingdom citizens andsoldiers and to Uncle Iroh as
well.
I think whenever they first hadtheir interaction, that was the

(12:22):
moment that the episode turnedfor me.
Whoever that actor is I didn'tget a chance to look it up, but
he was really

Wes (12:28):
get a chance to look it up, but he was really good.
That's what I did, and she'slike, no that's, that's all me.

Pauline (12:50):
Mhmm.

Wes (12:51):
I thought that was awesome.
Um, and the Stoner Singers.
That's what I'm going with.
I'm done with saying theminstrels.
Cause all I do is giggle.
But, I'm gonna call them theStoner Singers.

Pauline (13:02):
Okay, the Secret Tunnel Stoner Singers.
Alright, so I like yourhonorable

Wes (13:07):
mentions.
I liked yours.
Moving on.
Are you ready to talk about thisepisode?
And how do you want to go about

Pauline (13:13):
The way I want to frame this episode and the events is
surrounding the theme, butbefore we do, because that's
really going to be getting intothe meat of what we're going to
talk about, I want to go aheadand get this part out of the
way.
As I mentioned, we got twoiconic music moments and I want
to shout them out and just talkabout them a little bit before
we get into the rest.
Let's start with the lighthearted one.

(13:34):
We already talked about SecretTunnel.
For those who have never seenthe cartoon, and this is your
first exposure to Avatar, TheLast Airbender, Secret Tunnel is
iconic.
It's light hearted.
It's funny.
The characters are pretty muchthe exact same as how they were
in the cartoon.
Very like hippie like and theysing the song about the tunnel.
They sing a bunch of songs,really.

(13:55):
But this was like the main onethat everybody references when
it comes to the Avatar fandom.
What did you think about theexecution of the song?

Wes (14:04):
I liked it.
Although his character voicedidn't match the singing voice,
I mean, Just being picky.
We were all singing along.

Pauline (14:12):
I agree with you about the voice.
It was too neat and too cleansounding.
I am gonna say something thatnot everybody's gonna agree
with.
I don't like that it was putinto this episode.

Wes (14:25):
Why do you say

Pauline (14:27):
I don't know, it just felt a little out of place.

Wes (14:30):
You're talking about secret

Pauline (14:31):
Secret Tunnel,

Wes (14:32):
yeah.
Well,

Pauline (14:32):
I know, I'm very much it because I understand how they
wound up in the tunnels and howthe tunnels fit into the plot
that they've set, trying to finda way under the palace.
I think if I was a first timewatcher I would be like, where
the hell did this come from, whyare there people singing in the
tunnel, they sound auto tunedand also they didn't even do the

(14:54):
whole song, they left out someof the funniest parts of the
songs the part where they go,and die, that was not in there,
I don't know I like SecretTunnel, but I didn't like Secret
Tunnel, I wish it was saved forlater

Wes (15:07):
You're crazy.
It fit right into the episode.
Although we both looked at eachother and said Are they about to

Pauline (15:14):
What about leaves from the vine?

Wes (15:17):
What did you think?

Pauline (15:18):
I will be upfront that I knew leaves from the vine was
coming at some point in seasonone.
The reason why I knew that wasbecause when they had announced
the release of the music scoreon Spotify.
I went ahead and looked it up.
And just fair warning to anybodythat hasn't finished watching
the season, do not look it upbecause a lot of the song titles
are kind of spoilery, especiallyfor this scene.

(15:42):
Because it mentions Lu Ten, sodon't be like me.
Don't do that.
But.
It still got me.
I'm glad that they didn't usethe song with the words.
For those who don't know, Leavesfrom the Vine was from Season 2
in the cartoon and it was sungby the original voice actor for
Uncle Iroh, and his name isMako.
And he passed away afterrecording Season 2.

(16:05):
When the episode aired, they hada whole thing about an honor of
Mako so it holds more weightbeyond what happens to Uncle
Iroh and his son.
And Mako and the voice actor forZuko, who's Dante Basco, also
had a special relationship, verymuch like Iroh and Zuko, so
there's more meaning to it,that's for sure.
So when I heard it I was like,oh no, don't you dare do this to

(16:27):
me!

Wes (16:29):
me! I thought they did great, and then, upon watching
again, I realized in thebackground was his son's yeah,
was very sad.

Pauline (16:38):
I think the reason why I didn't like Secret Tunnel in
the episode was because, havingboth of them I think was too
much.
I knew one of them was going toget overshadowed.
Even though both songs, reallyshows the duality of Avatar, The
Last Airbender.
You have Secret Tunnel that isfunny and light hearted and is
like a joke, and then you haveLeaves from the Vine, which is

(16:59):
very serious, it pulls at yourheartstrings, and that is what
Avatar, The Last Airbender is.
But do you think it was finethat they had both or do you
think we would have been able toappreciate each a little bit
better if they were in twodifferent episodes.

Wes (17:13):
Well, I guess I'll answer your question with another
question.
Do you think they'll bring itback?

Pauline (17:19):
Either one of them, you mean?
Right.
I don't think they'll bringSecret Tunnel back.
I can see them bringing back thetheme of Leaves from the Vine at
some point down the

Wes (17:28):
So are you okay with bringing back both?

Pauline (17:31):
Not Secret Tunnel.
I think it needs to be a one anddone thing.

Wes (17:35):
Okay.

Pauline (17:35):
But Leaves from the Vine has such a deeper meaning
that I would like for it to comeback, except they have to do it
right.
Either you don't have thelyrics, or you have the original
recording

Wes (17:49):
original recorded

Pauline (17:58):
I don't think they should have anybody else sing
the song, because for those thatdon't know, the voice actor that
did replace Mako, he does notsing the song for fans out of
respect for Mako.
I think the fandom would be verymad if somebody

Wes (18:11):
fandom I disagree.
I think, I don't see anydisrespect in them singing the
song.
Okay, well

Pauline (18:17):
Fair enough, I will respectfully disagree.
Let's move on to talking aboutwhat happened in this episode
and we'll do it by discussingthe theme.
Um, and the events that surroundthe theme.
I had identified as a theme forthis episode is,"What difficult
choices do the characters facein times of darkness?" And I

(18:39):
want to say that a lot of thedarkness here probably is loss
for a lot of the characters.
I want to explore that a littlebit.
What are some of the difficultchoices that these characters
have to make in this episode?
And I think we can just discussthem in the order that they
happen.
Does that sound good?

Wes (18:56):
good?
Let's get into it.

Pauline (18:58):
I hope Baymax chewing on his toy in the background
isn't being picked up right now,Okay, so first let's start off
with Sai.
We find out that he is facedwith a choice of either exposing
the Fire Nation or betraying theEarth Kingdom.
And we find out that he ends upworking with the Fire Nation.

(19:19):
He mentions that it's notnecessarily weapons that he's
supplying the Fire Nation with,but it's quote unquote minor
designs, so we'll see where

Wes (19:27):
that's going.
I disagree with what you'resaying though.
He's not conflicted on exposingthe Fire Nation or betraying the
Earth Kingdom.
He's just trying to keep his sonsafe.

Pauline (19:36):
safe.
True, but he's still having tomake a choice.
Does he work for the Fire Nationor not.
And he chooses to help the FireNation in order to protect his
son and protect his family.
He says to Sokka,"You know whatit means to make hard choices,"
and he references Sokka'sfather, but,

Wes (19:55):
His father would never do something

Pauline (19:57):
says that to him, and that was a sore spot for Sai,
because, you're comparing twodifferent fathers here.
And I think a lot in thisepisode and in this season,
there's a lot of comparisonsbetween fathers but that's a
theme for another day.
So we have Sai and his decisionto help the Fire Nation.
And then we're over to Jet.
We already know from the lastepisode that he had the decision

(20:19):
to either fight the Fire Nationat all costs or if he's just
gonna stand by.
And he says to Katara,"Here, youhave to make hard decisions.
And we all know how much youlove Jet.

Wes (20:32):
Jet's a coward.

Pauline (20:35):
he chooses to fight even at the expense of innocent
lives.
That's his decision.

Wes (20:41):
Yeah, I take it back.
Jet's not a coward, he'sselfish.

Pauline (20:45):
Yes, he's selfish, he's lost his way, We mentioned last
episode that it started off withgood intentions, but he has
crossed the line and Katara isbasically like, bye, Felicia.

Wes (20:56):
Felicia.

Pauline (20:56):
Side note, she learned how to freeze water really fast.
I don't know where that camefrom, but

Wes (21:02):
it came from her inspiration from Jet, telling
her to not think about how yourmom died, but how your mom
lived.

Pauline (21:07):
Right.
I still think she's learningthings a little bit too fast,
but maybe it's just because I'mcomparing it to the cartoon in
my head.

Wes (21:13):
Hard not to do,

Pauline (21:14):
I know doing I'm not, I'm not gonna get too hung up

Wes (21:17):
This is not

Pauline (21:17):
the cartoon It's not the cartoon.
You have to tell yourself

Wes (21:20):
I have to do it all the time.

Pauline (21:21):
Yes.
Okay.
And then we have.
Zuko he's faced a couple timesin this episode with difficult
decisions, but here has thedecision to either capture Aang
or find his uncle

Wes (21:34):
it was very on the mentioned this before

Pauline (21:42):
Yeah, that was a little bit too on the nose.
I mentioned this before.
I wish Avatar would be a littlebit more subtle sometimes
because they're like Oh, if youhaven't gotten it by now, if you
haven't picked up what we'reputting down, here it is, this
is what they're doing, andthat's why it was a little too
easy to find the theme of thisepisode, and this kind of took
away the fun of it, because theybeat us over the head so many

(22:05):
times throughout.
You gotta make a choice.
You gotta make a choice.
The guard says, what are yougonna do?
You just gonna stand there?
He didn't have to say that.
We know what Zuko is conflictedwith at this moment.
His choice right now is thedifference between ensuring his
chance to return home or savingsomebody that he cares about.
And what does he choose?
He chooses to find his uncle.

(22:26):
We'll leave Zuko there for now.
Over to Aang.
When he gets taken to King Bumi,he comes across his first test
that Bumi gives him.

Wes (22:36):
Yes, which I believe he passes..
The, you know, the feast.
I think

Pauline (22:44):
you might be right.
So this test, he is offeredeither short ribs from kangaroo
island as his meal or Seaweedstew and he chooses the stew.
What do you think is the reasonfor this test?

Wes (22:56):
I don't know, because Bumi knows that it's Aang, so is he
testing Aang to see if Aangknows his true self?

Pauline (23:04):
Maybe he's unsure.
Prove to me that you really areAang?

Wes (23:08):
Yeah, I don't know.
I didn't get, I didn't getanything past that because Aang
never really passed anythingother than that

Pauline (23:15):
Bumi must have known that at some point that he's a
vegetarian and that's why heoffered him these two choices.
That's the only reason I canthink of.
What did you think of KingBumi's jokes and his real life
laugh track?
I like it.

Wes (23:29):
The character, the actor, was great.
Just wanted him ripped.

Pauline (23:35):
A lot of the jokes, I love that they lifted it right
from the cartoon.
Now, something they did change,though, is that they revealed
who King Bumi was immediately,rather than leaving his identity
a secret.
Did you like that change, or no?

Wes (23:48):
I think it was okay.
It worked out.
What did you think?

Pauline (23:51):
I didn't like it.
I think it would've been moremeaningful if they had left King
Bumi's identity more of asecret.
It gives us something toquestion throughout, we're
trying to solve this littlemystery here.
Who is this king and why is heacting like this?
I'm distracted because Baymaxjust farted and it stinks!
Thanks Baymax!

Wes (24:11):
So I like how they worked in Appa's Whistle, in that it
was originally Bumi's, was it agift?
But it was for, it was supposedto be a badgermole.
So I thought that was

Pauline (24:22):
cool.
Does that make up for uh, beforeyou said you didn't like that
Aang had the whistle

Wes (24:27):
It does make up for it because I thought they really
did a good job of working in howhe got the whistle.

Pauline (24:34):
It was a meaningful way of Aang coming across the
whistle.

Wes (24:38):
Yeah, and then showing their friendship.

Pauline (24:40):
I don't think they showed enough of their
friendship though.
Let's go ahead and get this outof the way.
Thoughts on Bumi himself.
You said already that you wishhe was a little bit more ripped.

Wes (24:49):
more ripped.

Pauline (24:50):
I didn't have much of a problem with, his physical
appearance from the neck down.
My issue was that you could tellclearly that his face, that's
not the actual actor's face.
And I know that they're tryingto age him up, but there was
like a disconnect.
I could just tell it was likeface prosthetics or something.

(25:10):
They're trying to tell us he'sold, but he doesn't seem old.
He still has youthful eyes.
It didn't look realistic.
I kind of wish that they wouldhave just found an older actor?
I'm sure there's somebody olderthat could pull off like the
martial arts moves and thefighting.
I know it's gonna be harder tofind somebody that looks like
they're a hundred years old andcan move like that.

(25:31):
So I, that was more of my griperather than whether his body
looked

Wes (25:35):
know, I feel like he could put on Craigslist, Guy that
looks old,

Pauline (25:39):
kidding.
But going back to what I wassaying about him and Aang's
friendship, I feel like eitherthey cut out stuff or just
didn't plan enough screen timefor their friendship in that
flashback.
That's why I felt theirinteractions and their
relationship just seemed veryhollow.

Wes (25:56):
I agree.
I can go on and on because Ididn't think that Bumi really
taught Aang anything.
I think they were on a verge ofteaching Aang something, and
then he got bailed out by hisfriends.
Bumi said, making decisionsfalls to Aang, but then he
didn't learn anything becausehis friends saved him.
He never learned anythingbecause his friends bailed him

(26:18):
out.
So I guess I didn't understandwhat the lesson he was trying to
teach

Pauline (26:21):
I agree with you.
I can see where they were tryingto go with it, but I think it
missed the mark.
And we'll talk about the secondtest and the final test when we,
cross that bridge.
That's the first test, initialthoughts on Bumi.
It moves over to Sokka andKatara in the tunnel and they
come across the minstrels and weget the story of Oma and Shu
just like they did in thecartoon.

(26:41):
In the story Shu had the choiceto declare the war over, instead
of destroying everybody and thenthe villagers helped build the
city of Omashu, where they allcould live together

Wes (26:53):
Yeah.
very beautiful

Pauline (26:54):
beautiful story.
Very beautiful story.
So even within the story withinthe story, they have that theme
of, choice and, how that affectseverything.
Did you like how the minstrelstold this story?

Wes (27:07):
I liked how the stoner told the story.
No, I do.
I thought it was verybeautifully done.
I liked everything about thesecret tunnel and the story.
What did you think

Pauline (27:19):
On its own, I liked it.
I just, again, felt a little bitout of place with everything
else going on.
But I do like that they kepttrue to the style the artwork.

Wes (27:30):
What didn't you like?
I mean, It worked out.
They're down there in thetunnels to get to the

Pauline (27:35):
Okay, I think this is it.
I think here it is.
With Leaves from The Vine beingin the same episode, it almost
felt like, oh, we need to fit asmany Easter eggs or as many
callbacks to the original andreferences into this one episode
for some reason, or even intothis season.
Secret Tunnel and Oma and Shuand the minstrels didn't happen

(27:56):
until season two, so I feel likethings were being shoehorned in
I don't think it was

Wes (28:03):
don't think it was necessary.
I think you're right.
Um, We're just very oppositebetween last

Pauline (28:23):
I think you're right.
We're just very opposite betweenlast episode and this episode.
And I think even two episodesago what we like and we don't
we're

Wes (28:31):
very close.

Pauline (28:31):
and also just want to shout out, Oma and Shu are both
women in this version.
I thought that was cool, theymentioned it and moved on, and
it was just a fact.

Wes (28:40):
The Cave of Two Lovers, and the menstruals.

Pauline (28:43):
We'll talk about the Sokka and Katara part here in
just a little bit.

Wes (28:46):
I just got it, hold on.
The Menstruals and the Cave ofTwo Lovers.

Pauline (28:51):
What?

Wes (28:53):
I can't.
I can't.
Minstrels.
Okay.
Okay.
Minstrels.
Okay.
Can we just call them thestoners?
Because everyone's on theirmenstruals.

Pauline (29:03):
Stop! Okay, moving on.
We'll get back to Sokka andKatara because now it cuts back
to Aang and the second

Wes (29:15):
What is the second test?

Pauline (29:16):
I think the second test was just what path should he
take, but this was my roughbuddy moment because I hated
this part.
I agree.
Hate's a

Wes (29:25):
what he learns here.

Pauline (29:26):
Here's what I dissected from this scene.
I had to watch it several timesjust to get something out of it.
So Aang says to Bumi he doesn'thave a choice but to go north to
the Northern Water Tribe.
You know, He has a mission.
And then Bumi says to Aang, thedirect path is not always the
best path.
Good advice,

Wes (29:44):
went, yeah,

Pauline (29:44):
And immediately, Aang happens to take a wrong step and
triggers the Creeping Crystals,and

Wes (29:51):
There's a rock candy.

Pauline (29:52):
what was the point?
What was the point?
Besides, Bumi, at the end of thescene, says there are no easy
journeys for the Avatar, butAang didn't even get a chance to
make a choice

Wes (30:03):
And by the way, just, he just, he just blows them away,
and then you just keep goingstraight.

Pauline (30:10):
What did he, I mean,

Wes (30:11):
I don't know, it was cool.

Pauline (30:13):
said, there's no easy journey, the crystals, the
rocks, really had nothing to dowith it because it didn't teach
Aang a lesson.
All it taught me was that Bumiis crazy.
But maybe, like you said, maybeit'll come back in the future,
maybe they're referencing afuture choice because this
hallway was juststraightforward.

(30:34):
There is no different

Wes (30:35):
straight forward.
There was

Pauline (30:41):
like brought it up

Wes (30:42):
patterns.
he it

Pauline (30:47):
so what path into maybe he could have flown over,

Wes (30:51):
I

Pauline (30:51):
didn't get it.
I was like, what the hell, Bumi?
Whatever.
Moving on before, because Ithink the more we try to make
sense of it, the more it's goingto not make sense.
And maybe that's the whole pointof Bumi.

Wes (31:01):
He's cray cray.

Pauline (31:02):
And he was in the cartoon.
I will say the actor did Bumi'svoice perfectly.
I'm guessing that was one of themain reasons they chose him,
anyways, now it jumps back toSokka and Katara in the secret
tunnels.
And they are faced with thechoice of do we follow the map
or do we follow the crystals?
I also have gripes about thisone.
Do you want to know why?

Wes (31:22):
Why?

Pauline (31:23):
Sokka and Katara's roles and attitudes should have
been reversed in this.
Katara is the one that's beingskeptical, Sokka is the one
that's going on about listeningto the minstrels and their
advice about love and love makesthe world go round.
Right.
And that, they should listen tothe advice of what the stoner
people, the stoner people said.

(31:45):
For one, in the cartoon, it wasthe other way around.
Sokka was not a big fan of them.
And I don't mean to makecomparisons but even in this
version since episode 1 Sokkahas been skeptic he's been
trying to think more logicallythat's just who he is so it felt
out of character that he wasgoing on about love and

(32:07):
following the crystals andditching the map Do you agree?

Wes (32:13):
I think the stoners unlocked his, optimism they gave
him that little

Pauline (32:17):
shaker.
What did they give him?

Wes (32:19):
like they unlocked his love.

Pauline (32:21):
They gave him a little more than the

Wes (32:23):
Yeah, maybe They gave him some of that ganja.
I don't

Pauline (32:26):
don't know.
And then Katara, she's the onethat's a little bit more hopeful
and optimistic than Sokka, butshe's the one that's like,
"Sokka, what are you doing?
You need to listen to me.
The crystals don't meananything."

Wes (32:40):
I agree.
I see what you're saying.
The roles should have beenreversed.

Pauline (32:45):
It just felt very out of character.

Wes (32:46):
I didn't have a problem with that scene, by the way.
But, I see what you're saying.

Pauline (32:50):
How did you feel about the changes that they made?
The big one being that it'sSokka in the secret tunnel with
Katara versus Aang.
Do you think that changed theimpact of the tunnels?

Wes (33:02):
Well, first of all, when they first went into the
tunnels, I'm like, oh my gosh,Pauline, they're about to

Pauline (33:07):
kiss.
Because it's the cave of two

Wes (33:10):
but we cannot compare it to the cartoon.
Right.
Forgetting about the cartoon.
Just watching what's happening.
It was, they did a good job.
Love they ended up loving eachother.
Sister brotherly love.
Yeah.

Pauline (33:24):
Not to be confused with the Lannisters from Game of
Thrones.

Wes (33:29):
Let's not get off track here.
By the way, Badgermole wasawesome.

Pauline (33:36):
Badger Mole was scary!

Wes (33:38):
it was awesome.

Pauline (33:39):
my goodness, it was pretty cool.
That was another slight change,love is greatest in the dark was
referring to the badgermoles inthis version rather than
referring to the light from thecrystals.

Wes (33:50):
Correct, they can sense love.

Pauline (33:52):
They can sense love, they're blind

Wes (33:54):
But they also took commands from Sokka.

Pauline (33:56):
commands from Sokka.
I, They can understand English,okay and Katara figured that all
out pretty quickly for somebodythat hasn't been outside of her
village until recently, butokay.

Wes (34:08):
Let's move on.

Pauline (34:08):
on.
On a positive note, something Idid love about the secret tunnel
scenes was the blue and theorange contrast because they had
the lanterns and then the cavewas imbued with this blue hue.
We are attracted to that blueand orange contrast because the
blue and orange are contrastingcolors.

Wes (34:27):
Use contrast one more

Pauline (34:28):
Contrast.
They are like with the colorwheel and stuff.
Anyways, I won't get too muchinto it, but we subconsciously
find appeal in that blue andorange.
Okay, let's move over to theEarth Kingdom soldier that was
with Uncle Iroh.
He was faced with the decisionof, Do I kill Iroh in my rage or
hold back?
The soldier's angry because helost his brother and it's

(34:51):
because of Iroh And we alreadyshouted this guy out, but it
also, he also shows that thereare bad players on both sides.
So you have bad people on theFire Nation side and then,
between this soldier and theneverything with Jet in the last
episode, the quote unquote goodguys everybody not on the Fire
Nation side, they're notnecessarily great people too.

(35:12):
Everybody's pushed to

Wes (35:13):
Well, it's war.
I thought they had anopportunity in this, these
scenes with Iroh and the earthKingdom Soldier.
I thought we were going to seeIroh really soften to the fact
that he was a killer, right?
And that's not how it reallyplayed out.
Um, Because one of my favoritequotes, which we're going to go
ahead, I'll go ahead and do.

(35:34):
I see that you have Not as yourfavorite quote, but it's one of
my quotes, which is coming fromIroh,"War pushes us to the edge.
Some of us don't like what wefind." but he's saying, I'm not
talking about me.
He was talking about the EarthKingdom soldier, but, isn't he
talking about himself?

Pauline (35:53):
I'm glad you brought that up.
Cause I, I was gonna questionthis too.
He was forcing the soldier to,basically look at himself.
But I think subconsciously, ormaybe after the tension is
broken, Iroh realizes he'spulling from his experience too.
It is also about Iroh.

(36:14):
And I thought that was very

Wes (36:15):
that was that was a very He didn't burn to a crisp.
Oh,

Pauline (36:30):
He didn't burn him to a crisp.
Oh, you mean the brother?

Wes (36:32):
Well,

Pauline (36:33):
Well, I think you're completely right that he was
talking about the soldier, buthe was also referencing himself.
Maybe he didn't realize it, butI feel like everything Iroh says
is really coming from his ownlife experience.

Wes (36:47):
With that quote, he's saying that to the soldier.
Iroh still knows nothing aboutthis soldier other than the
soldier feels sorrow for hisbrother and wants some kind of
redemption.

Pauline (36:57):
He can see that this soldier, darkness has taken hold
of his heart too.
He's angry.
He probably wants revenge andhe's given into the darkness a
little bit, calling back to, thetitle of the episode.
And I think Iroh was forcing himto take a look at himself and

(37:18):
what are you, what is it you'reabout to do right now?
The whole time they've beentraveling, this guy has been
beating on him and has beentreating him inhumanely, so I
think what Iroh said was toforce him to look at, look at
what you're doing.
If you take a good, long, hardlook at yourself, look at how
far you've fallen to thedarkness.
But the moment is broken afterthe soldier chooses to spare

(37:39):
him.
That's his choice.
He chooses to spare him, saying,you know, nothing of loss.
And Iroh gets this look after,and you get that little glimpse
of there's something there thatIroh is thinking about.
So I want to go ahead and getinto the flashback.
It also references Iroh's pastdecision to lay siege to Ba Sing
Se.
Iroh is known as the Dragon ofthe West.

Wes (38:01):
Yes, and he was a butcher.

Pauline (38:03):
Because he made the choice to attack Ba Sing Se for
600 days.
Ruthless.
It's war.
Iroh was a soldier.
It was a different time.
It causes Iroh to think aboutwhat did his decision cost him?
What did his war decision cost

Wes (38:20):
You would have to really look into this because if you
haven't watched the cartoon, Ifeel like they didn't do a very
great job with this scene.
be just because you don't reallyknow Iroh right now in the live
action.

Pauline (38:35):
But leading into this flashback is how the show is
getting the viewers to get toknow Iroh and get a glimpse of
his background and hisexperiences because the fact
that it flashbacks to his son'sfuneral shows there were
consequences to Iroh's decisionas a soldier.
He made the decision to attackBa Sing Se and it cost him his

(38:56):
son.
You hear from one of thecharacters there.
They say he chose to abandon thesiege after his son died.
And his son's gonna beremembered as a hero, but Iroh's
gonna be remembered as a coward.

Wes (39:10):
Right, the Fire Lord was your son's sacrifice enshrined,
basically.
And then Zuko comes in and saysYou both made a sacrifice.

Pauline (39:20):
Yeah, oh, this scene killed me

Wes (39:23):
was a great

Pauline (39:24):
It was so good.
Oh my gosh, where do I evenbegin?
It was my absolute favorite.
Besides the story that thisscene is telling, what really
made this scene for me was thelighting and the color, first of
all.
It had this soft, diffused,glowing lighting cool shadows,
warm highlights.
I loved how they did thisflashback.
It is repeated in the secondflashback as well.

(39:47):
But, oh my god, it felt very sadand heartbreaking.
They included the symbolism ofLu Ten's medal, right?
Zuko told Iroh that Lu Ten gaveme this medal and Lu Ten said
that it belongs to somebodywho's destined to do great
things but then decides thatUncle Iroh should have it.
So I think the significance ofZuko coming into possession of

(40:09):
this medal and then It's in thepossession of Uncle Iroh, I
think is pretty significant.
And then Lu Ten's portrait.
You mentioned that it was in thebackground, which is a callback
to the portrait in the cartoon.
And again, the music when Leavesfrom the Vine started playing in
the background.
That was it.
I was done.
I was crying.

Wes (40:27):
The actor that played Iroh did an amazing job.
And all that, I mean he didn'thave to say anything.
And just his face, the lighthitting, glaring off of his face
and his glorious beard.
But no, it was, I had a littlebit of tear,

Pauline (40:44):
they did a good job.
Both Paul Sun-Hyung Lee andDallas Liu, who plays Zuko both
did a phenomenal job here.
Um, Dallas did great.
That vulnerability.
And again, like I said, themusic is what hit it home.
The

Wes (40:59):
I think I literally, I think you were crying.

Pauline (41:02):
I was crying.
I had tears on my face.
Upon first watching, I didn'teven get to absorb everything in
the scene because I was justcrying.
When we watched it a secondtime, I cried.
When skimming through the scenesthe third time, as I do, I still
cried.
I,

Wes (41:17):
Yeah, I had to, I had to make a joke like, pfft, this is
stupid.
That's what you

Pauline (41:23):
when you start getting the feels.
You like to make

Wes (41:26):
jokes.
It was a great scene, good job.

Pauline (41:28):
Favorite scene of the whole series so far for me.
Moving on from the flashback orelse I'm gonna start crying
again.
Let's just go ahead and stickwith Iroh whenever Zuko does
finally find him, thanks to theWhite Lotus tile, I love how
that came into play again.
What did you think of the fightwhere Iroh and Zuko, teamed up

(41:50):
and fought the Earth Kingdom

Wes (41:51):
I thought that was the best bending moments, their fire
bending in that, and Zuko's abadass.

Pauline (41:57):
They're both badasses.
This fight was adapted reallywell, and also it had some
pretty cool callbacks to thecartoon.
First of all, Zuko's legstrength?
I don't know.
He broke the chains.
Just with his leg.
No fire.
Just his

Wes (42:11):
fire, just his leg.
No,

Pauline (42:14):
gave his, no, it was even in the cartoon.
It was his leg.
It was all his, it was

Wes (42:19):
was leg

Pauline (42:21):
No, he did not skip leg day.
Iroh's use of the chain whips.
Difference though, he's notnaked in this one like in

Wes (42:27):
one.
Yeah, yeah, what the

Pauline (42:28):
Yeah, what the heck?

Wes (42:31):
If we're gonna compare the cartoon and live action, we want
him naked, okay?
With that beard would beawesome.

Pauline (42:37):
Those who haven't seen the cartoon, Uncle Iroh during
this whole encaptured sceneyeah, he's basically naked
except for a little cloth.
Yeah, he even

Wes (42:44):
lost his stinky shoes, or his

Pauline (42:46):
It was like Tarzan, with the,

Wes (42:48):
we're talking about the fight scene.
Um, before the fight scene likereally went down, I had a
comment of did the Earth Kingdomwarrior slap or punch Iroh when
he was in chains?

Pauline (43:00):
The rest of the time he slapped

Wes (43:01):
Yeah, it was

Pauline (43:02):
slap, But he also did punch him in the gut

Wes (43:04):
though.
Right, the punch, and then itwas a slap?
Okay, that's very

Pauline (43:08):
disrespectful.
That is

Wes (43:09):
As a man, you better punch me.
You slap me?
Dude, I'm in chains and you slapme?
Yeah seriously, I don't know whyI was like, I had to rewind, I'm
like, wait a minute, I think heslapped him.
Like dude,

Pauline (43:20):
Yeah, insult to injury.

Wes (43:22):
What disrespect.

Pauline (43:24):
But then after this fight, the tables do turn, and
now it's Iroh that has thedecision, whereas before, the
soldier had the decision tosmash Iroh with his
earthbending, Iroh now has theopportunity to roast this guy or
spare him.
And Iroh, in true Iroh fashion,chooses to spare

Wes (43:45):
know what he says?

Pauline (43:47):
He says something about there's been enough war, right?
seen enough death.
Oh, we've all seen enough

Wes (43:53):
enough death.
And another one of my memorablequotes.
So I guess we can skip that whenwe come over it.
But no, that was it was reallygreat.
That backfires on him, doesn't

Pauline (44:02):
it?
Yeah, okay.
Can I just say, anybody that iswalking away from a downed enemy
but they're not dead, you Walkbackwards, okay?
Walk backwards, don't take youreye off of your enemy, because
the moment that you do, theygetcha.
He gets stabbed in the back,literally, with a rock and

Wes (44:23):
to look into there, foreshadowing.

Pauline (44:26):
After that, it cuts to Aang, and his final test, and in
this one He's faced with adecision of let Boomi die or get
himself killed.
So they're having to fight tothe death.
And the lesson that Bumi istrying to teach here is that
Aang needs to learn how to makeimpossible choices as the
avatar.
He gave examples of, save thistown or that.

(44:49):
Food rations.
Do the orphans get it?
Or the soldiers, similar to theEarth Kingdom soldier, when he
mentioned his brother chose togive food and water rations from
their platoon to children inneed and Bumi says these are
choices we made day after day,year after year, and you don't
know that because you haven'tbeen here.
So that was supposed to be thelesson of this test.

(45:10):
Bumi's trying to convince him,let the rock fall on Bumi.

Wes (45:13):
Yes.
I was very confused in thiswhole scene.
Because I thought this was gonnabe great, right?
Mhmm.
Which it was still good, I seeboth sides here.
Bumi was gonna make him make achoice, right?
His friends come and save him,get him out of the situation.
What did Aang learn here?
That his friends can help him,right?
you can lean on your friends.

Pauline (45:34):
What does Aang choose?

Wes (45:35):
He doesn't choose!

Pauline (45:36):
exactly.

Wes (45:38):
Oh, I see, okay, but

Pauline (45:41):
he chooses

Wes (45:41):
right?
so basically Aang's like, no,you can rely on your friends.
So does that mean that hisfriends are gonna help him make
a decision on what town to save?
So they're gonna hold the burdenas well.

Pauline (45:52):
As kids do, it's a very short sighted way of seeing it,
because right now, all they'rethinking about is saving the
world from the Fire Nation, stopthe Fire Nation, and that's
their goal.
And his friends are gonna helpwith that.
I think they're too naive atthis point to see beyond that,
because you have to think aboutwhat's the fallout after the
war.
But they're kids, they're notgoing to think about that.

(46:13):
They see this one goal.
This is what they have to do andeverything is going to be fine
and dandy after that.
So yeah, that's what Aang issaying is that his friends are
going to help him save theworld.
And when he chooses, or I guessdoesn't choose, to kill Bumi,
Bumi says,"Then the world isdoomed." But then his friends

(46:34):
come in, helping win thechallenge, I guess, if you
consider it winning.
You don't consider it as passingthe test.

Wes (46:40):
I don't.
I don't.
Like I said, he only passed onetest I think he failed this test
because Bumi was trying to gethim to make a decision and he
never did.

Pauline (46:49):
I can see both sides, but I see where you are coming
from.
I think it's because they didn'texecute the tests well.
In the cartoon, the message gotacross a lot better, but because
of the way they went about it,it was all rushed.
They couldn't dwell on one testfor too long.
It just came off as hollow.

Wes (47:07):
Hollow.

Pauline (47:09):
But then, Bumi sees the whistle, and he comes around,
all of a sudden.
Okay,

Wes (47:15):
all of a

Pauline (47:18):
Yes, so back to Sai.
At the end of this episode, Saicomes back into the picture,
Bumi lets the gang know thatthere is a Fire Nation attack
that is being planned for dawn,but Sai made the decision to rat
out the Fire Nation spies and sothat way they had time to

(47:38):
prepare and probably savedOmashu.
So that was Sai's impact.
So just a nice little neat bowto conclude Sai's character arc
there.
So I did like that.
And then it cuts back to Irohand Zuko after they've escaped.
They find the boat, which, Idon't know where the boat came
from.

Wes (47:58):
Well, don't you know boats are just sitting around?

Pauline (48:01):
Ready for an escape?
Like, where did the boat comefrom?

Wes (48:05):
We don't ask

Pauline (48:07):
I like that Iroh did say like, it seems like we're
pretty much destined to just begetting on

Wes (48:14):
and off boats.
I don't get that either.
That's our lot in life.
We're getting on and off

Pauline (48:18):
Because that's how their journey together started,
was getting on a ship.
And they've spent three years,looking for the Avatar, they've
spent three years

Wes (48:25):
in, so they were on a ship, one ship for three years,

Pauline (48:28):
But they're still, anyways but then this leads to a
flashback of how that journeystarted.
When Iroh decided to join Zuko.
Cause that's one thing thatmaybe first time viewers have
been questioning is, Why issomebody like Iroh with the
banished prince,

Wes (48:44):
Yeah, they wrapped that up

Pauline (48:46):
Iroh is then faced in his flashback He's faced with a
decision to stay in the firenation or follow his nephew And
of course he chooses to joinZuko and it was just a very
sweet moment.
I cried again It was It

Wes (49:00):
You know why?
You know why they ruined itright at the end?

Pauline (49:05):
Okay, why?

Wes (49:05):
Okay Zuko says I don't need I don't need a babysitter.
He's like, well how about afriend?
And he's like, well we won't behome for a while, it's gonna
take a while.
and he's like, everything on theboat is all I need or whatever,
something like that.
And they're like, they look ateach other and it's going to be
a loving moment and then onegoes like, remember, I have all
the tea I need.
I'm like, what the heck?

(49:26):
So, You want to break thetension by making a joke?

Pauline (49:30):
Hear me out, cause this is you.
We just mentioned it, that whenyou start getting the feels and
start getting vulnerable you,

Wes (49:36):
brought that full

Pauline (49:37):
circle.
You, uh, Make a

Wes (49:39):
no, it was beautiful

Pauline (49:41):
was, It was beautiful.
Here's, Here's the thing.
Both Iroh and Zuko, we've nowseen they both have vulnerable
sides.
But they both mask it with, inIroh's case, humor, and then,
with Zuko, he puts on a toughact.
Iroh was not the only one thatbroke that tender moment,
because when Zuko was stillfacing away from Iroh, you could

(50:04):
see in his face, he's gettingemotional, in his one eye, but
then he straightens up and putson this tough act like, oh, why
I don't need a babysitter, butyou know that he's feeling it,
he is feeling it in his heart,but they both just mask that.
Question though, Do you thinkthat Zuko understood that his
father, the Fire Lord, sent himon an impossible mission.

(50:27):
You think Zuko knows in hisheart, there's a good chance
that I'm not gonna come backhome.

Wes (50:32):
Yeah.
He didn't get hope until hefound the avatar and then he was
scared.

Pauline (50:38):
And then to know that you're also bringing along your
uncle on this impossiblemission.
That's why Zuko was trying towarn Uncle Iroh that They may
not be back for a long time.
I think what he really wanted tosay is, We may never see home
again.
If you come with me, we maynever see home again.
Yet, Iroh makes the choice tojoin him.
Oh, it's so touching!

Wes (51:00):
heart it's touching! I mean, Not in

Pauline (51:05):
Not in those words, but yeah.
He says everything he has onthat ship is home to him.
Yeah.
I love, again, the way thatthey've been doing the
flashbacks in this episode, withthat very soft lighting, the
color, ah man, it just got me.
Leaves from the Vine startedplaying in the background again,
I started crying again but Ilove how they brought that

(51:26):
moment back to that little boatwhen they were escaping.
Zuko sees Appa flying, and heknows that the Avatar is getting
away.
He's faced with a choice tofollow the Avatar or get his
uncle to safety, and he choosesto prioritize his uncle.

Wes (51:44):
Well, to be fair, he's still rowing in the direction
Appa was flying,

Pauline (51:47):
so I know, but still.
I just love how they broughtthat moment back to the boat.
Everything he needs is in thatboat.
Both of them.
Everything they need is in thatsmall little boat that's home.
It's so sweet.

Wes (52:01):
Moving on.

Pauline (52:02):
No, not moving on.
You're crying.
I'm gonna start crying again.
Okay, what did you think abouthow they executed that final
scene?
Cause it was different, a littlebit.

Wes (52:12):
little bit.
Yeah, cause I, again, weshouldn't compare, but we're
going to compare.
In the cartoon, it was UncleIroh seeing Appa fly away, and
then Zuko ask him, what's up?
And he's like, oh, nothing.
Go back to sleep.

Pauline (52:26):
I loved it.
Oh my gosh.
I feel like a lot of theepisodes, they've ended with
Zuko, or like, Zuko and Iroh,and it just makes me excited to
watch the next episode.
That's really one of the mainthings that I'm judging with
these episodes is how eager doesit make me to watch the next

Wes (52:41):
I'm eager as well.

Pauline (52:42):
Like I mentioned earlier, if it wasn't for these
Iroh and Zuko moments, Iwouldn't have rated this episode
nearly as high, and I'm findingmyself getting more and more
invested in Zuko and Iroh overwhat's happening with the A plot
with the Gaang.
What about you?

Wes (52:59):
I agree, I love Zuko.
From the beginning, I've likedZuko.
I did miss Zhao in this episode,

Pauline (53:06):
Oh, yes

Wes (53:06):
but yeah, Zuko

Pauline (53:08):
got a good trade off.
We got the the Earth Kingdomsoldier.

Wes (53:12):
Yeah.
Yeah.
But yeah, I agree.
I'm liking the duo between Irohand Zuko more than what's going
on with the Gaang.

Pauline (53:20):
Yeah, is that a bad thing?

Wes (53:23):
No, we're only on episode three,

Pauline (53:24):
no, this is episode

Wes (53:26):
Oh, sorry, we're only on episode

Pauline (53:27):
We're halfway through.

Wes (53:29):
So, don't worry.
It's gonna get way better.

Pauline (53:32):
Okay, I think so too.
We talked about so much.
Was there anything in your notesthat we missed?
Any other difficult choices thatwe didn't

Wes (53:39):
Oh, there's something I wanted to talk about real quick,
was when the Mechanist Sai, whenSai got the letter while he was
talking with Sokka, they heard abang on the door, right?
So, just the physics of it all,do you put the letter on the
knife and then throw the knife?
Or, how does the letter, do youtoss the letter up in the air,

(54:01):
throw the knife, it sticks tothe knife and then lands in the
door?
Like I just want to know how the

Pauline (54:07):
happens.
Do you want to know what I woulddo?
What?
I'd walk up to the door, holdthe letter up to the door, and
just stick a

Wes (54:12):
letter up to the door and stick a knife in it.
That would be

Pauline (54:27):
That would be the cooler thing because then you're
not gonna, you're not gonna becaught going up to the door.

Wes (54:31):
How would, how did the note get on the knife?

Pauline (54:34):
everything that happened in this episode, that's
what you were wondering

Wes (54:38):
I really want to know how that would work out.
Do you throw the note in the airand then throw the knife and
then the note sticks to the, oris it Pauline's way?
You just walked up, you justwalked up to the door.
What, they, the spies alreadydressed in red.
So really that's probably whathappened.
Okay, all right, sorry.
What do you have anything

Pauline (54:56):
else?
No, was that

Wes (54:57):
that was it, I'm sorry, that's been bugging me.

Pauline (55:01):
Alrighty, so then let's get into our favorite bending
moment.
I'll go ahead and go first.
Besides the tearbending that Idid, my favorite was Iroh's
fiery chain whip, closelyfollowed by Zuko's jumping
roundhouse kick with the fire.
Yeah,

Wes (55:17):
so you liked the fire, the whole fire fight.

Pauline (55:20):
yeah, the firebenders have been killing it literally
in this season.
But I think a lot of it isbecause of Iroh and Zuko.
What about

Wes (55:30):
That was one of mine I would say I've already, probably
already talked about the otherone, which was Bumi doing

Pauline (55:36):
Like the earthbending disc

Wes (55:38):
Yeah Bumi's rock bending.
Bumi, oh, bumi doing the Bolin.
His best, Bumi's bestinterpretation of Bolin.

Pauline (55:45):
Yeah, for those who don't know, Bolin is a
character.
We mentioned Korra earlier, buthe's a character in The Legend
of

Wes (55:52):
it was really awesome when he, made the column of rock and
then cut him in.

Pauline (55:57):
Yeah, they did a really good job with earthbending.
That was gonna be my second andthen I know there was a callback
to a moment in the cartoon, Aangjumps to dodge that boulder, and
there's like the slow mo.
I think he does like a

Wes (56:09):
Which one was it the first time or the second thing?
I think

Pauline (56:12):
remember.
I think the second time, the onewhere it's

Wes (56:14):
coming towards him and hit his foot?

Pauline (56:16):
No, the other time, and it was like all slow

Wes (56:18):
So it was coming behind him and then heading towards

Pauline (56:20):
Yes, and it narrowly misses him.
That was a callback to, I can'tremember what episode or what
moment in the cartoon, but thereis a moment just like that same
like camera angle andeverything,

Wes (56:30):
so it, it was when Aang was fighting Bumi in the cartoon,
they did the same Oh, was thesame?
Yeah, they did the same.
And then the rock hit Bumi,

Pauline (56:37):
So I thought that was cool.

Wes (56:38):
Who was your favorite character?

Pauline (56:40):
Iroh, all the way, he was the superstar he made this
episode 100 percent and he mademe feel.
That was the most importantthing.
Not only Iroh, but specificallyIroh's trembling chin.
That was the favorite characterof this episode.

Wes (56:56):
Maybe I can't get past the beard to look at the chin.

Pauline (56:59):
All together though, that's a powerful combination.
He had it all in this episode.
I'm just saying.

Wes (57:04):
same.
Is it real?

Pauline (57:06):
What about

Wes (57:06):
What about you?
My favorite character is theirwardrobe, which was Bumi's.
His King outfit was amazing.
The way it sparkled

Pauline (57:14):
Sparkled?

Wes (57:15):
he had like, sparkling things on his shoulders and to
his chest.
His hat was awesome his armpithair.
I know that's not part of thecostume, but.
No his costume was amazing.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I thought it was really cool.

Pauline (57:29):
Shout out to the costume

Wes (57:31):
No joke.
That was

Pauline (57:31):
really awesome.
You're the favorite character.

Wes (57:32):
Okay.
What about our animal ma watch,animal ma What about our animal
watch?

Pauline (57:39):
Yes, we have something besides just the, Ostrich horses
slash chocobos, which they ranaway like scared chickens in
this one.
But Of course, we have thebadger mole.
We

Wes (57:52):
We have the badgermole.

Pauline (57:53):
I originally wrote down badger moles, but I believe we
only had one badger mole inthis.
They're revealed to be theoriginal earthbenders.
they're blind, earthbending isan extension of their senses.
Apparently, they can sensefeelings too.
And, yeah, oh my gosh, they werejust terrifying.
But we already talked about thebadger moles earlier.

Wes (58:11):
I liked it.
The detail was awesome.
The wet nose.
It was cool.
I loved the badgermole.

Pauline (58:18):
I hope we see more badger moles in the future.
And then I don't know if thisone counts because it wasn't
alive, but we saw Flopsystatues.
So Flopsy in the cartoon isBumi's pet goat gorilla.

Wes (58:32):
That's what I thought Bumi was going to call.
Like, He was going to call yourfriend or whatever.
Call on a friend.
I was like, oh, is he about tocall Flopsy?

Pauline (58:42):
blow the whistle and then

Wes (58:43):
and like he comes out, of the statue?

Pauline (58:45):
I would've loved that.
But no, instead they just hadstatues of goat gorillas
throughout the palace.

Wes (58:52):
Is he a goat gorilla?

Pauline (58:53):
It's a goat gorilla.
So it has the face and body of agorilla, and then it has a
goat's hind legs, tail, eyes,and horns.
And then the ears are also thatof a rabbit, but, yes, we have
goat gorillas, but we just hadit in statue form this time
around.
Was there anything else animalwise?

Wes (59:11):
No, it's been very disappointing in the animal
department.
the hybrid animal department isvery lacking,

Pauline (59:19):
so hopefully we get some more, but,

Wes (59:21):
we didn't get to see Momo at all in this episode.
No, we didn't.
Which I miss

Pauline (59:25):
technically.
I don't even think we got to seeAppa except for his shadow or
his silhouette in the sky, soyeah.
Oh, well.
Okay.
We'll just move on to ourmemorable quotes, which you
already gave quite a few.
Did you have any others?

Wes (59:39):
No, I gave you everything I had.

Pauline (59:41):
Okay.
So my favorite quote.
This one was really hard.
The ones that I was thinkingabout, you've already mentioned
them, but I settled on a quotefrom Bumi when he said to Aang,
You may be a hundred years old,but you haven't lived a hundred
years.
I thought that was a good quotebecause, yeah, it just shows
that Aang really is still a kid.
Even though he technically is ahundred years old, he still has

(01:00:02):
a lot to, to learn, and hehasn't been around yeah.
He doesn't quite understand thedynamics of the world just yet,
and I know I keep mentioningthis the past couple episodes,
but it's showing thatconversation between an old
person and a kid, somebody who'smore idealistic and somebody
who's more of a realist.

(01:00:24):
And I love that they keepcalling back to that.
When I go back and rewatch thecartoon, I'm gonna have to look
out for those moments.
Because when we watched this askids, we're gonna side with the
kids, right?
Oh, the kids are the heroes, andboo to all the older people,
they're the bad guys, they don'tknow what they're talking about.
But now that we're older, andwe're millennials, we're kind of

(01:00:45):
in that middle ground where westill have some idealistic
sentiments.
that, the kids have.
But then we also understand whatthe older, wiser, more
experienced characters aresaying.
And we're caught in that middle.
So I think that's why I'mnoticing it a lot because I can
relate to both sides.
I just wanted to throw that outthere.

(01:01:06):
So yeah.

Wes (01:01:07):
um, I like that Bumi is trying to get Aang to realize,
You need to grow up, because,we're not just kids anymore.
Because Aang is, you know, Idon't believe that you've given
up.
You like games and messingaround.
He's like, well, dude, youmissed a hundred years.
I like that.

Pauline (01:01:25):
But Bumi says to Aang, "you still think like a child."
And Aang says,"is that such abad thing?" What do you think?
What?
What's your answer to

Wes (01:01:33):
right now, because they're in the middle of a war.
Yeah.

Pauline (01:01:36):
I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing.
I think of the song uh, like thechildren of the future,

Wes (01:01:43):
the

Pauline (01:01:44):
let them lead the way.
We're also supposed to side withthe kids here too.

Wes (01:01:49):
Okay, so don't ban

Pauline (01:01:51):
don't ban I think that it, wasn't it just in the news
that TikTok won that wholething?
It's not banned, so we stillhave TikTok.
All

Wes (01:02:00):
Let's move on to our question of the week.
Did we get any answers thistime?

Pauline (01:02:08):
We did get a few, so I did include a few of them here.
Awesome.

Our question of the week (01:02:12):
How did Uncle Iroh's flashback make
you feel?
I feel like that's the mainthing that people bring up with
this episode, so we posted thison Facebook and Instagram, so
let me go ahead and bring up afew of the answers that we got.
Okay, so Wes, do you want to goahead and read our first

Wes (01:02:31):
Okay, our first one's from Maureen S.
And they say I cried.
Skillful use of music in thisepisode.
Pulled at the heart strings.
I like getting more past detailson the family too.

Pauline (01:02:44):
I am so glad I'm not the only one that cried.
I'm not alone there, and yes, Iblame the music for most of it.
It really manipulates you, as itshould.

Wes (01:02:55):
Yeah, it really tugged at the heartstrings, I agree.
And, it does pull characterstogether when they give us more
details of their past,

Pauline (01:03:04):
yeah, I think the more layers that they peel back about
Zuko and Iroh it will continueto add more to the story and
give us more reasons to continuewatching.
Cause like I said, I'm, rightnow I'm more invested in that B
plot versus Aang trying to savethe world.

Wes (01:03:18):
the world.
Thank you, Maureen.

Pauline (01:03:20):
Okay, I'll go ahead and read the next one.
So this one is from Brianna orBrianna M.
And they said, While episodefour wasn't my favorite, Iroh
and Zuko's flashbacks were myfavorite parts.
The sadness felt real, the storyZuko told about Lu Ten sounded
like a real story being toldabout someone he was close to,
and hearing Leaves from the Vinemade me cry as much as the

(01:03:41):
original sung by Mako did.
The only quote unquote complaintI have is I wish in both
flashbacks Zuko was played by ayounger act by younger actors to
match the animated version'stimeline.

Wes (01:03:53):
I think Brianna has a point here, like that would have
probably hit a little harder ifZuko was younger.

Pauline (01:03:58):
Yeah, I didn't think about that when watching it
because it does feel like that'slike a very recent event.
It's been years because they'vebeen, like, I've been searching
for the Avatar for at leastthree years, kind of like how in
Katara's flashbacks they hadsomebody younger.

Wes (01:04:12):
Yeah,

Pauline (01:04:15):
Yeah, so I do agree that the way Zuko told the story
about Lu Ten did feel real and Ithink it added a little bit to
what Zuko's relationship with LuTen must have been like, who was
his cousin.
That was nice for them to alludeto.
Thank you, Brianna.

Wes (01:04:32):
And our next comment comes from Erin M.
They said, That episode almostgot me.
I agree with Brianna.
I wish they would have used ayounger actor for Zuko in the
flashback, as I have for severalscenes with flashbacks.

Pauline (01:04:49):
Yeah, that's something we didn't catch, really, the
episode did not almost get me,it did get me.

Wes (01:04:56):
They got

Pauline (01:04:56):
Really hard.
Alrighty, thanks Erin.

Wes (01:04:59):
Thank you all for the comments.

Pauline (01:05:00):
How many winged lemurs did we save?
Three.
We saved three winged lemurs.
Good job guys, good job.
It's been a while since we'vegotten a voice message.
We didn't get a voice messagewith this one but I do want to
remind everybody that you havethat option too to leave a 60
second voice message and we willplay it on our podcast and
respond to you if you want to dothat, just send us a direct

(01:05:22):
message with a voice

Wes (01:05:23):
be awesome to hear

Pauline (01:05:24):
you.
Alright, so before we close outthis episode, do you have any
final thoughts?

Wes (01:05:33):
I don't Netflix Keep trending upwards with the
episodes.
I thought I was really bummedout on episode three.

Pauline (01:05:42):
With

Wes (01:05:43):
Omashu and Jet?
Yeah, really bummed out.
But they really picked up theball and ran with it on this
episode and scored a touchdown.

Pauline (01:05:51):
If each episode keeps getting better and better, I
don't know, we might have tostart going to quarter ratings.
And, because now I'm thinkingmaybe I should have started with
a lower rating to begin with.
I just hope it continues thistrend.
I will say, with my predictionin our last episode I was wrong
about not liking this I thoughtI was right when we first

(01:06:11):
started watching.
Don't forget, I was reallybummed out when we started the
first 10 15 minutes of this, butit really turned things around,

Wes (01:06:19):
I'm ready for this podcast to end so I can watch episode 5.

Pauline (01:06:22):
Are we gonna watch it tonight?

Wes (01:06:24):
we're gonna watch it tonight.
You

Pauline (01:06:25):
We need to, cause we need to, so many crazy things
have happened with our schedule,we need to catch up and get the
question of the

Wes (01:06:32):
there.
Yeah, I'll start brewing thetea.

Pauline (01:06:34):
Brew the tea.
I'm drinking coffee right now, Iprobably shouldn't have any more
caffeine.

Wes (01:06:37):
Oh, by the way, talking about tea.
I'm getting ready to make somelotus root.
Lotus root, pine bark and driedjasmine.

Pauline (01:06:46):
Who told you to put the pine bark in here?
And Aang's like, you did.

Wes (01:06:50):
put the pine there?

Pauline (01:06:53):
When you say you tried, did you actually spend money on
something?

Wes (01:06:57):
you actually

Pauline (01:06:59):
"Lettuce" leaf.
"Lettuce" wrap it up.

Wes (01:07:04):
Oh.
That didn't hit.
That didn't hit.

Pauline (01:07:07):
Okay.

Wes (01:07:25):
That's our show for today, guys.
And as always, we appreciate youfor taking time to listen to us.
Speaking of choices, we hope youmake the choice to leave us a
rating if And only if youenjoyed this episode.

Pauline (01:07:39):
Yeah, don't leave us a bad rating.
It does

Wes (01:07:43):
help us out a lot though.
And don't forget to follow andsubscribe to this podcast so you
don't miss out any of the futureepisodes.

Pauline (01:07:50):
Yes, and we'd also love if you choose to follow us on
Facebook, Instagram, and TikTok.
we're we're at AvatarNationPodon all three, feel free to say
hi or ask us questions.
You know, We love to keep theconversation going outside of
these podcast episodes.
If you take a screenshot whileyou're listening to us and share

(01:08:11):
it to your stories, make sure totag us because we'd love to give
you a shout out.
So with that said, I'm Pauline.
And I'm Wes.
And you've been listening toAvatar Nation.
See ya next time!

Wes (01:08:23):
ya.