November 17, 2024 • 50 mins
Meet Lulu, a trauma therapist and healer from Dallas, Texas, whose life story is a testament to resilience from drug addiction to connection.
Growing up in a traditional Taiwanese household in Taipei, Lulu faced cultural challenges and the pressure of high expectations.
Her rebellious spirit set her on a path to healing, where she now integrates her unique background into her practice, making healing not only effective but also joyful.
Join us as we explore how Lulu's experiences have shaped her approach to therapy, focusing on communication and playfulness.
Lulu shares personal stories that highlight the importance of understanding subconscious drivers and belief systems, especially in the context of addiction.
Together, we highlight the critical role of community support, joy, and humor in the healing process.
Practices like yoga, breath work, and fellowship foster a sense of belonging and connection, vital for recovery from addiction.
As we embrace humor and celebrate small victories, Lulu encourages us to maintain a positive mindset, practice gratitude and that self-worth is the core of our healing journeys.
Connect with Lulu:
Instagram
Connect with Amanda O'Mara:
Instagram (come say hi!)
Website
Ways to work with me:
Book a 1:1 Session
EVOLVE Group Membership
On Demand Healing
Business Coaching & Healing
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Amanda (00:10):
Welcome to the Calm CEO podcast.
I'm your host, amanda, a spinalenergetics practitioner,
business energetics coach,energy healer, fitness coach and
, most importantly, a dog mom.
That's right, my furry friendis always here for the good
vibes, but today it's all abouthelping industry leading
entrepreneurs just like youunlock the secrets to healing
your nervous system and pavingthe way for more profit and
(00:32):
peace and business, life,relationships and health.
This podcast is your safe spacewhere we're going to go beyond
the basic business strategy andpersonal development.
We're here to cut out the BSand create a life and business
that you fucking love.
Expect raw, unfilteredconversations and leave each
episode with a toolbox full oftips, insights and a tribe of
(00:56):
like-minded souls.
Go ahead and hit that subscribebutton and with that let's dive
into today's episode.
Hello everyone, welcome back.
We have my awesome new bestiehere, lulu.
What's up, girl?
Lulu (01:13):
Hello, hello.
Amanda (01:16):
So Lulu and I actually met recently in LA and instantly
vibed and just been chatting itup.
Hey, we're actually bothwearing black today.
I just noticed that.
And I really wanted to bring heron today because, well, one,
she's freaking awesome.
Number two, she's just sowell-rounded in the healing
(01:41):
space.
I can't even list everything.
I mean she does spinalenergetics as well.
She does trauma therapy,somatic experiencing,
ketamine-assisted therapy,psychedelic integration,
breathwork, reiki, therapeuticyoga, just so much vibrational,
sound, healing movement therapy.
I mean what else, girl?
I mean jack of all trades here.
(02:03):
Hello, hello.
So, and we were just kind ofchatting it up recently about
healing journey and how it canfeel so hard sometimes, and we
thought it might be fun to havean episode on just how, to make
it fun, how healing can be fun.
So, without further ado, lulu,what's up, girl?
Lulu (02:26):
Oh, it's necessary.
Not that it can be fun, butit's necessary, right.
Amanda (02:30):
So necessary.
So, yeah, lulu, why don't youintroduce yourself if you want
to add anything to that, andthen yeah, tell us.
Yeah, where are you?
Tell everyone where you're fromand like a little bit more
about what you do.
Lulu (02:44):
I currently reside in Dallas, texas, and I'm a
licensed therapist and all thosethings that you mentioned.
Credentials are always kind ofweird.
I'm just a human trying to livemy best life.
I'm trying to help anyone thatI can right who's willing to
listen.
Amanda (03:02):
Yes, love it.
So you have a very interestingstory.
I've heard a lot of it.
Are you open to sharing withthe world Something?
Lulu (03:14):
Of course, yeah, yes, where should I start?
Wherever you want wherever youfeel called to.
Well, I was born in Taipei,taiwan.
Wherever you feel called to.
Well, I was born in taipei,taiwan, okay, so that's, that's
fun.
And so with that comes with adifferent culture.
So I was the person whointerpreted a lot when we moved
to the united states and kind ofhad to figure my way out
(03:37):
through the language and, um,you know, and a lot of my
upbringing was in a traditionalTaiwanese household.
Maybe people have heard ofthings called tiger parenting
and very strict, and they wanteveryone plays some kind of
piano and or viola or somethinglike that, and you become a
(03:57):
doctor or lawyers, you know,kind of stuff like that.
I'm not sure how much you knowabout the Asian culture, but so
a lot of pressure, right, justdesigned for you to do well and
to succeed, and, and so that'swhat I did.
I played classical piano when Iwas little and everything did
well in school.
But you know, I think over theyears growing up also in the
(04:20):
United States and acculturatingto this culture, there was a lot
of dissonance, right, andbecause what I was seeing in,
you know, going to school andthings like that, was not what I
was seeing at home, so it wasvery different.
I think the culture was verydifferent.
Amanda (04:38):
How so.
Lulu (04:40):
Well, I mean, looking back , it's all in hindsight, right.
I mean, we're not Asianstypically, or not very
emotionally, they don't.
We don't talk about emotions.
It's very hierarchical, right.
I mean, I think a lot ofcultures can be like that
patriarchal, hierarchical.
You don't really talk back.
And this, this idea of image,is very important.
(05:02):
You know.
So my parents were very wellknown in the community and there
was a lot of image stuff.
So looking back on it now,there was a lot of hiding you
know because there was thisimage to maintain.
I think people might know,especially in like Japanese
cultures too right, these Asiancultures, that shame and what
(05:23):
they call saving face is veryimportant, that you really just
don't want to shame or dishonoror disgrace your family, so kind
of having a good image anddoing well and things like that.
Amanda (05:36):
I mean, it sounds like my family, but we're not Asian,
I'm sure right.
Lulu (05:40):
I mean I think it goes right on the culture.
Amanda (05:43):
I didn't know that about .
In general, the Asian culturewas like that.
Lulu (05:48):
Yeah, the Japanese samurais used to just kill
themselves.
Right, they'd rather just killthemselves than say oh, I messed
up.
I mean that's insane.
I mean imagine the pain thatthat person must have felt.
That that's your, that's youronly option, you know so Okay.
Amanda (06:08):
so where did that lead you?
Like?
When did the healing, All themodalities, when did all that
start?
Lulu (06:14):
Yeah, so I think my spirit was always just a little bit
different.
So I was always trying to putyou know, play, play both sides,
like do well in school.
But I was a little bitdelinquent.
So it always starts off with alittle bit of sneaking out of
the house, staying out late,maybe drinking here and there a
little bit of drugs, all goodfun.
(06:34):
Well, my parents in high schoolwere like you are something you
know.
They noticed they didn't reallylike my friend group, right.
So they sent me to boardingschool and I remember that time
just feeling like that was, Ijust remember the words.
They're like we're sending yousomewhere because we don't have
time to like, mind you, in a way, right.
(06:55):
So I do feel like you know itfelt a lot like rejection you
know, that you really didn'twant to take care of me.
Looking back, it was actually agreat experience because when I
went to boarding school theteachers, they gave you so much
attention.
I'm like, oh, I feel actuallyvery cared for and loved.
But there was still a big partthat held pain, you know from
(07:19):
growing up and not feeling likeattuned to you know, but that's
kind of when I did more drugsand then drugs leads to more
drugs, and you know right, butthat's kind of when I did more
drugs and then drugs leads tomore drugs, and you know that
kind of happens.
I do want to say something thatthat I know.
I always tell my clients, right, the difference between impact
and intent, you know I thinkthat's an important thing for
(07:41):
everyone to realize in ineverything.
Really.
You really that a lot of timeswhere we get into trouble is
sometimes we're assuming intent,but that's very different than
the impact something had.
Especially when we talk aboutchildhood and things like that,
a lot of my clients have a lotof trouble.
They'll be like, oh well, myparents didn't mean to.
(08:03):
I'm like, yeah, we're notsaying anything's wrong with
your parents or anything, butlike I'm talking about the
impact, the impact thatsomething had on you, right?
Amanda (08:14):
If.
Lulu (08:14):
I hold the door open for you, but it actually swings and
hit you in the face.
You know what I mean.
It's usually our assumptionlike that the intent of the
person was negative.
That gets us in trouble.
We don't really think about thedifference between the two.
Right.
Amanda (08:31):
Oh, interesting.
Okay, so expand on that alittle bit.
More impact versus intent howthey're different.
Lulu (08:40):
So let's say, I come home and I don't know you're in the
house or we're roommates orsomething.
Hey, I'll be roommates with you,okay, oh my gosh, we have too
much fun, I know right, and soI'm in, okay, yeah, we usually
(09:00):
have so much fun.
I come home that day and I'm insuch a rush and I just like,
okay, hey, amanda, what's up?
And I run to my room, right,and so I don't know what would
you assume, right?
So maybe the intent, right, myintent is that, like I have a
meeting to hop on, I have notime to say hi to you.
It's maybe different than anyother day.
I kind of brush you by, I.
(09:20):
I kind of brush you by.
I don't have time to listen toyou, right.
Amanda (09:23):
Right.
Lulu (09:23):
Maybe you think my intent is like how freaking rude Every
day you say hi to me.
Like what is your problem todayJust because you're in a bad
mood?
Do you know what I mean?
It's so crazy.
But so when we have a rupture,like that right and we start to
(09:47):
repair.
I can say, oh, I can understandthe impact of my behavior, but
it doesn't mean that I'm wrongor you're right or I'm wrong
right.
So it's very mature to be likeoh, I can understand how you
know God.
I do say hi to you every singleday when I come home.
Yeah, how when I just likebrushed you off that you know
you would have felt dismissed,right.
Amanda (10:02):
I think this is so like common in relationships romantic
relationships you know, so manytriggers come out when you're
dating someone, when you'remarried to someone.
I've seen it in friendships.
I've experienced it withfriendships where it's just,
even though you intend somethingelse, the actions sometimes
speak otherwise.
Lulu (10:22):
Like you know, our actions can create unintended
consequences.
Right, yeah, I mean, and it'snot.
And okay, if we want to keepgoing on this, which we might
podcast, is because a lot ofstuff is driven by our nervous
system.
State too so we take things waytoo personally that people are
(10:42):
really responding the best thatthey know how to, based on their
relationship with their nervoussystem.
Right, yeah, yeah, that's ourshortness right, or our
snappiness or projections.
It's usually because ournervous systems are doing
something that we don't know howto be with.
Amanda (11:01):
So that's the defensive part that comes out right, yeah,
yeah, I mean, I'm just thinkinghow I used to be not saying I'm
perfect.
Now maybe I am, I don't know.
But man, like in relationshipswith well, I'll just speak with
like, my husband, there's beentimes where he wouldn't really
(11:26):
respond to me or he wouldn'topen up emotionally with me, and
then I would take thatpersonally.
I'm like like why, why aren'tyou opening up to me?
Is there something wrong withme?
Am I not good enough, like, andhe'd be like no, no, that's not
true.
But yeah, but I was in thestate of a dysregulated nervous
(11:48):
system of like feeling like likeI'm not good enough or he
doesn't trust me enough to openup to me, or something like that
.
But that was kind of like theunderlying belief, whereas my
response or my reaction to thatbehavior was like what the fuck?
And then I throw temper tantrumalmost you know what.
Lulu (12:08):
I mean, yeah, but I do think you know.
So part of relationships, right?
I mean working with couples islike we're wounded in
relationships and you also needto heal in relationships.
So when you actually marrysomeone, date someone, you're
basically saying like, okay,we're kind of marrying each
other's traumas in a way right.
It's not about this.
I'm going to be perfect beforeI meet you in a relationship.
(12:29):
Relationships are the arenawhere these things come out.
You know these couples,therapists, the Gottmans right,
they're really well known andbasically almost 70% of problems
and relationships are notsolvable.
Okay, isn't that crazy.
Amanda (12:48):
That's high, I know right.
Why are they not solvable Is?
It because people refuse totake responsibility.
Lulu (12:56):
Well, it comes down to just fundamental, like
personality differences, youknow, and values and things like
that.
So, for example, like like,let's just say you get pissed
because your husband, um uh,leaves the socks around, okay,
and you interpret it as hedoesn't care because you spent
all day cleaning up the houseand if he really cared about me
he'd pick up the damn socksright.
And perhaps to him like well,geez, you don't really care
(13:19):
about me because you're just anag, just like my mother, and if
you really cared about me thenyou would let me be a grown ass
man and do whatever I want.
You see how that's like.
The socks are not even theproblem.
So, what helps couples actuallycome together is this being able
to reflect like in thisregulated nervous system.
(13:41):
I can understand, right, goshyou really spent all day
cleaning up our house and I canunderstand how, when I do that,
that you would feel like I'm nottaking all you do into
consideration, that I'mneglecting you, right?
Amanda (13:56):
Communication is so key.
I know, and it's the tone,right, yeah, oh, the tone too,
yeah, Right, I'm sorry versussorry.
You know like it's totallydifferent.
Lulu (14:10):
So when we can talk like this and actually validate, a
lot of couples therapy is spentlike validating each other's
perspectives and reallypracticing using the right words
and the right tone.
Right, I can understand how youwould feel this way, but when
we're like that, you know whatit does.
It actually creates a heart toheart connection.
And when you have a heart toheart connection and you don't
(14:32):
feel like you're being attacked,then you're more likely to
change right.
Healing thrives when ournervous systems are relaxed at
ease.
You know, then I'll be like ohman, yeah, yeah, gosh, amanda
really just does a lot.
I'm just I'm gonna pick up thesocks man is awesome.
Amanda (14:49):
I love.
I should just love her more.
Lulu (14:52):
She's incredible because we do want to treat people that
we love like we want to.
You know, give them the worldthat's I okay.
Amanda (15:02):
I'm so funny that we're just kind of diving into this
topic and maybe we can still getto how healing can be fun
because it really is fun, guys,I promise More than I used to be
an IV drug addict.
Okay, cool on.
A lot of clients would come tome about like relationship stuff
(15:23):
and I call it the deal method Dfor describe the situation.
E express how you feel, but notto blame, right, taking
responsibility for your feelings.
A like ask for what you want.
And then L is listen andnegotiate.
So, for example, like, ifyou're describing the situation,
it's like I know you needattention and I'm grateful for
(15:45):
you to come for me for love andsupport and I'll always be here
for you.
And then e is you know,expressing how you feel, but not
blaming you know the gotmans um, that's their framework.
Anyways, go ahead oh really, ohcrazy though yeah, keep going,
yes no, I learned this from mymentor and then I'm pretty sure
she learned it from her mentor,and so who knows?
(16:06):
Right, I have just found itincredibly helpful.
I've used it on my husband manytimes and it like works magic.
But when you express how youfeel, that could look like
saying something.
Like I realized when I need mypersonal space, right, and when
I'm interrupted, it was bringingup old feelings for me.
Okay, when I am interruptedoften, it sometimes make me feel
(16:28):
like my goals in my businessthey're not important.
This is I mean I'm using thisexample my husband used to like
literally walk in my door allthe time and I work from home.
Guys, it's just like thatlittle peak in the in the corner
of the in the room, just like,hey, what are are you doing?
What are you doing now, amanda?
Hey, like just wantingattention, right, and so I used
(16:49):
to have to like tell him.
Like I realized that it's it'sum, like when he would do those
things.
It would take me back to mychildhood where I felt the same
way, right where I'm not blaminghim, but I'm I'm noticing,
maybe where that right when I'mnot blaming him, but I'm
noticing, maybe where thatbehavior stems from why that
(17:13):
triggers me, right.
And so, although I want him topay, you know, get the attention
that he needs, that I also needmy personal space, especially
the quiet time to work on mybusiness, and so you know, you
can do this with the kids too.
I don't know how this works Idon't have kids, but I feel like
it's the same type ofcommunication, right?
So just asking them if we cancome to an agreement to get
their needs met, but if I wantto have my time to work on my
(17:35):
business uninterrupted, thatthey're willing to wait to talk
to me until I'm done with mybusiness time, right, how do you
feel about that?
So here, we're not reallyblaming them, we're showing them
empathy, we're showing themacknowledgments that they too
are important, and it's solutionfocused, finding a compromise
(17:55):
that you're both heldaccountable to, and it works
wonders, right?
It's changing life changing.
Give it a try.
But anyways, do you want to addanything else to the deal
method?
Lulu (18:08):
No, I think that's good Understanding.
I always say, like curiosityfirst right, because you can't
get anywhere once you startgetting in attack mode.
There's no resolution there,you know and a lot of times, the
things that you think are theissues are really not the issues
.
Like you said, it stems a lot.
I mean what?
95% of our lives is driven byour subconscious.
Amanda (18:29):
Oh, totally yeah.
Lulu (18:31):
And it's important that couple and couples get together,
that they know what some oftheir you know, know belief
systems are that are drivingtheir reactions.
You know, and a lot of this isagain in our nervous system.
You know where we weren'tsupported, where we won't feel
safe much yeah, we don't feelsecure feel good enough, I feel
like is the cornerstone of allhealing safe.
Amanda (18:54):
So true, yeah, safety let's say it again safety safety
amen yeah yeah, the reason weget triggers because we don't
feel safe in some element in ourlife within.
Lulu (19:07):
And how do we feel we actually heal is we feel to heal
, but in safety in safety, yeah,so how do we create safety?
Yeah, how do we create safety?
Amanda (19:18):
usually starting with the breath, usually starting
with slowing the fuck down,usually starting with grounding
playfulness look at that segueyeah yeah yeah playfulness so
how?
How does Lulu play whilehealing?
Lulu (19:43):
Oh my gosh, I mean I think now so to go, kind of go back
right.
So let me, let me encapsulatethis.
I've told this story so manytimes.
Amanda (19:48):
I can sum up in five minutes.
Lulu (19:49):
But basically, yes, so I became a drug addict, you know,
and and it was, it's always fun.
I don't think anybody decidesto become a drug addict and and
picks up the drug and is like,oh yeah, I'm going to just
totally ruin my life and justright, I mean become addicted to
the substance.
Doesn't happen like that, right?
So it really is one thing ledto another.
And the thing about this thedrug word I love, I love Gabriel
(20:14):
Mate how he always talks aboutit's not the drugs, right, it's
really the pain.
What's the pain underneath?
You know, that the drugs are thesolution.
Whether it's drugs, alcohol,shopping, social media, sex,
anything right, these are thesolutions for the loneliness,
the pain, the disconnection thatwe feel.
Amanda (20:35):
Social media scrolling sex addiction, porn addiction
yeah.
Lulu (20:39):
I mean, there's so many different types of addiction.
Some of them are moreculturally acceptable than
others, right?
Amanda (20:44):
Yeah, which is BS, but yeah, yeah.
Lulu (20:48):
And it's so tricky right Because?
And really the addiction iscenters also in the mind too you
know, that we can be so trickywith it.
Just to tell you a little bit ofmy story I so I was, let me
think, clean and sober.
So I first got clean and soberwhen I was like 24 or something.
(21:09):
So a lot of my story is thatthe pain always got so bad that
I ended up trying to take mylife, okay, and then divinity
knows better and it's like Lulu,you're meant to be here for a
reason.
So it never really worked, okay, and I can laugh about it now
I'm not making it funny, but Ireally have really come to
(21:31):
appreciate this part of my lifethat it really feels like a
different life.
So just side note, and ifanyone's listening and they're
struggling, I'm not making amockery out of addiction or the
suffering.
I'm really just sharing myexperience and how I can look
back and with this differentperspective.
So I do always want to make thatclear.
So I don't even know what I wasabout to say.
(21:55):
Oh, okay, so.
So my addiction, right.
So I first got clean it's overwhen I was 24 or 25, after
college, and ended up in thepsych ward again taking my life
and I'm like, all right, well,let me just get my shit together
.
And then I had 10 years where Ihad, um, my kids.
So I have four beautifulchildren.
And then all of a sudden, right, I have four beautiful children
and then all of a sudden, right, I have four little toddlers
(22:19):
under six years old.
I'm really stressed out aboutlife.
And then my back was hurting alittle bit because of my
epidural and just like the waythat I delivered.
And then my brain says I thinkI want some heroin again, right,
and.
And then it was this voice thatwas so surprising and I was
like, well, I can't do that.
(22:39):
But you know, what I can do isI think I need to go to the
doctor because I probably needsome pain medication, right?
So you can imagine, that littlerabbit hole led me into a legal
addiction, right For a coupleyears and then soon after that
then back into injecting IVsubstances in my body, right.
(23:03):
So you know, when you startusing anybody who's ever used IV
drugs and there's not a lot ofold junkies because it's
something that really like sucksyour soul away.
You know, and I have so muchgratitude for that, because
again, this last time, um, Itook my life and there was this
(23:24):
message from the divinebasically was like like almost
like a slap, and it's likeyou're not gonna die, so just
stop it right.
And it was something.
Something about that messagelike I could hear, like I was a
little bit pissed off.
I remember saying like, fine,okay, fine, I'll live.
Amanda (23:46):
Fine, I'm gonna do this life.
Lulu (23:48):
fine, you know.
I mean, I just clearly rememberit, because how many times have
I tried to get clean and sober?
And this is with four childrentoo.
You know what I mean.
Addiction isn't something thatmakes sense.
No, you'd get them to schooland do all the things you had to
do, and then you know Wow.
So from that day right andagain, it all feels so divine,
(24:14):
because I don't know, if you askme to look back, I don't know
what made me make differentchoices.
I mean, the literal thing islike one day at a time.
Amanda (24:25):
Was it like the rock bottom period for you?
Like they always say, like inorder for change to happen,
sometimes we have to go to thedeep.
Lulu (24:33):
Yeah, but I think rock bottoms have rock bottoms, you
know.
I mean every bottom has a newbottom.
I don't think it's, I thinkit's endless, because how many
rock bottoms?
Have.
I felt like I've had.
Amanda (24:46):
Oh, I've been through so many rock holes Endless yeah so
, yeah, I mean.
Lulu (24:58):
So that's kind of how it started.
You know, I do think now.
So I would like did meditation,right, and I was like, all
right, well, let me do.
I think a friend of mine waslike you're such a yogi and I'm
like I don't even, can't reallytouch my toes, and but yoga is a
whole philosophy.
So I did some yoga teachertrainings and learn that, and
you know.
Then someone's like oh, maybeyou should do Reiki or maybe you
should, I don't know right.
(25:20):
And I think, as I just slowlyunfolded this thing, like I
always remembered how I felt somisunderstood in the healing
world right, like this modernpsychology you just didn't cut
it.
Actually, after my undergrad Iapplied for my PsyD, my
doctorate in psychology, butthat was like I'm like on drugs.
(25:43):
I've been in therapy for years,like I can't do something that
I don't believe in.
So, I think, like we're in thisawesome time right now, that
people are bringing moreawareness to our energy systems,
right, somatic awareness, ourbody, and it's not just in the
mind, because you really can'theal with that same almost
sickness that's creating thisdelusion.
(26:04):
Does that make sense?
Amanda (26:06):
Yeah, yeah.
Lulu (26:09):
So now my mission is like oh great, like I can.
You know, I understand thingsfrom this other way and I really
want to make it accessible forpeople, right, that most of the
stuff that we tell ourselvesabout what's happening is really
just not true.
Amanda (26:26):
Real quick.
I'd like to express myheartfelt gratitude to all the
listeners of this podcast.
Your support means the world tome.
As you're aware, a stellarrating plays a vital role not
just for the podcast success,but also in our collective
mission as change makers.
By awarding us five stars, youempower us to continue spreading
love, knowledge, support andguidance to people worldwide.
(26:48):
Please take a brief moment togive this podcast a five star
rating.
Thank you immensely, thank youimmensely.
Lulu (26:55):
It's not true.
You know.
We misinterpret the sensationsthat are in our bodies.
It's just sensation.
Amanda (27:08):
When it comes down to it , you know what we're afraid of
is sensations, yeah, I believe Imean that's, you know, those
who ever think are under feeling.
Or you know we're masking itthrough the drugs, through the
alcohol, through so many things.
It usually comes down toavoiding the sensation, avoiding
(27:28):
the feelings, avoiding goingwithin.
Yes, and we have to createsafety right and build the
capacity to feel it.
What was that like for you asyou began your healing journey?
The yoga and the breath work,and all of that as you began.
How helpful was that for youcompared to?
Did you do therapy?
Did you, you know, see doctors?
Well, you saw doctors beforefor the prescriptions.
(27:49):
How was that shift for you?
How did it change you?
How did it help you get awayfrom drugs?
Lulu (27:58):
Yeah, well, I definitely believe in community for people
who are trying to recover, likeI don't know.
I think most therapists willsay that, like you know somebody
who has a drug addiction or anykind of addiction.
If when they come in it'salmost like kind of they can't
just see us, you know theyreally do need community.
(28:19):
So I joined fellowships lots ofdifferent fellowships and and
developed community because thenit made you feel not so alone
in your stuff, like people jokeabout.
Oh yeah, well, this is what Idid in my last drunk fest, or
something you know, and you canlaugh about it because there's a
normalization of like theabsurd, crazy things that that
(28:40):
we do, and it always ends onsolution, you know yeah so
community is definitelyimportant, for sure, I mean not
just for addiction, but foreverybody, right?
I mean, we need each other,yeah I.
Amanda (28:55):
I remember dating this guy long before Mike, who was an
alcoholic and he went sober andI was maybe like 18, 19 at the
time and it was a big deal forhim to become sober.
(29:16):
But I never realized at thetime how difficult that was for
him and how important it was forhim to remain sober.
And I just remember his bestfriend telling me one time, like
if you want to understand,maybe start learning more about
alcoholism and how serious thatis and to help understand what
somebody's going through, andthat always stuck with me, no
(29:38):
matter what somebody was goingthrough, even if it was.
You know, um, I've had a lot ofnarcissists in my life.
So you started reading aboutnarcissists and kind of learning
that behavior.
And then you know people whodid have drug problems or sex
problems or any of those things,trying to understand where
they're coming from and whythose behaviors.
So you're not just looking atthe cover of the book, you're
(30:03):
reading the chapters, theirstories and what's in between
the lines, and it kind of, whenyou approach it that way, it
helps you to, you know, kind oftying back into into
relationships, like we weretalking about the beginning and
reactions, to understand, okay,why they're reacting yeah yeah,
(30:26):
just having that understanding Iit, the community is so
important and even if you knowyou're not a drug addict or you
know somebody who is like don'ttry to fix them, just maybe what
would you say to that personwho may be somebody in there, I?
Lulu (30:46):
think anyone, because I've also been in relationship with
someone who was in activeaddiction.
Even with the experience thatI've had in active addiction,
right, inactive addiction, right, and and I do think that we
have so many I call everythingan opportunity, but
opportunities in life to expandour capacity to hold dualities,
(31:08):
right.
So, so you know, it's sodifficult to be in relationship
with somebody who's in addiction, right.
That, and I think that's one ofour biggest lessons, is that we
can really have compassion andlove people so much and we can
also say I can't have them in mylife because that's also
honoring yourself, right.
(31:30):
I mean, I think that's that's ahuge lesson for a lot of people
.
When you talk about even thesenarcissistic relationships,
where people talk aboutcodependency whatever you want
to label it, you know, but yeah,because sometimes that's the
reality of it, right.
Amanda (31:47):
Yeah.
So what would you you know if Ihad known you back in the day,
when you're going through all ofthat, like, what would you have
needed from a friend?
And I'm just saying curious,because I used to be the one
that always tried to you know,fix the problem and I can't
right.
That's the people pleaser in me, but you also want to be there
for them without it affectingyou too.
Lulu (32:11):
Yeah, I mean I would say, like, looking back on the people
that you know and there's veryfew people that have known me in
that state in my life because alot of people are dead or a lot
of people are still in theiraddiction but the ones that were
very impactful, I feel like,were very boundary but also very
loving.
I remember one lady.
She was like Lulu people justdon't know what to do.
(32:36):
When you're like this, youscare them and they just, you
know, because I would always belike well, why doesn't anybody,
you know, I don't know, right,like people, people who are in
the active addiction, they don't, I don't think they necessarily
like hurting people and I wasalways one of those people that,
like, really didn't likehurting people.
So I would kind of withdrawinto myself, you know, but the I
(32:58):
mean it always bleeds out and Iremember her saying like just,
this is, it's why, like no,people don't know what to do,
right, like no one really canhelp you.
People don't like seeing youdestroy yourself.
Right, you're scaring them.
Amanda (33:14):
Yeah, I mean, nobody does, but is there anything that
you remember from a friend orfrom anyone.
I'm just curious because, like,like I mean, we've all been
through our own journeys andreally rough times.
It's like I think it depends onthe person.
Lulu (33:33):
Yeah.
Amanda (33:34):
Like when I was going through tremendous grief.
I liked it when people wouldcheck in on me every two, three
weeks, Not every day where itwas smothering, but like, just
know, like hey, I'm thinking ofyou.
Just a quick little, like heyno need to respond.
I'm thinking of you.
Lulu (33:53):
Yeah, I do think addiction is just a little bit different
and of course it depends'mthinking of you.
Yeah, yeah, I do think.
I mean addiction is just alittle bit different and of
course it depends on the degreeof addiction too, you know,
because a lot of times thebehaviors really are really
hurtful.
So I think it depends whatthey're actually doing.
So if someone's in activeaddiction and they're actively
hurting you like I don't know,you know that's different than
(34:17):
you know.
Yeah, something else right, um,but yeah, I mean, I think, with
any anything letting them knowyou love them and then being
clear on what your boundariesare, right, okay, because people
will really I I look at it thisway and it sort of releases
that like, um, we're brokenmindset in a way.
It's like if I really honestlybelieve that everybody has
(34:42):
within them the ability to dothe best that they need to do in
life, then I wouldn't treatthem like that.
They didn't Right, I wouldtreat the addict alcoholic.
It's like I'm really I love you, I care about you, I'm really
sorry You're suffering andhopefully you know one day
(35:02):
you'll make better choices,right, or go get help or right.
That's the belief that, like, Ireally believe in you.
Otherwise, if I'm kind ofstepping in, then what I'm
really believing is that youdon't have the ability to do it
yourself Right.
Amanda (35:17):
Yeah, ooh, okay.
So really just coming from anenergy of I believe in you, I
believe you can get through thisand I'm here if you need
anything, if I believe thateverybody, if I honestly am
practicing what I preach, thateverybody has this ability, then
I would treat you like you did,right.
Yeah.
Lulu (35:37):
It doesn't mean that I can't.
Amanda (35:38):
Well, you don't want to take their power away from being
able to take that on their ownand heal on their own, but even
just to just be there for them,because sometimes all we need is
a hug, right, nowhere, it'snothing.
Just give me a damn hug, that'sall I need for real um, but
(35:59):
yeah, wow, thank you for sharingthat with the world.
Yeah, wow, thank you for sharingthat with the world.
Yeah, so not to minimize thesubject in any way, but I know
we keep going back to like howdo we have fun?
Lulu (36:17):
Oh yeah.
Amanda (36:17):
Fun, especially yours.
Like what did you do to makelight of it?
I mean knowing you in thecouple months that I've gotten
to know you, and the privilegeof getting to know you, you're
very fun.
Your energy is contagious, youcrack jokes.
I mean, you're just a delightto be around.
So, yes, so how, how, how wouldyou say that you got through?
(36:42):
I?
Lulu (36:45):
think I've always been a little mischievous, you know, um
, and I think I I will likehonestly admit that part of it
is my own little pendulation outto um semi-avoidance, because
the reality that this humanexperience is really like can be
really dark and like toughright, I mean it really is.
(37:08):
There's things that are justhappening that we are all
powerless over, you know that wecan't even explain.
So I mean, that's the reality ofit, right, and so I do think
that humor helps ease thisemotional burden that we
experience.
And, like I said, you know,it's kind of like if we really
(37:31):
understand how our nervoussystems really impact the way
that we respond to things, andthe interpretations and our
emotions really are justinformation, it's just energy
trying to move through us andthen we don't, it kind of is a
little bit fun.
It's like a little video game,like you are implanted into this
body and you're having theseexperiences and some of them are
(37:54):
really crazy, right, and someof them are so lovely and they
just I want to hold on to themand I don't know, I just think,
looking at it a little moreplayfully, right, I mean, I
think hold on to them and Idon't know, I just think looking
at it a little more playfully,right.
I mean, I think that's reallyhard though for our ego
structure, because our egostructures really like order and
(38:15):
like to understand.
Amanda (38:15):
You know what's gonna happen totally, or like we get
offended.
Like you know, this is serious.
What's the last time?
Lulu (38:21):
you were offended, tell me .
Amanda (38:27):
I actually don't remember, I don't know.
It takes a lot for me to getoffended.
It really does.
I don't know, gosh, well, I saythat's a good thing If I can't
think of anything off.
Lulu (38:44):
I know too bad, we can't do this live and like viewers
tell us, tell us, yeah.
Amanda (38:49):
Well, if you're listening, though, you could
still tell us.
Send us a message on the gramand let us know how this is.
Lulu (38:55):
I mean really, I think we've all heard it right that,
like our healing, our life, itreally is a journey.
It's not the destination,because people are just
achieving and our society makesit so hard for us to, you know,
be regulated because there isthis pressure, right, marketing
is based on like what you don'thave and what you need.
Amanda (39:25):
Yeah, I've been into Matt Rife oh yeah, and.
Lulu (39:28):
I don't know, I'd be called out by him.
I feel like I get.
Oh my.
Amanda (39:31):
God, yes, he's so freaking funny.
I don't know what it is, butlike you know how, like you, if
you're scrolling and you watchone thing, you like it and you
then you start to get shown thesame stuff.
Well, now I get all my reelsare like Matt Rife and I just
crack up all the time and itjust it.
(39:52):
It feels like it's bringing meback to the human experience.
It's like to remember to justbe a human Cause.
Sometimes I get so wrapped upin my healing journey and you
know being in this work that youknow you're in the spiritual
world a lot where, like you kindof come back down Right and
just sometimes I just got tolaugh and like I'll always
(40:13):
remember too that you can alwaysshift the energy of a room, no
matter what vibe it's in theenergy of a room, no matter, no
matter what vibe it's in.
And my husband is so good atthis where he's got that dry
sense of humor and just cracks ajoke and it lightens up it
lightens up everything you know,I think joking.
(40:37):
Well, yeah, I mean in a sensibleway.
Lulu (40:39):
Yeah, no, our brains are wired to keep us safe, right,
and so it's just what does doesit do?
It thinks of like well, what'snext, what are we going to plan
on, and it's not necessarilydesigned to keep us happy.
Like a lot of, I think, myhealing process with people is
we need to look like if this I'mdrawing, like there's a circle,
okay, like if the left side ofthe circle was everything that
(41:00):
was going wrong in your life,right, and the right side of the
circle was all the things thatare going right.
Most of the time, our brains arelooking at the left side of the
circle okay, and you're notlooking at the right, like it
actually takes conscious effortto be able to shift, to say what
am I doing well today?
How do I feel?
Yeah, I mean, there's theirease, right.
Amanda (41:19):
I feel like that's so big for entrepreneurs Like we're
so in the do, do, do, do likego, go, go.
And we're like oh, celebrate it.
Lulu (41:26):
Celebrate, like, if it's hard for you to like I just told
a client today if it's hard foryou to get out of bed, when you
get up, be like yes, fuck, yeah, let's go Right.
I mean because patternings areactually very young.
We and patternings are actuallyvery young.
We get our nervousness andpatternings when we're young.
That's why you tell yourchildren well, I'm so proud of
you that you put your shoes onthe right way.
(41:48):
You got to tell yourself that.
Amanda (41:51):
Yeah, we got to tell it.
Yeah, you put your underwear ontoday.
Woo-hoo, I don't know Some daysit's like that.
Lulu (42:02):
You know, yeah, yes, yeah, like that you know, yeah, yeah,
yes, yeah, otherwise, it's likeI'm not enough, I gotta do this
.
And all these stories that thatpeople tell themselves you know
, even the healing journey, Ithat's like probably the biggest
ones.
That that, yes, when peoplestart their quote healing
journey like it's so greatbecause they just want to do all
the things, but then after awhile it's not about doing all
(42:24):
the things, it's really abouthow you find safety from this
present moment.
Amanda (42:29):
Oh, my God yeah.
Lulu (42:30):
And then this moment I think a lot of people like they
want the quick fixes.
Amanda (42:35):
They want to cross the finish line and their healing
journey, but the thing is it'snever ending too.
You're always going to behealing.
There's so many layers to ahealing journey, and so the
moment that you accept that, thesooner you accept that, the
more you can enjoy the ride.
Right, it's kind of likerunning a race, running a
(42:58):
marathon.
It's not about just crossingthe finish line, it's the
journey that takes you to getthere.
But with healing there reallyis no finish line per se.
Lulu (43:08):
So you're celebrating yeah , as we understand that.
Right, you celebrate everything.
I remember going to a yogaclass one time and I don't know
what I was going throughprobably some grief and somebody
was like, are you okay?
And I'm like in tears, I'm likeI'm just growing.
I'm just growing, I'm justgrowing.
Let me grow.
Yeah, I can laugh about itBecause, yes, all this emotion,
(43:30):
I understood it, like I neededto move this through my body.
It was so heavy and yet likeyeah.
Amanda (43:39):
I feel like we suppress joy a lot that when we were in
LA together I don't know if yousaw me, but I was laughing my
ass off.
You laughed your ass off.
I laughed my booty off Like I,for two weeks straight.
Almost every session I did likethere's maybe one good cry
session.
(43:59):
But I was reaching these newlevels of joy that I had never
felt before and I needed that,because sometimes I just take
life so dang seriously and mybusiness so dang seriously and
everything that I do so dangseriously and I'm like let's
have fun, let's let loose alittle bit.
You know, and I actuallystopped drinking um for the past
(44:25):
year like very little drinkshere and there, but like since
I've been home, I've actuallyhad a little bit more champagne.
I don't know, it's just been,but a totally different
relationship with it.
Yes, of like, I'm celebratingthe close of my house this week.
I'm celebrating my journey.
We had a retreat in New Jerseyrecently.
Lulu (44:47):
I'm celebrating, I don't know, I'm just like it's a
totally different vibe now whereI'm just and that's important
too, right, it's not like whatwe're doing, it's actually the
intention, right?
And people, I mean, they'relike okay, I go to yoga five
days a week, I do the gym.
I'm like are you enjoying it?
Amanda (45:05):
Yes.
Lulu (45:05):
Like you know, because we can do things like from a
relaxed like I want to nourishmy self-state, or we can do
things from our doing partswhich just need to check all the
boxes right.
Amanda (45:15):
Yeah, like when you're actually going to have fun, yeah
, when you're outside having fungoing for a hike with your dogs
.
Are you actually present inthat moment and really in like
living your life in that moment,or are you just focused on like
getting back so you can get thechores done, or something?
Lulu (45:31):
yeah, you know, and that's a lot of our like I said, it's
a lot of our conditioning.
You know, um, something whichwe probably don't have time to
get into that I really encouragepeople to look at is something
called internal family systems,and it really helps us explain
our psyche into these differentparts right.
That these parts are formed as away of protecting us, and then
(45:52):
a lot of times, our conflict arebecause we have parts that are
in conflict and the idea isreally to come back to our core
self, which is curious andcompassionate and open and
playful, and then unburden someof these what they call
vulnerable or exiled parts right, the parts of us that didn't
get to feel or be supported inexperience.
Amanda (46:15):
Yeah, yes, such a well, just like the doing parts.
Lulu (46:22):
The doing parts of most people really is a protective
part.
That is really scared for us tofeel what happens if you don't
do?
What was the relationship ofwhat happens right?
The association if, if youdon't do, you know, so true.
Amanda (46:37):
Well, thanks for sharing that.
I mean, laughter really is thebest medicine, and it's such a
cliche quote, but it is so.
If you got to go plan a girl'snight, guy's night whoever's
listening to this soon, this isyour message to go do that and
just go let loose.
(46:58):
Go have fun, laugh your ass off, tell some jokes.
Lulu (47:02):
Yeah, create a life worth living, right.
Amanda (47:05):
Yes, I don't know.
Or if you want to go to mattrife, and you know, invite me,
I'll go with you, I'll go to acomedy show.
Lulu (47:13):
Do something fun, maybe like matt rife, and if you're
gonna go, yeah, yeah yeah, let'ssit up front, maybe we'll get
called on.
Yeah yeah, but I do think, likeI don't know, maybe people's
souls aren't like them and mysoul definitely really like to
learn through experience and Ithink that's really helped me in
the way that I approach people,because I I won't really tell
you something unless I've reallyI've been through it too you
(47:35):
know, I'm not just like oh, go,try this new treatment.
I'm like I want to understandhow this works, like um.
So I've had a lot ofexperiences, right, just with
everything that's so good.
Amanda (47:45):
Yeah, go experience life , live, live your life.
Yeah, yeah, I would say what inyour healing journey, 75 laugh,
25 cry.
I don't know, I just made thatup, but it's like food, like eat
(48:06):
nutritious 80% of the time, butyou got to eat what's good for
the soul too.
Lulu (48:11):
So and again crying, right .
I mean we have to use theseterms positive, negative more
comfortable, not comfortable,but emotion is just emotion,
right?
I mean, we could probably do awhole segment on anger if anger
is just an emotion right, it'snot good or bad.
Amanda (48:28):
Yeah, I don't know it's good, it might well.
I just labeled it.
Lulu (48:32):
Don't label it, it's just an emotion, like well, it's an
emotion, it's an energy andthere's sense.
It accompanies with sensationsin your body and we really just
got to build the capacity to bewith that.
Yeah, yeah.
Amanda (48:43):
Uh-huh, ah, so good.
Um, okay, lulu, where canpeople find you, what you got
cooking up in your neck of thewoods and biz, how can people
work with you?
Give us the deets.
Lulu (48:57):
Yeah, so probably the best way is through Instagram um,
infinitehearthealing, um, andthen my website's on there and
you can send me a DM, and I'mnot as active as you are, amanda
, but I'm there, I check it.
Go say hello to my girl, ifyou're in Dallas.
Amanda (49:17):
Texas, hook me up look me up, amazing, amazing, any
last message you want to sharewith the world.
Lulu (49:24):
Enjoy your life.
Practice gratitude, practiceplayfulness.
Be compassionate with yourself.
Be your best cheerleader Giveyourself grace, don't be so
serial.
We love you.
Amanda (49:50):
We love you a lot, so much, so much.
You are enough.
You are worthy all of it.
Love you lattes.
All right, guys, lulu.
Thank you so much for coming on.
So fun and so good to see youagain you too.
Welcome to the Calm CEO podcast.
I'm your host, amanda, a spinalenergetics practitioner,
business energetics coach,energy healer, fitness coach and
, most importantly, a dog mom.
That's right, my furry friendis always here for the good
vibes, but today it's all abouthelping industry leading
entrepreneurs just like youunlock the secrets to healing
your nervous system and pavingthe way for more profit and
(00:32):
peace and business, life,relationships and health.
This podcast is your safe spacewhere we're going to go beyond
the basic business strategy andpersonal development.
We're here to cut out the BSand create a life and business
that you fucking love.
Expect raw, unfilteredconversations and leave each
episode with a toolbox full oftips, insights and a tribe of
(00:56):
like-minded souls.
Go ahead and hit that subscribebutton and with that let's dive
into today's episode.
Hello everyone, welcome back.
We have my awesome new bestiehere, lulu.
What's up, girl?
Lulu (01:13):
Hello, hello.
Amanda (01:16):
So Lulu and I actually met recently in LA and instantly
vibed and just been chatting itup.
Hey, we're actually bothwearing black today.
I just noticed that.
And I really wanted to bring heron today because, well, one,
she's freaking awesome.
Number two, she's just sowell-rounded in the healing
(01:41):
space.
I can't even list everything.
I mean she does spinalenergetics as well.
She does trauma therapy,somatic experiencing,
ketamine-assisted therapy,psychedelic integration,
breathwork, reiki, therapeuticyoga, just so much vibrational,
sound, healing movement therapy.
I mean what else, girl?
I mean jack of all trades here.
(02:03):
Hello, hello.
So, and we were just kind ofchatting it up recently about
healing journey and how it canfeel so hard sometimes, and we
thought it might be fun to havean episode on just how, to make
it fun, how healing can be fun.
So, without further ado, lulu,what's up, girl?
Lulu (02:26):
Oh, it's necessary.
Not that it can be fun, butit's necessary, right.
Amanda (02:30):
So necessary.
So, yeah, lulu, why don't youintroduce yourself if you want
to add anything to that, andthen yeah, tell us.
Yeah, where are you?
Tell everyone where you're fromand like a little bit more
about what you do.
Lulu (02:44):
I currently reside in Dallas, texas, and I'm a
licensed therapist and all thosethings that you mentioned.
Credentials are always kind ofweird.
I'm just a human trying to livemy best life.
I'm trying to help anyone thatI can right who's willing to
listen.
Amanda (03:02):
Yes, love it.
So you have a very interestingstory.
I've heard a lot of it.
Are you open to sharing withthe world Something?
Lulu (03:14):
Of course, yeah, yes, where should I start?
Wherever you want wherever youfeel called to.
Well, I was born in Taipei,taiwan.
Wherever you feel called to.
Well, I was born in taipei,taiwan, okay, so that's, that's
fun.
And so with that comes with adifferent culture.
So I was the person whointerpreted a lot when we moved
to the united states and kind ofhad to figure my way out
(03:37):
through the language and, um,you know, and a lot of my
upbringing was in a traditionalTaiwanese household.
Maybe people have heard ofthings called tiger parenting
and very strict, and they wanteveryone plays some kind of
piano and or viola or somethinglike that, and you become a
(03:57):
doctor or lawyers, you know,kind of stuff like that.
I'm not sure how much you knowabout the Asian culture, but so
a lot of pressure, right, justdesigned for you to do well and
to succeed, and, and so that'swhat I did.
I played classical piano when Iwas little and everything did
well in school.
But you know, I think over theyears growing up also in the
(04:20):
United States and acculturatingto this culture, there was a lot
of dissonance, right, andbecause what I was seeing in,
you know, going to school andthings like that, was not what I
was seeing at home, so it wasvery different.
I think the culture was verydifferent.
Amanda (04:38):
How so.
Lulu (04:40):
Well, I mean, looking back , it's all in hindsight, right.
I mean, we're not Asianstypically, or not very
emotionally, they don't.
We don't talk about emotions.
It's very hierarchical, right.
I mean, I think a lot ofcultures can be like that
patriarchal, hierarchical.
You don't really talk back.
And this, this idea of image,is very important.
(05:02):
You know.
So my parents were very wellknown in the community and there
was a lot of image stuff.
So looking back on it now,there was a lot of hiding you
know because there was thisimage to maintain.
I think people might know,especially in like Japanese
cultures too right, these Asiancultures, that shame and what
(05:23):
they call saving face is veryimportant, that you really just
don't want to shame or dishonoror disgrace your family, so kind
of having a good image anddoing well and things like that.
Amanda (05:36):
I mean, it sounds like my family, but we're not Asian,
I'm sure right.
Lulu (05:40):
I mean I think it goes right on the culture.
Amanda (05:43):
I didn't know that about .
In general, the Asian culturewas like that.
Lulu (05:48):
Yeah, the Japanese samurais used to just kill
themselves.
Right, they'd rather just killthemselves than say oh, I messed
up.
I mean that's insane.
I mean imagine the pain thatthat person must have felt.
That that's your, that's youronly option, you know so Okay.
Amanda (06:08):
so where did that lead you?
Like?
When did the healing, All themodalities, when did all that
start?
Lulu (06:14):
Yeah, so I think my spirit was always just a little bit
different.
So I was always trying to putyou know, play, play both sides,
like do well in school.
But I was a little bitdelinquent.
So it always starts off with alittle bit of sneaking out of
the house, staying out late,maybe drinking here and there a
little bit of drugs, all goodfun.
(06:34):
Well, my parents in high schoolwere like you are something you
know.
They noticed they didn't reallylike my friend group, right.
So they sent me to boardingschool and I remember that time
just feeling like that was, Ijust remember the words.
They're like we're sending yousomewhere because we don't have
time to like, mind you, in a way, right.
(06:55):
So I do feel like you know itfelt a lot like rejection you
know, that you really didn'twant to take care of me.
Looking back, it was actually agreat experience because when I
went to boarding school theteachers, they gave you so much
attention.
I'm like, oh, I feel actuallyvery cared for and loved.
But there was still a big partthat held pain, you know from
(07:19):
growing up and not feeling likeattuned to you know, but that's
kind of when I did more drugsand then drugs leads to more
drugs, and you know right, butthat's kind of when I did more
drugs and then drugs leads tomore drugs, and you know that
kind of happens.
I do want to say something thatthat I know.
I always tell my clients, right, the difference between impact
and intent, you know I thinkthat's an important thing for
(07:41):
everyone to realize in ineverything.
Really.
You really that a lot of timeswhere we get into trouble is
sometimes we're assuming intent,but that's very different than
the impact something had.
Especially when we talk aboutchildhood and things like that,
a lot of my clients have a lotof trouble.
They'll be like, oh well, myparents didn't mean to.
(08:03):
I'm like, yeah, we're notsaying anything's wrong with
your parents or anything, butlike I'm talking about the
impact, the impact thatsomething had on you, right?
Amanda (08:14):
If.
Lulu (08:14):
I hold the door open for you, but it actually swings and
hit you in the face.
You know what I mean.
It's usually our assumptionlike that the intent of the
person was negative.
That gets us in trouble.
We don't really think about thedifference between the two.
Right.
Amanda (08:31):
Oh, interesting.
Okay, so expand on that alittle bit.
More impact versus intent howthey're different.
Lulu (08:40):
So let's say, I come home and I don't know you're in the
house or we're roommates orsomething.
Hey, I'll be roommates with you,okay, oh my gosh, we have too
much fun, I know right, and soI'm in, okay, yeah, we usually
(09:00):
have so much fun.
I come home that day and I'm insuch a rush and I just like,
okay, hey, amanda, what's up?
And I run to my room, right,and so I don't know what would
you assume, right?
So maybe the intent, right, myintent is that, like I have a
meeting to hop on, I have notime to say hi to you.
It's maybe different than anyother day.
I kind of brush you by, I.
(09:20):
I kind of brush you by.
I don't have time to listen toyou, right.
Amanda (09:23):
Right.
Lulu (09:23):
Maybe you think my intent is like how freaking rude Every
day you say hi to me.
Like what is your problem todayJust because you're in a bad
mood?
Do you know what I mean?
It's so crazy.
But so when we have a rupture,like that right and we start to
(09:47):
repair.
I can say, oh, I can understandthe impact of my behavior, but
it doesn't mean that I'm wrongor you're right or I'm wrong
right.
So it's very mature to be likeoh, I can understand how you
know God.
I do say hi to you every singleday when I come home.
Yeah, how when I just likebrushed you off that you know
you would have felt dismissed,right.
Amanda (10:02):
I think this is so like common in relationships romantic
relationships you know, so manytriggers come out when you're
dating someone, when you'remarried to someone.
I've seen it in friendships.
I've experienced it withfriendships where it's just,
even though you intend somethingelse, the actions sometimes
speak otherwise.
Lulu (10:22):
Like you know, our actions can create unintended
consequences.
Right, yeah, I mean, and it'snot.
And okay, if we want to keepgoing on this, which we might
podcast, is because a lot ofstuff is driven by our nervous
system.
State too so we take things waytoo personally that people are
(10:42):
really responding the best thatthey know how to, based on their
relationship with their nervoussystem.
Right, yeah, yeah, that's ourshortness right, or our
snappiness or projections.
It's usually because ournervous systems are doing
something that we don't know howto be with.
Amanda (11:01):
So that's the defensive part that comes out right, yeah,
yeah, I mean, I'm just thinkinghow I used to be not saying I'm
perfect.
Now maybe I am, I don't know.
But man, like in relationshipswith well, I'll just speak with
like, my husband, there's beentimes where he wouldn't really
(11:26):
respond to me or he wouldn'topen up emotionally with me, and
then I would take thatpersonally.
I'm like like why, why aren'tyou opening up to me?
Is there something wrong withme?
Am I not good enough, like, andhe'd be like no, no, that's not
true.
But yeah, but I was in thestate of a dysregulated nervous
(11:48):
system of like feeling like likeI'm not good enough or he
doesn't trust me enough to openup to me, or something like that
.
But that was kind of like theunderlying belief, whereas my
response or my reaction to thatbehavior was like what the fuck?
And then I throw temper tantrumalmost you know what.
Lulu (12:08):
I mean, yeah, but I do think you know.
So part of relationships, right?
I mean working with couples islike we're wounded in
relationships and you also needto heal in relationships.
So when you actually marrysomeone, date someone, you're
basically saying like, okay,we're kind of marrying each
other's traumas in a way right.
It's not about this.
I'm going to be perfect beforeI meet you in a relationship.
(12:29):
Relationships are the arenawhere these things come out.
You know these couples,therapists, the Gottmans right,
they're really well known andbasically almost 70% of problems
and relationships are notsolvable.
Okay, isn't that crazy.
Amanda (12:48):
That's high, I know right.
Why are they not solvable Is?
It because people refuse totake responsibility.
Lulu (12:56):
Well, it comes down to just fundamental, like
personality differences, youknow, and values and things like
that.
So, for example, like like,let's just say you get pissed
because your husband, um uh,leaves the socks around, okay,
and you interpret it as hedoesn't care because you spent
all day cleaning up the houseand if he really cared about me
he'd pick up the damn socksright.
And perhaps to him like well,geez, you don't really care
(13:19):
about me because you're just anag, just like my mother, and if
you really cared about me thenyou would let me be a grown ass
man and do whatever I want.
You see how that's like.
The socks are not even theproblem.
So, what helps couples actuallycome together is this being able
to reflect like in thisregulated nervous system.
(13:41):
I can understand, right, goshyou really spent all day
cleaning up our house and I canunderstand how, when I do that,
that you would feel like I'm nottaking all you do into
consideration, that I'mneglecting you, right?
Amanda (13:56):
Communication is so key.
I know, and it's the tone,right, yeah, oh, the tone too,
yeah, Right, I'm sorry versussorry.
You know like it's totallydifferent.
Lulu (14:10):
So when we can talk like this and actually validate, a
lot of couples therapy is spentlike validating each other's
perspectives and reallypracticing using the right words
and the right tone.
Right, I can understand how youwould feel this way, but when
we're like that, you know whatit does.
It actually creates a heart toheart connection.
And when you have a heart toheart connection and you don't
(14:32):
feel like you're being attacked,then you're more likely to
change right.
Healing thrives when ournervous systems are relaxed at
ease.
You know, then I'll be like ohman, yeah, yeah, gosh, amanda
really just does a lot.
I'm just I'm gonna pick up thesocks man is awesome.
Amanda (14:49):
I love.
I should just love her more.
Lulu (14:52):
She's incredible because we do want to treat people that
we love like we want to.
You know, give them the worldthat's I okay.
Amanda (15:02):
I'm so funny that we're just kind of diving into this
topic and maybe we can still getto how healing can be fun
because it really is fun, guys,I promise More than I used to be
an IV drug addict.
Okay, cool on.
A lot of clients would come tome about like relationship stuff
(15:23):
and I call it the deal method Dfor describe the situation.
E express how you feel, but notto blame, right, taking
responsibility for your feelings.
A like ask for what you want.
And then L is listen andnegotiate.
So, for example, like, ifyou're describing the situation,
it's like I know you needattention and I'm grateful for
(15:45):
you to come for me for love andsupport and I'll always be here
for you.
And then e is you know,expressing how you feel, but not
blaming you know the gotmans um, that's their framework.
Anyways, go ahead oh really, ohcrazy though yeah, keep going,
yes no, I learned this from mymentor and then I'm pretty sure
she learned it from her mentor,and so who knows?
(16:06):
Right, I have just found itincredibly helpful.
I've used it on my husband manytimes and it like works magic.
But when you express how youfeel, that could look like
saying something.
Like I realized when I need mypersonal space, right, and when
I'm interrupted, it was bringingup old feelings for me.
Okay, when I am interruptedoften, it sometimes make me feel
(16:28):
like my goals in my businessthey're not important.
This is I mean I'm using thisexample my husband used to like
literally walk in my door allthe time and I work from home.
Guys, it's just like thatlittle peak in the in the corner
of the in the room, just like,hey, what are are you doing?
What are you doing now, amanda?
Hey, like just wantingattention, right, and so I used
(16:49):
to have to like tell him.
Like I realized that it's it'sum, like when he would do those
things.
It would take me back to mychildhood where I felt the same
way, right where I'm not blaminghim, but I'm I'm noticing,
maybe where that right when I'mnot blaming him, but I'm
noticing, maybe where thatbehavior stems from why that
(17:13):
triggers me, right.
And so, although I want him topay, you know, get the attention
that he needs, that I also needmy personal space, especially
the quiet time to work on mybusiness, and so you know, you
can do this with the kids too.
I don't know how this works Idon't have kids, but I feel like
it's the same type ofcommunication, right?
So just asking them if we cancome to an agreement to get
their needs met, but if I wantto have my time to work on my
(17:35):
business uninterrupted, thatthey're willing to wait to talk
to me until I'm done with mybusiness time, right, how do you
feel about that?
So here, we're not reallyblaming them, we're showing them
empathy, we're showing themacknowledgments that they too
are important, and it's solutionfocused, finding a compromise
(17:55):
that you're both heldaccountable to, and it works
wonders, right?
It's changing life changing.
Give it a try.
But anyways, do you want to addanything else to the deal
method?
Lulu (18:08):
No, I think that's good Understanding.
I always say, like curiosityfirst right, because you can't
get anywhere once you startgetting in attack mode.
There's no resolution there,you know and a lot of times, the
things that you think are theissues are really not the issues
.
Like you said, it stems a lot.
I mean what?
95% of our lives is driven byour subconscious.
Amanda (18:29):
Oh, totally yeah.
Lulu (18:31):
And it's important that couple and couples get together,
that they know what some oftheir you know, know belief
systems are that are drivingtheir reactions.
You know, and a lot of this isagain in our nervous system.
You know where we weren'tsupported, where we won't feel
safe much yeah, we don't feelsecure feel good enough, I feel
like is the cornerstone of allhealing safe.
Amanda (18:54):
So true, yeah, safety let's say it again safety safety
amen yeah yeah, the reason weget triggers because we don't
feel safe in some element in ourlife within.
Lulu (19:07):
And how do we feel we actually heal is we feel to heal
, but in safety in safety, yeah,so how do we create safety?
Yeah, how do we create safety?
Amanda (19:18):
usually starting with the breath, usually starting
with slowing the fuck down,usually starting with grounding
playfulness look at that segueyeah yeah yeah playfulness so
how?
How does Lulu play whilehealing?
Lulu (19:43):
Oh my gosh, I mean I think now so to go, kind of go back
right.
So let me, let me encapsulatethis.
I've told this story so manytimes.
Amanda (19:48):
I can sum up in five minutes.
Lulu (19:49):
But basically, yes, so I became a drug addict, you know,
and and it was, it's always fun.
I don't think anybody decidesto become a drug addict and and
picks up the drug and is like,oh yeah, I'm going to just
totally ruin my life and justright, I mean become addicted to
the substance.
Doesn't happen like that, right?
So it really is one thing ledto another.
And the thing about this thedrug word I love, I love Gabriel
(20:14):
Mate how he always talks aboutit's not the drugs, right, it's
really the pain.
What's the pain underneath?
You know, that the drugs are thesolution.
Whether it's drugs, alcohol,shopping, social media, sex,
anything right, these are thesolutions for the loneliness,
the pain, the disconnection thatwe feel.
Amanda (20:35):
Social media scrolling sex addiction, porn addiction
yeah.
Lulu (20:39):
I mean, there's so many different types of addiction.
Some of them are moreculturally acceptable than
others, right?
Amanda (20:44):
Yeah, which is BS, but yeah, yeah.
Lulu (20:48):
And it's so tricky right Because?
And really the addiction iscenters also in the mind too you
know, that we can be so trickywith it.
Just to tell you a little bit ofmy story I so I was, let me
think, clean and sober.
So I first got clean and soberwhen I was like 24 or something.
(21:09):
So a lot of my story is thatthe pain always got so bad that
I ended up trying to take mylife, okay, and then divinity
knows better and it's like Lulu,you're meant to be here for a
reason.
So it never really worked, okay, and I can laugh about it now
I'm not making it funny, but Ireally have really come to
(21:31):
appreciate this part of my lifethat it really feels like a
different life.
So just side note, and ifanyone's listening and they're
struggling, I'm not making amockery out of addiction or the
suffering.
I'm really just sharing myexperience and how I can look
back and with this differentperspective.
So I do always want to make thatclear.
So I don't even know what I wasabout to say.
(21:55):
Oh, okay, so.
So my addiction, right.
So I first got clean it's overwhen I was 24 or 25, after
college, and ended up in thepsych ward again taking my life
and I'm like, all right, well,let me just get my shit together
.
And then I had 10 years where Ihad, um, my kids.
So I have four beautifulchildren.
And then all of a sudden, right, I have four beautiful children
and then all of a sudden, right, I have four little toddlers
(22:19):
under six years old.
I'm really stressed out aboutlife.
And then my back was hurting alittle bit because of my
epidural and just like the waythat I delivered.
And then my brain says I thinkI want some heroin again, right,
and.
And then it was this voice thatwas so surprising and I was
like, well, I can't do that.
(22:39):
But you know, what I can do isI think I need to go to the
doctor because I probably needsome pain medication, right?
So you can imagine, that littlerabbit hole led me into a legal
addiction, right For a coupleyears and then soon after that
then back into injecting IVsubstances in my body, right.
(23:03):
So you know, when you startusing anybody who's ever used IV
drugs and there's not a lot ofold junkies because it's
something that really like sucksyour soul away.
You know, and I have so muchgratitude for that, because
again, this last time, um, Itook my life and there was this
(23:24):
message from the divinebasically was like like almost
like a slap, and it's likeyou're not gonna die, so just
stop it right.
And it was something.
Something about that messagelike I could hear, like I was a
little bit pissed off.
I remember saying like, fine,okay, fine, I'll live.
Amanda (23:46):
Fine, I'm gonna do this life.
Lulu (23:48):
fine, you know.
I mean, I just clearly rememberit, because how many times have
I tried to get clean and sober?
And this is with four childrentoo.
You know what I mean.
Addiction isn't something thatmakes sense.
No, you'd get them to schooland do all the things you had to
do, and then you know Wow.
So from that day right andagain, it all feels so divine,
(24:14):
because I don't know, if you askme to look back, I don't know
what made me make differentchoices.
I mean, the literal thing islike one day at a time.
Amanda (24:25):
Was it like the rock bottom period for you?
Like they always say, like inorder for change to happen,
sometimes we have to go to thedeep.
Lulu (24:33):
Yeah, but I think rock bottoms have rock bottoms, you
know.
I mean every bottom has a newbottom.
I don't think it's, I thinkit's endless, because how many
rock bottoms?
Have.
I felt like I've had.
Amanda (24:46):
Oh, I've been through so many rock holes Endless yeah so
, yeah, I mean.
Lulu (24:58):
So that's kind of how it started.
You know, I do think now.
So I would like did meditation,right, and I was like, all
right, well, let me do.
I think a friend of mine waslike you're such a yogi and I'm
like I don't even, can't reallytouch my toes, and but yoga is a
whole philosophy.
So I did some yoga teachertrainings and learn that, and
you know.
Then someone's like oh, maybeyou should do Reiki or maybe you
should, I don't know right.
(25:20):
And I think, as I just slowlyunfolded this thing, like I
always remembered how I felt somisunderstood in the healing
world right, like this modernpsychology you just didn't cut
it.
Actually, after my undergrad Iapplied for my PsyD, my
doctorate in psychology, butthat was like I'm like on drugs.
(25:43):
I've been in therapy for years,like I can't do something that
I don't believe in.
So, I think, like we're in thisawesome time right now, that
people are bringing moreawareness to our energy systems,
right, somatic awareness, ourbody, and it's not just in the
mind, because you really can'theal with that same almost
sickness that's creating thisdelusion.
(26:04):
Does that make sense?
Amanda (26:06):
Yeah, yeah.
Lulu (26:09):
So now my mission is like oh great, like I can.
You know, I understand thingsfrom this other way and I really
want to make it accessible forpeople, right, that most of the
stuff that we tell ourselvesabout what's happening is really
just not true.
Amanda (26:26):
Real quick.
I'd like to express myheartfelt gratitude to all the
listeners of this podcast.
Your support means the world tome.
As you're aware, a stellarrating plays a vital role not
just for the podcast success,but also in our collective
mission as change makers.
By awarding us five stars, youempower us to continue spreading
love, knowledge, support andguidance to people worldwide.
(26:48):
Please take a brief moment togive this podcast a five star
rating.
Thank you immensely, thank youimmensely.
Lulu (26:55):
It's not true.
You know.
We misinterpret the sensationsthat are in our bodies.
It's just sensation.
Amanda (27:08):
When it comes down to it , you know what we're afraid of
is sensations, yeah, I believe Imean that's, you know, those
who ever think are under feeling.
Or you know we're masking itthrough the drugs, through the
alcohol, through so many things.
It usually comes down toavoiding the sensation, avoiding
(27:28):
the feelings, avoiding goingwithin.
Yes, and we have to createsafety right and build the
capacity to feel it.
What was that like for you asyou began your healing journey?
The yoga and the breath work,and all of that as you began.
How helpful was that for youcompared to?
Did you do therapy?
Did you, you know, see doctors?
Well, you saw doctors beforefor the prescriptions.
(27:49):
How was that shift for you?
How did it change you?
How did it help you get awayfrom drugs?
Lulu (27:58):
Yeah, well, I definitely believe in community for people
who are trying to recover, likeI don't know.
I think most therapists willsay that, like you know somebody
who has a drug addiction or anykind of addiction.
If when they come in it'salmost like kind of they can't
just see us, you know theyreally do need community.
(28:19):
So I joined fellowships lots ofdifferent fellowships and and
developed community because thenit made you feel not so alone
in your stuff, like people jokeabout.
Oh yeah, well, this is what Idid in my last drunk fest, or
something you know, and you canlaugh about it because there's a
normalization of like theabsurd, crazy things that that
(28:40):
we do, and it always ends onsolution, you know yeah so
community is definitelyimportant, for sure, I mean not
just for addiction, but foreverybody, right?
I mean, we need each other,yeah I.
Amanda (28:55):
I remember dating this guy long before Mike, who was an
alcoholic and he went sober andI was maybe like 18, 19 at the
time and it was a big deal forhim to become sober.
(29:16):
But I never realized at thetime how difficult that was for
him and how important it was forhim to remain sober.
And I just remember his bestfriend telling me one time, like
if you want to understand,maybe start learning more about
alcoholism and how serious thatis and to help understand what
somebody's going through, andthat always stuck with me, no
(29:38):
matter what somebody was goingthrough, even if it was.
You know, um, I've had a lot ofnarcissists in my life.
So you started reading aboutnarcissists and kind of learning
that behavior.
And then you know people whodid have drug problems or sex
problems or any of those things,trying to understand where
they're coming from and whythose behaviors.
So you're not just looking atthe cover of the book, you're
(30:03):
reading the chapters, theirstories and what's in between
the lines, and it kind of, whenyou approach it that way, it
helps you to, you know, kind oftying back into into
relationships, like we weretalking about the beginning and
reactions, to understand, okay,why they're reacting yeah yeah,
(30:26):
just having that understanding Iit, the community is so
important and even if you knowyou're not a drug addict or you
know somebody who is like don'ttry to fix them, just maybe what
would you say to that personwho may be somebody in there, I?
Lulu (30:46):
think anyone, because I've also been in relationship with
someone who was in activeaddiction.
Even with the experience thatI've had in active addiction,
right, inactive addiction, right, and and I do think that we
have so many I call everythingan opportunity, but
opportunities in life to expandour capacity to hold dualities,
(31:08):
right.
So, so you know, it's sodifficult to be in relationship
with somebody who's in addiction, right.
That, and I think that's one ofour biggest lessons, is that we
can really have compassion andlove people so much and we can
also say I can't have them in mylife because that's also
honoring yourself, right.
(31:30):
I mean, I think that's that's ahuge lesson for a lot of people
.
When you talk about even thesenarcissistic relationships,
where people talk aboutcodependency whatever you want
to label it, you know, but yeah,because sometimes that's the
reality of it, right.
Amanda (31:47):
Yeah.
So what would you you know if Ihad known you back in the day,
when you're going through all ofthat, like, what would you have
needed from a friend?
And I'm just saying curious,because I used to be the one
that always tried to you know,fix the problem and I can't
right.
That's the people pleaser in me, but you also want to be there
for them without it affectingyou too.
Lulu (32:11):
Yeah, I mean I would say, like, looking back on the people
that you know and there's veryfew people that have known me in
that state in my life because alot of people are dead or a lot
of people are still in theiraddiction but the ones that were
very impactful, I feel like,were very boundary but also very
loving.
I remember one lady.
She was like Lulu people justdon't know what to do.
(32:36):
When you're like this, youscare them and they just, you
know, because I would always belike well, why doesn't anybody,
you know, I don't know, right,like people, people who are in
the active addiction, they don't, I don't think they necessarily
like hurting people and I wasalways one of those people that,
like, really didn't likehurting people.
So I would kind of withdrawinto myself, you know, but the I
(32:58):
mean it always bleeds out and Iremember her saying like just,
this is, it's why, like no,people don't know what to do,
right, like no one really canhelp you.
People don't like seeing youdestroy yourself.
Right, you're scaring them.
Amanda (33:14):
Yeah, I mean, nobody does, but is there anything that
you remember from a friend orfrom anyone.
I'm just curious because, like,like I mean, we've all been
through our own journeys andreally rough times.
It's like I think it depends onthe person.
Lulu (33:33):
Yeah.
Amanda (33:34):
Like when I was going through tremendous grief.
I liked it when people wouldcheck in on me every two, three
weeks, Not every day where itwas smothering, but like, just
know, like hey, I'm thinking ofyou.
Just a quick little, like heyno need to respond.
I'm thinking of you.
Lulu (33:53):
Yeah, I do think addiction is just a little bit different
and of course it depends'mthinking of you.
Yeah, yeah, I do think.
I mean addiction is just alittle bit different and of
course it depends on the degreeof addiction too, you know,
because a lot of times thebehaviors really are really
hurtful.
So I think it depends whatthey're actually doing.
So if someone's in activeaddiction and they're actively
hurting you like I don't know,you know that's different than
(34:17):
you know.
Yeah, something else right, um,but yeah, I mean, I think, with
any anything letting them knowyou love them and then being
clear on what your boundariesare, right, okay, because people
will really I I look at it thisway and it sort of releases
that like, um, we're brokenmindset in a way.
It's like if I really honestlybelieve that everybody has
(34:42):
within them the ability to dothe best that they need to do in
life, then I wouldn't treatthem like that.
They didn't Right, I wouldtreat the addict alcoholic.
It's like I'm really I love you, I care about you, I'm really
sorry You're suffering andhopefully you know one day
(35:02):
you'll make better choices,right, or go get help or right.
That's the belief that, like, Ireally believe in you.
Otherwise, if I'm kind ofstepping in, then what I'm
really believing is that youdon't have the ability to do it
yourself Right.
Amanda (35:17):
Yeah, ooh, okay.
So really just coming from anenergy of I believe in you, I
believe you can get through thisand I'm here if you need
anything, if I believe thateverybody, if I honestly am
practicing what I preach, thateverybody has this ability, then
I would treat you like you did,right.
Yeah.
Lulu (35:37):
It doesn't mean that I can't.
Amanda (35:38):
Well, you don't want to take their power away from being
able to take that on their ownand heal on their own, but even
just to just be there for them,because sometimes all we need is
a hug, right, nowhere, it'snothing.
Just give me a damn hug, that'sall I need for real um, but
(35:59):
yeah, wow, thank you for sharingthat with the world.
Yeah, wow, thank you for sharingthat with the world.
Yeah, so not to minimize thesubject in any way, but I know
we keep going back to like howdo we have fun?
Lulu (36:17):
Oh yeah.
Amanda (36:17):
Fun, especially yours.
Like what did you do to makelight of it?
I mean knowing you in thecouple months that I've gotten
to know you, and the privilegeof getting to know you, you're
very fun.
Your energy is contagious, youcrack jokes.
I mean, you're just a delightto be around.
So, yes, so how, how, how wouldyou say that you got through?
(36:42):
I?
Lulu (36:45):
think I've always been a little mischievous, you know, um
, and I think I I will likehonestly admit that part of it
is my own little pendulation outto um semi-avoidance, because
the reality that this humanexperience is really like can be
really dark and like toughright, I mean it really is.
(37:08):
There's things that are justhappening that we are all
powerless over, you know that wecan't even explain.
So I mean, that's the reality ofit, right, and so I do think
that humor helps ease thisemotional burden that we
experience.
And, like I said, you know,it's kind of like if we really
(37:31):
understand how our nervoussystems really impact the way
that we respond to things, andthe interpretations and our
emotions really are justinformation, it's just energy
trying to move through us andthen we don't, it kind of is a
little bit fun.
It's like a little video game,like you are implanted into this
body and you're having theseexperiences and some of them are
(37:54):
really crazy, right, and someof them are so lovely and they
just I want to hold on to themand I don't know, I just think,
looking at it a little moreplayfully, right, I mean, I
think hold on to them and Idon't know, I just think looking
at it a little more playfully,right.
I mean, I think that's reallyhard though for our ego
structure, because our egostructures really like order and
(38:15):
like to understand.
Amanda (38:15):
You know what's gonna happen totally, or like we get
offended.
Like you know, this is serious.
What's the last time?
Lulu (38:21):
you were offended, tell me .
Amanda (38:27):
I actually don't remember, I don't know.
It takes a lot for me to getoffended.
It really does.
I don't know, gosh, well, I saythat's a good thing If I can't
think of anything off.
Lulu (38:44):
I know too bad, we can't do this live and like viewers
tell us, tell us, yeah.
Amanda (38:49):
Well, if you're listening, though, you could
still tell us.
Send us a message on the gramand let us know how this is.
Lulu (38:55):
I mean really, I think we've all heard it right that,
like our healing, our life, itreally is a journey.
It's not the destination,because people are just
achieving and our society makesit so hard for us to, you know,
be regulated because there isthis pressure, right, marketing
is based on like what you don'thave and what you need.
Amanda (39:25):
Yeah, I've been into Matt Rife oh yeah, and.
Lulu (39:28):
I don't know, I'd be called out by him.
I feel like I get.
Oh my.
Amanda (39:31):
God, yes, he's so freaking funny.
I don't know what it is, butlike you know how, like you, if
you're scrolling and you watchone thing, you like it and you
then you start to get shown thesame stuff.
Well, now I get all my reelsare like Matt Rife and I just
crack up all the time and itjust it.
(39:52):
It feels like it's bringing meback to the human experience.
It's like to remember to justbe a human Cause.
Sometimes I get so wrapped upin my healing journey and you
know being in this work that youknow you're in the spiritual
world a lot where, like you kindof come back down Right and
just sometimes I just got tolaugh and like I'll always
(40:13):
remember too that you can alwaysshift the energy of a room, no
matter what vibe it's in theenergy of a room, no matter, no
matter what vibe it's in.
And my husband is so good atthis where he's got that dry
sense of humor and just cracks ajoke and it lightens up it
lightens up everything you know,I think joking.
(40:37):
Well, yeah, I mean in a sensibleway.
Lulu (40:39):
Yeah, no, our brains are wired to keep us safe, right,
and so it's just what does doesit do?
It thinks of like well, what'snext, what are we going to plan
on, and it's not necessarilydesigned to keep us happy.
Like a lot of, I think, myhealing process with people is
we need to look like if this I'mdrawing, like there's a circle,
okay, like if the left side ofthe circle was everything that
(41:00):
was going wrong in your life,right, and the right side of the
circle was all the things thatare going right.
Most of the time, our brains arelooking at the left side of the
circle okay, and you're notlooking at the right, like it
actually takes conscious effortto be able to shift, to say what
am I doing well today?
How do I feel?
Yeah, I mean, there's theirease, right.
Amanda (41:19):
I feel like that's so big for entrepreneurs Like we're
so in the do, do, do, do likego, go, go.
And we're like oh, celebrate it.
Lulu (41:26):
Celebrate, like, if it's hard for you to like I just told
a client today if it's hard foryou to get out of bed, when you
get up, be like yes, fuck, yeah, let's go Right.
I mean because patternings areactually very young.
We and patternings are actuallyvery young.
We get our nervousness andpatternings when we're young.
That's why you tell yourchildren well, I'm so proud of
you that you put your shoes onthe right way.
(41:48):
You got to tell yourself that.
Amanda (41:51):
Yeah, we got to tell it.
Yeah, you put your underwear ontoday.
Woo-hoo, I don't know Some daysit's like that.
Lulu (42:02):
You know, yeah, yes, yeah, like that you know, yeah, yeah,
yes, yeah, otherwise, it's likeI'm not enough, I gotta do this
.
And all these stories that thatpeople tell themselves you know
, even the healing journey, Ithat's like probably the biggest
ones.
That that, yes, when peoplestart their quote healing
journey like it's so greatbecause they just want to do all
the things, but then after awhile it's not about doing all
(42:24):
the things, it's really abouthow you find safety from this
present moment.
Amanda (42:29):
Oh, my God yeah.
Lulu (42:30):
And then this moment I think a lot of people like they
want the quick fixes.
Amanda (42:35):
They want to cross the finish line and their healing
journey, but the thing is it'snever ending too.
You're always going to behealing.
There's so many layers to ahealing journey, and so the
moment that you accept that, thesooner you accept that, the
more you can enjoy the ride.
Right, it's kind of likerunning a race, running a
(42:58):
marathon.
It's not about just crossingthe finish line, it's the
journey that takes you to getthere.
But with healing there reallyis no finish line per se.
Lulu (43:08):
So you're celebrating yeah , as we understand that.
Right, you celebrate everything.
I remember going to a yogaclass one time and I don't know
what I was going throughprobably some grief and somebody
was like, are you okay?
And I'm like in tears, I'm likeI'm just growing.
I'm just growing, I'm justgrowing.
Let me grow.
Yeah, I can laugh about itBecause, yes, all this emotion,
(43:30):
I understood it, like I neededto move this through my body.
It was so heavy and yet likeyeah.
Amanda (43:39):
I feel like we suppress joy a lot that when we were in
LA together I don't know if yousaw me, but I was laughing my
ass off.
You laughed your ass off.
I laughed my booty off Like I,for two weeks straight.
Almost every session I did likethere's maybe one good cry
session.
(43:59):
But I was reaching these newlevels of joy that I had never
felt before and I needed that,because sometimes I just take
life so dang seriously and mybusiness so dang seriously and
everything that I do so dangseriously and I'm like let's
have fun, let's let loose alittle bit.
You know, and I actuallystopped drinking um for the past
(44:25):
year like very little drinkshere and there, but like since
I've been home, I've actuallyhad a little bit more champagne.
I don't know, it's just been,but a totally different
relationship with it.
Yes, of like, I'm celebratingthe close of my house this week.
I'm celebrating my journey.
We had a retreat in New Jerseyrecently.
Lulu (44:47):
I'm celebrating, I don't know, I'm just like it's a
totally different vibe now whereI'm just and that's important
too, right, it's not like whatwe're doing, it's actually the
intention, right?
And people, I mean, they'relike okay, I go to yoga five
days a week, I do the gym.
I'm like are you enjoying it?
Amanda (45:05):
Yes.
Lulu (45:05):
Like you know, because we can do things like from a
relaxed like I want to nourishmy self-state, or we can do
things from our doing partswhich just need to check all the
boxes right.
Amanda (45:15):
Yeah, like when you're actually going to have fun, yeah
, when you're outside having fungoing for a hike with your dogs
.
Are you actually present inthat moment and really in like
living your life in that moment,or are you just focused on like
getting back so you can get thechores done, or something?
Lulu (45:31):
yeah, you know, and that's a lot of our like I said, it's
a lot of our conditioning.
You know, um, something whichwe probably don't have time to
get into that I really encouragepeople to look at is something
called internal family systems,and it really helps us explain
our psyche into these differentparts right.
That these parts are formed as away of protecting us, and then
(45:52):
a lot of times, our conflict arebecause we have parts that are
in conflict and the idea isreally to come back to our core
self, which is curious andcompassionate and open and
playful, and then unburden someof these what they call
vulnerable or exiled parts right, the parts of us that didn't
get to feel or be supported inexperience.
Amanda (46:15):
Yeah, yes, such a well, just like the doing parts.
Lulu (46:22):
The doing parts of most people really is a protective
part.
That is really scared for us tofeel what happens if you don't
do?
What was the relationship ofwhat happens right?
The association if, if youdon't do, you know, so true.
Amanda (46:37):
Well, thanks for sharing that.
I mean, laughter really is thebest medicine, and it's such a
cliche quote, but it is so.
If you got to go plan a girl'snight, guy's night whoever's
listening to this soon, this isyour message to go do that and
just go let loose.
(46:58):
Go have fun, laugh your ass off, tell some jokes.
Lulu (47:02):
Yeah, create a life worth living, right.
Amanda (47:05):
Yes, I don't know.
Or if you want to go to mattrife, and you know, invite me,
I'll go with you, I'll go to acomedy show.
Lulu (47:13):
Do something fun, maybe like matt rife, and if you're
gonna go, yeah, yeah yeah, let'ssit up front, maybe we'll get
called on.
Yeah yeah, but I do think, likeI don't know, maybe people's
souls aren't like them and mysoul definitely really like to
learn through experience and Ithink that's really helped me in
the way that I approach people,because I I won't really tell
you something unless I've reallyI've been through it too you
(47:35):
know, I'm not just like oh, go,try this new treatment.
I'm like I want to understandhow this works, like um.
So I've had a lot ofexperiences, right, just with
everything that's so good.
Amanda (47:45):
Yeah, go experience life , live, live your life.
Yeah, yeah, I would say what inyour healing journey, 75 laugh,
25 cry.
I don't know, I just made thatup, but it's like food, like eat
(48:06):
nutritious 80% of the time, butyou got to eat what's good for
the soul too.
Lulu (48:11):
So and again crying, right .
I mean we have to use theseterms positive, negative more
comfortable, not comfortable,but emotion is just emotion,
right?
I mean, we could probably do awhole segment on anger if anger
is just an emotion right, it'snot good or bad.
Amanda (48:28):
Yeah, I don't know it's good, it might well.
I just labeled it.
Lulu (48:32):
Don't label it, it's just an emotion, like well, it's an
emotion, it's an energy andthere's sense.
It accompanies with sensationsin your body and we really just
got to build the capacity to bewith that.
Yeah, yeah.
Amanda (48:43):
Uh-huh, ah, so good.
Um, okay, lulu, where canpeople find you, what you got
cooking up in your neck of thewoods and biz, how can people
work with you?
Give us the deets.
Lulu (48:57):
Yeah, so probably the best way is through Instagram um,
infinitehearthealing, um, andthen my website's on there and
you can send me a DM, and I'mnot as active as you are, amanda
, but I'm there, I check it.
Go say hello to my girl, ifyou're in Dallas.
Amanda (49:17):
Texas, hook me up look me up, amazing, amazing, any
last message you want to sharewith the world.
Lulu (49:24):
Enjoy your life.
Practice gratitude, practiceplayfulness.
Be compassionate with yourself.
Be your best cheerleader Giveyourself grace, don't be so
serial.
We love you.
Amanda (49:50):
We love you a lot, so much, so much.
You are enough.
You are worthy all of it.
Love you lattes.
All right, guys, lulu.
Thank you so much for coming on.
So fun and so good to see youagain you too.
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