April 9, 2025 • 27 mins
Can AI supercharge your advertising strategy? Hikari Senju, CEO of Omneky, reveals how generative AI is reshaping personalized content and driving real results for brands. With a background in computer science from Harvard and a lifelong passion for technology and art, Hikari’s journey to founding Omneky seems almost inevitable.
In this episode, Hikari shares how his childhood experiences, cross-registering at MIT while at Harvard, and encountering early generative AI models sparked his vision to revolutionize advertising. He dives into the challenges of scaling Omneky, growing his team to 40 employees, and learning the delicate balance of delegation and leadership.
Key Takeaways:
- Mastering the Art of Delegation: Why trusting your team is essential for scaling a business.
- Building High-Performing Teams: The three key traits Hikari looks for when hiring—high integrity, high curiosity, and high energy.
- AI as a Collaborative Tool: How Hikari envisions AI augmenting, not replacing, human creativity.
- Leadership Lessons: Navigating team dynamics, communicating strategy, and fostering continuous growth.
- Omneky’s Vision for the Future: Taking the company public by 2027 or well on the path to an IPO.
Hikari’s story is a testament to blending innovation with purpose and scaling a company that empowers brands to leverage AI for maximum impact.
About Hikari Senju:
Hikari Senju is the Founder & CEO of Omneky, a generative AI company based in San Francisco that personalizes and orchestrates omnichannel creative content. Hikari previously studied Computer Science at Harvard, founded an edtech company which he sold to Yup.com and became its Head of Growth. Omneky, founded in 2018, has raised over $13M in seed from Softbank, AIX Ventures and Village Global. The company is the first mover in generative AI advertising, was the first generative AI company to pitch as a finalist at TechCrunch Disrupt, and most recently was highlighted in Jensen Huang's GTC keynote.
Connect:
Website omneky.com
LinkedIn linkedin.com/in/hikari-senju-63780199
This episode is brought to you by Omneky; Smarter Digital Ads For Scale. Go to omneky.com to learn more.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Announcer (00:01):
Entrepreneur, founder , author and financial advisor,
Marc Bernstein helpshigh-performing business owners
turn their visions into reality.
Through his innovative work andthe Forward Focus Forums, Marc
connects entrepreneurs toresources that fuel their
success.
Founders Forum is a radio showand podcast where entrepreneurs
share their journeys, revealingthe lessons they've learned and
(00:23):
the stories behind their success.
Join Marc and his guests for amix of inspiration, valuable
insights and a little fun.
Now let's dive in.
Marc Bernstein (00:33):
Good morning America.
How are you?
This is another cloudy day inPhiladelphia, cloudy winter day.
How's our level there, tyler?
They're perfect, okay, great.
So we have a new engineer.
I didn't hear the volume changebetween the music and my
headphones, so sorry about that.
Anyway, we're here today withMike Martin as our co-host.
(00:55):
Mike Martin is give me onesecond to get his stuff out, but
Mike is.
His company is well.
His book.
He's an author, is theSelf-Fulfilling Formula.
His company is Top DownStrategies.
He's a TEDx speaker, businesscoach and technology leader.
Welcome, mike.
Yeah, thanks, happy to be, hereand I'll introduce our guest in
(01:16):
a minute.
But before we do that, ourtopic of the day I've got a
quote for you.
I collect quotes and many ofyou know that I'm a follower of
Dan Sullivan, the strategiccoach, and went through his
program and I just think he's anoutside-the-box thinker and
he's created a lot of new kindof thinking and I've got a
(01:36):
number of his quotes from hisbooks, but this one I like a lot
.
Your number one responsibilityas an entrepreneur is to protect
your confidence and I've gotthoughts about what that means
because I've been through hisprogram and that's really like
the heart of his program.
But, mike, what does that meanto you?
Mike Martin (01:54):
Yeah.
So I love that quote.
I'll apply it back to my coreright, which is the
self-fulfilling formula.
The book right, and that theformula for thriving in this
world is mental, social andexecution fitness.
And so that quote to me reallyresonates with the mental
fitness component of that.
(02:15):
A super fast story when myparents took me to kindergarten,
my father told the kindergartenteacher that my IQ was tested,
it was extremely high, andexpect me to be the best student
.
The catch was my dad totallymade that up.
He created a self-fulfillingprophecy for me.
Marc Bernstein (02:31):
Wow.
Mike Martin (02:31):
Love that, yeah.
So I had the belief at the corethere was that I was an
excellent student, and I becameone right so very nice.
This to me is you become whatyou think about.
You become what you think about, and your confidence is about
your mental fitness and thebelief you have in yourself.
So protecting that is criticalto making that whatever prophecy
(02:53):
be real.
I'm an entrepreneur, I'm anauthor.
Whatever it is for youprotecting your confidence and
having that unshakable beliefsuper powerful.
Marc Bernstein (03:02):
Wonderful.
The first name of our guesttoday I'm going to introduce him
in a minute is Hikari Hikari.
What occurs to you about thatquote?
Hikari Senju (03:12):
I think being an entrepreneur is an act of faith
and contrarianism.
You're often seeing somethingearly in the market, something
that most people have not seenand are executing in.
That's why no one's done it yet.
That's why no one's beensuccessful at it, and the reason
why no one's been successful atit is because it's probably
really hard, and so you have tohave confidence in yourself
(03:34):
throughout.
You know, through that journey,as you kind of overcome each
one of these challenges that youknow to like, fulfill your
vision and see through theopportunity, and so that could
be very fast, that could be thatcould take a long time.
And I think in some ways, youknow being great entrepreneur or
(03:54):
being great investor, I meanit's similar thing of you know
you're, you're, you're makingcontrarian bet and no one's
really seen yet.
You have to see through thatthesis, execute against that
thesis, and you need to havefaith throughout that process.
And so, and if you give up, youknow, I think the biggest
difference between successfulpeople and people who aren't
successful is really, ultimately, that the people who aren't
(04:16):
successful give up.
Successful people always manageto pull through the failures.
And so, yeah, and confidenceand faith in your office, I
think was very key to anchor ofthat.
Marc Bernstein (04:28):
So I love what both of you had to say about it.
You both talked about reallyabout acquiring confidence and
having it.
So since I've been through thestrategic coach, I'll just add a
little bit of dimension to that.
How do you protect it once youhave it as an example?
Another quote of dan sullivan'sis frank sinatra didn't move
pianos.
So imagine if he's this singerand he's getting ready and all
(04:51):
the mental preparation he has todo to do that and his only job
is to go out on the stage andsing.
But prior to the show he had tomove the piano, you know, and
change his clothes and move thepiano and and do like physical
work and all that.
Would he be as well prepared todo what he does?
So one of the things is youfigure out what your unique
ability is and what brings themost value to whoever your
(05:16):
audience is and your company,and you protect it by having
other people do everything else.
That's one of many ways, butthat's one of the things that
occurs to me that you find yourunique ability, you delegate the
rest.
You find the people that arebest at what they do around you.
We talked about that a littlebit in our last show, and that
(05:38):
is what helps protect yourconfidence, so that you're doing
, your energy is all focused onwhat it is you should be doing.
Mike Martin (05:45):
Stick to the things you're the best at.
Marc Bernstein (05:47):
Yes, so Hikari Senju is the founder and CEO of
Omneky, a generative AI companybased in San Francisco, so he's
joining us here from SanFrancisco today.
It personalizes andorchestrates omnichannel
creative content.
Hikari previously studiedcomputer science at Harvard,
(06:08):
founded an ed-tech company whichhe sold to Yupcom and became
its head of growth.
Omneky was founded in 2018 andhas raised over $13 million in
seed money from SoftBank, aixVentures and Village Global.
The company is the first moverin generative advertising and
was the first generative AIcompany to pitch as a finalist
(06:31):
at TechCrunch Disrupt and mostrecently, was highlighted in
Jensen Huang's GTC keynote.
Micah, you're a technology guyyourself, so I'm sure you have
some good questions for Hikariand Hikari.
Welcome Thanks for being heretoday.
Hikari Senju (06:47):
Thank you, Marc, thank you, mike for having me.
I'm really excited to be hereand, yes, I'm calling from
beautiful San Francisco.
Great weather today in the 60sand such.
Marc Bernstein (07:00):
We're in the 60s too, but it's kind of like raw
and you know, cloudy, rainy.
So you know, but it is what itis.
San Francisco beautiful weather, though I love it out there
yeah, me too.
So tell us your story.
You know kind of how you gotinto this, and we'll have a lot
of questions for you along theway.
Hikari Senju (07:19):
Yeah, I grew up in Westchester, new York, and the
reason why I grew up inWestchester, new York and the
reason why I grew up inWestchester, new York is because
it's near the IBM headquarters.
My grandfather worked at IBM andso that's also why my mother
went to the same high schoolthat I did in a horse wheeling
high school and so early on itdefinitely was an early milieu
(07:45):
of technology On breaks goingwith my grandfather to see demos
because he became a venturecapitalist afterward Early
access to learning to program,early competing robotics,
competitions just enjoyingmaking things, things and then
(08:07):
just in some ways getting someintuition of the exponential
rate in which technology evolvesand accelerates.
Separately, my dad's a painterand so I also grew up going to
art studios and paintingalongside my dad, growing up and
developing some kind ofintuition related to colors and
balance and how do you haveharmony in a design and how do
you create a visual experiencefor people.
(08:28):
I got into Harvard, I got intoMIT and Princeton and many of
these other schools ultimatelychose to go to Harvard, but
cross-registered at MIT,focusing on machine learning and
AI, and it was there at MIT,actually taking class there,
that I saw the early generativeAI models, and that's really
where everything comes togethermy background in technology as
(08:50):
well as art and seeing thepossibility of generative art in
particular, and that if an.
AI could create art better thanhumans or as good as humans, and
this is kind of what the earlydemos was showing is, and
especially if you could kind ofintuit Moore's law, and that it
would exponentially improve that, its implication is pretty
massive.
That's what really got mehooked into generative AI in
(09:13):
college about a decade ago.
Separately, though, you know,it was very early in the
technology.
It wasn't productionizable, itwasn't, you know, the go-to
market wasn't.
You know, the product wasnowhere near, or the technology
was nowhere near, a go-to market.
So I but I'm an entrepreneurialperson I started two
venture-backed companies incollege, and one of which was an
education company product.
(09:33):
It was a personalized learningapplication connecting students
to personalized tutors.
This was acquired by anothercompany in San Francisco, where
it became the head of growth,and so it was their running
growth, combined with my passionfor generative art and
generative AI, that I saw theopportunity to start OmniHeat
back in 2018 to generate andoptimize creative autonomously
advertising creativeautonomously with AI.
Marc Bernstein (09:56):
Wonderful, that's amazing.
Mike Martin (09:57):
Yeah, I just want to comment there because you
made a really excellent point.
That is something I believe inand I'm sure, Marc, you can
relate to this, us both beingmusicians is the union of the
logical and the artistic, thetechnology with the artistic.
You look at companies likeApple and Steve Jobs.
(10:18):
Right, he worried about the waythe fonts looked and what the
screens looked like, and I justfind that having that creative
look and sensibility reallymakes the technology palatable
and sellable.
Do you find that?
What's your thoughts on sort ofthat union of art and
technology?
Hikari Senju (10:39):
Yeah, I mean I think it like you're both.
You know you're ultimately acreator, you know an engineer is
a creator, an artist is acreator.
You're creating, you'rebirthing a new experience into
the world.
Um, and I think it's kind of aspectrum from you know, hardcore
engineering where everything iskind of, you know, fixed based
on the kind of the reality isphysics to like, you know, like
(11:02):
you have a blank canvas and Ithink really the best products
are something that you knowreally finds the right balance
between those two.
So you mentioning you knowSteve Jobs being you know
building these beautifulproducts.
But I think great engineers alsokind of view themselves as
artists.
I think there's probablythere's elements of when you go
through the code of a greatsoftware engineer.
(11:23):
You go through the code.
There's some artistry there.
There's probably some stuffthat they do in terms of the way
they write, in the logic thatthe code has.
That isn't necessarilynecessary, but you know, because
they're very proud of theircraft and so ultimately, I think
they're both engineers, artists.
They're craftspeople.
They like making things, theylike milking things for other
people.
They like other peopleexperiencing the things that
(11:44):
they make.
They like creating experiencesinto the world that didn't exist
before and that's really whatgot me into computer science
early on was actually throughjust enjoying to make art so
early on middle school, enjoyingto make art so early on, you
know, middle school I was, youknow, um artist of the week.
Every week, you know like Ioften, uh, I would like submit
artwork to like the school artteacher, and you know there'll
(12:07):
be competition, um, and so italways comes from um, this kind
of desire to create.
Yeah, um, and what was greatabout software in particular was
that you can do it at scale.
So, you know, if I create apiece of art painting, maybe,
you know, 10 people can see it,20 people can see it, but 100
million people can see it, butif I create a piece of software,
(12:28):
it's immediately scalable topotentially, you know, hundreds
of millions or billions ofpeople, and so that was that was
what um uh got, but it comesfrom this, you know, similar
source of this desire to create.
Marc Bernstein (12:43):
Yeah, the importance of creativity and the
union of form and function, umby the way you said Mike, I
could you said I could probablyrelate to it, not to take the
story away from Macari, but I'ma lawyer who went to music
school first.
There you go, and now I'm afinancial planner and I feel
that there's a lot of logic inmusic and there's a lot of
(13:04):
creativity in law, and financialplanning to me actually
combines it all together.
Mike Martin (13:10):
I think the importance of creativity as a
skill is really undervalued.
Marc Bernstein (13:15):
I understand creativity as a skill is really
undervalued.
I understand we have just aminute or two before our
commercial break, but, hikari, Iknow you know there's hills and
valleys.
When you're an entrepreneurit's not all, you know, just a
joy ride.
What kind of challenges haveyou faced in the building of
OmneKy?
Hikari Senju (13:31):
Oh gosh, I mean you have every.
I mean I've been running OmneKyfor six years.
I've been an entrepreneur forbasically my entire career.
I mean you face every singlekind of challenge.
You face the challenge of nothaving enough money.
What are some of your favoritechallenges?
(13:52):
The thing that I've learned mostrecently is how to just be a
great, to be a great becausethere's evolution as an
entrepreneur from, say, beingthe person that builds MVP and
building a great initial productwith a team of people, to then
scaling to a much larger teamwhere you have to start hiring
and delegating work, and justthe art of delegation I think
(14:15):
you mentioned prior to this kindof pre-call was, you know, it
was a theme from the previoussession as well, but it is not
an easy skill.
I mean, there is an urge tomicromanage, there's an urge to
get everything perfect, and youhave to trust people and you
have to trust their abilitiesand you have to communicate well
as well.
I mean, that is also, you know,you're only as good as your
(14:37):
ability to communicate astrategy.
You can have the perfectstrategy in your head, but if
you can't communicate itproperly, then it's as good as
not a great strategy, and sothat whole art of managing a
team of people who you know havemore, maybe specific domain
knowledge than you, and thencommunicating and then and then
communicating and havingeveryone's function as a strong
(14:58):
team is, you know, not not aneasy skill and and that has been
, you know, you know kind oflearning through through.
Marc Bernstein (15:08):
Yeah, and I also inferred from there, you know,
perfection is, perfection isthere's an urge for perfection,
but perfection is usuallynon-existent.
So progress is probably thebetter measure.
I would think right.
Hikari Senju (15:24):
Absolutely.
You know, every day, justseeing, are you putting one foot
in front of the other?
Are you you know what have youaccomplished today?
And then just you know, I think, at the end of every day,
really being proud that youproud that at least we move one
step forward in some keyinitiative throughout the org.
I think, the CEO, you run bothengineering products, marketing,
sales, financing, and so youhave to be good at at least be
(15:50):
able to supervise all thosethings, and so making sure that
you're incrementally makingprogress in at least one of
these dimensions every day isyou know the way to keep going.
Marc Bernstein (16:04):
Forward movement .
With that.
We want to take a quickcommercial break and hear a
little bit more about OmneKy.
Announcer (16:12):
Frustrated with your ad campaigns?
Let OmneKy take the wheel.
We use the power of AI togenerate high-performing ads,
personalized for every customer.
Omneky analyzes millions ofdata points to optimize your
creatives and target the rightaudience across all channels.
Stop wasting time and money.
Whether you're a small businessor a large enterprise, Omneky
(16:34):
helps you reach the right peoplewith the right message at the
right time.
Visit Omneky.
com today for a free trial andsee your ROI soar.
That's Omneky.
com.
Marc Bernstein (16:46):
I like that music in that commercial.
Yeah, I think it fits the themeof forward movement.
You know, absolutely.
Do you like that, mike?
How?
Mike Martin (16:54):
about you.
Marc Bernstein (16:55):
You like the music Hikari.
Hikari Senju (16:57):
Yeah, I listened to like a version of this with
your team before this and, yeah,it was good, I thought it
turned out good.
Marc Bernstein (17:06):
You always got to have music in the end, yeah,
so you talked a little bit aboutwell, you talked about
challenges.
You talked about some of thestrengths you've had to develop
to deal with those challenges.
Mike, you probably have somequestions, yeah.
Mike Martin (17:18):
I mean I think you also highlighted there sort of
the importance of communication.
You know, being able toarticulate your vision in order
to delegate.
So talk a little bit about theimportance of saying no and
having you know other peopletake over as a CEO.
It's hard to let go, so how doyou deal with that?
Hikari Senju (17:40):
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, at the end of the day,you know and you mentioned Frank
Sinatra earlier is that youknow you have a job and you
can't do everyone's job.
I mean you're not going to be.
You know everyone has to focuson their core area.
If you're doing somebody else'sjob, then you're not doing your
job, and so, yeah, it's about,you know there's that great Jim
(18:06):
Collins, you know quote, whichis you know you got to get the
right people on the bus and yougot to get the right people in
the right seats on the bus.
And so, yeah, that that is thekey.
The key important thing ofhaving a, you know, elite team
is everyone's in the rightposition, they know what they're
doing and they're the best inthat position.
Yeah, love Jim Collins.
Marc Bernstein (18:24):
How do you?
We were talking about this onour last show, but how do you?
What is your?
What they say and what you kindof agree on is required as a
team.
Hikari Senju (18:45):
So making sure there's clarity across the team
what everyone's responsibilityis, what their expectations are,
and if people aren't meetingthose expectations, then
problem-solving with them andfiguring out why, uh, why that
is the case, and and um, andthen, um, you know, trying to
really find the source of theriddle of the problem.
(19:06):
Is it?
Is it a personnel problem?
Is it?
Um?
I mean, in some ways everyproblem is a personnel problem.
You can argue, but but you knowit's, it can be.
The situation could just be avery tough situation, and you
have the understanding it couldbe a timing issue.
Sometimes it's just going tohave more patience.
Also, you know people learn andpeople change, and so you know
(19:28):
providing the right feedback.
You know the CEO is also.
The job is to be the coach forthe team, and so sometimes you
do switch players out, but othertimes it's really just about
coaching the players to reallyexcel at their role.
And so those are the nuances ofleadership.
Marc Bernstein (19:49):
How many employees do you have today?
Hikari Senju (19:52):
Yeah, so today we have 40 employees.
Marc Bernstein (19:55):
And is that the most you've had?
Hikari Senju (19:58):
I think we've scaled up and down.
I would say that we may havehad slightly more employees at
some point, but because thebusiness model has also somewhat
shifted, we used to do a lotmore services work than today,
which predominantly wereessentially product-driven
company, and so the people thatyou need has changed.
But yeah, around that range.
Mike Martin (20:22):
Mike, you had a.
Yeah, I was just going tohighlight the.
You talked about the importanceof accountability, and I'm a
huge believer in accountabilityas a key ingredient to execution
and achieving what you'retrying to, what you set out to
do, whether that'saccountability to yourself or
having it within a team as amanager or CEO.
So, yeah, I love that point andI guess I was going to ask you
(20:48):
with how rapidly technology ischanging, especially in the AI
space, how are you stayingcurrent and staying adaptable to
all the changes that arehappening there?
Hikari Senju (20:59):
Yeah, I mean, it definitely helps me.
In San Francisco, you know, atthe epicenter of a lot of you
know, the Silicon Valley, at theepicenter of all this change,
our office is in Sunnyvale.
We have a, you know, people arein the office, and so it's not
just me staying up to date, butmaking sure that our, you know,
key product team, engineeringteam, sales team, is up to date
(21:22):
in terms of all the information.
People are constantly learningthings.
They're learning aboutcompetitors, they're learning
about new tools, they'relearning about new technologies,
new interesting projects,interesting tools, and so
they're bringing back to theteam sharing that knowledge and,
as a group, just tools, and sothey're bringing back to the
(21:42):
team sharing that knowledge andand, as a group, just being an
information hungry organization.
I think generally, you know,when we're hiring people, we
look for three characteristicshigh integrity, high curiosity
and high energy.
And so, and so you know, thepeople that we've assembled are
all kind of, you know, alwaysseeking information and bringing
it back to the team.
Marc Bernstein (21:58):
Hikari.
This show is about reallylooking to the future and we
talked about forward movementand momentum and progression.
I'd like to ask you about youknow, if this were December of
2027, and we're talking andwe're looking back on the last
three years what would have tohappen in your life and I know a
huge part of your life is thebusiness at this point, what
(22:22):
would have to happen for you tofeel that that was a successful
three-year progression in yourlife and business?
Hikari Senju (22:28):
I mean, I think, either IPO-ed or on the way to
be IPO-ing, being a publiccompany.
This is something that I thinkis an important step in
achieving the skill that we wantto achieve and the impact we
want to achieve.
And so something, yeah, likesomewhere along that IPO journey
(22:49):
and definitely closer, orhaving surpassed it in the next
but three years is also a longtime, but also a short period of
time Right.
Marc Bernstein (22:57):
What challenges do you see in front of you to
get there?
Hikari Senju (23:01):
Generative AI is such an interesting space
because it is constantlyevolving and the dynamics are
constantly changing.
The competition is changing,the technology is changing, the
consumer and business demand forthat technology.
As they learn more abouttechnology, it's changing their
appetite, it's changing theirregard to technology, and so I
(23:22):
think it's continuously makingsure we're at the forefront of
generative AI, building the bestproducts generative AI products
for our customers, which aremarketers and advertisers, and,
yeah, just making sure thatwe're the best at delivering
their need with our technology.
Mike Martin (23:42):
Yeah, gotcha, I'll ask too this is a question I
love asking people If you couldwave a magic wand over your
business and have any result youwanted, in any area, what would
that be?
Hikari Senju (23:55):
I think it's just, you know, making sure that we
have the very best product ingeneral, ai, and that includes
the best AI, the bestengineering, and I think from
there, you know, by having thevery best product, you know many
other facts kind of cometogether sales, you know, then
you can have the very best sales.
You have the very best word ofmouth, you have the very best,
(24:15):
you know understanding, bestunderstanding in the general
market.
So we're a product-centric,product-oriented company and if
I would have imagined to havethe best product and therefore
also the best team to build thatto you know, that can build
that product.
Marc Bernstein (24:32):
I'm going to switch gears because we only
have a couple minutes left.
I know you're a voraciousreader.
We've talked about many books.
First of all, what are yourfavorite books?
And then I'd like to ask youwhat you're currently reading.
Hikari Senju (24:44):
Yeah, my favorite book is and we've actually had
this conversation over justspanning half a year, Marc.
But right now my favorite bookis a book called Accelerando and
it's actually a sci-fi bookabout AI, about AI, about AI.
Yeah, yeah, it's aboutartificial intelligence and kind
(25:09):
of the future.
It's a book called Accelerando.
Marc Bernstein (25:12):
I'm sorry, it just broke up a little bit,
that's why I wasn't sure.
Go ahead.
Yep, yeah, it's calledAccelerando.
Hikari Senju (25:15):
I'm sorry it just broke up a little bit, that's
why I wasn't sure Go ahead.
Yeah, it's by Charles Straussand it's about kind of a world
where you know the AI or kind ofcollective AI, human
intelligence or path is, there'sthis brain, where AI and
humanity, you know thecollective intelligence of this
kind of this total like,improves every you know decade
(25:36):
by like leaps and bounds.
And so you know you have this.
You know every chapter almostbegins with like MIPS, like how
much million instructions persecond can humanity collectively
calculate?
And you know you start the2000s and it's a certain amount
of MIPS.
But then as the computers getmore and more powerful and the
humans kind of brain melt withthe computers and it's like just
(25:57):
you know, like justexponentially grow.
And you know at some point thathumanity has built Dyson
spheres around the sun andthey're exploring other galaxies
, and so it's an optimistic book.
It's a book that I think isactually a vision of the future.
I think that is quite possibleas AI accelerates.
(26:18):
I don't think AI is going toreplace humans.
I think AI will coexist andevolve with humans.
They will come in time,probably when all the
computation in the world poweredby machines will be greater
than humanity.
Hopefully we can enter a worldwhere that would, but because
there's a brain merge withhumanity, it kind of expands
humanity's horizons as well.
That is currently my favoritebook, especially at this moment
(26:43):
in time, given the high changethat we're seeing related to AI
and kind of all the hype thatwe're hearing about AI and
seeing about AI.
Marc Bernstein (26:55):
Sounds like one, sounds like one.
We should all read actually.
Mike Martin (26:58):
Yeah.
Marc Bernstein (26:58):
I've written it down.
Yeah, I'm going to check it out.
Hikari Senju (27:00):
It's, it's, it's, it's a great book it's.
I don't really read a lot ofscience fiction.
I mostly read business books.
Marc Bernstein (27:08):
Well, this is like a business, right?
Yeah, yeah it is it is?
Hikari Senju (27:16):
It is kind of a very practical book in some ways
, and listen.
Marc Bernstein (27:20):
I thank you.
We're out of time, but thankyou for being here.
Announcer (27:24):
Kari Senju, thank you , mike Martin, thank you all for
listening and we'll see younext week on Founders Forum.
We hope you enjoyed your timewith Founders Forum and that you
found value to take with youthroughout your day.
Join us again next week foranother episode of Founders
Forum on WXKB 1039 HD2.
Entrepreneur, founder , author and financial advisor,
Marc Bernstein helpshigh-performing business owners
turn their visions into reality.
Through his innovative work andthe Forward Focus Forums, Marc
connects entrepreneurs toresources that fuel their
success.
Founders Forum is a radio showand podcast where entrepreneurs
share their journeys, revealingthe lessons they've learned and
(00:23):
the stories behind their success.
Join Marc and his guests for amix of inspiration, valuable
insights and a little fun.
Now let's dive in.
Marc Bernstein (00:33):
Good morning America.
How are you?
This is another cloudy day inPhiladelphia, cloudy winter day.
How's our level there, tyler?
They're perfect, okay, great.
So we have a new engineer.
I didn't hear the volume changebetween the music and my
headphones, so sorry about that.
Anyway, we're here today withMike Martin as our co-host.
(00:55):
Mike Martin is give me onesecond to get his stuff out, but
Mike is.
His company is well.
His book.
He's an author, is theSelf-Fulfilling Formula.
His company is Top DownStrategies.
He's a TEDx speaker, businesscoach and technology leader.
Welcome, mike.
Yeah, thanks, happy to be, hereand I'll introduce our guest in
(01:16):
a minute.
But before we do that, ourtopic of the day I've got a
quote for you.
I collect quotes and many ofyou know that I'm a follower of
Dan Sullivan, the strategiccoach, and went through his
program and I just think he's anoutside-the-box thinker and
he's created a lot of new kindof thinking and I've got a
(01:36):
number of his quotes from hisbooks, but this one I like a lot
.
Your number one responsibilityas an entrepreneur is to protect
your confidence and I've gotthoughts about what that means
because I've been through hisprogram and that's really like
the heart of his program.
But, mike, what does that meanto you?
Mike Martin (01:54):
Yeah.
So I love that quote.
I'll apply it back to my coreright, which is the
self-fulfilling formula.
The book right, and that theformula for thriving in this
world is mental, social andexecution fitness.
And so that quote to me reallyresonates with the mental
fitness component of that.
(02:15):
A super fast story when myparents took me to kindergarten,
my father told the kindergartenteacher that my IQ was tested,
it was extremely high, andexpect me to be the best student
.
The catch was my dad totallymade that up.
He created a self-fulfillingprophecy for me.
Marc Bernstein (02:31):
Wow.
Mike Martin (02:31):
Love that, yeah.
So I had the belief at the corethere was that I was an
excellent student, and I becameone right so very nice.
This to me is you become whatyou think about.
You become what you think about, and your confidence is about
your mental fitness and thebelief you have in yourself.
So protecting that is criticalto making that whatever prophecy
(02:53):
be real.
I'm an entrepreneur, I'm anauthor.
Whatever it is for youprotecting your confidence and
having that unshakable beliefsuper powerful.
Marc Bernstein (03:02):
Wonderful.
The first name of our guesttoday I'm going to introduce him
in a minute is Hikari Hikari.
What occurs to you about thatquote?
Hikari Senju (03:12):
I think being an entrepreneur is an act of faith
and contrarianism.
You're often seeing somethingearly in the market, something
that most people have not seenand are executing in.
That's why no one's done it yet.
That's why no one's beensuccessful at it, and the reason
why no one's been successful atit is because it's probably
really hard, and so you have tohave confidence in yourself
(03:34):
throughout.
You know, through that journey,as you kind of overcome each
one of these challenges that youknow to like, fulfill your
vision and see through theopportunity, and so that could
be very fast, that could be thatcould take a long time.
And I think in some ways, youknow being great entrepreneur or
(03:54):
being great investor, I meanit's similar thing of you know
you're, you're, you're makingcontrarian bet and no one's
really seen yet.
You have to see through thatthesis, execute against that
thesis, and you need to havefaith throughout that process.
And so, and if you give up, youknow, I think the biggest
difference between successfulpeople and people who aren't
successful is really, ultimately, that the people who aren't
(04:16):
successful give up.
Successful people always manageto pull through the failures.
And so, yeah, and confidenceand faith in your office, I
think was very key to anchor ofthat.
Marc Bernstein (04:28):
So I love what both of you had to say about it.
You both talked about reallyabout acquiring confidence and
having it.
So since I've been through thestrategic coach, I'll just add a
little bit of dimension to that.
How do you protect it once youhave it as an example?
Another quote of dan sullivan'sis frank sinatra didn't move
pianos.
So imagine if he's this singerand he's getting ready and all
(04:51):
the mental preparation he has todo to do that and his only job
is to go out on the stage andsing.
But prior to the show he had tomove the piano, you know, and
change his clothes and move thepiano and and do like physical
work and all that.
Would he be as well prepared todo what he does?
So one of the things is youfigure out what your unique
ability is and what brings themost value to whoever your
(05:16):
audience is and your company,and you protect it by having
other people do everything else.
That's one of many ways, butthat's one of the things that
occurs to me that you find yourunique ability, you delegate the
rest.
You find the people that arebest at what they do around you.
We talked about that a littlebit in our last show, and that
(05:38):
is what helps protect yourconfidence, so that you're doing
, your energy is all focused onwhat it is you should be doing.
Mike Martin (05:45):
Stick to the things you're the best at.
Marc Bernstein (05:47):
Yes, so Hikari Senju is the founder and CEO of
Omneky, a generative AI companybased in San Francisco, so he's
joining us here from SanFrancisco today.
It personalizes andorchestrates omnichannel
creative content.
Hikari previously studiedcomputer science at Harvard,
(06:08):
founded an ed-tech company whichhe sold to Yupcom and became
its head of growth.
Omneky was founded in 2018 andhas raised over $13 million in
seed money from SoftBank, aixVentures and Village Global.
The company is the first moverin generative advertising and
was the first generative AIcompany to pitch as a finalist
(06:31):
at TechCrunch Disrupt and mostrecently, was highlighted in
Jensen Huang's GTC keynote.
Micah, you're a technology guyyourself, so I'm sure you have
some good questions for Hikariand Hikari.
Welcome Thanks for being heretoday.
Hikari Senju (06:47):
Thank you, Marc, thank you, mike for having me.
I'm really excited to be hereand, yes, I'm calling from
beautiful San Francisco.
Great weather today in the 60sand such.
Marc Bernstein (07:00):
We're in the 60s too, but it's kind of like raw
and you know, cloudy, rainy.
So you know, but it is what itis.
San Francisco beautiful weather, though I love it out there
yeah, me too.
So tell us your story.
You know kind of how you gotinto this, and we'll have a lot
of questions for you along theway.
Hikari Senju (07:19):
Yeah, I grew up in Westchester, new York, and the
reason why I grew up inWestchester, new York and the
reason why I grew up inWestchester, new York is because
it's near the IBM headquarters.
My grandfather worked at IBM andso that's also why my mother
went to the same high schoolthat I did in a horse wheeling
high school and so early on itdefinitely was an early milieu
(07:45):
of technology On breaks goingwith my grandfather to see demos
because he became a venturecapitalist afterward Early
access to learning to program,early competing robotics,
competitions just enjoyingmaking things, things and then
(08:07):
just in some ways getting someintuition of the exponential
rate in which technology evolvesand accelerates.
Separately, my dad's a painterand so I also grew up going to
art studios and paintingalongside my dad, growing up and
developing some kind ofintuition related to colors and
balance and how do you haveharmony in a design and how do
you create a visual experiencefor people.
(08:28):
I got into Harvard, I got intoMIT and Princeton and many of
these other schools ultimatelychose to go to Harvard, but
cross-registered at MIT,focusing on machine learning and
AI, and it was there at MIT,actually taking class there,
that I saw the early generativeAI models, and that's really
where everything comes togethermy background in technology as
(08:50):
well as art and seeing thepossibility of generative art in
particular, and that if an.
AI could create art better thanhumans or as good as humans, and
this is kind of what the earlydemos was showing is, and
especially if you could kind ofintuit Moore's law, and that it
would exponentially improve that, its implication is pretty
massive.
That's what really got mehooked into generative AI in
(09:13):
college about a decade ago.
Separately, though, you know,it was very early in the
technology.
It wasn't productionizable, itwasn't, you know, the go-to
market wasn't.
You know, the product wasnowhere near, or the technology
was nowhere near, a go-to market.
So I but I'm an entrepreneurialperson I started two
venture-backed companies incollege, and one of which was an
education company product.
(09:33):
It was a personalized learningapplication connecting students
to personalized tutors.
This was acquired by anothercompany in San Francisco, where
it became the head of growth,and so it was their running
growth, combined with my passionfor generative art and
generative AI, that I saw theopportunity to start OmniHeat
back in 2018 to generate andoptimize creative autonomously
advertising creativeautonomously with AI.
Marc Bernstein (09:56):
Wonderful, that's amazing.
Mike Martin (09:57):
Yeah, I just want to comment there because you
made a really excellent point.
That is something I believe inand I'm sure, Marc, you can
relate to this, us both beingmusicians is the union of the
logical and the artistic, thetechnology with the artistic.
You look at companies likeApple and Steve Jobs.
(10:18):
Right, he worried about the waythe fonts looked and what the
screens looked like, and I justfind that having that creative
look and sensibility reallymakes the technology palatable
and sellable.
Do you find that?
What's your thoughts on sort ofthat union of art and
technology?
Hikari Senju (10:39):
Yeah, I mean I think it like you're both.
You know you're ultimately acreator, you know an engineer is
a creator, an artist is acreator.
You're creating, you'rebirthing a new experience into
the world.
Um, and I think it's kind of aspectrum from you know, hardcore
engineering where everything iskind of, you know, fixed based
on the kind of the reality isphysics to like, you know, like
(11:02):
you have a blank canvas and Ithink really the best products
are something that you knowreally finds the right balance
between those two.
So you mentioning you knowSteve Jobs being you know
building these beautifulproducts.
But I think great engineers alsokind of view themselves as
artists.
I think there's probablythere's elements of when you go
through the code of a greatsoftware engineer.
(11:23):
You go through the code.
There's some artistry there.
There's probably some stuffthat they do in terms of the way
they write, in the logic thatthe code has.
That isn't necessarilynecessary, but you know, because
they're very proud of theircraft and so ultimately, I think
they're both engineers, artists.
They're craftspeople.
They like making things, theylike milking things for other
people.
They like other peopleexperiencing the things that
(11:44):
they make.
They like creating experiencesinto the world that didn't exist
before and that's really whatgot me into computer science
early on was actually throughjust enjoying to make art so
early on middle school, enjoyingto make art so early on, you
know, middle school I was, youknow, um artist of the week.
Every week, you know like Ioften, uh, I would like submit
artwork to like the school artteacher, and you know there'll
(12:07):
be competition, um, and so italways comes from um, this kind
of desire to create.
Yeah, um, and what was greatabout software in particular was
that you can do it at scale.
So, you know, if I create apiece of art painting, maybe,
you know, 10 people can see it,20 people can see it, but 100
million people can see it, butif I create a piece of software,
(12:28):
it's immediately scalable topotentially, you know, hundreds
of millions or billions ofpeople, and so that was that was
what um uh got, but it comesfrom this, you know, similar
source of this desire to create.
Marc Bernstein (12:43):
Yeah, the importance of creativity and the
union of form and function, umby the way you said Mike, I
could you said I could probablyrelate to it, not to take the
story away from Macari, but I'ma lawyer who went to music
school first.
There you go, and now I'm afinancial planner and I feel
that there's a lot of logic inmusic and there's a lot of
(13:04):
creativity in law, and financialplanning to me actually
combines it all together.
Mike Martin (13:10):
I think the importance of creativity as a
skill is really undervalued.
Marc Bernstein (13:15):
I understand creativity as a skill is really
undervalued.
I understand we have just aminute or two before our
commercial break, but, hikari, Iknow you know there's hills and
valleys.
When you're an entrepreneurit's not all, you know, just a
joy ride.
What kind of challenges haveyou faced in the building of
OmneKy?
Hikari Senju (13:31):
Oh gosh, I mean you have every.
I mean I've been running OmneKyfor six years.
I've been an entrepreneur forbasically my entire career.
I mean you face every singlekind of challenge.
You face the challenge of nothaving enough money.
What are some of your favoritechallenges?
(13:52):
The thing that I've learned mostrecently is how to just be a
great, to be a great becausethere's evolution as an
entrepreneur from, say, beingthe person that builds MVP and
building a great initial productwith a team of people, to then
scaling to a much larger teamwhere you have to start hiring
and delegating work, and justthe art of delegation I think
(14:15):
you mentioned prior to this kindof pre-call was, you know, it
was a theme from the previoussession as well, but it is not
an easy skill.
I mean, there is an urge tomicromanage, there's an urge to
get everything perfect, and youhave to trust people and you
have to trust their abilitiesand you have to communicate well
as well.
I mean, that is also, you know,you're only as good as your
(14:37):
ability to communicate astrategy.
You can have the perfectstrategy in your head, but if
you can't communicate itproperly, then it's as good as
not a great strategy, and sothat whole art of managing a
team of people who you know havemore, maybe specific domain
knowledge than you, and thencommunicating and then and then
communicating and havingeveryone's function as a strong
(14:58):
team is, you know, not not aneasy skill and and that has been
, you know, you know kind oflearning through through.
Marc Bernstein (15:08):
Yeah, and I also inferred from there, you know,
perfection is, perfection isthere's an urge for perfection,
but perfection is usuallynon-existent.
So progress is probably thebetter measure.
I would think right.
Hikari Senju (15:24):
Absolutely.
You know, every day, justseeing, are you putting one foot
in front of the other?
Are you you know what have youaccomplished today?
And then just you know, I think, at the end of every day,
really being proud that youproud that at least we move one
step forward in some keyinitiative throughout the org.
I think, the CEO, you run bothengineering products, marketing,
sales, financing, and so youhave to be good at at least be
(15:50):
able to supervise all thosethings, and so making sure that
you're incrementally makingprogress in at least one of
these dimensions every day isyou know the way to keep going.
Marc Bernstein (16:04):
Forward movement .
With that.
We want to take a quickcommercial break and hear a
little bit more about OmneKy.
Announcer (16:12):
Frustrated with your ad campaigns?
Let OmneKy take the wheel.
We use the power of AI togenerate high-performing ads,
personalized for every customer.
Omneky analyzes millions ofdata points to optimize your
creatives and target the rightaudience across all channels.
Stop wasting time and money.
Whether you're a small businessor a large enterprise, Omneky
(16:34):
helps you reach the right peoplewith the right message at the
right time.
Visit Omneky.
com today for a free trial andsee your ROI soar.
That's Omneky.
com.
Marc Bernstein (16:46):
I like that music in that commercial.
Yeah, I think it fits the themeof forward movement.
You know, absolutely.
Do you like that, mike?
How?
Mike Martin (16:54):
about you.
Marc Bernstein (16:55):
You like the music Hikari.
Hikari Senju (16:57):
Yeah, I listened to like a version of this with
your team before this and, yeah,it was good, I thought it
turned out good.
Marc Bernstein (17:06):
You always got to have music in the end, yeah,
so you talked a little bit aboutwell, you talked about
challenges.
You talked about some of thestrengths you've had to develop
to deal with those challenges.
Mike, you probably have somequestions, yeah.
Mike Martin (17:18):
I mean I think you also highlighted there sort of
the importance of communication.
You know, being able toarticulate your vision in order
to delegate.
So talk a little bit about theimportance of saying no and
having you know other peopletake over as a CEO.
It's hard to let go, so how doyou deal with that?
Hikari Senju (17:40):
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, at the end of the day,you know and you mentioned Frank
Sinatra earlier is that youknow you have a job and you
can't do everyone's job.
I mean you're not going to be.
You know everyone has to focuson their core area.
If you're doing somebody else'sjob, then you're not doing your
job, and so, yeah, it's about,you know there's that great Jim
(18:06):
Collins, you know quote, whichis you know you got to get the
right people on the bus and yougot to get the right people in
the right seats on the bus.
And so, yeah, that that is thekey.
The key important thing ofhaving a, you know, elite team
is everyone's in the rightposition, they know what they're
doing and they're the best inthat position.
Yeah, love Jim Collins.
Marc Bernstein (18:24):
How do you?
We were talking about this onour last show, but how do you?
What is your?
What they say and what you kindof agree on is required as a
team.
Hikari Senju (18:45):
So making sure there's clarity across the team
what everyone's responsibilityis, what their expectations are,
and if people aren't meetingthose expectations, then
problem-solving with them andfiguring out why, uh, why that
is the case, and and um, andthen, um, you know, trying to
really find the source of theriddle of the problem.
(19:06):
Is it?
Is it a personnel problem?
Is it?
Um?
I mean, in some ways everyproblem is a personnel problem.
You can argue, but but you knowit's, it can be.
The situation could just be avery tough situation, and you
have the understanding it couldbe a timing issue.
Sometimes it's just going tohave more patience.
Also, you know people learn andpeople change, and so you know
(19:28):
providing the right feedback.
You know the CEO is also.
The job is to be the coach forthe team, and so sometimes you
do switch players out, but othertimes it's really just about
coaching the players to reallyexcel at their role.
And so those are the nuances ofleadership.
Marc Bernstein (19:49):
How many employees do you have today?
Hikari Senju (19:52):
Yeah, so today we have 40 employees.
Marc Bernstein (19:55):
And is that the most you've had?
Hikari Senju (19:58):
I think we've scaled up and down.
I would say that we may havehad slightly more employees at
some point, but because thebusiness model has also somewhat
shifted, we used to do a lotmore services work than today,
which predominantly wereessentially product-driven
company, and so the people thatyou need has changed.
But yeah, around that range.
Mike Martin (20:22):
Mike, you had a.
Yeah, I was just going tohighlight the.
You talked about the importanceof accountability, and I'm a
huge believer in accountabilityas a key ingredient to execution
and achieving what you'retrying to, what you set out to
do, whether that'saccountability to yourself or
having it within a team as amanager or CEO.
So, yeah, I love that point andI guess I was going to ask you
(20:48):
with how rapidly technology ischanging, especially in the AI
space, how are you stayingcurrent and staying adaptable to
all the changes that arehappening there?
Hikari Senju (20:59):
Yeah, I mean, it definitely helps me.
In San Francisco, you know, atthe epicenter of a lot of you
know, the Silicon Valley, at theepicenter of all this change,
our office is in Sunnyvale.
We have a, you know, people arein the office, and so it's not
just me staying up to date, butmaking sure that our, you know,
key product team, engineeringteam, sales team, is up to date
(21:22):
in terms of all the information.
People are constantly learningthings.
They're learning aboutcompetitors, they're learning
about new tools, they'relearning about new technologies,
new interesting projects,interesting tools, and so
they're bringing back to theteam sharing that knowledge and,
as a group, just tools, and sothey're bringing back to the
(21:42):
team sharing that knowledge andand, as a group, just being an
information hungry organization.
I think generally, you know,when we're hiring people, we
look for three characteristicshigh integrity, high curiosity
and high energy.
And so, and so you know, thepeople that we've assembled are
all kind of, you know, alwaysseeking information and bringing
it back to the team.
Marc Bernstein (21:58):
Hikari.
This show is about reallylooking to the future and we
talked about forward movementand momentum and progression.
I'd like to ask you about youknow, if this were December of
2027, and we're talking andwe're looking back on the last
three years what would have tohappen in your life and I know a
huge part of your life is thebusiness at this point, what
(22:22):
would have to happen for you tofeel that that was a successful
three-year progression in yourlife and business?
Hikari Senju (22:28):
I mean, I think, either IPO-ed or on the way to
be IPO-ing, being a publiccompany.
This is something that I thinkis an important step in
achieving the skill that we wantto achieve and the impact we
want to achieve.
And so something, yeah, likesomewhere along that IPO journey
(22:49):
and definitely closer, orhaving surpassed it in the next
but three years is also a longtime, but also a short period of
time Right.
Marc Bernstein (22:57):
What challenges do you see in front of you to
get there?
Hikari Senju (23:01):
Generative AI is such an interesting space
because it is constantlyevolving and the dynamics are
constantly changing.
The competition is changing,the technology is changing, the
consumer and business demand forthat technology.
As they learn more abouttechnology, it's changing their
appetite, it's changing theirregard to technology, and so I
(23:22):
think it's continuously makingsure we're at the forefront of
generative AI, building the bestproducts generative AI products
for our customers, which aremarketers and advertisers, and,
yeah, just making sure thatwe're the best at delivering
their need with our technology.
Mike Martin (23:42):
Yeah, gotcha, I'll ask too this is a question I
love asking people If you couldwave a magic wand over your
business and have any result youwanted, in any area, what would
that be?
Hikari Senju (23:55):
I think it's just, you know, making sure that we
have the very best product ingeneral, ai, and that includes
the best AI, the bestengineering, and I think from
there, you know, by having thevery best product, you know many
other facts kind of cometogether sales, you know, then
you can have the very best sales.
You have the very best word ofmouth, you have the very best,
(24:15):
you know understanding, bestunderstanding in the general
market.
So we're a product-centric,product-oriented company and if
I would have imagined to havethe best product and therefore
also the best team to build thatto you know, that can build
that product.
Marc Bernstein (24:32):
I'm going to switch gears because we only
have a couple minutes left.
I know you're a voraciousreader.
We've talked about many books.
First of all, what are yourfavorite books?
And then I'd like to ask youwhat you're currently reading.
Hikari Senju (24:44):
Yeah, my favorite book is and we've actually had
this conversation over justspanning half a year, Marc.
But right now my favorite bookis a book called Accelerando and
it's actually a sci-fi bookabout AI, about AI, about AI.
Yeah, yeah, it's aboutartificial intelligence and kind
(25:09):
of the future.
It's a book called Accelerando.
Marc Bernstein (25:12):
I'm sorry, it just broke up a little bit,
that's why I wasn't sure.
Go ahead.
Yep, yeah, it's calledAccelerando.
Hikari Senju (25:15):
I'm sorry it just broke up a little bit, that's
why I wasn't sure Go ahead.
Yeah, it's by Charles Straussand it's about kind of a world
where you know the AI or kind ofcollective AI, human
intelligence or path is, there'sthis brain, where AI and
humanity, you know thecollective intelligence of this
kind of this total like,improves every you know decade
(25:36):
by like leaps and bounds.
And so you know you have this.
You know every chapter almostbegins with like MIPS, like how
much million instructions persecond can humanity collectively
calculate?
And you know you start the2000s and it's a certain amount
of MIPS.
But then as the computers getmore and more powerful and the
humans kind of brain melt withthe computers and it's like just
(25:57):
you know, like justexponentially grow.
And you know at some point thathumanity has built Dyson
spheres around the sun andthey're exploring other galaxies
, and so it's an optimistic book.
It's a book that I think isactually a vision of the future.
I think that is quite possibleas AI accelerates.
(26:18):
I don't think AI is going toreplace humans.
I think AI will coexist andevolve with humans.
They will come in time,probably when all the
computation in the world poweredby machines will be greater
than humanity.
Hopefully we can enter a worldwhere that would, but because
there's a brain merge withhumanity, it kind of expands
humanity's horizons as well.
That is currently my favoritebook, especially at this moment
(26:43):
in time, given the high changethat we're seeing related to AI
and kind of all the hype thatwe're hearing about AI and
seeing about AI.
Marc Bernstein (26:55):
Sounds like one, sounds like one.
We should all read actually.
Mike Martin (26:58):
Yeah.
Marc Bernstein (26:58):
I've written it down.
Yeah, I'm going to check it out.
Hikari Senju (27:00):
It's, it's, it's, it's a great book it's.
I don't really read a lot ofscience fiction.
I mostly read business books.
Marc Bernstein (27:08):
Well, this is like a business, right?
Yeah, yeah it is it is?
Hikari Senju (27:16):
It is kind of a very practical book in some ways
, and listen.
Marc Bernstein (27:20):
I thank you.
We're out of time, but thankyou for being here.
Announcer (27:24):
Kari Senju, thank you , mike Martin, thank you all for
listening and we'll see younext week on Founders Forum.
We hope you enjoyed your timewith Founders Forum and that you
found value to take with youthroughout your day.
Join us again next week foranother episode of Founders
Forum on WXKB 1039 HD2.
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