April 11, 2025 • 44 mins
The Bible’s last book is God’s final word to mankind—and the breathtaking revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ. Though this letter describes depravity, devils, and destruction, it also provides an incredible portrait of our almighty God, delivering profound insights into who He really is. Jeff Kinley will examine the characteristics of God that Revelation uniquely and vividly illustrates through its foretelling of earth’s last days. Join us to develop a clear overview of end times events and to experience how God uses the apocalyptic realities of Revelation to reveal himself to you.
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S1 (00:00):
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(00:20):
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(00:42):
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(01:28):
Hi friends, this is Janet Parshall. Thanks so much for
choosing to spend the next hour with us. Today's program
is prerecorded so our phone lines are not open. But
thanks so much for being with us and enjoy the broadcast.
S2 (01:39):
Here are some of the news headlines we're watching.
S3 (01:41):
The conference was over. The president won a pledge.
S4 (01:43):
Americans worshiping government over God.
S3 (01:45):
Extremely rare safety move by a major in 17 years.
S5 (01:49):
The Palestinians and Israelis negotiated.
S1 (02:07):
Hi, friends. Welcome to In the Market with Janet Parshall.
We're going to take a look at the very last
book of that book that contains 66 books, every one
of them inerrant, inspired, transcendent, immutable. And it doesn't contain
the Word of God. It is the Word of God.
But what is it about that last book? You know,
Hollywood just loves that last book. They never get it right,
but oh, they just love to use their CGI stuff
(02:28):
and all of their computer programs and create their picture
of the apocalypse. And by the way, how many television
series right now streaming platforms, network television doesn't make any
difference how many deal with the apocalypse or dystopian world.
So what is it about gravitating toward the end times,
even if their eschatology and their theology aren't right? What
(02:49):
is it about that epoch, that time period? I know,
I know, teacher call on me. Maybe this is my
theory that because God has placed eternity in our hearts,
we have deduced, because it's not rocket science, that if
there was a beginning, there is an end. And for
us as followers of Christ, if everything up to that
book can be absolutely affirmed, and all the prophecies today
(03:10):
that have been prophesied have been filled jot and tittle,
it's a pretty good bet that everything we're going to
read about in revelation is going to come to pass
as well, but it's also one of those ones where, well,
I've often referred to the book of revelation, like Goldilocks's porridge.
For some people it's too hot. Don't touch it. For
some people it's too cold. I'm not interested. It has
no relevance for the date and time in which we live,
and for others, it's just right. And we're going to
(03:32):
talk to somebody for whom it's just right. He's written
a brand new book called God's Grand Finale. What a
great name. He's got an endorsement from our friend doctor
Mark Hitchcock as well. So, you know, it's good. Jeff
Kinley is with us again. He has authored 40 books.
He speaks across the country. He helps Christians to discern
the times and live with confidence. He's got some podcasts.
(03:53):
One is called the Prophecy Pros Podcast and the other
is Vintage Truth they heard in herded more than 130 countries,
and he's got a weekly TV show on his channel
TV called Jeff Kinley Live. But again, the book today
is called God's Grand Finale Wrath, Grace and Glory in
Earth's Last Days. I am going to take questions this
hour because you all love this topic. 87754836758775483675. But Jeff
(04:19):
first of all, thank you, thank you, thank you for
the book and for the gift of your time because
I can't return it. It's an absolute treasure. It's depletable
and it's not replaceable. And you chose to give it
to us. So that means a whole lot to me.
And I appreciate that. I want to start with this
first question for believers. What is the thing we get
the most wrong about the book of revelation?
S6 (04:37):
I think the thing we get the most wrong, Janet,
is that it's off limits to us, is that it's
somehow above our pay grade. It's not for us. It's
meant for the experts, for the PhDs in the Christian world.
But when you think about it, God wrote that to
seven churches in these cities scattered across Asia minor, therefore
ordinary people, and they're meant for the average Christian to understand.
(04:59):
And I think with just a little bit of help,
everybody can understand it.
S1 (05:02):
Yeah. Wow. You know, that idea that you have to
have all these initials after your name or just avoid it,
that that's so bizarre because we really don't take that
most of the time. For the 65 other books, what
makes that last book think that somehow you have to
have a TMD somewhere before you're allowed to really read it,
open it, and understand it?
S6 (05:22):
Absolutely. I think the way I look at it is
you look at some scripture, I call it some scriptures,
like low hanging fruit. Okay. Everybody can get it just immediately, uh,
the Lord is my shepherd. I can do all things
through Christ. Come to me, all you who are weary
and heavy laden. When it comes to some prophetic literature,
it does require what we call Bible study. And so
(05:42):
that means that we have to do a little digging. Uh,
and that means we have to engage. That means time.
That means thinking. And, you know, we want everything immediately
here today. We want to do our drive through discipleship,
microwave ourselves to maturity, that kind of thing. But God
says for some of these things, you do have to
do a little study, because it does require putting Scripture
with Scripture and understanding God's prophetic narrative. And that's why
(06:04):
I like to take people through the book and just say,
all right, I'm going to hold your hand. We're going
to get through this thing together. There'll be some rocky places.
But when we get the the bird's eye view of it,
it'll all make sense.
S1 (06:15):
Wow, I love it. And by the way, through the
book is an important phrase because that's what you do
in your book, God's Grand Finale. You start at the beginning,
and you really this is a great study guide to
have in your hands. I think as long as you're
reading the word as well. So you got the one
hand you have the word and the other you have
your book because you literally kind of give an overview
as you start with the book. So you start out
by saying, what's in a name, the God who reveals.
(06:38):
That's a brilliant way to talk about how the stage
is set in the book of revelation. So talk to
us about why that is important, and why would God
start by revealing himself through those first words?
S6 (06:49):
Yeah, I think that's very important, because when you encounter
the book of revelation, the very first thing you see
is he talks about Christ. He talks about who he
himself is, and he takes us through these amazing initial
attributes of Jesus Christ and and who he is and
what he has done. And just the fact that God
has revealed himself because we are dependent upon God to
(07:13):
reveal himself to us. I mean, we can learn certain
things about God from the universe and creation, but in
order to have special revelation from God, he has to
open himself up. And in fact, that's exactly what he
did throughout the canon of Scripture. Janet. But also through
the person of Jesus Christ and the Word of God.
And so that's where it begins, by telling us a
(07:34):
little bit about who Christ is and what he has
done for us, and how great it is really to
be a believer in him.
S1 (07:41):
Well (877) 548-3675. Any question you have about the book of revelation?
You have a great teacher in Jeff Kinley and a
great new resource called God's Grand Finale wrath, Grace and
glory in Earth's last days. So he reveals himself in
the beginning of the book. Back it up, by way,
and I love the biography of Scripture. So can you
(08:01):
set the stage historically for us? Who's the author? Where
is he writing it, and why did he end up
in that little piece of land?
S6 (08:08):
Yeah, so so John the Apostle, the same one who
wrote the Gospel of John first, second and third John.
He's the one who's been banished to the Isle of
Patmos at about 95 A.D. by the Emperor Domitian, who
was famous for banishing Christians. And he's there on this island.
And while he's there on the Lord's Day, the Bible
says that he gets this incredible vision of Jesus Christ.
(08:28):
It's actually the revelation of Jesus Christ, not just from Christ,
but of Christ. And that's really the whole basis of
this book, Janet, is that God reveals himself through revelation,
not just the future.
S1 (08:41):
Mhm. Wow. So it's a wonderful book because it helps
us look with glorious anticipation to his return and what's
going to happen in the days ahead. And what is
the purpose for all the things, the bizarre, the strange
that are taking place in the book of revelation. He's
a purposeful god. So why did he purposely put those
things in the book of revelation? Jeff Kindley is our guest,
(09:01):
and we're going to take questions that you have on
the book of revelation (877) 548-3675. Questions only this hour (877) 548-3675.
Jeff's brand new book is called God's Grand Finale. I
can't think of a better title to talk about the
Book of Revelation back after this. Did you know that
(09:29):
Jesus appears in every book of the Bible from Genesis
to Revelation? That's why I've chosen the Jesus Book as
this month's truth tool. Learn to read, understand, and apply
God's Word for yourself and how to know Jesus as
never before. As for your copy of the Jesus Book,
when you give a gift of any amount to in
the market, call 877858, that's eight 7758 or go to
(09:51):
in the market with Janet Parshall. Jeff Kinley is with us.
He's got a brand new book on the book of
revelation called God's Grand Finale. Jeff, of course, is someone
who talks a lot about this. He speaks all over
the country. He's written 40 plus books. He's got two podcasts,
and he's got a TV show on his channel network
as well. So you talked about God revealing himself, not
(10:14):
just the future. Now, let me linger on that, because
I think that's an intriguing and thought provoking statement. Jeff.
So you're not saying that up to the book of revelation,
God hasn't revealed himself. And if the answer to that
question is no, he's revealed who he is and the
Old and New Testament up to this point. What distinctive
is found in that revelation? No pun intended, in that
book of revelation that we don't see in the other
(10:35):
books of the Bible?
S6 (10:37):
Well, I think what we see is God culminating history together.
I mean, he's bringing all of these converging narratives of
the end times together in the book of revelation. But
as he's doing that there, there are a lot of
reminders of the God who is glorious, the God who
is wrathful, the God who is gracious and loving. We
see all that, but it's God's way of saying, I believe.
(10:58):
Don't forget who I am through this book. Don't get
caught up in all of the the judgments and the
Antichrist and all the things that are coming down from heaven.
And you miss me because the point of of Scripture,
all Scripture is not just to get knowledge, but to
be transformed by the truth of who God is. And
that to me, Janet, as I encountered this book and
(11:19):
got into it, just really dove into it. These emerging
attributes of God just floated to the surface, and it's
not like they've been hidden, it's just that we tend
to want to see what we want to see in revelation,
and we tend to miss the thing that God is saying,
which revelation 1910 says this. It says that the testimony
of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. And so if
(11:42):
we read revelation and we miss Jesus, if we miss
a more intimate and connection with him, then we've really
we've overshot the runway and we've missed the whole purpose
of the book.
S1 (11:53):
Yeah. Wow. (877) 548-3675. Steve, you are in Ohio. Your question
for Jeff Kinley, please.
S7 (12:02):
Hello? Steve in Iowa?
S1 (12:05):
Yes. Please go ahead.
S7 (12:07):
Okay. My question was, uh, as Christ has portrayed in
revelation and then his manifestation upon earth, which will we
see in eternity, the glorified Christ or in the human form?
S6 (12:22):
That's a great question, Steve. I think that when we
get to revelation, we see Christ as he is right now. Uh,
he's not walking around in a flowing robe, passing out
fish and bread and having little kids sit in his lap.
But he's an exalted, glorified, seated at the right hand
of the father. Uh, of course, revelation is is a
is a book of great glory of God. Uh, but
I think most of the time we tend to look
(12:44):
back at the Gospels to get our portrait of Christ.
And certainly that is true. But we also need to
see him as he is right now. And so we
see a triumphant, glorious Christ in the very beginning of revelation.
And at the end we see the same Christ. He
looks exactly the same as John saw him in chapter one,
as he does in chapter 19, when he comes back
(13:04):
as at his second coming. Uh, so I think that
we have to recalibrate our vision of Jesus according to
what the Scripture says he is right now.
S1 (13:13):
Um, thank you for the question, Steve. (877) 548-3675. Jesse in Illinois,
thank you for joining us. Your question now, please.
S8 (13:22):
Hi. Thanks for taking my call. Um, so my question,
I had a run in with a Jehovah's Witness recently,
and they were using some verses from revelation. I think
it was revelation 21 and they said that, um, God
will not destroy the earth, that his plan is to
restore it. Um, Jesus is not coming back. And I
was just wondering how to respond to that.
S6 (13:42):
Yeah. Well, Jesse, what we do is we let the
Scripture speak for itself. Uh, we don't have to defend
the Scripture. We just let let the Scripture loose. Like
Spurgeon said, let the lion loose. And so we have
to just say what the what the Word of God says.
It does tell us in chapter 19 he is physically
coming back. Chapter one verse seven says, every eye will
see him. Chapter 21 tells us about the eternal state.
(14:07):
Chapter 22 tells us about a new heavens and a
new earth. In fact, first Peter tells us that the
old earth and the universe is going to basically be
dissolved with great intense heat, and a whole new world
is going to be created by God. So again, we
just have to say what the scriptures say. A lot
of these cults will they will do, um, exegetical gymnastics
with the text. They'll try to reinterpret it to fit
(14:29):
a prescriptive narrative that they already believe. Uh, concerning the
144,000 concerning, uh, the New Jerusalem, all these things, they
reinterpret it. But let's just let the Bible speak for
itself and just rest on that.
S1 (14:42):
Thank you so much. I appreciate the question on that point.
You have an entire chapter called that the planet Earth
is in peril. And this is where you begin the dialogue.
And because you're moving into chapter six about the different
seal judgments, you break them down. Jeff, can you kind
of do a flyover on these? What do they mean?
And why are there so many enumerated specific judgments?
S6 (15:04):
Yeah, well, there are three basic sets of judgments and
revelation the seal judgments, the trumpet judgments and the bowl judgments.
And of course, Scripture portrays how those things are are
poured out or announced on the planet. And it begins
in chapter six when it says, The Lamb of God
really breaks the first seal. So we know that God's
judgment begins at the first part of the tribulation, because
(15:26):
he's the one that does that. But basically what we
see is we see kind of a there's almost like
a three pronged approach that God has towards what's going
on in the planet during revelation. On the one hand,
he's he's pouring out retribution on a rebellious planet that
has continually, repeatedly refused to listen to his truth. And
Second Thessalonians tells us that he will send a spirit
(15:46):
of delusion during that time as well as his incredible judgment.
It's going to be a really horrific time to be
alive if you're on the planet. The second part of
it is the fact that God does a great revival
during that time as well. We see in chapter seven
there's going to be a massive turning to the Lord
during that time. And it just tells us once again
what what a gracious God we have. But the third
(16:08):
part is he's going to be dealing with the nation
of Israel. He's going to be bringing Israel. Obviously, she's
back in the land, but he's going to have a
spiritual revival take place in Israel as well toward the
end of that period of time, that seven year period.
And it's going to be brought on. The part of
the catalyst is going to be some of God's two witnesses.
So there's going to be all these concurrent themes going on,
(16:28):
these these narrative, these scenes. There's judgment, there's grace, there's revival,
there's preaching, uh, there's blasphemy. There's all these things that
are going on in the earth. So it'll be a
great time of turmoil. But the sealed trumpet and bowl
judgments that's coming down, first part and the second part
of the tribulation.
S3 (16:46):
Wow.
S1 (16:46):
It's all there in the book of revelation. And Jeff
Kinley breaks this down beautifully in his brand new book,
God's Grand Finale. I wrote several things down when you
were talking because it raises a whole series of questions. Plus,
I've got some great callers online. (877) 548-3675. This beautiful new
book by Jeff Kinley looks at the Book of Revelation systematically, chronologically,
(17:07):
starting with the overview right there, verse one, chapter one,
and then gives us the core context of each of
the chapters and themes as you move through the book.
It is a great, user friendly resource to study the
Book of Revelation, which is accessible, as Jeff said earlier,
to all of us back after this. We're talking about
(17:30):
the book of Revelation with Jeff Kinley, who's authored the
brand new book God's Grand Finale. I'm going to go
back to the phones in just a minute, because we've
got some wonderful calls. You've called (877) 548-3675. But I was
writing some things down and I asked you the section
basically this is surrounding chapter six. Planet Earth is in peril.
And you talked about the judgments that were coming, the
seals that are going to be broken. So I'm asking
(17:52):
for the person who thinks they've just stumbled on this
conversation and hears the word God's retribution against those who
have rejected the message. I want to dig into this
because if the book of Revelation is, as you say,
a revelation of who God is revealed in all of
his glory, does it make him a bad God all
of a sudden? It's uh oh. I mean, we have
now this flawed, fractured thinking that says we disconnect the
(18:15):
old from the New Testament. God didn't. We shouldn't. And
if you're reading the Bible contextually, you can't. You just
it's a ludicrous thought. First, last and always. But some
would say you want to reject the Old Testament because
it's a God of judgment and wrath. I'll take the
Jesus with the children on his lap. So now this
God comes back in revelation and he's showing he's meting
out retribution. Does this make him a bad God, a
(18:37):
wrathful God, a God we should fear and for some avoid?
S6 (18:42):
Well, he definitely is a wrathful God. But here's the
thing is that when people talk about, well, I don't
want God to be wrathful, you really want him to
be righteous. You want him to be wrathful because we
all want God to do what is right. Every person,
to some degree, wants God to just make things right
in the world, get rid of the evil, get rid
of all the bad things. And and he's going to
(19:02):
do that eventually. He's going to do that. But this
period of tribulation, Janet, is a part of that. God
expressing his righteousness just like he did against the days
of Noah. And people refused to repent. They're just as
he did against Sodom and Gomorrah when they refused to repent, their, uh,
God brings judgment when people don't accept his mercy. And
so Jesus, that same Jesus in the New Testament, that
(19:23):
that gave out the fish and loaves and had children
in his lap, is going to ride a white horse,
come down, and he's going to tread the winepress of
the fierce wrath of God, and he's going to deal
with people that have basically rejected him over and over
and over again. And that's why it's so important for
us to respond to the goodness and the grace of God.
because what's on the other side is the wrath of God.
(19:45):
And so God has to punish sin either either now
through Christ on the cross or in eternity. And so
that's why it's important for people to respond correctly.
S1 (19:54):
I couldn't. What a wonderful answer. And I don't have
a problem with this. And I'll tell you why. Because
if there is no wrath, then Calvary was a sham.
If God tells us and tells us and tells us again,
so we can't say we haven't been told. If he
foretells that Jesus is coming, if Jesus becomes the propitiation
of our sins because the wages of sin is death.
If in the end judgment isn't meted out, then this
(20:15):
whole thing was kabuki theater and a sham. And it
makes a farce of what the Bible tells us. So
I don't have a problem with that. It's. Forgive me,
but I'm recognizing the holiness of our father. But there's
a part of me that wants to say. Do you
think he was saying I was only kidding all along?
So I don't have a problem with this. But then
the second hour you used was revival. This speaks to
his characteristic because you said there would be revival. It's
(20:38):
in line with his word that says he's not willing
that any should perish. So even after this retribution, there
will still be for those who have been left behind,
that last chance to be able to receive the good
news of the gospel. Right. So again, his mercy is
meted out.
S6 (20:53):
Janet, that's what's so amazing about this book, is that
we we understand God bringing his wrath to a certain degree. Uh,
but we we don't expect him to bring the grace.
And this is what is so amazing about our God
is that, yes, we deserve the wrath, especially during the tribulation.
But here comes God saying, no, I'm going to bring
this grace, uh, movement through the world in these last days.
(21:16):
And people are going to respond by the millions because
they're going to finally realize, hey, I missed that rapture thing. Uh,
the whole world is coming apart. Uh, you talk about
climate change. It's climate change on steroids, compliments of the
Lamb of God. And people hide from God. They run
from God. They blaspheme God. But they'll be a segment
of Earth's population that will get it and they will respond.
(21:37):
And really, the the big question is not why is
God bringing his wrath. The big question is why would
he still bring his mercy?
S1 (21:44):
Yes, yes. Oh, wow. All right. And because you brought
it up. Let me take the third part. Then I
promised friends I'm going to go to the phones. But
you brought up the nation of Israel. Sometimes we have
sloppy theology here. Um, because we have decided that somewhere
along the line, some have anyway. And it's another gospel.
And I want to take this moment to clear it
up that because this there's going to be this special
place for the nation of Israel, that they've taken the
(22:06):
passage that says all of Israel will be saved. Therefore,
we don't have to evangelize to the Jews, because in
the end, it doesn't make any difference anyway. In fact,
I would I heard one person posit, well, he never
said that he was savior. He just it's the reverend
that he's the question of Messiah. So they've parsed these
two things separately. The plan of salvation is still the
plan of salvation, is it not? And the fact that
(22:27):
Israel is going to play a significant part doesn't mean
blanket salvation for all the Jews, does it? Or does
it not?
S6 (22:33):
No, not at all. In fact, two thirds of the
Jews will perish during the tribulation period. It will be
a very sad time, but a third of them will
call that remnant. We'll call upon them. And you know,
Jesus even said when he rode into Jerusalem, when Israel
rejected him, he said, behold, your house is left to
you desolate. I say to you, from now on you
shall not see me until you say, blessed is he
(22:55):
who comes in the name of the Lord. Zechariah 1210.
You said, Romans 1126, The Jews will call upon the Lord,
but there'll be a massive evangelistic campaign to the Jews
during the tribulation period through 144,000 young Jewish male evangelists,
through these two witnesses that will be calling down fire
from heaven. Uh, it'll be a time of great revival
(23:16):
and persecution for the Jewish people once again.
S1 (23:19):
Well, follow up question to that and see good teachers
like you, Jeff, make you think of more questions. That
means you're getting the point across. And I want to
thank you. So for people, we're seeing this uptick in
anti-Semitism in the world, which is nothing but spiritual warfare.
So when we say that God chose the Jews and
I may just have time to ask the questions, but
I desperately want the answer on the other side, he
(23:39):
didn't pick the Normans. He didn't pick the the the picks.
He didn't pick the Celts. He picked the Jewish people
to mete out his plan of salvation for each and
every one of us. So does that make the nation
of Israel? Because there it is in the book of
revelation yet again, playing a place in history, past, present
and future. Is that means that there's why? Let me
(24:00):
ask it as a why. Why is God continually focusing
on the nation of Israel? He could have left them
on the ash heap of history. They didn't have to
show up in the book of revelation, where yet again,
some pretty amazing stuff is going to happen. Why does
it show up again? And what makes Israel so special?
Back after this? Tired of the endless, biased spin you
(24:29):
hear on mainstream media and in the market, we're using
God's Word as our guide as we examine today's events,
and we want you to be informed and bold about
his truth. This is a listener supported program, so if
you value what you hear and you want us to
continue on your station, become a partial partner with your
monthly support, call eight 7758. That's eight 7758 or go
online to in the market with Janet parshall.org. I am
(24:54):
thrilled with Jeff Kinley's brand new book. It's called God's
Grand Finale. I just love that as a title for
the book of Revelation subtitled wrath. We just talked about
that grace and glory in Earth's last days. If you're
just joining us, I'm so thankful we have a podcast
because you can go to that page in the market
with Janet parshall.org. Look at the left hand side. You're
going to see a bunch of words. Look for these
(25:15):
two past programs download this hour or either of the
two hours we do every day, going back a full year.
And then at your convenience, you can catch the total
conversation with Jeff, and you're going to want to do
that because it was rich and good stuff as you're
studying the book of revelation. So check that out. But
let me reintroduce Jeff to you. He has written over
40 books. He speaks all over the country. He loves
(25:36):
to teach Christians how to discern the times and live
with confidence. That's called equipping the saints in Scripture, and
I'm so glad he does. He's got not one, but
two podcasts The Prophecy Pros Podcast and Vintage Truth. It's
heard in about 130 plus countries. And then he has
a TV program on his channel TV called the Jeff
called Jeff Kinley Live. So that's all the background. I'm
going to get to the calls in a minute. But
(25:56):
you left hanging the question of Israel. And I think
this is important because there's still this dispute and I'm
going to call it out. anti-Semitism is not just outside
the church as well. And there's umbrage that some people
have against the nation of Israel, like, why are they
so special? They've rejected their predominantly secular. Why do they
keep showing up on the scene? Well, there they are
again in the book of revelation. I mean, we're talking
(26:18):
about Israel throughout the book, and there it is. So
why is Israel so special to the heart of God,
and why is it not Germany that's playing a significant
part in the book of revelation?
S6 (26:30):
That's a great question. You know, we go back to
the book of Genesis. The Bible tells us that God
chose a man, that this man named Name. Abraham to
have a covenant relationship, an unconditional covenant relationship with him,
to make of him a great nation, that through him
the Messiah would come. Through him all the nations of
the world would be blessed. And so Deuteronomy seven Janet
tells us that God did not choose Israel because they
(26:51):
were so special. In fact, it was in spite of
the fact that they were small and they were insignificant.
God just simply chose them because he's a sovereign God.
He gets to choose who he wants. Uh, you know,
we elect our leaders in our country. And, you know,
we have all these, uh, these stipulations about how you
can vote and all these other things. There are no
stolen elections in God's kingdom and his economy. He chooses
(27:12):
whom he wants, and he chose the nation of Israel. Now,
Israel has been unfaithful to God. And because of that,
God has in essence put them on the back burner
for a while. Uh, Romans 11 tells us, while he's
dealing with the whole world in terms of the the
church age, but he's going to return after the rapture,
I believe. Uh, back to the Jewish people begin to
deal specifically with them because he is obligated himself to them.
(27:36):
He's told them, there's a land I'm going to give you.
He's told them there is a messiah that's going to
sit on David's throne forever. I'm going to bring you
back to the land physically, God says, which he's already done.
Just about half of the Jews in the world are
now back in Israel. And then he says, I'm going
to bring you back spiritually at the end of this
time of tribulation. So it's all about Israel. I mean,
in fact, if you take your Bible, Janet, you put
(27:57):
your thumb in Genesis chapter 12 about verse three, and
then go ahead and put your your other index finger
in acts chapter two, and hold up that big, thick
portion of the Bible. That's all about the Jewish people. Wow.
And so it's a huge, huge section there. So we
as Gentiles are grafted in, which is wonderful. And we'll
all be in heaven together. But he has some unfinished
(28:19):
business to deal with, with the nation of Israel.
S1 (28:23):
Wow. Wow. Obligated himself to them. I love the way
you said that. Wow. All right, I won't be selfish.
I have a thousand questions, but so do you. (877) 548-3675 Pamela,
I welcome you from Florida. Your question please, for Jeff Kinley.
S9 (28:38):
Hi. Um, super simple question. I was trying to figure
out the whole process. Once we once we die, are
we in our sleep, if you will, until the revelation?
Or do we go to heaven immediately?
S6 (28:55):
Well, thank you, Pamela, for that question. It's a great question. Well,
second Corinthians chapter five, verses seven and eight tell us
that when we're absent from the body, we are present
with the Lord. So our physical body stays here on
the earth, but our soul, our spirit goes to be
with God. So we are with him in heaven. And
the Bible tells us that at the rapture, he's going
to bring back our bodies and our spirits together. We're
(29:16):
going to be given a brand new, glorious body. So
there's no real truth to this whole idea of soul sleep.
Are we going some sort of intermediary state, that type
of thing? Uh, Paul says that if I'm absent from
my body, I'm present with Jesus. You can have that 100% guarantee.
S1 (29:32):
Yeah, and thank his word for that truth. Pamela, thank
you so much. I appreciate it. Harold, let me turn
to you because I think your question is related. Thanks
for joining us from Illinois.
S10 (29:42):
Hello. So my question basically is revelation 20. And who's
really going to be there? Is it going to be
the the church and our all the past patriarchs, or
is it just kind of like the immediate people that
are delivered from the tribulation?
S6 (29:59):
Well, thank you for that question. It's a great question. Now,
in the Millennial kingdom, in revelation 20, we see tribulation
saints are going to be there. They're going to be rewarded.
We see the church, church age saints are going to
be there. They're they have come back with Christ in
Revelation 19. Old Testament saints Daniel 12 tells us, are
going to be given new bodies. They're going to be
in the Millennial Kingdom. So basically all believers from all
(30:21):
ages will inhabit the Millennial Kingdom. Now, some of these
believers that are alive at the time of the Second
Coming during the tribulation, they're just going to walk on
into the millennial Kingdom in their mortal bodies, and that
is where the nations will come from at the end
of that thousand year period that will establish a rebellion
led by Satan against the Lord. But at some point
(30:44):
when they die, they'll be given their glorified bodies as well.
But we'll all be there together in the kingdom of Christ. Wow.
S1 (30:52):
If this conversation doesn't give you triple goosebumps, you are asleep. Awake,
O sleeper. So get up and start thinking about the
glorious anticipation of what that's going to be like. Wow. Harold.
Thank you. (877) 548-3675. Brian, let me welcome you as well.
Your question please.
S7 (31:10):
Well, thank you for having me on. Um, my question
is I have been hearing through Christian news channels about
a group in Israel that's planning on gathering all the
accoutrements necessary for the rebuilding of the temple. But yesterday,
I believe in Yahoo news, mainstream media. I saw an
(31:33):
article about it too, and I'm wondering what you think
about the significance of the fact that this is gaining
traction in the general culture.
S6 (31:44):
That's a great question. Thank you so much, Brian. In fact, yeah,
there's a group there called the Temple Institute that were
established in 1987. They have, uh, they're intentional about rebuilding
the temple on that Temple Mount. They've already drawn up blueprints.
You can go to their website and see all this.
They've trained, uh, several hundred over 500 young priests. Uh,
they have established themselves with, uh, with the temple, um, monuments.
(32:08):
They've gotten the, uh, the menorah. So this this giant menorah,
in fact, I was there at the Temple Institute in January,
and they're buzzing with activity because they believe they're going
to rebuild their temple. Now, here's the thing. You talk
about the nation of Israel, how God works through the Jews.
The thing is, is that it's like a homing mechanism.
They just know it's going to happen. And so they're
(32:28):
sitting on ready, uh, they're gathering up sacrificial lambs. They've
already practiced sacrifices. They built the altars, they've got the
priestly garments. So all they need is permission to get
on that piece of real estate and build that temple.
And I believe some, some end times events are going
to enable that to happen for them. So we know
there's going to be a temple because Scripture tells us
(32:48):
there'll be a third temple. We don't know exactly how
that will happen, but we do know it's going to happen.
And they're right now sitting on ready to do it.
S1 (32:55):
Yeah, I just read an article within the last couple
of weeks about the red heifer again. So, Brian, you're right,
it does keep coming up in the news, but because
you brought it up, Brian, I want to linger. This
is why these conversations are so good and why I
can never get this all in in an hour. There's just.
This is like you've heard of a seven layer salad, ladies.
You'll get a gentleman even if you don't. There's so
many layers to this book, which is so exciting. I
used to get excited about taking people when I was
(33:17):
taking groups to the Temple Institute, because I just love history,
but the more I dug into this, the more I thought,
let's talk about the role of the temple. Maybe we
need to linger here for a minute. I think what
happens is sometimes as believers, we superimpose the temple as
it was put together in the Old Testament and before
it was ransacked again. Talk to me about the role
the temple is going to play in the end times.
S6 (33:40):
Yeah, well, the temple is going to play a huge
role because that'll be, I believe it'll be a time
when there'll be sacrifices that'll be made during the tribulation period.
The Bible tells us that at the midpoint of that
tribulation period, the Antichrist will come in and put a
stop to the sacrifice. So we know that the sacrifice
is going to be made. And I do believe, Janet,
that's going to be a way that God will continue
(34:02):
to prefigure, uh, what the Messiah has done for them.
And I believe that these the fault, the excuse me,
the two witnesses, the 144,000 will seize upon this and
use the temple sacrifices as a way to point them
to the Messiah, Jesus, just as the original sacrifices were
intended to do. The blood of bulls and goats could
(34:23):
never take away sin. So I believe the temple will
play a very important part also, because the Jews believe
that the Shekinah glory of God, the presence of God,
dwells in that Holy of Holies. That's going to be
the bull's eye target for Antichrist, because he cannot have
any other gods before him. So he's going to invade
that temple, plop himself up on that, that that holy
(34:45):
place there, and declare himself to be God. And so
the temple is going to be a place of, of
reunion's going to be a place of worship, but also
during the tribulation period. It's going to be a great
place of horror when Antichrist comes in. And at that moment,
that is when I believe God will begin to turn
the Jews hearts toward him, because Antichrist will launch this
(35:07):
three pronged attack in revelation chapter 12. It'll be a
another Holocaust in Israel, and it's going to be a
time when the Jews are going to finally say, wait
a minute. All these sacrifices pointed to the one person,
the Messiah.
S1 (35:20):
Amen. Oh, I just love hearing your brother's heart on this, Jeff.
So now you're a Jew and you're working at the
Temple Institute. Why are you doing this?
S6 (35:28):
Yeah, because they're trying to usher in the Messiah. They
believe the Messiah is not yet come yet. And so.
But they believe in order for the Messiah to come,
they must spiritually prepare themselves. And they cannot do that
unless they have the temple and the sacrifices.
S11 (35:42):
Wow. Wow.
S1 (35:43):
Missing the forest for the trees. Fascinating. Fred, thank you
so much for the question. We're going to take a
break and I'm going to come back with more of
your questions. Jeff, I can already tell you you must
come back so we can continue, because your book, God's
Grand Finale, which is this overview of the Book of Revelation,
is beautifully laid out in chronological order, thematic order. So
you start with revelation one. You go right to the
(36:04):
end of the book, and you really hear God's heart
and his intent for writing this very important book called
revelation back after this. Ever feel intimidated by the Bible?
(36:27):
Unsure where to begin or how it all fits together. Well,
you're not alone. That's why I've chosen The Jesus Book
by Doctor Jack Graham as this month's truth tool. Learn
to unlock the timeless wisdom of God's Word. As for
your copy of the Jesus Book, when you give a
gift of any amount to in the market, call eight 7758,
that's eight 7758 or go online to in the market
(36:48):
with Janet parshall.org. Jeff Kinley is with us. He loves
to teach people about Bible prophecy. He loves to teach
Christians period. To discern know the times to be equipped.
So his latest book is called God's Grand Finale Wrath,
Grace and Glory in Earth's Last Days. Fabulous. The way
(37:09):
the book is laid out beautifully starts with verse one,
gives you an overview in all the different segments and
what the themes are. So your Bible in one hand,
Jeff's books in the other, and you'll be able to
get through the book of Revelation and perhaps understand it
like you've never understood it before. (877) 548-3675. Dana, I welcome
you from Michigan. Thanks for being here. Your question?
S12 (37:30):
Yes. Um, you had answered a question before about, um,
when we die, um, we're present with the Lord. Is
does that include those who don't believe?
S6 (37:44):
Yeah, those who don't believe in Christ are not present
with the Lord. They're they're separated from him. Uh, Scripture
says the wages of sin is death. And that word
death means separation. So those who don't know Jesus Christ
will not be with him in his presence in heaven. Uh,
they'll be suffering under the wrath of God, unfortunately. And
that is why it's so urgent that people seriously consider
(38:07):
the gospel and the offer of salvation. Because what's at
stake is eternity. And so, just as we have the
assurance we're going to be with Christ, uh, we know
from the messages of Christ and the rest of Scripture
that those who die without Christ will not be with him.
S1 (38:21):
Mhm. I thank you, Dana, for the question. 3675. Jeff,
thank you for being here. Your question now?
S7 (38:30):
Yes. I guess it should have been two questions. And
we're going to be at the winter stage and we're
raptured and we're going to be with the millennium people
or 1000 year reign. And also, will we be working?
S6 (38:44):
Yeah. Great question. Yeah. Thank you so much for that question. Yes,
we will be with all the other saints during the
millennial reign. And Jesus promises that we're going to be
rewarded in the millennial Kingdom. We're going to actually have responsibilities.
Some people will be put in charge over cities, uh,
some over nations. And we'll be doing work for the Lord. Now,
(39:05):
it's not going to be like, you know, digging ditches
type thing for Christ, but it'll be things that'll be
very fulfilling, uh, very uplifting, very joyful. We will want
to serve him. And God's going to create so many
wonderful opportunities for us to live for him and to
serve him, uh, in that future kingdom. So, yeah, we'll
stay busy. It'll be a lot of fun, and it'll
be glorious in our joy.
S11 (39:26):
Mm.
S1 (39:27):
Let me linger here. This is where you kind of
use your sanctified imagination. I can't put there, Jeff. What's
not there? But I do love the fact that I
can lie on my back, look up in the sky
and dream and get excited about what's going to happen.
So first, talk about the thousand years. Right now, people
are going thousand years. I can't make it to bed
some nights. How am I going to get through a
thousand years? Well, don't we go back to the idea
that to the Lord is yours? A year is like
(39:48):
a thousand and thousands like a year. So in other words,
get off your watch because it's not going to be.
We won't have a sense of time. I mean, I
know Scripture doesn't give us clarity on this, but can
we deduce at least that time will have a different
sense and feeling? And maybe this is a peephole into
the idea of eternity?
S6 (40:06):
Yeah, I think we can look at it this way,
that God, we know that God is timeless. He's beyond time.
He created the idea of times, but he's beyond it.
He's eternity past, eternity future when we're made like Christ.
The Bible tells us in first Corinthians 13 that we're
going to know as we are known, so we'll be
able to understand the And the concept of eternity a
lot better. We won't need our Apple Watch in heaven.
(40:28):
We're not going to be counting times. We're looking at
our calendars or daytimers or anything like that. It's going
to be a timeless time. And so the great thing
about that is, is that we won't have to have
the the burdens and the constraints that the whole concept
of time really puts upon us. We'll be able to
live free outside of time. Now there will be a
thousand year period, but at the same time, we won't
(40:49):
be counting it down on our watches and that type
of thing. So we'll just be enjoying the eternal now,
just as God does. And as I said before, it'll
just be filled with complete joy because we won't be
worrying about anything else other than how to enjoy God
and what he's given to us.
S1 (41:04):
That's so cool. So Billy Graham once said that he
wanted to be the mayor of Jerusalem. So you talked
before about what makes sense. And Cliff barrows said, by
the way, one of the job of directing the choir.
So it makes perfect sense. But if you're going to
have some who are going to have positions of authority
over cities, who are the occupants, then of those cities?
S6 (41:23):
Yeah, well, there'll be those who inhabit the Millennial Kingdom
or will be citizens of God's great kingdom. You know,
Philippians 320 says that our citizenship is in heaven. So
that's where our allegiance is. That'll be the place of
our residence eventually will be in the New Jerusalem, this
incredible space that God will create for us. And and
here's the other great thing about the kingdom and about
(41:44):
heaven is that we live in such limited minds right now. Janet,
in terms of language, in terms of color, in terms
of sounds, in terms of music, uh, he's speaking about music.
I mean, there'll be sounds and things that we'll enjoy
and dimensions and aspects of our five senses, uh, that
we'll be able to enjoy there like we never have before. Why?
Because God is an infinitely creative God, and there are
(42:07):
things that are waiting for us that we cannot even
possibly write or imagine at this moment.
S11 (42:12):
Well, I've.
S1 (42:13):
So often thought that that as much as we think
we've seen it all here on earth, we have got
just a tiny little glimpse, like a glass darkly, as
we read in Scripture. So it gets you excited about
what that experience is going to be, and it has
to be absolutely fabulous. You said something earlier and I
feel pressed to bring this up. There are a lot
of people who hear about what's going to happen in
(42:33):
that millennial period and they're thinking, wow, you talked before
about there's going to be revival and people are going
to come to faith. It is appointed unto man once
to die. Talk to me about why the message of
salvation should be considered and adhered to now, because don't
bet that you'll have a second chance based on what's
going to happen in the book of revelation. Talk to
(42:54):
me about that.
S6 (42:55):
Yeah. Basically, we all have a really serious problem. It's
worse than cancer. It's called sin because it essentially damns
our eternal soul. It separates us from God. But the
deal of the ages is, Janet, is that Jesus Christ
took the penalty for our sin on the cross. We
trade our sin, we get salvation. We exchange God's wrath
for his rescue. And it helps us to avoid this
(43:19):
awful time of tribulation that's coming. And we get a great,
bright future no matter what we're going through right now.
So I urge people right now, it's the only time
you have in your whole life is right now to
turn to Jesus Christ. Do it now. Call upon him.
S1 (43:34):
That may be the most important thing you heard this
entire hour. So we know that Jesus is coming again.
We don't know. Scripture says no one knows but the father,
but he is coming again. So the question is, will
we look forward? And I'll use the phrase again with
glorious anticipation for Jesus's return. All that you know of
this life could end tonight. So where will you spend eternity?
(43:56):
Something to ponder, Jeff. Thank you. Superb book. There are
a gazillion more questions I would ask. In the meantime,
if you're looking for a wonderful book that breaks down
this magnificent book that deals with God's wrath, his grace,
and his glory, and what happens in Earth's last day,
then you need Jeff Kinley's book, God's Grand Finale. All
the info is on my page. Thank you Jeff. Thank
(44:16):
you friends. We'll see you next time on In the
Market with Janet Parshall.
Hi friends, thank you so much for downloading this podcast
and it is my sincere hope that you'll hear something
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Before you listen to this podcast, let me just tell
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(00:20):
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And yet, in truth, Jesus is there from Genesis to Revelation.
And that book was written for every single one of us.
We just need a better way to know how to
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(00:42):
is all about. So when you give a gift of
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(01:03):
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(01:28):
Hi friends, this is Janet Parshall. Thanks so much for
choosing to spend the next hour with us. Today's program
is prerecorded so our phone lines are not open. But
thanks so much for being with us and enjoy the broadcast.
S2 (01:39):
Here are some of the news headlines we're watching.
S3 (01:41):
The conference was over. The president won a pledge.
S4 (01:43):
Americans worshiping government over God.
S3 (01:45):
Extremely rare safety move by a major in 17 years.
S5 (01:49):
The Palestinians and Israelis negotiated.
S1 (02:07):
Hi, friends. Welcome to In the Market with Janet Parshall.
We're going to take a look at the very last
book of that book that contains 66 books, every one
of them inerrant, inspired, transcendent, immutable. And it doesn't contain
the Word of God. It is the Word of God.
But what is it about that last book? You know,
Hollywood just loves that last book. They never get it right,
but oh, they just love to use their CGI stuff
(02:28):
and all of their computer programs and create their picture
of the apocalypse. And by the way, how many television
series right now streaming platforms, network television doesn't make any
difference how many deal with the apocalypse or dystopian world.
So what is it about gravitating toward the end times,
even if their eschatology and their theology aren't right? What
(02:49):
is it about that epoch, that time period? I know,
I know, teacher call on me. Maybe this is my
theory that because God has placed eternity in our hearts,
we have deduced, because it's not rocket science, that if
there was a beginning, there is an end. And for
us as followers of Christ, if everything up to that
book can be absolutely affirmed, and all the prophecies today
(03:10):
that have been prophesied have been filled jot and tittle,
it's a pretty good bet that everything we're going to
read about in revelation is going to come to pass
as well, but it's also one of those ones where, well,
I've often referred to the book of revelation, like Goldilocks's porridge.
For some people it's too hot. Don't touch it. For
some people it's too cold. I'm not interested. It has
no relevance for the date and time in which we live,
and for others, it's just right. And we're going to
(03:32):
talk to somebody for whom it's just right. He's written
a brand new book called God's Grand Finale. What a
great name. He's got an endorsement from our friend doctor
Mark Hitchcock as well. So, you know, it's good. Jeff
Kinley is with us again. He has authored 40 books.
He speaks across the country. He helps Christians to discern
the times and live with confidence. He's got some podcasts.
(03:53):
One is called the Prophecy Pros Podcast and the other
is Vintage Truth they heard in herded more than 130 countries,
and he's got a weekly TV show on his channel
TV called Jeff Kinley Live. But again, the book today
is called God's Grand Finale Wrath, Grace and Glory in
Earth's Last Days. I am going to take questions this
hour because you all love this topic. 87754836758775483675. But Jeff
(04:19):
first of all, thank you, thank you, thank you for
the book and for the gift of your time because
I can't return it. It's an absolute treasure. It's depletable
and it's not replaceable. And you chose to give it
to us. So that means a whole lot to me.
And I appreciate that. I want to start with this
first question for believers. What is the thing we get
the most wrong about the book of revelation?
S6 (04:37):
I think the thing we get the most wrong, Janet,
is that it's off limits to us, is that it's
somehow above our pay grade. It's not for us. It's
meant for the experts, for the PhDs in the Christian world.
But when you think about it, God wrote that to
seven churches in these cities scattered across Asia minor, therefore
ordinary people, and they're meant for the average Christian to understand.
(04:59):
And I think with just a little bit of help,
everybody can understand it.
S1 (05:02):
Yeah. Wow. You know, that idea that you have to
have all these initials after your name or just avoid it,
that that's so bizarre because we really don't take that
most of the time. For the 65 other books, what
makes that last book think that somehow you have to
have a TMD somewhere before you're allowed to really read it,
open it, and understand it?
S6 (05:22):
Absolutely. I think the way I look at it is
you look at some scripture, I call it some scriptures,
like low hanging fruit. Okay. Everybody can get it just immediately, uh,
the Lord is my shepherd. I can do all things
through Christ. Come to me, all you who are weary
and heavy laden. When it comes to some prophetic literature,
it does require what we call Bible study. And so
(05:42):
that means that we have to do a little digging. Uh,
and that means we have to engage. That means time.
That means thinking. And, you know, we want everything immediately
here today. We want to do our drive through discipleship,
microwave ourselves to maturity, that kind of thing. But God
says for some of these things, you do have to
do a little study, because it does require putting Scripture
with Scripture and understanding God's prophetic narrative. And that's why
(06:04):
I like to take people through the book and just say,
all right, I'm going to hold your hand. We're going
to get through this thing together. There'll be some rocky places.
But when we get the the bird's eye view of it,
it'll all make sense.
S1 (06:15):
Wow, I love it. And by the way, through the
book is an important phrase because that's what you do
in your book, God's Grand Finale. You start at the beginning,
and you really this is a great study guide to
have in your hands. I think as long as you're
reading the word as well. So you got the one
hand you have the word and the other you have
your book because you literally kind of give an overview
as you start with the book. So you start out
by saying, what's in a name, the God who reveals.
(06:38):
That's a brilliant way to talk about how the stage
is set in the book of revelation. So talk to
us about why that is important, and why would God
start by revealing himself through those first words?
S6 (06:49):
Yeah, I think that's very important, because when you encounter
the book of revelation, the very first thing you see
is he talks about Christ. He talks about who he
himself is, and he takes us through these amazing initial
attributes of Jesus Christ and and who he is and
what he has done. And just the fact that God
has revealed himself because we are dependent upon God to
(07:13):
reveal himself to us. I mean, we can learn certain
things about God from the universe and creation, but in
order to have special revelation from God, he has to
open himself up. And in fact, that's exactly what he
did throughout the canon of Scripture. Janet. But also through
the person of Jesus Christ and the Word of God.
And so that's where it begins, by telling us a
(07:34):
little bit about who Christ is and what he has
done for us, and how great it is really to
be a believer in him.
S1 (07:41):
Well (877) 548-3675. Any question you have about the book of revelation?
You have a great teacher in Jeff Kinley and a
great new resource called God's Grand Finale wrath, Grace and
glory in Earth's last days. So he reveals himself in
the beginning of the book. Back it up, by way,
and I love the biography of Scripture. So can you
(08:01):
set the stage historically for us? Who's the author? Where
is he writing it, and why did he end up
in that little piece of land?
S6 (08:08):
Yeah, so so John the Apostle, the same one who
wrote the Gospel of John first, second and third John.
He's the one who's been banished to the Isle of
Patmos at about 95 A.D. by the Emperor Domitian, who
was famous for banishing Christians. And he's there on this island.
And while he's there on the Lord's Day, the Bible
says that he gets this incredible vision of Jesus Christ.
(08:28):
It's actually the revelation of Jesus Christ, not just from Christ,
but of Christ. And that's really the whole basis of
this book, Janet, is that God reveals himself through revelation,
not just the future.
S1 (08:41):
Mhm. Wow. So it's a wonderful book because it helps
us look with glorious anticipation to his return and what's
going to happen in the days ahead. And what is
the purpose for all the things, the bizarre, the strange
that are taking place in the book of revelation. He's
a purposeful god. So why did he purposely put those
things in the book of revelation? Jeff Kindley is our guest,
(09:01):
and we're going to take questions that you have on
the book of revelation (877) 548-3675. Questions only this hour (877) 548-3675.
Jeff's brand new book is called God's Grand Finale. I
can't think of a better title to talk about the
Book of Revelation back after this. Did you know that
(09:29):
Jesus appears in every book of the Bible from Genesis
to Revelation? That's why I've chosen the Jesus Book as
this month's truth tool. Learn to read, understand, and apply
God's Word for yourself and how to know Jesus as
never before. As for your copy of the Jesus Book,
when you give a gift of any amount to in
the market, call 877858, that's eight 7758 or go to
(09:51):
in the market with Janet Parshall. Jeff Kinley is with us.
He's got a brand new book on the book of
revelation called God's Grand Finale. Jeff, of course, is someone
who talks a lot about this. He speaks all over
the country. He's written 40 plus books. He's got two podcasts,
and he's got a TV show on his channel network
as well. So you talked about God revealing himself, not
(10:14):
just the future. Now, let me linger on that, because
I think that's an intriguing and thought provoking statement. Jeff.
So you're not saying that up to the book of revelation,
God hasn't revealed himself. And if the answer to that
question is no, he's revealed who he is and the
Old and New Testament up to this point. What distinctive
is found in that revelation? No pun intended, in that
book of revelation that we don't see in the other
(10:35):
books of the Bible?
S6 (10:37):
Well, I think what we see is God culminating history together.
I mean, he's bringing all of these converging narratives of
the end times together in the book of revelation. But
as he's doing that there, there are a lot of
reminders of the God who is glorious, the God who
is wrathful, the God who is gracious and loving. We
see all that, but it's God's way of saying, I believe.
(10:58):
Don't forget who I am through this book. Don't get
caught up in all of the the judgments and the
Antichrist and all the things that are coming down from heaven.
And you miss me because the point of of Scripture,
all Scripture is not just to get knowledge, but to
be transformed by the truth of who God is. And
that to me, Janet, as I encountered this book and
(11:19):
got into it, just really dove into it. These emerging
attributes of God just floated to the surface, and it's
not like they've been hidden, it's just that we tend
to want to see what we want to see in revelation,
and we tend to miss the thing that God is saying,
which revelation 1910 says this. It says that the testimony
of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. And so if
(11:42):
we read revelation and we miss Jesus, if we miss
a more intimate and connection with him, then we've really
we've overshot the runway and we've missed the whole purpose
of the book.
S1 (11:53):
Yeah. Wow. (877) 548-3675. Steve, you are in Ohio. Your question
for Jeff Kinley, please.
S7 (12:02):
Hello? Steve in Iowa?
S1 (12:05):
Yes. Please go ahead.
S7 (12:07):
Okay. My question was, uh, as Christ has portrayed in
revelation and then his manifestation upon earth, which will we
see in eternity, the glorified Christ or in the human form?
S6 (12:22):
That's a great question, Steve. I think that when we
get to revelation, we see Christ as he is right now. Uh,
he's not walking around in a flowing robe, passing out
fish and bread and having little kids sit in his lap.
But he's an exalted, glorified, seated at the right hand
of the father. Uh, of course, revelation is is a
is a book of great glory of God. Uh, but
I think most of the time we tend to look
(12:44):
back at the Gospels to get our portrait of Christ.
And certainly that is true. But we also need to
see him as he is right now. And so we
see a triumphant, glorious Christ in the very beginning of revelation.
And at the end we see the same Christ. He
looks exactly the same as John saw him in chapter one,
as he does in chapter 19, when he comes back
(13:04):
as at his second coming. Uh, so I think that
we have to recalibrate our vision of Jesus according to
what the Scripture says he is right now.
S1 (13:13):
Um, thank you for the question, Steve. (877) 548-3675. Jesse in Illinois,
thank you for joining us. Your question now, please.
S8 (13:22):
Hi. Thanks for taking my call. Um, so my question,
I had a run in with a Jehovah's Witness recently,
and they were using some verses from revelation. I think
it was revelation 21 and they said that, um, God
will not destroy the earth, that his plan is to
restore it. Um, Jesus is not coming back. And I
was just wondering how to respond to that.
S6 (13:42):
Yeah. Well, Jesse, what we do is we let the
Scripture speak for itself. Uh, we don't have to defend
the Scripture. We just let let the Scripture loose. Like
Spurgeon said, let the lion loose. And so we have
to just say what the what the Word of God says.
It does tell us in chapter 19 he is physically
coming back. Chapter one verse seven says, every eye will
see him. Chapter 21 tells us about the eternal state.
(14:07):
Chapter 22 tells us about a new heavens and a
new earth. In fact, first Peter tells us that the
old earth and the universe is going to basically be
dissolved with great intense heat, and a whole new world
is going to be created by God. So again, we
just have to say what the scriptures say. A lot
of these cults will they will do, um, exegetical gymnastics
with the text. They'll try to reinterpret it to fit
(14:29):
a prescriptive narrative that they already believe. Uh, concerning the
144,000 concerning, uh, the New Jerusalem, all these things, they
reinterpret it. But let's just let the Bible speak for
itself and just rest on that.
S1 (14:42):
Thank you so much. I appreciate the question on that point.
You have an entire chapter called that the planet Earth
is in peril. And this is where you begin the dialogue.
And because you're moving into chapter six about the different
seal judgments, you break them down. Jeff, can you kind
of do a flyover on these? What do they mean?
And why are there so many enumerated specific judgments?
S6 (15:04):
Yeah, well, there are three basic sets of judgments and
revelation the seal judgments, the trumpet judgments and the bowl judgments.
And of course, Scripture portrays how those things are are
poured out or announced on the planet. And it begins
in chapter six when it says, The Lamb of God
really breaks the first seal. So we know that God's
judgment begins at the first part of the tribulation, because
(15:26):
he's the one that does that. But basically what we
see is we see kind of a there's almost like
a three pronged approach that God has towards what's going
on in the planet during revelation. On the one hand,
he's he's pouring out retribution on a rebellious planet that
has continually, repeatedly refused to listen to his truth. And
Second Thessalonians tells us that he will send a spirit
(15:46):
of delusion during that time as well as his incredible judgment.
It's going to be a really horrific time to be
alive if you're on the planet. The second part of
it is the fact that God does a great revival
during that time as well. We see in chapter seven
there's going to be a massive turning to the Lord
during that time. And it just tells us once again
what what a gracious God we have. But the third
(16:08):
part is he's going to be dealing with the nation
of Israel. He's going to be bringing Israel. Obviously, she's
back in the land, but he's going to have a
spiritual revival take place in Israel as well toward the
end of that period of time, that seven year period.
And it's going to be brought on. The part of
the catalyst is going to be some of God's two witnesses.
So there's going to be all these concurrent themes going on,
(16:28):
these these narrative, these scenes. There's judgment, there's grace, there's revival,
there's preaching, uh, there's blasphemy. There's all these things that
are going on in the earth. So it'll be a
great time of turmoil. But the sealed trumpet and bowl
judgments that's coming down, first part and the second part
of the tribulation.
S3 (16:46):
Wow.
S1 (16:46):
It's all there in the book of revelation. And Jeff
Kinley breaks this down beautifully in his brand new book,
God's Grand Finale. I wrote several things down when you
were talking because it raises a whole series of questions. Plus,
I've got some great callers online. (877) 548-3675. This beautiful new
book by Jeff Kinley looks at the Book of Revelation systematically, chronologically,
(17:07):
starting with the overview right there, verse one, chapter one,
and then gives us the core context of each of
the chapters and themes as you move through the book.
It is a great, user friendly resource to study the
Book of Revelation, which is accessible, as Jeff said earlier,
to all of us back after this. We're talking about
(17:30):
the book of Revelation with Jeff Kinley, who's authored the
brand new book God's Grand Finale. I'm going to go
back to the phones in just a minute, because we've
got some wonderful calls. You've called (877) 548-3675. But I was
writing some things down and I asked you the section
basically this is surrounding chapter six. Planet Earth is in peril.
And you talked about the judgments that were coming, the
seals that are going to be broken. So I'm asking
(17:52):
for the person who thinks they've just stumbled on this
conversation and hears the word God's retribution against those who
have rejected the message. I want to dig into this
because if the book of Revelation is, as you say,
a revelation of who God is revealed in all of
his glory, does it make him a bad God all
of a sudden? It's uh oh. I mean, we have
now this flawed, fractured thinking that says we disconnect the
(18:15):
old from the New Testament. God didn't. We shouldn't. And
if you're reading the Bible contextually, you can't. You just
it's a ludicrous thought. First, last and always. But some
would say you want to reject the Old Testament because
it's a God of judgment and wrath. I'll take the
Jesus with the children on his lap. So now this
God comes back in revelation and he's showing he's meting
out retribution. Does this make him a bad God, a
(18:37):
wrathful God, a God we should fear and for some avoid?
S6 (18:42):
Well, he definitely is a wrathful God. But here's the
thing is that when people talk about, well, I don't
want God to be wrathful, you really want him to
be righteous. You want him to be wrathful because we
all want God to do what is right. Every person,
to some degree, wants God to just make things right
in the world, get rid of the evil, get rid
of all the bad things. And and he's going to
(19:02):
do that eventually. He's going to do that. But this
period of tribulation, Janet, is a part of that. God
expressing his righteousness just like he did against the days
of Noah. And people refused to repent. They're just as
he did against Sodom and Gomorrah when they refused to repent, their, uh,
God brings judgment when people don't accept his mercy. And
so Jesus, that same Jesus in the New Testament, that
(19:23):
that gave out the fish and loaves and had children
in his lap, is going to ride a white horse,
come down, and he's going to tread the winepress of
the fierce wrath of God, and he's going to deal
with people that have basically rejected him over and over
and over again. And that's why it's so important for
us to respond to the goodness and the grace of God.
because what's on the other side is the wrath of God.
(19:45):
And so God has to punish sin either either now
through Christ on the cross or in eternity. And so
that's why it's important for people to respond correctly.
S1 (19:54):
I couldn't. What a wonderful answer. And I don't have
a problem with this. And I'll tell you why. Because
if there is no wrath, then Calvary was a sham.
If God tells us and tells us and tells us again,
so we can't say we haven't been told. If he
foretells that Jesus is coming, if Jesus becomes the propitiation
of our sins because the wages of sin is death.
If in the end judgment isn't meted out, then this
(20:15):
whole thing was kabuki theater and a sham. And it
makes a farce of what the Bible tells us. So
I don't have a problem with that. It's. Forgive me,
but I'm recognizing the holiness of our father. But there's
a part of me that wants to say. Do you
think he was saying I was only kidding all along?
So I don't have a problem with this. But then
the second hour you used was revival. This speaks to
his characteristic because you said there would be revival. It's
(20:38):
in line with his word that says he's not willing
that any should perish. So even after this retribution, there
will still be for those who have been left behind,
that last chance to be able to receive the good
news of the gospel. Right. So again, his mercy is
meted out.
S6 (20:53):
Janet, that's what's so amazing about this book, is that
we we understand God bringing his wrath to a certain degree. Uh,
but we we don't expect him to bring the grace.
And this is what is so amazing about our God
is that, yes, we deserve the wrath, especially during the tribulation.
But here comes God saying, no, I'm going to bring
this grace, uh, movement through the world in these last days.
(21:16):
And people are going to respond by the millions because
they're going to finally realize, hey, I missed that rapture thing. Uh,
the whole world is coming apart. Uh, you talk about
climate change. It's climate change on steroids, compliments of the
Lamb of God. And people hide from God. They run
from God. They blaspheme God. But they'll be a segment
of Earth's population that will get it and they will respond.
(21:37):
And really, the the big question is not why is
God bringing his wrath. The big question is why would
he still bring his mercy?
S1 (21:44):
Yes, yes. Oh, wow. All right. And because you brought
it up. Let me take the third part. Then I
promised friends I'm going to go to the phones. But
you brought up the nation of Israel. Sometimes we have
sloppy theology here. Um, because we have decided that somewhere
along the line, some have anyway. And it's another gospel.
And I want to take this moment to clear it
up that because this there's going to be this special
place for the nation of Israel, that they've taken the
(22:06):
passage that says all of Israel will be saved. Therefore,
we don't have to evangelize to the Jews, because in
the end, it doesn't make any difference anyway. In fact,
I would I heard one person posit, well, he never
said that he was savior. He just it's the reverend
that he's the question of Messiah. So they've parsed these
two things separately. The plan of salvation is still the
plan of salvation, is it not? And the fact that
(22:27):
Israel is going to play a significant part doesn't mean
blanket salvation for all the Jews, does it? Or does
it not?
S6 (22:33):
No, not at all. In fact, two thirds of the
Jews will perish during the tribulation period. It will be
a very sad time, but a third of them will
call that remnant. We'll call upon them. And you know,
Jesus even said when he rode into Jerusalem, when Israel
rejected him, he said, behold, your house is left to
you desolate. I say to you, from now on you
shall not see me until you say, blessed is he
(22:55):
who comes in the name of the Lord. Zechariah 1210.
You said, Romans 1126, The Jews will call upon the Lord,
but there'll be a massive evangelistic campaign to the Jews
during the tribulation period through 144,000 young Jewish male evangelists,
through these two witnesses that will be calling down fire
from heaven. Uh, it'll be a time of great revival
(23:16):
and persecution for the Jewish people once again.
S1 (23:19):
Well, follow up question to that and see good teachers
like you, Jeff, make you think of more questions. That
means you're getting the point across. And I want to
thank you. So for people, we're seeing this uptick in
anti-Semitism in the world, which is nothing but spiritual warfare.
So when we say that God chose the Jews and
I may just have time to ask the questions, but
I desperately want the answer on the other side, he
(23:39):
didn't pick the Normans. He didn't pick the the the picks.
He didn't pick the Celts. He picked the Jewish people
to mete out his plan of salvation for each and
every one of us. So does that make the nation
of Israel? Because there it is in the book of
revelation yet again, playing a place in history, past, present
and future. Is that means that there's why? Let me
(24:00):
ask it as a why. Why is God continually focusing
on the nation of Israel? He could have left them
on the ash heap of history. They didn't have to
show up in the book of revelation, where yet again,
some pretty amazing stuff is going to happen. Why does
it show up again? And what makes Israel so special?
Back after this? Tired of the endless, biased spin you
(24:29):
hear on mainstream media and in the market, we're using
God's Word as our guide as we examine today's events,
and we want you to be informed and bold about
his truth. This is a listener supported program, so if
you value what you hear and you want us to
continue on your station, become a partial partner with your
monthly support, call eight 7758. That's eight 7758 or go
online to in the market with Janet parshall.org. I am
(24:54):
thrilled with Jeff Kinley's brand new book. It's called God's
Grand Finale. I just love that as a title for
the book of Revelation subtitled wrath. We just talked about
that grace and glory in Earth's last days. If you're
just joining us, I'm so thankful we have a podcast
because you can go to that page in the market
with Janet parshall.org. Look at the left hand side. You're
going to see a bunch of words. Look for these
(25:15):
two past programs download this hour or either of the
two hours we do every day, going back a full year.
And then at your convenience, you can catch the total
conversation with Jeff, and you're going to want to do
that because it was rich and good stuff as you're
studying the book of revelation. So check that out. But
let me reintroduce Jeff to you. He has written over
40 books. He speaks all over the country. He loves
(25:36):
to teach Christians how to discern the times and live
with confidence. That's called equipping the saints in Scripture, and
I'm so glad he does. He's got not one, but
two podcasts The Prophecy Pros Podcast and Vintage Truth. It's
heard in about 130 plus countries. And then he has
a TV program on his channel TV called the Jeff
called Jeff Kinley Live. So that's all the background. I'm
going to get to the calls in a minute. But
(25:56):
you left hanging the question of Israel. And I think
this is important because there's still this dispute and I'm
going to call it out. anti-Semitism is not just outside
the church as well. And there's umbrage that some people
have against the nation of Israel, like, why are they
so special? They've rejected their predominantly secular. Why do they
keep showing up on the scene? Well, there they are
again in the book of revelation. I mean, we're talking
(26:18):
about Israel throughout the book, and there it is. So
why is Israel so special to the heart of God,
and why is it not Germany that's playing a significant
part in the book of revelation?
S6 (26:30):
That's a great question. You know, we go back to
the book of Genesis. The Bible tells us that God
chose a man, that this man named Name. Abraham to
have a covenant relationship, an unconditional covenant relationship with him,
to make of him a great nation, that through him
the Messiah would come. Through him all the nations of
the world would be blessed. And so Deuteronomy seven Janet
tells us that God did not choose Israel because they
(26:51):
were so special. In fact, it was in spite of
the fact that they were small and they were insignificant.
God just simply chose them because he's a sovereign God.
He gets to choose who he wants. Uh, you know,
we elect our leaders in our country. And, you know,
we have all these, uh, these stipulations about how you
can vote and all these other things. There are no
stolen elections in God's kingdom and his economy. He chooses
(27:12):
whom he wants, and he chose the nation of Israel. Now,
Israel has been unfaithful to God. And because of that,
God has in essence put them on the back burner
for a while. Uh, Romans 11 tells us, while he's
dealing with the whole world in terms of the the
church age, but he's going to return after the rapture,
I believe. Uh, back to the Jewish people begin to
deal specifically with them because he is obligated himself to them.
(27:36):
He's told them, there's a land I'm going to give you.
He's told them there is a messiah that's going to
sit on David's throne forever. I'm going to bring you
back to the land physically, God says, which he's already done.
Just about half of the Jews in the world are
now back in Israel. And then he says, I'm going
to bring you back spiritually at the end of this
time of tribulation. So it's all about Israel. I mean,
in fact, if you take your Bible, Janet, you put
(27:57):
your thumb in Genesis chapter 12 about verse three, and
then go ahead and put your your other index finger
in acts chapter two, and hold up that big, thick
portion of the Bible. That's all about the Jewish people. Wow.
And so it's a huge, huge section there. So we
as Gentiles are grafted in, which is wonderful. And we'll
all be in heaven together. But he has some unfinished
(28:19):
business to deal with, with the nation of Israel.
S1 (28:23):
Wow. Wow. Obligated himself to them. I love the way
you said that. Wow. All right, I won't be selfish.
I have a thousand questions, but so do you. (877) 548-3675 Pamela,
I welcome you from Florida. Your question please, for Jeff Kinley.
S9 (28:38):
Hi. Um, super simple question. I was trying to figure
out the whole process. Once we once we die, are
we in our sleep, if you will, until the revelation?
Or do we go to heaven immediately?
S6 (28:55):
Well, thank you, Pamela, for that question. It's a great question. Well,
second Corinthians chapter five, verses seven and eight tell us
that when we're absent from the body, we are present
with the Lord. So our physical body stays here on
the earth, but our soul, our spirit goes to be
with God. So we are with him in heaven. And
the Bible tells us that at the rapture, he's going
to bring back our bodies and our spirits together. We're
(29:16):
going to be given a brand new, glorious body. So
there's no real truth to this whole idea of soul sleep.
Are we going some sort of intermediary state, that type
of thing? Uh, Paul says that if I'm absent from
my body, I'm present with Jesus. You can have that 100% guarantee.
S1 (29:32):
Yeah, and thank his word for that truth. Pamela, thank
you so much. I appreciate it. Harold, let me turn
to you because I think your question is related. Thanks
for joining us from Illinois.
S10 (29:42):
Hello. So my question basically is revelation 20. And who's
really going to be there? Is it going to be
the the church and our all the past patriarchs, or
is it just kind of like the immediate people that
are delivered from the tribulation?
S6 (29:59):
Well, thank you for that question. It's a great question. Now,
in the Millennial kingdom, in revelation 20, we see tribulation
saints are going to be there. They're going to be rewarded.
We see the church, church age saints are going to
be there. They're they have come back with Christ in
Revelation 19. Old Testament saints Daniel 12 tells us, are
going to be given new bodies. They're going to be
in the Millennial Kingdom. So basically all believers from all
(30:21):
ages will inhabit the Millennial Kingdom. Now, some of these
believers that are alive at the time of the Second
Coming during the tribulation, they're just going to walk on
into the millennial Kingdom in their mortal bodies, and that
is where the nations will come from at the end
of that thousand year period that will establish a rebellion
led by Satan against the Lord. But at some point
(30:44):
when they die, they'll be given their glorified bodies as well.
But we'll all be there together in the kingdom of Christ. Wow.
S1 (30:52):
If this conversation doesn't give you triple goosebumps, you are asleep. Awake,
O sleeper. So get up and start thinking about the
glorious anticipation of what that's going to be like. Wow. Harold.
Thank you. (877) 548-3675. Brian, let me welcome you as well.
Your question please.
S7 (31:10):
Well, thank you for having me on. Um, my question
is I have been hearing through Christian news channels about
a group in Israel that's planning on gathering all the
accoutrements necessary for the rebuilding of the temple. But yesterday,
I believe in Yahoo news, mainstream media. I saw an
(31:33):
article about it too, and I'm wondering what you think
about the significance of the fact that this is gaining
traction in the general culture.
S6 (31:44):
That's a great question. Thank you so much, Brian. In fact, yeah,
there's a group there called the Temple Institute that were
established in 1987. They have, uh, they're intentional about rebuilding
the temple on that Temple Mount. They've already drawn up blueprints.
You can go to their website and see all this.
They've trained, uh, several hundred over 500 young priests. Uh,
they have established themselves with, uh, with the temple, um, monuments.
(32:08):
They've gotten the, uh, the menorah. So this this giant menorah,
in fact, I was there at the Temple Institute in January,
and they're buzzing with activity because they believe they're going
to rebuild their temple. Now, here's the thing. You talk
about the nation of Israel, how God works through the Jews.
The thing is, is that it's like a homing mechanism.
They just know it's going to happen. And so they're
(32:28):
sitting on ready, uh, they're gathering up sacrificial lambs. They've
already practiced sacrifices. They built the altars, they've got the
priestly garments. So all they need is permission to get
on that piece of real estate and build that temple.
And I believe some, some end times events are going
to enable that to happen for them. So we know
there's going to be a temple because Scripture tells us
(32:48):
there'll be a third temple. We don't know exactly how
that will happen, but we do know it's going to happen.
And they're right now sitting on ready to do it.
S1 (32:55):
Yeah, I just read an article within the last couple
of weeks about the red heifer again. So, Brian, you're right,
it does keep coming up in the news, but because
you brought it up, Brian, I want to linger. This
is why these conversations are so good and why I
can never get this all in in an hour. There's just.
This is like you've heard of a seven layer salad, ladies.
You'll get a gentleman even if you don't. There's so
many layers to this book, which is so exciting. I
used to get excited about taking people when I was
(33:17):
taking groups to the Temple Institute, because I just love history,
but the more I dug into this, the more I thought,
let's talk about the role of the temple. Maybe we
need to linger here for a minute. I think what
happens is sometimes as believers, we superimpose the temple as
it was put together in the Old Testament and before
it was ransacked again. Talk to me about the role
the temple is going to play in the end times.
S6 (33:40):
Yeah, well, the temple is going to play a huge
role because that'll be, I believe it'll be a time
when there'll be sacrifices that'll be made during the tribulation period.
The Bible tells us that at the midpoint of that
tribulation period, the Antichrist will come in and put a
stop to the sacrifice. So we know that the sacrifice
is going to be made. And I do believe, Janet,
that's going to be a way that God will continue
(34:02):
to prefigure, uh, what the Messiah has done for them.
And I believe that these the fault, the excuse me,
the two witnesses, the 144,000 will seize upon this and
use the temple sacrifices as a way to point them
to the Messiah, Jesus, just as the original sacrifices were
intended to do. The blood of bulls and goats could
(34:23):
never take away sin. So I believe the temple will
play a very important part also, because the Jews believe
that the Shekinah glory of God, the presence of God,
dwells in that Holy of Holies. That's going to be
the bull's eye target for Antichrist, because he cannot have
any other gods before him. So he's going to invade
that temple, plop himself up on that, that that holy
(34:45):
place there, and declare himself to be God. And so
the temple is going to be a place of, of
reunion's going to be a place of worship, but also
during the tribulation period. It's going to be a great
place of horror when Antichrist comes in. And at that moment,
that is when I believe God will begin to turn
the Jews hearts toward him, because Antichrist will launch this
(35:07):
three pronged attack in revelation chapter 12. It'll be a
another Holocaust in Israel, and it's going to be a
time when the Jews are going to finally say, wait
a minute. All these sacrifices pointed to the one person,
the Messiah.
S1 (35:20):
Amen. Oh, I just love hearing your brother's heart on this, Jeff.
So now you're a Jew and you're working at the
Temple Institute. Why are you doing this?
S6 (35:28):
Yeah, because they're trying to usher in the Messiah. They
believe the Messiah is not yet come yet. And so.
But they believe in order for the Messiah to come,
they must spiritually prepare themselves. And they cannot do that
unless they have the temple and the sacrifices.
S11 (35:42):
Wow. Wow.
S1 (35:43):
Missing the forest for the trees. Fascinating. Fred, thank you
so much for the question. We're going to take a
break and I'm going to come back with more of
your questions. Jeff, I can already tell you you must
come back so we can continue, because your book, God's
Grand Finale, which is this overview of the Book of Revelation,
is beautifully laid out in chronological order, thematic order. So
you start with revelation one. You go right to the
(36:04):
end of the book, and you really hear God's heart
and his intent for writing this very important book called
revelation back after this. Ever feel intimidated by the Bible?
(36:27):
Unsure where to begin or how it all fits together. Well,
you're not alone. That's why I've chosen The Jesus Book
by Doctor Jack Graham as this month's truth tool. Learn
to unlock the timeless wisdom of God's Word. As for
your copy of the Jesus Book, when you give a
gift of any amount to in the market, call eight 7758,
that's eight 7758 or go online to in the market
(36:48):
with Janet parshall.org. Jeff Kinley is with us. He loves
to teach people about Bible prophecy. He loves to teach
Christians period. To discern know the times to be equipped.
So his latest book is called God's Grand Finale Wrath,
Grace and Glory in Earth's Last Days. Fabulous. The way
(37:09):
the book is laid out beautifully starts with verse one,
gives you an overview in all the different segments and
what the themes are. So your Bible in one hand,
Jeff's books in the other, and you'll be able to
get through the book of Revelation and perhaps understand it
like you've never understood it before. (877) 548-3675. Dana, I welcome
you from Michigan. Thanks for being here. Your question?
S12 (37:30):
Yes. Um, you had answered a question before about, um,
when we die, um, we're present with the Lord. Is
does that include those who don't believe?
S6 (37:44):
Yeah, those who don't believe in Christ are not present
with the Lord. They're they're separated from him. Uh, Scripture
says the wages of sin is death. And that word
death means separation. So those who don't know Jesus Christ
will not be with him in his presence in heaven. Uh,
they'll be suffering under the wrath of God, unfortunately. And
that is why it's so urgent that people seriously consider
(38:07):
the gospel and the offer of salvation. Because what's at
stake is eternity. And so, just as we have the
assurance we're going to be with Christ, uh, we know
from the messages of Christ and the rest of Scripture
that those who die without Christ will not be with him.
S1 (38:21):
Mhm. I thank you, Dana, for the question. 3675. Jeff,
thank you for being here. Your question now?
S7 (38:30):
Yes. I guess it should have been two questions. And
we're going to be at the winter stage and we're
raptured and we're going to be with the millennium people
or 1000 year reign. And also, will we be working?
S6 (38:44):
Yeah. Great question. Yeah. Thank you so much for that question. Yes,
we will be with all the other saints during the
millennial reign. And Jesus promises that we're going to be
rewarded in the millennial Kingdom. We're going to actually have responsibilities.
Some people will be put in charge over cities, uh,
some over nations. And we'll be doing work for the Lord. Now,
(39:05):
it's not going to be like, you know, digging ditches
type thing for Christ, but it'll be things that'll be
very fulfilling, uh, very uplifting, very joyful. We will want
to serve him. And God's going to create so many
wonderful opportunities for us to live for him and to
serve him, uh, in that future kingdom. So, yeah, we'll
stay busy. It'll be a lot of fun, and it'll
be glorious in our joy.
S11 (39:26):
Mm.
S1 (39:27):
Let me linger here. This is where you kind of
use your sanctified imagination. I can't put there, Jeff. What's
not there? But I do love the fact that I
can lie on my back, look up in the sky
and dream and get excited about what's going to happen.
So first, talk about the thousand years. Right now, people
are going thousand years. I can't make it to bed
some nights. How am I going to get through a
thousand years? Well, don't we go back to the idea
that to the Lord is yours? A year is like
(39:48):
a thousand and thousands like a year. So in other words,
get off your watch because it's not going to be.
We won't have a sense of time. I mean, I
know Scripture doesn't give us clarity on this, but can
we deduce at least that time will have a different
sense and feeling? And maybe this is a peephole into
the idea of eternity?
S6 (40:06):
Yeah, I think we can look at it this way,
that God, we know that God is timeless. He's beyond time.
He created the idea of times, but he's beyond it.
He's eternity past, eternity future when we're made like Christ.
The Bible tells us in first Corinthians 13 that we're
going to know as we are known, so we'll be
able to understand the And the concept of eternity a
lot better. We won't need our Apple Watch in heaven.
(40:28):
We're not going to be counting times. We're looking at
our calendars or daytimers or anything like that. It's going
to be a timeless time. And so the great thing
about that is, is that we won't have to have
the the burdens and the constraints that the whole concept
of time really puts upon us. We'll be able to
live free outside of time. Now there will be a
thousand year period, but at the same time, we won't
(40:49):
be counting it down on our watches and that type
of thing. So we'll just be enjoying the eternal now,
just as God does. And as I said before, it'll
just be filled with complete joy because we won't be
worrying about anything else other than how to enjoy God
and what he's given to us.
S1 (41:04):
That's so cool. So Billy Graham once said that he
wanted to be the mayor of Jerusalem. So you talked
before about what makes sense. And Cliff barrows said, by
the way, one of the job of directing the choir.
So it makes perfect sense. But if you're going to
have some who are going to have positions of authority
over cities, who are the occupants, then of those cities?
S6 (41:23):
Yeah, well, there'll be those who inhabit the Millennial Kingdom
or will be citizens of God's great kingdom. You know,
Philippians 320 says that our citizenship is in heaven. So
that's where our allegiance is. That'll be the place of
our residence eventually will be in the New Jerusalem, this
incredible space that God will create for us. And and
here's the other great thing about the kingdom and about
(41:44):
heaven is that we live in such limited minds right now. Janet,
in terms of language, in terms of color, in terms
of sounds, in terms of music, uh, he's speaking about music.
I mean, there'll be sounds and things that we'll enjoy
and dimensions and aspects of our five senses, uh, that
we'll be able to enjoy there like we never have before. Why?
Because God is an infinitely creative God, and there are
(42:07):
things that are waiting for us that we cannot even
possibly write or imagine at this moment.
S11 (42:12):
Well, I've.
S1 (42:13):
So often thought that that as much as we think
we've seen it all here on earth, we have got
just a tiny little glimpse, like a glass darkly, as
we read in Scripture. So it gets you excited about
what that experience is going to be, and it has
to be absolutely fabulous. You said something earlier and I
feel pressed to bring this up. There are a lot
of people who hear about what's going to happen in
(42:33):
that millennial period and they're thinking, wow, you talked before
about there's going to be revival and people are going
to come to faith. It is appointed unto man once
to die. Talk to me about why the message of
salvation should be considered and adhered to now, because don't
bet that you'll have a second chance based on what's
going to happen in the book of revelation. Talk to
(42:54):
me about that.
S6 (42:55):
Yeah. Basically, we all have a really serious problem. It's
worse than cancer. It's called sin because it essentially damns
our eternal soul. It separates us from God. But the
deal of the ages is, Janet, is that Jesus Christ
took the penalty for our sin on the cross. We
trade our sin, we get salvation. We exchange God's wrath
for his rescue. And it helps us to avoid this
(43:19):
awful time of tribulation that's coming. And we get a great,
bright future no matter what we're going through right now.
So I urge people right now, it's the only time
you have in your whole life is right now to
turn to Jesus Christ. Do it now. Call upon him.
S1 (43:34):
That may be the most important thing you heard this
entire hour. So we know that Jesus is coming again.
We don't know. Scripture says no one knows but the father,
but he is coming again. So the question is, will
we look forward? And I'll use the phrase again with
glorious anticipation for Jesus's return. All that you know of
this life could end tonight. So where will you spend eternity?
(43:56):
Something to ponder, Jeff. Thank you. Superb book. There are
a gazillion more questions I would ask. In the meantime,
if you're looking for a wonderful book that breaks down
this magnificent book that deals with God's wrath, his grace,
and his glory, and what happens in Earth's last day,
then you need Jeff Kinley's book, God's Grand Finale. All
the info is on my page. Thank you Jeff. Thank
(44:16):
you friends. We'll see you next time on In the
Market with Janet Parshall.
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