June 28, 2023 • 34 mins
Summer has officially kicked off, and for a lot of people, that means travel. We don’t want that to intimidate anyone. Today our guests will share not just tips but real-world experiences from their travels, good and bad.
Guests:
- Mollie Hernandez, Advocate
- Jen Goodwin, Staff Attorney
Helpful Links:
- US Department of State – Bureau of Consular Affairs
- US Department of Transportation
- Air Carrier Access Act
- ADA Resources
- DOT 2021 Air Travel Complaint Data
- Travel Tips
- Accessibility at AR State Parks
- Interagency Access Pass
Contact DRA
- Subscribe to our newsletter
- Stay connected
- Show your support
- Email us at info@disabilityrightsar.org
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Lani Jennings-Hall (00:02):
At Disability Rights Arkansas, we
are focused on guidance forpeople with disabilities on how
to navigate your rights, thingsthat help with your everyday
life, and how to navigate thecomplex systems of how to get
the support you need. I'm yourhost, Lani Jennings-Hall. In
this podcast, Including You, webring that information directly
to you the listener on thingslike accessibility questions,
(00:25):
career and care, and even thenuances of love life with a
disability. Everyone has theright to know their rights,
everyone, including you.
And summer has officially kickedoff for a lot of people. That
means travel, and we don't wantthat to intimidate anyone. I'm
joined by Jen Goodwin, DRA staffattorney.
Jen Goodwin (00:47):
yes, I will be more than happy to share a couple
stories that have happened to meover the years.
Lani Jennings-Hall (00:52):
And Mollie Hernandez, an advocate here at
DRA.
Mollie Hernandez (00:56):
Be loud and proud about your disability, let
them know what you need, becauseyou just can't assume that the
accommodation is there and thatit's going to meet your needs.
Lani Jennings-Hall (01:05):
Both travel extraordinaires are here to
share not just tips, but realworld experiences from their
travels, both the good and thebad. Thank you guys for joining
me today here on including you.
Guys, thank you so much forjoining me today on including
you. I'm so excited to have youguys on the podcast. So Jen, do
you want to tell us just alittle bit about yourself today?
Jen Goodwin (01:28):
Sure. My name is Jen Goodwin and I have a spinal
cord injury. So I'm actuallyquadriplegic that happened when
I was 25. So interestinglyenough for this topic, I
actually had done extensivetraveling pre-injury. And so the
differences between before myinjury and after my injury are
very, very different andexperiences for sure. Before
(01:50):
injury, I traveled and donestudy abroad in Australia and
been all over the countrytraveling for work by myself so
independently, and then now Irequire people to go with me on
most trips and just trying tonavigate airplanes and trains in
new cities and all the differentforms of transportation as a
(02:10):
wheelchair user, as a powerwheelchair user, I should add,
because that does add an extralayer in there has been eye
opening and a challenge. And I'm15 years out from injury. And
I'm still learning new tips andtricks. So hopefully something
that we've experienced can helpsomeone out there that can
answer a question that you mayhave.
Lani Jennings-Hall (02:33):
Yes, thank you, Jen. I'm so glad to have
you on. I'm glad you pointed outyou haven't stopped traveling,
you traveled before injury andpost injury and you're still
finding new tips keep going.
We're also joined here today byMollie Hernandez. Mollie, do you
want to give us a little bitabout your background?
Mollie Hernandez (02:48):
Sure. My name is Mollie Hernandez, and I am
blind due to a degenerativeretinal condition. So I like
Jen, kind of a lifelongtraveler. But there were many
years when I was low vision asopposed to blind. And it's
sometimes wondering, okay, howdo I accommodate this? Is it
(03:08):
okay for me to ask foraccommodation? Am I disabled
enough situation and a lot oftimes having to kind of defend
my need for accommodations whentraveling because my disability
wasn't very visible for a while.
So there's that I also travelwith a seeing eye dog, Boomer.
So I have those experiences aswell traveling with my guide
dog. I'm a mom of two, andthey're teenagers now. They're
(03:33):
15 and 17. And they don'tremember me not being blind. So
I have traveled with smallchildren on it to teenagers as a
blind parent. So that kind ofadds another dynamic and level
of fun to the picture when wetravel. So yeah, Jen and I are
so excited to get to do thistopic for disability rights. And
I think we'd like to let ourbosses know that if they need
(03:55):
some more extensive researchinto this topic, we're all in
you know, we're happy to goanywhere to better inform our
listeners.
Lani Jennings-Hall (04:04):
Yeah, anything for work, right?
Anything to just to be serious.
Jen Goodwin (04:09):
Mollie and I traveled together. So we enter a
plane and a power wheelchair andwith a service animal and the
airline usually has no idea whatto do with us at that point.
Mollie Hernandez (04:17):
Yes, yes, we have shocked some airlines when
we come in mass on our worktrips.
Lani Jennings-Hall (04:23):
Let's start with air travel. So I know you
guys have both had some veryunique experiences. And Mollie,
you kind of hit on it a littlebit when you hit on your intro
about advocating for yourself.
Is this the same trip that youguys took together when you had
back to back experience or werethese separate ones?
Mollie Hernandez (04:39):
This was separate. I was actually flying
alone without a guide dog. Thiswas a few years past. In fact, I
believe I was traveling to bematched with my guide dog at the
time. And so I was travelingalone independently from
Arkansas to New Jersey and whenyou travel with a disability and
this is Something we can talkmore about, or maybe I'll
(05:01):
explain enough now, when youcheck in, you can explain that
you have a disability and thatyou need an escort to and from
the gate someone to assist youin navigating the airport. For
our layover, because we live inLittle Rock, very few things are
direct out of Little Rock. So Idid have a change over and I had
to wait for my connectingflight. I was waiting for the
(05:22):
person to come and assist me toget me from the gate that I was
exiting the plane from to mynext gate. And they did come and
pick me up. But my problem was,I just assumed everyone realized
that I was fine. And the personthat assisted me that it had a
wheelchair for me, which isfine, I don't mind because not
everyone is really good atguiding a blind person using
(05:44):
sighted guide, which is whereyou would walk from gate to
gate. So I was fine, I was happyto use the wheelchair. And when
we got to the final gate where Iwas supposed to get on my plane,
we were kind of out in thewaiting area, the person
assisting me said you need tostand up now. And I just thought
they meant okay, we're not goingto drag the wheelchair down the
tunnel, they're going to go parkit. So I stood up and kind of
(06:05):
turned around waiting to grabtheir arm so they could assist
me the rest of the way, thenthey were gone. I had not
properly educated them andadvocated for myself saying,
Hey, I'm a blind person, I'mgoing to need some physical
assistance all the way to theplane. They were just gone. And
I was just kind of there in noman's land. And of course, you
can imagine how noisy airportsare for me to even try and get
(06:27):
my bearings. It was afrightening few seconds very,
very long seconds before anotherpassenger can actually came up
and said, Are you blind? I justsaw what happened. Do you need
help? And of course, I was like,yes, please help me. And they
guided me all the way to theplane, they actually told the
flight attendant what happenedand the flight attendant was
(06:48):
very kind of came to me laterand was like, That's
unacceptable. And it was but Iwon't completely remove the
fault for myself for not havingproperly advocated. So when you
need an accommodation, be loudand proud about your disability,
let them know what you need,because you just can't assume
that the accommodation was thereand that it's going to meet your
(07:08):
needs.
And with those people that dohelp us from from gate to gate,
while this is not at allsomething you have to do if I
get someone who is just stellar,because keep in mind, I'm the
girl that was left, you know,alone. If I get someone who's
gone above and beyond, I alwayskeep a little cash in my pocket
to give just a small tip just tosay, hey, thanks this this, this
(07:31):
was a good experience. Sothey're just escorts that get
you where you need to go. Onemore thing that I forgot to say.
And this is kind of a littleknown fact, if I'm flying by
myself, of course, right when Icheck in, I can request an
escort. But if whoever is tighthas taken me to the airport,
most likely my husband, if theyhave time to wait with me, they
(07:53):
can get a gate pass. And theycan be the person to escort me
directly to my gate and thenhand me off at the plane to the
flight attendant. And again, youalways like to be in familiar
hands as long as you can.
Because I mean, no one knows mebetter than my husband on how
you know I like to, to beescorted or guided through
through an unfamiliar area. Soit's kind of a little known
(08:16):
fact, it's been, gosh, probablylike four years since I've done
that that's the last time Ithink I flew by myself. But it
was still a thing then. Soanyhow, it's nice to know.
Jen Goodwin (08:29):
So with flying as a motor user, Mollie mentioned
before about going throughsecurity. So for me whenever I
go through security obviouslycan't stand up and go through
the metal detectors. So I get afull on pat downs. So TSA and I
become very familiar with eachother. On that trip, they're
required to tell me exactly whatthey're going to do. Every
(08:50):
single time that they do it. Iknow their song and dance, but
they have to do it to check thatoff their list. So it's a full
pat down of both myself and mychair. They tried to get me to
also give them all of my luggageso that they can I don't know
why they hand dig through all ofmy luggage if I bring it through
with me. But usually I will justhand that to my family and let
(09:12):
them bring it through securityfor me so that it can just go
through the rollers just likeeverybody else's so that it's
not getting dug through rot outin the open with everyone. So I
recommend that and the otherthing is actually when I board
the plane so I take my powerchair down to the gate and onto
the ramp but I can't take itonto the plane with me so they
(09:36):
bring it's called an aisle chairbecause the aisles are only
about 20 inches long or widethere and so it looks like a
furniture dolly with a seat onit. So usually I let my family
lifts me over but they arerequired to have somebody that
can help you with that as wellif you're on transfer over to
the seat and so they lift me andput me over on the seat and then
(09:59):
there's straps like buckles thatcriss cross across my chest down
to my waist. And then they alsogo around my knees area to to
hold my legs where they'resupposed to be. And then they
literally just took me backwardsand we'll move on to the plane,
as if it's a furniture dolly.
With the priority seating, theyusually sit me on the front row
unless that's first class. Andthen they'll move me back to you
(10:22):
know, whatever class I paid for,and sit on the front row there
so that I had the bulkheadseating to be able to have extra
room as needed for the transferand all of that sort of stuff.
That was a fun experience. Justa fun. Funny thing that
happened to me at one point ifthey took me backwards, and they
were hitting my hips on everyarmrests down the aisle. And so
(10:45):
I asked the lady, I said, Oh,that hurts, you know, because
she kept hitting me. And shesaid, Yeah, your hips are a
little wide.
Well, thank you for that you'vemade a girl feel really good
today. Appreciate that. So. Andwhile I'm the first person on
the plane, I'm always the lastperson off of the plane. So it's
usually a long experience. But Iget to know the flight
(11:06):
attendants really well, they'reusually given extra snacks to my
kids and hanging out and we justhave a good time. So if you're
open minded and willing to bepleasant, and you'll get some
fun experiences with that. Andthen also I get a transport at
times, again, I travel with twokids. So my family is often busy
trying to get them navigated.
And if I don't have my powerchair at the gate, we have a
(11:28):
tight layover, then I will justtake one of the chairs from the
airport. And with those, they'renot self propelled, you have to
have someone push you. And sosometimes I've gotten people who
are just happy go lucky andcruising along, and my name is
being called overhead. And Itell them to step on it, they've
got hurry. And then other timesI have people who are like,
(11:49):
maybe coming through there, bulldozing people in the airport, so
it's always fun to see what kindof adventures it's gonna be.
Lani Jennings-Hall (11:58):
No, that's a great point. And I do want to
hit just a second on the AirCarrier Access Act. So I don't
know exactly what year, Jen doyou happen to know what your
that was introduced? By chance?
Jen Goodwin (12:09):
I don't.
Lani Jennings-Hall (12:10):
So it does state that all domestic and
international flights that havethe US as the destination or
origination point are requiredto provide necessary
accommodations to people withdisabilities to ensure safe
travel. Now, in saying that, notall planes have the same
accommodations, but you got toknow you got to know to advocate
for yourself. Not all air travelexperiences are bad as Mollie
(12:35):
hit, you just have to advocatefor yourself, but you need to be
aware ahead of time and havesome expectations.
Jen Goodwin (12:43):
Yes, I will be more than happy to share a couple of
stories that have happened to meover the years. So first of all,
I do want to back up, you know,Molly mentioned that you should
mention your disability and whatyour needs are whenever you get
to the gate. But I want to addthat it should actually start
before that. I actually justbooked flights for my family.
And I should also add, by theway that I travel with two small
(13:05):
children myself now. So I have atwo year old and a seven year
old. So that certainly adds anextra layer in there, we're
traveling. And again, they lookat me a little sideways. So
whenever I come through thegates, but that's okay, we
always make it work. Butwhenever I booked my travel,
there's a place to click abutton that allows you to open
up the accessible travelquestions. And one of the things
(13:28):
that it says is, are you aWheelchair user? And so I click
Yes on that. And then it opensup more questions. So it asked
if I'm going to need aisleassistance. And I'll explain
more about that in just asecond. And then ask if I'm
going to need to borrow a chairor if I'm bringing my own it ask
it's if it's a power chair or amanual chair, and then what kind
(13:49):
of batteries I use, because thatwill determine where they need
to be stored on the plane. Andif they have to be removed from
the plane or from the chairbefore flying. So those are some
of the big questions. I knowthat they do have questions on
there as far as if you are blindas well. And if you'll be
traveling with a service animal,so I just saw those last night.
So that is something that whenyou book your travel, you should
(14:11):
do that at that point. But don'tthink that it's just going to
get done. As Mollie said, Whenyou get to check in at the
airport, go ahead and make surethat they have all of your needs
out there. So there'll beprepared and then also, when I
get to the gate, I make surethat the gate agent knows
everything too, because I'vejust traveled enough to know
(14:32):
that this information gets lostin translation a lot and as many
people that I can talk to, theeasier my travel is going to be
for me and my family. So wealways try to do that to be
proactive every step of the way.
But we'll tell you what happenedwith the Air Carriers Access Act
at one point. Part of what theAir Carriers Access Act, the
ACAA says is that you can travelwith medical equipment for free,
(14:55):
and so I always have medicalsupplies that I have to have for
my disability to be able to liveand function whenever I go on
trips. And it's more than whatyour average person needs
whenever they go on a trip.
And so like, I might need ashower chair or something like
that, well, those things shouldtravel for free. And on this
(15:16):
particular trip actually calledahead of time through the
disability guest servicesthrough the particular airline
that I was traveling with justto follow their policy, I wanted
to make sure that I knew whattheir policy was, so that there
wouldn't be any hitches in theplan. So I got to the airport, I
had the law on my side, and Ihad their company policy on my
side. But I did not have a gateagent on my side. So the check
(15:40):
in person told me that I will becharged for those bags. So I
will tell you, one of thecaveats is in that bag, it can
only be medical equipment. Soyou can't pack your clothes,
can't pack your shoes, whateverelse in the same bag with your
medical supplies. So you'restill responsible for any of
those bag charges that might bethere. But any bag that is
strictly dedicated to medicalshould be able to fly for free
(16:03):
with you. And so I told themthat whenever I checked in
because I checked on the policy,I knew what my rights were. And
they still tried to charge mefor the bag. And so in Little
Rock, I stood at the gateforever waiting on the girl to
check me in our guests check inbooth to get checked in for my
flight. And she insisted oncalling management, she sat on
hold forever. And then finallyone of the guys that was
(16:25):
standing there was like, moveover. Because I looked at him
and I don't normally do this.
But I pulled out my disabilityattorneys card to let him know
that I probably didn't know whatthe law was. And I didn't want
to be a disability rightsattorney today, I wanted to be a
passenger on an airplane today.
But my hat goes with me whereverI go. So I will be whatever I
need to be today.
(16:47):
So, he saw that he told the girlto move aside, he was gonna get
me checked in on my plane, itwas gonna take care of my bags
for me. And she's like, No, no,I'll do it. And he said, No, you
missed your opportunity. I'mtaking care of this girl, and
she's going to be flying on herway. And so I really appreciated
that well on my flight home fromSacramento, I went through the
same ordeal telling them at thegate that you know, I needed to
(17:09):
be able to carry my medical baghome. And that girl stopped and
told me no. I told her whattheir policy was told her what
the law was she called hermanager over. And the quote from
the manager that day was, "well,when they know the law, we have
to follow it." And I justlaughed when she said, because
that summed up so much that'swrong in this country. And so it
(17:31):
was really, it was just funny tome at that point. So that goes
to tell you that know yourrights, know the law before you
travel.
Lani Jennings-Hall (17:40):
And pushing back too, because it wasn't like
your first and second attempt,you just had to keep advocating
and keep pushing for it.
Jen Goodwin (17:48):
Yes. And just because we know our rights and
the laws does not mean that theemployees there do, though they
should.
Lani Jennings-Hall (17:55):
DOT statistics from 2021 reported,
This is a huge number, 33,631disability related complaints,
and over half of thosecomplaints reported related to
failure to provide adequateassistance to travelers using a
wheelchair.
Jen Goodwin (18:12):
Wow.
Lani Jennings-Hall (18:14):
I mean, that's just,that's ridiculous.
There are some perks though, youguys have talked about the pre
boarding you are first on somake sure as as she had
mentioned when you are gettingyour tickets, and everything
that you do correctly fill thatout so that you can board
correctly. That it will beimportant.
Jen Goodwin (18:36):
So when I go to board, I make sure this one I
tell them actually at the gatethat I will need pre boarding.
And so sometimes it makes othertravelers a little mad if
they've paid to be first on theplane or whatever. But I'm
usually the very first personand everyone in my party comes
with me, too, because I needtheir help I need their
assistance. And my two smallchildren need to be sitting with
(18:59):
me, they can't be separated fromme on the plane. And so that
process is pretty involved aswell. I always take my power
chair to the gate if I'm flyingwith a power chair instead of a
manual. And usually I asked tospeak to the person who's going
to be transporting my chair,because this is a $20,000
wheelchair that weighs 400pounds. And I need it to work
(19:22):
for me whenever I get towherever I'm going. So I want to
talk to as many people aspossible to make sure that they
know how to handle this chairappropriately and laying it on
its side or picking it up by itsseating base is not the way to
handle it because it's beenbroken probably six times by the
airlines in the times that I'veflown and usually it's the tilt
on it that gets broken andthat's something that I really
(19:45):
need. I use it in and out allday every day for pressure
relief and positioning in mychair. So I end up stuck on a
vacation or work trip orwhatever without a function that
I really need because they don'tget fixed that quickly either.
So I always also I have a sheetthat I've typed up that has my
name and phone number on it. Andit has specific instructions for
(20:06):
how to turn the chair on how toput it in a manual mode. And
then I'll also tell them how torecline the seat back so that it
will fit under the plane withouthaving to be flipped on its
side. And so I usually do it ona bright neon yellow piece of
paper and have it rubber bandedin a large gallon sized plastic
baggie so that it's not going toget wet. So I'm gonna get
(20:27):
damaged. And it's going to beseen plus I talked to the first
guy who's going to be taking itand actually putting it on. And
usually I feel like when theymeet me, and they have a person
in mind, for who that chairbelongs to, they're going to be
more likely to handle itappropriately. But on the other
side of the landing, it's goingto be different people. So they
don't have that luxury. That'swhy they have a note that tells
(20:49):
them exactly what to do. Andthey're the ones that have to
give me the bad news when theydamage it. So hopefully, they're
pretty careful with it as well.
And honestly, since I've beendoing that it has really cut
down on the number of times thatmy chair has been damaged. But I
also always watch out thewindow. And I've gotten to see
how it's handled on numerousoccasions. And it is
dumbfounding. Sometimes, likewell, there goes my tilt as the
(21:11):
band flipped on its side and putup a conveyor belt. So good
times. But one more fun storythat I have to share is I was on
a plane, we were taxiing downthe runway, and overhead comes
the pilot who tells us that weare going back for an important
piece of equipment that has beenleft behind. And I jokingly said
(21:34):
to my family, Oh, I wonder ifthey forgot my chair. And the
flight attendant said, Yep, it'syour chair. Set me back to the
insurance to get my chair andhave it loaded on. I'm just so
glad that we weren't in the airwhen that happened. Because if I
got to the other side with nochair and landing, that would
(21:56):
have been a nightmare. But I'malso proud that the pilot
recognizes the importance ofthat and was willing to taxi
back and get my legs essentiallyfor me to bring in that plane.
Lani Jennings-Hall (22:09):
Question If they hadn't had caught it. And
like if you had been in the air,like are they supposed to do
something to provide you someform of wheelchair?
Jen Goodwin (22:21):
So what has happened in the past whenever
they've broken my chair, and Iassume that it would be the same
if they just completelymisplaced or forgot it would be
that they would call a rentalcompany and have them come to
the airport and bring anincomparable power chair there
for me to use. But depending onwhere you are and what time you
get in, that's going todetermine if those things were
(22:42):
available. So I honestly justhope and pray that that never
happens. Because even when I'veborrowed chairs, places, it's
like driving someone else's carthat it takes a little bit to
get used to a different chair.
And so it's always you know,learning curve for sure.
Lani Jennings-Hall (22:59):
Oh, yeah, absolutely. Mollie, I want to
pass over to you as well.
Because I know you've takenBoomer you're seeing eye dog on
trips with do you want to talk alittle bit about service animals
in the airport?
Jen Goodwin (23:11):
Absolutely. So according to the air carrier
access act, dogs are the onlyanimals that are considered
service animals and the airportor the airline can require a
couple of different forms fromyou. And like Jen said, when you
are booking your flight, you canand should inform them that you
are bringing a dog, there aretwo different forms and there
(23:32):
are samples that you can seeonline and then of course, you
can actually access the actualforms to have them. One is just
to certify that your dog isvaccinated, it is trained that
it does not have a tendency foraggression, and that you do will
keep your dog under your controlat all times that it will be
attached to a leash or a tetherat all times. The second form is
(23:56):
another one it's a littledifferent and it's kind of where
you attests that your dog can golong periods of time without
needing to relieve themselvesthat they wouldn't be prone to
an accident on an airline.
However, they're animals, youknow, accidents can happen and I
do advise take a little doggieemergency kit have some Clorox
wipes and some paper towels, youknow anything that you might
(24:17):
need. Most airports these daysdo have doggie relief areas
within the secured area so thatyou don't actually have to go
back out of the airport to findphysical green space. And in
truth, most of these dogs can govery long periods of times if
necessary without having torelieve themselves and we do
(24:37):
take steps to reduce food reducewater a little bit, kind of like
we do as people you know toavoid having to go too much. So
there are steps to take otherthings with traveling with a
guide dog. When you have anescort through the airport, you
do need to alert them to thingslike you want to use elevators
(24:57):
even if they're Are escalatorsor moving walkways available,
those can risk your dogs toes,we have trained to do those
things when necessary with ourdogs, if there are alternatives,
use the alternatives, it'sbetter. Let's talk a little bit
about going through security.
What I tell everyone is when Iget rushed is when I'm most
(25:19):
likely to get hurt, I'm gonnaget distracted from the signals
that Boomer is trying to give meon navigating security, it just
always feels very, very rushed,and not so much by the TSA
personnel, but just by the othertravelers. So it's another time
to fully advocate for yourselfwith a guide dog, and it's never
(25:40):
appropriate for them to say, Letme hold your dog and you go
through, you know, what I do is,I changed my dog's leash up to a
long leash, which gives me aboutthree feet to work with, I'll
make him sit. And I'll just holdthe leash while I've walked
through the metal detector. Andthen I'll call him to me holding
the leash. So typically, there'sa TSA agent at the other end of
(26:04):
the metal detector to kind ofdirect me because I'm not
working the dog at that time,I'm just heeling him, you know,
helping, you know, just hangingon to them as we go through
these things. And then whatthey'll do is after Boomer comes
through, they'll do kind of aphysical pat down of him just
kind of checking his harness andthings, making sure that there's
(26:24):
nothing hidden underneath thisharness. So it's one of those
things, again, advocate foryourself, most of the personnel
is really, really good. And Ialways feel like they're
actually excited to get a momentto interact with the dog up
close and personal. It depends,you know, I always offer do you
need the harness off, I can takethe harness off, you know, we've
got that down to an art, it onlytakes a few seconds, but there
(26:47):
are people with some somemobility issues, and it might be
a bigger deal. So share them,you know, it's okay to touch my
dog, it's fine. And that's kindof how you get through security.
But again, just don't get in ahurry, always let people know,
this, this is your time, youknow, you've got a system,
don't, don't let them mess withyour system. So I'll come
through first, then I'll bringmy dog or however you were
(27:08):
trained at your own school. Thenwhen we do get to our gate, and
it's time to board, I do preboard for people that need
assistance. So once we get in atdo take the dogs harness off
boomers, a big dog, he's almost80 pounds, and he's just a big
lanky guy. So I take his harnessoff to make sure that he's
(27:29):
comfortable. And then I sit himdown, facing me, and then make
him lay down and then I'll kindof push his little bottom up
underneath the seat in front ofme where other people might
still a carry on bag. That'swhere Boomer goes. And I always
let their flight attendant knowto kind of be careful with the
harness. I mean, they're they'refairly durable. But if someone's
(27:51):
doing heavy baggage on top andstuff like Jen, if if something
happened to that harness anddon't have a way to communicate
with my dog, air communicationgoes through that harness handle
that pull that I get from him.
So if that harness is broken,that's a problem. So I always
try and make people aware, youknow, please make sure that the
harness is stored safely. I keepa few things for Boomer on the
(28:11):
plane with me. They they feelthe pressure changes just like
we do in our ears. If I noticedhim starting to do that head
shake, like you would think adog would do with an ear
infection or something. I givethem a couple of dog cookies or
something just to you know, helpthem swallow and pop those ears.
When the flight attendants comeby and offer drinks, they
usually get a cup of ice for thedog or save some of mine so that
(28:33):
he has a little something to wethis mouth. He can't really
drink, but just something forhim to chomp on that most times.
In fact, truly, every timeBoomer just sleeps the whole way
he's very, very well behaved. Heis attached to me at all times.
So yes, I've put the harnessaway but he is always on leash
the dog always needs to be undermy control. Flight Attendants
(28:56):
dote on him. So I know as muchas we say what goes wrong. There
are so many people that are veryhelpful and very knowledgeable.
So in fact, I actually one of myguide dogs. We didn't realize at
the time that he was he wascoming down with with an illness
called Addison's disease but hegot sick on a plane through and
(29:17):
the flight attendant was lovelyshe was like it's no big deal it
happened right at the end of theflight she was like we have a
cleaning crew Don't Don't worryabout it at all. I mean, I was
it's that mom instinct it waslike oh my gosh look what my kid
did but you know it's a dog andthey were so sweet. So no matter
how you prepare things may gosideways but it's it's alright
(29:38):
you know, if you start stressingwhile you travel that transfers
to your service animals so sokeep it cool make it enjoyable
because don't remember that forsubsequent trips have been
Boomer gets excited when wetravel and he gets excited when
he sees the suitcases come outin the house. So just remember
your your stress and anxietydoes transfer. So, you know,
(30:00):
it's, it's not always a funthing to travel, especially that
airline because a lot of stuffis out of your control. But it's
something that we all need to dojust to be a part of our
community. It's important.
Lani Jennings-Hall (30:14):
You had mentioned that sometimes you
bring in a little emergency bagfor Boomer, oryou kind of
suggested it? Is that one of thetypes of bags that would fly
free or is it only medicalequipment.
Jen Goodwin (30:25):
So his harness, things like that would qualify
as medical equipment, I've neverreally had to push it that much.
But to my understanding if Iwanted to bring a small carry on
that included his dog food forthe trip, and feeding bowls,
things like that, that wouldqualify for my little emergency
pack that I keep it's justsomething small in a ziplock
(30:47):
that I throw in a backpack. Butif I needed to be gone an
extended amount of time, I thinkit's arguable. I haven't
actually checked what the AirCarrier Access Act says or the
airline's policy on it. But Icertainly think it's arguable I
have been known to go over mywhatever it is 40 pound 50 pound
limit with baggage and sweettalk that check in person and
(31:10):
say okay, I'm really sorry. Butthere's dog food in there.
That's sure it's the dog foodthat made me go over and you
know, they're kind. So becausedog food is heavy, but usually
it's my return trip andsouvenirs that make me go over.
But also a dog crate somethinglike that would be counted as
medical equipment for a serviceanimal.
Mollie Hernandez (31:32):
Absolutely.
Yes.
Lani Jennings-Hall (31:34):
I know I've specifically heard about your
your trips to Disney withBoomer. Do you just want to
maybe give a final anecdoteabout some fun travel with
Boomer.
Jen Goodwin (31:44):
Boomer has made his maiden voyage to Disney during
the pandemic in fact, and ashout out to Disney for their
accessibility, especially forthe blind and your dog gets into
the park. There are even certainrides that you can take with
your dog, you do need an AccessPass and ease of access, which
makes it a little easier toboard and get off of certain
(32:07):
rides. There's that's for someof the rides that are a little
scarier than it wouldn't beappropriate to make a dog ride.
You can do what's called a riderswap, which means I would hold
my dog and part of my partywould take the ride and then
they would come out hold my dogand then I would ride with other
people in my party or my kidslike it when there's not a lot
(32:28):
of crowds. And basically theyget to run twice in a row. If we
do right or slop. There's alsooptions where you can leave your
service animal in a crate rightthere where you would get on the
ride. And that has worked outwell for me to just putting him
in the crate just for theduration of the rides. There's
always an attendant theretalking with him keeping him
company, they have some dogcookies, they ask if it's okay
(32:50):
to give. So those things gogreat at Disney. Just make sure
to get that access pass. I cantell you on one of my very first
trips to Disney taking my firstguide dog we were going through
and my kids were little we hadthat big double stroller that
you could rent at Disney at thetime. And my son was four and we
(33:11):
were walking through the crowdand I had my guide dog. My
husband had the stroller. And aswe met someone, this lady looked
at my dog and she was like, ohmy goodness, what a beautiful
service animal. My son, heturned around and he said that
is not a circus animal. He's aseeing eye dog. So he had never
heard service animal before andthought it was a circus animal.
(33:34):
He made sure to educate so ourhousehold Even my kids know how
to advocate for the guide dog.
Lani Jennings-Hall (33:39):
That's fantastic. Thank you Jen and
Mollie, and thank you listeners.
Now as you can tell there's somuch to cover when talking about
traveling, make sure to tuneinto our next episode. The
second part of this conversationas we talk about booking hotels,
Airbnb's, tackling beach andmuch more. You don't want to
miss it.
(33:59):
At Disability Rights Arkansas,we envision an Arkansas where
people with disabilities areequal members in their
communities and can dictacttheir lives through self
determination. And as made clearin this podcast, we can't create
that change without bringingself advocates to the table. If
you're interested in moreinformation, make sure to
subscribe to this podcast andvisit our website. And don't
forget to leave a five starrating and a review
At Disability Rights Arkansas, we
are focused on guidance forpeople with disabilities on how
to navigate your rights, thingsthat help with your everyday
life, and how to navigate thecomplex systems of how to get
the support you need. I'm yourhost, Lani Jennings-Hall. In
this podcast, Including You, webring that information directly
to you the listener on thingslike accessibility questions,
(00:25):
career and care, and even thenuances of love life with a
disability. Everyone has theright to know their rights,
everyone, including you.
And summer has officially kickedoff for a lot of people. That
means travel, and we don't wantthat to intimidate anyone. I'm
joined by Jen Goodwin, DRA staffattorney.
Jen Goodwin (00:47):
yes, I will be more than happy to share a couple
stories that have happened to meover the years.
Lani Jennings-Hall (00:52):
And Mollie Hernandez, an advocate here at
DRA.
Mollie Hernandez (00:56):
Be loud and proud about your disability, let
them know what you need, becauseyou just can't assume that the
accommodation is there and thatit's going to meet your needs.
Lani Jennings-Hall (01:05):
Both travel extraordinaires are here to
share not just tips, but realworld experiences from their
travels, both the good and thebad. Thank you guys for joining
me today here on including you.
Guys, thank you so much forjoining me today on including
you. I'm so excited to have youguys on the podcast. So Jen, do
you want to tell us just alittle bit about yourself today?
Jen Goodwin (01:28):
Sure. My name is Jen Goodwin and I have a spinal
cord injury. So I'm actuallyquadriplegic that happened when
I was 25. So interestinglyenough for this topic, I
actually had done extensivetraveling pre-injury. And so the
differences between before myinjury and after my injury are
very, very different andexperiences for sure. Before
(01:50):
injury, I traveled and donestudy abroad in Australia and
been all over the countrytraveling for work by myself so
independently, and then now Irequire people to go with me on
most trips and just trying tonavigate airplanes and trains in
new cities and all the differentforms of transportation as a
(02:10):
wheelchair user, as a powerwheelchair user, I should add,
because that does add an extralayer in there has been eye
opening and a challenge. And I'm15 years out from injury. And
I'm still learning new tips andtricks. So hopefully something
that we've experienced can helpsomeone out there that can
answer a question that you mayhave.
Lani Jennings-Hall (02:33):
Yes, thank you, Jen. I'm so glad to have
you on. I'm glad you pointed outyou haven't stopped traveling,
you traveled before injury andpost injury and you're still
finding new tips keep going.
We're also joined here today byMollie Hernandez. Mollie, do you
want to give us a little bitabout your background?
Mollie Hernandez (02:48):
Sure. My name is Mollie Hernandez, and I am
blind due to a degenerativeretinal condition. So I like
Jen, kind of a lifelongtraveler. But there were many
years when I was low vision asopposed to blind. And it's
sometimes wondering, okay, howdo I accommodate this? Is it
(03:08):
okay for me to ask foraccommodation? Am I disabled
enough situation and a lot oftimes having to kind of defend
my need for accommodations whentraveling because my disability
wasn't very visible for a while.
So there's that I also travelwith a seeing eye dog, Boomer.
So I have those experiences aswell traveling with my guide
dog. I'm a mom of two, andthey're teenagers now. They're
(03:33):
15 and 17. And they don'tremember me not being blind. So
I have traveled with smallchildren on it to teenagers as a
blind parent. So that kind ofadds another dynamic and level
of fun to the picture when wetravel. So yeah, Jen and I are
so excited to get to do thistopic for disability rights. And
I think we'd like to let ourbosses know that if they need
(03:55):
some more extensive researchinto this topic, we're all in
you know, we're happy to goanywhere to better inform our
listeners.
Lani Jennings-Hall (04:04):
Yeah, anything for work, right?
Anything to just to be serious.
Jen Goodwin (04:09):
Mollie and I traveled together. So we enter a
plane and a power wheelchair andwith a service animal and the
airline usually has no idea whatto do with us at that point.
Mollie Hernandez (04:17):
Yes, yes, we have shocked some airlines when
we come in mass on our worktrips.
Lani Jennings-Hall (04:23):
Let's start with air travel. So I know you
guys have both had some veryunique experiences. And Mollie,
you kind of hit on it a littlebit when you hit on your intro
about advocating for yourself.
Is this the same trip that youguys took together when you had
back to back experience or werethese separate ones?
Mollie Hernandez (04:39):
This was separate. I was actually flying
alone without a guide dog. Thiswas a few years past. In fact, I
believe I was traveling to bematched with my guide dog at the
time. And so I was travelingalone independently from
Arkansas to New Jersey and whenyou travel with a disability and
this is Something we can talkmore about, or maybe I'll
(05:01):
explain enough now, when youcheck in, you can explain that
you have a disability and thatyou need an escort to and from
the gate someone to assist youin navigating the airport. For
our layover, because we live inLittle Rock, very few things are
direct out of Little Rock. So Idid have a change over and I had
to wait for my connectingflight. I was waiting for the
(05:22):
person to come and assist me toget me from the gate that I was
exiting the plane from to mynext gate. And they did come and
pick me up. But my problem was,I just assumed everyone realized
that I was fine. And the personthat assisted me that it had a
wheelchair for me, which isfine, I don't mind because not
everyone is really good atguiding a blind person using
(05:44):
sighted guide, which is whereyou would walk from gate to
gate. So I was fine, I was happyto use the wheelchair. And when
we got to the final gate where Iwas supposed to get on my plane,
we were kind of out in thewaiting area, the person
assisting me said you need tostand up now. And I just thought
they meant okay, we're not goingto drag the wheelchair down the
tunnel, they're going to go parkit. So I stood up and kind of
(06:05):
turned around waiting to grabtheir arm so they could assist
me the rest of the way, thenthey were gone. I had not
properly educated them andadvocated for myself saying,
Hey, I'm a blind person, I'mgoing to need some physical
assistance all the way to theplane. They were just gone. And
I was just kind of there in noman's land. And of course, you
can imagine how noisy airportsare for me to even try and get
(06:27):
my bearings. It was afrightening few seconds very,
very long seconds before anotherpassenger can actually came up
and said, Are you blind? I justsaw what happened. Do you need
help? And of course, I was like,yes, please help me. And they
guided me all the way to theplane, they actually told the
flight attendant what happenedand the flight attendant was
(06:48):
very kind of came to me laterand was like, That's
unacceptable. And it was but Iwon't completely remove the
fault for myself for not havingproperly advocated. So when you
need an accommodation, be loudand proud about your disability,
let them know what you need,because you just can't assume
that the accommodation was thereand that it's going to meet your
(07:08):
needs.
And with those people that dohelp us from from gate to gate,
while this is not at allsomething you have to do if I
get someone who is just stellar,because keep in mind, I'm the
girl that was left, you know,alone. If I get someone who's
gone above and beyond, I alwayskeep a little cash in my pocket
to give just a small tip just tosay, hey, thanks this this, this
(07:31):
was a good experience. Sothey're just escorts that get
you where you need to go. Onemore thing that I forgot to say.
And this is kind of a littleknown fact, if I'm flying by
myself, of course, right when Icheck in, I can request an
escort. But if whoever is tighthas taken me to the airport,
most likely my husband, if theyhave time to wait with me, they
(07:53):
can get a gate pass. And theycan be the person to escort me
directly to my gate and thenhand me off at the plane to the
flight attendant. And again, youalways like to be in familiar
hands as long as you can.
Because I mean, no one knows mebetter than my husband on how
you know I like to, to beescorted or guided through
through an unfamiliar area. Soit's kind of a little known
(08:16):
fact, it's been, gosh, probablylike four years since I've done
that that's the last time Ithink I flew by myself. But it
was still a thing then. Soanyhow, it's nice to know.
Jen Goodwin (08:29):
So with flying as a motor user, Mollie mentioned
before about going throughsecurity. So for me whenever I
go through security obviouslycan't stand up and go through
the metal detectors. So I get afull on pat downs. So TSA and I
become very familiar with eachother. On that trip, they're
required to tell me exactly whatthey're going to do. Every
(08:50):
single time that they do it. Iknow their song and dance, but
they have to do it to check thatoff their list. So it's a full
pat down of both myself and mychair. They tried to get me to
also give them all of my luggageso that they can I don't know
why they hand dig through all ofmy luggage if I bring it through
with me. But usually I will justhand that to my family and let
(09:12):
them bring it through securityfor me so that it can just go
through the rollers just likeeverybody else's so that it's
not getting dug through rot outin the open with everyone. So I
recommend that and the otherthing is actually when I board
the plane so I take my powerchair down to the gate and onto
the ramp but I can't take itonto the plane with me so they
(09:36):
bring it's called an aisle chairbecause the aisles are only
about 20 inches long or widethere and so it looks like a
furniture dolly with a seat onit. So usually I let my family
lifts me over but they arerequired to have somebody that
can help you with that as wellif you're on transfer over to
the seat and so they lift me andput me over on the seat and then
(09:59):
there's straps like buckles thatcriss cross across my chest down
to my waist. And then they alsogo around my knees area to to
hold my legs where they'resupposed to be. And then they
literally just took me backwardsand we'll move on to the plane,
as if it's a furniture dolly.
With the priority seating, theyusually sit me on the front row
unless that's first class. Andthen they'll move me back to you
(10:22):
know, whatever class I paid for,and sit on the front row there
so that I had the bulkheadseating to be able to have extra
room as needed for the transferand all of that sort of stuff.
That was a fun experience. Justa fun. Funny thing that
happened to me at one point ifthey took me backwards, and they
were hitting my hips on everyarmrests down the aisle. And so
(10:45):
I asked the lady, I said, Oh,that hurts, you know, because
she kept hitting me. And shesaid, Yeah, your hips are a
little wide.
Well, thank you for that you'vemade a girl feel really good
today. Appreciate that. So. Andwhile I'm the first person on
the plane, I'm always the lastperson off of the plane. So it's
usually a long experience. But Iget to know the flight
(11:06):
attendants really well, they'reusually given extra snacks to my
kids and hanging out and we justhave a good time. So if you're
open minded and willing to bepleasant, and you'll get some
fun experiences with that. Andthen also I get a transport at
times, again, I travel with twokids. So my family is often busy
trying to get them navigated.
And if I don't have my powerchair at the gate, we have a
(11:28):
tight layover, then I will justtake one of the chairs from the
airport. And with those, they'renot self propelled, you have to
have someone push you. And sosometimes I've gotten people who
are just happy go lucky andcruising along, and my name is
being called overhead. And Itell them to step on it, they've
got hurry. And then other timesI have people who are like,
(11:49):
maybe coming through there, bulldozing people in the airport, so
it's always fun to see what kindof adventures it's gonna be.
Lani Jennings-Hall (11:58):
No, that's a great point. And I do want to
hit just a second on the AirCarrier Access Act. So I don't
know exactly what year, Jen doyou happen to know what your
that was introduced? By chance?
Jen Goodwin (12:09):
I don't.
Lani Jennings-Hall (12:10):
So it does state that all domestic and
international flights that havethe US as the destination or
origination point are requiredto provide necessary
accommodations to people withdisabilities to ensure safe
travel. Now, in saying that, notall planes have the same
accommodations, but you got toknow you got to know to advocate
for yourself. Not all air travelexperiences are bad as Mollie
(12:35):
hit, you just have to advocatefor yourself, but you need to be
aware ahead of time and havesome expectations.
Jen Goodwin (12:43):
Yes, I will be more than happy to share a couple of
stories that have happened to meover the years. So first of all,
I do want to back up, you know,Molly mentioned that you should
mention your disability and whatyour needs are whenever you get
to the gate. But I want to addthat it should actually start
before that. I actually justbooked flights for my family.
And I should also add, by theway that I travel with two small
(13:05):
children myself now. So I have atwo year old and a seven year
old. So that certainly adds anextra layer in there, we're
traveling. And again, they lookat me a little sideways. So
whenever I come through thegates, but that's okay, we
always make it work. Butwhenever I booked my travel,
there's a place to click abutton that allows you to open
up the accessible travelquestions. And one of the things
(13:28):
that it says is, are you aWheelchair user? And so I click
Yes on that. And then it opensup more questions. So it asked
if I'm going to need aisleassistance. And I'll explain
more about that in just asecond. And then ask if I'm
going to need to borrow a chairor if I'm bringing my own it ask
it's if it's a power chair or amanual chair, and then what kind
(13:49):
of batteries I use, because thatwill determine where they need
to be stored on the plane. Andif they have to be removed from
the plane or from the chairbefore flying. So those are some
of the big questions. I knowthat they do have questions on
there as far as if you are blindas well. And if you'll be
traveling with a service animal,so I just saw those last night.
So that is something that whenyou book your travel, you should
(14:11):
do that at that point. But don'tthink that it's just going to
get done. As Mollie said, Whenyou get to check in at the
airport, go ahead and make surethat they have all of your needs
out there. So there'll beprepared and then also, when I
get to the gate, I make surethat the gate agent knows
everything too, because I'vejust traveled enough to know
(14:32):
that this information gets lostin translation a lot and as many
people that I can talk to, theeasier my travel is going to be
for me and my family. So wealways try to do that to be
proactive every step of the way.
But we'll tell you what happenedwith the Air Carriers Access Act
at one point. Part of what theAir Carriers Access Act, the
ACAA says is that you can travelwith medical equipment for free,
(14:55):
and so I always have medicalsupplies that I have to have for
my disability to be able to liveand function whenever I go on
trips. And it's more than whatyour average person needs
whenever they go on a trip.
And so like, I might need ashower chair or something like
that, well, those things shouldtravel for free. And on this
(15:16):
particular trip actually calledahead of time through the
disability guest servicesthrough the particular airline
that I was traveling with justto follow their policy, I wanted
to make sure that I knew whattheir policy was, so that there
wouldn't be any hitches in theplan. So I got to the airport, I
had the law on my side, and Ihad their company policy on my
side. But I did not have a gateagent on my side. So the check
(15:40):
in person told me that I will becharged for those bags. So I
will tell you, one of thecaveats is in that bag, it can
only be medical equipment. Soyou can't pack your clothes,
can't pack your shoes, whateverelse in the same bag with your
medical supplies. So you'restill responsible for any of
those bag charges that might bethere. But any bag that is
strictly dedicated to medicalshould be able to fly for free
(16:03):
with you. And so I told themthat whenever I checked in
because I checked on the policy,I knew what my rights were. And
they still tried to charge mefor the bag. And so in Little
Rock, I stood at the gateforever waiting on the girl to
check me in our guests check inbooth to get checked in for my
flight. And she insisted oncalling management, she sat on
hold forever. And then finallyone of the guys that was
(16:25):
standing there was like, moveover. Because I looked at him
and I don't normally do this.
But I pulled out my disabilityattorneys card to let him know
that I probably didn't know whatthe law was. And I didn't want
to be a disability rightsattorney today, I wanted to be a
passenger on an airplane today.
But my hat goes with me whereverI go. So I will be whatever I
need to be today.
(16:47):
So, he saw that he told the girlto move aside, he was gonna get
me checked in on my plane, itwas gonna take care of my bags
for me. And she's like, No, no,I'll do it. And he said, No, you
missed your opportunity. I'mtaking care of this girl, and
she's going to be flying on herway. And so I really appreciated
that well on my flight home fromSacramento, I went through the
same ordeal telling them at thegate that you know, I needed to
(17:09):
be able to carry my medical baghome. And that girl stopped and
told me no. I told her whattheir policy was told her what
the law was she called hermanager over. And the quote from
the manager that day was, "well,when they know the law, we have
to follow it." And I justlaughed when she said, because
that summed up so much that'swrong in this country. And so it
(17:31):
was really, it was just funny tome at that point. So that goes
to tell you that know yourrights, know the law before you
travel.
Lani Jennings-Hall (17:40):
And pushing back too, because it wasn't like
your first and second attempt,you just had to keep advocating
and keep pushing for it.
Jen Goodwin (17:48):
Yes. And just because we know our rights and
the laws does not mean that theemployees there do, though they
should.
Lani Jennings-Hall (17:55):
DOT statistics from 2021 reported,
This is a huge number, 33,631disability related complaints,
and over half of thosecomplaints reported related to
failure to provide adequateassistance to travelers using a
wheelchair.
Jen Goodwin (18:12):
Wow.
Lani Jennings-Hall (18:14):
I mean, that's just,that's ridiculous.
There are some perks though, youguys have talked about the pre
boarding you are first on somake sure as as she had
mentioned when you are gettingyour tickets, and everything
that you do correctly fill thatout so that you can board
correctly. That it will beimportant.
Jen Goodwin (18:36):
So when I go to board, I make sure this one I
tell them actually at the gatethat I will need pre boarding.
And so sometimes it makes othertravelers a little mad if
they've paid to be first on theplane or whatever. But I'm
usually the very first personand everyone in my party comes
with me, too, because I needtheir help I need their
assistance. And my two smallchildren need to be sitting with
(18:59):
me, they can't be separated fromme on the plane. And so that
process is pretty involved aswell. I always take my power
chair to the gate if I'm flyingwith a power chair instead of a
manual. And usually I asked tospeak to the person who's going
to be transporting my chair,because this is a $20,000
wheelchair that weighs 400pounds. And I need it to work
(19:22):
for me whenever I get towherever I'm going. So I want to
talk to as many people aspossible to make sure that they
know how to handle this chairappropriately and laying it on
its side or picking it up by itsseating base is not the way to
handle it because it's beenbroken probably six times by the
airlines in the times that I'veflown and usually it's the tilt
on it that gets broken andthat's something that I really
(19:45):
need. I use it in and out allday every day for pressure
relief and positioning in mychair. So I end up stuck on a
vacation or work trip orwhatever without a function that
I really need because they don'tget fixed that quickly either.
So I always also I have a sheetthat I've typed up that has my
name and phone number on it. Andit has specific instructions for
(20:06):
how to turn the chair on how toput it in a manual mode. And
then I'll also tell them how torecline the seat back so that it
will fit under the plane withouthaving to be flipped on its
side. And so I usually do it ona bright neon yellow piece of
paper and have it rubber bandedin a large gallon sized plastic
baggie so that it's not going toget wet. So I'm gonna get
(20:27):
damaged. And it's going to beseen plus I talked to the first
guy who's going to be taking itand actually putting it on. And
usually I feel like when theymeet me, and they have a person
in mind, for who that chairbelongs to, they're going to be
more likely to handle itappropriately. But on the other
side of the landing, it's goingto be different people. So they
don't have that luxury. That'swhy they have a note that tells
(20:49):
them exactly what to do. Andthey're the ones that have to
give me the bad news when theydamage it. So hopefully, they're
pretty careful with it as well.
And honestly, since I've beendoing that it has really cut
down on the number of times thatmy chair has been damaged. But I
also always watch out thewindow. And I've gotten to see
how it's handled on numerousoccasions. And it is
dumbfounding. Sometimes, likewell, there goes my tilt as the
(21:11):
band flipped on its side and putup a conveyor belt. So good
times. But one more fun storythat I have to share is I was on
a plane, we were taxiing downthe runway, and overhead comes
the pilot who tells us that weare going back for an important
piece of equipment that has beenleft behind. And I jokingly said
(21:34):
to my family, Oh, I wonder ifthey forgot my chair. And the
flight attendant said, Yep, it'syour chair. Set me back to the
insurance to get my chair andhave it loaded on. I'm just so
glad that we weren't in the airwhen that happened. Because if I
got to the other side with nochair and landing, that would
(21:56):
have been a nightmare. But I'malso proud that the pilot
recognizes the importance ofthat and was willing to taxi
back and get my legs essentiallyfor me to bring in that plane.
Lani Jennings-Hall (22:09):
Question If they hadn't had caught it. And
like if you had been in the air,like are they supposed to do
something to provide you someform of wheelchair?
Jen Goodwin (22:21):
So what has happened in the past whenever
they've broken my chair, and Iassume that it would be the same
if they just completelymisplaced or forgot it would be
that they would call a rentalcompany and have them come to
the airport and bring anincomparable power chair there
for me to use. But depending onwhere you are and what time you
get in, that's going todetermine if those things were
(22:42):
available. So I honestly justhope and pray that that never
happens. Because even when I'veborrowed chairs, places, it's
like driving someone else's carthat it takes a little bit to
get used to a different chair.
And so it's always you know,learning curve for sure.
Lani Jennings-Hall (22:59):
Oh, yeah, absolutely. Mollie, I want to
pass over to you as well.
Because I know you've takenBoomer you're seeing eye dog on
trips with do you want to talk alittle bit about service animals
in the airport?
Jen Goodwin (23:11):
Absolutely. So according to the air carrier
access act, dogs are the onlyanimals that are considered
service animals and the airportor the airline can require a
couple of different forms fromyou. And like Jen said, when you
are booking your flight, you canand should inform them that you
are bringing a dog, there aretwo different forms and there
(23:32):
are samples that you can seeonline and then of course, you
can actually access the actualforms to have them. One is just
to certify that your dog isvaccinated, it is trained that
it does not have a tendency foraggression, and that you do will
keep your dog under your controlat all times that it will be
attached to a leash or a tetherat all times. The second form is
(23:56):
another one it's a littledifferent and it's kind of where
you attests that your dog can golong periods of time without
needing to relieve themselvesthat they wouldn't be prone to
an accident on an airline.
However, they're animals, youknow, accidents can happen and I
do advise take a little doggieemergency kit have some Clorox
wipes and some paper towels, youknow anything that you might
(24:17):
need. Most airports these daysdo have doggie relief areas
within the secured area so thatyou don't actually have to go
back out of the airport to findphysical green space. And in
truth, most of these dogs can govery long periods of times if
necessary without having torelieve themselves and we do
(24:37):
take steps to reduce food reducewater a little bit, kind of like
we do as people you know toavoid having to go too much. So
there are steps to take otherthings with traveling with a
guide dog. When you have anescort through the airport, you
do need to alert them to thingslike you want to use elevators
(24:57):
even if they're Are escalatorsor moving walkways available,
those can risk your dogs toes,we have trained to do those
things when necessary with ourdogs, if there are alternatives,
use the alternatives, it'sbetter. Let's talk a little bit
about going through security.
What I tell everyone is when Iget rushed is when I'm most
(25:19):
likely to get hurt, I'm gonnaget distracted from the signals
that Boomer is trying to give meon navigating security, it just
always feels very, very rushed,and not so much by the TSA
personnel, but just by the othertravelers. So it's another time
to fully advocate for yourselfwith a guide dog, and it's never
(25:40):
appropriate for them to say, Letme hold your dog and you go
through, you know, what I do is,I changed my dog's leash up to a
long leash, which gives me aboutthree feet to work with, I'll
make him sit. And I'll just holdthe leash while I've walked
through the metal detector. Andthen I'll call him to me holding
the leash. So typically, there'sa TSA agent at the other end of
(26:04):
the metal detector to kind ofdirect me because I'm not
working the dog at that time,I'm just heeling him, you know,
helping, you know, just hangingon to them as we go through
these things. And then whatthey'll do is after Boomer comes
through, they'll do kind of aphysical pat down of him just
kind of checking his harness andthings, making sure that there's
(26:24):
nothing hidden underneath thisharness. So it's one of those
things, again, advocate foryourself, most of the personnel
is really, really good. And Ialways feel like they're
actually excited to get a momentto interact with the dog up
close and personal. It depends,you know, I always offer do you
need the harness off, I can takethe harness off, you know, we've
got that down to an art, it onlytakes a few seconds, but there
(26:47):
are people with some somemobility issues, and it might be
a bigger deal. So share them,you know, it's okay to touch my
dog, it's fine. And that's kindof how you get through security.
But again, just don't get in ahurry, always let people know,
this, this is your time, youknow, you've got a system,
don't, don't let them mess withyour system. So I'll come
through first, then I'll bringmy dog or however you were
(27:08):
trained at your own school. Thenwhen we do get to our gate, and
it's time to board, I do preboard for people that need
assistance. So once we get in atdo take the dogs harness off
boomers, a big dog, he's almost80 pounds, and he's just a big
lanky guy. So I take his harnessoff to make sure that he's
(27:29):
comfortable. And then I sit himdown, facing me, and then make
him lay down and then I'll kindof push his little bottom up
underneath the seat in front ofme where other people might
still a carry on bag. That'swhere Boomer goes. And I always
let their flight attendant knowto kind of be careful with the
harness. I mean, they're they'refairly durable. But if someone's
(27:51):
doing heavy baggage on top andstuff like Jen, if if something
happened to that harness anddon't have a way to communicate
with my dog, air communicationgoes through that harness handle
that pull that I get from him.
So if that harness is broken,that's a problem. So I always
try and make people aware, youknow, please make sure that the
harness is stored safely. I keepa few things for Boomer on the
(28:11):
plane with me. They they feelthe pressure changes just like
we do in our ears. If I noticedhim starting to do that head
shake, like you would think adog would do with an ear
infection or something. I givethem a couple of dog cookies or
something just to you know, helpthem swallow and pop those ears.
When the flight attendants comeby and offer drinks, they
usually get a cup of ice for thedog or save some of mine so that
(28:33):
he has a little something to wethis mouth. He can't really
drink, but just something forhim to chomp on that most times.
In fact, truly, every timeBoomer just sleeps the whole way
he's very, very well behaved. Heis attached to me at all times.
So yes, I've put the harnessaway but he is always on leash
the dog always needs to be undermy control. Flight Attendants
(28:56):
dote on him. So I know as muchas we say what goes wrong. There
are so many people that are veryhelpful and very knowledgeable.
So in fact, I actually one of myguide dogs. We didn't realize at
the time that he was he wascoming down with with an illness
called Addison's disease but hegot sick on a plane through and
(29:17):
the flight attendant was lovelyshe was like it's no big deal it
happened right at the end of theflight she was like we have a
cleaning crew Don't Don't worryabout it at all. I mean, I was
it's that mom instinct it waslike oh my gosh look what my kid
did but you know it's a dog andthey were so sweet. So no matter
how you prepare things may gosideways but it's it's alright
(29:38):
you know, if you start stressingwhile you travel that transfers
to your service animals so sokeep it cool make it enjoyable
because don't remember that forsubsequent trips have been
Boomer gets excited when wetravel and he gets excited when
he sees the suitcases come outin the house. So just remember
your your stress and anxietydoes transfer. So, you know,
(30:00):
it's, it's not always a funthing to travel, especially that
airline because a lot of stuffis out of your control. But it's
something that we all need to dojust to be a part of our
community. It's important.
Lani Jennings-Hall (30:14):
You had mentioned that sometimes you
bring in a little emergency bagfor Boomer, oryou kind of
suggested it? Is that one of thetypes of bags that would fly
free or is it only medicalequipment.
Jen Goodwin (30:25):
So his harness, things like that would qualify
as medical equipment, I've neverreally had to push it that much.
But to my understanding if Iwanted to bring a small carry on
that included his dog food forthe trip, and feeding bowls,
things like that, that wouldqualify for my little emergency
pack that I keep it's justsomething small in a ziplock
(30:47):
that I throw in a backpack. Butif I needed to be gone an
extended amount of time, I thinkit's arguable. I haven't
actually checked what the AirCarrier Access Act says or the
airline's policy on it. But Icertainly think it's arguable I
have been known to go over mywhatever it is 40 pound 50 pound
limit with baggage and sweettalk that check in person and
(31:10):
say okay, I'm really sorry. Butthere's dog food in there.
That's sure it's the dog foodthat made me go over and you
know, they're kind. So becausedog food is heavy, but usually
it's my return trip andsouvenirs that make me go over.
But also a dog crate somethinglike that would be counted as
medical equipment for a serviceanimal.
Mollie Hernandez (31:32):
Absolutely.
Yes.
Lani Jennings-Hall (31:34):
I know I've specifically heard about your
your trips to Disney withBoomer. Do you just want to
maybe give a final anecdoteabout some fun travel with
Boomer.
Jen Goodwin (31:44):
Boomer has made his maiden voyage to Disney during
the pandemic in fact, and ashout out to Disney for their
accessibility, especially forthe blind and your dog gets into
the park. There are even certainrides that you can take with
your dog, you do need an AccessPass and ease of access, which
makes it a little easier toboard and get off of certain
(32:07):
rides. There's that's for someof the rides that are a little
scarier than it wouldn't beappropriate to make a dog ride.
You can do what's called a riderswap, which means I would hold
my dog and part of my partywould take the ride and then
they would come out hold my dogand then I would ride with other
people in my party or my kidslike it when there's not a lot
(32:28):
of crowds. And basically theyget to run twice in a row. If we
do right or slop. There's alsooptions where you can leave your
service animal in a crate rightthere where you would get on the
ride. And that has worked outwell for me to just putting him
in the crate just for theduration of the rides. There's
always an attendant theretalking with him keeping him
company, they have some dogcookies, they ask if it's okay
(32:50):
to give. So those things gogreat at Disney. Just make sure
to get that access pass. I cantell you on one of my very first
trips to Disney taking my firstguide dog we were going through
and my kids were little we hadthat big double stroller that
you could rent at Disney at thetime. And my son was four and we
(33:11):
were walking through the crowdand I had my guide dog. My
husband had the stroller. And aswe met someone, this lady looked
at my dog and she was like, ohmy goodness, what a beautiful
service animal. My son, heturned around and he said that
is not a circus animal. He's aseeing eye dog. So he had never
heard service animal before andthought it was a circus animal.
(33:34):
He made sure to educate so ourhousehold Even my kids know how
to advocate for the guide dog.
Lani Jennings-Hall (33:39):
That's fantastic. Thank you Jen and
Mollie, and thank you listeners.
Now as you can tell there's somuch to cover when talking about
traveling, make sure to tuneinto our next episode. The
second part of this conversationas we talk about booking hotels,
Airbnb's, tackling beach andmuch more. You don't want to
miss it.
(33:59):
At Disability Rights Arkansas,we envision an Arkansas where
people with disabilities areequal members in their
communities and can dictacttheir lives through self
determination. And as made clearin this podcast, we can't create
that change without bringingself advocates to the table. If
you're interested in moreinformation, make sure to
subscribe to this podcast andvisit our website. And don't
forget to leave a five starrating and a review
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