February 29, 2024 • 42 mins
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In our latest episode of "Living Reconciled," Brian Crawford, Austin Hoyle, and Neddie Winters, delve into the profound connections between Black History and the Christian call to reconciliation. Throughout our discussion, we underscore the year-round significance of Black History, reflecting on the foundational work of Dr. Carter G. Woodson, who initiated Negro History Week, and the enduring contributions of Black Americans to our society and culture.
We share our thoughts on the critical role that Black History plays in the Christian narrative, emphasizing its importance in understanding our past, informing our present, and shaping our future. Our dialogue brings to light the ways in which Black History Month acts as a lens through which we can view the broader American story, highlighting the achievements, struggles, and resilience of Black individuals and communities.
In our conversation, we also reference the poignant words of Langston Hughes in his poem "I, Too, Sing America," which resonates with the themes of recognition, dignity, and belonging. Hughes' words echo the sentiments that we explore throughout our discussion, reinforcing the idea that Black history is an integral part of the American fabric.
I, too, sing America.
I am the darker brother.
They send me to eat in the kitchen
When company comes,
But I laugh,
And eat well,
And grow strong.
Tomorrow,
I’ll be at the table
When company comes.
Nobody’ll dare
Say to me,
“Eat in the kitchen,”
Then.
Besides,
They’ll see how beautiful I am
And be ashamed—
I, too, am America.
Special thanks to our sponsors:
Nissan, St. Dominic's Hospital, Atmos Energy, Regions Foundation, Brown Missionary Baptist Church, Christian Life Church, Ms. Doris Powell, Mr. Robert Ward, and Ms. Ann Winters
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
This is Living Reconciled, a podcast dedicated
to giving our communitiespractical evidence of the gospel
message by helping Christianslearn how to live in the
reconciliation that Jesus hasalready secured for us by living
with grace across racial lines.
Hey, thanks so much for joiningus on this episode of Living
(00:38):
Reconciled, episode 43.
I am your host, brian Crawford,with my incredible friends,
prodigious friends, stupendousfriends, austin Hoyle, nettie
Winters indistensible friends.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
I like incredible.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Have I said that before.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Have I said I like incredible before.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Because my wife calls me Mr Incredible.
Mr Incredible, have I said thatbefore?
We've heard that before.
Oh, you've heard that before.
Never mind, we've heard thatbefore, that is not new man.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
Why do you keep bringing it up?
Because my wife we're not goingto call you Mr Incredible and
we still have not validated that.
So we need to talk to your wifebest and find out if that's
true, we need to talk to herbest.
That's true, man.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Special thanks to our sponsors, nissan, st George's
and the rest of the world.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Thank you so much for joining us.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Thank you so much for joining us.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
Oh, my God, we have notvalidated that.
We need to talk to your wifebest and find out if that's true
man.
Special thanks to our sponsorsNissan, st Dominick's Hospital
at Miss Energy RegentsFoundation, brown Missionary
Baptist Church, christian LifeChurch, miss Doris Powell, mr
Robert Ward, miss Ann Winners.
Thank you, guys, so much forwhat you do.
It's because of what you do toMission Mississippi is able to
do what we do and what we aredoing today.
Gentlemen, prodigious friends,we're spending some time talking
about Black history, are on theend of Black History Month, but
(01:47):
I thought it would be suitableto talk about not just simply
why Black History Month, but whyBlack History in general,
because this is something thatshould be discussed not just in
an isolated month in the year,but throughout the year.
Well.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
I'm excited we get 29 days to the 28 days to talk
about it.
Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
Isn't it great?
It's great and I think weshould continue to talk about it
.
So I want to talk a little bitabout Black History and Black
History Month.
Black History Month wasactually Negro History Week for
50 years, started in 1926,february, in light of Abraham
Lincoln and Frederick Douglass'birthday, dr Carter G Woodson
(02:32):
started Negro History Week.
He saw it as an opportunity tohighlight all of the great
achievements post emancipationfor Black Americans and actually
pre and post emancipation.
But he also saw it as anopportunity to bring to the
attention of the majorityculture, the white audience or
(02:53):
the white citizens of America,that Black folks had dignity,
black folks had value, blackfolks had knowledge and
ingenuity and wisdom as well toshare with this country.
And so Negro History Month wassomething that Dr Carter G
Woodson would host along withhis colleagues every single year
(03:15):
.
It went on for 50 years, until1976, where it was recognized as
Black History Month, and atthat time it began to be
recognized as a national youknow you know JRFO or the
president, Absolutely, andthat's well, not absolutely.
It's not like I was there.
I'm talking like I was there,but yes, I personally remember
(03:36):
that right.
No, I do know that JRFO was thefirst to actually acknowledge.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Black History Month, he proclaimed it or whatever,
but I was actually there, yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
That's right, I was there.
Yeah, I was actually there.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
I was two years, shocked.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
I was two years shocked.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
And so I want to talk about this idea of Black
History Month, I want to talkabout its significance and I
want to talk about why BlackHistory Month.
I have a question.
Yes, sir, you know.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
Carter G.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Carter G Woodson.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Woodson started this to recognize, you said,
achievements and accomplishmentsof Black folks.
It had amazed me that when youthink about George Washington
Carver, when you think about theguy that invented the elevator,
the ironing board, streetlights laid out in Washington DC
(04:34):
, how could they miss that?
That's just in my mind.
How did it just amaze me thatwe had to have a particular
month, a week, whatever, torecognize Black folks as it
relates to their history, andpeople would not.
(04:55):
Well, I guess it's likeeverything else, they did
recognize it, but this made theawareness and I guess, more
intense of the people and calledthe conscience of what was
going on, and it wasn't justthink about it, it wasn't just
for white people to recognizethe achievements.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
Part of the reason that Dr Carter G Woodson was so
inspired to start, I believe,the Journal of Negro History, I
think they called it was becausehe went to an event 1915 in
Chicago and it was an exhibit,so to speak, of all of these
black achievements and in thatexhibit thousands of
African-Americans became soinspired.
(05:39):
Well, carter G Woodson becamewas one of those
African-Americans that was soinspired.
He said, hey, we need tocontinue to tell these stories
because there's so much herethat I did not know about myself
.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
I still don't know all the.
You know, I read the book, thehistory.
I got several sheets that Ireview every year and I'm just
amazed at all the things.
I got a legal size sheet,several of them, several pages
with legal size sheets and it'slisted on bullet points of what
black Americans have achieved interms of patents and inventions
(06:13):
and things like that.
And I'm thinking, man, I owethis to a black guy.
Speaker 3 (06:17):
Wow, wow, wow Austin he's about to say something.
Yeah, and think about it.
There's so much to recover interms of black history because
for so long, methodologicallyand even the universities, it
was all done from the majorityperspective, really just until
recently, just in the pastprobably 50 years.
(06:38):
So you have a lot of recoveryof the history that needs to be
done as well.
So there really is.
You are more likely to recoverand to find new things within
the history of black historythan probably the history of
white history in America, justfor example, simply because the
(07:01):
tools for that type of discoveryhad not been allowed, as much
hasn't been as proliferated, soto speak, across the black
community as it has been justthrough history.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
And it's not just the recovery, which is incredibly
important I appreciate youhighlighting that but it's also
the engrafting of all of thishistory into the wider history,
exactly.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
Oh yes, integration.
Well, I mean integration.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
Yeah, I mean, we talked about yeah, the most
recent talks we've had aboutblack history and these
different locations this month,we've called it, we've called
the talks.
Black history is our history,the indispensability of our
history, the collective Americanstory.
Black history is a part of thatcollective American story and
weaving that into the fabric ofthe American story is just as
(07:53):
important as the recovery right.
Speaker 3 (07:54):
Oh, exactly, exactly, Making sure that it happens.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
You know and Austin made me think that is that it's
like all of you great economistshave been hidden in a bold.
Maybe it's at the part of theend of the rainbow.
No, it couldn't be there,because the rainbow was round,
so there ain't no end to it.
So it's like that was a.
For me, black history month waslike a gold rush, the more it
(08:22):
was highlighted about what blackfolks had accomplished.
It was like man, I can dreambeyond playing music.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
I ain't even dry the tractor, but before we got on
the podcast recording today, youwere talking about your dream
At one point in time was plowingme Right, plowing me.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
Listen, here's how that story works out Ted, my
brother Doris, my sister Emma,my sister and myself we went to
field chopping cotton and BigJunior, which my older brother
named after.
We called him Big Juniorbecause he's Evan Jr.
I got a cousin named Lil Junior, so anyway he was Big Junior.
I don't know how that.
(09:07):
Don't ask me about that Lil andBig Junior thing.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Big, junior and Little.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Junior and Lil Junior was in a fight one day and the
person that was fighting LilJunior thought Big Junior would
come to rescue him.
He popped Big Junior and almostknocked us out.
He had to wear a patch of hiseye for and had surgery on his
so you know, you ask me stories,man, I got them right.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
What's about to say?
We were asking about a storyplowing with mules and somehow
we got to Big Junior and LittleJunior and fistacuffs, but
anyway, but anyway stikuffs.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
So here's go, Big Junior.
He's flying and he'll plow allthe cognate.
We have right.
He put the mules in the bun,put the plop shed in the bun,
move in the pasture and put theplow in the bun.
Goes to the house, take a bag,put on his starch nine blue,
jean white t-shirt, hang a chip,hang it out of the bag and I
(09:58):
see him hitching a ride to town.
So he gets off the rest of theweek.
Maybe in a week or so he'llstart back plowing again.
Oh, wow.
But we get off early onSaturday.
You know what early on Saturdaymeant, instead of leaving the
field and going to the gardenand working, and we leave the
field and go directly home.
Wow, that's getting off early,wow.
(10:19):
So it gets too dark to work inthe field.
So you go closer to where thegarden is in the light and on
Saturday we get to go.
Just go straight home.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
That's getting off early.
That's getting off early.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
So would you have that dream?
That's a day off, listen.
Would you have that dream?
You know you're gonna work sixdays, right, right, right.
You know in the field.
And so you aspire, right, youaspire to get to plowing with
the mule so I can get off onWednesday, thursday and Friday,
maybe Monday, tuesday the nextweek, and then I'll plow it over
Wow, and so Black Historyexpands the horizon, so to speak
(10:56):
.
Yeah, they gave me dreams ofgoing to school and getting
education, a whole deal in termsof that yeah, yes.
I told you about the inspirationI had when Austin was talking
about his inspiration fromLangston Hughes.
My inspiration was to see mysister perform the creation by
Langston Hughes Right byLangston, and, as she done, the
(11:18):
creation.
It not only talked about thecreation that is self-invited,
but it also talks about whatthat instilled in us that we'd
be able to achieve Right right,and just so y'all know, I
haven't actually quoted LangstonHughes yet.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Nettie just knows I have it in my heart to do so.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Talk about Langston Hughes as we talk about Black
History.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
All right.
Well, I came across this poem.
It's called I Too Sing America.
I love this poem because whatit does, it really kind of
underscores the necessity forBlack History Months.
It reminds us about this kindof this reflection of the
struggle for not justrecognition but also to have
that capacity to be inspired togo after a mule Seeing what
(12:02):
other people who are like youlook like.
You had a similar kind ofhistory, similar context towards
they grew up, what they werelike.
So I really like how this poemencapsulates this.
So it says I too sing America.
It says I am the darker brother.
They send me to eat in thekitchen when company comes.
(12:24):
But I laugh and eat well andgrow strong.
And this is where remember,this is like 1920s, 1930s,
harlem to this New York city.
And he's saying tomorrow I'llbe at the table when company
comes.
Nobody will dare say to me eatin the kitchen then.
(12:45):
Besides, they'll see howbeautiful I am and be ashamed, I
too in America.
So this really does show thenecessity to have that time to
remember black history.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
It's Carter G Wood, since Dr Wood, since dream is
the same dream that LangstonHughes has, which is that I'll
be seen on the same level andwelcomed to the table as equal.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
You see how beautiful .
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Absolutely.
You'll see my dignity, you'llsee my value, you'll see my
worth.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
It's the same dream.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
It's the same dream.
That's incredible.
You know, besides inspiringright, there's a lot of reasons
why black history is importantshowing that it's a part of our
collective history and it'sindispensable, and because it's
our collective history, and alsoinspiring us like it inspired a
(13:43):
young, young netty winners ashe was planning his mule plowing
, and then he looked up and herealized that there were greater
dreams for netty winners toachieve.
But also also it gives usclarity about the present.
It gives us understanding aboutthe present.
You know, there are times inwhich only history can give us
(14:06):
reasons for why things are theway they are.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Absolutely, there's no way around it.
You got to know your history,not only that you would not
repeat it, but also to know howyou got to where you are and how
they worked out and why allthat.
All the six detective questionscan be worked out in black
history in terms ofunderstanding and appreciating
(14:29):
why things are the way they are.
You remember when we said BillHaven we were talking about the
civil rights movements and otherthings and one of the students
just outbursts go, oh, that'swhy it was like that.
Absolutely.
At that point, he's like whatis the big deal?
And then, at that point that hegot some clarity on how we got
(14:49):
to where we are, what happenedto make it this way and how
things were.
All of a sudden, this lightgoes on and now he's like man,
I'm tracking, now I'm clicking.
You know I'm with this, I gotit.
I appreciate it.
I think black history servesthose.
What do you call those momentslike that, all those aha moments
(15:10):
, those like moments?
Yeah, and I'm thinking tomyself now he went aha, but the
whole room with biz is writing,the other 26 or so students with
busy writing notes and they arehow mom, and they didn't
outburst aha, but they outburstwith their pen Like I'm making a
note of this because this isimportant and not because it's
going to be on a test, cause,you know, they just it was like
(15:33):
okay, that makes sense now to me, absolutely, absolutely you.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
9 11 2001.
That date lives, of course, inour collective conscience.
As Americans, we oftentimeshear the words associated with
that date Never forget, neverforget.
We are.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
We are told 9 11 2001 .
Speaker 1 (15:56):
We are told to remember and reflect and never
forget it, and one of the August2011, august 2011.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
And that Katrina.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
August 2005.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Okay, all right.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Let he forget.
Let he forget no.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
I didn't, no, I didn't forget.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
August 2011 was a tough year too, man.
Yeah, yeah, thank y'all.
Speaker 1 (16:21):
I don't know what happened but it was tough, it
was tough, it was tough, it wasleading up to 9 11.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
It was leading up to 9 11.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
But prerequisite but no, no, no, no, 9 11 2001.
Right and never forget.
And never forgetting helps us.
When I go to the airport andthey tell me to take my shoes
off, take my belt off, they tellme, hey, my lotion can only be
in containers three ounces.
They tell me, hey, if youbrought bottled water to this
check in station, you're goingto have to throw that bottle of
(16:50):
water away.
And when I want to get agitatedand aggravated and think about
why am I doing all of thisnonsense?
Just won't ride on the plane.
No, I'm reminded of 9, 11.
I thought there was a lot ofpeople who were like oh, I'm
reminded of 9, 11.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
I thought they're going to kick you off.
You get agitated.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
No, no, I'm reminded of 9, 11.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
And I'm reminded that four planes were hijacked.
For commercial planes werehijacked.
Three of them crashed intotargets.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
Now I'm stripping all the way to the bar man.
Whatever y'all need to do,Absolutely Exactly.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
And that history.
If you lose sight of thathistory, then you will easily
lose sight of why we do thethings that we do.
And eventually you'll say wedon't need to do them anymore.
It's interesting because evenbiblically, you can argue that
that's the reasons for thefestivals, because God is
constantly calling back, callingIsrael back to their exes.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
And I know exactly Remember remember remember.
Yeah, okay, you remember whereyou were 9, 11.
I do.
Speaker 1 (17:47):
Yes, yes, I remember, I remember almost yeah, I was.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
I was with Bill Bonham, bill Bonham Hope Credit
Union.
He and I went visit a guy namedBarnes about investing in the
credit union up in Madison, upthere where the uh C-spot
building in that area before heended up was developed.
That's where we were, wow,visiting, and on the way back we
listened to the radio and toldus what happened.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
I was on the campus of Mississippi State University
and on the campus of MississippiState University passing
through the library to class.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
That was before you met Candice after.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
That was before, that was before me and Candy started
.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
BC, bc, bc.
Before Candy, yeah, beforeCandy.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
I'm passing.
I'm passing through the libraryand I'm trying to figure out.
Why is everyone, all you know,huddled around the TV screens?
And that's why they werehuddled around the TV screens,
because they were watching umthe devastation.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Yeah, they were watching that playing.
They were playing in a good,good time.
You know they repeated thatover and over again watch that
playing.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
I remember man, I was , uh, I was driving in from
school or to school and I was.
It was a chemistry class.
I think it was 10th grade 2011.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
Yeah, 10th.
Speaker 3 (18:56):
No, junior year, junior software, junior year.
I forgot which one Um and uh.
And I was, I remember, you know, almost walking into my class
thinking, man, I'm 10 minuteslate.
But luckily, when I walked inthe teacher didn't even notice
and just had me watch TV and Iwas just like, oh I, I.
At first I was just like, ohgood, I'm not going to have to,
(19:16):
I'm not going to get in troublefor being late.
Right and then I was like oh,okay, that's, that's not really
that's not really good.
Yeah, I would prefer to havegotten in trouble being late.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Yeah, 이죠 checking out his new school uniform.
Living reconciled is the workof Mission Mississippi, but it
is not our only work.
From days of dialogue andprayer meetings to consultation
for schools, businesses andchurches, mission Mississippi is
eager to help you, your team,your church and your community
live reconciled Every month.
(19:47):
Join us for our weekly prayerbreakfasts on Tuesdays and
Thursdays at 6.45 am, ourbi-weekly statewide connection
meetings on Fridays at 10 am anda focused time of prayer on the
third Thursday of the month at7 am.
To get details on any of ourupcoming events or to learn how
you can invite us to your church, business or school, visit our
(20:08):
website at MissionMississippiorgand click on the events button
or call us at 601-353-6477.
We gain understanding when welook back for why we do the
things that we do and why thethings that are, why they are
the way they are.
For example, people argue aboutHBCUs and they say, hey, why do
(20:35):
we need two schools?
What's the purpose of anall-corn?
What's the purpose of a JacksonState?
Well, if you understand yourpast, you understand that
roughly 60 years ago, somewherearound 1962, there was a man by
the name of James Meredith whowas walking on the campus of
University of Mississippi.
He was not walking on thecampus to a friendly welcome.
He had to be escorted on tothat campus with US Marshals.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
Without those Marshals he would not have been
on that campus.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
Without those Marshals he would not have been
on that campus Not alive anyway.
Even beyond that.
1968, the same thing, or not tothat degree, but a similar
thing happened on the campus ofMississippi State University, my
own alma mater, in 1968, it'sbeen shared that some of those
(21:23):
Black students, the handful ofBlack students that went to
Mississippi State in 1968, someof them reflect on the one-seat
rule.
That was unwritten but was apart of their experience where
in the classes that they wouldgo to, one seat to the south,
the north, the east and the westof them was to remain empty.
(21:47):
Students didn't want to sit in,students didn't want to be near
them.
They had to literally keep oneseat of separation on the left,
right, front and back.
That was just an unspoken andunwritten rule.
That was some of theexperiences that they had.
Until you understand, or ratheruntil you see and reflect on
that history, then, yeah sure,an Alcorn State University might
(22:11):
not make sense to you, orJackson State University might
not make sense to you.
When you reflect on that, oh,now I see the reason for Russ
College, atougaloo College, aMississippi Valley, all of those
things make sense, and so weneed understanding.
We also need wisdom.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Yeah, had it not been for understanding.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
No, no, let's say it went understanding, Go ahead.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
Had it not been for Alcorn or Valley or Jackson
State, I would have had nooptions for going to school
Right, because during the timeMerritt was trying to get on the
campus, I was graduating.
I was getting on through things, and as I dreamed about going
(22:55):
to school, I couldn't dreamabout going to Mississippi State
Right.
Speaker 3 (23:01):
Ole Miss University of.
Speaker 2 (23:02):
Mississippi.
I couldn't do a whole lot ofdreaming about going to Alcorn
because my parents was not ableto send me.
But just thinking about goingbeyond one of the HBCUs was way
beyond my company to understandit, because I had to go there
and do work aid and work studyor whatever it is that they had
to offer me on limitedscholarships or work aid.
(23:25):
That was my option to go toschool and there was no way I
could have obtained that.
I couldn't even get enteredinto the university number one,
but if I did, I still wouldn'tget the finances I needed to do
that.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
That was not an option.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
Right, that was not an option.
So people need to understandthat we have like history month,
we have HBCUs because ofhistory.
We have black churches becauseAbsolutely I know you're going
to want to get to that, but wehave black churches because
white churches said no,absolutely, and if you're going
to come, you better come throughthe basement, absolutely,
(24:01):
absolutely.
And you better not get too loudin the basement or you're going
to put you out of the basementand some of that crazy stuff
goes on.
Today you got Asians andChinese folks meeting in the
basement of churches becausethey can't meet up stills in the
main sanctuary, and the thingthat I don't understand is that
nobody's in the sanctuary duringthe time you allowed them to
(24:23):
come, because certainly you'renot going to let them meet at
the same time.
You're, a major denominationgroup is meeting.
So since the sanctuary is empty, why are they still meeting in
the basement?
Why can't they just meet in thesanctuary?
I don't understand why it gotto be two separate services to
begin with.
But, more importantly, you havetwo separate services at two
separate times so that one orbump into the other coming and
(24:46):
going in the building, but youcan't even use the same seating
Right God's house man.
So appreciation for what allhas gone on in the past to get
us to the point of understandingthat, even though Carter G
(25:07):
Woodson was a Harvard graduatethink about it this is in what?
1920 something.
He's a graduate of Harvard.
Today, they still talk aboutthe first person that entered
Harvard and how difficult it isfor black folks to get into
Harvard.
Now, and I'm thinking, really,here's an educated man that
(25:33):
graduated to Harvard with a, gota PhD, and it stands for a
doctor of education, right?
Not a post-hoed digger.
And so that just amazed me.
I'm sorry with the landness,but to me it's like the
understanding and the librarythat we get from
(25:54):
African-American History Month.
I wonder when we're gonna startcalling it that brother, but I
hear it was Negro.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Negro History.
It was Negro History.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Week, now, now.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Black History.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Month.
No, no, no, it was NegroHistory Week.
It didn't became Negro HistoryMonth.
Right, right, right.
Right Now is Black HistoryMonth, so I know when it's gonna
get to be American HistoryMonth, african-american History
Month.
You know, we've been, we gotall these different names, so we
gotta catch up withAfrican-American now with Black
History Month.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I wanna focus in.
I wanna TM.
I'm sorry.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
I've been.
My purpose is to say it's Negro, but I've been colored.
I've been black.
Now I'm African-American man.
Speaker 1 (26:35):
I'm moving on up in life.
You've gone through all theiterations.
You've experienced all theiterations.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Hey, before we wrap up, I wanna talk a little bit.
That is not funny.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
Go ahead, man no.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
I wanna talk a little bit about the fact that we
talked about we need blackhistory because it's our history
, collective history.
We need black history becauseit inspires, it gives us hope,
because we see people rise abovethe odds and accomplish
incredible things.
We said we need black historybecause we need understanding
for why things the way they arecurrently, but also I think we
(27:07):
need black history because weneed wisdom and when we look
back we see incredible,incredible thinkers, Folks like
Booker T Washington.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
People love me some peanuts man.
I know y'all throw my peanutbutter.
Might not be one of them, but Ilove peanut butter.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
That's George Washington.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Carver.
Okay, whatever, so him, I thinkdid.
We have this conversationbefore.
Speaker 3 (27:39):
Yes, we had this conversation before we have had
this conversation before.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
And you still gotta correct me.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
George Washington Carver was the peanut man, the
peanut inventor, who had over300 uses for the peanut.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
I don't feed him man, I just love that.
Peanut butter was his.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
Peanut butter is on the mind of netty winners.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
Absolutely man.
But beyond peanut butter, Greatpeanut butter, jelly sandwich
man I don't know what you guysare doing.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
I know I like PB and Honey.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
There you go, man.
Speaker 1 (28:08):
But beyond PB and Honey we had great thinkers Like
Booker T Washington.
Beyond who helped establishTuskegee College and did not
invent anything with the peanut,but he may wait for the next
guy to do the peanut butter.
That's very true.
But we also had men like WEDeBoys, and we had WEB rather
(28:32):
than the boys, and we had ZoroNeil Hurston, absolutely
Langston Hughes Like wereflected on earlier.
And Dr King.
Speaker 3 (28:39):
Richard Wright.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Richard Wright, dr King, so much wisdom, harry
Tuckman, so much wisdom.
So much with Sojourner Truth.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
Washington T Bergen.
Speaker 1 (28:50):
So, much wisdom out there that goes untapped because
we don't reflect on the history.
You know when we were and thecontext in which that wisdom was
being produced and curated,this context of suffering and
struggle.
It's a lived wisdom oh mygoodness, it's not just a heady
(29:10):
wisdom, it's a lived wisdom it'sthe best kind the greatest
experiences come through.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
That.
It's the best kind, greatestwisdom I've ever had come
through, those kind ofexperiences.
You know, again I'm probablygonna throw us off track, but
I'm just thinking this stuff wasnot hidden in a basket
somewhere, so who was takingcredit for it?
Move on.
Speaker 1 (29:31):
I'm thinking, you know, you guys said something
just a second ago that took meback to something I heard
recently that just stuck with me, and it's that I can borrow
another man's knowledge, but Icannot borrow another man's
wisdom, because wisdom is anapplied knowledge, it's a
knowledge lived out, it's aknowledge that has been tested
(29:53):
and tried and then, and fromthat testing and trying, comes a
produced wisdom, right.
And so this struggle that wesee in the black experience
right Produces just timelesswisdom because, as your point to
your point, austin, it'sknowledge that's been lived out,
it's knowledge that's beentried, it's knowledge that's
(30:15):
been tested and the crucible ofexperience, and the crucible of
experience and the crucible ofstruggle, and so it's so rich.
You know, what FrederickDouglass has to articulate to us
, for example, is so rich.
The words that Dr King hasarticulated to us through
history is so rich because itcomes out of a shared struggle,
right, and there's so much forus to learn and to glean, not
(30:38):
only from them, but for ourcurrent lives when we look back
and we pull that knowledge fromthem.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
And I think this is also important, especially for
the white community, because wecan glean wisdom as well.
Yes, absolutely.
So look at what we can do.
And we can read these figures.
We can read Washington TBoecker, we can read Frederick
Douglass, we can read LangstonHughes, these guys who were
there way before the CivilRights Movement, ever, even
(31:07):
before the 1950s.
Absolutely, I mean, and you canread them, you can gain their
wisdom, you can see theearnestness of their heart.
Absolutely For, and I can seeit as nothing less than
reconciliation.
And in my opinion when I readFrederick Douglass, when I read
Langston Hughes although, yes,they're saying, I want something
(31:29):
for the next generation, forthe people who look like me, but
I also want to be reconciled toyou that's what I read when I
read that and for me there'sthat relational desire that's
there on the pages.
And so when I see thatrelational desire broken and
(31:50):
marred at times because, as justa couple of weeks ago we talked
about Dolfo's weary decidingwhether he was gonna kind of
stay at the school and he wasn'tin California he was gonna go
and kind of more of a I forgotif you said an extreme direction
.
I don't want to use words hedidn't use but at the same time,
(32:13):
anytime that doesn't happen orthat marred desire for
reconciliation and I see thatpeople have started with that,
wanting to have thatreconciliation.
But anytime it's marred, I seeit as because a relationship
that was not realized and thepain of that relationship that
was not realized or therelationship that was allowed to
(32:35):
continue to be incrediblywounded.
But when I read these figuresFrederick Douglass, langston
Hughes and just a number of themI see that desire for
reconciliation.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
The desire for one, Amen, amen.
You mentioned Dolfo's talkingabout he could have went in
another direction.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
Tony Evans and I ain't think King mentioned it as
well that those are the optionsavailable to them.
At the point Tony talks about,when he went to this church in
Atlanta and he would never callan A, he said you know, when
they turned him away, you know,at that point he had the option.
He had the option of going amore radical way, and we all
(33:18):
know that King talked about itin his letter from the
Birmingham jail that was aradical part of the black
community.
That would take you in adifferent direction.
And so, understanding blackhistory, you understand that so
many options were available interms of how do we make things
better, or at least attempt tomake things better that could
(33:39):
have made things worse.
And so that understanding thatwisdom, you know for me, when I
read King's letter or listen tohis speech about a nonviolent
movement and what that entails,you know research, the
negotiations, theself-purification, the indirect
(34:01):
action all of that is man.
That is mind-blowing.
And so I've made thesepresentations about Black
history money.
And somebody says to me Nettie.
So you know, you know there areother people have contributed
to Black history throughviolence and other things.
I'm saying, OK, you're right,but how is that working?
(34:24):
How effective was that and theyfinally come to the clear way.
You know that it was morecomfortable what Dr King did and
what Malcolm X did or othersdid.
I'm saying like OK, I ought togive you a clue about the wisdom
of understanding the method andthe ways that Dr King, booker T
(34:46):
Washington, not to be that man.
Speaker 3 (34:51):
Or does that say Washington T Booker?
You said Washington T Booker.
Yeah, I mean Booker TWashington.
Speaker 1 (34:56):
But yeah, if any descendants of Booker T
Washington is listening to thispodcast we apologize.
We apologize so giving himcredit.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
We are really apologizing for giving him
credit for peanut butter, butanyway, can I make?
I'm going to make this point.
Look at the look at thecircumstances and the conditions
of highlighting theseaccomplishments in the midst of
intense and extreme opposition.
Absolutely, absolutely that inmany instances people died, king
(35:26):
.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Evers.
I was about to say make herever.
That's literally, literally whoI was thinking of as you were
describing the situation.
Meagher Evers, anothernonviolent activist, had young
men and again, this is theimportance of history had young
men telling him, hey, why are wedoing this?
Why don't we take up arms andlet's go do what we need to do?
Speaker 3 (35:47):
And Meagher- Evers, let's do this Right.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
And Meagher Evers had a conversation.
Well, how far do you thinkthat's going to go?
You know how do you thinkthat's going to ultimately end
when you represent a little morethan 10% of the collective
population.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
But listen now, we ended up in slavery because the
people that put us in slaveryhad greater weapons, greater
strategies than we had.
So, therefore, they conqueredthe engines, they conquered the
people of color, and we ended upunder their rule as slaves.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
Absolutely you know I mean what, especially from
Germany, france and the UK, youhad entire empires come out of
there.
I mean your administrativeacumen had to be top top notch
to create a global empire.
Absolutely I mean, that wassomething that the rest of the
world didn't have necessarily inthe processes of their society
and civilization.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (36:44):
I'm not saying that's morally neutral.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
No, no, no, it's not.
Speaker 3 (36:48):
No absolutely, but it was an administrative machine
that was unrivaled anywhere elsein the world or anytime that
came before.
I mean, it's been rivaled sincethen.
But the point is, I mean thesophistication of that
administrative deal that Europehad.
Speaker 1 (37:06):
Yeah, and the point I was drawing out was that, going
back to this idea of wisdom,the wisdom of king, the wisdom
of evers, the wisdom of others,to say, hey, this is what we're
up against, yeah, and if we usethe prototypical tools, rather
that you would think that youuse in order to wage war, in
(37:28):
order to fight battles, this isgoing to be the inevitable
outcome and it won't be pretty.
And so what we're going to useis the weapons, the reminder
that the weapons of our warfareand our counter but they're
mighty through God to thepulling down on strongholds.
We're going to go back to ourbiblical understanding of how to
fight battles, and in ourbiblical understanding of how to
fight battles comes a timelesswisdom that allows progress to
(37:52):
be made in ways that we wouldhave never saw if we would have
chosen alternative course.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
There's wisdom in that, because when 300 years
after Christ died, not exactly300, 400 years in the hundreds
of years I don't want to get adate Someone's going to come
back and be like your date'swrong, your history's wrong.
But the point is, a few hundredyears after Christ died,
christianity, the earlyChristians, were able to come in
and the church was able to.
(38:18):
After the Roman Empire fell,the church was able to provide
the type of structure forcivilization that it needed at
the time, even to the pointwhere it was able to advance all
through Europe.
It provided the only realgovernmental structure for a
significant period of timeduring the Dark Ages.
Absolutely Right, we alwaysdecry the Dark Ages and the hold
(38:41):
that the church has on thatOnly some people do in our
modern world.
But at the same time, it wasthe church that was providing
the only source of structure forcivilization at the time.
But yet you had this fledgling,small Christian movement just in
the span of a couple of hundredyears, being able to provide
what an entire empire was.
Why did I say that?
(39:01):
Because wisdom, Wisdom.
Exactly the wisdom ofChristianity allows people to
organize quickly, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
Classical and well, that's a class of understanding,
yep, as often articulatedwisdom, yep, and even hope.
Speaker 1 (39:18):
Yep, exactly, amen, exactly.
That's a great way to put a bowon this episode.
It's been incredible to discussBlack History Month and why we
do it.
I want to encourage you that ifyou have not taken time in the
month of February 2024 to pickup a good book or to grab a good
documentary to watch, let meencourage you to do that.
(39:39):
There's still time because youhave time in your day, so it
doesn't have to be in February.
It can be in any month, but weencourage you to go back.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
You know they got to get it down before Jesus shows
up.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
That's what course we've got to get it down for.
We want them to do that beforeJesus shows up.
Speaker 3 (39:55):
But we don't know the time or the place or the hour,
and so do it now.
Do it now.
Do it now Grab a book.
Speaker 1 (40:02):
Grab a documentary.
Do it now.
Go and learn a little bit moreabout your story.
Whether you're Black, whetheryou're Asian, Hispanic, White,
this is our collective historyand we want to encourage you to
dig into it.
It's been great to be with youon this episode.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
You know they can go out website and find books and
video.
Amen.
Speaker 1 (40:22):
Thank you.
Thank you, go tomissymississippiorg and there
are some resources that you cancomb through and get a little
bit of that history and we wantto encourage you to go and check
that out.
It's been great to be with youon this episode of Living, rec
and Sound.
I am Brian Crawford, with myprodigious, incredibly
impressive and incrediblefriends, austin Hoyle, nettie
(40:44):
Winters, signing off saying Godbless, god bless.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
We are indispensable man, Indispensable.
I just want you to know that.
Speaker 3 (40:51):
Well, I'm just going to call myself Mr Incredible
after him being declaring usindispensable.
Speaker 2 (40:56):
Yeah, I must be indispensable here.
God bless, god bless.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
Thanks for joining Living Rec and Sound.
If you would like moreinformation on how you can be a
part of the ongoing work ofhelping Christians learn how to
live in the reconciliation thatJesus has already secured,
please visit us online atmissymississippiorg or call us
at 601-353-6477.
Thanks again for listening.
This is Living Reconciled, a podcast dedicated
to giving our communitiespractical evidence of the gospel
message by helping Christianslearn how to live in the
reconciliation that Jesus hasalready secured for us by living
with grace across racial lines.
Hey, thanks so much for joiningus on this episode of Living
(00:38):
Reconciled, episode 43.
I am your host, brian Crawford,with my incredible friends,
prodigious friends, stupendousfriends, austin Hoyle, nettie
Winters indistensible friends.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
I like incredible.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Have I said that before.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Have I said I like incredible before.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Because my wife calls me Mr Incredible.
Mr Incredible, have I said thatbefore?
We've heard that before.
Oh, you've heard that before.
Never mind, we've heard thatbefore, that is not new man.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
Why do you keep bringing it up?
Because my wife we're not goingto call you Mr Incredible and
we still have not validated that.
So we need to talk to your wifebest and find out if that's
true, we need to talk to herbest.
That's true, man.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Special thanks to our sponsors, nissan, st George's
and the rest of the world.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Thank you so much for joining us.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Thank you so much for joining us.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
Oh, my God, we have notvalidated that.
We need to talk to your wifebest and find out if that's true
man.
Special thanks to our sponsorsNissan, st Dominick's Hospital
at Miss Energy RegentsFoundation, brown Missionary
Baptist Church, christian LifeChurch, miss Doris Powell, mr
Robert Ward, miss Ann Winners.
Thank you, guys, so much forwhat you do.
It's because of what you do toMission Mississippi is able to
do what we do and what we aredoing today.
Gentlemen, prodigious friends,we're spending some time talking
about Black history, are on theend of Black History Month, but
(01:47):
I thought it would be suitableto talk about not just simply
why Black History Month, but whyBlack History in general,
because this is something thatshould be discussed not just in
an isolated month in the year,but throughout the year.
Well.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
I'm excited we get 29 days to the 28 days to talk
about it.
Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
Isn't it great?
It's great and I think weshould continue to talk about it
.
So I want to talk a little bitabout Black History and Black
History Month.
Black History Month wasactually Negro History Week for
50 years, started in 1926,february, in light of Abraham
Lincoln and Frederick Douglass'birthday, dr Carter G Woodson
(02:32):
started Negro History Week.
He saw it as an opportunity tohighlight all of the great
achievements post emancipationfor Black Americans and actually
pre and post emancipation.
But he also saw it as anopportunity to bring to the
attention of the majorityculture, the white audience or
(02:53):
the white citizens of America,that Black folks had dignity,
black folks had value, blackfolks had knowledge and
ingenuity and wisdom as well toshare with this country.
And so Negro History Month wassomething that Dr Carter G
Woodson would host along withhis colleagues every single year
(03:15):
.
It went on for 50 years, until1976, where it was recognized as
Black History Month, and atthat time it began to be
recognized as a national youknow you know JRFO or the
president, Absolutely, andthat's well, not absolutely.
It's not like I was there.
I'm talking like I was there,but yes, I personally remember
(03:36):
that right.
No, I do know that JRFO was thefirst to actually acknowledge.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Black History Month, he proclaimed it or whatever,
but I was actually there, yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
That's right, I was there.
Yeah, I was actually there.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
I was two years, shocked.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
I was two years shocked.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
And so I want to talk about this idea of Black
History Month, I want to talkabout its significance and I
want to talk about why BlackHistory Month.
I have a question.
Yes, sir, you know.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
Carter G.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Carter G Woodson.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Woodson started this to recognize, you said,
achievements and accomplishmentsof Black folks.
It had amazed me that when youthink about George Washington
Carver, when you think about theguy that invented the elevator,
the ironing board, streetlights laid out in Washington DC
(04:34):
, how could they miss that?
That's just in my mind.
How did it just amaze me thatwe had to have a particular
month, a week, whatever, torecognize Black folks as it
relates to their history, andpeople would not.
(04:55):
Well, I guess it's likeeverything else, they did
recognize it, but this made theawareness and I guess, more
intense of the people and calledthe conscience of what was
going on, and it wasn't justthink about it, it wasn't just
for white people to recognizethe achievements.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
Part of the reason that Dr Carter G Woodson was so
inspired to start, I believe,the Journal of Negro History, I
think they called it was becausehe went to an event 1915 in
Chicago and it was an exhibit,so to speak, of all of these
black achievements and in thatexhibit thousands of
African-Americans became soinspired.
(05:39):
Well, carter G Woodson becamewas one of those
African-Americans that was soinspired.
He said, hey, we need tocontinue to tell these stories
because there's so much herethat I did not know about myself
.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
I still don't know all the.
You know, I read the book, thehistory.
I got several sheets that Ireview every year and I'm just
amazed at all the things.
I got a legal size sheet,several of them, several pages
with legal size sheets and it'slisted on bullet points of what
black Americans have achieved interms of patents and inventions
(06:13):
and things like that.
And I'm thinking, man, I owethis to a black guy.
Speaker 3 (06:17):
Wow, wow, wow Austin he's about to say something.
Yeah, and think about it.
There's so much to recover interms of black history because
for so long, methodologicallyand even the universities, it
was all done from the majorityperspective, really just until
recently, just in the pastprobably 50 years.
(06:38):
So you have a lot of recoveryof the history that needs to be
done as well.
So there really is.
You are more likely to recoverand to find new things within
the history of black historythan probably the history of
white history in America, justfor example, simply because the
(07:01):
tools for that type of discoveryhad not been allowed, as much
hasn't been as proliferated, soto speak, across the black
community as it has been justthrough history.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
And it's not just the recovery, which is incredibly
important I appreciate youhighlighting that but it's also
the engrafting of all of thishistory into the wider history,
exactly.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
Oh yes, integration.
Well, I mean integration.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
Yeah, I mean, we talked about yeah, the most
recent talks we've had aboutblack history and these
different locations this month,we've called it, we've called
the talks.
Black history is our history,the indispensability of our
history, the collective Americanstory.
Black history is a part of thatcollective American story and
weaving that into the fabric ofthe American story is just as
(07:53):
important as the recovery right.
Speaker 3 (07:54):
Oh, exactly, exactly, Making sure that it happens.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
You know and Austin made me think that is that it's
like all of you great economistshave been hidden in a bold.
Maybe it's at the part of theend of the rainbow.
No, it couldn't be there,because the rainbow was round,
so there ain't no end to it.
So it's like that was a.
For me, black history month waslike a gold rush, the more it
(08:22):
was highlighted about what blackfolks had accomplished.
It was like man, I can dreambeyond playing music.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
I ain't even dry the tractor, but before we got on
the podcast recording today, youwere talking about your dream
At one point in time was plowingme Right, plowing me.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
Listen, here's how that story works out Ted, my
brother Doris, my sister Emma,my sister and myself we went to
field chopping cotton and BigJunior, which my older brother
named after.
We called him Big Juniorbecause he's Evan Jr.
I got a cousin named Lil Junior, so anyway he was Big Junior.
I don't know how that.
(09:07):
Don't ask me about that Lil andBig Junior thing.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Big, junior and Little.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Junior and Lil Junior was in a fight one day and the
person that was fighting LilJunior thought Big Junior would
come to rescue him.
He popped Big Junior and almostknocked us out.
He had to wear a patch of hiseye for and had surgery on his
so you know, you ask me stories,man, I got them right.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
What's about to say?
We were asking about a storyplowing with mules and somehow
we got to Big Junior and LittleJunior and fistacuffs, but
anyway, but anyway stikuffs.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
So here's go, Big Junior.
He's flying and he'll plow allthe cognate.
We have right.
He put the mules in the bun,put the plop shed in the bun,
move in the pasture and put theplow in the bun.
Goes to the house, take a bag,put on his starch nine blue,
jean white t-shirt, hang a chip,hang it out of the bag and I
(09:58):
see him hitching a ride to town.
So he gets off the rest of theweek.
Maybe in a week or so he'llstart back plowing again.
Oh, wow.
But we get off early onSaturday.
You know what early on Saturdaymeant, instead of leaving the
field and going to the gardenand working, and we leave the
field and go directly home.
Wow, that's getting off early,wow.
(10:19):
So it gets too dark to work inthe field.
So you go closer to where thegarden is in the light and on
Saturday we get to go.
Just go straight home.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
That's getting off early.
That's getting off early.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
So would you have that dream?
That's a day off, listen.
Would you have that dream?
You know you're gonna work sixdays, right, right, right.
You know in the field.
And so you aspire, right, youaspire to get to plowing with
the mule so I can get off onWednesday, thursday and Friday,
maybe Monday, tuesday the nextweek, and then I'll plow it over
Wow, and so Black Historyexpands the horizon, so to speak
(10:56):
.
Yeah, they gave me dreams ofgoing to school and getting
education, a whole deal in termsof that yeah, yes.
I told you about the inspirationI had when Austin was talking
about his inspiration fromLangston Hughes.
My inspiration was to see mysister perform the creation by
Langston Hughes Right byLangston, and, as she done, the
(11:18):
creation.
It not only talked about thecreation that is self-invited,
but it also talks about whatthat instilled in us that we'd
be able to achieve Right right,and just so y'all know, I
haven't actually quoted LangstonHughes yet.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Nettie just knows I have it in my heart to do so.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Talk about Langston Hughes as we talk about Black
History.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
All right.
Well, I came across this poem.
It's called I Too Sing America.
I love this poem because whatit does, it really kind of
underscores the necessity forBlack History Months.
It reminds us about this kindof this reflection of the
struggle for not justrecognition but also to have
that capacity to be inspired togo after a mule Seeing what
(12:02):
other people who are like youlook like.
You had a similar kind ofhistory, similar context towards
they grew up, what they werelike.
So I really like how this poemencapsulates this.
So it says I too sing America.
It says I am the darker brother.
They send me to eat in thekitchen when company comes.
(12:24):
But I laugh and eat well andgrow strong.
And this is where remember,this is like 1920s, 1930s,
harlem to this New York city.
And he's saying tomorrow I'llbe at the table when company
comes.
Nobody will dare say to me eatin the kitchen then.
(12:45):
Besides, they'll see howbeautiful I am and be ashamed, I
too in America.
So this really does show thenecessity to have that time to
remember black history.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
It's Carter G Wood, since Dr Wood, since dream is
the same dream that LangstonHughes has, which is that I'll
be seen on the same level andwelcomed to the table as equal.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
You see how beautiful .
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Absolutely.
You'll see my dignity, you'llsee my value, you'll see my
worth.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
It's the same dream.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
It's the same dream.
That's incredible.
You know, besides inspiringright, there's a lot of reasons
why black history is importantshowing that it's a part of our
collective history and it'sindispensable, and because it's
our collective history, and alsoinspiring us like it inspired a
(13:43):
young, young netty winners ashe was planning his mule plowing
, and then he looked up and herealized that there were greater
dreams for netty winners toachieve.
But also also it gives usclarity about the present.
It gives us understanding aboutthe present.
You know, there are times inwhich only history can give us
(14:06):
reasons for why things are theway they are.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Absolutely, there's no way around it.
You got to know your history,not only that you would not
repeat it, but also to know howyou got to where you are and how
they worked out and why allthat.
All the six detective questionscan be worked out in black
history in terms ofunderstanding and appreciating
(14:29):
why things are the way they are.
You remember when we said BillHaven we were talking about the
civil rights movements and otherthings and one of the students
just outbursts go, oh, that'swhy it was like that.
Absolutely.
At that point, he's like whatis the big deal?
And then, at that point that hegot some clarity on how we got
(14:49):
to where we are, what happenedto make it this way and how
things were.
All of a sudden, this lightgoes on and now he's like man,
I'm tracking, now I'm clicking.
You know I'm with this, I gotit.
I appreciate it.
I think black history servesthose.
What do you call those momentslike that, all those aha moments
(15:10):
, those like moments?
Yeah, and I'm thinking tomyself now he went aha, but the
whole room with biz is writing,the other 26 or so students with
busy writing notes and they arehow mom, and they didn't
outburst aha, but they outburstwith their pen Like I'm making a
note of this because this isimportant and not because it's
going to be on a test, cause,you know, they just it was like
(15:33):
okay, that makes sense now to me, absolutely, absolutely you.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
9 11 2001.
That date lives, of course, inour collective conscience.
As Americans, we oftentimeshear the words associated with
that date Never forget, neverforget.
We are.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
We are told 9 11 2001 .
Speaker 1 (15:56):
We are told to remember and reflect and never
forget it, and one of the August2011, august 2011.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
And that Katrina.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
August 2005.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Okay, all right.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Let he forget.
Let he forget no.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
I didn't, no, I didn't forget.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
August 2011 was a tough year too, man.
Yeah, yeah, thank y'all.
Speaker 1 (16:21):
I don't know what happened but it was tough, it
was tough, it was tough, it wasleading up to 9 11.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
It was leading up to 9 11.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
But prerequisite but no, no, no, no, 9 11 2001.
Right and never forget.
And never forgetting helps us.
When I go to the airport andthey tell me to take my shoes
off, take my belt off, they tellme, hey, my lotion can only be
in containers three ounces.
They tell me, hey, if youbrought bottled water to this
check in station, you're goingto have to throw that bottle of
(16:50):
water away.
And when I want to get agitatedand aggravated and think about
why am I doing all of thisnonsense?
Just won't ride on the plane.
No, I'm reminded of 9, 11.
I thought there was a lot ofpeople who were like oh, I'm
reminded of 9, 11.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
I thought they're going to kick you off.
You get agitated.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
No, no, I'm reminded of 9, 11.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
And I'm reminded that four planes were hijacked.
For commercial planes werehijacked.
Three of them crashed intotargets.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
Now I'm stripping all the way to the bar man.
Whatever y'all need to do,Absolutely Exactly.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
And that history.
If you lose sight of thathistory, then you will easily
lose sight of why we do thethings that we do.
And eventually you'll say wedon't need to do them anymore.
It's interesting because evenbiblically, you can argue that
that's the reasons for thefestivals, because God is
constantly calling back, callingIsrael back to their exes.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
And I know exactly Remember remember remember.
Yeah, okay, you remember whereyou were 9, 11.
I do.
Speaker 1 (17:47):
Yes, yes, I remember, I remember almost yeah, I was.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
I was with Bill Bonham, bill Bonham Hope Credit
Union.
He and I went visit a guy namedBarnes about investing in the
credit union up in Madison, upthere where the uh C-spot
building in that area before heended up was developed.
That's where we were, wow,visiting, and on the way back we
listened to the radio and toldus what happened.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
I was on the campus of Mississippi State University
and on the campus of MississippiState University passing
through the library to class.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
That was before you met Candice after.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
That was before, that was before me and Candy started
.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
BC, bc, bc.
Before Candy, yeah, beforeCandy.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
I'm passing.
I'm passing through the libraryand I'm trying to figure out.
Why is everyone, all you know,huddled around the TV screens?
And that's why they werehuddled around the TV screens,
because they were watching umthe devastation.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Yeah, they were watching that playing.
They were playing in a good,good time.
You know they repeated thatover and over again watch that
playing.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
I remember man, I was , uh, I was driving in from
school or to school and I was.
It was a chemistry class.
I think it was 10th grade 2011.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
Yeah, 10th.
Speaker 3 (18:56):
No, junior year, junior software, junior year.
I forgot which one Um and uh.
And I was, I remember, you know, almost walking into my class
thinking, man, I'm 10 minuteslate.
But luckily, when I walked inthe teacher didn't even notice
and just had me watch TV and Iwas just like, oh I, I.
At first I was just like, ohgood, I'm not going to have to,
(19:16):
I'm not going to get in troublefor being late.
Right and then I was like oh,okay, that's, that's not really
that's not really good.
Yeah, I would prefer to havegotten in trouble being late.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Yeah, 이죠 checking out his new school uniform.
Living reconciled is the workof Mission Mississippi, but it
is not our only work.
From days of dialogue andprayer meetings to consultation
for schools, businesses andchurches, mission Mississippi is
eager to help you, your team,your church and your community
live reconciled Every month.
(19:47):
Join us for our weekly prayerbreakfasts on Tuesdays and
Thursdays at 6.45 am, ourbi-weekly statewide connection
meetings on Fridays at 10 am anda focused time of prayer on the
third Thursday of the month at7 am.
To get details on any of ourupcoming events or to learn how
you can invite us to your church, business or school, visit our
(20:08):
website at MissionMississippiorgand click on the events button
or call us at 601-353-6477.
We gain understanding when welook back for why we do the
things that we do and why thethings that are, why they are
the way they are.
For example, people argue aboutHBCUs and they say, hey, why do
(20:35):
we need two schools?
What's the purpose of anall-corn?
What's the purpose of a JacksonState?
Well, if you understand yourpast, you understand that
roughly 60 years ago, somewherearound 1962, there was a man by
the name of James Meredith whowas walking on the campus of
University of Mississippi.
He was not walking on thecampus to a friendly welcome.
He had to be escorted on tothat campus with US Marshals.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
Without those Marshals he would not have been
on that campus.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
Without those Marshals he would not have been
on that campus Not alive anyway.
Even beyond that.
1968, the same thing, or not tothat degree, but a similar
thing happened on the campus ofMississippi State University, my
own alma mater, in 1968, it'sbeen shared that some of those
(21:23):
Black students, the handful ofBlack students that went to
Mississippi State in 1968, someof them reflect on the one-seat
rule.
That was unwritten but was apart of their experience where
in the classes that they wouldgo to, one seat to the south,
the north, the east and the westof them was to remain empty.
(21:47):
Students didn't want to sit in,students didn't want to be near
them.
They had to literally keep oneseat of separation on the left,
right, front and back.
That was just an unspoken andunwritten rule.
That was some of theexperiences that they had.
Until you understand, or ratheruntil you see and reflect on
that history, then, yeah sure,an Alcorn State University might
(22:11):
not make sense to you, orJackson State University might
not make sense to you.
When you reflect on that, oh,now I see the reason for Russ
College, atougaloo College, aMississippi Valley, all of those
things make sense, and so weneed understanding.
We also need wisdom.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Yeah, had it not been for understanding.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
No, no, let's say it went understanding, Go ahead.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
Had it not been for Alcorn or Valley or Jackson
State, I would have had nooptions for going to school
Right, because during the timeMerritt was trying to get on the
campus, I was graduating.
I was getting on through things, and as I dreamed about going
(22:55):
to school, I couldn't dreamabout going to Mississippi State
Right.
Speaker 3 (23:01):
Ole Miss University of.
Speaker 2 (23:02):
Mississippi.
I couldn't do a whole lot ofdreaming about going to Alcorn
because my parents was not ableto send me.
But just thinking about goingbeyond one of the HBCUs was way
beyond my company to understandit, because I had to go there
and do work aid and work studyor whatever it is that they had
to offer me on limitedscholarships or work aid.
(23:25):
That was my option to go toschool and there was no way I
could have obtained that.
I couldn't even get enteredinto the university number one,
but if I did, I still wouldn'tget the finances I needed to do
that.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
That was not an option.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
Right, that was not an option.
So people need to understandthat we have like history month,
we have HBCUs because ofhistory.
We have black churches becauseAbsolutely I know you're going
to want to get to that, but wehave black churches because
white churches said no,absolutely, and if you're going
to come, you better come throughthe basement, absolutely,
(24:01):
absolutely.
And you better not get too loudin the basement or you're going
to put you out of the basementand some of that crazy stuff
goes on.
Today you got Asians andChinese folks meeting in the
basement of churches becausethey can't meet up stills in the
main sanctuary, and the thingthat I don't understand is that
nobody's in the sanctuary duringthe time you allowed them to
(24:23):
come, because certainly you'renot going to let them meet at
the same time.
You're, a major denominationgroup is meeting.
So since the sanctuary is empty, why are they still meeting in
the basement?
Why can't they just meet in thesanctuary?
I don't understand why it gotto be two separate services to
begin with.
But, more importantly, you havetwo separate services at two
separate times so that one orbump into the other coming and
(24:46):
going in the building, but youcan't even use the same seating
Right God's house man.
So appreciation for what allhas gone on in the past to get
us to the point of understandingthat, even though Carter G
(25:07):
Woodson was a Harvard graduatethink about it this is in what?
1920 something.
He's a graduate of Harvard.
Today, they still talk aboutthe first person that entered
Harvard and how difficult it isfor black folks to get into
Harvard.
Now, and I'm thinking, really,here's an educated man that
(25:33):
graduated to Harvard with a, gota PhD, and it stands for a
doctor of education, right?
Not a post-hoed digger.
And so that just amazed me.
I'm sorry with the landness,but to me it's like the
understanding and the librarythat we get from
(25:54):
African-American History Month.
I wonder when we're gonna startcalling it that brother, but I
hear it was Negro.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Negro History.
It was Negro History.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Week, now, now.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Black History.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Month.
No, no, no, it was NegroHistory Week.
It didn't became Negro HistoryMonth.
Right, right, right.
Right Now is Black HistoryMonth, so I know when it's gonna
get to be American HistoryMonth, african-american History
Month.
You know, we've been, we gotall these different names, so we
gotta catch up withAfrican-American now with Black
History Month.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I wanna focus in.
I wanna TM.
I'm sorry.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
I've been.
My purpose is to say it's Negro, but I've been colored.
I've been black.
Now I'm African-American man.
Speaker 1 (26:35):
I'm moving on up in life.
You've gone through all theiterations.
You've experienced all theiterations.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Hey, before we wrap up, I wanna talk a little bit.
That is not funny.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
Go ahead, man no.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
I wanna talk a little bit about the fact that we
talked about we need blackhistory because it's our history
, collective history.
We need black history becauseit inspires, it gives us hope,
because we see people rise abovethe odds and accomplish
incredible things.
We said we need black historybecause we need understanding
for why things the way they arecurrently, but also I think we
(27:07):
need black history because weneed wisdom and when we look
back we see incredible,incredible thinkers, Folks like
Booker T Washington.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
People love me some peanuts man.
I know y'all throw my peanutbutter.
Might not be one of them, but Ilove peanut butter.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
That's George Washington.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Carver.
Okay, whatever, so him, I thinkdid.
We have this conversationbefore.
Speaker 3 (27:39):
Yes, we had this conversation before we have had
this conversation before.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
And you still gotta correct me.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
George Washington Carver was the peanut man, the
peanut inventor, who had over300 uses for the peanut.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
I don't feed him man, I just love that.
Peanut butter was his.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
Peanut butter is on the mind of netty winners.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
Absolutely man.
But beyond peanut butter, Greatpeanut butter, jelly sandwich
man I don't know what you guysare doing.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
I know I like PB and Honey.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
There you go, man.
Speaker 1 (28:08):
But beyond PB and Honey we had great thinkers Like
Booker T Washington.
Beyond who helped establishTuskegee College and did not
invent anything with the peanut,but he may wait for the next
guy to do the peanut butter.
That's very true.
But we also had men like WEDeBoys, and we had WEB rather
(28:32):
than the boys, and we had ZoroNeil Hurston, absolutely
Langston Hughes Like wereflected on earlier.
And Dr King.
Speaker 3 (28:39):
Richard Wright.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Richard Wright, dr King, so much wisdom, harry
Tuckman, so much wisdom.
So much with Sojourner Truth.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
Washington T Bergen.
Speaker 1 (28:50):
So, much wisdom out there that goes untapped because
we don't reflect on the history.
You know when we were and thecontext in which that wisdom was
being produced and curated,this context of suffering and
struggle.
It's a lived wisdom oh mygoodness, it's not just a heady
(29:10):
wisdom, it's a lived wisdom it'sthe best kind the greatest
experiences come through.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
That.
It's the best kind, greatestwisdom I've ever had come
through, those kind ofexperiences.
You know, again I'm probablygonna throw us off track, but
I'm just thinking this stuff wasnot hidden in a basket
somewhere, so who was takingcredit for it?
Move on.
Speaker 1 (29:31):
I'm thinking, you know, you guys said something
just a second ago that took meback to something I heard
recently that just stuck with me, and it's that I can borrow
another man's knowledge, but Icannot borrow another man's
wisdom, because wisdom is anapplied knowledge, it's a
knowledge lived out, it's aknowledge that has been tested
(29:53):
and tried and then, and fromthat testing and trying, comes a
produced wisdom, right.
And so this struggle that wesee in the black experience
right Produces just timelesswisdom because, as your point to
your point, austin, it'sknowledge that's been lived out,
it's knowledge that's beentried, it's knowledge that's
(30:15):
been tested and the crucible ofexperience, and the crucible of
experience and the crucible ofstruggle, and so it's so rich.
You know, what FrederickDouglass has to articulate to us
, for example, is so rich.
The words that Dr King hasarticulated to us through
history is so rich because itcomes out of a shared struggle,
right, and there's so much forus to learn and to glean, not
(30:38):
only from them, but for ourcurrent lives when we look back
and we pull that knowledge fromthem.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
And I think this is also important, especially for
the white community, because wecan glean wisdom as well.
Yes, absolutely.
So look at what we can do.
And we can read these figures.
We can read Washington TBoecker, we can read Frederick
Douglass, we can read LangstonHughes, these guys who were
there way before the CivilRights Movement, ever, even
(31:07):
before the 1950s.
Absolutely, I mean, and you canread them, you can gain their
wisdom, you can see theearnestness of their heart.
Absolutely For, and I can seeit as nothing less than
reconciliation.
And in my opinion when I readFrederick Douglass, when I read
Langston Hughes although, yes,they're saying, I want something
(31:29):
for the next generation, forthe people who look like me, but
I also want to be reconciled toyou that's what I read when I
read that and for me there'sthat relational desire that's
there on the pages.
And so when I see thatrelational desire broken and
(31:50):
marred at times because, as justa couple of weeks ago we talked
about Dolfo's weary decidingwhether he was gonna kind of
stay at the school and he wasn'tin California he was gonna go
and kind of more of a I forgotif you said an extreme direction
.
I don't want to use words hedidn't use but at the same time,
(32:13):
anytime that doesn't happen orthat marred desire for
reconciliation and I see thatpeople have started with that,
wanting to have thatreconciliation.
But anytime it's marred, I seeit as because a relationship
that was not realized and thepain of that relationship that
was not realized or therelationship that was allowed to
(32:35):
continue to be incrediblywounded.
But when I read these figuresFrederick Douglass, langston
Hughes and just a number of themI see that desire for
reconciliation.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
The desire for one, Amen, amen.
You mentioned Dolfo's talkingabout he could have went in
another direction.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
Tony Evans and I ain't think King mentioned it as
well that those are the optionsavailable to them.
At the point Tony talks about,when he went to this church in
Atlanta and he would never callan A, he said you know, when
they turned him away, you know,at that point he had the option.
He had the option of going amore radical way, and we all
(33:18):
know that King talked about itin his letter from the
Birmingham jail that was aradical part of the black
community.
That would take you in adifferent direction.
And so, understanding blackhistory, you understand that so
many options were available interms of how do we make things
better, or at least attempt tomake things better that could
(33:39):
have made things worse.
And so that understanding thatwisdom, you know for me, when I
read King's letter or listen tohis speech about a nonviolent
movement and what that entails,you know research, the
negotiations, theself-purification, the indirect
(34:01):
action all of that is man.
That is mind-blowing.
And so I've made thesepresentations about Black
history money.
And somebody says to me Nettie.
So you know, you know there areother people have contributed
to Black history throughviolence and other things.
I'm saying, OK, you're right,but how is that working?
(34:24):
How effective was that and theyfinally come to the clear way.
You know that it was morecomfortable what Dr King did and
what Malcolm X did or othersdid.
I'm saying like OK, I ought togive you a clue about the wisdom
of understanding the method andthe ways that Dr King, booker T
(34:46):
Washington, not to be that man.
Speaker 3 (34:51):
Or does that say Washington T Booker?
You said Washington T Booker.
Yeah, I mean Booker TWashington.
Speaker 1 (34:56):
But yeah, if any descendants of Booker T
Washington is listening to thispodcast we apologize.
We apologize so giving himcredit.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
We are really apologizing for giving him
credit for peanut butter, butanyway, can I make?
I'm going to make this point.
Look at the look at thecircumstances and the conditions
of highlighting theseaccomplishments in the midst of
intense and extreme opposition.
Absolutely, absolutely that inmany instances people died, king
(35:26):
.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Evers.
I was about to say make herever.
That's literally, literally whoI was thinking of as you were
describing the situation.
Meagher Evers, anothernonviolent activist, had young
men and again, this is theimportance of history had young
men telling him, hey, why are wedoing this?
Why don't we take up arms andlet's go do what we need to do?
Speaker 3 (35:47):
And Meagher- Evers, let's do this Right.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
And Meagher Evers had a conversation.
Well, how far do you thinkthat's going to go?
You know how do you thinkthat's going to ultimately end
when you represent a little morethan 10% of the collective
population.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
But listen now, we ended up in slavery because the
people that put us in slaveryhad greater weapons, greater
strategies than we had.
So, therefore, they conqueredthe engines, they conquered the
people of color, and we ended upunder their rule as slaves.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
Absolutely you know I mean what, especially from
Germany, france and the UK, youhad entire empires come out of
there.
I mean your administrativeacumen had to be top top notch
to create a global empire.
Absolutely I mean, that wassomething that the rest of the
world didn't have necessarily inthe processes of their society
and civilization.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (36:44):
I'm not saying that's morally neutral.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
No, no, no, it's not.
Speaker 3 (36:48):
No absolutely, but it was an administrative machine
that was unrivaled anywhere elsein the world or anytime that
came before.
I mean, it's been rivaled sincethen.
But the point is, I mean thesophistication of that
administrative deal that Europehad.
Speaker 1 (37:06):
Yeah, and the point I was drawing out was that, going
back to this idea of wisdom,the wisdom of king, the wisdom
of evers, the wisdom of others,to say, hey, this is what we're
up against, yeah, and if we usethe prototypical tools, rather
that you would think that youuse in order to wage war, in
(37:28):
order to fight battles, this isgoing to be the inevitable
outcome and it won't be pretty.
And so what we're going to useis the weapons, the reminder
that the weapons of our warfareand our counter but they're
mighty through God to thepulling down on strongholds.
We're going to go back to ourbiblical understanding of how to
fight battles, and in ourbiblical understanding of how to
fight battles comes a timelesswisdom that allows progress to
(37:52):
be made in ways that we wouldhave never saw if we would have
chosen alternative course.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
There's wisdom in that, because when 300 years
after Christ died, not exactly300, 400 years in the hundreds
of years I don't want to get adate Someone's going to come
back and be like your date'swrong, your history's wrong.
But the point is, a few hundredyears after Christ died,
christianity, the earlyChristians, were able to come in
and the church was able to.
(38:18):
After the Roman Empire fell,the church was able to provide
the type of structure forcivilization that it needed at
the time, even to the pointwhere it was able to advance all
through Europe.
It provided the only realgovernmental structure for a
significant period of timeduring the Dark Ages.
Absolutely Right, we alwaysdecry the Dark Ages and the hold
(38:41):
that the church has on thatOnly some people do in our
modern world.
But at the same time, it wasthe church that was providing
the only source of structure forcivilization at the time.
But yet you had this fledgling,small Christian movement just in
the span of a couple of hundredyears, being able to provide
what an entire empire was.
Why did I say that?
(39:01):
Because wisdom, Wisdom.
Exactly the wisdom ofChristianity allows people to
organize quickly, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
Classical and well, that's a class of understanding,
yep, as often articulatedwisdom, yep, and even hope.
Speaker 1 (39:18):
Yep, exactly, amen, exactly.
That's a great way to put a bowon this episode.
It's been incredible to discussBlack History Month and why we
do it.
I want to encourage you that ifyou have not taken time in the
month of February 2024 to pickup a good book or to grab a good
documentary to watch, let meencourage you to do that.
(39:39):
There's still time because youhave time in your day, so it
doesn't have to be in February.
It can be in any month, but weencourage you to go back.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
You know they got to get it down before Jesus shows
up.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
That's what course we've got to get it down for.
We want them to do that beforeJesus shows up.
Speaker 3 (39:55):
But we don't know the time or the place or the hour,
and so do it now.
Do it now.
Do it now Grab a book.
Speaker 1 (40:02):
Grab a documentary.
Do it now.
Go and learn a little bit moreabout your story.
Whether you're Black, whetheryou're Asian, Hispanic, White,
this is our collective historyand we want to encourage you to
dig into it.
It's been great to be with youon this episode.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
You know they can go out website and find books and
video.
Amen.
Speaker 1 (40:22):
Thank you.
Thank you, go tomissymississippiorg and there
are some resources that you cancomb through and get a little
bit of that history and we wantto encourage you to go and check
that out.
It's been great to be with youon this episode of Living, rec
and Sound.
I am Brian Crawford, with myprodigious, incredibly
impressive and incrediblefriends, austin Hoyle, nettie
(40:44):
Winters, signing off saying Godbless, god bless.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
We are indispensable man, Indispensable.
I just want you to know that.
Speaker 3 (40:51):
Well, I'm just going to call myself Mr Incredible
after him being declaring usindispensable.
Speaker 2 (40:56):
Yeah, I must be indispensable here.
God bless, god bless.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
Thanks for joining Living Rec and Sound.
If you would like moreinformation on how you can be a
part of the ongoing work ofhelping Christians learn how to
live in the reconciliation thatJesus has already secured,
please visit us online atmissymississippiorg or call us
at 601-353-6477.
Thanks again for listening.
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