May 30, 2023 • 42 mins
In the second part of the Plants, People, Science Horticultural Therapy discussion, Lara follows up on the topic with horticultural therapist Abby Jaroslow who leads the horticultural therapy program at the Alice & Herbert Sachs Therapeutic Conservatory at MossRehab Einstein Medical Center in Elkins Park, PA and is also an instructor at the New York Botanical Gardens. She works with individuals recovering from spinal cord injury, traumatic brain injury, stroke, amputation, and other medical conditions in inpatient and outpatient capacities. Ms. Jaroslow discusses her day-to-day work and the professional and personal journey that led her to a career dedicated to horticultural therapy.
For more information on Abby Jaroslow and the MossRehab horticultural therapy program go to https://www.mossrehab.com/horticultural-therapy.
Learn more about the American Society for Horticultural Science (ASHS) at https://ashs.org/.
HortTechnology, HortScience and the Journal of the American Society for Horticultural Science are all open-access and peer-reviewed journals, published by the American Society of Horticultural Science (ASHS). Find them at journals.ashs.org.
Consider becoming an ASHS member at https://ashs.org/page/Becomeamember!
You can also find the official webpage for Plants, People, Science at ashs.org/plantspeoplesciencepodcast, and we encourage you to send us feedback or suggestions at https://ashs.org/webinarpodcastsuggestion.
Podcast transcripts are available at https://plantspeoplescience.buzzsprout.com.
On LinkedIn find Sam Humphrey at linkedin.com/in/samson-humphrey. Curt Rom is at https://www.linkedin.com/in/curt-rom-611085134/. Lena Wilson is at https://www.linkedin.com/in/lena-wilson-2531a5141/.
Thank you for listening!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Sam Humphrey (00:10):
Welcome to Plants, People, Science a podcast by
the American Society forHorticultural Science where we
talk about all thingshorticulture.
Hey Lara, how's it going?
Lara Brindisi (00:18):
Good morning.
What's going on with you?
Sam Humphrey (00:23):
I was just thinking about how, in our last
episode on horticultural therapy, we closed off by mentioning
that you have an Instagramcalled at the plant PhD.
But things have changed, Lara.
What's recent in your life?
Lara Brindisi (00:38):
Oh yeah.
Well, I actually am a PhD now,technically no longer a student.
You can call me doctor.
In fact, that is the only titleI'll be accepting, just kidding
.
For most people you can stillcall me Lara, but any students
in the future will go by DrBrindisi.
Sam Humphrey (00:58):
So, doctor, how do things feel?
Does it feel like not too bigof a change, or?
Lara Brindisi (01:04):
You know, I don't know.
It kind of feels different.
Right, it feels like I didachieve something pretty cool,
but at the same time, my life isas normal and I'm still going
about my day to day, finishingup my publications and looking
at next steps and giving guestlectures, so it's almost like
(01:26):
business as usual, though I dohave something fun coming up.
I'm doing a volunteer programthrough an organization called
Farmer to Farmer through theUSAID, where I'll be going to
Ecuador to volunteer on a cacaofarm, which I'm very excited
about.
Sam Humphrey (01:42):
That's amazing.
How long will you be out thereOnly about?
Lara Brindisi (01:45):
two weeks, so I'll try to get as much done as
possible.
What do you have going on?
Sam Humphrey (01:52):
Well, during that two weeks I'll be reading up on
cacao so I can ask you the mostintelligent questions possible
about everything you've learned.
But recently I have been stillgoing, still doing my strawberry
research, and the plants aregrowing really huge and so it's
a lot of data to collect.
So I've actually developed aapp for my experiment and so I'm
(02:17):
really excited about this appdata management thing that I
made and I got to recently showit to industry.
So, yeah, exciting stuff allaround.
Lara Brindisi (02:28):
Very cool.
Does the app make your workeasier, or is it just kind of a
tool that helps you visualize it?
Sam Humphrey (02:37):
So imagine you have a strawberry plant and it's
producing a bunch of thesestolons, these like runner, like
almost vines, that havedaughter plants growing off of
them, clonal daughter plants andthese daughter plants grow
extremely quickly.
And so if I didn't have somesort of app or way to very
(03:02):
quickly collect this data, itwould just be out of hand.
It would be impossible to logevery single daughter as it
develops.
But so, yeah, part of it isjust logging a lot of data, but
it's more like just the pace ofit.
It's really intense.
Who knew?
Lara Brindisi (03:21):
Great Love to hear it.
Sam Humphrey (03:25):
Now, I've been really looking forward to our
episode today.
Welcome to part two of ourepisodes on horticultural
therapy.
Today we interview AbbyJaroslow, who practices
horticultural therapy, and walksus through her day to day as a
professional in the field.
If you haven't checked out thefirst episode, no problem, this
episode can be standalone, butwe definitely recommend giving
(03:47):
it a listen.
In our last episode, weinterviewed Dr Candice Shoemaker
, who has spent part of hercareer researching horticultural
therapy.
Lara Brindisi (03:56):
Unfortunately, Sam couldn't make this interview
due to the occasional woes ofbeing a graduate student, but I
had the pleasure of interviewingAbby Jaroslow, who is a
professional horticulturaltherapist.
She earned her bachelors inenvironmental design and
architecture at UC Berkeley andher master's in historic
preservation and conservation atColumbia University.
She also studied ornamentalhorticulture at Mercer County
(04:20):
Community College and becamecertified through ASHS.
She was president of theMid-Atlantic Horticultural
Therapy Network for four years.
Today, she leads theHorticultural Therapy Program at
Moss Rehab Einstein Healthcarein Philadelphia, Pennsylvania,
while also being an instructorat the New York Botanical
Gardens.
Sam Humphrey (04:40):
This episode will be great for anyone interested
in pursuing horticulturaltherapy as a career or as a
patient.
With that, let's get intotoday's episode.
Lara Brindisi (04:51):
Well, welcome Abby.
We're happy to have you on as ahorticultural therapist.
I have some questions for you.
If you're ready to jump into it, Sure.
What does your day-to-day looklike as a professional
horticultural therapist?
I?
Abby Jaroslow (05:08):
guess the best way to describe that is to talk
about this space that I work in.
So that is a.
It's a glass house, agreenhouse in the in a courtyard
of a hospital building, and thegreenhouse is divided into two
(05:33):
rooms.
The front room is sort of adisplay room.
It's where I keep my largetropical plants and sort of my
specimen plants, and thenthere's seating there and
there's lots of room forwheelchairs.
Because I work in a rehabhospital Rehabilitation, it's
physical rehabilitation hospital, so that's for people who are
(05:58):
recovering from injuries andillnesses and surgeries and
things like that.
The middle room of the, thesecond room of the greenhouse,
is our work room and that'swhere I work with patients and
actually do therapy and I have abig work table in the middle,
(06:23):
so that about, and then somesmaller tables on the side so we
can get about eight wheelchairsaround the table and they, the
tables, are adjustable so thatall the different types of
wheelchairs can fit at the table, so everybody is able to look
at each other.
And while we're, while we'rerunning a group, then the in
(06:48):
that room I keep usually like wedo.
The activities that we do arethings like propagating.
I keep a lot of four to sixinch size plants in there.
So we do transplanting, we dopropagation, sometimes we do
nature crafts and I do groupstwice a day and then I do
(07:16):
individual sessions withone-on-one with a patient
throughout the other parts ofthe day.
What else?
I also have a volunteer team, somy job involves not only
working with patients but alsocaring for that greenhouse.
(07:36):
There's also another room thatis my office and supply room,
and then outside the rest of thecourtyard is designed
specifically for wheelchairs andfor it's all raised containers
with plants so that patients canwork on those containers as
(08:00):
well.
And there are two argors outthere that provide shade and in
the summer the tropical plantsgo out there.
So it's like a little oasiswhen you step out in there,
because it's small and verycontained and all surrounded by
plants.
So to maintain all that, I dohave a volunteer crew and before
(08:26):
the pandemic I had about 10volunteers who were putting in
about 30 hours combined a week.
Now they just came back onboard the beginning of this year
and four of them came back andI have about four new ones that
are in the process of getting onboarded.
(08:48):
So hopefully we'll be back upand running with volunteers.
So basically my jobs includecaring for the facility and the
garden and running the volunteercrew and then working directly
one-on-one with patients, andthis year I have an assistant
(09:10):
for 16 hours a week, which isreally great.
Lara Brindisi (09:13):
Oh, wow, okay, so your work is really split
between preparation and then theactual sessions.
What does an actual sessionlook like?
Abby Jaroslow (09:22):
So a group session tends to be a little
more social.
So we focus more on sort ofstress reduction.
You know every patient has.
They have goals and objectivesfor their therapy and when they
(09:45):
come to the greenhouse a bigpart of that is stress reduction
and relaxation, socializationwhen it's a group, and
communication.
So many of our patients havecognitive issues and speech
(10:06):
issues so that socialization isused.
You know it gives them anopportunity to work on those
skills and then the activitiesthemselves are done tabletop, so
they're also working on finemotor skills.
If I have a physical therapistjoining the group then they met.
(10:30):
The patient might be working onstanding or balance you know,
endurance and balance and thephysical therapist would be
monitoring that and assessingthe patient.
And what we find is that thepatients really are able to do
(10:50):
more when they're in thegreenhouse and I think part of
it is that they're distracted bythe activity.
But I also believe that thethat the, just the being in the
presence of plants is, you know,is helping them to relax so
that they're more able to do thework that they're doing and
(11:10):
they're not so focused on whatthey can't do but what they can
do.
Lara Brindisi (11:15):
Okay, and then in one of these sessions, is it
all focused on, let's say,patients who went through a
stroke, or is it a diversity ofmedical conditions?
Abby Jaroslow (11:27):
So the patients that we work with in physical
rehab here are.
We have patients who have had astroke, we have patients with
spinal cord injury, we havepatients with traumatic brain
(11:47):
injury and we have patients withtraumatic amputation and then
other sort of complexneurological or orthopedic
conditions.
So there's such a wide varietyof abilities, both cognitive and
physical, with those differentgroups and that's, and so my, my
(12:12):
groups are divided, so half thegroups I do on the units where
I'm, so I'm working with, youknow, if I'm on the spinal cord
unit then I'm working only withpersons who have had a spinal
cord injury.
But when I do my group, myafternoon group in the
conservatory, we do it at theend of the day and it's really
(12:34):
intended to be very much forrespite and relaxation so, and I
do it in conjunction with therecreation department as well.
So there we have patientscoming from every different unit
.
So there's a real variety inabilities.
But I have the volunteers, Ihave the assistants, the rec
(12:57):
therapists, so we're all thereto kind of pitch in and where
there's a patient that needsmore assistance, you know
somebody's they're able to toassist and I sort of act as the
facilitator for the activity,you know, giving instructions
and and handling the materialsand so forth and keeping to the
(13:21):
clock.
Lara Brindisi (13:22):
What would be an example of a specific activity
that you've designed for yourpatients?
Abby Jaroslow (13:27):
So I do try to, I like to make the activities as
sensory rich as possible,Because the goal is to have the
patient really feel removed fromthe hospital.
We want them to not be thinkingabout, you know, to get out of
their head, thinking, worryingabout what's going to happen to
(13:49):
them, you know, thinking aboutwhat's going on and what their
you know what their care is isgoing to be like when they leave
the hospital.
And so I do a lot with driedherbs.
We make coquery, we make handsoap and hand sugar scrubs and
(14:10):
sugar and salt scrubs for yourhands with herbs.
So those are the ones thatsmell really wonderful.
We also do flower.
I do flower arranging, so thatyou know, I we bring in cut
flowers and then we make thesesmall arrangements.
(14:32):
And I have a method that allowsthe patient to have some
structure first and then theyhave the freedom to design the
rest of it themselves, and it'ssuch a way that every single
arrangement comes outbeautifully and they're all
different, even though they'reoften using the same flowers.
So that's that's anotherfavorite of mine.
(14:53):
And then, you know, but my realgo to activity is transplanting
, just transplanting from a fourinch pot to a five inch pot and
that is very sensory involvedas well.
So they're using fine motorskill, they're using cognitive
(15:14):
skill because they're listeningto the instructions and then
having to do the sequentialsteps that are involved in doing
a transplant and they get tosmell the earth and I always
have them mix the soil by handin a.
I give them small trays of soiland they put their hands in it
(15:35):
and mix it by hand and we canhave, we can do 10 minutes or 10
to 15 minutes of just havingsitting around the table and
everybody's got their hands inthe dirt and what happens is you
could you get the smell, thescent of the soil and the and
the texture and the feel of iton your hands and the rhythmic
(15:59):
motion of doing the mixing andit becomes very meditative.
So we've had, I've had somevery spontaneous group
conversation Emotional, you knowemotional and so it's really
(16:20):
kind of amazing.
I feel like I could do a wholesession just with mixing soil.
Lara Brindisi (16:27):
Yeah, and then another benefit right that gets
it to keep the plants after.
Abby Jaroslow (16:31):
And they do.
Yeah, they get to bring themhome and they really like that.
Lara Brindisi (16:36):
Wow, yeah, sounds like a great session.
I mean and you're observingyour, your patients going
through this therapy you'vementioned that they get stress
relief and opportunity to haveconversation, enter this
meditative state.
What kinds of benefits have younoticed in patients that
receive horticultural therapy?
Abby Jaroslow (16:54):
So I think, in addition to the, the, the, the
relaxation and the stressreduction and that sort of thing
, there is and there's a lotwritten on this too about how
being in contact with plants hasa physiological effect on the,
(17:17):
on the human body, whether it'sthe you know, the microorganisms
that are in the soil or the,the fact of the care that
somebody is giving to the plant.
And you know, for somebody who'sin the hospital and has been in
the hospital for months and hasnot been able to take care of
(17:38):
themselves not been able to, youknow, in any way, you know
whether even possibly feedingthemselves or going to the
restroom themselves and so to beable to care for something else
that is alive is reallymeaningful and has a lot of
(17:59):
metaphors.
I've had you mentioned that thepatients take their plants home
, and I have had patients comeback to me years after they've
left the hospital and tell methat they still have their plant
at home and it's thriving andthat it really helped them
adjust to being back homebecause they had this thing, to
(18:20):
this, this, this living thing totake care of and to, to talk to
sometimes, and and it was sortof a reflection of how the plant
was growing and they wereimproving, and so that's, it's
really rewarding when I hearthings like that.
Lara Brindisi (18:40):
Yeah, I'm sure you spend all this time with
your, your patients, and then toactually have them keep the
plants alive must be veryrewarding on your end.
Have any of your patients inparticular made a big impression
on you?
Abby Jaroslow (18:53):
Yeah, I mean, I think the the one that I often
refer to when I get the ask thatquestion is an older woman who
had had a stroke and very oftenwith stroke, depending on the
part of the brain that isaffected the, the, the, the
(19:17):
differences, the difference intheir abilities.
That change varies based onwhere in the brain the the
damages, and often it's speech,and so there it's.
It's called aphasia.
When somebody loses the abilityto speak, it's very.
There's all different types ofaphasia.
(19:38):
It's sort of complex but butit's the output often is the
hardest thing.
And there was a woman who camefor the first time and she at
first we just were lookingaround and we weren't really
doing an activity yet, we werejust enjoying the atmosphere and
(20:01):
she kept looking up at theglass roof and it was a
beautiful blue you know blue skyday and she pointed to it and I
noticed that she was gettingvery teary and she pointed to
the sky and she put her handover her heart and she pointed
to the sky and she put her handover her heart and then through
(20:24):
asking her a lot of questionsand and just and her gestures,
which is how you oftencommunicate with somebody with
aphasia.
In the beginning she said thatshe felt like she was in the
presence of God and it made her,you know, weep a little and it
(20:48):
made me a little teary too.
So that was.
That was a very touching time.
Lara Brindisi (20:53):
Wow, did you always know that you wanted to
enter this career?
How did you first find outabout horticultural therapy?
Abby Jaroslow (21:01):
so I did not and always know about it, but but I
did always.
I was always an outdoors person.
I really like to hike and kayakand, you know, just be out in
the environment.
And I as a as a in my previouscareer as a historic
(21:24):
preservation architect, I justhappened to have the opportunity
to work on some historiclandscapes, public.
One was a public park and onewas a well several actually but
it was a private garden that wasopen to the public, but it was
(21:46):
a.
The second one and it was anestate garden and both of those
were really like I just loveddoing those projects.
I had nothing, I had nothing todo with the horticulture side.
I was working on theinfrastructure, but it really
sort of got me jazzed aboutplants and learning more about
(22:10):
them.
You know I always had houseplants and I always did well
caring for them, but I net, Iwas never.
I lived in the city all thetime, so I as an adult, and so I
never had the opportunity tohave a garden.
But I got really excited aboutit and I, after the the housing
(22:35):
market crashed, I was laid offfrom my job as an architect and
it seemed like it was a greatopportunity at that point to go
back to school and studyhorticulture.
The reason I knew abouthorticultural therapy was
because my daughter who wasthree actually at the time that
(22:58):
she was diagnosed with a braintumor, was treated at NYU, which
is affiliated with Russ GrehebHospital in New York City.
We were living in New York thenand they had one of the old and
Russ has one of the oldesthorticultural therapy programs
(23:20):
in the country and they had awonderful greenhouse there that
had a children's garden outsideand then another garden and then
several rooms in the greenhouse.
They had birds that talked andbunnies to pet.
It was a really great place andso we spent my daughter and I
(23:44):
spent a lot of time therebecause it was so much better
than being there, than being inthe hospital room, and she was
treated, for she was in and outof the hospital for years.
Nyu became like our second home, so, but that was how I first
heard about horticulturaltherapy and after years of
(24:09):
taking care of her when she wasolder I was able to go.
Well, I was able to go back towork and then got laid off from
that job, and when I wasthinking about a new career I
was thinking about healthcarebecause I had become really
interested in that, spending somuch time in a hospital.
(24:32):
And then I but also I reallywanted to be outdoors in nature.
So I it was just one of thoseaha moments which you'll hear
that almost every horticulturaltherapist say that that the way
they figured out this was whatthey were gonna do was an aha
moment.
And so I figured I can combinehealthcare and nature.
(24:55):
So I did, yeah, so that's how.
And you know, when you askedabout the patient that had the
most effect on me, of course,was my daughter.
So she ended up with a braininjury as a result of the
(25:15):
combination of the tumor itselfand then all the treatments that
she had after that.
And you know she's 37 now, sothis was more than 25 years ago,
and at that time there reallywere not treatments for that,
for that type of tumor that shehad.
(25:37):
So everything, all thetreatment she got, was somewhat
experimental and so anyway, shesurvived it all.
And that was sort of myintroduction, but she's my
special patient with a braininjury.
Lara Brindisi (26:00):
Of course I'm so sorry you had to go through all
of that, but it does sound likeyou are, you know, paying it
forward by serving as ahorticultural therapist for all
of these patients now who mightbe going through something
similar.
So that's a wonderful way toturn you know as something that
(26:21):
could be very painful anddifficult to deal with and to
something very beautiful.
Abby Jaroslow (26:26):
And I will say that I was, my husband and I
were fortunate to find aresidential facility in the
Catskill Mountains where she isliving now as an adult, and it
is.
They have gardens.
(26:49):
They have beautiful healinggardens, but then they also have
vegetable gardens and they havea farm and they provide all the
food they grow their own food,basically including the meat and
eggs and poultry, as well asall the vegetables.
(27:13):
So it's a really fabulous placeand the residents are involved
in nature all the time.
It's a nature-based program.
Lara Brindisi (27:26):
So you had this really impactful event that
really opened your eyes tohorticultural therapy.
You had always known that youwere interested in plants, but
when it became time to actuallytransition your career, how did
you actually do that and how didyou actually become the
certified horticulturaltherapist?
Abby Jaroslow (27:43):
Well, so there are certificate programs and
there are also some bachelor'sprograms, I believe.
Throughout the country.
There's not a lot of them, butthere are several, and many of
them are on the East Coast, inthe Mid-Atlantic region, which
(28:05):
is where I'm located.
New York Botanical Garden isone of the programs, one of the
very well-loved programs, andRutgers also has a program, a
(28:27):
certificate program.
So, as it turned out, I didn'tgo to either of those places.
I ended up going to a programthat's affiliated with the
University of Colorado, but theydo like a distance program and
(28:48):
they come to the East Coasttwice a year once a year and the
West Coast once a year and sowhen they were on the East Coast
, I took their certificateprogram over the course of like
a year, but at the same time Ineeded to study horticulture.
So I got a certificate inornamental horticulture from the
(29:12):
community college in myneighborhood and I also studied
psychology and some anatomy andphysiology and some other
medical courses, because I knewthat the direction I wanted to
go with my practice was in amedical setting, in a very
(29:37):
clinical setting.
So I took all those classes.
It took two years, and then theAmerican Horticultural Therapy
Association offers aregistration process that
requires certain courses to betaken and then a 480 hour
(30:03):
internship, which I did at theRust Institute at NYU, and yeah,
and then I started, and so Igot registered in 2012 and I
started working as a freelancerin a variety of settings,
because Horticultural Therapy ispracticed in so many different
(30:29):
types of places, but I alwaysknew my goal, ultimately, was to
work in a medical setting.
And then the Moss rehab, where Iwork, had had a local family
come to the hospital and offeredto build a greenhouse if the
(30:52):
hospital would create afull-time horticultural therapy
program, and, of course, thehospital was thrilled to do that
.
And the interesting thing wasthe way that the family came to
know about horticultural therapywas also through the Rusk
Institute, because they had afamily member who was a patient
(31:15):
there and they found respite inthat program.
So it meant so much to them andthey live in this community, so
they came to this hospital,which was local to them and
offered that gift, which wasamazing.
(31:36):
And so once they had thebuilding up in construction,
they started to look for afull-time horticultural
therapist and I just luckily,was at the right place at the
right time.
Lara Brindisi (31:55):
My dream.
Wow, what inspired thephilanthropists to want to build
a greenhouse attached to ahospital?
How did they come up with that?
Abby Jaroslow (32:04):
As I said, they had a family member who was
treated at the Rusk Institute atNYU and so they became aware of
horticultural therapy throughthat program and they had sat in
the garden and sat in thegreenhouse and found respite
(32:24):
there and that was what put thatin their minds.
And they're very wonderfulpeople and they wanted to do
something for their communityand they just felt that that was
such a unique program and thisrehab hospital is very well
(32:50):
known actually throughout thecountry, but especially locally,
and they literally live in thesame town, so it was right here
and it seemed like a greatopportunity for them.
Lara Brindisi (33:05):
So besides Moss Rehab, einstein Hospital and NYU
, are there other hospitals orprograms that use horticultural
therapy, like this one?
Abby Jaroslow (33:13):
There are, ironically, in Philadelphia
there are two other rehabhospitals and both of them have
greenhouses and havehorticultural therapy programs.
I think it's pretty unusual tohave three hospitals and three
rehab hospitals in the same city, but there are so many
(33:37):
different settings where peopleare doing horticultural therapy,
especially now, as so manypeople became aware of gardening
during COVID, and I thinkthat's really carried on and
people become aware ofhorticultural therapy because of
that, because there was so muchwritten about it during COVID.
(34:04):
But there, like when I workedfreelance, I worked with
children.
I worked in several differentresidential facilities for older
adults, skilled nursingfacilities.
I worked with a group from theNew Jersey Commission on the
(34:30):
Blind.
They had a recreation groupwhere we did horticultural
therapy.
Schools that cater to personswith developmental disabilities
or autism, and now even themainstream schools are putting
in gardens and putting in gardenprograms.
(34:52):
They may not be calling ithorticultural therapy but it is.
And hospitals too your acutecare hospitals are also putting
in healing gardens, they callthem.
But everybody in healthcare isbecoming aware of the fact that
(35:13):
having a connection to nature isa positive, has a beneficial
effect on healing and recoveryand also eating healthy.
There's so much information outthere now about how much what
we eat affects our health, andthe two biggest health risks in
(35:33):
the now in the country arediabetes and obesity, and
certainly by the food issues ora big part of that.
Lara Brindisi (35:43):
Yeah, so it sounds like the market for
horticultural therapy jobs isimproving then.
Abby Jaroslow (35:49):
It is improving?
Yeah, it does seem to be.
I know so.
I had served as president ofthe Mid-Islandic Horticultural
Therapy Network, which is forNew York, new Jersey and
Pennsylvania, and we have a jobsboard there which had been
(36:11):
pretty sparse for a long, longtime.
But lately there have beenseveral full-time jobs posted
and when those get filled thereseem to be more coming up.
And then the other thing is alot of the students coming out
of all of the programs.
(36:31):
I'm most familiar with thebotanical garden because I teach
there.
But there the studentsthemselves are coming up with
all kinds of interesting placesto engage in horticultural
therapy or to bring the programinto an existing setting With
(36:57):
different.
You know, I've had severalstudents who have been either
working as social workers orcase managers or occupational
therapists or teachers, and theythemselves have their own
personal interest in gardeningand then learn about
horticultural therapy, gettrained in it and then bring it
into their whatever theirpractice is in the first place.
(37:20):
And I have students who'veworked with LGBTQ youth, with
youth at-risk youth.
I've had students who've workedwith very little children, with
on the autism spectrum.
Just now, homelessness is alsoa place where the supported
(37:48):
housing are putting in gardens.
There's food gardens and thingslike that, so it's soup
kitchens are putting in gardens.
There's a lot of interest inthe natural world.
Lara Brindisi (38:03):
I love hearing the interest grow for plants at
any time, but I'm a little bitbiased and so you're talking
about, you know, all thesegrowing opportunities.
What kind of personality traitsor skills do you think it takes
to be a good horticulturaltherapist?
Abby Jaroslow (38:22):
Well, probably foremost would be empathy.
You know somebody with a veryempathic I think that's the word
personality.
What I teach, so the course Iteach, is treatment planning.
(38:43):
So it's sort of start to finishhow do you take a horticultural
activity and turn it into atherapeutic process?
And so one of the things wetalk about is therapeutic use of
self, and that is, you know,sort of looking at yourself and
(39:06):
thinking about those traits thatare, you know, it's empathy,
compassion oh gosh, I'm notgoing to remember them all, I
should have looked them up.
But yeah, and sort of sharing,and also, anybody who goes into
(39:30):
this field is very passionateabout it, just as, I think, in
any of the horticulture fieldspeople are passionate about what
they do.
And so if you bring thatpassion to your job, you know
the people you're working with,just you know, pick up on it.
Oh, another place where thereare horticultural therapy
(39:51):
programs are prisons.
Oh wow, rikers Island has a very, very extensive and old program
.
Lara Brindisi (39:59):
Yeah, that's pretty incredible and I do like
how underlying horticulturaltherapy is, essentially, that
you know plants and natureshould be accessible to all.
Okay, well, great.
Thank you so much for doingthis interview with me.
Is there anything else you'dlike to share that we didn't
cover?
Abby Jaroslow (40:19):
Yeah, I would just say to you know to look for
programs out there.
If you have any interest in it,it's it's, it is.
It's for me it's been the bestdecision I've made in my life to
change to this field.
It may.
It also makes it's verytherapeutic for me to be doing
(40:40):
this.
Lara Brindisi (40:40):
So if anybody listening wants more information
about your program or your work, what's the best way to find
out?
Abby Jaroslow (40:49):
Probably the best way would be to go to the moss
rehabcom website and if you goto the homepage and then click
on the services button, you'llfind listed all the services
that that moss provides, andhorticultural therapy is listed
(41:09):
there.
I have, I'm so lucky that thehospital really embraces the
program and encourages really,you know, promotes it and
encourages patients to utilizeit.
So we're right there on thewebsite.
Lara Brindisi (41:27):
Excellent, Abby.
Thank you so much for joiningus today.
Abby Jaroslow (41:31):
Oh, you're very welcome.
It's my pleasure.
Sam Humphrey (41:36):
To learn more about the horticultural therapy
program forged by Amy Jarislow,please visit moss rehabcom.
Forward slash horticulturaldash therapy.
Lara Brindisi (41:48):
If you'd like more information about the
American society forhorticultural science in general
, you can go to ashsorg Sam.
If people want to follow yourwork, what's the best way?
Sam Humphrey (42:00):
You can find me on LinkedIn at Samson Home, free
Lara, what about you?
Lara Brindisi (42:05):
You can follow me on Instagram at the plant PhD
or on LinkedIn with the tag LaraBrindisi.
Sam Humphrey (42:12):
Thanks for joining us.
Stay tuned for our next episode.
Lara Brindisi (42:15):
ASHS podcasts are made possible by member dues
and volunteerism.
Please go to ashsorg to learnmore.
If you are not already a memberof ASHS, we invite you to join
us.
Ashs is a not for profit andyour donations are tax
deductible.
This episode was hosted by SamHumphrey and Lara Brindisi.
Special thanks to our audioengineer, alex Fraser, our
(42:37):
research team, lena Wilson andAndrew Comatz, our ASHS support
team, sarah Powell and SallyMurphy, and our musician, john
Clark.
Welcome to Plants, People, Science a podcast by
the American Society forHorticultural Science where we
talk about all thingshorticulture.
Hey Lara, how's it going?
Lara Brindisi (00:18):
Good morning.
What's going on with you?
Sam Humphrey (00:23):
I was just thinking about how, in our last
episode on horticultural therapy, we closed off by mentioning
that you have an Instagramcalled at the plant PhD.
But things have changed, Lara.
What's recent in your life?
Lara Brindisi (00:38):
Oh yeah.
Well, I actually am a PhD now,technically no longer a student.
You can call me doctor.
In fact, that is the only titleI'll be accepting, just kidding
.
For most people you can stillcall me Lara, but any students
in the future will go by DrBrindisi.
Sam Humphrey (00:58):
So, doctor, how do things feel?
Does it feel like not too bigof a change, or?
Lara Brindisi (01:04):
You know, I don't know.
It kind of feels different.
Right, it feels like I didachieve something pretty cool,
but at the same time, my life isas normal and I'm still going
about my day to day, finishingup my publications and looking
at next steps and giving guestlectures, so it's almost like
(01:26):
business as usual, though I dohave something fun coming up.
I'm doing a volunteer programthrough an organization called
Farmer to Farmer through theUSAID, where I'll be going to
Ecuador to volunteer on a cacaofarm, which I'm very excited
about.
Sam Humphrey (01:42):
That's amazing.
How long will you be out thereOnly about?
Lara Brindisi (01:45):
two weeks, so I'll try to get as much done as
possible.
What do you have going on?
Sam Humphrey (01:52):
Well, during that two weeks I'll be reading up on
cacao so I can ask you the mostintelligent questions possible
about everything you've learned.
But recently I have been stillgoing, still doing my strawberry
research, and the plants aregrowing really huge and so it's
a lot of data to collect.
So I've actually developed aapp for my experiment and so I'm
(02:17):
really excited about this appdata management thing that I
made and I got to recently showit to industry.
So, yeah, exciting stuff allaround.
Lara Brindisi (02:28):
Very cool.
Does the app make your workeasier, or is it just kind of a
tool that helps you visualize it?
Sam Humphrey (02:37):
So imagine you have a strawberry plant and it's
producing a bunch of thesestolons, these like runner, like
almost vines, that havedaughter plants growing off of
them, clonal daughter plants andthese daughter plants grow
extremely quickly.
And so if I didn't have somesort of app or way to very
(03:02):
quickly collect this data, itwould just be out of hand.
It would be impossible to logevery single daughter as it
develops.
But so, yeah, part of it isjust logging a lot of data, but
it's more like just the pace ofit.
It's really intense.
Who knew?
Lara Brindisi (03:21):
Great Love to hear it.
Sam Humphrey (03:25):
Now, I've been really looking forward to our
episode today.
Welcome to part two of ourepisodes on horticultural
therapy.
Today we interview AbbyJaroslow, who practices
horticultural therapy, and walksus through her day to day as a
professional in the field.
If you haven't checked out thefirst episode, no problem, this
episode can be standalone, butwe definitely recommend giving
(03:47):
it a listen.
In our last episode, weinterviewed Dr Candice Shoemaker
, who has spent part of hercareer researching horticultural
therapy.
Lara Brindisi (03:56):
Unfortunately, Sam couldn't make this interview
due to the occasional woes ofbeing a graduate student, but I
had the pleasure of interviewingAbby Jaroslow, who is a
professional horticulturaltherapist.
She earned her bachelors inenvironmental design and
architecture at UC Berkeley andher master's in historic
preservation and conservation atColumbia University.
She also studied ornamentalhorticulture at Mercer County
(04:20):
Community College and becamecertified through ASHS.
She was president of theMid-Atlantic Horticultural
Therapy Network for four years.
Today, she leads theHorticultural Therapy Program at
Moss Rehab Einstein Healthcarein Philadelphia, Pennsylvania,
while also being an instructorat the New York Botanical
Gardens.
Sam Humphrey (04:40):
This episode will be great for anyone interested
in pursuing horticulturaltherapy as a career or as a
patient.
With that, let's get intotoday's episode.
Lara Brindisi (04:51):
Well, welcome Abby.
We're happy to have you on as ahorticultural therapist.
I have some questions for you.
If you're ready to jump into it, Sure.
What does your day-to-day looklike as a professional
horticultural therapist?
I?
Abby Jaroslow (05:08):
guess the best way to describe that is to talk
about this space that I work in.
So that is a.
It's a glass house, agreenhouse in the in a courtyard
of a hospital building, and thegreenhouse is divided into two
(05:33):
rooms.
The front room is sort of adisplay room.
It's where I keep my largetropical plants and sort of my
specimen plants, and thenthere's seating there and
there's lots of room forwheelchairs.
Because I work in a rehabhospital Rehabilitation, it's
physical rehabilitation hospital, so that's for people who are
(05:58):
recovering from injuries andillnesses and surgeries and
things like that.
The middle room of the, thesecond room of the greenhouse,
is our work room and that'swhere I work with patients and
actually do therapy and I have abig work table in the middle,
(06:23):
so that about, and then somesmaller tables on the side so we
can get about eight wheelchairsaround the table and they, the
tables, are adjustable so thatall the different types of
wheelchairs can fit at the table, so everybody is able to look
at each other.
And while we're, while we'rerunning a group, then the in
(06:48):
that room I keep usually like wedo.
The activities that we do arethings like propagating.
I keep a lot of four to sixinch size plants in there.
So we do transplanting, we dopropagation, sometimes we do
nature crafts and I do groupstwice a day and then I do
(07:16):
individual sessions withone-on-one with a patient
throughout the other parts ofthe day.
What else?
I also have a volunteer team, somy job involves not only
working with patients but alsocaring for that greenhouse.
(07:36):
There's also another room thatis my office and supply room,
and then outside the rest of thecourtyard is designed
specifically for wheelchairs andfor it's all raised containers
with plants so that patients canwork on those containers as
(08:00):
well.
And there are two argors outthere that provide shade and in
the summer the tropical plantsgo out there.
So it's like a little oasiswhen you step out in there,
because it's small and verycontained and all surrounded by
plants.
So to maintain all that, I dohave a volunteer crew and before
(08:26):
the pandemic I had about 10volunteers who were putting in
about 30 hours combined a week.
Now they just came back onboard the beginning of this year
and four of them came back andI have about four new ones that
are in the process of getting onboarded.
(08:48):
So hopefully we'll be back upand running with volunteers.
So basically my jobs includecaring for the facility and the
garden and running the volunteercrew and then working directly
one-on-one with patients, andthis year I have an assistant
(09:10):
for 16 hours a week, which isreally great.
Lara Brindisi (09:13):
Oh, wow, okay, so your work is really split
between preparation and then theactual sessions.
What does an actual sessionlook like?
Abby Jaroslow (09:22):
So a group session tends to be a little
more social.
So we focus more on sort ofstress reduction.
You know every patient has.
They have goals and objectivesfor their therapy and when they
(09:45):
come to the greenhouse a bigpart of that is stress reduction
and relaxation, socializationwhen it's a group, and
communication.
So many of our patients havecognitive issues and speech
(10:06):
issues so that socialization isused.
You know it gives them anopportunity to work on those
skills and then the activitiesthemselves are done tabletop, so
they're also working on finemotor skills.
If I have a physical therapistjoining the group then they met.
(10:30):
The patient might be working onstanding or balance you know,
endurance and balance and thephysical therapist would be
monitoring that and assessingthe patient.
And what we find is that thepatients really are able to do
(10:50):
more when they're in thegreenhouse and I think part of
it is that they're distracted bythe activity.
But I also believe that thethat the, just the being in the
presence of plants is, you know,is helping them to relax so
that they're more able to do thework that they're doing and
(11:10):
they're not so focused on whatthey can't do but what they can
do.
Lara Brindisi (11:15):
Okay, and then in one of these sessions, is it
all focused on, let's say,patients who went through a
stroke, or is it a diversity ofmedical conditions?
Abby Jaroslow (11:27):
So the patients that we work with in physical
rehab here are.
We have patients who have had astroke, we have patients with
spinal cord injury, we havepatients with traumatic brain
(11:47):
injury and we have patients withtraumatic amputation and then
other sort of complexneurological or orthopedic
conditions.
So there's such a wide varietyof abilities, both cognitive and
physical, with those differentgroups and that's, and so my, my
(12:12):
groups are divided, so half thegroups I do on the units where
I'm, so I'm working with, youknow, if I'm on the spinal cord
unit then I'm working only withpersons who have had a spinal
cord injury.
But when I do my group, myafternoon group in the
conservatory, we do it at theend of the day and it's really
(12:34):
intended to be very much forrespite and relaxation so, and I
do it in conjunction with therecreation department as well.
So there we have patientscoming from every different unit
.
So there's a real variety inabilities.
But I have the volunteers, Ihave the assistants, the rec
(12:57):
therapists, so we're all thereto kind of pitch in and where
there's a patient that needsmore assistance, you know
somebody's they're able to toassist and I sort of act as the
facilitator for the activity,you know, giving instructions
and and handling the materialsand so forth and keeping to the
(13:21):
clock.
Lara Brindisi (13:22):
What would be an example of a specific activity
that you've designed for yourpatients?
Abby Jaroslow (13:27):
So I do try to, I like to make the activities as
sensory rich as possible,Because the goal is to have the
patient really feel removed fromthe hospital.
We want them to not be thinkingabout, you know, to get out of
their head, thinking, worryingabout what's going to happen to
(13:49):
them, you know, thinking aboutwhat's going on and what their
you know what their care is isgoing to be like when they leave
the hospital.
And so I do a lot with driedherbs.
We make coquery, we make handsoap and hand sugar scrubs and
(14:10):
sugar and salt scrubs for yourhands with herbs.
So those are the ones thatsmell really wonderful.
We also do flower.
I do flower arranging, so thatyou know, I we bring in cut
flowers and then we make thesesmall arrangements.
(14:32):
And I have a method that allowsthe patient to have some
structure first and then theyhave the freedom to design the
rest of it themselves, and it'ssuch a way that every single
arrangement comes outbeautifully and they're all
different, even though they'reoften using the same flowers.
So that's that's anotherfavorite of mine.
(14:53):
And then, you know, but my realgo to activity is transplanting
, just transplanting from a fourinch pot to a five inch pot and
that is very sensory involvedas well.
So they're using fine motorskill, they're using cognitive
(15:14):
skill because they're listeningto the instructions and then
having to do the sequentialsteps that are involved in doing
a transplant and they get tosmell the earth and I always
have them mix the soil by handin a.
I give them small trays of soiland they put their hands in it
(15:35):
and mix it by hand and we canhave, we can do 10 minutes or 10
to 15 minutes of just havingsitting around the table and
everybody's got their hands inthe dirt and what happens is you
could you get the smell, thescent of the soil and the and
the texture and the feel of iton your hands and the rhythmic
(15:59):
motion of doing the mixing andit becomes very meditative.
So we've had, I've had somevery spontaneous group
conversation Emotional, you knowemotional and so it's really
(16:20):
kind of amazing.
I feel like I could do a wholesession just with mixing soil.
Lara Brindisi (16:27):
Yeah, and then another benefit right that gets
it to keep the plants after.
Abby Jaroslow (16:31):
And they do.
Yeah, they get to bring themhome and they really like that.
Lara Brindisi (16:36):
Wow, yeah, sounds like a great session.
I mean and you're observingyour, your patients going
through this therapy you'vementioned that they get stress
relief and opportunity to haveconversation, enter this
meditative state.
What kinds of benefits have younoticed in patients that
receive horticultural therapy?
Abby Jaroslow (16:54):
So I think, in addition to the, the, the, the
relaxation and the stressreduction and that sort of thing
, there is and there's a lotwritten on this too about how
being in contact with plants hasa physiological effect on the,
(17:17):
on the human body, whether it'sthe you know, the microorganisms
that are in the soil or the,the fact of the care that
somebody is giving to the plant.
And you know, for somebody who'sin the hospital and has been in
the hospital for months and hasnot been able to take care of
(17:38):
themselves not been able to, youknow, in any way, you know
whether even possibly feedingthemselves or going to the
restroom themselves and so to beable to care for something else
that is alive is reallymeaningful and has a lot of
(17:59):
metaphors.
I've had you mentioned that thepatients take their plants home
, and I have had patients comeback to me years after they've
left the hospital and tell methat they still have their plant
at home and it's thriving andthat it really helped them
adjust to being back homebecause they had this thing, to
(18:20):
this, this, this living thing totake care of and to, to talk to
sometimes, and and it was sortof a reflection of how the plant
was growing and they wereimproving, and so that's, it's
really rewarding when I hearthings like that.
Lara Brindisi (18:40):
Yeah, I'm sure you spend all this time with
your, your patients, and then toactually have them keep the
plants alive must be veryrewarding on your end.
Have any of your patients inparticular made a big impression
on you?
Abby Jaroslow (18:53):
Yeah, I mean, I think the the one that I often
refer to when I get the ask thatquestion is an older woman who
had had a stroke and very oftenwith stroke, depending on the
part of the brain that isaffected the, the, the, the
(19:17):
differences, the difference intheir abilities.
That change varies based onwhere in the brain the the
damages, and often it's speech,and so there it's.
It's called aphasia.
When somebody loses the abilityto speak, it's very.
There's all different types ofaphasia.
(19:38):
It's sort of complex but butit's the output often is the
hardest thing.
And there was a woman who camefor the first time and she at
first we just were lookingaround and we weren't really
doing an activity yet, we werejust enjoying the atmosphere and
(20:01):
she kept looking up at theglass roof and it was a
beautiful blue you know blue skyday and she pointed to it and I
noticed that she was gettingvery teary and she pointed to
the sky and she put her handover her heart and she pointed
to the sky and she put her handover her heart and then through
(20:24):
asking her a lot of questionsand and just and her gestures,
which is how you oftencommunicate with somebody with
aphasia.
In the beginning she said thatshe felt like she was in the
presence of God and it made her,you know, weep a little and it
(20:48):
made me a little teary too.
So that was.
That was a very touching time.
Lara Brindisi (20:53):
Wow, did you always know that you wanted to
enter this career?
How did you first find outabout horticultural therapy?
Abby Jaroslow (21:01):
so I did not and always know about it, but but I
did always.
I was always an outdoors person.
I really like to hike and kayakand, you know, just be out in
the environment.
And I as a as a in my previouscareer as a historic
(21:24):
preservation architect, I justhappened to have the opportunity
to work on some historiclandscapes, public.
One was a public park and onewas a well several actually but
it was a private garden that wasopen to the public, but it was
(21:46):
a.
The second one and it was anestate garden and both of those
were really like I just loveddoing those projects.
I had nothing, I had nothing todo with the horticulture side.
I was working on theinfrastructure, but it really
sort of got me jazzed aboutplants and learning more about
(22:10):
them.
You know I always had houseplants and I always did well
caring for them, but I net, Iwas never.
I lived in the city all thetime, so I as an adult, and so I
never had the opportunity tohave a garden.
But I got really excited aboutit and I, after the the housing
(22:35):
market crashed, I was laid offfrom my job as an architect and
it seemed like it was a greatopportunity at that point to go
back to school and studyhorticulture.
The reason I knew abouthorticultural therapy was
because my daughter who wasthree actually at the time that
(22:58):
she was diagnosed with a braintumor, was treated at NYU, which
is affiliated with Russ GrehebHospital in New York City.
We were living in New York thenand they had one of the old and
Russ has one of the oldesthorticultural therapy programs
(23:20):
in the country and they had awonderful greenhouse there that
had a children's garden outsideand then another garden and then
several rooms in the greenhouse.
They had birds that talked andbunnies to pet.
It was a really great place andso we spent my daughter and I
(23:44):
spent a lot of time therebecause it was so much better
than being there, than being inthe hospital room, and she was
treated, for she was in and outof the hospital for years.
Nyu became like our second home, so, but that was how I first
heard about horticulturaltherapy and after years of
(24:09):
taking care of her when she wasolder I was able to go.
Well, I was able to go back towork and then got laid off from
that job, and when I wasthinking about a new career I
was thinking about healthcarebecause I had become really
interested in that, spending somuch time in a hospital.
(24:32):
And then I but also I reallywanted to be outdoors in nature.
So I it was just one of thoseaha moments which you'll hear
that almost every horticulturaltherapist say that that the way
they figured out this was whatthey were gonna do was an aha
moment.
And so I figured I can combinehealthcare and nature.
(24:55):
So I did, yeah, so that's how.
And you know, when you askedabout the patient that had the
most effect on me, of course,was my daughter.
So she ended up with a braininjury as a result of the
(25:15):
combination of the tumor itselfand then all the treatments that
she had after that.
And you know she's 37 now, sothis was more than 25 years ago,
and at that time there reallywere not treatments for that,
for that type of tumor that shehad.
(25:37):
So everything, all thetreatment she got, was somewhat
experimental and so anyway, shesurvived it all.
And that was sort of myintroduction, but she's my
special patient with a braininjury.
Lara Brindisi (26:00):
Of course I'm so sorry you had to go through all
of that, but it does sound likeyou are, you know, paying it
forward by serving as ahorticultural therapist for all
of these patients now who mightbe going through something
similar.
So that's a wonderful way toturn you know as something that
(26:21):
could be very painful anddifficult to deal with and to
something very beautiful.
Abby Jaroslow (26:26):
And I will say that I was, my husband and I
were fortunate to find aresidential facility in the
Catskill Mountains where she isliving now as an adult, and it
is.
They have gardens.
(26:49):
They have beautiful healinggardens, but then they also have
vegetable gardens and they havea farm and they provide all the
food they grow their own food,basically including the meat and
eggs and poultry, as well asall the vegetables.
(27:13):
So it's a really fabulous placeand the residents are involved
in nature all the time.
It's a nature-based program.
Lara Brindisi (27:26):
So you had this really impactful event that
really opened your eyes tohorticultural therapy.
You had always known that youwere interested in plants, but
when it became time to actuallytransition your career, how did
you actually do that and how didyou actually become the
certified horticulturaltherapist?
Abby Jaroslow (27:43):
Well, so there are certificate programs and
there are also some bachelor'sprograms, I believe.
Throughout the country.
There's not a lot of them, butthere are several, and many of
them are on the East Coast, inthe Mid-Atlantic region, which
(28:05):
is where I'm located.
New York Botanical Garden isone of the programs, one of the
very well-loved programs, andRutgers also has a program, a
(28:27):
certificate program.
So, as it turned out, I didn'tgo to either of those places.
I ended up going to a programthat's affiliated with the
University of Colorado, but theydo like a distance program and
(28:48):
they come to the East Coasttwice a year once a year and the
West Coast once a year and sowhen they were on the East Coast
, I took their certificateprogram over the course of like
a year, but at the same time Ineeded to study horticulture.
So I got a certificate inornamental horticulture from the
(29:12):
community college in myneighborhood and I also studied
psychology and some anatomy andphysiology and some other
medical courses, because I knewthat the direction I wanted to
go with my practice was in amedical setting, in a very
(29:37):
clinical setting.
So I took all those classes.
It took two years, and then theAmerican Horticultural Therapy
Association offers aregistration process that
requires certain courses to betaken and then a 480 hour
(30:03):
internship, which I did at theRust Institute at NYU, and yeah,
and then I started, and so Igot registered in 2012 and I
started working as a freelancerin a variety of settings,
because Horticultural Therapy ispracticed in so many different
(30:29):
types of places, but I alwaysknew my goal, ultimately, was to
work in a medical setting.
And then the Moss rehab, where Iwork, had had a local family
come to the hospital and offeredto build a greenhouse if the
(30:52):
hospital would create afull-time horticultural therapy
program, and, of course, thehospital was thrilled to do that
.
And the interesting thing wasthe way that the family came to
know about horticultural therapywas also through the Rusk
Institute, because they had afamily member who was a patient
(31:15):
there and they found respite inthat program.
So it meant so much to them andthey live in this community, so
they came to this hospital,which was local to them and
offered that gift, which wasamazing.
(31:36):
And so once they had thebuilding up in construction,
they started to look for afull-time horticultural
therapist and I just luckily,was at the right place at the
right time.
Lara Brindisi (31:55):
My dream.
Wow, what inspired thephilanthropists to want to build
a greenhouse attached to ahospital?
How did they come up with that?
Abby Jaroslow (32:04):
As I said, they had a family member who was
treated at the Rusk Institute atNYU and so they became aware of
horticultural therapy throughthat program and they had sat in
the garden and sat in thegreenhouse and found respite
(32:24):
there and that was what put thatin their minds.
And they're very wonderfulpeople and they wanted to do
something for their communityand they just felt that that was
such a unique program and thisrehab hospital is very well
(32:50):
known actually throughout thecountry, but especially locally,
and they literally live in thesame town, so it was right here
and it seemed like a greatopportunity for them.
Lara Brindisi (33:05):
So besides Moss Rehab, einstein Hospital and NYU
, are there other hospitals orprograms that use horticultural
therapy, like this one?
Abby Jaroslow (33:13):
There are, ironically, in Philadelphia
there are two other rehabhospitals and both of them have
greenhouses and havehorticultural therapy programs.
I think it's pretty unusual tohave three hospitals and three
rehab hospitals in the same city, but there are so many
(33:37):
different settings where peopleare doing horticultural therapy,
especially now, as so manypeople became aware of gardening
during COVID, and I thinkthat's really carried on and
people become aware ofhorticultural therapy because of
that, because there was so muchwritten about it during COVID.
(34:04):
But there, like when I workedfreelance, I worked with
children.
I worked in several differentresidential facilities for older
adults, skilled nursingfacilities.
I worked with a group from theNew Jersey Commission on the
(34:30):
Blind.
They had a recreation groupwhere we did horticultural
therapy.
Schools that cater to personswith developmental disabilities
or autism, and now even themainstream schools are putting
in gardens and putting in gardenprograms.
(34:52):
They may not be calling ithorticultural therapy but it is.
And hospitals too your acutecare hospitals are also putting
in healing gardens, they callthem.
But everybody in healthcare isbecoming aware of the fact that
(35:13):
having a connection to nature isa positive, has a beneficial
effect on healing and recoveryand also eating healthy.
There's so much information outthere now about how much what
we eat affects our health, andthe two biggest health risks in
(35:33):
the now in the country arediabetes and obesity, and
certainly by the food issues ora big part of that.
Lara Brindisi (35:43):
Yeah, so it sounds like the market for
horticultural therapy jobs isimproving then.
Abby Jaroslow (35:49):
It is improving?
Yeah, it does seem to be.
I know so.
I had served as president ofthe Mid-Islandic Horticultural
Therapy Network, which is forNew York, new Jersey and
Pennsylvania, and we have a jobsboard there which had been
(36:11):
pretty sparse for a long, longtime.
But lately there have beenseveral full-time jobs posted
and when those get filled thereseem to be more coming up.
And then the other thing is alot of the students coming out
of all of the programs.
(36:31):
I'm most familiar with thebotanical garden because I teach
there.
But there the studentsthemselves are coming up with
all kinds of interesting placesto engage in horticultural
therapy or to bring the programinto an existing setting With
(36:57):
different.
You know, I've had severalstudents who have been either
working as social workers orcase managers or occupational
therapists or teachers, and theythemselves have their own
personal interest in gardeningand then learn about
horticultural therapy, gettrained in it and then bring it
into their whatever theirpractice is in the first place.
(37:20):
And I have students who'veworked with LGBTQ youth, with
youth at-risk youth.
I've had students who've workedwith very little children, with
on the autism spectrum.
Just now, homelessness is alsoa place where the supported
(37:48):
housing are putting in gardens.
There's food gardens and thingslike that, so it's soup
kitchens are putting in gardens.
There's a lot of interest inthe natural world.
Lara Brindisi (38:03):
I love hearing the interest grow for plants at
any time, but I'm a little bitbiased and so you're talking
about, you know, all thesegrowing opportunities.
What kind of personality traitsor skills do you think it takes
to be a good horticulturaltherapist?
Abby Jaroslow (38:22):
Well, probably foremost would be empathy.
You know somebody with a veryempathic I think that's the word
personality.
What I teach, so the course Iteach, is treatment planning.
(38:43):
So it's sort of start to finishhow do you take a horticultural
activity and turn it into atherapeutic process?
And so one of the things wetalk about is therapeutic use of
self, and that is, you know,sort of looking at yourself and
(39:06):
thinking about those traits thatare, you know, it's empathy,
compassion oh gosh, I'm notgoing to remember them all, I
should have looked them up.
But yeah, and sort of sharing,and also, anybody who goes into
(39:30):
this field is very passionateabout it, just as, I think, in
any of the horticulture fieldspeople are passionate about what
they do.
And so if you bring thatpassion to your job, you know
the people you're working with,just you know, pick up on it.
Oh, another place where thereare horticultural therapy
(39:51):
programs are prisons.
Oh wow, rikers Island has a very, very extensive and old program
.
Lara Brindisi (39:59):
Yeah, that's pretty incredible and I do like
how underlying horticulturaltherapy is, essentially, that
you know plants and natureshould be accessible to all.
Okay, well, great.
Thank you so much for doingthis interview with me.
Is there anything else you'dlike to share that we didn't
cover?
Abby Jaroslow (40:19):
Yeah, I would just say to you know to look for
programs out there.
If you have any interest in it,it's it's, it is.
It's for me it's been the bestdecision I've made in my life to
change to this field.
It may.
It also makes it's verytherapeutic for me to be doing
(40:40):
this.
Lara Brindisi (40:40):
So if anybody listening wants more information
about your program or your work, what's the best way to find
out?
Abby Jaroslow (40:49):
Probably the best way would be to go to the moss
rehabcom website and if you goto the homepage and then click
on the services button, you'llfind listed all the services
that that moss provides, andhorticultural therapy is listed
(41:09):
there.
I have, I'm so lucky that thehospital really embraces the
program and encourages really,you know, promotes it and
encourages patients to utilizeit.
So we're right there on thewebsite.
Lara Brindisi (41:27):
Excellent, Abby.
Thank you so much for joiningus today.
Abby Jaroslow (41:31):
Oh, you're very welcome.
It's my pleasure.
Sam Humphrey (41:36):
To learn more about the horticultural therapy
program forged by Amy Jarislow,please visit moss rehabcom.
Forward slash horticulturaldash therapy.
Lara Brindisi (41:48):
If you'd like more information about the
American society forhorticultural science in general
, you can go to ashsorg Sam.
If people want to follow yourwork, what's the best way?
Sam Humphrey (42:00):
You can find me on LinkedIn at Samson Home, free
Lara, what about you?
Lara Brindisi (42:05):
You can follow me on Instagram at the plant PhD
or on LinkedIn with the tag LaraBrindisi.
Sam Humphrey (42:12):
Thanks for joining us.
Stay tuned for our next episode.
Lara Brindisi (42:15):
ASHS podcasts are made possible by member dues
and volunteerism.
Please go to ashsorg to learnmore.
If you are not already a memberof ASHS, we invite you to join
us.
Ashs is a not for profit andyour donations are tax
deductible.
This episode was hosted by SamHumphrey and Lara Brindisi.
Special thanks to our audioengineer, alex Fraser, our
(42:37):
research team, lena Wilson andAndrew Comatz, our ASHS support
team, sarah Powell and SallyMurphy, and our musician, john
Clark.
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