July 27, 2022 • 30 mins
For this kickoff episode, Sam and Lara interview Dr. Benjamin Campbell, an agricultural economist, to talk about his recent research on how horticulture consumer behavior has changed from COVID-19. Find this featured publication at https://doi.org/10.21273/HORTTECH04911-21. The authors include Benjamin Campbell, David San Fratello, William Secor, and Julie Campbell, from the Department of Agricultural and Applied Economics and the Department of Horticulture at the University of Georgia.
For more information on Dr. Benjamin Campbell visit his faculty page or view his list of publications. You can reach him by email at ben.campbell@uga.edu.
Learn more about the American Society for Horticultural Science (ASHS) at https://ashs.org/.
HortTechnology, HortScience and the Journal of the American Society for Horticultural Science are all open-access and peer-reviewed journals, published by the American Society of Horticultural Science (ASHS). Find them at journals.ashs.org.
Consider becoming an ASHS member at https://ashs.org/page/Becomeamember!
You can also find the official webpage for Plants, People, Science at ashs.org/plantspeoplesciencepodcast, and we encourage you to send us feedback or suggestions at https://ashs.org/webinarpodcastsuggestion.
Podcast transcripts are available at https://plantspeoplescience.buzzsprout.com.
On LinkedIn find Sam Humphrey at linkedin.com/in/samson-humphrey. Curt Rom is at https://www.linkedin.com/in/curt-rom-611085134/. Lena Wilson is at https://www.linkedin.com/in/lena-wilson-2531a5141/.
Thank you for listening!
...
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brind (00:08):
Welcome to Plants, people Science.
This is a podcast of theAmerican Society for
Horticultural Science, the ASHS,whose mission is to bring
together researchers, scientists, industry, academia, extension,
government and students tocultivate ideas and share new
techniques relating tohorticulture and plant sciences.
We'll be promoting this missionby interviewing leaders in the
(00:31):
field to pull back the curtainand to learn a little bit more
about the scientists and theirscience.
If you listened to the trailer,you might have already heard
who we are, but for all of youwho didn't, my name is Lara
Brindisi and I'm a plantbiologist with a focus on
breeding and genomics, and Ialso have experience in plant
physiology and chemistry.
I'm a PhD candidate in theSimon Lab, currently at Rutgers
(00:52):
University and my researchcenters on sweet basil, though
I've also worked on Africanindigenous vegetables and
vertically farmed leafy greens,and I'm Sam Humphrey, a master's
student at North Carolina StateUniversity.
I study ways to propagatestrawberry plants in controlled
environments or indoor farms.
In undergrad at the Universityof Florida, I studied plant
physiology and had variousengineering and
(01:14):
chemistry-focused projects.
Lara, how's your week going?
My week is going pretty good,actually.
We're in peak season forplanting, so I work mainly on
basil, sweet basil and weplanted huge trials this month
and we planted a CRISPR editedtrial actually this week.
So we're in the height of fieldseason.
(01:35):
It's great to get outdoors, geta little tan trying not to get
a farmer's tan as best as I canHow's everything going with you,
sam?
I can.
How's everything going with you, sam?
It's been a rough week.
My strawberry plants had a minicrisis this past Monday or
Tuesday and not many of themmade it, but my week has gotten
(01:55):
better.
I, admittedly, am working on farfewer plants than you are.
I have like 25 plants, but yousaid you have a lot of basil.
I'm so curious how much basilare you growing there?
Yeah, so the one that weplanted this week was a small
trial, only about 30 plots, sothat's about 300 plants.
But down south, at our otherfarm site about two hours away,
(02:19):
we've planted about 1300 plots,so it's way bigger.
I would say it's actually thelargest field study that we've
ever done on basil I think maybeanyone's ever done on basil.
So quite a lot of work, but wehave a big team.
Don't worry, this is just thebeginning.
I think we're going to need afuture episode on this podcast
(02:43):
about how you avoided farmer'stan, because I don't know how
you've done it.
A balance of tank tops androlling up my sleeve.
That's the whole episode.
No, no, no, leave the tips.
Leave the tips for later.
Okay, you got it All right.
So today we'll be talking withour very first guest, dr
Benjamin Cantbill.
(03:03):
He is an associate professor inthe Department of Agricultural
and Applied Economics at theUniversity of Georgia and he
studies consumer behavior andmarketing.
Dr Campbell has recentlypublished a paper entitled the
Impact of COVID-19 Pandemic onGardening in the United States
Post-Pandemic Expectations.
(03:23):
All right, welcome, dr Campbell.
How are you doing today?
I'm doing well, you've had along week.
You've been out and about andI'm sure your research was put
on hold but what does thattypically look like for you?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (03:45):
What does your work tend to look like?
So I am a sort of greenindustry economist so I deal
with a lot with nursery,greenhouse and turf industries,
mostly in the state of Georgia,but throughout the nation.
So a lot of my research isfocusing on issues from
production to marketingeconomics related on those areas
.
So it can be anything fromconsumer preferences to policy
(04:06):
to looking at what's happeningproduction-wise and the supply
chain side.
So it's very varied and a lotof it depends on what's
happening current issues.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (04:18):
How did you start studying something
like that?
I mean, the intersectionbetween horticulture and
economics is so crucial, but Idon't think it's something that
a lot of people in either fieldnecessarily think to intersect.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (04:31):
I would agree it is very, very few of us
that do sort of green industryeconomics because generally it
sort of marries agriculturaleconomics and horticulture
together.
I get a weird start, I wouldsay, in doing that.
When I went to Texas A&M for myPhD there was an advertisement
(04:52):
that came out that looking forsomeone to do research on
biodegradable potting containers.
So from the horticulturedepartment and I was in
agricultural economics and Icontacted Charlie Hall who put
the announcement out and fromthere we started working on a
project together and it sort offit from there and you know I
went from doing fruits andvegetables and looking at
(05:15):
national school lunch program tomore doing green industry,
greenhouse, nursery plants,those type things.
So it sort of evolved fromthere.
It was sort of just by chancethat I sort of focused in on
nursery greenhouse and turfinstead of doing something else.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (05:32):
So you're telling me you didn't
always dream of being ahorticultural economist.
The pieces kind of came intoplace.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (05:38):
Well, so starting out when I went to
college I didn't know I want tobe a veterinarian but I didn't
want to take chemistry, soagriculture economics was one
major didn't require chemistry,so that's for me.
And then from there I knew Iwant to be an agriculture
economist because I like theclasses I started doing for my
master's thesis at Auburn.
(05:58):
I did fruit and vegetable work,mostly fruit, looking at
consumer preferences, and so Iknew I really liked doing that
kind of stuff and so the plantside really didn't come in for a
while.
I knew I knew I liked theagricultural economics side.
I liked the specialty crop side.
So you know, the plant sort ofcame in later when I started my
(06:20):
PhD work at Texas A&M.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (06:22):
So I knew I wanted specialty crops.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (06:24):
It just focused on a lot more on the
plant side once I startedworking on the project at Texas
A&M.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (06:30):
I'm sure you didn't see this
pandemic coming either.
So how did that, how did thatwork in your master's and your
PhD, lead into what we'retalking about today with your
your current work in that paperon pandemic gardening?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (06:43):
Uh, yeah, I did not see the pandemic
coming.
Um, interesting enough, we putour house on the market the week
that the quarantine, umlockdown hit.
What came into effect inGeorgia, um, and so we were
looking to buy, uh, to movesomewhere in the area.
But we're where we were, arenow, but, yes, did not see that
coming.
You know, again, the one thingI like doing is looking for
(07:05):
issues that are impactingindustry, that can make an
impact.
So you know, sort of that'swhat I like to do.
If someone's already done it, Igenerally try to find something
new and interesting.
Pandemic provide thatopportunity to say, hey, what's
happening?
We had anecdotal evidencecoming in from uh, um industry
that that there was uptick in umplant purchases, and so it sort
(07:29):
of led into hey, I like doingnew and interesting things, and
we've got this anecdotalevidence that you know there's a
change happening in behaviorand sales, and so that sort of
led into the research of lookingat what happening pandemic was.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindis (07:41):
Sorry to hear about your housing
decision.
Bad timing for the market.
I guess you couldn't predictthe global pandemic.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (07:47):
Well, you can say bad or good, right, I
mean it's you know.
We ended up happy where we'reat, so it all worked out, yeah.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (07:55):
So I guess that leads us into the
paper.
Then, specifically withCOVID-19.
I mean, this was a reallyunpredictable event, but you
were able to use this phenomenonhappening around you and then
understand it more through yourresearch.
Can you talk a little bit abouthow you were able to do that?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (08:12):
Yeah, so we had a survey.
That was the way it started wassort of weird.
We had a survey that wassupposed to go out in January,
not January, march-ish of 2020.
The pandemic hit, so we pushedit back a little bit and several
(08:35):
months, until until I thinkwe'd end up doing it in july, uh
, and then from there it was thesurvey was looking at.
We sort of in happenstance, puta question in because we're
interested out the antidoteevidence that um sales were
going up, just so we wanted tosee, okay, what happened with
gardening sales um, from januaryjuly of 2020?
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (08:54):
and so that sort of led it.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (08:56):
It led to the start of this research.
You know, get pushed back onanother survey.
We had a couple of questions onsales and saw that sales were
up roughly 8% from January Julyof 2020.
And so that sort of got uswondering well, why are sales
going up?
Is it people are buying more?
Is it new people coming in themarket?
(09:16):
Why are sales going up?
Is it people are buying more?
Is it new people coming in themarket?
And so then we sort of wentabout and had another survey
lined up to do later in the year, coming into January of 2021.
So we were like, okay, well,who's in the market and are they
going to stay in the market?
Because what we see in mostmajor events is that someone
comes in the market or they dosome kind of change in behavior
(09:39):
and then sort of, as we moveaway, farther and farther away
from that event, people sort ofgo back to their norm, the
pre-event levels or consumptionor behaviors.
So we want to know, okay, whathappened and why, and who's
going to stay in the market ifthey were entered the market.
So that first paper paper, thechange in sales that led to the
second paper, the one ongardening, and who's going to be
(10:00):
in the market.
What we did January 21, askingdid you enter the market?
Did you start gardening or wereyou gardening before?
And then, what are your sort ofplans after this, after the
event, are you going to continuegardening?
So that's sort of how it led toa long path, of how we got from
no pandemic, no issue, tolooking at what's happening on
(10:24):
the sales side and the gardeningside.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindi (10:27):
That's wonderful.
Yeah, the sales side andgardening side is not something
I typically think of in my work,and so it's really exciting to
see how you looked at thisproblem.
So what would you say the maintakeaways are?
For someone who's listening tothis podcast or might not be
deeply in tune with this work,what are the main takeaways of
(10:49):
this research?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (10:52):
I think the big takeaways are that, I
mean, we are seeing a reversionto that pre-pandemic norm.
You know, you had peoplebecause they were stuck at home
for quarantine or they werescared or whatever reasons they
were at home they were, you know, couldn't do a lot of things,
and so gardening and thelandscape, those type things,
(11:15):
were something they could do,and so gardening and the
landscape, those type things,were something they could do,
given that most statesclassified greenhouses as
essential businesses.
The only two exceptions wereMichigan, which shut down
greenhouse greenhouses sales forroughly a month, two months.
And then you had New York, whohad some sort of restrictions on
(11:40):
greenhouse sales for a while.
Other than that, every otherstate had a greenhouses nursery
as essential businesses.
So you had these sales thatwere happening and, you know, at
some point people get to goback to sort of move out of that
pandemic lifestyle and go backto their norm where they've been
, going back to work, and sowe're seeing a reversion.
(12:02):
We see that, with even comingout of 2020, 2021, as you see in
the paper, that the largenumber of people started saying,
look, I'm not going to gardeneven though I started in 2020.
And we see it acrossdemographics, which is really
really interesting as well.
We see younger consumers thatthey entered gardening and then
(12:23):
some are sticking around, butsome are already stopping a year
in.
So I think that's the big thinghere is that we are seeing that
we're moving back towards thatpre-pandemic norm.
The question is, will it beexactly there?
Probably not.
We'll pick up some gardeners,but the big thing here is that
we are sort of reverting back tothat pre-pandemic levels.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (12:46):
So, if I'm understanding correctly,
the market aka growers,retailers, anyone in the supply
chain of gardening should not berelying on the 2020 levels of
purchasing, because millennialsare gardening just because they
had more time on their handsduring that period.
Is that correct?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (13:06):
Yeah, we saw 2020, people had time on
their hands they didn't have, asthe expenditures were going
down because they weren't havingto drive for work and they
weren't eating out as much, soyou had extra disposable income.
2021, we still saw increasedsales.
2022, from what I've heard,we've had sales decline a little
bit, and I think some of thestuff I've heard is that we've.
(13:28):
I guess would be that you areseeing less consumers come
through your bigger sales moredollars per consumer that comes
in, but less consumers comethrough your bigger sales more
dollars per consumer that comesin, but less consumers.
So you know we're going to seea drop off.
I mean, as people are turning,normal, dropping off is going to
take place, and I thinkmillennials are one of those
(13:50):
segments that there's thingsthey want to do they couldn't do
, so they got into gardening andnow they're getting out because
they can do those things theycouldn't do.
So they got into gardening andnow they're getting out because
they can do those things theycouldn't do before.
Um, you know, does that meanthat?
I mean, if a new variant comesabout that sort of slows things
down again, then yeah, we couldsee it higher sales and people
return to gardening.
But I mean, as it is, peopleare turning their normal
(14:10):
lifestyles.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (14:10):
We go back to that norm yeah, so
age was one of the mostimportant takeaways from my
understanding of the paper.
But you also mentioned how raceand household income can
explain the household's decisionto garden or not garden Can you
talk a little bit more aboutthat.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (14:30):
You're seeing that that they are more
likely to garden and they aremore likely to be in gardening,
which makes sense.
They have this buzz winds cometo do it.
They may have the time to do it, the resources to do it and the
space you know.
So you see those things.
You do see a myriad of things,such as even so, males were more
(14:54):
likely to be in gardening thanwomen were.
So we see that you knowdifferent races.
Generally, caucasians were alittle bit more likely to be
gardeners and remain ingardening than non-Caucasians.
So there are these differentthings.
I don't think these things areanything new.
I think we've seen that overtime.
It just sort of reiterates,sort of, where that pre-pandemic
(15:17):
norm is going to be.
We're going to return to it tosome form or fashion.
We're moving back that way andpeople who didn't garden before
are not going to garden after.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (15:34):
Just sort of the way we deal with
events.
We always sort of move back tothe norm.
Yeah, I know I'm certainlydropping a lot of my COVID
hobbies that I've picked up, butwhen I have more space I'll
surely get back into gardening.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (15:42):
Yeah, I mean that's the way we do it.
I mean you're at home, you havetime, so you had time to garden
, and then, once your time goesback, you go back to doing those
things that you were doing,whether it be going back to work
, eating out, whatever time goesaway.
And then you know, thereby, Iknow, we had a little bit more
time.
Summer sports sort of sloweddown for our kids, so thereby we
(16:03):
had time to really guard in theback.
And so you know, with thosesummer sports returning spring
and summer sports returning, nowwe have a garden that's not
near as big and it's not nearlyas maintained as it was in 2020.
So I mean you have this sort ofI mean it doesn't mean people
are going to go out andcompletely stop gardening, it
just maybe the size of yourgarden goes down because you
(16:24):
don't have that time.
But again, if you're thinkingabout a business and you're
thinking about expanding, youknow great, you may have the
same number of consumers orcustomers out there, but they
may be gardening less space,right?
So again, I know I've done somework with the Georgia Green
Industry Association, helpinggive not advice, but giving
(16:45):
things to consider on when youthink about expanding, because
some of these firms orbusinesses are looking to expand
and, you know, is that demandgoing to be there?
Are you going to have thoseconsumers that are going to be
in the market, that are going tobuy product, I mean, if you put
more on the market?
So those are some things we'relooking at here.
Why I think it's important isto help firms make decisions on
(17:07):
what they should consider whenthey go about deciding should
they expand or should they docertain things no-transcript.
Yeah, so my appointment is 60%extension, 40% teaching, and so
(17:34):
I, you know, a lot of time I dois working on issues for the
industry.
I do talks and I dopresentations and fact sheets,
write pieces in trade press togive information.
Right, I can't make a decisionfor someone.
My job, my goal and I think Iam successful if I can help
someone get more information tomake a decision.
(17:55):
So if a business is thinkingabout expanding and I can do
some kind of informational pieceto help them think about the
issues they need to consider,and that I think that's a
success.
And so I'm going to spend a lotof time trying to figure out
and trying to come up with waysto communicate results to the
(18:16):
industry so that they can makebetter decisions.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (18:19):
Is that where your future research
is going?
Can you give us any tidbits onwhat you're working on now?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (18:25):
Well, we've got some on the COVID
front.
We're looking at regulations tosee how much did the
regulations by state impact thegreen industry.
So we divided out theregulations by, say, low, medium
and high being high being veryrestrictive and low being
(18:45):
something like Georgia who wasbasically shut down for a very
short amount of time, thenreopened really quickly
Something like Georgia who wasbasically shut down for a very
short amount of time, thenreopened really quickly and
looking at, did thoseregulations impact the grain
industry sales?
So we're doing that.
That's sort of look at somestuff we're doing on the COVID
front.
I think there's there's moreresearch to be done on COVID,
looking at what are the impactsof using plants during COVID.
(19:10):
Did it help with mental issuesand helping reduce stress?
Those are some interestingthings that I'm not doing but I
think would be really cool to do.
So those are things on theCOVID front.
I think would be sort of whereI'm headed in that area to look
at.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (19:25):
It must be a very interesting time
to be an ag economist.
This sounds really exciting.
I'm curious what do you finddrives you in this?
Like, where do you find yourexcitement to keep going with
this work?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (19:40):
So it's always a fun time to be an ag
economist, and so we don't needa pandemic for that.
It's always exciting.
You know where do I find it?
I look at just looking atthings happening in the real
world is one of the big placesto find motivation to do
research or extension activities.
There's I'm doing stuff onlabor right now, looking at
(20:01):
labor issues.
There's consumer preferences,product introductions All of
those are very interesting to meand things that are very
worthwhile for on the supplyside and production side for
them to have answers to.
Whether it be what products orwhat should we be concentrating
on or what attributes doconsumers like, and that not
(20:24):
only helps on the productionside but also the breeding side.
What attributes should we bebreeding for?
Should it be a certain color,size, shape?
We just wrapped up a productwith the World Marketing Fund
looking at flowers and what typeof flowers people are buying.
What are the attributes thatare driving roses, the people
buying roses.
(20:44):
So again, those are things thatare interesting to me and I
think that keep me going on thatrespect.
There's a lot of interestingissues out there that can help
producers, consumers, academicsdoing breeding or whatever, that
are fun to look at.
So that's what keeps me going.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindis (21:06):
Great .
Can you elaborate on thatexample with the roses or on an
example that illustrates theconnection between breeders and
research and what's sold?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (21:15):
flowers.
When do people buy?
Why are they buying?
What are they buying and forwhat occasion?
And we looked at roses as sortof a subset and looked at what
(21:37):
are the attributes that aredriving people's purchasing
decision, whether it be origin,is it flower size, is it how
long it lasts and we foundsegments.
There are different segmentsout there that are people are
looking for different things.
So I'm a breeder and I'mlooking at I mean, should I be
trying to increase the how longthis rose is going to last once
(21:59):
it's cut, or the, or thepractices that will help make it
last longer, or should I beconcentrated on bloom size?
Those are some issues therethat we can look at.
How many consumers value thesedifferent things and then what
now drives them to as a breeder,what should I focus on?
You can't focus on everything,so what should you focus on?
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (22:19):
Very cool.
Do you have any advice foranyone who might be interested
in studying these types oftopics, whether doing something
like you do or making theseconnections?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (22:30):
Advice.
Well, I guess you gotta have tome you have fun with it, with
respect to be willing to becreative and realize there's a
lot of things out there and, youknow, pick something that's
going to be important to notonly you but also to the
industry as a whole.
I mean, I can find a bunch ofprojects that aren't going to
mean anything, that are going tobe worthless to the outside
(22:55):
world but I love doing them, butit doesn't mean anything.
So the big thing there is lookon the issues.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (23:00):
What are some issues?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (23:01):
you can contribute to that will make a
difference, whether it be on asmall difference on the breeding
size or a big difference inindustry where it was labor or
pandemic expansion, those typeof things right.
So big thing is find areas thatyou can contribute, especially
in areas that will make a bigdifference to some group or of
(23:24):
the industry.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindis (23:25):
Right , especially because something
like economics and horticulturalagricultural economics is a
very applied field close tobasic exploratory science Right.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (23:36):
Yeah, it's very applied, I mean, and
again, could we do theoreticalstuff?
Probably.
But to me at this point for mein my career, I like the applied
aspect.
I like to say, hey, my research, someone's reading it and it's
making a difference.
Right, and so you know, if Iwrite an article and it's no one
(23:58):
contacts me on or I don't, itdoesn't have applications to
help someone or to help themmake better decisions, then sort
of OK, why do it?
Then?
Sort of like okay, why did I doit?
So the big focus for me is tofind things that I can actually
hopefully help someone make abetter decision and better
business decision or productiondecision or something like that,
so they can be more successful.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindi (24:21):
That's fantastic.
You've worked in a lot ofdifferent fields.
It's really exciting to see allthe broad ways that you've
approach agriculture in youreconomics research.
So if anyone wants to find yourwork or reach out to you, how
would you suggest they do that?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (24:40):
Basically , email is the best way.
I don't really do social mediathat much, so, as far as you
know, email is probably theeasiest way and the best way to
make that connection, whether itbe to discuss something that we
need to be looking at as ahorticultural ag economist, or
whether we need something that Imean a person to collaborate on
(25:01):
.
Something and that's theeasiest way is email.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindis (25:04):
Great , and is there anything else
that you want to mention butdidn't get the chance to say yet
?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (25:08):
Not that I know of.
I mean it's a fun time to be anagricultural economist dealing
with, you know, the grainindustry.
There's not a lot of us, soit's sort of a tight-knit group
that work on these things, andso you know it's a fun time
because there's a lot of issuesthere that not many people are
working on.
I mean, if you think aboutother issues where you go about
(25:33):
overall labor or the economy,things like that a lot of people
working on them, even fruitsand vegetables a lot of people
working on it.
Greenhouse nursery plants veryfew people.
And so there's a lot of roomfor growth and to do different
things and doing in the greenindustry different things and
(25:54):
doing in the green industry.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindis (25:55):
Great , always exciting to discover
new niche fields for everyoneout there interested in
horticulture but not sure wherethey quite fit in yet.
Well, I think that brings us tothe end of this discussion.
Thank you so, so much forjoining us, dr Campbell.
So, going into thisconversation, lara, what did you
(26:18):
expect, like did you?
Did you expect something verydifferent from what the paper
talked about?
You know, I guess it's not somuch that I had different
expectations.
I guess I didn't think abouthow some businesses might
actually be consistentlyincreasing in their revenue.
(26:41):
I mean, I noticed it in acertain way, right, like when I
ordered seeds.
My seed was backlogged formonths before I could actually
get it in the mail.
So I was like, oh, this isweird.
I guess all these new hobbygrowers are getting into this
industry.
So it makes sense, right, itmakes sense.
I guess hearing about howconsumer interest in gardening
(27:05):
increased during COVID-19 didn'texactly surprise me, but it
surprised me that we're notseeing some of that renewed
interest stick around.
I would have expected people tobe getting more in touch with
nature and kind of gettingreally excited by it, but it
seems like people are gettingback to the hustle and bustle
after the COVID-19 pandemic issubsiding in its intensity.
(27:28):
Yeah, that was reallyinteresting, especially, I think
it was the younger populationof people, like a younger
generation said like they werelooking into the future and
they've said I'm less likely togarden next year, which like
blew my mind, like I wouldn'tsay that and and the people I'm
around you know aren't sayingthose things, and so it's really
(27:50):
interesting to hear that peopleare actually expecting that of
themselves as they go back andforth.
Right, I can imagine it withgoing back to work, though, and
picking up a busy schedule andnot being home as much, and then
finding out how much workgardening takes up.
When you start gardening forthe first time, I could
definitely see it, but thenagain, maybe I just get too
(28:10):
attached to my plants becauseI'm like I could definitely see
it, but then again, like maybe Ijust get too attached to my
plants because I'm like I neverwant it to die, like I'll just
keep propagating it for years,trying to keep it alive.
So maybe I have that bias in myhead.
Yeah, and of course, there aremany, many, many tragedies of
COVID-19.
But if there is one smallshining light in there.
(28:31):
It's that more people got theopportunity to get a feel for
plants, maybe gain a newappreciation for how much work
it takes to garden and to growthings from scratch.
It's rewarding.
More people should do it.
And, yeah, it's very, very cooltakeaway from COVID and, who
(28:54):
knows, maybe some people willpick it back up that had tried
it in COVID-19 and they'll tryit again later.
We'll see.
The paper from today's articlewas published in Hort Technology
in the May 2022 issue.
You can find it and otherarticles published through
ASHS's three open accessjournals at journalsashsorg.
(29:17):
Sam, if people want to followyour work, what's the best way?
You can find me by searching myname on LinkedIn.
That is, samson Humphrey andLara.
What about you?
You can follow me on Instagram,at ThePlantPhD, or on LinkedIn
with the tag Lara Brindisi.
You can find these links andother links in my link tree in
(29:39):
the show notes.
I mainly use Instagram to showsome pictures of what my
research actually looks like,and my LinkedIn to share
professional resources.
Ashs podcasts are made possibleby member dues and volunteerism
.
Please go to ashsorg to learnmore.
If you are not already a memberof ASHS, we invite you to join
us.
Ashs is a not-for-profit andyour donations are tax
(30:01):
deductible.
This episode was hosted by SamHumphrey and Lara Brindisi.
Special thanks to our audioengineer, Alex Fraser, our
research team, lena Wilson andAndrew Komatz, our ASHS support
team, sarah Powell and SallyMurphy, and our musician, john
Clark.
Welcome to Plants, people Science.
This is a podcast of theAmerican Society for
Horticultural Science, the ASHS,whose mission is to bring
together researchers, scientists, industry, academia, extension,
government and students tocultivate ideas and share new
techniques relating tohorticulture and plant sciences.
We'll be promoting this missionby interviewing leaders in the
(00:31):
field to pull back the curtainand to learn a little bit more
about the scientists and theirscience.
If you listened to the trailer,you might have already heard
who we are, but for all of youwho didn't, my name is Lara
Brindisi and I'm a plantbiologist with a focus on
breeding and genomics, and Ialso have experience in plant
physiology and chemistry.
I'm a PhD candidate in theSimon Lab, currently at Rutgers
(00:52):
University and my researchcenters on sweet basil, though
I've also worked on Africanindigenous vegetables and
vertically farmed leafy greens,and I'm Sam Humphrey, a master's
student at North Carolina StateUniversity.
I study ways to propagatestrawberry plants in controlled
environments or indoor farms.
In undergrad at the Universityof Florida, I studied plant
physiology and had variousengineering and
(01:14):
chemistry-focused projects.
Lara, how's your week going?
My week is going pretty good,actually.
We're in peak season forplanting, so I work mainly on
basil, sweet basil and weplanted huge trials this month
and we planted a CRISPR editedtrial actually this week.
So we're in the height of fieldseason.
(01:35):
It's great to get outdoors, geta little tan trying not to get
a farmer's tan as best as I canHow's everything going with you,
sam?
I can.
How's everything going with you, sam?
It's been a rough week.
My strawberry plants had a minicrisis this past Monday or
Tuesday and not many of themmade it, but my week has gotten
(01:55):
better.
I, admittedly, am working on farfewer plants than you are.
I have like 25 plants, but yousaid you have a lot of basil.
I'm so curious how much basilare you growing there?
Yeah, so the one that weplanted this week was a small
trial, only about 30 plots, sothat's about 300 plants.
But down south, at our otherfarm site about two hours away,
(02:19):
we've planted about 1300 plots,so it's way bigger.
I would say it's actually thelargest field study that we've
ever done on basil I think maybeanyone's ever done on basil.
So quite a lot of work, but wehave a big team.
Don't worry, this is just thebeginning.
I think we're going to need afuture episode on this podcast
(02:43):
about how you avoided farmer'stan, because I don't know how
you've done it.
A balance of tank tops androlling up my sleeve.
That's the whole episode.
No, no, no, leave the tips.
Leave the tips for later.
Okay, you got it All right.
So today we'll be talking withour very first guest, dr
Benjamin Cantbill.
(03:03):
He is an associate professor inthe Department of Agricultural
and Applied Economics at theUniversity of Georgia and he
studies consumer behavior andmarketing.
Dr Campbell has recentlypublished a paper entitled the
Impact of COVID-19 Pandemic onGardening in the United States
Post-Pandemic Expectations.
(03:23):
All right, welcome, dr Campbell.
How are you doing today?
I'm doing well, you've had along week.
You've been out and about andI'm sure your research was put
on hold but what does thattypically look like for you?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (03:45):
What does your work tend to look like?
So I am a sort of greenindustry economist so I deal
with a lot with nursery,greenhouse and turf industries,
mostly in the state of Georgia,but throughout the nation.
So a lot of my research isfocusing on issues from
production to marketingeconomics related on those areas
.
So it can be anything fromconsumer preferences to policy
(04:06):
to looking at what's happeningproduction-wise and the supply
chain side.
So it's very varied and a lotof it depends on what's
happening current issues.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (04:18):
How did you start studying something
like that?
I mean, the intersectionbetween horticulture and
economics is so crucial, but Idon't think it's something that
a lot of people in either fieldnecessarily think to intersect.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (04:31):
I would agree it is very, very few of us
that do sort of green industryeconomics because generally it
sort of marries agriculturaleconomics and horticulture
together.
I get a weird start, I wouldsay, in doing that.
When I went to Texas A&M for myPhD there was an advertisement
(04:52):
that came out that looking forsomeone to do research on
biodegradable potting containers.
So from the horticulturedepartment and I was in
agricultural economics and Icontacted Charlie Hall who put
the announcement out and fromthere we started working on a
project together and it sort offit from there and you know I
went from doing fruits andvegetables and looking at
(05:15):
national school lunch program tomore doing green industry,
greenhouse, nursery plants,those type things.
So it sort of evolved fromthere.
It was sort of just by chancethat I sort of focused in on
nursery greenhouse and turfinstead of doing something else.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (05:32):
So you're telling me you didn't
always dream of being ahorticultural economist.
The pieces kind of came intoplace.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (05:38):
Well, so starting out when I went to
college I didn't know I want tobe a veterinarian but I didn't
want to take chemistry, soagriculture economics was one
major didn't require chemistry,so that's for me.
And then from there I knew Iwant to be an agriculture
economist because I like theclasses I started doing for my
master's thesis at Auburn.
(05:58):
I did fruit and vegetable work,mostly fruit, looking at
consumer preferences, and so Iknew I really liked doing that
kind of stuff and so the plantside really didn't come in for a
while.
I knew I knew I liked theagricultural economics side.
I liked the specialty crop side.
So you know, the plant sort ofcame in later when I started my
(06:20):
PhD work at Texas A&M.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (06:22):
So I knew I wanted specialty crops.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (06:24):
It just focused on a lot more on the
plant side once I startedworking on the project at Texas
A&M.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (06:30):
I'm sure you didn't see this
pandemic coming either.
So how did that, how did thatwork in your master's and your
PhD, lead into what we'retalking about today with your
your current work in that paperon pandemic gardening?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (06:43):
Uh, yeah, I did not see the pandemic
coming.
Um, interesting enough, we putour house on the market the week
that the quarantine, umlockdown hit.
What came into effect inGeorgia, um, and so we were
looking to buy, uh, to movesomewhere in the area.
But we're where we were, arenow, but, yes, did not see that
coming.
You know, again, the one thingI like doing is looking for
(07:05):
issues that are impactingindustry, that can make an
impact.
So you know, sort of that'swhat I like to do.
If someone's already done it, Igenerally try to find something
new and interesting.
Pandemic provide thatopportunity to say, hey, what's
happening?
We had anecdotal evidencecoming in from uh, um industry
that that there was uptick in umplant purchases, and so it sort
(07:29):
of led into hey, I like doingnew and interesting things, and
we've got this anecdotalevidence that you know there's a
change happening in behaviorand sales, and so that sort of
led into the research of lookingat what happening pandemic was.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindis (07:41):
Sorry to hear about your housing
decision.
Bad timing for the market.
I guess you couldn't predictthe global pandemic.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (07:47):
Well, you can say bad or good, right, I
mean it's you know.
We ended up happy where we'reat, so it all worked out, yeah.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (07:55):
So I guess that leads us into the
paper.
Then, specifically withCOVID-19.
I mean, this was a reallyunpredictable event, but you
were able to use this phenomenonhappening around you and then
understand it more through yourresearch.
Can you talk a little bit abouthow you were able to do that?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (08:12):
Yeah, so we had a survey.
That was the way it started wassort of weird.
We had a survey that wassupposed to go out in January,
not January, march-ish of 2020.
The pandemic hit, so we pushedit back a little bit and several
(08:35):
months, until until I thinkwe'd end up doing it in july, uh
, and then from there it was thesurvey was looking at.
We sort of in happenstance, puta question in because we're
interested out the antidoteevidence that um sales were
going up, just so we wanted tosee, okay, what happened with
gardening sales um, from januaryjuly of 2020?
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (08:54):
and so that sort of led it.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (08:56):
It led to the start of this research.
You know, get pushed back onanother survey.
We had a couple of questions onsales and saw that sales were
up roughly 8% from January Julyof 2020.
And so that sort of got uswondering well, why are sales
going up?
Is it people are buying more?
Is it new people coming in themarket?
(09:16):
Why are sales going up?
Is it people are buying more?
Is it new people coming in themarket?
And so then we sort of wentabout and had another survey
lined up to do later in the year, coming into January of 2021.
So we were like, okay, well,who's in the market and are they
going to stay in the market?
Because what we see in mostmajor events is that someone
comes in the market or they dosome kind of change in behavior
(09:39):
and then sort of, as we moveaway, farther and farther away
from that event, people sort ofgo back to their norm, the
pre-event levels or consumptionor behaviors.
So we want to know, okay, whathappened and why, and who's
going to stay in the market ifthey were entered the market.
So that first paper paper, thechange in sales that led to the
second paper, the one ongardening, and who's going to be
(10:00):
in the market.
What we did January 21, askingdid you enter the market?
Did you start gardening or wereyou gardening before?
And then, what are your sort ofplans after this, after the
event, are you going to continuegardening?
So that's sort of how it led toa long path, of how we got from
no pandemic, no issue, tolooking at what's happening on
(10:24):
the sales side and the gardeningside.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindi (10:27):
That's wonderful.
Yeah, the sales side andgardening side is not something
I typically think of in my work,and so it's really exciting to
see how you looked at thisproblem.
So what would you say the maintakeaways are?
For someone who's listening tothis podcast or might not be
deeply in tune with this work,what are the main takeaways of
(10:49):
this research?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (10:52):
I think the big takeaways are that, I
mean, we are seeing a reversionto that pre-pandemic norm.
You know, you had peoplebecause they were stuck at home
for quarantine or they werescared or whatever reasons they
were at home they were, you know, couldn't do a lot of things,
and so gardening and thelandscape, those type things,
(11:15):
were something they could do,and so gardening and the
landscape, those type things,were something they could do,
given that most statesclassified greenhouses as
essential businesses.
The only two exceptions wereMichigan, which shut down
greenhouse greenhouses sales forroughly a month, two months.
And then you had New York, whohad some sort of restrictions on
(11:40):
greenhouse sales for a while.
Other than that, every otherstate had a greenhouses nursery
as essential businesses.
So you had these sales thatwere happening and, you know, at
some point people get to goback to sort of move out of that
pandemic lifestyle and go backto their norm where they've been
, going back to work, and sowe're seeing a reversion.
(12:02):
We see that, with even comingout of 2020, 2021, as you see in
the paper, that the largenumber of people started saying,
look, I'm not going to gardeneven though I started in 2020.
And we see it acrossdemographics, which is really
really interesting as well.
We see younger consumers thatthey entered gardening and then
(12:23):
some are sticking around, butsome are already stopping a year
in.
So I think that's the big thinghere is that we are seeing that
we're moving back towards thatpre-pandemic norm.
The question is, will it beexactly there?
Probably not.
We'll pick up some gardeners,but the big thing here is that
we are sort of reverting back tothat pre-pandemic levels.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (12:46):
So, if I'm understanding correctly,
the market aka growers,retailers, anyone in the supply
chain of gardening should not berelying on the 2020 levels of
purchasing, because millennialsare gardening just because they
had more time on their handsduring that period.
Is that correct?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (13:06):
Yeah, we saw 2020, people had time on
their hands they didn't have, asthe expenditures were going
down because they weren't havingto drive for work and they
weren't eating out as much, soyou had extra disposable income.
2021, we still saw increasedsales.
2022, from what I've heard,we've had sales decline a little
bit, and I think some of thestuff I've heard is that we've.
(13:28):
I guess would be that you areseeing less consumers come
through your bigger sales moredollars per consumer that comes
in, but less consumers comethrough your bigger sales more
dollars per consumer that comesin, but less consumers.
So you know we're going to seea drop off.
I mean, as people are turning,normal, dropping off is going to
take place, and I thinkmillennials are one of those
(13:50):
segments that there's thingsthey want to do they couldn't do
, so they got into gardening andnow they're getting out because
they can do those things theycouldn't do.
So they got into gardening andnow they're getting out because
they can do those things theycouldn't do before.
Um, you know, does that meanthat?
I mean, if a new variant comesabout that sort of slows things
down again, then yeah, we couldsee it higher sales and people
return to gardening.
But I mean, as it is, peopleare turning their normal
(14:10):
lifestyles.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (14:10):
We go back to that norm yeah, so
age was one of the mostimportant takeaways from my
understanding of the paper.
But you also mentioned how raceand household income can
explain the household's decisionto garden or not garden Can you
talk a little bit more aboutthat.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (14:30):
You're seeing that that they are more
likely to garden and they aremore likely to be in gardening,
which makes sense.
They have this buzz winds cometo do it.
They may have the time to do it, the resources to do it and the
space you know.
So you see those things.
You do see a myriad of things,such as even so, males were more
(14:54):
likely to be in gardening thanwomen were.
So we see that you knowdifferent races.
Generally, caucasians were alittle bit more likely to be
gardeners and remain ingardening than non-Caucasians.
So there are these differentthings.
I don't think these things areanything new.
I think we've seen that overtime.
It just sort of reiterates,sort of, where that pre-pandemic
(15:17):
norm is going to be.
We're going to return to it tosome form or fashion.
We're moving back that way andpeople who didn't garden before
are not going to garden after.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (15:34):
Just sort of the way we deal with
events.
We always sort of move back tothe norm.
Yeah, I know I'm certainlydropping a lot of my COVID
hobbies that I've picked up, butwhen I have more space I'll
surely get back into gardening.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (15:42):
Yeah, I mean that's the way we do it.
I mean you're at home, you havetime, so you had time to garden
, and then, once your time goesback, you go back to doing those
things that you were doing,whether it be going back to work
, eating out, whatever time goesaway.
And then you know, thereby, Iknow, we had a little bit more
time.
Summer sports sort of sloweddown for our kids, so thereby we
(16:03):
had time to really guard in theback.
And so you know, with thosesummer sports returning spring
and summer sports returning, nowwe have a garden that's not
near as big and it's not nearlyas maintained as it was in 2020.
So I mean you have this sort ofI mean it doesn't mean people
are going to go out andcompletely stop gardening, it
just maybe the size of yourgarden goes down because you
(16:24):
don't have that time.
But again, if you're thinkingabout a business and you're
thinking about expanding, youknow great, you may have the
same number of consumers orcustomers out there, but they
may be gardening less space,right?
So again, I know I've done somework with the Georgia Green
Industry Association, helpinggive not advice, but giving
(16:45):
things to consider on when youthink about expanding, because
some of these firms orbusinesses are looking to expand
and, you know, is that demandgoing to be there?
Are you going to have thoseconsumers that are going to be
in the market, that are going tobuy product, I mean, if you put
more on the market?
So those are some things we'relooking at here.
Why I think it's important isto help firms make decisions on
(17:07):
what they should consider whenthey go about deciding should
they expand or should they docertain things no-transcript.
Yeah, so my appointment is 60%extension, 40% teaching, and so
(17:34):
I, you know, a lot of time I dois working on issues for the
industry.
I do talks and I dopresentations and fact sheets,
write pieces in trade press togive information.
Right, I can't make a decisionfor someone.
My job, my goal and I think Iam successful if I can help
someone get more information tomake a decision.
(17:55):
So if a business is thinkingabout expanding and I can do
some kind of informational pieceto help them think about the
issues they need to consider,and that I think that's a
success.
And so I'm going to spend a lotof time trying to figure out
and trying to come up with waysto communicate results to the
(18:16):
industry so that they can makebetter decisions.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (18:19):
Is that where your future research
is going?
Can you give us any tidbits onwhat you're working on now?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (18:25):
Well, we've got some on the COVID
front.
We're looking at regulations tosee how much did the
regulations by state impact thegreen industry.
So we divided out theregulations by, say, low, medium
and high being high being veryrestrictive and low being
(18:45):
something like Georgia who wasbasically shut down for a very
short amount of time, thenreopened really quickly
Something like Georgia who wasbasically shut down for a very
short amount of time, thenreopened really quickly and
looking at, did thoseregulations impact the grain
industry sales?
So we're doing that.
That's sort of look at somestuff we're doing on the COVID
front.
I think there's there's moreresearch to be done on COVID,
looking at what are the impactsof using plants during COVID.
(19:10):
Did it help with mental issuesand helping reduce stress?
Those are some interestingthings that I'm not doing but I
think would be really cool to do.
So those are things on theCOVID front.
I think would be sort of whereI'm headed in that area to look
at.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (19:25):
It must be a very interesting time
to be an ag economist.
This sounds really exciting.
I'm curious what do you finddrives you in this?
Like, where do you find yourexcitement to keep going with
this work?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (19:40):
So it's always a fun time to be an ag
economist, and so we don't needa pandemic for that.
It's always exciting.
You know where do I find it?
I look at just looking atthings happening in the real
world is one of the big placesto find motivation to do
research or extension activities.
There's I'm doing stuff onlabor right now, looking at
(20:01):
labor issues.
There's consumer preferences,product introductions All of
those are very interesting to meand things that are very
worthwhile for on the supplyside and production side for
them to have answers to.
Whether it be what products orwhat should we be concentrating
on or what attributes doconsumers like, and that not
(20:24):
only helps on the productionside but also the breeding side.
What attributes should we bebreeding for?
Should it be a certain color,size, shape?
We just wrapped up a productwith the World Marketing Fund
looking at flowers and what typeof flowers people are buying.
What are the attributes thatare driving roses, the people
buying roses.
(20:44):
So again, those are things thatare interesting to me and I
think that keep me going on thatrespect.
There's a lot of interestingissues out there that can help
producers, consumers, academicsdoing breeding or whatever, that
are fun to look at.
So that's what keeps me going.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindis (21:06):
Great .
Can you elaborate on thatexample with the roses or on an
example that illustrates theconnection between breeders and
research and what's sold?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (21:15):
flowers.
When do people buy?
Why are they buying?
What are they buying and forwhat occasion?
And we looked at roses as sortof a subset and looked at what
(21:37):
are the attributes that aredriving people's purchasing
decision, whether it be origin,is it flower size, is it how
long it lasts and we foundsegments.
There are different segmentsout there that are people are
looking for different things.
So I'm a breeder and I'mlooking at I mean, should I be
trying to increase the how longthis rose is going to last once
(21:59):
it's cut, or the, or thepractices that will help make it
last longer, or should I beconcentrated on bloom size?
Those are some issues therethat we can look at.
How many consumers value thesedifferent things and then what
now drives them to as a breeder,what should I focus on?
You can't focus on everything,so what should you focus on?
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (22:19):
Very cool.
Do you have any advice foranyone who might be interested
in studying these types oftopics, whether doing something
like you do or making theseconnections?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (22:30):
Advice.
Well, I guess you gotta have tome you have fun with it, with
respect to be willing to becreative and realize there's a
lot of things out there and, youknow, pick something that's
going to be important to notonly you but also to the
industry as a whole.
I mean, I can find a bunch ofprojects that aren't going to
mean anything, that are going tobe worthless to the outside
(22:55):
world but I love doing them, butit doesn't mean anything.
So the big thing there is lookon the issues.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindisi (23:00):
What are some issues?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (23:01):
you can contribute to that will make a
difference, whether it be on asmall difference on the breeding
size or a big difference inindustry where it was labor or
pandemic expansion, those typeof things right.
So big thing is find areas thatyou can contribute, especially
in areas that will make a bigdifference to some group or of
(23:24):
the industry.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindis (23:25):
Right , especially because something
like economics and horticulturalagricultural economics is a
very applied field close tobasic exploratory science Right.
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (23:36):
Yeah, it's very applied, I mean, and
again, could we do theoreticalstuff?
Probably.
But to me at this point for mein my career, I like the applied
aspect.
I like to say, hey, my research, someone's reading it and it's
making a difference.
Right, and so you know, if Iwrite an article and it's no one
(23:58):
contacts me on or I don't, itdoesn't have applications to
help someone or to help themmake better decisions, then sort
of OK, why do it?
Then?
Sort of like okay, why did I doit?
So the big focus for me is tofind things that I can actually
hopefully help someone make abetter decision and better
business decision or productiondecision or something like that,
so they can be more successful.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindi (24:21):
That's fantastic.
You've worked in a lot ofdifferent fields.
It's really exciting to see allthe broad ways that you've
approach agriculture in youreconomics research.
So if anyone wants to find yourwork or reach out to you, how
would you suggest they do that?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (24:40):
Basically , email is the best way.
I don't really do social mediathat much, so, as far as you
know, email is probably theeasiest way and the best way to
make that connection, whether itbe to discuss something that we
need to be looking at as ahorticultural ag economist, or
whether we need something that Imean a person to collaborate on
(25:01):
.
Something and that's theeasiest way is email.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindis (25:04):
Great , and is there anything else
that you want to mention butdidn't get the chance to say yet
?
Dr. Benjamin Campbell (25:08):
Not that I know of.
I mean it's a fun time to be anagricultural economist dealing
with, you know, the grainindustry.
There's not a lot of us, soit's sort of a tight-knit group
that work on these things, andso you know it's a fun time
because there's a lot of issuesthere that not many people are
working on.
I mean, if you think aboutother issues where you go about
(25:33):
overall labor or the economy,things like that a lot of people
working on them, even fruitsand vegetables a lot of people
working on it.
Greenhouse nursery plants veryfew people.
And so there's a lot of roomfor growth and to do different
things and doing in the greenindustry different things and
(25:54):
doing in the green industry.
Sam Humphrey/Lara Brindis (25:55):
Great , always exciting to discover
new niche fields for everyoneout there interested in
horticulture but not sure wherethey quite fit in yet.
Well, I think that brings us tothe end of this discussion.
Thank you so, so much forjoining us, dr Campbell.
So, going into thisconversation, lara, what did you
(26:18):
expect, like did you?
Did you expect something verydifferent from what the paper
talked about?
You know, I guess it's not somuch that I had different
expectations.
I guess I didn't think abouthow some businesses might
actually be consistentlyincreasing in their revenue.
(26:41):
I mean, I noticed it in acertain way, right, like when I
ordered seeds.
My seed was backlogged formonths before I could actually
get it in the mail.
So I was like, oh, this isweird.
I guess all these new hobbygrowers are getting into this
industry.
So it makes sense, right, itmakes sense.
I guess hearing about howconsumer interest in gardening
(27:05):
increased during COVID-19 didn'texactly surprise me, but it
surprised me that we're notseeing some of that renewed
interest stick around.
I would have expected people tobe getting more in touch with
nature and kind of gettingreally excited by it, but it
seems like people are gettingback to the hustle and bustle
after the COVID-19 pandemic issubsiding in its intensity.
(27:28):
Yeah, that was reallyinteresting, especially, I think
it was the younger populationof people, like a younger
generation said like they werelooking into the future and
they've said I'm less likely togarden next year, which like
blew my mind, like I wouldn'tsay that and and the people I'm
around you know aren't sayingthose things, and so it's really
(27:50):
interesting to hear that peopleare actually expecting that of
themselves as they go back andforth.
Right, I can imagine it withgoing back to work, though, and
picking up a busy schedule andnot being home as much, and then
finding out how much workgardening takes up.
When you start gardening forthe first time, I could
definitely see it, but thenagain, maybe I just get too
(28:10):
attached to my plants becauseI'm like I could definitely see
it, but then again, like maybe Ijust get too attached to my
plants because I'm like I neverwant it to die, like I'll just
keep propagating it for years,trying to keep it alive.
So maybe I have that bias in myhead.
Yeah, and of course, there aremany, many, many tragedies of
COVID-19.
But if there is one smallshining light in there.
(28:31):
It's that more people got theopportunity to get a feel for
plants, maybe gain a newappreciation for how much work
it takes to garden and to growthings from scratch.
It's rewarding.
More people should do it.
And, yeah, it's very, very cooltakeaway from COVID and, who
(28:54):
knows, maybe some people willpick it back up that had tried
it in COVID-19 and they'll tryit again later.
We'll see.
The paper from today's articlewas published in Hort Technology
in the May 2022 issue.
You can find it and otherarticles published through
ASHS's three open accessjournals at journalsashsorg.
(29:17):
Sam, if people want to followyour work, what's the best way?
You can find me by searching myname on LinkedIn.
That is, samson Humphrey andLara.
What about you?
You can follow me on Instagram,at ThePlantPhD, or on LinkedIn
with the tag Lara Brindisi.
You can find these links andother links in my link tree in
(29:39):
the show notes.
I mainly use Instagram to showsome pictures of what my
research actually looks like,and my LinkedIn to share
professional resources.
Ashs podcasts are made possibleby member dues and volunteerism
.
Please go to ashsorg to learnmore.
If you are not already a memberof ASHS, we invite you to join
us.
Ashs is a not-for-profit andyour donations are tax
(30:01):
deductible.
This episode was hosted by SamHumphrey and Lara Brindisi.
Special thanks to our audioengineer, Alex Fraser, our
research team, lena Wilson andAndrew Komatz, our ASHS support
team, sarah Powell and SallyMurphy, and our musician, john
Clark.
Popular Podcasts
40s and Free Agents: NFL Draft Season
Daniel Jeremiah of Move the Sticks and Gregg Rosenthal of NFL Daily join forces to break down every team's needs this offseason.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
The Bobby Bones Show
Listen to 'The Bobby Bones Show' by downloading the daily full replay.