December 9, 2024 • 36 mins
Networking isn't just about exchanging business cards - it's about building real, sustainable relationships that will help you business thrive.
In this episode, Helena Baker, founder of English Speaking Network, shares the inspiring story of her move to Israel four years ago and how she couldn't find the community she was looking for, so she created it!
Fast-forward to today, Helena truly is a "Networking Queen" who understands what it means to network INTENTIONALLY without being a salesy weirdo. In this epsiode, she shares practical strategies for maximizing your networking experiences - from setting the right goals and mastering follow-ups to crafting meaningful interactions at events, Helena lots of insights and some pro-tips you've probably never heard before!
This episode will leave you feeling empowered to up your networking game and integrate it seamlessly into your business growth strategy, while staying true to yourself.
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The Powerful Women Rising Virtual Speed Networking Event is the perfect place to put some of these tips into action!
- Join us at our next PWR Virtual Speed Networking Event!
Learn more about becoming a member of the Powerful Women Rising Community here: https://powerfulwomenrising.com/community/
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To connect with Helena Baker or learn more about English Speaking Network:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/helenabaker/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/networkwithhelena/
Connect with Your Host!
Melissa Snow is a Business Relationship Strategist dedicated to empowering women in entrepreneurship. She founded the Powerful Women Rising Community, which provides female business owners with essential support and resources for business growth.
Melissa's other mission is to revolutionize networking, promoting authenticity and genuine connections over sleazy sales tactics. She runs an incredible monthly Virtual Speed Networking Event which you can attend once at no cost using the code FIRSTTIME
She lives in Colorado Springs with two girl dogs, two boy cats and any number of foster kittens. She loves iced coffee, Taylor Swift, and Threads.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to Powerful Women Rising, the podcast where
we ditch the rulebook and buildbusinesses with authenticity,
integrity and a whole lot of fun.
Join host Melissa Snow,business relationship strategist
and founder of the PowerfulWomen Rising community, as she
interviews top experts andshares candid insights on
business strategy, marketing,mindset and more.
(00:22):
Let's get real, get inspiredand rise together.
This is Powerful Women Rising.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode
of the Powerful Women Risingpodcast.
I'm your host, melissa Snow,super excited to be joining you
on this lovely Monday morning.
How are things going in yourworld?
Did you know that when you arelistening to a podcast this is
for those of you who areimpatient like me and like to
listen to your podcasts on 1.5speed and hit that little skip
(00:53):
30 second button?
If you listen to this podcastregularly, that little intro is
30 seconds exactly, so as soonas you hear it, you can push the
30 second button and you'll beright where you need to be, here
with me.
I am so excited to share today'sepisode with you.
I know I say that all the time,like every single week, but
(01:14):
this is one of the most funinterviews I've done in a while.
If you've been listening to mefor a bit, you know I think I'm
pretty funny and today's guestis also very funny.
So we had a great time talkingabout networking, which is in my
wheelhouse and also in hers,and it was really fun because
(01:37):
she shared some things that Ihad never thought about before
and some tips for when to showup at a networking event, what
to do before you go to anetworking event, and it's just
so fun to hear other people'sperspectives.
This is one of the reasons Iget so bent out of shape about
networking groups that areexclusive, where you can only
(01:58):
have one person per industry, ornetworking groups that are
exclusive in terms of if you'rein this group, or networking
groups that are exclusive interms of if you're in this group
, you can't be in any othergroups.
Because when you are withsomebody who does the same or
something similar to what you doas I was in this interview with
Helena Baker you get to hear adifferent perspective.
You get to hear other people'sexperiences.
(02:20):
You get to talk about thingsthat don't necessarily relate to
everyone else, but when youguys talk about them, the other
person is always like oh my gosh.
Yes, I hate that, but if you'retalking to somebody who's in a
different industry, they arelike I don't know what you're
talking about.
So that is my soapbox for theday and also my explanation of
(02:42):
one of many reasons I enjoyeddoing this interview with Helena
Baker.
So she was born and raised inEngland.
She started a copywritingbusiness at the age of 21 with
no contacts and no idea what shewas doing.
So she went out and startednetworking and attended pretty
much all of the networkinggroups in London, and then four
(03:04):
years ago, she moved to Israeland she found that in Israel,
there was not much of a formalnetworking community for English
speakers, and so she decided tocreate one.
She is the founder of theEnglish Speaking Network, which
now has multiple in-persongroups in Israel, and more
recently saw demand for onlinemeetings, and so last year she
(03:26):
founded the InternationalEnglish Speaking Network, with a
focus on helping businessowners all over the world
network and grow their business.
So you can see why I love herand why I had so much fun
chatting with her aboutnetworking strategies.
I am going to share thisinterview with you without
further ado, but, as always, Iwould love to connect with you
(03:47):
over on Instagram and hear yourthoughts.
I am certain you're going tohear something in this interview
that you're like oh, I neverthought about that before and I
would love to know what it is.
All right, here we go.
This is my interview withHelena Baker.
Hello, helena, welcome to thepodcast.
Thank you for having me, yeah,so excited for our chat today.
We're talking about one of myfavorite things networking, so
(04:10):
let's talk a little bit aboutyour background, like why are
you the person to talk to usabout networking and how did you
get to this space?
Speaker 3 (04:17):
I'm flattered that you think I'm the person to
speak to.
So very briefly, I'll explain.
I grew up in England and at 22,which is very young to decide
to be freelance.
But I got made redundant.
The company I was working atclosed and I was at the time
doing a bit of freelance writingand decided to kind of go all
in, which I wouldn't recommendat 22.
(04:37):
But my parents very kindlyhelped me.
So when I first started mybusiness, I was really
networking.
So I went to tons of groups inLondon that's what you could and
over about five years I grewour business nicely, only
exclusively through networking,which again, I wouldn't do.
But at 22 to 26, that's whatmade the most sense for me.
I moved to Israel in 2019.
I wanted to continue being afreelance writer and there was
(05:01):
really a lack of networkinggroups for English speakers in
the small business space.
There was a lot, lot of hightech and a lot of Hebrew
speaking, but nothing that kindof offered small business owners
in English networking.
So I decided to create my owngroup six months after moving
here, which again I mean I wouldnot move to a country and start
a business six months after.
I mean it was a pretty I think.
It was very much like I reallyneeded this.
(05:22):
So I was like, well, everybodywill surely need this.
How could this businesspossibly fail?
It was really hard.
But then, six months after Istarted the business, covid hit
as well.
So it was a very interestingfirst year of living here.
Thank God now we are doing verywell, but it has obviously been
a growth journey.
(05:42):
But for me, networking what itreally comes down to is offering
people the opportunity to growtheir business, and that's why
it?
was so key for me when I livedin England and why I really felt
that we needed it here inIsrael.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
I love that.
Now I see why so many peoplewere like you need to connect
with her, because we have a lotof things in common in terms of
like being able to see how webuilt our business.
I was a dating coach for sixyears before this and I had a
business doing contractparalegal work before that and
during my dating coaching time Ispent so much time and so much
(06:15):
money on all the things that arelike you need this If you're
going to succeed.
You need to hire this coach.
You need to take this courseabout sales.
You need to do this thing and,looking back on it, the one
thing that consistently broughtme sales, brought me clients,
made me money, grew my business,was the relationships that I
made, the connections that Ibuilt, and so that was when I
(06:37):
kind of transitioned into mycurrent business Powerful Women
Rising to really help femaleentrepreneurs.
Get back to that.
Like you don't need all thisfancy stuff.
Like let's get back to havingactual conversations with humans
and like telling people what wedo in like a normal human way
and not a weird salesy way, andjust like being in community and
(06:59):
offering to help each otherwithout expecting anything
return.
Like they're these very novelideas, but they're actually not
at all.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
I think with when starting a business.
I think there's always like,obviously everyone's marketing
their services.
So the Facebook person willtell you you must do Facebook
and Instagram and everyone's howyou that their service is right
for you.
And I think it's very easy as abusiness owner to just feel
very taught and to do lots ofthings.
And I don't think networking isfor everyone.
(07:30):
I don't think it's for everybusiness.
I think it's really the modelthat works best for you.
So your personality as abusiness owner was drawn to
networking because you arecommunicative and friendly and
warm and people feel that.
So networking really works.
You know, I think networkingworks for anyone.
You have to have a strategy.
But I just think with businessowners, I think they get kind of
stressed by all the differentoptions.
Ultimately you have to pick oneand be consistent.
It doesn't really matter which.
I mean it does a little bit,but ultimately it doesn't matter
(07:52):
that much what you choose.
You have to choose one, youhave to be consistent, you have
to be strategic.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
I think networking is one of the easiest and one of
the lowest cost personally, butthat for me is a really big
challenge and I see all the timebusiness owners that are
getting like oh, choose one,that's it yeah, yeah, I think we
get really focused on quantityover quality sometimes and like
it's better to be in eightgroups where I like know a
(08:19):
hundred people five percent,rather than being in one group
where I know 30 people 85%, andthat's backwards.
But we're going to talk aboutthat in a little bit.
So I want to go back to a wordthat you used a couple of times
strategy because I thinksometimes when people hear the
word strategy used inconjunction with networking like
when I talk about networking, Italk a lot about like this is
(08:42):
just about creating genuinerelationships and, you know,
having real connections andthings like that and a lot of
people like think strategy isthe opposite of that, like
strategy is the likemanipulative, planned out, fake,
transactional side of that.
So how do you find thatnetworking, like that strategy,
fits into networking and how doyou do that without being a
(09:05):
salesy weirdo?
Speaker 3 (09:07):
so another question.
Firstly, I think it's reallyimportant, okay.
So when I talk about networkingand strategy, I think people
like you think I mean sell tothe room.
The first thing I want to sayand I'm sure that you say this
to your members is networking isnever about sales.
When I've been thinking aboutsales it's so like not on the
radar.
So I know that's very hard forpeople and it does take time.
(09:28):
But when you're going to anynetworking event you have to
forget about selling like,otherwise it's not going to work
, because nobody wants to besold to, it's just icky, there's
no better word for it.
But when we think about strategyin the same vein, you don't
want to go to a networking eventand just kind of schmooze and
that kind of be a nice event andthat'd be it, because that's a
waste of your time.
You're not going to getbusiness.
(09:48):
There is a happy medium.
I think people like black andwhite.
There's actually gray therewhen I talk about strategy.
So I'm going to say that you'regoing this.
Well, there's two ways to lookat it.
Let's say you're going to a bignetworking event.
Your local chamber of commerceis doing an event for 150 people
.
You're turning up.
You know two people.
What are you going to do?
There's really clear strategiesin place that can help me, that
(10:10):
I'm more successful.
And again, that will depend onhow experienced you are.
But the main ones would bearriving not hungry.
Even if they say they're goingto give you food, you make sure
you arrive not hungry.
You don't want to be the personat the networking event just to
be trying to get to the foodtable and when it's in your
talking to people, it's veryhard to eat food.
So you arrive satiated.
You arrive early.
I think so many people arrive tonetworking events late because
(10:32):
they kind of don't want to bethe first.
I disagree with that 100percent.
You want to be the secondperson to arrive.
If you're there early, you canfirstly speak to the organizer
and make a relationship withthem, and they're always good
people to know and it's mucheasier to kind of shift yourself
into a conversation with likethree people than 120.
It's much less daunting.
Please don't arrive half anhour early, because people do
(10:53):
that at my events and it's verystressful.
I'm talking five, 10 minutes ontime.
I'm not talking anything beyondthat.
As an organizer, it's quitehorrific.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
I was totally thinking that, as you were
talking.
Speaker 3 (11:03):
I was about to jump in and be like, but not that
early no, no, we do a big meganetwork human every year.
Last year we were 160 people andpeople arrived really early and
we just didn't let them in.
We did send out helpers withlike food and wine and water for
them, and it was inside.
They weren't like outside inthe cold or whatever, but we
just didn't let them in becausewe weren't ready to accept them.
There's a process in place andwe need to kind of funnel them
(11:24):
through.
So, yeah, yeah, but five tenminutes.
Please don't write before that.
As an organizer, it's just verychallenging, but five ten on
time is perfect.
So that's that.
And then when you're at theevent and again, this really
depends on your experience Iwould go with a mission of
speaking to x amounts of people.
You say to yourself I'm goingto speak to five people, I'm
going to speak to 10 people, andthen you go home.
(11:45):
Why am I saying that again?
I would never do that myselfbecause I'm crazy, but for most
people that's appropriate,because you're going to go with
a clear mission in mind.
You can tell yourself a pat onthe back I've done what I came
to do.
And those five ten people youcan actually follow up with
because you'll remember theconversations with them, because
that's the most important partof networking and it's the same
(12:05):
for smaller groups as well isit's the follow-up that's key.
It doesn't matter if you meetthem once.
That's irrelevant.
I also want to add one thingthat when you're talking to them
, don't take up too much oftheir time.
Speak to them for 10 minutes.
You end the conversationpolitely.
I'd love to follow up what'syour LinkedIn, what's your
number, what's your email, andthen you follow up with that
one-to-one, because that's wherethe money is going to happen.
You build a relationship withthem.
(12:26):
So I'm saying you have fivemeaningful, exciting there was a
click conversations, becauseyou can have a few that are just
like hi, hi and it doesn't work.
That's for the strategy, forlike a big event again, I can go
more into details there, butthose are the broad strokes.
When you're going to eventslike I have, which are more like
structured networking, whereyou're meeting the same person
time and time again and you havethe opportunity to give your 60
(12:49):
second pitch, you won in your60 second pitch and again
there's one-to-one, so there'schats outside.
So talk about referral partners,and what do I mean by that?
You're not asking for the typesof clients you want.
You're asking the types ofbusiness owners that they're
going to refer you to as clients, because it's very awkward for
someone to be like to introduceyou as a potential supplier.
(13:10):
It's also awkward for them.
What's very easy for them is ifyou're a web designer and a
great referral part of you asgraphic designers, because they
will refer you work that theycan't do.
Let's say it's very easy foryour friends at networking who's
met you time and time again andreally likes you to be like.
You know this is Charlie,charlie's great.
I think the two of you wouldreally get along.
You have a lot in common.
You overlap, but you don't dothe same thing.
(13:31):
Have a chat and your job isdone.
That's a really easy.
That's a win for everybody.
It's easy on the person you'remeeting with because they've
made a nice connection and it'snot new to build that
relationship.
That's the strategy ofnetworking those those big
events that have a very, very,very clear idea of how many
people you're going to speakwith and doing that follow-up.
And then at the smaller eventswhere the people you meet in
(13:53):
time and time again, talkingabout those referral partners
and saying it over and overagain.
And the last thing I want tosay I've spoken a lot about it
is it's so important to turn upto a networking event, whether
they're big or small, with anidea of what you want to do.
What do you, what types ofpeople you're trying to build
relationships with, what's yourgoal here, who do you want to be
meeting with, understand whatyou're trying to do and do the
(14:14):
follow-up.
And please, I beg of you, youmay get a member list after the
event.
Please don't add everyone'sremaining list.
Please don't send a blank email, even if you have the software
to change the first name.
Everybody knows what you'redoing.
I get complaints about it oftennot often, like people are very
good, but I do.
I get the complaints, not theperson that complained to me.
Everybody knows you're doing itand it's so gross.
(14:35):
There's a better word, but I'mgoing to use gross.
It's so gross.
So please, please, don't dothat.
I'm done now.
That's all I have to say.
I.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
I love all of that especially the last part.
I do the same thing.
I send out a contact list afterI do my virtual speed
networking events and I say onthe event.
I say before the event, I sayin several emails after the
event like this is the reasonyou're receiving this contact
list.
You should only use thisinformation for this specific
(15:04):
reason, and it's gotten better,but still every once in a while.
My favorite is when they don'trealize that I also am on the
list.
So they also send me the likehey, it was so great to meet you
at that event, didn't you lovemelissa?
And I'm like no, I, I am her.
Speaker 3 (15:21):
You actually sent it to me a few crazy ones I've had,
obviously, people emailingpeople who didn't come to the
event and saying it was great tomeet you but.
I had some you I've had peopleuse my brand name in their.
They don't they can't even wantto send it to me, but in their
marketing.
Basically, just send out anemail to my members.
I'm basically saying I'moffering a special offer for esm
(15:42):
as if, like, that's beenapproved, it is, if it's like
the way that they worded it andpeople have told me about it,
I'm like that has nothing to dowith me.
It's not okay to do that andthat's happened a few times
actually yeah, I don't knowwho's teaching this stuff, but
it ain't us, no.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
So one of the things that I picked up when you were
talking about strategy is thereis certainly some strategy
involved in what you're doing atthe networking event, and we
could probably make this intolike a nine part series between
the two of us.
There's certainly some strategyinvolved in what you're doing
at the event, but what I heardyou saying a lot is that there
(16:19):
is some strategy involved in howyou're preparing for the event
as well, like being really clearabout how you want to introduce
yourself.
How are you gonna balance, likeintroducing yourself as a
person, but also making surethat people know what you do and
what you're looking for.
Taking the time to think about,like who do I want to connect
with?
And maybe it's different thismonth than it was last month.
(16:40):
Maybe now I'm looking forspeaking opportunities, whereas
last month I just really neededa copywriter, so being prepared
to answer some of thosequestions people ask me all the
time when I do one-to-ones in aspecific group that I'm in,
everybody asks at the end whatcan I do to support you?
This month, and I used to neverhave an answer because I was
(17:01):
always like oh, I don't know,but this was a great chat, bye.
And of course you know we haveall this mindset stuff to work
through, right, like they don'tactually mean it and they don't
actually want to do the thingyou're going to ask them to do
and all the things.
But even being prepared with ananswer for something like that,
I think the more preparationthat you put in, the less
anxious you're going to be andyou're also probably going to
(17:24):
have a better result in theconversations that you're having
as well.
Do you agree?
Speaker 3 (17:28):
I agree a hundred percent and I think, like you
said, so much, so much.
But it's about the mindset.
And I think people approachnetworking kind of two ways.
One is like the extrovert who'slike I love networking, I'm
great at networking, I'm goingto smash this, and does no work
and it's just super cocky, whichalso is not ideal, by the way.
And then there's a person who'slike the introvert, who like
really doesn't come, who wasforced because they everyone's
(17:49):
told them they have to donetworking this.
They really don't want to.
They come like being draggedthere and they're really not
happy about it.
Um and um, they talk to oneperson and leave like those are
the two extremes and both ofthose extremes need that
strategy.
They need slightly differentstrategies to match their
personalities.
But ultimately, lovingnetworking isn't enough.
(18:10):
You have to also worknetworking.
It's not enough to just turn up.
And the same for the, theintrovert, who's like really
scared.
There's so many.
I have introverts who, it'sfunny, I've been running my
business for five years and I'vehad people who join now, who
didn't join for a long timebecause they were so introverted
and so scared.
Um, it's all about thatstrategy piece.
It's just I think people causenetworking is essentially just
(18:32):
talk.
People think it's essentiallyjust talking.
It's not.
There's a lot more there to itand I think people have like a
bit of a a problem acceptingthat or understanding that fully
, I guess.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Okay, not that it's sneaky, but it's just, yeah,
it's just thought, it'sthoughtful, intentional, that's
a good word for it so can yougive us an example, either from
your own life or a story fromlike one of the things that
you've seen at your events, of atime that you or someone else
has gone into a networking eventwith a strategy and it's been
(19:04):
successful?
Oh my gosh, that's a very, verygood question, it should be,
you wrote it did I?
Speaker 3 (19:11):
yeah, oh my gosh, you can keep this in.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
I'm not embarrassed I love it when I ask people
questions that they wrote andthey're like that's such a good
question.
I'm like thank you a greatquestion.
Speaker 3 (19:22):
So actually I'm gonna look at my computer now.
It's not because I'm ignoringyou, but I did.
I did a big, I did a women'sevent yesterday.
We had almost 80 women, um, andsomebody who joined ESN, who's
a member of my groups anyway,came.
I wrote a LinkedIn post aboutit, um, and she is a
self-proclaimed introvert.
I actually don't think she's.
I don't think she's sointroverted, but that's how she
(19:44):
defines herself and and Irespect that, and she didn't
join ESN for a really long timebecause of that reason.
Eventually she joined and ofcourse, it's like no loves it,
thank God.
And she gave tips on how shehandled the event to make sure
that she wasn't overwhelmed by80 people.
So this is completely, dani,seriously, you're welcome to go
(20:05):
check her out.
This is not coming from me, butthese were her tips which I
think actually some of them, Ithink, hopefully were inspired
by my content, but some of themwere not for me at all because
it's not my.
I'm not an introvert, it's notmy uh, it's not my truth.
Um, so, arriving early, whichis something I always say,
definitely get there early.
This I really liked.
It's not something I've thoughtabout.
If you start to feeloverwhelmed.
Look for someone you trust andjust stand next to them, which I
really liked.
It's not something I've thoughtabout.
(20:25):
If you start to feeloverwhelmed, look for someone
you trust and just stand next tothem, which I really liked,
really loved that.
This I loved.
If you feel like a simulator,step outside, and I noticed that
she did that and I didn't.
I wasn't bothered, I just didn't.
I wasn't aware of the reason.
I thought that was such abeautiful, um, and this I really
liked.
It's something my husbandalways tells me to do and I'm
very bad at doing it because I'ma bit of a workaholic.
She said after networking andthat I just I sorry, after a
(20:48):
networking event, I don't doanything, I just take a nap, and
I really, really like that andit's something that I need to do
more, because networking eventstake a lot from you, especially
when you're running them, and Ithink and she really liked it,
she really liked the event and Ithink that those tips that she
went in having, I think, madethe event so much more
digestible because it was I mean, we're 80 women it was a lot.
(21:11):
It was really a lot and Ithought that was really
beautiful and such helpful tipsfor any introvert, and again,
some of those I wouldn't thinkabout because it's not my truth.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Yeah, what I love about those two is that it's
very much about her givingherself permission to be herself
and do it the way that worksfor her.
She didn't feel like she neededto be pressured to like push
through, or oh, if I go stepoutside, people are gonna think
I'm weird, or you know, whateverit was.
It was just like this is me,this is what I need, this is
(21:38):
what's gonna give me the bestexperience, and that strategy
worked for her as an organizerfrom my perspective.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
At no point at all in the event did I think, oh,
that's like I didn't even Inoticed they were outside, but
there was a few of them and Ijust thought it was nice.
The room was a little bit small, like none of this came from,
like none of it was noted by me,um, and I thought they were
such lovely tips, um, and, likeI said, most of them I hadn't
thought about and I think it'sit's really nice.
I'm trying to think of otherstrategies in place for
(22:05):
networking events that I've goneto.
It's funny because obviously Idon't do I don't keep to this
with the strategy.
Like I'm terrible for thestrategy, of course, because
that just makes sense.
Um, because that that's how itworks.
I'll tell you the truth with mynetworking strategy, and this
is really a terrible thing.
The truth is, my networkingstrategy is I'm very active on
(22:26):
LinkedIn and that's really thesecret for me is I'm very active
on LinkedIn and Israel is avery small business community.
There is not that many of us.
So once you know, you know, youknow.
So, when I first moved to Israel, I remember going to a
networking event in 2019.
I traveled an hour and a halfto get there.
I arrived, was very overwhelmedand left after 15 minutes.
It was super overwhelming andI'm an extrovert.
(22:47):
I found it really hard and thatwas obviously no strategy in
place.
I just turned up hope for thebest and it was a nightmare.
I guess that my strategy thesedays is that I'm really active
on LinkedIn.
This sounds really pompous andit's not mental.
It's just the truth that if Igo to networking event, people
know me not always, but mostlyknow me and so there's a
conversation starter.
I recently did a spokennetworking event in the states
(23:10):
and it was very humbling becausepeople there less knew me and
it was a real reminder that youdo need a strategy in place for
those events because and I did,I the truth is I did that I
didn't know that would happenand I did have a very clear
strategy of bringing people infor a certain service I offered
that's relevant to peopleoutside of israel and I did get
a client through that strategybecause I went in with that
specific strategy, knowingexactly how I could.
(23:33):
There's only really one way Icould offer to American clients.
There's only really oneoffering I have for them and I
really went in with that focusand it did pay off.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
Yeah, well, I love that, because what it's showing
is that you don't necessarilyuse the same strategy for every
single event.
Every single group.
Right, there's very different.
There's the more transactionalgroups there are, the more
relationship focused groups.
There are groups where you knowmost everybody.
There are groups where youdon't know anybody, and so you
(24:01):
may have different strategiesfor different ones.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
I think, the more I'm thinking about it, like as
we're talking, I do think I gowith strategies.
I don't think I like I shouldthink about it a lot more than I
do, but I do go with strategiesthinking don't think I like I
should think about it a lot morethan I do, but I do go with
strategies thinking okay, thisis an event case, it's an X
market, what offerings do I havefor that market?
And again, I'm not going insalesy at all, but I will bring
that up, I will discuss that.
I will kind of like have a chatwith someone.
Feel the vibes want a betterword.
(24:27):
So I do each event thinkingokay, what offerings do I have
for this sort of event?
That's the most relevant.
Now I'm kind of going into adifferent sector of high tech
which I don't have experiencewith at all.
I want to go to those events.
I'm really just trying to buildrelationships because I don't
really have as much experiencethere as I would like.
And so those events, I'm likeI'm here to build relationships,
I'm here to grow, so it's.
It is different depending,you're right.
So different depending what theevent is.
(24:48):
Um, and I do, the truth is thatyou're right, I do have
strategies.
It's just not something thatI'm like, so I'm not writing it
down before how much really youshould.
You should be much moreintentional about it, but I've
been doing this for a long timeyeah, it's a lot of.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
Your strategy is probably not as conscious as it
used to be because, yeah, I'mnot using it right, exactly.
So you mentioned LinkedIn and Iwant to talk about that a
little bit, although this is awhole rabbit hole we could go
down.
Yeah, but one of the thingsthat I talk about a lot is that
networking doesn't just happenat networking events.
(25:23):
You don't just network atnetworking events and networking
groups.
Speaker 3 (25:27):
You can't just have a networking event Like that's
just not possible.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
Right, exactly, oh, I just have no humans Like that's
just not possible.
Right Exactly.
And and for me, I thinknetworking is and can happen
anywhere that you're creating aconnection with another human
being, and for a lot of people,that social media.
A lot of people love socialmedia.
They're really good at it.
They're good at connecting withpeople on a human level on
social media.
There are people who despise itand don't want anything to do
with it, and so that's fine too.
(25:51):
But for the people who do likesocial media and you mentioned
you do a lot on LinkedIn howdoes social media play into your
networking strategy?
Speaker 3 (26:01):
They're intertwined.
There's no way to separate themwhatsoever.
For me personally, I actuallythink it's very hard to network
in this day and age withouthaving someone with social media
presence.
It can be be done.
I think it makes.
I think it makes life much,much harder.
Um, for me, like I said, I cannow go to events and people will
know me, which just makes lifemore pleasant and easier.
(26:21):
To be honest, like I have tosay, there's just no two ways
about it.
Um, I think it means I'll meetsomeone at an event and I can
never speak to them again, butthey'll.
They see me on LinkedIn becauseI always connect on LinkedIn.
I should say I'll connect witheveryone on LinkedIn, which you
can do after an event.
You can connect with everyoneon LinkedIn.
That's completely acceptable.
I would never write a no oranything.
I'll just maybe I'd say it wasgreat to meet you at the event,
(26:42):
but I'll probably just send arequest and that's it.
Um, so they see me time and timeagain and it's just again with
marketing.
It's so boring, it's such acliche, but it takes time and
people have to be exposed to you.
They say seven touch points tosay four.
Whatever it is, it's rarely,just once I mean it should be,
but it's not always so for me.
They're just so intertwined inlike helping each other and
(27:04):
supporting each other.
I truly don't know how peoplereally succeed in networking
without it.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Yeah yeah, I agree, I use, uh Facebook a lot.
I want to be more on LinkedIn,but I'm just not, and so that's
a truth about myself that I'maccepting right now.
I don't think you need to be onLinkedIn at all.
Speaker 3 (27:22):
I just think, like, if Facebook's working for you,
great, just focus on that.
Like I really want to be onInstagram.
That is not my reality, so yeahexactly.
Speaker 2 (27:30):
We're just.
Speaker 3 (27:30):
We're just accepting the truths about ourselves today
, but I think, as businessowners we have, you don't have
to do anything, you have to makemoney for making money and you
can grow your business.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
Then that makes it.
Yeah, that that's certainlyhelpful.
Uh, but one of the things thatI find people ask me a lot about
with networking and youprobably find this too is the
follow-up, and this is likepeople's biggest complaint is
like I don't have time to followup.
I don't know how to follow up,I don't know how to keep track
of all these people.
When do I follow up with them,what do I do?
And I find that social mediamakes the follow-up much easier.
(28:01):
Do you think so too?
Speaker 3 (28:04):
I think it makes it easier.
You can also email.
I think people are looking forexcuses.
Also email.
I think people are looking forexcuses.
Excuse me for saying there'salways an excuse not to do the
follow-up.
It doesn't take that long.
Like I'm the organizer ofevents, so when I'm in a like
I'm a women's event yesterday,so I did a special offer that if
you join this week, you know weoffer we're going to offer this
(28:24):
like a like a very small setperiod of free membership.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Okay, so I had a few people who are interested.
Speaker 3 (28:29):
So I followed up with them them.
I sent them WhatsApps, which inIsrael we WhatsApp in business.
I don't know if it's soacceptable in America, but
that's how we do it here.
I sent them WhatsApps.
My baby was home.
She was not well.
My baby was home all the time.
I was able to do it, even justwith her home the whole time,
which, like it, doesn't takethat at quite a bit of trading.
I do think with networking,people have a lot of excuses.
(28:51):
You find the time for what'simportant and if growing your
business is important, you'llfind the time for it.
That's number one.
If you have LinkedIn orFacebook, it is easier to send
LinkedIn messages, for sure.
But I also think an email seemsa bit more sometimes, can feel
a bit more professional and Ithink it's very easy.
I mean, when I do events, Iwrite down very clearly a list
(29:12):
of like a heading this person'sinterested in this and then I
write the list of that and thenthe next heading and then the
list just cross them off whenI've heard to them, chase them.
I would chase people myself onlytwice.
I would like I would send anemail and then a follow-up email
.
I personally would never gobeyond that.
Everyone does what they wouldlike.
That's my way of doing it, andwhen you're doing a follow-up or
you're asking for I mean, itreally depends.
(29:32):
It's organized.
It's different.
But if you're just asking for achat, I'd just love to meet with
you.
Hi, it was so.
I mean you can write templates.
Hi, it was so great to meet you.
I love talking about inserttopic how is your cat doing?
I hope they feel better.
Like you speak from theconversation and then say,
listen, I would love to have achat with you.
What I, what I personally thinkis really helpful for people is
if you give them don't sendthem a calendar link.
(29:54):
Give them five dates, give themfive options of dates.
People are really lazy and theydon't want to give you options.
They don't necessarily want togo through a link.
Just say I'm available on thesefive dates.
Do any of these work for you?
If not, please send me dates.
You're available and, of course, work.
Make it as easy as possible forpeople.
(30:14):
I just think that's the key.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
I don't think it's that challenging.
I really don't.
No, I don't think it is either.
I mean, it's not hard and it'snot um, it doesn't take a long
time, but you do have to beintentional about, like, setting
aside the time to do it andmaking that a priority, like you
said but like we have to takeresponsibility for our actions,
like we have to say that we arebusiness owners and we've come
here to show up and this is partof my networking.
Speaker 3 (30:36):
And if you're going to a networking event, I'm going
to tell you a secret there's nopoint going if you're not
following up.
If you don't have the time,then just don't go.
It's also okay, you don't haveto go to every event, but if
you're going to get thisoccasionally, of course I've
also had it where you go to theevent and it happens to be that
person needs your service andyou get really lucky and you get
(30:57):
business from that.
It does happen, for sure, andit's beautiful and it's lovely,
but it's very rare.
That's the exception to therule.
You are the rule.
It happens in the follow up.
Speaker 2 (31:12):
So just be aware of that Love, that Great points.
I feel like we're going to needa part two and a part three, so
we'll have to come back formore of this.
I could tell you these aretopics I could talk about all
day long and there's so muchthat goes into all of them,
because we're all such differentpeople, right Like we're going
to approach it differently.
If we're introverts, everyoneis surprised.
When I say I'm an introvert,I'm like, no, you just think I'm
not an introvert Cause I'm likesuper awkward.
But also, when I get reallynervous, I just like say
(31:35):
whatever's in my brain andsomehow it comes out funny and
you guys all think I'm funny andlike this outgoing comedian
person people think ofintroverts as socially awkward
and it's not the same thing atall.
Speaker 3 (31:48):
Like you can be introverted and be incredibly
friendly and warm.
Yeah, and confident.
Yeah, 100%.
Like I think I come across asextremely extroverted.
I think you do come across asmore introverted, but we're both
warm, friendly, like I thinkthere's a lot of confusion
around what introvertism,introverted really means.
I like introvertism.
(32:08):
Again, it is not my, I'mdefinitely not an introvert.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
Yeah, yeah, I think it's more clear.
I think it's harder to tell ina networking event, like when
you're interacting with someone,as opposed to like what happens
after the event.
Right, like do you leave therefeeling like so jazzed and
excited and like what are wedoing now?
Who are we talking to now?
What's next Versus?
I leave and I'm like I don'teven want to turn the radio on,
(32:33):
like let's just drive home insilence.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
So I love.
I really do love my networkingevents and events I go to.
It really depends, but I reallythrive on problems, like if
there's an issue, like that'swhen my adrenaline really hits
and that's when I'm really readyto rock and roll.
I had an event a while ago itwas our big mega event and it
(32:58):
went beyond smoothly, there wasno issues.
I'm not saying this to brag,like we do it for four years,
like we're making it bigger nextyear, like because it was too
smooth, you need to improveevery year.
There was really no issues.
It was so, so smooth and that'smostly due to my husband who
helps with everything and he'svery good at logistics.
Um, and I left feeling a bitflat, actually, because I need
yesterday we had a bit too muchdrama.
There's needs to be a happymedium, but I need a little bit
(33:18):
of, like a fizz, like I needthat.
That kind of gets me going,that adrenaline, and it was so
smooth.
Like it was really a bit scary,but we made up for yesterday,
where we had, like you know, keypeople who didn't show up, like
there was a lot more issuesyesterday, which you know, gave
me that adrenaline buzz that Iso desperately crave, but that's
when my therapist to work out.
(33:39):
I suppose it's funny.
It's also funny because I woremy no drama shirt for you today,
but your shirt says yes, drama,please, please more drama yeah,
I watch a lot of reality tv,which I think, yeah, my husband
like tell me things happening inhis office.
I'm like I need more.
He's like have like he has thebasic facts.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
No, they never ask the right questions give me more
.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
Invite them around to our house now, let's get drinks
and let's get this informationout.
I need to know why they gotbroke up like yeah, yeah, um,
yeah, it's not my best quality,I wouldn't say, but it is
intrinsic to who I am.
I want to say I really likegossip about people I don't know
, obviously about people I knowit's very sad to know it must
sound like a terrible person.
I'm generally very lovely, butI do love reality too.
(34:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
Same, I do too Okay.
So if people want to connectwith you more, if they want to
learn more about Englishspeaking network, if they want
to just follow you for yourawesome networking tips, if they
just want to hear your accentsmore, what's the best way for
them to connect with you?
We get really excited aboutaccents here in Colorado.
Speaker 3 (34:44):
Yeah, I'm like a scumbag, like I'm from the North
of England, so my accent is solovely If you, if you're British
, it's nice.
No, it's so lovely if you, ifyou're british, it's nice.
You say that, but it's notlondon.
I don't sound posh, um, sothank you so much.
So, um, linkedin, the name ishelena baker, which I'm sure we
spelled beautifully in the shownotes.
Instagram, if you'd like tofollow me there.
(35:04):
It's network with helena.
There's always a very goodintention around posting.
I can't pretend I always do,and I'm actually launching my
own podcast um on the Octoberthe 29th, which is the fifth
year birthday of Englishspeaking networking um, and
we're speaking to five businessowners in Israel with more than
five employees who've been goingfor more than five years to
celebrate Arthur's birthday andabout three families they've had
(35:26):
a business.
So that is being launchedOctober 29th and it'll be on all
where you get your podcasts atfailing our way to success.
It's a lot of work, so I verymuch respect what you're doing.
I did not appreciate.
That is being launched onOctober 29th and it will be on
all where you get your podcastsat Failing Our Way to Success.
It's super exciting.
It's a lot of work of podcasts,so I very much respect what
you're doing.
I do not appreciate the levelof work that goes into these.
I have to say, that's about it.
I'm really excited.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Awesome.
Well, thank you so much forbeing a guest.
I loved our conversation.
You and I are very much on, sowe will definitely have you back
on the show again, so much.
Speaker 3 (35:50):
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
Thanks for listening to Powerful Women Rising.
We hope today's episodeinspired you to keep rising.
If you love the podcast, pleasesubscribe and leave a review.
It's like giving us a virtualhug and helps more awesome women
like you find the show.
Click the link in the shownotes to get your free list of
top virtual networking eventsfor female entrepreneurs.
It's time to make realconnections and grow your
(36:15):
business with integrity andauthenticity.
Until next time, keep risingand stay powerful.
Welcome to Powerful Women Rising, the podcast where
we ditch the rulebook and buildbusinesses with authenticity,
integrity and a whole lot of fun.
Join host Melissa Snow,business relationship strategist
and founder of the PowerfulWomen Rising community, as she
interviews top experts andshares candid insights on
business strategy, marketing,mindset and more.
(00:22):
Let's get real, get inspiredand rise together.
This is Powerful Women Rising.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode
of the Powerful Women Risingpodcast.
I'm your host, melissa Snow,super excited to be joining you
on this lovely Monday morning.
How are things going in yourworld?
Did you know that when you arelistening to a podcast this is
for those of you who areimpatient like me and like to
listen to your podcasts on 1.5speed and hit that little skip
(00:53):
30 second button?
If you listen to this podcastregularly, that little intro is
30 seconds exactly, so as soonas you hear it, you can push the
30 second button and you'll beright where you need to be, here
with me.
I am so excited to share today'sepisode with you.
I know I say that all the time,like every single week, but
(01:14):
this is one of the most funinterviews I've done in a while.
If you've been listening to mefor a bit, you know I think I'm
pretty funny and today's guestis also very funny.
So we had a great time talkingabout networking, which is in my
wheelhouse and also in hers,and it was really fun because
(01:37):
she shared some things that Ihad never thought about before
and some tips for when to showup at a networking event, what
to do before you go to anetworking event, and it's just
so fun to hear other people'sperspectives.
This is one of the reasons Iget so bent out of shape about
networking groups that areexclusive, where you can only
(01:58):
have one person per industry, ornetworking groups that are
exclusive in terms of if you'rein this group, or networking
groups that are exclusive interms of if you're in this group
, you can't be in any othergroups.
Because when you are withsomebody who does the same or
something similar to what you doas I was in this interview with
Helena Baker you get to hear adifferent perspective.
You get to hear other people'sexperiences.
(02:20):
You get to talk about thingsthat don't necessarily relate to
everyone else, but when youguys talk about them, the other
person is always like oh my gosh.
Yes, I hate that, but if you'retalking to somebody who's in a
different industry, they arelike I don't know what you're
talking about.
So that is my soapbox for theday and also my explanation of
(02:42):
one of many reasons I enjoyeddoing this interview with Helena
Baker.
So she was born and raised inEngland.
She started a copywritingbusiness at the age of 21 with
no contacts and no idea what shewas doing.
So she went out and startednetworking and attended pretty
much all of the networkinggroups in London, and then four
(03:04):
years ago, she moved to Israeland she found that in Israel,
there was not much of a formalnetworking community for English
speakers, and so she decided tocreate one.
She is the founder of theEnglish Speaking Network, which
now has multiple in-persongroups in Israel, and more
recently saw demand for onlinemeetings, and so last year she
(03:26):
founded the InternationalEnglish Speaking Network, with a
focus on helping businessowners all over the world
network and grow their business.
So you can see why I love herand why I had so much fun
chatting with her aboutnetworking strategies.
I am going to share thisinterview with you without
further ado, but, as always, Iwould love to connect with you
(03:47):
over on Instagram and hear yourthoughts.
I am certain you're going tohear something in this interview
that you're like oh, I neverthought about that before and I
would love to know what it is.
All right, here we go.
This is my interview withHelena Baker.
Hello, helena, welcome to thepodcast.
Thank you for having me, yeah,so excited for our chat today.
We're talking about one of myfavorite things networking, so
(04:10):
let's talk a little bit aboutyour background, like why are
you the person to talk to usabout networking and how did you
get to this space?
Speaker 3 (04:17):
I'm flattered that you think I'm the person to
speak to.
So very briefly, I'll explain.
I grew up in England and at 22,which is very young to decide
to be freelance.
But I got made redundant.
The company I was working atclosed and I was at the time
doing a bit of freelance writingand decided to kind of go all
in, which I wouldn't recommendat 22.
(04:37):
But my parents very kindlyhelped me.
So when I first started mybusiness, I was really
networking.
So I went to tons of groups inLondon that's what you could and
over about five years I grewour business nicely, only
exclusively through networking,which again, I wouldn't do.
But at 22 to 26, that's whatmade the most sense for me.
I moved to Israel in 2019.
I wanted to continue being afreelance writer and there was
(05:01):
really a lack of networkinggroups for English speakers in
the small business space.
There was a lot, lot of hightech and a lot of Hebrew
speaking, but nothing that kindof offered small business owners
in English networking.
So I decided to create my owngroup six months after moving
here, which again I mean I wouldnot move to a country and start
a business six months after.
I mean it was a pretty I think.
It was very much like I reallyneeded this.
(05:22):
So I was like, well, everybodywill surely need this.
How could this businesspossibly fail?
It was really hard.
But then, six months after Istarted the business, covid hit
as well.
So it was a very interestingfirst year of living here.
Thank God now we are doing verywell, but it has obviously been
a growth journey.
(05:42):
But for me, networking what itreally comes down to is offering
people the opportunity to growtheir business, and that's why
it?
was so key for me when I livedin England and why I really felt
that we needed it here inIsrael.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
I love that.
Now I see why so many peoplewere like you need to connect
with her, because we have a lotof things in common in terms of
like being able to see how webuilt our business.
I was a dating coach for sixyears before this and I had a
business doing contractparalegal work before that and
during my dating coaching time Ispent so much time and so much
(06:15):
money on all the things that arelike you need this If you're
going to succeed.
You need to hire this coach.
You need to take this courseabout sales.
You need to do this thing and,looking back on it, the one
thing that consistently broughtme sales, brought me clients,
made me money, grew my business,was the relationships that I
made, the connections that Ibuilt, and so that was when I
(06:37):
kind of transitioned into mycurrent business Powerful Women
Rising to really help femaleentrepreneurs.
Get back to that.
Like you don't need all thisfancy stuff.
Like let's get back to havingactual conversations with humans
and like telling people what wedo in like a normal human way
and not a weird salesy way, andjust like being in community and
(06:59):
offering to help each otherwithout expecting anything
return.
Like they're these very novelideas, but they're actually not
at all.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
I think with when starting a business.
I think there's always like,obviously everyone's marketing
their services.
So the Facebook person willtell you you must do Facebook
and Instagram and everyone's howyou that their service is right
for you.
And I think it's very easy as abusiness owner to just feel
very taught and to do lots ofthings.
And I don't think networking isfor everyone.
(07:30):
I don't think it's for everybusiness.
I think it's really the modelthat works best for you.
So your personality as abusiness owner was drawn to
networking because you arecommunicative and friendly and
warm and people feel that.
So networking really works.
You know, I think networkingworks for anyone.
You have to have a strategy.
But I just think with businessowners, I think they get kind of
stressed by all the differentoptions.
Ultimately you have to pick oneand be consistent.
It doesn't really matter which.
I mean it does a little bit,but ultimately it doesn't matter
(07:52):
that much what you choose.
You have to choose one, youhave to be consistent, you have
to be strategic.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
I think networking is one of the easiest and one of
the lowest cost personally, butthat for me is a really big
challenge and I see all the timebusiness owners that are
getting like oh, choose one,that's it yeah, yeah, I think we
get really focused on quantityover quality sometimes and like
it's better to be in eightgroups where I like know a
(08:19):
hundred people five percent,rather than being in one group
where I know 30 people 85%, andthat's backwards.
But we're going to talk aboutthat in a little bit.
So I want to go back to a wordthat you used a couple of times
strategy because I thinksometimes when people hear the
word strategy used inconjunction with networking like
when I talk about networking, Italk a lot about like this is
(08:42):
just about creating genuinerelationships and, you know,
having real connections andthings like that and a lot of
people like think strategy isthe opposite of that, like
strategy is the likemanipulative, planned out, fake,
transactional side of that.
So how do you find thatnetworking, like that strategy,
fits into networking and how doyou do that without being a
(09:05):
salesy weirdo?
Speaker 3 (09:07):
so another question.
Firstly, I think it's reallyimportant, okay.
So when I talk about networkingand strategy, I think people
like you think I mean sell tothe room.
The first thing I want to sayand I'm sure that you say this
to your members is networking isnever about sales.
When I've been thinking aboutsales it's so like not on the
radar.
So I know that's very hard forpeople and it does take time.
(09:28):
But when you're going to anynetworking event you have to
forget about selling like,otherwise it's not going to work
, because nobody wants to besold to, it's just icky, there's
no better word for it.
But when we think about strategyin the same vein, you don't
want to go to a networking eventand just kind of schmooze and
that kind of be a nice event andthat'd be it, because that's a
waste of your time.
You're not going to getbusiness.
(09:48):
There is a happy medium.
I think people like black andwhite.
There's actually gray therewhen I talk about strategy.
So I'm going to say that you'regoing this.
Well, there's two ways to lookat it.
Let's say you're going to a bignetworking event.
Your local chamber of commerceis doing an event for 150 people
.
You're turning up.
You know two people.
What are you going to do?
There's really clear strategiesin place that can help me, that
(10:10):
I'm more successful.
And again, that will depend onhow experienced you are.
But the main ones would bearriving not hungry.
Even if they say they're goingto give you food, you make sure
you arrive not hungry.
You don't want to be the personat the networking event just to
be trying to get to the foodtable and when it's in your
talking to people, it's veryhard to eat food.
So you arrive satiated.
You arrive early.
I think so many people arrive tonetworking events late because
(10:32):
they kind of don't want to bethe first.
I disagree with that 100percent.
You want to be the secondperson to arrive.
If you're there early, you canfirstly speak to the organizer
and make a relationship withthem, and they're always good
people to know and it's mucheasier to kind of shift yourself
into a conversation with likethree people than 120.
It's much less daunting.
Please don't arrive half anhour early, because people do
(10:53):
that at my events and it's verystressful.
I'm talking five, 10 minutes ontime.
I'm not talking anything beyondthat.
As an organizer, it's quitehorrific.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
I was totally thinking that, as you were
talking.
Speaker 3 (11:03):
I was about to jump in and be like, but not that
early no, no, we do a big meganetwork human every year.
Last year we were 160 people andpeople arrived really early and
we just didn't let them in.
We did send out helpers withlike food and wine and water for
them, and it was inside.
They weren't like outside inthe cold or whatever, but we
just didn't let them in becausewe weren't ready to accept them.
There's a process in place andwe need to kind of funnel them
(11:24):
through.
So, yeah, yeah, but five tenminutes.
Please don't write before that.
As an organizer, it's just verychallenging, but five ten on
time is perfect.
So that's that.
And then when you're at theevent and again, this really
depends on your experience Iwould go with a mission of
speaking to x amounts of people.
You say to yourself I'm goingto speak to five people, I'm
going to speak to 10 people, andthen you go home.
(11:45):
Why am I saying that again?
I would never do that myselfbecause I'm crazy, but for most
people that's appropriate,because you're going to go with
a clear mission in mind.
You can tell yourself a pat onthe back I've done what I came
to do.
And those five ten people youcan actually follow up with
because you'll remember theconversations with them, because
that's the most important partof networking and it's the same
(12:05):
for smaller groups as well isit's the follow-up that's key.
It doesn't matter if you meetthem once.
That's irrelevant.
I also want to add one thingthat when you're talking to them
, don't take up too much oftheir time.
Speak to them for 10 minutes.
You end the conversationpolitely.
I'd love to follow up what'syour LinkedIn, what's your
number, what's your email, andthen you follow up with that
one-to-one, because that's wherethe money is going to happen.
You build a relationship withthem.
(12:26):
So I'm saying you have fivemeaningful, exciting there was a
click conversations, becauseyou can have a few that are just
like hi, hi and it doesn't work.
That's for the strategy, forlike a big event again, I can go
more into details there, butthose are the broad strokes.
When you're going to eventslike I have, which are more like
structured networking, whereyou're meeting the same person
time and time again and you havethe opportunity to give your 60
(12:49):
second pitch, you won in your60 second pitch and again
there's one-to-one, so there'schats outside.
So talk about referral partners,and what do I mean by that?
You're not asking for the typesof clients you want.
You're asking the types ofbusiness owners that they're
going to refer you to as clients, because it's very awkward for
someone to be like to introduceyou as a potential supplier.
(13:10):
It's also awkward for them.
What's very easy for them is ifyou're a web designer and a
great referral part of you asgraphic designers, because they
will refer you work that theycan't do.
Let's say it's very easy foryour friends at networking who's
met you time and time again andreally likes you to be like.
You know this is Charlie,charlie's great.
I think the two of you wouldreally get along.
You have a lot in common.
You overlap, but you don't dothe same thing.
(13:31):
Have a chat and your job isdone.
That's a really easy.
That's a win for everybody.
It's easy on the person you'remeeting with because they've
made a nice connection and it'snot new to build that
relationship.
That's the strategy ofnetworking those those big
events that have a very, very,very clear idea of how many
people you're going to speakwith and doing that follow-up.
And then at the smaller eventswhere the people you meet in
(13:53):
time and time again, talkingabout those referral partners
and saying it over and overagain.
And the last thing I want tosay I've spoken a lot about it
is it's so important to turn upto a networking event, whether
they're big or small, with anidea of what you want to do.
What do you, what types ofpeople you're trying to build
relationships with, what's yourgoal here, who do you want to be
meeting with, understand whatyou're trying to do and do the
(14:14):
follow-up.
And please, I beg of you, youmay get a member list after the
event.
Please don't add everyone'sremaining list.
Please don't send a blank email, even if you have the software
to change the first name.
Everybody knows what you'redoing.
I get complaints about it oftennot often, like people are very
good, but I do.
I get the complaints, not theperson that complained to me.
Everybody knows you're doing itand it's so gross.
(14:35):
There's a better word, but I'mgoing to use gross.
It's so gross.
So please, please, don't dothat.
I'm done now.
That's all I have to say.
I.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
I love all of that especially the last part.
I do the same thing.
I send out a contact list afterI do my virtual speed
networking events and I say onthe event.
I say before the event, I sayin several emails after the
event like this is the reasonyou're receiving this contact
list.
You should only use thisinformation for this specific
(15:04):
reason, and it's gotten better,but still every once in a while.
My favorite is when they don'trealize that I also am on the
list.
So they also send me the likehey, it was so great to meet you
at that event, didn't you lovemelissa?
And I'm like no, I, I am her.
Speaker 3 (15:21):
You actually sent it to me a few crazy ones I've had,
obviously, people emailingpeople who didn't come to the
event and saying it was great tomeet you but.
I had some you I've had peopleuse my brand name in their.
They don't they can't even wantto send it to me, but in their
marketing.
Basically, just send out anemail to my members.
I'm basically saying I'moffering a special offer for esm
(15:42):
as if, like, that's beenapproved, it is, if it's like
the way that they worded it andpeople have told me about it,
I'm like that has nothing to dowith me.
It's not okay to do that andthat's happened a few times
actually yeah, I don't knowwho's teaching this stuff, but
it ain't us, no.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
So one of the things that I picked up when you were
talking about strategy is thereis certainly some strategy
involved in what you're doing atthe networking event, and we
could probably make this intolike a nine part series between
the two of us.
There's certainly some strategyinvolved in what you're doing
at the event, but what I heardyou saying a lot is that there
(16:19):
is some strategy involved in howyou're preparing for the event
as well, like being really clearabout how you want to introduce
yourself.
How are you gonna balance, likeintroducing yourself as a
person, but also making surethat people know what you do and
what you're looking for.
Taking the time to think about,like who do I want to connect
with?
And maybe it's different thismonth than it was last month.
(16:40):
Maybe now I'm looking forspeaking opportunities, whereas
last month I just really neededa copywriter, so being prepared
to answer some of thosequestions people ask me all the
time when I do one-to-ones in aspecific group that I'm in,
everybody asks at the end whatcan I do to support you?
This month, and I used to neverhave an answer because I was
(17:01):
always like oh, I don't know,but this was a great chat, bye.
And of course you know we haveall this mindset stuff to work
through, right, like they don'tactually mean it and they don't
actually want to do the thingyou're going to ask them to do
and all the things.
But even being prepared with ananswer for something like that,
I think the more preparationthat you put in, the less
anxious you're going to be andyou're also probably going to
(17:24):
have a better result in theconversations that you're having
as well.
Do you agree?
Speaker 3 (17:28):
I agree a hundred percent and I think, like you
said, so much, so much.
But it's about the mindset.
And I think people approachnetworking kind of two ways.
One is like the extrovert who'slike I love networking, I'm
great at networking, I'm goingto smash this, and does no work
and it's just super cocky, whichalso is not ideal, by the way.
And then there's a person who'slike the introvert, who like
really doesn't come, who wasforced because they everyone's
(17:49):
told them they have to donetworking this.
They really don't want to.
They come like being draggedthere and they're really not
happy about it.
Um and um, they talk to oneperson and leave like those are
the two extremes and both ofthose extremes need that
strategy.
They need slightly differentstrategies to match their
personalities.
But ultimately, lovingnetworking isn't enough.
(18:10):
You have to also worknetworking.
It's not enough to just turn up.
And the same for the, theintrovert, who's like really
scared.
There's so many.
I have introverts who, it'sfunny, I've been running my
business for five years and I'vehad people who join now, who
didn't join for a long timebecause they were so introverted
and so scared.
Um, it's all about thatstrategy piece.
It's just I think people causenetworking is essentially just
(18:32):
talk.
People think it's essentiallyjust talking.
It's not.
There's a lot more there to itand I think people have like a
bit of a a problem acceptingthat or understanding that fully
, I guess.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Okay, not that it's sneaky, but it's just, yeah,
it's just thought, it'sthoughtful, intentional, that's
a good word for it so can yougive us an example, either from
your own life or a story fromlike one of the things that
you've seen at your events, of atime that you or someone else
has gone into a networking eventwith a strategy and it's been
(19:04):
successful?
Oh my gosh, that's a very, verygood question, it should be,
you wrote it did I?
Speaker 3 (19:11):
yeah, oh my gosh, you can keep this in.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
I'm not embarrassed I love it when I ask people
questions that they wrote andthey're like that's such a good
question.
I'm like thank you a greatquestion.
Speaker 3 (19:22):
So actually I'm gonna look at my computer now.
It's not because I'm ignoringyou, but I did.
I did a big, I did a women'sevent yesterday.
We had almost 80 women, um, andsomebody who joined ESN, who's
a member of my groups anyway,came.
I wrote a LinkedIn post aboutit, um, and she is a
self-proclaimed introvert.
I actually don't think she's.
I don't think she's sointroverted, but that's how she
(19:44):
defines herself and and Irespect that, and she didn't
join ESN for a really long timebecause of that reason.
Eventually she joined and ofcourse, it's like no loves it,
thank God.
And she gave tips on how shehandled the event to make sure
that she wasn't overwhelmed by80 people.
So this is completely, dani,seriously, you're welcome to go
(20:05):
check her out.
This is not coming from me, butthese were her tips which I
think actually some of them, Ithink, hopefully were inspired
by my content, but some of themwere not for me at all because
it's not my.
I'm not an introvert, it's notmy uh, it's not my truth.
Um, so, arriving early, whichis something I always say,
definitely get there early.
This I really liked.
It's not something I've thoughtabout.
If you start to feeloverwhelmed.
Look for someone you trust andjust stand next to them, which I
really liked.
It's not something I've thoughtabout.
(20:25):
If you start to feeloverwhelmed, look for someone
you trust and just stand next tothem, which I really liked,
really loved that.
This I loved.
If you feel like a simulator,step outside, and I noticed that
she did that and I didn't.
I wasn't bothered, I just didn't.
I wasn't aware of the reason.
I thought that was such abeautiful, um, and this I really
liked.
It's something my husbandalways tells me to do and I'm
very bad at doing it because I'ma bit of a workaholic.
She said after networking andthat I just I sorry, after a
(20:48):
networking event, I don't doanything, I just take a nap, and
I really, really like that andit's something that I need to do
more, because networking eventstake a lot from you, especially
when you're running them, and Ithink and she really liked it,
she really liked the event and Ithink that those tips that she
went in having, I think, madethe event so much more
digestible because it was I mean, we're 80 women it was a lot.
(21:11):
It was really a lot and Ithought that was really
beautiful and such helpful tipsfor any introvert, and again,
some of those I wouldn't thinkabout because it's not my truth.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Yeah, what I love about those two is that it's
very much about her givingherself permission to be herself
and do it the way that worksfor her.
She didn't feel like she neededto be pressured to like push
through, or oh, if I go stepoutside, people are gonna think
I'm weird, or you know, whateverit was.
It was just like this is me,this is what I need, this is
(21:38):
what's gonna give me the bestexperience, and that strategy
worked for her as an organizerfrom my perspective.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
At no point at all in the event did I think, oh,
that's like I didn't even Inoticed they were outside, but
there was a few of them and Ijust thought it was nice.
The room was a little bit small, like none of this came from,
like none of it was noted by me,um, and I thought they were
such lovely tips, um, and, likeI said, most of them I hadn't
thought about and I think it'sit's really nice.
I'm trying to think of otherstrategies in place for
(22:05):
networking events that I've goneto.
It's funny because obviously Idon't do I don't keep to this
with the strategy.
Like I'm terrible for thestrategy, of course, because
that just makes sense.
Um, because that that's how itworks.
I'll tell you the truth with mynetworking strategy, and this
is really a terrible thing.
The truth is, my networkingstrategy is I'm very active on
(22:26):
LinkedIn and that's really thesecret for me is I'm very active
on LinkedIn and Israel is avery small business community.
There is not that many of us.
So once you know, you know, youknow.
So, when I first moved to Israel, I remember going to a
networking event in 2019.
I traveled an hour and a halfto get there.
I arrived, was very overwhelmedand left after 15 minutes.
It was super overwhelming andI'm an extrovert.
(22:47):
I found it really hard and thatwas obviously no strategy in
place.
I just turned up hope for thebest and it was a nightmare.
I guess that my strategy thesedays is that I'm really active
on LinkedIn.
This sounds really pompous andit's not mental.
It's just the truth that if Igo to networking event, people
know me not always, but mostlyknow me and so there's a
conversation starter.
I recently did a spokennetworking event in the states
(23:10):
and it was very humbling becausepeople there less knew me and
it was a real reminder that youdo need a strategy in place for
those events because and I did,I the truth is I did that I
didn't know that would happenand I did have a very clear
strategy of bringing people infor a certain service I offered
that's relevant to peopleoutside of israel and I did get
a client through that strategybecause I went in with that
specific strategy, knowingexactly how I could.
(23:33):
There's only really one way Icould offer to American clients.
There's only really oneoffering I have for them and I
really went in with that focusand it did pay off.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
Yeah, well, I love that, because what it's showing
is that you don't necessarilyuse the same strategy for every
single event.
Every single group.
Right, there's very different.
There's the more transactionalgroups there are, the more
relationship focused groups.
There are groups where you knowmost everybody.
There are groups where youdon't know anybody, and so you
(24:01):
may have different strategiesfor different ones.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
I think, the more I'm thinking about it, like as
we're talking, I do think I gowith strategies.
I don't think I like I shouldthink about it a lot more than I
do, but I do go with strategiesthinking don't think I like I
should think about it a lot morethan I do, but I do go with
strategies thinking okay, thisis an event case, it's an X
market, what offerings do I havefor that market?
And again, I'm not going insalesy at all, but I will bring
that up, I will discuss that.
I will kind of like have a chatwith someone.
Feel the vibes want a betterword.
(24:27):
So I do each event thinkingokay, what offerings do I have
for this sort of event?
That's the most relevant.
Now I'm kind of going into adifferent sector of high tech
which I don't have experiencewith at all.
I want to go to those events.
I'm really just trying to buildrelationships because I don't
really have as much experiencethere as I would like.
And so those events, I'm likeI'm here to build relationships,
I'm here to grow, so it's.
It is different depending,you're right.
So different depending what theevent is.
(24:48):
Um, and I do, the truth is thatyou're right, I do have
strategies.
It's just not something thatI'm like, so I'm not writing it
down before how much really youshould.
You should be much moreintentional about it, but I've
been doing this for a long timeyeah, it's a lot of.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
Your strategy is probably not as conscious as it
used to be because, yeah, I'mnot using it right, exactly.
So you mentioned LinkedIn and Iwant to talk about that a
little bit, although this is awhole rabbit hole we could go
down.
Yeah, but one of the thingsthat I talk about a lot is that
networking doesn't just happenat networking events.
(25:23):
You don't just network atnetworking events and networking
groups.
Speaker 3 (25:27):
You can't just have a networking event Like that's
just not possible.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
Right, exactly, oh, I just have no humans Like that's
just not possible.
Right Exactly.
And and for me, I thinknetworking is and can happen
anywhere that you're creating aconnection with another human
being, and for a lot of people,that social media.
A lot of people love socialmedia.
They're really good at it.
They're good at connecting withpeople on a human level on
social media.
There are people who despise itand don't want anything to do
with it, and so that's fine too.
(25:51):
But for the people who do likesocial media and you mentioned
you do a lot on LinkedIn howdoes social media play into your
networking strategy?
Speaker 3 (26:01):
They're intertwined.
There's no way to separate themwhatsoever.
For me personally, I actuallythink it's very hard to network
in this day and age withouthaving someone with social media
presence.
It can be be done.
I think it makes.
I think it makes life much,much harder.
Um, for me, like I said, I cannow go to events and people will
know me, which just makes lifemore pleasant and easier.
(26:21):
To be honest, like I have tosay, there's just no two ways
about it.
Um, I think it means I'll meetsomeone at an event and I can
never speak to them again, butthey'll.
They see me on LinkedIn becauseI always connect on LinkedIn.
I should say I'll connect witheveryone on LinkedIn, which you
can do after an event.
You can connect with everyoneon LinkedIn.
That's completely acceptable.
I would never write a no oranything.
I'll just maybe I'd say it wasgreat to meet you at the event,
(26:42):
but I'll probably just send arequest and that's it.
Um, so they see me time and timeagain and it's just again with
marketing.
It's so boring, it's such acliche, but it takes time and
people have to be exposed to you.
They say seven touch points tosay four.
Whatever it is, it's rarely,just once I mean it should be,
but it's not always so for me.
They're just so intertwined inlike helping each other and
(27:04):
supporting each other.
I truly don't know how peoplereally succeed in networking
without it.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Yeah yeah, I agree, I use, uh Facebook a lot.
I want to be more on LinkedIn,but I'm just not, and so that's
a truth about myself that I'maccepting right now.
I don't think you need to be onLinkedIn at all.
Speaker 3 (27:22):
I just think, like, if Facebook's working for you,
great, just focus on that.
Like I really want to be onInstagram.
That is not my reality, so yeahexactly.
Speaker 2 (27:30):
We're just.
Speaker 3 (27:30):
We're just accepting the truths about ourselves today
, but I think, as businessowners we have, you don't have
to do anything, you have to makemoney for making money and you
can grow your business.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
Then that makes it.
Yeah, that that's certainlyhelpful.
Uh, but one of the things thatI find people ask me a lot about
with networking and youprobably find this too is the
follow-up, and this is likepeople's biggest complaint is
like I don't have time to followup.
I don't know how to follow up,I don't know how to keep track
of all these people.
When do I follow up with them,what do I do?
And I find that social mediamakes the follow-up much easier.
(28:01):
Do you think so too?
Speaker 3 (28:04):
I think it makes it easier.
You can also email.
I think people are looking forexcuses.
Also email.
I think people are looking forexcuses.
Excuse me for saying there'salways an excuse not to do the
follow-up.
It doesn't take that long.
Like I'm the organizer ofevents, so when I'm in a like
I'm a women's event yesterday,so I did a special offer that if
you join this week, you know weoffer we're going to offer this
(28:24):
like a like a very small setperiod of free membership.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Okay, so I had a few people who are interested.
Speaker 3 (28:29):
So I followed up with them them.
I sent them WhatsApps, which inIsrael we WhatsApp in business.
I don't know if it's soacceptable in America, but
that's how we do it here.
I sent them WhatsApps.
My baby was home.
She was not well.
My baby was home all the time.
I was able to do it, even justwith her home the whole time,
which, like it, doesn't takethat at quite a bit of trading.
I do think with networking,people have a lot of excuses.
(28:51):
You find the time for what'simportant and if growing your
business is important, you'llfind the time for it.
That's number one.
If you have LinkedIn orFacebook, it is easier to send
LinkedIn messages, for sure.
But I also think an email seemsa bit more sometimes, can feel
a bit more professional and Ithink it's very easy.
I mean, when I do events, Iwrite down very clearly a list
(29:12):
of like a heading this person'sinterested in this and then I
write the list of that and thenthe next heading and then the
list just cross them off whenI've heard to them, chase them.
I would chase people myself onlytwice.
I would like I would send anemail and then a follow-up email
.
I personally would never gobeyond that.
Everyone does what they wouldlike.
That's my way of doing it, andwhen you're doing a follow-up or
you're asking for I mean, itreally depends.
(29:32):
It's organized.
It's different.
But if you're just asking for achat, I'd just love to meet with
you.
Hi, it was so.
I mean you can write templates.
Hi, it was so great to meet you.
I love talking about inserttopic how is your cat doing?
I hope they feel better.
Like you speak from theconversation and then say,
listen, I would love to have achat with you.
What I, what I personally thinkis really helpful for people is
if you give them don't sendthem a calendar link.
(29:54):
Give them five dates, give themfive options of dates.
People are really lazy and theydon't want to give you options.
They don't necessarily want togo through a link.
Just say I'm available on thesefive dates.
Do any of these work for you?
If not, please send me dates.
You're available and, of course, work.
Make it as easy as possible forpeople.
(30:14):
I just think that's the key.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
I don't think it's that challenging.
I really don't.
No, I don't think it is either.
I mean, it's not hard and it'snot um, it doesn't take a long
time, but you do have to beintentional about, like, setting
aside the time to do it andmaking that a priority, like you
said but like we have to takeresponsibility for our actions,
like we have to say that we arebusiness owners and we've come
here to show up and this is partof my networking.
Speaker 3 (30:36):
And if you're going to a networking event, I'm going
to tell you a secret there's nopoint going if you're not
following up.
If you don't have the time,then just don't go.
It's also okay, you don't haveto go to every event, but if
you're going to get thisoccasionally, of course I've
also had it where you go to theevent and it happens to be that
person needs your service andyou get really lucky and you get
(30:57):
business from that.
It does happen, for sure, andit's beautiful and it's lovely,
but it's very rare.
That's the exception to therule.
You are the rule.
It happens in the follow up.
Speaker 2 (31:12):
So just be aware of that Love, that Great points.
I feel like we're going to needa part two and a part three, so
we'll have to come back formore of this.
I could tell you these aretopics I could talk about all
day long and there's so muchthat goes into all of them,
because we're all such differentpeople, right Like we're going
to approach it differently.
If we're introverts, everyoneis surprised.
When I say I'm an introvert,I'm like, no, you just think I'm
not an introvert Cause I'm likesuper awkward.
But also, when I get reallynervous, I just like say
(31:35):
whatever's in my brain andsomehow it comes out funny and
you guys all think I'm funny andlike this outgoing comedian
person people think ofintroverts as socially awkward
and it's not the same thing atall.
Speaker 3 (31:48):
Like you can be introverted and be incredibly
friendly and warm.
Yeah, and confident.
Yeah, 100%.
Like I think I come across asextremely extroverted.
I think you do come across asmore introverted, but we're both
warm, friendly, like I thinkthere's a lot of confusion
around what introvertism,introverted really means.
I like introvertism.
(32:08):
Again, it is not my, I'mdefinitely not an introvert.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
Yeah, yeah, I think it's more clear.
I think it's harder to tell ina networking event, like when
you're interacting with someone,as opposed to like what happens
after the event.
Right, like do you leave therefeeling like so jazzed and
excited and like what are wedoing now?
Who are we talking to now?
What's next Versus?
I leave and I'm like I don'teven want to turn the radio on,
(32:33):
like let's just drive home insilence.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
So I love.
I really do love my networkingevents and events I go to.
It really depends, but I reallythrive on problems, like if
there's an issue, like that'swhen my adrenaline really hits
and that's when I'm really readyto rock and roll.
I had an event a while ago itwas our big mega event and it
(32:58):
went beyond smoothly, there wasno issues.
I'm not saying this to brag,like we do it for four years,
like we're making it bigger nextyear, like because it was too
smooth, you need to improveevery year.
There was really no issues.
It was so, so smooth and that'smostly due to my husband who
helps with everything and he'svery good at logistics.
Um, and I left feeling a bitflat, actually, because I need
yesterday we had a bit too muchdrama.
There's needs to be a happymedium, but I need a little bit
(33:18):
of, like a fizz, like I needthat.
That kind of gets me going,that adrenaline, and it was so
smooth.
Like it was really a bit scary,but we made up for yesterday,
where we had, like you know, keypeople who didn't show up, like
there was a lot more issuesyesterday, which you know, gave
me that adrenaline buzz that Iso desperately crave, but that's
when my therapist to work out.
(33:39):
I suppose it's funny.
It's also funny because I woremy no drama shirt for you today,
but your shirt says yes, drama,please, please more drama yeah,
I watch a lot of reality tv,which I think, yeah, my husband
like tell me things happening inhis office.
I'm like I need more.
He's like have like he has thebasic facts.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
No, they never ask the right questions give me more
.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
Invite them around to our house now, let's get drinks
and let's get this informationout.
I need to know why they gotbroke up like yeah, yeah, um,
yeah, it's not my best quality,I wouldn't say, but it is
intrinsic to who I am.
I want to say I really likegossip about people I don't know
, obviously about people I knowit's very sad to know it must
sound like a terrible person.
I'm generally very lovely, butI do love reality too.
(34:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
Same, I do too Okay.
So if people want to connectwith you more, if they want to
learn more about Englishspeaking network, if they want
to just follow you for yourawesome networking tips, if they
just want to hear your accentsmore, what's the best way for
them to connect with you?
We get really excited aboutaccents here in Colorado.
Speaker 3 (34:44):
Yeah, I'm like a scumbag, like I'm from the North
of England, so my accent is solovely If you, if you're British
, it's nice.
No, it's so lovely if you, ifyou're british, it's nice.
You say that, but it's notlondon.
I don't sound posh, um, sothank you so much.
So, um, linkedin, the name ishelena baker, which I'm sure we
spelled beautifully in the shownotes.
Instagram, if you'd like tofollow me there.
(35:04):
It's network with helena.
There's always a very goodintention around posting.
I can't pretend I always do,and I'm actually launching my
own podcast um on the Octoberthe 29th, which is the fifth
year birthday of Englishspeaking networking um, and
we're speaking to five businessowners in Israel with more than
five employees who've been goingfor more than five years to
celebrate Arthur's birthday andabout three families they've had
(35:26):
a business.
So that is being launchedOctober 29th and it'll be on all
where you get your podcasts atfailing our way to success.
It's a lot of work, so I verymuch respect what you're doing.
I did not appreciate.
That is being launched onOctober 29th and it will be on
all where you get your podcastsat Failing Our Way to Success.
It's super exciting.
It's a lot of work of podcasts,so I very much respect what
you're doing.
I do not appreciate the levelof work that goes into these.
I have to say, that's about it.
I'm really excited.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Awesome.
Well, thank you so much forbeing a guest.
I loved our conversation.
You and I are very much on, sowe will definitely have you back
on the show again, so much.
Speaker 3 (35:50):
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
Thanks for listening to Powerful Women Rising.
We hope today's episodeinspired you to keep rising.
If you love the podcast, pleasesubscribe and leave a review.
It's like giving us a virtualhug and helps more awesome women
like you find the show.
Click the link in the shownotes to get your free list of
top virtual networking eventsfor female entrepreneurs.
It's time to make realconnections and grow your
(36:15):
business with integrity andauthenticity.
Until next time, keep risingand stay powerful.
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