March 23, 2025 • 37 mins
This week on Rugby Direct, Elliott Smith and Liam Napier discuss the Crusaders' big win over the Blues - and dig further into just why the latter are struggling so bad in their title defence.
We wrap the rest of round 6 in Super Rugby and also pose a few questions around international eligibility as well as the prospect of who Ian Foster might pick for the combined Australia-NZ team he's picking to face the British and Irish Lions in July.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
You're listening to a podcast from News Talks EDB. Follow
this and our Wide Ranger podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Inside the Game from Every Angle.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
It's Rugby Direct with Elliott Smith, powered by News Talks EDB.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Welcome to Rugby to powered by Habit Health, tackling all
your aches and pains from sports and work back for
another week to dissect the rugby issues. Elliott Smith with
me as always, Liam Napier. Liam, Greetings, it's been another
fascinating week in the world of rugby. I suppose let's
go back to last week where by the time we
(00:44):
recorded our usual weekly podcast, we're about twenty four hours
out from releasing a podcast with Mark Robinson into our
CEO and Scott robertson All Black Sea Coach. Plenty of
positive reactions, so I thank you to all that have
got in touch with us on that. And yeah, it's
created a few stories around the rugby world, hasn't it has.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Indeed, anytime the All Blacks Coach goes live to the
nation so to speak, or it does an in depth
interview like that, it's widely picked up on. And yeah,
I thought it was quite candid by Razor at times.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Some hot top.
Speaker 4 (01:15):
Topics covered eligibility, everything from Kalyn Ponger to NRL converts
and the like in Richie Muonga what happened in Japan.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
So yeah, thanks for all your feedback.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
And if you haven't had a chance to listen to
it's yea rap breads around it.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
Yeah, you can view it on YouTube as well. Check
it on the old Crome cast or smart TV and
park up in the lounge and watch it that way
if you're so inclined and keen for any other guests
that you might like us to get on Rugby Direct.
Let's rip into the weekend that was, and the headline
match from a New Zealand perspective was the Blues and
(01:54):
Crusaders on Saturday night and it delivered plenty of tries,
It delivered a big win for the Crusaders, and it
delivered more questions about this Blues team one and five
in their title defense. No one would have picked this.
This was perhaps a fifty to fifty game heading in.
You know, the Crusaders were underdogs at the bookies, but
(02:15):
the Crusaders just too good on the nights and deserving
of their win. What did you make of the performance then.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
I think we've split them down the middle.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
If we deal with the Crusaders first and foremost, what
a transformation in the past. What is it four months
really from a disastrous season. I think they only won
four games last year, missed the playoffs. Rob Penney's coaching
job was on the line, questions about his back room staff,
(02:46):
players weren't happy, there were selection concerns. This year, They've
got some bodies back, but they're still missing a few.
Cody Taylor is a couple of others that Brandon n
or Scott Barret only played half of that game. At
the weekends. Ethan Blackhead is still out. So look, the Crusaders,
all credit to them. They did a number on the Blues.
(03:08):
This was the Blues equal biggest loss to the Crusaders
at Eden Park, and I think the Crusaders have now
won nine of the last ten at Eden Park as well,
which is quite staggering. But this was a Crusaders team
that hadn't won away from home and Rob Penny's tenure
nine games. You have to go back to the twenty
(03:28):
twenty three Super Aby Final to find their last away win,
so that was a big monkey off their back. What
I like about the Crusaders is they are far more
adventurous this year, and far more adventurous than they were
under Scott Robertson.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
As well.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
They are attacking from inside their twenty two. They are
offloading using the ball, having a real crack playing with pace.
The Blues could not slow down their quick recycle and
that really hurt them. So I was very impressed by
the Crusaders forward pack. They did a number on the
Blues lineout on this scrum the breakdown, and it really
(04:06):
was one rate traffic apart from the Blues scored the
opening try and then it was all the Crusaders.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
And what the Crusaders thought did well after that opening
try is that they didn't allow the Blues to get
him momnt and they went back down the other end
and scored, then scored again fee hockey scores from the
twenty two, and that just put the Blues on the
back foot after they've done well to open the scoring,
get on the front foot, give themselves a bit of confidence.
The Crusaders managed to do that and that allowed them
to take control of the game from that point onwards
(04:34):
and went into halftime with a thirteen point lead. Extended
it after the break and never really felt like in
any danger from when they went about twenty points to
seven up. And we think back to last year what
the Blues were able to do so well. They played direct,
They used their ball runners really effectively. They used this
set piece really effectively. I know they've got a number
(04:56):
of injuries, but they looked ponderous at times with ball
in hand. And it wasn't until they were chasing the
game late on and the Crusaders maybe switched off a
little bit and some tied bodies out there that they
made and to be a little bit more expansive with
the game plan. It was too late for the Blues
by that point. They let the game slip. In the
(05:16):
first half.
Speaker 4 (05:17):
They did just on the Crusaders again. The final score
line flated the Blues. Kimitta missed three conversions and the
Crusaders could have I think they lead twenty to seven
at halftime, and Will Jordan came close to scoring. I
think he dropped the ball quite close to the line.
They were breaking the Blues open at will. So many
(05:39):
unforced eras from the Blues and senior players were talking here,
you know, Stephen Petefetter dropping a very simple high ball.
The Crusaders score from that. Riquewani at least two drop
balls in contact and he was elevated to the captaincy
after Patrick two Polotu's withdrawal. I think for me that
the form of the crusaders is encapsulated in David Havili's
(06:01):
form last year. I know he had some injury concerns,
but he is now the out and out form second
five in this competation. The way he's carrying the ball
in a dominant fashion, if you watch him his talk,
his organization, he's really relishing that leadership and so his
(06:21):
transformation transformation has been very stark and that's reflected in
the Crusader's form.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
And he's taking pressure off to Hakimitter as well, which
is big because he's a young team. We know the
woes he had last year dropped back to Waycato Club Rugby,
missing conversions and and things like that. That he's taking
that is a big concern. So he's taking a lot
of the heat off Tarkumeter in terms of the way
he's running the game.
Speaker 4 (06:43):
Still a young guy, but when you cast a head
to the playoffs, you've got to be kicking your goals.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
That is going to make a big difference.
Speaker 4 (06:50):
So at some point there's going to be a very
tight call for a penny there does he go for
the experience and James O'Connor, you know when when if
does he make that call?
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Well, he's got free hockey who can go kick. He's
got David Havilli who can goal kick. Now they are
not first choice goal kick is by any strip to
the imagine, but Ta Hakim his numbers would suggest that
he's not at that level of being a first choice
goalkicker as yet, so that I don't need to know
that they really need to change the run on team.
I just think you give the kicking team. I mean,
he's already doing plenty for the Crusaders one to give
(07:21):
it to David Harvilli and say this is part of
your responsibilities now.
Speaker 4 (07:25):
Yeah, well it's not working for him and why does
the first five have to kick? When you mentioned that,
and just on schaefe K, I've given him a bit
of stick here, yeh. And justifiably so, I felt at
the time in terms of the All Blacks conversation, and
it was a big call for Rob Penny to bring
him back and drop Macha Springer to the bench after
(07:46):
he scored five tries.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
But fie Hackey was excellent at the weekend.
Speaker 4 (07:50):
He was highly involved, very dangerous, and every time he
touched the ball fully justified his selection. So that speaks
to the Crusader's depth. Now let's look at the Blues.
What the hell's gone wrong? This was a team that
dominated last year and they were titled favorites and now
they have been a complete flop. And the biggest concern
(08:12):
was we'll talk about the injuries, but last week they
really hinted that they were improving. They could have very
easily beaten the Chiefs in Hamilton but for a sideline
conversion from Xavier Taili and this was easily their worst
performance of the season.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
That leaves so many question marks.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
It does. It was a massive step backwards after what
they were able to do the week prior and push
the Chiefs right to the limit. And you look at
the stats postgame and they do not tell the story.
I was looking up. The possession was fifty fifty, so
charactery of fifty fifty possession, The Blues had fifty three
to forty seven running meters. The Blues had five hundred
(08:52):
and ninety to the Crusaders three hundred and forty. This
is a game where the stats don't tell the tale.
It's probably bolstered by the last fifteen or so minutes
where they became a bit more adventurous, had to really
chase the game and had some better running meters and
were able to hold onto the ball for perhaps a
little bit longer. But they seem to have just gone
away from everything that was working so well last year.
(09:12):
They don't build pressure, and that's the concerning thing for me,
is that they had a lot of position in that
game and just didn't know really what to do with it.
And whether teams have figured them out, or whether they're
not comfortable playing that style of rugby anymore, I don't
exactly know. But they barely really got into the Crusaders
twenty two and put pressure on in that game on
(09:33):
the weekend. They Crusaders were able to force eras, the
Blues made unforced eras, and there was one period in
the second spell where they just sort of were five
minutes five minutes inside the Crusaders half, not really going
anywhere for about two or three minutes at a time,
just passing left and right, not able to strike, not
able to find a way through. So I think the
Blues have become really ponderous this year. And yeah, there's
(09:54):
a number of injuries, but there's still a lot of
quality in that team, and I don't know why they
haven't been able to recapture any of that magic from
last year.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
Very disjointed and directionless performance, and it is a big concern.
There were a couple of stats which does speak to
that performance. The Blues had nineteen turnovers to the Crusaders,
five six those were unforced eerers and they won five
of thirteen lineouts and the scrum was seventy five percent.
So if you look at where the Blues were strong
(10:26):
last year, it was in the collisions, it was the
line out, drives, the set piece, the defense, their kick strategy,
all of those things are not working for them. And
we do have to touch on their injuries.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
I think fourteen.
Speaker 4 (10:38):
Players out and Patrick losing Patrick, two Polo to and
Eckland just prior in the days leading up to that
game does have a massive influence on your leadership, on
your line out. And the Blues now go into the
buy and from what I'm hearing, they will get potentially Ricky, Rictelli, Eckland,
(10:59):
Patrick two, Polo to Zan Sullivan, Bowden, Barrett, Adrian Choate,
Anton Signer, Tafafunaki, aj Lamb potentially all coming back after
the buyer. Now there's some massive inns offer doing a
fussy knick injury doesn't sound great. Not sure what his
prognosis is, but you've got to front with who you've got,
(11:22):
and there's no excuses for basic errors and the lack
of direction and so yes, you can make excuses and
the injuries do play a part, but I don't think
that justifies the phenomenal slide we've seen in such a
short space time.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
I agree, And the problem I've got is that at
some of the All Blacks players that are not standing
up and delivering, the ones that are still standing and
not injured, that they're not getting the best out of
Rico Jowani. I think ran for a lot of meters
on the weekend, but and he was captain, but I
think didn't have one of his better games and struggled
to get on the go forward on the weekend. Dalton
(12:02):
Papa Lei has been really quiet this season and I'm
not sure why that. In these occasions where you need
players to stand up, they're not. Cameron Christie has been.
On the other hand, a young player that's only in
what has theod fourth game maybe for super rugby level,
is one of those ones that a stand up. As
zeb Ta earlier, you can see the brilliance and the
(12:22):
possibilities that he might bring. So it's those younger players
are standing up. And I think you've got to put
some real question marks around Papalii and Yuani as leaders
in this team. They've both captained before the Blues and
they're not delivering at the moment.
Speaker 2 (12:36):
And for me, that speaks to an attitude thing.
Speaker 4 (12:39):
To be honest, it's very hard to quantify, but I
spoke to Stephen bit of fit to this year and
he hinted that a training attitude that wasn't the same
as last year, and speaking to others around the team,
there is a sense that there hasn't been that same hunger.
The Blues broke their eighteen year title drought last year.
They wanted it really bad and von Kotta came in
(13:02):
got a reaction from this team and it is very
much like do you want this?
Speaker 2 (13:08):
How hungry are you?
Speaker 4 (13:09):
And it's a classic case of almost second year syndrome.
Going through the motions. They made all the right noises
about not being complacent, but they're not walking the talk.
Speaker 3 (13:18):
No and they had said that. You know, the players
have said that the training wasn't as intense as it
needed to be, perhaps in preseason from their own perspective,
that they they didn't bring the intensity required. And that's
the hallmarks of you know, great teams, isn't it. You
look back to some of the super rugby teams. You know,
the Crusader's going on that run between twenty seventeen and
twenty three, even the Chiefs in twenty twelve and twenty
(13:40):
thirteen winning back to back, the Blues you know, way
back in the nineties doing it back to bads. It's
all very well. Winning one and that's great and you
can celebrate that, and they broke the adrat there. But
the great teams back it up and they may not
go back and win the title the next year, but
they'll go very very close. And we're just not seeing
that from the Blues. You know, there's a long way
(14:01):
to go in this competition. They're one in five, but
you know, they get some players back, sure, but there's
still some big games to come from. They've got to
go play the Crusader's Wayne christ Church go to Suva.
They've got to a suver. They've got Hurricanes at home
in a couple of weeks. They've got Wana Pacific two
games to play now, one is bottom of the table.
(14:21):
But you just don't know what kind of game plan
they'll bring and how hungry they might be on the night.
So they've got a still some runway the Blues, but
not a lot really in this competition.
Speaker 4 (14:32):
No times running out and you know what, this is
where we find out what the Blues are made of
and what their attitude is and how much they want it.
They've dug themselves a massive hole. And for me, the
responsibility it's player lead. The coaching team can only do
so much. Where are these players at How are they
gonna They need to catch the ball, they need to
(14:55):
put these things in place. The other thing we just
another step. The kicking meters, I think it was the
Crusaders kicked twenty five times and they've got eight hundred
odd meters. The Blues were nineteen odd times for three hundreds.
So little things like that have a profound effect but yeah,
the Blues there are in some adversity. How and are
(15:17):
they going to fight their way out of it? Because
this has been their own doing. So let's find out
what they're all about.
Speaker 3 (15:22):
Indeed, they go into the buy the sweet, plenty of
things to pond it there. Let's go to the Reeds
in the hand is under the roof in Dunedin on
Saturday afternoon, the Reeds emerging twenty nine to twenty three winners. Look,
the Reds were without Fraser mcwright as they crossed the
Tasman tamd Dermott and yet they come over and take
the win. And for periods in this game it felt
(15:45):
like the Highlanders not necessarily have this game under control,
but they know they trailed early, came back, got themselves
into the contest and it felt like, okay, they'd set
themselves up for well, but they just made a couple
of errors. In the second spell, Ethan Degrouk goes off
for a yellow card. They can sider to try either
side of that, and all they can escape with is
(16:06):
a penalty goal at the end for a bonus point.
I thought this was a really disappointing second spell, in
particular from the Highlanders.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
It was.
Speaker 4 (16:14):
Yes, the game was there for the taking and they
started slowly and then I felt like they got their
game going, started to build, some things got on top,
and then they felt like they let it slip. You
mentioned the yellow card, and the other big factor here
was their scrum got completely dismantled, dismantled. Their replacement tight
head had some real struggles, then went off injured. The
(16:35):
starting tight head came back, but the Reds really their
replacement front rowers Alex Hodgman and the like did a
number on the Highlanders. Poor yellow card from the group.
That was costly as well from an all Black. So yeah, look,
there were some impressive individual performances. Was great to see
(16:56):
Peter umung A Jensen back in the midfield. I thought
he was added some real touches of class with his
long balls and midfield penetration. Sean Withey was good well,
at least one turnover, but yeah, the read's not at
full strength. That was there for the taking for the Honders.
I think there was the Reds first one in Dneed
(17:18):
in ten twelve years. So there's a bit about that team.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
There is a bit about that team. We saw them
come to christ Church and get beaten there, but they
felt threatening in that game, just didn't quite get maybe
the bounce of the ball the war waritie. They go
over to Needen, which is as you said and historically
has been a tricky trip for them. They're well in
Sconced now in that top three alongside the Chiefs and Crusaders.
You know, they're building quite nicely and they've got an
(17:43):
interesting all run. They've got the Chiefs in a couple
of weeks in Hamilton, which is gonna be a real
litmus test for them because.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
I've had a bit of success against the Chiefs.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
They have exactly and they deliver it in Hamilton in
a couple of weeks time. Because it feels like they're building,
you know, and there's all sorts of things going on
in the background around Les Kiss and his likelihood that
he's probably going to be the next Wallabies coach after
Joe Schmidt. But what I like about them is their
depth and we've seen that again you know, Frasmik right out.
(18:12):
But they've got a really strong loose for trio and
the Highlanders just couldn't kick with it. And it feels
like this is a hot and cold sort of Highlanders team.
At the moment, they are better than last year, but
whether they can push for you know, those top spots
when it comes to the playoffs, it's going to be
a real question.
Speaker 4 (18:30):
Yeah, it feels like they're on the fringe, doesn't it.
They can pull out a performance. But the hot cold
is a good analogy because even if you go back
to that performance against Wina Pacifica where they just scrape through,
you know, very lucky to get through that. So there's
still a bit of growing for that team.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
There is in d Let's go back to the weekend
this for night, to the game that started the weekend,
the Chiefs fifty one of PACIFICA thirty five in Pocaki.
This was a very odd game of rugby to one
watch to commentate. Was forty three to seven at half time.
And the Chiefs are cruising and playing some of the
best rugby this season. One are playing some of their worst.
(19:07):
We've seen how good they can be against the Canes
and the Herders, or seeing how bad they can be
though at times, and how they can switch off. Well,
they didn't switch on until minute forty on the weekend,
but when they switched on, they were hard to contain.
Really hard to get a read on what this game
meant and what we got out of it, the key
point probably being the halftime break and also tinn of
(19:28):
Umonger changing. I think five players at the break and
bring on some fresh legs.
Speaker 4 (19:32):
Read a nice line from Aaron Goyle saying Pokakoe Stadium
someone needed to check the slope on it because there's
seventy five points scored at one end.
Speaker 3 (19:40):
Of the the Old Lord's but at Cricket Ground.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
It's quite staggering, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (19:47):
I guess Look, I think you're the Chiefs and you're
up by forty odd points at halftime. There is an
element of clocking off mentally and parking the bus. Wine
will be very disappointed with the way they started their game.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
The Chiefs. Weren't you a full strength to provide?
Speaker 4 (20:02):
Pulled out just before the game, missing Ardie as well,
and they got a lot of off their bench. Maybe
they look to change things up from a selection perspective there.
But yeah, very very strange game. I know punters were
sweeten the on the Chiefs thirteen plus down the stretch there.
I don't know how much he can take out of
(20:22):
that game.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
For either team. Wana.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
You know, a lot of work to do on how
they start games and Chiefs will be disappointed to concede
that many points.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Damian McKenzie very good again.
Speaker 3 (20:32):
He was very good again. But I just think Clayton
McMillan won't have been a happy man. Halftime interview on
sky TV says, you know, he basically to paraphrase, we
need to go out and complete the job. Well they didn't,
and it would have been a very tense bus ride back,
I'm sure on Friday night from Hamilton to Pookey. That's right,
Bookie to Hamilton.
Speaker 4 (20:50):
Yeah, and look, the Chiefs are title favorites, but they
do look a bit fallible. They were pushed to the
brink by the Blues. I only turned up for one
half against the against Mona lost the week prior to
the Blues, so yeah, there's a few holes you could
put punch there.
Speaker 3 (21:08):
Yeah. Their best performance was that Crusader's game where they
nearly put fifty on on that night, and they've been
a bit up and down since, but they are collecting
the wins. Anything stand out from the other two games
of the weekend Warratars Brumbies twenty eight twenty three and
the four fifty two fifteen over the poor old Druler
in Sunday night footy or Sunday afternoon for they in Perth.
Speaker 4 (21:26):
Yeah, surprised by the margin in Perth. The Duror always
struggle away from home, but they pushed the Brumbies in Canberra.
Look I saw parts of that Wartars Brumbies game. It
was a great finish and one thing to note there.
Speaker 2 (21:39):
Is the Waratars heads.
Speaker 4 (21:41):
I think twenty odd thousand at that game, which is
a record attendance for them in the last couple of years.
And I think there is a bit of buzz building
around Australian rugby. They've got the lines there next year,
so starting to slowly rebuild and put Ozzie rugby back
on the map. These teams are a lot more competitive
this year and I think Sydney is a bit of
(22:03):
a gauge of that twenty thousand that compares really well
to the NRL crowds that they've seen this year. So
positive rumblings in Australian rugby, which is good to see.
Speaker 3 (22:12):
Yeah, we love to see that absolutely and more on
the Aussie teams. After this here on Rugby Direct will
come back take a break, second half of Rugby Direct
after this.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
This is Rugby Direct, a podcast for real rugby fares.
Rugby Direct, Howard Buddies Talk SIV.
Speaker 3 (22:34):
You're back with Rugby Direct. Time now for our final
four or Liam. There are four Australian teams in the
Super Rugby Top six at the moment. How many will
make the playoffs? So they're all in their The Chiefs
are on top on twenty two points, Crusaders on nineteen,
Reds on nineteen, Wartars on seventeen, Brumby's on fifteen, Force
on fourteen. That's the top six. Highland is eleven, Hurricanes nine,
(22:55):
Blues seven drew a seven more on a Pacificer on six.
At this point in the season, will all four of
those teams make the top six?
Speaker 2 (23:05):
No?
Speaker 4 (23:05):
No, they won't. The Force won't. I'm torn on two
or three, but I can't. We don't fit fence here
at Rugby Derex. So I'm going to say two of
them make it, and the Blues and Hurricanes both sneaking.
Speaker 3 (23:22):
Okay, I tend to agree. The Force have got a
tricky back half of the season. They got the Reds
this week, then they welcome the Highlanders and Hurricanes at
home in consecutive weeks. Then they're away to the Force
on as Sorry to the Chiefs on anzac Dan Todonga.
Then there to Auckland and playing the Blues, who at
(23:42):
that point in the season, who knows they'll be hungry.
And then the Brumbies drew it and war Atars to finish.
So that's a tricky run includes a trip to Suva
for them as well. So I suspect you're right around
the Force dropping out. Who did you say that your
two teams is going to make it?
Speaker 4 (23:56):
So I said two. Yeah, it's tough, isn't it. So
we've got the Reds, Wartars and Brumbies. It's really tough
to draw a line through one of them. I'm going
to say the Warriors miss out.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
I tend to agree because they've got a number of
New Zealand teams and not just to put the New
Zealand teams up in lights, but there's a tricky drawer.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
Yeah seven, I think the Blues and Knees sneak in.
Speaker 4 (24:22):
But look, it's very it's going to be a great
finish to the season and there's.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Going to be a lot of jeopardy around around there.
Speaker 3 (24:28):
Well at the Blues, you know seven points on the
letter stands there one went outside the playoffs. They do
have the buy, but other teams have the ball. It'll
even itself out. That flows really nicely onto topic number two.
Are you willing to draw a line through the Blues
winning the title this year one in five outside the
(24:52):
playofs at the moment on seven points?
Speaker 2 (24:55):
No, no, no, I'm not.
Speaker 4 (24:56):
But it's a long long road to hoe because they
will be away from home for should they sneak into
the playoffs, there's two questions here. One is do they
make the playoffs and then they still title contenders? As
it stands right now, you would say, no, they're not
title contenders. I think they make the playoffs and if
they're healthy, they could knock over anyone on their day,
(25:19):
and we saw that a week ago in Hamilton where
they pushed the title favorites to the brink.
Speaker 3 (25:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (25:25):
So look, they desperately need some bodies back, and they
desperately need the reset and the buy, and we're gonna
it's almost it's not quite make or break territory for
the Blues, but with the Hurricanes next up, these are
very very important matches. So no, I'm not willing to
draw a line through them as title contenders, but it's
(25:47):
very touch and go.
Speaker 3 (25:48):
They've got a trip to christ shoots to come yep
and SUV and SUV and Queensland and Brisbane. Yeah. Yeah,
there's not much regal, right, I know that. So the
one went out of the playoffs, but there really isn't
much regular room excuse me left for the Blues.
Speaker 4 (26:01):
Well, they can probably drop what are they one and five?
They could probably drop two ab three most and it
also depends on how other teams go as well. And
that's just getting to the top six. You don't really
want to be going to Hamilton a week one. No,
that's that's tough. Yeah, one v six, two v five
three p four Yeah, what about you. I don't think
(26:23):
they can win the title. I think they can still
make the playoffs, absolutely. I have seen enough from the
Chiefs too are clear favorites Crusaders and Reds tucked in
behind to suguesce that there are better teams at this
point in time. And you're right, having to go from
deep mark it down twenty fourth to March. I don't
think they can win the title again this year. The
(26:44):
only thing I'm hanging on to here is if you
get bow in the back at ten, you put Peter
Fittis to fall back. You know, you welcome some of
these Patrick Ricky big names, but it just hasn't happened
for them.
Speaker 3 (26:58):
So and they've had a lot of those names in
the opening rounds. You know, maybe not in the positions
that they would necessarily have put them, but they've had
a lot of those players that you know, these aren't
players that have been out for the entire season. These
are players out for two or three weeks.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
YEP.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
Topic number three A good story from our friend Joe Pearson.
Last week. Current time way Flour goes on record saying
that he is wanting to play for the All Blacks.
He played for Tonger at the twenty twenty three World Cup,
so it wouldn't be eligible until the back end of
twenty twenty six, a long way to go. And he
certainly signs some really good signs that he's a promising
footballer and has some real quality about him. But having
(27:33):
played for Tonga, was this what the rule was brought
in for? And would you support it? If you know?
Sc Robertson comes knocking next year.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
It's no idea, was it.
Speaker 4 (27:44):
You want players to play for their heritage, and the
fact he has played for Tonga you would hope that
that would continue. But we have discussed the iniquities in
test rugby, and I think for most Pacific Islanders, I
don't want to generalize here speak for individuals, but there
is an elevated prestige that comes with the all blacks.
(28:07):
A certainly opens a lot more doors to securing your
financial future. So by all means individuals can do as
they choose. But in an ideal world where you could
make everything equitable, these guys play for their home nations.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
The rule is in the rule Boox. You know, I
wouldn't have too much of a problem with it necessarily.
It's happened, you know, Frank Buntz in the nineties. I
think a Lumbit had admired did it as well. When
the rules are a bit more loosened than they are now.
And even these rules have been loosened from what they
were previously, it's not ideal. I still think having completed
(28:48):
a three year standdown, you're entitled to go play for
who you want. And yeah, I don't know that you
go from you can only go from tier one down
to tear two. I don't think you can lock that
in going from Ted. You know, you couldn't say you
can only go down, you can't go up. So it's
not what the rule was brought in for. But he's
a special case in many ways.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (29:08):
The other question is around Moana's purpose, right, So is
it just a vehicle for the All Blacks to cherry
pick their best players or are they really benefiting Tonga
and some more?
Speaker 3 (29:20):
Well, look at their rules, don't they that they're allowed
three All Blacks? But then they've got a number of
other plays who are eligible for the All Blacks and
are eligible for multiple countries. Levi Moore, who's no longer
with them, played for He's think eligible for four countries.
It was another examle We've go a number of players
who are eligible for the All Blacks but have Pacific
Island heritage. And I think that's the thing around what
(29:43):
makes New Zealand so unique and special is that we
have that strong connection to the Pacific and people are
proud of multiple heritages, and because we are still so
close to them in terms of geographical nature, it is
possible to go and play for them and have these
mixed that mixed heritage that makes New Zealand great and
makes wite A Pacific great and makes these teams great.
(30:04):
So I don't think you can cap it and go, well,
you can't be eligible for the All Blacks because then
they're losing a lot of players.
Speaker 4 (30:09):
Yeah, it's a vexed conversation, isn't it. Because you have
other players like Miracle Vai Lungy who was plucked from
samo On Club Rugby essentially and has come in and
been a roaring successful Muana and he will go back
and strengthen Samoa and there are other examples of that.
So Miana is strengthening those island nations. It's just there
(30:34):
is something that doesn't feel quite right about Miana being
used as a vehicle for the All Blacks.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Topic number four. Ian Foster back in international rugby coaching.
He's going to coach the Australian New Zealand Invitational team
that will play the British and Irish lines a week
out from the first Test, so they're probably going to
play shadow test team in Adelaide. That was announced last
week that Ian Foster is going to be back in
the reins.
Speaker 2 (30:56):
Yea a chet to him, didn't you.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
He did have a chat with him, jumped on too
zoom and had a chat that was Fuzzy Bear. It
was good. He's looking forward to picking. I think primarily
the New Zealand based players will get will mostly be
Japanese players, maybe players he's got connections to previously.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
Him and Steve Hanson might be out of a job
come the end of the season. There Toyota teams.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Not going to flatter I or they're lost on the
weekend as well. I mean, who ideally is going to
form the basis of this Australian New Zealand team, Probably
around the vicinity of sixty to seventy percent Australians by
the sound of it, and they'll be wide to Wallaby
squad members you would expect maybe Michael Hooper comes back
for it. But who would you have there is dream
New Zealand targets.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
Well, Fuzzy dropped a few big names, didn't he. Aaron Smith,
Richie mo Wonger, Nathan Cleary.
Speaker 3 (31:43):
That was I'm not sure the Panthers were releasing from
around whatever it is of the nral To.
Speaker 4 (31:48):
I'd be shocked to see that happen. It would be
great to see Joe Marnhu in that team. I think
there'd be a lot of interest in that, particularly in Australia.
I think there would be a desire from Aaron Smith
and Richie Warner to play in that fixture. They can't
play international rugby as it stands, and they are still
competing still in particular, still still got it. And the
(32:12):
big question for me is there's there's going to be
need that there will need to be some big sums
of insurance because these guys rich and along is on
upwards of two million a season with Tshiba and his
Someone's going to need to ensure him.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
How does it work when South African players go back
and play for their country from Japanese they must be ensured,
I would guess.
Speaker 4 (32:38):
Yeah, I guess they have to release them, don't they
because it's a regulation.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
They don't have to release these players because it's an
invitational teams.
Speaker 4 (32:45):
Yeah, And I guess when they signed them it would
be on the proviso that they're not playing international rugby.
So I think there would need to be a deal broken.
From a spectacle point of view, great, the more quality
former international players you can have in that team, the better.
When this ficture was announced, people talked about all Blacks
(33:09):
being involved, and that was never going to happen because
it clashes with the All Backs playing France. And so
then you're looking at second tier, well not second to
you're looking at super rugby players potentially who but even
then are they going to be released from MPC teams
at that time?
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Well, July and then it's two weeks out, three weeks
out from the start of the NPC, you know, pre
seasons and full swing there.
Speaker 4 (33:31):
Yeah, maybe you could get a Shan Stephenson who's possibly
going back to Japan.
Speaker 3 (33:37):
Well, you might lean up Foster, might lean on some
of those connections, you know with all Blacks that he
had that are no longer being selected by the All
Black like Christie for example.
Speaker 4 (33:45):
Yeah, it's going to be a barbarians type team, is it?
And I think they'll play that way. So it should
be a hell of a spectacle. And it would be
great to see Aaron Smith and Richard Wonger link up
because from a viewing point of view, we don't get
to watch Japanese rugby.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Nobody has the rights to I think it's on rugby passon.
You get one game a week and it's their peckers
to who you see.
Speaker 4 (34:04):
So it's a very interesting plot line to see who
who in Foster can ken Dragon.
Speaker 3 (34:11):
The Penrith Panthers play the paramount of Eels that weekend.
They probably don't need clearing to get past the Eels.
So maybe maybe Fozzy can get on the phone to
Ivan and just work out some sort of deal.
Speaker 2 (34:23):
Yeah, Brad Thorne's not coaching.
Speaker 3 (34:26):
It's still right, all right, let's get into our tepic Liam,
shocking weekend for you. Thanks one of five. You picked
the Chiefs correctly, everything else wrong, remembering that we picked
everything diametrically opposite last week.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
Yes, I'm just trying to give you a chance this year.
I appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (34:41):
Too many beatdowns, Yeah, reads Crusader's task Force, Thank you
very much. Four or five. I have the lead by
four nineteen versus fifteen. Who do you picked this week?
In our first four game round? Liam? And it starts
on Friday night? Hurricanes, Waratars Love and gold Sport and
iHeart Radio.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Well, no, everyone's missed the Hurricanes.
Speaker 4 (35:01):
So great to have the cane train back and I'll
be steamrolling the Waratas and Wellington.
Speaker 3 (35:07):
I can't see the Wartars winning that one, despite the
fact they did get over the Brumbies. Rumbies into the Highlanders.
Hard place to go on Camber, isn't it.
Speaker 2 (35:15):
Yes, tough one, but Brumbies for me.
Speaker 3 (35:18):
Yeah, I'm going to pick the same on that front. Crusaders,
Mona pacifica christ.
Speaker 4 (35:24):
I am feeling a strong connection to Moana this year,
but look from a tipping point of view, going to
have to.
Speaker 3 (35:29):
Well, I can't go against Okay, we're all the same.
Red's Force will.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Be cheering hard for Moana.
Speaker 3 (35:34):
Just for the record, please don't Red's Force Brisbane reads.
Speaker 4 (35:40):
Yeah, the Force, It's not going to get you much
in the multi force.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
Well, okay, all right, upset time blow Dollie and the
boys are going you look at the way they played
against the.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
Drawer last night and Lea McDonald do you trust that's right?
Speaker 3 (35:54):
Absolutely? Always have always Well Rugby Direct m VP Metal
voting time. Let's go rook at the table Actually na
way out on top. On eight there is a five
way tie for second. Ardie save Quinti, Pie Will, Jordan Duplessy,
Confi and Damian McKenzie and what make that seventh alone
(36:16):
in seventh's miracle Fi Lungey. So there's your top three
ish as it stands my top three this week, I'm
going first, Liam, you are any more? And Nonu the
Crusaders hooker. Thought he was excellent on the weekend, remembering
that he is the third choice hooker for the Crusaders
with George boll out, Cody Taylor ruled out during the week,
Brody Mcalster left in the off season. He's taken his
(36:37):
opportunity and taking it really well. So he gets my
three points. David HARVILLI gets my two thought he was
really positive as we've touched on before. And Gideon Rampling
from the Chiefs, who I thought was electric in midfield,
especially that first half, gets my one point.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
This week we'll got the same one and two just
on the Crusader's hooker. Another one that you've recruited from
outside your region. Smart recruit good counties, boy, so recruit
maybe produce some of your own for a change in well.
Speaker 3 (37:08):
You know, James Mullens from the Kanbury region has gone
up to Auckland, so it's all about sharing it around.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
Nice Auckland products.
Speaker 4 (37:15):
There's been many of them over the years, Non Berryman
RP norm and in one point I'm giving to Peter
Humung and Jensen great scend back on the park and
long way that continue.
Speaker 3 (37:26):
So we've got the same two and three, same big
weekend for the Crusaders. That special from you to see
that limb.
Speaker 2 (37:32):
Ah yes credit weird credits too, you.
Speaker 3 (37:34):
Know, yeah, absolutely right. That'll do us for another week
of Rugby direct. I thanks to Larson Bars English for
putting us together, and thanks of course to Abbit Health
tackling all your aches and pains from sport and work.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
For more from News Talks ed B.
Speaker 1 (37:50):
Listen live on air or online, and keep our shows
with you wherever you go with our podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to a podcast from News Talks EDB. Follow
this and our Wide Ranger podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Inside the Game from Every Angle.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
It's Rugby Direct with Elliott Smith, powered by News Talks EDB.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Welcome to Rugby to powered by Habit Health, tackling all
your aches and pains from sports and work back for
another week to dissect the rugby issues. Elliott Smith with
me as always, Liam Napier. Liam, Greetings, it's been another
fascinating week in the world of rugby. I suppose let's
go back to last week where by the time we
(00:44):
recorded our usual weekly podcast, we're about twenty four hours
out from releasing a podcast with Mark Robinson into our
CEO and Scott robertson All Black Sea Coach. Plenty of
positive reactions, so I thank you to all that have
got in touch with us on that. And yeah, it's
created a few stories around the rugby world, hasn't it has.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Indeed, anytime the All Blacks Coach goes live to the
nation so to speak, or it does an in depth
interview like that, it's widely picked up on. And yeah,
I thought it was quite candid by Razor at times.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Some hot top.
Speaker 4 (01:15):
Topics covered eligibility, everything from Kalyn Ponger to NRL converts
and the like in Richie Muonga what happened in Japan.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
So yeah, thanks for all your feedback.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
And if you haven't had a chance to listen to
it's yea rap breads around it.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
Yeah, you can view it on YouTube as well. Check
it on the old Crome cast or smart TV and
park up in the lounge and watch it that way
if you're so inclined and keen for any other guests
that you might like us to get on Rugby Direct.
Let's rip into the weekend that was, and the headline
match from a New Zealand perspective was the Blues and
(01:54):
Crusaders on Saturday night and it delivered plenty of tries,
It delivered a big win for the Crusaders, and it
delivered more questions about this Blues team one and five
in their title defense. No one would have picked this.
This was perhaps a fifty to fifty game heading in.
You know, the Crusaders were underdogs at the bookies, but
(02:15):
the Crusaders just too good on the nights and deserving
of their win. What did you make of the performance then.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
I think we've split them down the middle.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
If we deal with the Crusaders first and foremost, what
a transformation in the past. What is it four months
really from a disastrous season. I think they only won
four games last year, missed the playoffs. Rob Penney's coaching
job was on the line, questions about his back room staff,
(02:46):
players weren't happy, there were selection concerns. This year, They've
got some bodies back, but they're still missing a few.
Cody Taylor is a couple of others that Brandon n
or Scott Barret only played half of that game. At
the weekends. Ethan Blackhead is still out. So look, the Crusaders,
all credit to them. They did a number on the Blues.
(03:08):
This was the Blues equal biggest loss to the Crusaders
at Eden Park, and I think the Crusaders have now
won nine of the last ten at Eden Park as well,
which is quite staggering. But this was a Crusaders team
that hadn't won away from home and Rob Penny's tenure
nine games. You have to go back to the twenty
(03:28):
twenty three Super Aby Final to find their last away win,
so that was a big monkey off their back. What
I like about the Crusaders is they are far more
adventurous this year, and far more adventurous than they were
under Scott Robertson.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
As well.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
They are attacking from inside their twenty two. They are
offloading using the ball, having a real crack playing with pace.
The Blues could not slow down their quick recycle and
that really hurt them. So I was very impressed by
the Crusaders forward pack. They did a number on the
Blues lineout on this scrum the breakdown, and it really
(04:06):
was one rate traffic apart from the Blues scored the
opening try and then it was all the Crusaders.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
And what the Crusaders thought did well after that opening
try is that they didn't allow the Blues to get
him momnt and they went back down the other end
and scored, then scored again fee hockey scores from the
twenty two, and that just put the Blues on the
back foot after they've done well to open the scoring,
get on the front foot, give themselves a bit of confidence.
The Crusaders managed to do that and that allowed them
to take control of the game from that point onwards
(04:34):
and went into halftime with a thirteen point lead. Extended
it after the break and never really felt like in
any danger from when they went about twenty points to
seven up. And we think back to last year what
the Blues were able to do so well. They played direct,
They used their ball runners really effectively. They used this
set piece really effectively. I know they've got a number
(04:56):
of injuries, but they looked ponderous at times with ball
in hand. And it wasn't until they were chasing the
game late on and the Crusaders maybe switched off a
little bit and some tied bodies out there that they
made and to be a little bit more expansive with
the game plan. It was too late for the Blues
by that point. They let the game slip. In the
(05:16):
first half.
Speaker 4 (05:17):
They did just on the Crusaders again. The final score
line flated the Blues. Kimitta missed three conversions and the
Crusaders could have I think they lead twenty to seven
at halftime, and Will Jordan came close to scoring. I
think he dropped the ball quite close to the line.
They were breaking the Blues open at will. So many
(05:39):
unforced eras from the Blues and senior players were talking here,
you know, Stephen Petefetter dropping a very simple high ball.
The Crusaders score from that. Riquewani at least two drop
balls in contact and he was elevated to the captaincy
after Patrick two Polotu's withdrawal. I think for me that
the form of the crusaders is encapsulated in David Havili's
(06:01):
form last year. I know he had some injury concerns,
but he is now the out and out form second
five in this competation. The way he's carrying the ball
in a dominant fashion, if you watch him his talk,
his organization, he's really relishing that leadership and so his
(06:21):
transformation transformation has been very stark and that's reflected in
the Crusader's form.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
And he's taking pressure off to Hakimitter as well, which
is big because he's a young team. We know the
woes he had last year dropped back to Waycato Club Rugby,
missing conversions and and things like that. That he's taking
that is a big concern. So he's taking a lot
of the heat off Tarkumeter in terms of the way
he's running the game.
Speaker 4 (06:43):
Still a young guy, but when you cast a head
to the playoffs, you've got to be kicking your goals.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
That is going to make a big difference.
Speaker 4 (06:50):
So at some point there's going to be a very
tight call for a penny there does he go for
the experience and James O'Connor, you know when when if
does he make that call?
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Well, he's got free hockey who can go kick. He's
got David Havilli who can goal kick. Now they are
not first choice goal kick is by any strip to
the imagine, but Ta Hakim his numbers would suggest that
he's not at that level of being a first choice
goalkicker as yet, so that I don't need to know
that they really need to change the run on team.
I just think you give the kicking team. I mean,
he's already doing plenty for the Crusaders one to give
(07:21):
it to David Harvilli and say this is part of
your responsibilities now.
Speaker 4 (07:25):
Yeah, well it's not working for him and why does
the first five have to kick? When you mentioned that,
and just on schaefe K, I've given him a bit
of stick here, yeh. And justifiably so, I felt at
the time in terms of the All Blacks conversation, and
it was a big call for Rob Penny to bring
him back and drop Macha Springer to the bench after
(07:46):
he scored five tries.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
But fie Hackey was excellent at the weekend.
Speaker 4 (07:50):
He was highly involved, very dangerous, and every time he
touched the ball fully justified his selection. So that speaks
to the Crusader's depth. Now let's look at the Blues.
What the hell's gone wrong? This was a team that
dominated last year and they were titled favorites and now
they have been a complete flop. And the biggest concern
(08:12):
was we'll talk about the injuries, but last week they
really hinted that they were improving. They could have very
easily beaten the Chiefs in Hamilton but for a sideline
conversion from Xavier Taili and this was easily their worst
performance of the season.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
That leaves so many question marks.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
It does. It was a massive step backwards after what
they were able to do the week prior and push
the Chiefs right to the limit. And you look at
the stats postgame and they do not tell the story.
I was looking up. The possession was fifty fifty, so
charactery of fifty fifty possession, The Blues had fifty three
to forty seven running meters. The Blues had five hundred
(08:52):
and ninety to the Crusaders three hundred and forty. This
is a game where the stats don't tell the tale.
It's probably bolstered by the last fifteen or so minutes
where they became a bit more adventurous, had to really
chase the game and had some better running meters and
were able to hold onto the ball for perhaps a
little bit longer. But they seem to have just gone
away from everything that was working so well last year.
(09:12):
They don't build pressure, and that's the concerning thing for me,
is that they had a lot of position in that
game and just didn't know really what to do with it.
And whether teams have figured them out, or whether they're
not comfortable playing that style of rugby anymore, I don't
exactly know. But they barely really got into the Crusaders
twenty two and put pressure on in that game on
(09:33):
the weekend. They Crusaders were able to force eras, the
Blues made unforced eras, and there was one period in
the second spell where they just sort of were five
minutes five minutes inside the Crusaders half, not really going
anywhere for about two or three minutes at a time,
just passing left and right, not able to strike, not
able to find a way through. So I think the
Blues have become really ponderous this year. And yeah, there's
(09:54):
a number of injuries, but there's still a lot of
quality in that team, and I don't know why they
haven't been able to recapture any of that magic from
last year.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
Very disjointed and directionless performance, and it is a big concern.
There were a couple of stats which does speak to
that performance. The Blues had nineteen turnovers to the Crusaders,
five six those were unforced eerers and they won five
of thirteen lineouts and the scrum was seventy five percent.
So if you look at where the Blues were strong
(10:26):
last year, it was in the collisions, it was the
line out, drives, the set piece, the defense, their kick strategy,
all of those things are not working for them. And
we do have to touch on their injuries.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
I think fourteen.
Speaker 4 (10:38):
Players out and Patrick losing Patrick, two Polo to and
Eckland just prior in the days leading up to that
game does have a massive influence on your leadership, on
your line out. And the Blues now go into the
buy and from what I'm hearing, they will get potentially Ricky, Rictelli, Eckland,
(10:59):
Patrick two, Polo to Zan Sullivan, Bowden, Barrett, Adrian Choate,
Anton Signer, Tafafunaki, aj Lamb potentially all coming back after
the buyer. Now there's some massive inns offer doing a
fussy knick injury doesn't sound great. Not sure what his
prognosis is, but you've got to front with who you've got,
(11:22):
and there's no excuses for basic errors and the lack
of direction and so yes, you can make excuses and
the injuries do play a part, but I don't think
that justifies the phenomenal slide we've seen in such a
short space time.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
I agree, And the problem I've got is that at
some of the All Blacks players that are not standing
up and delivering, the ones that are still standing and
not injured, that they're not getting the best out of
Rico Jowani. I think ran for a lot of meters
on the weekend, but and he was captain, but I
think didn't have one of his better games and struggled
to get on the go forward on the weekend. Dalton
(12:02):
Papa Lei has been really quiet this season and I'm
not sure why that. In these occasions where you need
players to stand up, they're not. Cameron Christie has been.
On the other hand, a young player that's only in
what has theod fourth game maybe for super rugby level,
is one of those ones that a stand up. As
zeb Ta earlier, you can see the brilliance and the
(12:22):
possibilities that he might bring. So it's those younger players
are standing up. And I think you've got to put
some real question marks around Papalii and Yuani as leaders
in this team. They've both captained before the Blues and
they're not delivering at the moment.
Speaker 2 (12:36):
And for me, that speaks to an attitude thing.
Speaker 4 (12:39):
To be honest, it's very hard to quantify, but I
spoke to Stephen bit of fit to this year and
he hinted that a training attitude that wasn't the same
as last year, and speaking to others around the team,
there is a sense that there hasn't been that same hunger.
The Blues broke their eighteen year title drought last year.
They wanted it really bad and von Kotta came in
(13:02):
got a reaction from this team and it is very
much like do you want this?
Speaker 2 (13:08):
How hungry are you?
Speaker 4 (13:09):
And it's a classic case of almost second year syndrome.
Going through the motions. They made all the right noises
about not being complacent, but they're not walking the talk.
Speaker 3 (13:18):
No and they had said that. You know, the players
have said that the training wasn't as intense as it
needed to be, perhaps in preseason from their own perspective,
that they they didn't bring the intensity required. And that's
the hallmarks of you know, great teams, isn't it. You
look back to some of the super rugby teams. You know,
the Crusader's going on that run between twenty seventeen and
twenty three, even the Chiefs in twenty twelve and twenty
(13:40):
thirteen winning back to back, the Blues you know, way
back in the nineties doing it back to bads. It's
all very well. Winning one and that's great and you
can celebrate that, and they broke the adrat there. But
the great teams back it up and they may not
go back and win the title the next year, but
they'll go very very close. And we're just not seeing
that from the Blues. You know, there's a long way
(14:01):
to go in this competition. They're one in five, but
you know, they get some players back, sure, but there's
still some big games to come from. They've got to
go play the Crusader's Wayne christ Church go to Suva.
They've got to a suver. They've got Hurricanes at home
in a couple of weeks. They've got Wana Pacific two
games to play now, one is bottom of the table.
(14:21):
But you just don't know what kind of game plan
they'll bring and how hungry they might be on the night.
So they've got a still some runway the Blues, but
not a lot really in this competition.
Speaker 4 (14:32):
No times running out and you know what, this is
where we find out what the Blues are made of
and what their attitude is and how much they want it.
They've dug themselves a massive hole. And for me, the
responsibility it's player lead. The coaching team can only do
so much. Where are these players at How are they
gonna They need to catch the ball, they need to
(14:55):
put these things in place. The other thing we just
another step. The kicking meters, I think it was the
Crusaders kicked twenty five times and they've got eight hundred
odd meters. The Blues were nineteen odd times for three hundreds.
So little things like that have a profound effect but yeah,
the Blues there are in some adversity. How and are
(15:17):
they going to fight their way out of it? Because
this has been their own doing. So let's find out
what they're all about.
Speaker 3 (15:22):
Indeed, they go into the buy the sweet, plenty of
things to pond it there. Let's go to the Reeds
in the hand is under the roof in Dunedin on
Saturday afternoon, the Reeds emerging twenty nine to twenty three winners. Look,
the Reds were without Fraser mcwright as they crossed the
Tasman tamd Dermott and yet they come over and take
the win. And for periods in this game it felt
(15:45):
like the Highlanders not necessarily have this game under control,
but they know they trailed early, came back, got themselves
into the contest and it felt like, okay, they'd set
themselves up for well, but they just made a couple
of errors. In the second spell, Ethan Degrouk goes off
for a yellow card. They can sider to try either
side of that, and all they can escape with is
(16:06):
a penalty goal at the end for a bonus point.
I thought this was a really disappointing second spell, in
particular from the Highlanders.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
It was.
Speaker 4 (16:14):
Yes, the game was there for the taking and they
started slowly and then I felt like they got their
game going, started to build, some things got on top,
and then they felt like they let it slip. You
mentioned the yellow card, and the other big factor here
was their scrum got completely dismantled, dismantled. Their replacement tight
head had some real struggles, then went off injured. The
(16:35):
starting tight head came back, but the Reds really their
replacement front rowers Alex Hodgman and the like did a
number on the Highlanders. Poor yellow card from the group.
That was costly as well from an all Black. So yeah, look,
there were some impressive individual performances. Was great to see
(16:56):
Peter umung A Jensen back in the midfield. I thought
he was added some real touches of class with his
long balls and midfield penetration. Sean Withey was good well,
at least one turnover, but yeah, the read's not at
full strength. That was there for the taking for the Honders.
I think there was the Reds first one in Dneed
(17:18):
in ten twelve years. So there's a bit about that team.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
There is a bit about that team. We saw them
come to christ Church and get beaten there, but they
felt threatening in that game, just didn't quite get maybe
the bounce of the ball the war waritie. They go
over to Needen, which is as you said and historically
has been a tricky trip for them. They're well in
Sconced now in that top three alongside the Chiefs and Crusaders.
You know, they're building quite nicely and they've got an
(17:43):
interesting all run. They've got the Chiefs in a couple
of weeks in Hamilton, which is gonna be a real
litmus test for them because.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
I've had a bit of success against the Chiefs.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
They have exactly and they deliver it in Hamilton in
a couple of weeks time. Because it feels like they're building,
you know, and there's all sorts of things going on
in the background around Les Kiss and his likelihood that
he's probably going to be the next Wallabies coach after
Joe Schmidt. But what I like about them is their
depth and we've seen that again you know, Frasmik right out.
(18:12):
But they've got a really strong loose for trio and
the Highlanders just couldn't kick with it. And it feels
like this is a hot and cold sort of Highlanders team.
At the moment, they are better than last year, but
whether they can push for you know, those top spots
when it comes to the playoffs, it's going to be
a real question.
Speaker 4 (18:30):
Yeah, it feels like they're on the fringe, doesn't it.
They can pull out a performance. But the hot cold
is a good analogy because even if you go back
to that performance against Wina Pacifica where they just scrape through,
you know, very lucky to get through that. So there's
still a bit of growing for that team.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
There is in d Let's go back to the weekend
this for night, to the game that started the weekend,
the Chiefs fifty one of PACIFICA thirty five in Pocaki.
This was a very odd game of rugby to one
watch to commentate. Was forty three to seven at half time.
And the Chiefs are cruising and playing some of the
best rugby this season. One are playing some of their worst.
(19:07):
We've seen how good they can be against the Canes
and the Herders, or seeing how bad they can be
though at times, and how they can switch off. Well,
they didn't switch on until minute forty on the weekend,
but when they switched on, they were hard to contain.
Really hard to get a read on what this game
meant and what we got out of it, the key
point probably being the halftime break and also tinn of
(19:28):
Umonger changing. I think five players at the break and
bring on some fresh legs.
Speaker 4 (19:32):
Read a nice line from Aaron Goyle saying Pokakoe Stadium
someone needed to check the slope on it because there's
seventy five points scored at one end.
Speaker 3 (19:40):
Of the the Old Lord's but at Cricket Ground.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
It's quite staggering, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (19:47):
I guess Look, I think you're the Chiefs and you're
up by forty odd points at halftime. There is an
element of clocking off mentally and parking the bus. Wine
will be very disappointed with the way they started their game.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
The Chiefs. Weren't you a full strength to provide?
Speaker 4 (20:02):
Pulled out just before the game, missing Ardie as well,
and they got a lot of off their bench. Maybe
they look to change things up from a selection perspective there.
But yeah, very very strange game. I know punters were
sweeten the on the Chiefs thirteen plus down the stretch there.
I don't know how much he can take out of
(20:22):
that game.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
For either team. Wana.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
You know, a lot of work to do on how
they start games and Chiefs will be disappointed to concede
that many points.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Damian McKenzie very good again.
Speaker 3 (20:32):
He was very good again. But I just think Clayton
McMillan won't have been a happy man. Halftime interview on
sky TV says, you know, he basically to paraphrase, we
need to go out and complete the job. Well they didn't,
and it would have been a very tense bus ride back,
I'm sure on Friday night from Hamilton to Pookey. That's right,
Bookie to Hamilton.
Speaker 4 (20:50):
Yeah, and look, the Chiefs are title favorites, but they
do look a bit fallible. They were pushed to the
brink by the Blues. I only turned up for one
half against the against Mona lost the week prior to
the Blues, so yeah, there's a few holes you could
put punch there.
Speaker 3 (21:08):
Yeah. Their best performance was that Crusader's game where they
nearly put fifty on on that night, and they've been
a bit up and down since, but they are collecting
the wins. Anything stand out from the other two games
of the weekend Warratars Brumbies twenty eight twenty three and
the four fifty two fifteen over the poor old Druler
in Sunday night footy or Sunday afternoon for they in Perth.
Speaker 4 (21:26):
Yeah, surprised by the margin in Perth. The Duror always
struggle away from home, but they pushed the Brumbies in Canberra.
Look I saw parts of that Wartars Brumbies game. It
was a great finish and one thing to note there.
Speaker 2 (21:39):
Is the Waratars heads.
Speaker 4 (21:41):
I think twenty odd thousand at that game, which is
a record attendance for them in the last couple of years.
And I think there is a bit of buzz building
around Australian rugby. They've got the lines there next year,
so starting to slowly rebuild and put Ozzie rugby back
on the map. These teams are a lot more competitive
this year and I think Sydney is a bit of
(22:03):
a gauge of that twenty thousand that compares really well
to the NRL crowds that they've seen this year. So
positive rumblings in Australian rugby, which is good to see.
Speaker 3 (22:12):
Yeah, we love to see that absolutely and more on
the Aussie teams. After this here on Rugby Direct will
come back take a break, second half of Rugby Direct
after this.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
This is Rugby Direct, a podcast for real rugby fares.
Rugby Direct, Howard Buddies Talk SIV.
Speaker 3 (22:34):
You're back with Rugby Direct. Time now for our final
four or Liam. There are four Australian teams in the
Super Rugby Top six at the moment. How many will
make the playoffs? So they're all in their The Chiefs
are on top on twenty two points, Crusaders on nineteen,
Reds on nineteen, Wartars on seventeen, Brumby's on fifteen, Force
on fourteen. That's the top six. Highland is eleven, Hurricanes nine,
(22:55):
Blues seven drew a seven more on a Pacificer on six.
At this point in the season, will all four of
those teams make the top six?
Speaker 2 (23:05):
No?
Speaker 4 (23:05):
No, they won't. The Force won't. I'm torn on two
or three, but I can't. We don't fit fence here
at Rugby Derex. So I'm going to say two of
them make it, and the Blues and Hurricanes both sneaking.
Speaker 3 (23:22):
Okay, I tend to agree. The Force have got a
tricky back half of the season. They got the Reds
this week, then they welcome the Highlanders and Hurricanes at
home in consecutive weeks. Then they're away to the Force
on as Sorry to the Chiefs on anzac Dan Todonga.
Then there to Auckland and playing the Blues, who at
(23:42):
that point in the season, who knows they'll be hungry.
And then the Brumbies drew it and war Atars to finish.
So that's a tricky run includes a trip to Suva
for them as well. So I suspect you're right around
the Force dropping out. Who did you say that your
two teams is going to make it?
Speaker 4 (23:56):
So I said two. Yeah, it's tough, isn't it. So
we've got the Reds, Wartars and Brumbies. It's really tough
to draw a line through one of them. I'm going
to say the Warriors miss out.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
I tend to agree because they've got a number of
New Zealand teams and not just to put the New
Zealand teams up in lights, but there's a tricky drawer.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
Yeah seven, I think the Blues and Knees sneak in.
Speaker 4 (24:22):
But look, it's very it's going to be a great
finish to the season and there's.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Going to be a lot of jeopardy around around there.
Speaker 3 (24:28):
Well at the Blues, you know seven points on the
letter stands there one went outside the playoffs. They do
have the buy, but other teams have the ball. It'll
even itself out. That flows really nicely onto topic number two.
Are you willing to draw a line through the Blues
winning the title this year one in five outside the
(24:52):
playofs at the moment on seven points?
Speaker 2 (24:55):
No, no, no, I'm not.
Speaker 4 (24:56):
But it's a long long road to hoe because they
will be away from home for should they sneak into
the playoffs, there's two questions here. One is do they
make the playoffs and then they still title contenders? As
it stands right now, you would say, no, they're not
title contenders. I think they make the playoffs and if
they're healthy, they could knock over anyone on their day,
(25:19):
and we saw that a week ago in Hamilton where
they pushed the title favorites to the brink.
Speaker 3 (25:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (25:25):
So look, they desperately need some bodies back, and they
desperately need the reset and the buy, and we're gonna
it's almost it's not quite make or break territory for
the Blues, but with the Hurricanes next up, these are
very very important matches. So no, I'm not willing to
draw a line through them as title contenders, but it's
(25:47):
very touch and go.
Speaker 3 (25:48):
They've got a trip to christ shoots to come yep
and SUV and SUV and Queensland and Brisbane. Yeah. Yeah,
there's not much regal, right, I know that. So the
one went out of the playoffs, but there really isn't
much regular room excuse me left for the Blues.
Speaker 4 (26:01):
Well, they can probably drop what are they one and five?
They could probably drop two ab three most and it
also depends on how other teams go as well. And
that's just getting to the top six. You don't really
want to be going to Hamilton a week one. No,
that's that's tough. Yeah, one v six, two v five
three p four Yeah, what about you. I don't think
(26:23):
they can win the title. I think they can still
make the playoffs, absolutely. I have seen enough from the
Chiefs too are clear favorites Crusaders and Reds tucked in
behind to suguesce that there are better teams at this
point in time. And you're right, having to go from
deep mark it down twenty fourth to March. I don't
think they can win the title again this year. The
(26:44):
only thing I'm hanging on to here is if you
get bow in the back at ten, you put Peter
Fittis to fall back. You know, you welcome some of
these Patrick Ricky big names, but it just hasn't happened
for them.
Speaker 3 (26:58):
So and they've had a lot of those names in
the opening rounds. You know, maybe not in the positions
that they would necessarily have put them, but they've had
a lot of those players that you know, these aren't
players that have been out for the entire season. These
are players out for two or three weeks.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
YEP.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
Topic number three A good story from our friend Joe Pearson.
Last week. Current time way Flour goes on record saying
that he is wanting to play for the All Blacks.
He played for Tonger at the twenty twenty three World Cup,
so it wouldn't be eligible until the back end of
twenty twenty six, a long way to go. And he
certainly signs some really good signs that he's a promising
footballer and has some real quality about him. But having
(27:33):
played for Tonga, was this what the rule was brought
in for? And would you support it? If you know?
Sc Robertson comes knocking next year.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
It's no idea, was it.
Speaker 4 (27:44):
You want players to play for their heritage, and the
fact he has played for Tonga you would hope that
that would continue. But we have discussed the iniquities in
test rugby, and I think for most Pacific Islanders, I
don't want to generalize here speak for individuals, but there
is an elevated prestige that comes with the all blacks.
(28:07):
A certainly opens a lot more doors to securing your
financial future. So by all means individuals can do as
they choose. But in an ideal world where you could
make everything equitable, these guys play for their home nations.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
The rule is in the rule Boox. You know, I
wouldn't have too much of a problem with it necessarily.
It's happened, you know, Frank Buntz in the nineties. I
think a Lumbit had admired did it as well. When
the rules are a bit more loosened than they are now.
And even these rules have been loosened from what they
were previously, it's not ideal. I still think having completed
(28:48):
a three year standdown, you're entitled to go play for
who you want. And yeah, I don't know that you
go from you can only go from tier one down
to tear two. I don't think you can lock that
in going from Ted. You know, you couldn't say you
can only go down, you can't go up. So it's
not what the rule was brought in for. But he's
a special case in many ways.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (29:08):
The other question is around Moana's purpose, right, So is
it just a vehicle for the All Blacks to cherry
pick their best players or are they really benefiting Tonga
and some more?
Speaker 3 (29:20):
Well, look at their rules, don't they that they're allowed
three All Blacks? But then they've got a number of
other plays who are eligible for the All Blacks and
are eligible for multiple countries. Levi Moore, who's no longer
with them, played for He's think eligible for four countries.
It was another examle We've go a number of players
who are eligible for the All Blacks but have Pacific
Island heritage. And I think that's the thing around what
(29:43):
makes New Zealand so unique and special is that we
have that strong connection to the Pacific and people are
proud of multiple heritages, and because we are still so
close to them in terms of geographical nature, it is
possible to go and play for them and have these
mixed that mixed heritage that makes New Zealand great and
makes wite A Pacific great and makes these teams great.
(30:04):
So I don't think you can cap it and go, well,
you can't be eligible for the All Blacks because then
they're losing a lot of players.
Speaker 4 (30:09):
Yeah, it's a vexed conversation, isn't it. Because you have
other players like Miracle Vai Lungy who was plucked from
samo On Club Rugby essentially and has come in and
been a roaring successful Muana and he will go back
and strengthen Samoa and there are other examples of that.
So Miana is strengthening those island nations. It's just there
(30:34):
is something that doesn't feel quite right about Miana being
used as a vehicle for the All Blacks.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Topic number four. Ian Foster back in international rugby coaching.
He's going to coach the Australian New Zealand Invitational team
that will play the British and Irish lines a week
out from the first Test, so they're probably going to
play shadow test team in Adelaide. That was announced last
week that Ian Foster is going to be back in
the reins.
Speaker 2 (30:56):
Yea a chet to him, didn't you.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
He did have a chat with him, jumped on too
zoom and had a chat that was Fuzzy Bear. It
was good. He's looking forward to picking. I think primarily
the New Zealand based players will get will mostly be
Japanese players, maybe players he's got connections to previously.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
Him and Steve Hanson might be out of a job
come the end of the season. There Toyota teams.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Not going to flatter I or they're lost on the
weekend as well. I mean, who ideally is going to
form the basis of this Australian New Zealand team, Probably
around the vicinity of sixty to seventy percent Australians by
the sound of it, and they'll be wide to Wallaby
squad members you would expect maybe Michael Hooper comes back
for it. But who would you have there is dream
New Zealand targets.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
Well, Fuzzy dropped a few big names, didn't he. Aaron Smith,
Richie mo Wonger, Nathan Cleary.
Speaker 3 (31:43):
That was I'm not sure the Panthers were releasing from
around whatever it is of the nral To.
Speaker 4 (31:48):
I'd be shocked to see that happen. It would be
great to see Joe Marnhu in that team. I think
there'd be a lot of interest in that, particularly in Australia.
I think there would be a desire from Aaron Smith
and Richie Warner to play in that fixture. They can't
play international rugby as it stands, and they are still
competing still in particular, still still got it. And the
(32:12):
big question for me is there's there's going to be
need that there will need to be some big sums
of insurance because these guys rich and along is on
upwards of two million a season with Tshiba and his
Someone's going to need to ensure him.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
How does it work when South African players go back
and play for their country from Japanese they must be ensured,
I would guess.
Speaker 4 (32:38):
Yeah, I guess they have to release them, don't they
because it's a regulation.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
They don't have to release these players because it's an
invitational teams.
Speaker 4 (32:45):
Yeah, And I guess when they signed them it would
be on the proviso that they're not playing international rugby.
So I think there would need to be a deal broken.
From a spectacle point of view, great, the more quality
former international players you can have in that team, the better.
When this ficture was announced, people talked about all Blacks
(33:09):
being involved, and that was never going to happen because
it clashes with the All Backs playing France. And so
then you're looking at second tier, well not second to
you're looking at super rugby players potentially who but even
then are they going to be released from MPC teams
at that time?
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Well, July and then it's two weeks out, three weeks
out from the start of the NPC, you know, pre
seasons and full swing there.
Speaker 4 (33:31):
Yeah, maybe you could get a Shan Stephenson who's possibly
going back to Japan.
Speaker 3 (33:37):
Well, you might lean up Foster, might lean on some
of those connections, you know with all Blacks that he
had that are no longer being selected by the All
Black like Christie for example.
Speaker 4 (33:45):
Yeah, it's going to be a barbarians type team, is it?
And I think they'll play that way. So it should
be a hell of a spectacle. And it would be
great to see Aaron Smith and Richard Wonger link up
because from a viewing point of view, we don't get
to watch Japanese rugby.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Nobody has the rights to I think it's on rugby passon.
You get one game a week and it's their peckers
to who you see.
Speaker 4 (34:04):
So it's a very interesting plot line to see who
who in Foster can ken Dragon.
Speaker 3 (34:11):
The Penrith Panthers play the paramount of Eels that weekend.
They probably don't need clearing to get past the Eels.
So maybe maybe Fozzy can get on the phone to
Ivan and just work out some sort of deal.
Speaker 2 (34:23):
Yeah, Brad Thorne's not coaching.
Speaker 3 (34:26):
It's still right, all right, let's get into our tepic Liam,
shocking weekend for you. Thanks one of five. You picked
the Chiefs correctly, everything else wrong, remembering that we picked
everything diametrically opposite last week.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
Yes, I'm just trying to give you a chance this year.
I appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (34:41):
Too many beatdowns, Yeah, reads Crusader's task Force, Thank you
very much. Four or five. I have the lead by
four nineteen versus fifteen. Who do you picked this week?
In our first four game round? Liam? And it starts
on Friday night? Hurricanes, Waratars Love and gold Sport and
iHeart Radio.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Well, no, everyone's missed the Hurricanes.
Speaker 4 (35:01):
So great to have the cane train back and I'll
be steamrolling the Waratas and Wellington.
Speaker 3 (35:07):
I can't see the Wartars winning that one, despite the
fact they did get over the Brumbies. Rumbies into the Highlanders.
Hard place to go on Camber, isn't it.
Speaker 2 (35:15):
Yes, tough one, but Brumbies for me.
Speaker 3 (35:18):
Yeah, I'm going to pick the same on that front. Crusaders,
Mona pacifica christ.
Speaker 4 (35:24):
I am feeling a strong connection to Moana this year,
but look from a tipping point of view, going to
have to.
Speaker 3 (35:29):
Well, I can't go against Okay, we're all the same.
Red's Force will.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Be cheering hard for Moana.
Speaker 3 (35:34):
Just for the record, please don't Red's Force Brisbane reads.
Speaker 4 (35:40):
Yeah, the Force, It's not going to get you much
in the multi force.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
Well, okay, all right, upset time blow Dollie and the
boys are going you look at the way they played
against the.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
Drawer last night and Lea McDonald do you trust that's right?
Speaker 3 (35:54):
Absolutely? Always have always Well Rugby Direct m VP Metal
voting time. Let's go rook at the table Actually na
way out on top. On eight there is a five
way tie for second. Ardie save Quinti, Pie Will, Jordan Duplessy,
Confi and Damian McKenzie and what make that seventh alone
(36:16):
in seventh's miracle Fi Lungey. So there's your top three
ish as it stands my top three this week, I'm
going first, Liam, you are any more? And Nonu the
Crusaders hooker. Thought he was excellent on the weekend, remembering
that he is the third choice hooker for the Crusaders
with George boll out, Cody Taylor ruled out during the week,
Brody Mcalster left in the off season. He's taken his
(36:37):
opportunity and taking it really well. So he gets my
three points. David HARVILLI gets my two thought he was
really positive as we've touched on before. And Gideon Rampling
from the Chiefs, who I thought was electric in midfield,
especially that first half, gets my one point.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
This week we'll got the same one and two just
on the Crusader's hooker. Another one that you've recruited from
outside your region. Smart recruit good counties, boy, so recruit
maybe produce some of your own for a change in well.
Speaker 3 (37:08):
You know, James Mullens from the Kanbury region has gone
up to Auckland, so it's all about sharing it around.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
Nice Auckland products.
Speaker 4 (37:15):
There's been many of them over the years, Non Berryman
RP norm and in one point I'm giving to Peter
Humung and Jensen great scend back on the park and
long way that continue.
Speaker 3 (37:26):
So we've got the same two and three, same big
weekend for the Crusaders. That special from you to see
that limb.
Speaker 2 (37:32):
Ah yes credit weird credits too, you.
Speaker 3 (37:34):
Know, yeah, absolutely right. That'll do us for another week
of Rugby direct. I thanks to Larson Bars English for
putting us together, and thanks of course to Abbit Health
tackling all your aches and pains from sport and work.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
For more from News Talks ed B.
Speaker 1 (37:50):
Listen live on air or online, and keep our shows
with you wherever you go with our podcast on iHeartRadio
Popular Podcasts
40s and Free Agents: NFL Draft Season
Daniel Jeremiah of Move the Sticks and Gregg Rosenthal of NFL Daily join forces to break down every team's needs this offseason.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
The Bobby Bones Show
Listen to 'The Bobby Bones Show' by downloading the daily full replay.