Branding Mastery: Justin Eklund’s Guide to Merging Faith and Marketing Strategies

How can businesses and organizations merge faith with purpose to not just survive but thrive in today's marketplace? Join host Tim Winders on this episode of Seek Go Create, where he interviews branding expert and author Justin Eklund. Together, they explore the fusion of spiritual values with business strategies to create compelling brand identities that not only drive profit but also make an eternal impact. Dive into Justin's experiences, from climbing the corporate ladder to serving in ministry, and discover how you can align your work with your faith for sustainable growth and true success. Listen in to revolutionize your approach to both business and life.

"A brand is the one idea that people think of when they think of you." - Justin Eklund

Access all show and episode resources HERE

About Our Guest:

Meet Justin Eklund, a seasoned branding expert with over twenty-five years in the advertising industry. As a branding enthusiast who skillfully merges faith with business, Justin has carved a niche in crafting brand identities that harmonize profit with purpose. His journey from marketing and advertising to impacting faith-driven organizations is showcased in his book, "Brand for Impact," which serves as a guide for leaders eager to infuse spiritual values into their professional endeavors. Whether it's strategic marketing or creating a lasting brand impact, Justin’s insights prove invaluable for those seeking both economic success and eternal significance.

Reasons to Listen:

1. Merger of Faith and Business: Discover how Justin Eklund blends faith with business in his unique approach to branding. His insights will show you the potential of aligning spiritual values with professional ventures, sparking curiosity about this innovative niche.
2. Real-World Branding Insights: Learn from Justin’s 25 years in advertising and his experiences in the church and nonprofit sectors. His practical strategies can guide you in clarifying your brand and increasing your organization’s impact in the marketplace.
3. Inspiring Leadership Journeys: Explore Justin’s personal journey from a marketing intern to running a branding agency with a mission-driven focus. His story offers valuable lessons in leadership, resilience, and staying true to your calling.

Episode Resources & Action Steps:

Resources Mentioned:

1. Book: "Brand for Impact" by Justin Eklund - This book serves as a roadmap for leaders looking to infuse their spiritual values into their professional ventures. It's essential for understanding how to create a brand that drives both profit and purpose.
2. Website: Grove 9 - Justin Eklund's agency, where they help organizations clarify their brand and increase their impact. You can learn more at grove9.com.

Action Steps:

1. Clarify Your Brand: Take the time to define the unique idea you want people to associate with your business. Ensure it reflects your purpose and resonates with your target audience. This foundational clarity is crucial for effective marketing.
2. Be Consistent: Once you've clarified your brand, make sure to deliver this message consistently across all platforms and materials. Consistency helps to cut through the noise and keeps your brand top-of-mind for potential customers.
3. Integrate Faith and Work: If you're a faith-driven leader, find ways to...

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Welcome to Seek, Go Create theLeadership Journey, the podcast for

(00:03):
Christian entrepreneurs and faith drivenleaders who want to redefine success.
I'm your host, Tim Winders, and herewe explore how to lead with purpose,
build businesses with integrity,and align your work with your faith.
Whether you're navigating challenges,seeking fulfillment, or striving
to make an impact, this is yourspace to grow, to grow, to Innovate
and create a life that matters.

(00:23):
Let's dive in.
How can faith-driven organizationsnot only survive, but thrive
in today's marketplace?
Meet Justin Eklund, a brandingexpert, author, and speaker

(00:45):
dedicated to answering this question.
With over 25 years in advertising,Justin has crafted a unique niche
by merging faith with business tocreate compelling brand identities
that drive both profit and purpose.
His book Brand For Impact serves as aroadmap for leaders looking to infuse
their spiritual values into theirprofessional ventures, promising not just

(01:09):
economic success, but eternal impact.
We'll explore how Justin's approachhelps organizations elevate their
mission and achieve sustainable growth.
Justin, welcome to Seek Go Create.
thanks.
It's a pleasure to be on.
I'm excited that you're on too.
You're coming in from a cold climate.
I'm in the warmth, so we'llsee if we can merge these two

(01:29):
together and have some fun.
I just read your book over the lastfew days, so we're gonna have fun
with, branding and impact and purposeand business and lots of cool things.
Before we jump in, though, this is noteven really a good icebreaker question
anymore, but it's kind of a deepthing, so I'm gonna give you a choice.
What would you prefer to answer?
What do you do?

(01:51):
Kinda like the icebreaker e question orwho are you choose and start answering.
Hmm.
I think those questionsgo together for me.
I'm gonna start with who I am,which will lead into what I do.
I've been doing marketing andadvertising my entire life, it

(02:12):
seems like from a young age.
I was selling thingsout on the corner and.
doing fundraisers and trying to be anentrepreneur, even from a very young age.
And I think that'salways been in my blood.
And then my parents are both artists.
And so that creativity piece hasalways been a part of, I am as well.
And in high school I went to a Christianyouth conference, called Christ in Youth.

(02:36):
And the last day we, there was a,an invitation to come forward if
you felt like God was calling youinto full-time vocational ministry.
And for some reason I felt that tugon my heart and I felt like this
is, this is a big decision, but Ifeel like God wants me to do this.
So I went forward, made that commitment.
I had no idea what that was gonnaentail in my life, but I knew I

(02:58):
God wanted me to, to be involvedin ministry professionally somehow.
So I went to Bible college,discovered quickly that God was
not calling me to be a preacheror a missionary or a youth pastor.
And so I was a little, you know.
Confused, wondering, okay, God, you calledme into ministry, but this doesn't seem

(03:19):
like this is where you want me to be.
So, prior to that, I had done someinternships with advertising agencies
and you know, that's interesting to me,so at least I'm gonna get my degree.
came back here to Wichita StateUniversity, got a degree in marketing
and advertising, started climbingthe corporate ladder, doing all
the, the things you do, in the,in the advertising world, and,

(03:43):
and really, became, experiencedand talented at writing strategic
marketing plans for organizations, forcompanies, and helping them succeed.
So, you know, this seemed like is, thisis kind of who God's created me to be.
I'm thriving in business and in creativityand in this area of advertising.

(04:04):
So, long story short, God calledme in, in a really cool way to a
missions organization called ywam.
I didn't know.
It felt like a detour from my professionalpath, but I felt like I couldn't say no.
It was also in Maui,Hawaii, so that didn't hurt.

(04:25):
So I went there, did three months oftraining in Maui, and then the plan
was to go to the Philippines for threemonths and minister to the surf culture.
Well, there were a lot ofCalifornia people on my team,
and they were much better surfersthan I was being from Kansas.
So I ended up in India.
They needed a worship leader, and soI went on the India team and had the

(04:45):
most incredible three months of mylife just ministering to, and making
friends with some of the most gracious,humble, generous people I've ever met.
so that was my missions for a,they asked me to stay on and do
communications and marketing forthem, and I did that for a while.
Really felt called back to Wichita, which.
It's only God if he can moveyou from Hawaii back to Kansas.

(05:08):
Right?
So came back here, met my wife,I was, playing in a worship band.
I looked down from the stage and there wasthis light coming down from heaven and,
you know, this beautiful woman down there.
So came down, met my wife.
we were, you know, six monthslater we were married and we've
been married 20, almost 26 yearsnow, which is pretty awesome.

(05:31):
And, she had a, she had a job atthe time and so my friend started
a medical missions nonprofit and hesaid, would you come and do development
and marketing for me for free?
I'm like, okay, that doesn't seemlike again, the career path is not
a, is not going in the directionI thought it was going to go.
But I really felt like God was sayingfor that he wanted me to do this.

(05:52):
So I did.
Got him really, off to a strong start.
Music has been a part of this journey.
Ended up leading worshipfor a youth group, in town.
And my friend, who was the youthpastor, as soon as I got there,
he left and they said, all right,would you stay and be the youth?
You know, be the youth pastor for a while.

(06:12):
And then after that think we'd likeyou to do communications for us and
we don't have a job and it's not evengonna be full time and we don't know
if it's gonna work out, but we knowthis is what you do and we would love
you to do it for us here at the church.
So after my wife and Iprayed about it, we did it.
And looking back in retrospect, I hada front row seat to watch God grow that

(06:33):
little church of 500 to over 5,000.
In 14 years with, five campuses andtremendous life change, tremendous
impact, all of that is just reallyGod's leading and God's guidance.
And, somehow I had the good senseor the courage to be obedient

(06:53):
to where he was leading me,even when it didn't make sense.
So that was, marketing and ministryall wrapped into one and looking
back, you're like, Hey, God,this is what you called me to do.
So 10 years ago we've felt like,hey, we've done, we've done what God
called us to do here at the church.
Now we feel like he's callingus into the marketplace to help

(07:16):
purpose-driven, leaders, business owners,entrepreneurs make a greater kingdom
impact through the work that they do.
Not only in ministry, but in themarketplace and really helping them
understand that they can, see theirwork as a sacred activity and really
grow their business, whatever it is,glorify God at the same time, then,

(07:41):
at the same time really infuse theirfaith into their brand, and have a more
impactful, presence in the marketplaceand be more successful ultimately.
So our company, GroveNine is 10 years old.
We've been doing that, for the past 10years, and it's just been a neat journey
to look back and see God's faithfulness,throughout every step of the journey.
Well, one thing that's curiousto me, you mentioned that both

(08:03):
your parents were artists whattype artists were your parents?
So fine arts painting and theyboth had fine arts degrees, so
would they were, in the marketplace atall or were they in education or were
they creating that, what was, I guess I'mtrying to get to, you mentioned you were
selling things at a young age and thingslike that in a family of two artists, so

(08:29):
help me connect a few dots right there.
Yeah.
I think the artistic DNA is justpart of, who God made me to be.
they weren't, commercial successesor teachers or anything like that.
They just enjoyed art.
God had given them talent fordrawing and painting and creating.
I got a little bit of that, butI also got this business side,

(08:50):
It's really interesting.
When I went to college for advertising,you kinda have to choose, are you gonna
an artist and a designer or are you gonnabe more on the business side of things?
I was really torn becauseI enjoyed both of those.
now running my own agency, it'sbeen really cool to be able to
do the strategy and also, beinvolved in the creative execution.

(09:12):
Hmm.
So this is the part of the, episode whereif any of our parents are listening,
I'll say, maybe turn it off for a minute.
I don't wanna throw parents under the bus.
But both my parents were educators.
I thought that I was gonna be acoach and teacher, et cetera, until I
found out how much money my dad made.

(09:32):
And I didn't realize we were poor.
But, did.
Any of the desire for financialsuccess drive you at a younger age?
And specifically, did you see somethingin your parents that you desired or
possibly didn't want to be that way?

(09:53):
Growing up, and again, we've alreadyasked the parents not to listen in, so
we're not blaming them on anything.
no, that's a great question.
I do think that at that intersectionduring college, everyone told me,
you can be a starving artist oryou can be in business and maybe

(10:15):
be financially more successful.
So I'd be lying if I said that didn'tenter into the equation at all.
Well, I think that's part of our journey.
And I think sometimes as people of faith,we don't want to admit that, but that
was what drove me in the eighties, man.
I was go, go, go eighties.
I was gonna make me some money, and thatwas what the Lord used to get my attention

(10:37):
because I was saved in more of a businesssetting than even in a church setting.
So, I think it's okay becausethen what happens is later
in life the Lord uses that.
Like he's using you right nowand all to kind of bring some
of these things together.
you brought up, so this is agood time to ask this question.
You brought up that you were around achurch for a number of years and then,

(11:00):
it grew and I'm sure your role andprobably your job and pay and different
things like that hopefully went up.
I sometimes get a little bitsnarky about church world.
It's like, we've got this greattalent, but you need to serve the Lord.
You need to do it for free here.
But then you kind of left thereand went into marketplace.
I think this would be a good timeto put a stake in the ground.

(11:21):
And I want to ask contrast thedifferences that you saw at that time
or maybe even today, I guess betweentraditional church world and marketplace.
Hmm.
You know, I think there's amisperception out there between

(11:41):
the sacred and the secular.
I think that business owners,business people in the church
feel like their job is maybe lessthan, spiritual than the pastor.
And I think that's reallyimportant to dispel that myth.
And I've grown in my understandingand my belief on that as well.
And, God's the author ofwork and he invented it.

(12:05):
He created it and.
Therefore it is a sacred activity.
you know, the Bible talks about if, ifwe're doing it to his glory, then that's
also part of what he's created us to do.
So I really wanted to, not redeem is toostrong of a word, but when we started
this company, I really wanted to helpChristian business owners understand

(12:26):
that your work is just as sacred andjust as impactful for eternity as the
person on the stage giving the sermon.
Hmm.
So you mentioned you went to bible school.
I went to bible school a few yearsago, about seven or eight years ago.
And, just to kind of throw alittle bit of gas on that fire.
I just got started with thisdivide between marketplace and

(12:47):
full-time ministry type things.
I noticed that there was a realpecking order with, with the way
they talked about certain roles.
you know, it's kinda like the missionaryto a third world country is number one.
I, I do wanna say that a missionary toMaui, though I'm not sure where that would

(13:07):
fall in the pecking order, and especially.
To surfers.
Come on.
I mean, that's like, I don't wannaget off track, but good gracious.
That got me thinking about thingsand then, you know, then it was maybe
evangelist, pastor, et cetera, et cetera.
And then, you know, businessman, used,car salesman, lawyer, you know, that's
like the pecking order and all that.

(13:29):
And did you notice that when youwere going through your schooling?
I think your bible school was probablyat a younger age than mine was.
Yeah, I think there's someperception of that out there.
And yeah, it all comes back to thatidea that, you know, what is ministry?
And, you know, understandingthat everything that we put our
hand to, to the glory of Godcan be and should be ministry.

(13:53):
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, I've been doing a read throughthe gospels and, you know, the 12
that Jesus picked to hang out that.
Got this big party that we're celebratingin now started, none of them were
the scholars and the biblical, youknow, religious people of the day.
They were fishermen, tax collectorsand zealots and other type.

(14:20):
They would be theentrepreneurs of the world.
how long did you say youwere in the church setting
that went from 500 to 5,000?
Yeah.
Over 14 years.
Wow.
Alright, so you learned a ton there.
Tell me some real takeaways you had,maybe just about organization and
organizational growth in general, butthen maybe drop down and talk about what

(14:44):
you've learned in that environment thatfed into, you know, the last 10 years in
branding for impact and things like that.
Because I'm sure you saw a lot ofthings that worked really well and
you probably had your hands in it andthen maybe some things that didn't.
So just take some time andtalk about that experience.
'cause I think there'sa lot to learn there.

(15:05):
Yeah.
You know, a church as a nonprofitorganization, is different
than marketplace organization.
And so I think there's a lotyou can learn about how to grow.
and have, I think healthy thingsgrow and there's, I think God uses
our intellect and our strategy, thewhat He's put that inside of us in

(15:27):
addition to just our heart, right?
And so he wants us to be thinking,Christians, and he wants us to be
strategic and he wants us to useall of the faculties that he's given
us, to move his kingdom forward.
So understanding that growth mindsetisn't a bad thing, I think is important.
a church grows through really thepeople that believe in the mission.

(15:52):
Life change.
we were constantly telling stories ofhow God was transforming people's lives.
it all comes down to your why.
It comes down to what you believeand what you're called to do.
And when your why resonateswith your audience's, why
you're gonna have a really.
Wonderful strong connection and communitythat you're gonna be able to build.
And I think that's true in the church,and that's true in the business world,

(16:14):
and in the nonprofit world as well.
So telling stories of life change,telling stories of transformation,
that's how you engage people's heartsand ultimately engage their resources,
which is so closely tied to our hearts.
And I think really important for anynonprofit to understand when you're

(16:35):
asking for money, when you're trying toraise funds, when you're development,
when you're looking for volunteers,it's gotta be about the why and the
mission and the calling, then all ofthose other things fall into place.
One of the things when we get intomarketing and even branding and sales and.

(16:56):
You just mentioned the wordgrowth, all of those things.
It for people with certainpersonalities, mine, it can sometimes
be a slippery slope, Justin, where
Hmm.
you begin going down a path whereyou say something to the effect of,
well, if we, if we had more revenueor if we had more people in the

(17:21):
seats, we could have a bigger impact.
We could have a biggerbudget, we could do more.
And so then we begin justifyingcertain tactics or techniques,
and I'll, I'll throw this word outhere, manipulation possibly in the
arena that, that you may operate in.

(17:43):
How can we keep those things in check?
And, and again, I know you, you mayhave been in a church environment
that you're still connectedwith, so I don't want you to.
Saying, say negative about them, but Ilike to have candid conversations here.
What are some challenges in a localchurch that's going through growth?

(18:04):
They believe that they've got acall to church, their town or their
area and you know, there are certainways you could do things that might
be shortcuts or things like that.
talk a little bit aboutthat, that challenge.
Yeah, I mean, I think it comes down tothe heart of the leader, and that's,

(18:30):
that's really most important thing.
are we serving God with integrity,with excellence, with honesty is, our,
I can talk about this later, but wefounded our company on the, the Fruit
of the Spirit in the Book of Galatians.
And I think if a church is following andgrowing in the fruit of the spirit going

(18:51):
to help inform those decisions, it's gonnahelp their motives be pure and their,
You know, a lot of times in the churchthere's this idea of, you know, church
stealing or, you know, member stealing ortaking, taking somebody from this church.
And, you know, that was, that's,that's not a healthy thing.
That's not something that, that I think,sincere churches are ever trying to do.

(19:14):
I think there are, the statistics areoverwhelming in terms of the number
of unchurched in our communities.
there are so many who are not connectedto a, a faith fellowship in any way.
there's so much opportunity outthere and people resonate with
different styles in different,methods and different denominations.

(19:36):
And you know, I think it's importantfor a church to have the greatest
influence that it can and build as muchawareness as possible and say, this is
who we are, this is what we believe,and this is how, this is how we do it.
And if that's interestingto you, you know.
Come and be a part of it, comecheck it out and see what happens.
So I, you never wantgrowth for growth's sake.

(19:57):
You wanna always have growth forkingdom, for kingdom purposes.
And it's about people toChrist and helping them grow
into fully devoted followers.
And I think if that's your heart andthat informs every, that's the lens
that you make decisions through, I thinkthat's gonna keep a church, on track.
one thing that fascinates me and you dida great job in the book, brand for Impact.

(20:21):
I've got it right over here, isthe reason I'm glancing over there.
Got it on my Kindle here.
One of the things you did a great jobof is you went through some techniques
and all, which was awesome, but youalso brought some stories in of real
world leaders that are out doing this.
I, I'll make a statement thenI'll let you respond to it.
One of the things I observe, 'causeI work with nonprofits and also work

(20:44):
with for-profit, and my observationis this, in the nonprofit world,
many times leaders struggle.
Yeah, with bringing in what I'll term asBabylonian or worldly techniques, methods,
et cetera, to function and operate andgrow their organization in the for-profit

(21:07):
world, what I notice is, is they'reoperating in the Babylonian system and
they're attempting to lead with faith.
Then, like you mentioned, the giftsof the spirit and things like that.
I'll kind of frame that and justmaybe let you respond because
I know you work with both.
What do you see related to that?
Also similar tension orsome different things.

(21:30):
Hmm.
You know, I think there are somany faith-driven leaders in the
marketplace who desire and feel acalling do more with their business.
They, there's something inside ofthem saying, I wish I could share
my faith or express my faith a moreprofound way through the thing that

(21:53):
I do with the majority of my life.
Right?
We spend so much of our time at work,yet there seems to be this chasm
between their personal life theirfaith, expression, and then what
they do for a living, their business.
And, know, there are reasons thatwe uncovered during the research
for why that's true, Yeah.

(22:17):
You know, more often than not,we just saw leaders who were so
hesitant let those two worlds touch.
And so, obviously you interviewedand spoke to a number of them that
are able to merge those together.
What are some things that youobserved in those people that

(22:39):
appear to, or are doing it well?
You know, courage is the big one,and I think that's the leaders
who have really done it wellhave said, this is who we are.
is who I am.
I'm the leader of the organizationand this is what I believe and this

(23:00):
is what God's calling me to do withthis business, with this company.
if it works, it works.
And if it doesn't, then know,we'll figure something else out.
If I'm going to be in businessand I'm going to have a platform,
gonna make sure that God isrepresented clearly in what I do.
And I think that's the first stepis just having the willingness

(23:23):
to really take a stand and say,this is what it's going to be.
we're gonna be unashamed about expressingour faith and the purpose gets us up every
morning and leads us to do what we do.
building widgets withexcellence and with integrity.
reason we do it ultimatelyis to glorify God.
And we're not going tobe afraid to say it.

(23:43):
You know, we're, we're gonna closeon Sunday and if it hurts our
business, it hurts our business.
and we've, we've all seen howthat's worked out for Chick-fil-A.
I'm from Atlanta originally.
I've been to their headquarters and Idon't eat a lot of fast food anymore.
Some people might say it's blasphemousnot to get you a good old godly
chicken sandwich every once in a while.

(24:04):
I'm not totally sure.
I agree with that.
However, yesterday my wife was outand about, had some errands to run.
I was doing some work and she broughtme a 12 pack of nuggets in and
truthfully, they were quite divine.
I enjoyed it thoroughly and true at Kathy.
job.
Kathy spoke at her graduationwhen she graduated at Georgia
State University a few years ago.
Wow.

(24:24):
So one of the things that's interestingis fascinating to me, is I get to
prepare and study up on, on the leadersand people like you that I talked to.
I read your book thisweek, brand for Impact.
We're gonna talk more aboutit here in just a moment.
And I'm also preparingfor next week's guest.
I believe that's when it'll fall, it'sKen Gosnell and he works with CEOs that

(24:47):
are working towards being well done.
I mean, not being well done, but at theend of their journey they can say it was
well done and we know what the referenceto that scripture is being Well done.
That might've been a, thatmight've been an interesting slip
of the tongue there, but, but.
But you, you used the word andit came up in his book too.
So it's like rolling aroundin my head quite a bit.

(25:08):
And it's a word thatmeans quite a bit to me.
And, and it's the word stewardship.
I really see a lot of leaders bothin profit and nonprofit that, that
aren't doing well, that aren'tgetting the message of well done,
that we will talk about next week'sepisode that are not stewards.

(25:30):
They really perceive themselves asowners of everything in the organization.
But the ones that seem to do well,
they treat their organizationmore as they're a steward
of it and they don't own it.
And you talk about that a good bitin your book, talk about stewardship.
I.
Hmm.
some tremendous examples out there of,business leaders who have done this well.

(25:55):
And one of the companies thatwe interviewed, metal Forging
company called Well Deloy.
he was inspired by reading a book calledGod Owns My Business by Stanley Tam.
It's such a wonderful example ofthat idea of stewardship, right?
This is not my stuff.
I'm simply the steward of theseresources that he's entrusted to me.

(26:17):
And that changes everything.
When you have that mindset, itallows you to hold loosely to,
those things and make decisions notbased on fear, but based on faith.
And, you know, that's,tremendously freeing.
and as we know, you can't outgive God.
And these are his resources and he alwaysreturns that blessing in multiple ways.

(26:39):
And I think that's somethingthat I hope people get from the
book is this idea of stewardship.
You know, stewardship is, for somepeople it might be a bit of a churchy
word, and so Justin, if someone'slistening in and they're not.
Quite sure what stewardship means,and you address it in your book.
I think you do a great job thereand you give great examples, but

(27:03):
if someone were like going, what?
What do you mean by stewardship?
I think you described a little bit,but what do you mean by stewardship?
tell somebody what itreally means in your words.
Yeah, it's that idea that we're notthe owner, we're simply the steward.
We're simply the caretaker.
God owns it all.
It's all his.

(27:23):
We didn't generate any of this on our own.
this is all from him.
In fact, our very, know, wakingup every day with breath in our
lungs, that's a gift from him.
And so really that idea of, ofstewardship versus ownership, I think
is, is at the core of your question.
And, and it's really freeing, you know,it's, it's freeing in relationships.
It's freeing in business, it'sfreeing in parenting, in every way.

(27:47):
This being, being a caretaker.
And doing everything we can to, to stewardthose gifts well, I think is, is really
the idea that, that we see in scripture.
And, you know, I'm not, I'm just overthe 50 mark, so I'm not young anymore.
I like to think I'm still I'm not oldeither, but I've had enough life behind

(28:10):
me to see that God is so faithful.
And I think that's helpful to havesome road in the rear view where you
can say, yeah, this works and thisis the way God's created it to be.
I use AI at times to do somedescriptions and things like that.
And the word that AI uses over and overagain for people like you, like me, who's

(28:32):
10, 11 years older than you is seasoned.
Yeah.
We're seasoned, which I think isa nice way of saying we're older,
mature, or, something like that.
Justin, I am curious 'cause you, I lovethe fact that y'all interviewed and
you interact with a number of people.
Can you think of any practical,either day to day or just practical

(28:58):
things that leaders do that reflectstewardship versus ownership?
you see it in generosity, yousee it in a business setting.
we're talking about this idea thatwe're stewards, not owners, and the
goal is to grow the company to God'sglory and for God's impact your

(29:20):
perspective allows generosity, allowsthe organization to do so much more.
and to shine their light even brighterbecause they have a different mindset
about their revenue and their priorities.
Yeah.
I love you mentioned generositybecause especially when money
starts being factored in, you canlearn a lot about people when all

(29:43):
of a sudden that comes into play.
along the way with your agency, thisaspect of brand became important.
Obviously you've written the book brandfor impact, and some might say, I'm gonna
give a counter that I may or may notbelieve, but I'm gonna do it hopefully
to agitate you to get a good response.

(30:05):
Some might say.
That if you're doing it for the Lordor you're doing it for, mission or
whatever, that, you know, what brandisn't that important, how would you
respond if someone says, you know,I'm not concerned about my brand.
Brand isn't that important?

(30:26):
I would strongly disagreewith that statement.
you have stirred the hornet's nest.
we live in a noisy worldand we're called to share.
Ultimately we're called toshare God's love and God's truth
and do it in a winsome way.
with all of the noise, studies,say we have over 10,000 marketing

(30:49):
messages hitting us every day.
How are you ever going to filter allthat noise and actually get someone to
listen to what you're trying to say?
having a clarified brand isthe most effective way heard.
as Christ's followers, we have amessage that needs to be heard.
if people can come in contact with thesebusinesses that are putting God first, and

(31:14):
operating with excellence, those are thebusinesses that I believe should be heard.
so that's why this book was so importantto me to help those organizations
clarify their brand so that they canrise above the commotion, above the
noise, rise above the clutter, and.
Really be known for what they do andultimately what they believe so that

(31:35):
they can have a greater kingdom impact.
So brand is so important and it'sreally one of the most cost effective
ways for an organization to finallyget an edge on the competition, if you
will, to stand out and to be known.
and it really just comes throughconsistency and frequency.

(31:55):
And so if you can develop that brandthat's unique, and then you're consistent
in your delivery of that brand,that's gonna make such a tremendous
difference for any kind of business
Tell me all the components of a brandand while you're thinking about that,
I'll give you a little bit of context.
We have a title here at our podcastcalled Seek Go Create that I. It,

(32:20):
that means a great deal to me.
There's an origin story and allthat kind of stuff, but I've also
found in the podcast world thatlisteners don't know what it means.
you know, there's the name, there'sobviously the visuals, there's web
presence, there's digital presence,all of those kind of things, I'm sure.
tell me all the components.
What makes up a brand?

(32:43):
Yeah.
at its core, at Grove nine, we, we saya brand is the one idea that people
think of when they think of you.
So it's not your logo, it'snot your colors, it's not your
fonts, it's not your website.
It's not your social media presence.
A brand is an idea.
Right.
We talk about, Michelin is such a greatexample of a consistent brand over time.

(33:08):
Their tagline, because so much isriding on your tires, They've got
the big puffy Michelin man who's,who's carrying, and he's a protector.
you see these ads with dad's puttingtheir, you know, their kids into a
car, sending them off to college.
putting Michelins on their, on thatcar because they love their kids.

(33:30):
And this, the brand is safety.
And over the past a hundredyears, everything Michelin
has done has been consistentlyline with that idea of safety.
So now when you buy a minivan foryour family, you're automatically
going to consider putting Michelinson your car even though they're
more expensive than another tire.

(33:50):
They've built that strong, clear brandof safety and whether it's true, we
talk about the law of perception.
There may be other products thatare just as good or better than a
Michelin tire, but the perception isthat is a safe tire and that tire will
help you take care of your family.
the power of a brand.
The brand is not the logo, it's not thewords, it's not the shoe and the wing for

(34:12):
Goodyear, it's not the swoosh for Nike.
It's the idea behind all of those things.
S So in all the work that you do andalso the research you've done, what are
two or three of the biggest mistakes yousee people make related to their brand?
Well, I talked about consistencyearlier and I think one of the big

(34:35):
mistakes is, is being inconsistentwith the delivery of your brand.
Right?
So sometimes you're talking aboutprice, and sometimes you're talking
about quality and sometimes you'retalking about other features.
And if you're not consistentlydelivering one message again, 10,000
messages hitting us every day,you're never going to stand out.

(34:56):
There's a reason, you know, researchsays that we need to hear, see,
and hear something seven to 12times before it actually sticks.
So consistency is really importantwhen it comes to building a brand
that stands out and gets attention.
And really the second one is justtaking the time to clarify your brand.
When they think of your podcast,what do you want them to think of?

(35:20):
personal brands are the same.
When they think of you, doyou want someone to think of?
And if you don't clarify that brand,and then deliver it consistently.
People are gonna make up whateveridea, whatever brand they want to
about your organization, or you asa person based on very little data.

(35:40):
And so it's our job to develop thatbrand that's gonna be unique, and we're
gonna deliver that brand in a creative,effective way, consistently over time.
Right.
So I'm gonna put you on thespot just a little bit here.
I know probably being a guest here,you probably glanced at a few things

(36:01):
of our podcast and possibly me
hit me, hit me hard here, Justin,what are some things that you
went Oh, doing okay with that?
And then, Ooh, not so good with that.
Go ahead man.
I'm ready for it.
Give, give me some feedback.

(36:22):
That's really unfair.
I would love to spend timewith you talking about this.
I think visually you'vebeen pretty consistent with
the delivery of your brand.
I think that there's, theredefinitely are some things you're
doing well, and consistency Ithink is pretty strong as well.
I think that, you know, that ideaof what does, what does the, what

(36:44):
does the organization really dobest and what do you want people
to think of when they think of you?
Because you offer, uh, you know, a, awide array of services, um, to people.
And even your podcast has, somany interesting guests from,
from all these different fields.
But.
What's the thread?

(37:05):
What's the one thing thatyou want people to get?
Like, if I give an hour of my time, thisis what I know I'm gonna get in return.
And I think that's, that'sreally the important thing is
to, to put a, put a word to it.
You know, Coca-Cola, their brand for,for, has been happiness and they've
committed to say that when people thinkof drinking a Coke, they're going to

(37:26):
think of smiling and joy and happiness.
And everything you've seen hasbeen people enjoying the time with
each other, drinking Coca-Cola.
And I don't know if, if that beverageactually brings joy to a person,
scientifically or physically, butfrom a branding perspective, they've

(37:46):
done a really good job of, oftelling us that that's the, that's
the result we can expect when we.
crack open a Coke.
So that's, that's really my, my bestadvice is really figure out what
that one idea is, and then that youcan infuse that into everything.
there's a, there's an appon my phone that I love.

(38:08):
It's called Evernote.
in a perfect world, you developthis brand idea before you actually
even name your company or yourpodcast, uh, or your nonprofit.
And then you can infuse that brand intothe name and into the logo and into the
website and into everything that you do.
Um, so Evernote, it says what itdoes, it's a place for your notes,

(38:33):
they're going to be there forever.
It's, it's brilliant.
The logo is an elephant witha little dog ear, like a page.
is it an elephant?
Because elephants never forget.
So everything about the brand sayslongevity and permanency and safety, and
just a brilliant example of how all theelements of a brand can come together

(38:56):
in a, in a very straight line and createthat idea that this is the best place to,
to put your notes, to put your thoughts.
That's good.
I, when, when you were talkingabout Coca-Cola, I'm from Atlanta,
so I, I'm fully aware of this.
I'm pretty sure that thehappiness came from when they were
putting cocaine in those drinks.

(39:16):
Maybe not.
I don't know.
You know, everybody was, boy, thesepeople are, are, are happy now.
It's probably just thesugar and other stuff.
I used to love having me a goodold Coca-Cola about once or twice
a day, and I cut that out a fewyears before I was your age.
It might've been one ofthe best things I did.
As much as I love Coca-Cola, I'm notsure that it's healthy, healthy for us.

(39:39):
You know, one of the things, and Iappreciate the feedback by the way,
and I know I did put you on the spotand you probably didn't want to just
slice and dice me right here, you know,being a, being a guest, but one of the
things, and, and I don't know if this issomething I'm sort of cynical about or
whatever, but one of the things that I.
Observe is that we have quitethe celebrity culture in the

(40:02):
world that we're in today.
And I observe, and I don't know if this isa correct or incorrect observation, that
there, there seem to be different rulesfor people that have a celebrity brand.
And so I'd love just if you've gotthoughts or anything because you

(40:24):
know there, there's what I'd callan average Joe business guy building
it from the ground up or whatever.
And then there's someone who's alreadyfamous known as if they can almost
do anything without some of theprinciples that we're talking about.
So.
Does that make any sense?
I guess, I guess just speak to alittle bit of personal and or celebrity

(40:48):
branding that we see quite a bit.
If anyone jumps on anysocial media platform.
Yeah, I actually, interestingly, Ithink that, that we're seeing a shift
where celebrity brands almost have morefreedom to express their faith, right?

(41:09):
Steph Curry has bible verse on his shoe.
Um, almost every, almost every,many of the post post championship
interviews that we watch athletes give.
give glory to God first and foremost.
You know, they're not ashamedto put their faith out there.
Even if it were to hurt theirpersonal brand, which it

(41:30):
doesn't, it enhances their brand.
It, it draws me to certainquarterbacks in the NFL because
I know that they're men of faith.
Um, they're, you know, they're notashamed to say Jesus won, right?
It's, it's on the t-shirt.
It's just, I think that's, that's reallybeen interesting to me to see so many

(41:51):
celebrities use their platform and theircelebrity to express their faith, and
I think the business world, the averageJoe can take a, take a cue from that
and say, these guys with so much atstake are willing to share their faith
in a very public way, am, why am I sohesitant to do that in my business?

(42:13):
So let's shift, we got a few minutesleft here and I want to talk, uh,
more about, about your book, but Ialso want to give maybe some practical
things that some people listening in.
I know that we have listenersthat are operating for profit.
And then I also know we haveministry people that are
operating in the nonprofit.
Some actually have both too.

(42:34):
By the way.
What are some things that you cangive, and I know get the book is
the best tip, but, but what are afew tips you can give to either both
categories together or if you want tosplit 'em out, uh, that's fine too.
But, uh, give some tips on your brandfor both the for-profit and non-profit

(42:54):
business or organization leader.
I think the most important tip,this is where we start with all of
our organizations that we serve.
We want to help them clarify theirbrand, We, we develop intentional.
We have an intentional researchand strategic process to help them
decide what that idea should be.

(43:15):
You don't just wanna pick it out ofthe air, you want it to be strategic.
It should be a promise that youcan keep true to who you are.
And it should also be as unique amongyour competition as possible, right?
It's less expensive and moreeffective to have a unique brand
than it is to compete with 10 otherorganizations for that same idea.

(43:37):
When you're doing that, you justreally need to outs spind them or
be so creative that people think ofyou, um, instead of the competition.
So the most important thing is to take thetime, do the research, really understand
what your brand idea should be, whatyour brand platform should be, and then
start to build everything on top of that.

(43:59):
So where we start with 90% ofthe clients that we serve, we.
We almost won't execute creativewithout doing that, that
foundational work on the front end.
And that's really, really very important.
Do you have, do you have, I guess,companies or organizations come to you and
say something to the effect of, Hey, wewant you to do some Facebook stuff for us,

(44:25):
Yeah, absolutely.
which is not necessarily strategic.
Yeah.
right?
Um.
can help you, we can help you spendyour money, but if you want to be a good
steward of those resources, you should dothis first, you should do the homework.
Go through the frameworkand clarify your brand.
Come up with, with, uh, measurablespecific objectives based on that

(44:52):
brand, and then decide which strategiesmake most sense for your business.
may not be Facebook stuff,it may be something else.
Right Justin.
What I do, I work with, uh, leadershipteams and work on strategy and being
strategic, and my observation is thatmany businesses that we would term

(45:14):
successful have, in many ways, I don'twanna say they've stumbled onto that
success, but that success has evolved.
It hasn't been necessarily intentional.
I hate to say that they got lucky.
There are some that have, and, andso one of the things I attempt to
do is work with them and being moreproactive as opposed to reactive,

(45:37):
which involves a lot of strategy.
I'm curious how many organizations,we'll call it, not just businesses,
but organizations, how manyorganizations come to you?
And, uh, and you just sort ofscratch your head and say, Hmm, they
don't really know who they are, orthey really don't have strategy.

(45:58):
And I don't know if it's a percentageor a number of that, so, but, but
do, do you see that very often?
All the time.
In fact, that's more common than not.
Does does it make you go, huh?
How did they get to this level of success?

(46:21):
Yeah, it really does.
And you know, it's, you've seen itmany times working with organizations,
especially small to midsize organizations.
They, they saw a need in the marketplace.
They developed a product orservice to meet that need and,
and they just continued to grow.
And they really never did the work ofbuilding a foundation that's, that's

(46:42):
gonna take them to the next level.
So they're always going to haveincremental growth, but they're not
gonna have that more significant growth.
And more importantly, the, we callit the triple bottom line, the
economic, social, and spiritualimpact that their business or their
organization could have they do that.
Um.

(47:03):
foundational work, that strategy work.
I notice a lot that they justhave a tremendous work ethic,
so they could grind it out.
They may have been at the right place atthe right time, or they may have saw a
need and they, you know, met that need,but yet they get to a place where they
are looking to do something different.
The, the word you use, and I've gotyour book up here again, I'll hold

(47:26):
it up so people that are watchingthe video can see brand for impact.
You've got two big wordsin this book title.
I'm gonna read, I wanna read to the,uh, subtitle, A Proven blueprint
to help faith-driven leadersclarify their brand, grow their
revenue, and make a greater impact.
There's a lot in that subtitle that'sreally good, but, uh, the word brand

(47:49):
and impact, those are two big words.
Talk about the word impact, becauseI, I see it thrown around quite a bit.
People say, oh, I wanna make an impact.
Uh, I interview a lot of people here.
I'm just, success to me is makingan impact and things like that.
And, um, obviously you believe it's a bigword because it's included in your title.

(48:10):
So talk about impact andwhat that means to you.
Yeah, it's, you're right, it hasbecome a bit of a buzzword, um,
lately, but impact is, is resonance.
It's, um.
Changing things in a, in a way thatresonates and, and has, you know, it

(48:35):
starts, it starts small, but it hasa tremendous influence, a tremendous
impact as it resonates outward.
And, you know, that's really why wetalk about, you know, Simon Sinek
has the golden circle, and it'sthe what, the how, and the why.
And most organizations, um,you know, the outside of the

(48:55):
bullseye is the what you do.
Many organizations are good attalking about what they do, then
how you do it, that starts toget a little more interesting and
maybe starts to set you apart.
But there may be a lot of peoplewho do it the way you do it, but
the why is in the bullseye for him.
And that's, that's theemotional connection that
you make with your customers.

(49:15):
That's what gets you up in the morning.
And when people connect withthat, they resonate with that.
That's really what's gonnacreate brand loyalty.
We just flipped his circleupside down and said.
put the what in the middle?
Let's put the how on the, out on thenext circle, and then let's put the
why in the biggest circle, and thenwe're gonna radiate out from there.
Because the why makes the most difference.

(49:37):
and when people connect with your why,especially from a faith perspective,
about, you know, whether, whetherChick-fil-A has the best chicken sandwich
or not, that that may be up for debate.
I don't know.
But the truth is that people offaith to support the organization of
what it stands for and because theirvalues and beliefs align with the

(50:01):
organization's values and beliefs.
that's, that's tremendously powerful.
And so I think when an organizationcan, can, uh, understand how to
incorporate their faith and their beliefinto their brand in a way that's not.
Cheesy, it's not salesy, it's not,um, disingenuine, but in a way that's,

(50:23):
that's really genuine and that'screative and that's interesting.
That's when people say, I love that I,that connects to my soul that that's
something that I want to be a part of.
whether, you know, whether those socks arebetter than these socks, I believe in the
story behind these socks, and I believe inthat everyone should have a pair of socks.

(50:46):
And, and I, and I love that.
And so I'm going to paymore for your product.
that's impact, right?
That's making a difference the world.
And I think that's such a cool thing thatwe have the opportunity to do through
the, the arena of business and nonprofitis, is have this tremendous impact today

(51:08):
and obviously ultimately for eternity.
That's, that's our,that's our bottom line.
That's why we do what we do.
And.
know, we're called to, we're called,uh, for the great commission right.
To, to make disciples.
And that's ultimately, businessis such a great way to do that.
And I think so many people are missing outon the opportunity to, to have more impact

(51:32):
and have more influence, um, and, andmore fully fulfill the great commission
in their lives and, and in their work.
At your, at your agency?
I, I believe, if I'munderstanding it correctly, you
could correct me if I'm wrong.
Y y'all obviously help people with theclarity and their purpose and things
like that, but I think you also do whatI would call some of the granular, um,

(51:58):
tactical things, website design and,and campaigns and things like that.
I, is there one of those thatyou enjoy more than the other
at this stage of your career?
It's a great question.
No one's ever asked me that
It is not a trick questionand no one's listened to.

(52:19):
Oh yeah.
Justin just said he hates doing websites.
He just wants to do clarity with people.
No, no.
I mean, but, but yeah.
I'm just curious because we do evolveand, and so I'm just curious because
the book really spoke more of theclarity message than the application

(52:42):
message, so that's, that's why I waswondering which one do you really,
which one speaks to you more now?
that's a great question.
The reason it's challenging is becauseonce you do the clarity, you get to that
in all of the mediums, in the website,in the logo, in the social media, the

(53:04):
email marketing, um, in the billboards.
In this, in the public relations,in the swag, in the signage.
Like it, it's everywhere.
And so that first piece, thatfundamental, um, brand clarification
and that strategy that's uh, pivotalto everything else being effective.
But I would say if I had to pick one,you know, we, we build identities, we

(53:29):
create logos for organizations, andthe logo is, is, you know, you talked
about the pecking order earlier.
logo is pretty high up in thepecking order when it comes to
the thing that influences, um, theother visual elements of a brand.
So that designing logos, that, again,they don't just look good, but they

(53:52):
have criteria for why they work.
They're on brand.
Therefore, they're going to be somuch more effective than just simply,
hey, the founder loves, you know.
Golden retrievers.
And so we, we knew we hadgolden retriever in the logo.
Like, what, why, you know, whatdoes that have to do with anything?

(54:15):
the business initials, right?
uh, having, having two letterscreatively joined together in the name
of the, of, of a logo is, is fine andinteresting, but it could be so much more.
And I think that's, we, I get prettyexcited about designing logos that really
express the brand platform, um, in apowerful, um, and, and effective way.

(54:39):
You know, you look at Goodyear,Goodyear Tires, their brand is really
about performance and speed, right?
And they've got the, this, the runningshoe with the wing, and it's, it's
this idea of speed and performance.
And that's, that's powerful, right?
It's so much more powerful thanmaybe just a, a g and a y put

(55:00):
together in, in an interesting way.
So I think.
Seeing and there's lots of research youcan do on hidden meanings and logos,
and sometimes it's a little too subtleand people don't actually get it.
But Amazon has the smile and it goesfrom A to Z and it says, we do everything
from A to Z and we're gonna give youreally excellent customer service that's
gonna make you happy at the same time.

(55:23):
so I think there's designing anidentity and a logo that that
incorporates the brand is really fun.
One thing that came to me, I wassmiling, maybe not chuckling,
but I see people often.
That our newer businessmaybe, I don't know.
I actually see some more experience thatthey feel very strongly about putting

(55:44):
LLC or ink or, and you know, I'm, I'man, I've got an LLC now, so I need to
put it, which I'm not sure, we don'tneed to go into that discussion, but my,
the thing that came to me earlier whenyou were speaking is that, my guess is
that someone has that clarity, then therest it is, I don't wanna say it's easy,

(56:07):
but maybe it's simpler or it is easier.
I mean, would that be accurate?
Yeah, the decision making processis much easier, It goes from being
subjective to being objective.
now we have actual data informingthe decisions that we make.
And it's not, don't just haveto take a vote and see which,

(56:28):
which logo everyone likes best.
We can actually say these, these threeoptions are all on brand, on target.
They're going to be effective for you.
And now we can let our preferencestake over and say, Hey, we, we
love the way this one looks,but they all meet the criteria.
We wouldn't put it in frontof a client, as an option if
it didn't meet the criteria.

(56:49):
Justin, you say that the bookis to help faith-driven leaders
in the, uh, tagline here.
I've used that termfaith-driven leaders before.
Sometimes I wonder if peoplereally know what that means.
How do you define faith-driven leaders?
Yeah.
It's someone, it's a person of, of faith,um, who has, has, you know, we talk about

(57:15):
it as, as a Christ follower, someonewho lives by the great commandment and
the great commission, and they desireto, to live those things out in their
family and their business and their life.
And so, that's, that drives our personalcore values and the way we act and, and

(57:35):
the content of our character the idea.
the book is to challenge and equip themto do that in their business and their
organization as well, and to give somereally, really cool, really practical
examples of other businesses who havebeen really successful in doing that.
Very same thing.
Justin, go ahead and let peopleknow how they can connect with you

(57:56):
at Grove nine or get the book andgo ahead while you're doing it.
Tell people.
Who should probably reach out to you?
Let's just say someone's listening in.
They've, some of the thingsyou've said resonate with them
and they might want to connect.
Go ahead and tell 'em who, whoshould, who should reach out to you

(58:19):
and give all your information sothat they know where to do that.
Yeah.
Thanks Tim.
organizations that desire to developthat triple bottom line to have
economic, social, and spiritualflourishing within their organization.
Uh, within, if it's a nonprofit withintheir community, within the people that
they serve, if they wanna make a greaterimpact, if they wanna grow, if they wanna

(58:43):
reach more people with the products andservices, um, that they offer, that's
really who should reach out to us.
we, we say if you have a purposethan just profit, probably
a good fit to work together.
Um, and, you know, ours is,our, our values revolve really

(59:03):
around those kingdom purposes.
Um, and that's, that'sreally a great fit for us.
And I think that that synergybetween the shared values really
creates, um, an advantage.
And, uh, it helps, it helpsus help those organizations.

(59:26):
have that shared foundation, we have thatshared purpose, we have that connection,
and that's part of our brand, right?
That's we named our company Grove Nine.
fruit grows in a grove and the fruitof the spirit, there are nine of them.
And we thought first one is love.
So let's make our logothe shape of a heart.
And we were able to incorporate the G andthe nine into the, the shape of the heart.

(59:49):
And, you know, it lets us tell our story.
You know, let's just saythis is important to us.
And if your organization values those samethings, then let's have a conversation.
We think we can, help you do moregood in the world, um, based on,
based on that shared connection.
Um, our website is grove nine.com,G-R-O-V-E, number nine.com.

(01:00:11):
website is justin eklund.com.
It's J-U-S-T-I-N-E-K.
You can connect with meat either of those places.
You can buy the book on Amazon.
I really didn't writethe book to sell books.
I wrote the book to challenge andequip these faith-driven leaders and
organizations to a greater impact, um,through their business and see those

(01:00:36):
three types of flourishing, right?
The economic, the social,and the spiritual.
I think that that's, that's what God'scalled me to do, to help faith-driven
leaders make a greater impact.
And I think, I pray that this bookwill really be helpful in that.
I think I told you that I read it and gotit on Kindle here, and, uh, I enjoyed it.

(01:00:57):
It's a good read.
It's not a complicated read, which I thinkis good and healthy for a lot of leaders
in today's world, and I love the storiesyou're interspersed throughout of what
I would term and I think you did too.
They're faith-driven leaders.
Justin, did I miss anything?
We're buttoning up against our timehere, but is there anything else you
just wanted to say or share at allbefore we wrap up and close it down?

(01:01:23):
I just wanna thank you forthe opportunity to be here and
for what you do consistently.
I think the faithfulness in your, yourpodcast and just the work that goes on
behind the scenes to, to really helporganizations bring their, their faith and
their work together is so important and sovery grateful that you're doing this work.

(01:01:43):
And, it's been a pleasure to, to be onthe podcast and just hopefully share
a little bit of what, what we do.
I think the uniqueness of, of Brandfor Impact and what we do at Grove
Nine is that we take this very, we'vetaken this very popular praise the
Lord, this idea of faith and work.
Is gaining momentum, right?

(01:02:04):
There are organizations that we justsee this tremendous growth in this.
People are saying, yeah,this, this is important.
We wanna do this and lookat all these other business
leaders who are doing it also.
so I think our agency and, and thisbook really brings that into the
idea of marketing and branding, thathasn't been, um, the idea many, many

(01:02:26):
faith-driven leaders are saying,I, I can do this in my business.
And we're saying, here's howyou do it in your marketing.
it helps with that, that youbrought up earlier, which is the
courage helps build confidence sothat people can go out and do it.
Justin Eklund, thanks for joining us.
The book is Brand for Impact.
I'm gonna read this tagline again.

(01:02:46):
really good.
A proven blueprint to help faith-drivenleaders, clarify their brand, grow their
revenue, and make a greater impact.
Get that book, it'll be helpful for you.
Thanks again, Justin, for joining us.
We've got new episodes here at Seat.
Go create.
Every Monday, like I mentioned earlier,I believe next week's episode with
Ken Gosnell is gonna be a greatpartner episode to this one because

(01:03:10):
there's stewardship conversation,there's how to do business and how
to be a steward in the marketplace.
So make sure you're listing in subscribe,leave us reviews, all that kind of stuff.
So appreciate you being here.
We'll see you next week on Seek Go Create.