Curiouser & Curiouser
Curiouser & Curiouser is a podcast for leaders, builders, and curious minds navigating AI, GenAI safety, and governance in a rapidly changing world. Produced by Alice, the enterprise trust, safety, and security platform for the AI era, the show draws on frontline adversarial intelligence to explore how AI systems are stress-tested, red-teamed, governed, and protected across their lifecycle. Each episode looks at how AI is actually showing up in the real world, how organizations evaluate it, where it breaks, and what it takes to build systems people can trust. We cut through hype and fear to explore how AI shapes trust, decision-making, and real-world work, one rabbit hole at a time. Explore more from Alice: Website: https://alice.io YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Alice.io.advance.unafraid LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/company/alice-io X: https://x.com/alice_dot_io
Episodes
What if the person whose entire job is risk was the most excited one in the room about AI?
That's Mea Clift. While most CISOs are bracing for what could go wrong, she's leaning in, she calls it being "risk excited," and it flips the whole conversation. She and Mo get into saying yes to AI without letting risk run away from you, how she handles shadow AI without punishing people for being curious, and how she somehow ends up teaching...
Your doctor's office knows more about you than almost anyone. So what happens when AI gets its hands on all of it?
That's Sandy Dunn's whole job as a healthcare CISO, and her answer is calmer than you'd expect, because the threats aren't new, it's the speed and the blast radius that changed. Which is where she and Mo pick it up, getting into HIPAA as a checkbox that protects no one, why synthetic data beats guarding data you never n...
Some guests have seen the field from one seat. Phil Venables has seen it from most of them: CISO at Goldman Sachs, the first CISO for Google Cloud, and now a partner at Ballistic Ventures. So when he says what's worth paying attention to in AI security, it's worth a listen. We get into why he's more worried about attackers scaling up than about the flood of new vulnerabilities, what changes when the actor in your environment is an ...
Mo sits down with Dr. Janet Bastiman, Chief Data Scientist at Napier AI, to talk about why fraud is easier to catch than money laundering, how deepfakes got good enough to fool a finance team out of millions, and why the humans who oversee AI matter more than ever.
🔗 Podcast: https://alice.io/podcast
Follow the show so you don’t miss the next episode.
New episodes every two weeks. Stay curious.
James Villarrubia went from building AI for NASA's drone and aerospace programs to becoming CTO of a travel tech company. In this episode, he and Mo get into why curiosity might be the most important skill in the AI era, what happens to our brains when we stop pushing back on the answers we get, and why the people most resistant to AI might actually be seeing something the rest of us are missing.
Guest: James Villurbia, Group CTO, A...
In this episode of Curiouser & Curiouser, Mo sits down with Alison Cossette, Founder and CEO of ClariTrace, to talk about why your enterprise AI is moving faster than your visibility into it and what to actually do about it. They get into control native AI, why observability and traceability aren't optional anymore, and what leaders need to put in place before something goes wrong.
🔗 Podcast: https://alice.io/podcast
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Tennisha Martin has five master's degrees, a doctorate in progress, founded one of the most important communities in cybersecurity, and will be the first to tell you that none of it mattered until she stopped trying to do it alone. In this episode, Mo and Tennisha get into AI bias, why the systems being built today are only as good as the people building them, and what it actually takes to break into a field that wasn't designed fo...
David Wendt spent 30 years building models for Fortune 100 companies before stepping away from the keyboard entirely to focus on AI governance. He also happens to be a Dungeon Master, and it turns out those two things have more in common than you'd think.
Mo and David get into red teaming, what good metrics look like in a probabilistic system, why you should probably stop measuring AI and start measuring outcomes, and what we ...
Diana Kelley has spent four decades in security watching AI go from a Dartmouth conference to an avalanche. Now CISO at Noma Security, she joins Mo to break down why the LLM is not your guardrail, why agentic AI is exposing hygiene debt you already knew you had, and why misplaced trust in these systems is the real vulnerability.
🔗 Podcast: https://alice.io/podcast
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Most countries talk about digital trust. Estonia built it into the architecture.
Joseph Carson, Chief Security Evangelist and Advisory CISO at Segura, has spent 23 years living through Estonia's digital transformation from the inside. In this episode, he and Mo get into what it actually takes to engineer trust at a national scale, what went wrong along the way, and why the lessons from a small Baltic nation matter more than ever rig...
AI governance sounds straightforward until you try to actually do it.
In this episode, Mo talks with Laura Powell, Senior Director of Partnerships at LatticeFlow AI, about the messy reality of building AI systems organizations can actually trust. They discuss translating responsible AI principles into technical controls, why many systems never make it into production, and how teams should think about risk as agentic AI systems becom...
Agentic AI is moving fast. So are the risks.
Mo talks with Steve Wilson (Chief AI and Product Officer at Exabeam and Founder and Co-chair of the OWASP GenAI Security Project) about OWASP’s approach to agentic AI security, including prompt injection, guardrails, and what it means to keep humans in the loop as agents scale.
🔗 OWASP GenAI Project: https://genai.owasp.org
AI is moving fast, but good judgment still takes time. In this premiere episode, Mo Sadek and Julie Tsai explore AI, security, and why curiosity and human perspective still matter as technology scales.
🔗 Podcast: https://alice.io/podcast
Follow the show so you don’t miss the next episode.
New episodes every two weeks. Stay curious.
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