INTERVIEW: Tiffany Cross, Angela Rye & Andrew Gillum On Truth Liberation, Native Land Podcast + More
January 11, 2024 • 46 mins
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Wake that ass up in the morning. The Breakfast Club Morning.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Everybody in is dj n V Charlamagne the Guy. We
all the Breakfast Club and we got some special guests.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
In the belloty.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Yes, indeed we have Angela Rye all right to a cross,
Andrew Gillen, Welcome, what's up everybody?
Speaker 3 (00:18):
Happy New Year? How you feeling the Internet caused him?
Destiny fulfilled? Now we're death Throat.
Speaker 4 (00:24):
Did you hear that it's giving death Throat?
Speaker 1 (00:28):
I was like, I appreciate that because of their plumbing pictures.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
For what they're here to talk about their new podcast,
native Land Native Land Podcast?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Well, how did you three get together? They decide to
do this podcast.
Speaker 5 (00:37):
Long before the podcast. Actually, we've all known each other.
Angela and I've known Angela almost my whole adult life.
I think we met when I was like twenty three,
twenty four, right when we both moved to DC. Angela
and Andrew already knew each other. And Andrew and I met.
Speaker 6 (00:51):
Through the years CBC mostly yeah, exactly.
Speaker 5 (00:54):
But you're also like in DC a lot doing things,
and so it was really organic the way our friendship
came together. And Angela had this vision of doing the
podcast and reached out to both of us. And when
Angela calls, my sister calls always say yes.
Speaker 6 (01:08):
So what was your vision?
Speaker 1 (01:09):
He said?
Speaker 3 (01:10):
Everybody has a different perspective of how they met. How
do y'all meet Angela? And yeah, I'm saying Angela's story
probably different.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
We don't remember.
Speaker 6 (01:17):
I don't remember.
Speaker 7 (01:17):
I don't remember how I met.
Speaker 4 (01:18):
If I can say that there are the two of
my oldest and longest friends in d C.
Speaker 7 (01:23):
When I moved to d C.
Speaker 4 (01:24):
The two people that I associate with d C have
Ohio connections, and that's Tiffany Crossing, Stephanie Brown James.
Speaker 7 (01:32):
So I don't remember.
Speaker 4 (01:34):
With Andrew, I think the funny story is his best
friend is my ex boyfriend.
Speaker 7 (01:39):
So but somehow, but.
Speaker 4 (01:43):
But somehow, but somehow I kept him and let the
other would go. Everybody comfortable family him and him and
r J his lovely bride and his kids now are
like my niece, my niece and nephews.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
So yeah, what about you.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Ag I met?
Speaker 8 (02:03):
Well, of course I heard about Angela through my best friend.
Shout out to Chris uh Daddy rest in peace. And
Angela was the person I mean, honestly, if I if
you asked me, then if we would ever be working together,
it would have been like a hard stop no because
both a type. She really didn't ask what you wanted.
(02:24):
You should have directed everything to tell you Chris needed
to be directed. But so that worked for them, But
I didn't feel like but we we had an instant
I mean it's instant met love and respect for this
sister who was I mean leveling your biggest beast in
the room.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
It didn't matter.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
Uh.
Speaker 8 (02:46):
And to see Angela change the culture for young professionals
in d C during her time there. Her legacy lives
on with other young Dane has live, but they lives
on through those who will continue her work and to
come to this podcast. I think what is particularly special
is not just the long standing relationship that we have.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
With each other.
Speaker 8 (03:06):
It is that very few people want to enter your
atmosphere when they think you are radioactive. Maybe you're radioactive cooling,
maybe you've gotten through, but it is.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Very hard to find the first.
Speaker 8 (03:19):
Person, the first entity, the first whatever to enter that phray.
And what makes Angela's invitation I think to me and
I imagine if you may feel in some ways the same,
is that all the hardships had somehow reached alchemy that
you could turn what was what you thought was bad
horrific that you're still mourning and grieving and triggered by
(03:45):
you have to be thankful for it all. It got
us to this point where I think we can affect
lives by helping to change and expand pupiple's perspective about
the power they have, how they use it to achieve
a meaningful political and which for me ultimately is our liberation,
our true freedom, where we get to move how we
(04:06):
want to move, not how it's been determined we should
do in order to reach quote unquote levels of success.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
With that said, who determines if you're radioactive? Though? Because
I think a lot of times we might care more
than other people do, Like.
Speaker 6 (04:22):
It might just be you know, society at large. I
think social media can be harsh them.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
I agree this morning.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
But she's right because the social media creates the noise y.
Speaker 5 (04:34):
And sometimes it can penetrate lazy journalism and drive how
newsrooms treat you and how they speak.
Speaker 6 (04:42):
So and sometimes it like they say, be your own people.
You know, sometimes people who you.
Speaker 5 (04:46):
Thought were your friend were not at that time. And
in the time of fire, I would say, when my
show got canceled unexpectedly, Charlottne you remember that time period.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Instead of chelamone much.
Speaker 5 (05:01):
It was not Charlemagne's fault at all, for the record,
but you could not reach me, like you literally had
to go through Angela to get to me. Like Angela,
get on a plane, come to Atlanta, and we were
like together non stop. And you know, you notice who's
slow to return your phone calls because they're playing the
power game. And you know, would rather align with like
(05:24):
feckless leaders who uphold white supremacy instead of people who
never came to you in crisis.
Speaker 6 (05:29):
But we're always with you in sisterhood.
Speaker 5 (05:30):
And so I think you have three people here who
have been consistent in that way. And it takes a
special person, like Andrew said, to stand with you in
the fire. But Andrew, I want Andrew to say the
advice he gave because I can be a petty bitch,
you know, And it's like I don't stuck with that
person anymore. And Andrew has a really great point that
he makes about expecting, like acceptance and expecting and it's
(05:53):
like you are expecting I'm gonna mess it up but
you are expecting a hyena to act like a lion
when they've always been a hyaen.
Speaker 6 (06:00):
So you just setting yourself up for disappointment.
Speaker 8 (06:02):
No, I mean, I so the point about I think
tried through the fire. You know, the phoenix keeps coming
to mind of going through something and then trying to emerge.
I think to your earlier question of who decides when
you're radioactive, you know that phoenix rising is much more
emblematic and representative of what the everyday lived experiences are
(06:26):
of the people whose voices really do matter. They are
the majority, they're silent in so many ways. But this
whole flash point, you know, highlight real society we've become
and when inappropriately applied, canceling of folks because not of
a I mean anything real legitimate is because I disagree
(06:48):
with your position. And we have founders who represented people
who well, the Boston Tea Party, you know, insurrection against
the US government in a real way, who were represented
by what would become a president of the United States. Right,
So you defended those people, and there's something wrong with
where we are.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
Tiffany, I'm so sorry I got off the track.
Speaker 8 (07:10):
But the point I was trying to make was going
through these kinds of things, me the trial, everything that
happened post my run for governor of Florida. I had
assumed that people who benefited financially personally, who got their
(07:32):
jobs are holding those jobs in those advances because of
doing as you were opened, because you refused to do
business with people who did not hire employee, respect the
diversity of our community whose dollars were actually spending. And
I thought, because of my presence for them, forget what
it meant to lead and represent it as a mayor
(07:52):
and run for governor and earn those votes and so
on and so forth. But commission who in a cmuson
couldn't they were aloof disappeared Vaymouth.
Speaker 3 (08:05):
You couldn't have thought they were your real friend though?
Speaker 8 (08:07):
No, No, I absolutely thought that these were people who
were in These were people who I could go into
a bunker with, and I think all of us would
have you if you pull back the layers. I'm not
sure how why do you go with all your circle
and whether you call.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Everybody a friend.
Speaker 8 (08:23):
But these are people had put on a friend list
after scrutiny, and expect that they're going to be there
for me not because I read something in the newspaper
and I'm just finding his heart. No, it's because the
person I know wouldn't do what you're suggesting, Praise God,
and I'm standing with him in the gap until somebody
(08:45):
proves me otherwise, it proves me different. And even after that,
I have grace when none of that shows up. Lonely, angry, mad.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
And all that stuff.
Speaker 8 (08:56):
You know, it's for the birds. I'm just so thankful
God revealed for me people in my life who would
say and hold me and say, you know, you were
expecting those folks to show up as you would, and
I understand how that happens. But their reaction was simply
them doing what they knew how to do.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
It was their default.
Speaker 8 (09:16):
They didn't know that perform differently. They didn't know to
organize our friends to hold a press conference and call
for this, that and the other.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
What they did was they.
Speaker 8 (09:24):
Retreated their safety and security because if they can take
this dube down, then what what about me?
Speaker 5 (09:31):
And as the intention of it, that is the intention
of it. Don't be too bold, don't be too real,
don't speak too honest. A truth we have to present,
like if these negresses get too out of hand. We
are going to castrate you on some level. I think
that happens all the time, right, it is important to
show like, hey, I'm still here, I ain't never gone nowhere.
(09:52):
We are all still here, We're all still standing. And
even if like the faces look different, right, but it
still represents the same thing. So it is, I would say, Andrew,
and for all of us who have ever found ourselves
in the public eye in a negative way to the
mass consumers out there, don't do the conservative white man's
bidding for him. Stop spreading bullshit on the internet. Stop
(10:15):
spreading salacious things on the internet to get likes, stop
spreading lots.
Speaker 6 (10:20):
Like they expect you to do that.
Speaker 5 (10:22):
We're gonna spong feed this to you because we know
that you will be the person to carry this to
the community, whether it be right wing talking points or
an effort to take out one of your leaders.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
But what you said earlier is lazy journalism and in
the fact that people don't want to actually read, they
chase headlines and clicks. And I was gonna ask, does
it bother you that it's a lot of times in
both your situations in Angela as well, where it's the
people that look like you that's attacking you more.
Speaker 5 (10:47):
It is a problem. That is a problem. Part of
it is I think social media, which just erodes intellect
in a lot of ways. Read a paper and stop
scrolling through Instagram looking at nonsense. But also even as
it impacts lazy journalism, look, the oppressor does not have
to look like them. Sometimes the oppressor looks like you.
(11:07):
Sometimes they select I'm gonna pick you the overseer because
I know you are a weak one who can be
bought and sold, and I know I can send you
out to the path to keep all the other negroes
and negresses in check. And you have to look at yourself,
like what side if history steps back and judge me,
what side am I on? And look, if you look
at history, there's always been that Like Martin Luther King
(11:29):
was not celebrated his entire life. He was considered a troublemaker,
like we don't want you around here, massive feed us good. Yeah,
we happy. So there's always been those people. Don't be
that person.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
I want to say this, it's coming from a place
of love. You know, I gotta love for you, Andrew.
But I know people are watching this and they're gonna say, well, Andrew,
don't put that on us like you put yourself in
a situation. What would you say to those.
Speaker 8 (11:54):
People, Well, I'm not sure that there's been lots of situations.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
You're talking about, But if we if if.
Speaker 8 (12:05):
If Miami were the example, I would I would understand
how someone could be hurt. Now, you can't be more
hurt than me.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Or absolutely right, you can be more hanging.
Speaker 8 (12:17):
More disappointing, or let down more whatever, then than me.
You don't need to evoke my wife or my children
as a way to help me get to that emotion. Yeah,
it's it's not an appendage. It runs through my blood.
What I would say, if I were telling the truth
about the situation, I would I would compare it to
(12:38):
you deciding that you want to go out to a
club for whatever reason, for giving your motivation, and but
the main motivation was you want to have a good time.
You wanted to be seen enjoy yourself for whatever opportunity
you could. And when you were there, someone slipped your
drink or coelude, and every everything from the point of
(13:01):
your having had that drink to waking up the next
day is a mystery to you. If we were of
different genders, we might talk about this even more differently.
But I made a choice to go somewhere at five
o'clock in the afternoon with the expectation of leave it
(13:22):
in thirty minutes, and after my drink, I don't have
a memory for six hours. And every picture, every video,
everything we've collected since that was taken of me shows
me for the duration of that time, lifeless looking or
(13:45):
with no ability to give consent, approval or anything else.
Speaker 1 (13:51):
And so.
Speaker 8 (13:54):
Put myself in that situation. Yes, we all make choices.
I chose this gas station to get gas, and I
know they sometimes shoot it up. I chose this highway
express over this when thinking it would get me there quicker.
So yes, we all make choices. But if you get
an accident along the way, I'm not going to say
that you want to go to the club. Something happened
(14:17):
to you, whatever what it was, your fault, because you
put yourself in the situation. What you put yourself in
the situation to do was to enjoy yourself, have a
good time to dance, And what resulted from that was
something that looked very, very different. And I put it
that way, Charlamagne, because I think we all have to
start to consider the people living, making mistakes, thriving as
(14:43):
relatable to our circumstances. You made a choice to go
to a club, and I don't blame you for that.
And if something happens at that club that did not
have your permission, your awareness, your co creation, No, I'm
not going to brate you for having made the decision
(15:05):
to go dancing.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Between that and your situation with the FBI, did you
realize how targeted you were?
Speaker 8 (15:10):
I had a sense of it, but I knew my actions.
Speaker 4 (15:14):
I just want to say, we're here to promote this podcast,
and you about to.
Speaker 7 (15:20):
Take all from the damn podcast.
Speaker 4 (15:23):
I'm literally ready to leave across this chair at you,
and on a positive note, because.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
The first three episodes of the podcast are all of
y'all breaking down.
Speaker 4 (15:29):
Y'all, we're talking about our stories. But I want to
say this too. We came in hot on black people
being the overseer, but there are a lot of black
people and people who don't look like us who are
celebrating this, the union, this partnership, this podcast, who can't
wait to hear from you again, who can't wait to
hear from you again, And so I don't want to
(15:50):
come in like this isn't going to be something where
we're commiserating about the negativity and our experience. We are
so honored to have a platform to speak truth to
to talk about our political circumstances, to talk about what
is happening with a crumbling democracy, the fact that Republicans
are taking this head on and are in all out war,
(16:10):
and Democrats are saying the things.
Speaker 7 (16:12):
But not necessarily delivering the things on policy.
Speaker 4 (16:15):
We are eager to talk about these things in our
stories and the intersection of all those things, because it's
not by accident speaking of targets that folks up here
were targeted tried to be silenced, but you cannot silence us.
To Tiffany's point, we are still here and we will
deliver for our fooks.
Speaker 7 (16:34):
And it's some of it out.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
The reason is because a lot of time envy. Yeah,
like a lot of times, like you said, a lot
of people would wouldn't want to stand next to maybe Andrew,
or wouldn't stand next to Tiffany. But it's like you
guys come together and people see something outside of that right,
And I love that because I think we need to
do that more sometimes I think we need to get
to the truth and not just what a headline says
(16:58):
and not just what lazy journalism. That's I go back
to it because sometimes that lazy journalism affects your life
and people, and people don't understand that that. Yeah, it
might be, it might be a joke, it might be
funny to some it might be ha ha ha ha ha.
But at the end of the day, people believe it
and it affects, you know, what you might do next,
and affects your lifestyle and how you take care of
your kids, and how take you take care of your family.
(17:19):
That's not funny. Now it takes how you, you know,
take care of your family. That's not funny, and people
think it's funny, but it really affects everything that you're doing.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
But now we can go out of that. So it's
funny when we're joking amongst each other.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Though, Yeah, we'll see Charlamagne thinks everything he has a laugh,
he's gonna and Angela knows that.
Speaker 5 (17:41):
So that's how he processes his pain.
Speaker 3 (17:46):
Think I think the best way to discuss trauma is
through the lens of humor. But if you said something
earlier that I think is a big problem when you
talk about lazy journalism. Why do people take social media
so serious? Like when you see situations that happen with
fishal TD. So I saw Oprah Winfrey this week responding
to things that kiktok. I'm like, why, Yeah, since when
did we start giving that, you know, credibility?
Speaker 1 (18:08):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (18:09):
I mean again, it is.
Speaker 5 (18:12):
Ill equipped people running newsrooms. I mean you see this
time and again where you know, when you look at
when you break down the data of who is actually
on social media, it is less than ten percent of society.
When you look at who actually uses social media, who's
actually the actively active engagers, it's less than five percent
of society. So this very small group of people gets
(18:33):
a very large megaphone. And you can be talentless, unintellectual,
have zero intellectual curiosity about anything, but you can have
a viral moment and be considered somebody to listen to.
But on the flip side of that, because I do
want to say, because the mainstream media has so ignored
the rising majority of this country and created these you know,
(18:55):
thought processes about who black people are and what we do.
Social media has also democized who has a voice in
this space, and so for that I applauded, because as
you continually ignore us, we will build and find our
own spaces that can have a damaging impact on democracy.
We saw that in twenty sixteen, where if the only
time you were outraged about Sandra Bland, you know, being
(19:17):
dying in police custody, or you were outraised about Trayvon
Martin getting shot, the only time you saw that outrage
was in an internet meme, then yes, I am likely
to go get my information from there, while the rest
of the media summarily dismisses me. When Russia looked at
that and they said, oh, I know how we can
sow discord in this country, think it took them twenty
seconds to say, oh, they treat black people fucked up.
(19:38):
So let that be our entree into their election process,
and that's where we will drive a divide. What the
white run news media saw was rait Trump just won. Guys,
we didn't pay enough attention to the racist white people.
Let's make them the center of our story. After George Floyd,
I think we all understood that is a brief moment
in time. That is a marketing campaign, that is a
talking point, that is not an active commitment to liberation
(20:02):
and equality, and you see it time and again, we
see voices getting silenced across mainstream media and out Mehdi Hassan,
amazing journalists, just had his voice canceled because he dared
to acknowledge the humanity of the Palestinian people, and he
had his voice silence. Same leaders, when you have somebody
when we look at news all the time, we all
watch news all the time, and you look at people
(20:23):
any I already know the fact that you have a platform.
At this time, I'm questioning, how real are you. I
got to give a shout out to Joy Reid, who
holds the line every day. The more that you watch
and support, the more unfuckiable we are. We don't always
have that category. And I want to say, envy, I
hear you. I gotta say the community stood with me.
(20:44):
The community saw past every kind of ridiculous talking. I
never felt alone, I never felt abandoned, not only because
of my friends sitting here with me, but people I
ain't never met before gave a big fuck you to
a corporation that was intending to take me down. It
did not work. The community immediately saw they were sophisticated
(21:04):
enough to say, nah, like we know her, and we
know she you know, keeps it one hundred percent straight,
no chaser on her show. We rock with her and
it did not work. But this big, huge corporation still
gets to drive so much part of the conversation. And
I think you're gonna see that with the decentralization of media,
voices like ours coming and filling in the gap, just
(21:25):
like keep ignoring us and you let me just say
real quick, the average cable news viewer is between sixty
two and sixty five years old.
Speaker 6 (21:32):
White men.
Speaker 5 (21:33):
That is who they are catering to the news centers,
not just white people, conservative white people. So when they
talk about, ooh, how big the Iowa caucus is, how
big the New Hampshire caucus is, this is a population
that is ninety three and ninety four percent white, respectively.
Like why have we centered this as the most important thing?
When they talk about voters from the heartland, voters from
(21:53):
the heartland, like why you gotta live in East bumblefuck
Alabama to be a voter from the heartland or real America?
Like to me, real America go to the slots in Atlanta,
Georgia after a basketball game. Let out, Those two are
real voters. Go to a wingstop in East Cleveland. Those
two are real voters. Go to Cracker Barrel in Birmingham,
Alabama after church let out. Those two are real voters.
(22:14):
I dare say those are the descendants of the architect
of this country. But yet, when you look at social
media or I'm sorry, when you look at newsrooms and
news segments, you will see an audience, a panel of
four white folks, one obligatory black person. No dis to
revern now, but so often somebody thinks that we are
rever now. That's the black perspective right there. The devil
is a lie. That is not true, right.
Speaker 4 (22:35):
It's definitely not true on Native Lampow where there are
three black voys who will be talking about our issues
every week.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
I just want to and Lardy gave me to look
like motherfucker.
Speaker 4 (22:47):
Yeah, Like we can go in And I think the
main thing for us to know is this is radio.
We want people to tune into the podcast. We want
them to do that every week. It's dropping every single Thursday.
Native Lamb Pie. Yeah, I'm going to tell you right now,
you're going to like I've been talking for fifteen minutes.
Speaker 7 (23:08):
But no, it was.
Speaker 4 (23:10):
There's a stanza in James Weldon Johnson's lift every voice
and sing true to our God, true to our native land.
And I think that the conundrum that many of us
find ourselves in is we know that this isn't our
original birthplace, This isn't our origin story, so to speak.
It is the continent, but a lot of us have
never been there. We have been fortunate to go, but
(23:30):
a lot of us haven't been there. But this has
become our native land. This has because we become our
home base, because our folks built this. I say, we
built this joint for free, and then moreover because of
the lack of safety that Tiff has referenced and that
Andrew's reference. We wanted at home base for our folks
to come to every single week. And so when we
say Native Lampid, we also say welcome home, y'all.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
That was gonna ask with the podcast, are you doing
the podcast live every week or is it going to
be pre taped so you're going to be talking about
what's going on in the world, especially to shit because
it's election.
Speaker 3 (24:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (24:00):
Absolutely, And just really quickly, the other point that Angela
referenced when coming up with this name is an homage
to the indigenous community. Yes, here we recognize that this
land was stolen and taking America wasn't found that on
peace and prosperity, as the fairy tale would have you believe.
It was taken with blood and fury from the our
(24:20):
indigenous brothers and sisters. So we acknowledge them.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
And well, are you gonna have guests as well?
Speaker 4 (24:25):
No, this is a talk based show. As you can see,
we can definitely hold our own. The hour will go
by very very fast.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Just want to come on the show.
Speaker 7 (24:35):
I think right now we're no.
Speaker 4 (24:36):
I think that we may end up doing some specials,
but clearly we got a lot to get off our chests.
Speaker 8 (24:41):
And a lot to get off our chests, not just politically,
because I think we have to draw the distinction between
what you get with all the other corporate based, you know,
consumer based news. You heard us talk about our personal stories,
which I think we've back into a large societal set
(25:01):
of questions that we have to you know, have to
reckon with. I want to co sign that the support
that our guy from just regular black folks I didn't
even know, couldn't call their names, It was incredible so
social media also gives us the impression that we're the majority.
Tear you down when you know, overwhelmingly black folks and
(25:23):
lots of times without even knowing a detailed left or
right knows that something is amiss here and they're saying
you five dollars, you know, put some peppermints in your
jacket pocket when you pass. You know what, they would
do what they can to be there for you. And
so it's important that we start to trace some of
(25:44):
what has political implications back to our practices in society.
If we're tearing each other down, note that that's because
we are under a white hedgem and his system that
values you performing and showing up in society this way
every day, regardless of what you're doing the backframe when
everybody don't know, but this is how you're supposed to
show and when you step out of that blueprint and
(26:06):
something is a miss. Corporate America depends relies on reliability, predictability.
They need to know what you're going to do. That's
where their profit lies. And so we are a society
that in large part is the matrix we perform how
large interests expect us to and they spend billions trillions
(26:28):
making that the outcome.
Speaker 7 (26:30):
I like where Andrew was going with that too, And
Tiff has brought this.
Speaker 4 (26:33):
Up as well, that we we believe that politics are
everywhere like we're impacted by them, We are touched by them,
whether folks want to touch it or not, and so
we absolutely plan on making those connections for folks on
the pot.
Speaker 3 (26:45):
Well, would you say to people who will probably look
at you'all and say, well, this is just gonna be
another Democratic echo chamber.
Speaker 6 (26:51):
I don't know why.
Speaker 5 (26:52):
Yeah, I mean I vote Democrat most of the time,
but I am not a talking head for the party
at all. I think they make horrific decisions. I think
they summarily dismiss our community the same way a lot
of the cable news industry does. I think they fail
us at every point. I think this is part of
another narrative that some black folks have taken in and believed,
(27:15):
and that is, and a lot of white folks believe
it that black people are so loyal to the Democratic Party.
That is not true. Black folks are loyal to ourselves
and the world benefits from it. Society benefits from what
we do. I understand the person's perspective who says, you know,
you want me to participate in this system that has
(27:36):
incarcerated my brother, poisoned my mother, keeps my kids in
a dilapidated school, and you're telling me by my participation
in this system, I'm going to somehow fix it, when
for decades my life has not changed. I understand that perspective.
When we vote, we are not American enthusiasts trying to
uphold the white man's democracy. We are voting in favor
of harm reduction. That has nothing to do with loyalty
(27:58):
to a party. We are loyal to our people, and
by our people, I mean us as black folks, but
also the rising majority of this country, the Asian American,
Pacific Islander community, the Indigenous community, the Latino community, because
this country hasn't been very polite or kind to any
of those communities, and so we're trying to be here
to advance a cause for the greater good, not for
any political party.
Speaker 3 (28:18):
Would any of y'all have a vote for a conservative
like that that wasn't a Trump Conservative?
Speaker 5 (28:24):
Conservative policies I think have been overwhelmingly harmful to black folks,
So I would I don't know. I don't know necessarily
get so caught up in time show democratic That's what
I was about to say, Like, there are conservative democrats,
So I think anybody who falls under the conservative umbrella
those policies are contrary to my survival into the health
of my community.
Speaker 4 (28:43):
So I don't think so, I think, And you know,
we talked about lazy journalism earlier, and this is no
insult to you, my dear brother, but I think that
what we often do is say we want to break
out of boxes, and then we try to find a
way to put people right back in those boxes.
Speaker 7 (28:57):
I think here on this show, what we're going to.
Speaker 4 (28:59):
Really try to do is break out of those constraints
and really talk about what it looks like to have
a black agenda. Thank god for Alicia Garza doing working
on the Black Census project that now gives us permission
to imagine what a world could look like that we
could live in and thrive in. I think the other
thing that's really important is I don't really want to
construct another Republican frankistigin. They tried that experiment and failed,
(29:22):
at least it failed us as Donald Trump right, Like,
I don't want to build the ideal conservative.
Speaker 7 (29:27):
For me, I don't know who that is.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
I thinkitician, but that's what I'm saying. I to Tip's
point about harm reduction. So for me, I'm progressive. I
don't see myself in the White House. I don't see
myself for the most part, in Congress. There are several
Congressional Black Caucus members who I think don't get the
attention and the respect they deserve because they represent my
best interests. I wish some of them would run for
(29:50):
higher office, and some of them haven't and couldn't get
there is.
Speaker 8 (29:54):
Some of their I appreciate the point around best interests
because the truth is is that most these things benefit everybody.
I mean, it's put one of heather the most. When
we say people are out there advocating, legislating on our behalf,
it's largely to close a gap that should never have
existed in the first place, that exist in public policy society,
(30:16):
and it plays out every single day again on this
hamster wheel that we're bridging that but the benefit of
that idea, that policy, you can't tell me getting that
extra However, many hundreds of dollars per child during COVID
for childcare didn't mean something to white folks, black folks,
brown folks, and everything in between. The problem is is
(30:37):
that we've got folks who are putting lots of money
into making sure that all we know are our differences.
Speaker 1 (30:44):
Right.
Speaker 8 (30:45):
You can't tell me my state is uber Republican when
we had a race in eighteen that came down too
point four percent difference. Now I am nowhere near a
conservative title. Joe Biden is much more that than I.
Him and Ye had a five or six point difference
in the less democratic nominee you know, love them, but
(31:05):
a twenty point gap, and so did thou Demings. Right,
So what the hell are white people prepared to hear
from us? And in what way do they need to
hear it that doesn't betray our agenda, it furthers it,
but allows them to see themselves in the process, because
I think that's what we had to do to close
that divide. And unfortunately, black voters are the most sophisticated
(31:26):
voters that exist, period, And we are going to exclamation
mark that point on the program. Well, well, let's use
Obama as an example. We thought he spoke well, We
thought that he was well groomed and well prepared and
everybody was in love with Michelle Obama.
Speaker 3 (31:42):
But we we didn't be well spoken and we roomed.
Speaker 8 (31:47):
I'm putting it in a in a frame that I
think most people recognize our societal attributes. When you're considering
somebody to be president of the United States, he couldn't
be no black brother, brown brother like me or Warnock
from the South.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
Uh voted for.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Voter because him down that was sophisticated as voted in.
Speaker 8 (32:04):
But I will tell you, am you you our age range.
We carried him when our grandparents and parents didn't believe. Now,
when black folks saw that white folks in Iowa and
New Hampshire were willing to go there for him, then
it changed our perception of what was possible. But black folks, unfortunately,
but it is created in us a gift, have always
(32:27):
had to consider how white people will vote when considering
whether we could get behind that candidate put money there
organized for that person, because if it can't, if it
ain't real. As pragmatic people, we're not going there. By
and large, we supports you, hallelujah, Da da da, but
society by large isn't supporting you. So when we saw that,
(32:48):
did we rally or did we rally? There was no
turning back. After New Hampshire and then South Carolina, there
was no it changed. The winds in South Carolina was
different a.
Speaker 3 (32:57):
Week before in South Carolina. So I'm saying it was
a lot of He won a lot of cultural wars.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
My cultural wars I think framed a whole long time.
Speaker 6 (33:07):
Black folks were solidly in the Clinton camp. If you remember.
Speaker 3 (33:11):
Talking about inside political people, I'm talking about people just
don't talking.
Speaker 8 (33:15):
About and my mother who were committed to voting for
Hillary clon first time I ever voted with Brock a
ball period, and millions of others.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
That's what I'm trying to tell you. That President Obama
energized the whole group of people who never even considered.
Speaker 4 (33:29):
That's literally what I think Andrew's point was there was
young people first who carried him and made it feel
like that was even possible. Older black folks were like this,
and it wasn't not just political folk.
Speaker 8 (33:40):
And it wasn't because they were hating. They for us,
but they were scared.
Speaker 3 (33:47):
To make it.
Speaker 8 (33:47):
To your point of sophisticated, why are we because we
consider the performance of everyone else, bake get into the
formula before we go in and make decisions about ourselves.
That the privilege that we're going to talk about liberation,
because liberation is that I get to decide regardless of
how it impacts. I am going in here and I've
got a frame, and my freedom requires that I vote
(34:09):
for this thing that's going to lead to more of that.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Take it from your podcast, all the stuff you.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
Don't notice.
Speaker 3 (34:18):
But lost the share aspect too, because there was a
lot of people who would say, no, I don't want
Obama to run because he'll get killed. I remember when
he won the election, people thought he was going to
get on stage. I remember when they had the parade
after he got sworn in and he got off the car.
Speaker 1 (34:33):
People was like, no, no, yeah, I was one of them.
Speaker 7 (34:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (34:37):
Why because we have lived alongside these homicidal maniacs for
four hundred plus years, and we have seen firsthand what
white violence can do in this country. And I think
Andrew's point was we are sophisticated because we don't have
the privilege to say to cherry pick values and political
standpoints and say until I find this specific person, I'm
going to reserve my vote. I hear so many whit
(35:00):
women with that attitude. A lot of the Bernie folks
I think had that attitude where it's like this this
specific set.
Speaker 6 (35:07):
Of things I'm waiting for, and if I don't.
Speaker 5 (35:09):
I have the privilege to sit it out. I have
the privilege to criticize. I have the privilege to cross
a political divide and vote Republican.
Speaker 6 (35:16):
We don't have that. We don't have that, we have
to sophisticated.
Speaker 3 (35:20):
I don't feel we're sophisticated because we know where our
vote is going.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
Everybody knows.
Speaker 5 (35:26):
I don't think that's true because you know why, Because
black people they're just like everybody else, every other constituency.
Speaker 6 (35:33):
Black folks have the option to abstain. I hope people
don't choose that.
Speaker 5 (35:37):
But the conversation, I think this is where the news
media gets it wrong as well. The conversation is not
there's a lot of focus on black voters when it
comes to how we fail when we don't show up.
So now the conversation is, oh, Biden, in all his
trouble with black voters, no talk about white folks who
are actively supporting and excited to support an insurrection as president.
(35:59):
Talk about white folks who are happy to celebrate a
man who is has unteemed indictments, and three baby mamas
talk about white folks excitement about somebody who put over
two hundred white conservative judges to lifetime appointments who were
completely ineps in law. Some of these people have never
been judges before. Those are the folks who are a
danger to democracy, not black folks. After being frustrated in
(36:23):
this process for so long, and I don't.
Speaker 4 (36:24):
Hear us being called dangerous, I do hear the point
about sophistication, and I think it goes back to pigeonholing
us into believing that we are not capable of having
a nuanced conversation.
Speaker 7 (36:37):
Right, I think that we.
Speaker 3 (36:38):
Don't have a nuanced vote.
Speaker 8 (36:40):
We have a nuanced vote every time we vote, but
black people are doing, are deciding, and and.
Speaker 7 (36:45):
I'll stop because I need we can say.
Speaker 8 (36:49):
That simply because the majority of a vote goes one
way that is in lockstep. Couldn't it be that we
liked the some of those checks too, and we knew
that the other party is against them. And so even
though I can't get everything I want, this gets me
marginally closer to the things that meet my knee.
Speaker 7 (37:05):
And that's not my point.
Speaker 4 (37:07):
I support that, but I think what I'm saying is
it is unfortunate. When you go to the ballot box,
you are literally in a box, right, You have to
make a decision. There's no nuance between checking between this
person and that person. It doesn't mean that the road
you traveled to get there was not difficult, was not excruciating.
The things that I'm hearing my dad say about what
(37:28):
is going to mean for him to vote for Joe
Biden this time? It's hard, you know, Like there are
people who I love dearly who have said not and
they didn't say this in twenty twenty, but like this
one is going.
Speaker 7 (37:41):
To be tough because I don't feel represented.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Why, like why would I get out and vote and
not sit on the couch? Right, That's what a lot
of people are saying. Why would I go vote for bid?
Speaker 4 (37:51):
Or they're saying I haven't heard why wouldn't I sit
on the couch? I have heard I wish somebody else
was running.
Speaker 7 (37:56):
I have heard that. I've heard it a lot more.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
It is scaring me, right, And what I hope comes
out of this not just for us for the conversations,
We'll have a native lamppod. But I hope what comes
out of this is a push from the administration to
do some things, to meet people where they are, meet
them in their sacrifice.
Speaker 7 (38:12):
People showed up through a.
Speaker 4 (38:14):
Pandemic for this administration, show up for these folks. You
know it's I'm tired of having the conversation about the
Democratic Party takes black voters for granted.
Speaker 7 (38:22):
We know what are you going to do about it?
Chairman Jamie Harrison. I know you. I know that you
know the sacrifice.
Speaker 4 (38:29):
I know what you're up against with all those white
consultants that ain't moved over there.
Speaker 7 (38:32):
We got your back, so have hours. Right.
Speaker 4 (38:35):
I think that it's time for us to really have
that conversation more publicly. We've had it quietly because a
lot of our friends work in there. We want to
give our we want to embolden our friends, empower our friends.
But now we're at a point where our family members,
our friends are talking about this more publicly and they
deserve to be held to.
Speaker 3 (38:52):
Accuse you'll attack y'all when y'all speak out against the
President Biden. Well, look, I do date this for some
real plantation. Don't you talk about mathilistic?
Speaker 7 (39:04):
But Leonardi might not just be plantation mentality. Some of
it is feared.
Speaker 3 (39:08):
I was so I watched him.
Speaker 8 (39:12):
I gotta check this time that there was legislature there.
Speaker 3 (39:16):
You can't be mad at people who feel like that
about Trump when you.
Speaker 7 (39:20):
Check.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
I thought he was not just the stimulus.
Speaker 8 (39:23):
I'm saying the agenda. If y'all, if you have kids
and you were paying for daycare and you saw that
that subsidy doubled on your taxes, that it went to
a three month every three month dispersement. Things have happened
as a result of this man being in office that
has improved.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Our quality of life.
Speaker 3 (39:45):
How do you message what?
Speaker 8 (39:46):
What?
Speaker 1 (39:46):
Well?
Speaker 8 (39:47):
You got to remind people and they have to stay
in the fight for it. What happened mentioned and Cinema said,
we're not going back there, and that was all she wrote.
Two Democrats said was stepping back in the Senate and
that was all she wrote. But I will tell you
this much, if Biden, we're running off of his agenda.
And by the way, I firmly believe these things ought
to exist in society anyway, because we don't pay people
(40:09):
enough to deal with the hell we deal with to
catch our breath from day to day. We are Native Land.
Podcast is going to be transformational because I think it's
going to remind us of our power. And yes, elections
have names on the ballot of people we don't like,
think too old, might die, Da da dadada. But it
(40:30):
is unfortunately the system that we are operating within, and
until we can coerce that system to looking more like
the one that we believe we deserve. You don't walk
off the field. You stay on the field, because there
are consequences to walking.
Speaker 1 (40:46):
Off the field.
Speaker 8 (40:47):
Trump said, I know who's getting most impacted by this coronavirus,
and it's mostly older, sicker, and people of color. I
knew right then and that press conference that he didn't
care a lick about the coronavirus because the people who
were at the intersection of the greatest impact didn't look
like him here and care about and so on and
so forth. So we if we if we just check
(41:09):
out because we're not getting everything, at least tell me
you're checking out from Joe Biden, because on the other
side of the agenda, you're getting more than what you're
getting on this side. Not one promise, not almost send
a check to your business. But I am going to
produce public policy that leads to your greater freedom, your
ability to move the way you want to move, because
(41:31):
those rights are inalienable.
Speaker 5 (41:33):
But to switch over, I may have an unpopular take here,
so I may lose my a man corner. But there
is a saying in politics that you can never blame
the voter. I am gonna blame the voter a little
bit because I feel like society at large is so
caught up again in bulshit, and so there are many
things that the Biden administration has done that people benefit from.
I think one, there's a lack of understanding and civics
(41:55):
in this country across every socioeconomic status, across every racial divide.
People don't underst the difference between state, federal, and local government,
and so sometimes people ascribe blame where there should be
none to the federal government too. We have to take
responsibility as citizens of this country. It is our job
to know when elections are happening, what's on the ballot,
(42:16):
who's on the ballot, why these things matter. So maybe
just maybe instead of scrolling through Instagram looking at nonsense
for three fucking hours, maybe pick up a paper or
maybe Google, maybe say what has Biden done for Black America.
That's a question you have asked that. That's a fair
question you should be asking it. I encourage that kind
of curiosity.
Speaker 6 (42:35):
Ask it. Maybe you will be surprised.
Speaker 5 (42:38):
You can call up your member of Congress and say, hey,
I got fifty friends at my house and we want
to hear what you're doing for us. That member of
Congress just might show up. Maybe show up to the
school board meeting where your kids are in school, where
they're taking their rewriting history. They're banning books in this
country right now. Maybe participate in that. At the bare minimum,
you can read something. At most, you can go up
(42:59):
and show and show up someplace and ask a question.
You can host something, you can be a voice. You
can write a check to a candidate, you can run
for office. But these things do require some participation from us,
not us sitting around whining about, well, I don't know
what he did. When you have this in your hand
every five minutes and it's full of information, you can
find a reliable source from the White House website itself,
(43:21):
to newspapers, et cetera, and be informed.
Speaker 3 (43:24):
I agree with you. I just think we're intellectually dishonest
about a lot of this stuff based on what party
we like, because we'll say things like, oh, people don't
know civics. But then if you mentioned Barack Obama, you'll
say Obama gave you health care, right, But if you
say Trump gave Stimie, you're like, no, Trump didn't give
the Stimmies, Congress voting for it them. You say Trump
did the FIRS step back. Trump didn't do the first
step back. Congress did for it. See a little intellectually dishonest.
Everybody is based on what party.
Speaker 1 (43:45):
I think that's what you deal on all sides. Yeah, right,
absolutely right, As.
Speaker 3 (43:49):
You said, google what Biden did? So you want to
you whatever he did pass Trump did?
Speaker 7 (43:55):
She was saying to the question, because people did does
come up?
Speaker 4 (43:58):
I mean even in some of the questions in the
commons where I was like, what do you guys want
us to address on the podcast, one of them was
what did Biden do for black people versus the g
O P now, because he can't make a speech from yesterday, no,
that from the Trouston speech, because he had whole lists
of stuff in the pulpit and Mother Emmanuel of what
he believes he did for like on the.
Speaker 3 (44:19):
Things he didn't get done, the first thing we'll say
is was because Congress wouldn't allow him to he had
gotten them done, y'all, Like, look what Biden did. That's
why I said, it's a little be.
Speaker 7 (44:29):
Careful about y'all.
Speaker 4 (44:30):
Right, we have this fight all the time, even on
our phone calls, like I don't like to be y'all
to me, like, shut up, that's true what y'all were
on and we on the fourth y'all.
Speaker 7 (44:43):
That's definitely where I'm at. But I guess the point
is say again, yeah, that's what she said.
Speaker 4 (44:53):
But no, I think at the end of the day,
it is true that we will assign blame to people
that some times don't deserve it when there is a
whole process to tips point on civics, and we will
reward someone who we need them to win, you know.
And I think that again, going back to the reason
we're here today, Native Lampod every Thursday, we're gonna be
honest about processes. We want our folks to be smarter.
(45:15):
We want folks to hold us to account. We say
something wrong, tell us we want to get it right,
and it's not to be right. It's because we want
to be better, we want to be free, We want
to walk in.
Speaker 7 (45:24):
Our true liberation.
Speaker 4 (45:25):
If we can get our folks one step closer to that,
that's what we want to do.
Speaker 8 (45:28):
Everything as long as we give them a shout out
right now, because black people, ever since we've been able
to participate in elections and before, have been holding this
country and pushing this country closer to its true vision
of an American dream and it's principles upon which it's built,
enshrined in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution and
(45:52):
reiterated throughout. It's been black voters who have consistently showed
up to hold America to the fire of the promise
that we weren't even designed in from its beginning. The
words were there, the actions weren't, and black folks would
be the reinforces and the accountability agents to make the
words mean.
Speaker 3 (46:12):
Something that's right. Native Lamp Podcast. It starts January Thursday,
and I think it's very important to note that this
is the first flagship podcast from Reason Choice Media, which
is a political podcast network with with With iHeart that
angela Ria is the founder of.
Speaker 7 (46:29):
With You and Chris Mile and it is my honor, yes.
Speaker 3 (46:33):
So it'll be a lot more shows coming down the pipeline,
but we appreciate you guys for joining us.
Speaker 1 (46:39):
Thank you so much, Andrew Gillam.
Speaker 3 (46:41):
Subscribe the Native Lamp podcast right now.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
That's episoday. Wake that ass up in the morning. The
Breakfast Club
Wake that ass up in the morning. The Breakfast Club Morning.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Everybody in is dj n V Charlamagne the Guy. We
all the Breakfast Club and we got some special guests.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
In the belloty.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Yes, indeed we have Angela Rye all right to a cross,
Andrew Gillen, Welcome, what's up everybody?
Speaker 3 (00:18):
Happy New Year? How you feeling the Internet caused him?
Destiny fulfilled? Now we're death Throat.
Speaker 4 (00:24):
Did you hear that it's giving death Throat?
Speaker 1 (00:28):
I was like, I appreciate that because of their plumbing pictures.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
For what they're here to talk about their new podcast,
native Land Native Land Podcast?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Well, how did you three get together? They decide to
do this podcast.
Speaker 5 (00:37):
Long before the podcast. Actually, we've all known each other.
Angela and I've known Angela almost my whole adult life.
I think we met when I was like twenty three,
twenty four, right when we both moved to DC. Angela
and Andrew already knew each other. And Andrew and I met.
Speaker 6 (00:51):
Through the years CBC mostly yeah, exactly.
Speaker 5 (00:54):
But you're also like in DC a lot doing things,
and so it was really organic the way our friendship
came together. And Angela had this vision of doing the
podcast and reached out to both of us. And when
Angela calls, my sister calls always say yes.
Speaker 6 (01:08):
So what was your vision?
Speaker 1 (01:09):
He said?
Speaker 3 (01:10):
Everybody has a different perspective of how they met. How
do y'all meet Angela? And yeah, I'm saying Angela's story
probably different.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
We don't remember.
Speaker 6 (01:17):
I don't remember.
Speaker 7 (01:17):
I don't remember how I met.
Speaker 4 (01:18):
If I can say that there are the two of
my oldest and longest friends in d C.
Speaker 7 (01:23):
When I moved to d C.
Speaker 4 (01:24):
The two people that I associate with d C have
Ohio connections, and that's Tiffany Crossing, Stephanie Brown James.
Speaker 7 (01:32):
So I don't remember.
Speaker 4 (01:34):
With Andrew, I think the funny story is his best
friend is my ex boyfriend.
Speaker 7 (01:39):
So but somehow, but.
Speaker 4 (01:43):
But somehow, but somehow I kept him and let the
other would go. Everybody comfortable family him and him and
r J his lovely bride and his kids now are
like my niece, my niece and nephews.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
So yeah, what about you.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Ag I met?
Speaker 8 (02:03):
Well, of course I heard about Angela through my best friend.
Shout out to Chris uh Daddy rest in peace. And
Angela was the person I mean, honestly, if I if
you asked me, then if we would ever be working together,
it would have been like a hard stop no because
both a type. She really didn't ask what you wanted.
(02:24):
You should have directed everything to tell you Chris needed
to be directed. But so that worked for them, But
I didn't feel like but we we had an instant
I mean it's instant met love and respect for this
sister who was I mean leveling your biggest beast in
the room.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
It didn't matter.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
Uh.
Speaker 8 (02:46):
And to see Angela change the culture for young professionals
in d C during her time there. Her legacy lives
on with other young Dane has live, but they lives
on through those who will continue her work and to
come to this podcast. I think what is particularly special
is not just the long standing relationship that we have.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
With each other.
Speaker 8 (03:06):
It is that very few people want to enter your
atmosphere when they think you are radioactive. Maybe you're radioactive cooling,
maybe you've gotten through, but it is.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Very hard to find the first.
Speaker 8 (03:19):
Person, the first entity, the first whatever to enter that phray.
And what makes Angela's invitation I think to me and
I imagine if you may feel in some ways the same,
is that all the hardships had somehow reached alchemy that
you could turn what was what you thought was bad
horrific that you're still mourning and grieving and triggered by
(03:45):
you have to be thankful for it all. It got
us to this point where I think we can affect
lives by helping to change and expand pupiple's perspective about
the power they have, how they use it to achieve
a meaningful political and which for me ultimately is our liberation,
our true freedom, where we get to move how we
(04:06):
want to move, not how it's been determined we should
do in order to reach quote unquote levels of success.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
With that said, who determines if you're radioactive? Though? Because
I think a lot of times we might care more
than other people do, Like.
Speaker 6 (04:22):
It might just be you know, society at large. I
think social media can be harsh them.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
I agree this morning.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
But she's right because the social media creates the noise y.
Speaker 5 (04:34):
And sometimes it can penetrate lazy journalism and drive how
newsrooms treat you and how they speak.
Speaker 6 (04:42):
So and sometimes it like they say, be your own people.
You know, sometimes people who you.
Speaker 5 (04:46):
Thought were your friend were not at that time. And
in the time of fire, I would say, when my
show got canceled unexpectedly, Charlottne you remember that time period.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Instead of chelamone much.
Speaker 5 (05:01):
It was not Charlemagne's fault at all, for the record,
but you could not reach me, like you literally had
to go through Angela to get to me. Like Angela,
get on a plane, come to Atlanta, and we were
like together non stop. And you know, you notice who's
slow to return your phone calls because they're playing the
power game. And you know, would rather align with like
(05:24):
feckless leaders who uphold white supremacy instead of people who
never came to you in crisis.
Speaker 6 (05:29):
But we're always with you in sisterhood.
Speaker 5 (05:30):
And so I think you have three people here who
have been consistent in that way. And it takes a
special person, like Andrew said, to stand with you in
the fire. But Andrew, I want Andrew to say the
advice he gave because I can be a petty bitch,
you know, And it's like I don't stuck with that
person anymore. And Andrew has a really great point that
he makes about expecting, like acceptance and expecting and it's
(05:53):
like you are expecting I'm gonna mess it up but
you are expecting a hyena to act like a lion
when they've always been a hyaen.
Speaker 6 (06:00):
So you just setting yourself up for disappointment.
Speaker 8 (06:02):
No, I mean, I so the point about I think
tried through the fire. You know, the phoenix keeps coming
to mind of going through something and then trying to emerge.
I think to your earlier question of who decides when
you're radioactive, you know that phoenix rising is much more
emblematic and representative of what the everyday lived experiences are
(06:26):
of the people whose voices really do matter. They are
the majority, they're silent in so many ways. But this
whole flash point, you know, highlight real society we've become
and when inappropriately applied, canceling of folks because not of
a I mean anything real legitimate is because I disagree
(06:48):
with your position. And we have founders who represented people
who well, the Boston Tea Party, you know, insurrection against
the US government in a real way, who were represented
by what would become a president of the United States. Right,
So you defended those people, and there's something wrong with
where we are.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
Tiffany, I'm so sorry I got off the track.
Speaker 8 (07:10):
But the point I was trying to make was going
through these kinds of things, me the trial, everything that
happened post my run for governor of Florida. I had
assumed that people who benefited financially personally, who got their
(07:32):
jobs are holding those jobs in those advances because of
doing as you were opened, because you refused to do
business with people who did not hire employee, respect the
diversity of our community whose dollars were actually spending. And
I thought, because of my presence for them, forget what
it meant to lead and represent it as a mayor
(07:52):
and run for governor and earn those votes and so
on and so forth. But commission who in a cmuson
couldn't they were aloof disappeared Vaymouth.
Speaker 3 (08:05):
You couldn't have thought they were your real friend though?
Speaker 8 (08:07):
No, No, I absolutely thought that these were people who
were in These were people who I could go into
a bunker with, and I think all of us would
have you if you pull back the layers. I'm not
sure how why do you go with all your circle
and whether you call.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Everybody a friend.
Speaker 8 (08:23):
But these are people had put on a friend list
after scrutiny, and expect that they're going to be there
for me not because I read something in the newspaper
and I'm just finding his heart. No, it's because the
person I know wouldn't do what you're suggesting, Praise God,
and I'm standing with him in the gap until somebody
(08:45):
proves me otherwise, it proves me different. And even after that,
I have grace when none of that shows up. Lonely, angry, mad.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
And all that stuff.
Speaker 8 (08:56):
You know, it's for the birds. I'm just so thankful
God revealed for me people in my life who would
say and hold me and say, you know, you were
expecting those folks to show up as you would, and
I understand how that happens. But their reaction was simply
them doing what they knew how to do.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
It was their default.
Speaker 8 (09:16):
They didn't know that perform differently. They didn't know to
organize our friends to hold a press conference and call
for this, that and the other.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
What they did was they.
Speaker 8 (09:24):
Retreated their safety and security because if they can take
this dube down, then what what about me?
Speaker 5 (09:31):
And as the intention of it, that is the intention
of it. Don't be too bold, don't be too real,
don't speak too honest. A truth we have to present,
like if these negresses get too out of hand. We
are going to castrate you on some level. I think
that happens all the time, right, it is important to
show like, hey, I'm still here, I ain't never gone nowhere.
(09:52):
We are all still here, We're all still standing. And
even if like the faces look different, right, but it
still represents the same thing. So it is, I would say, Andrew,
and for all of us who have ever found ourselves
in the public eye in a negative way to the
mass consumers out there, don't do the conservative white man's
bidding for him. Stop spreading bullshit on the internet. Stop
(10:15):
spreading salacious things on the internet to get likes, stop
spreading lots.
Speaker 6 (10:20):
Like they expect you to do that.
Speaker 5 (10:22):
We're gonna spong feed this to you because we know
that you will be the person to carry this to
the community, whether it be right wing talking points or
an effort to take out one of your leaders.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
But what you said earlier is lazy journalism and in
the fact that people don't want to actually read, they
chase headlines and clicks. And I was gonna ask, does
it bother you that it's a lot of times in
both your situations in Angela as well, where it's the
people that look like you that's attacking you more.
Speaker 5 (10:47):
It is a problem. That is a problem. Part of
it is I think social media, which just erodes intellect
in a lot of ways. Read a paper and stop
scrolling through Instagram looking at nonsense. But also even as
it impacts lazy journalism, look, the oppressor does not have
to look like them. Sometimes the oppressor looks like you.
(11:07):
Sometimes they select I'm gonna pick you the overseer because
I know you are a weak one who can be
bought and sold, and I know I can send you
out to the path to keep all the other negroes
and negresses in check. And you have to look at yourself,
like what side if history steps back and judge me,
what side am I on? And look, if you look
at history, there's always been that Like Martin Luther King
(11:29):
was not celebrated his entire life. He was considered a troublemaker,
like we don't want you around here, massive feed us good. Yeah,
we happy. So there's always been those people. Don't be
that person.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
I want to say this, it's coming from a place
of love. You know, I gotta love for you, Andrew.
But I know people are watching this and they're gonna say, well, Andrew,
don't put that on us like you put yourself in
a situation. What would you say to those.
Speaker 8 (11:54):
People, Well, I'm not sure that there's been lots of situations.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
You're talking about, But if we if if.
Speaker 8 (12:05):
If Miami were the example, I would I would understand
how someone could be hurt. Now, you can't be more
hurt than me.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Or absolutely right, you can be more hanging.
Speaker 8 (12:17):
More disappointing, or let down more whatever, then than me.
You don't need to evoke my wife or my children
as a way to help me get to that emotion. Yeah,
it's it's not an appendage. It runs through my blood.
What I would say, if I were telling the truth
about the situation, I would I would compare it to
(12:38):
you deciding that you want to go out to a
club for whatever reason, for giving your motivation, and but
the main motivation was you want to have a good time.
You wanted to be seen enjoy yourself for whatever opportunity
you could. And when you were there, someone slipped your
drink or coelude, and every everything from the point of
(13:01):
your having had that drink to waking up the next
day is a mystery to you. If we were of
different genders, we might talk about this even more differently.
But I made a choice to go somewhere at five
o'clock in the afternoon with the expectation of leave it
(13:22):
in thirty minutes, and after my drink, I don't have
a memory for six hours. And every picture, every video,
everything we've collected since that was taken of me shows
me for the duration of that time, lifeless looking or
(13:45):
with no ability to give consent, approval or anything else.
Speaker 1 (13:51):
And so.
Speaker 8 (13:54):
Put myself in that situation. Yes, we all make choices.
I chose this gas station to get gas, and I
know they sometimes shoot it up. I chose this highway
express over this when thinking it would get me there quicker.
So yes, we all make choices. But if you get
an accident along the way, I'm not going to say
that you want to go to the club. Something happened
(14:17):
to you, whatever what it was, your fault, because you
put yourself in the situation. What you put yourself in
the situation to do was to enjoy yourself, have a
good time to dance, And what resulted from that was
something that looked very, very different. And I put it
that way, Charlamagne, because I think we all have to
start to consider the people living, making mistakes, thriving as
(14:43):
relatable to our circumstances. You made a choice to go
to a club, and I don't blame you for that.
And if something happens at that club that did not
have your permission, your awareness, your co creation, No, I'm
not going to brate you for having made the decision
(15:05):
to go dancing.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Between that and your situation with the FBI, did you
realize how targeted you were?
Speaker 8 (15:10):
I had a sense of it, but I knew my actions.
Speaker 4 (15:14):
I just want to say, we're here to promote this podcast,
and you about to.
Speaker 7 (15:20):
Take all from the damn podcast.
Speaker 4 (15:23):
I'm literally ready to leave across this chair at you,
and on a positive note, because.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
The first three episodes of the podcast are all of
y'all breaking down.
Speaker 4 (15:29):
Y'all, we're talking about our stories. But I want to
say this too. We came in hot on black people
being the overseer, but there are a lot of black
people and people who don't look like us who are
celebrating this, the union, this partnership, this podcast, who can't
wait to hear from you again, who can't wait to
hear from you again, And so I don't want to
(15:50):
come in like this isn't going to be something where
we're commiserating about the negativity and our experience. We are
so honored to have a platform to speak truth to
to talk about our political circumstances, to talk about what
is happening with a crumbling democracy, the fact that Republicans
are taking this head on and are in all out war,
(16:10):
and Democrats are saying the things.
Speaker 7 (16:12):
But not necessarily delivering the things on policy.
Speaker 4 (16:15):
We are eager to talk about these things in our
stories and the intersection of all those things, because it's
not by accident speaking of targets that folks up here
were targeted tried to be silenced, but you cannot silence us.
To Tiffany's point, we are still here and we will
deliver for our fooks.
Speaker 7 (16:34):
And it's some of it out.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
The reason is because a lot of time envy. Yeah,
like a lot of times, like you said, a lot
of people would wouldn't want to stand next to maybe Andrew,
or wouldn't stand next to Tiffany. But it's like you
guys come together and people see something outside of that right,
And I love that because I think we need to
do that more sometimes I think we need to get
to the truth and not just what a headline says
(16:58):
and not just what lazy journalism. That's I go back
to it because sometimes that lazy journalism affects your life
and people, and people don't understand that that. Yeah, it
might be, it might be a joke, it might be
funny to some it might be ha ha ha ha ha.
But at the end of the day, people believe it
and it affects, you know, what you might do next,
and affects your lifestyle and how you take care of
your kids, and how take you take care of your family.
(17:19):
That's not funny. Now it takes how you, you know,
take care of your family. That's not funny, and people
think it's funny, but it really affects everything that you're doing.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
But now we can go out of that. So it's
funny when we're joking amongst each other.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Though, Yeah, we'll see Charlamagne thinks everything he has a laugh,
he's gonna and Angela knows that.
Speaker 5 (17:41):
So that's how he processes his pain.
Speaker 3 (17:46):
Think I think the best way to discuss trauma is
through the lens of humor. But if you said something
earlier that I think is a big problem when you
talk about lazy journalism. Why do people take social media
so serious? Like when you see situations that happen with
fishal TD. So I saw Oprah Winfrey this week responding
to things that kiktok. I'm like, why, Yeah, since when
did we start giving that, you know, credibility?
Speaker 1 (18:08):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (18:09):
I mean again, it is.
Speaker 5 (18:12):
Ill equipped people running newsrooms. I mean you see this
time and again where you know, when you look at
when you break down the data of who is actually
on social media, it is less than ten percent of society.
When you look at who actually uses social media, who's
actually the actively active engagers, it's less than five percent
of society. So this very small group of people gets
(18:33):
a very large megaphone. And you can be talentless, unintellectual,
have zero intellectual curiosity about anything, but you can have
a viral moment and be considered somebody to listen to.
But on the flip side of that, because I do
want to say, because the mainstream media has so ignored
the rising majority of this country and created these you know,
(18:55):
thought processes about who black people are and what we do.
Social media has also democized who has a voice in
this space, and so for that I applauded, because as
you continually ignore us, we will build and find our
own spaces that can have a damaging impact on democracy.
We saw that in twenty sixteen, where if the only
time you were outraged about Sandra Bland, you know, being
(19:17):
dying in police custody, or you were outraised about Trayvon
Martin getting shot, the only time you saw that outrage
was in an internet meme, then yes, I am likely
to go get my information from there, while the rest
of the media summarily dismisses me. When Russia looked at
that and they said, oh, I know how we can
sow discord in this country, think it took them twenty
seconds to say, oh, they treat black people fucked up.
(19:38):
So let that be our entree into their election process,
and that's where we will drive a divide. What the
white run news media saw was rait Trump just won. Guys,
we didn't pay enough attention to the racist white people.
Let's make them the center of our story. After George Floyd,
I think we all understood that is a brief moment
in time. That is a marketing campaign, that is a
talking point, that is not an active commitment to liberation
(20:02):
and equality, and you see it time and again, we
see voices getting silenced across mainstream media and out Mehdi Hassan,
amazing journalists, just had his voice canceled because he dared
to acknowledge the humanity of the Palestinian people, and he
had his voice silence. Same leaders, when you have somebody
when we look at news all the time, we all
watch news all the time, and you look at people
(20:23):
any I already know the fact that you have a platform.
At this time, I'm questioning, how real are you. I
got to give a shout out to Joy Reid, who
holds the line every day. The more that you watch
and support, the more unfuckiable we are. We don't always
have that category. And I want to say, envy, I
hear you. I gotta say the community stood with me.
(20:44):
The community saw past every kind of ridiculous talking. I
never felt alone, I never felt abandoned, not only because
of my friends sitting here with me, but people I
ain't never met before gave a big fuck you to
a corporation that was intending to take me down. It
did not work. The community immediately saw they were sophisticated
(21:04):
enough to say, nah, like we know her, and we
know she you know, keeps it one hundred percent straight,
no chaser on her show. We rock with her and
it did not work. But this big, huge corporation still
gets to drive so much part of the conversation. And
I think you're gonna see that with the decentralization of media,
voices like ours coming and filling in the gap, just
(21:25):
like keep ignoring us and you let me just say
real quick, the average cable news viewer is between sixty
two and sixty five years old.
Speaker 6 (21:32):
White men.
Speaker 5 (21:33):
That is who they are catering to the news centers,
not just white people, conservative white people. So when they
talk about, ooh, how big the Iowa caucus is, how
big the New Hampshire caucus is, this is a population
that is ninety three and ninety four percent white, respectively.
Like why have we centered this as the most important thing?
When they talk about voters from the heartland, voters from
(21:53):
the heartland, like why you gotta live in East bumblefuck
Alabama to be a voter from the heartland or real America?
Like to me, real America go to the slots in Atlanta,
Georgia after a basketball game. Let out, Those two are
real voters. Go to a wingstop in East Cleveland. Those
two are real voters. Go to Cracker Barrel in Birmingham,
Alabama after church let out. Those two are real voters.
(22:14):
I dare say those are the descendants of the architect
of this country. But yet, when you look at social
media or I'm sorry, when you look at newsrooms and
news segments, you will see an audience, a panel of
four white folks, one obligatory black person. No dis to
revern now, but so often somebody thinks that we are
rever now. That's the black perspective right there. The devil
is a lie. That is not true, right.
Speaker 4 (22:35):
It's definitely not true on Native Lampow where there are
three black voys who will be talking about our issues
every week.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
I just want to and Lardy gave me to look
like motherfucker.
Speaker 4 (22:47):
Yeah, Like we can go in And I think the
main thing for us to know is this is radio.
We want people to tune into the podcast. We want
them to do that every week. It's dropping every single Thursday.
Native Lamb Pie. Yeah, I'm going to tell you right now,
you're going to like I've been talking for fifteen minutes.
Speaker 7 (23:08):
But no, it was.
Speaker 4 (23:10):
There's a stanza in James Weldon Johnson's lift every voice
and sing true to our God, true to our native land.
And I think that the conundrum that many of us
find ourselves in is we know that this isn't our
original birthplace, This isn't our origin story, so to speak.
It is the continent, but a lot of us have
never been there. We have been fortunate to go, but
(23:30):
a lot of us haven't been there. But this has
become our native land. This has because we become our
home base, because our folks built this. I say, we
built this joint for free, and then moreover because of
the lack of safety that Tiff has referenced and that
Andrew's reference. We wanted at home base for our folks
to come to every single week. And so when we
say Native Lampid, we also say welcome home, y'all.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
That was gonna ask with the podcast, are you doing
the podcast live every week or is it going to
be pre taped so you're going to be talking about
what's going on in the world, especially to shit because
it's election.
Speaker 3 (24:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (24:00):
Absolutely, And just really quickly, the other point that Angela
referenced when coming up with this name is an homage
to the indigenous community. Yes, here we recognize that this
land was stolen and taking America wasn't found that on
peace and prosperity, as the fairy tale would have you believe.
It was taken with blood and fury from the our
(24:20):
indigenous brothers and sisters. So we acknowledge them.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
And well, are you gonna have guests as well?
Speaker 4 (24:25):
No, this is a talk based show. As you can see,
we can definitely hold our own. The hour will go
by very very fast.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Just want to come on the show.
Speaker 7 (24:35):
I think right now we're no.
Speaker 4 (24:36):
I think that we may end up doing some specials,
but clearly we got a lot to get off our chests.
Speaker 8 (24:41):
And a lot to get off our chests, not just politically,
because I think we have to draw the distinction between
what you get with all the other corporate based, you know,
consumer based news. You heard us talk about our personal stories,
which I think we've back into a large societal set
(25:01):
of questions that we have to you know, have to
reckon with. I want to co sign that the support
that our guy from just regular black folks I didn't
even know, couldn't call their names, It was incredible so
social media also gives us the impression that we're the majority.
Tear you down when you know, overwhelmingly black folks and
(25:23):
lots of times without even knowing a detailed left or
right knows that something is amiss here and they're saying
you five dollars, you know, put some peppermints in your
jacket pocket when you pass. You know what, they would
do what they can to be there for you. And
so it's important that we start to trace some of
(25:44):
what has political implications back to our practices in society.
If we're tearing each other down, note that that's because
we are under a white hedgem and his system that
values you performing and showing up in society this way
every day, regardless of what you're doing the backframe when
everybody don't know, but this is how you're supposed to
show and when you step out of that blueprint and
(26:06):
something is a miss. Corporate America depends relies on reliability, predictability.
They need to know what you're going to do. That's
where their profit lies. And so we are a society
that in large part is the matrix we perform how
large interests expect us to and they spend billions trillions
(26:28):
making that the outcome.
Speaker 7 (26:30):
I like where Andrew was going with that too, And
Tiff has brought this.
Speaker 4 (26:33):
Up as well, that we we believe that politics are
everywhere like we're impacted by them, We are touched by them,
whether folks want to touch it or not, and so
we absolutely plan on making those connections for folks on
the pot.
Speaker 3 (26:45):
Well, would you say to people who will probably look
at you'all and say, well, this is just gonna be
another Democratic echo chamber.
Speaker 6 (26:51):
I don't know why.
Speaker 5 (26:52):
Yeah, I mean I vote Democrat most of the time,
but I am not a talking head for the party
at all. I think they make horrific decisions. I think
they summarily dismiss our community the same way a lot
of the cable news industry does. I think they fail
us at every point. I think this is part of
another narrative that some black folks have taken in and believed,
(27:15):
and that is, and a lot of white folks believe
it that black people are so loyal to the Democratic Party.
That is not true. Black folks are loyal to ourselves
and the world benefits from it. Society benefits from what
we do. I understand the person's perspective who says, you know,
you want me to participate in this system that has
(27:36):
incarcerated my brother, poisoned my mother, keeps my kids in
a dilapidated school, and you're telling me by my participation
in this system, I'm going to somehow fix it, when
for decades my life has not changed. I understand that perspective.
When we vote, we are not American enthusiasts trying to
uphold the white man's democracy. We are voting in favor
of harm reduction. That has nothing to do with loyalty
(27:58):
to a party. We are loyal to our people, and
by our people, I mean us as black folks, but
also the rising majority of this country, the Asian American,
Pacific Islander community, the Indigenous community, the Latino community, because
this country hasn't been very polite or kind to any
of those communities, and so we're trying to be here
to advance a cause for the greater good, not for
any political party.
Speaker 3 (28:18):
Would any of y'all have a vote for a conservative
like that that wasn't a Trump Conservative?
Speaker 5 (28:24):
Conservative policies I think have been overwhelmingly harmful to black folks,
So I would I don't know. I don't know necessarily
get so caught up in time show democratic That's what
I was about to say, Like, there are conservative democrats,
So I think anybody who falls under the conservative umbrella
those policies are contrary to my survival into the health
of my community.
Speaker 4 (28:43):
So I don't think so, I think, And you know,
we talked about lazy journalism earlier, and this is no
insult to you, my dear brother, but I think that
what we often do is say we want to break
out of boxes, and then we try to find a
way to put people right back in those boxes.
Speaker 7 (28:57):
I think here on this show, what we're going to.
Speaker 4 (28:59):
Really try to do is break out of those constraints
and really talk about what it looks like to have
a black agenda. Thank god for Alicia Garza doing working
on the Black Census project that now gives us permission
to imagine what a world could look like that we
could live in and thrive in. I think the other
thing that's really important is I don't really want to
construct another Republican frankistigin. They tried that experiment and failed,
(29:22):
at least it failed us as Donald Trump right, Like,
I don't want to build the ideal conservative.
Speaker 7 (29:27):
For me, I don't know who that is.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
I thinkitician, but that's what I'm saying. I to Tip's
point about harm reduction. So for me, I'm progressive. I
don't see myself in the White House. I don't see
myself for the most part, in Congress. There are several
Congressional Black Caucus members who I think don't get the
attention and the respect they deserve because they represent my
best interests. I wish some of them would run for
(29:50):
higher office, and some of them haven't and couldn't get
there is.
Speaker 8 (29:54):
Some of their I appreciate the point around best interests
because the truth is is that most these things benefit everybody.
I mean, it's put one of heather the most. When
we say people are out there advocating, legislating on our behalf,
it's largely to close a gap that should never have
existed in the first place, that exist in public policy society,
(30:16):
and it plays out every single day again on this
hamster wheel that we're bridging that but the benefit of
that idea, that policy, you can't tell me getting that
extra However, many hundreds of dollars per child during COVID
for childcare didn't mean something to white folks, black folks,
brown folks, and everything in between. The problem is is
(30:37):
that we've got folks who are putting lots of money
into making sure that all we know are our differences.
Speaker 1 (30:44):
Right.
Speaker 8 (30:45):
You can't tell me my state is uber Republican when
we had a race in eighteen that came down too
point four percent difference. Now I am nowhere near a
conservative title. Joe Biden is much more that than I.
Him and Ye had a five or six point difference
in the less democratic nominee you know, love them, but
(31:05):
a twenty point gap, and so did thou Demings. Right,
So what the hell are white people prepared to hear
from us? And in what way do they need to
hear it that doesn't betray our agenda, it furthers it,
but allows them to see themselves in the process, because
I think that's what we had to do to close
that divide. And unfortunately, black voters are the most sophisticated
(31:26):
voters that exist, period, And we are going to exclamation
mark that point on the program. Well, well, let's use
Obama as an example. We thought he spoke well, We
thought that he was well groomed and well prepared and
everybody was in love with Michelle Obama.
Speaker 3 (31:42):
But we we didn't be well spoken and we roomed.
Speaker 8 (31:47):
I'm putting it in a in a frame that I
think most people recognize our societal attributes. When you're considering
somebody to be president of the United States, he couldn't
be no black brother, brown brother like me or Warnock
from the South.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
Uh voted for.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Voter because him down that was sophisticated as voted in.
Speaker 8 (32:04):
But I will tell you, am you you our age range.
We carried him when our grandparents and parents didn't believe. Now,
when black folks saw that white folks in Iowa and
New Hampshire were willing to go there for him, then
it changed our perception of what was possible. But black folks, unfortunately,
but it is created in us a gift, have always
(32:27):
had to consider how white people will vote when considering
whether we could get behind that candidate put money there
organized for that person, because if it can't, if it
ain't real. As pragmatic people, we're not going there. By
and large, we supports you, hallelujah, Da da da, but
society by large isn't supporting you. So when we saw that,
(32:48):
did we rally or did we rally? There was no
turning back. After New Hampshire and then South Carolina, there
was no it changed. The winds in South Carolina was
different a.
Speaker 3 (32:57):
Week before in South Carolina. So I'm saying it was
a lot of He won a lot of cultural wars.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
My cultural wars I think framed a whole long time.
Speaker 6 (33:07):
Black folks were solidly in the Clinton camp. If you remember.
Speaker 3 (33:11):
Talking about inside political people, I'm talking about people just
don't talking.
Speaker 8 (33:15):
About and my mother who were committed to voting for
Hillary clon first time I ever voted with Brock a
ball period, and millions of others.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
That's what I'm trying to tell you. That President Obama
energized the whole group of people who never even considered.
Speaker 4 (33:29):
That's literally what I think Andrew's point was there was
young people first who carried him and made it feel
like that was even possible. Older black folks were like this,
and it wasn't not just political folk.
Speaker 8 (33:40):
And it wasn't because they were hating. They for us,
but they were scared.
Speaker 3 (33:47):
To make it.
Speaker 8 (33:47):
To your point of sophisticated, why are we because we
consider the performance of everyone else, bake get into the
formula before we go in and make decisions about ourselves.
That the privilege that we're going to talk about liberation,
because liberation is that I get to decide regardless of
how it impacts. I am going in here and I've
got a frame, and my freedom requires that I vote
(34:09):
for this thing that's going to lead to more of that.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Take it from your podcast, all the stuff you.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
Don't notice.
Speaker 3 (34:18):
But lost the share aspect too, because there was a
lot of people who would say, no, I don't want
Obama to run because he'll get killed. I remember when
he won the election, people thought he was going to
get on stage. I remember when they had the parade
after he got sworn in and he got off the car.
Speaker 1 (34:33):
People was like, no, no, yeah, I was one of them.
Speaker 7 (34:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (34:37):
Why because we have lived alongside these homicidal maniacs for
four hundred plus years, and we have seen firsthand what
white violence can do in this country. And I think
Andrew's point was we are sophisticated because we don't have
the privilege to say to cherry pick values and political
standpoints and say until I find this specific person, I'm
going to reserve my vote. I hear so many whit
(35:00):
women with that attitude. A lot of the Bernie folks
I think had that attitude where it's like this this
specific set.
Speaker 6 (35:07):
Of things I'm waiting for, and if I don't.
Speaker 5 (35:09):
I have the privilege to sit it out. I have
the privilege to criticize. I have the privilege to cross
a political divide and vote Republican.
Speaker 6 (35:16):
We don't have that. We don't have that, we have
to sophisticated.
Speaker 3 (35:20):
I don't feel we're sophisticated because we know where our
vote is going.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
Everybody knows.
Speaker 5 (35:26):
I don't think that's true because you know why, Because
black people they're just like everybody else, every other constituency.
Speaker 6 (35:33):
Black folks have the option to abstain. I hope people
don't choose that.
Speaker 5 (35:37):
But the conversation, I think this is where the news
media gets it wrong as well. The conversation is not
there's a lot of focus on black voters when it
comes to how we fail when we don't show up.
So now the conversation is, oh, Biden, in all his
trouble with black voters, no talk about white folks who
are actively supporting and excited to support an insurrection as president.
(35:59):
Talk about white folks who are happy to celebrate a
man who is has unteemed indictments, and three baby mamas
talk about white folks excitement about somebody who put over
two hundred white conservative judges to lifetime appointments who were
completely ineps in law. Some of these people have never
been judges before. Those are the folks who are a
danger to democracy, not black folks. After being frustrated in
(36:23):
this process for so long, and I don't.
Speaker 4 (36:24):
Hear us being called dangerous, I do hear the point
about sophistication, and I think it goes back to pigeonholing
us into believing that we are not capable of having
a nuanced conversation.
Speaker 7 (36:37):
Right, I think that we.
Speaker 3 (36:38):
Don't have a nuanced vote.
Speaker 8 (36:40):
We have a nuanced vote every time we vote, but
black people are doing, are deciding, and and.
Speaker 7 (36:45):
I'll stop because I need we can say.
Speaker 8 (36:49):
That simply because the majority of a vote goes one
way that is in lockstep. Couldn't it be that we
liked the some of those checks too, and we knew
that the other party is against them. And so even
though I can't get everything I want, this gets me
marginally closer to the things that meet my knee.
Speaker 7 (37:05):
And that's not my point.
Speaker 4 (37:07):
I support that, but I think what I'm saying is
it is unfortunate. When you go to the ballot box,
you are literally in a box, right, You have to
make a decision. There's no nuance between checking between this
person and that person. It doesn't mean that the road
you traveled to get there was not difficult, was not excruciating.
The things that I'm hearing my dad say about what
(37:28):
is going to mean for him to vote for Joe
Biden this time? It's hard, you know, Like there are
people who I love dearly who have said not and
they didn't say this in twenty twenty, but like this
one is going.
Speaker 7 (37:41):
To be tough because I don't feel represented.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Why, like why would I get out and vote and
not sit on the couch? Right, That's what a lot
of people are saying. Why would I go vote for bid?
Speaker 4 (37:51):
Or they're saying I haven't heard why wouldn't I sit
on the couch? I have heard I wish somebody else
was running.
Speaker 7 (37:56):
I have heard that. I've heard it a lot more.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
It is scaring me, right, And what I hope comes
out of this not just for us for the conversations,
We'll have a native lamppod. But I hope what comes
out of this is a push from the administration to
do some things, to meet people where they are, meet
them in their sacrifice.
Speaker 7 (38:12):
People showed up through a.
Speaker 4 (38:14):
Pandemic for this administration, show up for these folks. You
know it's I'm tired of having the conversation about the
Democratic Party takes black voters for granted.
Speaker 7 (38:22):
We know what are you going to do about it?
Chairman Jamie Harrison. I know you. I know that you
know the sacrifice.
Speaker 4 (38:29):
I know what you're up against with all those white
consultants that ain't moved over there.
Speaker 7 (38:32):
We got your back, so have hours. Right.
Speaker 4 (38:35):
I think that it's time for us to really have
that conversation more publicly. We've had it quietly because a
lot of our friends work in there. We want to
give our we want to embolden our friends, empower our friends.
But now we're at a point where our family members,
our friends are talking about this more publicly and they
deserve to be held to.
Speaker 3 (38:52):
Accuse you'll attack y'all when y'all speak out against the
President Biden. Well, look, I do date this for some
real plantation. Don't you talk about mathilistic?
Speaker 7 (39:04):
But Leonardi might not just be plantation mentality. Some of
it is feared.
Speaker 3 (39:08):
I was so I watched him.
Speaker 8 (39:12):
I gotta check this time that there was legislature there.
Speaker 3 (39:16):
You can't be mad at people who feel like that
about Trump when you.
Speaker 7 (39:20):
Check.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
I thought he was not just the stimulus.
Speaker 8 (39:23):
I'm saying the agenda. If y'all, if you have kids
and you were paying for daycare and you saw that
that subsidy doubled on your taxes, that it went to
a three month every three month dispersement. Things have happened
as a result of this man being in office that
has improved.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Our quality of life.
Speaker 3 (39:45):
How do you message what?
Speaker 8 (39:46):
What?
Speaker 1 (39:46):
Well?
Speaker 8 (39:47):
You got to remind people and they have to stay
in the fight for it. What happened mentioned and Cinema said,
we're not going back there, and that was all she wrote.
Two Democrats said was stepping back in the Senate and
that was all she wrote. But I will tell you
this much, if Biden, we're running off of his agenda.
And by the way, I firmly believe these things ought
to exist in society anyway, because we don't pay people
(40:09):
enough to deal with the hell we deal with to
catch our breath from day to day. We are Native Land.
Podcast is going to be transformational because I think it's
going to remind us of our power. And yes, elections
have names on the ballot of people we don't like,
think too old, might die, Da da dadada. But it
(40:30):
is unfortunately the system that we are operating within, and
until we can coerce that system to looking more like
the one that we believe we deserve. You don't walk
off the field. You stay on the field, because there
are consequences to walking.
Speaker 1 (40:46):
Off the field.
Speaker 8 (40:47):
Trump said, I know who's getting most impacted by this coronavirus,
and it's mostly older, sicker, and people of color. I
knew right then and that press conference that he didn't
care a lick about the coronavirus because the people who
were at the intersection of the greatest impact didn't look
like him here and care about and so on and
so forth. So we if we if we just check
(41:09):
out because we're not getting everything, at least tell me
you're checking out from Joe Biden, because on the other
side of the agenda, you're getting more than what you're
getting on this side. Not one promise, not almost send
a check to your business. But I am going to
produce public policy that leads to your greater freedom, your
ability to move the way you want to move, because
(41:31):
those rights are inalienable.
Speaker 5 (41:33):
But to switch over, I may have an unpopular take here,
so I may lose my a man corner. But there
is a saying in politics that you can never blame
the voter. I am gonna blame the voter a little
bit because I feel like society at large is so
caught up again in bulshit, and so there are many
things that the Biden administration has done that people benefit from.
I think one, there's a lack of understanding and civics
(41:55):
in this country across every socioeconomic status, across every racial divide.
People don't underst the difference between state, federal, and local government,
and so sometimes people ascribe blame where there should be
none to the federal government too. We have to take
responsibility as citizens of this country. It is our job
to know when elections are happening, what's on the ballot,
(42:16):
who's on the ballot, why these things matter. So maybe
just maybe instead of scrolling through Instagram looking at nonsense
for three fucking hours, maybe pick up a paper or
maybe Google, maybe say what has Biden done for Black America.
That's a question you have asked that. That's a fair
question you should be asking it. I encourage that kind
of curiosity.
Speaker 6 (42:35):
Ask it. Maybe you will be surprised.
Speaker 5 (42:38):
You can call up your member of Congress and say, hey,
I got fifty friends at my house and we want
to hear what you're doing for us. That member of
Congress just might show up. Maybe show up to the
school board meeting where your kids are in school, where
they're taking their rewriting history. They're banning books in this
country right now. Maybe participate in that. At the bare minimum,
you can read something. At most, you can go up
(42:59):
and show and show up someplace and ask a question.
You can host something, you can be a voice. You
can write a check to a candidate, you can run
for office. But these things do require some participation from us,
not us sitting around whining about, well, I don't know
what he did. When you have this in your hand
every five minutes and it's full of information, you can
find a reliable source from the White House website itself,
(43:21):
to newspapers, et cetera, and be informed.
Speaker 3 (43:24):
I agree with you. I just think we're intellectually dishonest
about a lot of this stuff based on what party
we like, because we'll say things like, oh, people don't
know civics. But then if you mentioned Barack Obama, you'll
say Obama gave you health care, right, But if you
say Trump gave Stimie, you're like, no, Trump didn't give
the Stimmies, Congress voting for it them. You say Trump
did the FIRS step back. Trump didn't do the first
step back. Congress did for it. See a little intellectually dishonest.
Everybody is based on what party.
Speaker 1 (43:45):
I think that's what you deal on all sides. Yeah, right,
absolutely right, As.
Speaker 3 (43:49):
You said, google what Biden did? So you want to
you whatever he did pass Trump did?
Speaker 7 (43:55):
She was saying to the question, because people did does
come up?
Speaker 4 (43:58):
I mean even in some of the questions in the
commons where I was like, what do you guys want
us to address on the podcast, one of them was
what did Biden do for black people versus the g
O P now, because he can't make a speech from yesterday, no,
that from the Trouston speech, because he had whole lists
of stuff in the pulpit and Mother Emmanuel of what
he believes he did for like on the.
Speaker 3 (44:19):
Things he didn't get done, the first thing we'll say
is was because Congress wouldn't allow him to he had
gotten them done, y'all, Like, look what Biden did. That's
why I said, it's a little be.
Speaker 7 (44:29):
Careful about y'all.
Speaker 4 (44:30):
Right, we have this fight all the time, even on
our phone calls, like I don't like to be y'all
to me, like, shut up, that's true what y'all were
on and we on the fourth y'all.
Speaker 7 (44:43):
That's definitely where I'm at. But I guess the point
is say again, yeah, that's what she said.
Speaker 4 (44:53):
But no, I think at the end of the day,
it is true that we will assign blame to people
that some times don't deserve it when there is a
whole process to tips point on civics, and we will
reward someone who we need them to win, you know.
And I think that again, going back to the reason
we're here today, Native Lampod every Thursday, we're gonna be
honest about processes. We want our folks to be smarter.
(45:15):
We want folks to hold us to account. We say
something wrong, tell us we want to get it right,
and it's not to be right. It's because we want
to be better, we want to be free, We want
to walk in.
Speaker 7 (45:24):
Our true liberation.
Speaker 4 (45:25):
If we can get our folks one step closer to that,
that's what we want to do.
Speaker 8 (45:28):
Everything as long as we give them a shout out
right now, because black people, ever since we've been able
to participate in elections and before, have been holding this
country and pushing this country closer to its true vision
of an American dream and it's principles upon which it's built,
enshrined in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution and
(45:52):
reiterated throughout. It's been black voters who have consistently showed
up to hold America to the fire of the promise
that we weren't even designed in from its beginning. The
words were there, the actions weren't, and black folks would
be the reinforces and the accountability agents to make the
words mean.
Speaker 3 (46:12):
Something that's right. Native Lamp Podcast. It starts January Thursday,
and I think it's very important to note that this
is the first flagship podcast from Reason Choice Media, which
is a political podcast network with with With iHeart that
angela Ria is the founder of.
Speaker 7 (46:29):
With You and Chris Mile and it is my honor, yes.
Speaker 3 (46:33):
So it'll be a lot more shows coming down the pipeline,
but we appreciate you guys for joining us.
Speaker 1 (46:39):
Thank you so much, Andrew Gillam.
Speaker 3 (46:41):
Subscribe the Native Lamp podcast right now.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
That's episoday. Wake that ass up in the morning. The
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