March 31, 2025 • 127 mins
Just Jay & Jim Version. It’s finally here! Our audio commentary for Superman II: The Original Theatrical Lester Cut (127 minutes).Put Superman II on and listen along with Jay Towers & Jim Bowers for the special "Just Jay & Jim Version." This edition is designed specifically for fans watching Superman II while listening to our commentary. To ensure the commentary aligns perfectly with your viewing experience, we recommend starting the audio right after the Warner Bros. logo piece ends. When you see the deep space star field appear immediately after the logo fades out, press play on your headphones or smart device.If you prefer to enjoy the commentary without watching the film, please download the "In Your Car Version," created especially for listening during car rides, walks, or whenever you don't have Superman II on a screen. If a commercial plays before our commentary, you will need to pause your audio after the commercial and then start it at the right spot.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hi, everybody. It's Shay Towers with Jim Bowers and welcome
to the Superman two. I guess what do we call this?
Jim AA watch along.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Absolutely, I'll watch it.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
This is exciting.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Jay, We've been waiting for this. I think we haven't
done one of these in a while, and we're starting
with the Lester cut of Superman two. So Jim, take
us back to the year here as we watch these
as this opening scene here.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Well, a very interesting marketing campaign was done for this film.
Reverse marketing campaign was done to open the film across
the world during each country's respective peak summer season, so
this film actually opened first in December nineteen eighty whereas
(00:51):
the US did not see it in theaters until July nineteenth,
nineteen eighty one. And our good friend Sarah Douglas was
the world representative for this film, so she toured all
over the world to promote this movie.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
This scene not in Superman the movie, although it's meant
to be a recap, this basically shows us what the
scene would look like minus Marlon Brando.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Right right now.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
In the original script, the nineteen seventy nine script, Zod
actually walks to all of those little pedestals. Oh, each
pedestal is for an elder. He chooses jor El's Wow
breaks the crystal, and then the script says that a
bunch of the other Kryptonian guards surround them, and then
(01:38):
the rings come down as we see here.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Wow, what a great scene that would have been to see.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Right now, we're in Donner footage, right whereas the film
started with Lester footage. Obviously, this is not Marlon Brando.
This is a voice stand in or a voice actor
doing his some of his lines, as well as some
(02:02):
of the other elders' lines.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
So was this supposed to be what we're listening here?
Was this supposed to be Jirell? No, there sposed to be
the elders talking, right elders.
Speaker 3 (02:25):
So we're still on Donner footage. The really unique thing
about this film, Jay As we get an amazing recap
of the first film, So even if you didn't go
see the first movie, you've got a great idea of
what's going on. You're all caught up, ready to go.
What I love about this film is it starts off
with a bank right into the action.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Right into the action.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
This is Lester voiceover, and here we go.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
I mean, here we go with the opening credits, which
is a different look from the original film.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
Different look.
Speaker 3 (03:02):
These opening credits were done by a company called Camera
Effects Limited, and they also did some optical work for
the first film. They also did the amazing Alley transformation
that we're going to see after this recap.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Careful, tonight, use any Marlon Brando in this right, I
mean it's selective, you wouldn't even notice. But even this scene.
Speaker 3 (03:25):
Here, Marlin, of course had sued the producers for more money.
We know from an early step outline that they were
considering using Brando's footage with some Lara footage. Ultimately they
decided to cut Brando out altogether.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
Just this s is so fantastic.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Ken Thorne did a great job adapting some of John
Williams's themes.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
I think when people think of Superman too. Even if
you love the Donner cutting some of that extra footage,
this is the version we saw as kids, or you know,
whatever age you were when you saw this, But you
remember this recap so well. And even when the credits
come in, there's Aaron Smallinsk.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
That was our friend, Aaron on his tippy toes.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
Yeah, boom.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
I love these credits.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
There's our friend Sarah Douglas. There's those big barn.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Doors, beautiful Alberta, Canada.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
Jeff East There, Margo Jack, there's Valerie.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Here comes that crystal throw next. I know exactly what
it's about to happen.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
How many times have you seen this movie, Jake?
Speaker 1 (05:19):
The hundreds?
Speaker 2 (05:21):
So have I.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
Credits Clifton James.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
E. G.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Marshall, who also was in Christmas Vacation. There's Mark McClure.
That's right, great Terence Stamp. E. G.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
Marshall was in the film Absolute Power with Gene Hackman.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
I love this New York footage too.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
And we see this in the extended cut ABC of
Superman the movie when Superman first arrives to Metropolis.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Right down the Hudson There, here you go.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Now that is a swell scene.
Speaker 1 (06:04):
Jay love it. The great New York Daily News building.
That globe's still there, still a big tourist attraction.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
This moment always got a great laugh and every theatrical
screening I ever saw of the first film.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
Because you expect them to get into a phone with
it's not there, not.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
There, Wow, want to rescue mank What a great guy
he was.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
It must be interesting. It must have been interesting for
Mario Poosa to watch these films to see how much
of his script made it in.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
And you can read those scripts on Cape to wonder.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
How about a candy apple? That map would be an
amazing prop to own.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
There's the Hoover Dam. There's a filming location we visited, Jim,
we did the Alberta Badlands. It's just the greatest recap
of a film. You couldn't do a better job.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
You're pumped up before the new action even gets started.
The great Derek Meddings miniatures, which were very large, if
that makes any sense.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
That's a great scene. It's the wave.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
Our friend Dahlia.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Pierre Spangler, who I got to meet in New York
last year. Right, this is a great shot too, one
of the best, of course. Richard Lester, the Richard Lester
original cut here. Now we've got uh, that's Donner footage
(08:23):
from Donner footage, and then we cut right to Lester.
Notice the gentleman's outfit carrying the bicycle, same outfit they
wear on the roof in the first film. This hat
trick is amazing. Jay watch this. Yeah, it's unbelievable. You
(08:50):
have to wonder. I'd love to watch the take after
take of that.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
One of the interesting things about this set, Jay is
they used a lot of mirrors, so if you look carefully,
you'll actually see the reflection of people at the furthest
point on the right side.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Interesting.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
Watch the red super copy.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
The guys in red.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
I never noticed that that guy is walking back and
forth with the exercise machine. Right.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
Look how much older Mark looks.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
That's why they call him terrorists. It's a great line.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
Now watch the copy boy back here. Okay, you think
you're seeing two copy boys and there's only one because
it's his reflection in the mirror.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Yeah, look at that.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
Now you're gonna see Chris on the far right side
in the mirror as he runs away.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Watch the far right side.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
Yeah, wow, never noticed that before.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
Extends the set without having to build a big set.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
This scene here is not in New York City because
is the back lot of Pinewood. That's right, here's a
Sally transformation.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Is that my favorite scene in the movie? Perfect Donner
background plate?
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Hmmm.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
And here we are in Paris in the rain, and
this is Paris. This is Paris.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
So Margot went to Paris?
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Yes, she did, and they built part of the Eiffel
Tower at Pinewood. I love all of the film cameras,
(12:00):
always looking at photographers.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
A lot of extras for that scene too, it looked busy.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
No comprende.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
So this upcoming stair scene with her running upstairs, did
they recreate these stairs or this is all Paris? Do
we know? Well?
Speaker 2 (12:32):
I think it's both.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
At the point where it's has said, it's difficult to tell.
Now in the script this is probably real.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
This is real, of course, I don't think you could.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
And that may not even be Margo. That could be
someone else. Now that gentleman right there that you just
saw operating or controlling the bomb, that's Richard Griffiths, whose
uncle Vernon.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
Harry Potter, that's right.
Speaker 3 (13:03):
And they named these three guys in the script, Surge,
Luke and Claude miniature here right, So we're probably well,
we may still be in the actual Eiffel Tower Derek
Beddings miniature.
Speaker 5 (13:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
I always can identify the top of the Eiffel Tower
miniature because I have two of the satellite dishes. Ah
you do, that's right, A small piece of railing.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
Now Mark says, there's twenty hostages, and the script says twenty. Right,
but you'll see here there's only a handful. I don't
see twenty, No, just a couple of nuns and three
other people.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
And those are the same ones we saw earlier.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
Right.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
Ken Thorn's music is so great here, it's fantastic. Now
(14:30):
we're on a front projection studio set, so she's actually
stationary and they shake it and move it and Margo's
got to do all her good acting.
Speaker 1 (14:42):
Probably the same for this elevator scene right projected there.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
Right, there's a little mini Margo right there.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
Yeah, maybe we'll see that.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
At approp Shrock.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
So much detail they could zoom in on it that close.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
Yeah. The movie making is so good too. I mean
to be able to cut from miniatures to the actual
Rifele tower to the stuff that's on the set.
Speaker 3 (15:18):
Lots of research, lots of drawings.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Yeah, you're right.
Speaker 3 (15:54):
You'll see the French National Police Special Mobile Police Force
patches on their uniform.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
Yeah, and the biggest walkie talk he's ever.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Seen, gigantic.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
One of these gentlemen, you're going to recognize who actually
cuts the cable, all right, and that's Paul Weston stuntman
stunt quarter coordinator Paul Weston, who also plays Zod and
uh and uh none. I only get a shot of
a great zoptic shot here.
Speaker 1 (16:31):
It's taking him an awfully long time to get the Paris.
Speaker 3 (16:34):
By the way, I wonder if he's actually watching yeah
long range vision. I think he spots are right there.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
There you go.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
That's great, and that's great. You can see the Eiffel
Tower in the distance.
Speaker 3 (16:55):
Here comes Paul on the left.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
There there is man. I remember seeing this when I
was a kid. This scene was great, and.
Speaker 3 (17:12):
We know this actually replaces the some of the scenes
from the Donner.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
Here jumping out the right, here's one of my favorite scenes.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
John Victor Smith at a beautiful editing job on this.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
And it's right there. Oh that's great.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
And originally he just says, Lois, we've got to quit
meeting like this, and I thought that worked so much
better with the elevator comment.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Yeah, this is another great shot.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
All miniature work.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
Yeah, this right here, all of that yeah, blows through
the top.
Speaker 3 (18:11):
And now we're at a point where we believe that
the background plate is all from the Donner years, because
we see these plates when the x K one O
one rocket is in space in the Donner cut, So
this is all Leicester footage at this point. Then we
(18:31):
cut to a piece of Donner footage in the phantom zone.
Still lester, and now we've got a Donner piece of footage,
and as soon as it it's the waves, it's Leicester footage.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
An animation, all animation, right.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Love that mm hmm, that's traveling Matt bluescreen optical work.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
They are headed to the moon. Donner footage here right,
the fruit stand from the first movie.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
Daily News building.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Then we cut to Pinewood back lot.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Just like that.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
Now this gag with the cab, yeah, was written very
early on and intended originally for when Clark arrives in Metropolis,
crosses the street to go inside the Daily Planet for
his job interview for his job. And you can see
drawings of crashed cabs sitting on trailers in that collector's
(20:04):
album for Superman the movie.
Speaker 2 (20:05):
Wow. You notice here, Jay that she's got her own office.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
Now that's Tray. She's graduated from the desk just outside
of Perry's office. Clearly she liked the rollerskape.
Speaker 2 (20:21):
Do we ever see Clark if he has an office?
Speaker 1 (20:23):
I don't. I don't know, but I love those blue
cups on her desk, which I still to this day
order from New.
Speaker 3 (20:30):
York Mercie Superman. Notice the two promotional pictures on each
side of the office there of Superman.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
On the water framed black and white.
Speaker 2 (20:47):
M hm, why is.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
There a bad mitton birdie on her typewriter.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
They did a great job of decorating this at to
show kind of how chaotic she was.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Right, did you ever squeeze oranges at home?
Speaker 1 (21:14):
I always wanted to after this and smoke?
Speaker 3 (21:18):
No, make sure they're Marlborough.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
Marlboro appears in this movie about twenty two toughs.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
That's a good product placement. Here's that great acting by
(22:02):
Chris again, very Clark Kent.
Speaker 3 (22:11):
It flies newspaper. Notice how the sound when she hits his.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
Back sounds like a wall yep.
Speaker 3 (22:27):
Take a look at Lex Luthor's inmate number.
Speaker 2 (22:31):
On his uniform.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
Alrighty standing by for that.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
This is Donner footage.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
By the way, well, all the all the gene dialogue
on camera is Donna right right, shot nothing for Lester
right twelve forty six, twelve forty six.
Speaker 3 (23:00):
Now in Superman four, those four numbers are also used
six four one two. Wow, what what's the significance?
Speaker 2 (23:09):
I don't know. Do you have any Liberati records, Shay?
Speaker 1 (23:18):
I don't, and if I did, I'd scratch them the
ski And of course Lex Luthor has an ascot on well, yes,
(23:47):
in prison.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
I don't own any ascots.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Am I right that there's some great or a great
black and white photo of Gene in this outfit?
Speaker 2 (24:17):
Yes? Yes, and I'd love that as a prop.
Speaker 5 (24:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
So here's a part of the film Jay that is
very very interesting as far as who filmed what? Okay,
many people feel that the Moon was filmed entirely by Donner,
and we don't think that's true. This footage, for instance,
was shot by Lester, and I think the office in
the distance is actually a part of the Daily Planet set.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
Okay, So the Michigan control here.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
Michigan control is Yester footage with Donner shot Moon footage
on the screen right, Okay, so this is this is Donner.
I believe this piece of footage. The close up of
Nate is Lester. In the distant shot of the module,
(25:23):
there is no gold metallic square, but there is in
the close ups.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
So this dialogue shot by Lester, we think.
Speaker 3 (25:33):
I think it was written earlier and it may have
been filmed, but I think it was reshot or shot
differently by Lester. When you're looking out the window, it's Donner.
It is my belief, because you see Sarah going by,
et cetera. I don't think the villains came back for
Lester in this. In this scene, this is John Morton.
(26:05):
He was Luke Skywalker's gunner during the hof planet battle
in the Empire Strikes Back. All right, he's the guy
who's knocked out. Here we have stuntman Paul Weston again
again here with Sarah.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
Now you see his logo right there.
Speaker 3 (26:37):
Yeah, that's the Society of International Space Exploration and it's
actually upside down on the John Morton scenes in the module.
Oh so continuity was messed up there.
Speaker 1 (26:49):
Sure this is a great shot too. The takeoff and landing.
Speaker 3 (27:07):
Coming up is John Jim Dodall stuntman.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
That's a familiar costume to me.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
He's in the Spyo Love Me OCTOPUSY, many great films
we love. Of course he's Russian here and the translation
we think is who are you identify yourself.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Here? Hm hmm. It's a loud thud for space. It
is cut that oxygen supply off and rolls od fashion.
(28:01):
And here's Non driving.
Speaker 3 (28:07):
He's in a panic.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
These scenes always freaked me out as a kid. I mean,
Non was scary.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
You don't know what he's thinking. No, here's a familiar
face from Superman the movie, John Ratzenberger. Yes, function negative sir,
from the first film.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
And would go on to be Cliff Clay even on cheers.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
That's right. The great Shane Rimmer on the right, who
we see in Superman three. We do.
Speaker 3 (29:29):
Her eyes are so great in that shot. One of
(29:54):
the clues when you look at Terrence Stamp that it's
Donner versus Lester is the Donna footage. His hair is
less gray and kind of curly around his ears, and
it's shorter a piece of Donner footage.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Here New York.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Now we're on the actual prison set at Pinewood outside.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
This is a big set, by the way.
Speaker 3 (30:19):
Yes, here's Angus McGinnis, the warden. He doesn't look like
a warden to me. He looks like a prison guard,
but he's credited as a warden. He was in Star
Wars Rogue one witness. Great actor from Canada.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
I was like looking at what's on the shelves in there,
and it's funny that they have a tray with a
cocktail shaker.
Speaker 3 (31:09):
There's a little red Russian black and white TV sitting
at the table too. Outtakes from this would have been
great to see.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Yeah, I'm sure they exist.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
They're reading comic books in that shack. Otis has a
real issue with ladders. Every time he gets around a
ladder with les, he gets his foot Lex's foot on
(31:46):
his hand the second time.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Second time, Otis's advanced weight.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
I's thinking it's.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
Causing the balloon to come down and alert the guards.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
That's the last we see of Otis.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
That's it. I love that he waves goodbye.
Speaker 3 (33:02):
Here's the location we've been to Jay, we have with
Hadley Kay.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Himself, Niagara Falls. We know all the Niagara Falls shots
are Leicester, right.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
All of them are Leicester. Shot in September of seventy nine.
Some of the first footage Leicester shots the film started.
He started filming in August of seventy nine.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
Should mentioned if you try to line this stuff up,
that hotel and all, it looks a lot different, absolutely,
a lot of new structures around that area.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
There The bellboy is Shakespearean actor Anthony Sheer, who's from
Stratford upon Avon, Sarah douglas hometown.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
Yeah, doing his American accent.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
They like pink very much. Yeah, great timing.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
Yeah, yeah, it's the highest ceilings any hotel room has
(34:55):
ever had. Do we know when this was filmed?
Speaker 2 (35:22):
Off the top of my head?
Speaker 1 (35:23):
No, but Blakely Pinewood? Right, Oh you said where when
and where?
Speaker 2 (35:31):
Well, this was definitely Pinewood.
Speaker 3 (35:32):
Yeah, I'll have to review my script and my notes.
(36:19):
M This was originally intended to be night time to
the Donner cut, you see it at night the Laster
cut day, but it was originally written to be a
night shot.
Speaker 1 (36:41):
I wonder why they change other than just to be different.
I don't know. There's our friend Hadley k.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
And our Derby Shire friend, the Derby Shires.
Speaker 1 (37:21):
There they are.
Speaker 3 (37:24):
There's a little one ten pocket camera there on the right.
Speaker 1 (37:37):
One of my favorite things about this whole scene is
watching extras and watching them pop up in different spots.
Speaker 3 (37:48):
That polaroid camera was the Polaroid one step, a real
popular camera in the seventies, first one with the little
rainbows stripes. In the seventy nine script Jay, he almost
(38:13):
falls and an arm reaches out and grabs him, and
it's Clark's arms, so he actually saves him as Clark
and Superman in the script.
Speaker 1 (38:21):
Yeah, they would have had to revoice this entire scene,
Am I right? I mean we were at Niagara Falls.
It's really loud, really loud. I mean it's the falls
down pretty quiet in these uh, in these scenes.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
A lot of adr.
Speaker 3 (38:38):
Yes, I'm kind of in the mood for a super
duper hot dog. You Yeah, hot dogs are in every
(39:04):
single Christopher Eve Superman movie.
Speaker 5 (39:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (39:12):
Hattlee Kay joined us in Detroit for a signing at
a MotorCity Comic Con and wore a red and white
striped shirt.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
And he met us here and explained how he did
this stunt. That's right, got that rainbow.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
There's actually a small landing right beyond that railing. And
(39:52):
Hattie told us that that catch happened in Pinewood, right right.
Speaker 3 (39:59):
He had to film I'm on wires here with Chris
and then he went to Pinewood and flew right noticed
the little grease shirt on your blonde kid. There Canadian
(40:29):
flag flying there. You know you're on the Canadian side, right.
Speaker 1 (40:51):
We have grape behind the scenes photos of all of
this on Cape wonder dot com.
Speaker 2 (41:06):
This is my favorite shirt, this guy right here.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
Yeah, but the turtleneck, blue turtleneck stripes.
Speaker 3 (41:20):
Nobody did golly like Chris.
Speaker 1 (41:22):
Right, No orange juice. My brother texts me that to
this day at least three times a week. No orange juice. Here.
Speaker 3 (41:35):
We've got some Donner footage from the first film. All right,
different piece of footage, but from the same shot.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
So is this Donner footage?
Speaker 3 (41:46):
Well, that's a good question.
Speaker 2 (41:47):
Some people feel that it.
Speaker 1 (41:48):
Is because we know that's not Jeane, right, that's.
Speaker 3 (41:51):
Not Jean's a voice actor. We do know they went
up to Norway and did some filming, and of course
the glacier up above of the Canadian Rockies.
Speaker 1 (42:02):
But here we are back at the here we.
Speaker 3 (42:04):
Bought, are back in the fortress exterior, and now we
go to the Fortress interior again, all shot by Donner.
So whenever you see Valerie and Jane, it's Donner.
Speaker 1 (42:16):
And this is the same fortress that Chris takes that
first flight from Chris that we're here.
Speaker 2 (42:22):
And when Jeffies first arrives and talks.
Speaker 1 (42:24):
With his all this for this, this version of the Fortress.
Speaker 3 (42:27):
Yes, right, this was shot at Shepperton, whereas the fortress
interior we see during the Leicester filming was shot at Pinewood.
Speaker 2 (42:36):
It was rebuilt.
Speaker 3 (42:49):
Now what we're about to see is Donner footage of
Gene and Valerie looking at Lester footage of Laura and
John Hollis one of the other elders coming up from
a crystal shard or collection of chards. But what Jean
(43:12):
and Valerie are actually looking at were supposed to be
looking at, is Marlon Brando as Joerel. And you see
that in the Donner cut. So we've got some optical
work to put both of those Lester Donner pieces together.
Speaker 1 (43:31):
We did a podcast about some of the things Lester
had to do when he took over this and how
to rework these script moments.
Speaker 3 (43:45):
This is John Hollis. He was an elder in the
first film. Here we have Susannah York who did come
(44:22):
back during the Laster Years. Can I remember Trees by
(44:47):
Joyce Kilmer. Yeah, that's Val Kilmer's.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
Cousin who was killed in World War One.
Speaker 1 (44:54):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (44:55):
Val Kilmer was Batman in the third Batman movie. The
script in the Lester Years. It also includes another elder
who we do not see in this cut, and he
speaks some of the Jorell dialogue.
Speaker 1 (45:22):
So everything Gene is reacting to here would have been Brando.
Speaker 3 (45:27):
Right, he would have been directed to be responding to Brando.
What I believe you're seeing here is a background plate
of Donner shot Fortress with Lester foreground crystal cluster optically added. Again,
(45:54):
some fans feel this is Donner footage, others feel it's
Lester footage.
Speaker 2 (45:58):
Reshot.
Speaker 3 (45:59):
We know Donner took a crew or a second unit
crew up there and filmed. Whether it was used or not,
we don't know for sure. I always thought it was
Donner footage. Right now, we've been here. This is back
in Niagara Falls.
Speaker 1 (46:13):
These small boats aren't at this location anymore. They're in
a museum, right.
Speaker 3 (46:17):
But this looks almost the same.
Speaker 1 (46:19):
Right, the landing area here. This this what we call
it a deck or porch here, right. It's very loud,
and the rocks in the background are all still exactly
the same.
Speaker 3 (46:54):
They built a water tank at Pinewood, Yes, took out
board motors to churn up the water her and had
Margo get in it. For many of these scenes. We
see that in the making of Superman.
Speaker 1 (47:08):
Give Superran to the ABC special. We saw the stunt doubles.
(47:29):
We walked down that boardwalk. Looks the same, looks exactly
the same.
Speaker 3 (47:33):
This is the first instance of Clark or Superman.
Speaker 1 (47:38):
That's a dummy, right. And then there's Margo.
Speaker 3 (47:41):
This is the first time we see heat vision.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 3 (47:46):
In one of the scripts, he actually uses super breath
to blow the branch towards her once it.
Speaker 2 (47:53):
Falls on the water.
Speaker 1 (47:55):
Great over the shoulder shot there.
Speaker 3 (48:02):
Now, some fans have asked, how could he use his
heat vision and not shatter his glasses, And this is
the answer. Some fans have come up with that the
glass and his glasses are from the ship, is from
his starship.
Speaker 1 (48:17):
Well, that's how it was in the comic books, right.
Speaker 3 (48:22):
Lois and Clark, he always lowered his glasses.
Speaker 1 (48:24):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (48:36):
This was a really fantastic trip for us. Jay and
I encourage everybody to go here and visit.
Speaker 1 (48:46):
And this rock formation here that they this kind of
little area that they swim into, still exactly the same.
It looks a little different if you try to photograph
it because of the cameras they used. Right. We often
talk about that how you can can't match it up
with your iPhone camera. No, but those rocks are exactly
that way.
Speaker 3 (49:15):
Well, your iPhone camera usually defaults to a very wide
angle lens, which expands and pushes everything away. There's that
finger push. Here's a very interesting scene. Pay close attention
(49:37):
to Jack o'holler and to none when he lands. He
has no platforms on his boots, and I think they've
had him wear boots that were lighter weight for flying scenes.
Speaker 1 (49:52):
So you really see the red in these costumes.
Speaker 3 (50:02):
Here first time I remember seeing red. Here's Gordon Rawlings.
He's actually in the third movie. He falls in the
hole in the street when the penguin that's running around.
Speaker 1 (50:18):
This is back lot Pinewood.
Speaker 3 (50:20):
Right, this is Black Lake Park and you see Supergirl
fly out of this lake and you see Superman freeze
this lake in Superman three. It's just down the street
from Pinewood.
Speaker 6 (50:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (50:33):
Now, watch, no platforms on Jack's boots, so I think
he's wearing his flying boots. But in the next shot
he'll have his platforms.
Speaker 1 (50:41):
On because he's almost the same height.
Speaker 3 (50:43):
As right, Terrence, there's his platforms. Yeah, probably shot on
a different day or maybe later in the day all
(51:13):
Leicester shot. There's some product placement there with the polaroid
(51:40):
in the background.
Speaker 1 (52:02):
What the Leicester cut didn't give us was the setup
on why they did this story, right, that's right, why
they were posing as newlywits. Well you got some of
that dialogue from Margo earlier.
Speaker 3 (52:34):
This is one of my favorite scenes with Christopher Eve
in this film.
Speaker 7 (52:45):
Just defeated.
Speaker 3 (52:59):
Once again and he stands up straight and ticks off
his glasses. You notice he's wearing a ring.
Speaker 1 (53:30):
Well, they're opposing a zulize, right, Yeah, get to wonder
(54:34):
she's thinking, are we going to a small apartment in Metropolis.
Speaker 3 (54:47):
This piece of footage was actually the background plate used
for when Superman flies around the hill and spots Lois's car.
Speaker 2 (54:58):
Oh crack, yeah, Superman in.
Speaker 1 (55:00):
The movie much at a much faster speed.
Speaker 3 (55:03):
At a much faster speed, right, that's.
Speaker 1 (55:04):
Probably that was probably the normal speed there.
Speaker 3 (55:06):
Here we are in England. M Clifton James on the
(55:29):
left plays almost the same character in Levin led Die
many years earlier. Peter Whitman on the right, Dwayne. We
see him standing at the ATM when all the money
starts spitting out.
Speaker 1 (55:48):
It's funny they reuse these. It's a great scene. These
three have signed so many photographs of that post.
Speaker 2 (56:14):
They're driving.
Speaker 3 (56:16):
A very similar car to what Loess drives the red
car in the first film, the old Ford Ltd. Sedan,
(56:45):
So it not only heats things up, it levitates things apparently,
(57:22):
just check the tire. East Houston, Idaho.
Speaker 1 (57:44):
Childlike got some beautiful.
Speaker 3 (57:47):
Flying shots in this movie. They shot VistaVision, which is
a larger frame of film to enable you to have
these very very beautiful backgrounds and allow the actors to
be further away from the camera. Fortress background and miniatures.
(58:15):
There miniature flying right with a beautiful entry into the fortress.
And now we're inside Richard Lester's Pinewood built fortress.
Speaker 1 (58:26):
Smaller looks like right right, that's a Donner shot.
Speaker 3 (58:36):
Yeah, the crystal control console appears to be lower in that.
Speaker 1 (58:54):
Yeah, not as grand looking.
Speaker 3 (58:59):
Marcus, the Miko Child actor, he went on to be
in full metal jacket.
Speaker 1 (59:09):
There's non testing out his heat visions to his skills.
Speaker 2 (59:11):
Notice the bee.
Speaker 3 (59:12):
Yeah, have a good day, have a good breakfast. Those
signs are even outside.
Speaker 1 (59:30):
I love that wallpaper.
Speaker 2 (59:33):
Lots of product in this shot.
Speaker 1 (59:35):
Mm hm to coca Cola Fanta.
Speaker 3 (59:37):
Wriggly's Is that Wriggly's gun? Watch what Zod is doing?
He picks up a dirty plate and stares at it.
Speaker 1 (59:46):
That's funny. Yeah, you never really focus on him. You're
always looking at Sarah here corse shirt.
Speaker 3 (01:00:35):
Now, this stunt was shot on a set where he's
actually falling, so the camera was mounted side of falling
into the floor.
Speaker 1 (01:01:02):
Wasn't there something to the trailer we just saw in
the background. Wasn't that someone's I thought that was someone's
We heard was someone's trailer.
Speaker 3 (01:01:11):
This stuntman's name is jack Cooper. They credit him in
the movie as Jackie Cooper. Interesting, he's also credited as Dino,
but the guys call him Jody here and he's Willie's dad.
(01:01:36):
See how lo this this control calls on it. It
looks bigger than the one in the In the Donner Years.
Speaker 1 (01:01:43):
The green crystal looks so small.
Speaker 2 (01:01:51):
It does, doesn't it? Now?
Speaker 3 (01:02:30):
In the seventy nine script, we actually see him go
from place to place to get his flowers, his champagne.
And what they did here is they took a crew
with Chris to Saint Lucia and the Caribbean and actually
filmed there.
Speaker 1 (01:02:50):
So this is Saint Lucia.
Speaker 3 (01:02:51):
This is Saint Lucia, and they've named the falls there
Superman Falls.
Speaker 2 (01:02:55):
You can go see it today.
Speaker 3 (01:02:58):
But in the script you see him go around and
pick up the different items at different places, and he's
so love struck while he's out that he straightens the
leaning tower of Pisa and upsets the vendor selling Chachkes.
So that idea for the Pisa scene we see in
three actually was first written in seventy seven by Mankowitz.
Speaker 2 (01:03:23):
Then you come to this scene.
Speaker 3 (01:03:35):
Here's Richard Leparmitier. He's famous for Darth Vader choking him
in Star Wars. Yes, he later married Sarah Douglas.
Speaker 1 (01:03:45):
That's right. We saw them together on Lifestyles of the
Rich and the Family.
Speaker 8 (01:03:49):
Right.
Speaker 2 (01:03:50):
He also appeared in Rollerball with Sarah. Now you're going
to hear John Ratzenberger on the radio.
Speaker 3 (01:04:04):
Yeah, you notice this town has no paved roads and
(01:04:54):
no sidewalks.
Speaker 1 (01:04:55):
All right, all dirt roads.
Speaker 3 (01:05:00):
Some great stunt work here.
Speaker 1 (01:05:02):
Copper tone ad mmm, some great.
Speaker 3 (01:05:19):
Flame animation which they completely redid in the Donner cut.
Speaker 2 (01:05:29):
But right, sure, we're open.
Speaker 1 (01:05:49):
Here. We are in the White House, and all the
white house scenes Donner. No, No, this is Lester.
Speaker 3 (01:05:57):
I believe this is Lester with a stand in for
EG Marshall. Later on we'll see the same almost the
same shot, but with different footage on the TV screen. Right.
Notice on the right that guy's sixteen was being held
up by a manneican.
Speaker 2 (01:06:18):
I love this scene with Jack.
Speaker 3 (01:06:24):
Now coming up is a really interesting shot that I
know you'll appreciate.
Speaker 9 (01:06:28):
Jay.
Speaker 3 (01:06:30):
That sign has an area code of three one three, oh,
the Detroit area code, even though they're in Idaho.
Speaker 1 (01:06:40):
Right.
Speaker 3 (01:06:42):
Look at her fluttering her eyes. She said, all that
debris got in her, got in her eyes. You'll see
a Panavision camera with the back of a guy's head
filming that shot. Did you see how the camera passed in.
Speaker 1 (01:06:57):
Front of Oh? Yeah, then there's the miniature.
Speaker 3 (01:07:12):
Some more great Derek Medding's work here, done in very
large scale. There's some great behind the scenes photographs from
this shot online if you.
Speaker 4 (01:07:25):
Yeah, yeah, he's busy.
Speaker 10 (01:07:41):
Right now, let's have some dinner. Beautiful crystal glass table
in the fortress.
Speaker 3 (01:07:56):
I love the way it's lit in green. Left here
with the flowers to paradise. There's that Sioux fle a Jay.
Speaker 1 (01:08:20):
Which we see in the TV cut right right.
Speaker 3 (01:08:50):
The clarity in the blue rays, in particular the four
K really is remarkable in.
Speaker 1 (01:08:55):
This, especially the close ups of the costume. Right.
Speaker 3 (01:09:18):
We're hoping one day that we see the extended TV
cut on blu ray and widescreen.
Speaker 2 (01:09:23):
Yeah, many fans, we're anxious to see that.
Speaker 1 (01:09:36):
It's see tough to see any of the red in
the costumes here.
Speaker 3 (01:09:52):
Have you seen a costume in person that shows the red?
Speaker 1 (01:09:56):
No?
Speaker 2 (01:09:57):
I haven't either.
Speaker 3 (01:10:14):
Actor Don Fellows, he's mister Hornsby who helps Clark Kent
sell his farm in Superman four.
Speaker 1 (01:10:21):
Who the general?
Speaker 2 (01:10:22):
Yes, get out.
Speaker 1 (01:10:26):
I didn't know that.
Speaker 3 (01:10:31):
He's also in Raiders of the Lost Arc.
Speaker 1 (01:10:38):
And this conversation obviously was refilmed with Leicster.
Speaker 3 (01:10:46):
Yes, with Sarah Sarah Susannah York of course instead of
Marlon Brando.
Speaker 2 (01:11:29):
Love this shot.
Speaker 3 (01:11:55):
Some great footage in the making of Superman too, behind
the scenes for this. Remember they were shining the red
gels on him as he's losing his powers.
Speaker 1 (01:12:12):
Can we see Susannah York disappear?
Speaker 2 (01:12:15):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (01:12:22):
Now during the depowering We're going to see some quick
footage that was shot during the Gauntlet scene when he
walks through fire shot by Donner.
Speaker 1 (01:12:36):
Here. It is.
Speaker 3 (01:12:44):
Some great animation. I remember the reaction in the theater.
People just couldn't believe this was happening.
Speaker 1 (01:13:00):
Yeah, well, sure, you don't expect it. And then you know,
lose all the crystals here and they do such a
great job right here, and you know, you see Clark
walking out, and you see Superman just kind of fade
away and he's gone.
Speaker 3 (01:13:22):
Yeah, and he's wearing similar clothes to what we see
during the Donner cut right footage, and he's talking with Corell.
Speaker 1 (01:13:59):
When you the early Mario Puzo script which you can
see on capewonder dot com, there's there was so much
discussion about how to handle this back in nineteen seventy
six and seventy five when they were writing these scripts,
about what to do about this, about you know, a kryptonium,
(01:14:19):
a Kryptonian and a mortal woman.
Speaker 3 (01:14:23):
There's quite a bit of objection from DC real.
Speaker 5 (01:14:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:14:27):
Yeah, they thought they needed to be married for this
to happen, and they said that taking his powers away
was the one way to, I guess, get away with it.
Speaker 3 (01:14:35):
This was a miniature done during the Donner years, but
originally Ursa does this destruction not all three.
Speaker 2 (01:14:45):
Back at Lake Powell.
Speaker 3 (01:14:47):
Same background footage we see when he's chasing the rocket
in the first film.
Speaker 1 (01:14:51):
And he used at the start of the trailer for
Superman two. Right, this bed always struck me as a
bed that didn't it wasn't very breatheable.
Speaker 3 (01:15:11):
No, it's like a water bed that's I didn't have.
Speaker 1 (01:15:15):
Enough water in it, a rubbery aluminum foil.
Speaker 3 (01:15:22):
We believe this is stock footage, Yeah, with of course
the villains added in a boom slight zoom. Now, this
entire sequence was shot by Donner, with the exception of
one shot where you see the American flag fall. Lots
(01:15:44):
of stuntmen in this shot.
Speaker 1 (01:15:46):
In this sequence you could really see the villains just
look a little different than we just saw them in
what was supposed to be Texas or was it Idaho?
Speaker 2 (01:15:58):
Idaho?
Speaker 1 (01:15:58):
Idaho.
Speaker 3 (01:15:59):
Yeah, there's the Leicester shot. The makeup on Terrence is
(01:16:46):
very pale in this shot.
Speaker 1 (01:16:47):
Yeah, this poor guy's not very president sure all.
Speaker 6 (01:17:06):
And I know it.
Speaker 3 (01:18:02):
It's one of my favorite Terence Stamp moments.
Speaker 5 (01:18:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:18:06):
What about this shot here, Well, we're in BAMF National
Park in Canadian Rockies and this is actually footage shot
during the Donner years. This is Lex Luthor's car. That's
what I thought that he flips and destroys. It's a
seventy five Dodge Monaco and we see Miss Tess Smacker.
Here comes Dick Donner with a pipe. On the left,
there is Don's diner. Now in the script, this is
(01:18:30):
supposed to be in Alaska, Okay. And if you look
carefully when they walk in and look back out the window,
this is actually a mid seventies Mustang. So it's a
very small car that you get out of.
Speaker 1 (01:18:45):
Oh yeah, this was shot by whom.
Speaker 3 (01:18:52):
This is all Richard Donner.
Speaker 1 (01:18:54):
Call Richard Donner.
Speaker 3 (01:18:57):
Pamela Mandel is the waitress. She wins the jingle Bengo
in Superman's.
Speaker 1 (01:19:05):
That's to win the trip to South America.
Speaker 3 (01:19:09):
And later she is at the un it's one of
the delegates listening to Chris Reeve give his speech in
four in the Superman.
Speaker 1 (01:19:18):
Four so she's been in three Superman films.
Speaker 3 (01:19:21):
Pepper Martin, famous wrestler actor, mhm.
Speaker 11 (01:19:45):
He plays such a good, bad guy.
Speaker 12 (01:20:00):
Assassa n.
Speaker 2 (01:21:09):
Marco's great in that.
Speaker 3 (01:21:23):
Imagine seeing your blood for the first time, That gentleman, right,
there sitting at the table. He drives the taxi when
Superman drills through the street and Superman the movie Wow
the Lady who stole.
Speaker 1 (01:21:35):
Yeah, this is such a great scene and the soundtrack
is used so well here.
Speaker 13 (01:22:20):
Look up what what you what.
Speaker 1 (01:23:01):
You said? The script said that they were supposed to
be an Alaska a diner. Is that where they are?
That were there? They're supposed to be here.
Speaker 3 (01:23:15):
This set is actually right next to the prison wall set.
Now we're back to Leicester.
Speaker 1 (01:23:22):
This is Leicester footage.
Speaker 3 (01:23:28):
Someone mentioned to me once upon a time that.
Speaker 1 (01:23:33):
Was that.
Speaker 3 (01:23:36):
Pepper Martin and the truck right here that.
Speaker 1 (01:23:38):
Passes in interesting.
Speaker 3 (01:24:00):
I think there might have been some frostbite along the way.
Speaker 1 (01:24:02):
I think so, especially for a human man. That's quite
a walk.
Speaker 3 (01:24:14):
Beautifully lit. Lester Fortress noticed the moisture on his jacket there.
Speaker 8 (01:24:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:25:12):
Of course.
Speaker 3 (01:25:12):
In the Donner cut we see him get his powers back.
He puts the crystal in the controls. Joel appears and
his powers are restored. Here you don't know.
Speaker 1 (01:25:25):
Sure, basically telling him this is the last this is
your last time, your last shot.
Speaker 3 (01:25:45):
And we see Lois drop this crystal earlier.
Speaker 1 (01:25:49):
Right was under a purse right.
Speaker 14 (01:25:51):
Right, Leicester footage, not Donor footage here at the White House, this.
Speaker 2 (01:26:05):
Segment right.
Speaker 15 (01:26:08):
And this part.
Speaker 2 (01:26:22):
Now we're on.
Speaker 3 (01:26:24):
Donor footage as soon as lecture. There's one of the
(01:27:13):
best moments here.
Speaker 1 (01:27:15):
Yeah, oh hand.
Speaker 3 (01:27:19):
Crack, magnificent one.
Speaker 16 (01:27:55):
Oh my fullness, you arning the first.
Speaker 3 (01:29:03):
We're back at the Daily Planet and we're going to
see Lester footage as we see right here and Donner
footage headed together beautifully.
Speaker 1 (01:29:13):
And you can tell by the length of Lois's hair.
Speaker 3 (01:29:16):
Right, she's wearing wigs during the Leicester years, likely to
make it easier to style because she always had to
have her hair and curlers between takes.
Speaker 2 (01:29:27):
And the Donner.
Speaker 3 (01:29:28):
Years, Mark's hair is longer, he's taller.
Speaker 1 (01:29:35):
Were we talk about continuity and trying to get things
to match up.
Speaker 3 (01:29:49):
Now we're at Donner footage, and when the shot goes
back to the office, you'll notice how much younger Mark looks.
Speaker 1 (01:29:58):
Right, and Margot's hair is now behind her ears.
Speaker 3 (01:30:24):
Another clue that you're looking at Lester footage is the
telephone is white during the Laster years and black during
the Donner years. In Perry's office, there's that blue cup
(01:30:46):
on the desk.
Speaker 1 (01:31:03):
And any time we've seen Gene Hackman. Who I see
Gene Hackman. We know that that's don Our footage.
Speaker 3 (01:31:08):
Right in this scene, you'll notice that Ursa has all
(01:32:08):
of her medals and badges.
Speaker 10 (01:32:09):
Yeah, White House surrenders the news vendor right here, Eugene Lipinski.
Speaker 3 (01:32:18):
He is the cosmonaut that Superman rescues in Superman four.
Speaker 1 (01:32:25):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (01:32:28):
Right?
Speaker 1 (01:32:28):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (01:32:35):
Care to step outside? Is Lester?
Speaker 1 (01:32:38):
Right? Because freedom of the press was Donner? Right? Right?
Speaker 3 (01:32:44):
Why is Bill Cosby in a picture in the office
because he did a nineteen sixty three comedy record talking
about Superman. That's the only connection I can make. Now,
we've got some fantastic Derek Mettings miniatures combined with Donner
(01:33:05):
footage at Pinewood, some miniature flying models.
Speaker 1 (01:33:13):
Mostly everything you see on the ground is less I right.
Speaker 2 (01:33:16):
Yes, this is all.
Speaker 3 (01:33:20):
Miniatures and footage shot by Derek Mettings. Now, they built
the whole set full size or full scale, and it
was supposed to be on forty second Street between Second
(01:33:43):
and Third Avenue in New York City, And it was
built right next to the Double seven sound stage outside
of Pinewood in the middle of winter.
Speaker 1 (01:34:03):
Why a heat vision in this film.
Speaker 3 (01:34:06):
Richard Donner never got the chance to finish this.
Speaker 1 (01:34:09):
No same cab driver Alan.
Speaker 3 (01:34:15):
Stewart, he was a stunt driver. He did stunt driving
for Richard Donner in the sixties, got some background plates
during the Donner years. Whether the optical blue screen flying
was Donner or Lester unknown, for sure.
Speaker 1 (01:34:42):
He's look a lot like the optical shots from the
Supergirl trailer.
Speaker 3 (01:34:48):
Right front Projection's optic work shot from a car. Vic
Armstrong the stunt hitting the side of the building. I
(01:35:14):
always love this jay because he knocks the antenna over
on the Empire State Building right, And of course that's
the building that King Kong climbs. And in nineteen seventy six,
Jack o'holleran was in that King Kong movie.
Speaker 1 (01:35:31):
That's right, Jessica Lang, Jessica Lang.
Speaker 3 (01:35:42):
Yeah, so many details to look at on this street.
(01:36:19):
Aristo's JVC, lots of JVC.
Speaker 2 (01:36:23):
Mother Care.
Speaker 3 (01:36:24):
I think was an actual UK maternity baby store. Some
(01:36:50):
great pre digital practical working days. I love the sign
behind them. Some like it hot an air conditioning company,
some like it hot nineteen fifty nine Marilyn Monroe movie. Yeah,
(01:37:11):
I spotted lots of Mustangs among the cars. One of
the products you see a lot of in this sequence
is Kentucky Fried Chicken.
Speaker 1 (01:37:31):
Good product placement again.
Speaker 3 (01:37:33):
Oh yeah, essex oil. And I think this is the
first instance of super breath coming up.
Speaker 1 (01:37:45):
First time we see him freeze up something.
Speaker 3 (01:37:49):
Chris really pulls it off on this one.
Speaker 2 (01:38:00):
Cooling cool.
Speaker 1 (01:38:01):
At least it's right by him.
Speaker 2 (01:38:06):
I love this. When he stops it, it's it's great.
Speaker 1 (01:38:16):
That's it frozen up.
Speaker 3 (01:38:44):
Some great miniature work here when none busts out of
the hole. Yeah, there are miniature cars, that's right, and
they're about twenty.
Speaker 1 (01:38:53):
Six twenty six inches inches long.
Speaker 3 (01:38:59):
Paulton does the stunt going through the building and again
everybody's he's falling through the floor, so they're all wired in.
Let gravity do the work.
Speaker 2 (01:39:14):
There we go.
Speaker 3 (01:39:25):
The maid does a yawn there.
Speaker 2 (01:39:27):
Do you see that.
Speaker 3 (01:39:29):
During a battle? She's working and yawning.
Speaker 1 (01:39:37):
That manhole cover? Boom.
Speaker 3 (01:39:46):
Paul Weston again as Zod.
Speaker 2 (01:39:50):
Right here.
Speaker 3 (01:39:59):
I can't mention Paul because he played Clark and Superman
opposite Chris during the Junkyard battle when Evil Superman arrives,
So Superman.
Speaker 1 (01:40:10):
Three Terrence is on wires here.
Speaker 3 (01:40:12):
Yeah, and then we go to the dummy throw.
Speaker 1 (01:40:39):
We really get to see this scene broken down in
the making of Superman two TV special.
Speaker 3 (01:40:45):
Great work with a forced perspective. Miniature bus. Full scale
bus which Sarah hurt herself because the chain slipped and
she kept trying to hold it up.
Speaker 2 (01:41:07):
Miniature bus. If you go frame by frame on that shot,
you'll see that they can just hung a cape on
the side of the bus and there's no person.
Speaker 1 (01:41:26):
Ah, it's interesting.
Speaker 2 (01:41:28):
Just as it hits the.
Speaker 3 (01:41:28):
Marlborough bus see forty sixth Street on the side of
the bus.
Speaker 1 (01:41:49):
Right, you'll see a lot of miniature work up here.
Speaker 2 (01:42:05):
Coming up.
Speaker 1 (01:42:14):
Once again the use of super breath.
Speaker 3 (01:42:17):
Same sort of boot shot as we see later in
the Fortress with Superman's boots.
Speaker 1 (01:42:27):
There's that KFC there it is.
Speaker 3 (01:42:30):
You get a nice shot of a bunch of record
albums there.
Speaker 2 (01:42:33):
Yeah, I spotted.
Speaker 3 (01:42:35):
The Beatles record. There's Stevie Wonder record. JVC love this one.
This shot coming up, there's kn't kent cigarettes. Now look
(01:43:09):
on the left you'll see both mannequins holding KFC buckets
in the window.
Speaker 1 (01:43:16):
Right. Oh look at that.
Speaker 2 (01:43:18):
Yeah, il you made sure KFC was everywhere.
Speaker 1 (01:43:24):
Eh L two nine seven That license please.
Speaker 2 (01:43:26):
Notice the Omni sign there.
Speaker 3 (01:43:28):
Brian McKernan interviewed Christopher Ree when he worked for Omni.
Our friend, Brian, Yeah, great work here by Derek and
his team. That's my favorite and it's work.
Speaker 2 (01:44:01):
You get a.
Speaker 3 (01:44:02):
Good look at the elastic strap on the back of
Chris's belt there when he stands up. Sometimes he wore
elastic yeah, during action shots, so his belt would stretch.
(01:44:31):
Looks so great on the big screen.
Speaker 1 (01:44:34):
It really looks fantastic. This is a great takeoff. How
about Superman two tops card right? How cold?
Speaker 2 (01:44:49):
Look at their breath.
Speaker 1 (01:44:58):
And it sure m.
Speaker 3 (01:45:07):
We saw him earlier in the film.
Speaker 1 (01:45:09):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 3 (01:45:18):
Now we're coming to a shot and do you look
that's a Gene Hackman stand in.
Speaker 2 (01:45:23):
Ah, just for that one.
Speaker 1 (01:45:26):
That one.
Speaker 3 (01:45:28):
Now we're looking at Donner. Donner's city was typically warmer,
Lester's was cooler. Lester look at her pale makeup.
Speaker 5 (01:46:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:46:27):
I highly recommend listening to these films with full size headphones.
Speaker 1 (01:46:31):
I know we're hearing so many things we didn't hear
from the work.
Speaker 3 (01:46:34):
The sirens and all the sound effects during.
Speaker 1 (01:46:36):
The battle, even the clock chiming in the White house.
Speaker 2 (01:46:39):
Right.
Speaker 3 (01:46:51):
Lester footage Apparently this is one of the most difficult
u zoptic shots because there were so many people being
suspended in photographed at the same time, so they had
three pole arms sticking out from the wall at one time.
That's a Donner shot. And then we're back to Leicester footage.
Speaker 1 (01:47:14):
When they land.
Speaker 3 (01:47:16):
Of course she's gonna throw off a gene Hackman stand
in and you'll see his arm go behind the matte
painting for a second. Great landings on.
Speaker 2 (01:47:27):
The Lester set.
Speaker 1 (01:47:34):
Great landing from Sarah.
Speaker 15 (01:47:46):
No.
Speaker 3 (01:47:46):
Watch he pulls off a plastic s off his chest
and then when he throws it's optical.
Speaker 5 (01:47:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:47:56):
Fans have discussed these powers for a many many years.
Some of them feel like they could only do these
powers if they're in the fortress that are somehow tapping
into fortress technology. The s the giant s is like
(01:48:21):
a taser.
Speaker 1 (01:48:26):
It's interesting because you don't see a lot of hackmen here, No,
not even a stand in.
Speaker 2 (01:48:42):
Some great optical work.
Speaker 3 (01:48:53):
And this was not any part of Mankowitz.
Speaker 1 (01:48:58):
Scripture tricks. These trails see the legs all over.
Speaker 9 (01:49:08):
Which school mm hmm, yeah, okay, h mh We.
Speaker 1 (01:49:32):
Assume this is Lester here as well. All Leicester, All Yester.
Speaker 3 (01:50:07):
Now we're starting with Donner.
Speaker 1 (01:50:08):
Right, he told Chris's hair as well.
Speaker 3 (01:50:14):
This is some of the first footage the Donner shot
back in seventy seven.
Speaker 2 (01:50:39):
Look at his cape.
Speaker 3 (01:50:40):
It's so thickly padded on the shoulders. Yeah, compared to
later mhm, the great Jeffrey Unsworth.
Speaker 1 (01:51:35):
Some of his.
Speaker 3 (01:51:39):
Shots are just so beautifully lit to composed Lester footage.
Whenever we see the chamber door opening and closing us Lester,
look at that shot.
Speaker 1 (01:52:12):
Remember when you saw the scene for the first time, Right,
You're like, man, this is it?
Speaker 2 (01:52:17):
This is it?
Speaker 1 (01:52:18):
What could possibly happen? Now?
Speaker 3 (01:52:23):
One of the scripts I read describes Superman returning to
the fortress and waving his hands over some crystals, but
we're unaware of what he's doing.
Speaker 2 (01:52:36):
Before they arrive, and the Donner cut. You can hear
Zod in this shot say Neil.
Speaker 15 (01:52:45):
Yeah, let's just hold hands.
Speaker 1 (01:53:06):
It's great.
Speaker 2 (01:53:22):
Paul Weston hits the wall.
Speaker 3 (01:53:51):
Will that punch work this day?
Speaker 2 (01:53:54):
Lester?
Speaker 3 (01:53:57):
Just for a few seconds and then back to Donner again.
(01:54:18):
One of the scripts describes hearing a smack and Lex
falls into a hole and Lowest goes I never knew
he could sink so low or sink the lowest.
Speaker 2 (01:54:33):
That's what she said.
Speaker 3 (01:54:36):
Because you never get an explanation. It was Jane just
left to fend for himself in there.
Speaker 1 (01:54:42):
Well. And when we have the Lester cut on television, Wait,
we learned more.
Speaker 3 (01:54:51):
The villain survived and they're all hauled off. So check
that out in the supplementals of the Blu ray And
in the four K Donner footage beautiful takeoff. Yeah, you
(01:55:11):
watch carefully, you'll notice there are two guys inside Lewis's apartment.
She jumps up and down.
Speaker 1 (01:55:20):
And there's somebody sitting down to dinner and the next
in the lower one.
Speaker 3 (01:55:23):
Actually he's sitting down on the toilet. Oh is that right,
little Donner humor there? Yeah, back to Leicester footage. There's
that white one piece jumpsuit there like they wear on
the roof.
Speaker 1 (01:55:41):
Back of marbles.
Speaker 3 (01:55:46):
Yeah, we never see Clark's office, do we. Another newspaper
(01:56:26):
on the wall is that the I spent the night?
Speaker 1 (01:56:29):
Now it is.
Speaker 3 (01:56:36):
Lester did a good job with putting papers throughout the set, right.
Speaker 1 (01:56:43):
The way a reporter would probably put one of their
most you know, famous articles up.
Speaker 12 (01:57:07):
H y.
Speaker 1 (01:58:03):
There just hasn't been chemistry like this between two characters
in any Superman film like this.
Speaker 3 (01:58:18):
And this is proof that no matter who's directing them,
they have magical chemistry.
Speaker 5 (01:58:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:58:27):
Now, our good friend Daniel Sanchez did some research and
found out that Action Comics number three, six and November
of nineteen sixty three featured the Superkiss really something very
similar to this. There was a lot of discussion during
(01:58:52):
the development of the Richard Donner cut Superman two years ago.
Should we use the Lester super Kiss or should did
we go back to the original script with the world
around they Michael Thaw, who we've interviewed on our podcast,
he actually called me and said which version would you use?
(01:59:12):
And I said, well, I'd use the super Kiss or
I just leave it where she knows. Yeah, but they
decided to stay true to the mank ending.
Speaker 1 (01:59:25):
Good for you.
Speaker 3 (01:59:46):
Chris's Clark Ken is so amazing.
Speaker 1 (02:00:00):
Mhm mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (02:00:15):
Ibm.
Speaker 3 (02:00:16):
Selectric typewriter. They still have those rotary phones.
Speaker 1 (02:00:25):
H I loove how he looked back at her after
her Just just double check to make sure everything I
think solid.
Speaker 3 (02:00:38):
Look, look at the background the Motel signs Neon signs there.
Speaker 1 (02:00:49):
Yeh mh again another another scene that you just goes
(02:01:16):
go back to the first time you saw it, and
how great, how great it was in the theater.
Speaker 3 (02:01:21):
Oh, people cheered when I saw them. Yeah, many times
I went to see this in the theater. Every time
they cheered.
Speaker 1 (02:01:30):
That punch in the hand cracking, there it.
Speaker 3 (02:01:34):
Is, And I did a freeze frame on his food. Yeah,
it's steaking eggs with big beans.
Speaker 17 (02:01:44):
Oh watched, Yeah, tilt.
Speaker 3 (02:02:12):
I love how the wife grabs the money out of
his hand. She look at her face. My second favorite
scene in the movie. Yeah, same shot frozen right and
a sky added with the miniature Leicester footage in the
(02:02:47):
seventy nine script. He goes back and pushes the leaning
tower piece of back in its place. Then they go
to this, there's no American flag.
Speaker 1 (02:02:56):
This shot the same as the first film or or
different version.
Speaker 2 (02:02:59):
This is a different version version.
Speaker 1 (02:03:07):
Coming soon. Superman three.
Speaker 3 (02:03:14):
You didn't have to wait till the end of the
credits this time, right, like in Superman the movie, of
course it said coming next year. That's right, And we
didn't see it until at least in the US till
nineteen eighty one.
Speaker 1 (02:03:35):
Well, fantastic. Every time we see Superman two.
Speaker 3 (02:03:38):
It did an amazing job putting all the footage together. Yeah,
John Victor Smith, the editor, really had a monumental job
on his hands. M h.
Speaker 1 (02:03:52):
It was like putting together a puzzle. And again they
had they needed, They needed to really go through the script,
see what they shot, what they didn't, and then they
they're kind of right around things, which they did and
really at least.
Speaker 3 (02:04:04):
Remember all the boxes of footage in that making of
that in his editing room. One of the most exciting
extended TV cuts, of course, is this film, which came
out on ABC TV in February of nineteen eighty four. Yeah,
(02:04:26):
and the fans today so desperately want a blu ray
of that. And when I talked to Warner Archive a
few years ago, right after Superman the Movie Extended Cut
came out, they very much had an interest in releasing it,
but we haven't seen it yet.
Speaker 1 (02:04:44):
So much of the footage that you see in the
lesser extended TV cut included Donner footage that we saw
in the Donner cut. Do we know what some of
the existing scenes are that we've yet to get good
copies of, Well, a Concord fly button, the Concord five.
Speaker 3 (02:05:03):
I sure we've only seen that on the you know, VHS,
Penn and Scan rights. The extended TV cut is about
nineteen minutes longer than the theatrical Okay. The theatrical cut
is about sixty six percent Lester and thirty four percent Donner, Okay,
(02:05:27):
but the TV cut is forty five percent Donner Lester
fifty five.
Speaker 2 (02:05:33):
So there's less Lester.
Speaker 1 (02:05:35):
More Donner right in the TV cut.
Speaker 3 (02:05:37):
In the TV cut right, the richer Donner cut is
eighty three percent Donner sixteen percent Lester.
Speaker 1 (02:05:46):
Because there was just some things they had to use
from Lester to make the Donner cut.
Speaker 3 (02:05:51):
The Metropolis Battle, the Niagara Falls, scenes like that. There
is a typo in this, Okay, Instead of prison Warden,
(02:06:12):
it's prison Warner. Oh and they credit Jack Cooper as
Jackie Cooper.
Speaker 1 (02:06:19):
That's right now.
Speaker 2 (02:06:19):
I don't know if that's a mistake.
Speaker 3 (02:06:21):
I don't think that was his nickname or his formal name,
but all the promotional materials also say Jackie Cooper. I
bring that up because some fans initially thought it was
Jackie Cooper the editor playing both parts. Well, obviously it wasn't.
Speaker 1 (02:06:41):
Niagara Parks Commission.
Speaker 2 (02:06:45):
Do you have a favorite scene or moment in Superman two.
Speaker 1 (02:06:51):
I love you know, the Alley transformation obviously like you
and I love General would care to step outside? That's like,
you know, it's game on.
Speaker 3 (02:07:03):
You know that really does work better than freedom of
the pressure.
Speaker 1 (02:07:06):
Yeah, there you go. That's Superman two, the Leicester Cut.
We hope you'll join us again on the Cape Wonder
Superman podcast because Jimmy know what's next. The Donner Cut,
Superman three, Superman four.
Speaker 3 (02:07:18):
And then when the extended TV cuts come out, we
must do those as well.
Speaker 1 (02:07:22):
We'll have those as well. Thank you everybody for listening today.
I hope you had fun hanging out with us, and
it was great to hang out with each other and
get to do this today.
Speaker 3 (02:07:30):
Hey Jay, I'm really glad you're here in my home.
Speaker 1 (02:07:33):
Yes, that's right.
Speaker 3 (02:07:34):
Doing this together really makes a difference, and we hope
that you had a grand time listening to us go
on and on in our continued excitement about this film.
Speaker 1 (02:07:44):
So many years later, I forget that we're doing commentary.
Sometimes I got sucked into the film and couldn't stop watching,
and I've only seen it a million times. Thank you
everybody for listening. We'll see you again. Soon stay Super
Hi, everybody. It's Shay Towers with Jim Bowers and welcome
to the Superman two. I guess what do we call this?
Jim AA watch along.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Absolutely, I'll watch it.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
This is exciting.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Jay, We've been waiting for this. I think we haven't
done one of these in a while, and we're starting
with the Lester cut of Superman two. So Jim, take
us back to the year here as we watch these
as this opening scene here.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Well, a very interesting marketing campaign was done for this film.
Reverse marketing campaign was done to open the film across
the world during each country's respective peak summer season, so
this film actually opened first in December nineteen eighty whereas
(00:51):
the US did not see it in theaters until July nineteenth,
nineteen eighty one. And our good friend Sarah Douglas was
the world representative for this film, so she toured all
over the world to promote this movie.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
This scene not in Superman the movie, although it's meant
to be a recap, this basically shows us what the
scene would look like minus Marlon Brando.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Right right now.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
In the original script, the nineteen seventy nine script, Zod
actually walks to all of those little pedestals. Oh, each
pedestal is for an elder. He chooses jor El's Wow
breaks the crystal, and then the script says that a
bunch of the other Kryptonian guards surround them, and then
(01:38):
the rings come down as we see here.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Wow, what a great scene that would have been to see.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Right now, we're in Donner footage, right whereas the film
started with Lester footage. Obviously, this is not Marlon Brando.
This is a voice stand in or a voice actor
doing his some of his lines, as well as some
(02:02):
of the other elders' lines.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
So was this supposed to be what we're listening here?
Was this supposed to be Jirell? No, there sposed to be
the elders talking, right elders.
Speaker 3 (02:25):
So we're still on Donner footage. The really unique thing
about this film, Jay As we get an amazing recap
of the first film, So even if you didn't go
see the first movie, you've got a great idea of
what's going on. You're all caught up, ready to go.
What I love about this film is it starts off
with a bank right into the action.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Right into the action.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
This is Lester voiceover, and here we go.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
I mean, here we go with the opening credits, which
is a different look from the original film.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
Different look.
Speaker 3 (03:02):
These opening credits were done by a company called Camera
Effects Limited, and they also did some optical work for
the first film. They also did the amazing Alley transformation
that we're going to see after this recap.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Careful, tonight, use any Marlon Brando in this right, I
mean it's selective, you wouldn't even notice. But even this scene.
Speaker 3 (03:25):
Here, Marlin, of course had sued the producers for more money.
We know from an early step outline that they were
considering using Brando's footage with some Lara footage. Ultimately they
decided to cut Brando out altogether.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
Just this s is so fantastic.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Ken Thorne did a great job adapting some of John
Williams's themes.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
I think when people think of Superman too. Even if
you love the Donner cutting some of that extra footage,
this is the version we saw as kids, or you know,
whatever age you were when you saw this, But you
remember this recap so well. And even when the credits
come in, there's Aaron Smallinsk.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
That was our friend, Aaron on his tippy toes.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
Yeah, boom.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
I love these credits.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
There's our friend Sarah Douglas. There's those big barn.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Doors, beautiful Alberta, Canada.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
Jeff East There, Margo Jack, there's Valerie.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Here comes that crystal throw next. I know exactly what
it's about to happen.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
How many times have you seen this movie, Jake?
Speaker 1 (05:19):
The hundreds?
Speaker 2 (05:21):
So have I.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
Credits Clifton James.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
E. G.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Marshall, who also was in Christmas Vacation. There's Mark McClure.
That's right, great Terence Stamp. E. G.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
Marshall was in the film Absolute Power with Gene Hackman.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
I love this New York footage too.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
And we see this in the extended cut ABC of
Superman the movie when Superman first arrives to Metropolis.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Right down the Hudson There, here you go.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Now that is a swell scene.
Speaker 1 (06:04):
Jay love it. The great New York Daily News building.
That globe's still there, still a big tourist attraction.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
This moment always got a great laugh and every theatrical
screening I ever saw of the first film.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
Because you expect them to get into a phone with
it's not there, not.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
There, Wow, want to rescue mank What a great guy
he was.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
It must be interesting. It must have been interesting for
Mario Poosa to watch these films to see how much
of his script made it in.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
And you can read those scripts on Cape to wonder.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
How about a candy apple? That map would be an
amazing prop to own.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
There's the Hoover Dam. There's a filming location we visited, Jim,
we did the Alberta Badlands. It's just the greatest recap
of a film. You couldn't do a better job.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
You're pumped up before the new action even gets started.
The great Derek Meddings miniatures, which were very large, if
that makes any sense.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
That's a great scene. It's the wave.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
Our friend Dahlia.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Pierre Spangler, who I got to meet in New York
last year. Right, this is a great shot too, one
of the best, of course. Richard Lester, the Richard Lester
original cut here. Now we've got uh, that's Donner footage
(08:23):
from Donner footage, and then we cut right to Lester.
Notice the gentleman's outfit carrying the bicycle, same outfit they
wear on the roof in the first film. This hat
trick is amazing. Jay watch this. Yeah, it's unbelievable. You
(08:50):
have to wonder. I'd love to watch the take after
take of that.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
One of the interesting things about this set, Jay is
they used a lot of mirrors, so if you look carefully,
you'll actually see the reflection of people at the furthest
point on the right side.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Interesting.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
Watch the red super copy.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
The guys in red.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
I never noticed that that guy is walking back and
forth with the exercise machine. Right.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
Look how much older Mark looks.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
That's why they call him terrorists. It's a great line.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
Now watch the copy boy back here. Okay, you think
you're seeing two copy boys and there's only one because
it's his reflection in the mirror.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Yeah, look at that.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
Now you're gonna see Chris on the far right side
in the mirror as he runs away.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Watch the far right side.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
Yeah, wow, never noticed that before.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
Extends the set without having to build a big set.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
This scene here is not in New York City because
is the back lot of Pinewood. That's right, here's a
Sally transformation.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Is that my favorite scene in the movie? Perfect Donner
background plate?
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Hmmm.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
And here we are in Paris in the rain, and
this is Paris. This is Paris.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
So Margot went to Paris?
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Yes, she did, and they built part of the Eiffel
Tower at Pinewood. I love all of the film cameras,
(12:00):
always looking at photographers.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
A lot of extras for that scene too, it looked busy.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
No comprende.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
So this upcoming stair scene with her running upstairs, did
they recreate these stairs or this is all Paris? Do
we know? Well?
Speaker 2 (12:32):
I think it's both.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
At the point where it's has said, it's difficult to tell.
Now in the script this is probably real.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
This is real, of course, I don't think you could.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
And that may not even be Margo. That could be
someone else. Now that gentleman right there that you just
saw operating or controlling the bomb, that's Richard Griffiths, whose
uncle Vernon.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
Harry Potter, that's right.
Speaker 3 (13:03):
And they named these three guys in the script, Surge,
Luke and Claude miniature here right, So we're probably well,
we may still be in the actual Eiffel Tower Derek
Beddings miniature.
Speaker 5 (13:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
I always can identify the top of the Eiffel Tower
miniature because I have two of the satellite dishes. Ah
you do, that's right, A small piece of railing.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
Now Mark says, there's twenty hostages, and the script says twenty. Right,
but you'll see here there's only a handful. I don't
see twenty, No, just a couple of nuns and three
other people.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
And those are the same ones we saw earlier.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
Right.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
Ken Thorn's music is so great here, it's fantastic. Now
(14:30):
we're on a front projection studio set, so she's actually
stationary and they shake it and move it and Margo's
got to do all her good acting.
Speaker 1 (14:42):
Probably the same for this elevator scene right projected there.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
Right, there's a little mini Margo right there.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
Yeah, maybe we'll see that.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
At approp Shrock.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
So much detail they could zoom in on it that close.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
Yeah. The movie making is so good too. I mean
to be able to cut from miniatures to the actual
Rifele tower to the stuff that's on the set.
Speaker 3 (15:18):
Lots of research, lots of drawings.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Yeah, you're right.
Speaker 3 (15:54):
You'll see the French National Police Special Mobile Police Force
patches on their uniform.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
Yeah, and the biggest walkie talk he's ever.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Seen, gigantic.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
One of these gentlemen, you're going to recognize who actually
cuts the cable, all right, and that's Paul Weston stuntman
stunt quarter coordinator Paul Weston, who also plays Zod and
uh and uh none. I only get a shot of
a great zoptic shot here.
Speaker 1 (16:31):
It's taking him an awfully long time to get the Paris.
Speaker 3 (16:34):
By the way, I wonder if he's actually watching yeah
long range vision. I think he spots are right there.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
There you go.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
That's great, and that's great. You can see the Eiffel
Tower in the distance.
Speaker 3 (16:55):
Here comes Paul on the left.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
There there is man. I remember seeing this when I
was a kid. This scene was great, and.
Speaker 3 (17:12):
We know this actually replaces the some of the scenes
from the Donner.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
Here jumping out the right, here's one of my favorite scenes.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
John Victor Smith at a beautiful editing job on this.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
And it's right there. Oh that's great.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
And originally he just says, Lois, we've got to quit
meeting like this, and I thought that worked so much
better with the elevator comment.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Yeah, this is another great shot.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
All miniature work.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
Yeah, this right here, all of that yeah, blows through
the top.
Speaker 3 (18:11):
And now we're at a point where we believe that
the background plate is all from the Donner years, because
we see these plates when the x K one O
one rocket is in space in the Donner cut, So
this is all Leicester footage at this point. Then we
(18:31):
cut to a piece of Donner footage in the phantom zone.
Still lester, and now we've got a Donner piece of footage,
and as soon as it it's the waves, it's Leicester footage.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
An animation, all animation, right.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Love that mm hmm, that's traveling Matt bluescreen optical work.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
They are headed to the moon. Donner footage here right,
the fruit stand from the first movie.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
Daily News building.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Then we cut to Pinewood back lot.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Just like that.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
Now this gag with the cab, yeah, was written very
early on and intended originally for when Clark arrives in Metropolis,
crosses the street to go inside the Daily Planet for
his job interview for his job. And you can see
drawings of crashed cabs sitting on trailers in that collector's
(20:04):
album for Superman the movie.
Speaker 2 (20:05):
Wow. You notice here, Jay that she's got her own office.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
Now that's Tray. She's graduated from the desk just outside
of Perry's office. Clearly she liked the rollerskape.
Speaker 2 (20:21):
Do we ever see Clark if he has an office?
Speaker 1 (20:23):
I don't. I don't know, but I love those blue
cups on her desk, which I still to this day
order from New.
Speaker 3 (20:30):
York Mercie Superman. Notice the two promotional pictures on each
side of the office there of Superman.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
On the water framed black and white.
Speaker 2 (20:47):
M hm, why is.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
There a bad mitton birdie on her typewriter.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
They did a great job of decorating this at to
show kind of how chaotic she was.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Right, did you ever squeeze oranges at home?
Speaker 1 (21:14):
I always wanted to after this and smoke?
Speaker 3 (21:18):
No, make sure they're Marlborough.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
Marlboro appears in this movie about twenty two toughs.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
That's a good product placement. Here's that great acting by
(22:02):
Chris again, very Clark Kent.
Speaker 3 (22:11):
It flies newspaper. Notice how the sound when she hits his.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
Back sounds like a wall yep.
Speaker 3 (22:27):
Take a look at Lex Luthor's inmate number.
Speaker 2 (22:31):
On his uniform.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
Alrighty standing by for that.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
This is Donner footage.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
By the way, well, all the all the gene dialogue
on camera is Donna right right, shot nothing for Lester
right twelve forty six, twelve forty six.
Speaker 3 (23:00):
Now in Superman four, those four numbers are also used
six four one two. Wow, what what's the significance?
Speaker 2 (23:09):
I don't know. Do you have any Liberati records, Shay?
Speaker 1 (23:18):
I don't, and if I did, I'd scratch them the
ski And of course Lex Luthor has an ascot on well, yes,
(23:47):
in prison.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
I don't own any ascots.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Am I right that there's some great or a great
black and white photo of Gene in this outfit?
Speaker 2 (24:17):
Yes? Yes, and I'd love that as a prop.
Speaker 5 (24:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
So here's a part of the film Jay that is
very very interesting as far as who filmed what? Okay,
many people feel that the Moon was filmed entirely by Donner,
and we don't think that's true. This footage, for instance,
was shot by Lester, and I think the office in
the distance is actually a part of the Daily Planet set.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
Okay, So the Michigan control here.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
Michigan control is Yester footage with Donner shot Moon footage
on the screen right, Okay, so this is this is Donner.
I believe this piece of footage. The close up of
Nate is Lester. In the distant shot of the module,
(25:23):
there is no gold metallic square, but there is in
the close ups.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
So this dialogue shot by Lester, we think.
Speaker 3 (25:33):
I think it was written earlier and it may have
been filmed, but I think it was reshot or shot
differently by Lester. When you're looking out the window, it's Donner.
It is my belief, because you see Sarah going by,
et cetera. I don't think the villains came back for
Lester in this. In this scene, this is John Morton.
(26:05):
He was Luke Skywalker's gunner during the hof planet battle
in the Empire Strikes Back. All right, he's the guy
who's knocked out. Here we have stuntman Paul Weston again
again here with Sarah.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
Now you see his logo right there.
Speaker 3 (26:37):
Yeah, that's the Society of International Space Exploration and it's
actually upside down on the John Morton scenes in the module.
Oh so continuity was messed up there.
Speaker 1 (26:49):
Sure this is a great shot too. The takeoff and landing.
Speaker 3 (27:07):
Coming up is John Jim Dodall stuntman.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
That's a familiar costume to me.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
He's in the Spyo Love Me OCTOPUSY, many great films
we love. Of course he's Russian here and the translation
we think is who are you identify yourself.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Here? Hm hmm. It's a loud thud for space. It
is cut that oxygen supply off and rolls od fashion.
(28:01):
And here's Non driving.
Speaker 3 (28:07):
He's in a panic.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
These scenes always freaked me out as a kid. I mean,
Non was scary.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
You don't know what he's thinking. No, here's a familiar
face from Superman the movie, John Ratzenberger. Yes, function negative sir,
from the first film.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
And would go on to be Cliff Clay even on cheers.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
That's right. The great Shane Rimmer on the right, who
we see in Superman three. We do.
Speaker 3 (29:29):
Her eyes are so great in that shot. One of
(29:54):
the clues when you look at Terrence Stamp that it's
Donner versus Lester is the Donna footage. His hair is
less gray and kind of curly around his ears, and
it's shorter a piece of Donner footage.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Here New York.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Now we're on the actual prison set at Pinewood outside.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
This is a big set, by the way.
Speaker 3 (30:19):
Yes, here's Angus McGinnis, the warden. He doesn't look like
a warden to me. He looks like a prison guard,
but he's credited as a warden. He was in Star
Wars Rogue one witness. Great actor from Canada.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
I was like looking at what's on the shelves in there,
and it's funny that they have a tray with a
cocktail shaker.
Speaker 3 (31:09):
There's a little red Russian black and white TV sitting
at the table too. Outtakes from this would have been
great to see.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Yeah, I'm sure they exist.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
They're reading comic books in that shack. Otis has a
real issue with ladders. Every time he gets around a
ladder with les, he gets his foot Lex's foot on
(31:46):
his hand the second time.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Second time, Otis's advanced weight.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
I's thinking it's.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
Causing the balloon to come down and alert the guards.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
That's the last we see of Otis.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
That's it. I love that he waves goodbye.
Speaker 3 (33:02):
Here's the location we've been to Jay, we have with
Hadley Kay.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Himself, Niagara Falls. We know all the Niagara Falls shots
are Leicester, right.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
All of them are Leicester. Shot in September of seventy nine.
Some of the first footage Leicester shots the film started.
He started filming in August of seventy nine.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
Should mentioned if you try to line this stuff up,
that hotel and all, it looks a lot different, absolutely,
a lot of new structures around that area.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
There The bellboy is Shakespearean actor Anthony Sheer, who's from
Stratford upon Avon, Sarah douglas hometown.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
Yeah, doing his American accent.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
They like pink very much. Yeah, great timing.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
Yeah, yeah, it's the highest ceilings any hotel room has
(34:55):
ever had. Do we know when this was filmed?
Speaker 2 (35:22):
Off the top of my head?
Speaker 1 (35:23):
No, but Blakely Pinewood? Right, Oh you said where when
and where?
Speaker 2 (35:31):
Well, this was definitely Pinewood.
Speaker 3 (35:32):
Yeah, I'll have to review my script and my notes.
(36:19):
M This was originally intended to be night time to
the Donner cut, you see it at night the Laster
cut day, but it was originally written to be a
night shot.
Speaker 1 (36:41):
I wonder why they change other than just to be different.
I don't know. There's our friend Hadley k.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
And our Derby Shire friend, the Derby Shires.
Speaker 1 (37:21):
There they are.
Speaker 3 (37:24):
There's a little one ten pocket camera there on the right.
Speaker 1 (37:37):
One of my favorite things about this whole scene is
watching extras and watching them pop up in different spots.
Speaker 3 (37:48):
That polaroid camera was the Polaroid one step, a real
popular camera in the seventies, first one with the little
rainbows stripes. In the seventy nine script Jay, he almost
(38:13):
falls and an arm reaches out and grabs him, and
it's Clark's arms, so he actually saves him as Clark
and Superman in the script.
Speaker 1 (38:21):
Yeah, they would have had to revoice this entire scene,
Am I right? I mean we were at Niagara Falls.
It's really loud, really loud. I mean it's the falls
down pretty quiet in these uh, in these scenes.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
A lot of adr.
Speaker 3 (38:38):
Yes, I'm kind of in the mood for a super
duper hot dog. You Yeah, hot dogs are in every
(39:04):
single Christopher Eve Superman movie.
Speaker 5 (39:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (39:12):
Hattlee Kay joined us in Detroit for a signing at
a MotorCity Comic Con and wore a red and white
striped shirt.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
And he met us here and explained how he did
this stunt. That's right, got that rainbow.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
There's actually a small landing right beyond that railing. And
(39:52):
Hattie told us that that catch happened in Pinewood, right right.
Speaker 3 (39:59):
He had to film I'm on wires here with Chris
and then he went to Pinewood and flew right noticed
the little grease shirt on your blonde kid. There Canadian
(40:29):
flag flying there. You know you're on the Canadian side, right.
Speaker 1 (40:51):
We have grape behind the scenes photos of all of
this on Cape wonder dot com.
Speaker 2 (41:06):
This is my favorite shirt, this guy right here.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
Yeah, but the turtleneck, blue turtleneck stripes.
Speaker 3 (41:20):
Nobody did golly like Chris.
Speaker 1 (41:22):
Right, No orange juice. My brother texts me that to
this day at least three times a week. No orange juice. Here.
Speaker 3 (41:35):
We've got some Donner footage from the first film. All right,
different piece of footage, but from the same shot.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
So is this Donner footage?
Speaker 3 (41:46):
Well, that's a good question.
Speaker 2 (41:47):
Some people feel that it.
Speaker 1 (41:48):
Is because we know that's not Jeane, right, that's.
Speaker 3 (41:51):
Not Jean's a voice actor. We do know they went
up to Norway and did some filming, and of course
the glacier up above of the Canadian Rockies.
Speaker 1 (42:02):
But here we are back at the here we.
Speaker 3 (42:04):
Bought, are back in the fortress exterior, and now we
go to the Fortress interior again, all shot by Donner.
So whenever you see Valerie and Jane, it's Donner.
Speaker 1 (42:16):
And this is the same fortress that Chris takes that
first flight from Chris that we're here.
Speaker 2 (42:22):
And when Jeffies first arrives and talks.
Speaker 1 (42:24):
With his all this for this, this version of the Fortress.
Speaker 3 (42:27):
Yes, right, this was shot at Shepperton, whereas the fortress
interior we see during the Leicester filming was shot at Pinewood.
Speaker 2 (42:36):
It was rebuilt.
Speaker 3 (42:49):
Now what we're about to see is Donner footage of
Gene and Valerie looking at Lester footage of Laura and
John Hollis one of the other elders coming up from
a crystal shard or collection of chards. But what Jean
(43:12):
and Valerie are actually looking at were supposed to be
looking at, is Marlon Brando as Joerel. And you see
that in the Donner cut. So we've got some optical
work to put both of those Lester Donner pieces together.
Speaker 1 (43:31):
We did a podcast about some of the things Lester
had to do when he took over this and how
to rework these script moments.
Speaker 3 (43:45):
This is John Hollis. He was an elder in the
first film. Here we have Susannah York who did come
(44:22):
back during the Laster Years. Can I remember Trees by
(44:47):
Joyce Kilmer. Yeah, that's Val Kilmer's.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
Cousin who was killed in World War One.
Speaker 1 (44:54):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (44:55):
Val Kilmer was Batman in the third Batman movie. The
script in the Lester Years. It also includes another elder
who we do not see in this cut, and he
speaks some of the Jorell dialogue.
Speaker 1 (45:22):
So everything Gene is reacting to here would have been Brando.
Speaker 3 (45:27):
Right, he would have been directed to be responding to Brando.
What I believe you're seeing here is a background plate
of Donner shot Fortress with Lester foreground crystal cluster optically added. Again,
(45:54):
some fans feel this is Donner footage, others feel it's
Lester footage.
Speaker 2 (45:58):
Reshot.
Speaker 3 (45:59):
We know Donner took a crew or a second unit
crew up there and filmed. Whether it was used or not,
we don't know for sure. I always thought it was
Donner footage. Right now, we've been here. This is back
in Niagara Falls.
Speaker 1 (46:13):
These small boats aren't at this location anymore. They're in
a museum, right.
Speaker 3 (46:17):
But this looks almost the same.
Speaker 1 (46:19):
Right, the landing area here. This this what we call
it a deck or porch here, right. It's very loud,
and the rocks in the background are all still exactly
the same.
Speaker 3 (46:54):
They built a water tank at Pinewood, Yes, took out
board motors to churn up the water her and had
Margo get in it. For many of these scenes. We
see that in the making of Superman.
Speaker 1 (47:08):
Give Superran to the ABC special. We saw the stunt doubles.
(47:29):
We walked down that boardwalk. Looks the same, looks exactly
the same.
Speaker 3 (47:33):
This is the first instance of Clark or Superman.
Speaker 1 (47:38):
That's a dummy, right. And then there's Margo.
Speaker 3 (47:41):
This is the first time we see heat vision.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 3 (47:46):
In one of the scripts, he actually uses super breath
to blow the branch towards her once it.
Speaker 2 (47:53):
Falls on the water.
Speaker 1 (47:55):
Great over the shoulder shot there.
Speaker 3 (48:02):
Now, some fans have asked, how could he use his
heat vision and not shatter his glasses, And this is
the answer. Some fans have come up with that the
glass and his glasses are from the ship, is from
his starship.
Speaker 1 (48:17):
Well, that's how it was in the comic books, right.
Speaker 3 (48:22):
Lois and Clark, he always lowered his glasses.
Speaker 1 (48:24):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (48:36):
This was a really fantastic trip for us. Jay and
I encourage everybody to go here and visit.
Speaker 1 (48:46):
And this rock formation here that they this kind of
little area that they swim into, still exactly the same.
It looks a little different if you try to photograph
it because of the cameras they used. Right. We often
talk about that how you can can't match it up
with your iPhone camera. No, but those rocks are exactly
that way.
Speaker 3 (49:15):
Well, your iPhone camera usually defaults to a very wide
angle lens, which expands and pushes everything away. There's that
finger push. Here's a very interesting scene. Pay close attention
(49:37):
to Jack o'holler and to none when he lands. He
has no platforms on his boots, and I think they've
had him wear boots that were lighter weight for flying scenes.
Speaker 1 (49:52):
So you really see the red in these costumes.
Speaker 3 (50:02):
Here first time I remember seeing red. Here's Gordon Rawlings.
He's actually in the third movie. He falls in the
hole in the street when the penguin that's running around.
Speaker 1 (50:18):
This is back lot Pinewood.
Speaker 3 (50:20):
Right, this is Black Lake Park and you see Supergirl
fly out of this lake and you see Superman freeze
this lake in Superman three. It's just down the street
from Pinewood.
Speaker 6 (50:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (50:33):
Now, watch, no platforms on Jack's boots, so I think
he's wearing his flying boots. But in the next shot
he'll have his platforms.
Speaker 1 (50:41):
On because he's almost the same height.
Speaker 3 (50:43):
As right, Terrence, there's his platforms. Yeah, probably shot on
a different day or maybe later in the day all
(51:13):
Leicester shot. There's some product placement there with the polaroid
(51:40):
in the background.
Speaker 1 (52:02):
What the Leicester cut didn't give us was the setup
on why they did this story, right, that's right, why
they were posing as newlywits. Well you got some of
that dialogue from Margo earlier.
Speaker 3 (52:34):
This is one of my favorite scenes with Christopher Eve
in this film.
Speaker 7 (52:45):
Just defeated.
Speaker 3 (52:59):
Once again and he stands up straight and ticks off
his glasses. You notice he's wearing a ring.
Speaker 1 (53:30):
Well, they're opposing a zulize, right, Yeah, get to wonder
(54:34):
she's thinking, are we going to a small apartment in Metropolis.
Speaker 3 (54:47):
This piece of footage was actually the background plate used
for when Superman flies around the hill and spots Lois's car.
Speaker 2 (54:58):
Oh crack, yeah, Superman in.
Speaker 1 (55:00):
The movie much at a much faster speed.
Speaker 3 (55:03):
At a much faster speed, right, that's.
Speaker 1 (55:04):
Probably that was probably the normal speed there.
Speaker 3 (55:06):
Here we are in England. M Clifton James on the
(55:29):
left plays almost the same character in Levin led Die
many years earlier. Peter Whitman on the right, Dwayne. We
see him standing at the ATM when all the money
starts spitting out.
Speaker 1 (55:48):
It's funny they reuse these. It's a great scene. These
three have signed so many photographs of that post.
Speaker 2 (56:14):
They're driving.
Speaker 3 (56:16):
A very similar car to what Loess drives the red
car in the first film, the old Ford Ltd. Sedan,
(56:45):
So it not only heats things up, it levitates things apparently,
(57:22):
just check the tire. East Houston, Idaho.
Speaker 1 (57:44):
Childlike got some beautiful.
Speaker 3 (57:47):
Flying shots in this movie. They shot VistaVision, which is
a larger frame of film to enable you to have
these very very beautiful backgrounds and allow the actors to
be further away from the camera. Fortress background and miniatures.
(58:15):
There miniature flying right with a beautiful entry into the fortress.
And now we're inside Richard Lester's Pinewood built fortress.
Speaker 1 (58:26):
Smaller looks like right right, that's a Donner shot.
Speaker 3 (58:36):
Yeah, the crystal control console appears to be lower in that.
Speaker 1 (58:54):
Yeah, not as grand looking.
Speaker 3 (58:59):
Marcus, the Miko Child actor, he went on to be
in full metal jacket.
Speaker 1 (59:09):
There's non testing out his heat visions to his skills.
Speaker 2 (59:11):
Notice the bee.
Speaker 3 (59:12):
Yeah, have a good day, have a good breakfast. Those
signs are even outside.
Speaker 1 (59:30):
I love that wallpaper.
Speaker 2 (59:33):
Lots of product in this shot.
Speaker 1 (59:35):
Mm hm to coca Cola Fanta.
Speaker 3 (59:37):
Wriggly's Is that Wriggly's gun? Watch what Zod is doing?
He picks up a dirty plate and stares at it.
Speaker 1 (59:46):
That's funny. Yeah, you never really focus on him. You're
always looking at Sarah here corse shirt.
Speaker 3 (01:00:35):
Now, this stunt was shot on a set where he's
actually falling, so the camera was mounted side of falling
into the floor.
Speaker 1 (01:01:02):
Wasn't there something to the trailer we just saw in
the background. Wasn't that someone's I thought that was someone's
We heard was someone's trailer.
Speaker 3 (01:01:11):
This stuntman's name is jack Cooper. They credit him in
the movie as Jackie Cooper. Interesting, he's also credited as Dino,
but the guys call him Jody here and he's Willie's dad.
(01:01:36):
See how lo this this control calls on it. It
looks bigger than the one in the In the Donner Years.
Speaker 1 (01:01:43):
The green crystal looks so small.
Speaker 2 (01:01:51):
It does, doesn't it? Now?
Speaker 3 (01:02:30):
In the seventy nine script, we actually see him go
from place to place to get his flowers, his champagne.
And what they did here is they took a crew
with Chris to Saint Lucia and the Caribbean and actually
filmed there.
Speaker 1 (01:02:50):
So this is Saint Lucia.
Speaker 3 (01:02:51):
This is Saint Lucia, and they've named the falls there
Superman Falls.
Speaker 2 (01:02:55):
You can go see it today.
Speaker 3 (01:02:58):
But in the script you see him go around and
pick up the different items at different places, and he's
so love struck while he's out that he straightens the
leaning tower of Pisa and upsets the vendor selling Chachkes.
So that idea for the Pisa scene we see in
three actually was first written in seventy seven by Mankowitz.
Speaker 2 (01:03:23):
Then you come to this scene.
Speaker 3 (01:03:35):
Here's Richard Leparmitier. He's famous for Darth Vader choking him
in Star Wars. Yes, he later married Sarah Douglas.
Speaker 1 (01:03:45):
That's right. We saw them together on Lifestyles of the
Rich and the Family.
Speaker 8 (01:03:49):
Right.
Speaker 2 (01:03:50):
He also appeared in Rollerball with Sarah. Now you're going
to hear John Ratzenberger on the radio.
Speaker 3 (01:04:04):
Yeah, you notice this town has no paved roads and
(01:04:54):
no sidewalks.
Speaker 1 (01:04:55):
All right, all dirt roads.
Speaker 3 (01:05:00):
Some great stunt work here.
Speaker 1 (01:05:02):
Copper tone ad mmm, some great.
Speaker 3 (01:05:19):
Flame animation which they completely redid in the Donner cut.
Speaker 2 (01:05:29):
But right, sure, we're open.
Speaker 1 (01:05:49):
Here. We are in the White House, and all the
white house scenes Donner. No, No, this is Lester.
Speaker 3 (01:05:57):
I believe this is Lester with a stand in for
EG Marshall. Later on we'll see the same almost the
same shot, but with different footage on the TV screen. Right.
Notice on the right that guy's sixteen was being held
up by a manneican.
Speaker 2 (01:06:18):
I love this scene with Jack.
Speaker 3 (01:06:24):
Now coming up is a really interesting shot that I
know you'll appreciate.
Speaker 9 (01:06:28):
Jay.
Speaker 3 (01:06:30):
That sign has an area code of three one three, oh,
the Detroit area code, even though they're in Idaho.
Speaker 1 (01:06:40):
Right.
Speaker 3 (01:06:42):
Look at her fluttering her eyes. She said, all that
debris got in her, got in her eyes. You'll see
a Panavision camera with the back of a guy's head
filming that shot. Did you see how the camera passed in.
Speaker 1 (01:06:57):
Front of Oh? Yeah, then there's the miniature.
Speaker 3 (01:07:12):
Some more great Derek Medding's work here, done in very
large scale. There's some great behind the scenes photographs from
this shot online if you.
Speaker 4 (01:07:25):
Yeah, yeah, he's busy.
Speaker 10 (01:07:41):
Right now, let's have some dinner. Beautiful crystal glass table
in the fortress.
Speaker 3 (01:07:56):
I love the way it's lit in green. Left here
with the flowers to paradise. There's that Sioux fle a Jay.
Speaker 1 (01:08:20):
Which we see in the TV cut right right.
Speaker 3 (01:08:50):
The clarity in the blue rays, in particular the four
K really is remarkable in.
Speaker 1 (01:08:55):
This, especially the close ups of the costume. Right.
Speaker 3 (01:09:18):
We're hoping one day that we see the extended TV
cut on blu ray and widescreen.
Speaker 2 (01:09:23):
Yeah, many fans, we're anxious to see that.
Speaker 1 (01:09:36):
It's see tough to see any of the red in
the costumes here.
Speaker 3 (01:09:52):
Have you seen a costume in person that shows the red?
Speaker 1 (01:09:56):
No?
Speaker 2 (01:09:57):
I haven't either.
Speaker 3 (01:10:14):
Actor Don Fellows, he's mister Hornsby who helps Clark Kent
sell his farm in Superman four.
Speaker 1 (01:10:21):
Who the general?
Speaker 2 (01:10:22):
Yes, get out.
Speaker 1 (01:10:26):
I didn't know that.
Speaker 3 (01:10:31):
He's also in Raiders of the Lost Arc.
Speaker 1 (01:10:38):
And this conversation obviously was refilmed with Leicster.
Speaker 3 (01:10:46):
Yes, with Sarah Sarah Susannah York of course instead of
Marlon Brando.
Speaker 2 (01:11:29):
Love this shot.
Speaker 3 (01:11:55):
Some great footage in the making of Superman too, behind
the scenes for this. Remember they were shining the red
gels on him as he's losing his powers.
Speaker 1 (01:12:12):
Can we see Susannah York disappear?
Speaker 2 (01:12:15):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (01:12:22):
Now during the depowering We're going to see some quick
footage that was shot during the Gauntlet scene when he
walks through fire shot by Donner.
Speaker 1 (01:12:36):
Here. It is.
Speaker 3 (01:12:44):
Some great animation. I remember the reaction in the theater.
People just couldn't believe this was happening.
Speaker 1 (01:13:00):
Yeah, well, sure, you don't expect it. And then you know,
lose all the crystals here and they do such a
great job right here, and you know, you see Clark
walking out, and you see Superman just kind of fade
away and he's gone.
Speaker 3 (01:13:22):
Yeah, and he's wearing similar clothes to what we see
during the Donner cut right footage, and he's talking with Corell.
Speaker 1 (01:13:59):
When you the early Mario Puzo script which you can
see on capewonder dot com, there's there was so much
discussion about how to handle this back in nineteen seventy
six and seventy five when they were writing these scripts,
about what to do about this, about you know, a kryptonium,
(01:14:19):
a Kryptonian and a mortal woman.
Speaker 3 (01:14:23):
There's quite a bit of objection from DC real.
Speaker 5 (01:14:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:14:27):
Yeah, they thought they needed to be married for this
to happen, and they said that taking his powers away
was the one way to, I guess, get away with it.
Speaker 3 (01:14:35):
This was a miniature done during the Donner years, but
originally Ursa does this destruction not all three.
Speaker 2 (01:14:45):
Back at Lake Powell.
Speaker 3 (01:14:47):
Same background footage we see when he's chasing the rocket
in the first film.
Speaker 1 (01:14:51):
And he used at the start of the trailer for
Superman two. Right, this bed always struck me as a
bed that didn't it wasn't very breatheable.
Speaker 3 (01:15:11):
No, it's like a water bed that's I didn't have.
Speaker 1 (01:15:15):
Enough water in it, a rubbery aluminum foil.
Speaker 3 (01:15:22):
We believe this is stock footage, Yeah, with of course
the villains added in a boom slight zoom. Now, this
entire sequence was shot by Donner, with the exception of
one shot where you see the American flag fall. Lots
(01:15:44):
of stuntmen in this shot.
Speaker 1 (01:15:46):
In this sequence you could really see the villains just
look a little different than we just saw them in
what was supposed to be Texas or was it Idaho?
Speaker 2 (01:15:58):
Idaho?
Speaker 1 (01:15:58):
Idaho.
Speaker 3 (01:15:59):
Yeah, there's the Leicester shot. The makeup on Terrence is
(01:16:46):
very pale in this shot.
Speaker 1 (01:16:47):
Yeah, this poor guy's not very president sure all.
Speaker 6 (01:17:06):
And I know it.
Speaker 3 (01:18:02):
It's one of my favorite Terence Stamp moments.
Speaker 5 (01:18:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:18:06):
What about this shot here, Well, we're in BAMF National
Park in Canadian Rockies and this is actually footage shot
during the Donner years. This is Lex Luthor's car. That's
what I thought that he flips and destroys. It's a
seventy five Dodge Monaco and we see Miss Tess Smacker.
Here comes Dick Donner with a pipe. On the left,
there is Don's diner. Now in the script, this is
(01:18:30):
supposed to be in Alaska, Okay. And if you look
carefully when they walk in and look back out the window,
this is actually a mid seventies Mustang. So it's a
very small car that you get out of.
Speaker 1 (01:18:45):
Oh yeah, this was shot by whom.
Speaker 3 (01:18:52):
This is all Richard Donner.
Speaker 1 (01:18:54):
Call Richard Donner.
Speaker 3 (01:18:57):
Pamela Mandel is the waitress. She wins the jingle Bengo
in Superman's.
Speaker 1 (01:19:05):
That's to win the trip to South America.
Speaker 3 (01:19:09):
And later she is at the un it's one of
the delegates listening to Chris Reeve give his speech in
four in the Superman.
Speaker 1 (01:19:18):
Four so she's been in three Superman films.
Speaker 3 (01:19:21):
Pepper Martin, famous wrestler actor, mhm.
Speaker 11 (01:19:45):
He plays such a good, bad guy.
Speaker 12 (01:20:00):
Assassa n.
Speaker 2 (01:21:09):
Marco's great in that.
Speaker 3 (01:21:23):
Imagine seeing your blood for the first time, That gentleman, right,
there sitting at the table. He drives the taxi when
Superman drills through the street and Superman the movie Wow
the Lady who stole.
Speaker 1 (01:21:35):
Yeah, this is such a great scene and the soundtrack
is used so well here.
Speaker 13 (01:22:20):
Look up what what you what.
Speaker 1 (01:23:01):
You said? The script said that they were supposed to
be an Alaska a diner. Is that where they are?
That were there? They're supposed to be here.
Speaker 3 (01:23:15):
This set is actually right next to the prison wall set.
Now we're back to Leicester.
Speaker 1 (01:23:22):
This is Leicester footage.
Speaker 3 (01:23:28):
Someone mentioned to me once upon a time that.
Speaker 1 (01:23:33):
Was that.
Speaker 3 (01:23:36):
Pepper Martin and the truck right here that.
Speaker 1 (01:23:38):
Passes in interesting.
Speaker 3 (01:24:00):
I think there might have been some frostbite along the way.
Speaker 1 (01:24:02):
I think so, especially for a human man. That's quite
a walk.
Speaker 3 (01:24:14):
Beautifully lit. Lester Fortress noticed the moisture on his jacket there.
Speaker 8 (01:24:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:25:12):
Of course.
Speaker 3 (01:25:12):
In the Donner cut we see him get his powers back.
He puts the crystal in the controls. Joel appears and
his powers are restored. Here you don't know.
Speaker 1 (01:25:25):
Sure, basically telling him this is the last this is
your last time, your last shot.
Speaker 3 (01:25:45):
And we see Lois drop this crystal earlier.
Speaker 1 (01:25:49):
Right was under a purse right.
Speaker 14 (01:25:51):
Right, Leicester footage, not Donor footage here at the White House, this.
Speaker 2 (01:26:05):
Segment right.
Speaker 15 (01:26:08):
And this part.
Speaker 2 (01:26:22):
Now we're on.
Speaker 3 (01:26:24):
Donor footage as soon as lecture. There's one of the
(01:27:13):
best moments here.
Speaker 1 (01:27:15):
Yeah, oh hand.
Speaker 3 (01:27:19):
Crack, magnificent one.
Speaker 16 (01:27:55):
Oh my fullness, you arning the first.
Speaker 3 (01:29:03):
We're back at the Daily Planet and we're going to
see Lester footage as we see right here and Donner
footage headed together beautifully.
Speaker 1 (01:29:13):
And you can tell by the length of Lois's hair.
Speaker 3 (01:29:16):
Right, she's wearing wigs during the Leicester years, likely to
make it easier to style because she always had to
have her hair and curlers between takes.
Speaker 2 (01:29:27):
And the Donner.
Speaker 3 (01:29:28):
Years, Mark's hair is longer, he's taller.
Speaker 1 (01:29:35):
Were we talk about continuity and trying to get things
to match up.
Speaker 3 (01:29:49):
Now we're at Donner footage, and when the shot goes
back to the office, you'll notice how much younger Mark looks.
Speaker 1 (01:29:58):
Right, and Margot's hair is now behind her ears.
Speaker 3 (01:30:24):
Another clue that you're looking at Lester footage is the
telephone is white during the Laster years and black during
the Donner years. In Perry's office, there's that blue cup
(01:30:46):
on the desk.
Speaker 1 (01:31:03):
And any time we've seen Gene Hackman. Who I see
Gene Hackman. We know that that's don Our footage.
Speaker 3 (01:31:08):
Right in this scene, you'll notice that Ursa has all
(01:32:08):
of her medals and badges.
Speaker 10 (01:32:09):
Yeah, White House surrenders the news vendor right here, Eugene Lipinski.
Speaker 3 (01:32:18):
He is the cosmonaut that Superman rescues in Superman four.
Speaker 1 (01:32:25):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (01:32:28):
Right?
Speaker 1 (01:32:28):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (01:32:35):
Care to step outside? Is Lester?
Speaker 1 (01:32:38):
Right? Because freedom of the press was Donner? Right? Right?
Speaker 3 (01:32:44):
Why is Bill Cosby in a picture in the office
because he did a nineteen sixty three comedy record talking
about Superman. That's the only connection I can make. Now,
we've got some fantastic Derek Mettings miniatures combined with Donner
(01:33:05):
footage at Pinewood, some miniature flying models.
Speaker 1 (01:33:13):
Mostly everything you see on the ground is less I right.
Speaker 2 (01:33:16):
Yes, this is all.
Speaker 3 (01:33:20):
Miniatures and footage shot by Derek Mettings. Now, they built
the whole set full size or full scale, and it
was supposed to be on forty second Street between Second
(01:33:43):
and Third Avenue in New York City, And it was
built right next to the Double seven sound stage outside
of Pinewood in the middle of winter.
Speaker 1 (01:34:03):
Why a heat vision in this film.
Speaker 3 (01:34:06):
Richard Donner never got the chance to finish this.
Speaker 1 (01:34:09):
No same cab driver Alan.
Speaker 3 (01:34:15):
Stewart, he was a stunt driver. He did stunt driving
for Richard Donner in the sixties, got some background plates
during the Donner years. Whether the optical blue screen flying
was Donner or Lester unknown, for sure.
Speaker 1 (01:34:42):
He's look a lot like the optical shots from the
Supergirl trailer.
Speaker 3 (01:34:48):
Right front Projection's optic work shot from a car. Vic
Armstrong the stunt hitting the side of the building. I
(01:35:14):
always love this jay because he knocks the antenna over
on the Empire State Building right, And of course that's
the building that King Kong climbs. And in nineteen seventy six,
Jack o'holleran was in that King Kong movie.
Speaker 1 (01:35:31):
That's right, Jessica Lang, Jessica Lang.
Speaker 3 (01:35:42):
Yeah, so many details to look at on this street.
(01:36:19):
Aristo's JVC, lots of JVC.
Speaker 2 (01:36:23):
Mother Care.
Speaker 3 (01:36:24):
I think was an actual UK maternity baby store. Some
(01:36:50):
great pre digital practical working days. I love the sign
behind them. Some like it hot an air conditioning company,
some like it hot nineteen fifty nine Marilyn Monroe movie. Yeah,
(01:37:11):
I spotted lots of Mustangs among the cars. One of
the products you see a lot of in this sequence
is Kentucky Fried Chicken.
Speaker 1 (01:37:31):
Good product placement again.
Speaker 3 (01:37:33):
Oh yeah, essex oil. And I think this is the
first instance of super breath coming up.
Speaker 1 (01:37:45):
First time we see him freeze up something.
Speaker 3 (01:37:49):
Chris really pulls it off on this one.
Speaker 2 (01:38:00):
Cooling cool.
Speaker 1 (01:38:01):
At least it's right by him.
Speaker 2 (01:38:06):
I love this. When he stops it, it's it's great.
Speaker 1 (01:38:16):
That's it frozen up.
Speaker 3 (01:38:44):
Some great miniature work here when none busts out of
the hole. Yeah, there are miniature cars, that's right, and
they're about twenty.
Speaker 1 (01:38:53):
Six twenty six inches inches long.
Speaker 3 (01:38:59):
Paulton does the stunt going through the building and again
everybody's he's falling through the floor, so they're all wired in.
Let gravity do the work.
Speaker 2 (01:39:14):
There we go.
Speaker 3 (01:39:25):
The maid does a yawn there.
Speaker 2 (01:39:27):
Do you see that.
Speaker 3 (01:39:29):
During a battle? She's working and yawning.
Speaker 1 (01:39:37):
That manhole cover? Boom.
Speaker 3 (01:39:46):
Paul Weston again as Zod.
Speaker 2 (01:39:50):
Right here.
Speaker 3 (01:39:59):
I can't mention Paul because he played Clark and Superman
opposite Chris during the Junkyard battle when Evil Superman arrives,
So Superman.
Speaker 1 (01:40:10):
Three Terrence is on wires here.
Speaker 3 (01:40:12):
Yeah, and then we go to the dummy throw.
Speaker 1 (01:40:39):
We really get to see this scene broken down in
the making of Superman two TV special.
Speaker 3 (01:40:45):
Great work with a forced perspective. Miniature bus. Full scale
bus which Sarah hurt herself because the chain slipped and
she kept trying to hold it up.
Speaker 2 (01:41:07):
Miniature bus. If you go frame by frame on that shot,
you'll see that they can just hung a cape on
the side of the bus and there's no person.
Speaker 1 (01:41:26):
Ah, it's interesting.
Speaker 2 (01:41:28):
Just as it hits the.
Speaker 3 (01:41:28):
Marlborough bus see forty sixth Street on the side of
the bus.
Speaker 1 (01:41:49):
Right, you'll see a lot of miniature work up here.
Speaker 2 (01:42:05):
Coming up.
Speaker 1 (01:42:14):
Once again the use of super breath.
Speaker 3 (01:42:17):
Same sort of boot shot as we see later in
the Fortress with Superman's boots.
Speaker 1 (01:42:27):
There's that KFC there it is.
Speaker 3 (01:42:30):
You get a nice shot of a bunch of record
albums there.
Speaker 2 (01:42:33):
Yeah, I spotted.
Speaker 3 (01:42:35):
The Beatles record. There's Stevie Wonder record. JVC love this one.
This shot coming up, there's kn't kent cigarettes. Now look
(01:43:09):
on the left you'll see both mannequins holding KFC buckets
in the window.
Speaker 1 (01:43:16):
Right. Oh look at that.
Speaker 2 (01:43:18):
Yeah, il you made sure KFC was everywhere.
Speaker 1 (01:43:24):
Eh L two nine seven That license please.
Speaker 2 (01:43:26):
Notice the Omni sign there.
Speaker 3 (01:43:28):
Brian McKernan interviewed Christopher Ree when he worked for Omni.
Our friend, Brian, Yeah, great work here by Derek and
his team. That's my favorite and it's work.
Speaker 2 (01:44:01):
You get a.
Speaker 3 (01:44:02):
Good look at the elastic strap on the back of
Chris's belt there when he stands up. Sometimes he wore
elastic yeah, during action shots, so his belt would stretch.
(01:44:31):
Looks so great on the big screen.
Speaker 1 (01:44:34):
It really looks fantastic. This is a great takeoff. How
about Superman two tops card right? How cold?
Speaker 2 (01:44:49):
Look at their breath.
Speaker 1 (01:44:58):
And it sure m.
Speaker 3 (01:45:07):
We saw him earlier in the film.
Speaker 1 (01:45:09):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 3 (01:45:18):
Now we're coming to a shot and do you look
that's a Gene Hackman stand in.
Speaker 2 (01:45:23):
Ah, just for that one.
Speaker 1 (01:45:26):
That one.
Speaker 3 (01:45:28):
Now we're looking at Donner. Donner's city was typically warmer,
Lester's was cooler. Lester look at her pale makeup.
Speaker 5 (01:46:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:46:27):
I highly recommend listening to these films with full size headphones.
Speaker 1 (01:46:31):
I know we're hearing so many things we didn't hear
from the work.
Speaker 3 (01:46:34):
The sirens and all the sound effects during.
Speaker 1 (01:46:36):
The battle, even the clock chiming in the White house.
Speaker 2 (01:46:39):
Right.
Speaker 3 (01:46:51):
Lester footage Apparently this is one of the most difficult
u zoptic shots because there were so many people being
suspended in photographed at the same time, so they had
three pole arms sticking out from the wall at one time.
That's a Donner shot. And then we're back to Leicester footage.
Speaker 1 (01:47:14):
When they land.
Speaker 3 (01:47:16):
Of course she's gonna throw off a gene Hackman stand
in and you'll see his arm go behind the matte
painting for a second. Great landings on.
Speaker 2 (01:47:27):
The Lester set.
Speaker 1 (01:47:34):
Great landing from Sarah.
Speaker 15 (01:47:46):
No.
Speaker 3 (01:47:46):
Watch he pulls off a plastic s off his chest
and then when he throws it's optical.
Speaker 5 (01:47:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:47:56):
Fans have discussed these powers for a many many years.
Some of them feel like they could only do these
powers if they're in the fortress that are somehow tapping
into fortress technology. The s the giant s is like
(01:48:21):
a taser.
Speaker 1 (01:48:26):
It's interesting because you don't see a lot of hackmen here, No,
not even a stand in.
Speaker 2 (01:48:42):
Some great optical work.
Speaker 3 (01:48:53):
And this was not any part of Mankowitz.
Speaker 1 (01:48:58):
Scripture tricks. These trails see the legs all over.
Speaker 9 (01:49:08):
Which school mm hmm, yeah, okay, h mh We.
Speaker 1 (01:49:32):
Assume this is Lester here as well. All Leicester, All Yester.
Speaker 3 (01:50:07):
Now we're starting with Donner.
Speaker 1 (01:50:08):
Right, he told Chris's hair as well.
Speaker 3 (01:50:14):
This is some of the first footage the Donner shot
back in seventy seven.
Speaker 2 (01:50:39):
Look at his cape.
Speaker 3 (01:50:40):
It's so thickly padded on the shoulders. Yeah, compared to
later mhm, the great Jeffrey Unsworth.
Speaker 1 (01:51:35):
Some of his.
Speaker 3 (01:51:39):
Shots are just so beautifully lit to composed Lester footage.
Whenever we see the chamber door opening and closing us Lester,
look at that shot.
Speaker 1 (01:52:12):
Remember when you saw the scene for the first time, Right,
You're like, man, this is it?
Speaker 2 (01:52:17):
This is it?
Speaker 1 (01:52:18):
What could possibly happen? Now?
Speaker 3 (01:52:23):
One of the scripts I read describes Superman returning to
the fortress and waving his hands over some crystals, but
we're unaware of what he's doing.
Speaker 2 (01:52:36):
Before they arrive, and the Donner cut. You can hear
Zod in this shot say Neil.
Speaker 15 (01:52:45):
Yeah, let's just hold hands.
Speaker 1 (01:53:06):
It's great.
Speaker 2 (01:53:22):
Paul Weston hits the wall.
Speaker 3 (01:53:51):
Will that punch work this day?
Speaker 2 (01:53:54):
Lester?
Speaker 3 (01:53:57):
Just for a few seconds and then back to Donner again.
(01:54:18):
One of the scripts describes hearing a smack and Lex
falls into a hole and Lowest goes I never knew
he could sink so low or sink the lowest.
Speaker 2 (01:54:33):
That's what she said.
Speaker 3 (01:54:36):
Because you never get an explanation. It was Jane just
left to fend for himself in there.
Speaker 1 (01:54:42):
Well. And when we have the Lester cut on television, Wait,
we learned more.
Speaker 3 (01:54:51):
The villain survived and they're all hauled off. So check
that out in the supplementals of the Blu ray And
in the four K Donner footage beautiful takeoff. Yeah, you
(01:55:11):
watch carefully, you'll notice there are two guys inside Lewis's apartment.
She jumps up and down.
Speaker 1 (01:55:20):
And there's somebody sitting down to dinner and the next
in the lower one.
Speaker 3 (01:55:23):
Actually he's sitting down on the toilet. Oh is that right,
little Donner humor there? Yeah, back to Leicester footage. There's
that white one piece jumpsuit there like they wear on
the roof.
Speaker 1 (01:55:41):
Back of marbles.
Speaker 3 (01:55:46):
Yeah, we never see Clark's office, do we. Another newspaper
(01:56:26):
on the wall is that the I spent the night?
Speaker 1 (01:56:29):
Now it is.
Speaker 3 (01:56:36):
Lester did a good job with putting papers throughout the set, right.
Speaker 1 (01:56:43):
The way a reporter would probably put one of their
most you know, famous articles up.
Speaker 12 (01:57:07):
H y.
Speaker 1 (01:58:03):
There just hasn't been chemistry like this between two characters
in any Superman film like this.
Speaker 3 (01:58:18):
And this is proof that no matter who's directing them,
they have magical chemistry.
Speaker 5 (01:58:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:58:27):
Now, our good friend Daniel Sanchez did some research and
found out that Action Comics number three, six and November
of nineteen sixty three featured the Superkiss really something very
similar to this. There was a lot of discussion during
(01:58:52):
the development of the Richard Donner cut Superman two years ago.
Should we use the Lester super Kiss or should did
we go back to the original script with the world
around they Michael Thaw, who we've interviewed on our podcast,
he actually called me and said which version would you use?
(01:59:12):
And I said, well, I'd use the super Kiss or
I just leave it where she knows. Yeah, but they
decided to stay true to the mank ending.
Speaker 1 (01:59:25):
Good for you.
Speaker 3 (01:59:46):
Chris's Clark Ken is so amazing.
Speaker 1 (02:00:00):
Mhm mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (02:00:15):
Ibm.
Speaker 3 (02:00:16):
Selectric typewriter. They still have those rotary phones.
Speaker 1 (02:00:25):
H I loove how he looked back at her after
her Just just double check to make sure everything I
think solid.
Speaker 3 (02:00:38):
Look, look at the background the Motel signs Neon signs there.
Speaker 1 (02:00:49):
Yeh mh again another another scene that you just goes
(02:01:16):
go back to the first time you saw it, and
how great, how great it was in the theater.
Speaker 3 (02:01:21):
Oh, people cheered when I saw them. Yeah, many times
I went to see this in the theater. Every time
they cheered.
Speaker 1 (02:01:30):
That punch in the hand cracking, there it.
Speaker 3 (02:01:34):
Is, And I did a freeze frame on his food. Yeah,
it's steaking eggs with big beans.
Speaker 17 (02:01:44):
Oh watched, Yeah, tilt.
Speaker 3 (02:02:12):
I love how the wife grabs the money out of
his hand. She look at her face. My second favorite
scene in the movie. Yeah, same shot frozen right and
a sky added with the miniature Leicester footage in the
(02:02:47):
seventy nine script. He goes back and pushes the leaning
tower piece of back in its place. Then they go
to this, there's no American flag.
Speaker 1 (02:02:56):
This shot the same as the first film or or
different version.
Speaker 2 (02:02:59):
This is a different version version.
Speaker 1 (02:03:07):
Coming soon. Superman three.
Speaker 3 (02:03:14):
You didn't have to wait till the end of the
credits this time, right, like in Superman the movie, of
course it said coming next year. That's right, And we
didn't see it until at least in the US till
nineteen eighty one.
Speaker 1 (02:03:35):
Well, fantastic. Every time we see Superman two.
Speaker 3 (02:03:38):
It did an amazing job putting all the footage together. Yeah,
John Victor Smith, the editor, really had a monumental job
on his hands. M h.
Speaker 1 (02:03:52):
It was like putting together a puzzle. And again they
had they needed, They needed to really go through the script,
see what they shot, what they didn't, and then they
they're kind of right around things, which they did and
really at least.
Speaker 3 (02:04:04):
Remember all the boxes of footage in that making of
that in his editing room. One of the most exciting
extended TV cuts, of course, is this film, which came
out on ABC TV in February of nineteen eighty four. Yeah,
(02:04:26):
and the fans today so desperately want a blu ray
of that. And when I talked to Warner Archive a
few years ago, right after Superman the Movie Extended Cut
came out, they very much had an interest in releasing it,
but we haven't seen it yet.
Speaker 1 (02:04:44):
So much of the footage that you see in the
lesser extended TV cut included Donner footage that we saw
in the Donner cut. Do we know what some of
the existing scenes are that we've yet to get good
copies of, Well, a Concord fly button, the Concord five.
Speaker 3 (02:05:03):
I sure we've only seen that on the you know, VHS,
Penn and Scan rights. The extended TV cut is about
nineteen minutes longer than the theatrical Okay. The theatrical cut
is about sixty six percent Lester and thirty four percent Donner, Okay,
(02:05:27):
but the TV cut is forty five percent Donner Lester
fifty five.
Speaker 2 (02:05:33):
So there's less Lester.
Speaker 1 (02:05:35):
More Donner right in the TV cut.
Speaker 3 (02:05:37):
In the TV cut right, the richer Donner cut is
eighty three percent Donner sixteen percent Lester.
Speaker 1 (02:05:46):
Because there was just some things they had to use
from Lester to make the Donner cut.
Speaker 3 (02:05:51):
The Metropolis Battle, the Niagara Falls, scenes like that. There
is a typo in this, Okay, Instead of prison Warden,
(02:06:12):
it's prison Warner. Oh and they credit Jack Cooper as
Jackie Cooper.
Speaker 1 (02:06:19):
That's right now.
Speaker 2 (02:06:19):
I don't know if that's a mistake.
Speaker 3 (02:06:21):
I don't think that was his nickname or his formal name,
but all the promotional materials also say Jackie Cooper. I
bring that up because some fans initially thought it was
Jackie Cooper the editor playing both parts. Well, obviously it wasn't.
Speaker 1 (02:06:41):
Niagara Parks Commission.
Speaker 2 (02:06:45):
Do you have a favorite scene or moment in Superman two.
Speaker 1 (02:06:51):
I love you know, the Alley transformation obviously like you
and I love General would care to step outside? That's like,
you know, it's game on.
Speaker 3 (02:07:03):
You know that really does work better than freedom of
the pressure.
Speaker 1 (02:07:06):
Yeah, there you go. That's Superman two, the Leicester Cut.
We hope you'll join us again on the Cape Wonder
Superman podcast because Jimmy know what's next. The Donner Cut,
Superman three, Superman four.
Speaker 3 (02:07:18):
And then when the extended TV cuts come out, we
must do those as well.
Speaker 1 (02:07:22):
We'll have those as well. Thank you everybody for listening today.
I hope you had fun hanging out with us, and
it was great to hang out with each other and
get to do this today.
Speaker 3 (02:07:30):
Hey Jay, I'm really glad you're here in my home.
Speaker 1 (02:07:33):
Yes, that's right.
Speaker 3 (02:07:34):
Doing this together really makes a difference, and we hope
that you had a grand time listening to us go
on and on in our continued excitement about this film.
Speaker 1 (02:07:44):
So many years later, I forget that we're doing commentary.
Sometimes I got sucked into the film and couldn't stop watching,
and I've only seen it a million times. Thank you
everybody for listening. We'll see you again. Soon stay Super
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