June 19, 2024 • 15 mins
Explore Camden Battlefield with Military historian Rick Wise and David Duncan from the American Battlefield Trust, including modern discoveries and historical insights. Step back in time to the American Revolution, as Darley Newman takes you on location to highlight the sacrifices made by soldiers and the ongoing efforts to preserve this hallowed ground. Learn about the August 1780 Revolutionary War battle, a British victory by General Cornwallis. Experience the sights and sounds of the battlefield, including the thunderous roar of artillery with local reenactors led by Tray Dunaway, who is involved with the yearly “Battle of Camden Reenactment.”
Learn more about visiting South Carolina’s oldest inland city, Camden, and battlefields like this one at battlefields.org. Listen for other “Travels with Darley” podcast episodes exploring battlefields and historic sites in South Carolina, New Jersey and Virginia. Search for the PBS TV and streaming version of the “Travels with Darley” series to further explore these locations and other places to travel around the world.
Learn more about visiting South Carolina’s oldest inland city, Camden, and battlefields like this one at battlefields.org. Listen for other “Travels with Darley” podcast episodes exploring battlefields and historic sites in South Carolina, New Jersey and Virginia. Search for the PBS TV and streaming version of the “Travels with Darley” series to further explore these locations and other places to travel around the world.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
The city of Camden in South Carolina is the oldest inland city in the state,
(00:04):
located northeast of South Carolina's capital city of Columbia. Camden, during the American
Revolution, became a major supply post for the British during the Southern Campaign,
and a major battle took place that we're still learning about today. We're traveling to
Camden, South Carolina, where military historian Rick Wise shares what it's like as a soldier.
(00:28):
What took place here is very humbling to me when I think about the soldiers in the sacrifice
that night. And David Duncan at the American Battlefield Trust, who works to safeguard sites like
this, explores modern discoveries, making us think differently about the past. We look at battlefields
as outdoor classrooms, that there's nothing like the power of place. There's just something unique
(00:54):
about being in exactly the same place where tremendous events in our country's history
happened. We'll also bring in all five senses, especially our sense of sound. Today, we're going to
be using a three-pounder cannon and, darling, I'd like you to actually do all the firing. As we
look at artillery from the American Revolution, to understand what soldiers might have contended with
(01:18):
during battles. This is a podcast meant to share a sense of place, and why we should travel and learn
about these sites today. By taking you on location to Camden Battlefield, you'll learn from a soldier
why wars are the past are so relevant, and poignant, in modern times.
I've visited a lot of sites related to the American Revolution as I film Revolutionary Road trips,
(01:46):
a sub-series of my long-running PBS and streaming series travels with Darley. I've been filming this
content in the lead up to 2026, the 250th commemorations of the founding of the United States.
When you visit sites that date back 250 years or more, and many of them are battlefields,
sometimes there isn't much to see. A mound of earth, historical placard, acres of forest,
(02:13):
it's hard to imagine what went on, without the proper context. Which is why I was happy to be able to
explore Camden Battlefield with historian Rick Wise. The Battle of Camden was foought on August
16, 1780. Unfortunately it turned out very, very badly for the Patriots. Rick and I are walking
on sandy grassy footing, just past a split rail fence and a historical placard at Camden Battlefield.
(02:40):
The terrain is relatively flat and dotted with a variety of pine trees.
Two-thirds of the army ran the militia, kind of how the militia had fought earlier in the war,
and it was the worst tactical defeat of an American army during the American Revolution.
Camden Battlefield is part of the Liberty Trail in South Carolina, a route that traces Revolutionary
(03:01):
War history sites throughout the state. From 1775 to 1784, the Revolutionary War saw North American
colonists in a fight against the British for independence. Some of the most significant American
losses and victories took place in South Carolina. Rick, how many people died here at the Battle of Camden?
(03:23):
You know it's really hard for us to tell, but we think it's around 400 that are still here on
this battlefield. And so this is hallowed ground. Those soldiers after the battle were buried pretty
much where they fell. Over here are the graves of five continental soldiers who were buried together.
(03:46):
I could envision these guys probably back-to-back guarding each other as they tried to fight these men
off until they all went down and then they were buried in a common grave. The sacrifice they made
was remarkable. They allowed the escape of a lot of those continental soldiers on the other side of
the battlefield. Those soldiers who stayed at was to escape this battlefield, they were the ones that
(04:10):
fought the Battle of Cowpins Guilford Court House, Hobkirk Hill, Euwtaw Springs, and they were
the ones who accepted the surrender at Charleston. So a lot of our independence and liberty that we have
today was the result of the sacrifice of these five men that were recovered here at the Battle
(04:33):
Field at Camden. Do we know anything about these men, their age, where they came from?
The five soldiers here, and there were a total of 12 continental soldiers recovered here at the
Battle Field at Camden. Two of these soldiers over here were teenagers. One of those over here was
somewhere around 30 years old, and then the old man was about 40, and we can kind of think that maybe
(04:58):
he was their sergeant, and he fought with them and led them until they all went down. And this
took place on the battlefield after Lord Cornwalis committed his reserves to include the 71st
Highlanders. They were probably surrounded at the point, and they paid the ultimate sacrifice.
When we think about history, we think of the past, but what we know is constantly evolving,
(05:25):
including at battle sites like Camden Battlefield. In 2020, researchers discovered remains
in a shallow grave on the battlefield, a combined effort of historians, researchers, archaeologists,
anthropologists, and forensic analysts work to learn more. David Duncan of the American Battlefield
(05:45):
Trust, whose mission is to preserve battlegrounds and educate the public about the history, shares more
about the discovery. They made some amazing archaeological progress there at Camden
that allowed them to identify, believe it or not, even after all this time has passed. They identified
(06:07):
the 12 of those 14 were American patriots. One was probably a North Carolina loyalist, which meant he
was on the side of the British. And then one was actually a member of the 71st regiment of foot,
a group called Frazier's Highlanders. So he was a Scotsman fighting for the British at that time.
(06:32):
It just drives home the point that all of these battle fields from the Revolutionary War,
still to this day all the way up through the Civil War, are to a certain extent military cemeteries.
That something like this could still happen here in 2023 at that time, just I think to me really
(06:55):
drives that point home. They found these soldiers, they wanted to respectfully study them
from an archaeological perspective, which they did. And that's how they were able to identify
these folks, not necessarily by name because soldiers back then didn't wear dog tags,
but they have a pretty good idea who they were and who they fought for. David was at Camden
(07:21):
Battlefield in the spring of 2023 when a ceremony was held to honor the Revolutionary War soldiers
as there remains made their way back to Camden. They had a very, very moving ceremony to re-enter
those soldiers as well. And I was very privileged to attend that last year. And it was one of the
(07:44):
most amazing two-day ceremonies I've ever been involved with. The ceremony included military
honors for the soldiers and a flyover by the South Carolina Army National Guard in Apache helicopters.
You had the U.S. Army involved. You had a contingent of Scottish soldiers come and they went
through all the military pageantry and respectful ways of handling military dead.
(08:13):
And it was just so incredibly moving. I will also say that at one point during the ceremony,
I stopped and I just looked around 360 degrees because this was conducted actually on the Camden
Battlefield outside the small town of Camden, South Carolina. And there were at least as many,
(08:34):
if not more people on that battlefield that day for that re-entermed ceremony,
that have been on that battlefield since the day of the battle.
Walking the battlefield with Rick Wise, a soldier himself, gives greater meaning to what transpired
here. So on a hot foggy August day with a lot of smoke going off from cannons and artillery being
(08:59):
fired, we had this battle where hundreds people died. That's right. And the thing is, it actually was
right at dawn. Daylight then was at five o'clock in the morning and this battle was fought
and over by six o'clock in the morning. So in that darkness, the early morning glome with the
(09:22):
gun smoke, the pungent in the air, you know, these guys fought and made the ultimate sacrifice here.
How many battles in South Carolina, Rick, were there during the American Revolution?
There were over 200 battles and engagements. And so there is a very solid argument that the
Revolutionary War was won here in South Carolina from 1780 to 1782 because it was a stalemate in the
(09:48):
north at this time and what took place here was really what sealed the fate of our becoming the
nation that we are today. So it's pretty interesting to understand that the sacrifices here at this
battle and at the other places around South Carolina, for us, there were times where Francis Marion and
(10:13):
the swamp fox and his men were the only resistance to the British going on here in the Southern Campaign.
And it's hard to believe that Marian and only a couple of hundred men was able to accomplish that
but he did. He was a natural partisan guerrilla type fighter. So one of those things that we look at
(10:34):
today and it's just amazing to us that they were able to pull that off. And when we look at the
casualties that were here, I've studied military history, I've practically my whole life and
recovering these men here has given it definitely a different persona because these guys are not
(10:57):
excerpt from history, they're real and they're right here with us. And so the ceremony that we held to
honor them was an honor that was over 242 years in waiting until we were able to do this. So it was
our honor and privilege to be able to acknowledge those folks and the 400 who are here.
(11:18):
Rick, how do you feel being out here? I mean you've studied military history for a very long time
and you're an expert on this particular site but what does it mean to you when you walk out here and
you think about it? I was a soldier for 23 years and when I come out here I think of the soldiers
(11:38):
and you think of the hardships that they went through. Do I commune with these guys when I walk around
this battlefield? I do. What took place here is very humbling to me when I think about the soldiers
and the sacrifice they might. For over 50 years the Battle of Camden Revolutionary War reenactment
(12:00):
has been the largest force on force Revolutionary War reenactment in the nation.
Tray done away in a group of reenactors are meeting me on the battlefield to give me a taste
of this annual event and greater context on the power of the artillery used in the battle.
If you've never shot off a cannon before put in your ear plugs, no you really won't need to listen
(12:22):
to this podcast but I had some in as I walked towards the cannon situated on two large wheels
at Tray and his team had brought to the sandy battlefield. He had it aimed down a long track
and I was going to be the one to help with the cannon firing. Today we're going to be using a
three-pounder cannon and darlie I'd like you to actually do all the firing. Search the piece.
(12:45):
You're going to search the piece. You're going to take this worm it's got a curved
hook spiral and you're going to put it into the cannon and pull out any debris.
Advance the charge. Load the charge. Ram the charge. That's it Brian. We are loaded and ready to go.
(13:07):
Make ready fire!
It's loud jarring and can certainly be dangerous. No one wants to lose a hand while firing a cannon
not in battle or in a reenactment which is why safety precautions and procedure are so key.
How fast would they have had to do this? This is a lot of steps. This is a crew could do this four
(13:33):
to five times a minute. Oh wow. That's the power of artillery. On the canton battlefield this
would be used either to shoot grape shot which is a one-inch iron ball and that's like a big shotgun
or it could be used as canister shots which use musket balls and again it amplifies the power of
(13:54):
one firing. So this was devastating on the battlefield. Most injuries from this battle
well there are different varieties of injuries but a lot of them could have come from the cannon
fire other than the fact that in a hot August morning there was an inversion and when you these when
this cannon shoots you will see the smoke it produces and when that cannon shoots it would just
(14:17):
get a haze over the entire battlefield. My mind feels more hazy yet clear as I leave the jarring
cannon fire from trays reenactment group and the impactful tour of the battlefield with brick wise
and I can't help but want to know more about this site and the aftermath of the battle here.
The next stop if you're traveling to canton battlefield this historic canton and the Revolutionary
(14:41):
War Center where a museum and living history site interpret this time period and the Southern
Campaign and if you want to learn more about visiting canton battlefield and other saps along the
Liberty Trail watch my travels with darling tv and streaming episodes on the Liberty Trail
and Revolutionary Road Trip in South Carolina taking you to these stops with local experts and check
(15:04):
out battlefields.org the website of the American Battlefield Trust to learn more about the history
and get practical advice for trip planning as well as the Liberty Trail app.
Thanks for joining me to get a greater appreciation and sense of place and history
on the travels with darling podcast and look for my other podcast taking you to battlefields in
(15:26):
Virginia, New Jersey and Europe. Places you can visit too.
The city of Camden in South Carolina is the oldest inland city in the state,
(00:04):
located northeast of South Carolina's capital city of Columbia. Camden, during the American
Revolution, became a major supply post for the British during the Southern Campaign,
and a major battle took place that we're still learning about today. We're traveling to
Camden, South Carolina, where military historian Rick Wise shares what it's like as a soldier.
(00:28):
What took place here is very humbling to me when I think about the soldiers in the sacrifice
that night. And David Duncan at the American Battlefield Trust, who works to safeguard sites like
this, explores modern discoveries, making us think differently about the past. We look at battlefields
as outdoor classrooms, that there's nothing like the power of place. There's just something unique
(00:54):
about being in exactly the same place where tremendous events in our country's history
happened. We'll also bring in all five senses, especially our sense of sound. Today, we're going to
be using a three-pounder cannon and, darling, I'd like you to actually do all the firing. As we
look at artillery from the American Revolution, to understand what soldiers might have contended with
(01:18):
during battles. This is a podcast meant to share a sense of place, and why we should travel and learn
about these sites today. By taking you on location to Camden Battlefield, you'll learn from a soldier
why wars are the past are so relevant, and poignant, in modern times.
I've visited a lot of sites related to the American Revolution as I film Revolutionary Road trips,
(01:46):
a sub-series of my long-running PBS and streaming series travels with Darley. I've been filming this
content in the lead up to 2026, the 250th commemorations of the founding of the United States.
When you visit sites that date back 250 years or more, and many of them are battlefields,
sometimes there isn't much to see. A mound of earth, historical placard, acres of forest,
(02:13):
it's hard to imagine what went on, without the proper context. Which is why I was happy to be able to
explore Camden Battlefield with historian Rick Wise. The Battle of Camden was foought on August
16, 1780. Unfortunately it turned out very, very badly for the Patriots. Rick and I are walking
on sandy grassy footing, just past a split rail fence and a historical placard at Camden Battlefield.
(02:40):
The terrain is relatively flat and dotted with a variety of pine trees.
Two-thirds of the army ran the militia, kind of how the militia had fought earlier in the war,
and it was the worst tactical defeat of an American army during the American Revolution.
Camden Battlefield is part of the Liberty Trail in South Carolina, a route that traces Revolutionary
(03:01):
War history sites throughout the state. From 1775 to 1784, the Revolutionary War saw North American
colonists in a fight against the British for independence. Some of the most significant American
losses and victories took place in South Carolina. Rick, how many people died here at the Battle of Camden?
(03:23):
You know it's really hard for us to tell, but we think it's around 400 that are still here on
this battlefield. And so this is hallowed ground. Those soldiers after the battle were buried pretty
much where they fell. Over here are the graves of five continental soldiers who were buried together.
(03:46):
I could envision these guys probably back-to-back guarding each other as they tried to fight these men
off until they all went down and then they were buried in a common grave. The sacrifice they made
was remarkable. They allowed the escape of a lot of those continental soldiers on the other side of
the battlefield. Those soldiers who stayed at was to escape this battlefield, they were the ones that
(04:10):
fought the Battle of Cowpins Guilford Court House, Hobkirk Hill, Euwtaw Springs, and they were
the ones who accepted the surrender at Charleston. So a lot of our independence and liberty that we have
today was the result of the sacrifice of these five men that were recovered here at the Battle
(04:33):
Field at Camden. Do we know anything about these men, their age, where they came from?
The five soldiers here, and there were a total of 12 continental soldiers recovered here at the
Battle Field at Camden. Two of these soldiers over here were teenagers. One of those over here was
somewhere around 30 years old, and then the old man was about 40, and we can kind of think that maybe
(04:58):
he was their sergeant, and he fought with them and led them until they all went down. And this
took place on the battlefield after Lord Cornwalis committed his reserves to include the 71st
Highlanders. They were probably surrounded at the point, and they paid the ultimate sacrifice.
When we think about history, we think of the past, but what we know is constantly evolving,
(05:25):
including at battle sites like Camden Battlefield. In 2020, researchers discovered remains
in a shallow grave on the battlefield, a combined effort of historians, researchers, archaeologists,
anthropologists, and forensic analysts work to learn more. David Duncan of the American Battlefield
(05:45):
Trust, whose mission is to preserve battlegrounds and educate the public about the history, shares more
about the discovery. They made some amazing archaeological progress there at Camden
that allowed them to identify, believe it or not, even after all this time has passed. They identified
(06:07):
the 12 of those 14 were American patriots. One was probably a North Carolina loyalist, which meant he
was on the side of the British. And then one was actually a member of the 71st regiment of foot,
a group called Frazier's Highlanders. So he was a Scotsman fighting for the British at that time.
(06:32):
It just drives home the point that all of these battle fields from the Revolutionary War,
still to this day all the way up through the Civil War, are to a certain extent military cemeteries.
That something like this could still happen here in 2023 at that time, just I think to me really
(06:55):
drives that point home. They found these soldiers, they wanted to respectfully study them
from an archaeological perspective, which they did. And that's how they were able to identify
these folks, not necessarily by name because soldiers back then didn't wear dog tags,
but they have a pretty good idea who they were and who they fought for. David was at Camden
(07:21):
Battlefield in the spring of 2023 when a ceremony was held to honor the Revolutionary War soldiers
as there remains made their way back to Camden. They had a very, very moving ceremony to re-enter
those soldiers as well. And I was very privileged to attend that last year. And it was one of the
(07:44):
most amazing two-day ceremonies I've ever been involved with. The ceremony included military
honors for the soldiers and a flyover by the South Carolina Army National Guard in Apache helicopters.
You had the U.S. Army involved. You had a contingent of Scottish soldiers come and they went
through all the military pageantry and respectful ways of handling military dead.
(08:13):
And it was just so incredibly moving. I will also say that at one point during the ceremony,
I stopped and I just looked around 360 degrees because this was conducted actually on the Camden
Battlefield outside the small town of Camden, South Carolina. And there were at least as many,
(08:34):
if not more people on that battlefield that day for that re-entermed ceremony,
that have been on that battlefield since the day of the battle.
Walking the battlefield with Rick Wise, a soldier himself, gives greater meaning to what transpired
here. So on a hot foggy August day with a lot of smoke going off from cannons and artillery being
(08:59):
fired, we had this battle where hundreds people died. That's right. And the thing is, it actually was
right at dawn. Daylight then was at five o'clock in the morning and this battle was fought
and over by six o'clock in the morning. So in that darkness, the early morning glome with the
(09:22):
gun smoke, the pungent in the air, you know, these guys fought and made the ultimate sacrifice here.
How many battles in South Carolina, Rick, were there during the American Revolution?
There were over 200 battles and engagements. And so there is a very solid argument that the
Revolutionary War was won here in South Carolina from 1780 to 1782 because it was a stalemate in the
(09:48):
north at this time and what took place here was really what sealed the fate of our becoming the
nation that we are today. So it's pretty interesting to understand that the sacrifices here at this
battle and at the other places around South Carolina, for us, there were times where Francis Marion and
(10:13):
the swamp fox and his men were the only resistance to the British going on here in the Southern Campaign.
And it's hard to believe that Marian and only a couple of hundred men was able to accomplish that
but he did. He was a natural partisan guerrilla type fighter. So one of those things that we look at
(10:34):
today and it's just amazing to us that they were able to pull that off. And when we look at the
casualties that were here, I've studied military history, I've practically my whole life and
recovering these men here has given it definitely a different persona because these guys are not
(10:57):
excerpt from history, they're real and they're right here with us. And so the ceremony that we held to
honor them was an honor that was over 242 years in waiting until we were able to do this. So it was
our honor and privilege to be able to acknowledge those folks and the 400 who are here.
(11:18):
Rick, how do you feel being out here? I mean you've studied military history for a very long time
and you're an expert on this particular site but what does it mean to you when you walk out here and
you think about it? I was a soldier for 23 years and when I come out here I think of the soldiers
(11:38):
and you think of the hardships that they went through. Do I commune with these guys when I walk around
this battlefield? I do. What took place here is very humbling to me when I think about the soldiers
and the sacrifice they might. For over 50 years the Battle of Camden Revolutionary War reenactment
(12:00):
has been the largest force on force Revolutionary War reenactment in the nation.
Tray done away in a group of reenactors are meeting me on the battlefield to give me a taste
of this annual event and greater context on the power of the artillery used in the battle.
If you've never shot off a cannon before put in your ear plugs, no you really won't need to listen
(12:22):
to this podcast but I had some in as I walked towards the cannon situated on two large wheels
at Tray and his team had brought to the sandy battlefield. He had it aimed down a long track
and I was going to be the one to help with the cannon firing. Today we're going to be using a
three-pounder cannon and darlie I'd like you to actually do all the firing. Search the piece.
(12:45):
You're going to search the piece. You're going to take this worm it's got a curved
hook spiral and you're going to put it into the cannon and pull out any debris.
Advance the charge. Load the charge. Ram the charge. That's it Brian. We are loaded and ready to go.
(13:07):
Make ready fire!
It's loud jarring and can certainly be dangerous. No one wants to lose a hand while firing a cannon
not in battle or in a reenactment which is why safety precautions and procedure are so key.
How fast would they have had to do this? This is a lot of steps. This is a crew could do this four
(13:33):
to five times a minute. Oh wow. That's the power of artillery. On the canton battlefield this
would be used either to shoot grape shot which is a one-inch iron ball and that's like a big shotgun
or it could be used as canister shots which use musket balls and again it amplifies the power of
(13:54):
one firing. So this was devastating on the battlefield. Most injuries from this battle
well there are different varieties of injuries but a lot of them could have come from the cannon
fire other than the fact that in a hot August morning there was an inversion and when you these when
this cannon shoots you will see the smoke it produces and when that cannon shoots it would just
(14:17):
get a haze over the entire battlefield. My mind feels more hazy yet clear as I leave the jarring
cannon fire from trays reenactment group and the impactful tour of the battlefield with brick wise
and I can't help but want to know more about this site and the aftermath of the battle here.
The next stop if you're traveling to canton battlefield this historic canton and the Revolutionary
(14:41):
War Center where a museum and living history site interpret this time period and the Southern
Campaign and if you want to learn more about visiting canton battlefield and other saps along the
Liberty Trail watch my travels with darling tv and streaming episodes on the Liberty Trail
and Revolutionary Road Trip in South Carolina taking you to these stops with local experts and check
(15:04):
out battlefields.org the website of the American Battlefield Trust to learn more about the history
and get practical advice for trip planning as well as the Liberty Trail app.
Thanks for joining me to get a greater appreciation and sense of place and history
on the travels with darling podcast and look for my other podcast taking you to battlefields in
(15:26):
Virginia, New Jersey and Europe. Places you can visit too.
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