Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Chris Cuomo, the host of theeponymous Cuomo Show, which airs on News
Nation at six pm weeknights, andI highly recommend it. It's also maybe
the only TV show I know thattakes calls. Maybe one of your colleagues
takes calls, Chris, But Ithink that's pretty cool. Welcome back,
Good to have you for us.What the time to be alive? Well?
(00:23):
Yeah, indeed, I was quitefascinated by your conversation with Tim Burchett
yesterday on the show. Can youjust describe that briefly? Listeners? Yeah,
Look, I know Tim Burchett,Republican Tennessee, big trumper, okay,
not a bigot, okay, Nota guy who's a biggot but doesn't
know it. Not a guy who'sa bigot but won't say it. Not
(00:45):
a big one. Now, youknow. Joe Biden hung in albatross around
Vice President Harris's neck when he saidI'm picking a black woman. What he
should have done is, if hewanted to pick Harris, fine, picture
said here's why I'm picking her ABCANDD and she's a black woman, shall
be the first of her That's awesomeand we wouldn't have this problem right now,
Biden didn't say that. He said, I'm picking a black woman.
(01:06):
And for Burchest to say Harris's aDEI higher because Biden said it doesn't make
him a bigot. That's what Bidensaid, and it was unfair to Harris.
So here we are now in anelection that's shaping up, and yes,
there are lots of different variables andthings to criticize and look at,
but if it goes the way it'sstanding now, it's Harris saying I'm a
(01:29):
prosecutor. You don't have any stinkon me about barismo or a laptop or
any other fantasy. And this guyis a felon and a pig and a
liar, and I know guys likehim, and that's who he is.
And on the other side, it'sthis is the manifestation of DEI if she
gets in, which is just tome a dog whistle to saying, be
(01:49):
where the black lady. And weall lose in this election. We all
lose. You don't know what anybody'sfor, you don't know what they're going
to do. There's no agenda toget us to a better place. It's
just a battle of which is worse. And that's where I think we're headed.
So I think that if Republicans godown the road of trying to make
this about her being a Dei higher, I think they will lose. I
(02:14):
think if this election were truly aboutissues, which it mostly won't be,
but if it lure, Trump wouldwin. Harris is going to try to
make it about personalities and all thatsort of thing, and if Trump goes
along with it, Trump will probablylose. I want to say one other
thing, because I've been paying attentiona lot and your show and some other
(02:34):
people talking about this whole Dei higherthing. So here's my take, and
I want I think you basically saidthis already, but I'm going to put
it in my own words. Soit would be a political mistake for Republicans
to keep talking about Kamala Harris asa Dei higher because the only people who
would think that that's an interesting orfunny line are people who are already voting
(02:58):
for Trump. It doesn't add anybody, and they should not go down that
road because they need to get moderatesand women and suburbanites and young people,
and that line will turn all thosepeople off. But it is true that
she was a Dei higher because shewas only picked, in my opinion,
because she was a half black,half Asian woman. There were lots of
(03:19):
reasons not to pick her, andonly the DEI reason to pick her.
Look, let me argue the otherside just for the audience's benefit. Okay.
If it's a personality contest, Ithink Harris loses because the cult of
personality and the intensity of the baseis on Trump's side, and an extension
(03:40):
of personality is always about the mongogueryand about what somebody is afraid of and
wants you to be afraid of.And I think arguing DEI is an issue.
Yeah, election is always about issues. It's about which ones, and
it's I'm afraid of the boogeyman,the far left, removing what is gender
(04:02):
and having people who are Cemo sizedswimming against twelve year old girls. If
that's the issue, and it's aboutpersonality one, you can't beat Trump because
you can't. You can't win witha negative campaign against him because nobody who
votes for him cares about his negatives, which is the weirdest thing I've ever
(04:23):
witnessed in policies. So I thinkfor Harris to win, it has to
move away from who Trump is andhow she identifies him as filling the blank
of nasty things right and move toward. This guy is going to take away
reproductive rights in this country, notjust for women, for men, because
(04:44):
IDs is the way so many familieshave been created, which means men aren't
going to be able to create afamily the only way they may be able
to either. And he has alsodone And you have to fill in these
other things that she will fight against. I think affordability is going to be
a bigg issue for her. Yeah, and then well the borders the problem
for her, And I don't youknow these people are pitching me. Now.
(05:08):
Hey, you know Cuomo, youwere on faired Harris Man when you're
saying she's going to have to ownthe southern border because you know Biden charged
her with that. You know,she was only charged with figuring out the
migratory issue and that was really abouther working with other countries and she's been
doing it. Here's my problem.One, it's too late for you to
tell me that and rediply it.Two, even if that is what she
was doing, we never heard fromher again on it. So she's got
(05:30):
a problem. And if you're explaining, you're losing in politics, and I
think personality wise, she doesn't wantto get in this fight. Man.
This is why social media is unsurprisinglybut suddenly filled with all this propaganda about
her dating life and how she gotto the top and all these other,
(05:51):
you know, very very sexist tropes, right, which also also a really
dangerous road for Republicans to go down. Even though I'm reasonably confident, based
on people I know from California thatthose stories are basically right, it doesn't
mean that it's a good tactic forRepublicans. I've got I got about ninety
(06:11):
seconds left. Chris, Who ifyou were Kamala Harris, who would you
pick as a running maiden? Why? I don't know, man, It's
a little out of my depth.I'm someone who doesn't really believe in the
VP role on the ticket that much. This time may be different, for
good and bad reason. If Harrisis at the top of the ticket,
if I'm Shapiro from Pennsylvania, isAmerica ready for a black and a Jew?
(06:36):
I don't know. People will getupset when I say that you call
him his biggots. Yeah, wehave problems with minority groups, and I
think there are a lot of peoplein this country who may still or until
too long not too long ago,thought Jews are different, maybe some have
borns on their heads and all thisother crazy nonsense. I think that we
do have a problem with that inthis country. I don't think it makes
(06:58):
us ugue. But he did winPennsylvania, a huge you know, a
huge diverse Calvania, and he's atfifty plus percent popularity there right now with
this political environment is baffo. Buthe should only consider it if the understanding
is he stays governor two reasons.One, he may well lose and that
was stuck for him. Two,I would argue I can do both for
(07:20):
this period, and you need meas the sitting governor if you want any
chance to win Pennsylvania, because youneed me to have that kind of control
over the party process in that state. But I don't know that he's enough
to win it. I think ifthat's your bet, you're better off going
with Kelly. Kelly is interesting becausehe's completely unassailable on a personal level.
(07:42):
You go after that guy personally,even Trumper's will be offended because he is
such a stand up guy and justwhat he did with his wife alone and
an astronaut. You know, he'she's an all American guy whose wife got
shot by a person, you know, and Trump people depending you know,
you're talking about a reasonably rational,rational Trump person, not just someone who
(08:05):
you know, you have two typesof voters right now that we're paying too
much attention to. Trump is adespot in the making who's going to destroy
the democracy. And on the otherside, Democrats are whole bent on removing
gender and everything else and they aregoing to make us all freaks. So
outside of those two voters, peoplewho are voting for Trump, they may
not be open to hearing bad thingsabout Trump because it's already built in and
(08:26):
they're more pissed off at other thingsand want to disrupt a force. Then
they want someone to virtue themselves.But they don't like hearing Trump go after
people for things where he is absolutelyno better. And so you go after
Mark Kelly, you know, oreven Kamala Harris for sleeping around for somehow
(08:48):
having any kind of moral question.It doesn't hit, you know, it
doesn't land well. So Mark Kellyis absolutely strong there, so is Shapiro.
Cooper is interesting, but he doesn'treally get anything. Because North Carolina
does not really in play. Ithink the last time that when Democrat was
for Obama, and that was witha huge oversample of the black vote,
Well why wouldn't Harris get it?I think black woman is different than black
(09:11):
man, even within the black community. Not to treat them as a monolithe,
but we tend to have a genderbias in any demographic on top of
whatever other biases exist. And youalready had your first so it doesn't have
as much shine on it as thatproposition did in two thousand and eight.
And also the country is in adifferent place and the reaction formation was to
a righty president, not a leftypresident. So I think that the problem
(09:35):
that the Democrats are going to haveto deal with immediately is, Hey,
you said you were going to havea process. There's no process. This
is more of a coronation. Andwhat happened to Biden. I think they'll
get over that question. Yeah,I don't think it matters either. And
I think Trump is so polarizing thatthe people who want to beat Trump don't
care what the process is. ABTvote, The ABT vote is humongous.
(09:58):
Yeah, and Ross, I don'tlike that you cut me, give me
such a little time. Well,then we got to get you on the
show at a different time where wehave more time to talk. Chris Clomo's
show is called Clomo at Airs weeknightsat six pm. I will talk with
your person about putting you on adifferent time in the show if you want
to spend a little more time withme, which would be great. Ross
Listen, I just got off LarsLarsen's show, okay, and I get
(10:18):
where he's coming from. And Itake the opportunity because I think there's value
in it. But it's got tobe guys like you that get us to
a better place. It's got tobe guys who don't have a home team,
not guys who apologize for having ahome team and lie about having a
home team and deny it. Ifwe keep playing to the teams, we're
going to keep losing the game.Folks, watch Chris weeknights at six on
(10:41):
News Nation. Thanks for being here, Chris, talk to you soon later.
Brothers, all right,
Chris Cuomo, the host of theeponymous Cuomo Show, which airs on News
Nation at six pm weeknights, andI highly recommend it. It's also maybe
the only TV show I know thattakes calls. Maybe one of your colleagues
takes calls, Chris, But Ithink that's pretty cool. Welcome back,
Good to have you for us.What the time to be alive? Well?
(00:23):
Yeah, indeed, I was quitefascinated by your conversation with Tim Burchett
yesterday on the show. Can youjust describe that briefly? Listeners? Yeah,
Look, I know Tim Burchett,Republican Tennessee, big trumper, okay,
not a bigot, okay, Nota guy who's a biggot but doesn't
know it. Not a guy who'sa bigot but won't say it. Not
(00:45):
a big one. Now, youknow. Joe Biden hung in albatross around
Vice President Harris's neck when he saidI'm picking a black woman. What he
should have done is, if hewanted to pick Harris, fine, picture
said here's why I'm picking her ABCANDD and she's a black woman, shall
be the first of her That's awesomeand we wouldn't have this problem right now,
Biden didn't say that. He said, I'm picking a black woman.
(01:06):
And for Burchest to say Harris's aDEI higher because Biden said it doesn't make
him a bigot. That's what Bidensaid, and it was unfair to Harris.
So here we are now in anelection that's shaping up, and yes,
there are lots of different variables andthings to criticize and look at,
but if it goes the way it'sstanding now, it's Harris saying I'm a
(01:29):
prosecutor. You don't have any stinkon me about barismo or a laptop or
any other fantasy. And this guyis a felon and a pig and a
liar, and I know guys likehim, and that's who he is.
And on the other side, it'sthis is the manifestation of DEI if she
gets in, which is just tome a dog whistle to saying, be
(01:49):
where the black lady. And weall lose in this election. We all
lose. You don't know what anybody'sfor, you don't know what they're going
to do. There's no agenda toget us to a better place. It's
just a battle of which is worse. And that's where I think we're headed.
So I think that if Republicans godown the road of trying to make
this about her being a Dei higher, I think they will lose. I
(02:14):
think if this election were truly aboutissues, which it mostly won't be,
but if it lure, Trump wouldwin. Harris is going to try to
make it about personalities and all thatsort of thing, and if Trump goes
along with it, Trump will probablylose. I want to say one other
thing, because I've been paying attentiona lot and your show and some other
(02:34):
people talking about this whole Dei higherthing. So here's my take, and
I want I think you basically saidthis already, but I'm going to put
it in my own words. Soit would be a political mistake for Republicans
to keep talking about Kamala Harris asa Dei higher because the only people who
would think that that's an interesting orfunny line are people who are already voting
(02:58):
for Trump. It doesn't add anybody, and they should not go down that
road because they need to get moderatesand women and suburbanites and young people,
and that line will turn all thosepeople off. But it is true that
she was a Dei higher because shewas only picked, in my opinion,
because she was a half black,half Asian woman. There were lots of
(03:19):
reasons not to pick her, andonly the DEI reason to pick her.
Look, let me argue the otherside just for the audience's benefit. Okay.
If it's a personality contest, Ithink Harris loses because the cult of
personality and the intensity of the baseis on Trump's side, and an extension
(03:40):
of personality is always about the mongogueryand about what somebody is afraid of and
wants you to be afraid of.And I think arguing DEI is an issue.
Yeah, election is always about issues. It's about which ones, and
it's I'm afraid of the boogeyman,the far left, removing what is gender
(04:02):
and having people who are Cemo sizedswimming against twelve year old girls. If
that's the issue, and it's aboutpersonality one, you can't beat Trump because
you can't. You can't win witha negative campaign against him because nobody who
votes for him cares about his negatives, which is the weirdest thing I've ever
(04:23):
witnessed in policies. So I thinkfor Harris to win, it has to
move away from who Trump is andhow she identifies him as filling the blank
of nasty things right and move toward. This guy is going to take away
reproductive rights in this country, notjust for women, for men, because
(04:44):
IDs is the way so many familieshave been created, which means men aren't
going to be able to create afamily the only way they may be able
to either. And he has alsodone And you have to fill in these
other things that she will fight against. I think affordability is going to be
a bigg issue for her. Yeah, and then well the borders the problem
for her, And I don't youknow these people are pitching me. Now.
(05:08):
Hey, you know Cuomo, youwere on faired Harris Man when you're
saying she's going to have to ownthe southern border because you know Biden charged
her with that. You know,she was only charged with figuring out the
migratory issue and that was really abouther working with other countries and she's been
doing it. Here's my problem.One, it's too late for you to
tell me that and rediply it.Two, even if that is what she
was doing, we never heard fromher again on it. So she's got
(05:30):
a problem. And if you're explaining, you're losing in politics, and I
think personality wise, she doesn't wantto get in this fight. Man.
This is why social media is unsurprisinglybut suddenly filled with all this propaganda about
her dating life and how she gotto the top and all these other,
(05:51):
you know, very very sexist tropes, right, which also also a really
dangerous road for Republicans to go down. Even though I'm reasonably confident, based
on people I know from California thatthose stories are basically right, it doesn't
mean that it's a good tactic forRepublicans. I've got I got about ninety
(06:11):
seconds left. Chris, Who ifyou were Kamala Harris, who would you
pick as a running maiden? Why? I don't know, man, It's
a little out of my depth.I'm someone who doesn't really believe in the
VP role on the ticket that much. This time may be different, for
good and bad reason. If Harrisis at the top of the ticket,
if I'm Shapiro from Pennsylvania, isAmerica ready for a black and a Jew?
(06:36):
I don't know. People will getupset when I say that you call
him his biggots. Yeah, wehave problems with minority groups, and I
think there are a lot of peoplein this country who may still or until
too long not too long ago,thought Jews are different, maybe some have
borns on their heads and all thisother crazy nonsense. I think that we
do have a problem with that inthis country. I don't think it makes
(06:58):
us ugue. But he did winPennsylvania, a huge you know, a
huge diverse Calvania, and he's atfifty plus percent popularity there right now with
this political environment is baffo. Buthe should only consider it if the understanding
is he stays governor two reasons.One, he may well lose and that
was stuck for him. Two,I would argue I can do both for
(07:20):
this period, and you need meas the sitting governor if you want any
chance to win Pennsylvania, because youneed me to have that kind of control
over the party process in that state. But I don't know that he's enough
to win it. I think ifthat's your bet, you're better off going
with Kelly. Kelly is interesting becausehe's completely unassailable on a personal level.
(07:42):
You go after that guy personally,even Trumper's will be offended because he is
such a stand up guy and justwhat he did with his wife alone and
an astronaut. You know, he'she's an all American guy whose wife got
shot by a person, you know, and Trump people depending you know,
you're talking about a reasonably rational,rational Trump person, not just someone who
(08:05):
you know, you have two typesof voters right now that we're paying too
much attention to. Trump is adespot in the making who's going to destroy
the democracy. And on the otherside, Democrats are whole bent on removing
gender and everything else and they aregoing to make us all freaks. So
outside of those two voters, peoplewho are voting for Trump, they may
not be open to hearing bad thingsabout Trump because it's already built in and
(08:26):
they're more pissed off at other thingsand want to disrupt a force. Then
they want someone to virtue themselves.But they don't like hearing Trump go after
people for things where he is absolutelyno better. And so you go after
Mark Kelly, you know, oreven Kamala Harris for sleeping around for somehow
(08:48):
having any kind of moral question.It doesn't hit, you know, it
doesn't land well. So Mark Kellyis absolutely strong there, so is Shapiro.
Cooper is interesting, but he doesn'treally get anything. Because North Carolina
does not really in play. Ithink the last time that when Democrat was
for Obama, and that was witha huge oversample of the black vote,
Well why wouldn't Harris get it?I think black woman is different than black
(09:11):
man, even within the black community. Not to treat them as a monolithe,
but we tend to have a genderbias in any demographic on top of
whatever other biases exist. And youalready had your first so it doesn't have
as much shine on it as thatproposition did in two thousand and eight.
And also the country is in adifferent place and the reaction formation was to
a righty president, not a leftypresident. So I think that the problem
(09:35):
that the Democrats are going to haveto deal with immediately is, Hey,
you said you were going to havea process. There's no process. This
is more of a coronation. Andwhat happened to Biden. I think they'll
get over that question. Yeah,I don't think it matters either. And
I think Trump is so polarizing thatthe people who want to beat Trump don't
care what the process is. ABTvote, The ABT vote is humongous.
(09:58):
Yeah, and Ross, I don'tlike that you cut me, give me
such a little time. Well,then we got to get you on the
show at a different time where wehave more time to talk. Chris Clomo's
show is called Clomo at Airs weeknightsat six pm. I will talk with
your person about putting you on adifferent time in the show if you want
to spend a little more time withme, which would be great. Ross
Listen, I just got off LarsLarsen's show, okay, and I get
(10:18):
where he's coming from. And Itake the opportunity because I think there's value
in it. But it's got tobe guys like you that get us to
a better place. It's got tobe guys who don't have a home team,
not guys who apologize for having ahome team and lie about having a
home team and deny it. Ifwe keep playing to the teams, we're
going to keep losing the game.Folks, watch Chris weeknights at six on
(10:41):
News Nation. Thanks for being here, Chris, talk to you soon later.
Brothers, all right,
The Ross Kaminsky Show News
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