Ugly, Lonely, Hurt: Real Talk + Is Amy's Face Fitness a Scam?

Kat runs Amy through a ‘con artist checklist’ to see if Amy’s fallen for a scam with all of her face fitness investments. Amy and Kat also go over 2 of the 8 core feelings: lonely and hurt (sharing gifts, impairments and relatable stories for each feeling—which the story that came up with hurt is something that recently happened between Amy and Kat!) 

Feelings can either guide us toward healing or lead us into cycles of suppression and disconnection. Feelings aren't good or bad, they simply are, and acknowledging them can be the first step toward reclaiming our energy, health, and wholeness.

Email: [e-mail]

HOSTS:

Amy Brown // RadioAmy.com // @RadioAmy

Kat Van Buren // @KatVanburen

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
All right, break it down. If you ever have feelings
that you just fons Amy and Cat gotcha, Cob and
locking no brother ladies and fels do you just follow
Ann the spirit where it's all the real stuff to
the chill stuff and the m but Swayne, sometimes the
best thing you can do it just stop you feel things.

Speaker 2 (00:27):
This is Feeling Things with Amy and Kat.

Speaker 3 (00:29):
Have you Tuesday Feeling Things? Formerly? I wanted to say
formerly four Things with Amy Brown because someone someone might
be tuning in right now and they're like, which tuning in?
Is that totally a radio thing, like tuning into the
dialtive But someone might be streaming us, downloading us at

(00:50):
the moment and listening and they're like, wait, what is
feeling things? Because I'm just trying to listen to four
Things with Amy Brown. But welcome to Feeling Things, which
is formally four Things with Amy Brown. I'm Amy, I'm Kat,
and today's episode one of Feeling Things. But it's episode
six hundred and fifty. If we were still four things,

(01:12):
that's crazy, so we could look at it that way,
which I don't know how we're really going to count
it because it's on the same feed and we have
somewhere between. I thought it was twenty five million, but
I got an update from our PR person because she
was putting together a press release, and it said nearly
twenty seven million downloads. But if you're listening right now,
and this is episode one of Feeling Things, and someone's

(01:34):
actually listening, then we have one download and counting. So
we're just excited that you're here. And if you have time,
or when you have time, if you can subscribe, follow
leave a review. That is very helpful, especially during this transition,
this makeover, this rebrand, and we're going to get into

(01:55):
a lot of different things today. One thing specifically that
is by request by Cat, which is about con artist,
but it's mostly because you think I'm getting conned.

Speaker 2 (02:03):
By your face fitness person. Right, We're going to go
through a checklist and see it could be true.

Speaker 3 (02:08):
I paid money officially thirty days ago.

Speaker 2 (02:12):
And are you getting something out of it? Well, we'll go,
we'll get into it.

Speaker 3 (02:15):
We get when we go we get a con artist checklist.
I'll tell you kind of an email I got today
from them and I was like, oh, perfect timing. We're
also going to go over core emotions, and today will
be part one because Kat's the therapist here, so she
knows the basics. Did you learn the eight core emotions
in school or no?

Speaker 2 (02:35):
Because there's not like an actual one eight feelings, eight emotions.
If you look on the internet, you're going to get
allion different answers. But there's a couple places that I've found,
well I use what works for me that it splits
them up into eight and then there's like sub sections,
so we're going to go through all of those.

Speaker 3 (02:56):
So eight core emotions coming up, and it may seem
a little bit basic, but what's cool about our emotions?
Which we're going to cover the first four today and
then next Tuesday we'll do the other four. But feelings
can be a gift or they can be an impairment.
And so you might be like, oh, I don't need
to know the core feelings or I already know them.
Of course I've heard those before, but you may not

(03:18):
know the gift that they give you, and you may
not know the impairment that they give you. So that's
really what we're going to be going over.

Speaker 2 (03:23):
Which that I feel like when you learn that, you're
more apt to actually feel the uncomfortable stuff because you
know that there's a gift in it, and sometimes it
just feels like, oh the sucks, you know.

Speaker 3 (03:34):
Yeah, I mean, and I want the gifts, like I'm
going to chase the gifts, like now that I know
there's gifts, like at the end of the tunnel, yeah,
I'm gonna be like, Okay, let's just feel this faster.

Speaker 2 (03:42):
Like last week when you hurt me, that gave me a.

Speaker 3 (03:45):
Gift, well, I didn't know that I felt hurt. I
felt hurt right, and then you were able to share
that with me, and hurt is one of the first
four that we're going to go over today. So we'll
share that story. And I learned something too in that
the faster you speak about it, the quicker it gets
resolved deep I mean, quote me, quote me, which obviously

(04:09):
that is exactly what happens. But so many times we
put things off or we don't want to bring it
up because we don't want to be a burden, or
we don't want to seem silly, or it's like, oh
is it us, which there was some of it going
on with you, and you were willing to address that
one on one with your therapist, which I can respect.

Speaker 2 (04:26):
I wanted to make sure that it wasn't just my
stuff coming up before I brought it up to you,
but then we brought it up pretty quickly.

Speaker 3 (04:34):
Well, you didn't even need to bring it up to
me because I brought it up to Yeah, we're giving
away the whole story, Okay, we'll do it when we
get into Hurt, and I do have a little side
story about my daughter, Sashira. She's seventeen. And you know,
we're starting to build like these segments, Like in a second,
we'll do the feeling of the day, so every Tuesday episode,
people will get a new feeling of the day that

(04:55):
we're going to focus on and talk about in today's word.
Like I never really thought about how that was an
actual feeling. I mean, i know I've used it like
I feel, but I'm like, wait, that's a feeling, like
where's the gift? So we'll go over that kind of second.
But as we were building out, like you know, things
we want to have, like in radio, we call them benchmarks,

(05:16):
so core things, when you tune in, you're gonna get it.
Like when Kat and I were doing the Fifth Thing,
the bonus episode for the Fourth Things podcast, we had
a quote every episode. So now on the Tuesday episodes,
you're gonna get a feeling of the day. And so
I was going over some of that was to share,
and she goes, can I have a segment on the podcast?
And I was like, what would your segment be? And
she goes, oh, I can talk about all kinds of things,
but I really like to discuss about that time that

(05:38):
you thought you knew.

Speaker 2 (05:39):
That guy and you.

Speaker 3 (05:41):
Were hanging out with that guy all the time, and
I knew all along, Like I knew right away this
is something's off, something's off, and how mom's gonna fall
for anything.

Speaker 2 (05:52):
And I was like, oh, just to share it, that'd
be a good segment.

Speaker 3 (05:55):
Well, I said, well, lucky for her, you're going over
a con artist checklist. This will apply to anything, whether
it's you know something you've signed up for, dating, a
work relationship. You can spot the con artists with the list.
But she really was easy. She knew to come on
and make a segment. Oh, she knew, and we talked
about it whenever I was severing that relationship, which is

(06:19):
a little backstory on that and I am not going
to get into the whole thing because I had to
shut it down and like to share that's not going
to be a segment. But I was spending time with
this one particular person and it turned out not to
be a healthy situation.

Speaker 2 (06:34):
It's a good way to put it.

Speaker 3 (06:35):
And she was sixteen at the time, and she knew it,
like she knew right away. She was, Oh, mom, I
kinda told you that from why didn't the beginning?

Speaker 2 (06:46):
I know, she's she's an adult, she can make an
own decision.

Speaker 3 (06:49):
She's like, I'm good at sniffing people out and figuring
out those details. So she wanted to come on and
share her thoughts about that. However, out of respect for
other people involved, Like, I don't think it'd be fair
for me to tell that entire story. Yeah, maybe I'll
feel differently in like a year.

Speaker 2 (07:03):
Yeah, it's too close right now. And it's also one
of those things that the further away from it, the
funnier it gets, you know. Yes, Oh wait another year,
so I'll be even more funny.

Speaker 3 (07:12):
I was thinking about that the other day. It's like, God,
how quickly our lives turn, because now I'm in a
completely different type of relationship, completely different type of person,
you know, like he's employed, it's a car stuff like that. Okay, okay,
feeling of the day, you ready for it? I'm ready. Okay,
we don't have any like fun. The feeling of the day.

Speaker 2 (07:36):
Like a little extra song. Here is the feeling of
the day.

Speaker 3 (07:42):
Okay, cat cat nailed it. Which, by the way, when
I get into the feeling of the day, which is ugly,
ugly is the feeling of the day. But Cat got
to my house and I was running a little behind
getting ready because I am drawing on my eyebrows right
now because I had them lasered off and now they're red.
The undertone is red like they're burnt off, like I

(08:05):
have a little bit of hair. But then underneath where
the microbladed, it's like a tattoo was lasered off and
the red part is left. So the red part is
going to get removed in like seven weeks.

Speaker 2 (08:16):
But it oh be red for seven weeks. Yeah, okay,
And it's red well right now. Doesn't look bad because.

Speaker 3 (08:22):
I put a layer of foundation over my brows and
then I put powder, and then I put a little
bronzer or something to give it a little sign of
color because my foundation's a little pale. Probably need to
upgrade that. And then I drew on my new brows. Well,
I drew them on the first time and they were

(08:43):
a little wonky, So then what do you do? I
have to start over.

Speaker 2 (08:46):
So did you watch a tutorial.

Speaker 3 (08:49):
No, it took me a minute to figure out this concoction.
Like I just kind of thought, well, I'm gonna draw
over the red and then I realized if I wipe
them out basically, and then I give myself more of
a blank canvas.

Speaker 2 (09:00):
But that's what a lot of people that I see
on TikTok, that's what they do. And they have eyebrows,
but they put foundation completely over them and make it
look like they are bald, and then they start anew
and they make their eyebrows look how they want ahead
of the Well, some people just do this anyway, so
maybe you're just on the makeup trends. Also, I think
you need to shout out the lift and snatch because

(09:22):
you're still using it and I cannot I can't describe
how real they look. My strokes, Your strokes, Your strokes
are good. Yeah, it's a The brand is in y
X Nicks. Is it called Nicks or in my ex
I have no idea. I don't know because I think
I always read that as NYC in my head.

Speaker 3 (09:40):
Okay, well it's even though it's an x Nicks. Yeah,
and lift and snatch is the brow like a pin
and it creates these lifelike strokes. But you got to
have a steady hand because so when I first started,
I was a little nervous, shaky, But now I've gotten
to where I'm like, yeah, you know, so, yeah, maybe

(10:02):
I have maybe there's a future for me.

Speaker 2 (10:04):
And is that why the feeling of the day ugly? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (10:07):
Well, you know, we have our emotional barometer box and
I was just flipping through some of them. When I
came across ugly. I resonated and I was like, Okay,
we're going to do this. So I dedicate this feeling
of the day to my brows. Feeling ugly isn't about looks.
It's about how we see ourselves when we're down. Our
mood distorts our reflection, making us focus on flaws that

(10:30):
aren't really there. Even the most beautiful people feel this
way when that happens. We don't need a makeover. We
need kindness, love and perspective. And if we can't find
that in ourselves, we can borrow it from someone who
sees us clearly.

Speaker 2 (10:45):
I love that you picked this. I think I've never
seen these cards, so I never have read that and
have looked at ugly as an actual emotion. But I
do talk about, because I specialize in body image and
eating disorders, is that when people see themselves in a mirror,
they don't see what they look like, they see how
they're feeling. So I love this, And a lot of

(11:06):
times when we look in the mirror, we were like, Oh,
I need to lose weight, or I need to dye
my hair, or I need a new wardrobe, when really
it's what you're saying, it's I need to go do
something nice for myself, and if I come back in
like an hour, I might see something different. Yeah, it's crazy.

Speaker 3 (11:22):
Try the dopamine dressing, Like, Yeah, instead of trying to
force some outfit to make yourself fit into, like a
trend or whatever's happening, or a color you thought you
wanted to wear, Like, go to your closet and get
a go to outfit that you know you feel good
in and put that on and then go in the
mirror and do what do they call it? The the
super woman pose? You're talking about where you stand in

(11:43):
the mirror.

Speaker 2 (11:44):
What is that called power?

Speaker 3 (11:45):
Post power post superwoman power?

Speaker 2 (11:47):
I like superwoman better power.

Speaker 3 (11:49):
Sometimes I when I'm doing my meditation.

Speaker 2 (11:53):
Sums up yourself. You know how some people.

Speaker 3 (11:56):
Sit well, and a lot of times I do. But
I sit calmly with my palms up if I'm wanting
to receive, and palms down if I'm wanting to feel grounded.
And then other times I just stick my thumb straight
in the air with my eyes closed. But I put
my arms out really straight, and I'm trying to channel
my thumbs out into the It's like a little antenna.

Speaker 2 (12:17):
I thought you were trying to like give yourself a
thumbs up.

Speaker 3 (12:20):
No, oh, I don't try to receive the where I
got the waves, But sometimes I do. I do it,
and I think that that's my body saying like I
need it, like I don't have it in me today,
so like Lord, give it to me, Lord give it
to me, you know, fill me up, give me the energy.
And I picture it going like I have a visualization
of it going like through my thumb all the way

(12:40):
down my arm into my body.

Speaker 2 (12:42):
I kind of did you learn that or you just.

Speaker 3 (12:44):
I don't know where I learned it. I certainly didn't come.
I mean, I don't know if it was over time
in different meditations that I've done, if maybe you're random
one on YouTube someone's like, now stick your thumbs in
the air and.

Speaker 2 (12:54):
You're like, okay, I'll do anything.

Speaker 3 (12:55):
I mean, I definitely didn't call it an antenna or
who knows. It could have been a yoga class at
one point. Which part of this podcast flipping over from
Four Things to Feeling Things is just the evolution of
where we are and the direction my life is going.
Meeting you, having you as now a full time host
with me, and kind of what we want to share

(13:15):
with others and come alongside people in their journey of
growing and therapy and whatnot. And Kat had a podcast
called You Need Therapy, and she has set that aside
and now here with us. So this is going to
be like a mixture of what we were doing on
Four Things and You Need Therapy and you'll see it.
That's the plan now, but we may continue to evolve.

(13:36):
But speaking of evolution, I was thinking back when I
first started doing yoga, way way way, way way back
in the day in Austin. I went too this one
class where they had gongs and they were laying there
and then they served this little tea afterwards, and I'm like,
I couldn't get the heck out of there fast enough.
But that was your first experience, yeah, because it was
this yoga studio sort of close to my mom's house.

(13:58):
So I decided to go, and I was terrified, like
I thought they had a gong. I remember even going
on the Bobby buoncher the next day and I'm like,
I don't know where I went, guys, but it was crazy,
like we were laying down and then we kind of
doing and unison. Yeah, we did a flow practice, but
then between the gong and the kool aid at the end,

(14:19):
you can't go right. But that's what it felt to me.
And now I'd be like, sign me up, Like where
is this classic?

Speaker 2 (14:29):
Nobody uses gongs anymore.

Speaker 3 (14:30):
I'm like, I want to breathe in unison? Yeah, are
we gonna chant?

Speaker 2 (14:34):
Because it probably felt very different. So You're like, this
is weird. I gotta get out. And now you've You've
embraced so many different things.

Speaker 3 (14:40):
So now I've evolved to where I stick my thumbs
in the air and channel the energy. I've also evolved
to where I'm doing face fitness in lua botox.

Speaker 2 (14:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (14:52):
I think the last time I got injected was six
six months ago.

Speaker 2 (14:59):
Yeah, six months sober.

Speaker 3 (15:00):
Six months clean from botox. I may go back to it.
I'm not antiet at all, Like if somebody wants to
get it, but for me, I wanted to know my
new baseline. And so for the last three months, so
January February March, I'm doing face fitness. The first two
months I was doing free things on YouTube. The month

(15:21):
of March I was doing.

Speaker 2 (15:23):
A paid course. You dove right in.

Speaker 3 (15:26):
And Kat thinks that I'm being conned.

Speaker 2 (15:28):
Yeah, So we're going to go over a list of
things that might indicate that you're being conned by somebody,
and then we're going to keep your tally and based
on your score, we're gonna vote. I'm gonna vote if
you're my scam score, your scam score, we'll see if
you got conned or not. But before we do that,
I do want to say I don't know if I've

(15:49):
said this before, but you doing the no botox is
a big deal. I feel like because you've and I
mean I'll pat myself on the back too because I'm
doing it. Too, But I have been getting botox for
a couple of years, and you get used to your
face looking a certain way, and so stopping doing that
it is like you have to get used to that again.

(16:09):
So I think it's a big deal that you're attempting this.
Even if you go back to it, it's just, hey,
I want to make sure that this is something I
still want to.

Speaker 3 (16:16):
Do, which I'll touch on the fact that the reason
why I decided to get my brows lasered off, my
micro bladed brows is because I stopped the botox and
my forehead changed. So you happen to be listening for
the first day. I've talked about this in previous episodes,
but I'll just give you that tiny bit of information
because you might be like, why would you get your
brows micro bladed and then have them lasered off. Well,

(16:39):
nobody tells you. Nobody tells you when you go get
a microbladed with botox that then when your forehead starts
to shift because it's not frozen anymore, your brows can
be wonky. And so that was happening to me. So
I was like, I need a fresh start.

Speaker 2 (16:52):
So thank you for spreading awareness. To that because people
might be like, oh, I'm going to stop this too,
and then they're like oh no now.

Speaker 3 (16:59):
But it may not. Everybody's foreheads different.

Speaker 2 (17:02):
I don't depending on where your wrinkles are, because I
mine didn't move because I my it was my eleven
wasn't as as now pronounced.

Speaker 3 (17:09):
I can give you an exercise for that.

Speaker 2 (17:11):
Okay, great, did you get that from your front?

Speaker 3 (17:15):
So you take this hook and then you press like
but you build it real good and you can even
do a vibrating sensation and then you go all.

Speaker 2 (17:22):
The way up.

Speaker 3 (17:23):
But you've got to really get deep into the muscle,
deep into.

Speaker 2 (17:26):
The So before we go into this list, can you
tell me where you found this person? Did she have
like a credential or TikTok? Got it?

Speaker 3 (17:35):
Yeah? I think she has uh sort of training in anatomy,
in kinesiology. I don't know where she received her letters,
but you know, like she has a certificate.

Speaker 2 (17:47):
I'm sure, Okay, I haven't seen it. Okay, before we
get into this, let's between a certificate and a degree.

Speaker 3 (17:54):
But she also has one of these cute little skeletons
and she knows all.

Speaker 2 (17:59):
Of the the bone, like she'll.

Speaker 3 (18:01):
Be like your muscle and I'm like, oh. And then
my friend Claire was telling her the other day. I
was like, you want to massage this? And then Claire
said that. She goes, oh, the Claire is a I
know she has degrees. But what I'm saying is Claire
said it, and it's the exact thing. She confirmed it,
which I don't know what. The reason why I don't

(18:21):
know exactly how to say it is because she's.

Speaker 2 (18:23):
Foreign, so you can say in the foreign language Claire.

Speaker 3 (18:28):
Claire said it and it sounded similar, and I'm like,
that's it. So yeah, she has an accent and her
English isn't great, so sometimes she's like, you know what's
this called? She's like, oh, your teeth or or you
know what's that You need to get a pull your
hair back with a hairband, stuff like that.

Speaker 2 (18:49):
So it's in English. Yes, okay, yes, okay, yes.

Speaker 3 (18:53):
Because when I was doing some free YouTube, I was
having to read the subtitle trends to know what to do,
which was a lot of work because I was like
trying to like massage my face and read. I just
want to be told. So she has who knows, maybe
she has a million something on TikTok, she has over
a million on Instagram, she's on YouTube with millions of views,

(19:15):
and then she has a course. Okay, so the course
is what I signed up for, so con artists checklist.

Speaker 2 (19:21):
Let's go through it. And I have a affinity for
this type of stuff. As you know, I'm very skeptical
of everybody of everybody. But I learned that the hard
way though, because I wanted to trust everybody, and then
I got really into things and I'm like, oh my gosh,
they're lying. And I will say I got a certificate
for something back in the day, and as I'm getting

(19:43):
the certificate, I was like, I could do this with
my eyes closed. So I kind of learned that you
have to be aware of what certificate somebody has, you know,
because I didn't learn anything in that course, and I
could have been doing all kinds of things. Okay.

Speaker 3 (19:57):
AnyWho, Yeah, I'll trust just about anybody. So which is
I mean.

Speaker 2 (20:02):
I'm not better that You're not worse, it's just different.

Speaker 3 (20:06):
No, I mean I feel like you're probably missing out
on a lot, which is back to Stashira's segment idea
that she wanted where she's like mama fall for anything.

Speaker 2 (20:17):
Probably a lot. Okay, Well, let's go through. This is
just a little checklist of things that might signify that
somebody is conning you or manipulating you.

Speaker 3 (20:26):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (20:27):
So I'm going to read them, and you're going to
tell me yes or notice is fit? And so like,
maybe why I'm going to read them and you're going
to tell me yes or notice is fit? Okay, And

(20:47):
so like maybe why does it seem too good to
be true? Yes?

Speaker 3 (20:51):
Because well, I mean, now that I think about it,
but I think that I'm like, wow, you can really
achieve these results by just massaging your face every day?
Like I guess at the end of the day, it
does seem too good to be true.

Speaker 2 (21:05):
Like she's over promising, but it still could be possible. Okay.
So it's not crazy. It's not like we'll make you
look like you're seven. It's like we can make you
look like you have botox by just these three simple Right.

Speaker 3 (21:17):
This is where I struggle because I have my I
want to give this a go, and I'm trying anything
brain and like, I think it's possible, but also could
it be too good to be true?

Speaker 2 (21:27):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (21:27):
So I'm just answering, honestly, okay, like at the end
of the day, yes, okay, okay.

Speaker 2 (21:32):
Are they promising guaranteed results with no risk?

Speaker 3 (21:37):
No, they're not promising guaranteed results. Everybody's a different starting stage,
is she said, in different ages?

Speaker 2 (21:43):
And okay? Do they make you feel like you're broken
or incomplete without using their thing that they're selling on
the method? No? Okay?

Speaker 3 (21:54):
Am I not getting called? So far?

Speaker 2 (21:56):
You're doing pretty good. Is there a sense of urgent
see or pressure to buy now or you're going to
miss out on something? Yes? Okay, what's that? Yes? She
said that it was sold out and you were got
on a wait list and then all of a sudden
you're in the file.

Speaker 3 (22:09):
And then I got an email and it's like, oh,
a spot opened up. It's all virtual, by the way,
I don't know why it would fill up, you know
what I mean?

Speaker 2 (22:17):
Wait?

Speaker 3 (22:18):
So, yeah, it's true, I know. But you know, maybe
she good sales tectic.

Speaker 2 (22:23):
Maybe she is.

Speaker 3 (22:24):
Making sure that her inbox doesn't get overloaded with questions
from her current students.

Speaker 2 (22:31):
That probably is what it was. Yeah, that could be it.

Speaker 3 (22:33):
But yes, there was definitely an urgency like get it now,
and then the price slash.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
Did you buy it before the price slashed.

Speaker 3 (22:40):
Yes, but when you go no, no, no, sorry, I
bought it with.

Speaker 2 (22:45):
The price slash, but it's like it was ever that
much money? Exactly?

Speaker 3 (22:48):
Yeah, because I don't know, I because I never saw
that page. But once I had access to the page
because she had to send you a special link because
now I'm special. So then I clicked on the link
and it's said, you know, like nine hundred dollars, and
then it had a big line through it and it
was like, now only one hundred and ninety nine dollars.
What a deal?

Speaker 2 (23:10):
Like I just saved seven hundred dollars.

Speaker 3 (23:13):
Wow, I was on a wait list. I made it
in and now I got the special link and the
special links the price is slashed. So yeah.

Speaker 2 (23:23):
That reminds me of infomercials growing up, when they're like
call the next five minutes and you can get this
for like four ninety nine, and then you go to
the grocery store and they're selling that same thing for
that same price. It's like just to get you to
buy it right then, smart business.

Speaker 3 (23:37):
Whenever I think of an infomercial, did you ever see
that one way back in the day with that guy
that had the nut chopper, and then he would be
chopping the nuts and be late at night. My mom
and I don't know what we'd be watching late at night,
but he would always come on and it'd be like, oh, yeah,
my mom loved to buy stuff like that.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
This is your mom.

Speaker 3 (23:59):
Yeah, and he'd be like, you're gonna love my nuts
and even be chopping it.

Speaker 2 (24:03):
And this is also a perfect example of how you
learn things from your environment, and so you are a
product of your environment. Right now, we don't have infomercials.
We have TikTok scammers. Okay, do they call themselves things
like face healer or ageous oracle or just do they
call themselves any kind of like self proclaimed guru.

Speaker 3 (24:26):
No, but she definitely says that other methods, like if
you're doing it this way, you're doing it wrong. But
then I've seen other people say this is how I
do it. So, but she doesn't have like a special
guru name. But does she have like what are her
like credentials? I don't know. Okay, I just know what's
in her Instagram bio and I don't know that that's even.

Speaker 2 (24:48):
Well, so this is this goes to those I don't
know if she's real.

Speaker 3 (24:51):
Honestly, sometimes I'm like, is this AAI?

Speaker 2 (24:54):
I think what gets a lot of people now is
anybody can call themselves any kind of like hell balistic
coach or this type of heal or this whatever, and
it sounds really fancy, but it's also something they just
made up, Like I could you could call yourself anything.
I could call myself anything and it could sound really good,
versus somebody who's really doing that's probably just like an esthetician,

(25:19):
you know. Yeah, Okay. Are they constantly posting testimonials that
sound a little too dramatic?

Speaker 3 (25:26):
Yeah, I mean some of the results are pretty dramatic.
So I feel like they either they cherry pick like
this was a good success story someone to highlight this,
or it's being photoshopped or something maybe I don't know, yeah.

Speaker 2 (25:40):
Or it's AI the whole thing.

Speaker 3 (25:43):
Well, no other people have joined because I see them.
I think I have a.

Speaker 2 (25:51):
Whole group of friends in my face fitness Facebook grouping. Okay.
Are they avoiding transparency about what actually is involved?

Speaker 3 (26:01):
No, like you have to, They're pretty transparent. However, I
don't know how they have the time and the day,
like what I has been required of me the last
thirty days. We don't have this time.

Speaker 2 (26:12):
I thought I was just seven, like seven minutes a day.

Speaker 3 (26:14):
No, the lesson is thirty minutes ish, she said. She
tries to keep the lessons at twenty, but they always
go over. So let's just call it what it is.
They're thirty then, but before you start the thirty minute
you have to do a two minute lymphatic drainage exercise
which opens up your limbs. And so that's two minutes.
So now we're at thirty two. Then if you want

(26:35):
good results, she highly recommends the bonus exercises after that.
And so I'm like, this is every day. I used
to do this on top of you know, go on
a walk in the forest with the trees.

Speaker 2 (26:49):
Is that part of it now?

Speaker 3 (26:51):
Like, that's just another thing that I like to do
because I want to be with nature and I want
to have that hit of dope.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
Can you do your drainage while you're on your walk?

Speaker 3 (27:03):
Yeah, but you want to do your drainage right before
you do your face fitness?

Speaker 2 (27:06):
Okay? Do they discourage you from doing other things that
could help?

Speaker 3 (27:11):
I haven't caught on to that yet. If she has,
I don't. I don't think she said, like, don't do
now she says, like, if you want to do washer,
if you want to put the oil on, she goes,
but I don't think you need any of that. But
a lot of people are like, oh, I love the
oil and the quasha. But she she's like, there's a
time and a place for.

Speaker 2 (27:27):
That, okay. And then are they trying to become like
your go to person like for that? So it could
be like your friend, it could be like your like
mentor your are they trying to become something?

Speaker 3 (27:42):
I mean, I guess sometimes when she says stuff like
that of like, okay, if you want to do that,
but you know, like that's not good. You need to
do what I'm doing.

Speaker 2 (27:52):
So and then I also want to add, this is online,
but if you wanted to like meet this person in person.

Speaker 3 (28:00):
I don't know where. I don't even know where in
the world she is, Like where, like, yeah, where in
the world does she reside? I think I saw something
the other day on TikTok about Miami. But then you know,
TikTok's weird, Like I couldn't figure out that video because
I don't even think it was herd that posted it.
You know, people repost other people's things, so I don't know.

Speaker 2 (28:18):
Okay, so your test is done and I'm going to
be honest. You might not be getting scammed.

Speaker 3 (28:27):
WHOA, okay, Okay, well then I'm just getting scammed on
time because I just completed the thirty days and we
get an email this morning like congratulations, you completed the
thirty days, and now for the next thirty days.

Speaker 2 (28:39):
She wants you to sign up for someone else.

Speaker 3 (28:41):
No, this is included. Oh, this is included a gift
from her.

Speaker 2 (28:46):
She's giving you a gift.

Speaker 3 (28:47):
The gift is for the next thirty days. Repeat it
the entire thing from day one to day three, because
now your hands are stronger, you know the techniques, so
you can do it better. And I'm like, wait a second, wait,
I have to do it again.

Speaker 2 (29:05):
Well, you're gonna have to do it for the rest
of it.

Speaker 3 (29:07):
There's my certificate. I just don't in my thirty days
like I want to.

Speaker 2 (29:10):
You should be going to teach it now.

Speaker 3 (29:12):
Yeah, but she said, we won't graduate until we do
it again. Oh and then maybe our body will be ready.
And what I have learned. Let me tell you, kat
Let me let me tell you a lot of our
wrinkles and what we're dealing with or sagging things in
the front part of our skull, which would be our face.
That's what we see, right. We have the part we

(29:33):
don't see, which is the back of our school where
our school meets our neck, the top of our our neck,
our shoulders. We spend more time massaging our trapezes, our
skylt like all these things that you don't see. We
spend so much time. And that's why she said, your

(29:55):
hands are stronger because some of the massages you really
have to get in there, and like your biceps tired,
and like your arms are up. We do all these,
like other things in these stretches, and sometimes a thirty
minute workout we won't even have touched our face. And
then I feel like that's a waste, but she says
it's not, because everything is playing a part and we

(30:16):
can see that. It's when we're relaxed back here, this
falls into place. When we're tight here, this SAgs.

Speaker 2 (30:23):
I could see that.

Speaker 3 (30:24):
So I'm not getting scamped.

Speaker 2 (30:25):
Well you're not.

Speaker 3 (30:26):
You're on board.

Speaker 2 (30:27):
I could be.

Speaker 3 (30:28):
I will send you the thirty days for just.

Speaker 2 (30:31):
One hundred dollars.

Speaker 3 (30:33):
I'll give you a deal.

Speaker 2 (30:34):
Ninety nine, I get a special link. Yes. Yes. I
also think that you kind of reverse your answer on
some of these things, like you said it she hasn't promised.
Does it seem too good to be true? And then
you said that she is making you do a double
thirty days. Yeah, like she's making it seem like it's
something that's not she wants it probably to be like oh, by.

Speaker 3 (30:55):
This, I'm just saying the results sometimes seem too good
to be true, like we're not looking at other people's results,
like is this for real?

Speaker 2 (31:01):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (31:02):
And then yeah, you could be true, like we know
at the time, like, dude, what it is you're could
be true? Nobody has time for this.

Speaker 2 (31:06):
But also this is I think a key that I
don't know if this is happening or not. When you
are getting scammed, there's usually always like what's next, Like
she's making you do this thing again, but it doesn't
sound like she's charging any more money.

Speaker 3 (31:19):
No, it's a gift, okay, but I feel like that means.

Speaker 2 (31:22):
Here's a free gift, So then you'll buy this other.

Speaker 3 (31:24):
Thing thirty days from now. It'll be like, remember that
free gift I gave you?

Speaker 2 (31:28):
You owe me? Yeah, And then you're gonna feel guilty.
So that's one thing I would have people look out for.
If there is always something else and it keeps going
and you have you need them. If somebody's not a scammer,
they're gonna teach you the thing and then they're gonna
let you go be free on your own versus like
I need you to stay with me and stay in

(31:49):
my tribe CULTI vibes.

Speaker 3 (31:51):
You know, if I pack my bags and move to
wherever in the world.

Speaker 2 (31:56):
The next step is in person, and I have to
go meet her this plane ticket to I don't know where.
You just show up.

Speaker 3 (32:03):
Yeah, okay, I will say my shoulders are more relaxed
and my posta is a little bit better, I feel like.
But I will say this checklist is good for anybody
that's you know, when you're following certain people on Instagram.
It could be just influencers that you follow and they're
talking about a particular product, and now there's there's I mean,

(32:24):
the spectrum is it's all over the place, but there
is one particular girl I started to follow a couple
of months ago, and I may unfollow because I've started
to realize I get hooked every single time, because I
think she's really good about that too good to be
true hook, and she gets me and like one thing,
she's into face fitness, and well, I guess probably a

(32:45):
lot of people that pop up in my account now
are face fitness because the algorithm, that's all it feeds me.
So I won't even pin this directly on her, but
so many people are like, I canceled my plastic surgery appointment,
which who knows what her plastic surgery appointment was. Was
it for botox? Because you can get botox at the
plastic surgeon's office. So I don't know if she's claiming
she's about to go get a facelift or something, but
she said that was her hook. It's like, oh, someone

(33:08):
canceled an appointment because of this. I'm going to pause
and watch, and then you know, she does like a
little temple massage here and like a nasal limn and
then it's like, oh, that's all you do every day
for three minutes, and you were able to cancel your
your appointment at the doctor for whatever it is you
wanted to change. But that's an example of one thing
that I've seen. And then they're good at in anything

(33:31):
they're trying to pitch, whether it's that you learn a
product or whatever, and some people just that's their gifts,
like they are really really good at it.

Speaker 2 (33:39):
Yeah. Yeah, and you just have to be aware. And
I think it's a different if it is taking resources
away from you that you actually don't have, that's one thing,
Like this is kind of harmless. I mean besides the time, right,
but if you like had to sell your house because
you had to afford this face fitness score, of course, right,

(33:59):
that you're being scammed and also you need some we
need help you in other ways.

Speaker 3 (34:04):
Okay, well I think you concluded I'm currently not getting
scammed at the moment, so yeah, we can high five
on that and then move on to core emotions and
speak Core Emotions Part one. Yeah, that's a ang.

Speaker 2 (34:17):
I love talking about feelings first of all, so I
could do this all day long, but I wanted to start.
I think we both wanted to start with feelings because
we're going to be obviously it's feelings things. We're going
to be talking about them all the time and relating
things back and learning how to identify my own feelings
and learning how to like sit in my own feelings

(34:37):
has transformed I think my relationships in my life in general,
because we're getting these gifts. So I like to describe
feelings as guides or tools. So they're not good or bad.
They're not right or wrong. If once you see this list,
you're gonna look at it and you're gonna say, Catherine,
there's only one good one. They're all the same, They're all.

Speaker 3 (35:01):
They are not good or bad. Yeah, they all have
an offering.

Speaker 2 (35:04):
They all have an offering, and they all have an
impairment if you choose not to feel them. And the
visual I like to give people is feelings are very
similar to the lights on the dashboard of your car.
So if you're driving down the road, and this resonates
with me a lot because I get so frustrated and
I feel so inconvenienced when a light pops up. So

(35:27):
I'm driving down the road and maybe a check engine
or my my change your oil light or something pops
up on my car. All that is doing is saying, hey,
there's something that you need to go look at or
check or pay attention to. So it's a tool, right,
that is, it's a guide that's leading you to what
your car needs. Yes, if you have to change my oil.

(35:50):
Probably inconvenient. I might it might like I don't know,
if I'm on a road trip, set me back an hour. However,
if I don't get that oil changed and my oil
is gone, but con guess what, my car is going
to blow up and I'm not going to ever get
to where I'm going, which I have had my car
stop in the middle of the road one time because

(36:12):
I had no oil and it was so inconvenient, and
it led me from I was in a rush and
I wanted to get to my full day of work
and I don't want to be late for my clients. And
then because I didn't just get my oil change when
I should have, I actually missed that whole day of work.
So you're going to be forced to pay attention to
it one way or another. Feelings are the same way,
So you have a feeling it's just signaling, Hey, there's

(36:34):
something that you need to pay attention to, that you
want to look at, that you just want to care for.
Could be inconvenient, but also if you pay attention to it,
you might get something that you're missing or needing.

Speaker 3 (36:47):
I think one thing to keep in mind too, is
people that grew up in a really dysfunctional environment. They
learned not to feel, and so there's a lot of
us walking around not me. I just mean humans that
don't even know how to feel. And I guess I
say not me because I don't like to put my
home as like dysfunctional. But everybody had their own dysfunction,

(37:08):
and I do think that my parents were emotionally unavailable.

Speaker 2 (37:16):
Dysfunctional doesn't always mean like right, like creative and bad.
It's really honestly, we're all paying attention. There's dysfunction in
every system, right.

Speaker 3 (37:25):
And that's why I had to rewind and sort of
stop myself because I'm like a lot of us walking
around because dysfunction.

Speaker 2 (37:30):
I'm like, not me.

Speaker 3 (37:32):
But then I was like, shoot, I don't want to
discount that. Yeah, there was some dysfunction in my home,
and I, as a parent, have created some dysfunction for
my kids. And it doesn't mean that you're a bad
parent or my parents were bad. Now, some people grew
up in environment where, yeah, you'd probably classify their their
upbringing as like, oh that was really rough. I had
loving parents. They loved the best that they could, but

(37:54):
they also were very shut down themselves. So that's something
I'm trying to undo generational trauma, Like whatever they had
from their parents, they were just doing the best that
they could. And I'm trying to offer my kids all
the space to feel and we want to feel all
the things and ask all the questions and dive in.
And I'm excited about doing this for people that maybe

(38:17):
are like me in their forties where they're trying to
figure some stuff out that they didn't have access to
early on.

Speaker 2 (38:37):
Yeah, I think it is important to note that when
we are in our dysfunction, most of the time, it's
coming from a good place. I'm doing what I know,
I'm doing what i'm taught to, doing what I think
is right, and specifically with feelings, because a lot of
them are uncomfortable to feel. Steering somebody away from them

(39:00):
probably feels like sometimes the right thing to do. And
then another thing to note is that because feelings signify
a need, that's why a lot of us shut them
down because I don't want to have to need something,
Because sometimes we're taught that we don't need to be
needy or we don't need to draw attention to ourselves,
especially women, so we shut those down and we're like, oh,

(39:21):
that's I'm okay, I'm fine, when really that's gonna come
out a different way. These feelings are also like energy,
So if I'm going to shut it down, I have
to put that energy somewhere in my body, and to
do that, I'm gonna have to displace something else. So
something's gonna come out, and then that energy is still
down there, and eventually you're gonna have to get that

(39:44):
out because you're gonna have something else to put there.

Speaker 3 (39:46):
But it's gonna be way more of an inconvenience, sort
of like when, yeah, you break down on the side
of the road, if you addressed it early on.

Speaker 2 (39:53):
Yes, yes, And I say all this too. I am
a therapist who goes to therapy myself, and I'm not
perfect at this stuff. So when I talk about this
stuff or teach it, it's also reminders for me and
anybody who's listening. I would just want you to give
yourself a lot of grace because, as you'll hear in

(40:14):
some of the stories we tell, I still get stuck
in this stuff as well because of just the way
our world is.

Speaker 3 (40:21):
Yeah. Okay, we'll especially get into that when we talk
about hurt.

Speaker 2 (40:24):
Yeah, but we're.

Speaker 3 (40:24):
Gonna start with feeling one, which is lonely.

Speaker 2 (40:26):
Yes, and I do want to shout out these little
worksheets that we made. So we made our own feeling
wheel that specifically talks about these eight emotions. And these
feelings are not the like I said in the beginning,
the right feelings. They're just the ones that I use.
And you look like here.

Speaker 3 (40:46):
We are exhibit A. But these are something that people
can have access to for a limited time.

Speaker 2 (40:57):
If you sign up in the next thirty seconds.

Speaker 3 (40:59):
There's a weight list to get these and we'll send
you a special link and then you can download them.

Speaker 2 (41:08):
Give us your bank account number.

Speaker 3 (41:10):
No, no, really, we should do a little thing. I mean,
we're not going to, but what if we did a
thing where it's like, this was five hundred dollars and
we put a red line through. We're like zero, Now
it's zero dollars. All you have to do is sign
up for a newsletter.

Speaker 2 (41:22):
We really should do that. I feel like that'd be funny.

Speaker 3 (41:25):
I feel like an inside joke. If people even made
it to this point in the.

Speaker 2 (41:28):
Podcast, they're like, what, who would buy that for five
hundred dollars? Like literally no, right?

Speaker 3 (41:35):
So, but really. If you sign up for our newsletter,
you will get the Feelings wheel, the Gifts of feelings,
which is another wheel chart situation, and then sort of
this flow chart, which I think is great, which really
breaks down the gifts that you'll get from each feeling,
and then the impairment want the impairment and the need

(41:58):
and the need, which is so helpful because prop to
get in this another time. But I was on a
phone call with my boyfriend today and I don't know,
I'm realizing I don't know how to express my needs
well because part of it feels selfish.

Speaker 2 (42:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (42:13):
Yeah, so that's all I'll say about that. So that's
something I'm working on too. And Kat's expert, she's the therapist.
But I love that you said I'm a therapist that
also goes to therapy, because I'd like to say I'm
a normal, everyday human that's not a therapist that also
goes to therapy.

Speaker 2 (42:29):
So we're the same. Yeah, we're the same.

Speaker 3 (42:31):
We're the same.

Speaker 2 (42:31):
And I will say with the need, that's like a
jumping off point because sometimes that's not always the exact need.
So I would take that as like a I would
take it with a grain of salt. I guess where
this could be it or it could be a version
of this, but it does help you start thinking about
what it is. I don't want people to get too
stuck on that part, because sometimes I might be like,
that doesn't fit. Okay, So do you want to just

(42:55):
get into it?

Speaker 3 (42:55):
Yeah, Lovely, we're feeling one.

Speaker 2 (42:57):
So we're starting with lonely. That need is to be known,
and so that can be a version of a lot
of different things, like being known can mean different things
to different people. I might just want my friend to
see me. I might want maybe in a there was
an event, or you know what, I'll just get into this.

(43:18):
I feel like in the situation we had, I was
feeling a little lonely because I wanted to be more
a part of the production that we were creating. And
so I felt like you were over there and I
was over here, and I just wanted you to know
more about what I could offer.

Speaker 3 (43:33):
Oh, and that was lonely for you. Yeah, And we'll
get into more of the in the weeds of that
when we talk about the feeling of hurt. When I
think of lonely, I think of a time when we
first adopted the kids or I was going through certain
things in my marriage where I didn't have community around
that because these were situations that I had never encountered before,
and I kind of felt like I was the only one.

(43:56):
I didn't know there were groups of people that would
meet and gather like I've yeah, I'm like, shoot, what
if I said? What if I not said? Over the years,
because it's not just my story, So there's things that
I went through there involving other people, and it's it's
their story too, So that's why I'm careful with details
and what I say and what I don't say. But

(44:18):
what I can say about that is I spent a
lot of time alone in my closet crying, and that
was before I found community in what I was going
through in both situations, so as an adopted mom and
as a wife, there were things. And once I found
community on the internet.

Speaker 4 (44:39):
Okay, you weren't scammed there first or Facebook, and then
I was like, oh, this is a group, and then
you know that was a group where you had to
get invited in, so I was all nervous, you got
a special link I got in, but then once I
got in, and then I did meet them in person,
so I realized there was a group of moms that
were gathering right here in Nashville where it was a
very safe space and you could say anything and there

(45:01):
was no judgment. And then in my marriage, I found
another group where I got to go meet and I'm like, oh,
and that gave me tools to get through that.

Speaker 2 (45:11):
When people saw you you felt like they're.

Speaker 3 (45:14):
Different Vergine and heard like I was like, oh, I'm
not alone. And then now I'm still involved in those things.
But now when I was calling some of those women
feeling lost and alone and like can you help me,
It's like now periodically I get a text or an
email or phone call from other people are like, Hey,
my friend is going through this right now. Can I

(45:35):
give her your number? Or can this you know? My
coworker's cousin is going through this, can you? I mean,
that's how distant, that's how desperate sometimes people are to
find people that understand what they're going through, because sometimes
you just don't know anybody, and it takes reaching out
and asking others, hey do you know anybody, and then
they might be like, oh, yeah, my neighbors, cousin, sisters,

(45:58):
father in law's stepdaughter is exactly who you can call,
let me reach out to her. And so now I'm
on the receiving end of that, where I was the
one seeking that out and people were there for me.
I'm able to now be like, oh, hey, here's what
we did. This is what I can say. Can't say
for sure that it will work for you, but this
is a starting point, and then hopefully they feel less alone.

(46:21):
And so that was the part where I felt very lonely,
and then once I found the community. But it took
me being proactive.

Speaker 2 (46:27):
Well, it took you acknowledging and allowing yourself to feel
the feeling. So if you didn't allow yourself to feel lonely,
that that impairment would lead you to be apathetic, it
would lead you to have distance, you wouldn't have as
close as relationships. I think that would even affect your
relationships that you already had. I for sure keep pulling

(46:48):
back because you would keep feeling like different or people
didn't understand, or you just would want to keep shutting
yourself down. And the only way to do that is
to not be face to face with what you don't have,
and then by feeling the feeling didn't feel very good.
I'm sure those moments in your closet were excruciating, but
that led you to intimacy and connection, which I think

(47:09):
a gift. That's the gift. Yeah, we want.

Speaker 3 (47:12):
The gift intimacy and connection with a little butt on it.

Speaker 2 (47:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (47:16):
Okay, okay, So are we good? Feeling one check?

Speaker 2 (47:19):
Feeling one check? We could do a whole episode probably
on each of these, but lonely specifically, we really could.

Speaker 3 (47:24):
Especially since especially since I just say that already because
in my brain I say that out loud twice. Maybe actually, especially.

Speaker 2 (47:33):
Since now you said it.

Speaker 3 (47:37):
Your CD's not skipping well since the pandemic loneliness has
been an epidemic of SS.

Speaker 2 (47:47):
Yes, and I'm.

Speaker 3 (47:47):
Sure we could spend a lot of time on it,
but we can move on to feeling too. We'll come back,
which will be hurt, Yeah, which is where Cat's going
to share out.

Speaker 2 (47:56):
I hurt her. I felt hurt, but you didn't do
it to me.

Speaker 3 (48:00):
I didn't do it to you, and I didn't mean to. Yeah,
I didn't even know I was doing it.

Speaker 2 (48:04):
So I like to say that nobody can make you
feel anything. That's right. So as the tailings one oh
one right, and the reason I believe that is because
the same thing could have happened to ten other people,
and not everybody would have felt the same thing. It's
what is happening in the world is hitting my story
and my stuff, and then I feel something about it.

(48:27):
So not trying to invalidate what I was feeling, I'm
just really trying to that's helpful when you confront somebody
about it, or I'm not like you did this to me,
it's I felt this so hurt. That need is a
lot of times just simply attention, attention to whatever it
is came up, and I'll share the story, but first

(48:51):
I'll share the impairment and the gift. So if you
are unaware and you don't let yourself actually acknowledge hurt,
which I think we do a lot because when we're
our feelings are hurt, I feel like people make that
sound like weak or you're being dramatic or get over it.
You know, that's the whole like put yourself up by
your bootstraps and like keep going, like oh, if it's

(49:13):
not broken, keep going kind of thing. And so when
we're unaware, that really leads to resentment. And what I
do most of the time is I become passive aggressive,
or I like stonewall. People all cut people out without
even realizing it. So we don't want that.

Speaker 3 (49:30):
However, few no, we don't, especially since we just launch podcasts.
We can't be having that, And then our friendship is
more important to me than the podcast.

Speaker 2 (49:37):
So there's yeah, yeah, And if you are aware, it
leads to healing, which obviously feels good, and it helps
build courage. So the more I can actually confront somebody
about an experience I had, the more courage I have
to do that, because it's it is hard, it's vulnerable.
You don't know how somebody is going to respond.

Speaker 3 (49:56):
And I feel like sometimes in a romantic relationship, when
we decid to actually let someone in and share a
feeling or what we are feeling, I think it's important
to say I am feeling this way, not to your partner.
A lot of times in relationship could be like, well,
you made me feel this way, so I'm glad you
clarified that that nobody can make you feel a certain way.
But there is this fear of if there's not healthy communication,

(50:20):
that it's your feelings won't be valid, that it'll be
met with you're being dramatic, yeah, or you're overreacting, which.

Speaker 2 (50:28):
That can happen, And I get the one. There are
people that you confront, there's people that you don't. If
you know somebody is going to probably not be receptive
and you've already been through this, then there's more of
a boundary of Okay, I need to find healing, but
that healing might not always come from the person that
I felt the hurt way.

Speaker 3 (50:48):
So do you think that that's the case even if
you're in a romantic relationship with someone, Well, if you're in.

Speaker 2 (50:51):
A romantic relationship with somebody, I would say, let's talk
about it. And if they are not able to validate
your feelings consistently over and over and over again, then
maybe you are not in a healthy relationship and you
want to evaluate do I want to still be in this?
I think there's some people we can't avoid, like a boss,
or like my parents, or just somebody who's in your

(51:13):
life that you for one reason oother you can't it's
not that easy to end that relationship, So evaluate that
because you don't want to then put yourself in a
position where that's going to feel even worse or that's
going to kind of dig deeper a story you already
have in your head.

Speaker 3 (51:30):
So that's that just the side note of healing doesn't
have to come from the person that hurt you. Yeah, okay,
And in our case, yeah, we were able to resolve
it pretty quickly, which I think was a good thing
to experience early on in this endeavor because it was
related to episode one, this very episode, except for you're
not listening to the original episode that we did because

(51:52):
we already recorded an entire episode one and it is trashed.
It's actually literally in the cat's trash box on her computer.
It's in the trash, which is for the better.

Speaker 2 (52:04):
Yeah. Do you want to share what happened to it?

Speaker 3 (52:06):
Well, so I okay, will you share your part?

Speaker 2 (52:11):
I'll share my part.

Speaker 3 (52:12):
So I woke up two days after we recorded it.
So we recorded it because we were trying to get
way ahead because you know, we have video.

Speaker 2 (52:18):
Now of everything.

Speaker 3 (52:20):
Shout out go to our Instagram at Feelings Things podcast. Yeah,
we're only five years behind on that, but we're going
to consistently have video. I've dabbled in that with Four
Things a little bit, but this is just part of
our our big girl pants now. And we filmed it
recorded it, and with social stuff, we were trying to

(52:42):
get way ahead of schedule, and so I woke up
two days after we recorded it and I just had
this feeling. It's almost like I woke up even the
middle of the night of like something was off. I
didn't like the way we did it. I didn't like
the vibe and like the energy. I know that it's
okay if we have a knee and we're leaning more therapy.
And in the first episode, I was very clear on

(53:06):
that this wasn't a therapy podcast. In fact, it was
in our original podcast description you know Kat's a therapist
and is like, this isn't a therapy podcast. Like I
felt the need to say that Kat's a therapist. She
had a podcast for years, a successful podcast that a
lot of people love, called you Need Therapy. And then
she's setting that aside to come join me, which was

(53:28):
something you wanted to do too. But we're joining together,
and here I am being like, this isn't a therapy podcast,
just so that everybody knows, over and over, and I
think you were sitting there thinking like, why does she
keep saying this so much? Like this is this is
like a sort of a slap to my face and like,
I'm a therapist and I have a lot to offer

(53:49):
and I would like for this to lean therapy. Well
I knew we may lean therapy, but some reviews or
comments that I've seen about me over the last four
years or so dms comments on my Instagram reviews of
the podcast, like on iTunes, oh this is leaning way

(54:10):
to therapy for me, or Amy's just to therapy. I
can't listen to her anymore. Means stuff which I've evolved. Yeah,
and so yeah, maybe I am leaning that way because
of things that I'm learning and that I find interesting
and stuff I have going on in my life. I
just want to share. Like I'm not claiming to be
the expert or anything. It just can be maybe like

(54:31):
come alongside other people that are going through things. And
when I read that about me, I thought, well, shoot,
I don't want to be put in that box. So
bringing you on as a therapist, I think I had
this well like it wasn't awareness awareness of it, but
maybe just somewhere my subconscious of like, oh, Cat's a therapist.
So I need to make sure that people know this

(54:52):
isn't going to be a therapy podcast because then they're
going to say more bad things about me. So it
is my own fear. And so I woke up two
days after we recorded, I'm like, why am I worried
about what any meaning mine and have said on iTunes
reviews about me and how I am as a person now.
And if they can't listen, that's fine. If they don't

(55:13):
want to listen, that's okay. There are other people that
may want this type of content. So we are a
therapy podcast, mental health minded. Kat give me that we
are mental health minded. So we're mental health minded. Cat's
a therapist. I don't even need to reiterate over and
over how we're not a therapy podcast, because who cares.

(55:34):
We're just going to be what we are and see
where it goes. And some episodes may lean more therapy,
some episodes may not. And we've got our couch Talks
episodes on Thursday where people are going to be writing
in and it may be questions they might ask a
therapist or a friend, which sometimes your conversations with a
friend is like therapy. So I just woke up with

(55:56):
this feeling of we need to redo this. I feel
bad that I made at that way and it's okay
to have a niche, and our niche is this, screw
anybody else who doesn't like it. So then I called

(56:18):
you and I'm like, hey, this is what I'm thinking
about this, and you were literally on your way to therapy,
I know, to just like rip me a new one
with your therapist. And you're in the car and you're like,
oh my gosh, I can't believe you called and you're
saying all this right now, because you were like, I've
been trying to process how I'm going to talk through
this with my therapist so I can figure out what

(56:39):
I need from this. Because you left that recording like
what am I even doing here? But I didn't know
you felt that way, and so I by saying over
and over this isn't a therapy podcast. That was hurting you,
and so I'm sorry for that.

Speaker 2 (56:55):
Thank you. That's my perspective. Yeah, and well, I think
most of what you said is what happens. So we
recorded this episode. I kept hearing the it's not a
therapy podcast over and over and over again, and I
think I you didn't realize how much you were saying it,
and I clocked it every single time. So I was really.
I actually was really fearful and anxious that day recording

(57:17):
because I didn't know how to be, because I was
worried if I, like I feel today, I can talk
as much as I want or as little as I want.
I can share whatever I want, I can add things.
But I was trying to like stay inside these imaginary
bounds that had been created because we weren't a therapy podcast.
But I also was trying to and I talked to

(57:39):
this about with my therapists before too. I have to
maintain some professional boundaries for myself as well, because I
want people who either, if you are my client, I
want you to be able to listen to this just
like you could listen to you need therapy. And I
want to be congruent with how I show up as
a therapist and how I show up here because this
is public, and so I didn't. I was like, I

(58:00):
feel like a dud, Like I can't be fun and
I can't be smart, or I can't be like I
didn't know how to be.

Speaker 3 (58:06):
So for that one comment, isn't that interesting me saying
that over and over dimmed your light?

Speaker 2 (58:12):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (58:13):
And that's the last thing I would want to do,
is dim your light, but it was my own insecurity
of worrying about whomever.

Speaker 2 (58:20):
Well, I also heard a lot of stuff that you said,
and I filtered a lot of stuff, Like when I
was like going back and recounting the conversation, I think
I exaggerated things that happened because I was hearing them through.
This is not a therapy podcast. So whenever you would
like stop me, I was like, oh my god, it

(58:40):
did something wrong right, like I just I felt. So
I got a lot of emotions, so it wasn't just
as you can see, you're feeling multiple emotions at once,
not just one. So I was going to go to
my therapist. Well, and the next day was your birthday,
so I said, well, I'm not going to talk about
it with her. And I also had this feeling that
I didn't like that. I was like, does she think
I'm stupid? Like does she not know? I felt like

(59:02):
does she not respect me? And that all started coming
up and I was like why is this bothering me
so much? So I knew I needed to process it.
I knew that I didn't want to talk about it
on your birthday. But after your birthday party, I came
home and I said to Patrick, I said, Amy's such
a good friend, and it's because I was seeing you
in a different light too. It was like this was
not about work, and I was like, she does like

(59:24):
me and think this about me and think this about me?
So what was going on in me that I saw
everything she was saying and doing through this filter and
through this lens. So I knew part of it was
my own stuff. But still the timing was so weird
because I even walked into my therapist's office and I said, Okay,
I don't really know what my angle is now today

(59:46):
because I was going to talk about this, but now
I need to talk about this, and honestly thinking about
this today too when I was driving to work. That
experience was very helpful. I think for our relationship there
was healing, But also does this make me emotional? I
think that it allowed me to open up a place
that I need healing in my own life too. And again,

(01:00:08):
somebody hurt, they're being hurt doesn't mean you did anything wrong.
It almost is like you showed me a spot that
I need to go back and address because I realized
that a lot of my life I have survived on
being smart and that's what I offered, Like that's what
I was versus I was other things, but that was

(01:00:28):
like what I was like, Well, if I have this,
I'm okay and I want I went back and I
started talking about all the things that I wish I
would have done as a kid. I was like, and
I want to do these things, and I want to
do these things, and one of them was like an
improv class, And I was like, Amy's been trying to
get me to do an improv class, Like she's trying
to heal this part of me and I don't even
know it. So it was very cool for me to

(01:00:48):
be able to take that experience, really sit with it,
use it as a tool. What is it that I need?
There are things that I need that I had no idea.
I was still feeling pain from that had nothing to
do with you.

Speaker 3 (01:01:00):
Yeah, when I think that, that's the beauty of the experience.
That's the gift of allowing yourself to feel the emotion
and also us feeling safe enough to come to each
other and both want to hear what the other person
has to say. Like I called you and woke up
with this epiphany and I shared it, and then you
were able to finally say, especially because you didn't want

(01:01:21):
to bring it up on my birthday, like Okay, well
you're not gonna believe this, but I'm about to go
into my therapist, and you were able to share with
me exactly and I held space for that.

Speaker 2 (01:01:30):
You were really good at listening, which.

Speaker 3 (01:01:32):
If I wasn't in a healthy place, who knows, Like
if I could have held space for that, if I
had a different filter that then I was taking what
you were saying through. And that's what I think can
happen when there's big disconnects and relationships. It's like everyone
has their filter and it's like nobody's feeling seen or heard,
and it's like oh, And so I was very thankful
that we were able to come to a resolution and

(01:01:55):
heal that in such a timely manner. And I think
that was a gift for us, especially starting this out
because it's episode one.

Speaker 2 (01:02:03):
And it's a gift for everybody else too. That episode
was not good.

Speaker 3 (01:02:07):
It wasn't like like it was pretty terrible, like people
probably unsubscribe. So I think we were both just not
ourselves because I was too busy trying to fit a
mold that I think listeners would want of me and
then trying to force you into that when you're like, hello, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:25):
I'm kat I am like that's part of who I am.

Speaker 3 (01:02:28):
Went to grad school.

Speaker 2 (01:02:30):
Don't tell me, Buddy's not a therapy podcast.

Speaker 3 (01:02:34):
Oh yeah, and we're over that. Yeah, Okay, this is
so the whatever you need it to be podcast.

Speaker 2 (01:02:40):
So well, yeah, but we do have a niche, but
we have a niche feelings in therapy, but there's a
there's so many gifts in that. I think that is.
I'm glad that happened because of the things that I'm
getting in my own life, the things that we're able
to gain from each other, like we're learning about each other.

Speaker 3 (01:02:57):
And that, Well, something else you said to me that
stood out of like you're like, I'm also trying to
figure out like I always have the need to be right,
and you're you were able to say this is even
an issue in my own marriage of like the I
always have to be right. So I just wanted to
so I was, yeah, I think your awareness and be like, okay, yes,

(01:03:18):
when you have awareness, it's it's so beautiful. It can
suck because you're like I hate that I am this
way and people have to put up with me being
this way, but you can work on it, Yeah, when
you can work on it. Yeah, I wasn't saying you.

Speaker 2 (01:03:36):
You can work on this part of you because you're
not always right Cat, I'm really not. And I am
glad you said that because I forgot that was one
of the things I was going to go in and
talk about of I need to be better at knowing
when I really am in the right and when I
am being stubborn and when I'm just used to people

(01:03:56):
listening to me. Because I work by my I work
for myself, so I haven't had a boss since I
was twenty six. So I'm in this new partnership and
I'm like, dang it is it? Am I not good
at working with people? And I'm married to somebody who's
very agreeable, So I want there to be space for
his voice. And so this was another opportunity for me

(01:04:16):
to say, for me to feel like, what does it
feel like when I really do feel like this is
something that has happened, And what does it feel like
when I'm just being my egos taking over ego? Yeah,
we all have it, even though we don't want it.
We need it to survive. But yeah. I like to
say self awareness really is knowing that there's so much

(01:04:37):
stuff that you don't know. Yes, So the more self
awareness I have, the more I know that, like I
need a lot of help, which we'll get to because
that's part of another feeling.

Speaker 3 (01:04:46):
And you can find all the help you need here
because we're a therapy podcast.

Speaker 2 (01:04:50):
Just kidding me, You've got from one side of the
spectrum to the other.

Speaker 3 (01:04:54):
Now I'm being yeah, I'm joking, being silly. We just
are who we are, and you are a therapist. I'm
trying to figure out here with what do you think
on time? Because I feel like we've should we keep
going through the other two or should we we stop
with her and then pick back up, pick back up
next week.

Speaker 2 (01:05:13):
With yeah yeah fear.

Speaker 3 (01:05:15):
Yeah, we'll do to at a time, maybe two or
three maybe yeah, yeah, let's do that because we've got stories.
Because with Fear, I feel like I have a whole
story about my boyfriend. Okay, you can get into.

Speaker 2 (01:05:26):
That cliffhanger and China next time for the story about
her boyfriend's.

Speaker 3 (01:05:30):
We call it tease.

Speaker 2 (01:05:31):
That's what we call tea.

Speaker 3 (01:05:32):
Subscribe follow.

Speaker 2 (01:05:34):
If you subscribe, we'll send you the special episode about
Amy's fear for free and it's worth one thousand dollars.

Speaker 3 (01:05:41):
Yeah, we view all the details, which really doesn't matter,
but I want to share it because it does matter.
Why do we say things that sometimes we don't mean?
It does matter. I think it's important when you recognize
a fear, because that's one if you set aside, you
will miss out on life. You will miss out on something.
It could be unexpectedly fabulous.

Speaker 2 (01:06:04):
And fear doesn't. Well, we're getting into it. Fear does
not mean stop all the time. Sometimes it doesn't. Times
it doesn't. So let's get let's pause, pause, because I'm
gonna get ahead of myself.

Speaker 3 (01:06:14):
Okay, So fear coming up next Tuesday. It'll be tuned
be one of our core feelings and then uh feeling
for which we get into that next week with fear
is a little weird to me.

Speaker 2 (01:06:25):
It's glad.

Speaker 3 (01:06:26):
I never really I know it's a core feeling glad,
but I don't know that I spend too much time
with the word glad. So I'm glad we are.

Speaker 2 (01:06:35):
It is like dressful, old person word. I feel like
it's like gladness feels like it's from the nineteen twenties
or something, you know, like who says.

Speaker 3 (01:06:40):
I'm glad, Well, I say it when I Oh, I'm
glad about that, but I don't ever be like I
feel glad.

Speaker 2 (01:06:46):
Yeah, well, we'll get into.

Speaker 3 (01:06:48):
It and I can't wait to feel more glad.

Speaker 2 (01:06:50):
I will say with the feelings wheel, when you guys
see it, which I don't know, did we say that
we're sending it to them. If we did, say we
weren't kidding about that. We really will send it to you.

Speaker 3 (01:07:02):
You have to do a sign up with these letter.

Speaker 2 (01:07:04):
There's no tricks, yeah, and we'll send you all those things.
But you'll see that there's eight core and then outside
of the core feelings, they're what I like to call
shades of the feelings. So with glad, there's so many
that's the wrong one, that's gifts. Oh, these are gifts,
so that one. Yeah, yeah, feelings. So if you look
at glad, there's different shades of gladness. So you could

(01:07:25):
use different what are other words on there?

Speaker 3 (01:07:28):
Uh for glad? Yeah, excited, encouraged, happy, content, satisfaction, optimistic.
It's a different shade of yellow though, and then an
even lighter shade of it would.

Speaker 2 (01:07:38):
Be I didn't organize them in the shades though. Oh okay, yeah, so,
and that's not all encompassing. Those are just other words
you could use because sometimes it's hard to come up
with the word, and it's helpful to look at that.
But even with like anger and fear and all of those,
sometimes anger and fear and those words feel too heavy.
But that's why we have all these different shades of

(01:07:59):
the It's still the same core root, right, but it
might be a more palatable or more fitting word.

Speaker 3 (01:08:05):
Okay, So I think since we spent some time on hurt,
we can wrap up with that one because I think
it's a good way to look at it, Like although, dang,
you just flat out we're feeling hurt. Yeah, like you've
watched straight to that core, but the lighter shade of
green is offended. I was sorry.

Speaker 2 (01:08:24):
Sometimes it's counting, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:08:26):
All your hard work disappointed because you're like, wait, I
just left this and I came and I'm doing this
with you, and now I don't even know my role,
which also could feel rejected, is under there. So then
you're feeling rejected because I'm shutting up shocked because you're
like what what? That's another one so under hurt. It's despair, shock, betrayed, rejected, offended, disappointed,

(01:08:49):
pain and then you were having your own pain.

Speaker 2 (01:08:52):
So yeah, so that those words might just be more
helpful if the other ones don't.

Speaker 3 (01:08:57):
Yeah, I love the feelings. We all you did a
great job. You so good so feeling things with Amy
and Kat we have our own wheel, we have our
gifts of feelings and then the feelings the feeling flow chart,
which I love like this. I'm going to use my
everyday life things in my relationship things with my kids
where there's four columns impairment, feeling, need, and gift, and

(01:09:22):
I'm going to be referencing this all the time.

Speaker 2 (01:09:23):
And I do have to shout this out because copyright.
The majority of this comes from this Feelings flow chart
comes from Chip Dods, the Voice of the Heart, and
he also uses those same eight core feelings so it
aligns really well. So I don't want anybody think that
I created that, that I have adapted from other people's work.

Speaker 3 (01:09:43):
Yeah, you noted it on the PDF. I don't want
to get suit and it is downloaded when you sign
up for newsletter and then you get these files. It
said this chart was adapted from Chip Dods The Voice
of the Heart, and then shout out Lindsay Gibson for
her she has a adult children of emotionally immature parents.

(01:10:05):
That is me.

Speaker 2 (01:10:06):
I have the book in my back, that's me. That
book's really good to just help understand why we don't
feel the these feelings as easily as we want.

Speaker 3 (01:10:16):
Yeah, this is good stuff. What I'm saying is you're
gonna want to sign up for a newsletter because if anything,
you're just gonna get this, and this is gonna be
something you can reference or you know, you can hit up.
You know. I'm sure Chip has it somewhere somewhere. But
is this color coordinated?

Speaker 2 (01:10:31):
That's pretty.

Speaker 3 (01:10:32):
The colors are pretty because Cat color coordinated it. So yeah,
I guess that's that's it. That's a wrap on episode one.
I mean, we encourage y'all to, yeah, follow us on socials.
Feeling Things podcast is the handle Feeling Things podcasts. There's
other Feeling Things accounts where the podcast one and when
you'll see my face in Cat's face, so it should

(01:10:54):
be pretty clear. And then we want to hear from
you for couch talks or anything else. Do you want
to share couch Talks will be our Q and a
episode which will be every Thursday. So coming up in
a couple of days, we'll have our very first couch
talks and the email for that is Hey there at
Feelingthings podcast dot com. Kat originally thought it was Hello.

Speaker 2 (01:11:18):
But yeah, sorry, let's see. I also got locked out
of our email for like three weeks. I was silently panicking.
But we're in.

Speaker 3 (01:11:25):
We're in, we are in. We're reading your emails. So Hey,
there at Feeling Things at podcast dot com. Thank you
for being here, and.

Speaker 2 (01:11:33):
We hope you have the day you need to have.
Boom bye