Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hudson Valley This morning with Ed Kowalski is the new
voice in the Hudson Valley.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Hi, this is Ed. I am so grateful for the
support you've already given us. We are creating a platform
that gives you our listeners of voice. Together we can
build the best local community talk program in the Hudson Valley.
You're listening to Hudson Valley Live with Ed Kowalski and
Uncle Mike, and we are pleased once again to welcome
to the WKIP microphones Doctor Salgee or Johnny, who is
(00:27):
our Healthy Men's consultant. He's been with us, as you know,
for a long time. He's helped us and our listeners
through the COVID pandemic. He's given sage medical advice, and
he's continuing to be able to do so. Doctor Sal
welcome to our microphones again, sir, well.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Thank you. So's a pleasure to be with you and
Uncle Mike. I hope you're have a good day up there.
The weather has been pretty brutal around here.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Now. Is this the part of the interview, Doctor Sal
where you rub it in the fact that Uncle Mike
and I up here in zero degree weather and you're
down there in Bomby, Florida at about sixty five seventy degrees.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
Oh oh, no, Central Florida these days is we're in
the forties and right now it's midday and it's not
even broken sixty. So I know for some people like
short weather. But yes, I was rubbering in just a
tiny bit.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Okay, sir, doctor Suck. Can you talk to us about
how you came to come, how you came to healthy,
healthy men, why this has been something that you're passionate about,
and if you can explain to our listeners how that
came about. I think that's certainly something and a lot
of them are going to be interested in knowing.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Well, you know, I worked for a very large corporation
for years, and I had a lot of travel responsibilities,
and I didn't always take care of myself the way
I should. When I was in my twenties and thirties
and even forties, that's when I was going to live
forever and be wonderful forever, and I didn't do the
things that I talk about now. And I kind of
(01:55):
when I get up and I speak to folks to say, look,
I'm a poster boy for what you sh shouldn't be doing.
And I'm here to tell you, I'm going to give
you some lots of good reasons why you really need
to think about your health when you're twenty seven and
what kind of life you want to lead for yourself,
your families, to your kids, your boys, and what kind
of life you want to have when you're in your seventies, eighties,
(02:18):
and these days even into your nineties. And that was
my original passion. I did a lot of work for
several men's health organizations. I helped establish the Men's Health
Caucus of the American Public Health Association. I did some
work with that group. And then just about three years ago,
(02:40):
some of my colleagues, doctor Schanbonom, who's a board certified
Lifespay lifestyle medicine specialists. Sorry, another good friend and colleague,
Harmon Brott, who is an author of over fifteen books,
Hated Them best sellers on positive parenting and one of
(03:05):
the first books to be written about what dads can
expect when they're expecting and how to be a good dad.
And myself we formed an organization called Healthy Men, Inc.
And the reason we did this is well, there are
a lot of groups out there look at individual health
care issues for men such as cardiac health, prostate health.
(03:29):
We need healthy Men, Inc. Wanted to get to the
root cause of why we think men have for example,
nine out of the ten causes of death in America,
men lead in nine out of the ten causes of death.
Why the suicide rate in men is almost four times
out of women and seventy five percent of the men
(03:50):
who commit suicide in the US have never had a
diagnosis of a mental health condition. Why we see so
many men struggling in their latter years. So we looked
at we did a classic root cause analysis and in
our opinion and out of our scientific Advisory Board and
healthy Men in't we found that it's because men don't
(04:14):
feel that healthcare treat them the way they wanted to
be treated. They don't think it's our phrases guy friendly.
And one of the biggest things that we used to
support this is a marvelous study by Cleveland Clinic several
years ago when they were looking to develop a men's
health practice for a men's health program. They surveyed men
(04:36):
and they asked them their opinions about health care, and
what cemented our view was that over seventy two percent
of the men studied said that they would rather do housework,
including cleaning the bathroom, than going out to a medical visit.
So I think, you know, we can quote also statistics
(04:58):
about how men don't PARTICI to debate their mortality rate,
their morbidity rate, how soon they die, how much sicker
they are where I think the most telling for us
was that men just don't feel the healthcare system, healthcare projects,
healthcare programs are guy friendly. So that's what we're trying
to change, you know.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
You know you said so much in that introduction, and
I thank you for being able to sort of break
that down because I know our listeners really wanted to
understand how you came to do what you do.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
Well, doctor, I raised my hand three times during.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
That discussion, exactly correct.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
I pointed at me that once.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Actually, well, I should be pointing at myself too, because
one of the things that you said during that segment, doctor,
is that you know, I can't tell you how many
times when I was in my twenty you know, my
late twenties, my early thirties and early forties, I used
to think I was still nineteen, you know, and I
was acting like I was still nineteen in terms of diet,
(05:55):
in terms of doing all sorts of things that I
probably shouldn't have been doing. And I guess the question
that I would have for you is what you know?
And I know that your website and when we've spoken
over the years that you've been on the show about
a lot of things men should be thinking about as
they hit these milestones. Meaning the kinds of things a
(06:15):
twenty five year old should be concerned about visa v
health is different than what a forty year old or
a fifty year old needs to be dealing with. Can
you talk a little bit about the age difference in
terms of the brackets that people are in and what
they should be thinking about from a men's health perspective
during these during these decades.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
You know, that's that's a very important point that what
you need to do, or you should do, or you
need to consider does differ you when you're a child,
when you're a young man, when you're in your middle ages,
in the middle of your career, when you're older and retired.
And we recognize that. So on our website, which is
at www healthymen dot org Healthy Men, we have a
(07:01):
series of information pieces and we use the funds that
we get to help sustain your organization produce materials that
we think will help men understand how to take care
of themselves better so at ninety they can live like
they're nineteen. And we call this their Checkpoints series. And
(07:23):
there's one piece of there which takes the decades of
life starting at about young childhood twelve and up, and
it goes all the way through the sixty five plus
group and then tells you what are the sorts of
diagnostic tests, what sort of vaccinations, what sort of things
(07:46):
you should be thinking about to do to check to
see if you're in good condition. So that Checkpoints document,
and it's in there under the resources section on the website,
will help guideman as to what sort of things they
should be thinking about when they go to make their
next primary care or next doctor's appointment. And that that's
(08:08):
critical if you have underlying conditions. For example, if you're
one of these children that has a heart condition from birth,
certainly you want to change your view and the things
you need to do. As someone who has a young
medical condition with our saisma or heart disease or some
(08:28):
other terrible, terrible thing, you want to change it. But
as a general rule, the checkpoint documents will give guys
a good roadmap as to what sort of things they
should be doing, you know.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
And the other point that I think is very important
that I want to discuss with you is the issue
of men's mental health.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Now.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
The last time you're on the show, we spoke a
little bit about that, but I want to dig go
a little bit deeper with you on this. And I
know Uncle Mike, with his work with veterans up here
in the Dutchess County area, Hudson region, he sees this
a lot. He sees this. You know, a lot of individuals,
a lot of veterans, you know, coming home dealing with
(09:08):
post traumatic stress. And it's just something that from someone
who's never really experienced that knock on wood, you know,
it's I don't have a frame of reference for being
able to experience that myself. I have known people who
are going through post traumatic stress and it's a very
difficult thing to be able to do. Now. There was
(09:29):
a New York Times editorial that was written and published
about in twenty thirteen, and it was written by David Brooks,
who's a very very famous New York Times columnist, and
he was talking about a high school friend of his,
a childhood friend of his who grew up became a
very successful ophthalmologist and began suffering with depression, and Sally,
(09:51):
I'm going to send it to you because it's a
phenomenal read in terms of how he ended up dealing
with his friend's depression who ultimately he committed suicide. And
he talks about some of the things that he was
talking to this individual about ostensibly to try to pull
him out of his depression, and he regrets doing the
(10:12):
steps that he took. Why is it so hard for
men to be able to recognize that they have an
issue that they need to talk about and they don't
want to talk about it.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
Well, how men view their health care responsibilities to themselves
head to that families is very much shaped by the media.
I did a study that I published the American Public
Health Association way back in twenty thirteen when we looked
at healthcare advertising and about seventy percent of the advertising,
(10:49):
which is a mirror as well as a shaper of
people's opinions in America, seventy five percent or so of
the advertising for healthy things products and services was directed
at women and girls. There was a neutral category of
about ten percent, so that leads about fifteen percent of
(11:10):
the print media advertising at that time period twenty twelve
twenty thirteen was directed towards men, and men are taught
from a very young age that admitting there's a problem,
admitting hurt, admitting emotional.
Speaker 2 (11:27):
Is a sign of weakness, is a sign of weakness.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
And we see it even now. Is watching a football
game playoff this weekend, and the announcer probably said, this
is the kind of game where the players have to
sacrifice their bodies. So I understand what he's saying. I
get it. But unfortunately, some of the younger folks who
are maybe twelve fourteen listening to this, they don't understand
(11:54):
what this is, and they think that they should be
sacrificing their bodies for the go, getting for the team.
When Johnny's very young, he balls down, he scrapes his knee,
and he say, come on, Johnny, get up and shake
it off and keep going. And it's not out of
the fear of malice. It's just the way we bring
it up. There were studies that my colleague Garment Brock
(12:14):
talks about someone who's very much involved in healthy parenting,
where they studied how empathetic or sympathetic parents work to
a young girl versus a young boy, and there were
decided differences. The girls were taught early ages, this is
a problem. We feel badly for you. We need to
sit back and we'll take care of it for you.
(12:36):
The boys buy and large. We're told just what I said,
you know, get up, take it like a man. You're
a big boy. Keep going that thought a very early age.
So there's a whole climate in health care behavioral patterns
that starts for a very early age, instantly enough that
(12:56):
helps meant to have an anti health acculturation. You know,
it's inning grandislas into the fact that they are very
much against going to get healthcare systems sport.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
And doctor one of the things. And again I come
back to this article specifically penned by the New York
Times editorialist who was talking about the suicide of his
best friend. And he was lamenting during the course of
this editorial how much and how many times he said
to his friend who was depressed, just shake it off.
(13:27):
Just shake it off, you know, And he regrets having
said that that's.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
Common with people that don't understand it. Doctor, I want
to really quickly go back. You were talking about the
study you had done where only fifty percent of the
print media was focused on men. That's because the demographics
that these companies used, they see the women are the
ones spending the money, so they're going to drive the media,
the advertising naturally toward where the money's coming from, right,
(13:53):
I mean, that's why it ends up going in that direction.
And it's still there when it comes to healthcare. If
you look at most of the ads, look at the
one I think of is the I take Jardience and
that Jardien's commercial. It's a heavy set woman out there dancing.
That's who they have as they're spokesperson. If you will,
it is all. You're right and your study was spot
(14:15):
on because most of the advertising in the media is
driven toward the female side of the equation.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
Yes, and I actually am doing A healthy man is
working with some students of public health students at the
wheel Ornell Wheel School of Medicine to do a survey
of commercial advertising and electronic advertising now for just that purpose,
to catalog what percentage is designed for men, what percentages
(14:43):
to design for women? And then who's delivering the messages
even sometimes that's important. So you know, if you've just
quickly watched the news at any given heating I'd say
over seventy percent or vast majority of advertising for help
products and health solutions to women, and then the burgers
(15:05):
and the hamburgers, and you know, things like that are
to men. So it is still a problem. But what
the biggest I think one of the biggest dilemmas that
men have in addressing emotional discomfort is stigma. And it
comes down to, in large part to the roots that
you shouldn't be talking about how you feel or if
(15:29):
you are hurt. So that translatable moment when Johnny is
told just shake it off and keep going, translates later
on into just shake off that mental hurt and keep going.
And it's so difficult for men to know how to
help their buddies to address that. There are some companies
(15:52):
now who recognize this as an issue, and they and providers,
and in some community areas is a technique called emergency UH,
mental health emergency or mental first aid or emotional first aid.
It these programs that appear in various parts of the country,
various venues where plain on people are trained to recognize
(16:18):
someone who is having an emotional crisis or down in
the dumpsters. There's not always the guy or the gal,
the guy who sits around, molkes around, doesn't go out
and do things. Sometimes it's the uh, the face of
the clown, you know in that song Teers of the clown. Uh.
You know. Sometimes it's the jovial guy who's covering up
(16:39):
that terrible terrible feelings of inadequacy or shame or hurt
or PTSD by putting on a bravado or a show.
But people understand that.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
As a poster child for that was Robin Williams.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
That's a very good point.
Speaker 3 (16:55):
Yes, you know, it is a very very good point.
Mary found many others in the media.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Yeah, but he found relief out of making people laugh.
That's how he got it far as he did that.
That was his therapy of making other people laugh. But
he was dying inside while he was doing it.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
I come back to this editorial where the author ended
up saying he would tell his buddy, look, why don't
you He was a successful ophthalmologist. He spent many years
traveling to Vietnam to perform eye surgeries for kids and
people over there couldn't afford it. And his friend said,
when he was beginning to show signs of depression, hey,
(17:33):
why don't you go back and do that? That'll help
you snap out of it. And then he relates in
the same editorial that his friend would tell his wife,
I wish I could snap out of it, and I can't.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
And I can tell you, knowing what I know now,
in some of the situations that I've dealt with over
the years, I was guilty of that. You get frustrated.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
We are all guilty of it.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
You get frustrated to a point where you want to
shake somebody and say, what's wrong, Come on, snap out
of it. And because you can't imagine what they're going through, right,
I think that's one of the keys and the stigma
you talk about. Doctor, We work on that up here
with Mental Health America's Adam or Andrew O'Grady who's CEO.
Him and I have a lot of discussions. You know,
(18:16):
the theory that if you break your arm, or if
your appendix is bothering you, if you're spraying your ankle,
you go get that treated right away. But if you're
having anxiety of your depression that could go on for
years and sometimes you never you don't recognize that as
a sickness, and it can kill you just like anything else.
Speaker 4 (18:33):
Can, and it did, but people don't want to recognize
question and you know, doctor On the same note, Uncle Mike,
and I have Andrew O'Grady, who is the CEO who
runs an organization up here called Dutchess County Mental Health America.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
Listen to this. He's got a program going and I
think you're going to be very impressed by this. He's
got a program where if a movie that is just
released comes out and has a theme specific to mental health,
you know, depression, so suicide and anything along those lines.
They've actually cut a deal whereby Andrew and representatives of
(19:11):
his organization will be at the movie theater and then
we'll after the film runs, they they'll have a question
and answer session with the audience to talk about what
they've just seen, which I think is an amazing, amazing thing.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
It is to be very helpful in identifying, at least
self identifying that this disturbed me much more than I
think it should have. But it's still it's tough for
someone for a guy to admit that something like that
disturbs them, because guys are taught to be stoic, not
only in their own mind, but in the minds of
(19:48):
other individuals. You know that don't went bad on me, buddy, Right, Well.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
We've asked him where ED and I are going to
go the next time he does it, because he told
us the first time they did it, they were shocked
how many people stayed and talked to them, Right, they
were shocked.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
Right, Well, that's an indicator that those folks are. That's
one of the primary indicators that either they or someone
very close to them has exhibiting signs of you know,
physical emotional interrelated depression, anxiety, and just the mere fact
(20:26):
and part of this emotional first aid scenario of programs
that are ongoing is not only recognizing but how to
provide support to the individual and that interim period to
let them recognize that they are having a problem that
isn't all that unusual, it isn't shameful, and it is manageable.
(20:48):
So try to bring them along, encourage them along to
the point to get it, get it managed and treated.
And that's that's the important thing. And as I said
earlier on seventy five percent of the medical Susan I'd
never had a primary care and primary diagnosis of a
mental illness.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Incredible doctor. I have a good friend whose father is
ninety years old right now, and he's coming to the end.
He's coming to the end where there are some circulatory
issues that have been diagnosed, and there are a couple
of issues pertaining to Because of the circulation issues, some
of his toes are starting to turn dangrenous if you will,
(21:29):
and I guess, but yet he is still very much
aware as to what's going on. And what advice would
you give his family to be able to counsel and
deal with someone who's coming to the end, is you know,
in terms of helping him understand what's happening and helping
him understand the kind of life that he had. I mean,
(21:50):
I know it's a tough question, and I know you
don't know the specifics of it other than what I
just told you, But when men get to that point
in life, what are the things that they're families that
you should be doing to help people understand that, you know,
it's it's okay to go kind of a thing, if
that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
Yeah, we studied cool a Ross and the stages of
grief and duying, because think one of the things when
it's one of the important stages on the individual who
was faced with an eminent death. And if you look
at some of the scenarios and some of the works
that talk about people in hospice, and there are several
books being written. In my former university, Bublon University, the
dean there, sorry, the president of the university, went out
(22:33):
and the surveyed individuals who were in hospice care and
their outlook, and they all wanted to know. They all
wanted to know that they made a difference from what
they did, the sacrifices they made, they made a difference
in the lives of the individuals in their family, not
(22:54):
just their kids, but then also in their community. So
it's wonderful to go when you have a scenario like
this and then be candidly honest and say, you know, pop,
this was such a meaningful thing to me that I
think is the most wonderful thing because then everybody wants
(23:15):
to be relevant. And in fact, I do the things
that I do now because I want to maintain being relevant.
So I think they're an individual like that, showing them
how what they've done has made a difference is terribly important.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
And even to go one step further, and even for
the person who is in this position to be forgiven
for the things that he might feel he's done incorrectly.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
Yeah. True, but we all have regrets, and the regrets
that we have may not be their regrets to other see.
I mean so I think that's true. And just sitting
sometimes not forcing the conversation. Guys like a lot of humor,
a little bit of humor when having these serious conversations
to break in there, and that's the hallmark of the
(24:06):
guy's mental mentality or gerial mentality. Not everybody you know,
of course, I'm just speakning of garrrowies, but guys like
a little bit of human Hey, John, you remember the
time that we went bowling and he kept throwing a
ball in the gutter and he just kept doing it
and doing it, and we had such a great time
here for which because he just had such a good
outlook on that sort of thing that was so wonderful.
(24:27):
So John may have felt that throwing gutter balls was
shameful and ridiculous and made him feel bad. I was
a failure, if you will, But the people he was
with were actually uplifted by the fact that he just
kept plugging along. So sometimes to see the little things
that in our lives that we don't think are heroic,
(24:48):
that actually mean the most to the individuals who love us.
So I think when you point that out to folks,
it has a very powerful validating if you feel experience
for them.
Speaker 1 (25:04):
And I can tell you with all my experience with
the military, one of the things I hear so often
when a soldier is dying is the runs around them
will say job well done, soldier, will take it from here, right,
and that that is a calming message, like you've done
a great job, you did your duty, We'll take it
from here. And I've seen it a couple of times
(25:24):
where almost a sense of relief comes across the soldier
who knows his hours are numbered, where he's relieved that
somebody thinks he did a great job and that it's
okay he can go now. My father was my dad.
The last time I saw him, I saw how much
he was struggling, and my better half got mad at me,
but I was able to tell him, Pop, you put
(25:47):
up a good fight. It's okay. I know you're missing mom,
it's okay, don't fight anymore, because it's okay to go.
And my better half was mad at me for saying that,
but nine point thirty the next morning he died.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
You know, it's interesting too. There have been studies, and
I think you can confirm this, There have been studies
that a lot of people choose to give up and
when I don't say give up, choose to let go
at like three in the morning, when they know that
their family is not around, that they know that they
sort of can do this on their own, that they've
spoken to them, and so on and so forth. I've
I've seen that in my own life, and I've also
(26:19):
seen that I've heard that from people who run hospices.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
Yes, that's true. Letting them know that they made a difference,
letting them know that you are going to carry on.
One of the reasons that having children such a strong
biologic dribe, because we all want our legacies to live
on after us. And reassuring that you taught me great, mom,
(26:43):
You train me well, Mom, give them a wonderful life.
I'm taking what you've taught me and given me them,
and you can see them doing with my kids. You
don't have to say it exactly that way. Deed speak
louder than words to folks. But the notion that you've
made a difference, I'm carrying on the wonderful way that
you live your life. And I'm at piece that if
(27:07):
you want to go, go whenever you.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Want, you know, doctor sal One of the nicest things
I've ever heard anybody say was when this person's father
was dying and she looked at him and she goes, Dad,
you loved me more than evolution required you to love me.
And it was just a really wonderful, wonderful thing to say.
And she said her father looked at her, smiled, and
(27:31):
then he died a little a little bit later on
that afternoon. So, doctor Sal, I, you know, a healthymen
dot Org is such an incredible organization and the contributions
that you are continuing to make to it. I encourage
our listeners to visit your website to talk about the
kinds of things that we're talking about now.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
Con to talk about it.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
And when doctor Salle is a regular contributor to the show,
so he comes in, we talk about various things, but
this was an important segment to do, Doctor Sell, and
I thank you for the time in doing it, because
we never really had the chance to be able to
speak uninterrupted because we're paying bills during the segments and
so on and so forth, and we just get going
and we have to, you know, break. This has been
an important segment for our listeners to really understand who
(28:15):
you are, why you're doing it, and what your organization's
all about.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
Your description of the three individuals involved or the other
two involved with you, and how it all came together
was fascinating. Incidentally, when I was twenty seven looking back,
surprised I'm still here the way I conduct to myself,
but I am.
Speaker 3 (28:32):
Are many of us. Yeah, well, and speaking of paying
the bills, if you do go on the healthy men
dot org website, we do have a little button there
you can donates a tax deductible donation. We're C threely
qualified nonprofit and we use the resources we have to
build programs, information, content, and support other individuals who work
(28:58):
for the benefit of men and boys. So we are
always happy to get donations too.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
And after what you just heard us talk about, which
we're gonna we're gonna have a few more segments, But
after what you just heard, anything you contribute is a
good investment not only for the for for society, but
for yourselves because you never know when this is going
to come knocking at your door or someone you loves door.
I mean, we we have so many situations where you
(29:24):
know yourself what you just explained that, especially men, they
won't ask for help. Sometimes it's the families and the
loved ones around them that have to force them to
get help. So making contribution to an organization like this
does help society, but it helps yourself somewhere along the way,
I'm sure. So if you can afford whatever you can,
please help help the good doctor here keep his.
Speaker 2 (29:47):
Keeping healthy men healthymen dot org. It's a phenomenally well
put together website. There's there's a tremendous amount of information
on it for for for boys and young men and
old men like us Mike to be able to just
sort of take cues from the website what we should
be looking at, how we need to be able to
looking at it, how we need to be able to
(30:09):
deal with our own health issues, and more importantly, how
we have to be able to have this kind of
dialogue in terms of being able to talk about what's
what's affecting us to talk about this in the way
that we need to be able to talk with the doctors. Doctor,
so I think I may have told you this story.
I can remember waiting for test results in a doctor's
(30:30):
office once, and there was an older couple and there
was a man, probably about eighty, and he was with
his wife and they were holding hands, and the nurse
escorted him into the doctor's office because he was there
to pick up results too, and they forgot to close
the door, and so I was sitting there and in
earshot of what the doctor was saying to this couple.
And the doctor said, I don't know how to tell you,
(30:52):
but you've only got six months. And I looked at
the nurse and I heard, sort of in a very
soft voice, the man looked at the doctor and said,
but suppose I want more than six months, at which
time the nurse jumped up, closed the door and continued
the conversation. Now, when I got in after they left
(31:13):
to get my results, I looked at the doctor, I said,
give me my results. I don't even want you to
tell me what they say. I'm out of here. And
he looked at me and said, well why, I said,
because The way you just treated that person was very,
very cruel, and I just on and found another doctor.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
Why did you.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Because the manner in which the message was delivered, You know,
let me tell you, I don't know what to tell you. You
have six months, and the guy said he was with
the Mike, he was there with his wife.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
Come on, I think the doctor has got to be
brutally honest. You can't sugarcoat.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
I think there's a better way of saying it. Doctor
sol What do you say help help us settle this
argument between Mike and myself.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
Well, you have to sort of know everything he might
have been trying to get across for somebody. You have
to take care of you myself. You have to do this.
You have to get treated, You have to get surgery.
You might have been trying to do that for the
past twenty years.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
Get it in that context. I understand that. In that context,
I understand. But maybe I'm reacting more to the gentleman's
reaction in terms of but suppose I want more than
six months.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
I have my physician conditioned already.
Speaker 4 (32:20):
I've told him.
Speaker 1 (32:21):
If you ever tell me I have six months, it's
only going to be three. Because I'm going to party
my ass off of my lever. He is going to
give out long before whatever this is is going.
Speaker 2 (32:28):
To kill me. And there you go.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
Don't forget to send me the bill in month seven.
Yeah yeah, right, Well, doctor Style's reaction is a good
and healthy one, right. You know, if he had said, oh,
I was hoping you were going to tell me I
only have three months, that was or something equivalent. Of course,
I'm making light of a very serious situation. I would
be able to sit in my desk, if my desk
(32:51):
at the clinic, and I would see people who are
come into the office dressed nicely, making an effort and
it went out, you know, they came and in looked nice,
and they treated this seriously. And I would see some
folks who are usually not doing very well, not complying
with the regimen, not complying with the medications, and they
(33:13):
didn't take general good care of yourself. So you get
the life that you expect sometimes and sometimes you get,
you know, a curve brow thrown at you. But I
think putting it that way, you have to be in
that position shoes to be able to deliver that hard
kind of message. You have to know the personality of
the individual. But then the individual's reaction should be as
(33:36):
a good one is I want six but if I
want more than six months, and then my next comment
would be, well, George, I've told you before, these are
the things you've got to do, and if you do
these things, you'll have more than six months. You might
have nine months, you might have six years, but unless
you do these nine things, you're not going to have
(33:59):
six months.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
Right, Doctor Salgi or Johnny, It's been such a pleasure
to talk to you in this extended format. We're going
to do this more often, but I think it's very
important to be able to have these kinds of uninterrupted
dialogues with you, and we will certainly. We're very grateful
and the WQIP listeners are very grateful for your your advice,
your counsel to us over the years. And we're very
(34:22):
very happy to have you as a contributor here to
our program.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
And I'm thrilled to be able to do it. Thank
you so much for having me on gov list.
Speaker 1 (34:28):
We'd love it if you tuned in to Hudson Valley
This Morning with Ed Kowalski from six to nine am
Monday through Friday, on fourteen fifteen thirteen seventy AM or
ninety eight five FM, WUKIP
Hudson Valley This morning with Ed Kowalski is the new
voice in the Hudson Valley.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Hi, this is Ed. I am so grateful for the
support you've already given us. We are creating a platform
that gives you our listeners of voice. Together we can
build the best local community talk program in the Hudson Valley.
You're listening to Hudson Valley Live with Ed Kowalski and
Uncle Mike, and we are pleased once again to welcome
to the WKIP microphones Doctor Salgee or Johnny, who is
(00:27):
our Healthy Men's consultant. He's been with us, as you know,
for a long time. He's helped us and our listeners
through the COVID pandemic. He's given sage medical advice, and
he's continuing to be able to do so. Doctor Sal
welcome to our microphones again, sir, well.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Thank you. So's a pleasure to be with you and
Uncle Mike. I hope you're have a good day up there.
The weather has been pretty brutal around here.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Now. Is this the part of the interview, Doctor Sal
where you rub it in the fact that Uncle Mike
and I up here in zero degree weather and you're
down there in Bomby, Florida at about sixty five seventy degrees.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
Oh oh, no, Central Florida these days is we're in
the forties and right now it's midday and it's not
even broken sixty. So I know for some people like
short weather. But yes, I was rubbering in just a
tiny bit.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Okay, sir, doctor Suck. Can you talk to us about
how you came to come, how you came to healthy,
healthy men, why this has been something that you're passionate about,
and if you can explain to our listeners how that
came about. I think that's certainly something and a lot
of them are going to be interested in knowing.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Well, you know, I worked for a very large corporation
for years, and I had a lot of travel responsibilities,
and I didn't always take care of myself the way
I should. When I was in my twenties and thirties
and even forties, that's when I was going to live
forever and be wonderful forever, and I didn't do the
things that I talk about now. And I kind of
(01:55):
when I get up and I speak to folks to say, look,
I'm a poster boy for what you sh shouldn't be doing.
And I'm here to tell you, I'm going to give
you some lots of good reasons why you really need
to think about your health when you're twenty seven and
what kind of life you want to lead for yourself,
your families, to your kids, your boys, and what kind
of life you want to have when you're in your seventies, eighties,
(02:18):
and these days even into your nineties. And that was
my original passion. I did a lot of work for
several men's health organizations. I helped establish the Men's Health
Caucus of the American Public Health Association. I did some
work with that group. And then just about three years ago,
(02:40):
some of my colleagues, doctor Schanbonom, who's a board certified
Lifespay lifestyle medicine specialists. Sorry, another good friend and colleague,
Harmon Brott, who is an author of over fifteen books,
Hated Them best sellers on positive parenting and one of
(03:05):
the first books to be written about what dads can
expect when they're expecting and how to be a good dad.
And myself we formed an organization called Healthy Men, Inc.
And the reason we did this is well, there are
a lot of groups out there look at individual health
care issues for men such as cardiac health, prostate health.
(03:29):
We need healthy Men, Inc. Wanted to get to the
root cause of why we think men have for example,
nine out of the ten causes of death in America,
men lead in nine out of the ten causes of death.
Why the suicide rate in men is almost four times
out of women and seventy five percent of the men
(03:50):
who commit suicide in the US have never had a
diagnosis of a mental health condition. Why we see so
many men struggling in their latter years. So we looked
at we did a classic root cause analysis and in
our opinion and out of our scientific Advisory Board and
healthy Men in't we found that it's because men don't
(04:14):
feel that healthcare treat them the way they wanted to
be treated. They don't think it's our phrases guy friendly.
And one of the biggest things that we used to
support this is a marvelous study by Cleveland Clinic several
years ago when they were looking to develop a men's
health practice for a men's health program. They surveyed men
(04:36):
and they asked them their opinions about health care, and
what cemented our view was that over seventy two percent
of the men studied said that they would rather do housework,
including cleaning the bathroom, than going out to a medical visit.
So I think, you know, we can quote also statistics
(04:58):
about how men don't PARTICI to debate their mortality rate,
their morbidity rate, how soon they die, how much sicker
they are where I think the most telling for us
was that men just don't feel the healthcare system, healthcare projects,
healthcare programs are guy friendly. So that's what we're trying
to change, you know.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
You know you said so much in that introduction, and
I thank you for being able to sort of break
that down because I know our listeners really wanted to
understand how you came to do what you do.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
Well, doctor, I raised my hand three times during.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
That discussion, exactly correct.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
I pointed at me that once.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Actually, well, I should be pointing at myself too, because
one of the things that you said during that segment, doctor,
is that you know, I can't tell you how many
times when I was in my twenty you know, my
late twenties, my early thirties and early forties, I used
to think I was still nineteen, you know, and I
was acting like I was still nineteen in terms of diet,
(05:55):
in terms of doing all sorts of things that I
probably shouldn't have been doing. And I guess the question
that I would have for you is what you know?
And I know that your website and when we've spoken
over the years that you've been on the show about
a lot of things men should be thinking about as
they hit these milestones. Meaning the kinds of things a
(06:15):
twenty five year old should be concerned about visa v
health is different than what a forty year old or
a fifty year old needs to be dealing with. Can
you talk a little bit about the age difference in
terms of the brackets that people are in and what
they should be thinking about from a men's health perspective
during these during these decades.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
You know, that's that's a very important point that what
you need to do, or you should do, or you
need to consider does differ you when you're a child,
when you're a young man, when you're in your middle ages,
in the middle of your career, when you're older and retired.
And we recognize that. So on our website, which is
at www healthymen dot org Healthy Men, we have a
(07:01):
series of information pieces and we use the funds that
we get to help sustain your organization produce materials that
we think will help men understand how to take care
of themselves better so at ninety they can live like
they're nineteen. And we call this their Checkpoints series. And
(07:23):
there's one piece of there which takes the decades of
life starting at about young childhood twelve and up, and
it goes all the way through the sixty five plus
group and then tells you what are the sorts of
diagnostic tests, what sort of vaccinations, what sort of things
(07:46):
you should be thinking about to do to check to
see if you're in good condition. So that Checkpoints document,
and it's in there under the resources section on the website,
will help guideman as to what sort of things they
should be thinking about when they go to make their
next primary care or next doctor's appointment. And that that's
(08:08):
critical if you have underlying conditions. For example, if you're
one of these children that has a heart condition from birth,
certainly you want to change your view and the things
you need to do. As someone who has a young
medical condition with our saisma or heart disease or some
(08:28):
other terrible, terrible thing, you want to change it. But
as a general rule, the checkpoint documents will give guys
a good roadmap as to what sort of things they
should be doing, you know.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
And the other point that I think is very important
that I want to discuss with you is the issue
of men's mental health.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Now.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
The last time you're on the show, we spoke a
little bit about that, but I want to dig go
a little bit deeper with you on this. And I
know Uncle Mike, with his work with veterans up here
in the Dutchess County area, Hudson region, he sees this
a lot. He sees this. You know, a lot of individuals,
a lot of veterans, you know, coming home dealing with
(09:08):
post traumatic stress. And it's just something that from someone
who's never really experienced that knock on wood, you know,
it's I don't have a frame of reference for being
able to experience that myself. I have known people who
are going through post traumatic stress and it's a very
difficult thing to be able to do. Now. There was
(09:29):
a New York Times editorial that was written and published
about in twenty thirteen, and it was written by David Brooks,
who's a very very famous New York Times columnist, and
he was talking about a high school friend of his,
a childhood friend of his who grew up became a
very successful ophthalmologist and began suffering with depression, and Sally,
(09:51):
I'm going to send it to you because it's a
phenomenal read in terms of how he ended up dealing
with his friend's depression who ultimately he committed suicide. And
he talks about some of the things that he was
talking to this individual about ostensibly to try to pull
him out of his depression, and he regrets doing the
(10:12):
steps that he took. Why is it so hard for
men to be able to recognize that they have an
issue that they need to talk about and they don't
want to talk about it.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
Well, how men view their health care responsibilities to themselves
head to that families is very much shaped by the media.
I did a study that I published the American Public
Health Association way back in twenty thirteen when we looked
at healthcare advertising and about seventy percent of the advertising,
(10:49):
which is a mirror as well as a shaper of
people's opinions in America, seventy five percent or so of
the advertising for healthy things products and services was directed
at women and girls. There was a neutral category of
about ten percent, so that leads about fifteen percent of
(11:10):
the print media advertising at that time period twenty twelve
twenty thirteen was directed towards men, and men are taught
from a very young age that admitting there's a problem,
admitting hurt, admitting emotional.
Speaker 2 (11:27):
Is a sign of weakness, is a sign of weakness.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
And we see it even now. Is watching a football
game playoff this weekend, and the announcer probably said, this
is the kind of game where the players have to
sacrifice their bodies. So I understand what he's saying. I
get it. But unfortunately, some of the younger folks who
are maybe twelve fourteen listening to this, they don't understand
(11:54):
what this is, and they think that they should be
sacrificing their bodies for the go, getting for the team.
When Johnny's very young, he balls down, he scrapes his knee,
and he say, come on, Johnny, get up and shake
it off and keep going. And it's not out of
the fear of malice. It's just the way we bring
it up. There were studies that my colleague Garment Brock
(12:14):
talks about someone who's very much involved in healthy parenting,
where they studied how empathetic or sympathetic parents work to
a young girl versus a young boy, and there were
decided differences. The girls were taught early ages, this is
a problem. We feel badly for you. We need to
sit back and we'll take care of it for you.
(12:36):
The boys buy and large. We're told just what I said,
you know, get up, take it like a man. You're
a big boy. Keep going that thought a very early age.
So there's a whole climate in health care behavioral patterns
that starts for a very early age, instantly enough that
(12:56):
helps meant to have an anti health acculturation. You know,
it's inning grandislas into the fact that they are very
much against going to get healthcare systems sport.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
And doctor one of the things. And again I come
back to this article specifically penned by the New York
Times editorialist who was talking about the suicide of his
best friend. And he was lamenting during the course of
this editorial how much and how many times he said
to his friend who was depressed, just shake it off.
(13:27):
Just shake it off, you know, And he regrets having
said that that's.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
Common with people that don't understand it. Doctor, I want
to really quickly go back. You were talking about the
study you had done where only fifty percent of the
print media was focused on men. That's because the demographics
that these companies used, they see the women are the
ones spending the money, so they're going to drive the media,
the advertising naturally toward where the money's coming from, right,
(13:53):
I mean, that's why it ends up going in that direction.
And it's still there when it comes to healthcare. If
you look at most of the ads, look at the
one I think of is the I take Jardience and
that Jardien's commercial. It's a heavy set woman out there dancing.
That's who they have as they're spokesperson. If you will,
it is all. You're right and your study was spot
(14:15):
on because most of the advertising in the media is
driven toward the female side of the equation.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
Yes, and I actually am doing A healthy man is
working with some students of public health students at the
wheel Ornell Wheel School of Medicine to do a survey
of commercial advertising and electronic advertising now for just that purpose,
to catalog what percentage is designed for men, what percentages
(14:43):
to design for women? And then who's delivering the messages
even sometimes that's important. So you know, if you've just
quickly watched the news at any given heating I'd say
over seventy percent or vast majority of advertising for help
products and health solutions to women, and then the burgers
(15:05):
and the hamburgers, and you know, things like that are
to men. So it is still a problem. But what
the biggest I think one of the biggest dilemmas that
men have in addressing emotional discomfort is stigma. And it
comes down to, in large part to the roots that
you shouldn't be talking about how you feel or if
(15:29):
you are hurt. So that translatable moment when Johnny is
told just shake it off and keep going, translates later
on into just shake off that mental hurt and keep going.
And it's so difficult for men to know how to
help their buddies to address that. There are some companies
(15:52):
now who recognize this as an issue, and they and providers,
and in some community areas is a technique called emergency UH,
mental health emergency or mental first aid or emotional first aid.
It these programs that appear in various parts of the country,
various venues where plain on people are trained to recognize
(16:18):
someone who is having an emotional crisis or down in
the dumpsters. There's not always the guy or the gal,
the guy who sits around, molkes around, doesn't go out
and do things. Sometimes it's the uh, the face of
the clown, you know in that song Teers of the clown. Uh.
You know. Sometimes it's the jovial guy who's covering up
(16:39):
that terrible terrible feelings of inadequacy or shame or hurt
or PTSD by putting on a bravado or a show.
But people understand that.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
As a poster child for that was Robin Williams.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
That's a very good point.
Speaker 3 (16:55):
Yes, you know, it is a very very good point.
Mary found many others in the media.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Yeah, but he found relief out of making people laugh.
That's how he got it far as he did that.
That was his therapy of making other people laugh. But
he was dying inside while he was doing it.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
I come back to this editorial where the author ended
up saying he would tell his buddy, look, why don't
you He was a successful ophthalmologist. He spent many years
traveling to Vietnam to perform eye surgeries for kids and
people over there couldn't afford it. And his friend said,
when he was beginning to show signs of depression, hey,
(17:33):
why don't you go back and do that? That'll help
you snap out of it. And then he relates in
the same editorial that his friend would tell his wife,
I wish I could snap out of it, and I can't.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
And I can tell you, knowing what I know now,
in some of the situations that I've dealt with over
the years, I was guilty of that. You get frustrated.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
We are all guilty of it.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
You get frustrated to a point where you want to
shake somebody and say, what's wrong, Come on, snap out
of it. And because you can't imagine what they're going through, right,
I think that's one of the keys and the stigma
you talk about. Doctor, We work on that up here
with Mental Health America's Adam or Andrew O'Grady who's CEO.
Him and I have a lot of discussions. You know,
(18:16):
the theory that if you break your arm, or if
your appendix is bothering you, if you're spraying your ankle,
you go get that treated right away. But if you're
having anxiety of your depression that could go on for
years and sometimes you never you don't recognize that as
a sickness, and it can kill you just like anything else.
Speaker 4 (18:33):
Can, and it did, but people don't want to recognize
question and you know, doctor On the same note, Uncle Mike,
and I have Andrew O'Grady, who is the CEO who
runs an organization up here called Dutchess County Mental Health America.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
Listen to this. He's got a program going and I
think you're going to be very impressed by this. He's
got a program where if a movie that is just
released comes out and has a theme specific to mental health,
you know, depression, so suicide and anything along those lines.
They've actually cut a deal whereby Andrew and representatives of
(19:11):
his organization will be at the movie theater and then
we'll after the film runs, they they'll have a question
and answer session with the audience to talk about what
they've just seen, which I think is an amazing, amazing thing.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
It is to be very helpful in identifying, at least
self identifying that this disturbed me much more than I
think it should have. But it's still it's tough for
someone for a guy to admit that something like that
disturbs them, because guys are taught to be stoic, not
only in their own mind, but in the minds of
(19:48):
other individuals. You know that don't went bad on me, buddy, Right, Well.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
We've asked him where ED and I are going to
go the next time he does it, because he told
us the first time they did it, they were shocked
how many people stayed and talked to them, Right, they
were shocked.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
Right, Well, that's an indicator that those folks are. That's
one of the primary indicators that either they or someone
very close to them has exhibiting signs of you know,
physical emotional interrelated depression, anxiety, and just the mere fact
(20:26):
and part of this emotional first aid scenario of programs
that are ongoing is not only recognizing but how to
provide support to the individual and that interim period to
let them recognize that they are having a problem that
isn't all that unusual, it isn't shameful, and it is manageable.
(20:48):
So try to bring them along, encourage them along to
the point to get it, get it managed and treated.
And that's that's the important thing. And as I said
earlier on seventy five percent of the medical Susan I'd
never had a primary care and primary diagnosis of a
mental illness.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Incredible doctor. I have a good friend whose father is
ninety years old right now, and he's coming to the end.
He's coming to the end where there are some circulatory
issues that have been diagnosed, and there are a couple
of issues pertaining to Because of the circulation issues, some
of his toes are starting to turn dangrenous if you will,
(21:29):
and I guess, but yet he is still very much
aware as to what's going on. And what advice would
you give his family to be able to counsel and
deal with someone who's coming to the end, is you know,
in terms of helping him understand what's happening and helping
him understand the kind of life that he had. I mean,
(21:50):
I know it's a tough question, and I know you
don't know the specifics of it other than what I
just told you, But when men get to that point
in life, what are the things that they're families that
you should be doing to help people understand that, you know,
it's it's okay to go kind of a thing, if
that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
Yeah, we studied cool a Ross and the stages of
grief and duying, because think one of the things when
it's one of the important stages on the individual who
was faced with an eminent death. And if you look
at some of the scenarios and some of the works
that talk about people in hospice, and there are several
books being written. In my former university, Bublon University, the
dean there, sorry, the president of the university, went out
(22:33):
and the surveyed individuals who were in hospice care and
their outlook, and they all wanted to know. They all
wanted to know that they made a difference from what
they did, the sacrifices they made, they made a difference
in the lives of the individuals in their family, not
(22:54):
just their kids, but then also in their community. So
it's wonderful to go when you have a scenario like
this and then be candidly honest and say, you know, pop,
this was such a meaningful thing to me that I
think is the most wonderful thing because then everybody wants
(23:15):
to be relevant. And in fact, I do the things
that I do now because I want to maintain being relevant.
So I think they're an individual like that, showing them
how what they've done has made a difference is terribly important.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
And even to go one step further, and even for
the person who is in this position to be forgiven
for the things that he might feel he's done incorrectly.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
Yeah. True, but we all have regrets, and the regrets
that we have may not be their regrets to other see.
I mean so I think that's true. And just sitting
sometimes not forcing the conversation. Guys like a lot of humor,
a little bit of humor when having these serious conversations
to break in there, and that's the hallmark of the
(24:06):
guy's mental mentality or gerial mentality. Not everybody you know,
of course, I'm just speakning of garrrowies, but guys like
a little bit of human Hey, John, you remember the
time that we went bowling and he kept throwing a
ball in the gutter and he just kept doing it
and doing it, and we had such a great time
here for which because he just had such a good
outlook on that sort of thing that was so wonderful.
(24:27):
So John may have felt that throwing gutter balls was
shameful and ridiculous and made him feel bad. I was
a failure, if you will, But the people he was
with were actually uplifted by the fact that he just
kept plugging along. So sometimes to see the little things
that in our lives that we don't think are heroic,
(24:48):
that actually mean the most to the individuals who love us.
So I think when you point that out to folks,
it has a very powerful validating if you feel experience
for them.
Speaker 1 (25:04):
And I can tell you with all my experience with
the military, one of the things I hear so often
when a soldier is dying is the runs around them
will say job well done, soldier, will take it from here, right,
and that that is a calming message, like you've done
a great job, you did your duty, We'll take it
from here. And I've seen it a couple of times
(25:24):
where almost a sense of relief comes across the soldier
who knows his hours are numbered, where he's relieved that
somebody thinks he did a great job and that it's
okay he can go now. My father was my dad.
The last time I saw him, I saw how much
he was struggling, and my better half got mad at me,
but I was able to tell him, Pop, you put
(25:47):
up a good fight. It's okay. I know you're missing mom,
it's okay, don't fight anymore, because it's okay to go.
And my better half was mad at me for saying that,
but nine point thirty the next morning he died.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
You know, it's interesting too. There have been studies, and
I think you can confirm this, There have been studies
that a lot of people choose to give up and
when I don't say give up, choose to let go
at like three in the morning, when they know that
their family is not around, that they know that they
sort of can do this on their own, that they've
spoken to them, and so on and so forth. I've
I've seen that in my own life, and I've also
(26:19):
seen that I've heard that from people who run hospices.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
Yes, that's true. Letting them know that they made a difference,
letting them know that you are going to carry on.
One of the reasons that having children such a strong
biologic dribe, because we all want our legacies to live
on after us. And reassuring that you taught me great, mom,
(26:43):
You train me well, Mom, give them a wonderful life.
I'm taking what you've taught me and given me them,
and you can see them doing with my kids. You
don't have to say it exactly that way. Deed speak
louder than words to folks. But the notion that you've
made a difference, I'm carrying on the wonderful way that
you live your life. And I'm at piece that if
(27:07):
you want to go, go whenever you.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Want, you know, doctor sal One of the nicest things
I've ever heard anybody say was when this person's father
was dying and she looked at him and she goes, Dad,
you loved me more than evolution required you to love me.
And it was just a really wonderful, wonderful thing to say.
And she said her father looked at her, smiled, and
(27:31):
then he died a little a little bit later on
that afternoon. So, doctor Sal, I, you know, a healthymen
dot Org is such an incredible organization and the contributions
that you are continuing to make to it. I encourage
our listeners to visit your website to talk about the
kinds of things that we're talking about now.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
Con to talk about it.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
And when doctor Salle is a regular contributor to the show,
so he comes in, we talk about various things, but
this was an important segment to do, Doctor Sell, and
I thank you for the time in doing it, because
we never really had the chance to be able to
speak uninterrupted because we're paying bills during the segments and
so on and so forth, and we just get going
and we have to, you know, break. This has been
an important segment for our listeners to really understand who
(28:15):
you are, why you're doing it, and what your organization's
all about.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
Your description of the three individuals involved or the other
two involved with you, and how it all came together
was fascinating. Incidentally, when I was twenty seven looking back,
surprised I'm still here the way I conduct to myself,
but I am.
Speaker 3 (28:32):
Are many of us. Yeah, well, and speaking of paying
the bills, if you do go on the healthy men
dot org website, we do have a little button there
you can donates a tax deductible donation. We're C threely
qualified nonprofit and we use the resources we have to
build programs, information, content, and support other individuals who work
(28:58):
for the benefit of men and boys. So we are
always happy to get donations too.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
And after what you just heard us talk about, which
we're gonna we're gonna have a few more segments, But
after what you just heard, anything you contribute is a
good investment not only for the for for society, but
for yourselves because you never know when this is going
to come knocking at your door or someone you loves door.
I mean, we we have so many situations where you
(29:24):
know yourself what you just explained that, especially men, they
won't ask for help. Sometimes it's the families and the
loved ones around them that have to force them to
get help. So making contribution to an organization like this
does help society, but it helps yourself somewhere along the way,
I'm sure. So if you can afford whatever you can,
please help help the good doctor here keep his.
Speaker 2 (29:47):
Keeping healthy men healthymen dot org. It's a phenomenally well
put together website. There's there's a tremendous amount of information
on it for for for boys and young men and
old men like us Mike to be able to just
sort of take cues from the website what we should
be looking at, how we need to be able to
looking at it, how we need to be able to
(30:09):
deal with our own health issues, and more importantly, how
we have to be able to have this kind of
dialogue in terms of being able to talk about what's
what's affecting us to talk about this in the way
that we need to be able to talk with the doctors. Doctor,
so I think I may have told you this story.
I can remember waiting for test results in a doctor's
(30:30):
office once, and there was an older couple and there
was a man, probably about eighty, and he was with
his wife and they were holding hands, and the nurse
escorted him into the doctor's office because he was there
to pick up results too, and they forgot to close
the door, and so I was sitting there and in
earshot of what the doctor was saying to this couple.
And the doctor said, I don't know how to tell you,
(30:52):
but you've only got six months. And I looked at
the nurse and I heard, sort of in a very
soft voice, the man looked at the doctor and said,
but suppose I want more than six months, at which
time the nurse jumped up, closed the door and continued
the conversation. Now, when I got in after they left
(31:13):
to get my results, I looked at the doctor, I said,
give me my results. I don't even want you to
tell me what they say. I'm out of here. And
he looked at me and said, well why, I said,
because The way you just treated that person was very,
very cruel, and I just on and found another doctor.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
Why did you.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Because the manner in which the message was delivered, You know,
let me tell you, I don't know what to tell you. You
have six months, and the guy said he was with
the Mike, he was there with his wife.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
Come on, I think the doctor has got to be
brutally honest. You can't sugarcoat.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
I think there's a better way of saying it. Doctor
sol What do you say help help us settle this
argument between Mike and myself.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
Well, you have to sort of know everything he might
have been trying to get across for somebody. You have
to take care of you myself. You have to do this.
You have to get treated, You have to get surgery.
You might have been trying to do that for the
past twenty years.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
Get it in that context. I understand that. In that context,
I understand. But maybe I'm reacting more to the gentleman's
reaction in terms of but suppose I want more than
six months.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
I have my physician conditioned already.
Speaker 4 (32:20):
I've told him.
Speaker 1 (32:21):
If you ever tell me I have six months, it's
only going to be three. Because I'm going to party
my ass off of my lever. He is going to
give out long before whatever this is is going.
Speaker 2 (32:28):
To kill me. And there you go.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
Don't forget to send me the bill in month seven.
Yeah yeah, right, Well, doctor Style's reaction is a good
and healthy one, right. You know, if he had said, oh,
I was hoping you were going to tell me I
only have three months, that was or something equivalent. Of course,
I'm making light of a very serious situation. I would
be able to sit in my desk, if my desk
(32:51):
at the clinic, and I would see people who are
come into the office dressed nicely, making an effort and
it went out, you know, they came and in looked nice,
and they treated this seriously. And I would see some
folks who are usually not doing very well, not complying
with the regimen, not complying with the medications, and they
(33:13):
didn't take general good care of yourself. So you get
the life that you expect sometimes and sometimes you get,
you know, a curve brow thrown at you. But I
think putting it that way, you have to be in
that position shoes to be able to deliver that hard
kind of message. You have to know the personality of
the individual. But then the individual's reaction should be as
(33:36):
a good one is I want six but if I
want more than six months, and then my next comment
would be, well, George, I've told you before, these are
the things you've got to do, and if you do
these things, you'll have more than six months. You might
have nine months, you might have six years, but unless
you do these nine things, you're not going to have
(33:59):
six months.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
Right, Doctor Salgi or Johnny, It's been such a pleasure
to talk to you in this extended format. We're going
to do this more often, but I think it's very
important to be able to have these kinds of uninterrupted
dialogues with you, and we will certainly. We're very grateful
and the WQIP listeners are very grateful for your your advice,
your counsel to us over the years. And we're very
(34:22):
very happy to have you as a contributor here to
our program.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
And I'm thrilled to be able to do it. Thank
you so much for having me on gov list.
Speaker 1 (34:28):
We'd love it if you tuned in to Hudson Valley
This Morning with Ed Kowalski from six to nine am
Monday through Friday, on fourteen fifteen thirteen seventy AM or
ninety eight five FM, WUKIP
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