April 9, 2025 • 33 mins
A humorous but insightful commentary in which host Andrew Wallenstein discusses the personal experience of developing a TikTok habit so powerful it displaced TV as “his go-to media habit for the past 50 years.” Describes his months of immersion on the platform, he likens it to a religious conversion that left him with prophetic visions of media's future, which he shares in detail (before the men in white coats come for him).
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
Welcome to another episode of Strictly Business, the podcast in
which we speak with some of the brightest minds working
in the media business today. I'm Andrew Wallenstein, chief media
analyst with Variety Intelligence Platform. Got no guests this week,
and I'll tell you why, because I, as one of
the raining media gurus coming to you each week on
(00:27):
Strictly Business, could not do another interview for this podcast,
dear listener without talking about a profound transformation I've recently
undergone with my own personal media habits. There's just no
other way to say it. TikTok has broken my middle
aged brain. Stick around, and I'll explain why. Welcome back
(00:57):
by I record this day's after President Trump issued in
executive order granting a seventy five day extension on the
TikTok ban in order to facilitate a sale to an
American company. There is so much to say about the
implications of all this from a business perspective, a cultural perspective.
But you know what, you won't hear any of that
(01:18):
from me on this edition of the podcast, because, as
I said, I cannot in good conscience sit here any
longer like it's just another episode and pontificate per usual
about all things media with guests until I've come clean
about what has hit me with the force of a
religious experience in recent months, and maybe a spiritual metaphor
(01:39):
is the best way to explain what I'm trying to convey.
After fifty years of faithful devotion to TV, I've converted
to TikTok.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Somehow, the controversial app has become my primary media destination
every day instead of television. And when I say television,
I mean both pay TV and some description streaming TV
shows and movies have taken a backseat to TikTok's never ending,
algorithmically targeted feed of short form videos. The advertising is
(02:11):
so light touch I barely notice it, and best of all,
it's totally free, yet I'd probably pay for it if
I had to. And though I am pathetically late to
the party and just too darn old to be captivated
by TikTok in the first place, I must share what
this experience has been like because it's left me with
some observations about not just this powerful platform, but the
(02:34):
future of media in general. I know it's a lot
to take in, and I'm as surprised to hear these
words coming out of my mouth as anyone, because prior
to my conversion, I've always found something dystopian about the
whole notion of TikTok. User generated clips shot rapid fire
into my cerebral cortex, shredding my attention span. But what
(02:59):
can I say? That sweet sweet algorithm has worked its
magic on my mind over enough time to cast a
spell on me. I've come to love meme culture and
the relative absence of mainstream media culture on the platform.
And there's just so much more that I'll get into here.
(03:19):
But before I pontificate any further, let me just acknowledge
this much. I totally get it. If your reaction to
what little I've said so far is okay, boomer, thanks
but no thanks, not interested in insights from the last
oldest TikTok adopter on Earth? Why don't you come back
next week? Some hot takes on what MySpace or for
(03:41):
inster was like too, And I get it. That's a
totally valid reaction, though I should point out first I'm
not a boomer. I'm Generation X old, but not that old.
If you want to just bail right now before I
unpack this any further, I could accept that you won't
hurt my feelings. I'm sure there's a fresh four our
Joe Rogan interview that's a better use of your time.
(04:03):
But for those of you who have stuck around first,
thanks for giving me a chance. I should also clarify
it's not like I suddenly discovered TikTok in twenty twenty
five after crawling out from under whatever rock I was
living under. I've had the app on my phone for
several years for the occasion when someone mentioned something I
wanted to see on TikTok, I'd use the app to
(04:26):
check it out, always wondering, considering its vaunted algorithm, whether
it was akin to taking a hit from a crack pipe.
But I would dip in, dip out, figuring I was
old enough to be impervious to its charms until this year.
What drew me to TikTok long enough to get sufficiently
seduced this time around came late last year, when the
(04:49):
political drama around the app's existence was at its high point.
I was curious to get a first hand sense of
how the crisis was being felt by the TikTok Faithful
and truth be told. While I was struck by the
creativity and passion of many on the platform. I wasn't
impressed anymore by what I was seeing on TikTok than
I was on any other social platform. You have to
(05:12):
understand I've been following digital native content trends for nearly
two decades, dating back to the earliest days of YouTube
and the earliest flowerings of the creator economy, back before
it was called the creator economy, before they were even
called influencers. And I followed these trends as the momentum
move from one platform to another, whether it was Vine
(05:34):
or Switch or Snapchat, each had their own quirks and idiosyncrasies.
But through it all, I always prided myself on keeping
a kind of anthropological detachment from it all. I admired
from a distance, but never really got drawn in personally.
But now, in twenty twenty five, the truth is the
programming experience of TikTok has been so thoroughly co opted
(05:58):
by rival copycat products like Instagram reels and YouTube shorts
that when I talk about TikTok, I'm not really talking
about TikTok per se. It's format that algorithmically targeted torrent
of short form videos curated by my thumb swiping with
such reptilian efficiency, it almost feels like my hand is
(06:20):
operating independently from my brain. I call it the clip
scroll format. TikTok created it, but apparently couldn't patent it.
That said, TikTok's algorithmic magic may be more powerful than
the other platforms, at the very least deserves credit for
pioneering the format that's become so addictive. Addiction. Yeah, that's
(06:43):
a word I must admit I shouldn't be using loosely
when it comes to TikTok or any social apps. There
are serious concerns about the power they have, particularly with
its youngest users. Not to mention the serious concerns about
the potential espionage risk that TikTok app presents, I'd be
remissing not referencing these dangers. And yet I must admit
(07:05):
none of that stop me from falling head over heels
in love with TikTok. And here's what may be the
most tragic part of all. I see that the hours
I spend on TikTok now each day clearly come at
the expense of the time I used to spend watching TV.
I just don't watch. I just don't watch a half
(07:26):
hour or hour long shows at the volume that I
used to. When after enjoying the first season of Severance recently,
I found myself bored with season two. Even amid all
that hype, I wondered if my TV taste buds were
somehow permanently broken. Well, at least I'm still watching White Lotus,
though I think that's about the only TV show I've
(07:48):
been watching these days. But here's the thing. It's hard
not to give TikTok credit for stealing the wind from
TV sales, because when I reflect on TikTok's bounty, I
see the seeds of so much what I had previously
gotten from TV, super served by TikTok. Let me start
with a counter intuitive example. I've really gotten to enjoy
(08:11):
keeping up with what the biggest memes are on TikTok.
The one that I cannot seem to get out of
my head right now is people dancing to a rap
song called you Gotta cut It, cut It, cut It,
cut It, cut It, cut It, cut It, cut it,
cut it Now. Maybe hip hop isn't your cup of tea,
(08:33):
but I promise, if you let this earworm in your brain,
it's gonna burrow so deep in there you'll never get
it out. But let me get back to my point.
How is something like memes, which are so particular to
the Internet and not television, end up displacing my TV habit? Well,
this is why I think. Part of what has made
memes so compelling to me is that in our increasingly
(08:56):
fragmented culture, where so many people are experiencing different and
content a far cry from decades ago when the TV
was the great unifying force that could bring together tens
of millions of people on any given night, These memes
and the way people play on them are as close
to unifying our culture in its own interactive way. They
(09:16):
make me feel connected to a larger culture and so
you got to cut it and just feels more important
to me right now than say, white lotus. Now, I
know what you're thinking, Andy, This kind of mean play
has been around on other platforms long before TikTok, So
what makes so special here? And to that, I say,
(09:36):
it's just different. On TikTok the level of creativity employed
and the memes feels higher. And for those who disagree
with that, okay, But here's where I think there's no
argument the TikTok ux is just a superior delivery mechanism
than any other social platform. Maybe it's the same old content,
but it's different now. And I'll tell you what else.
(10:01):
Maybe it's something particular to my feed, certainly not something
I set out to cultivate. But the mainstream Hollywood galaxy
of stars has such a muted presence in my feed.
Don't get me wrong. I follow the accounts on TikTok
of dozens of actors, performers, singers, whatever, and I know
that sounds like a knock against mainstream Hollywood entertainment culture,
(10:24):
but it's not meant to be. There's plenty I like
about the culture that I get everywhere else, But on
TikTok it feels like the algorithm just intuitive that I
would prefer to turn the dimmer down on the celebrity
industrial complex. They don't loom nearly as large on TikTok,
which doesn't have the top down entertainer elite separated by
(10:47):
the unwashed mass audiences. It's a more democratic medium where
the distinction between the entertainer and the audience doesn't really exist.
It's such a refreshing differentiating thing that makes the app
just a fascinating world to inhabit, and into the vacuum
of all the oxygen that the celebrity industrial complex typically
(11:07):
sucks up steps in this explosion of homegrown talent on
the platform. Now, I wouldn't blame you if you started
to get an ick feeling right about now thinking about
the brand name creators out there, from mister Beast to
the Paul Brothers. I'm just not a huge fan of
these types, because there's something off putting to me about
(11:28):
how sweaty that class of entertainers comes off, constantly shilling
for themselves with they're desperate hit the subscribe button pitches
and shilling for whatever brand is paying them. But that's
not who populate my TikTok feed. Those who do are
mostly thousands of not famous at least yet, people who
(11:49):
may not be household names, but they've got talent. Watching
TikTok makes you feel like what many of us already
suspect about Hollywood. It's not as if their most successful
performers possess some kind of rare talent that separates them
from the masses, like the way you say your average
pro athlete is world's better than ninety nine percent of
the rest of the population. Now, TikTok gives the lie
(12:13):
to that notion by exposing that there's many many people
out there with comparable levels of talent to the lucky
group that makes it through the Hollywood machine and onto
our screens. And these many, many people just needed a
discovery mechanism powerful enough to elevate them. And that's where
TikTok comes in. If you had to pin me down
(12:35):
to defining in one word, what gives TikTok gets a llure,
I'm going to use a very scientific term, the vibe. Okay,
maybe I'll need a few more words to capture what
that vibe is. It's like everyone on TikTok is in
a dance circle, taking turns, making each other laugh at
the center with the silly jig. It's like you're inviting
(12:58):
let me try something else. It's like you're invited to
this gigantic potluck dinner where many people have taken it
upon themselves to generously share the content they've cooked up,
and you have this endless buffet that just gets shotgunned
into your mouth in perfect little snackable bites. I myself
don't contribute content, preferring to stay what they call, in
(13:19):
Internet parlance, a lurker. But that's not unusual. A Pew
Research Center study last year found that just twenty five
percent of the most active people on the platform produced
ninety eight percent of its content. Let me try to
capture what I love about TikTok using a TV metaphor
of sorts. Imagine if Saturday Night Live was a medium
(13:40):
onto itself. Instead of about twenty performers Lauren Michael's pluck
from obscurity, there's about one thousand more cast members just
cranking out comedic vignettes on their own instead of relying
on Lauren's taste and sketches, which frankly is a mixed
track record. That's a subject for another podcast. You could
just curate your own group from a vast sea of
(14:02):
talent that you didn't know existed. And like SNL, some
of the comedy comes from some pretty classic categories, like
celebrity impressionists. But on an average episode of SNL, you're
lucky if you'll see more than two impressionisms at work.
On TikTok, you could sift through two hundred of them
in a minute, and the quality differential from what you
(14:23):
see on SNL. It's not that slim.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
Look.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
I love James Austin Johnson's Trump impression on SNL. He's
a genius. But you know what, someone who calls herself
d doo dah on TikTok, she's not bad herself. If
you wanted to find a random what looks to be
high school student with just three thousand followers whose Trump
(14:47):
impression in her own words is quote if he was
a baby or had inhaled helium, well here for yourself,
baby Trump.
Speaker 3 (14:57):
On the way to the airport. I like my suitcase, frankly,
but I've seen like very big ones in China, frankly,
and I'm thinking that I want my mommy to buy
me a bigger ones. I'm not very statisfied.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
What can I say? The sight of a girl who
can't be a day over sixteen doing a Trump impression
kills me every time. Now, the thing to keep in
mind here is d doo dah isn't some rare hidden
gem on TikTok. More like a dime a dozen. You see,
TikTok is like a metal detector for sucking all the
needles from the haystack. The algorithm sees what you like
(15:33):
and seamlessly hits you with like ten more of the
same thing. And I understand these people that I'm finding
on TikTok. They're not new or exclusive to the platform.
They may even have bigger followings on other platforms where
they got their start before moving to TikTok. I'm sure
I've seen their videos years ago, but the point is
(15:54):
that TikTok is the platform that made this experience sticky.
I've been on Instagram YouTube for many years and have
never felt anything like the rabbit hole drop that TikTok
delivers every time out. And there's a lot of different
types of comedy to choose from. I've gotten into this
whole cottage industry of teachers who like to imitate their
(16:16):
young students. And I'm a dad, so there's like five
hundred men out there contributing dad jokes into my feed
in an endless supply. And as a married man, I
also enjoy the entire genre of couple's humor, where real
life husband and wives who fancy themselves comedy duos dissect
relationship pitfalls pretty endlessly. I think my favorite is a
(16:38):
well known TikTok pairing Alex and John, who have millions
of followers.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
John, are you serious? What can you not pick this up?
Speaker 2 (16:47):
They're not in the way.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
It's lazy, John. We both live here, Okay, it's a mess.
Pile of your clothes, Well that's different. They're on a chair,
so they're elevated out of the way.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
It's a pile of shit, just like mine.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
It is not a It is an organized mess, and
I know where everything is.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
I just can't admit that we're the same. And it
just kills you to know that we both have a
pile of shit. But for some reason you think your
pile of shit is better than mine.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
But it's not fine. I won't talk about your pile
of shit if you don't talk about mine.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
Honestly, you watch these two long enough and you'll understand
why comparisons to TV classics like I Love Lucy and
The Honeymooners aren't so far fetched. Whether the comedy is
thirty minutes or in the case of Alex and John,
sometimes like thirty seconds, the connection is pretty clear. And
to bring this back to what I was saying about
(17:36):
TikTok as a TV substitute, this is a perfect example
Alex and John feel to me like the kind of
couple centric sitcoms I used to watch all the time
but just don't see on TV anymore. I mean, forget
about couple sitcoms. I don't find myself watching sitcoms at all. Really,
And have you seen a comedy in a movie theater lately?
(17:57):
Come to think of it, I think you could draw
an even broader conclusion that the vast array of comedy
you can overdose on TikTok comes at the expense of
the rest of media. I just don't think it's a
coincidence that comedy could not seem more dead in film
and TV right now, while on TikTok it's alive and well.
Now I realize I've been painting a picture in this
(18:18):
podcast of TikTok standing apart from the rest of culture.
But after the break I'll get into why that's not
an accurate picture entirely. We are back with my endless
jeremiad about the state of television and the triumph that
(18:42):
I think TikTok has had its expense. And look, it's
not that pop culture as we know it is absent
from TikTok. Now TikTok is very much in dialogue with culture,
but instead of just being like another TV channel or
movie theater or streaming service or the performer and programs
djor distribute their content, TikTokers meet these brands on their
(19:05):
own terms, and those terms are typically through the filter
of fan worship or ridicule. Like any other social platform,
it's where the water cooler conversation happens, even though the
content that spurs the conversation isn't available on the platform.
For instance, if there's one TV show I've Stuck with
its White Lotus, but no episode is complete without watching
(19:28):
all the satirical reactions each episode prompts, the most famous
of which is mining maximum yucks out of every heavily
accent accented utterance from Parker Posey's mouth. But it's not
just about sharing the post, it's each user putting their
own unique spin on it, like this one set to
(19:48):
auto tune.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Like I love tsunami, no hyper no bis no, And
then you know, we just played on that, so it
just started to grow and grow.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
To take it a step further, I'll take you back
to a recent episode of this podcast in which I
interviewed the head of research at Warner Brothers Discovery, who
shared research suggesting that while social video consumption is drawing
away eyeballs from studio content, it's also very much a
valuable promotional driver to that content off platform, like back
(20:34):
on a Netflix or at your local cineplex or what
have you. These are fan accounts I follow that spit
out nothing but clips of TV shows I enjoyed ages
ago but had no plans to revisit. Like community and
entourage that make me reappreciate enough to increase the likelihood
of me revisiting an episode. But I think TikTok serves
(20:56):
an additional function as something of a highlight reel for
content I'm just not going to follow back to the
TV because the excerpted clips from that programming is how
I want to consume it. With all due respect to
the great late night comedians like Colbert and Kimmel and
John Stewart, on and on, I'm not going to sit
down for a long form linear TV experience. I want
(21:18):
the best moments from those shows sliced and diced in
my feed, or I'm just not going to watch it
at all. Sorry. And the same goes for news content.
Whether it's coming from twenty four hour news networks or newspapers,
all of them have TikTok accounts. But I will say that,
unlike with comedy, where I find myself enjoying lots of
new personalities and in addition to a highlight reel of
(21:40):
establishment figures, with news, I find myself sticking to the
tried and true brands. I know there's a lot of
amateur commentators and analysts doing their thing on TikTok, but
it just doesn't do it for me, and I don't
want to forget to acknowledge that TikTok has been home
to lots of different experimentation and narrative driven storytelling but
in short form formats. But like news, nothing really is
(22:04):
stuck with me yet, though I have a feeling maybe
that's just a matter of time. Take the Chinese microdrama Fomenon,
for instance. They maintain a healthy presence on TikTok, though
that's really just a promotional platform for driving consumers off
platform to apps of their own, like Real Short and
Drama Box. Look. I find most of this content unwatchable.
(22:26):
It's just not my cup of tea. But when you
see this ferment of creativity. You have to wonder whether,
as unthinkable as it sounds, there's an inevitability to TikTokers
cracking the code on the kind of content it will
feel more directly competitive with traditional dramas. Maybe the closest
thing to that is a whole genre of what I'd
(22:47):
call confessional videos, where real people of all kinds candidly
share from the struggles in their lives on TikTok, and
they interact with the fan bases they build there. It's
pure monologues, but they have that voyeuristic frison you get
from watching good reality TV. There's so much more I
(23:08):
get out of TikTok. We'd be here all day if
I drilled too deep into any one of the many
categories of content that float my boat. Like I'm an
avid road biker, so I watch videos of bikers in action.
Been playing a lot of basketball lately, So I watch
instructors break down all sorts of shooting mechanics used to
DJ but back in my younger days, And so I
(23:29):
have endless appetite for watching amateur spinners honkered over their MPCs,
pounding out homemade beats. But this infinite variety also works
against TikTok. I believe you see. The algorithm is like
this machine gun with incredible aim, mowing down every interest
(23:50):
I have. But here's the thing. Sometimes I'm in the
mood for biking videos. Sometimes I want to listen to
the DJs. Sometimes I want memes. But TikTok doesn't hand
me a menu of my favorite subjects and ask me
which one I like. As powerful as its algorithm is,
it insists on pushing everything I like to me indiscriminately
(24:14):
in one feed. As amazing as TikTok has been its
sucking the wind out of TV, it falls short for
me by not taking TV's more channel centric approach. It's
made me visualized. TikTok is like one big, unprecedentedly powerful pipe.
At one end of the pipe, it draws from a
veritable ocean of content choices, somehow hoovering out of that
(24:37):
ocean just the things I like with astonishing speed and accuracy.
But what's not remarked upon as much is the other
end of the pipe is just this hydrant blast when
what I'd rather have as a ux that knowing what
I'd like separates each droplet, so to speak, into separate categories. Yes,
(24:58):
I could go into TikTok account settings and adjust the
topic bars, but those aren't my topic labels, And even
if they were, why not bring that topic orientation to
the front of the TikTok ux instead of hiding it away.
But in the scheme of the bounty TikTok brings, maybe
that's just a quibble. When I'm thumbing constantly, it reminds
(25:21):
me of something I don't do anymore on TV, channel flipping.
But what decades ago is treated as a nuisance. The
experience of channel flipping, I think, is going to be
a mode of viewing in its own right. When the
tiktokification of TV truly begins, the manic thumb swiping that is,
(25:41):
the modern day version of channel flipping or surfing, will
be something we'll actually happily spend time doing, perhaps as
much time as we spend on a long form show. See,
I'm starting to put my nostra damas hat on here.
I get it. I mean, call me a zealot for
my newfound religion. But this format TikTok and its copycats
(26:03):
are employing, this isn't just a format for a particular
kind of social app I'm convinced this is the evolution
of what the personal video experience will be, certainly much
more so than a TV's electronic programming guide or the
tile soup of choices you have to navigate on the
spot of your choice. I've come to the conclusion that
(26:26):
for better or for worse, this is where it's all
going where whether you're watching on your phone, and this
is where you want to question by sanity larger screens
like your living room TV. Yep. Maybe that's the most
surprising realization I've had as a TikTok user, that this
format it pioneered, that seems so inextricably tied to the
(26:48):
mobile device, seems to me not mobile specific at all.
I fully anticipate the TikTok format, right down to all
its wonderful esthetic particularity, will seep so thoroughly into TV
in the coming years that I won't even be surprised
if living room walls start to get adorned by screens
that will hang vertically instead of horizontal. The phone could
(27:13):
become a remote control for swiping, or maybe the remote
control as we know it will lose more than a
few buttons to make room for a thumb swipe, and
the PayTV and svod UX's will take their cue from
this too. As the line between short and long form
video increasingly blurs, perhaps the typical TV future will be
(27:36):
more like NTV moving from one music video sized program
to another than the current thirty or sixty or one
hundred and twenty minute blocks of movie or TV show.
I'm not saying are going to go away, but they
will seed significant ground to the short form videos in
viewing time. It would be pretty star contrast from today's
(27:58):
video platforms, which are entirely separated by the size of
the content, though YouTube is clearly leading the charge in
erasing that distinction. Though TikTok's bread and butter maybe short
form today, I wonder are we really that far away
where it will exceed that current ten minute cap it
has on video and start to home in on Netflix's territory.
(28:22):
Of course, that could also go vice versa, and we've
seen streaming services do some experimentation with short form content,
though nothing notable to date. But I think where this
is all going is that the short form content, it
won't just coexist with long form content on the same platforms,
but it will become a springboard into long form. This
(28:46):
takes me back to the Warner Brothers research I spoke
about earlier. I just think this is going to become
a big driver, but I think it'll get mechanized, so
to speak. Like you'll watch a clip of White Lotus
if you like it, it will have a button linking
you to a long form episode two, and I'd say
that would go for the rest of TV two. But
(29:07):
I think there will be a lot of TV program
brands that will actually minimize or cease to exist in
any long form container. The advertising market will catch up
to a point where, say Stephen Colbert's show will cease
to exist as an hour long show, existing instead is
a series of short form segments. I really believe this
(29:30):
is going to happen just as soon as the advertising
market catches up. Speaking of advertising, as we head towards
the upfront season in the TV industry, there is a
lot of talk about YouTube as the new TV, and
rightfully so. The notion that TV viewing has exceeded mobile
viewing in the US, as the company recently announced, that's
(29:52):
a staggering achievement. Truth be told, I cannot understand why
TikTok hasn't made a stronger bid for TV domination, like
team up with a TV manufacturer to make a linked
line of TikTok TVs. I wonder whether that's going to
end up a fatal flaw too late to correct. If
TikTok is not careful they're inviting one of their copycats
(30:14):
to seize that opportunity. As much as I've said so far,
I feel like I'm really just scratching the surface of
how TikTok's clip scroll format will become the future. Hell,
I haven't even addressed the e current e commerce element
of TikTok, which end up which may end up the
most game changing contribution the act makes, given the early
(30:37):
success of TikTok Shop, breathless as I'm being look, I'm
mindful of the fact that I'm just six months into
my TikTok experience. Perhaps there's a honeymoon period and in
time I will tire of the clip scroll format, or
something better that's not even on the market yet will
come along and revolutionize the video delivery space all over again. Yeah,
(30:59):
I'm looking at you.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
I guess.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
Ultimately, the thing I can't get over is I underestimated
the power of TikTok. Honestly, my perception of the app
coming into this was antiquated. I realized in retrospect, colored
by what seems like the endless reign of the Damelio
sisters from like, I don't know, seven eight years ago,
they were the app's first stars. I just assumed that
(31:23):
was kind of the sensibility of TikTok going forward, like
it's just a bunch of clips of weird dances. But
you know, that's what made my immersion in this app
all the more unlikely. And what was I doing on
this app at my age? I'm so preoccupied by that,
And so I researched TikTok demographic data just to see
(31:44):
how unusual that was. Research firm Data Reportal estimates that
four point three percent of TikTok users are men between
the ages of forty five and fifty four. So, no,
I guess I don't have a lot of company. Maybe
this is my version of a midlife crisis. I mean,
most middle aged men by a convertible or get an earring.
(32:05):
I use TikTok. I'm not sure what's more pathetic, But
now I choose to look at it differently. I rationalize
that I'm really more like an early adopter among the olds,
the first wave of a broader demographic shift that will
transform the demographic makeup of these clip scrolling apps, maybe
drive more product evolution that makes these platforms even more
(32:27):
welcoming to Generation X and even the boomers. For now, though,
I'm just one old man who happens to have become
TikTok's newest fan.
Speaker 3 (32:41):
Thanks for listening. Be sure to leave us a review
at Apple Podcasts or Amazon Music. We love to hear
from listeners. Please go to Variety dot com and sign
up for the free weekly Strictly Business newsletter, and don't
forget to tune in next week for another episode of
Strictly Business.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
T
Welcome to another episode of Strictly Business, the podcast in
which we speak with some of the brightest minds working
in the media business today. I'm Andrew Wallenstein, chief media
analyst with Variety Intelligence Platform. Got no guests this week,
and I'll tell you why, because I, as one of
the raining media gurus coming to you each week on
(00:27):
Strictly Business, could not do another interview for this podcast,
dear listener without talking about a profound transformation I've recently
undergone with my own personal media habits. There's just no
other way to say it. TikTok has broken my middle
aged brain. Stick around, and I'll explain why. Welcome back
(00:57):
by I record this day's after President Trump issued in
executive order granting a seventy five day extension on the
TikTok ban in order to facilitate a sale to an
American company. There is so much to say about the
implications of all this from a business perspective, a cultural perspective.
But you know what, you won't hear any of that
(01:18):
from me on this edition of the podcast, because, as
I said, I cannot in good conscience sit here any
longer like it's just another episode and pontificate per usual
about all things media with guests until I've come clean
about what has hit me with the force of a
religious experience in recent months, and maybe a spiritual metaphor
(01:39):
is the best way to explain what I'm trying to convey.
After fifty years of faithful devotion to TV, I've converted
to TikTok.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Somehow, the controversial app has become my primary media destination
every day instead of television. And when I say television,
I mean both pay TV and some description streaming TV
shows and movies have taken a backseat to TikTok's never ending,
algorithmically targeted feed of short form videos. The advertising is
(02:11):
so light touch I barely notice it, and best of all,
it's totally free, yet I'd probably pay for it if
I had to. And though I am pathetically late to
the party and just too darn old to be captivated
by TikTok in the first place, I must share what
this experience has been like because it's left me with
some observations about not just this powerful platform, but the
(02:34):
future of media in general. I know it's a lot
to take in, and I'm as surprised to hear these
words coming out of my mouth as anyone, because prior
to my conversion, I've always found something dystopian about the
whole notion of TikTok. User generated clips shot rapid fire
into my cerebral cortex, shredding my attention span. But what
(02:59):
can I say? That sweet sweet algorithm has worked its
magic on my mind over enough time to cast a
spell on me. I've come to love meme culture and
the relative absence of mainstream media culture on the platform.
And there's just so much more that I'll get into here.
(03:19):
But before I pontificate any further, let me just acknowledge
this much. I totally get it. If your reaction to
what little I've said so far is okay, boomer, thanks
but no thanks, not interested in insights from the last
oldest TikTok adopter on Earth? Why don't you come back
next week? Some hot takes on what MySpace or for
(03:41):
inster was like too, And I get it. That's a
totally valid reaction, though I should point out first I'm
not a boomer. I'm Generation X old, but not that old.
If you want to just bail right now before I
unpack this any further, I could accept that you won't
hurt my feelings. I'm sure there's a fresh four our
Joe Rogan interview that's a better use of your time.
(04:03):
But for those of you who have stuck around first,
thanks for giving me a chance. I should also clarify
it's not like I suddenly discovered TikTok in twenty twenty
five after crawling out from under whatever rock I was
living under. I've had the app on my phone for
several years for the occasion when someone mentioned something I
wanted to see on TikTok, I'd use the app to
(04:26):
check it out, always wondering, considering its vaunted algorithm, whether
it was akin to taking a hit from a crack pipe.
But I would dip in, dip out, figuring I was
old enough to be impervious to its charms until this year.
What drew me to TikTok long enough to get sufficiently
seduced this time around came late last year, when the
(04:49):
political drama around the app's existence was at its high point.
I was curious to get a first hand sense of
how the crisis was being felt by the TikTok Faithful
and truth be told. While I was struck by the
creativity and passion of many on the platform. I wasn't
impressed anymore by what I was seeing on TikTok than
I was on any other social platform. You have to
(05:12):
understand I've been following digital native content trends for nearly
two decades, dating back to the earliest days of YouTube
and the earliest flowerings of the creator economy, back before
it was called the creator economy, before they were even
called influencers. And I followed these trends as the momentum
move from one platform to another, whether it was Vine
(05:34):
or Switch or Snapchat, each had their own quirks and idiosyncrasies.
But through it all, I always prided myself on keeping
a kind of anthropological detachment from it all. I admired
from a distance, but never really got drawn in personally.
But now, in twenty twenty five, the truth is the
programming experience of TikTok has been so thoroughly co opted
(05:58):
by rival copycat products like Instagram reels and YouTube shorts
that when I talk about TikTok, I'm not really talking
about TikTok per se. It's format that algorithmically targeted torrent
of short form videos curated by my thumb swiping with
such reptilian efficiency, it almost feels like my hand is
(06:20):
operating independently from my brain. I call it the clip
scroll format. TikTok created it, but apparently couldn't patent it.
That said, TikTok's algorithmic magic may be more powerful than
the other platforms, at the very least deserves credit for
pioneering the format that's become so addictive. Addiction. Yeah, that's
(06:43):
a word I must admit I shouldn't be using loosely
when it comes to TikTok or any social apps. There
are serious concerns about the power they have, particularly with
its youngest users. Not to mention the serious concerns about
the potential espionage risk that TikTok app presents, I'd be
remissing not referencing these dangers. And yet I must admit
(07:05):
none of that stop me from falling head over heels
in love with TikTok. And here's what may be the
most tragic part of all. I see that the hours
I spend on TikTok now each day clearly come at
the expense of the time I used to spend watching TV.
I just don't watch. I just don't watch a half
(07:26):
hour or hour long shows at the volume that I
used to. When after enjoying the first season of Severance recently,
I found myself bored with season two. Even amid all
that hype, I wondered if my TV taste buds were
somehow permanently broken. Well, at least I'm still watching White Lotus,
though I think that's about the only TV show I've
(07:48):
been watching these days. But here's the thing. It's hard
not to give TikTok credit for stealing the wind from
TV sales, because when I reflect on TikTok's bounty, I
see the seeds of so much what I had previously
gotten from TV, super served by TikTok. Let me start
with a counter intuitive example. I've really gotten to enjoy
(08:11):
keeping up with what the biggest memes are on TikTok.
The one that I cannot seem to get out of
my head right now is people dancing to a rap
song called you Gotta cut It, cut It, cut It,
cut It, cut It, cut It, cut It, cut it,
cut it Now. Maybe hip hop isn't your cup of tea,
(08:33):
but I promise, if you let this earworm in your brain,
it's gonna burrow so deep in there you'll never get
it out. But let me get back to my point.
How is something like memes, which are so particular to
the Internet and not television, end up displacing my TV habit? Well,
this is why I think. Part of what has made
memes so compelling to me is that in our increasingly
(08:56):
fragmented culture, where so many people are experiencing different and
content a far cry from decades ago when the TV
was the great unifying force that could bring together tens
of millions of people on any given night, These memes
and the way people play on them are as close
to unifying our culture in its own interactive way. They
(09:16):
make me feel connected to a larger culture and so
you got to cut it and just feels more important
to me right now than say, white lotus. Now, I
know what you're thinking, Andy, This kind of mean play
has been around on other platforms long before TikTok, So
what makes so special here? And to that, I say,
(09:36):
it's just different. On TikTok the level of creativity employed
and the memes feels higher. And for those who disagree
with that, okay, But here's where I think there's no
argument the TikTok ux is just a superior delivery mechanism
than any other social platform. Maybe it's the same old content,
but it's different now. And I'll tell you what else.
(10:01):
Maybe it's something particular to my feed, certainly not something
I set out to cultivate. But the mainstream Hollywood galaxy
of stars has such a muted presence in my feed.
Don't get me wrong. I follow the accounts on TikTok
of dozens of actors, performers, singers, whatever, and I know
that sounds like a knock against mainstream Hollywood entertainment culture,
(10:24):
but it's not meant to be. There's plenty I like
about the culture that I get everywhere else, But on
TikTok it feels like the algorithm just intuitive that I
would prefer to turn the dimmer down on the celebrity
industrial complex. They don't loom nearly as large on TikTok,
which doesn't have the top down entertainer elite separated by
(10:47):
the unwashed mass audiences. It's a more democratic medium where
the distinction between the entertainer and the audience doesn't really exist.
It's such a refreshing differentiating thing that makes the app
just a fascinating world to inhabit, and into the vacuum
of all the oxygen that the celebrity industrial complex typically
(11:07):
sucks up steps in this explosion of homegrown talent on
the platform. Now, I wouldn't blame you if you started
to get an ick feeling right about now thinking about
the brand name creators out there, from mister Beast to
the Paul Brothers. I'm just not a huge fan of
these types, because there's something off putting to me about
(11:28):
how sweaty that class of entertainers comes off, constantly shilling
for themselves with they're desperate hit the subscribe button pitches
and shilling for whatever brand is paying them. But that's
not who populate my TikTok feed. Those who do are
mostly thousands of not famous at least yet, people who
(11:49):
may not be household names, but they've got talent. Watching
TikTok makes you feel like what many of us already
suspect about Hollywood. It's not as if their most successful
performers possess some kind of rare talent that separates them
from the masses, like the way you say your average
pro athlete is world's better than ninety nine percent of
the rest of the population. Now, TikTok gives the lie
(12:13):
to that notion by exposing that there's many many people
out there with comparable levels of talent to the lucky
group that makes it through the Hollywood machine and onto
our screens. And these many, many people just needed a
discovery mechanism powerful enough to elevate them. And that's where
TikTok comes in. If you had to pin me down
(12:35):
to defining in one word, what gives TikTok gets a llure,
I'm going to use a very scientific term, the vibe. Okay,
maybe I'll need a few more words to capture what
that vibe is. It's like everyone on TikTok is in
a dance circle, taking turns, making each other laugh at
the center with the silly jig. It's like you're inviting
(12:58):
let me try something else. It's like you're invited to
this gigantic potluck dinner where many people have taken it
upon themselves to generously share the content they've cooked up,
and you have this endless buffet that just gets shotgunned
into your mouth in perfect little snackable bites. I myself
don't contribute content, preferring to stay what they call, in
(13:19):
Internet parlance, a lurker. But that's not unusual. A Pew
Research Center study last year found that just twenty five
percent of the most active people on the platform produced
ninety eight percent of its content. Let me try to
capture what I love about TikTok using a TV metaphor
of sorts. Imagine if Saturday Night Live was a medium
(13:40):
onto itself. Instead of about twenty performers Lauren Michael's pluck
from obscurity, there's about one thousand more cast members just
cranking out comedic vignettes on their own instead of relying
on Lauren's taste and sketches, which frankly is a mixed
track record. That's a subject for another podcast. You could
just curate your own group from a vast sea of
(14:02):
talent that you didn't know existed. And like SNL, some
of the comedy comes from some pretty classic categories, like
celebrity impressionists. But on an average episode of SNL, you're
lucky if you'll see more than two impressionisms at work.
On TikTok, you could sift through two hundred of them
in a minute, and the quality differential from what you
(14:23):
see on SNL. It's not that slim.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
Look.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
I love James Austin Johnson's Trump impression on SNL. He's
a genius. But you know what, someone who calls herself
d doo dah on TikTok, she's not bad herself. If
you wanted to find a random what looks to be
high school student with just three thousand followers whose Trump
(14:47):
impression in her own words is quote if he was
a baby or had inhaled helium, well here for yourself,
baby Trump.
Speaker 3 (14:57):
On the way to the airport. I like my suitcase, frankly,
but I've seen like very big ones in China, frankly,
and I'm thinking that I want my mommy to buy
me a bigger ones. I'm not very statisfied.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
What can I say? The sight of a girl who
can't be a day over sixteen doing a Trump impression
kills me every time. Now, the thing to keep in
mind here is d doo dah isn't some rare hidden
gem on TikTok. More like a dime a dozen. You see,
TikTok is like a metal detector for sucking all the
needles from the haystack. The algorithm sees what you like
(15:33):
and seamlessly hits you with like ten more of the
same thing. And I understand these people that I'm finding
on TikTok. They're not new or exclusive to the platform.
They may even have bigger followings on other platforms where
they got their start before moving to TikTok. I'm sure
I've seen their videos years ago, but the point is
(15:54):
that TikTok is the platform that made this experience sticky.
I've been on Instagram YouTube for many years and have
never felt anything like the rabbit hole drop that TikTok
delivers every time out. And there's a lot of different
types of comedy to choose from. I've gotten into this
whole cottage industry of teachers who like to imitate their
(16:16):
young students. And I'm a dad, so there's like five
hundred men out there contributing dad jokes into my feed
in an endless supply. And as a married man, I
also enjoy the entire genre of couple's humor, where real
life husband and wives who fancy themselves comedy duos dissect
relationship pitfalls pretty endlessly. I think my favorite is a
(16:38):
well known TikTok pairing Alex and John, who have millions
of followers.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
John, are you serious? What can you not pick this up?
Speaker 2 (16:47):
They're not in the way.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
It's lazy, John. We both live here, Okay, it's a mess.
Pile of your clothes, Well that's different. They're on a chair,
so they're elevated out of the way.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
It's a pile of shit, just like mine.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
It is not a It is an organized mess, and
I know where everything is.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
I just can't admit that we're the same. And it
just kills you to know that we both have a
pile of shit. But for some reason you think your
pile of shit is better than mine.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
But it's not fine. I won't talk about your pile
of shit if you don't talk about mine.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
Honestly, you watch these two long enough and you'll understand
why comparisons to TV classics like I Love Lucy and
The Honeymooners aren't so far fetched. Whether the comedy is
thirty minutes or in the case of Alex and John,
sometimes like thirty seconds, the connection is pretty clear. And
to bring this back to what I was saying about
(17:36):
TikTok as a TV substitute, this is a perfect example
Alex and John feel to me like the kind of
couple centric sitcoms I used to watch all the time
but just don't see on TV anymore. I mean, forget
about couple sitcoms. I don't find myself watching sitcoms at all. Really,
And have you seen a comedy in a movie theater lately?
(17:57):
Come to think of it, I think you could draw
an even broader conclusion that the vast array of comedy
you can overdose on TikTok comes at the expense of
the rest of media. I just don't think it's a
coincidence that comedy could not seem more dead in film
and TV right now, while on TikTok it's alive and well.
Now I realize I've been painting a picture in this
(18:18):
podcast of TikTok standing apart from the rest of culture.
But after the break I'll get into why that's not
an accurate picture entirely. We are back with my endless
jeremiad about the state of television and the triumph that
(18:42):
I think TikTok has had its expense. And look, it's
not that pop culture as we know it is absent
from TikTok. Now TikTok is very much in dialogue with culture,
but instead of just being like another TV channel or
movie theater or streaming service or the performer and programs
djor distribute their content, TikTokers meet these brands on their
(19:05):
own terms, and those terms are typically through the filter
of fan worship or ridicule. Like any other social platform,
it's where the water cooler conversation happens, even though the
content that spurs the conversation isn't available on the platform.
For instance, if there's one TV show I've Stuck with
its White Lotus, but no episode is complete without watching
(19:28):
all the satirical reactions each episode prompts, the most famous
of which is mining maximum yucks out of every heavily
accent accented utterance from Parker Posey's mouth. But it's not
just about sharing the post, it's each user putting their
own unique spin on it, like this one set to
(19:48):
auto tune.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Like I love tsunami, no hyper no bis no, And
then you know, we just played on that, so it
just started to grow and grow.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
To take it a step further, I'll take you back
to a recent episode of this podcast in which I
interviewed the head of research at Warner Brothers Discovery, who
shared research suggesting that while social video consumption is drawing
away eyeballs from studio content, it's also very much a
valuable promotional driver to that content off platform, like back
(20:34):
on a Netflix or at your local cineplex or what
have you. These are fan accounts I follow that spit
out nothing but clips of TV shows I enjoyed ages
ago but had no plans to revisit. Like community and
entourage that make me reappreciate enough to increase the likelihood
of me revisiting an episode. But I think TikTok serves
(20:56):
an additional function as something of a highlight reel for
content I'm just not going to follow back to the
TV because the excerpted clips from that programming is how
I want to consume it. With all due respect to
the great late night comedians like Colbert and Kimmel and
John Stewart, on and on, I'm not going to sit
down for a long form linear TV experience. I want
(21:18):
the best moments from those shows sliced and diced in
my feed, or I'm just not going to watch it
at all. Sorry. And the same goes for news content.
Whether it's coming from twenty four hour news networks or newspapers,
all of them have TikTok accounts. But I will say that,
unlike with comedy, where I find myself enjoying lots of
new personalities and in addition to a highlight reel of
(21:40):
establishment figures, with news, I find myself sticking to the
tried and true brands. I know there's a lot of
amateur commentators and analysts doing their thing on TikTok, but
it just doesn't do it for me, and I don't
want to forget to acknowledge that TikTok has been home
to lots of different experimentation and narrative driven storytelling but
in short form formats. But like news, nothing really is
(22:04):
stuck with me yet, though I have a feeling maybe
that's just a matter of time. Take the Chinese microdrama Fomenon,
for instance. They maintain a healthy presence on TikTok, though
that's really just a promotional platform for driving consumers off
platform to apps of their own, like Real Short and
Drama Box. Look. I find most of this content unwatchable.
(22:26):
It's just not my cup of tea. But when you
see this ferment of creativity. You have to wonder whether,
as unthinkable as it sounds, there's an inevitability to TikTokers
cracking the code on the kind of content it will
feel more directly competitive with traditional dramas. Maybe the closest
thing to that is a whole genre of what I'd
(22:47):
call confessional videos, where real people of all kinds candidly
share from the struggles in their lives on TikTok, and
they interact with the fan bases they build there. It's
pure monologues, but they have that voyeuristic frison you get
from watching good reality TV. There's so much more I
(23:08):
get out of TikTok. We'd be here all day if
I drilled too deep into any one of the many
categories of content that float my boat. Like I'm an
avid road biker, so I watch videos of bikers in action.
Been playing a lot of basketball lately, So I watch
instructors break down all sorts of shooting mechanics used to
DJ but back in my younger days, And so I
(23:29):
have endless appetite for watching amateur spinners honkered over their MPCs,
pounding out homemade beats. But this infinite variety also works
against TikTok. I believe you see. The algorithm is like
this machine gun with incredible aim, mowing down every interest
(23:50):
I have. But here's the thing. Sometimes I'm in the
mood for biking videos. Sometimes I want to listen to
the DJs. Sometimes I want memes. But TikTok doesn't hand
me a menu of my favorite subjects and ask me
which one I like. As powerful as its algorithm is,
it insists on pushing everything I like to me indiscriminately
(24:14):
in one feed. As amazing as TikTok has been its
sucking the wind out of TV, it falls short for
me by not taking TV's more channel centric approach. It's
made me visualized. TikTok is like one big, unprecedentedly powerful pipe.
At one end of the pipe, it draws from a
veritable ocean of content choices, somehow hoovering out of that
(24:37):
ocean just the things I like with astonishing speed and accuracy.
But what's not remarked upon as much is the other
end of the pipe is just this hydrant blast when
what I'd rather have as a ux that knowing what
I'd like separates each droplet, so to speak, into separate categories. Yes,
(24:58):
I could go into TikTok account settings and adjust the
topic bars, but those aren't my topic labels, And even
if they were, why not bring that topic orientation to
the front of the TikTok ux instead of hiding it away.
But in the scheme of the bounty TikTok brings, maybe
that's just a quibble. When I'm thumbing constantly, it reminds
(25:21):
me of something I don't do anymore on TV, channel flipping.
But what decades ago is treated as a nuisance. The
experience of channel flipping, I think, is going to be
a mode of viewing in its own right. When the
tiktokification of TV truly begins, the manic thumb swiping that is,
(25:41):
the modern day version of channel flipping or surfing, will
be something we'll actually happily spend time doing, perhaps as
much time as we spend on a long form show. See,
I'm starting to put my nostra damas hat on here.
I get it. I mean, call me a zealot for
my newfound religion. But this format TikTok and its copycats
(26:03):
are employing, this isn't just a format for a particular
kind of social app I'm convinced this is the evolution
of what the personal video experience will be, certainly much
more so than a TV's electronic programming guide or the
tile soup of choices you have to navigate on the
spot of your choice. I've come to the conclusion that
(26:26):
for better or for worse, this is where it's all
going where whether you're watching on your phone, and this
is where you want to question by sanity larger screens
like your living room TV. Yep. Maybe that's the most
surprising realization I've had as a TikTok user, that this
format it pioneered, that seems so inextricably tied to the
(26:48):
mobile device, seems to me not mobile specific at all.
I fully anticipate the TikTok format, right down to all
its wonderful esthetic particularity, will seep so thoroughly into TV
in the coming years that I won't even be surprised
if living room walls start to get adorned by screens
that will hang vertically instead of horizontal. The phone could
(27:13):
become a remote control for swiping, or maybe the remote
control as we know it will lose more than a
few buttons to make room for a thumb swipe, and
the PayTV and svod UX's will take their cue from
this too. As the line between short and long form
video increasingly blurs, perhaps the typical TV future will be
(27:36):
more like NTV moving from one music video sized program
to another than the current thirty or sixty or one
hundred and twenty minute blocks of movie or TV show.
I'm not saying are going to go away, but they
will seed significant ground to the short form videos in
viewing time. It would be pretty star contrast from today's
(27:58):
video platforms, which are entirely separated by the size of
the content, though YouTube is clearly leading the charge in
erasing that distinction. Though TikTok's bread and butter maybe short
form today, I wonder are we really that far away
where it will exceed that current ten minute cap it
has on video and start to home in on Netflix's territory.
(28:22):
Of course, that could also go vice versa, and we've
seen streaming services do some experimentation with short form content,
though nothing notable to date. But I think where this
is all going is that the short form content, it
won't just coexist with long form content on the same platforms,
but it will become a springboard into long form. This
(28:46):
takes me back to the Warner Brothers research I spoke
about earlier. I just think this is going to become
a big driver, but I think it'll get mechanized, so
to speak. Like you'll watch a clip of White Lotus
if you like it, it will have a button linking
you to a long form episode two, and I'd say
that would go for the rest of TV two. But
(29:07):
I think there will be a lot of TV program
brands that will actually minimize or cease to exist in
any long form container. The advertising market will catch up
to a point where, say Stephen Colbert's show will cease
to exist as an hour long show, existing instead is
a series of short form segments. I really believe this
(29:30):
is going to happen just as soon as the advertising
market catches up. Speaking of advertising, as we head towards
the upfront season in the TV industry, there is a
lot of talk about YouTube as the new TV, and
rightfully so. The notion that TV viewing has exceeded mobile
viewing in the US, as the company recently announced, that's
(29:52):
a staggering achievement. Truth be told, I cannot understand why
TikTok hasn't made a stronger bid for TV domination, like
team up with a TV manufacturer to make a linked
line of TikTok TVs. I wonder whether that's going to
end up a fatal flaw too late to correct. If
TikTok is not careful they're inviting one of their copycats
(30:14):
to seize that opportunity. As much as I've said so far,
I feel like I'm really just scratching the surface of
how TikTok's clip scroll format will become the future. Hell,
I haven't even addressed the e current e commerce element
of TikTok, which end up which may end up the
most game changing contribution the act makes, given the early
(30:37):
success of TikTok Shop, breathless as I'm being look, I'm
mindful of the fact that I'm just six months into
my TikTok experience. Perhaps there's a honeymoon period and in
time I will tire of the clip scroll format, or
something better that's not even on the market yet will
come along and revolutionize the video delivery space all over again. Yeah,
(30:59):
I'm looking at you.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
I guess.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
Ultimately, the thing I can't get over is I underestimated
the power of TikTok. Honestly, my perception of the app
coming into this was antiquated. I realized in retrospect, colored
by what seems like the endless reign of the Damelio
sisters from like, I don't know, seven eight years ago,
they were the app's first stars. I just assumed that
(31:23):
was kind of the sensibility of TikTok going forward, like
it's just a bunch of clips of weird dances. But
you know, that's what made my immersion in this app
all the more unlikely. And what was I doing on
this app at my age? I'm so preoccupied by that,
And so I researched TikTok demographic data just to see
(31:44):
how unusual that was. Research firm Data Reportal estimates that
four point three percent of TikTok users are men between
the ages of forty five and fifty four. So, no,
I guess I don't have a lot of company. Maybe
this is my version of a midlife crisis. I mean,
most middle aged men by a convertible or get an earring.
(32:05):
I use TikTok. I'm not sure what's more pathetic, But
now I choose to look at it differently. I rationalize
that I'm really more like an early adopter among the olds,
the first wave of a broader demographic shift that will
transform the demographic makeup of these clip scrolling apps, maybe
drive more product evolution that makes these platforms even more
(32:27):
welcoming to Generation X and even the boomers. For now, though,
I'm just one old man who happens to have become
TikTok's newest fan.
Speaker 3 (32:41):
Thanks for listening. Be sure to leave us a review
at Apple Podcasts or Amazon Music. We love to hear
from listeners. Please go to Variety dot com and sign
up for the free weekly Strictly Business newsletter, and don't
forget to tune in next week for another episode of
Strictly Business.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
T
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