August 22, 2023 • 42 mins
Leaping from Algiers, Louisiana to the Broadway stage and, ultimately, the top-tier of Hollywood, is no simple feat. In Patricia Clarkson’s case, it required a daring jump from her native New Orleans to Fordham University, and the fortuitous, essential mentorship of actress Debra Monk. But Clarkson never truly left the South behind, and in fact she relishes her upbringing there, recalling it fondly—especially her mother’s Creole cooking. On this week’s episode of Table for Two, the Golden Globe Award-winner sits down with host Bruce Bozzi to reflect on her early roles in The House of Blue Leaves and The Untouchables, her adoration of actress and singer Jennifer Holliday, and the values she’s gained by growing up the youngest of five sisters. Hear a preview of the episode below, and subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Today's episode was recorded before the SAG after a strike
began on July fourteenth. Table for two thanks you as
always for tuning in and supporting entertainers.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Hey, everybody, welcome back to Table for two.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
We are sitting at the Sunset Tower here on a
very gray Los Angeles day.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
But that's okay. I'm super excited.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Because today a powerhouse New Yorker is in the house.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Do we really eat?
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Oh god? Oh yeah, okay, good, I'm a little hungry.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
She's a Southern girl from birth, moved to New York
in the eighties, went to Fordham, got a BFA, went
to Yale, got an MFA. You've seen her in countless films.
You've seen her in countless Broadway productions. She owns every
scene she's in.
Speaker 3 (00:52):
Oh, I'll have the Chinese chickens. Are we drinking just water?
Speaker 2 (00:56):
No?
Speaker 3 (00:57):
We drank yees verse like dry?
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Is you know?
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Perfect?
Speaker 1 (01:04):
She's outspoken, she is sexy, she's super talented. Today we're
having lunch with Patricia Clarkson, So sit back and enjoy.
I'm Bruce Bozi and this is my podcast Table for two.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Wow, this is a.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Super special day in LA and you want to know why, Patty.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Because New York is in the house. Yes, we are
having lunch today.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
If you hold up a chair with the incredible, super
talented someone I always have a rock and roll time
with Patricia Clarkson.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Can I call you Patty?
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Oh please god, oh please, yes, Hey Darling, welcome. I'm
so happy to see you again. I have to tell
you I've been looking forward to this, you know, because
we were trying to juggle the dates everything. I was
literally asking if we had worked out a date to
talk with you, kind of every hour on the hour,
like we just said, Patty, we're going to figure it
(02:12):
out with Okay, we're going to figure it out.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
Okay, I mean, thank you my god. That is such
a compliment. And so we have a lot to talk about.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
Yeah we do.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
We do a movie that's Monica that we're going to
talk about. Oh, here's Rose. Okay, let's just be civilized.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
I know. It's so nice, Southern born lady. I so
adore you. Thank you, thank you, thank you. Oh that's nice.
It's nice. Right. I feel better. Well, I flew in
last night. I had a COVID. I'm like, well, because
I have to I'm doing a few other things after you.
This is but this is the highlight.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
This is exactly and this is the only time you're
gonna sit and eat. So Patty, you're born in the South,
You're Louisiana.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
Orle and girl girl.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
You hit New York, Fordham eighties, the nineteen.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Eighties, nineteen eighty, I hit New York.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
Big decade for New York. A lot goes down you.
Then you also go to Yalef. So just talk to
me about your New York, Like what do you love
about New York? I kind of want to know, Like
also like what was that New York versus.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
What is this? Oh?
Speaker 3 (03:22):
Wow, Well, I have to tell you the best story.
So I come off. I go to LSU, transfer to Fordham.
Best decision I ever made. It was very hard for
my father for it because I was nineteen. I left
New Orleans and it was my parents. I grew up
very middle class, very very very middle class, and it
(03:45):
was tough to get me to Fordham. But my beauty
because no, just tough. No. I had good grades. And
my aunt, my beautiful aunt restor So, my beautiful aunt
Becky was dean of Admissions of Loyola in New Ork
and she said, Patty, let's try to connect you to Fordham.
So I didn't have to audition then, but I wanted.
(04:07):
I heard they had a very good theater program. So
my parents gather the money. I go off to New York.
Fordham has no dorm at Lincoln Center. So there's a
rose Hill, huge rose Hill with many and then there's
Lincoln Center. Guess where I lived.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Because of the Forum, And funnily enough, I just walked
by forduam about a week and a half ago.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
I thought about that.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
I think, why am here? I am this southern girl,
like really not innocent and well a little bit I
mean naive. I mean, I'm born and raised in New
Orleans and Norman's is very cosmopolitan and very cool, but
and very progressive, thankfully. But I get off to New York.
(04:56):
I go to the Riots. It's only ladies on one floor.
The room was literally the size that you had to
turn sideways to get into the room.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
And it was women of all ages and we all
showered together in a big, pink old bathroom just because
of the door. And it was the most depressing place
you could have ever been in the history of depressing.
And it was brutal. It was brutal. It's sixty fourth
(05:31):
and Broadway. But I meet this woman, Viviana from Karraka.
She's studying at Parsons and she did not speak a
lot of English, but she spoke enough English to say,
we have to get out of here. She did well,
showering with some of these lads. Open huge open shower
(05:52):
and like you walked in it spicts out the wall
and some of the lady you know, and there were
people on it was and on Saturday nights there were
all these young men in the lobby and me, stupidly
I thought, oh, it's the boy scouts returning from a trip.
(06:13):
Oh so a lot was going down a lot and
I finally, you know, I finally we found an apartment
on the upper with this woman, with Vivian, we found
an apartment. There was a big bedroom. And even though
they were so kind to us and they built a
wall down the center, we got our separate bedrooms and
(06:35):
we It was the best thing that happened. We got
out of the y and that was New York. For me,
it was going to afford him no money. I had
no money, but that is none.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
So there's so many things that are inspiring about that.
One is that it's very scary for parents. You were
one of five sisters and parents are like, okay, and
now to say it, I'm gonna do this. There was
no spoiled and titled that might have been fear, but
you're like, I'm.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
I packed doing bags and went to you know, big
bags and got there. I knew no one, but I
met my mentor, one of my biggest mentors at Fordham,
Joe Jozevsky, and he was at the theater in the
theater department. A teacher I was taught by. Deborah Monk,
was my first acting teacher. Deborah Monk, the great, the great, great, great,
(07:30):
gorgeous Deborah Monk was my first acting teacher at Fordham. Okay,
it was just I loved for it. I just I
go back every year now and speak to the graduating
actors every year. I had to miss a few times
here or there because I was shooting or something, but
I just did it, like a couple of weeks ago.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
What were some of the shows that you did.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
I did Pinter I did the famous pinter play Three Characters,
the Old Fair Betrayal, Trill Betrayal. You'd like the Trail
with Ron Morasco, the best actor ever at Fordham. I
was in his shadow. And I mean he's now an academic.
He's brilliant, brilliant man of renaissance man. He's writer, actor
(08:13):
director anyway, But I I formed, I became an actor,
and Joe Jozevsky helped shape me, directed me, and had
a gabbler in my senior year, you know, and then
I he's the one who told me you will get
into Yale. I said no, they had people were telling
me you have to have connections to get in the Yale.
(08:34):
Joe said, no, Patty, we're going to get the right
two right pieces for you and we're going to work
your ass off for this and you're going to get in.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
So you knew then at Fordham, when you were getting
your BFA, yes, that you want your next goal was
MFA eal.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
Well I always had. I never thought about film. I
always thought about theater, and I knew how important studying was.
And really, remember I had only had two years at Fordham.
I needed more depth and breadth of studying. And I
thought I just always had this thing about well, if
(09:14):
I could get into Yale, and I'll never forget the
day I lived. So we found an apartment, me and
Viviana on seventy seventh and Broadway and Fordham is at sixtieth.
And I got that letter in the mail. I opened
it at my little our little table that was in
our little apartment, and it says you have been accepted
(09:38):
to the School of Dramas. I ran seventeen blocks to Fordham.
Joe and everybody was in a staff meeting, and I
just went through the secretary. I just opened it in
and I said, Joe, right, and.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
There's so much great, like I mean, first of all,
like remember that time in your life and everything.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
First of all, it was nineteen eighty so.
Speaker 3 (10:03):
For everyone to really this was eighty two. Now in
nineteen eighty.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
Two, eighty two, it's New York City. It's a very
special time in New York City. Things are real, you
know what I mean. And you're young, and we're young
like that.
Speaker 3 (10:15):
Twenty two everything was just like the world was. Everything
was before me, and I had nothing to regret behind me,
so everything was forward. And again my parents had to
find and I had a full ride to study at Rutgers.
I had a full I was offered a a I
(10:38):
was offered a soap opera.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Okay, I was.
Speaker 3 (10:42):
And my father was like, well, well of course she
takes you.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
What made you know that you wanted to continue with learning,
in studying as opposed to hitting.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Did you see Broadway shows?
Speaker 3 (11:03):
I would assume, And I saw it, and you know what,
you know what I saw like twelve times and I
had no money. I stood dream Girls. I was j Jennifer.
Most people would think it was some straight and I'm
not a musical theater person at all. Just if I
sang one note, you'd know immediately. I did dance when
(11:24):
I was young. But but Jennifer holiday that performance. I
saw that just it informed me in ways as an
actor that I will never lose.
Speaker 4 (11:35):
You're you're eating that's I have a very tight dress,
gorgeous Christian Syrianna dress tomorrow night.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
And I.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
But anyway, so I'm yes, I'm girls, you're standing in
the yes and I because when she hits that last
closing song of Act one, and I am telling you,
she's just.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
You know, it's it's.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
The earth moves, the earth.
Speaker 3 (12:11):
Moves, and it's it's such a visceral, beautiful performance, and
you didn't want to change me. It just inform me
as an actress. Sorry, would go back and back and back.
You know. It's what I just told that all the
Fordham kids I just spoke to. I said, nobody, nobody
was filming anything. This is the Your cell phone is
a death of you as an actress. I felt everything
(12:33):
I saw. I didn't have to record it. It was
my body, my soul, my mind was recording it. I
will never forget Jennifer Holiday ever. I mean, Jennifer was
wonderful also, but Jennifer Holiday is my erson now in.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
The eighties, specifically in that show which just blew it
off the room.
Speaker 3 (12:53):
I had a rich friend and he came to visit me.
Kathy Smith and her mother bought us tickets and I
sat in. I sat down to watch it. Finally, Oh
my god, like really good seats.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
So why didn't you just say I'm ready?
Speaker 3 (13:20):
You know, after Fordam, Yeah, like I'm ready. I don't know.
I had this. I had this desire to keep trying
to hone my craft. You know, as actors we it
is a craft. It is a muscle that needs to
be flexed and toned and you know, exercise. But what
we ultimately want is to make art, and I think
(13:42):
it it's hard. It's hard to take craft and lift
it art. It's hard.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
How come every senior in you own you own?
Speaker 1 (13:54):
And clearly it started at fordom Patricia clar When you're
in a movie and you're in and you've done a
lot of theater, and you've done a lot of movies, when.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
You walk on, can you identify it? Don't you know?
Speaker 3 (14:12):
Do it? This is the only thing I do know
this as I've gotten older, and I hope this doesn't
sound pretentious. I think as actors we can only create
so much and fake so much, and kind of I
do believe that as we age, we bring more and
(14:33):
more and more of ourselves, and I think that's essential.
We have to marry life and art. And yes there
are times when we're outside the box of ourselves, but
ourselves we always have to. Our emotional life has to
somehow mirror our own right and maybe I'm comfortable the
(14:57):
body wants to shut you down when you act and
you do these very big emotional scenes, are you just
or when you're taking on like when I was doing
sharp objects, you know, these hideous scenes are poisoning my child.
The body wants to shut you down, but you have
to actually understand. You have to have the truth around it.
(15:18):
You have to understand it. You have to understand the
way Patty would understand it, so then it actually is
the way the character would understand. And as I've moved
forward in this world, I realize when I'm not present,
it's not a good thing. And as difficult as that is,
(15:38):
I think that's the shame about acting. Although things are
dramatically changing in Hollywood, as we age, we just we
get better because we're able to just be there.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Welcome back to Table for two.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
After earning not one, but two prestigious drama degrees, Patricia
Clarkson began her professional life on stage. I want to
know when she first sensed that her career was taken off.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
What's the first play you nail?
Speaker 3 (16:33):
Hit?
Speaker 2 (16:34):
Past that?
Speaker 3 (16:35):
You were like, holy shit, you mean that? I got yes, well,
House of Blue Leaves on Broadway. I replaced Julie Haggerty
right after they won that, but I had an audition
for it. Originally had given this crazy audition, got a
standing ovation, but they went with Julie Haggerty. Nine months
later we.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Got standing ovation in the.
Speaker 3 (16:56):
In the audition, John, they were so sweet. They were
so sweet to me, and so I think I'm getting this.
I bought a new dress, I had no money, I
had my hair because I'm playing you know, you can
say the hearing impair. She wasn't deaf, she was hearing
impaired movie star Corina. And I fell out my chair
(17:16):
and you know, and I didn't get the part. And
then nine months later, after they win the Tony, Julia
Haggerty's leaving to go do one of her big films
at the time. And I have a message on my
answering machine from Jerry's Axe Patricia.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
Jerry's right, We're.
Speaker 3 (17:34):
Giving you the part, you know. And it was one
thousand dollars a week. I thought I died and gone right.
I'd never made.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Any money, that's so amazing.
Speaker 3 (17:45):
I stepped in to House of Blue Leaves. I'd done
a few plays off Broadway before that, some Richard Greenberg
and atest some beautiful and then but then I got
House of Blue Leaves on Broadway right after they won
the Tony. Know that. Then I'm in that for three months,
but then I have to leave it to go do
(18:07):
the Untouchables.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
Okay, all right, So she just kind of throws the
Untouchables in.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
Okay, So the.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
First movie This Gorgeous Woman Across from Me is in
is a Palmer film starring Kevin Costner in his height oftitious.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Gorgeous How did I mean? What I mean? That's it.
That's a huge, huge thing. You nail it.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Can you tell me about the process working with Brian
de Palmer making out with Kevin.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
The famous great acting a great casting director who passed
away not long ago. Anyway, it'll come to me. And
I go in to read for him, and I kind
of was a little dulled up, and he goes listen.
I think Brian would like you, but you need to
come back in no makeup and don't wear that sexy dress.
So I go out by like a little house in
(19:02):
the prairie, drows seriously like like crunchy, like puffy sleeves
and like like a midt like a tie around the thing.
I walk in very unsuthered, like no makeup, like oh,
I hit my life, and and there's Brian to ball
(19:22):
and he the reader's there, but Brian reads Elliott nests
opposite me, and I think Brian liked the juxtaposition of
my kind of you know, deep voice, my kind of
you know, baritone dux opposed to my kind of you know,
(19:43):
upturned nose and you know, and my big hair. I
think he just liked that I was this sweet looking
person and I kind of had a little bit of
a naughty voice. Well, so I walk out the room
and the next thing I know is they're flying me.
(20:03):
I'm now in the middle of doing housabilities, but they're
flying me to Chicago to meet Kevin Costner. I have
a matinee I have to do, but they fly me on.
Like you it's seven, no, no, no, no, seven o'clock.
I walk in again. I wear kind of like a
plain Jane dress. I'm like Jesus, like these ugly shoes
and no make I'm like, oh God. And I walk
(20:26):
in and Kevin's kind of sweet and he's like, I
hear Brian, Brian loves you, Patricia. And I read with
Kevin and they tell me I have the part right
in the room, but my agents didn't believe me. So
I walk out. I'm like, I got the park. They're like, no, no, no, Patty.
(20:46):
I was like, no, no, no, no, They're not going
to lie to me. I would not lie to a
southern girl like with with who walked in with no
makeup and big hair, and of course, like you know,
I get back on the plane. I'm in my dressing
room preparing for my matinee. I made it back with
(21:07):
me matinee. Okay, but I'd never flown like first class. Really,
I never had a car picked me up. I never
had I had everybody just waiting on me. I never
had any of that. So anyway, I get back to
the dressing room in the phone rings and my agent
was like, Okay, you were right, you got the car.
But Bruce, it was wall to wall white men. Even
(21:32):
my makeup artist was a white man. Really beautiful man.
Mike can't got beautiful and beautiful. Everybody everybody was mail.
My mother came to visit me in set because my
mother had business in Chicago at the time, and she
came to visit me. She was like, petty, Petty, I
(21:55):
don't know if this is good or bad, but there's
a lot of handsome men and there's just nothing but man,
if I can see for are there any ladies here?
Are there any ladies in Chicago? I mean, it was
just wall. I was the only woman on the set
(22:18):
and then there was my mother for a day and
my mother was like, oh, hello, but no, Brian was
Brian was incredible to me. And I'll tell you what
he did, and it still moves me to this day.
I was broke and I was being paid but minimum.
You know, they got me for scale, but I was
still struggling in New York City. And he knew it,
(22:43):
and he couldn't get me more money. But he told paramount,
he said, I think we need miss Ness in the courtroom.
I think we need her in the courtroom. And they said, well,
it's a it's not We're not shooting the courtroom till
the month. He said, well, I guess you're just gonna
have to pay her for a month because we need
her in that court. I got paid an extra month,
(23:07):
a whole month. It saved me. Yeah, and I just
sat in New York and went back and shopped the
court right, but I got paid.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
That makes me so happy.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
That till this day, he's my hero. He's he was amazing,
amazing to me.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
You bring up something that's so obviously changed, which is
a white male set, and that was you know, obviously
probably over the last ten years, massive, massive, how has
that now been for you and work and the whole
movement of really diversifying the place, the movie set.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
It's the thing that's ever happened in Hollywood. It's single.
It is the best thing. The best part of Hollywood
now is its diversity on camera. Off camera. We still
have a way to go, but I'm telling you off camera,
the things I've shot recently, everybody is reflected. When you
(24:19):
go to a movie set, you want to see yourself
reflected in all the people because the crew is part
of your life. You see them every day for twelve
fourteen hours a day, and often you're working for no money.
What are you there for if you're not reflected in
all of the people on that set, or more importantly,
if you're not reflected on film. Now sometimes you know,
(24:39):
we have to do things that don't include people of color,
if talking something historic but something important, but you know,
as a white woman, but an older white like, there's
older people now on sets. It used to just be
really young people, I mean young white guys and some
old guys that ran the show, and now it's older
(25:03):
women who are not giving up their careers, Beautiful makeup
artists and beautiful costume designers and beautiful set designers, all
of these women of many nationalities. We still have a
way to go, but it's the best thing that's ever
happened in Hollywood is the diversity.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
Back on table for two, Patricia and I have had
a wonderful lunch talking about her career on Broadway and
the silver screen. All of a sudden, when I mentioned
Chelsea Handler in passing, she calls her her hero.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
Let's find out why.
Speaker 3 (26:00):
I'm a sixty three year old, single, straight Southern woman
who never married and never had children. You know that
man who's got the squeaky voice, who says she must
be the most unhappy when in the world. Come to
our house one night and see just how unhappy Chelsea
and I are. I mean, look, I have so many
(26:20):
sisters who have beautiful children, and they now have beautiful children.
I love being an aunt. I love it more than
probably more than acting, which is odd. Okay, they're on
a par okay, but but I'm telling you, these are
gorgeous children. But that defined that, that doesn't have to
(26:44):
define every woman.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
You know what, Like, You're right, you made a choice.
Speaker 3 (26:47):
I made a big choice.
Speaker 5 (26:50):
I made it.
Speaker 3 (26:50):
But I knew it when I was young, and I've
had beautiful men in my life. And I thought about
it with this one artist I dated where it's I
was like thirty eight. I had a window, well, a
window to have a child. I was thirty eight, so
I had a window. But in the end of the day,
I loved working. And I grew up with great parents
(27:13):
who sacrificed everything for me. And you have to really
be committed to having children, right, you have to be
a great parent, And I was afraid I couldn't be.
I didn't want to fail at being a parent. I'm
fine failing as an actor. I didn't want to fail
as being a parent. But look, I'm a Southern woman.
(27:35):
But let me tell you who's the coolest about it
is my mother, like my mother, my father. My mother said, Patty,
I just don't want you to wake up at fifty
and be unhappy. I woke up at fifty in stilettos
and a fall far. I let me tell you, no,
I mean I had great sexy asfeh. I mean I
(28:00):
I'm just saying is, And it's not that my whole
life is that.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
I'm just saying is.
Speaker 3 (28:04):
I love being an a. I love being a sister,
I love being a daughter, I love being a great
best friend. I'm a very good friend. I think it's
not what I wanted to define me because I didn't
want to fail.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
I also just watched for the first time Pieces of April,
and my question around that it was a serious family
you're sick with cancer.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
Katie Holmes is.
Speaker 3 (28:35):
Sort of like, oh, delicious, and Katie was delicious.
Speaker 1 (28:38):
You have you come from a family of five sisters,
like are the traditions that like? You know, this was
about Thanksgiving and this was about the complexities of it.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
Do your family and it was a great one. All
of you should see it and.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
We all have Yes. Well, well, my mother she doesn't
cook anymore. You know, my parents are still with me.
They're eighty seven.
Speaker 2 (28:59):
Yeah, they're in credit.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
My mother doesn't cook anymore. But you know it was
always you know, she was going to make Merlaton crab meat.
She's going to make jamalaia but very specific. You're very
going to make very specific jamalia. Not a Cajun. People
can flat Cajun and Creole. I'm Creole. We grew up
with Creole cooking. Creole is the Spanish and French influence
that really landed was throughout the people. It is. You know,
(29:26):
the people of New Orleans are a real gumbo. They're
such a mixture and that's the beauty of this city.
But the cooking, like my mother, my mother never saw
sausage in her life. You know, they did not cook.
My mother didn't cook with sausage really.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
No.
Speaker 3 (29:41):
Everything was crab meat, shrimp.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
That's all Cajun.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
That's all Cajun, and sausage and meat on doing. Yeah, yeah, no, no, no,
my mother, My mother cooked you know, creole. So everything
we ate, we had big you know, and we always
my mother never allowed a container on the table like ketchup.
Everything had to be even though we were like but
(30:05):
my mother had nice things because she was given nice
things from like her bubby, from her you know, from
down the line. But you know, we were living in
the suburbs of our years outside New Orleans, going to
public school, but we still a ketchup bottle was not
allowed all the time. But I'm like mom, I think
(30:25):
we can put the.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
Clarks and sisters kind of wild.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
No, well, we were all very different, but we were
all we all have the same tambur of voice. Like
if all my sisters, any of my sisters walk in,
it just got deeper and deeper and deeper. But no,
we all have these kind of de voice of that
I think we got from my grandmother on my father's side.
(30:52):
We are very close. We were all like we were
all sixteen eighteen months apart. Wow, we were all like
five of us. We were all, you know, we were
born with them out you know, we all there were
five sets of hot curlers, five sets of you know
what I mean, we all we you know, boxes of
Tampa everywhere, my all, I mean like we just like
(31:15):
our whole house with curlers and tampas and Panny Huges.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Curlersas that's the memoir. That's the name of the memoir.
Oh my god, I that that was there, like any
of that? Like, did you have any like sparring with one? Yes?
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Well, Kevy my oldest sister, My sister was just ahead
of me. Her name is Kevin. My mother in nineteen
in nineteen fifty in nineteen fifty eight named my sister
Kevin Elizabeth. She knew a little girl named Kevin. How
cool was that? First of all, because my father was
never going to have a boy, so well, we'll give
her a boy name. Buzz that's my buys name, but
(31:56):
it'll be close enough, all right. But Heavy and I
had to share clothes and share a room, and as
we got into teenage years and hormones raising, racing, and
we even I think one year I had to share
hot curlers. I mean, we were always we had to
share everything, and that was rough. But you know, my
(32:17):
mother and father didn't. My mother wasn't working at the
time when we were growing up. My father was working
and he was running a children's home, and we didn't
have money, you know, so we sparred. We would fight.
But then but my fiercest, staunchest defenders till the day
(32:39):
I die. If something bad happens to me in this industry,
my sister's life that I don't care. I hate that,
you know. I mean, they defend me to the death.
You do not want to best with the clarks And girls, No, no, no,
So they're beautiful.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
So let's talk to you. Are starring in Monica.
Speaker 3 (33:06):
Well, I mean the star is Tracey Lazet, but I
am a bigger I'm a bigger supporting character, very big.
Speaker 1 (33:12):
Well, yeah, it's a huge supporting character, and it's really
kind of the emotional thing around.
Speaker 3 (33:16):
Yes, I had to carry the emotional a lot of
the emotional way hinged on this character.
Speaker 2 (33:21):
And again Patty Clarkson, just you own it, Honey, you
just own it.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
It's a it's a You've always been a very strong
advocate for the LGBTQ plus.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
Community, always always always talk to.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
Us about this movie and about the complexities of the story.
Speaker 3 (33:42):
I'll tell you, Bruce, if I can get through this
without crying, and and it's it's it's it's a very
it's taken a part of me being in this film
right now at this moment when I watch you know,
that beautiful woman who is just silenced on the Montana
floor for the rest of the year.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
I met on the day at Baloo who's like you.
Boo's just a gorgeous pan physically and of fears and
just a beautiful director. And I met him long ago
at Marrakesh when I was on the jury and he
said I want to work with you someday and then
he finally cast Trace and then he came to me
(34:21):
to play the mother and I said yes. In one day.
I literally said yes. By the end of the day,
maybe the next morning. And so Trace and I were
attached to this film for quite some time. But raising
money for a transgender film it's hard.
Speaker 2 (34:36):
It's hard.
Speaker 1 (34:37):
Can you take a beat and explain Trace so everyone
who's listening can understand.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Trace is a beautiful transgender actress. The real thing. We
finally have a transgender actress that I'm not denigrating anybody
else who played transgender. You know, we were politically incorrect
often in Hollywood. It's not new to us. We've all
been at moments politically. But she is a absolutely beautiful
(35:06):
inside and out, beautiful transgender woman. And this story grew
up in Ohio. This story of Monica echoes hers. She's
still playing a different woman, but she left home also
like Monica. So the story of the movie is she's
an eighteen year old, leaves home, is not well treated
(35:29):
by the father. I don't know that I did the
best I could as the mother. There is guilt and
shame in my world. She transitions on her own, which
must have been brutal. And anyway, she's returning home to
me because I'm in the final stages of cancer, and
(35:51):
this is brutal cancer. It's brain cancer. I'm in the
final stages and I'm dying, and I think she's hospice.
This beautiful comes in. I have a nurse played by
the Great Adriana Barrazza, who was in battle. And anyway,
it's a pot of to where we get to. But trace,
(36:13):
you know, on the day I auditioned many, many, many people,
and then he got to trace and he found he
found Monica and very you know, there was no question
she is. And she's so beautiful and subtle and truthful
and open and available. And you know, I've been asked before,
how did you do these emotional scenes? And I say, well,
(36:36):
she was. The love I have for her off screen
is on screen. The reverence and the respect I have
of what she went through to get to where she
is now moves me to the core. And so it
was very emotional. The whole shoot of this movie was
(36:58):
very emotional because dealing with the real thing and someone
who has made this remarkable transformation. But you know, I
tell you, Bruce, I don't think a transgender person's life
is up for debate. They are Americans. They are free
to be here and free to be themselves. That's why
(37:22):
we fight. We're born here and stay here, or we fight.
People lose their lives fighting to get to this country
to what be persecuted. They're fleeing persecution. What the hell
are we doing persecuting people in this country? How do
you know how that person feels deep inside? They know,
their parent knows, often their doctor knows. Whenever they transition,
(37:47):
that is their choice, that is their freedom. Everybody balks
about freedom. Yeah, I don't think there's anything more American
than being transgender. There's nothing more beautiful than being transgender.
You have made it to the life you've always wanted.
(38:07):
You know, Trace Lessette is a beautiful, beautiful woman. And
I said, someday, Trace, you know, you are carrying the
banner and the flag. Thank you God for the transgender community.
She's so beloved in the transgender community. It's you know,
it's very moving to me, you know, to be a
part of all of this. But at the end of
(38:28):
the day, someday Trace will just be two actresses playing spies,
you know what I mean. And that's ultimately her goal
is just to be an actress. She's just a beautiful
woman in this world navigating a career completely.
Speaker 1 (38:51):
I've had such an incredible lunch with Battye today. I
so admire her passion and how much she cares about others.
Before we go, she and I talk about how it
took a while to get the funding together for Monica
and how that led to a very interesting casting decision.
Speaker 3 (39:09):
You know, this movie had no money, and you know
that the dog in the film is.
Speaker 5 (39:13):
My own eyes because but and so on day, it
took us quite a while to get some filmed, some
money together.
Speaker 3 (39:25):
So Andrea I would see easy in New York. She
he's here at the chateau because she just owned the chateau.
She roams free, and she's like Eloise, and.
Speaker 2 (39:38):
You've made EASi, No I have.
Speaker 3 (39:41):
She passed and so through that she she had plaits,
a kind of a dog form of lupas, and but
she lived to do the movie. Yeah, and she she
was so sweet during the filming. No, it was very hard.
(40:03):
Everybody in New York, who's coming to you know, all
my friends, they're all coming, I said, brinkleanex Yeah, oh yeah,
you know, because when you well, for other reasons, but
when you're going to see Izzy.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
Yeah, they all loved.
Speaker 3 (40:16):
Oh, she was the love of every single friend of mine.
Everybody loved Dizzy. Everybody she was like it was like
she was like a little black fawn. I had like
a black fawn in my house or something, you.
Speaker 1 (40:30):
Know, Pricia Clarkson, as we sort of, I know you
have a very busy day. I want to say that
not only do I know you're one of the most
talented human beings on the silver screen, on a Broadway stage,
you are completely one of the kindest, most just generous humans.
And I love running into you on sixth Avenue. I
love sitting with you in Hollywood, and thank you so much,
(40:54):
and and I admire your courage and everything that you've
done from that why I.
Speaker 2 (41:00):
Amc a shitdes form room to this movie. Thank you
so much.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
You realize everything's going to be downhill from here on out,
but I'm taking the rest of my.
Speaker 2 (41:15):
All right, everyone, thank you for pulling up with s
heare today. Thanks miss Patricia clarks Thank you.
Speaker 6 (41:26):
Table for two with Bruce Bosi is produced by iHeartRadio
seven three seven Park and Airmail. Our executive producers are
Bruce Bosi and Nathan King. Table for two is researched
and written by Bridget arsenalt Our sound engineers are Paul
Bowman and Alyssa Midcalf. Table for two's LA production team
is Danielle Romo and Lorraine Verrez.
Speaker 2 (41:48):
Our music supervisor is Randall poster.
Speaker 1 (41:50):
Our Talent booking is by James Harkin. Special thanks to
Amy Sugarman, Uni Cher, Kevin Yvane, Bobby Bauer, Alison Kanter, Graber,
Barbara and Jazz, and Jeff Klein and the staff at
the Tower Bar in the world famous Sunset Tower Hotel.
For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple
Speaker 2 (42:09):
Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Today's episode was recorded before the SAG after a strike
began on July fourteenth. Table for two thanks you as
always for tuning in and supporting entertainers.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Hey, everybody, welcome back to Table for two.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
We are sitting at the Sunset Tower here on a
very gray Los Angeles day.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
But that's okay. I'm super excited.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Because today a powerhouse New Yorker is in the house.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Do we really eat?
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Oh god? Oh yeah, okay, good, I'm a little hungry.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
She's a Southern girl from birth, moved to New York
in the eighties, went to Fordham, got a BFA, went
to Yale, got an MFA. You've seen her in countless films.
You've seen her in countless Broadway productions. She owns every
scene she's in.
Speaker 3 (00:52):
Oh, I'll have the Chinese chickens. Are we drinking just water?
Speaker 2 (00:56):
No?
Speaker 3 (00:57):
We drank yees verse like dry?
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Is you know?
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Perfect?
Speaker 1 (01:04):
She's outspoken, she is sexy, she's super talented. Today we're
having lunch with Patricia Clarkson, So sit back and enjoy.
I'm Bruce Bozi and this is my podcast Table for two.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Wow, this is a.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Super special day in LA and you want to know why, Patty.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Because New York is in the house. Yes, we are
having lunch today.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
If you hold up a chair with the incredible, super
talented someone I always have a rock and roll time
with Patricia Clarkson.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Can I call you Patty?
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Oh please god, oh please, yes, Hey Darling, welcome. I'm
so happy to see you again. I have to tell
you I've been looking forward to this, you know, because
we were trying to juggle the dates everything. I was
literally asking if we had worked out a date to
talk with you, kind of every hour on the hour,
like we just said, Patty, we're going to figure it
(02:12):
out with Okay, we're going to figure it out.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
Okay, I mean, thank you my god. That is such
a compliment. And so we have a lot to talk about.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
Yeah we do.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
We do a movie that's Monica that we're going to
talk about. Oh, here's Rose. Okay, let's just be civilized.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
I know. It's so nice, Southern born lady. I so
adore you. Thank you, thank you, thank you. Oh that's nice.
It's nice. Right. I feel better. Well, I flew in
last night. I had a COVID. I'm like, well, because
I have to I'm doing a few other things after you.
This is but this is the highlight.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
This is exactly and this is the only time you're
gonna sit and eat. So Patty, you're born in the South,
You're Louisiana.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
Orle and girl girl.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
You hit New York, Fordham eighties, the nineteen.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Eighties, nineteen eighty, I hit New York.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
Big decade for New York. A lot goes down you.
Then you also go to Yalef. So just talk to
me about your New York, Like what do you love
about New York? I kind of want to know, Like
also like what was that New York versus.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
What is this? Oh?
Speaker 3 (03:22):
Wow, Well, I have to tell you the best story.
So I come off. I go to LSU, transfer to Fordham.
Best decision I ever made. It was very hard for
my father for it because I was nineteen. I left
New Orleans and it was my parents. I grew up
very middle class, very very very middle class, and it
(03:45):
was tough to get me to Fordham. But my beauty
because no, just tough. No. I had good grades. And
my aunt, my beautiful aunt restor So, my beautiful aunt
Becky was dean of Admissions of Loyola in New Ork
and she said, Patty, let's try to connect you to Fordham.
So I didn't have to audition then, but I wanted.
(04:07):
I heard they had a very good theater program. So
my parents gather the money. I go off to New York.
Fordham has no dorm at Lincoln Center. So there's a
rose Hill, huge rose Hill with many and then there's
Lincoln Center. Guess where I lived.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Because of the Forum, And funnily enough, I just walked
by forduam about a week and a half ago.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
I thought about that.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
I think, why am here? I am this southern girl,
like really not innocent and well a little bit I
mean naive. I mean, I'm born and raised in New
Orleans and Norman's is very cosmopolitan and very cool, but
and very progressive, thankfully. But I get off to New York.
(04:56):
I go to the Riots. It's only ladies on one floor.
The room was literally the size that you had to
turn sideways to get into the room.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
And it was women of all ages and we all
showered together in a big, pink old bathroom just because
of the door. And it was the most depressing place
you could have ever been in the history of depressing.
And it was brutal. It was brutal. It's sixty fourth
(05:31):
and Broadway. But I meet this woman, Viviana from Karraka.
She's studying at Parsons and she did not speak a
lot of English, but she spoke enough English to say,
we have to get out of here. She did well,
showering with some of these lads. Open huge open shower
(05:52):
and like you walked in it spicts out the wall
and some of the lady you know, and there were
people on it was and on Saturday nights there were
all these young men in the lobby and me, stupidly
I thought, oh, it's the boy scouts returning from a trip.
(06:13):
Oh so a lot was going down a lot and
I finally, you know, I finally we found an apartment
on the upper with this woman, with Vivian, we found
an apartment. There was a big bedroom. And even though
they were so kind to us and they built a
wall down the center, we got our separate bedrooms and
(06:35):
we It was the best thing that happened. We got
out of the y and that was New York. For me,
it was going to afford him no money. I had
no money, but that is none.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
So there's so many things that are inspiring about that.
One is that it's very scary for parents. You were
one of five sisters and parents are like, okay, and
now to say it, I'm gonna do this. There was
no spoiled and titled that might have been fear, but
you're like, I'm.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
I packed doing bags and went to you know, big
bags and got there. I knew no one, but I
met my mentor, one of my biggest mentors at Fordham,
Joe Jozevsky, and he was at the theater in the
theater department. A teacher I was taught by. Deborah Monk,
was my first acting teacher. Deborah Monk, the great, the great, great, great,
(07:30):
gorgeous Deborah Monk was my first acting teacher at Fordham. Okay,
it was just I loved for it. I just I
go back every year now and speak to the graduating
actors every year. I had to miss a few times
here or there because I was shooting or something, but
I just did it, like a couple of weeks ago.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
What were some of the shows that you did.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
I did Pinter I did the famous pinter play Three Characters,
the Old Fair Betrayal, Trill Betrayal. You'd like the Trail
with Ron Morasco, the best actor ever at Fordham. I
was in his shadow. And I mean he's now an academic.
He's brilliant, brilliant man of renaissance man. He's writer, actor
(08:13):
director anyway, But I I formed, I became an actor,
and Joe Jozevsky helped shape me, directed me, and had
a gabbler in my senior year, you know, and then
I he's the one who told me you will get
into Yale. I said no, they had people were telling
me you have to have connections to get in the Yale.
(08:34):
Joe said, no, Patty, we're going to get the right
two right pieces for you and we're going to work
your ass off for this and you're going to get in.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
So you knew then at Fordham, when you were getting
your BFA, yes, that you want your next goal was
MFA eal.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
Well I always had. I never thought about film. I
always thought about theater, and I knew how important studying was.
And really, remember I had only had two years at Fordham.
I needed more depth and breadth of studying. And I
thought I just always had this thing about well, if
(09:14):
I could get into Yale, and I'll never forget the
day I lived. So we found an apartment, me and
Viviana on seventy seventh and Broadway and Fordham is at sixtieth.
And I got that letter in the mail. I opened
it at my little our little table that was in
our little apartment, and it says you have been accepted
(09:38):
to the School of Dramas. I ran seventeen blocks to Fordham.
Joe and everybody was in a staff meeting, and I
just went through the secretary. I just opened it in
and I said, Joe, right, and.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
There's so much great, like I mean, first of all,
like remember that time in your life and everything.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
First of all, it was nineteen eighty so.
Speaker 3 (10:03):
For everyone to really this was eighty two. Now in
nineteen eighty.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
Two, eighty two, it's New York City. It's a very
special time in New York City. Things are real, you
know what I mean. And you're young, and we're young
like that.
Speaker 3 (10:15):
Twenty two everything was just like the world was. Everything
was before me, and I had nothing to regret behind me,
so everything was forward. And again my parents had to
find and I had a full ride to study at Rutgers.
I had a full I was offered a a I
(10:38):
was offered a soap opera.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Okay, I was.
Speaker 3 (10:42):
And my father was like, well, well of course she
takes you.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
What made you know that you wanted to continue with learning,
in studying as opposed to hitting.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Did you see Broadway shows?
Speaker 3 (11:03):
I would assume, And I saw it, and you know what,
you know what I saw like twelve times and I
had no money. I stood dream Girls. I was j Jennifer.
Most people would think it was some straight and I'm
not a musical theater person at all. Just if I
sang one note, you'd know immediately. I did dance when
(11:24):
I was young. But but Jennifer holiday that performance. I
saw that just it informed me in ways as an
actor that I will never lose.
Speaker 4 (11:35):
You're you're eating that's I have a very tight dress,
gorgeous Christian Syrianna dress tomorrow night.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
And I.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
But anyway, so I'm yes, I'm girls, you're standing in
the yes and I because when she hits that last
closing song of Act one, and I am telling you,
she's just.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
You know, it's it's.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
The earth moves, the earth.
Speaker 3 (12:11):
Moves, and it's it's such a visceral, beautiful performance, and
you didn't want to change me. It just inform me
as an actress. Sorry, would go back and back and back.
You know. It's what I just told that all the
Fordham kids I just spoke to. I said, nobody, nobody
was filming anything. This is the Your cell phone is
a death of you as an actress. I felt everything
(12:33):
I saw. I didn't have to record it. It was
my body, my soul, my mind was recording it. I
will never forget Jennifer Holiday ever. I mean, Jennifer was
wonderful also, but Jennifer Holiday is my erson now in.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
The eighties, specifically in that show which just blew it
off the room.
Speaker 3 (12:53):
I had a rich friend and he came to visit me.
Kathy Smith and her mother bought us tickets and I
sat in. I sat down to watch it. Finally, Oh
my god, like really good seats.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
So why didn't you just say I'm ready?
Speaker 3 (13:20):
You know, after Fordam, Yeah, like I'm ready. I don't know.
I had this. I had this desire to keep trying
to hone my craft. You know, as actors we it
is a craft. It is a muscle that needs to
be flexed and toned and you know, exercise. But what
we ultimately want is to make art, and I think
(13:42):
it it's hard. It's hard to take craft and lift
it art. It's hard.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
How come every senior in you own you own?
Speaker 1 (13:54):
And clearly it started at fordom Patricia clar When you're
in a movie and you're in and you've done a
lot of theater, and you've done a lot of movies, when.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
You walk on, can you identify it? Don't you know?
Speaker 3 (14:12):
Do it? This is the only thing I do know
this as I've gotten older, and I hope this doesn't
sound pretentious. I think as actors we can only create
so much and fake so much, and kind of I
do believe that as we age, we bring more and
(14:33):
more and more of ourselves, and I think that's essential.
We have to marry life and art. And yes there
are times when we're outside the box of ourselves, but
ourselves we always have to. Our emotional life has to
somehow mirror our own right and maybe I'm comfortable the
(14:57):
body wants to shut you down when you act and
you do these very big emotional scenes, are you just
or when you're taking on like when I was doing
sharp objects, you know, these hideous scenes are poisoning my child.
The body wants to shut you down, but you have
to actually understand. You have to have the truth around it.
(15:18):
You have to understand it. You have to understand the
way Patty would understand it, so then it actually is
the way the character would understand. And as I've moved
forward in this world, I realize when I'm not present,
it's not a good thing. And as difficult as that is,
(15:38):
I think that's the shame about acting. Although things are
dramatically changing in Hollywood, as we age, we just we
get better because we're able to just be there.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Welcome back to Table for two.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
After earning not one, but two prestigious drama degrees, Patricia
Clarkson began her professional life on stage. I want to
know when she first sensed that her career was taken off.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
What's the first play you nail?
Speaker 3 (16:33):
Hit?
Speaker 2 (16:34):
Past that?
Speaker 3 (16:35):
You were like, holy shit, you mean that? I got yes, well,
House of Blue Leaves on Broadway. I replaced Julie Haggerty
right after they won that, but I had an audition
for it. Originally had given this crazy audition, got a
standing ovation, but they went with Julie Haggerty. Nine months
later we.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Got standing ovation in the.
Speaker 3 (16:56):
In the audition, John, they were so sweet. They were
so sweet to me, and so I think I'm getting this.
I bought a new dress, I had no money, I
had my hair because I'm playing you know, you can
say the hearing impair. She wasn't deaf, she was hearing
impaired movie star Corina. And I fell out my chair
(17:16):
and you know, and I didn't get the part. And
then nine months later, after they win the Tony, Julia
Haggerty's leaving to go do one of her big films
at the time. And I have a message on my
answering machine from Jerry's Axe Patricia.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
Jerry's right, We're.
Speaker 3 (17:34):
Giving you the part, you know. And it was one
thousand dollars a week. I thought I died and gone right.
I'd never made.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Any money, that's so amazing.
Speaker 3 (17:45):
I stepped in to House of Blue Leaves. I'd done
a few plays off Broadway before that, some Richard Greenberg
and atest some beautiful and then but then I got
House of Blue Leaves on Broadway right after they won
the Tony. Know that. Then I'm in that for three months,
but then I have to leave it to go do
(18:07):
the Untouchables.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
Okay, all right, So she just kind of throws the
Untouchables in.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
Okay, So the.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
First movie This Gorgeous Woman Across from Me is in
is a Palmer film starring Kevin Costner in his height oftitious.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Gorgeous How did I mean? What I mean? That's it.
That's a huge, huge thing. You nail it.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Can you tell me about the process working with Brian
de Palmer making out with Kevin.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
The famous great acting a great casting director who passed
away not long ago. Anyway, it'll come to me. And
I go in to read for him, and I kind
of was a little dulled up, and he goes listen.
I think Brian would like you, but you need to
come back in no makeup and don't wear that sexy dress.
So I go out by like a little house in
(19:02):
the prairie, drows seriously like like crunchy, like puffy sleeves
and like like a midt like a tie around the thing.
I walk in very unsuthered, like no makeup, like oh,
I hit my life, and and there's Brian to ball
(19:22):
and he the reader's there, but Brian reads Elliott nests
opposite me, and I think Brian liked the juxtaposition of
my kind of you know, deep voice, my kind of
you know, baritone dux opposed to my kind of you know,
(19:43):
upturned nose and you know, and my big hair. I
think he just liked that I was this sweet looking
person and I kind of had a little bit of
a naughty voice. Well, so I walk out the room
and the next thing I know is they're flying me.
(20:03):
I'm now in the middle of doing housabilities, but they're
flying me to Chicago to meet Kevin Costner. I have
a matinee I have to do, but they fly me on.
Like you it's seven, no, no, no, no, seven o'clock.
I walk in again. I wear kind of like a
plain Jane dress. I'm like Jesus, like these ugly shoes
and no make I'm like, oh God. And I walk
(20:26):
in and Kevin's kind of sweet and he's like, I
hear Brian, Brian loves you, Patricia. And I read with
Kevin and they tell me I have the part right
in the room, but my agents didn't believe me. So
I walk out. I'm like, I got the park. They're like, no, no, no, Patty.
(20:46):
I was like, no, no, no, no, They're not going
to lie to me. I would not lie to a
southern girl like with with who walked in with no
makeup and big hair, and of course, like you know,
I get back on the plane. I'm in my dressing
room preparing for my matinee. I made it back with
(21:07):
me matinee. Okay, but I'd never flown like first class. Really,
I never had a car picked me up. I never
had I had everybody just waiting on me. I never
had any of that. So anyway, I get back to
the dressing room in the phone rings and my agent
was like, Okay, you were right, you got the car.
But Bruce, it was wall to wall white men. Even
(21:32):
my makeup artist was a white man. Really beautiful man.
Mike can't got beautiful and beautiful. Everybody everybody was mail.
My mother came to visit me in set because my
mother had business in Chicago at the time, and she
came to visit me. She was like, petty, Petty, I
(21:55):
don't know if this is good or bad, but there's
a lot of handsome men and there's just nothing but man,
if I can see for are there any ladies here?
Are there any ladies in Chicago? I mean, it was
just wall. I was the only woman on the set
(22:18):
and then there was my mother for a day and
my mother was like, oh, hello, but no, Brian was
Brian was incredible to me. And I'll tell you what
he did, and it still moves me to this day.
I was broke and I was being paid but minimum.
You know, they got me for scale, but I was
still struggling in New York City. And he knew it,
(22:43):
and he couldn't get me more money. But he told paramount,
he said, I think we need miss Ness in the courtroom.
I think we need her in the courtroom. And they said, well,
it's a it's not We're not shooting the courtroom till
the month. He said, well, I guess you're just gonna
have to pay her for a month because we need
her in that court. I got paid an extra month,
(23:07):
a whole month. It saved me. Yeah, and I just
sat in New York and went back and shopped the
court right, but I got paid.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
That makes me so happy.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
That till this day, he's my hero. He's he was amazing,
amazing to me.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
You bring up something that's so obviously changed, which is
a white male set, and that was you know, obviously
probably over the last ten years, massive, massive, how has
that now been for you and work and the whole
movement of really diversifying the place, the movie set.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
It's the thing that's ever happened in Hollywood. It's single.
It is the best thing. The best part of Hollywood
now is its diversity on camera. Off camera. We still
have a way to go, but I'm telling you off camera,
the things I've shot recently, everybody is reflected. When you
(24:19):
go to a movie set, you want to see yourself
reflected in all the people because the crew is part
of your life. You see them every day for twelve
fourteen hours a day, and often you're working for no money.
What are you there for if you're not reflected in
all of the people on that set, or more importantly,
if you're not reflected on film. Now sometimes you know,
(24:39):
we have to do things that don't include people of color,
if talking something historic but something important, but you know,
as a white woman, but an older white like, there's
older people now on sets. It used to just be
really young people, I mean young white guys and some
old guys that ran the show, and now it's older
(25:03):
women who are not giving up their careers, Beautiful makeup
artists and beautiful costume designers and beautiful set designers, all
of these women of many nationalities. We still have a
way to go, but it's the best thing that's ever
happened in Hollywood is the diversity.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
Back on table for two, Patricia and I have had
a wonderful lunch talking about her career on Broadway and
the silver screen. All of a sudden, when I mentioned
Chelsea Handler in passing, she calls her her hero.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
Let's find out why.
Speaker 3 (26:00):
I'm a sixty three year old, single, straight Southern woman
who never married and never had children. You know that
man who's got the squeaky voice, who says she must
be the most unhappy when in the world. Come to
our house one night and see just how unhappy Chelsea
and I are. I mean, look, I have so many
(26:20):
sisters who have beautiful children, and they now have beautiful children.
I love being an aunt. I love it more than
probably more than acting, which is odd. Okay, they're on
a par okay, but but I'm telling you, these are
gorgeous children. But that defined that, that doesn't have to
(26:44):
define every woman.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
You know what, Like, You're right, you made a choice.
Speaker 3 (26:47):
I made a big choice.
Speaker 5 (26:50):
I made it.
Speaker 3 (26:50):
But I knew it when I was young, and I've
had beautiful men in my life. And I thought about
it with this one artist I dated where it's I
was like thirty eight. I had a window, well, a
window to have a child. I was thirty eight, so
I had a window. But in the end of the day,
I loved working. And I grew up with great parents
(27:13):
who sacrificed everything for me. And you have to really
be committed to having children, right, you have to be
a great parent, And I was afraid I couldn't be.
I didn't want to fail at being a parent. I'm
fine failing as an actor. I didn't want to fail
as being a parent. But look, I'm a Southern woman.
(27:35):
But let me tell you who's the coolest about it
is my mother, like my mother, my father. My mother said, Patty,
I just don't want you to wake up at fifty
and be unhappy. I woke up at fifty in stilettos
and a fall far. I let me tell you, no,
I mean I had great sexy asfeh. I mean I
(28:00):
I'm just saying is, And it's not that my whole
life is that.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
I'm just saying is.
Speaker 3 (28:04):
I love being an a. I love being a sister,
I love being a daughter, I love being a great
best friend. I'm a very good friend. I think it's
not what I wanted to define me because I didn't
want to fail.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
I also just watched for the first time Pieces of April,
and my question around that it was a serious family
you're sick with cancer.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
Katie Holmes is.
Speaker 3 (28:35):
Sort of like, oh, delicious, and Katie was delicious.
Speaker 1 (28:38):
You have you come from a family of five sisters,
like are the traditions that like? You know, this was
about Thanksgiving and this was about the complexities of it.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
Do your family and it was a great one. All
of you should see it and.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
We all have Yes. Well, well, my mother she doesn't
cook anymore. You know, my parents are still with me.
They're eighty seven.
Speaker 2 (28:59):
Yeah, they're in credit.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
My mother doesn't cook anymore. But you know it was
always you know, she was going to make Merlaton crab meat.
She's going to make jamalaia but very specific. You're very
going to make very specific jamalia. Not a Cajun. People
can flat Cajun and Creole. I'm Creole. We grew up
with Creole cooking. Creole is the Spanish and French influence
that really landed was throughout the people. It is. You know,
(29:26):
the people of New Orleans are a real gumbo. They're
such a mixture and that's the beauty of this city.
But the cooking, like my mother, my mother never saw
sausage in her life. You know, they did not cook.
My mother didn't cook with sausage really.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
No.
Speaker 3 (29:41):
Everything was crab meat, shrimp.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
That's all Cajun.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
That's all Cajun, and sausage and meat on doing. Yeah, yeah, no, no, no,
my mother, My mother cooked you know, creole. So everything
we ate, we had big you know, and we always
my mother never allowed a container on the table like ketchup.
Everything had to be even though we were like but
(30:05):
my mother had nice things because she was given nice
things from like her bubby, from her you know, from
down the line. But you know, we were living in
the suburbs of our years outside New Orleans, going to
public school, but we still a ketchup bottle was not
allowed all the time. But I'm like mom, I think
(30:25):
we can put the.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
Clarks and sisters kind of wild.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
No, well, we were all very different, but we were
all we all have the same tambur of voice. Like
if all my sisters, any of my sisters walk in,
it just got deeper and deeper and deeper. But no,
we all have these kind of de voice of that
I think we got from my grandmother on my father's side.
(30:52):
We are very close. We were all like we were
all sixteen eighteen months apart. Wow, we were all like
five of us. We were all, you know, we were
born with them out you know, we all there were
five sets of hot curlers, five sets of you know
what I mean, we all we you know, boxes of
Tampa everywhere, my all, I mean like we just like
(31:15):
our whole house with curlers and tampas and Panny Huges.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Curlersas that's the memoir. That's the name of the memoir.
Oh my god, I that that was there, like any
of that? Like, did you have any like sparring with one? Yes?
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Well, Kevy my oldest sister, My sister was just ahead
of me. Her name is Kevin. My mother in nineteen
in nineteen fifty in nineteen fifty eight named my sister
Kevin Elizabeth. She knew a little girl named Kevin. How
cool was that? First of all, because my father was
never going to have a boy, so well, we'll give
her a boy name. Buzz that's my buys name, but
(31:56):
it'll be close enough, all right. But Heavy and I
had to share clothes and share a room, and as
we got into teenage years and hormones raising, racing, and
we even I think one year I had to share
hot curlers. I mean, we were always we had to
share everything, and that was rough. But you know, my
(32:17):
mother and father didn't. My mother wasn't working at the
time when we were growing up. My father was working
and he was running a children's home, and we didn't
have money, you know, so we sparred. We would fight.
But then but my fiercest, staunchest defenders till the day
(32:39):
I die. If something bad happens to me in this industry,
my sister's life that I don't care. I hate that,
you know. I mean, they defend me to the death.
You do not want to best with the clarks And girls, No, no, no,
So they're beautiful.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
So let's talk to you. Are starring in Monica.
Speaker 3 (33:06):
Well, I mean the star is Tracey Lazet, but I
am a bigger I'm a bigger supporting character, very big.
Speaker 1 (33:12):
Well, yeah, it's a huge supporting character, and it's really
kind of the emotional thing around.
Speaker 3 (33:16):
Yes, I had to carry the emotional a lot of
the emotional way hinged on this character.
Speaker 2 (33:21):
And again Patty Clarkson, just you own it, Honey, you
just own it.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
It's a it's a You've always been a very strong
advocate for the LGBTQ plus.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
Community, always always always talk to.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
Us about this movie and about the complexities of the story.
Speaker 3 (33:42):
I'll tell you, Bruce, if I can get through this
without crying, and and it's it's it's it's a very
it's taken a part of me being in this film
right now at this moment when I watch you know,
that beautiful woman who is just silenced on the Montana
floor for the rest of the year.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
I met on the day at Baloo who's like you.
Boo's just a gorgeous pan physically and of fears and
just a beautiful director. And I met him long ago
at Marrakesh when I was on the jury and he
said I want to work with you someday and then
he finally cast Trace and then he came to me
(34:21):
to play the mother and I said yes. In one day.
I literally said yes. By the end of the day,
maybe the next morning. And so Trace and I were
attached to this film for quite some time. But raising
money for a transgender film it's hard.
Speaker 2 (34:36):
It's hard.
Speaker 1 (34:37):
Can you take a beat and explain Trace so everyone
who's listening can understand.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Trace is a beautiful transgender actress. The real thing. We
finally have a transgender actress that I'm not denigrating anybody
else who played transgender. You know, we were politically incorrect
often in Hollywood. It's not new to us. We've all
been at moments politically. But she is a absolutely beautiful
(35:06):
inside and out, beautiful transgender woman. And this story grew
up in Ohio. This story of Monica echoes hers. She's
still playing a different woman, but she left home also
like Monica. So the story of the movie is she's
an eighteen year old, leaves home, is not well treated
(35:29):
by the father. I don't know that I did the
best I could as the mother. There is guilt and
shame in my world. She transitions on her own, which
must have been brutal. And anyway, she's returning home to
me because I'm in the final stages of cancer, and
(35:51):
this is brutal cancer. It's brain cancer. I'm in the
final stages and I'm dying, and I think she's hospice.
This beautiful comes in. I have a nurse played by
the Great Adriana Barrazza, who was in battle. And anyway,
it's a pot of to where we get to. But trace,
(36:13):
you know, on the day I auditioned many, many, many people,
and then he got to trace and he found he
found Monica and very you know, there was no question
she is. And she's so beautiful and subtle and truthful
and open and available. And you know, I've been asked before,
how did you do these emotional scenes? And I say, well,
(36:36):
she was. The love I have for her off screen
is on screen. The reverence and the respect I have
of what she went through to get to where she
is now moves me to the core. And so it
was very emotional. The whole shoot of this movie was
(36:58):
very emotional because dealing with the real thing and someone
who has made this remarkable transformation. But you know, I
tell you, Bruce, I don't think a transgender person's life
is up for debate. They are Americans. They are free
to be here and free to be themselves. That's why
(37:22):
we fight. We're born here and stay here, or we fight.
People lose their lives fighting to get to this country
to what be persecuted. They're fleeing persecution. What the hell
are we doing persecuting people in this country? How do
you know how that person feels deep inside? They know,
their parent knows, often their doctor knows. Whenever they transition,
(37:47):
that is their choice, that is their freedom. Everybody balks
about freedom. Yeah, I don't think there's anything more American
than being transgender. There's nothing more beautiful than being transgender.
You have made it to the life you've always wanted.
(38:07):
You know, Trace Lessette is a beautiful, beautiful woman. And
I said, someday, Trace, you know, you are carrying the
banner and the flag. Thank you God for the transgender community.
She's so beloved in the transgender community. It's you know,
it's very moving to me, you know, to be a
part of all of this. But at the end of
(38:28):
the day, someday Trace will just be two actresses playing spies,
you know what I mean. And that's ultimately her goal
is just to be an actress. She's just a beautiful
woman in this world navigating a career completely.
Speaker 1 (38:51):
I've had such an incredible lunch with Battye today. I
so admire her passion and how much she cares about others.
Before we go, she and I talk about how it
took a while to get the funding together for Monica
and how that led to a very interesting casting decision.
Speaker 3 (39:09):
You know, this movie had no money, and you know
that the dog in the film is.
Speaker 5 (39:13):
My own eyes because but and so on day, it
took us quite a while to get some filmed, some
money together.
Speaker 3 (39:25):
So Andrea I would see easy in New York. She
he's here at the chateau because she just owned the chateau.
She roams free, and she's like Eloise, and.
Speaker 2 (39:38):
You've made EASi, No I have.
Speaker 3 (39:41):
She passed and so through that she she had plaits,
a kind of a dog form of lupas, and but
she lived to do the movie. Yeah, and she she
was so sweet during the filming. No, it was very hard.
(40:03):
Everybody in New York, who's coming to you know, all
my friends, they're all coming, I said, brinkleanex Yeah, oh yeah,
you know, because when you well, for other reasons, but
when you're going to see Izzy.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
Yeah, they all loved.
Speaker 3 (40:16):
Oh, she was the love of every single friend of mine.
Everybody loved Dizzy. Everybody she was like it was like
she was like a little black fawn. I had like
a black fawn in my house or something, you.
Speaker 1 (40:30):
Know, Pricia Clarkson, as we sort of, I know you
have a very busy day. I want to say that
not only do I know you're one of the most
talented human beings on the silver screen, on a Broadway stage,
you are completely one of the kindest, most just generous humans.
And I love running into you on sixth Avenue. I
love sitting with you in Hollywood, and thank you so much,
(40:54):
and and I admire your courage and everything that you've
done from that why I.
Speaker 2 (41:00):
Amc a shitdes form room to this movie. Thank you
so much.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
You realize everything's going to be downhill from here on out,
but I'm taking the rest of my.
Speaker 2 (41:15):
All right, everyone, thank you for pulling up with s
heare today. Thanks miss Patricia clarks Thank you.
Speaker 6 (41:26):
Table for two with Bruce Bosi is produced by iHeartRadio
seven three seven Park and Airmail. Our executive producers are
Bruce Bosi and Nathan King. Table for two is researched
and written by Bridget arsenalt Our sound engineers are Paul
Bowman and Alyssa Midcalf. Table for two's LA production team
is Danielle Romo and Lorraine Verrez.
Speaker 2 (41:48):
Our music supervisor is Randall poster.
Speaker 1 (41:50):
Our Talent booking is by James Harkin. Special thanks to
Amy Sugarman, Uni Cher, Kevin Yvane, Bobby Bauer, Alison Kanter, Graber,
Barbara and Jazz, and Jeff Klein and the staff at
the Tower Bar in the world famous Sunset Tower Hotel.
For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple
Speaker 2 (42:09):
Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations.
The Nikki Glaser Podcast
Every week comedian and infamous roaster Nikki Glaser provides a fun, fast-paced, and brutally honest look into current pop-culture and her own personal life.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.