February 11, 2024 • 50 mins
In this episode of The Success Palette, I invite the multi-talented artist and poet, Daniel Maluka, for a peek into his artistic journey. Maluka shares his insights and lessons learned from a life intertwined with creativity and business. He shares his childhood inspirations, the duality of his love for art and poetry and the significance of authenticity in the realm of creativity.
Learn about his transformation from a Dragon Ball Z inspired child to a successful creative entrepreneur. Uncover the influence of art icons like Salvador Dali, Goya, and Francis Bacon on his perspective and discover how he navigates the tricky landscape of personal creativity versus business savvy.
A significant highlight of the discussion is Maluka's distinctive approach to creating art - allowing the art to take the lead and letting his inner creative spirit flow freely. Hear the artist share about his spontaneous late-night drawing sessions, his personal favorite work- a self-portrait and his belief in trusting your instincts and creating for the joy of creation.
Gain practical insights on ways creatives can find success in business—value networking, responsiveness, and learning from others. Join in the conversation around the impact of social media on creativity, the ongoing struggle of balancing a full-time job while passionately creating art, embracing the unknown, and fostering experiences to nurture creativity.
Daniel previews his upcoming poetry collection, Unwashed, which comes out Summer 2024. Immerse yourself in this insightful dialogue that strikes an excellent balance of creative passion and entrepreneurship, sure to fuel your artistic endeavors.
Daniel Maluka Website: https://www.danielmaluka.net
The Success Palette links:
https://www.thesuccesspalette.com
Video mentioned in interview: https://youtu.be/7k1VSAnoi_Y?si=P0vHHUEKDVGPiV0P
This podcast is supported by Women Into Networking:
https://www.womenintonetworking.org
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hello, hello everyone, you are listening to The Success Palette,
a place to discuss how creatives can succeed in every aspect of our lives.
I'm your host Soda and today I invited Daniel Maluka to help me discuss how
to find a balance between being your authentic creative self,
(00:24):
but also tapping into that business aspect of being a creative entrepreneur.
Daniel, do you want to start off talking a little bit about your artistic journey,
how you got into art, poetry, all of these creative outlets that you have?
So I've been writing and drawing my whole life, basically.
(00:46):
I started at first because of Dragon Ball Z. When I was a little kid,
watching that show had a pretty profound impact on me.
I always I always wanted to draw as a result of that show, drawing the characters that I would see.
I realized it wasn't necessarily just the characters that I liked,
but it was also the branching storylines and how you were following the lives
(01:08):
of those individuals in addition to the action and the animation and the cartoon aspect of it.
But I got a little older and I realized that like you didn't necessarily have
to use like animation or comic books to tell a story through art.
Discovering artists like Salvador Dali, Goya, Francis Bacon.
(01:28):
I learned that you could tell stories through your artwork through like one-offs
or like a one-off painting.
You can do a lot of like symbolic things that do tell a story to the viewer.
So that's sort of like what I started to do. I really, really carried that sort
of narrative drive throughout my whole art journey.
Started with Dragon Ball Z, then later getting influenced by some of the old
(01:50):
masters, some famous painters, Basquiat, Picasso, Dali, Caravaggio,
Francis Bacon. They're all pretty big influences on me.
And in terms of the writing aspect, similar to the drawing aspect,
it was through Dragon Ball Z, right?
Because I love those stories that that creator was telling.
Toriyama was his name. I really liked the stories he was telling in his manga
(02:14):
and his comic book and in his actual show of Dragon Ball Z.
So I said, I wanted to make my own type of story.
So I was always writing and drawing and writing and drawing and writing and
drawing and writing and drawing since I was younger.
It was only through university that I started to take just poetry more seriously.
The reason for that being was...
(02:36):
In the creative writing class I had, my poetry teacher would give me higher
marks in poetry than in short stories or anything.
And I had asked him why, and he had simply said, oh, just the poetry is more interesting.
So that kind of planted a seed in my mind to sort of like allow myself to go
down that specific poetry avenue.
So yeah, that's sort of how I started with the two of them.
(02:57):
And I love that you really focus on the story aspect of it, because that is
something that is so important for me.
My dad is a photographer on the side and he would always tell me how when he
takes photographs, he wants to show a story just in that one image.
And that was so profound because I come from an animation background.
(03:18):
So I think of story as this whole big thing, but it could really just one phrase,
one small poem. I'm getting into poetry right now, kind of transitioning from
art to poetry and so many similar aspects to it.
But I also understand that we have to really make something that doesn't just
(03:40):
inspire us, but inspires other people.
How do you find that balance between doing what you want to create,
but also something that you could make a living off of?
Yes, that is a very good question. For me, I would say that that balance,
for me, it's happened sort of like accidentally.
(04:02):
I've had things that I've drawn that I haven't really thought anything about.
Just like something I'm drawing, like maybe at 2 a.m., just a random thing.
And someone will connect with it so profoundly, which has happened to me,
that they ask to get it tattooed.
They buy a print of it. They ask to get the thing tattooed that I drew.
And there are other instances where it's like, I have two artworks of mine that are the most popular,
(04:26):
and both of them sell pretty well on my end because I was really,
really surrendering myself to the creative process.
I didn't put as much of myself into the work.
I sort of let the creative spirit, that creative energy, I sort of let it take
(04:48):
over uncensored and then I would create that thing.
And those are my two most popular ones. And I think the reason why they connect
with people so much is because I wasn't trying to tell something specific about me, Daniel.
I was more so sort of like...
Trying to tap in without realizing, trying to tap in more to the collective
(05:11):
unconscious and sort of like say what we're all thinking, display what we're all thinking.
There was one illustration that I did that was also quite popular.
I did sell a few prints of it. It was titled Lockdown.
And it was of a woman. It's in black and white. It's basically,
not black and white, it's more so in grayscale.
It's a woman lying down on her bed and she's melting. And I had drawn this during
(05:35):
lockdowns, especially in my country in Canada, our lockdowns are pretty severe.
So when I had drawn that and when I had put that out, a lot of people related
to it, a lot of people sort of tapped into it because they were feeling that same thing.
So tapping into that collective unconscious is one way that I'm able to access the business side.
(05:56):
The other way that I've been able to access the business side is just through a lot of networking.
I'm lucky I live in a pretty creative city.
It's a pretty artistic city, the place that I live. So my mind is always in
tune and looking out for calls for submission, paid calls.
(06:17):
We need an artist to do this. We need someone to do this logo.
We need this. I have this idea. I need someone to help me brainstorm.
I'm willing to pick any of those sort of calls for submission.
I'm really, really tuned into, and I often apply to them.
I recently applied to one.
I forget the name of it, but if you are one of the artists selected,
they pay you about $2,000 and your art goes up on big posters in the subway.
(06:41):
Now, the reason why I submitted something to them is because,
let's say, even if I don't get selected for that,
the fact that I'm getting myself into the habit of figuring out what the theme
is, drawing something to the theme, creating new work on a timeline that's relevant
to that theme, and also writing a relevant artist statement and to go with it.
(07:03):
So even if I don't win or even if I don't get self-selected,
I'm getting myself comfortable and used to the idea of commercial work.
As in someone has a very specific idea, a very specific thing that they want
you to do, and there's a specific deadline.
And now I'm a lot more comfortable with tapping into that and sort of getting into that zone.
(07:26):
But I still allow myself to do the other side where I'm just vibing,
letting my mind wander, drawing whatever I want.
So I would say getting comfortable with responding to specific art calls is
how I activate the business side.
The networking aspect, being in the rooms, being in the positions,
(07:46):
knowing the people who are most likely to need an artist to do something.
That's sort of how I access the business side as well.
And tapping into that sort of like unconscious sense when I am making my own
artwork for like prints and such.
So I would say that those are the three ways, if that makes sense.
That absolutely makes sense.
(08:08):
And what really I connected with was where you talked about tapping into this
connection, this overall human experience that we all have.
What are some ways that you've been able to do that? Is it through talking with just observing people?
Is it just more of a spiritual thing? How do you know how to feel what others
(08:34):
are feeling and what they're able to, what they need in their lives through
your art and your poetry?
I suppose it's, I suppose to answer this question, basically depends on like
how weird you want to get.
Basically, I guess that's my question, right?
I'm a witch, so you could go as weird as you want. But I just love to hear people's,
(08:56):
because I think it's so important to understand what the world is feeling because
I believe in that collective energy.
So that's why I was very intrigued when you brought that up.
So I would say, yes, talking to people, being immersed, speaking to other creatives,
seeing where those conversations go, letting yourself be open, I would say.
(09:17):
Let yourself be a transmitter for that sort of energy.
And one of the ways that I was able to get into that zone was to be not as intentional
about some of the artwork I'd make.
I'll give you an example. There was a point in time when I was really,
really got back into drawing after a while of not doing it.
And I was like sort of stumped. I was intimidated by big white pages.
(09:41):
Like I didn't know what to draw. I didn't know how to start.
So what I did was I would spill coffee on a page, wait for that to dry, come back to it.
Then I would let sort of the coffee spills tell their own story.
Story, surrendering my intention.
I want it to look like this. It has to be good. It has to surrendering that
intention and letting the artwork lead itself.
(10:03):
Right. So that's one of the ways because I let the artwork lead.
I'm not as like ego driven in the things that I create. Right.
And another way that it happens and I have like I've had like a theory on this.
I think all All artists, and I know you would agree with this as a creative,
(10:24):
all artists, all creatives, we are ahead.
By that, I mean our tastes are ahead. The things that we're into are ahead.
And usually we're so ahead of the general curve of what people like, what people are into.
We're so ahead of what's in, what's popular.
We're so ahead of what's going to resonate with people that usually people have to catch up to us.
(10:47):
Whenever I go on Instagram and you see like those art aggregator accounts and
they're reposting art from other artists whenever I click the artist's actual
name to see the artist page themselves that piece of artwork that the aggregator
account is reposting it's usually old.
You usually have to go down a lot of pages to get to where the artist first posted it.
(11:12):
But that aggregator is picking it up and it's so popular and it's getting reposted
usually a year later, years later.
And the reason for that being is I think that creative people are so ahead of
the general curve, our tastes are that ahead, that usually others have to sort of catch up to us.
So I think as long as you keep that in mind, as long as you as a creative are
(11:37):
tapped into what excites you, what's an idea you had that you can't wait to draw?
What's something, a sensation that came to mind that you can't wait to put into words in a poem?
A feeling that comes to mind that you can't wait to show visually?
Go down the avenue go
down the path of those creative urges those
sensations those fragments of inspiration that
(12:00):
get you the most excited because those things that are getting you the most
excited those are the things that maybe a year maybe two years later those are
the things that are going to resonate the most i would say like my my most popular
artwork is this illustration called The Black Rose.
(12:20):
I first sketched that in 2017.
But it is so popular now. It has been so popular over the more recent few years
because I think that it's now in.
When I had first drawn it, I was ahead. But now the collective taste is catching up to it.
(12:46):
So I think that trusting yourself, having the confidence to know that any weird
idea, any weird thing that you ever want to draw, that there's a reason why
your mind is letting you go there. Listen to that inner voice.
Don't censor it and really tap in. I think that's how you get to the point where
(13:07):
you're not just creating things that are agreeing with the collective.
You're creating things that people don't even know that they like yet, if that makes sense.
They're going to catch up with your tastes eventually. eventually.
That was beautiful and something I personally really needed to hear because
(13:28):
a lot of us tend to put ego way too high up.
We focus so much on how many likes that we have, how many are we keeping up with these trends?
We're told to constantly keep up with trends, but by the time that we get to
the trend, it's over what you are saying and focused on what can can I do that
(13:49):
can inspire people to want to buy my art and so focused on that.
And while it's important to make money as an artist so we can have the funds
to live, when we focus too much on that, we kind of put our ego really high up.
What are some ways that you're able to kind of humble yourself to not let your ego take over?
(14:12):
Because when that's the art that tends to be most successful when you really
are able to put your ego aside.
That's very, very true what you just said. The art that's the most successful
is when you put your ego aside.
I think that every artist sort of like deep down feels like a bit of a fraud.
Deep down, you feel that imposter syndrome. Deep down for you,
(14:36):
as an artist, as a creative, it's insane.
For me, for example, it blows my mind even to this day. This happened a few years ago, pre-COVID.
I just drew something randomly at 3 a.m. My friend of mine connected with it
so much, she bought a print of it, she got a tattoo on her leg.
Like, that is crazy to me.
Like, I don't know why she did that. I don't know why it connected with her so much.
(15:00):
But I know that I drew that thing. It came from me. It came from my mind.
But the things that I draw that resonate the most with people,
they don't even feel like I did them, weirdly enough.
I feel like I'm a bit of like a transmitter for something else.
Else so for me my ego is always in check
because the way that i feel is like the artwork
(15:22):
that i'm the most intentional about that i'm being the most specific
that's the most planned where i'm saying i want to give this i
want to say this i want this symbol i want it to mean this
i want people to feel this the one where i'm being the most heavy-handed
and directed with it that's the art that tends
not to be as popular the art where i'm sort of
like giving up control and letting go
(15:43):
and like sort of not leading with
i want to say this daniel i want to like that's the
art that tends to be the most popular so for me my
ego is always in check because in the back of my mind i
know man like i drew this by accident and it's very popular i did this one unintentionally
and it's very popular versus the ones that i like feel are the most by me by
(16:08):
daniel those ones tend not to pop as much however the The ones that I feel that are the most by me,
that have the most Daniel in them,
I have a personal connection with them.
I love them more than any of the others.
There's one that I drew, there's a self-portrait I drew because I was drawing
a lot digitally at the time and I wanted to get that tactile feeling back.
(16:31):
So I got this wooden block and I pinned a piece of paper to it and I was doing
this on the actual page to draw the self-portrait.
Like really, really like rapidly moving my arm around, getting that like sensation.
Putting a lot of energy into the work.
And that's one of my favorites, if not the favorite thing that I've drawn.
(16:51):
Does anyone else like it? No. Do I care? No. I like that one because I know
how I felt when I was doing that.
I'd say that that's how the ego is in check for me.
That's one of the ways that I know deep down the most popular ones that I've
done are the ones that are not as directed by me.
Another way that my ego is in check, it's just like I'm always looking at other
(17:17):
art from other artists, and the technical level that some people are able to achieve is insane to me.
My technique is okay. I don't think I'm the most technical, the most accomplished
artist in terms of technique.
I think that my concepts are a lot stronger than my technique, personally.
But when I see artists who are able to draw in perfect perspective and do all
(17:39):
of this and do all of that,
and people who are able to render so well when they paint, and people who have
these giant canvases, and they can do all of those things, that humbles me as well.
That sort of reminds me, hey, there's a long way to go.
This is a lifelong journey. And that's one of the things I always keep in mind,
(18:00):
that I'm never going to reach a point where even 30 years from now,
if I keep drawing, which I will, I'm never going to reach a point where I say,
okay, yes, I'm now a master artist. Now I'm done.
No, you're always going to be learning more.
There's always new techniques to try, new mediums to try, new subject matter to explore. Lord.
(18:23):
There's always ways to push yourself.
And I feel if an artist feels as though they're now a master artist and their
ego is out of control, I just think that you're being dishonest with yourself personally.
Have you read the book, Ego is the Enemy?
By who? I'm trying to remember. I've been reading it.
(18:45):
So that's what a lot of these principles started making me think of because
Because not just with the art and writing aspect, I'm sure it's very similar with your poetry,
but I'm thinking of when with the financial aspect of how sometimes when we
do get higher pay for an art or higher audience,
(19:09):
higher recognition, obviously we want to be proud of ourselves when we do something well.
But sometimes we get so obsessed with these numbers of prices and followers and everything.
I'd love to hear some of the ways that you are able to kind of focus on that,
understand that, but also understand that that doesn't mean your value is more
(19:32):
significant than maybe someone else.
I would say a good thing to keep in mind, especially for a platform like Instagram.
Instagram is always going to show your post that have your face in it to more
people than it is any artwork that doesn't have a face in it.
The way that the application is programmed, it favors posts with human faces in it, for one.
(19:55):
So I've got a lot more likes with a gallery post where I'm standing there next to something.
And it's not because that artwork is my best one. It's because literally the
algorithm is showing the post to more of my followers because my face is in it.
So I think it's important to keep in mind the actual limits of the platforms that we're using.
(20:15):
The other thing that I keep in mind that doesn't get me fixated on numbers,
even outside of social media, I feel as though that life can feel out of control sometimes.
We can't control our circumstances, right? We can't control where we were born.
We can't control who our parents were. We can't control our cultural background.
(20:36):
They're just things that in this reality were given to us, right?
I feel as though writing, artwork, creativity, that's like the one realm.
That's the one of the one arena of where we have total control,
where we can do whatever we want. So it's like, I don't let myself get caught
up with, oh, this one is selling.
(20:56):
I should make more things that look like this. Oh, this seller should make more.
Because my thought process always comes down to the baseline of,
this is one of the only places where I can do whatever I want.
I'm not going to let this sale or the popularity of this artwork or anything
else influence the aspect that if I want to just wake up one day and for weeks
(21:18):
just paint red dots on white paper,
and that's the only thing I do for weeks, I have that ability.
I have that freedom. I'm not restricted by anything.
I'm not contained by anything. So because of that, all of the numbers and the
algorithms and the likes and sales, it's not relevant to me.
Because I know, like myself, I know that I would be drawing,
(21:41):
I would be creating stuff, I would be writing, if no one was watching.
If no one was interested, I'd still be doing it. Because I'm not doing it for anyone but myself.
Right. Like maybe that's a bit selfish.
I don't know. But if I'm not interested in the thing that I'm illustrating,
if I'm not interested in the thing that I'm writing, I'm not going to do it
(22:04):
because I have to be like I was saying earlier.
I have to be excited to do it, excited to create, excited to go for it.
And as long as I have that feeling, I let myself engage in that sense of play.
So in a sense, I am a little bit in a bubble by design.
For example, I don't know what is in the art world right now. I have no idea.
(22:28):
And I don't care because I'm here to do whatever it is I want.
Whatever weird pathway my brain wants to go down, that's sort of like what I do.
So I think my whole creative process, it's not really tied to like external
numbers or external validation, I'd say.
And, you know, something I feel from you is that you have a genuine love for
(22:55):
humanity and that you genuinely want to inspire people.
And when you have that desire, then you have an unselfish way of creating,
even if it's for yourself, because you want to bring joy to the world.
And I think that that is so beautiful.
And I know that your poetry, I'm sure, is a lot like that, too.
(23:19):
Do you want to talk a little bit about how you got into writing a book for your poetry?
Because you mentioned a little bit how you first experimented with it.
But what made you want to write a whole book that I believe is coming out in
June, right? Or July? Yes.
June of this year, June 2024.
It's called Unwashed. So since like university, since like 2015,
(23:43):
that was when I started taking poetry a lot more seriously.
Like a lot of people, I wanted to be like a fiction writer, like a short story novel typewriter.
In all the creative writing classes I've taken, it wasn't really like the short
stories or the novels that any of the teachers were connecting with.
(24:03):
It was actually the poetry.
That was where I would get higher marks in. That was the work that they found the most interesting.
So I would say I was sort of encouraged to take it more seriously after that point.
I started going to more poetry readings around the city.
I started to read more poetry. I started to let myself enjoy the granular details of language,
(24:31):
really, really letting yourself, when you're writing something,
have fun with the descriptors and the imagery and the metaphors and the things
that you can do to give your writing tactility, to put someone in a location,
to put an image in someone's mind.
I really started to enjoy that I fell
in love with that aspect of it so I would be writing here and there I had a
(24:54):
few like writing groups I was in but I was always writing poetry because they
were something I wanted to say they were feelings that I was going through for
me it's like if I want to my writing and my poetry I usually do it when it's like,
if I don't believe I have the technical ability to like draw or paint the thing.
(25:17):
Then I'll just sort of like get into it with a poem so that the image is in
each individual's mind visually rather than seeing it.
And it's the same thing vice versa, right? If I'm not able, it's rare,
but if I don't have the language or if I feel that the sensation I'm trying
to put across would be stronger and like a painting, then I'll paint it.
(25:39):
Over the years, I was always just writing poetry here, here and there,
here and there. I had a bunch of poems from like 2015, 2014 on my computer, just on my hard drive.
And I always wanted to write a book. It was always like a goal of mine.
And I had thought that it would be like a novel, but I had realized that like
(26:00):
my creative voice was sort of more suited to poetry. And I had a teacher who
basically told me that like the art form chooses us.
But sort of like really, really believed in that. And I said,
let me just give myself into poetry. So I went through all of the.
Poems I had on my hard drive. And I basically found the ones that were the least
(26:23):
embarrassing. I said, okay, these ones are good.
And I compiled them. I think I had about 30 pages.
I had a lot of mentors. I went to a lot of conferences.
I was really encouraged. I'm pretty lucky, I'd say, for the poetry aspect.
I had a lot of people who saw my writing and encouraged me and put a battery
(26:43):
in my back and really told me to pursue it.
So I met with George Eliot Clark at this one conference, and he read through
my manuscript at the time, just that 30-page one,
which was all the poems to that date, pre-COVID, all the poems to that date
that were on my computer. I just put them in a Word document.
(27:04):
And he was so generous with his time. He sent me a PDF, an email.
He's just like, these are different poetic exercises and forms.
And he told me, he's like, your writing is suited to this form.
Your writing is suited to this form. He's like, you should really do those and experiment.
And I was glad to get that from him because if he didn't tell me about those
(27:25):
different poetic forms and different techniques to diversify your writing, I wouldn't have known.
I wouldn't have done them. So it was through his feedback, through feedback
of others that I created the actual manuscript.
Once I had the manuscript, then it was just a matter of sending it out to publishers.
I didn't have an agent, which is pretty typical for poetry. Poets tend not to.
(27:50):
So I was just writing my own query letters, just emailing publishers.
It was a year and a few months, a year and five months. I got about six or five
rejections and one publisher who said that they were that they wanted to move forward with it.
So that's sort of how it came. It came about. Yeah.
I am so glad that you mentioned all that.
(28:14):
I'm going through a similar transition right now from art to actually songwriting is my new thing.
That when you said sometimes you're called to do something else with the way that you create,
like that was so powerful for me because I've been trying to force myself to
express what I want to express through my art and it's just not coming through.
(28:38):
And I felt silly kind of switching to songwriting when I've spent my whole life
studying art, but I personally really needed to hear that.
So I appreciate that insight.
What are some of the major themes that you have noticed in both your writing and your art?
(28:59):
And do they kind of correlate with each other or do you tend to have separate themes for each?
This wasn't even something that I had noticed.
In my artwork, this girl that I knew who had been following my artwork and my
writing, we were at a party and she had told me that she sees a lot of thematic
(29:19):
use of the body, of the human body in my artwork.
And I didn't really notice that because I guess this is maybe the downside of
my creative process. I'm a little bit too in it.
I'm too much like this sometimes, just like my head deep in the bushes doing
my own thing, not really taking a step back and seeing it as a whole.
So I couldn't see all of those references to the body over the years.
(29:43):
But when she said that, I said, yeah, that makes sense.
There is a lot of references to the body in my artwork.
There's a lot of references to the body in my writing as well.
Well, in my visual work, I tend to do things, right?
Like if I want to give across a feeling of powerlessness, maybe the figure will
have no hand, something like that, right? That I draw.
(30:06):
And as well with my writing, I'm thinking of a few lines that I've written where
like the body is referenced and it's like either the body's being broken down
or like to make a thematic point or like exaggerate something happening to the
body to give a feeling emotionally to the reader.
So I think that there is that interplay between the writing and the art in terms of the body.
(30:30):
And in terms of the writing, I'd say a lot of the other themes,
it's more so centered on heartbreak, like sadness, like.
My artistic voice and visual art, it's not as sad as my voice is in writing.
I've never been able to write an uplifting poem.
I'm just not capable of it. When I sit down to write something,
(30:53):
it just comes out as either really intense or really, really sad.
That's just where my poetic voice is with the actual poetry.
But I'd say in terms of both of them, my brain tends to see them as separate.
I have experimented in the past where I'll draw something, then write a poem
(31:15):
for it or the other way around.
But I don't know. I feel as though if you're just transcribing images from your
poem and your artwork, my brain kind of thinks like, you've already done this. You see what I mean?
Like you've already shown the individual, the image with words.
(31:36):
Why are you now showing the image again visually, right?
Like I feel as though you're, and this is in my instance, I'm taking something
away from the poetry if I want to draw scenes from a poem.
Because it's like the whole idea is like you're trying to get the individual
reading it to conjure those images in their own mind.
(31:57):
Like why are you then showing it to them? Like, why are you being so prescriptive
to be like, oh, this is what it looks like.
It's like, no, like, just let it live on its own.
And I think I sort of view the artwork the same way, weirdly enough. Yeah. Yeah.
And it sounds like you put a lot of soul into everything that you create.
(32:20):
And I know most of us do. We put so much soul and so much love and effort.
And when it comes to selling it, it kind of feels like you're taking part of
your soul and monetizing it.
What are some ways that you can still feel good about selling something that
(32:40):
you put so much soul into?
What are some ways to rethink that kind of philosophy?
That's a really good question. And I totally understand how it can feel like
that, that you're selling out, you're selling pieces of yourself.
But for me, my thought process is, no matter how personal the work is to you,
(33:02):
as soon as you put it out, as soon as it's made public, it doesn't belong to you anymore.
It's now a part of the public ecosystem it's now
a part of the public consciousness like it's
there it's a thing it exists in the world right like as soon as i make something
and i put it out it's not mine anymore that's kind of how i view it like it's
(33:24):
not anything that i'm precious about because it's like yeah like i made it and
it's done like i made it it's gone i made it like like it's it It came from my mind,
went through my body, went through my fingertips,
went into my pencil or paintbrush onto the page, and now it's gone.
I did it like it's by Daniel, but like, do I own it now?
(33:45):
No, I wouldn't say that. I would
say that like, I'm not precious about it because it's not mine anymore.
I don't know how else to say that, Beau.
That really makes sense to me.
Are there any specific situations that you have had to deal with where you had
struggles with balancing the aspect, the business aspect and the creative aspect?
(34:10):
And what are some ways that you were able to overcome that?
Because I have a full-time job, right? Like I'm in a field that's not creative.
That's how I make my money. But outside of that, I'm like always engaging in
like art, making art, writing poetry, writing in general.
So I'd say that what I do to avoid that feeling is I'm a lot better with how I structure my time.
(34:35):
Last year has been the most fulfilling year for me artistically. It was amazing.
I'm very grateful for everything that happened to me last year.
And this year is the same. But with how busy things have been,
I actually have to use a personal calendar now to schedule, okay,
this day is going to be a day where I let myself make the artwork.
(34:59):
This day, Sundays at around 3, 4 p.m., that's my art admin day.
That's my portrait admin day. By that, I mean I'm doing all of the stuff to
support the art stuff that are not creative, like sending out emails,
applying for grants, applying for shows, submitting calls to submission, editing poetry,
(35:22):
submitting poetry to different calls, trying to get into readings,
trying to get noticed by, et cetera, et cetera.
Like all of the stuff that's more the non-creative business side,
I actually schedule that time out.
So that my mind doesn't feel guilty when I am creating.
Thinking like, oh, I should respond to this email because my mind knows,
(35:45):
oh, I have a day set up for that. It's fine. When that day comes, I'll do it. Boom.
So that's sort of how I separate them. But I'd say that there have been days
where you come home from work and you're tired.
And you have so many art things that have piled up, so many writing things that
have piled up that you have to respond to.
And it can feel like sort of like having two jobs it can feel like that right
(36:10):
like i've definitely had days where i was just like why am i even doing this
like what's the point like i'm not making.
Money consistently from it it's draining my energy like why am i doing it but
the thing that sort of keeps me balanced the thing that sort of keeps me consistent
is realizing oh no i'm doing it because I love it. I love this.
(36:34):
This is what I feel like I'm here for. This is part of what my purpose is.
I love this so much that I'm willing to sacrifice time after work for it.
I'm willing to lose sleep over it because I love it. And that love,
(36:55):
that joy, that excitement from it,
It's worth structuring your life around. That's how I feel. I completely, absolutely agree.
And a lot of us do have to work full-time jobs while we write our book or make
our music or create our art.
And some people feel ashamed of that, that they aren't doing this full-time.
(37:20):
How do you really embrace your inner artist when you do have to have that full-time
job working something that is not artistic?
And are there any ways that you could actually benefit from not being a full-time creative?
(37:41):
I definitely think that there are ways you can benefit. There's a video that I saw.
It's by this sculpture artist, this African-American guy.
I think he's living in America right now. His name is Leonardo Drew.
This video changed my life. Changed my life. It's just like a four-minute clip.
(38:02):
I can find it and send it to you after. he was just talking about his traveling
and whatever and he said that he used to be of the mindset where it's just like
i have to be in the studio all the time i have to be painting all the time i
have to be engaged in my artwork all the time allusion he used to be in that sort of like,
all-consuming sort of mindset he said that he was on a plane in japan he said
(38:26):
that he realized he's like oh he realized he's like i actually don't have to
be in the studio all the time it's like Like, even if I'm not making art,
if I'm playing with my nephews, if I'm on this plane,
if I'm doing something, if I'm at work, the art is happening within me.
The art's happening within my body regardless.
Like, that insight from him changed my whole perspective because I used to be
(38:50):
of that same mindset where it's like, oh no, you have to be doing it all the time.
But you literally don't. Like, think about it, right? Like.
I'm sure you can relate. You've probably had times in your life when you're
not being creative, when you're
not making things, but magically you always end up going back to it.
It always comes back. And the reason why it always comes back is because this is your calling.
(39:12):
This is your thing. So you don't have to always be tapping into the well and
drawing every day and really, really grinding and going crazy.
You're going to burn yourself out doing that. And I know that when I'm going
to work, when I'm at work, when I'm dealing with clients,
when I'm going for a walk, when I'm whatever, all of that life,
(39:35):
all of that life experience that we go through, frustration,
anxiety, fears, worry, happiness, all of that is creating an alchemical concoction
within us that is building the art.
The art has to come from somewhere, right? It has to come from something.
If you were isolated, living in a tower and you had no input,
(39:59):
you had no stimuli, what art would you make?
Where would your inspiration come from? So I'd say what I keep in mind is I
know that regardless of what I'm doing, the art's happening within me.
The other thing that I keep in mind is I'm.
It's this one artist, I met him here in Toronto, and we were at an art show,
(40:21):
and he said that he tried going full-time to be an artist, right?
And he said that it warped his whole mindset, because this was his livelihood.
It became like, if he didn't do this, he wouldn't eat, right?
If he didn't sell, he wouldn't survive.
So he said that his attitude, even at shows, when people would ask him,
(40:42):
oh, what is this painting about, whatever? He said whenever strangers would
approach him, his mindset would immediately be like, what a waste of time.
This guy's not going to buy.
So already, his mindset is warping the interaction because there's too much pressure on it.
There's too much pressure on it. and that's why
like i wouldn't want to go like full-time because
(41:04):
this is my baby like i love it
like i don't want to fall out of love with it by forcing myself to put economic
pressure on it that same artist he he stopped doing full-time he did interior
design and then did his art on the side and he said it was perfect he said that
like that was the balance that he needed and me and him are similar, right?
(41:26):
Like I know myself, I would have that same attitude he had if I went full time with it.
I'd approach every interaction with that same amount of like hostility because I would get frustrated.
Just like, oh, I'm doing this, I'm doing that. This person's not buying,
this person's not like, it's turning this thing that should be your passion
(41:46):
into something where it's like, if you're not giving me money for it, then what's the point?
So I think that like those are the two two things that I do to keep myself balanced, right?
Like I protect it from the capitalist power structures that we live in.
And I also sort of know that you don't have to be creating all the time to be
creating and quotes, you know?
(42:08):
I love that answer. And I completely agree.
What is something that you wish every artist who's wanting to create an art
business, Maybe in addition to what you were just talking about,
would know that would help them become more successful as an artist?
(42:29):
Not to get too meta, but I would say know what you don't know.
Know the things you're not good at. In terms of like making a business plan, making a budget.
Marketing, graphic design, advertising, I don't know how to do those things.
I'm not good at those things.
I'm not going to then force myself and bully myself and shame myself for not knowing those things.
(42:55):
I'm going to, if you're lucky enough, to lean on people in your your life who
have those skills and ask for help.
I would say, know what you don't know.
I know myself pretty well at this point.
I'm not going to learn how to code my website. It's just not going to happen.
I tried it. It's not going to happen.
So I lean on people who I can go to for support.
(43:17):
I would say being humble enough to ask for help, being humble enough to lean
on people for support, and being wise enough to steal.
By steal, I mean, if you know an artist And for example, like there's an artist
I know, she has like a content calendar.
What she does is anytime she has like multiple shows in a month,
(43:38):
she'll post like an animated calendar and she'll circle and then note down what
the shows are for each thing. That's brilliant.
That's brilliant. That's an easy way to remind everyone in one go of all the
things that you have coming up in a month.
And I would steal that. I would do that too because it's smart. You know what I mean?
(43:59):
So like lean on the people who know more than you and don't be afraid to steal
if you see someone doing something that makes sense, I'd say.
I absolutely do that. My main core group, my main support group is not an artist group.
It's actually a networking group called Women Into Networking.
(44:19):
And we are just all about sharing what helps us be successful and really learning
from each other. So that was perfect.
It's unreasonable to expect one individual to be an expert on everything.
It doesn't make sense. I think that the smartest people, the most successful
people, they know what their capacity is.
(44:41):
And for things that are outside of their scope, they delegate. Yes, delegation.
I think it's important to learn the very basics of things, the very basics of what is SEO?
What are all these things? But you don't need to become an expert in them.
And if you can't afford to hire an expert, there's always bartering.
(45:02):
There's always ways that you can work with others who are expert and actually,
for some reason, love doing social media things or whatever it is,
building websites. sites.
So that is what I want to see more of in the art community and the writing and music, whatever it is.
So I'm so glad that you brought it up.
(45:22):
And did you have any final thoughts? And also, what are some ways that people
can find you, can find your book, can find any other social media outlet of yours?
Okay, so you could go on danielmaluca.net. That's my website.
Site, d-a-n-i-e-l-a-l-u-k-a.net, right there on my homepage.
(45:49):
You can put your email in to get on the email list.
Once I have any updates or info about the book titled Unwashed coming 2024,
June, maybe later, but yeah, 2024 for sure.
Once I have any updates on that, once you put your email in,
you will receive those updates.
I'm also on Instagram. My Instagram handle is whatdanieldrew,
(46:13):
so W-H-A-T, the first name Daniel and the D-R-E-W.
The book is coming out June 2024.
It's called Unwashed. It's a collection of poetry.
The subject matters on alienation, growing up, the immigrant experience.
A loss of innocence, you know, all that fun stuff.
(46:36):
So yeah, I'd say those are the best places to reach me at. Perfect.
And I will put all of those links down below.
Please check out Daniel. He has some amazing work and some even more amazing
stuff coming up in the future.
So thank you so much for meeting up with me today, Daniel.
Thanks for tuning in to this week's episode of The Success Palette,
(46:59):
where we talked about balance of being your creative, authentic self,
your business strategy, and also how ego plays a part in all of that.
If you would like to listen to more bonus episodes or check us out on social
media, please go to thesuccesspalette.com.
(47:21):
And please, let's make it a successful week. See you next time.
Hello, hello everyone, you are listening to The Success Palette,
a place to discuss how creatives can succeed in every aspect of our lives.
I'm your host Soda and today I invited Daniel Maluka to help me discuss how
to find a balance between being your authentic creative self,
(00:24):
but also tapping into that business aspect of being a creative entrepreneur.
Daniel, do you want to start off talking a little bit about your artistic journey,
how you got into art, poetry, all of these creative outlets that you have?
So I've been writing and drawing my whole life, basically.
(00:46):
I started at first because of Dragon Ball Z. When I was a little kid,
watching that show had a pretty profound impact on me.
I always I always wanted to draw as a result of that show, drawing the characters that I would see.
I realized it wasn't necessarily just the characters that I liked,
but it was also the branching storylines and how you were following the lives
(01:08):
of those individuals in addition to the action and the animation and the cartoon aspect of it.
But I got a little older and I realized that like you didn't necessarily have
to use like animation or comic books to tell a story through art.
Discovering artists like Salvador Dali, Goya, Francis Bacon.
(01:28):
I learned that you could tell stories through your artwork through like one-offs
or like a one-off painting.
You can do a lot of like symbolic things that do tell a story to the viewer.
So that's sort of like what I started to do. I really, really carried that sort
of narrative drive throughout my whole art journey.
Started with Dragon Ball Z, then later getting influenced by some of the old
(01:50):
masters, some famous painters, Basquiat, Picasso, Dali, Caravaggio,
Francis Bacon. They're all pretty big influences on me.
And in terms of the writing aspect, similar to the drawing aspect,
it was through Dragon Ball Z, right?
Because I love those stories that that creator was telling.
Toriyama was his name. I really liked the stories he was telling in his manga
(02:14):
and his comic book and in his actual show of Dragon Ball Z.
So I said, I wanted to make my own type of story.
So I was always writing and drawing and writing and drawing and writing and
drawing and writing and drawing since I was younger.
It was only through university that I started to take just poetry more seriously.
The reason for that being was...
(02:36):
In the creative writing class I had, my poetry teacher would give me higher
marks in poetry than in short stories or anything.
And I had asked him why, and he had simply said, oh, just the poetry is more interesting.
So that kind of planted a seed in my mind to sort of like allow myself to go
down that specific poetry avenue.
So yeah, that's sort of how I started with the two of them.
(02:57):
And I love that you really focus on the story aspect of it, because that is
something that is so important for me.
My dad is a photographer on the side and he would always tell me how when he
takes photographs, he wants to show a story just in that one image.
And that was so profound because I come from an animation background.
(03:18):
So I think of story as this whole big thing, but it could really just one phrase,
one small poem. I'm getting into poetry right now, kind of transitioning from
art to poetry and so many similar aspects to it.
But I also understand that we have to really make something that doesn't just
(03:40):
inspire us, but inspires other people.
How do you find that balance between doing what you want to create,
but also something that you could make a living off of?
Yes, that is a very good question. For me, I would say that that balance,
for me, it's happened sort of like accidentally.
(04:02):
I've had things that I've drawn that I haven't really thought anything about.
Just like something I'm drawing, like maybe at 2 a.m., just a random thing.
And someone will connect with it so profoundly, which has happened to me,
that they ask to get it tattooed.
They buy a print of it. They ask to get the thing tattooed that I drew.
And there are other instances where it's like, I have two artworks of mine that are the most popular,
(04:26):
and both of them sell pretty well on my end because I was really,
really surrendering myself to the creative process.
I didn't put as much of myself into the work.
I sort of let the creative spirit, that creative energy, I sort of let it take
(04:48):
over uncensored and then I would create that thing.
And those are my two most popular ones. And I think the reason why they connect
with people so much is because I wasn't trying to tell something specific about me, Daniel.
I was more so sort of like...
Trying to tap in without realizing, trying to tap in more to the collective
(05:11):
unconscious and sort of like say what we're all thinking, display what we're all thinking.
There was one illustration that I did that was also quite popular.
I did sell a few prints of it. It was titled Lockdown.
And it was of a woman. It's in black and white. It's basically,
not black and white, it's more so in grayscale.
It's a woman lying down on her bed and she's melting. And I had drawn this during
(05:35):
lockdowns, especially in my country in Canada, our lockdowns are pretty severe.
So when I had drawn that and when I had put that out, a lot of people related
to it, a lot of people sort of tapped into it because they were feeling that same thing.
So tapping into that collective unconscious is one way that I'm able to access the business side.
(05:56):
The other way that I've been able to access the business side is just through a lot of networking.
I'm lucky I live in a pretty creative city.
It's a pretty artistic city, the place that I live. So my mind is always in
tune and looking out for calls for submission, paid calls.
(06:17):
We need an artist to do this. We need someone to do this logo.
We need this. I have this idea. I need someone to help me brainstorm.
I'm willing to pick any of those sort of calls for submission.
I'm really, really tuned into, and I often apply to them.
I recently applied to one.
I forget the name of it, but if you are one of the artists selected,
they pay you about $2,000 and your art goes up on big posters in the subway.
(06:41):
Now, the reason why I submitted something to them is because,
let's say, even if I don't get selected for that,
the fact that I'm getting myself into the habit of figuring out what the theme
is, drawing something to the theme, creating new work on a timeline that's relevant
to that theme, and also writing a relevant artist statement and to go with it.
(07:03):
So even if I don't win or even if I don't get self-selected,
I'm getting myself comfortable and used to the idea of commercial work.
As in someone has a very specific idea, a very specific thing that they want
you to do, and there's a specific deadline.
And now I'm a lot more comfortable with tapping into that and sort of getting into that zone.
(07:26):
But I still allow myself to do the other side where I'm just vibing,
letting my mind wander, drawing whatever I want.
So I would say getting comfortable with responding to specific art calls is
how I activate the business side.
The networking aspect, being in the rooms, being in the positions,
(07:46):
knowing the people who are most likely to need an artist to do something.
That's sort of how I access the business side as well.
And tapping into that sort of like unconscious sense when I am making my own
artwork for like prints and such.
So I would say that those are the three ways, if that makes sense.
That absolutely makes sense.
(08:08):
And what really I connected with was where you talked about tapping into this
connection, this overall human experience that we all have.
What are some ways that you've been able to do that? Is it through talking with just observing people?
Is it just more of a spiritual thing? How do you know how to feel what others
(08:34):
are feeling and what they're able to, what they need in their lives through
your art and your poetry?
I suppose it's, I suppose to answer this question, basically depends on like
how weird you want to get.
Basically, I guess that's my question, right?
I'm a witch, so you could go as weird as you want. But I just love to hear people's,
(08:56):
because I think it's so important to understand what the world is feeling because
I believe in that collective energy.
So that's why I was very intrigued when you brought that up.
So I would say, yes, talking to people, being immersed, speaking to other creatives,
seeing where those conversations go, letting yourself be open, I would say.
(09:17):
Let yourself be a transmitter for that sort of energy.
And one of the ways that I was able to get into that zone was to be not as intentional
about some of the artwork I'd make.
I'll give you an example. There was a point in time when I was really,
really got back into drawing after a while of not doing it.
And I was like sort of stumped. I was intimidated by big white pages.
(09:41):
Like I didn't know what to draw. I didn't know how to start.
So what I did was I would spill coffee on a page, wait for that to dry, come back to it.
Then I would let sort of the coffee spills tell their own story.
Story, surrendering my intention.
I want it to look like this. It has to be good. It has to surrendering that
intention and letting the artwork lead itself.
(10:03):
Right. So that's one of the ways because I let the artwork lead.
I'm not as like ego driven in the things that I create. Right.
And another way that it happens and I have like I've had like a theory on this.
I think all All artists, and I know you would agree with this as a creative,
(10:24):
all artists, all creatives, we are ahead.
By that, I mean our tastes are ahead. The things that we're into are ahead.
And usually we're so ahead of the general curve of what people like, what people are into.
We're so ahead of what's in, what's popular.
We're so ahead of what's going to resonate with people that usually people have to catch up to us.
(10:47):
Whenever I go on Instagram and you see like those art aggregator accounts and
they're reposting art from other artists whenever I click the artist's actual
name to see the artist page themselves that piece of artwork that the aggregator
account is reposting it's usually old.
You usually have to go down a lot of pages to get to where the artist first posted it.
(11:12):
But that aggregator is picking it up and it's so popular and it's getting reposted
usually a year later, years later.
And the reason for that being is I think that creative people are so ahead of
the general curve, our tastes are that ahead, that usually others have to sort of catch up to us.
So I think as long as you keep that in mind, as long as you as a creative are
(11:37):
tapped into what excites you, what's an idea you had that you can't wait to draw?
What's something, a sensation that came to mind that you can't wait to put into words in a poem?
A feeling that comes to mind that you can't wait to show visually?
Go down the avenue go
down the path of those creative urges those
sensations those fragments of inspiration that
(12:00):
get you the most excited because those things that are getting you the most
excited those are the things that maybe a year maybe two years later those are
the things that are going to resonate the most i would say like my my most popular
artwork is this illustration called The Black Rose.
(12:20):
I first sketched that in 2017.
But it is so popular now. It has been so popular over the more recent few years
because I think that it's now in.
When I had first drawn it, I was ahead. But now the collective taste is catching up to it.
(12:46):
So I think that trusting yourself, having the confidence to know that any weird
idea, any weird thing that you ever want to draw, that there's a reason why
your mind is letting you go there. Listen to that inner voice.
Don't censor it and really tap in. I think that's how you get to the point where
(13:07):
you're not just creating things that are agreeing with the collective.
You're creating things that people don't even know that they like yet, if that makes sense.
They're going to catch up with your tastes eventually. eventually.
That was beautiful and something I personally really needed to hear because
(13:28):
a lot of us tend to put ego way too high up.
We focus so much on how many likes that we have, how many are we keeping up with these trends?
We're told to constantly keep up with trends, but by the time that we get to
the trend, it's over what you are saying and focused on what can can I do that
(13:49):
can inspire people to want to buy my art and so focused on that.
And while it's important to make money as an artist so we can have the funds
to live, when we focus too much on that, we kind of put our ego really high up.
What are some ways that you're able to kind of humble yourself to not let your ego take over?
(14:12):
Because when that's the art that tends to be most successful when you really
are able to put your ego aside.
That's very, very true what you just said. The art that's the most successful
is when you put your ego aside.
I think that every artist sort of like deep down feels like a bit of a fraud.
Deep down, you feel that imposter syndrome. Deep down for you,
(14:36):
as an artist, as a creative, it's insane.
For me, for example, it blows my mind even to this day. This happened a few years ago, pre-COVID.
I just drew something randomly at 3 a.m. My friend of mine connected with it
so much, she bought a print of it, she got a tattoo on her leg.
Like, that is crazy to me.
Like, I don't know why she did that. I don't know why it connected with her so much.
(15:00):
But I know that I drew that thing. It came from me. It came from my mind.
But the things that I draw that resonate the most with people,
they don't even feel like I did them, weirdly enough.
I feel like I'm a bit of like a transmitter for something else.
Else so for me my ego is always in check
because the way that i feel is like the artwork
(15:22):
that i'm the most intentional about that i'm being the most specific
that's the most planned where i'm saying i want to give this i
want to say this i want this symbol i want it to mean this
i want people to feel this the one where i'm being the most heavy-handed
and directed with it that's the art that tends
not to be as popular the art where i'm sort of
like giving up control and letting go
(15:43):
and like sort of not leading with
i want to say this daniel i want to like that's the
art that tends to be the most popular so for me my
ego is always in check because in the back of my mind i
know man like i drew this by accident and it's very popular i did this one unintentionally
and it's very popular versus the ones that i like feel are the most by me by
(16:08):
daniel those ones tend not to pop as much however the The ones that I feel that are the most by me,
that have the most Daniel in them,
I have a personal connection with them.
I love them more than any of the others.
There's one that I drew, there's a self-portrait I drew because I was drawing
a lot digitally at the time and I wanted to get that tactile feeling back.
(16:31):
So I got this wooden block and I pinned a piece of paper to it and I was doing
this on the actual page to draw the self-portrait.
Like really, really like rapidly moving my arm around, getting that like sensation.
Putting a lot of energy into the work.
And that's one of my favorites, if not the favorite thing that I've drawn.
(16:51):
Does anyone else like it? No. Do I care? No. I like that one because I know
how I felt when I was doing that.
I'd say that that's how the ego is in check for me.
That's one of the ways that I know deep down the most popular ones that I've
done are the ones that are not as directed by me.
Another way that my ego is in check, it's just like I'm always looking at other
(17:17):
art from other artists, and the technical level that some people are able to achieve is insane to me.
My technique is okay. I don't think I'm the most technical, the most accomplished
artist in terms of technique.
I think that my concepts are a lot stronger than my technique, personally.
But when I see artists who are able to draw in perfect perspective and do all
(17:39):
of this and do all of that,
and people who are able to render so well when they paint, and people who have
these giant canvases, and they can do all of those things, that humbles me as well.
That sort of reminds me, hey, there's a long way to go.
This is a lifelong journey. And that's one of the things I always keep in mind,
(18:00):
that I'm never going to reach a point where even 30 years from now,
if I keep drawing, which I will, I'm never going to reach a point where I say,
okay, yes, I'm now a master artist. Now I'm done.
No, you're always going to be learning more.
There's always new techniques to try, new mediums to try, new subject matter to explore. Lord.
(18:23):
There's always ways to push yourself.
And I feel if an artist feels as though they're now a master artist and their
ego is out of control, I just think that you're being dishonest with yourself personally.
Have you read the book, Ego is the Enemy?
By who? I'm trying to remember. I've been reading it.
(18:45):
So that's what a lot of these principles started making me think of because
Because not just with the art and writing aspect, I'm sure it's very similar with your poetry,
but I'm thinking of when with the financial aspect of how sometimes when we
do get higher pay for an art or higher audience,
(19:09):
higher recognition, obviously we want to be proud of ourselves when we do something well.
But sometimes we get so obsessed with these numbers of prices and followers and everything.
I'd love to hear some of the ways that you are able to kind of focus on that,
understand that, but also understand that that doesn't mean your value is more
(19:32):
significant than maybe someone else.
I would say a good thing to keep in mind, especially for a platform like Instagram.
Instagram is always going to show your post that have your face in it to more
people than it is any artwork that doesn't have a face in it.
The way that the application is programmed, it favors posts with human faces in it, for one.
(19:55):
So I've got a lot more likes with a gallery post where I'm standing there next to something.
And it's not because that artwork is my best one. It's because literally the
algorithm is showing the post to more of my followers because my face is in it.
So I think it's important to keep in mind the actual limits of the platforms that we're using.
(20:15):
The other thing that I keep in mind that doesn't get me fixated on numbers,
even outside of social media, I feel as though that life can feel out of control sometimes.
We can't control our circumstances, right? We can't control where we were born.
We can't control who our parents were. We can't control our cultural background.
(20:36):
They're just things that in this reality were given to us, right?
I feel as though writing, artwork, creativity, that's like the one realm.
That's the one of the one arena of where we have total control,
where we can do whatever we want. So it's like, I don't let myself get caught
up with, oh, this one is selling.
(20:56):
I should make more things that look like this. Oh, this seller should make more.
Because my thought process always comes down to the baseline of,
this is one of the only places where I can do whatever I want.
I'm not going to let this sale or the popularity of this artwork or anything
else influence the aspect that if I want to just wake up one day and for weeks
(21:18):
just paint red dots on white paper,
and that's the only thing I do for weeks, I have that ability.
I have that freedom. I'm not restricted by anything.
I'm not contained by anything. So because of that, all of the numbers and the
algorithms and the likes and sales, it's not relevant to me.
Because I know, like myself, I know that I would be drawing,
(21:41):
I would be creating stuff, I would be writing, if no one was watching.
If no one was interested, I'd still be doing it. Because I'm not doing it for anyone but myself.
Right. Like maybe that's a bit selfish.
I don't know. But if I'm not interested in the thing that I'm illustrating,
if I'm not interested in the thing that I'm writing, I'm not going to do it
(22:04):
because I have to be like I was saying earlier.
I have to be excited to do it, excited to create, excited to go for it.
And as long as I have that feeling, I let myself engage in that sense of play.
So in a sense, I am a little bit in a bubble by design.
For example, I don't know what is in the art world right now. I have no idea.
(22:28):
And I don't care because I'm here to do whatever it is I want.
Whatever weird pathway my brain wants to go down, that's sort of like what I do.
So I think my whole creative process, it's not really tied to like external
numbers or external validation, I'd say.
And, you know, something I feel from you is that you have a genuine love for
(22:55):
humanity and that you genuinely want to inspire people.
And when you have that desire, then you have an unselfish way of creating,
even if it's for yourself, because you want to bring joy to the world.
And I think that that is so beautiful.
And I know that your poetry, I'm sure, is a lot like that, too.
(23:19):
Do you want to talk a little bit about how you got into writing a book for your poetry?
Because you mentioned a little bit how you first experimented with it.
But what made you want to write a whole book that I believe is coming out in
June, right? Or July? Yes.
June of this year, June 2024.
It's called Unwashed. So since like university, since like 2015,
(23:43):
that was when I started taking poetry a lot more seriously.
Like a lot of people, I wanted to be like a fiction writer, like a short story novel typewriter.
In all the creative writing classes I've taken, it wasn't really like the short
stories or the novels that any of the teachers were connecting with.
(24:03):
It was actually the poetry.
That was where I would get higher marks in. That was the work that they found the most interesting.
So I would say I was sort of encouraged to take it more seriously after that point.
I started going to more poetry readings around the city.
I started to read more poetry. I started to let myself enjoy the granular details of language,
(24:31):
really, really letting yourself, when you're writing something,
have fun with the descriptors and the imagery and the metaphors and the things
that you can do to give your writing tactility, to put someone in a location,
to put an image in someone's mind.
I really started to enjoy that I fell
in love with that aspect of it so I would be writing here and there I had a
(24:54):
few like writing groups I was in but I was always writing poetry because they
were something I wanted to say they were feelings that I was going through for
me it's like if I want to my writing and my poetry I usually do it when it's like,
if I don't believe I have the technical ability to like draw or paint the thing.
(25:17):
Then I'll just sort of like get into it with a poem so that the image is in
each individual's mind visually rather than seeing it.
And it's the same thing vice versa, right? If I'm not able, it's rare,
but if I don't have the language or if I feel that the sensation I'm trying
to put across would be stronger and like a painting, then I'll paint it.
(25:39):
Over the years, I was always just writing poetry here, here and there,
here and there. I had a bunch of poems from like 2015, 2014 on my computer, just on my hard drive.
And I always wanted to write a book. It was always like a goal of mine.
And I had thought that it would be like a novel, but I had realized that like
(26:00):
my creative voice was sort of more suited to poetry. And I had a teacher who
basically told me that like the art form chooses us.
But sort of like really, really believed in that. And I said,
let me just give myself into poetry. So I went through all of the.
Poems I had on my hard drive. And I basically found the ones that were the least
(26:23):
embarrassing. I said, okay, these ones are good.
And I compiled them. I think I had about 30 pages.
I had a lot of mentors. I went to a lot of conferences.
I was really encouraged. I'm pretty lucky, I'd say, for the poetry aspect.
I had a lot of people who saw my writing and encouraged me and put a battery
(26:43):
in my back and really told me to pursue it.
So I met with George Eliot Clark at this one conference, and he read through
my manuscript at the time, just that 30-page one,
which was all the poems to that date, pre-COVID, all the poems to that date
that were on my computer. I just put them in a Word document.
(27:04):
And he was so generous with his time. He sent me a PDF, an email.
He's just like, these are different poetic exercises and forms.
And he told me, he's like, your writing is suited to this form.
Your writing is suited to this form. He's like, you should really do those and experiment.
And I was glad to get that from him because if he didn't tell me about those
(27:25):
different poetic forms and different techniques to diversify your writing, I wouldn't have known.
I wouldn't have done them. So it was through his feedback, through feedback
of others that I created the actual manuscript.
Once I had the manuscript, then it was just a matter of sending it out to publishers.
I didn't have an agent, which is pretty typical for poetry. Poets tend not to.
(27:50):
So I was just writing my own query letters, just emailing publishers.
It was a year and a few months, a year and five months. I got about six or five
rejections and one publisher who said that they were that they wanted to move forward with it.
So that's sort of how it came. It came about. Yeah.
I am so glad that you mentioned all that.
(28:14):
I'm going through a similar transition right now from art to actually songwriting is my new thing.
That when you said sometimes you're called to do something else with the way that you create,
like that was so powerful for me because I've been trying to force myself to
express what I want to express through my art and it's just not coming through.
(28:38):
And I felt silly kind of switching to songwriting when I've spent my whole life
studying art, but I personally really needed to hear that.
So I appreciate that insight.
What are some of the major themes that you have noticed in both your writing and your art?
(28:59):
And do they kind of correlate with each other or do you tend to have separate themes for each?
This wasn't even something that I had noticed.
In my artwork, this girl that I knew who had been following my artwork and my
writing, we were at a party and she had told me that she sees a lot of thematic
(29:19):
use of the body, of the human body in my artwork.
And I didn't really notice that because I guess this is maybe the downside of
my creative process. I'm a little bit too in it.
I'm too much like this sometimes, just like my head deep in the bushes doing
my own thing, not really taking a step back and seeing it as a whole.
So I couldn't see all of those references to the body over the years.
(29:43):
But when she said that, I said, yeah, that makes sense.
There is a lot of references to the body in my artwork.
There's a lot of references to the body in my writing as well.
Well, in my visual work, I tend to do things, right?
Like if I want to give across a feeling of powerlessness, maybe the figure will
have no hand, something like that, right? That I draw.
(30:06):
And as well with my writing, I'm thinking of a few lines that I've written where
like the body is referenced and it's like either the body's being broken down
or like to make a thematic point or like exaggerate something happening to the
body to give a feeling emotionally to the reader.
So I think that there is that interplay between the writing and the art in terms of the body.
(30:30):
And in terms of the writing, I'd say a lot of the other themes,
it's more so centered on heartbreak, like sadness, like.
My artistic voice and visual art, it's not as sad as my voice is in writing.
I've never been able to write an uplifting poem.
I'm just not capable of it. When I sit down to write something,
(30:53):
it just comes out as either really intense or really, really sad.
That's just where my poetic voice is with the actual poetry.
But I'd say in terms of both of them, my brain tends to see them as separate.
I have experimented in the past where I'll draw something, then write a poem
(31:15):
for it or the other way around.
But I don't know. I feel as though if you're just transcribing images from your
poem and your artwork, my brain kind of thinks like, you've already done this. You see what I mean?
Like you've already shown the individual, the image with words.
(31:36):
Why are you now showing the image again visually, right?
Like I feel as though you're, and this is in my instance, I'm taking something
away from the poetry if I want to draw scenes from a poem.
Because it's like the whole idea is like you're trying to get the individual
reading it to conjure those images in their own mind.
(31:57):
Like why are you then showing it to them? Like, why are you being so prescriptive
to be like, oh, this is what it looks like.
It's like, no, like, just let it live on its own.
And I think I sort of view the artwork the same way, weirdly enough. Yeah. Yeah.
And it sounds like you put a lot of soul into everything that you create.
(32:20):
And I know most of us do. We put so much soul and so much love and effort.
And when it comes to selling it, it kind of feels like you're taking part of
your soul and monetizing it.
What are some ways that you can still feel good about selling something that
(32:40):
you put so much soul into?
What are some ways to rethink that kind of philosophy?
That's a really good question. And I totally understand how it can feel like
that, that you're selling out, you're selling pieces of yourself.
But for me, my thought process is, no matter how personal the work is to you,
(33:02):
as soon as you put it out, as soon as it's made public, it doesn't belong to you anymore.
It's now a part of the public ecosystem it's now
a part of the public consciousness like it's
there it's a thing it exists in the world right like as soon as i make something
and i put it out it's not mine anymore that's kind of how i view it like it's
(33:24):
not anything that i'm precious about because it's like yeah like i made it and
it's done like i made it it's gone i made it like like it's it It came from my mind,
went through my body, went through my fingertips,
went into my pencil or paintbrush onto the page, and now it's gone.
I did it like it's by Daniel, but like, do I own it now?
(33:45):
No, I wouldn't say that. I would
say that like, I'm not precious about it because it's not mine anymore.
I don't know how else to say that, Beau.
That really makes sense to me.
Are there any specific situations that you have had to deal with where you had
struggles with balancing the aspect, the business aspect and the creative aspect?
(34:10):
And what are some ways that you were able to overcome that?
Because I have a full-time job, right? Like I'm in a field that's not creative.
That's how I make my money. But outside of that, I'm like always engaging in
like art, making art, writing poetry, writing in general.
So I'd say that what I do to avoid that feeling is I'm a lot better with how I structure my time.
(34:35):
Last year has been the most fulfilling year for me artistically. It was amazing.
I'm very grateful for everything that happened to me last year.
And this year is the same. But with how busy things have been,
I actually have to use a personal calendar now to schedule, okay,
this day is going to be a day where I let myself make the artwork.
(34:59):
This day, Sundays at around 3, 4 p.m., that's my art admin day.
That's my portrait admin day. By that, I mean I'm doing all of the stuff to
support the art stuff that are not creative, like sending out emails,
applying for grants, applying for shows, submitting calls to submission, editing poetry,
(35:22):
submitting poetry to different calls, trying to get into readings,
trying to get noticed by, et cetera, et cetera.
Like all of the stuff that's more the non-creative business side,
I actually schedule that time out.
So that my mind doesn't feel guilty when I am creating.
Thinking like, oh, I should respond to this email because my mind knows,
(35:45):
oh, I have a day set up for that. It's fine. When that day comes, I'll do it. Boom.
So that's sort of how I separate them. But I'd say that there have been days
where you come home from work and you're tired.
And you have so many art things that have piled up, so many writing things that
have piled up that you have to respond to.
And it can feel like sort of like having two jobs it can feel like that right
(36:10):
like i've definitely had days where i was just like why am i even doing this
like what's the point like i'm not making.
Money consistently from it it's draining my energy like why am i doing it but
the thing that sort of keeps me balanced the thing that sort of keeps me consistent
is realizing oh no i'm doing it because I love it. I love this.
(36:34):
This is what I feel like I'm here for. This is part of what my purpose is.
I love this so much that I'm willing to sacrifice time after work for it.
I'm willing to lose sleep over it because I love it. And that love,
(36:55):
that joy, that excitement from it,
It's worth structuring your life around. That's how I feel. I completely, absolutely agree.
And a lot of us do have to work full-time jobs while we write our book or make
our music or create our art.
And some people feel ashamed of that, that they aren't doing this full-time.
(37:20):
How do you really embrace your inner artist when you do have to have that full-time
job working something that is not artistic?
And are there any ways that you could actually benefit from not being a full-time creative?
(37:41):
I definitely think that there are ways you can benefit. There's a video that I saw.
It's by this sculpture artist, this African-American guy.
I think he's living in America right now. His name is Leonardo Drew.
This video changed my life. Changed my life. It's just like a four-minute clip.
(38:02):
I can find it and send it to you after. he was just talking about his traveling
and whatever and he said that he used to be of the mindset where it's just like
i have to be in the studio all the time i have to be painting all the time i
have to be engaged in my artwork all the time allusion he used to be in that sort of like,
all-consuming sort of mindset he said that he was on a plane in japan he said
(38:26):
that he realized he's like oh he realized he's like i actually don't have to
be in the studio all the time it's like Like, even if I'm not making art,
if I'm playing with my nephews, if I'm on this plane,
if I'm doing something, if I'm at work, the art is happening within me.
The art's happening within my body regardless.
Like, that insight from him changed my whole perspective because I used to be
(38:50):
of that same mindset where it's like, oh no, you have to be doing it all the time.
But you literally don't. Like, think about it, right? Like.
I'm sure you can relate. You've probably had times in your life when you're
not being creative, when you're
not making things, but magically you always end up going back to it.
It always comes back. And the reason why it always comes back is because this is your calling.
(39:12):
This is your thing. So you don't have to always be tapping into the well and
drawing every day and really, really grinding and going crazy.
You're going to burn yourself out doing that. And I know that when I'm going
to work, when I'm at work, when I'm dealing with clients,
when I'm going for a walk, when I'm whatever, all of that life,
(39:35):
all of that life experience that we go through, frustration,
anxiety, fears, worry, happiness, all of that is creating an alchemical concoction
within us that is building the art.
The art has to come from somewhere, right? It has to come from something.
If you were isolated, living in a tower and you had no input,
(39:59):
you had no stimuli, what art would you make?
Where would your inspiration come from? So I'd say what I keep in mind is I
know that regardless of what I'm doing, the art's happening within me.
The other thing that I keep in mind is I'm.
It's this one artist, I met him here in Toronto, and we were at an art show,
(40:21):
and he said that he tried going full-time to be an artist, right?
And he said that it warped his whole mindset, because this was his livelihood.
It became like, if he didn't do this, he wouldn't eat, right?
If he didn't sell, he wouldn't survive.
So he said that his attitude, even at shows, when people would ask him,
(40:42):
oh, what is this painting about, whatever? He said whenever strangers would
approach him, his mindset would immediately be like, what a waste of time.
This guy's not going to buy.
So already, his mindset is warping the interaction because there's too much pressure on it.
There's too much pressure on it. and that's why
like i wouldn't want to go like full-time because
(41:04):
this is my baby like i love it
like i don't want to fall out of love with it by forcing myself to put economic
pressure on it that same artist he he stopped doing full-time he did interior
design and then did his art on the side and he said it was perfect he said that
like that was the balance that he needed and me and him are similar, right?
(41:26):
Like I know myself, I would have that same attitude he had if I went full time with it.
I'd approach every interaction with that same amount of like hostility because I would get frustrated.
Just like, oh, I'm doing this, I'm doing that. This person's not buying,
this person's not like, it's turning this thing that should be your passion
(41:46):
into something where it's like, if you're not giving me money for it, then what's the point?
So I think that like those are the two two things that I do to keep myself balanced, right?
Like I protect it from the capitalist power structures that we live in.
And I also sort of know that you don't have to be creating all the time to be
creating and quotes, you know?
(42:08):
I love that answer. And I completely agree.
What is something that you wish every artist who's wanting to create an art
business, Maybe in addition to what you were just talking about,
would know that would help them become more successful as an artist?
(42:29):
Not to get too meta, but I would say know what you don't know.
Know the things you're not good at. In terms of like making a business plan, making a budget.
Marketing, graphic design, advertising, I don't know how to do those things.
I'm not good at those things.
I'm not going to then force myself and bully myself and shame myself for not knowing those things.
(42:55):
I'm going to, if you're lucky enough, to lean on people in your your life who
have those skills and ask for help.
I would say, know what you don't know.
I know myself pretty well at this point.
I'm not going to learn how to code my website. It's just not going to happen.
I tried it. It's not going to happen.
So I lean on people who I can go to for support.
(43:17):
I would say being humble enough to ask for help, being humble enough to lean
on people for support, and being wise enough to steal.
By steal, I mean, if you know an artist And for example, like there's an artist
I know, she has like a content calendar.
What she does is anytime she has like multiple shows in a month,
(43:38):
she'll post like an animated calendar and she'll circle and then note down what
the shows are for each thing. That's brilliant.
That's brilliant. That's an easy way to remind everyone in one go of all the
things that you have coming up in a month.
And I would steal that. I would do that too because it's smart. You know what I mean?
(43:59):
So like lean on the people who know more than you and don't be afraid to steal
if you see someone doing something that makes sense, I'd say.
I absolutely do that. My main core group, my main support group is not an artist group.
It's actually a networking group called Women Into Networking.
(44:19):
And we are just all about sharing what helps us be successful and really learning
from each other. So that was perfect.
It's unreasonable to expect one individual to be an expert on everything.
It doesn't make sense. I think that the smartest people, the most successful
people, they know what their capacity is.
(44:41):
And for things that are outside of their scope, they delegate. Yes, delegation.
I think it's important to learn the very basics of things, the very basics of what is SEO?
What are all these things? But you don't need to become an expert in them.
And if you can't afford to hire an expert, there's always bartering.
(45:02):
There's always ways that you can work with others who are expert and actually,
for some reason, love doing social media things or whatever it is,
building websites. sites.
So that is what I want to see more of in the art community and the writing and music, whatever it is.
So I'm so glad that you brought it up.
(45:22):
And did you have any final thoughts? And also, what are some ways that people
can find you, can find your book, can find any other social media outlet of yours?
Okay, so you could go on danielmaluca.net. That's my website.
Site, d-a-n-i-e-l-a-l-u-k-a.net, right there on my homepage.
(45:49):
You can put your email in to get on the email list.
Once I have any updates or info about the book titled Unwashed coming 2024,
June, maybe later, but yeah, 2024 for sure.
Once I have any updates on that, once you put your email in,
you will receive those updates.
I'm also on Instagram. My Instagram handle is whatdanieldrew,
(46:13):
so W-H-A-T, the first name Daniel and the D-R-E-W.
The book is coming out June 2024.
It's called Unwashed. It's a collection of poetry.
The subject matters on alienation, growing up, the immigrant experience.
A loss of innocence, you know, all that fun stuff.
(46:36):
So yeah, I'd say those are the best places to reach me at. Perfect.
And I will put all of those links down below.
Please check out Daniel. He has some amazing work and some even more amazing
stuff coming up in the future.
So thank you so much for meeting up with me today, Daniel.
Thanks for tuning in to this week's episode of The Success Palette,
(46:59):
where we talked about balance of being your creative, authentic self,
your business strategy, and also how ego plays a part in all of that.
If you would like to listen to more bonus episodes or check us out on social
media, please go to thesuccesspalette.com.
(47:21):
And please, let's make it a successful week. See you next time.
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