May 2, 2024 • 29 mins
In this episode, I share the 3 biggest mistakes I'm seeing from top producing agents, and how many big producers don't actually have the basics down in their mortgage businesses, which is now causing problems in a tougher market.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:06):
that building a mortgage business,a successful one, is like playing
a game.
There's winners, there's losers,
there's certain things you try.
Some of us are playing checkers
while others are playing chess.
I've had the ability to coach and
mentor hundreds of mortgagebrokers.
I myself built a very nicebusiness.
So now I want to distill all thatinformation, all the things I've
(00:29):
learned from that and bring itdirectly to you in a simple to
understand way.
I hope you enjoy.
right.
Good morning.
Welcome to the Mortgage GamePodcast.
West Coast Wiley here, coming toyou live from one of my old spots
of recording, down by the beach.
That is correct.
Down by the beach with my hotAmericano, as opposed to die with
(00:52):
these Edmonton Oilers. 30 secondrant.
Not cool, Oilers.
Not cool.
Losing games, you should bedestroying people.
And yeah, my wife's always likethe next day, she's like, oh,
okay, the first hour I gotta like,just let's just give dad his room,
his space.
(01:13):
That is true.
It's like, I care that much.
And I know some of you are like,
oh, you should never care that.
Okay, what sets you off?
Like, don't judge.
Someone cuts you off on the
highway the highway you knowsomeone's rude to you in a store
your flight's delayed your tv showgot canceled they like none of
that bothers me none of thatbothers me my favorite sport team
(01:33):
i've been following for 40 yearssucks when they shouldn't yeah
that bothers me so you know don'tthrow what do they say stones at
glass houses or whatever they sayso just saying that's my thing
rant over let's get into it okayso i've been taking on more
one-on-one coaching it was alwaysthe plan we just had to get
(01:54):
something sorted out and it wasalways the plan and there's going
to be a model there an offering atsome point where it's like a
regular thing where it's a yearcommitment.
But I haven't got there yet.
Right now, it's taking on certain
people.
They have to fit certain criteria.
the three or four biggest mistakesI'm seeing from top producing
agents.
Okay.
And this is going to be the samestuff that was with non-producing
(02:28):
agents, newer agents, the same,exact same stuff.
But I'm telling you, like whenyou're a broker, you always,
you're, you're never looking atpeople behind you.
You're always looking at thepeople ahead of you.
That's just in life, I think.
And so if you're doing 20 million,
you're like, man, I don't know howthey're doing 70, 80 million.
If you're doing 3 million, you'relike, you can't even fathom doing
10 million, 12 million, 15million, right?
Going crazy.
Same thing when you're 100
million.
How do I grow that?
(02:49):
Like you're not going, man, howare they only doing 30?
How are they only doing 20?You never think about that.
You don't.
So a lot of you are doing whatever
volume you're doing.
And you think that, hey, the
people got it figured out, theones who you would deem
successful.
So I'll give you an example.
If you're doing 15 million andsomeone else is doing 80 million,
you're like, hey, I think they'rerunning a very successful
(03:10):
business.
They have this figured So it's
just they've been doing it longer.
They stuck with it.
They ran through some good times.
They had a database.
They've been there's other thingsat like, but they don't have their
shit play, figured out.
(03:34):
And so I've been doing one-on-one
coaching.
I did with a team that produces
over 150 million.
That's not one-to-one, that's
one-to-five.
Did it with a producing agent, 80
million.
Did it 70 million, 40 million, 110
million is coming on.
So people who are like, they're
making half a million, 700, 800thousand dollars a year.
And you're like, hey, but nowthere's problems now, which is why
they're hiring the coaching, whichis crazy because you should be
(03:58):
hiring coaching way before youhave the problems so that you
would save yourself a lot of timeand money and not even get to
where there's problems.
And so I feel like I'm rambling on
here, there's you'll get a lot outof this okay i'm here to explain
to you the top three or fourthings that i'm seeing very
consistently with 50 60 70 80 90100 120 million dollar producers
(04:20):
it's the same freaking thing overand over and because of where
we're at interest rates high fearup, all these things coming out.
We've been dealing with this for awhile now.
You start to see holes in theboat.
And these people who have thesebusinesses that were humming
along.
I could ask one of these producers
three years ago when they're justlike money's falling out of their
(04:44):
pockets.
Hey, where do you get your
business from?Yeah, I don't know.
I just like talk to people and myphone rings and I get texts and
email people like they don't know.
They have no idea.
There's not like a specific thingthey're doing.
They're just showing up and themarket's good and blah, blah,
blah.
And they're staying in front of
people and they're talking topeople.
Okay.
Well, I can't really like if a new
agent came on with you and waslike, hey, I want you to mentor
(05:05):
me.
Sounds great.
So what do I do?I don't know.
Let's go talk to people.
Like that's where we're at today.
The top producing agents arethere.
Their businesses are fallingapart.
There are holes in their boat.
Their business is down 40, 50, 60%
and they don't have any weapons toget out.
This isn't every top producingagent, but man, I'm talking to
some sharp people, people that youwould think have their shit
together, but they don't.
So let's get into the three or
(05:31):
four things I'm seeing that arevery consistent.
The number one thing I'm seeingacross the board with every, this
is 99.9% of mortgage brokers.
You've heard me talk about it.
It's the biggest mistake.
I come to you and I say, this is
the first question I ask when I dothe one-on-one coaching.
Before we get into this, thispodcast is brought to question I
(05:53):
ask is in 60 seconds or less, tellme your marketing plan.
Right?I don't give a shit about your
client journey on the back end.
I don't care how many emails you
got going out and telling thelawyers this and that and
notifying them on this and boobitybah, all these things.
I want to know because offensewins.
Winning solves all problems.
That's true.
(06:13):
You see a sports team and they'rea good team, but they lose seven
in a row.
And all of a sudden, finger
pointing starts coming out.
Ah, look, Johnny, if you only play
(06:36):
better.
Hey, if you and blah, blah, blah.
They go on a seven game winstreak.
Hey, we're all good.
We're good.
If you have 200 grand in your bankaccount versus 10 that you might
have right now, it're all good.
We're good.
If you have 200 grand in your bankaccount versus 10 that you might
have right now, it's all good.
Your client journey, you're not
thinking about it.
You're not spending time on it.
(06:57):
You're like, ah, it's working,right?
Why fix it if it's not brokenmentality?
Well, you only have the 200 grandbecause you're marketing.
It's not because of the clientjourney.
So if you have a kick assmarketing plan, that's winning.
You will have more opportunities,more swings of the play.
You will have more conversations,more business, more applications,
more closed deals, regardless ofhow good or not you are on the
back end of the stuff.
So I ask you listening 60 seconds
or less, map it out for me, bigwhiteboard in front of you with a
(07:17):
marker draw your marketing planwhat it is they're like oh shit I
don't have one I'm like so youdon't know how to get business and
a lot of these bleed in theseproblems bleed into the others.
Mike, so there's like, these arethe conversations I'm having with
people making like a milliondollars a year.
And now they're not.
Now they're making 600 and the
(07:39):
pipeline's drying up and they cansee it.
They're writing on the wall andthey're like, man, I got to get
serious.
But yeah, a lot of people have
been coasting and And I'm here totell you, it is going to get worse
before it gets better.
I have stats to back that up?
(08:02):
No. and hundreds of mortgagebrokers.
I have a different perspective anddifferent angle on what I'm
seeing.
And I'm seeing people's business
models, their marketing models.
I'm seeing their social media.
And quite frankly, I'm veryunimpressed, which tells me it's
only a matter of time.
And there's more people leaving
our industry than ever before.
So it's only a matter of time
before that rears its head on yourstuff.
(08:22):
You need to sit there.
And if you don't have a marketing
plan, you need to two days, lockyourself in a room.
You need to figure it out.
You need to figure a marketing
plan.
It is crazy town that you can't
articulate within 60 seconds in a100% commission-based business,
(08:43):
how you plan on marketing yourselfand getting business.
this before, but I'm telling you,it's not just you.
If you're doing 5 million, it'snot just you.
Don't feel bad.
I'm talking to people who've made
a million dollars a year.
And they're like, Ryan, couldn't
tell you.
Don't have it.
Or they kind of bumble throughsome things, but there's no like
(09:05):
it's 60 second map it out whereI'm like, yep.
Okay.
Connect the dot here.
Yeah.
There.
Okay.
Yeah.
That makes sense.
Awesome.
Okay, great.
Now let's go analyze your
marketing plan and let's just domore of this and this let's tweak
(09:27):
this.
No, we're building it from
scratch.
We are building people's marketing
plans from scratch, which isawesome for me because I'm a coach
and I train on this stuff and I'mreally good at it and I love doing
it.
So for me, I'm like, holy shit,
everybody needs this.
I'm like, this is crazy.
All right.
I'm the guy that'll make the
(09:48):
million Let that sink So numberone thing I see people I'm
coaching one-on-one, Right.
in. the problems they're and this
is doing, what most mortgage theydon't brokers, have a marketing
plan.
Right.
Number two, and I'm going to, I'mgoing to unpack some of that a
little more in a little bit.
Number two, their social media, A
lot of people's social media, it'sjust not there.
It's, they think they have asocial media.
(10:09):
While these producers are doingthe 50, 60, 80, a hundred million,
they've got social media.
Everyone has it now.
Okay.
If you don't, I don't know what to
tell you.
Like you're probably in the wrong
business.
(10:31):
Not probably, but you are.
You're in the wrong business.
If you don't already have a social
media account with your name onit, telling people what you do for
a living, right?I'm not saying posting and all
that, but if you haven't connectedthe dots that that's actually your
website and you know that, andlike if you don't have social
media, if you don't have anInstagram account or a Facebook or
a LinkedIn, if you don't havesocial media, if you don't have an
Instagram account or a Facebook ora LinkedIn, if you don't have one
(10:55):
of those three things, I'll eventhrow TikTok in there, and it says
you're a mortgage agent and youwork in this area, this is what
you do, blah, blah, blah.
I don't care if you have content.
I'm just saying if you don't havea profile set up, you're probably
in the wrong business.
That should be stuff you do in the
first week of becoming a mortgagebroker, right?
(11:16):
It's that important.
And so a lot of these producers,
they have social media and they'relike, cool, but I don't really get
business from it, but I feel likeit's kind of like a good business
card and a website.
I'm like, great.
I'm glad that you think that way.
And that's awesome.
You're, you are correct.
Very small piece of that is
correct.
But then I go look at the content.
I go, okay.
So you, you realize people are
looking at that a lot.
(11:37):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Totally.
Okay.
But there's no business coming infrom it.
No, no, no, no, nothing.
A little here, a little there.
Maybe, I don't know, but really,okay.
So do we see a problem there?You know, social media and
building a brand should be amassive part of your business.
You're doing stuff on socialmedia, but you're not getting
anything from it.
Ah, I'm probably not doing it
right.
Ah, you're right.
(11:57):
You're throwing up static posts,crap, and you're hoping it brings
in business, right?Where you're not connecting with
anyone.
So another big problem.
They have social media, butthey're just not doing it who they
are as a person.
They're a little too buttoned up.
They don't have a content day.
If you do not have a content day,
that is another big problem.
Massive problem.
That content, if you've beenfollowing along here on my
(12:17):
journey, that content feeds yourentire marketing plan.
Your marketing plan is builtaround content.
If it's not, then tell me what itis built around.
right?The most basic marketing plan you
could ever have that will make youhundreds and hundreds of thousands
of dollars a year, if not amillion dollars a year, is you
have an email marketing machinethat goes out consistently to an
email list that you nurture andyou keep adding in.
(12:45):
And that goes out once a week oronce every two weeks as a minimum.
That's built around video.
You could have a regular email
that goes out to referral partnersto stay in touch with them and add
value.
That's all through email.
You have social media where you'retelling the world what you do.
There's three components, emailmarketing, social media to the
(13:09):
public, components, emailmarketing, social media to the
public.
It's you showing people, building
trust.
People consume your content much
like you consume content of hoursof people.
You already feel like you knowthem and you already have trust
built up with them.
Go do that for your own business.
That'll then it's one thing tohave the stuff going out, but how
(13:32):
are you peeling out all theopportunities into conversations
and book calls?You have to have a DM strategy.
You have to have a way of talkingto people through their DMs and
adding value in DMs and askingquestions and putting offers out
there.
Do you need my help for this, for
this, for this?I do this.
Let me show you.
(13:53):
This is what I do.
This is what I do.
This is what I do.
You show through video.
So a video works in DMs, being
posted on your social media, andthrough email marketing.
One video can work for all three.
It sounds like a broken record
here, but this is the simplestmodel.
This podcast is brought to havinga marketing plan, number one
(14:14):
problem, mortgage brokers inCanada today.
Hands down, without a doubt, putme on a stage with absolutely
anybody in the industry, and Iwill debate that.
Let's go.
Anyone listening here, you don't
agree or you just wantentertainment, go set it up.
Hit me up on Instagram.
Time and place, I'm there.
What's the number one problem withmortgage brokers in Canada?
(14:37):
In their own business.
Put me up there.
I'll debate it.
Let's go.
Let's go.
Anyone listen?
So this, I'm, I'm, I'm shaking thetree a bit here.
I'm trying to go like, you guysneed to put the, not saying you
got to like, Hey, let's go hireRyan as a coach or Hey, let's go
strategy hub or Hey, let's go toone of his accountability groups
or Hey, let's go to his bootcampor Hey, let's go.
(14:58):
No, I'm not saying that you haveto figure it out.
Whatever that marketing plan isfor you.
Like a bunch of marketing plans.
I'm giving you this most simplest
one, which time in, time in, moneyout.
The model I just laid out for you,email marketing, social media,
(15:20):
DMs.
Boom, there you go.
Then you can start layering inwhatever you want on top of that.
But go get those basics figuredout.
So that's the number one problem.
The second is people having the
social media, thinking they'redoing social media, either A, not
doing it, which I'm just going tostop talking about people not
(15:40):
doing social media at some point,because I feel like it's like,
duh, I don't have social media.
Like, come on.
Like we're, we should be therenow.
Like we're, it's been talked aboutfor a decade.
Like we should be there.
Someone doesn't have to convince
you.
That's what you need to do.
Okay.
So then it's just like, okay, I
get it.
I'm doing it.
I'm not doing it right though.
That now is going to be the new
(16:01):
conversation.
How do I do it right?
How do I do it to get business?Not just to act as a business
card.
How do I engage with people and
get them to respond to my videosand comment and this and that?
And then how do I startconversations behind the scenes
that nobody actually sees?I know top producing agents who
are crushing it on social media,crushing it, but it's a two-prong
(16:22):
attack.
They're putting consistent,
authentic content out there allaround video, majority of it
around video.
And then they are backing it up
with a DM game where they connectwith their audience through their
DMs, direct messages for those whodon't know what that is.
Okay.
Just like that.
So number two, number three,first, sorry, it's early.
(16:43):
Okay.
I need my coffee.
It's a podcast.
It's brought to you by yeah.
Americano.
If it sounds like I'm a little
salty today.
Yeah.
I told you the beginning, theOilers lost last night, a game
they shouldn't have.
So you're feeling it right now.
So number three, one of thebiggest mistakes I've seen, and I
was trending down that path as amortgage broker myself.
I'll tell you this, out of thethree I'm going to share with you,
(17:05):
there was only one that, well, themain one, the marketing plan.
I had a marketing plan.
My social media, didn't have it.
Next one I'm going to share itthrough.
Yeah, I relied on some of that.
So I was making two of the
mistakes.
The one, the big, big one, I had a
marketing plan.
I could map out exactly where I
(17:30):
was getting my business from andboom, boom, boom, boom, boom.
And if there was a faucet and Ineeded business, what to go do?
I could just turn a faucet on andgo and go get business.
So I had my marketing plan figuredout.
I was ahead of the curve on thatand said, how do you marketing
(17:52):
plan?I just found something that worked
for me that felt comfortable.
And I just kept doing it.
And then I just, oh, I enjoy this.
I'm going to keep doing it.
I go, I'm onto something.
Wow.
I'm going to keep doing this.
And then I just didn't stop.
I never switched gears.
So it became a marketing plan and
(18:13):
a very good one.
One that would work very well
today as well.
Okay.
So number three was law of thebrokers.
They are, they're built a businessthat is relying on referrals.
And I've told you love referralbased before, love them.
businesses, But there's pros andcons with everything in life.
Do you really want your entirebusiness built on someone else's
efforts?On someone else's marketing sales
(18:33):
efforts, and building skills, uptrust and closing clients and
getting them to work with you.
The market turns to shit and now
they don't have business.
Now you don't have business.
Like you need to have a direct toconsumer model where you market
and you can find business withoutrelying on someone else.
If majority of your business comesfrom referral partners, that's
okay.
But you need to understand the ups
and downs that come with that.
(18:57):
It's like if you build your entire
business around this one littlething and then we just unplug it
one day, you're like, ah, shit.
I don't have a business anymore.
Right?You have to be cognizant of this.
So it's awesome to have referralpartners.
I love it, but you need to have away to just go get clients
yourself.
You have to.
And a lot of producing agents feltit over the past two, two and a
half years, and are going tocontinue feeling it because the
(19:20):
realtors are feeling it and andthey're gun shy too.
The realtors are gun shy.
They're coming in like a lot of
realtors from the, I've talked to,I talked to a bunch of realtors
too and mortgage brokers aboutthis stuff.
The conversation I'm being had isthe realtors are a little more gun
(19:44):
shy to pass deals off to mortgagebrokers when they can just get
them from the bank because justanother obstacle they have to
fight their client to do or pushtheir client, convince their
client to do when they haven't hadbusiness in a while and they don't
want to rock the boat.
It's backwards thinking, yes, but
it's what's happening.
The banks are ruthless right now.
They all usually always are, butit's even worse now.
(20:06):
Deals are hard, hard, hard to comeby.
So if I'm navigating and trying tofind referral partners to get me
business to, but I might have todeal with 40 referral partners and
manage and juggle all that.
That's exhausting, right?
If you can find your three, four,five, six awesome rock stars,
that's awesome.
(20:26):
It's just something you need to be
cognizant of because I've seen thepeople who have these
referral-based businesses andtheir 60, 70%.
And so these all sort of bleedinto each other, right?
They all come around marketing.
If you think about it, everything
always comes back to marketing.
Marketing rules the world.
(20:47):
Every time you walk down thestreet, turn on the TV, turn on
your phone, drive down the street,look in a magazine, look at
anything you marketing, marketing.
Someone is vying for your
attention so they can put it hereand monetize it.
That's the world we're in.
It's been that way for a long
time, like a very long time.
The best marketer always wins.
And my hope is that you listen tothis and you finally realize that
(21:10):
if you have the best marketing oryou have very good marketing as a
mortgage broker, nothing elsematters.
As a responsible business owner,it doesn't sound cool.
You're like, well, no, it does.
Yes, I agree.
But I'm saying you will alwayshave money in the bank account if
you are a good marketer.
If you are a good broker, bad
marketer, no money in bankaccount.
Bunch of times where you'll haveno money.
(21:32):
Good marketer, bad mortgagebroker, always have money.
else wants to When it was awesomeand rates were low and people were
coming out of the woodwork sayingoh no just the best mortgage
broker marketing only gets you sofar if you don't know how to close
the deal blah blah blah oh andthen interest rates are five six
(21:55):
seven percent now look how manyswings of the plate you're getting
look how many leads are coming innot so many wouldn't it be cool if
you're good at marketing?Ah, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding,
ding, ding.
Marketing always wins.
Every industry.
Marketing, marketing, marketing.
Brand, brand, brand.
Always, always freaking wins.
(22:16):
Another mistake stop producingagents making is their database
marketing game.
Weak or non-existent, which should
shouldn't be not shocked anymorebut for a couple of people i was
flabbergasted never used that wordon this podcast i was like uh
excuse me now what you don't sendout emails and you have a database
(22:38):
of 2400?When was the last time you
contacted them?I'm ashamed to say it was like
over two years ago.
Excuse me?
Excuse me?I'm like sitting here going, what?
Or yeah, I do.
Okay.
What do you send?Fire it over to me.
Let's see.
Let's take a look.
That's what you're sending?Yeah.
And it doesn't work.
Well, no shit, you that from your
(22:59):
brokerage.
It looks like some corporate
person, the tie that doesn't evenknow anything about the industry,
just wrote this super long jargonarticle in this outdated look.
And then you fire it out and youthink people are going to like,
(23:22):
like what?Like, just like reply and go, man,
I read your 17 paragraph article.
So cool.
Can we do a refinance?That used to work back in the day.
I remember when I started withDLC, DLC was probably called
something else.
And they had emails, and they hung
their hat on this.
And this is, it is what it is,
right?This isn't throwing DLC under the
bus, but it is what it is.
Their database marketing, not so
good.
Back then, it was good because
(23:43):
they were the only ones doingconsistent marketing, and they
gave it all to you, and it waslike, oh, this is cool.
I even knew back then it wasn'tgood.
And fast forward to now, it's thesame, they're the same system,
(24:07):
right?And a lot of other networks, same
thing.
So I'm just saying, if you think
your email marketing doesn't workand email marketing is dead and it
doesn't get you business anddoesn't get book calls and doesn't
keep you in front of people.
it's just Well, you're not doing
it right.
And I'm seeing it firsthand with
(24:28):
top producing agents withdatabases.
And I'm are you kidding me?like, There's so much opportunity
in that database.
if I I'd build something.
I'd get something weekly from it.
Value, value, value, ask.
Value, value, value, ask.
I'd show and not tell.
I'd show them what I do.
I'd show them things.
(24:49):
I'd come up with good hooks, comeup with great subject lines.
Boom, people would open.
Engagement would go up.
I'd get them with a big call toaction.
They'd be booking calls on mycalendar.
What happens after that?Different story.
Up to you how good you are on thatdiscovery call.
(25:10):
But the moral of the story here isI've been talking and coaching a
lot of brokers from brand newpeople all the way up to $120
million a year people.
And the stories are the same.
And so I want to just shed somelight on that for you.
Everyone puts their pants on thesame, right?
(25:32):
One leg at a time, that oldsaying, they do that.
The people over here that youthink have their shit together,
they don't.
They just have a longer runway
than you because they either haveA, more money in the bank.
B, they can rely on some, theyhave a little more street smarts,
better, a little better at saleshere.
They do have some referralpartners coming in, but they're
nowhere near where they, wherethey were.
(25:53):
And they're starting to realizeit.
They're starting to realize, Iactually don't have a business.
I was just a person winging it,talking to people, dealing,
reacting instead of was going withthat more.
They were playing defense dealscome in.
You play defense from all thedeals coming in.
You're like, ah, okay, okay, okay.
Instead of on the offense, they're
not out looking for business.
(26:13):
They're not out building marketing
plans.
And a lot of you are that.
You're playing defense.
You're sitting there waiting for
someone to talk to you, someone tocome up to you, someone that is
(26:36):
not happy with the bank, someonethat's got a bad rate and you can
beat it.
You're waiting for someone that
someone else screwed up on to cometo you, if that was a banker or
broker, someone in hard times thatneeds to go down a different
avenue that they don't have accessto.
You're sitting there You'rewaiting.
playing You defense.
need to go down a different avenue
that they don't have access You'resitting to.
there waiting.
You're playing defense.
(26:56):
You need to go on the offensive.
You need to go and aggressively
tell people what you do and showpeople what you do.
And the only way you can do that,the only way is social media.
So, this is a longer podcast.
Didn't mean for it to be this
long.
I apologize.
A little salty after the Oilers,but all the energy was there.
(27:19):
That's exactly what I wanted toget out is that we're all the
same, but we're not, but we are asbrokers.
We all the same problems we have.
We're not very good We don't have
a marketing plan.
Our email marketing sucks.
And we probably rely on otherpeople too much to feed us
business.
Those four things are very
consistent across the board.
So then the question what is, are
(27:41):
you going to do about it?That's it, kids.
Peace out.
Go Oilers.
that building a mortgage business,a successful one, is like playing
a game.
There's winners, there's losers,
there's certain things you try.
Some of us are playing checkers
while others are playing chess.
I've had the ability to coach and
mentor hundreds of mortgagebrokers.
I myself built a very nicebusiness.
So now I want to distill all thatinformation, all the things I've
(00:29):
learned from that and bring itdirectly to you in a simple to
understand way.
I hope you enjoy.
right.
Good morning.
Welcome to the Mortgage GamePodcast.
West Coast Wiley here, coming toyou live from one of my old spots
of recording, down by the beach.
That is correct.
Down by the beach with my hotAmericano, as opposed to die with
(00:52):
these Edmonton Oilers. 30 secondrant.
Not cool, Oilers.
Not cool.
Losing games, you should bedestroying people.
And yeah, my wife's always likethe next day, she's like, oh,
okay, the first hour I gotta like,just let's just give dad his room,
his space.
(01:13):
That is true.
It's like, I care that much.
And I know some of you are like,
oh, you should never care that.
Okay, what sets you off?
Like, don't judge.
Someone cuts you off on the
highway the highway you knowsomeone's rude to you in a store
your flight's delayed your tv showgot canceled they like none of
that bothers me none of thatbothers me my favorite sport team
(01:33):
i've been following for 40 yearssucks when they shouldn't yeah
that bothers me so you know don'tthrow what do they say stones at
glass houses or whatever they sayso just saying that's my thing
rant over let's get into it okayso i've been taking on more
one-on-one coaching it was alwaysthe plan we just had to get
(01:54):
something sorted out and it wasalways the plan and there's going
to be a model there an offering atsome point where it's like a
regular thing where it's a yearcommitment.
But I haven't got there yet.
Right now, it's taking on certain
people.
They have to fit certain criteria.
the three or four biggest mistakesI'm seeing from top producing
agents.
Okay.
And this is going to be the samestuff that was with non-producing
(02:28):
agents, newer agents, the same,exact same stuff.
But I'm telling you, like whenyou're a broker, you always,
you're, you're never looking atpeople behind you.
You're always looking at thepeople ahead of you.
That's just in life, I think.
And so if you're doing 20 million,
you're like, man, I don't know howthey're doing 70, 80 million.
If you're doing 3 million, you'relike, you can't even fathom doing
10 million, 12 million, 15million, right?
Going crazy.
Same thing when you're 100
million.
How do I grow that?
(02:49):
Like you're not going, man, howare they only doing 30?
How are they only doing 20?You never think about that.
You don't.
So a lot of you are doing whatever
volume you're doing.
And you think that, hey, the
people got it figured out, theones who you would deem
successful.
So I'll give you an example.
If you're doing 15 million andsomeone else is doing 80 million,
you're like, hey, I think they'rerunning a very successful
(03:10):
business.
They have this figured So it's
just they've been doing it longer.
They stuck with it.
They ran through some good times.
They had a database.
They've been there's other thingsat like, but they don't have their
shit play, figured out.
(03:34):
And so I've been doing one-on-one
coaching.
I did with a team that produces
over 150 million.
That's not one-to-one, that's
one-to-five.
Did it with a producing agent, 80
million.
Did it 70 million, 40 million, 110
million is coming on.
So people who are like, they're
making half a million, 700, 800thousand dollars a year.
And you're like, hey, but nowthere's problems now, which is why
they're hiring the coaching, whichis crazy because you should be
(03:58):
hiring coaching way before youhave the problems so that you
would save yourself a lot of timeand money and not even get to
where there's problems.
And so I feel like I'm rambling on
here, there's you'll get a lot outof this okay i'm here to explain
to you the top three or fourthings that i'm seeing very
consistently with 50 60 70 80 90100 120 million dollar producers
(04:20):
it's the same freaking thing overand over and because of where
we're at interest rates high fearup, all these things coming out.
We've been dealing with this for awhile now.
You start to see holes in theboat.
And these people who have thesebusinesses that were humming
along.
I could ask one of these producers
three years ago when they're justlike money's falling out of their
(04:44):
pockets.
Hey, where do you get your
business from?Yeah, I don't know.
I just like talk to people and myphone rings and I get texts and
email people like they don't know.
They have no idea.
There's not like a specific thingthey're doing.
They're just showing up and themarket's good and blah, blah,
blah.
And they're staying in front of
people and they're talking topeople.
Okay.
Well, I can't really like if a new
agent came on with you and waslike, hey, I want you to mentor
(05:05):
me.
Sounds great.
So what do I do?I don't know.
Let's go talk to people.
Like that's where we're at today.
The top producing agents arethere.
Their businesses are fallingapart.
There are holes in their boat.
Their business is down 40, 50, 60%
and they don't have any weapons toget out.
This isn't every top producingagent, but man, I'm talking to
some sharp people, people that youwould think have their shit
together, but they don't.
So let's get into the three or
(05:31):
four things I'm seeing that arevery consistent.
The number one thing I'm seeingacross the board with every, this
is 99.9% of mortgage brokers.
You've heard me talk about it.
It's the biggest mistake.
I come to you and I say, this is
the first question I ask when I dothe one-on-one coaching.
Before we get into this, thispodcast is brought to question I
(05:53):
ask is in 60 seconds or less, tellme your marketing plan.
Right?I don't give a shit about your
client journey on the back end.
I don't care how many emails you
got going out and telling thelawyers this and that and
notifying them on this and boobitybah, all these things.
I want to know because offensewins.
Winning solves all problems.
That's true.
(06:13):
You see a sports team and they'rea good team, but they lose seven
in a row.
And all of a sudden, finger
pointing starts coming out.
Ah, look, Johnny, if you only play
(06:36):
better.
Hey, if you and blah, blah, blah.
They go on a seven game winstreak.
Hey, we're all good.
We're good.
If you have 200 grand in your bankaccount versus 10 that you might
have right now, it're all good.
We're good.
If you have 200 grand in your bankaccount versus 10 that you might
have right now, it's all good.
Your client journey, you're not
thinking about it.
You're not spending time on it.
(06:57):
You're like, ah, it's working,right?
Why fix it if it's not brokenmentality?
Well, you only have the 200 grandbecause you're marketing.
It's not because of the clientjourney.
So if you have a kick assmarketing plan, that's winning.
You will have more opportunities,more swings of the play.
You will have more conversations,more business, more applications,
more closed deals, regardless ofhow good or not you are on the
back end of the stuff.
So I ask you listening 60 seconds
or less, map it out for me, bigwhiteboard in front of you with a
(07:17):
marker draw your marketing planwhat it is they're like oh shit I
don't have one I'm like so youdon't know how to get business and
a lot of these bleed in theseproblems bleed into the others.
Mike, so there's like, these arethe conversations I'm having with
people making like a milliondollars a year.
And now they're not.
Now they're making 600 and the
(07:39):
pipeline's drying up and they cansee it.
They're writing on the wall andthey're like, man, I got to get
serious.
But yeah, a lot of people have
been coasting and And I'm here totell you, it is going to get worse
before it gets better.
I have stats to back that up?
(08:02):
No. and hundreds of mortgagebrokers.
I have a different perspective anddifferent angle on what I'm
seeing.
And I'm seeing people's business
models, their marketing models.
I'm seeing their social media.
And quite frankly, I'm veryunimpressed, which tells me it's
only a matter of time.
And there's more people leaving
our industry than ever before.
So it's only a matter of time
before that rears its head on yourstuff.
(08:22):
You need to sit there.
And if you don't have a marketing
plan, you need to two days, lockyourself in a room.
You need to figure it out.
You need to figure a marketing
plan.
It is crazy town that you can't
articulate within 60 seconds in a100% commission-based business,
(08:43):
how you plan on marketing yourselfand getting business.
this before, but I'm telling you,it's not just you.
If you're doing 5 million, it'snot just you.
Don't feel bad.
I'm talking to people who've made
a million dollars a year.
And they're like, Ryan, couldn't
tell you.
Don't have it.
Or they kind of bumble throughsome things, but there's no like
(09:05):
it's 60 second map it out whereI'm like, yep.
Okay.
Connect the dot here.
Yeah.
There.
Okay.
Yeah.
That makes sense.
Awesome.
Okay, great.
Now let's go analyze your
marketing plan and let's just domore of this and this let's tweak
(09:27):
this.
No, we're building it from
scratch.
We are building people's marketing
plans from scratch, which isawesome for me because I'm a coach
and I train on this stuff and I'mreally good at it and I love doing
it.
So for me, I'm like, holy shit,
everybody needs this.
I'm like, this is crazy.
All right.
I'm the guy that'll make the
(09:48):
million Let that sink So numberone thing I see people I'm
coaching one-on-one, Right.
in. the problems they're and this
is doing, what most mortgage theydon't brokers, have a marketing
plan.
Right.
Number two, and I'm going to, I'mgoing to unpack some of that a
little more in a little bit.
Number two, their social media, A
lot of people's social media, it'sjust not there.
It's, they think they have asocial media.
(10:09):
While these producers are doingthe 50, 60, 80, a hundred million,
they've got social media.
Everyone has it now.
Okay.
If you don't, I don't know what to
tell you.
Like you're probably in the wrong
business.
(10:31):
Not probably, but you are.
You're in the wrong business.
If you don't already have a social
media account with your name onit, telling people what you do for
a living, right?I'm not saying posting and all
that, but if you haven't connectedthe dots that that's actually your
website and you know that, andlike if you don't have social
media, if you don't have anInstagram account or a Facebook or
a LinkedIn, if you don't havesocial media, if you don't have an
Instagram account or a Facebook ora LinkedIn, if you don't have one
(10:55):
of those three things, I'll eventhrow TikTok in there, and it says
you're a mortgage agent and youwork in this area, this is what
you do, blah, blah, blah.
I don't care if you have content.
I'm just saying if you don't havea profile set up, you're probably
in the wrong business.
That should be stuff you do in the
first week of becoming a mortgagebroker, right?
(11:16):
It's that important.
And so a lot of these producers,
they have social media and they'relike, cool, but I don't really get
business from it, but I feel likeit's kind of like a good business
card and a website.
I'm like, great.
I'm glad that you think that way.
And that's awesome.
You're, you are correct.
Very small piece of that is
correct.
But then I go look at the content.
I go, okay.
So you, you realize people are
looking at that a lot.
(11:37):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Totally.
Okay.
But there's no business coming infrom it.
No, no, no, no, nothing.
A little here, a little there.
Maybe, I don't know, but really,okay.
So do we see a problem there?You know, social media and
building a brand should be amassive part of your business.
You're doing stuff on socialmedia, but you're not getting
anything from it.
Ah, I'm probably not doing it
right.
Ah, you're right.
(11:57):
You're throwing up static posts,crap, and you're hoping it brings
in business, right?Where you're not connecting with
anyone.
So another big problem.
They have social media, butthey're just not doing it who they
are as a person.
They're a little too buttoned up.
They don't have a content day.
If you do not have a content day,
that is another big problem.
Massive problem.
That content, if you've beenfollowing along here on my
(12:17):
journey, that content feeds yourentire marketing plan.
Your marketing plan is builtaround content.
If it's not, then tell me what itis built around.
right?The most basic marketing plan you
could ever have that will make youhundreds and hundreds of thousands
of dollars a year, if not amillion dollars a year, is you
have an email marketing machinethat goes out consistently to an
email list that you nurture andyou keep adding in.
(12:45):
And that goes out once a week oronce every two weeks as a minimum.
That's built around video.
You could have a regular email
that goes out to referral partnersto stay in touch with them and add
value.
That's all through email.
You have social media where you'retelling the world what you do.
There's three components, emailmarketing, social media to the
(13:09):
public, components, emailmarketing, social media to the
public.
It's you showing people, building
trust.
People consume your content much
like you consume content of hoursof people.
You already feel like you knowthem and you already have trust
built up with them.
Go do that for your own business.
That'll then it's one thing tohave the stuff going out, but how
(13:32):
are you peeling out all theopportunities into conversations
and book calls?You have to have a DM strategy.
You have to have a way of talkingto people through their DMs and
adding value in DMs and askingquestions and putting offers out
there.
Do you need my help for this, for
this, for this?I do this.
Let me show you.
(13:53):
This is what I do.
This is what I do.
This is what I do.
You show through video.
So a video works in DMs, being
posted on your social media, andthrough email marketing.
One video can work for all three.
It sounds like a broken record
here, but this is the simplestmodel.
This podcast is brought to havinga marketing plan, number one
(14:14):
problem, mortgage brokers inCanada today.
Hands down, without a doubt, putme on a stage with absolutely
anybody in the industry, and Iwill debate that.
Let's go.
Anyone listening here, you don't
agree or you just wantentertainment, go set it up.
Hit me up on Instagram.
Time and place, I'm there.
What's the number one problem withmortgage brokers in Canada?
(14:37):
In their own business.
Put me up there.
I'll debate it.
Let's go.
Let's go.
Anyone listen?
So this, I'm, I'm, I'm shaking thetree a bit here.
I'm trying to go like, you guysneed to put the, not saying you
got to like, Hey, let's go hireRyan as a coach or Hey, let's go
strategy hub or Hey, let's go toone of his accountability groups
or Hey, let's go to his bootcampor Hey, let's go.
(14:58):
No, I'm not saying that you haveto figure it out.
Whatever that marketing plan isfor you.
Like a bunch of marketing plans.
I'm giving you this most simplest
one, which time in, time in, moneyout.
The model I just laid out for you,email marketing, social media,
(15:20):
DMs.
Boom, there you go.
Then you can start layering inwhatever you want on top of that.
But go get those basics figuredout.
So that's the number one problem.
The second is people having the
social media, thinking they'redoing social media, either A, not
doing it, which I'm just going tostop talking about people not
(15:40):
doing social media at some point,because I feel like it's like,
duh, I don't have social media.
Like, come on.
Like we're, we should be therenow.
Like we're, it's been talked aboutfor a decade.
Like we should be there.
Someone doesn't have to convince
you.
That's what you need to do.
Okay.
So then it's just like, okay, I
get it.
I'm doing it.
I'm not doing it right though.
That now is going to be the new
(16:01):
conversation.
How do I do it right?
How do I do it to get business?Not just to act as a business
card.
How do I engage with people and
get them to respond to my videosand comment and this and that?
And then how do I startconversations behind the scenes
that nobody actually sees?I know top producing agents who
are crushing it on social media,crushing it, but it's a two-prong
(16:22):
attack.
They're putting consistent,
authentic content out there allaround video, majority of it
around video.
And then they are backing it up
with a DM game where they connectwith their audience through their
DMs, direct messages for those whodon't know what that is.
Okay.
Just like that.
So number two, number three,first, sorry, it's early.
(16:43):
Okay.
I need my coffee.
It's a podcast.
It's brought to you by yeah.
Americano.
If it sounds like I'm a little
salty today.
Yeah.
I told you the beginning, theOilers lost last night, a game
they shouldn't have.
So you're feeling it right now.
So number three, one of thebiggest mistakes I've seen, and I
was trending down that path as amortgage broker myself.
I'll tell you this, out of thethree I'm going to share with you,
(17:05):
there was only one that, well, themain one, the marketing plan.
I had a marketing plan.
My social media, didn't have it.
Next one I'm going to share itthrough.
Yeah, I relied on some of that.
So I was making two of the
mistakes.
The one, the big, big one, I had a
marketing plan.
I could map out exactly where I
(17:30):
was getting my business from andboom, boom, boom, boom, boom.
And if there was a faucet and Ineeded business, what to go do?
I could just turn a faucet on andgo and go get business.
So I had my marketing plan figuredout.
I was ahead of the curve on thatand said, how do you marketing
(17:52):
plan?I just found something that worked
for me that felt comfortable.
And I just kept doing it.
And then I just, oh, I enjoy this.
I'm going to keep doing it.
I go, I'm onto something.
Wow.
I'm going to keep doing this.
And then I just didn't stop.
I never switched gears.
So it became a marketing plan and
(18:13):
a very good one.
One that would work very well
today as well.
Okay.
So number three was law of thebrokers.
They are, they're built a businessthat is relying on referrals.
And I've told you love referralbased before, love them.
businesses, But there's pros andcons with everything in life.
Do you really want your entirebusiness built on someone else's
efforts?On someone else's marketing sales
(18:33):
efforts, and building skills, uptrust and closing clients and
getting them to work with you.
The market turns to shit and now
they don't have business.
Now you don't have business.
Like you need to have a direct toconsumer model where you market
and you can find business withoutrelying on someone else.
If majority of your business comesfrom referral partners, that's
okay.
But you need to understand the ups
and downs that come with that.
(18:57):
It's like if you build your entire
business around this one littlething and then we just unplug it
one day, you're like, ah, shit.
I don't have a business anymore.
Right?You have to be cognizant of this.
So it's awesome to have referralpartners.
I love it, but you need to have away to just go get clients
yourself.
You have to.
And a lot of producing agents feltit over the past two, two and a
half years, and are going tocontinue feeling it because the
(19:20):
realtors are feeling it and andthey're gun shy too.
The realtors are gun shy.
They're coming in like a lot of
realtors from the, I've talked to,I talked to a bunch of realtors
too and mortgage brokers aboutthis stuff.
The conversation I'm being had isthe realtors are a little more gun
(19:44):
shy to pass deals off to mortgagebrokers when they can just get
them from the bank because justanother obstacle they have to
fight their client to do or pushtheir client, convince their
client to do when they haven't hadbusiness in a while and they don't
want to rock the boat.
It's backwards thinking, yes, but
it's what's happening.
The banks are ruthless right now.
They all usually always are, butit's even worse now.
(20:06):
Deals are hard, hard, hard to comeby.
So if I'm navigating and trying tofind referral partners to get me
business to, but I might have todeal with 40 referral partners and
manage and juggle all that.
That's exhausting, right?
If you can find your three, four,five, six awesome rock stars,
that's awesome.
(20:26):
It's just something you need to be
cognizant of because I've seen thepeople who have these
referral-based businesses andtheir 60, 70%.
And so these all sort of bleedinto each other, right?
They all come around marketing.
If you think about it, everything
always comes back to marketing.
Marketing rules the world.
(20:47):
Every time you walk down thestreet, turn on the TV, turn on
your phone, drive down the street,look in a magazine, look at
anything you marketing, marketing.
Someone is vying for your
attention so they can put it hereand monetize it.
That's the world we're in.
It's been that way for a long
time, like a very long time.
The best marketer always wins.
And my hope is that you listen tothis and you finally realize that
(21:10):
if you have the best marketing oryou have very good marketing as a
mortgage broker, nothing elsematters.
As a responsible business owner,it doesn't sound cool.
You're like, well, no, it does.
Yes, I agree.
But I'm saying you will alwayshave money in the bank account if
you are a good marketer.
If you are a good broker, bad
marketer, no money in bankaccount.
Bunch of times where you'll haveno money.
(21:32):
Good marketer, bad mortgagebroker, always have money.
else wants to When it was awesomeand rates were low and people were
coming out of the woodwork sayingoh no just the best mortgage
broker marketing only gets you sofar if you don't know how to close
the deal blah blah blah oh andthen interest rates are five six
(21:55):
seven percent now look how manyswings of the plate you're getting
look how many leads are coming innot so many wouldn't it be cool if
you're good at marketing?Ah, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding,
ding, ding.
Marketing always wins.
Every industry.
Marketing, marketing, marketing.
Brand, brand, brand.
Always, always freaking wins.
(22:16):
Another mistake stop producingagents making is their database
marketing game.
Weak or non-existent, which should
shouldn't be not shocked anymorebut for a couple of people i was
flabbergasted never used that wordon this podcast i was like uh
excuse me now what you don't sendout emails and you have a database
(22:38):
of 2400?When was the last time you
contacted them?I'm ashamed to say it was like
over two years ago.
Excuse me?
Excuse me?I'm like sitting here going, what?
Or yeah, I do.
Okay.
What do you send?Fire it over to me.
Let's see.
Let's take a look.
That's what you're sending?Yeah.
And it doesn't work.
Well, no shit, you that from your
(22:59):
brokerage.
It looks like some corporate
person, the tie that doesn't evenknow anything about the industry,
just wrote this super long jargonarticle in this outdated look.
And then you fire it out and youthink people are going to like,
(23:22):
like what?Like, just like reply and go, man,
I read your 17 paragraph article.
So cool.
Can we do a refinance?That used to work back in the day.
I remember when I started withDLC, DLC was probably called
something else.
And they had emails, and they hung
their hat on this.
And this is, it is what it is,
right?This isn't throwing DLC under the
bus, but it is what it is.
Their database marketing, not so
good.
Back then, it was good because
(23:43):
they were the only ones doingconsistent marketing, and they
gave it all to you, and it waslike, oh, this is cool.
I even knew back then it wasn'tgood.
And fast forward to now, it's thesame, they're the same system,
(24:07):
right?And a lot of other networks, same
thing.
So I'm just saying, if you think
your email marketing doesn't workand email marketing is dead and it
doesn't get you business anddoesn't get book calls and doesn't
keep you in front of people.
it's just Well, you're not doing
it right.
And I'm seeing it firsthand with
(24:28):
top producing agents withdatabases.
And I'm are you kidding me?like, There's so much opportunity
in that database.
if I I'd build something.
I'd get something weekly from it.
Value, value, value, ask.
Value, value, value, ask.
I'd show and not tell.
I'd show them what I do.
I'd show them things.
(24:49):
I'd come up with good hooks, comeup with great subject lines.
Boom, people would open.
Engagement would go up.
I'd get them with a big call toaction.
They'd be booking calls on mycalendar.
What happens after that?Different story.
Up to you how good you are on thatdiscovery call.
(25:10):
But the moral of the story here isI've been talking and coaching a
lot of brokers from brand newpeople all the way up to $120
million a year people.
And the stories are the same.
And so I want to just shed somelight on that for you.
Everyone puts their pants on thesame, right?
(25:32):
One leg at a time, that oldsaying, they do that.
The people over here that youthink have their shit together,
they don't.
They just have a longer runway
than you because they either haveA, more money in the bank.
B, they can rely on some, theyhave a little more street smarts,
better, a little better at saleshere.
They do have some referralpartners coming in, but they're
nowhere near where they, wherethey were.
(25:53):
And they're starting to realizeit.
They're starting to realize, Iactually don't have a business.
I was just a person winging it,talking to people, dealing,
reacting instead of was going withthat more.
They were playing defense dealscome in.
You play defense from all thedeals coming in.
You're like, ah, okay, okay, okay.
Instead of on the offense, they're
not out looking for business.
(26:13):
They're not out building marketing
plans.
And a lot of you are that.
You're playing defense.
You're sitting there waiting for
someone to talk to you, someone tocome up to you, someone that is
(26:36):
not happy with the bank, someonethat's got a bad rate and you can
beat it.
You're waiting for someone that
someone else screwed up on to cometo you, if that was a banker or
broker, someone in hard times thatneeds to go down a different
avenue that they don't have accessto.
You're sitting there You'rewaiting.
playing You defense.
need to go down a different avenue
that they don't have access You'resitting to.
there waiting.
You're playing defense.
(26:56):
You need to go on the offensive.
You need to go and aggressively
tell people what you do and showpeople what you do.
And the only way you can do that,the only way is social media.
So, this is a longer podcast.
Didn't mean for it to be this
long.
I apologize.
A little salty after the Oilers,but all the energy was there.
(27:19):
That's exactly what I wanted toget out is that we're all the
same, but we're not, but we are asbrokers.
We all the same problems we have.
We're not very good We don't have
a marketing plan.
Our email marketing sucks.
And we probably rely on otherpeople too much to feed us
business.
Those four things are very
consistent across the board.
So then the question what is, are
(27:41):
you going to do about it?That's it, kids.
Peace out.
Go Oilers.
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