April 16, 2024 • 54 mins
In this episode, Kate and Charles discuss Buffy the Vampire Slayer's language and jargon and the show's impact on television writing and pop culture.
Spoiler alert: The entire Buffy the Vampire Slayer series will be discussed.
This episode was produced by Kate Balzer and Charles Swint. Edited by Jeremy Williams.
Theme song
Angel’s Rock by Twisterium | https://www.twisterium.com Music promoted by https://www.free-stock-music.com Creative Commons / Attribution 3.0 Unported License (CC BY 3.0) https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/deed.en_US
Sources
Slayer Slang: A Buffy the Vampire Slayer Lexicon by Michael Adams
The Power of Slang by Tom Dalzell: https://www.pbs.org/speak/words/sezwho/slang/
Understanding the Language of Buffy the Vampire Slayer: https://h2g2.com/edited_entry/A13492776
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:09):
Hey,
everyone.
Welcome to a girl,
a guy in a Buffy podcast.
I'm one of your co-host,
Kate Balser and I'm Charles Swint and we're so excited to have you with us today.
So uh continuing in our season of pop culture for Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
Today,
we are talking language in Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
Um So we're delving into,
(00:29):
you know,
Buffy's unique language,
not only the character but the show itself.
Um And you know what that all means and how that really gets shown in the,
in the series.
Start talking a little slang if you will a little slang.
I like that.
Yeah.
And just a reminder for anyone who's joining us for the first time.
This is a totally spoil podcast.
(00:53):
We are discussing the series in its entirety.
Uh We try not to talk about other elements,
but if we do,
we mentioned that,
you know,
there might be spoilers for some of the comic stuff,
but mostly we focus on the show.
But we do recommend if you haven't watched the whole series and you don't want to be spoiled,
finish watching the series and then come check us out.
(01:13):
Yes.
Um,
but if you're here for the first time and you have watched everything.
Welcome.
Yeah,
we're so glad you're here and thank you to everyone who's returning each week to listen to us.
You know,
who you are?
So language,
language,
language,
it's a tricky thing.
So,
(01:34):
do you want to do some like level setting on,
on language itself?
Sure.
Absolutely.
Um,
so I definitely did a little,
uh,
you know,
start in the traditional way with defining some words for myself as I was researching for this episode.
And um,
because a couple of words kept coming up in some of the research I was doing related to slang in general and then specific to the language in the series and those words were lexicon,
(02:05):
jargon and slang.
And so all my definitions come from Miriam Webster and lexicon.
Well,
let me say,
um I'm picking the definition that fits with the conversation today.
A couple of these,
you know,
the words had multiple definitions.
So for lexicon,
the one that we're really kind of looking at is the vocabulary of a language,
(02:29):
an individual speaker or group of speakers or a subject,
which definitely fits with Buffy,
they certainly have their own vocabulary of language or lexicon.
And then jargon,
this is interesting,
I kind of always use jargon and slang like interchange interchangeably,
but really,
um it's more jargon is more the technical terminology or characteristic idiom of a special activity or group.
(02:56):
Um So it's not just general slang.
It either pertains to us like a spec specific activity or,
um,
work as well.
Like you hear work jargon and then slang.
Um,
I pulled both definitions and the first one is language peculiar to a particular group.
And the second,
uh,
definition is an informal non-standard vocabulary composed typically of coinages arbitrarily change words and extravagant,
(03:24):
forced or facetious figures of speech.
Ok.
Yeah.
So,
in all,
in all of this discussion,
I think I,
I agreed like Buffy definitely has um the show itself has a very rich lexicon.
Um And you,
and I think too,
when you're talking about that it go and there,
(03:45):
there's so many layers to it.
All right,
because there,
there is like sort of the language and the usage that each individual character has,
um that sort of the universe as a whole uses and then there gets into,
you know,
because they had to build all of this,
um the mythos behind everything and like the creatures and,
(04:08):
and,
and all the research stuff that the Scooby had to do and build all of that,
which I think falls more into like the jargon um category a little bit in terms of like how,
like,
so they,
the idea of jargon being something that's related to your work or your profession.
So anything that's specifically related to Buffy slaying would be using sort of slayer jargon because it's something specific to her job.
(04:38):
Yeah,
I would definitely agree.
Yeah.
So it's terms like Slayer and Watcher would be like jargon because it pertains specifically to her work.
Um,
but then a lot of times they'll take those words and turn them into slang,
you know,
like saying going on and turning it into Slay Edge,
um,
kind of becomes slang for the Slay Inc like hell,
(04:59):
Mouse vamp dusting all like dust being but like,
you know,
dusting and yet it's interesting because I think we think of the show more as a very slang heavy show,
which it is.
But when you start to understand what the differences are between slang and jargon,
you realize it's a very jargon heavy show as well and they make,
(05:20):
they make the jargon sound slangy.
And so like,
again,
like,
that's how I think that the,
the evolution of language comes because taking something out of jargon and making it into slang,
um,
helps,
helps in that development.
Yeah.
Well,
kind of leading into that one of the,
um,
great resources I found in research.
(05:42):
Um,
and this was just in language in general.
It was a PBS,
um,
resource for,
uh,
page they called Do you speak American?
And there was a piece called The Power of Slang by Tom Dalzell.
And,
um,
just gonna quote from it,
slang's primary reason for being to establish a sense of commonality amongst its speakers further ensues its widespread use when slang is used.
(06:09):
There is a subtext to the primary message that subtext speaks to the speakers and listeners membership in the same quote unquote tribe.
Because tribe identity is so important.
Slang is a powerful and graphic manifestation of that identity's benefit at the time.
The primary message is not in the meaning of what is said,
(06:31):
but in the very use of slang,
a compelling example of how the medium can be the message.
So what I think is interesting about that is um the,
the slang that develops in the series obviously binds the characters together.
Um But it binds us viewers together because we know the slang,
(06:56):
like it becomes our language too.
Um You know,
when you talk to other people and if you were to use those terminologies or use the jargon,
like we all understand each other and we know what it means and we,
we know what it's coming from.
So it took it from building a community within the series to a building a larger community amongst the fans,
which I think is just kind of really fascinating cultural phenomenon.
(07:20):
Yeah.
And it's interesting because like when you're talking about the that shared usage and how we all sort of again,
it,
it sort of goes back to the show itself where there was a Slayer,
the chosen one,
the Slayer.
And then you get,
then you introduce Kendra and then she is also a Slayer,
(07:44):
but she's not the Slayer.
And so how that goes on and then when the potentials come in and then they all become slayers,
they are all slayers,
but they are not the slayer.
There's no more like chosen one so that,
that jargon changes around even the singular of that word slayer or slayers.
(08:04):
And,
and I see the parallel of the growth of that towards the growth of how,
how all of that,
how we as audience members come in at the end and being sort of potential slayers,
all of us and taking on that language and taking on that jargon um and making it our own and going out into the world and creating something something else.
(08:31):
Yeah,
that's actually a really great point.
And really,
I mean,
it shows you how important language is and what a role it plays in,
you know,
culture,
sociology,
anthropology,
um all those elements of uh society,
whatever,
however big or small that society is absolutely,
(08:53):
there is another um couple of lines from that,
the power of slanging by Tom Dalzell,
um that I thought it was great.
It's specific on slang,
but I thought it really applied so much to Buffy.
Um And the way that Josh we Joss Whedon developed his language.
Um and the show developed its language as other writers took on his,
(09:15):
his style of language and writing.
And the quote is with slang.
Each generation or subculture or counterculture group has the chance to shape and propagate its own lexicon.
And in doing so to exercise,
originality and imagination.
The end result is a lively,
playful body of language that is at times used for no other reason than that.
(09:39):
It is fun to use and identifies the speaker as clever and witty.
And I thought that was just such an app description of the show's language.
Um that there is such a level of playfulness of wittiness of,
of clever turn of phrases.
Um not only specific to slang but in general as well.
(10:02):
Um Yeah,
and I think that,
yeah,
that idea of using slang to make your so self sound clever and to sound different.
I think one of the good examples and this is from um from a book called Slayer Slang and it says um and some Slayer uh slang is,
is clever like Inner Slayer for the essential person of a Slayer,
(10:25):
by analogy with inner child and extension of the terms to mean one who dominates in inactivity.
So as in Cordelia's uh famous Retort and Halloween,
she says,
look Buffy,
you might be hot stuff when it comes to demonology or whatever,
but when it comes to dating,
I'm the Slayer.
And so the the use of that and the use of term like turning that around and on it on itself to mean something different.
(10:53):
So here again,
we have an example of them already taking their jargon and making it into slang for themselves.
Right.
Yeah.
Yeah,
exactly.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um So should we get into a little bit.
(11:13):
I don't know what information you have.
I know we kind of ended up both using some of the same resources.
But,
um,
getting into,
you know how the language was formed,
uh,
in the show,
I'm,
you know,
we both read some of the,
the Slayer Slang book and in the,
(11:34):
um,
introduction is written by Jane Espenson,
one of the writers from Buffy,
one of the great writers from Buffy who was probably there for at least half the series,
I believe she came in in season three.
Don't quote me on that.
I think so,
but we can fact check that.
(11:58):
But yeah,
so she,
she gives a great introduction to the book.
Um and really gives some great insights in how the language of Buffy was developed.
And basically,
it,
you know,
as we were saying,
it really at the heart of it comes down to Joss Whedon.
Um She was saying a lot of the words used is how he speaks.
(12:20):
One of the things that he would do is truncating words.
So like instead of saying necessary,
he'd say n um he'd also do a double negative.
So instead of saying this person is untalented or I'm sorry,
this person is talented,
he would say,
you know,
not untalented.
Um So that's definitely,
(12:40):
you know,
the,
where it all stems and starts from,
that's the seed of the language.
Um and the turn of phrase.
But so some ways that they would build on the language of Joss Sweden was creative Compounds.
An example would be chock full o sanity.
Um And then grammatically or phonetically complex lines.
(13:01):
Um Like this quote uh from Willow a doodle.
I do doodle.
You too.
You do doo doodle too.
I can't read that line without laughing.
It makes me laugh every time.
Um And then juxtaposing casual language with dramatic import.
So this is a line from um Double Meat Palace.
The beefy layer is definitely people,
(13:22):
probably not the chicky part,
but who knows?
Who knows?
Um So I thought that was great,
like,
insight into like how the language is built um that,
you know,
we just sort of all absorbed and didn't,
you know,
probably think about and um at a higher level,
like how it was all put together,
(13:43):
but I do think it's really interesting and you,
it's amazing how easy it is to pick up because I definitely found myself particularly when the show was on air and I was really hardcore into watching it doing that myself,
like adding,
you know,
I know the one of the other big things um is,
you know,
adding an E or an EY to a word,
(14:03):
adding a eg to a word.
So like going from Slay to Slay Edge,
um you know,
or that's um now,
I can't think of an eyay word that the show used.
Um And then there were,
you know,
that kind of stuff and I found myself doing that a lot,
um just automatically and even like the development of,
(14:24):
and again,
it sort of internally,
like the development of the,
of the words that they used and like,
started in season one when they were like,
trying to sort of brand who,
um,
willow and,
and Xander were to Buffy and the use of Slayer.
And then,
oh,
and the Slayer ATS,
(14:44):
which didn't really quite catch on because they ended up using Cordy and the quartets,
which made for better usage in terms of just communicating those things.
And so they had to drop sleets because it couldn't be sleets and quartets.
And then that's how we get the Scooby gang,
(15:04):
which we get the Scooby,
the Scooby Gang,
Scoob Scoops and all of that stuff which allowed for more like development,
like developmental of development of that language.
Um And the use of those terms.
Yeah.
And that,
that example is a great example too of how then tying into our season theme of pop culture,
(15:25):
how pop culture references then became part of their own,
became part of the vocabulary development.
So there were a couple of great examples like so Slayer Palooza.
Um So obviously,
you know,
most of us at the time,
we know what Lallapalooza was and obviously,
it still is going on today.
So you knew what that meant when they put it together.
And then another quote was from Xander.
(15:47):
Does anyone feel like we've been Kaiser so well.
So anyone who watched Usual Suspects would understand that reference and become like they've verified the name Kaiser.
So and then another example is the count of three isn't a plan,
it's Sesame Street.
So again,
we all like,
we grew up on Sesame Street,
like you get that and you get under,
(16:08):
you also get like the whole,
you know,
you,
there's the count character in Sesame Street and then there's the fact that like Sesame Street would be like,
it's brought to you by the letter A and the number one,
you know,
so like that,
all of that is built into that cultural references that then become part of the language and the vocab.
So it,
it codifies that sense of cultural community and identity even more.
(16:32):
Well and what and what a more fascinating and interesting way to say something like OK,
we're go,
which is something that you do in every TV show,
right?
It's like,
OK,
we're gonna do this on the count of 3123.
And usually the joke is like,
do we go on three or after three or we're like,
what?
Like that's usually the joke,
but it's like on the count of three,
(16:52):
that's not a plan.
It's Sesame Street.
Like that gives it such a more richer context because you know that that's just the basics like,
yes,
of course,
we know we're gonna go on the count of three like,
why would we not?
Because who goes on like unless you're a dancer,
you then you go on eight but you go on one or eight if you're a dancer.
(17:16):
But otherwise like everyone else goes on the count of three.
So why would you not?
Um So yeah,
it just,
it makes and again,
and it makes them sound smarter and more that almost sounded like a dumb sense.
It makes them smell more smart than they were.
Um But it makes them,
it,
(17:36):
it elevates their language more,
it makes them more informed and more aware and it separates them from being just these sort of vapid self abed teenagers,
right?
I think it also gives whatever the point is being made much more specificity that people like you get what that means,
(18:00):
like you get what that is like and you don't have to say it with a whole ton of language like we got there like when you say,
does anyone feel we've been Kaiser?
So say like,
you know,
that means we feel like we've been tricked like there's a,
we've been hacked and in a way that's so and in a way that is so specific that is so like specifically had not just like,
(18:22):
you know,
yeah,
not just a general ha just not a general trick.
Like if you've seen the movie and you know how,
what happens,
like you get what that means.
Um Yeah,
I know.
And then another thing that I also um read for one of the ways that they use language is to condense information.
(18:43):
Um So that you like we were saying like you don't have to go on and on it.
You got it in those,
you know,
few words or one sentence,
whatever it is a great example which I love I like and you understand this so perfectly is at the end of graduation day part two when Giles and Buffy are talking and all Buffy can say is fire bad tree pretty.
(19:03):
It's like you get it.
She is so burnt out.
Like has no more brain power like Giles,
we cannot discuss this right now.
I need to go home and take a nap for like the rest of the summer.
And you're like,
I totally get that.
I know exactly how she's feeling like I I need nothing else as there's like a fire burning like fire badge pretty pretty like that's it.
(19:25):
Like that's it.
Like these are the things in the shot.
I can acknowledge two things.
Um They also,
I just also interesting too.
Uh and I can't remember the article that I was reading but it,
it talks about the use of language with specific characters too and about the use of um it's a,
it was an article talking about people who had uh had done transcripts of the entire series and saying how uh the Cordelia used the word very more often than anyone else as very specifically in her language to give her sort of this cadence and this tone,
(20:07):
um,
that made her seem cooler or not very,
she used so sorry,
what's the word?
So she used the word so,
um to make her self sound,
you know,
different than everybody else.
Um,
where willow doesn't have that same,
same sort of lexicon.
But then as the show goes on,
Cordelia uses so less and Willow uses it much more.
(20:32):
Um And then the use and,
and just the use of British slang and terminologies and things like that with,
with uh Giles and,
and Spike.
But even Giles just using his word,
he's the one who uses very and quite much more often in his sentence structures than anybody else does.
Um And then of course they use both use bloody.
(20:54):
Um But you know,
well,
and going back to the point of so with Cordelia and then like you said,
the,
the shifting of her using a lesson Willow using it more when you take a step back and look at it,
this two letter word is being used to show confidence,
like Cordelia is a leader.
She knows her place like she,
she has a good sense of who she is overall.
(21:16):
And so,
you know,
that is a sense of like she knows what's going on.
She's gonna tell you what's cool,
what's not cool.
And then as she kind of shift away from being let being away from,
becomes less superficial,
excuse me.
And not that Willie becomes more superficial for her.
It means more confident that use of language starts to flip,
(21:38):
which is so fascinating.
I mean,
it's talk about like,
really understanding your show and your characters and having such a nuanced development that like even the simplest word as so can tell you so much.
Yeah,
it's really,
and I love this quote.
I have to read this quote from um from Slayer Slang because I just thought it was so amazing and it's um it's from Karen Eileen over and uh Lehan Preston motto,
(22:11):
uh I think I'm getting that correct.
Uh And it says Buffy is able to survive longer than any other Slayer because she is embedded in language and because she embodies language,
it is a very particular language with its own vernacular,
but it behaves like all language languages in that it creates,
it compiles,
(22:31):
it translates,
it follows well defined rules.
It draws on shared knowledge and it must be wielded with precision in order to be effective.
Any Slayer can brandish a weapon.
But for Buffy,
the Vampire Slayer,
the tongue is as pointed as the stake.
That's a great quote.
And I think that is no,
(22:52):
it nowhere is it more obvious than the Buffy bot particularly the start of season six and that she cannot use language the way Buffy does.
And that is like she may be decent at slang,
but it just,
that's why she's not Buffy.
We took her punning for granted.
(23:12):
So put that m what is that?
Put that MP menu in your pie plate?
Yes,
exactly.
So,
I love that.
That is so true.
I mean,
she's known for her punning.
She's known for her,
you know,
witty,
uh,
Slay remarks,
um,
(23:34):
which I love about her.
Yeah.
And it's,
and it's the thing that separate again.
It is the thing that sort of separates her because no other when we watch,
you know,
when we see Kendra,
when we see Faith Slay,
like they don't pun like Buffy,
puns like nobody puns like Buffy does.
Um no one can give you a Zinger right before they stake you like Buffy like Buffy can.
(23:58):
Um And so,
and then,
and I think,
and she,
and even Willis says,
I,
well,
they ask like,
well,
why is that so important?
Like,
what,
why do we need to bother with all of that?
And Willis says,
well,
I think it throws them off like I think it's,
it's the thing,
it's her secret weapon.
It's the thing that she like,
(24:19):
you know,
when you're fighting somebody and they're like,
you know,
throwing one liners at,
at you,
it's got to get in your head a little bit.
Yeah,
I think you could also make the argument that it shows her level of intellect not to say that,
you know,
Kendra and Faith are not smart.
But I think that's the one thing that helps Buffy,
(24:41):
that or that we come to see is why Buffy stands out as such a phenomenal Slayer is her ability to take that information and process it and really come up with some creative,
um you know,
ideas.
She has a really great sense of intuition and,
you know,
that's,
that's all part of like intellect and,
(25:03):
and taking your experience and processing it.
So I think elevating that through her language shows us um you know,
her intellectual abilities and that she's not just like the weapon that the counselor wants.
The council wants her to be where she just goes out like a robot slays comes back.
(25:24):
Um And that's why she is the amazing slayer that she is and why she comes up with all these ways to constantly defeat the big bads.
Um And then changes everything by the very end of the show.
Yeah,
I mean,
I it's interesting too that with like faith,
(25:44):
you know,
she is known,
you know,
I think she definitely has some language play there.
We don't see her obviously as much,
but it's interesting that she is given um that phrase five by five,
which if you haven't heard what it means,
it comes from um like really like transportation.
(26:07):
And I think it was also,
wasn't it the military?
But it basically was like on a scale from 1 to 5,
like communicating.
How well can you hear me through our communication means and if it's perfect,
it's five by five on a scale of 1 to 5,
it's five.
So we use five by five,
which is like a phrase that none of us had ever heard.
I mean,
(26:27):
unless maybe you had some connection to somebody older who used it.
But like,
they give it to this,
like,
young brassy woman and you're,
and it,
like you got,
but you got what it meant,
even if you didn't know where it came from,
like it was understood.
But I think it's fascinating to like,
give her the way they gave her like this very actually jargon from another,
(26:50):
another jargon from another workspace.
Um Another culture and give it to her and it's also like,
you know,
beyond her age and yet it totally works well,
I think,
you know,
and yeah,
so yes,
the five by five is,
it's about the clarity of the radio signal.
(27:13):
Yeah.
So it's a measure of scale of five points.
Um And then not,
not the dimensions of a square to clarify that.
But um but also,
and,
you know,
truckers use it a lot too and,
and CB speak.
So I think that that's how I imagine faith picks up on,
(27:35):
on that.
It's like her travels across the country is maybe she hitch,
hitchhiked with a,
with a trucker and heard the lingo,
you know,
again,
it's the jargon of,
of this,
the CB communication of radio communication that she probably picked up,
you know,
from,
you know,
doing a sailor or like,
you know,
or like,
(27:56):
or being with a trucker or something like that.
Um,
but,
and we do know what it is kind of like,
we,
we get it sort of,
but even the Scooby do,
um,
have to do some,
have some question about it and clarify and,
you know,
there's a time where she says,
oh,
well,
how are you?
And she's like,
I'm five by five and Buffy says,
I guess that means you are of the good of the good.
(28:19):
That is one I would like to use all the time.
And so again,
using this jargon that is now a slang for somebody else has to be explained to the audience using slang.
And a Buffy is that the audience is familiar with and that's just a whole like,
what are we doing?
Yeah.
(28:40):
Yeah.
And then even Willow goes like,
oh,
faith with her five by five.
What does that even mean?
She's so mad about it?
But funny now that we fully explain where that five by five comes.
When you think about it.
Actually,
it's like a genius phrase to give to her because like when you understand where it comes from,
like you said,
(29:01):
it gives you more into faith backstory without spelling it out,
right?
That this is a,
like faith is someone who has been,
who doesn't have a home who's been traveling around and even when she comes in the Sunnydale.
And it's very unclear if she has been slaying vampires before she became a slayer.
(29:23):
Or if she like,
or if in like the,
you know,
couple of months that she became a slayer and got her first,
like her first watcher came,
granted if Buffy can have an adventure every week,
so can faith.
So why,
like she has lots of stories and it's been several months,
it would be basically like a season,
(29:43):
like a half a season of slaying for faith.
She wasn't discovered as a potential before,
if she wasn't discovered beforehand.
So,
you know,
but there is a,
there's sort of a trans even just that one saying gives her like this transient feeling.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
(30:06):
Um Yeah,
it's so amazing.
It's so cool,
you know,
one thing um we could talk about and I don't remember much being said on,
on this topic about Buffy,
but I do remember everyone was saying this about Dawson's Creek,
um which premiered during the middle of Buffy's second season.
(30:26):
Um And,
and what they would say about the characters on Dawson's Creek,
the,
the teen characters is they talked at a level that didn't feel like any teen talked at,
it felt very dull.
They were talking in these,
you know,
on these big topics with these,
you know,
big vocabulary that just didn't feel like teenage speak.
And I think you could argue that about the Buffy teen characters.
(30:49):
I mean,
they certainly make,
you know,
not so much maybe in the specific actual words used,
but certainly all the references.
I mean,
yes,
there's the,
like normal teen pop culture references that you'd expect them to make.
Um,
but I think even like bigger ones towards,
you know,
literature or old movies that you would not necessarily expect to them and watch or other things.
(31:10):
And to me,
actually,
on both shows,
it never felt weird because it felt like that's the conversations like me and my high school friends were having because we were reading stuff and we were discussing politics because you had to for school and it also interested us.
So,
like,
all of that,
like,
quote unquote adult language or adult conversations never felt artificial even though they were being written by like men in their thirties and then,
(31:37):
you know,
or showrunners in their thirties along with their writers of varying ages that always actually felt real to me.
Like,
it never felt un teen.
Like,
how about,
I don't know how you felt well,
and I would say like,
one,
the first,
the first teen show that I ever watched where I felt like the language of the teens really worked and it really felt like,
(32:02):
oh,
ok,
you're not pandering.
What's my so called life?
Like that was the show that I saw that I was like,
00,
you get it.
And like,
and the weird thing about it is,
is that,
you know,
people have what,
uh what's it called when,
I don't know where it's where words and sounds tickle your brain or whatever.
(32:22):
Like,
there was something about the way that they spoke that excited me in a way that I had never been excited before because it was finally like,
oh,
yes,
you see me and you're talking,
like you're talking about the things that I want to talk about and you're expressing them in a way that I would tell my friend this way.
(32:43):
And actually,
oh,
I don't know how to express this to my friend,
but that's how I want to do it because that's exactly it.
And now I have language to use in order to communicate myself better,
which I think is an incredible,
like,
that's the power of great writing can do is that it can,
it can give voice to the voiceless.
(33:04):
It can,
it can fill in some of the gaps when you don't,
when you don't have,
you know,
the space for that when you don't have the,
the vocabulary or the experience for it.
But then here's someone your own age who is going through something similar that can,
that can fill that in for you.
Um,
and so yes,
and I agree.
And I watched Justin's Creek too and it never bothered me.
(33:24):
Um,
I actually really like that on that show.
Um,
you know,
it certainly didn't bother me on Buffy.
I just,
I've always thought that the language on Buffy has been,
um,
it's,
it's so great.
I mean,
I just think it's so,
um,
it's so smart in the first episode where,
(33:46):
you know,
where Buffy is like.
So,
what's the,
what's the sitch?
Um,
I think I've read that there are articles that Sarah Michelle Geller was,
like,
I don't know what this means.
Like,
I don't even know.
Can someone explain,
can someone explain this to me?
Yeah.
Well,
it's funny,
I was thinking,
um,
particularly when I read that about,
(34:06):
um,
one of the things that Jos Sweden would do is um,
truncating words.
So,
like I said,
would say ness instead of necessary.
And I was trying to think back because obviously we were like,
you know,
coming out of our teens into our twenties when Buffy was on.
And so like a few years before that we had been in high school and I was like,
honestly,
(34:26):
I don't remember a lot of our slang,
like from that time period,
like what teen speak is like,
but like thinking about going a few years forward into like the millennial slang.
That is one thing that like a lot of millennial slang does is that like truncating of words.
So it's really funny that like somebody who is,
(34:48):
I guess Jos Whedon is technically like,
what,
like the beginning of Gen X I think,
um,
maybe like a baby boomer.
I'm not sure exactly when,
when he was born um,
but it's just funny that,
like,
he was doing that and then not,
not saying that he influenced it.
It's just funny how I think what it shows you is that first off,
(35:09):
like,
generational definitions are pretty fluid.
Um,
and that the influence kind of goes back and forth.
Um,
but it is really interesting.
Do you remember,
like,
any flying from,
like when we were growing up?
The only thing I remember is from when I was in middle school and not was the big word.
(35:30):
So you'd be like,
oh,
I really want to go fishing with you this weekend.
Not.
And how quickly that got annoying to parents.
Like,
I remember things like,
oh,
that's bumping was a,
was a big thing when I was like in middle school living in,
in,
like in the DC area like that was bumping.
(35:50):
Um,
well,
and to say also,
like,
slang obviously is not universal across teenagers,
like regional race religion.
Like all of that plays an influence.
I'm trying to think of,
um,
gosh,
I really can't and now I want to,
I really want to,
like,
look and see.
(36:11):
Um I'm going to like,
try to do a quick,
oh,
you know what?
Actually,
I do remember one of the influences would be clueless.
I feel like,
um,
like,
whatever that was one thing we were doing and then the loser with the l like,
I feel like those are things and then like,
uh ride in the Crimson Wave.
(36:34):
I don't know,
it was used all that often.
Um,
but the other,
the other big influence I remember on,
like me and my friends again,
more going back to middle school was heathers.
We use like lines from heathers all the time.
Oh,
so yeah,
so like talk to the hand,
talk to the hand because the face don't want to hear it was one or,
(36:55):
oh,
that's the bomb or whatever.
I really home skillet.
What's up home skillet?
We used to say that.
Um,
you going right out to the crib?
Um,
I gotta bounce.
Uh,
oh,
that's so Crunk.
Crunk.
(37:15):
Um.
Oh,
snap.
Oh,
snap.
Oh,
snap.
Um,
what's another one?
Uh,
I,
yeah.
All right.
Uh,
buzz kill.
You're such a buzz kill.
Oh my gosh,
you're such a,
uh,
sup.
I gotta dip,
uh,
(37:37):
eat my shorts.
That Simpson.
Oh,
he's pretty fly,
pretty fly for a white guy and boo,
yah.
Um,
yeah,
those were some talk to the hand as if,
(37:58):
as if that was the one all the time,
whatever,
as if,
as if totally use that all the time.
Um,
which also shows you that speaks to what we were saying earlier about how fast slang,
uh,
runs hot and burns out.
(38:18):
Um,
which is ok because now hearing it,
it just feels cringy.
Oh,
or like you're straight tripping.
Oh,
what you say?
Like,
oh,
who's your daddy?
And like nineties slang?
Some nineties slang is just wildly.
Yeah.
Well,
it probably depends to,
(38:38):
like,
who is using it more.
I don't know if we heard so much of that stuff in high school.
At least our high school.
But so,
oh,
so Sue Me was another 10,
yeah.
I had forgotten about that one.
Um,
yeah.
Oh,
my goodness.
Yeah.
90 slang.
I mean,
(39:00):
doesn't it all sound like it's all crazy?
Yeah.
It all sounds crazy Like when you're not speaking it and when you're out of it,
um,
and now I'm at the age where if I'm using it,
it's,
it's over because I'm too old to be.
I still use it.
I don't care.
(39:21):
No,
I meant,
like,
the slang of the,
now,
if I'm,
if,
like,
now I'm using it,
it's over.
We're at that age.
I don't know what's on it now.
Like,
I keep looking up stuff on tiktok and I'm like,
there's a,
there's a teacher on the substitute teacher on tiktok who's like,
I guess,
like,
my students into thinking that these words are slight.
(39:45):
It's so funny and it's interesting because what he puts out,
like what he puts out there and how he's how he talks about how this word and what this means.
Like,
he really is sort of breaking down,
sort of like,
sort of a modern day etymology of how we would get,
how we would use this word as a new slang word except no one's using it.
(40:07):
But he just tells the students that and because he subs and goes to different schools,
he was like,
yeah.
Well,
I was just over at the high school last week and they use that all the time.
So I don't know what you talking about.
I love it.
So,
he's like,
basically making,
he's making slang happen,
making slang happen in the moment.
Well,
also gas lighting his students.
(40:30):
Oh,
my goodness,
jeez.
All right.
So I was wondering,
what do you think going back to our culture,
pop culture theme in the larger scheme of other television shows?
How Buffy falls with its development of its own language?
Like,
does it seem unique?
(40:51):
Does it still feel unique?
Um,
well,
I think it's still,
I think it still feels unique.
Um,
I don't,
I feel like when I watch,
when I go back and watch Buffy it,
I don't have that.
Like,
there's a sense that especially in season one,
(41:11):
season one definitely feels like it's over time.
Feels very much like this is the nineties,
like everything they do,
not only nineties but like specifically a certain group of in California,
right?
Um So yes.
(41:34):
So in that,
so in some senses,
yes,
I,
I think it does,
um,
it encapsulates sort of a time and a place very nicely that feels very nostalgic um,
in a good way for me and in other ways it just because the language is so specific because the jargon is so specific and because it,
(41:58):
it really turns into this sort of meta force where it's just like where it starts referencing itself over and over and over again,
it becomes so self referential that it contains it,
like the language is almost contained within the body of work itself.
Um And so that way it keeps,
(42:20):
it keeps sort of this like stasis for itself where it doesn't,
where they are referring to things that are outside of the universe.
But those things have already established themselves as being sort of timeless classic pop culture references.
Uh Yes.
So yes,
we absolutely can use this because those things are not going away anytime soon,
(42:42):
like we can refer to them as the Scooby because Scooby Doo has been around since the seventies and every kid has watched,
there's always an iteration of Scooby Doo running around somewhere somewhere in the universe.
So that's OK to use.
And I think that's one of the things that they were smart about was about using very specific pop culture references in the inclusion of the language so that it was always something that would be timeless.
(43:12):
I don't know if that was planned or not.
But yeah.
No,
that's a really good point.
Yeah,
I think you're right.
That's kind of why season one sticks out.
Like I'm thinking about the fact just in the pilot episode when Cordelia is quizzing Buffy and she's talking about like she has to get with James Spade.
And you're like,
whoa,
that's dated.
James Spader.
Like no one's getting.
Yeah.
Or James Spader.
(43:33):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um,
he has to call me.
Um,
yeah,
I mean,
that's very,
that's,
I mean,
honestly she's almost even 10 years out of date with that reference.
Like,
I would have used something more like Christian Slater or,
or,
yeah.
But yeah,
he's,
(43:53):
to me,
James Vader is like a heartthrob,
is more like eighties.
Um,
so it's funny that,
that it's already,
like dated.
Yeah,
that,
that reference in of itself is already dated and just that conversation probably,
maybe why,
like season one can be more,
it could be made that,
that also is partly why season one can be more of a struggle for people.
(44:15):
Um,
you know,
it has its moments but obviously it,
that does date it,
um,
which can make it hard to go back and,
and re-watch amongst some of the other,
um,
aspects of it that,
you know,
like,
what's that conversation that they have in the,
um,
in the locker room after they find that?
(44:37):
And she's like,
what,
like,
what's the sick?
Uh,
well,
the chatter and the calf is,
they found a dead guy in the body,
a dead guy in the locker.
Yeah.
Apparently more jos we didn't speak.
But the way the girls do it,
it comes off.
Very Valley girl.
Yes.
Yes.
(45:00):
When I started my rewatched this time around.
Yeah.
That felt so weird.
It was like,
oh,
this is jarring.
This feels like weird,
it feel out of place,
it feel so out of place because that's not,
that's not what we're doing here.
That's not the language that we're trying to,
we're trying to do.
So it does.
So I think especially those first few episodes feel very,
(45:22):
that first episode in particular.
But,
um,
you know,
there are other episodes in season one where everything just feels a,
feels a little bit forced and feels a little bit out of place.
But by season two,
definitely we have and even probably,
even earlier than that,
we really start to find a rhythm for the language.
(45:46):
Yeah.
Yeah.
That,
I mean,
the pilot really stands out like,
I it,
you don't feel as much of that out of sense of,
out of place with the language moving into the main part of the season compared to the pilot episode,
that's for sure.
And then it only gets better as this series goes on.
I was thinking in the larger cultural context as well,
(46:06):
you know,
comparing Buffy to other shows,
um,
in that how it develops and uses language feels fairly unique compared to other shows.
I mean,
I do think there are other shows out there that use,
you know,
language.
Well,
I'm not saying they're,
they don't.
But again,
this is really just speaking to things I've read and heard said by cultural critics,
(46:31):
um you know,
anything written about pop culture or television,
the two that I think of when it comes to being written about with,
about their language.
Buffy is one,
the other show is Deadwood.
Mm Again,
I,
you know,
and I'm sure you could probably speak to it.
Uh Mad Men as well.
(46:51):
But the way The Mad Men is,
I think it's a little bit different from the way these two shows are,
whereas these two shows are very much about the language and what is said and how the phrasing is done is so specific.
And so um technically developed that I just don't see in a lot of other shows,
(47:13):
even like other great dramas that have been developed,
you know,
it's not everything.
Yeah,
everything is so pedestrian.
I mean,
I think most,
most shows are very pedestrian when it comes,
comes to that.
Um You know,
I will,
I mean,
and this is a little outside of what you were talking about in terms of language.
(47:34):
But I would also,
I would also sort of argue that um genre shows do I think genre shows probably do better with the development of language?
Because they,
because they can lean on the jargon so much.
Um And so or other languages.
So when you're talking about something like Star Trek,
(47:56):
when you're talking about like Klingon,
where like where they developed like certain phrases for the show.
But because it became such a huge cultural hit and people were so interested in that,
that like this whole language developed out of,
you know,
small phrases or when you're looking at um Game of Thrones where they had like an entire language built,
(48:21):
you know,
and developed for that series before they started,
which had to have like its rules and it's,
you know,
verb tenses and all of that stuff written out before they,
you know,
when they were working on the script.
So,
um well,
I think another example too,
not that they create their own language but um would be the um remake of Battlestar Galactica.
(48:44):
And you think about like Frack and you know,
they,
again,
you're right,
like that,
that sci fi,
that genre,
that supernatural um those supernatural shows by nature of the content and uh probably leaning heavier into the jargon and the flying development.
And I think like two things that just sort of popped into my head would be like uh Seinfeld with the use of yada yada yada,
(49:12):
like pushing that as,
as slang or friends.
Could you be any more annoying like that sort of like again and,
and a lot of that has nothing to do with,
I mean,
yes,
that's a slight a phrase or whatever,
but it is also more about the actor delivery of those lines that make to those that makes,
(49:34):
which is a,
so then you're talking about catchphrases,
right?
Which is a completely different thing like someone having a catch phrase,
which is what you get in sitcoms,
which is so much more different than having an entire lexicon of,
of language.
You know what you're talking about,
Willis.
Like that's,
you know,
you get those things,
you get those nuggets which then get used over and over and over again to sort of like a nauseam for the,
(50:00):
for the punch line of the joke as opposed to creating an entire language that you can take the punch line,
you see it coming and then flip it on its head to something else.
Um Yeah,
I mean,
it's,
I know we talk about this,
we love the show so we like,
love almost everything about it.
But I really the language I think again,
(50:20):
just it's what helps keep the show alive and why people keep coming back to it because it is such a unique feature of a television show that you don't see happening in a lot of other television shows,
even great genre supernatural sci fi shows.
Um OK,
I thought it would be a little fun to wrap up with.
(50:42):
I found a reddit thread from a couple of years ago where somebody asked like,
if you watch Buffy in a different language in your country,
how does the title translates it?
It's really funny.
So the first one,
the person who posted the question said,
um I don't know where she's from originally but said they had moved to Germany and couldn't help giggle at the title which translate as Buffy in the Bewitchment of the Demons and the Bewitchment of the Demon.
(51:15):
OK.
Um And then she uh 00 and then apparently wherever this person comes from,
which they didn't say what their home country is.
The title translates to Buffy Against the Vampires,
which that's not a bad translation against the Vampires.
Yeah.
Um So a person from Norway said that this is not an exact translation.
(51:35):
This is as poetic as they could put it.
But apparently if you translate the Norwegian title to English,
it's Buffy Nightmare of The Vampires,
which I was like,
that's pretty good.
Um,
as,
as the person said,
it works well with the line.
I'm the thing,
Monsters have nightmares about,
um,
in Sweden,
it was Buffy and the Vampires.
(51:57):
Buffy and the Vampires.
It's like a band.
That's exactly what it sounds like a band name.
It's like J and the Pussycat in Poland.
It translated as Buffy Collin Boogeyman for the Vampires.
She's like doing dance competitions for him.
Yeah.
Um,
this person didn't say what country they were in but it,
(52:18):
their translation is Buffy,
The Hunter of Vampires.
So it's funny we went back to like vampire hunters which,
uh,
is more common.
It doesn't give it that like uniqueness that Slayer does.
Um,
oh,
I like this one in Hungary.
They were like,
it's something like Buffy,
the bane of vampires.
I like that too,
(52:39):
which is great.
I think that might be my favorite one.
So hungry.
Um,
I like Buffy and the Vampires.
Buffy and the Vampires.
That great band name.
Yeah,
it's like Jim and the Holograms or something.
Exactly.
Susie and the Banshee.
(52:59):
Awesome.
Well,
thank you.
Thanks everyone for tuning in.
We hope you enjoyed this discussion.
Obviously,
we certainly did.
Um,
we went out for a while on that one who knew there'd be so much to say about words.
Um,
that was a sort of intended pun um if it counts as a pun.
(53:19):
Um But yeah,
thanks so much and we hope you enjoyed the episode and we'd love it if you would rate and review us wherever you listen to your podcast and let us know what's your thoughts on,
um,
you know,
on language if listen.
Uh because I know we do have some listeners in other countries.
Um So we would love to hear your thoughts on what um how things translate and how things sound um on different languages.
(53:43):
And you can always reach us on our socials on our Instagram,
which is at a Buffy podcast on Instagram and on Facebook.
Or you can email us at a Buffy pie,
a Buffy podcast at gmail.com.
All right.
Well,
thanks so much and we'll see you next week.
(54:05):
All right,
thanks a lot.
Thanks.
Bye.
Hey,
everyone.
Welcome to a girl,
a guy in a Buffy podcast.
I'm one of your co-host,
Kate Balser and I'm Charles Swint and we're so excited to have you with us today.
So uh continuing in our season of pop culture for Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
Today,
we are talking language in Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
Um So we're delving into,
(00:29):
you know,
Buffy's unique language,
not only the character but the show itself.
Um And you know what that all means and how that really gets shown in the,
in the series.
Start talking a little slang if you will a little slang.
I like that.
Yeah.
And just a reminder for anyone who's joining us for the first time.
This is a totally spoil podcast.
(00:53):
We are discussing the series in its entirety.
Uh We try not to talk about other elements,
but if we do,
we mentioned that,
you know,
there might be spoilers for some of the comic stuff,
but mostly we focus on the show.
But we do recommend if you haven't watched the whole series and you don't want to be spoiled,
finish watching the series and then come check us out.
(01:13):
Yes.
Um,
but if you're here for the first time and you have watched everything.
Welcome.
Yeah,
we're so glad you're here and thank you to everyone who's returning each week to listen to us.
You know,
who you are?
So language,
language,
language,
it's a tricky thing.
So,
(01:34):
do you want to do some like level setting on,
on language itself?
Sure.
Absolutely.
Um,
so I definitely did a little,
uh,
you know,
start in the traditional way with defining some words for myself as I was researching for this episode.
And um,
because a couple of words kept coming up in some of the research I was doing related to slang in general and then specific to the language in the series and those words were lexicon,
(02:05):
jargon and slang.
And so all my definitions come from Miriam Webster and lexicon.
Well,
let me say,
um I'm picking the definition that fits with the conversation today.
A couple of these,
you know,
the words had multiple definitions.
So for lexicon,
the one that we're really kind of looking at is the vocabulary of a language,
(02:29):
an individual speaker or group of speakers or a subject,
which definitely fits with Buffy,
they certainly have their own vocabulary of language or lexicon.
And then jargon,
this is interesting,
I kind of always use jargon and slang like interchange interchangeably,
but really,
um it's more jargon is more the technical terminology or characteristic idiom of a special activity or group.
(02:56):
Um So it's not just general slang.
It either pertains to us like a spec specific activity or,
um,
work as well.
Like you hear work jargon and then slang.
Um,
I pulled both definitions and the first one is language peculiar to a particular group.
And the second,
uh,
definition is an informal non-standard vocabulary composed typically of coinages arbitrarily change words and extravagant,
(03:24):
forced or facetious figures of speech.
Ok.
Yeah.
So,
in all,
in all of this discussion,
I think I,
I agreed like Buffy definitely has um the show itself has a very rich lexicon.
Um And you,
and I think too,
when you're talking about that it go and there,
(03:45):
there's so many layers to it.
All right,
because there,
there is like sort of the language and the usage that each individual character has,
um that sort of the universe as a whole uses and then there gets into,
you know,
because they had to build all of this,
um the mythos behind everything and like the creatures and,
(04:08):
and,
and all the research stuff that the Scooby had to do and build all of that,
which I think falls more into like the jargon um category a little bit in terms of like how,
like,
so they,
the idea of jargon being something that's related to your work or your profession.
So anything that's specifically related to Buffy slaying would be using sort of slayer jargon because it's something specific to her job.
(04:38):
Yeah,
I would definitely agree.
Yeah.
So it's terms like Slayer and Watcher would be like jargon because it pertains specifically to her work.
Um,
but then a lot of times they'll take those words and turn them into slang,
you know,
like saying going on and turning it into Slay Edge,
um,
kind of becomes slang for the Slay Inc like hell,
(04:59):
Mouse vamp dusting all like dust being but like,
you know,
dusting and yet it's interesting because I think we think of the show more as a very slang heavy show,
which it is.
But when you start to understand what the differences are between slang and jargon,
you realize it's a very jargon heavy show as well and they make,
(05:20):
they make the jargon sound slangy.
And so like,
again,
like,
that's how I think that the,
the evolution of language comes because taking something out of jargon and making it into slang,
um,
helps,
helps in that development.
Yeah.
Well,
kind of leading into that one of the,
um,
great resources I found in research.
(05:42):
Um,
and this was just in language in general.
It was a PBS,
um,
resource for,
uh,
page they called Do you speak American?
And there was a piece called The Power of Slang by Tom Dalzell.
And,
um,
just gonna quote from it,
slang's primary reason for being to establish a sense of commonality amongst its speakers further ensues its widespread use when slang is used.
(06:09):
There is a subtext to the primary message that subtext speaks to the speakers and listeners membership in the same quote unquote tribe.
Because tribe identity is so important.
Slang is a powerful and graphic manifestation of that identity's benefit at the time.
The primary message is not in the meaning of what is said,
(06:31):
but in the very use of slang,
a compelling example of how the medium can be the message.
So what I think is interesting about that is um the,
the slang that develops in the series obviously binds the characters together.
Um But it binds us viewers together because we know the slang,
(06:56):
like it becomes our language too.
Um You know,
when you talk to other people and if you were to use those terminologies or use the jargon,
like we all understand each other and we know what it means and we,
we know what it's coming from.
So it took it from building a community within the series to a building a larger community amongst the fans,
which I think is just kind of really fascinating cultural phenomenon.
(07:20):
Yeah.
And it's interesting because like when you're talking about the that shared usage and how we all sort of again,
it,
it sort of goes back to the show itself where there was a Slayer,
the chosen one,
the Slayer.
And then you get,
then you introduce Kendra and then she is also a Slayer,
(07:44):
but she's not the Slayer.
And so how that goes on and then when the potentials come in and then they all become slayers,
they are all slayers,
but they are not the slayer.
There's no more like chosen one so that,
that jargon changes around even the singular of that word slayer or slayers.
(08:04):
And,
and I see the parallel of the growth of that towards the growth of how,
how all of that,
how we as audience members come in at the end and being sort of potential slayers,
all of us and taking on that language and taking on that jargon um and making it our own and going out into the world and creating something something else.
(08:31):
Yeah,
that's actually a really great point.
And really,
I mean,
it shows you how important language is and what a role it plays in,
you know,
culture,
sociology,
anthropology,
um all those elements of uh society,
whatever,
however big or small that society is absolutely,
(08:53):
there is another um couple of lines from that,
the power of slanging by Tom Dalzell,
um that I thought it was great.
It's specific on slang,
but I thought it really applied so much to Buffy.
Um And the way that Josh we Joss Whedon developed his language.
Um and the show developed its language as other writers took on his,
(09:15):
his style of language and writing.
And the quote is with slang.
Each generation or subculture or counterculture group has the chance to shape and propagate its own lexicon.
And in doing so to exercise,
originality and imagination.
The end result is a lively,
playful body of language that is at times used for no other reason than that.
(09:39):
It is fun to use and identifies the speaker as clever and witty.
And I thought that was just such an app description of the show's language.
Um that there is such a level of playfulness of wittiness of,
of clever turn of phrases.
Um not only specific to slang but in general as well.
(10:02):
Um Yeah,
and I think that,
yeah,
that idea of using slang to make your so self sound clever and to sound different.
I think one of the good examples and this is from um from a book called Slayer Slang and it says um and some Slayer uh slang is,
is clever like Inner Slayer for the essential person of a Slayer,
(10:25):
by analogy with inner child and extension of the terms to mean one who dominates in inactivity.
So as in Cordelia's uh famous Retort and Halloween,
she says,
look Buffy,
you might be hot stuff when it comes to demonology or whatever,
but when it comes to dating,
I'm the Slayer.
And so the the use of that and the use of term like turning that around and on it on itself to mean something different.
(10:53):
So here again,
we have an example of them already taking their jargon and making it into slang for themselves.
Right.
Yeah.
Yeah,
exactly.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um So should we get into a little bit.
(11:13):
I don't know what information you have.
I know we kind of ended up both using some of the same resources.
But,
um,
getting into,
you know how the language was formed,
uh,
in the show,
I'm,
you know,
we both read some of the,
the Slayer Slang book and in the,
(11:34):
um,
introduction is written by Jane Espenson,
one of the writers from Buffy,
one of the great writers from Buffy who was probably there for at least half the series,
I believe she came in in season three.
Don't quote me on that.
I think so,
but we can fact check that.
(11:58):
But yeah,
so she,
she gives a great introduction to the book.
Um and really gives some great insights in how the language of Buffy was developed.
And basically,
it,
you know,
as we were saying,
it really at the heart of it comes down to Joss Whedon.
Um She was saying a lot of the words used is how he speaks.
(12:20):
One of the things that he would do is truncating words.
So like instead of saying necessary,
he'd say n um he'd also do a double negative.
So instead of saying this person is untalented or I'm sorry,
this person is talented,
he would say,
you know,
not untalented.
Um So that's definitely,
(12:40):
you know,
the,
where it all stems and starts from,
that's the seed of the language.
Um and the turn of phrase.
But so some ways that they would build on the language of Joss Sweden was creative Compounds.
An example would be chock full o sanity.
Um And then grammatically or phonetically complex lines.
(13:01):
Um Like this quote uh from Willow a doodle.
I do doodle.
You too.
You do doo doodle too.
I can't read that line without laughing.
It makes me laugh every time.
Um And then juxtaposing casual language with dramatic import.
So this is a line from um Double Meat Palace.
The beefy layer is definitely people,
(13:22):
probably not the chicky part,
but who knows?
Who knows?
Um So I thought that was great,
like,
insight into like how the language is built um that,
you know,
we just sort of all absorbed and didn't,
you know,
probably think about and um at a higher level,
like how it was all put together,
(13:43):
but I do think it's really interesting and you,
it's amazing how easy it is to pick up because I definitely found myself particularly when the show was on air and I was really hardcore into watching it doing that myself,
like adding,
you know,
I know the one of the other big things um is,
you know,
adding an E or an EY to a word,
(14:03):
adding a eg to a word.
So like going from Slay to Slay Edge,
um you know,
or that's um now,
I can't think of an eyay word that the show used.
Um And then there were,
you know,
that kind of stuff and I found myself doing that a lot,
um just automatically and even like the development of,
(14:24):
and again,
it sort of internally,
like the development of the,
of the words that they used and like,
started in season one when they were like,
trying to sort of brand who,
um,
willow and,
and Xander were to Buffy and the use of Slayer.
And then,
oh,
and the Slayer ATS,
(14:44):
which didn't really quite catch on because they ended up using Cordy and the quartets,
which made for better usage in terms of just communicating those things.
And so they had to drop sleets because it couldn't be sleets and quartets.
And then that's how we get the Scooby gang,
(15:04):
which we get the Scooby,
the Scooby Gang,
Scoob Scoops and all of that stuff which allowed for more like development,
like developmental of development of that language.
Um And the use of those terms.
Yeah.
And that,
that example is a great example too of how then tying into our season theme of pop culture,
(15:25):
how pop culture references then became part of their own,
became part of the vocabulary development.
So there were a couple of great examples like so Slayer Palooza.
Um So obviously,
you know,
most of us at the time,
we know what Lallapalooza was and obviously,
it still is going on today.
So you knew what that meant when they put it together.
And then another quote was from Xander.
(15:47):
Does anyone feel like we've been Kaiser so well.
So anyone who watched Usual Suspects would understand that reference and become like they've verified the name Kaiser.
So and then another example is the count of three isn't a plan,
it's Sesame Street.
So again,
we all like,
we grew up on Sesame Street,
like you get that and you get under,
(16:08):
you also get like the whole,
you know,
you,
there's the count character in Sesame Street and then there's the fact that like Sesame Street would be like,
it's brought to you by the letter A and the number one,
you know,
so like that,
all of that is built into that cultural references that then become part of the language and the vocab.
So it,
it codifies that sense of cultural community and identity even more.
(16:32):
Well and what and what a more fascinating and interesting way to say something like OK,
we're go,
which is something that you do in every TV show,
right?
It's like,
OK,
we're gonna do this on the count of 3123.
And usually the joke is like,
do we go on three or after three or we're like,
what?
Like that's usually the joke,
but it's like on the count of three,
(16:52):
that's not a plan.
It's Sesame Street.
Like that gives it such a more richer context because you know that that's just the basics like,
yes,
of course,
we know we're gonna go on the count of three like,
why would we not?
Because who goes on like unless you're a dancer,
you then you go on eight but you go on one or eight if you're a dancer.
(17:16):
But otherwise like everyone else goes on the count of three.
So why would you not?
Um So yeah,
it just,
it makes and again,
and it makes them sound smarter and more that almost sounded like a dumb sense.
It makes them smell more smart than they were.
Um But it makes them,
it,
(17:36):
it elevates their language more,
it makes them more informed and more aware and it separates them from being just these sort of vapid self abed teenagers,
right?
I think it also gives whatever the point is being made much more specificity that people like you get what that means,
(18:00):
like you get what that is like and you don't have to say it with a whole ton of language like we got there like when you say,
does anyone feel we've been Kaiser?
So say like,
you know,
that means we feel like we've been tricked like there's a,
we've been hacked and in a way that's so and in a way that is so specific that is so like specifically had not just like,
(18:22):
you know,
yeah,
not just a general ha just not a general trick.
Like if you've seen the movie and you know how,
what happens,
like you get what that means.
Um Yeah,
I know.
And then another thing that I also um read for one of the ways that they use language is to condense information.
(18:43):
Um So that you like we were saying like you don't have to go on and on it.
You got it in those,
you know,
few words or one sentence,
whatever it is a great example which I love I like and you understand this so perfectly is at the end of graduation day part two when Giles and Buffy are talking and all Buffy can say is fire bad tree pretty.
(19:03):
It's like you get it.
She is so burnt out.
Like has no more brain power like Giles,
we cannot discuss this right now.
I need to go home and take a nap for like the rest of the summer.
And you're like,
I totally get that.
I know exactly how she's feeling like I I need nothing else as there's like a fire burning like fire badge pretty pretty like that's it.
(19:25):
Like that's it.
Like these are the things in the shot.
I can acknowledge two things.
Um They also,
I just also interesting too.
Uh and I can't remember the article that I was reading but it,
it talks about the use of language with specific characters too and about the use of um it's a,
it was an article talking about people who had uh had done transcripts of the entire series and saying how uh the Cordelia used the word very more often than anyone else as very specifically in her language to give her sort of this cadence and this tone,
(20:07):
um,
that made her seem cooler or not very,
she used so sorry,
what's the word?
So she used the word so,
um to make her self sound,
you know,
different than everybody else.
Um,
where willow doesn't have that same,
same sort of lexicon.
But then as the show goes on,
Cordelia uses so less and Willow uses it much more.
(20:32):
Um And then the use and,
and just the use of British slang and terminologies and things like that with,
with uh Giles and,
and Spike.
But even Giles just using his word,
he's the one who uses very and quite much more often in his sentence structures than anybody else does.
Um And then of course they use both use bloody.
(20:54):
Um But you know,
well,
and going back to the point of so with Cordelia and then like you said,
the,
the shifting of her using a lesson Willow using it more when you take a step back and look at it,
this two letter word is being used to show confidence,
like Cordelia is a leader.
She knows her place like she,
she has a good sense of who she is overall.
(21:16):
And so,
you know,
that is a sense of like she knows what's going on.
She's gonna tell you what's cool,
what's not cool.
And then as she kind of shift away from being let being away from,
becomes less superficial,
excuse me.
And not that Willie becomes more superficial for her.
It means more confident that use of language starts to flip,
(21:38):
which is so fascinating.
I mean,
it's talk about like,
really understanding your show and your characters and having such a nuanced development that like even the simplest word as so can tell you so much.
Yeah,
it's really,
and I love this quote.
I have to read this quote from um from Slayer Slang because I just thought it was so amazing and it's um it's from Karen Eileen over and uh Lehan Preston motto,
(22:11):
uh I think I'm getting that correct.
Uh And it says Buffy is able to survive longer than any other Slayer because she is embedded in language and because she embodies language,
it is a very particular language with its own vernacular,
but it behaves like all language languages in that it creates,
it compiles,
(22:31):
it translates,
it follows well defined rules.
It draws on shared knowledge and it must be wielded with precision in order to be effective.
Any Slayer can brandish a weapon.
But for Buffy,
the Vampire Slayer,
the tongue is as pointed as the stake.
That's a great quote.
And I think that is no,
(22:52):
it nowhere is it more obvious than the Buffy bot particularly the start of season six and that she cannot use language the way Buffy does.
And that is like she may be decent at slang,
but it just,
that's why she's not Buffy.
We took her punning for granted.
(23:12):
So put that m what is that?
Put that MP menu in your pie plate?
Yes,
exactly.
So,
I love that.
That is so true.
I mean,
she's known for her punning.
She's known for her,
you know,
witty,
uh,
Slay remarks,
um,
(23:34):
which I love about her.
Yeah.
And it's,
and it's the thing that separate again.
It is the thing that sort of separates her because no other when we watch,
you know,
when we see Kendra,
when we see Faith Slay,
like they don't pun like Buffy,
puns like nobody puns like Buffy does.
Um no one can give you a Zinger right before they stake you like Buffy like Buffy can.
(23:58):
Um And so,
and then,
and I think,
and she,
and even Willis says,
I,
well,
they ask like,
well,
why is that so important?
Like,
what,
why do we need to bother with all of that?
And Willis says,
well,
I think it throws them off like I think it's,
it's the thing,
it's her secret weapon.
It's the thing that she like,
(24:19):
you know,
when you're fighting somebody and they're like,
you know,
throwing one liners at,
at you,
it's got to get in your head a little bit.
Yeah,
I think you could also make the argument that it shows her level of intellect not to say that,
you know,
Kendra and Faith are not smart.
But I think that's the one thing that helps Buffy,
(24:41):
that or that we come to see is why Buffy stands out as such a phenomenal Slayer is her ability to take that information and process it and really come up with some creative,
um you know,
ideas.
She has a really great sense of intuition and,
you know,
that's,
that's all part of like intellect and,
(25:03):
and taking your experience and processing it.
So I think elevating that through her language shows us um you know,
her intellectual abilities and that she's not just like the weapon that the counselor wants.
The council wants her to be where she just goes out like a robot slays comes back.
(25:24):
Um And that's why she is the amazing slayer that she is and why she comes up with all these ways to constantly defeat the big bads.
Um And then changes everything by the very end of the show.
Yeah,
I mean,
I it's interesting too that with like faith,
(25:44):
you know,
she is known,
you know,
I think she definitely has some language play there.
We don't see her obviously as much,
but it's interesting that she is given um that phrase five by five,
which if you haven't heard what it means,
it comes from um like really like transportation.
(26:07):
And I think it was also,
wasn't it the military?
But it basically was like on a scale from 1 to 5,
like communicating.
How well can you hear me through our communication means and if it's perfect,
it's five by five on a scale of 1 to 5,
it's five.
So we use five by five,
which is like a phrase that none of us had ever heard.
I mean,
(26:27):
unless maybe you had some connection to somebody older who used it.
But like,
they give it to this,
like,
young brassy woman and you're,
and it,
like you got,
but you got what it meant,
even if you didn't know where it came from,
like it was understood.
But I think it's fascinating to like,
give her the way they gave her like this very actually jargon from another,
(26:50):
another jargon from another workspace.
Um Another culture and give it to her and it's also like,
you know,
beyond her age and yet it totally works well,
I think,
you know,
and yeah,
so yes,
the five by five is,
it's about the clarity of the radio signal.
(27:13):
Yeah.
So it's a measure of scale of five points.
Um And then not,
not the dimensions of a square to clarify that.
But um but also,
and,
you know,
truckers use it a lot too and,
and CB speak.
So I think that that's how I imagine faith picks up on,
(27:35):
on that.
It's like her travels across the country is maybe she hitch,
hitchhiked with a,
with a trucker and heard the lingo,
you know,
again,
it's the jargon of,
of this,
the CB communication of radio communication that she probably picked up,
you know,
from,
you know,
doing a sailor or like,
you know,
or like,
(27:56):
or being with a trucker or something like that.
Um,
but,
and we do know what it is kind of like,
we,
we get it sort of,
but even the Scooby do,
um,
have to do some,
have some question about it and clarify and,
you know,
there's a time where she says,
oh,
well,
how are you?
And she's like,
I'm five by five and Buffy says,
I guess that means you are of the good of the good.
(28:19):
That is one I would like to use all the time.
And so again,
using this jargon that is now a slang for somebody else has to be explained to the audience using slang.
And a Buffy is that the audience is familiar with and that's just a whole like,
what are we doing?
Yeah.
(28:40):
Yeah.
And then even Willow goes like,
oh,
faith with her five by five.
What does that even mean?
She's so mad about it?
But funny now that we fully explain where that five by five comes.
When you think about it.
Actually,
it's like a genius phrase to give to her because like when you understand where it comes from,
like you said,
(29:01):
it gives you more into faith backstory without spelling it out,
right?
That this is a,
like faith is someone who has been,
who doesn't have a home who's been traveling around and even when she comes in the Sunnydale.
And it's very unclear if she has been slaying vampires before she became a slayer.
(29:23):
Or if she like,
or if in like the,
you know,
couple of months that she became a slayer and got her first,
like her first watcher came,
granted if Buffy can have an adventure every week,
so can faith.
So why,
like she has lots of stories and it's been several months,
it would be basically like a season,
(29:43):
like a half a season of slaying for faith.
She wasn't discovered as a potential before,
if she wasn't discovered beforehand.
So,
you know,
but there is a,
there's sort of a trans even just that one saying gives her like this transient feeling.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
(30:06):
Um Yeah,
it's so amazing.
It's so cool,
you know,
one thing um we could talk about and I don't remember much being said on,
on this topic about Buffy,
but I do remember everyone was saying this about Dawson's Creek,
um which premiered during the middle of Buffy's second season.
(30:26):
Um And,
and what they would say about the characters on Dawson's Creek,
the,
the teen characters is they talked at a level that didn't feel like any teen talked at,
it felt very dull.
They were talking in these,
you know,
on these big topics with these,
you know,
big vocabulary that just didn't feel like teenage speak.
And I think you could argue that about the Buffy teen characters.
(30:49):
I mean,
they certainly make,
you know,
not so much maybe in the specific actual words used,
but certainly all the references.
I mean,
yes,
there's the,
like normal teen pop culture references that you'd expect them to make.
Um,
but I think even like bigger ones towards,
you know,
literature or old movies that you would not necessarily expect to them and watch or other things.
(31:10):
And to me,
actually,
on both shows,
it never felt weird because it felt like that's the conversations like me and my high school friends were having because we were reading stuff and we were discussing politics because you had to for school and it also interested us.
So,
like,
all of that,
like,
quote unquote adult language or adult conversations never felt artificial even though they were being written by like men in their thirties and then,
(31:37):
you know,
or showrunners in their thirties along with their writers of varying ages that always actually felt real to me.
Like,
it never felt un teen.
Like,
how about,
I don't know how you felt well,
and I would say like,
one,
the first,
the first teen show that I ever watched where I felt like the language of the teens really worked and it really felt like,
(32:02):
oh,
ok,
you're not pandering.
What's my so called life?
Like that was the show that I saw that I was like,
00,
you get it.
And like,
and the weird thing about it is,
is that,
you know,
people have what,
uh what's it called when,
I don't know where it's where words and sounds tickle your brain or whatever.
(32:22):
Like,
there was something about the way that they spoke that excited me in a way that I had never been excited before because it was finally like,
oh,
yes,
you see me and you're talking,
like you're talking about the things that I want to talk about and you're expressing them in a way that I would tell my friend this way.
(32:43):
And actually,
oh,
I don't know how to express this to my friend,
but that's how I want to do it because that's exactly it.
And now I have language to use in order to communicate myself better,
which I think is an incredible,
like,
that's the power of great writing can do is that it can,
it can give voice to the voiceless.
(33:04):
It can,
it can fill in some of the gaps when you don't,
when you don't have,
you know,
the space for that when you don't have the,
the vocabulary or the experience for it.
But then here's someone your own age who is going through something similar that can,
that can fill that in for you.
Um,
and so yes,
and I agree.
And I watched Justin's Creek too and it never bothered me.
(33:24):
Um,
I actually really like that on that show.
Um,
you know,
it certainly didn't bother me on Buffy.
I just,
I've always thought that the language on Buffy has been,
um,
it's,
it's so great.
I mean,
I just think it's so,
um,
it's so smart in the first episode where,
(33:46):
you know,
where Buffy is like.
So,
what's the,
what's the sitch?
Um,
I think I've read that there are articles that Sarah Michelle Geller was,
like,
I don't know what this means.
Like,
I don't even know.
Can someone explain,
can someone explain this to me?
Yeah.
Well,
it's funny,
I was thinking,
um,
particularly when I read that about,
(34:06):
um,
one of the things that Jos Sweden would do is um,
truncating words.
So,
like I said,
would say ness instead of necessary.
And I was trying to think back because obviously we were like,
you know,
coming out of our teens into our twenties when Buffy was on.
And so like a few years before that we had been in high school and I was like,
honestly,
(34:26):
I don't remember a lot of our slang,
like from that time period,
like what teen speak is like,
but like thinking about going a few years forward into like the millennial slang.
That is one thing that like a lot of millennial slang does is that like truncating of words.
So it's really funny that like somebody who is,
(34:48):
I guess Jos Whedon is technically like,
what,
like the beginning of Gen X I think,
um,
maybe like a baby boomer.
I'm not sure exactly when,
when he was born um,
but it's just funny that,
like,
he was doing that and then not,
not saying that he influenced it.
It's just funny how I think what it shows you is that first off,
(35:09):
like,
generational definitions are pretty fluid.
Um,
and that the influence kind of goes back and forth.
Um,
but it is really interesting.
Do you remember,
like,
any flying from,
like when we were growing up?
The only thing I remember is from when I was in middle school and not was the big word.
(35:30):
So you'd be like,
oh,
I really want to go fishing with you this weekend.
Not.
And how quickly that got annoying to parents.
Like,
I remember things like,
oh,
that's bumping was a,
was a big thing when I was like in middle school living in,
in,
like in the DC area like that was bumping.
(35:50):
Um,
well,
and to say also,
like,
slang obviously is not universal across teenagers,
like regional race religion.
Like all of that plays an influence.
I'm trying to think of,
um,
gosh,
I really can't and now I want to,
I really want to,
like,
look and see.
(36:11):
Um I'm going to like,
try to do a quick,
oh,
you know what?
Actually,
I do remember one of the influences would be clueless.
I feel like,
um,
like,
whatever that was one thing we were doing and then the loser with the l like,
I feel like those are things and then like,
uh ride in the Crimson Wave.
(36:34):
I don't know,
it was used all that often.
Um,
but the other,
the other big influence I remember on,
like me and my friends again,
more going back to middle school was heathers.
We use like lines from heathers all the time.
Oh,
so yeah,
so like talk to the hand,
talk to the hand because the face don't want to hear it was one or,
(36:55):
oh,
that's the bomb or whatever.
I really home skillet.
What's up home skillet?
We used to say that.
Um,
you going right out to the crib?
Um,
I gotta bounce.
Uh,
oh,
that's so Crunk.
Crunk.
(37:15):
Um.
Oh,
snap.
Oh,
snap.
Oh,
snap.
Um,
what's another one?
Uh,
I,
yeah.
All right.
Uh,
buzz kill.
You're such a buzz kill.
Oh my gosh,
you're such a,
uh,
sup.
I gotta dip,
uh,
(37:37):
eat my shorts.
That Simpson.
Oh,
he's pretty fly,
pretty fly for a white guy and boo,
yah.
Um,
yeah,
those were some talk to the hand as if,
(37:58):
as if that was the one all the time,
whatever,
as if,
as if totally use that all the time.
Um,
which also shows you that speaks to what we were saying earlier about how fast slang,
uh,
runs hot and burns out.
(38:18):
Um,
which is ok because now hearing it,
it just feels cringy.
Oh,
or like you're straight tripping.
Oh,
what you say?
Like,
oh,
who's your daddy?
And like nineties slang?
Some nineties slang is just wildly.
Yeah.
Well,
it probably depends to,
(38:38):
like,
who is using it more.
I don't know if we heard so much of that stuff in high school.
At least our high school.
But so,
oh,
so Sue Me was another 10,
yeah.
I had forgotten about that one.
Um,
yeah.
Oh,
my goodness.
Yeah.
90 slang.
I mean,
(39:00):
doesn't it all sound like it's all crazy?
Yeah.
It all sounds crazy Like when you're not speaking it and when you're out of it,
um,
and now I'm at the age where if I'm using it,
it's,
it's over because I'm too old to be.
I still use it.
I don't care.
(39:21):
No,
I meant,
like,
the slang of the,
now,
if I'm,
if,
like,
now I'm using it,
it's over.
We're at that age.
I don't know what's on it now.
Like,
I keep looking up stuff on tiktok and I'm like,
there's a,
there's a teacher on the substitute teacher on tiktok who's like,
I guess,
like,
my students into thinking that these words are slight.
(39:45):
It's so funny and it's interesting because what he puts out,
like what he puts out there and how he's how he talks about how this word and what this means.
Like,
he really is sort of breaking down,
sort of like,
sort of a modern day etymology of how we would get,
how we would use this word as a new slang word except no one's using it.
(40:07):
But he just tells the students that and because he subs and goes to different schools,
he was like,
yeah.
Well,
I was just over at the high school last week and they use that all the time.
So I don't know what you talking about.
I love it.
So,
he's like,
basically making,
he's making slang happen,
making slang happen in the moment.
Well,
also gas lighting his students.
(40:30):
Oh,
my goodness,
jeez.
All right.
So I was wondering,
what do you think going back to our culture,
pop culture theme in the larger scheme of other television shows?
How Buffy falls with its development of its own language?
Like,
does it seem unique?
(40:51):
Does it still feel unique?
Um,
well,
I think it's still,
I think it still feels unique.
Um,
I don't,
I feel like when I watch,
when I go back and watch Buffy it,
I don't have that.
Like,
there's a sense that especially in season one,
(41:11):
season one definitely feels like it's over time.
Feels very much like this is the nineties,
like everything they do,
not only nineties but like specifically a certain group of in California,
right?
Um So yes.
(41:34):
So in that,
so in some senses,
yes,
I,
I think it does,
um,
it encapsulates sort of a time and a place very nicely that feels very nostalgic um,
in a good way for me and in other ways it just because the language is so specific because the jargon is so specific and because it,
(41:58):
it really turns into this sort of meta force where it's just like where it starts referencing itself over and over and over again,
it becomes so self referential that it contains it,
like the language is almost contained within the body of work itself.
Um And so that way it keeps,
(42:20):
it keeps sort of this like stasis for itself where it doesn't,
where they are referring to things that are outside of the universe.
But those things have already established themselves as being sort of timeless classic pop culture references.
Uh Yes.
So yes,
we absolutely can use this because those things are not going away anytime soon,
(42:42):
like we can refer to them as the Scooby because Scooby Doo has been around since the seventies and every kid has watched,
there's always an iteration of Scooby Doo running around somewhere somewhere in the universe.
So that's OK to use.
And I think that's one of the things that they were smart about was about using very specific pop culture references in the inclusion of the language so that it was always something that would be timeless.
(43:12):
I don't know if that was planned or not.
But yeah.
No,
that's a really good point.
Yeah,
I think you're right.
That's kind of why season one sticks out.
Like I'm thinking about the fact just in the pilot episode when Cordelia is quizzing Buffy and she's talking about like she has to get with James Spade.
And you're like,
whoa,
that's dated.
James Spader.
Like no one's getting.
Yeah.
Or James Spader.
(43:33):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um,
he has to call me.
Um,
yeah,
I mean,
that's very,
that's,
I mean,
honestly she's almost even 10 years out of date with that reference.
Like,
I would have used something more like Christian Slater or,
or,
yeah.
But yeah,
he's,
(43:53):
to me,
James Vader is like a heartthrob,
is more like eighties.
Um,
so it's funny that,
that it's already,
like dated.
Yeah,
that,
that reference in of itself is already dated and just that conversation probably,
maybe why,
like season one can be more,
it could be made that,
that also is partly why season one can be more of a struggle for people.
(44:15):
Um,
you know,
it has its moments but obviously it,
that does date it,
um,
which can make it hard to go back and,
and re-watch amongst some of the other,
um,
aspects of it that,
you know,
like,
what's that conversation that they have in the,
um,
in the locker room after they find that?
(44:37):
And she's like,
what,
like,
what's the sick?
Uh,
well,
the chatter and the calf is,
they found a dead guy in the body,
a dead guy in the locker.
Yeah.
Apparently more jos we didn't speak.
But the way the girls do it,
it comes off.
Very Valley girl.
Yes.
Yes.
(45:00):
When I started my rewatched this time around.
Yeah.
That felt so weird.
It was like,
oh,
this is jarring.
This feels like weird,
it feel out of place,
it feel so out of place because that's not,
that's not what we're doing here.
That's not the language that we're trying to,
we're trying to do.
So it does.
So I think especially those first few episodes feel very,
(45:22):
that first episode in particular.
But,
um,
you know,
there are other episodes in season one where everything just feels a,
feels a little bit forced and feels a little bit out of place.
But by season two,
definitely we have and even probably,
even earlier than that,
we really start to find a rhythm for the language.
(45:46):
Yeah.
Yeah.
That,
I mean,
the pilot really stands out like,
I it,
you don't feel as much of that out of sense of,
out of place with the language moving into the main part of the season compared to the pilot episode,
that's for sure.
And then it only gets better as this series goes on.
I was thinking in the larger cultural context as well,
(46:06):
you know,
comparing Buffy to other shows,
um,
in that how it develops and uses language feels fairly unique compared to other shows.
I mean,
I do think there are other shows out there that use,
you know,
language.
Well,
I'm not saying they're,
they don't.
But again,
this is really just speaking to things I've read and heard said by cultural critics,
(46:31):
um you know,
anything written about pop culture or television,
the two that I think of when it comes to being written about with,
about their language.
Buffy is one,
the other show is Deadwood.
Mm Again,
I,
you know,
and I'm sure you could probably speak to it.
Uh Mad Men as well.
(46:51):
But the way The Mad Men is,
I think it's a little bit different from the way these two shows are,
whereas these two shows are very much about the language and what is said and how the phrasing is done is so specific.
And so um technically developed that I just don't see in a lot of other shows,
(47:13):
even like other great dramas that have been developed,
you know,
it's not everything.
Yeah,
everything is so pedestrian.
I mean,
I think most,
most shows are very pedestrian when it comes,
comes to that.
Um You know,
I will,
I mean,
and this is a little outside of what you were talking about in terms of language.
(47:34):
But I would also,
I would also sort of argue that um genre shows do I think genre shows probably do better with the development of language?
Because they,
because they can lean on the jargon so much.
Um And so or other languages.
So when you're talking about something like Star Trek,
(47:56):
when you're talking about like Klingon,
where like where they developed like certain phrases for the show.
But because it became such a huge cultural hit and people were so interested in that,
that like this whole language developed out of,
you know,
small phrases or when you're looking at um Game of Thrones where they had like an entire language built,
(48:21):
you know,
and developed for that series before they started,
which had to have like its rules and it's,
you know,
verb tenses and all of that stuff written out before they,
you know,
when they were working on the script.
So,
um well,
I think another example too,
not that they create their own language but um would be the um remake of Battlestar Galactica.
(48:44):
And you think about like Frack and you know,
they,
again,
you're right,
like that,
that sci fi,
that genre,
that supernatural um those supernatural shows by nature of the content and uh probably leaning heavier into the jargon and the flying development.
And I think like two things that just sort of popped into my head would be like uh Seinfeld with the use of yada yada yada,
(49:12):
like pushing that as,
as slang or friends.
Could you be any more annoying like that sort of like again and,
and a lot of that has nothing to do with,
I mean,
yes,
that's a slight a phrase or whatever,
but it is also more about the actor delivery of those lines that make to those that makes,
(49:34):
which is a,
so then you're talking about catchphrases,
right?
Which is a completely different thing like someone having a catch phrase,
which is what you get in sitcoms,
which is so much more different than having an entire lexicon of,
of language.
You know what you're talking about,
Willis.
Like that's,
you know,
you get those things,
you get those nuggets which then get used over and over and over again to sort of like a nauseam for the,
(50:00):
for the punch line of the joke as opposed to creating an entire language that you can take the punch line,
you see it coming and then flip it on its head to something else.
Um Yeah,
I mean,
it's,
I know we talk about this,
we love the show so we like,
love almost everything about it.
But I really the language I think again,
(50:20):
just it's what helps keep the show alive and why people keep coming back to it because it is such a unique feature of a television show that you don't see happening in a lot of other television shows,
even great genre supernatural sci fi shows.
Um OK,
I thought it would be a little fun to wrap up with.
(50:42):
I found a reddit thread from a couple of years ago where somebody asked like,
if you watch Buffy in a different language in your country,
how does the title translates it?
It's really funny.
So the first one,
the person who posted the question said,
um I don't know where she's from originally but said they had moved to Germany and couldn't help giggle at the title which translate as Buffy in the Bewitchment of the Demons and the Bewitchment of the Demon.
(51:15):
OK.
Um And then she uh 00 and then apparently wherever this person comes from,
which they didn't say what their home country is.
The title translates to Buffy Against the Vampires,
which that's not a bad translation against the Vampires.
Yeah.
Um So a person from Norway said that this is not an exact translation.
(51:35):
This is as poetic as they could put it.
But apparently if you translate the Norwegian title to English,
it's Buffy Nightmare of The Vampires,
which I was like,
that's pretty good.
Um,
as,
as the person said,
it works well with the line.
I'm the thing,
Monsters have nightmares about,
um,
in Sweden,
it was Buffy and the Vampires.
(51:57):
Buffy and the Vampires.
It's like a band.
That's exactly what it sounds like a band name.
It's like J and the Pussycat in Poland.
It translated as Buffy Collin Boogeyman for the Vampires.
She's like doing dance competitions for him.
Yeah.
Um,
this person didn't say what country they were in but it,
(52:18):
their translation is Buffy,
The Hunter of Vampires.
So it's funny we went back to like vampire hunters which,
uh,
is more common.
It doesn't give it that like uniqueness that Slayer does.
Um,
oh,
I like this one in Hungary.
They were like,
it's something like Buffy,
the bane of vampires.
I like that too,
(52:39):
which is great.
I think that might be my favorite one.
So hungry.
Um,
I like Buffy and the Vampires.
Buffy and the Vampires.
That great band name.
Yeah,
it's like Jim and the Holograms or something.
Exactly.
Susie and the Banshee.
(52:59):
Awesome.
Well,
thank you.
Thanks everyone for tuning in.
We hope you enjoyed this discussion.
Obviously,
we certainly did.
Um,
we went out for a while on that one who knew there'd be so much to say about words.
Um,
that was a sort of intended pun um if it counts as a pun.
(53:19):
Um But yeah,
thanks so much and we hope you enjoyed the episode and we'd love it if you would rate and review us wherever you listen to your podcast and let us know what's your thoughts on,
um,
you know,
on language if listen.
Uh because I know we do have some listeners in other countries.
Um So we would love to hear your thoughts on what um how things translate and how things sound um on different languages.
(53:43):
And you can always reach us on our socials on our Instagram,
which is at a Buffy podcast on Instagram and on Facebook.
Or you can email us at a Buffy pie,
a Buffy podcast at gmail.com.
All right.
Well,
thanks so much and we'll see you next week.
(54:05):
All right,
thanks a lot.
Thanks.
Bye.
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