Unraveling the History and Resilience of the Taino People

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Music.

(00:06):
Gwan, everybody, welcome to the Dis Afami History podcast,
where we'll be speaking about history and as well family history and how history
relates in terms of Caribbean people for the present as well as in the past.
And how in the past, what that does and brings forward for what we are going

(00:27):
through at present and what we can learn from our history, from our family and
take that moving forward.
So I do hope you enjoy the podcast. And if you like it, please ensure to subscribe, like, and review.
Thank you. In today's episode, Wendy Aris has the honor of speaking with Chief
Kalan Nibonrix Kaiman of the Jamaican Hummingbird Taino people.

(00:51):
Join us for an inspiring discussion about the Jamaican Taino community,
their remarkable resilience and unwavering perseverance.
Let's dive into this enriching conversation. So let's have a listen.
Thank you so much, Kelan, for coming on to the podcast,
Dysaphomy History, and to speak about the Tainos in Jamaica,

(01:14):
and that they have not been a group of people that have been destroyed or no longer exist.
So before we start, can I just have you introduce yourself and then we'll start.

(01:43):
Greetings, good day, my relatives, and my sister.
My Taino name is Nibon Rish Kaiman. You can call me Kalan, Chief of the Jamaican
Hummingbird Taino People. and today we are here to honor those who came before
us and those who will come after us, the future generations.
Kahom, thank you for this opportunity to share our story.

(02:07):
No, absolutely. Thank you, Kalan. And can you just be able to, you know, we'll start.
So can you be able to walk us through your ancestry to the Taino indigenous people on Jamaica?
Yes. So for me personally,
And I'll share this from a first-person perspective so that others that have

(02:29):
similar experiences can understand
that there are ways and means of coming to a similar conclusion.
First of all, within my family, as a child growing up, we were very community-based.
My grandfather worked in construction and you know we would live in these houses

(02:54):
that he would build and then he would build another one and we moved to somewhere else you know,
we're hopping around but we're always hopping around in the same areas.
And we grew up in but I grew up in St.
Andrew and you know that's another contention because But people say that I

(03:15):
come from Kingston and I also sent Andrew because, you know,
my experiences growing up is running cows,
neighbors cows out of the yard and going into open fields and picking fruits.
You know, it was a very different experience and it was one that I assumed was the norm for everyone.
And, you know, as you meet more in your age range, going to school,

(03:37):
you may have friends that may come over.
You may visit them in their home situation. That is the first glance that some things are different.
You know, it's the first realization that there are differences in culture.
There are differences in households and how they're operated.

(03:59):
And when that came to the forefront for me as an individual,
you know, I started to ask questions.
Now, in my family, when those questions came up, whatever was not known to be
European was assumed to be African, right?
That's just what happened. And there was an older generation in the family that.

(04:26):
They didn't speak so freely of things that were not European.
You know, there were sayings like, during the summertime, go inside,
you know, you'll lose your color, you know, statements.
So there were a lot of wounds coming up, internal wounds as it related to identity

(04:46):
and how we're perceived and how we viewed ourselves.
And that changed when I was in my late teens,
early 20s, and I met someone who was a white passing individual with Jamaican
ancestry that came here to learn more about his father's line.

(05:10):
But he came with teachings from peru and
he took me on as an
apprentice and was teaching me these teachings from peru you
know these indian people now my entire life growing
up as i said you know i i when it came to cowboys and indians i had an affinity
for native america you know parents would buy me bow and arrows and headdress

(05:34):
and you know it it was something that the narrative was different for me.
I always wondered why would they attack these people? Why do they want to take their lands?
At an early age, I was aware of what was happening and this programming and making this seem fine.
I was aware that what Indiana Jones was doing was wrong, which not many would have seen it this way.

(06:02):
And after I learned these things from him, I felt a little grounded.
I honored the Taino people of Jamaica. At that point, I didn't know there was
any connection for myself and my family.
And learning traditions from South America, there are similarities.
You know, they're talking about woodpeckers. They were talking about the hummingbird.
They were talking about the crocodile, which are things that are here.

(06:25):
That going to the regular school system, we're not taught to value these things.
We're not taught to of value are coney and the few that exist you know not many
were lamenting what happened to our iguanas this this was just not normal outside
of my household family discussions.
And the next phase in my life was when I was introduced, because I was now trained

(06:50):
in this, you know, healing modality.
I was invited to an Akan shrine house, Sankofia House of Journeys.
And while there, they shared with me about the Peace and Dignity Journeys,
which is an intertribal prayer run. And that is really what shifted things for me.
Every four years since 1992, there's an intertribal prayer run that takes place
where Native Americans from Alaska.

(07:13):
All the way down to Argentina connect and they
share in ceremony and a community runs from
the north to a central space designated and
from the south to the central space and they're hosted by different communities
so this is kind of that reconnection that
is taking place and I was invited to represent the
Jamaican Taino so I had to do you know research so

(07:34):
now this is reading up what colonizers wrote
and and i have to thank boyanani dr leslie
gale atkinson swaby jamaican homegrown identifies
as taino and maroon who has a book
the earliest inhabitants and it spoke about you
know taino spaces in saint andrew that i

(07:55):
had recollection of you know
i remember going to school and my classmates saying
to me that you know that they found a skull
in the yard and and how them parents destroyed
because they thought it was over and then to read in
Leslie Gale's book that they were actually on
a Taino site and being able to map

(08:17):
the two experiences together and I'm
saying wow this has been hovering around me for quite some time so when I was
learning certain practices now connected to Taino tradition and how I'd have
to carry myself representing Jamaica I was doing this training around my grandmother
and she said to me that you know you you're doing things that my father used to do.

(08:40):
And I said what and she say yes you know I'm used
to same as my own engine or my own coolie and
I was shocked because I've never heard that spoken of in
the family before and when I asked her why am
I only hearing of this now that is when she shared that the maternal
side of the family they they grew

(09:02):
up to believe that maroon or indian they
weren't good people and for that reason that
wasn't something to speak of and whatever programming she received she told
her father even though she was you know laughing when she said it to him when
she explained the story to me as a child she told him not to share that with

(09:23):
anyone and to never say that again and he respected that and we had no clue we
know nothing more about that part of the family other than his mother,
spent some time in cuba before we heard she was born in cuba what we get to
learn that you know she was born here and went to cuba and worked there with the church.
And, you know, that shifted things for me internally because now this became

(09:47):
a personal journey, not just, you know, me honoring the people that were here.
But now, what can I learn about myself?
What can I learn about my family? And while on the journey, I met with the Caribbean
contingent, you know, people from Puerto Rico, Borinquen, people from Dominican
Republic, Quisqueya, IT, people from Cuba.

(10:09):
And now you know I'm sharing with people
that are Cuba Taino descendants that you know I have ancestry
from Cuba too and they're saying yeah you know or people went from Jamaica to
Cuba you know that that happened and hearing the stories of how you know there
were cave systems when the British came and you know how the story between Cuba

(10:29):
and Jamaica is different from the other islands that
there were places where, you know, there were Spanish men that intermarried with Taino women.
And when the British came, they tried to hide these families and hide these
communities in fishing villages.
And it was such an emotional shift for me that here I am traveling throughout

(10:54):
the Americas thinking I'm doing something,
you know, to help others when it was really a lot of help for myself and my family.
And to summarize what happened next is when I returned home with this information
and I started to share with them,

(11:14):
you know, like going through the family tree and where this person came from
and started to record the stories from my grandmother.
The funny thing that happened is sharing it with my paternal side,
my father's mother, my grandmother, my paternal side started to share stories too.
So I was like wait and she's now sharing that yes you know her her grandmother's

(11:40):
name was Yaya and how she looked and how long her hair was and you know she
said yes you know she was Indian I said East Indian and she said no we don't
have any East Indian in my family they're from Jamaica,
and it created a shift in our family because now these were things that my parents
didn't know about and everybody was welcoming and accepting and.

(12:05):
Started to make sense of some of the things that we do you know our family is
a family of of dreamers on my mother's side so my
mother my grandmother and my aunt
and grandaunts like the woman on a whole in the family whenever there's
someone has a a dream everyone would gather
and talk about the dream and discuss and and interpret

(12:25):
it and and come to conclusions and who
the dream is for and what the dream means you know
I thought this was normal in every household
and it connected when I
was there with our other Caribbean contingent families
so we're at today
for my family is that we know that we have Maroon ancestry we know that we have

(12:52):
Taino ancestry we know that we have some Taino and Native American retention
in some of our cultural practices and how we deal with dreams,
how we deal with the ancestors.
And from that, we have been able to connect with others on the island that share similar stories.

(13:15):
You know, there's a terminology that one of our council members has shared in a paper, blood memory.
It is an interesting thing when we get together and we're talking about dreams
and everybody's like oh i've had that experience too yes this this dream or
this experience where you're on the coast and you see these ships coming in
and you know and i'm like wow so.

(13:36):
Hmm, there are these powerful experiences that have connected us and this journey
of understanding who we are and bringing that pride to our ancestry.
Since then, we have accounts that has come together and we have restarted our
tiny community, bringing everyone back together and sharing stories,

(13:58):
sharing about the language resurgence.
And what has happened is that we have community members was that they found
out they're related you know they don't know each other but through looking
into this tiny ancestry you know there are certain surnames that come up certain
places that come up St Mary,
St Anne, St Elizabeth and the connections are being made and you know I'm happy

(14:24):
that these shifts are happening not only in my family but extending to others as well.
No absolutely and And it seems to me like that, you know, based on what you
just said, is that there's been, I guess, certain things that have followed
you your whole life until it all came together.
And then with your light now being further flamed, it allowed others to be able

(14:48):
to tell their story as well, which has been, you know, that's kind of,
it's kind of humbling as well to be able to be a part of that.
And so what are some of the, I guess, the key cultural practices and traditions
and beliefs that have been preserved within the Jamaican Taino community?
Okay, well, alright. So the Taina community, I like to look at it in two subgroups.

(15:12):
So there are the fishing villages that are on the coast, and there are those
that are in the interior, in the mountain spaces.
So there are some that identify as Maroon in the sense of they're not treaty communities.
And there are the treaty communities of
Maroons as well that they have individuals that

(15:35):
kind of live distant from the
rest of the community and they know them to be you know the indigenous Indian
Taino people and amongst the communities on the fishing course the majority
of the practices are related to fishing it is related to canoe making or however

(15:55):
elder that you know he has his
father's ads and he holds a tradition of
woodwork and making these dugout canoes
he will have what the archaeologists call
the Antillian Z fish trap we in Jamaica does
not have much fish but that is coming from that tiny
tradition it there's our people are

(16:16):
our farmers so in the mountains overall they
are farming practices how we observe the cycles of
the moon how we operate with our calendar when do we plan when
do we reap there's even folklore around our practices so
one of our staple foods is yucca which is cassava
the teaching is that you don't smoke tobacco when you are planting cassava the

(16:37):
cassava will become bitter you know and i've i've learned that from various
communities as well so there are there are these different things that maintain
there is basket weaving.
There is in some communities hammock making, there is.
The food of Bami. You know, that's a kind of practice as well.

(17:01):
There is other folklore around trees, like the trumpet tree.
You know, we know that the leaves
of the trumpet tree indicate the weather conditions that will be coming.
This folklore is contained in some of our communities, like Woodside and a lot throughout the island.
And some has become widespread, like the concept of the doctor bird,

(17:22):
doctor bird being a cunning bird. You know, Dr. Bud Akonibud, hard bud for dead.
You know, that song and that concept of it being the god bird is from Thai tradition.
There are stories behind why it's considered the god bird, the resilience that
this bird has and its intelligence is connected to our people.
There are still elders that they are growing tobacco for medicinal purposes

(17:45):
and they're growing a traditional way and they're drying it with other medicinal herbs.
So it's it's a
surprising thing when you open that
door and at first for
most because we're disconnected you feel like
you know you're the only one in the space like you're the you're the last yes

(18:09):
and then you realize that there's so much preserved and there's so much going
on i mean we'll have our sacred sites and all of our sacred sites and when most
most of our sacred sites and sacred caves have a caretaker.
Like naturally, there are families in these communities that they understand
that their job is to take care of these spaces, take care of these petroglyphs,

(18:30):
take care of these sites, take care of these rivers, and they give offerings there.
So there's a continuation of these practices now that we're coming together.
It's not that we're trying to recreate or we're trying to, you know,
read records from the 1300s or the 1400s and pretend like we're coming out of
a time machine. These things are here.

(18:50):
And that's why I tell our community members that they have to honor their grandparents.
They have to honor their parents. Because the narrative of our existence and
continuity is what they have preserved and brought forward. It is not in the history books.
Right? How our people survived in Jamaica is one. It was by hiding.

(19:12):
So everybody wonders, why is it that we're just popping up now?
Know because there are systems in place and there's an opportunity for us to
have our rights there's an elder that we have in in green island that you know
his family is caretakers of a cave that actually has a cacique's bones it has
calcified into the cave so it cannot be removed,

(19:35):
And he has this fear of sharing about that space because we don't have our rights,
that the government or others are going to want to come and take over the space and take over the space.
Already, archaeologists have come from universities overseas.
They've gone through, they've found pottery and different things.
They said they're going to write upon it. They don't include where they found

(19:56):
the things, any of that. They leave, they go back to the States,
and he has no connection with them. He can't hear from them.
You know, young students doing their thesis. places.
So we've had these experiences.
We carry that trauma of attempted genocide on our people.
So of course, we're not going to want to just come out and tell everybody, here we are.
You know, when we hear the response from the public, oh, is he only representing 10 people?

(20:20):
The thought that pops up in one of my council members' heads when they heard
that is, are they going to try to wipe out who they think is these 10 people now to put this to rest?
So we are very protective of our
community we're very protective of our families
we're very protective of our practices what we do now is we do have celebrations

(20:42):
that the public can participate in where we share more of our concepts our cosmology
how we connect with the environment the value in that is for the younger generations
because you know with all that is taking place with climate change,
a return to ancestral ways of balance that existed here for centuries is important.

(21:03):
And we know that that onus is on us to speak up.
When we see our generation, we have seen too many things happening,
you know, that the summers are getting hotter and the dry seasons are getting longer.
It would have been very difficult for us to not step up and speak and share

(21:24):
what we know and to protect these spaces with the international laws that exist.
So we're trying to preserve our sustainable farming practices or fishing practices,
our connection with the environment and these sacred animals.
There was a narrative that iguanas were
extinct so we use them as one of our mascots too and there

(21:48):
has been a rehabilitation program with Hope Zoo Foundation
and you know the iguanas are
coming back in Jamaica and we say you know like oh like
like the iguanas they said we were extinct too right and
the iguanas hold this special function because the seeds that an iguana consumes
when it passes through the iguanas body those grow faster and are more fertilized

(22:15):
than the regular seeds even when using you know these external.
Fertilizers, it helps to repopulate our forests.
So we all have a role to play and that is an important part of the practices
that we preserve and looking to share with the rest of Jamaica.

(22:36):
No, thank you for that because it is something to protect and just as you had indicated in terms of,
students coming over and doing their thesis and doing their archaeological digs
and just taking things that are actually tangible that are part of your heritage,
and then never to be able to see them again.

(22:56):
So, you know, absolutely to be able
to, I guess, to protect and to be very cautious, you know, of your group.
So would you be able to discuss, I guess, some of the challenges,
and I guess maybe that might be some of it, or obstacles that the Jamaican-Tayano
people have faced in preserving and promoting their cultural heritage?

(23:19):
Well, the most obvious one is that we don't have Indigenous rights in Germany.
Okay. And I appreciate this opportunity to speak to us and clarify.
The assumption based on things happening in the world today is that when an
Indigenous group speaks about Indigenous rights, that they're only talking about

(23:43):
land. It is more than land.
The land is a central space that people are rooted and connected in and through
the land that's a space now where they can preserve their practices for future generations.
Communal land and living together and all that is very important. But.

(24:03):
Our indigenous rights deals with our cultural practices, deals with our spiritual practices.
We see feathers are sacred, feathers of certain birds that in our cosmology,
they're sort of closest to creator.
So it represents for us a connection to creator and our prayers being carried and lifted.

(24:23):
There are systems that the average Jamaican has to go through to grow tobacco. one.
Most of the traditional Taino individuals that I know that grow that are not
operating through those systems because it's just something that their father
taught them and they pass it down for generations.
You just know that these things going to be dried in a shed when you need medicine

(24:47):
or cleansing or you need to offer prayers that's something that you do.
We have a ridiculous Oviola in the books that mentions feathers and herbs and
plants that though not enforced, it still exists.
And there is concern and worry about us when we're gathering,
when we're blowing our conch shells, when we're honoring the sun,

(25:09):
we're honoring the day, we're honoring the moon, we're giving thanks to a good harvest.
All of these things are impacted upon based on the programming and the systems that exist today.
So all of that troubles are our rights the the
fact that in our communities there is
normally an elder woman who deals with home births the laws state that mother

(25:35):
cannot have a home birth for her first or her tenth child and the system that
exists today is really let me rephrase that let me not say the system.
The education for young doctors is around ensuring that when it comes to the birth of children,

(26:01):
for the mother and for them, they have less issues and the system that they
have designated as one for less issues is a C-section. a surgery.
I've heard the same being said amongst these practitioners that,

(26:24):
you know, it's a simple cut and they can be home in time for dinner, right?
That infringes upon the rights of our people and our cultural practices,
you know, that honoring of the placenta, that honoring of the navel string,
like there are generations who they don't know what that is like and they I will not have that.

(26:45):
So it's not just about the land.
It is about our identity.
We don't have the rights of indigenous people.
They say that we are viewed as indigenous culture and not people.
So that means we don't have the basic human rights to our practices,

(27:06):
to our religious beliefs,
to our ceremonies to have our elder
officiate or our union ceremonies
you know marriage between our people our rites of passage
to have our young ones pulled out of school for their rites of passage like
these things may not seem important but it is integral in understanding our

(27:27):
connection to the land and the spaces and who we are and all of these are impacted
by the fact that we do not have our rights?
No, definitely that anything pertaining to the law to ensure that you have your
rights is absolutely important.
So going on to that, so what are some of the ongoing efforts or initiatives

(27:51):
aimed at reclaiming and revitalizing the Tayano traditions and knowledge among
the Jamaican Tayano community?
Well, the first is that, you know, I'm so happy that Ancestors blessed us with
the Council of Elders and we have a connection with the international Taino
community and through these avenues and these channels we are able to consolidate

(28:14):
and archive a lot of the knowledge and information that we have.
There are things that should be obvious but they aren't and it's just because.
This knowledge wasn't being disseminated, you know, our ancestors and elders.
And when I say ancestors and elders, just for those listening,
I'm not talking about the 1400s.
I'm talking about grandparents and great-grandparents.

(28:36):
They had to hold on to some of this knowledge and hide it.
I mean, we have records of some of our elders that would step up and claim,
in those days, the terminology used was Arawak.
And they were ridiculed, you know. know they they
lost opportunities for business or
to own real estate or spaces based on

(28:57):
this sharing that they have done and
their complexion so in
the times that we're living now you know we have
an opportunity to step forward we have an opportunity i give
thanks that we have council members like tekina eri in a rule that is a professor
at university of ontario and she has scholarship for young Tainoa and black

(29:23):
students that want to continue their studies in education.
We give thanks for Tekina Katia Toa, Diane Prankt-Golding, that she's currently
the head of the Archaeological Society of Jamaica and one of our main genealogists.
We give thanks for Bajita Siba Inaru, one of our elders that specializes in

(29:50):
stones and crystals and she's able to share.
Most people when they talk about healing and the nature and the environment,
they talk about plants, but our traditions use stones as well and she carries
that tradition and she speaks towards that tradition.
So through these individuals recognized in their own right and these work that
they are doing, all of us coming together, we have an avenue to share with the

(30:12):
next generation and to share with the public.
We have sent a report to the Committee on Elimination of Racial Discrimination in 2022,
and the recommendations of the United Nations Committee is that the government
sit down and have discussions with us and the maroons,
and also that the members of society that are self-identifying as Taino,

(30:36):
that the government seeks to deal with us and acknowledge that.
You know it's not something for them
to try for us now
after all of this time of being ignored and rejected
to prove who we are what
we're asking is to preserve what we have and who
we are and our spaces that is

(30:58):
the ask so there's that there is last year went to the Inter-American Commission
on Human Rights and there as well we made our requests and our petition known
for indigenous rights of Taino and Maroon in Jamaica.
We are working at a level with the Ministry of Culture, pushing for support

(31:24):
on our activities so that we can share more with our community members and those interested.
We've connected with the History Association and there are some schools that
we may go and share with as well.
And then, of course, others like yourself that give us a platform to get our message out.

(31:44):
Most recently, I was sharing at University of Rhode Island in Boston and Northeast
University through a collaboration with both of them, Catherine
John of URI and Chris Mangiapra of.
Northeast and there was also a manship artist residency where

(32:06):
we worked on solutions to preserve and promote the
culture of one of our communities woodside community there is
there's a lot of things that we're doing and we really appreciate that support
we'll have our big celebration coming up our new year celebration in may 26
so we'll share you know the fundraise and the stuff for that this one is on

(32:27):
a sunday so can get more support more people can come out and that's up Woodside,
one of our sacred sites that has three national heritage sites there.
So it's really about that awareness and getting it out there,
archiving information.
Another success for us most recently, March this year, we were included in the

(32:53):
launch of an Indigenous Studies Cluster,
the The University of the West Indies was asked to, you know, be a part of that.
And MinorityRights.org, we were able to update the profile that they have on
Jamaica to include the Yamantayino as indigenous people.
And to speak about, hasn't it, our background, our profile and our current issues,

(33:18):
you know, where we're living people in the present, not just the issues that our ancestors face.
So a lot of the narrative is being changed to the present.
And I also co-authored a paper with Peter Siegel and Dr.
Professor Zachary Baird on another one of our thinocytes, white marl.
And that one is an archaeological paper.

(33:40):
So if you Google white marl and Cacica Callan or Peter Siegel, that one will come up.
And it is talking about white maltaina
site and its relevance throughout the centuries
for different groups and how
we're honoring and the work that we have to do and issues
that we have with even preserving that site as well because if

(34:02):
we're not people and we don't have the rights of
indigenous people then we can't
claim our ancestors when people find them we can't say
that we want them to be buried in an honorable way you
know there are so many implications that comes
from that and these are things that we want
to correct to shift but we want our

(34:24):
voice to be included and when there
are discussions or decisions around lands that everyone knows
them to be Taina lands it's on records and you know because we have not been
formally using these spaces because we don't have those rights they don't seek
or free our prior informed consent before any activities so we may just turn

(34:47):
up one day and the site is gone you know.
So we're becoming more vocal and galvanizing international support.
Our community sits on the Council of Indigenous, Caribbean Organization of Indigenous Peoples.
We've created the Yame Council of Indigenous Leaders with ourselves and the

(35:07):
Wynwood Maroons here in Jamaica doing advocacy.
And myself individually, I'm a part of the Council of Indigenous Traditional
Healers of the Americas. And, you know, they are each organization,
each group helps us with a different level of advocacy.
So we talked about health and medicine and birth practices that would fall under

(35:30):
the accounts of indigenous traditional healers of the Americas.
You know, they would amplify that message.
There is a quarterly magazine that they put out.
Right now it's in Spanish. So I have to translate everything that I write to
Spanish. But it's an opportunity to get out to Latin America,
some of our tie-in ways here in Jamaica, how we view moon cycles, etc.

(35:52):
And happy for the waves that we've been able to make and maintain.
Absolutely. I mean, you're not only connecting to the local Jamaican community,
but as well to the broader community within the region itself.
So to amplify what you are about to in terms of having your Indigenous rights

(36:14):
acknowledged and put into law in Jamaica.
So, again, would you be able to, I guess, share any other personal or community
experiences that highlight, again, the resilience and the vitality of the Tayano
culture among the Jamaican Tayano today?
Oh, repeat that question? Like, would you be able to share any personal or community

(36:35):
experiences that highlight the resilience and vitality of Tayano culture among Jamaican Tayano today?
Oh, yes. All right. So one of the things, obviously, that I was sharing before
that I'm very proud of is that when...
When we did some research and we were looking online for Jamaica and Taino,

(36:58):
or looking up on Jamaica, we found MinorityRights.org website.
And the narrative, which is the same for so many places, had our people in the past.
Yes. You know, this narrative of extinction.
And I guess it was ancestors' guidance because I told our council member that
we need to write to them and let them know that we are here.

(37:22):
We need to mention the work that we have been doing and we need to push to have this changed.
You know, it is time now that we write our story because what they have on their
website was referenced by the Organization of American States and most university
students when they're searching, you know, that's one of the websites that would come up.

(37:43):
And though it took almost a year, you know, March this year,
we were successful in having that change.
So now when people ask, oh, we want some info on your Rwanda profile,
we can send them to MinorityRights.org.
And there it details the profile, it details the background,
the background from our perspective.

(38:05):
The background says that our island was the first island that Columbus and his
people released, the Bull Mastiffs.
That was the moment that people ran into the mountains from the shores.
Or a narrative which speaks towards that intermarriage with the Spanish as well.
And these coastal villages and those who, to protect themselves and to hide,

(38:28):
they claim to be of Spanish descent instead of Taino because there was an exotic slave trade.
Which we have community members who would share with you that their great-grandmother
says this is something that is not that long ago.
Is in england because
you know there were offers made

(38:50):
for better life or this or that or whatever
it may be by a suitor and ended
up over there and had to start over from
scratch the promises were not kept these things have
been happening for quite some time so we are happy that we're able had that
opportunity to share our message and to share our story and to get that out

(39:11):
there The next thing that we're happy about that our community has been doing
here locally is that this year would make, for May 26,
the fifth year that we've had our Taino New Year celebration.
And it has been getting stronger and stronger support from grassroots,

(39:33):
those giving to the fundraiser.
We got support from the Ministry of Culture last year and from private entities.
We've been able to have activities at our white mile site as well.
Two celebrations each year supported by Water Resource Authority and Hope Zoo.
We have been able to solidify for our community through my duality and our chieftainess.

(40:00):
She was successful with a group that got a project done with the University
of Edinburgh and got a grant.
And what it was about is climate justice or climate mitigation through ancestral
gardens so a book is going to be created and website on one of our our sites
and the whole emphasis on it is how through these ancestral farming practices and

(40:25):
growing these ancestral foods the Taino foods of the island how we can contribute to.
Correcting climate change in these small ways and
as a result of that work that she has done she was
nominated to join a global research
co-researcher expo or conference

(40:47):
in edinburgh scotland so you
know we should be going there end of may and that's
another opportunity to network and to connect with others and
to get that awareness out and i guess the based on
your platform the creme de la creme is that we
have been working on something with harvard
for quite some time and that should come out later this year

(41:09):
so their harvard's
lab has genome-wide testing that has been used to extrapolate additional information
or detailed information on the ancestors or first peoples of spanish-speaking
caribbean and i can successfully say that

(41:29):
they had 22 successful samples from Jamaica and the data,
the information is already being extracted.
So by the end of this year or before the end of this year, there will be a paper
on the Taino people, ancient Taino people of Jamaica.

(41:50):
And that genome, that DNA sequence will be available for others to map to.
So they can definitively say that they are Taino descendants of Jamaica.
Absolutely. That's great. That is probably validation as well.

(42:10):
Because as you said, a lot of the Taino people had to hide, had to cover that,
you know, deny their culture in order to survive to this day. Right.
So and I guess I know that you've mentioned a couple of things in regards to
the Italian perspective.
Would there be any other way in which the Taino perspective and voices contribute

(42:33):
to the discussion about Indigenous rights, environmental stewardship,
and cultural diversity in Jamaica?
Yes, my dear. So as it relates to Indigenous rights, you know,
if you've noticed when I share about any advocacy work that we're doing,
I always include the Maroons. Maroons are our relatives.

(42:54):
And when I say relatives, I don't mean like distant cousins.
I mean, brothers and sisters, blood relatives.
If you want to look at it one way, you can say that the people in the mountains
are the Maroons and the people on the coast, you know, you just refer to as the Amitai.
And due to that fact whatever it

(43:16):
is that we're doing we ensure that the doors open and
they have access and they have their own keys not something that
they have to require us or they have to
be subservient to us or any of that they have these rights as well so we're
working on that and we're pushing for that together you know there are atrocities
that take place in their communities And a lot of it is from misinformation

(43:40):
and lack of understanding.
And there really needs to be a cultural sensitivity course as a part of our
indigenous rights and this moving forward.
You know, how they deal with ancestral remains, allowing us,
when they find them, to be present and to honor the spirit of those ancestors so they can pass over.

(44:02):
These things are important to us and our people. It's like some of these remains
or ancestors are condemned because they don't have that opportunity.
Just as someone of a Catholic faith would have their last rites, we have our rites too.
There's a story I heard from one of my own relatives in a community where police

(44:22):
came and someone was in mile and the police was trying to address that individual who,
you know, if you understand about our spiritual practices, he wasn't present.
And, you know, it was escalating to the police officer almost becoming violent.
You know, as if this person is not having any disregard for him.

(44:44):
If we had our rights that wouldn't happen an elder
medicine person they would speak to someone in the community and that person
would do whatever it is that it requires his information if it's somebody that
you want for something whatever and will be that guide and explain that you
cannot do that during these times you cannot do that because of the impact it
will have right there are so many

(45:06):
things that are of utmost
importance to us and our
way of life and our way of being and our identity and i
think it is good if that is understood wide
scale so one of the things that we'd love to do we
heard that it's funding is an issue so that's why in
the recent press release we made mention of that that the narratives

(45:30):
in the national museum and these places and
need to be updated to speak towards the present so if
it means that they need funding for signs i know
that if we reach out to the diaspora we will get the funding you
know so if the signs need to be updated and it's a cost they
let us know the cost and we will find the money to pay for that
to happen because it it shifts things for our young ones growing up knowing

(45:53):
that we are here but being taught in schools and elsewhere that we're extinct
i have no problem with the narrative that or communities were decimated because they were.
But the people survived and the culture survived.
So those are some aspects of things as it relates to our indigenous rights.

(46:17):
As it relates to cultural diversity, yeah, that respect on a whole.
I mean, there are several ethnicities here, Jamaica's motto is out of many one people.
Because of the circles that I'm in, Jamaica has a good amount of Native Americans
that will pass through here from time to time.

(46:37):
There are Cherokee here, there are Diné Lakota here, there are Miskito from
Nicaragua here who have settled in St. Elizabeth.
And the average Jamaican has no idea, has no clue. And,
you know, a lot of times these stereotype comments are made and ingest and they
don't understand the impact that these will have, especially to a younger generation

(46:57):
who might hear these things and feel like, you know, they don't really want to take up.
There's no pride in taking up their place and their culture and their way of being.
So that needs to happen. And appreciation and respect.
We have that. We understand that. when we're going
to a space because of the connection that i shared with our

(47:18):
relatives from south america we understand what plural
nationality is and that's lost even in
some places in north america and central america yeah the
concept that several nations nations
can exist on one landmass and
together and work together we can
in the morning i can greet creator in my way and you greet creator in your way

(47:43):
and somebody else greet creator in their way and we move through the day together
in a good way you don't have to repeat what i am saying and i don't have to
repeat what you're saying but that colonized way so i guess the next thing to summarize it is,
decolonization you know as it relates to education interaction relation hierarchies

(48:04):
that needs to be shifted and we're doing the work to shift that.
I believe that the template of us working together through the AMA slash Jamaica
Council of Indigenous Leaders with our own relatives is a good example of what's
possible and what I've heard from our relatives throughout the Caribbean is that,
nothing like that exists elsewhere to date.

(48:26):
So the more opportunities we have to amplify and to share that for pro-national
groups, they're rooted in the space and in the land and their stories in the land.
So that's something that we share together as stewards of the land,
not to reap or to take from the land, but to give to the land.
No, definitely. And what you said kind of leads into the next question in terms of,

(48:49):
you know, what the role do you see with Latino culture revitalization playing
in the broader conversation about decolonization and Indigenous sovereignty in Jamaica? cap.
All right. So in Jamaica, sovereignty is a hot word, right?
There are many concepts around sovereignty. And again, I think the reason why

(49:13):
it's a hot word is that a lot of times it is focused on land. Yes.
Sovereignty and autonomy, as I've shared, is more than just land.
Sovereignty means that we have
the wherewithal the rights
and the systems the systems in place
to take care of our own people take care of them physically emotionally and

(49:40):
spiritually that means that if there are issues we have our own systems for
conflict resolution we can settle disputes on our own.
That means that as it relates to poverty or it relates to malnutrition,
we have systems that can resolve those issues that we can make our decision

(50:02):
and we can work on our own without requiring any.
Provisions or making applications in external entities to have these things done.
It's that is what we're looking at. That is what we're working on.
And that to me for our community is our definition of sovereignty.

(50:22):
Sovereignty for us is our medicine people respected just as much as the Western doctors.
So if there is an issue, we can go to our medicine people.
They can write a certificate. They can recommend certain practices,
diets, fasts for our young ones.

(50:43):
They can write up a paper for someone and, you know, they have that time off
from work to go and deal with whatever spiritual ailment that may be affecting
them mentally so that they can move forward.
But it is a vision of a Jamaica that is even advanced as it relates to North
America and South America that has these things because it is based on our traditional values.

(51:07):
A lot of the systems that are in place as it relates to federal recognition
in the States were penned by the colonizers, even though with an intention to
strike some balance. but it was based on what they saw as valuable.
And over time, that is what value, cultural value became. But for us,
the cultural value is the culture itself and the practices itself.

(51:29):
You know, how amazing would it be for a young girl having her first moon.
Have a certificate for her to have that time at home with community and go through
a rite of passage to understand something that she's going to live with until
she's going through menopause that empowers her and helps her to understand the part that she's on.

(51:54):
Imagine what it is like if our young men had their rite of passage when their
voice was changing instead of them feeling embarrassed and feeling that they
need to tap into more testosterone and become more aggressive,
they realize that their voice changing means there's a responsibility they're
taking on and it means that they need to be mindful of how they use their voice,

(52:17):
the type of content they create in this world of creating content,
what messages they're putting out, who are they protecting with their voice.
Imagine what Jamaica would be like because these are not things that That would
be relegated to our communities alone.
But would be shared with the wider Jamaica.
So that the young ones understand and are welcomed into these different phases as they grow older.

(52:46):
If they were welcomed into manhood and womanhood. And welcomed into their sacred unions.
And welcomed into the role of being an elder. So it was time.
They could look forward to it.
They could say, whoa, you're not 50 and are going to be 52 in two years.
And I'm going to be an elder and the community going to welcome me and I'm going

(53:07):
to put a sash on me and I can give feathers now at celebrations and ceremonies.
And if something happening now at a university, I can go and talk and go and
collect an honorarium instead of just sitting down in an old folks home or at home with nothing to do.
So it shifts the mindset and it's going to take time to get Jamaica to understand

(53:29):
because right now, everybody is in this landlocked perspective.
And they're thinking that when we talk about rights and we talk about what it
is that we desire, that that's all that we're talking about.
What we want is for land and the water and the environment to be in a sustainable
way for the next seven generations.

(53:50):
And right now, because the next seven generations is 200 years,
right now we have no faith in those who are the current caretakers.
So if it means that we are co-caretakers, that is fine.
Because in our traditions, there was no concept of owning land.
I can't say I'm going to own the land and when the land feels like it's going

(54:12):
to shake or it's going to flood or the trees are just going to turn over. I can't control that.
What we can do is try to ensure that we are remaining in balance so that what
we have lasts for the next generation.
There's an old saying that the land that we live on today is something that

(54:33):
we have borrowed from the future generation.
So it doesn't belong to us. And we need to make sure that they have it to utilize.
No, for sure. And you're just talking about in terms of having some sense of
value, some sense of knowing oneself in terms of being able to,
as you said, to the rites of passage for both the female and the male.

(54:55):
And of course, then, of course, later on, part of that life cycle and then becoming
an elder in the community.
I mean, it's all about knowing oneself and knowing what each of these milestones
will represent and be significant to.
So, you know, I guess this leads again to the next question about,

(55:15):
are there any significant historical or archaeological findings related to Chimeketayano
people that have been found or documented?
Yes, there has been quite a few. As I recommended the book, Earliest Inhabitants by Dr.
Leslie Gayle Atkinson-Suewe. We know her as Boyanani.

(55:38):
She shares about several archaeological
sites and work that has been done some of them you know lost to development
these buildings built on top of them so there's not much that can be done there's
a white mile site that a lot of rescue archaeology is taking place there and
that is one of the sites that we're trying to protect as much as we can there

(55:59):
is Woodside where we'll have our
celebrations that has their two national heritage sites that are Taino sites,
the Taino Steps and the Atabay or Mother Earth,
Spirit of Mother Earth, Tetraglyph, where we do our offerings and give thanks
during our New Year celebration, which for us is the start of the rainy season.

(56:23):
There's discussions about, well, there
has been discussion for some time about having returned to
our island two of our most I would
say our most important semis that are at the British Museum
currently and I know I know the government
was talking about this new system that
exists of having things on loan I mean I'd rather we have them and I know that

(56:48):
the government wants to put these at the a new museum they are looking to build
at Port Royal you know I'm looking to have some discussion with them because
we don't necessarily want our ancestral artifacts to be separated.
The two semis that I mentioned is the semi of Boyne Hill and the semi of Marahou.
Marahou has been known as the Birdman and Boyne Hill is the rain semi.

(57:12):
And these are two significant things because they anchor the two seasons that
we have here, the dry season and the rainy season.
We believe that once those return home and we can start doing the work that
we're supposed to do with honoring those semis,
is that some semblance of balance or at
least wisdom would be garnered on how to maintain

(57:34):
the semblance of balance that we seek
and i had mentioned to you about the work that is being done with harvard where
the ancestral remains samples were taken from those that are a part of ue's
archive and institute of jamaica
22 were successful and information will be coming out if not by the

(57:54):
end of the year before the end of the year on the data that
has come from that one of the things that i've requested from them is
to to identify the closest living relative today of our ancestors because one
of the things our people hears a lot is you know about phenotype how we look
and reality is that they don't know how tiny people look right my belief is that the closest,

(58:21):
living relative to our ancestors today.
Maybe, well, from what I understand, our Lakona relatives, the Arawak relatives
on the mainland, or maybe some relatives in the Amazon, the Brazil region of the Amazon.
But I think, still believe it is good for them to understand that,
And for that to be clear, in the minds of Jamaicans moving forward,

(58:46):
not to say that, you know, our phenotype is what their phenotype would be or vice versa,
because we're not assuming to be people from the 1300s or the 1200s.
Caribbean has always always had a culture of intermarriage intermixing you know

(59:06):
taking the best of two worlds and putting it together to ensure the survival of the next generation.
Definitely a good stock yeah for sure absolutely so and then how can individuals
outside of the community support the efforts to preserve and celebrate Taino
culture and heritage in Jamaica.

(59:28):
Well, one, what I'll do is that, you know, we'll have our website,
yamayuani.com, Y-A-M-A-Y-E-G-U-A-N-I.com, can reach out to us.
With the recent press release, there are some NGOs and other organizations that
are looking to support us with our Indigenous rights, amplifying our voices,
creating platforms for us to share, whether it's Zoom meetings or inviting us

(59:52):
to speak at conferences, seminars, etc.
Et cetera, because in every space that there is individuals from the Jamaican
diaspora, chances are that they themselves may have Taina ancestry.
And in our desire to help you, well, in our desire to find help for ourselves,
maybe end up helping you as well.

(01:00:13):
Our culture is cyclical and circular and deals with being holistic.
So there's this concept of reciprocity. As we give, so do we receive.
So that's one aspect of it. And the other is, yeah, we have our celebrations,
you know, where there's four that is open.
Well, let me tell you, we have one March 14th at White Marl.

(01:00:38):
We have May 26th at Woodside.
We have June 20th at Charlestown. That's where we are now.
Solstice in our Taino way. We have September 21st or 22nd back at White Marl
and then we have December 21st.

(01:01:01):
So we have these activities that take place that's open to the public.
We're developing other activities at Woodside so people can go there and they
can do a tour of the Taino site,
Daddy Rock and Taino Steps with you know
the aim of helping to develop up the community and
create sustainable ways for the community and

(01:01:21):
the individuals and there's expertise that
we may require too you know so we're reaching out to these ngos that
are out there our young ones may want some opportunities to
to learn how to work with social media probably one
of our communities could be suited with
computer lab and instructors come and
teach them robotics or programming you know

(01:01:43):
like there's always this assumption that in
our communities the only thing that we want to learn is is craft
and to build things you know there's there's other levels we have graphic artists
or boarding graphic artists or videographers there are certain levels of sustainability
required when we have our celebrations it would be good if it's somebody from

(01:02:03):
our community that can do it
would be good if there are scholarships for archaeology so So, you know,
the person doing them theses just go around in backyard and them checking up
on other artifacts that are there.
You know, there are a lot of barriers perceived for our people and any assistance
in breaking those barriers.
Exactly. No, that'd be great. Now, I'll include that in some of the show notes

(01:02:24):
as well for some of the links that you mentioned.
And what message would you like to share with people who are interested in learning
more about the Jamaican Taino and their contributions to Jamaican history and culture?
In the annals of history, there is a line in which the attempt to wipe my ancestors

(01:02:47):
from the history books was initiated.
That line is during the moments when the British came to the island,
and it is said that the Spanish released the enslaved.
At that point, for whatever reason, as sad as it may be,

(01:03:08):
the assumption was made and programmed into the people of this island that enslaved
in the America only refers to people of African ancestry, which is a hard one to swallow.
And from that point, the Tainos were whittled away little by little.

(01:03:31):
There are records of us on plantations belonging to the British,
even some prominent schools.
We are part of building some of these prominent schools in Jamaica.
But whittled away little by little to where our first prime minister claimed
he has had Arawak ancestry, Alexander Bustamante. And again, he was ridiculed.

(01:03:56):
What I would say is that we're in a time now in the world where we have to write our narratives,
on our history and we have to understand and look on things from the perspective
of the people that lived during those times.

(01:04:16):
Have to respect our ancestors, those who came before us, those who taught these
practices of preparing the bami,
of growing the cassava in a way that, you know, Jamaica has no mass numbers
or any, I've never heard of cyanide poisoning from cassava in Jamaica.

(01:04:38):
It happened in Nigeria when the crop went there, but not here because it has
been practiced here for centuries prior.
It is a staple food that we really should be growing more and have the availability of it more.
I believe once we understand the medicines that are here, that have always been
here, the value, and we start to value them, we start to value that heritage,

(01:05:03):
whether you're Taino or not, because it was passed on to the enslaved Africans.
We were enslaved together and the purpose was our survival and we've survived
and forgotten that part of our history.
We forgot those who showed us the medicine, we forgot those who showed us how
to plant on this land, we forgotten those who fed us and took care of us.

(01:05:28):
And the traditional teaching that I shared with you is that because life is
cyclical in our circle, they said that the healing can only take place when
the The circle is closed.
And those who were here first, the circle returns to them finally in the end.
And the healing can begin.

(01:05:50):
So in our teachings, acknowledging the Taino people is a step,
as simple as it may sound, but it is a step forward in healing the trauma of
this land, the resistance of this land.
Healing the people of this land.
Wherever it is that they may come from, and in so honoring first people,

(01:06:12):
that we can truly step forward into healing.
We would then acknowledge what has been here the longest and what are the priorities
to preserve, protect, and maintain.
I definitely agree and definitely resonate with all that you said,
because healing is a big part of it in order to be able to move forward and

(01:06:36):
to cherish what has and what will be moving forward.
So how do you envision the future of the Jamaican Taino community and their cultural legacies?
I envision a Jamaica that is resilient, as resilient as the cassava, as we call it, yuca.

(01:06:56):
One of our spirits is yuca who, which is the spirit of the cassava.
This crop is resilient to hurricanes because it is a tuba.
It's resilient to floods because it is a tuba.
It is resilient to strong winds because it is a tuba.
And it can last the food made from it can last the cassava bread for up to 3 or 4 years,

(01:07:20):
it's filled with a lot of nutrients, vitamins and minerals and living on a land
that has that legacy and has continued for so long our main staple is rice,
which is not grown here so the vision is for Jamaica to take up the work that

(01:07:40):
Chief Dennis is doing my wife Chief Dennis Ranalla To have several ancestral gardens,
you know, with our heirloom corn or heirloom cassava.
A return to the awareness of the medicinal uses of tobacco for parasites, for wounds.
A respecting of our traditional healers for there to be an established complementary

(01:08:04):
alternative medicine section with the Ministry of Health here in Jamaica.
Maker, for there to be a representative in government that is dealing with indigenous
rights and indigenous people's rights, so that we have a voice when it comes
to any extractive industries around our waters or around our lands,
that our sacred sites are preserved and protected.

(01:08:28):
Once that happens, there will be an influx of what they call spiritual and indigenous
tourism because other relatives on other islands that don't have the things
that we have like our Atabay,
Semi and Petroglyph can come to Woodside and pay respects there as their ancestors would have done.
Can learn some of the things that we have preserved and we can learn things

(01:08:50):
from our relatives as well. We can trade and receive some heirloom seeds and
crops that we may have lost during the colonization process.
That we can honor and preserve and promote the expansion of the spaces of our
iguana so that we can have that reforestation taking place.
That there can be education on Taino cosmology, Taino medicinal practice and

(01:09:17):
worldviews that is taught as a curriculum at the University of the West Indies.
You know, probably this is the future result from this indigenous
studies cluster so that we can
create cultural value so that young ones
in our community do not view the
role of elder council member or kaseke

(01:09:38):
or chieftainess as duty of
burden but something to aspire towards that
is able to maintain their family and their livelihood that
there will be a network of individuals throughout the diaspora supporting these
activities that there will be this resurgence of our language probably it will

(01:09:58):
start our ceremonial and it will grow to something now that is anchored in our
communities because in In the languages,
a lot of our cosmology and our worldview, they're there.
They're things that are hard to express in English about our respect for the
land and our connection to the land.
That there will be young leaders leading the charge in preserving and promoting

(01:10:23):
sustainable ways of living and passing that true digital technology out there
to the rest of the globe and the world at large,
that we will have these archives of our stories because stories are medicine as well.
Understanding where we came from, where these birds came from,
and helping us to stay in alignment and knowing what are the good morals to

(01:10:47):
hold on to and the values to uphold.
I see a future where there is cultural sensitivity.
Where we will be able to walk hand in hand and understand the issues that each
of us has struggled through and work on it together, where we'll understand
that this is one planet that we're sharing.

(01:11:11):
And if there is an issue on one side, it affects all of us so that we'll be
able to collaborate on things that are most important and that the Indigenous
principle of working for the next seven generations,
the next 200 years, is at the core of the decision making process.
That's the future I envision. No, thank you so much for that,

(01:11:33):
Cologne, because that's a great vision and something that, you know,
hopefully can be worked towards. words.
And finally, as we close, what are some current call to actions that you have
of the Jamaican Taino, or is there anything else that you'd like to bring to
the attention to our listeners today?
To our listeners, I would say that there are a lot of activities that are being

(01:11:58):
started, that have been initiated.
I would say, I would,
for the individuals listening that are curious to start with your family start with asking questions,
if you need help you can look online for you know good bio questions start recording information,

(01:12:19):
from your parents and from your grandparents while you can some of it may not
make sense now but it will make sense later understand their stories understand
what the world was like through their eyes.
Yes, what has been recorded by others has value, but start at home, okay?

(01:12:40):
Check while you can. How did the parents meet? How did the grandparents meet?
What era were they growing in?
What is some of the folklore or the stories that they heard growing up?
What were some of the practices that were done at home?
You would be surprised because with the information available now you're able
to place where some of these things are coming from what is the nature what

(01:13:02):
is the root of it you know there's some simple things you you hear in your family
that you have Indian tracing back to practicing,
back before 1834 well the Indian indentured came to Jamaica in 1834 so if you
have Indian in a family before then then who are they right.
Start there. DNA comes later. So start at home with the family. That's one.

(01:13:28):
And the stories and asking the right questions, you get the right answers.
You know, what folklore you have in your family, what folklore stories you have
about dreams, you know, what are some interesting things that happened while
they were growing up, some stories, what were their relations to storms and
natural disasters and events.
A solar eclipse took place recently. What is your family's

(01:13:49):
tradition regarding solar eclipse what's your
family tradition regarding lunar eclipse what's the family tradition
regarding full moon and a new moon
document this for yourself
for the future generation so that's one and then two reach out to our community
the activities that we're doing support if you can when you can messages like

(01:14:14):
this that are amplifying our voices like subscribe subscribe, share.
You know, it is important. This is how we get the messages out and are able
to reach those who may be going through some issues,
who may be going through imposter syndrome, and they need that support.

(01:14:34):
They need to hear from someone who looks like them, that that great-grandmother
was not crazy, and that, you know, we may have a record of that family line
in our list of enrolled family members.
That they are not alone, that there is community.
And we're here and we'll do our best to try and support.

(01:14:58):
Thank you so much. Thank you, Kalon.
I really do appreciate your time for coming on to the podcast and to speak about
the Jamaican-Tayano community and to be able to expand that discussion. So thank you so much.
Music.
Hope you enjoyed this episode, and if you did, please make sure to like,

(01:15:22):
follow, subscribe, and write a review for the episode wherever you listen to
your podcasts. Thank you.
Music.

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