April 8, 2024 • 34 mins
April is International Caesarean Awareness Month, and Cassy and Emily -- both c-section mamas -- discuss their c-sections, the crazy things they experienced in recovery, and what they want other c-section mamas to know. SHOW NOTES: International Caesarean Awareness Month Mayo Clinic C-Section Information The Bump: 11 Things No One Tells You About C-Sections
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Cassy (00:07):
Hi, and welcome to the south central PA mom, Fireflies and Whoopie Pie podcast, where
we discuss motherhood, local events, andeverything in between right here in south
central, Pa.
So sit back, grab a coffee a while, and settle
in for the show.
(00:30):
Hi, everyone.
Welcome back.
We're back after a Easter break.
I hope everyone had a good holiday.
Emily, how was yours?
Emily (00:38):
It was really well, it was a little different this year.
We were at a funeral, so obviously that partwas really bad.
But we got to see a lot of family, so thatpart was special.
And, you know, our daughter got to reconnectwith her cousins.
She doesn't get to see a lot, so it was.
It was bittersweet.
There was, you know, some real good and somereal, real crazy, but it all works out in the
end.
That's life.
Cassy (01:00):
Well, this week we are talking about International Caesarean Awareness Month, and
that was something you were saying last weekthat you're really passionate about.
Emily (01:12):
Absolutely.
I know that a lot of times I feel like women
who are c section moms, there's almost astereotypical bias against that type of a
birth experience, and it's not for the faintof heart.
I remember during the birthing class at thehospital before my daughter was born, they got
to the video, and it was just an animation ofthe process of a c section.
(01:35):
And I was so nervous about the whole thing, Iwalked out and refused to watch the video.
So I was very surprised when I myself was anemergency c section mom.
So it was.
The recovery is very intense, and, you know,
it's.
I'm just always so awestruck by how our bodies
(01:55):
are designed and what we are capable ofrecovering from while caring for this tiny,
fragile new life.
And I believe firmly that everybody's birth
experience is valid and unique and beautifuland different.
But I have a real soft spot for my fellow csection mamas, and I'm really grateful that in
April, we pause and take time to reflect onwhat that experience is like.
Cassy (02:18):
Yeah, I will say I'm a c section mom, too.
All of my kids were born from c sections, andit's still, like, to this day.
How old is my youngest?She's six.
Okay.
Six years later, you look back, and it's like,
okay, you just went through major abdominalsurgery, and you had, like, what, seven
(02:38):
layers?And then it's like an hour later.
Okay, here you go.
Yeah.
Take care of this tiny person.
Emily (02:47):
Oh, by the way, we expect milk to be kicking in right exactly now.
So good luck with that.
Cassy (02:52):
Oh, my gosh.
Did you.
Did you deliver at a baby friendly hospital,baby initiative.
It's like you get this certification, babyfriendly hospital initiative.
So if you get the certification, they have alist of rules that you have to follow in order
to get it, and one of them is, you have toinitiate breastfeeding within an hour.
Emily (03:12):
I would not be surprised then, if that's what the hospital was, because those
lactation consultants were on me immediately.
Cassy (03:22):
They did that with my fourth, so that was the only one I delivered in a baby
friendly hospital.
It was horrible.
I hated every second of it.
And part of it was because of stuff like this.
I literally.
I mean, you've been through it.
You.
You go through recovery, and that's almost an
hour.
You know, if you're lucky, if everything goes
perfectly, then you'll be back in your roomwithin around an hour, which I was.
Emily (03:44):
Did not.
I actually was very unconscious for most of
the day.
I gave birth to my daughter, so I lost.
I had a postpartum hemorrhage, and my uteruscollapsed.
And it was.
They actually almost had to do a hysterectomy
on me at 29.
Cassy (03:57):
Oh, my gosh.
Emily (03:58):
Yeah, it was a crazy, crazy experience.
I was not conscious for much of the day.
I remember bits and pieces.
I don't remember.
This, I think is the hardest part for me.
And it's why I really am passionate about
trying to do everything I can to help mamaswho have experienced birth trauma.
I have no memory of holding my daughter forthe first time because.
(04:20):
And, like, you can clearly see it in photos.
I was unconscious the first time they put her
on me, and that's kind of hard to deal withthat.
I don't have those sweet memories of meetingmy, like, I remember when she.
When the doctor first pulled her out, youknow, they set her by my face, but you're
still strapped down.
You can't even hold your child.
And it was shortly after that that I passedout.
(04:41):
I don't.
I don't remember anything of the first time
she was, like, put on my chest.
So, yeah, it was.
But even with that, like, I do remember thatfirst day, like, the lactation consultants,
like, coming in, I'm like, with all of the.
The drugs that are in my body right now, you
know, because you guys were trying to save mylife and all that, like, is breastfeeding
really a great idea at this moment in time?
Cassy (05:05):
In my case, I was like, literally, they pulled me right into my room.
I was still numb.
And they're like, okay, let's sit you up to
start breastfeeding.
And I'm like, how?
Emily (05:16):
That's nuts.
Cassy (05:17):
I can't move.
Emily (05:20):
That is wild.
Like, within an hour of giving birth, dare I
say traumatically, like you said, majorabdominal surgery.
Just like, oh, good luck with this.
Like, wow.
Cassy (05:32):
That's the dramatic part.
It was.
So my first birth was an emergency c section.
Not as dramatic as yours.
It was.
I was okay.
But my son was not tolerating labor.
Emily (05:47):
Well, that was, like, my best situation like that as well, with her c section.
Cassy (05:53):
Yeah, he has a very large head.
He did when he was a baby.
Does take Ed.
And essentially, he got stuck.
And so we're in labor for 16 hours, and henever descended.
We weren't making any progress.
Like, I was dilating, but he wasn't moving
down, and his heart rate kept getting lowerand lower and lower and lower.
(06:14):
And finally, when he got to 60 beats perminute, what struck me is how calm they were
about it.
You know, I didn't even really know in the
moment that it was an emergency c section,because everyone was just very calm.
Emily (06:25):
Yeah, yeah.
Cassy (06:27):
And so they're like, we need to go ahead and do a c section.
I had a midwife, and, you know, I look at her,and she's like, yes, we need to go ahead and
do this.
And I'm like, okay.
And then, you know, it's only, like, inretrospect, I look back and compare it to the
other ones.
Like, everything was very fast in the OR.
There wasn't anything like.
No, it wasn't the other ones.
(06:48):
It was so much easier and, like, slower and,like, okay, we're gonna take our time, and
we'll just, you know, I don't know.
Everything is just very quick.
Quick and, like, quiet.
There wasn't a lot of, like, chitchat.
And then he came out, and he was blue and notbreathing, so.
Emily (07:07):
Oh, my goodness.
That's terrifying.
Cassy (07:09):
But I will say.
Did you labor before your c section?
Emily (07:15):
I did.
Oh, I did.
That was.
That was what did me in, actually, was.
Everything was going awesome.
There was.
I got to the hospital.
I was dilated about four inches.
I got.
I mean, it was all.
It started like a dream.
Like, I got that epidural before my
contractions were even all that painful.
And, like, I was.
(07:35):
I got to rest all night.
The next morning came.
I want to say they gave me a little bit ofpitocin to help me get that last centimeter,
but then I was ten, and they're like, yep,let's do this.
Let's start pushing.
It was around 08:00 a.m.
Because I remember watching the clock at thefoot of the bed, and I pushed for 3 hours, and
I could not get her out.
(07:57):
Like, she just, she was not coming out.
We found out later that she was not breach,but she was facing instead of down.
Like, she, she was down.
But correct me if I'm wrong, it's.
Cassy (08:09):
Turned around the wrong way.
Like, her face was the wrong way.
Emily (08:12):
Her face was the wrong way.
Her face was, like, sunny side up, they called
it, I think.
So. Like, when she came out, she had a big,
like, dent down her nose because she was sopressed against me.
Girlfriend was not coming out.
So that was, it was at that point that the
doctor came in, you know, it's been 3 hours.
Nothing is happening, and, you know, active
(08:34):
pushing for those 3 hours.
And my doctor came in, she's like, you know, I
think it might be time to start thinkingthrough a c section.
And I was like, this is what did me in.
I'm like, I want to give it one last shot.
And I gave it all I had to give.
And I think that's what really messed up my
universe.
I remember it's funny, too, because you know
how they bring you all that paperwork you haveto sign, but in the moment, it's just kind of
(08:58):
like, it's so out of body.
I'm like, does my signature even, oh, I
remember, oh, I had to sign all this stuff.
And it was.
I remember feeling like it was a very weirdthing.
Like, it was so out of body.
I'm like, is my signature valid right now?
Because I don't even know what I'm saying, butit was, I have to give such a huge shout out
(09:21):
to Doylestown Hospital, which is where Ilabored and delivered.
I was in the hospital for five days, or Ithink it was five days total to recover,
because then my hemoglobin, I think it was,was so low, two days later, they had to give
me another.
I had, I think it was two blood transfusions
immediately because I lost so much blood.
And then I needed another one two days later
(09:42):
because I was still so, like, not doing great,but it was very, like, the staff there.
Like, I remember even the janitorial staff,everybody, they were angels.
Like, not only do I credit them with saving mylife, everybody was family.
Like, you see a woman in distress, and justeverybody was all hands on deck.
(10:06):
Like, when they took my catheter out to go tothe bathroom, which was, I want to say, a full
day later, they kept me catheterized because Iwas I couldn't really move.
And you know that first moment where you standup for the first time after a c section and
you just feel like, am I ever going to be ableto bend at the waist again?
Cassy (10:26):
Like, it's really fun.
Feelings.
My favorite is, like, when it feels like allyour organs are sloshing around.
Emily (10:35):
You'Re like, if I take a step, are they going to, like, zombie style?
Cassy (10:38):
They're going to fall out?
Emily (10:40):
Yeah. Like, I don't know.
And I do.
I don't.
It's funny how, like, your mind kind of, like,
protects you from, like, remembering the exactfeel of the pain, but I just remember it was
like, the agony was unbelievable.
It took two of the nurses to help me walk to
the bathroom, and a maintenance lady waswalking by and she glanced in the my hospital
(11:04):
room and she saw that, like, I was absolutelynot okay.
And I will never forget her droppingeverything to also rush in and help me.
Perfect strangers.
Like, just.
It was.
It's amazing how with birth, like, we women,
we are all one.
Like, and that's how it should be.
Regardless of your birth experience, whetherit was amazing and a dream and you're like,
(11:28):
gung ho to do this again ASAP because it was agreat experience or you are severely
traumatized from the whole thing.
You know, I just.
I love that I see women and I try to be thiswoman.
You know, we're checking in on new moms.
We're appreciating and respecting that fourth
trimester.
We are, you know, asking how the baby sleeps.
We're offering to babysit, we're offering tobring food.
(11:48):
We're trying to.
It all comes down, I think, to validation my
experience.
Your experience, like, it's all valid, it's
all real.
However we're processing, it is all genuine.
And we just.
Maybe it sounds cliche, but we have to be that
village.
Cassy (12:04):
Yeah. Because it's.
Emily (12:06):
It's.
Cassy (12:07):
It's hard.
I will say that it's easier just for anyone
who's listening and maybe like, oh, my gosh.
I've had scheduled.
Emily (12:16):
Recovery.
Cassy (12:17):
The reason I asked if you labored first, the recovery between my first one after
I had labored for 16 hours versus the otherfour, which were all scheduled, was like night
and day.
Emily (12:27):
That is what I hear.
Yeah.
Cassy (12:29):
It was so much easier.
So if you have a scheduled C section, you
know, it is about a million times easier notto say that, like, the ones that are
emergencies, like, it's not the end of theworld, you know, like, right.
Emily (12:40):
It's.
Cassy (12:41):
You get through it you'll survive.
You'll be okay.
At least it doesn't hurt when you pee.
That all I can say.
I don't know.
Emily (12:49):
That is exactly right.
And I'll say this, too.
Like, they prescribed me Percocet for, like, awhile, and I weaned myself off before I cut
the dose.
They prescribed me in half almost immediately
because I don't like being on intensivepainkillers.
I was starting to breastfeed, and it wasmanageable.
And again, what happened to me was very muchnot planned.
(13:12):
I have so many friends who have had Csections, and it was a very different
experience.
The recovery was a wildly different
experience.
So don't hear this and be afraid and think
that this is, like, a typical C sectionexperience.
It absolutely unequivocally is not.
Cassy (13:29):
So. It's second one, I was, like, doing laps around the ward, you know, because, like,
I think I had read that.
Emily (13:36):
It said, like, oh, the more you.
Cassy (13:37):
Walk, the better you'll recover.
I'm like, all right.
See how I'm feeling?It was just.
It was night and day.
Night and day.
Yeah.
Emily (13:44):
So, no. No fear, ladies.
It's.
It all works out.
And they're.
That, like, situations like that are rare.
Those are not the norm, and, you know, like.
Cassy (13:57):
Like, regardless of whether it's scheduled or planned.
And this is not to be TMI, but I think themost terrifying.
There are two things.
The most terrifying experiences after a c
section for me, and one was the first time youhad to go poo was because that was just like,
medication.
It's just, like, working against you, and it's
(14:17):
like.
It was terrifying.
Emily (14:19):
Yeah. And it takes forever.
Cassy (14:21):
Yeah. And then the first time that we had sex after the c section, because I was
terrified.
I'm like, oh, my God, I'm gonna rip something
inside, or I don't know.
And then I'm not gonna know I ripped
something, and I'm gonna lead to death, or.
I don't know.
I don't know why I was so terrified, but I wasterrified.
Yep.
Emily (14:39):
Yeah, 100%.
I think after those five ish day, four or five
ish days in the hospital, whatever it was, Ithink it took me until I got home again, TMI,
to finally, like, have a bowel movement.
I just couldn't relax, and it was.
You were on all the pains.
I remember them prescribing me in addition to
the painkillers.
(15:01):
It was some.
It was basically like a medical.
Yeah.
And, like, tom's like.
Like medical strength, and so it's.
I think I still have them somewhere in mymedicine cabinet.
And, yeah, it's, that was a very weird partbecause it was just like, you feel kind of
like your body.
I mean, in every.
You feel like your body's not your own whenyou're pregnant, but with the recovery, too,
(15:24):
it's like you have to be completelyreintroduced to your body.
And that can mess with your head as well, youknow?
Okay.
That can also affect the recovery.
And, like, case in point, I had a whole, youknow, cute going home outfit picked right to
go home with my husband and our newborn.
I went home wearing socks.
(15:45):
My daughter was born in January because I wasso swollen from all the iv's and medications
and whatever that I could not even get, like,uggs on my feet.
No shoes would fit on my feet.
I had to wear the largest size of sweatpants I
owned because I was so bloated.
And it was the funniest thing.
(16:05):
It, like, the bloating gradually went away dayby day, but it was like, first it disappeared
from my face and then it disappeared from myarms and then my stomach, but, like, it was
going down till all I had left was hobbit feetabout a week later.
But I remember I couldn't really walk, but Ihad these big old hobbit feet.
(16:25):
And my poor dad, who's just, he's the best,but he was coming over to, I don't know, watch
my baby or bring me food or something, and Iwas propped up on the couch with my feet out
in front of me.
And he couldn't help it.
Like, he just took one look and cracked up.
I'm like, I know.
They're hilarious.
Nothing fits.
I cannot wear any shoes.
Cassy (16:42):
Anyone, like, warns you about it, though.
Emily (16:44):
They do not.
They do not at all warn you about this.
Well, but if you're hearing this and you'reconcerned about that, please don't let that
scare you because I'm telling you, it goesaway quickly.
Like, you'll be a little concerned.
I do remember looking in the mirror the day
after and being in crying and saying, I looklike Fiona from Shrek.
Just get me green makeup, because why do Ibother anymore?
(17:07):
My face is twice the size it normally is.
But then by the next day, that was gone.
And then, like I said, it was like a slowdeflation head to toe.
And it does not last long in the moment.
When you first look in the mirror, you're
like, who is this person?Is this just what I look like now?
It is not.
Rest assured, it'll go as faster than you
think.
Is possible.
You are going to be just fine.
Cassy (17:29):
Well, and, I mean, I don't know if you took labor and delivery classes and stuff.
I know I did.
Obviously, that didn't count for me.
Yep.
Same about C sections in there, but they don't
tell you about any of this stuff.
It's like, so surface level, and it's like all
of these things to prepare you for labor, andthey're all things that prepare you for
(17:51):
vaginal labor.
There's lots of in depth stuff about that, but
there was no in depth anything about what toexpect if you've had a c section.
Emily (17:58):
There's, like, a little video you watch about how the process is done, but it's made
very clear that, like, this is not the normalway to give birth.
Like, that's how they make you feel.
And I think my message to moms everywhere is,
however you give birth is normal.
However you give birth, and however you give
birth is right for your body and for yourbaby.
And, you know, don't let anybody, like, Idon't know, I've just heard so much, whether
(18:23):
it's in pop culture or whatever, about how,like.
Or like, even people who are c suits, they'rec section moms, but then they make.
And if this is what you want to do, I respectit.
I think you're amazing.
I champion it.
Cassy (18:38):
I.
Emily (18:38):
This is certainly not me coming down on it, but I remember I was in, like, one of
those natural moms groups shortly after mydaughter was born.
I was looking for some solidarity.
You know, as a new mom, I learned pretty
quickly I wasn't going to find it with thecrunchy moms.
Me personally, again, if that's your thing, Irespect it 100%.
(18:59):
It just is not personally me.
And there were a lot of women talking about
VBAC births in there, so of course I had tolook it up what a VBAC was.
But it was almost like this.
I almost got the sense that these women felt
like they had something to prove to themselvesin terms of a birth experience.
And I'm like, honey, you don't.
(19:19):
Nobody.
One of the best things I ever heard about, youknow, epidural, natural birth, c section,
vaginal birth, you know, labor for 3 hours or30, like, whatever it is.
At the end of the day, nobody wins a medal.
And that stuck with me because it's true for
however you give birth, baby, nobody wins amedal for how they do that.
(19:41):
In the same.
Cassy (19:42):
I remember who phrased it as when I remember asking her, like, is it better to use
an epidural or not, use one or go, like,natural.
She said it's like flavors of ice cream.
She said there's chocolate and there's
vanilla, but one is not better than the other.
Emily (19:57):
Exactly.
And it depends on you.
I mean, it depends on everything.
And that's the same thing, you know, in my
opinion, with a birth experience.
And I think that if we would just as women, as
moms, just focus on validation and support andencouragement.
I mean, I've got friends who, like me,delivered in a hospital with an epidural.
(20:20):
They asked me what my drug, my birth plan waswhen I came to the hospital, and my honest
response was, and I quote, all the drugs.
And the nurse just kind of looked at me, what
part of my face looks like.
Cassy (20:30):
I'm joking right now.
Emily (20:32):
But then I have friends, multiple, multiple friends who did home births with
multiple children, you know, in a pool intheir living room.
And that was the right choice for them.
So it's just if we can, you know, never act
superior or whatever about our own birthexperience.
(20:53):
I mean, and I also think, you know, those ofus, especially those of us with daughters,
like, they're watching.
They're watching how we process.
They're watching how we talk about otherwomen.
They're watching how we, you know, tell themthe stories of their own birds.
These are things that, you know, they'reprocessing as, you know, eventually as they
(21:16):
get older and they think, you know, is thissomething I want to do someday?
Do I want to have a child someday?And I think the way we talk about how babies
are brought into the world, even from a youngage, is so formative for our little ones.
And it's so important that they see all of usmamas validating and championing each other
every step of the way through this journey.
Cassy (21:37):
Yeah. And I think that another thing that is maybe helpful for people to keep in
mind is that, like you talk about the VBAC, Ithink a lot of women do that because they
think if I have another C section, then I'mgoing to be limited and I'm only be able to
have two kids or whatever.
Emily (21:54):
Right?
Cassy (21:55):
And obviously, there's the big caveat here.
For some women, this is true because everyperson's body is different.
Like, everyone's body is different.
But as a rule, that's not necessarily true.
That's correct.
I've had five c sections.
I've had five.
And as of my last one, I mean, we're done
having kids for other reasons, but as of mylast one, for me personally, okay, I still did
(22:23):
not have issues that, if I had a 6th, wouldhave necessarily been like the worst thing.
I didn't have a uterine window.
I had like, scar tissue.
And that was pretty much it, you know?Yeah.
And so I just kept on checking, you know,after, after my second, you know, I made sure
to talk with the surgeon.
Okay.
How things looking there?
Emily (22:44):
Yeah, yeah.
Cassy (22:46):
She's like, you know, yeah, you look, you look pretty okay.
You know, make sure you give yourself the, youknow, year to two years to heal.
But, you know, if you, if you feel like youwant to keep going, that's fine.
And so I just made sure to consult with themafterwards each time.
Emily (22:57):
So then I.
Cassy (22:58):
What was going on? And the whole reason I say that is because you
don't feel like if you had a c section, thatmeans now you're going to be limited.
You might be.
That might be what happened with your body,
but it might not either.
Emily (23:10):
That's exactly right.
Everybody's.
I had a boyfriend years ago who.
He was one of six and all six of them c
sections.
Mom was okay.
Mom was fine.
And, you know, see, like, like you said,
everybody is so different.
Don't worry about it.
Limiting you.
Like, just focus on what is best and
healthiest for you and for your baby.
(23:35):
Yeah.
Cassy (23:35):
And I chose not to have a VBAC, and that was the right choice for me.
And if that's the choice for you, that's okay,too.
Exactly.
There's like a sense of shame of choosing to
do that out of convenience.
Like, the superior choice is a vaginal birth,
and if you're not doing everything you can toget that, then you're not doing the right
(23:59):
thing or something.
And it's like, look, you know, in my case, so
I could have had a VBAC with my second.
That was an option.
They were all about it.
They were like, yeah, you're a great
candidate.
Let's do it.
My husband was in Afghanistan.
He was not going to be home for the birth,
which.
And I already had a baby, you know?
Emily (24:20):
Yeah.
Cassy (24:21):
I'm like, okay, well, my mom's going to have to come to North Carolina from Florida to
watch my son while I'm in labor, which she'stotally up to do.
I'm like, but if I go in labor, how's shegoing to get here in time?
And then I'm going to be doing what while I'min the hospital?
I'm like, nope.
Give me the convenience of the scheduled date
and I'm just going to do that.
(24:41):
And then even with my, my third one, they even
still, this is great hospital in northCarolina.
They were like, do you want to do a VBAC aftertwo c sections?
And I'm like, um, I don't know, maybe what,what are you, what would be the, the details?
And they're like, well, you would just need todeliver in Wilmington.
You know, it was like an hour away.
Emily (24:58):
Oh, my gosh.
Cassy (24:58):
And because you've had c sections, we can't induce you.
Emily (25:01):
So just when you go to labor.
Cassy (25:02):
When you go into labor, you would just, you and your husband would drive down to
Wilmington, and I'm like, um, no, no, thankyou.
No, thank you.
Maybe that's convenience, so to speak, but I
don't think there's anything wrong with that.
You do what works best for you.
Emily (25:18):
Absolutely.
Cassy (25:19):
That's another thing that, it's like just, you have this notion where the vaginal
birth is the superior option.
It's like, no, you know what?
Do whatever works for you.
Emily (25:26):
That's exactly right.
If I could wish for one thing for my
daughter's generation, when they're dealingwith all this, when they're thinking about
having children and giving birth and all that,my hope is that at that point in time, there's
going to be no preferred way anymore.
There's not going to be any, well, this is
(25:47):
superior, or that is period.
No, no. As long as the baby and mom are
healthy and here, that is what is superior.
In the same way, you know, it's like fed is
best, you know, rather formula breast milk,you've got to figure out what works for your
family.
Born is best, however that baby is born.
And, you know, I, that is something that Ireally would love to see shift, because there
(26:10):
is that, you know, that stereotype.
There is that kind of just this feeling that,
like, there's a preferred way, there's a rightway to do this.
And no, they're really is not.
And if you're listening and you're pregnant,
or maybe it's your first time, or second orthird or fifth, whatever it is, and you are
thinking through these options, just know thatyou are loved and you are supported, and
(26:35):
whatever you decide is the right decision.
And if anybody tries to tell you differently,
you are not obligated to listen to them.
Cassy (26:47):
I'm curious, what would be your number one tip for someone that is listening, and
it's like going to have a c section?
Emily (26:54):
Like, what would you.
My number one tip for somebody who is
listening, who is having a c section is toprepare a support network as you recover,
like, do that now, if this is something youknow that you're going to do, you know,
understand that.
I think, like, like you said, you had that
baby on you within an hour, and they wantedyou to be breastfeeding and ready to go
(27:18):
regardless of how you give birth.
They typically do things like that.
Understand that it is major abdominal surgery.
You know, you will your recovery.
You're going to feel kind of funky down therefor a while.
You're going to lean against the kitchencounter for months and feel a little tingle,
you know, at least.
And, you know, it's.
(27:38):
That scar is.
It quickly became my very favorite feature
because it's better than a tattoo.
It's a symbol of me doing the strongest thing
I've ever done in my life that I never thoughtI could do.
Embrace the scar.
Don't think that it's gonna make you less
beautiful.
It's gonna enhance your beauty.
Lean into that, learn to love it.
(27:59):
It is my proudest and best feature.
And just prepare now, okay, maybe I alreadyhave older children.
Here's who's gonna watch the children line up.
Somebody maybe consider a postpartum doula.
That's something I certainly wish I knew aboutwhen I had no idea postpartum was the thing.
Cassy (28:18):
Such a great thing to exist.
Emily (28:20):
Such a great thing.
I would absolutely consider that.
I would highly recommend it.
If you have family close by, that's amazing.
See who's willing to take shifts so you cansleep.
Because guess what?You're recovering from abdominal surgery, and
babies don't like to sleep on an awesomeschedule.
And this was the biggest thing that surprisedme when I took that birthing class.
You got to wake them up every two to 3 hoursto feed them.
(28:42):
I was, you know, raised by the generation thatwas of the mindset.
You let a sleeping baby sleep.
So I was a little bit floored by that
information.
Line up as much help as you can now.
So that way, when you do come home with babyand you're recovering, you're not floundering
for help or, like, working yourself to thepoint of exhaustion, to the point where you're
going to crash and you don't have the helpwhen you need it.
Cassy (29:05):
Well, I think that it's important to remember like that, working yourself to the
bone, like it's okay if for the first month ortwo months or three months, whatever feels
best for you.
If you spend that time sitting in your bed
with your baby, and that's it, other peoplecan clean your house for you.
Other people can do other stuff for you.
You can sit there and get better and bond.
Emily (29:27):
That's all you need.
Cassy (29:27):
Absolutely.
Emily (29:28):
And anybody, take it from moms who know and who have been there, anybody that would
judge you on, I don't know, whether your foodwas homemade or you had food waiting or your
house wasn't clean or whatever.
Anybody who would judge you on having or not
having those things don't deserve a place atyour table while you're recovering.
(29:49):
Frankly, they don't deserve a place at yourtable at any point in time.
But be kind to yourself.
That's my number one tip for every mom.
Be kind to yourself.
Treat yourself to something.
Love on yourself a little bit, because guesswhat?
Everybody's going to be loving on your baby.
And that's good.
And that's right.
(30:10):
But mom sometimes kind of get forgotten.
They need a lot of love, too, especially inthose first few days, weeks, months, dare I
say that first year, you know, it's.
It's okay.
Like, one of the most powerful things a frienddid within the first two weeks of me giving
birth was drive to my house and insist you areleaving the baby with your husband and take me
(30:30):
out for coffee and, you know, find.
Find your village like that.
Let people love on you.
Don't think you have to do it all yourself
because.
Because you will.
You will feel that pressure.
You will absolutely feel that pressure.
But know that even though you feel thatpressure, it's a liar and it's okay to rest.
Cassy (30:53):
It took me until my last baby to do that, too.
Like my fifth one.
And some of the reasons we didn't do this
before, because it wasn't realistic.
So I'm giving that kind of warning first,
that, look, if this isn't possible for youbecause of your finances or your job or
whatever, you're a single parent, this mightnot be possible for you.
(31:15):
And that's okay.
You're not doing anything wrong.
You're doing the best you can.
That's all that matters.
But I will say the best recovery I had was myfifth one when my husband was like, you know,
we're going to make sure that you're able totake it easy.
And we had someone come in.
She was our regular babysitter, basically all
day.
She came in for a week afterwards, and then
(31:36):
for the rest of the month after I gave birth,she wasn't there anymore.
But he was basically, I spent the month in bedand just sat there with Felicity, our baby.
And, you know, I just would breastfeed her andsit there and we would hang out and I did not
really leave that bed at all for a month,except when I felt like I wanted to.
And that was hands down my best recovery, Ibelieve.
(31:57):
Hands down.
Emily (31:58):
Yep, 100%.
So, yeah, it's mom, take care of yourself.
Cassy (32:05):
Yeah. And, I mean, I felt guilty, you know?
But at the same time, I was also like, youknow, this is great.
And then I'm, like, feeling guilty because I'mlike, man, this is great.
Wait, I'm not supposed to feel like this isgreat.
I'm supposed to be doing mom stuff.
Emily (32:19):
Yeah, well, in society will make you feel like that.
But just like I said before, remember, anybodywho makes you feel like that, they're not your
friends.
You're going to be doing enough of that in
your own head, making yourself feel, I shouldbe doing laundry, I should be vacuuming.
I should be doing whatever.
Try not to listen to that voice.
It's hard.
(32:39):
You're going to want to, and you know, there
will be times that you will, but it's okay tolean into recovery.
Cassy (32:47):
Mm hmm. Yeah. Well, Emily, thank you so much for hanging out and talking about this
with me.
Emily (32:54):
Thanks having me.
I'm very, very blessed to be able to have the
chance to talk about this.
It's something I'm really passionate about.
And, you know, if you're listening and you'rec section mom, or you're about to be, please
feel free to reach out to me.
I'd love to talk to you.
I'd love to send you a meal or some coffee orhave the baby's born a bottle of wine.
Cassy (33:14):
Oh, yeah, yeah, for sure.
And just, you know, there's.
There's.
There's help out there, you know, even if it's
before you're getting ready, and it's likeyou're taking those stupid birthing classes
and they're not giving you any information.
It's like, oh, my gosh, I don't know what to
do.
You can reach out and we'll answer questions
for you all day long.
Absolutely.
Emily (33:33):
Let us be your village.
Cassy (33:35):
Well, I will talk to you soon, then, and I hope you have a great week.
Emily (33:41):
You too.
Cassy (33:42):
And see you next week.
Emily (33:47):
Talk to you later.
Cassy (33:55):
That's our episode for this week.
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Thanks for stopping by the Fireflies and
Whoopie Pie podcast, the only podcast by SouthCentral PA moms for south central PA moms.
Until next time.
Hi, and welcome to the south central PA mom, Fireflies and Whoopie Pie podcast, where
we discuss motherhood, local events, andeverything in between right here in south
central, Pa.
So sit back, grab a coffee a while, and settle
in for the show.
(00:30):
Hi, everyone.
Welcome back.
We're back after a Easter break.
I hope everyone had a good holiday.
Emily, how was yours?
Emily (00:38):
It was really well, it was a little different this year.
We were at a funeral, so obviously that partwas really bad.
But we got to see a lot of family, so thatpart was special.
And, you know, our daughter got to reconnectwith her cousins.
She doesn't get to see a lot, so it was.
It was bittersweet.
There was, you know, some real good and somereal, real crazy, but it all works out in the
end.
That's life.
Cassy (01:00):
Well, this week we are talking about International Caesarean Awareness Month, and
that was something you were saying last weekthat you're really passionate about.
Emily (01:12):
Absolutely.
I know that a lot of times I feel like women
who are c section moms, there's almost astereotypical bias against that type of a
birth experience, and it's not for the faintof heart.
I remember during the birthing class at thehospital before my daughter was born, they got
to the video, and it was just an animation ofthe process of a c section.
(01:35):
And I was so nervous about the whole thing, Iwalked out and refused to watch the video.
So I was very surprised when I myself was anemergency c section mom.
So it was.
The recovery is very intense, and, you know,
it's.
I'm just always so awestruck by how our bodies
(01:55):
are designed and what we are capable ofrecovering from while caring for this tiny,
fragile new life.
And I believe firmly that everybody's birth
experience is valid and unique and beautifuland different.
But I have a real soft spot for my fellow csection mamas, and I'm really grateful that in
April, we pause and take time to reflect onwhat that experience is like.
Cassy (02:18):
Yeah, I will say I'm a c section mom, too.
All of my kids were born from c sections, andit's still, like, to this day.
How old is my youngest?She's six.
Okay.
Six years later, you look back, and it's like,
okay, you just went through major abdominalsurgery, and you had, like, what, seven
(02:38):
layers?And then it's like an hour later.
Okay, here you go.
Yeah.
Take care of this tiny person.
Emily (02:47):
Oh, by the way, we expect milk to be kicking in right exactly now.
So good luck with that.
Cassy (02:52):
Oh, my gosh.
Did you.
Did you deliver at a baby friendly hospital,baby initiative.
It's like you get this certification, babyfriendly hospital initiative.
So if you get the certification, they have alist of rules that you have to follow in order
to get it, and one of them is, you have toinitiate breastfeeding within an hour.
Emily (03:12):
I would not be surprised then, if that's what the hospital was, because those
lactation consultants were on me immediately.
Cassy (03:22):
They did that with my fourth, so that was the only one I delivered in a baby
friendly hospital.
It was horrible.
I hated every second of it.
And part of it was because of stuff like this.
I literally.
I mean, you've been through it.
You.
You go through recovery, and that's almost an
hour.
You know, if you're lucky, if everything goes
perfectly, then you'll be back in your roomwithin around an hour, which I was.
Emily (03:44):
Did not.
I actually was very unconscious for most of
the day.
I gave birth to my daughter, so I lost.
I had a postpartum hemorrhage, and my uteruscollapsed.
And it was.
They actually almost had to do a hysterectomy
on me at 29.
Cassy (03:57):
Oh, my gosh.
Emily (03:58):
Yeah, it was a crazy, crazy experience.
I was not conscious for much of the day.
I remember bits and pieces.
I don't remember.
This, I think is the hardest part for me.
And it's why I really am passionate about
trying to do everything I can to help mamaswho have experienced birth trauma.
I have no memory of holding my daughter forthe first time because.
(04:20):
And, like, you can clearly see it in photos.
I was unconscious the first time they put her
on me, and that's kind of hard to deal withthat.
I don't have those sweet memories of meetingmy, like, I remember when she.
When the doctor first pulled her out, youknow, they set her by my face, but you're
still strapped down.
You can't even hold your child.
And it was shortly after that that I passedout.
(04:41):
I don't.
I don't remember anything of the first time
she was, like, put on my chest.
So, yeah, it was.
But even with that, like, I do remember thatfirst day, like, the lactation consultants,
like, coming in, I'm like, with all of the.
The drugs that are in my body right now, you
know, because you guys were trying to save mylife and all that, like, is breastfeeding
really a great idea at this moment in time?
Cassy (05:05):
In my case, I was like, literally, they pulled me right into my room.
I was still numb.
And they're like, okay, let's sit you up to
start breastfeeding.
And I'm like, how?
Emily (05:16):
That's nuts.
Cassy (05:17):
I can't move.
Emily (05:20):
That is wild.
Like, within an hour of giving birth, dare I
say traumatically, like you said, majorabdominal surgery.
Just like, oh, good luck with this.
Like, wow.
Cassy (05:32):
That's the dramatic part.
It was.
So my first birth was an emergency c section.
Not as dramatic as yours.
It was.
I was okay.
But my son was not tolerating labor.
Emily (05:47):
Well, that was, like, my best situation like that as well, with her c section.
Cassy (05:53):
Yeah, he has a very large head.
He did when he was a baby.
Does take Ed.
And essentially, he got stuck.
And so we're in labor for 16 hours, and henever descended.
We weren't making any progress.
Like, I was dilating, but he wasn't moving
down, and his heart rate kept getting lowerand lower and lower and lower.
(06:14):
And finally, when he got to 60 beats perminute, what struck me is how calm they were
about it.
You know, I didn't even really know in the
moment that it was an emergency c section,because everyone was just very calm.
Emily (06:25):
Yeah, yeah.
Cassy (06:27):
And so they're like, we need to go ahead and do a c section.
I had a midwife, and, you know, I look at her,and she's like, yes, we need to go ahead and
do this.
And I'm like, okay.
And then, you know, it's only, like, inretrospect, I look back and compare it to the
other ones.
Like, everything was very fast in the OR.
There wasn't anything like.
No, it wasn't the other ones.
(06:48):
It was so much easier and, like, slower and,like, okay, we're gonna take our time, and
we'll just, you know, I don't know.
Everything is just very quick.
Quick and, like, quiet.
There wasn't a lot of, like, chitchat.
And then he came out, and he was blue and notbreathing, so.
Emily (07:07):
Oh, my goodness.
That's terrifying.
Cassy (07:09):
But I will say.
Did you labor before your c section?
Emily (07:15):
I did.
Oh, I did.
That was.
That was what did me in, actually, was.
Everything was going awesome.
There was.
I got to the hospital.
I was dilated about four inches.
I got.
I mean, it was all.
It started like a dream.
Like, I got that epidural before my
contractions were even all that painful.
And, like, I was.
(07:35):
I got to rest all night.
The next morning came.
I want to say they gave me a little bit ofpitocin to help me get that last centimeter,
but then I was ten, and they're like, yep,let's do this.
Let's start pushing.
It was around 08:00 a.m.
Because I remember watching the clock at thefoot of the bed, and I pushed for 3 hours, and
I could not get her out.
(07:57):
Like, she just, she was not coming out.
We found out later that she was not breach,but she was facing instead of down.
Like, she, she was down.
But correct me if I'm wrong, it's.
Cassy (08:09):
Turned around the wrong way.
Like, her face was the wrong way.
Emily (08:12):
Her face was the wrong way.
Her face was, like, sunny side up, they called
it, I think.
So. Like, when she came out, she had a big,
like, dent down her nose because she was sopressed against me.
Girlfriend was not coming out.
So that was, it was at that point that the
doctor came in, you know, it's been 3 hours.
Nothing is happening, and, you know, active
(08:34):
pushing for those 3 hours.
And my doctor came in, she's like, you know, I
think it might be time to start thinkingthrough a c section.
And I was like, this is what did me in.
I'm like, I want to give it one last shot.
And I gave it all I had to give.
And I think that's what really messed up my
universe.
I remember it's funny, too, because you know
how they bring you all that paperwork you haveto sign, but in the moment, it's just kind of
(08:58):
like, it's so out of body.
I'm like, does my signature even, oh, I
remember, oh, I had to sign all this stuff.
And it was.
I remember feeling like it was a very weirdthing.
Like, it was so out of body.
I'm like, is my signature valid right now?
Because I don't even know what I'm saying, butit was, I have to give such a huge shout out
(09:21):
to Doylestown Hospital, which is where Ilabored and delivered.
I was in the hospital for five days, or Ithink it was five days total to recover,
because then my hemoglobin, I think it was,was so low, two days later, they had to give
me another.
I had, I think it was two blood transfusions
immediately because I lost so much blood.
And then I needed another one two days later
(09:42):
because I was still so, like, not doing great,but it was very, like, the staff there.
Like, I remember even the janitorial staff,everybody, they were angels.
Like, not only do I credit them with saving mylife, everybody was family.
Like, you see a woman in distress, and justeverybody was all hands on deck.
(10:06):
Like, when they took my catheter out to go tothe bathroom, which was, I want to say, a full
day later, they kept me catheterized because Iwas I couldn't really move.
And you know that first moment where you standup for the first time after a c section and
you just feel like, am I ever going to be ableto bend at the waist again?
Cassy (10:26):
Like, it's really fun.
Feelings.
My favorite is, like, when it feels like allyour organs are sloshing around.
Emily (10:35):
You'Re like, if I take a step, are they going to, like, zombie style?
Cassy (10:38):
They're going to fall out?
Emily (10:40):
Yeah. Like, I don't know.
And I do.
I don't.
It's funny how, like, your mind kind of, like,
protects you from, like, remembering the exactfeel of the pain, but I just remember it was
like, the agony was unbelievable.
It took two of the nurses to help me walk to
the bathroom, and a maintenance lady waswalking by and she glanced in the my hospital
(11:04):
room and she saw that, like, I was absolutelynot okay.
And I will never forget her droppingeverything to also rush in and help me.
Perfect strangers.
Like, just.
It was.
It's amazing how with birth, like, we women,
we are all one.
Like, and that's how it should be.
Regardless of your birth experience, whetherit was amazing and a dream and you're like,
(11:28):
gung ho to do this again ASAP because it was agreat experience or you are severely
traumatized from the whole thing.
You know, I just.
I love that I see women and I try to be thiswoman.
You know, we're checking in on new moms.
We're appreciating and respecting that fourth
trimester.
We are, you know, asking how the baby sleeps.
We're offering to babysit, we're offering tobring food.
(11:48):
We're trying to.
It all comes down, I think, to validation my
experience.
Your experience, like, it's all valid, it's
all real.
However we're processing, it is all genuine.
And we just.
Maybe it sounds cliche, but we have to be that
village.
Cassy (12:04):
Yeah. Because it's.
Emily (12:06):
It's.
Cassy (12:07):
It's hard.
I will say that it's easier just for anyone
who's listening and maybe like, oh, my gosh.
I've had scheduled.
Emily (12:16):
Recovery.
Cassy (12:17):
The reason I asked if you labored first, the recovery between my first one after
I had labored for 16 hours versus the otherfour, which were all scheduled, was like night
and day.
Emily (12:27):
That is what I hear.
Yeah.
Cassy (12:29):
It was so much easier.
So if you have a scheduled C section, you
know, it is about a million times easier notto say that, like, the ones that are
emergencies, like, it's not the end of theworld, you know, like, right.
Emily (12:40):
It's.
Cassy (12:41):
You get through it you'll survive.
You'll be okay.
At least it doesn't hurt when you pee.
That all I can say.
I don't know.
Emily (12:49):
That is exactly right.
And I'll say this, too.
Like, they prescribed me Percocet for, like, awhile, and I weaned myself off before I cut
the dose.
They prescribed me in half almost immediately
because I don't like being on intensivepainkillers.
I was starting to breastfeed, and it wasmanageable.
And again, what happened to me was very muchnot planned.
(13:12):
I have so many friends who have had Csections, and it was a very different
experience.
The recovery was a wildly different
experience.
So don't hear this and be afraid and think
that this is, like, a typical C sectionexperience.
It absolutely unequivocally is not.
Cassy (13:29):
So. It's second one, I was, like, doing laps around the ward, you know, because, like,
I think I had read that.
Emily (13:36):
It said, like, oh, the more you.
Cassy (13:37):
Walk, the better you'll recover.
I'm like, all right.
See how I'm feeling?It was just.
It was night and day.
Night and day.
Yeah.
Emily (13:44):
So, no. No fear, ladies.
It's.
It all works out.
And they're.
That, like, situations like that are rare.
Those are not the norm, and, you know, like.
Cassy (13:57):
Like, regardless of whether it's scheduled or planned.
And this is not to be TMI, but I think themost terrifying.
There are two things.
The most terrifying experiences after a c
section for me, and one was the first time youhad to go poo was because that was just like,
medication.
It's just, like, working against you, and it's
(14:17):
like.
It was terrifying.
Emily (14:19):
Yeah. And it takes forever.
Cassy (14:21):
Yeah. And then the first time that we had sex after the c section, because I was
terrified.
I'm like, oh, my God, I'm gonna rip something
inside, or I don't know.
And then I'm not gonna know I ripped
something, and I'm gonna lead to death, or.
I don't know.
I don't know why I was so terrified, but I wasterrified.
Yep.
Emily (14:39):
Yeah, 100%.
I think after those five ish day, four or five
ish days in the hospital, whatever it was, Ithink it took me until I got home again, TMI,
to finally, like, have a bowel movement.
I just couldn't relax, and it was.
You were on all the pains.
I remember them prescribing me in addition to
the painkillers.
(15:01):
It was some.
It was basically like a medical.
Yeah.
And, like, tom's like.
Like medical strength, and so it's.
I think I still have them somewhere in mymedicine cabinet.
And, yeah, it's, that was a very weird partbecause it was just like, you feel kind of
like your body.
I mean, in every.
You feel like your body's not your own whenyou're pregnant, but with the recovery, too,
(15:24):
it's like you have to be completelyreintroduced to your body.
And that can mess with your head as well, youknow?
Okay.
That can also affect the recovery.
And, like, case in point, I had a whole, youknow, cute going home outfit picked right to
go home with my husband and our newborn.
I went home wearing socks.
(15:45):
My daughter was born in January because I wasso swollen from all the iv's and medications
and whatever that I could not even get, like,uggs on my feet.
No shoes would fit on my feet.
I had to wear the largest size of sweatpants I
owned because I was so bloated.
And it was the funniest thing.
(16:05):
It, like, the bloating gradually went away dayby day, but it was like, first it disappeared
from my face and then it disappeared from myarms and then my stomach, but, like, it was
going down till all I had left was hobbit feetabout a week later.
But I remember I couldn't really walk, but Ihad these big old hobbit feet.
(16:25):
And my poor dad, who's just, he's the best,but he was coming over to, I don't know, watch
my baby or bring me food or something, and Iwas propped up on the couch with my feet out
in front of me.
And he couldn't help it.
Like, he just took one look and cracked up.
I'm like, I know.
They're hilarious.
Nothing fits.
I cannot wear any shoes.
Cassy (16:42):
Anyone, like, warns you about it, though.
Emily (16:44):
They do not.
They do not at all warn you about this.
Well, but if you're hearing this and you'reconcerned about that, please don't let that
scare you because I'm telling you, it goesaway quickly.
Like, you'll be a little concerned.
I do remember looking in the mirror the day
after and being in crying and saying, I looklike Fiona from Shrek.
Just get me green makeup, because why do Ibother anymore?
(17:07):
My face is twice the size it normally is.
But then by the next day, that was gone.
And then, like I said, it was like a slowdeflation head to toe.
And it does not last long in the moment.
When you first look in the mirror, you're
like, who is this person?Is this just what I look like now?
It is not.
Rest assured, it'll go as faster than you
think.
Is possible.
You are going to be just fine.
Cassy (17:29):
Well, and, I mean, I don't know if you took labor and delivery classes and stuff.
I know I did.
Obviously, that didn't count for me.
Yep.
Same about C sections in there, but they don't
tell you about any of this stuff.
It's like, so surface level, and it's like all
of these things to prepare you for labor, andthey're all things that prepare you for
(17:51):
vaginal labor.
There's lots of in depth stuff about that, but
there was no in depth anything about what toexpect if you've had a c section.
Emily (17:58):
There's, like, a little video you watch about how the process is done, but it's made
very clear that, like, this is not the normalway to give birth.
Like, that's how they make you feel.
And I think my message to moms everywhere is,
however you give birth is normal.
However you give birth, and however you give
birth is right for your body and for yourbaby.
And, you know, don't let anybody, like, Idon't know, I've just heard so much, whether
(18:23):
it's in pop culture or whatever, about how,like.
Or like, even people who are c suits, they'rec section moms, but then they make.
And if this is what you want to do, I respectit.
I think you're amazing.
I champion it.
Cassy (18:38):
I.
Emily (18:38):
This is certainly not me coming down on it, but I remember I was in, like, one of
those natural moms groups shortly after mydaughter was born.
I was looking for some solidarity.
You know, as a new mom, I learned pretty
quickly I wasn't going to find it with thecrunchy moms.
Me personally, again, if that's your thing, Irespect it 100%.
(18:59):
It just is not personally me.
And there were a lot of women talking about
VBAC births in there, so of course I had tolook it up what a VBAC was.
But it was almost like this.
I almost got the sense that these women felt
like they had something to prove to themselvesin terms of a birth experience.
And I'm like, honey, you don't.
(19:19):
Nobody.
One of the best things I ever heard about, youknow, epidural, natural birth, c section,
vaginal birth, you know, labor for 3 hours or30, like, whatever it is.
At the end of the day, nobody wins a medal.
And that stuck with me because it's true for
however you give birth, baby, nobody wins amedal for how they do that.
(19:41):
In the same.
Cassy (19:42):
I remember who phrased it as when I remember asking her, like, is it better to use
an epidural or not, use one or go, like,natural.
She said it's like flavors of ice cream.
She said there's chocolate and there's
vanilla, but one is not better than the other.
Emily (19:57):
Exactly.
And it depends on you.
I mean, it depends on everything.
And that's the same thing, you know, in my
opinion, with a birth experience.
And I think that if we would just as women, as
moms, just focus on validation and support andencouragement.
I mean, I've got friends who, like me,delivered in a hospital with an epidural.
(20:20):
They asked me what my drug, my birth plan waswhen I came to the hospital, and my honest
response was, and I quote, all the drugs.
And the nurse just kind of looked at me, what
part of my face looks like.
Cassy (20:30):
I'm joking right now.
Emily (20:32):
But then I have friends, multiple, multiple friends who did home births with
multiple children, you know, in a pool intheir living room.
And that was the right choice for them.
So it's just if we can, you know, never act
superior or whatever about our own birthexperience.
(20:53):
I mean, and I also think, you know, those ofus, especially those of us with daughters,
like, they're watching.
They're watching how we process.
They're watching how we talk about otherwomen.
They're watching how we, you know, tell themthe stories of their own birds.
These are things that, you know, they'reprocessing as, you know, eventually as they
(21:16):
get older and they think, you know, is thissomething I want to do someday?
Do I want to have a child someday?And I think the way we talk about how babies
are brought into the world, even from a youngage, is so formative for our little ones.
And it's so important that they see all of usmamas validating and championing each other
every step of the way through this journey.
Cassy (21:37):
Yeah. And I think that another thing that is maybe helpful for people to keep in
mind is that, like you talk about the VBAC, Ithink a lot of women do that because they
think if I have another C section, then I'mgoing to be limited and I'm only be able to
have two kids or whatever.
Emily (21:54):
Right?
Cassy (21:55):
And obviously, there's the big caveat here.
For some women, this is true because everyperson's body is different.
Like, everyone's body is different.
But as a rule, that's not necessarily true.
That's correct.
I've had five c sections.
I've had five.
And as of my last one, I mean, we're done
having kids for other reasons, but as of mylast one, for me personally, okay, I still did
(22:23):
not have issues that, if I had a 6th, wouldhave necessarily been like the worst thing.
I didn't have a uterine window.
I had like, scar tissue.
And that was pretty much it, you know?Yeah.
And so I just kept on checking, you know,after, after my second, you know, I made sure
to talk with the surgeon.
Okay.
How things looking there?
Emily (22:44):
Yeah, yeah.
Cassy (22:46):
She's like, you know, yeah, you look, you look pretty okay.
You know, make sure you give yourself the, youknow, year to two years to heal.
But, you know, if you, if you feel like youwant to keep going, that's fine.
And so I just made sure to consult with themafterwards each time.
Emily (22:57):
So then I.
Cassy (22:58):
What was going on? And the whole reason I say that is because you
don't feel like if you had a c section, thatmeans now you're going to be limited.
You might be.
That might be what happened with your body,
but it might not either.
Emily (23:10):
That's exactly right.
Everybody's.
I had a boyfriend years ago who.
He was one of six and all six of them c
sections.
Mom was okay.
Mom was fine.
And, you know, see, like, like you said,
everybody is so different.
Don't worry about it.
Limiting you.
Like, just focus on what is best and
healthiest for you and for your baby.
(23:35):
Yeah.
Cassy (23:35):
And I chose not to have a VBAC, and that was the right choice for me.
And if that's the choice for you, that's okay,too.
Exactly.
There's like a sense of shame of choosing to
do that out of convenience.
Like, the superior choice is a vaginal birth,
and if you're not doing everything you can toget that, then you're not doing the right
(23:59):
thing or something.
And it's like, look, you know, in my case, so
I could have had a VBAC with my second.
That was an option.
They were all about it.
They were like, yeah, you're a great
candidate.
Let's do it.
My husband was in Afghanistan.
He was not going to be home for the birth,
which.
And I already had a baby, you know?
Emily (24:20):
Yeah.
Cassy (24:21):
I'm like, okay, well, my mom's going to have to come to North Carolina from Florida to
watch my son while I'm in labor, which she'stotally up to do.
I'm like, but if I go in labor, how's shegoing to get here in time?
And then I'm going to be doing what while I'min the hospital?
I'm like, nope.
Give me the convenience of the scheduled date
and I'm just going to do that.
(24:41):
And then even with my, my third one, they even
still, this is great hospital in northCarolina.
They were like, do you want to do a VBAC aftertwo c sections?
And I'm like, um, I don't know, maybe what,what are you, what would be the, the details?
And they're like, well, you would just need todeliver in Wilmington.
You know, it was like an hour away.
Emily (24:58):
Oh, my gosh.
Cassy (24:58):
And because you've had c sections, we can't induce you.
Emily (25:01):
So just when you go to labor.
Cassy (25:02):
When you go into labor, you would just, you and your husband would drive down to
Wilmington, and I'm like, um, no, no, thankyou.
No, thank you.
Maybe that's convenience, so to speak, but I
don't think there's anything wrong with that.
You do what works best for you.
Emily (25:18):
Absolutely.
Cassy (25:19):
That's another thing that, it's like just, you have this notion where the vaginal
birth is the superior option.
It's like, no, you know what?
Do whatever works for you.
Emily (25:26):
That's exactly right.
If I could wish for one thing for my
daughter's generation, when they're dealingwith all this, when they're thinking about
having children and giving birth and all that,my hope is that at that point in time, there's
going to be no preferred way anymore.
There's not going to be any, well, this is
(25:47):
superior, or that is period.
No, no. As long as the baby and mom are
healthy and here, that is what is superior.
In the same way, you know, it's like fed is
best, you know, rather formula breast milk,you've got to figure out what works for your
family.
Born is best, however that baby is born.
And, you know, I, that is something that Ireally would love to see shift, because there
(26:10):
is that, you know, that stereotype.
There is that kind of just this feeling that,
like, there's a preferred way, there's a rightway to do this.
And no, they're really is not.
And if you're listening and you're pregnant,
or maybe it's your first time, or second orthird or fifth, whatever it is, and you are
thinking through these options, just know thatyou are loved and you are supported, and
(26:35):
whatever you decide is the right decision.
And if anybody tries to tell you differently,
you are not obligated to listen to them.
Cassy (26:47):
I'm curious, what would be your number one tip for someone that is listening, and
it's like going to have a c section?
Emily (26:54):
Like, what would you.
My number one tip for somebody who is
listening, who is having a c section is toprepare a support network as you recover,
like, do that now, if this is something youknow that you're going to do, you know,
understand that.
I think, like, like you said, you had that
baby on you within an hour, and they wantedyou to be breastfeeding and ready to go
(27:18):
regardless of how you give birth.
They typically do things like that.
Understand that it is major abdominal surgery.
You know, you will your recovery.
You're going to feel kind of funky down therefor a while.
You're going to lean against the kitchencounter for months and feel a little tingle,
you know, at least.
And, you know, it's.
(27:38):
That scar is.
It quickly became my very favorite feature
because it's better than a tattoo.
It's a symbol of me doing the strongest thing
I've ever done in my life that I never thoughtI could do.
Embrace the scar.
Don't think that it's gonna make you less
beautiful.
It's gonna enhance your beauty.
Lean into that, learn to love it.
(27:59):
It is my proudest and best feature.
And just prepare now, okay, maybe I alreadyhave older children.
Here's who's gonna watch the children line up.
Somebody maybe consider a postpartum doula.
That's something I certainly wish I knew aboutwhen I had no idea postpartum was the thing.
Cassy (28:18):
Such a great thing to exist.
Emily (28:20):
Such a great thing.
I would absolutely consider that.
I would highly recommend it.
If you have family close by, that's amazing.
See who's willing to take shifts so you cansleep.
Because guess what?You're recovering from abdominal surgery, and
babies don't like to sleep on an awesomeschedule.
And this was the biggest thing that surprisedme when I took that birthing class.
You got to wake them up every two to 3 hoursto feed them.
(28:42):
I was, you know, raised by the generation thatwas of the mindset.
You let a sleeping baby sleep.
So I was a little bit floored by that
information.
Line up as much help as you can now.
So that way, when you do come home with babyand you're recovering, you're not floundering
for help or, like, working yourself to thepoint of exhaustion, to the point where you're
going to crash and you don't have the helpwhen you need it.
Cassy (29:05):
Well, I think that it's important to remember like that, working yourself to the
bone, like it's okay if for the first month ortwo months or three months, whatever feels
best for you.
If you spend that time sitting in your bed
with your baby, and that's it, other peoplecan clean your house for you.
Other people can do other stuff for you.
You can sit there and get better and bond.
Emily (29:27):
That's all you need.
Cassy (29:27):
Absolutely.
Emily (29:28):
And anybody, take it from moms who know and who have been there, anybody that would
judge you on, I don't know, whether your foodwas homemade or you had food waiting or your
house wasn't clean or whatever.
Anybody who would judge you on having or not
having those things don't deserve a place atyour table while you're recovering.
(29:49):
Frankly, they don't deserve a place at yourtable at any point in time.
But be kind to yourself.
That's my number one tip for every mom.
Be kind to yourself.
Treat yourself to something.
Love on yourself a little bit, because guesswhat?
Everybody's going to be loving on your baby.
And that's good.
And that's right.
(30:10):
But mom sometimes kind of get forgotten.
They need a lot of love, too, especially inthose first few days, weeks, months, dare I
say that first year, you know, it's.
It's okay.
Like, one of the most powerful things a frienddid within the first two weeks of me giving
birth was drive to my house and insist you areleaving the baby with your husband and take me
(30:30):
out for coffee and, you know, find.
Find your village like that.
Let people love on you.
Don't think you have to do it all yourself
because.
Because you will.
You will feel that pressure.
You will absolutely feel that pressure.
But know that even though you feel thatpressure, it's a liar and it's okay to rest.
Cassy (30:53):
It took me until my last baby to do that, too.
Like my fifth one.
And some of the reasons we didn't do this
before, because it wasn't realistic.
So I'm giving that kind of warning first,
that, look, if this isn't possible for youbecause of your finances or your job or
whatever, you're a single parent, this mightnot be possible for you.
(31:15):
And that's okay.
You're not doing anything wrong.
You're doing the best you can.
That's all that matters.
But I will say the best recovery I had was myfifth one when my husband was like, you know,
we're going to make sure that you're able totake it easy.
And we had someone come in.
She was our regular babysitter, basically all
day.
She came in for a week afterwards, and then
(31:36):
for the rest of the month after I gave birth,she wasn't there anymore.
But he was basically, I spent the month in bedand just sat there with Felicity, our baby.
And, you know, I just would breastfeed her andsit there and we would hang out and I did not
really leave that bed at all for a month,except when I felt like I wanted to.
And that was hands down my best recovery, Ibelieve.
(31:57):
Hands down.
Emily (31:58):
Yep, 100%.
So, yeah, it's mom, take care of yourself.
Cassy (32:05):
Yeah. And, I mean, I felt guilty, you know?
But at the same time, I was also like, youknow, this is great.
And then I'm, like, feeling guilty because I'mlike, man, this is great.
Wait, I'm not supposed to feel like this isgreat.
I'm supposed to be doing mom stuff.
Emily (32:19):
Yeah, well, in society will make you feel like that.
But just like I said before, remember, anybodywho makes you feel like that, they're not your
friends.
You're going to be doing enough of that in
your own head, making yourself feel, I shouldbe doing laundry, I should be vacuuming.
I should be doing whatever.
Try not to listen to that voice.
It's hard.
(32:39):
You're going to want to, and you know, there
will be times that you will, but it's okay tolean into recovery.
Cassy (32:47):
Mm hmm. Yeah. Well, Emily, thank you so much for hanging out and talking about this
with me.
Emily (32:54):
Thanks having me.
I'm very, very blessed to be able to have the
chance to talk about this.
It's something I'm really passionate about.
And, you know, if you're listening and you'rec section mom, or you're about to be, please
feel free to reach out to me.
I'd love to talk to you.
I'd love to send you a meal or some coffee orhave the baby's born a bottle of wine.
Cassy (33:14):
Oh, yeah, yeah, for sure.
And just, you know, there's.
There's.
There's help out there, you know, even if it's
before you're getting ready, and it's likeyou're taking those stupid birthing classes
and they're not giving you any information.
It's like, oh, my gosh, I don't know what to
do.
You can reach out and we'll answer questions
for you all day long.
Absolutely.
Emily (33:33):
Let us be your village.
Cassy (33:35):
Well, I will talk to you soon, then, and I hope you have a great week.
Emily (33:41):
You too.
Cassy (33:42):
And see you next week.
Emily (33:47):
Talk to you later.
Cassy (33:55):
That's our episode for this week.
New episodes will drop every Monday.
Make sure to subscribe so you never miss out.
Leave us a review and share to help other moms
find us.
Thanks for stopping by the Fireflies and
Whoopie Pie podcast, the only podcast by SouthCentral PA moms for south central PA moms.
Until next time.
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