Manipulative Tactics in Relationships and Scams with Mindi "The Fenyx" / E31

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Music.

(00:06):
Hello and welcome to Fraud Busting Neo-Fraud's podcast.
It is the only podcast for female fraud professionals and their allies who want
to stay on top of the fraud awareness spectrum in order to thrive professionally
while maximizing their happiness and having the courage to create the the life they love.

(00:30):
Thank you for listening.
Hi, everyone, and welcome to this new episode of the Neo-Praus podcast.
Today, we have a special guest. This is Mindy, and in a minute,
she will be sharing with us her unique story and all the important insights

(00:50):
that she prepared for for us today.
But without further ado, let me provide Mindy the floor. Hi, Mindy.
Hi, thank you so much for having me here. I'm very excited and we're just going
to see what pops up today.
Thank you so much. I'm really excited to be able to talk to you today and asking

(01:10):
you the questions to tell us more about your important story.
Could you please kind of Say a few words before we start to the audience about yourself.
Yeah, absolutely. This topic always gets me a little bit because it's such a
broad question, you know, asking someone to share a little bit about themselves
because there's so many different aspects of us.

(01:31):
But I think the key things that people tend to hone in on are,
number one, a fact that people kind of like to know is that I am a solo parent.
I have three kids that I'm raising entirely by myself.
Actually, my oldest daughter, she's an adult now.
Shocking, shocking, but I was a young mother, and so she's now 25,
and I also have an almost 16-year-old son and a 14-year-old daughter.

(01:55):
So a solo parent that became a solo parent overnight back in 2016,
that's a big part of my story because even during my marriage,
I went through a very, very, very deep, dark depression.
I was struggling with a lot of different things, my own identity,
the dynamics of the relationship itself being very toxic, which I know is a

(02:18):
hot topic for a lot of people.
But when you're someone who's navigating those things, there can be a lot of
shame that's associated with different aspects of the relationship.
You can feel very isolated and very alone, especially if it's a dynamic where
there's a lot of toxicity.
And I know there's terms that are
thrown around a lot with narcissism and gaslighting and things like that.

(02:40):
But I had become someone who very much lost my my self-identity,
even though I'm a very intelligent person, I'm a very strong person,
you'd be shocked at situations that you can find yourself in that you would
have never in a million years dreamed that you would be in.
So I'm someone who, in many respects, I feel like I'm just a human.
I'm just me. I'm like anybody else.

(03:01):
And at the same time, I've been through trauma and drama like most humans that walk this planet.
But I am someone who is very passionate about being vulnerable and being very
transparent about the sharing of my story because there's a quote that really
impacted me that I heard one time that says,

(03:22):
sharing your story can be the key that unlocks someone else's prison.
And I think that a lot of times when we keep the things to ourselves that we
might be embarrassed about or ashamed of, or, you know, that parts of our stories
in our lives that we attach as.
Failures, you know, mistakes that we've made or things that have happened that

(03:43):
we might be embarrassed about.
It's what I found for myself personally, is that it is those things that that
actually create human connection.
And I think we live in a world where human connection is so craved.
People are really craving to feel seen and to feel heard and to feel valued.
And when we are isolating ourselves or aspects of ourselves and presenting forward almost like this,

(04:09):
painted, you know, Stepford Wives type persona that is very,
you know, the highlight reels of of our lives, it can effectively create more
isolation because perfectionism just isn't relatable. We all are messy in our own way.
So I really just kind of developed a strong passion for being able to share my story,

(04:30):
even though that can be scary because when you put things out there that you
might not necessarily feel proud about or, you know, that could potentially
be misconstrued or, you know, I've definitely been subject of a lot of criticism,
a lot of condemnation, a lot of, you know, losing friends,
losing, you know, people in my life that has been something that's happened.

(04:53):
So I have lived my worst fears about many things.
And now I stand as someone who went from being that extremely depressed,
feeling very hopeless, very helpless,
you know, the victim, all of those things, to being someone today who has really
redefined how I see myself.

(05:13):
How I see my past, how I'm able to navigate the things that I go through presently
and also the impact that I'm able to create in the sharing of my story and my journey.
And I'm just very, very, it really is my soul's purpose to be able to share

(05:33):
all of that with the intention of providing hope and inspiration and encouragement
and support to other women who have either been through stuff or are going through stuff.
And they could just use use that breath of oxygen to know that someone else
out there understands them.
Even if I haven't walked your path, the exact same steps and nobody has,

(05:56):
I am someone that can relate to almost anything because of the things that I've been through.
And I just really feel like that's something that's very needed in our world
right now. And that's why I'm here.
Thank you. Thank you so much, Mindy, for this kind of brief description of your story,
but also So your intentions, you know, for sharing your story,

(06:19):
it really much aligns with my preference for guests.
And I guess that's why I was impressed with your topics.
You're usually speaking about and decided to invite you to my podcast,
which I'm really happy about.
That's exactly what you just described. My intentions are also featuring guests

(06:40):
with real stories from real life, simply to remind ourselves and the listeners that life isn't about,
you know, all the pretty things and all the high level perfection,
but life is real and anyone could could be in different, different situations
where it's difficult to deal with,

(07:04):
especially when there is no previous experience or you haven't even heard anyone
going through something similar.
And so interviews such as this one with you can be extremely helpful to people
to be knowledgeable knowledgeable about possibilities of being in some difficult situations or either,

(07:26):
you know, some simple tips,
if you will,
for how to deal with difficult situations.
I'm sorry, maybe I should not say that, but I'm sorry you've been through, as a human,
through these difficulties difficulties in your life because no,

(07:47):
no human deserves, you know, to be, to be in horrible.
Aspects, you know, of, of the daily life.
And I see in front of me today, an extremely beautiful person.
My listeners will not be able to see the video of this recording,
but, but I am sure there will be a beautiful photo of you too, for them to see.

(08:09):
And, and I'm really, you know, grateful for you being the guest on today's show.
Okay. So without further ado, let me ask you the question.
Could you please share the story with the listeners, your personal story?
Goodness, again, it's like, how do you possibly summarize that in a very small amount of time?

(08:30):
I can give you sort of the cliff notes version. And of course,
there's so much more depth to all of this, but I'm going to try and speed through it very quickly.
I was raised very, very conservatively way out in the middle of nowhere.
I had an extremely primitive upbringing bringing.
And I was raised in an environment that I actually didn't feel great in.

(08:53):
I had a lot of, you know, you're not good enough.
You're never going to amount to anything. You're stupid. You're good for nothing.
You're fat. You're a pig. You know, there's just a lot of negativity.
And so at a young age, I just, it's like you look to the people in your life
when you're young like that, And you kind of adapt those things as truth for you because it's like,

(09:15):
why would someone say those things about me if they weren't true?
And so I really took on a lot of things as truths for me because of the environment that I had.
And that ended up dramatically impacting my own view of myself, my self-worth.
I had very low confidence. I had very low view of myself in general.

(09:36):
And yet at the same time, just the core of who I am, my DNA,
I'm someone who's kind of a little bit of a rebel.
If you see me, you would know that. And it's kind of like I had this determination
that I did not want to be average.
When I was told that I was good for nothing and wouldn't amount to anything,
it was kind of like, I will prove you wrong.

(09:57):
I'm going to show you, you know, you're going to be the last one laughing.
And I just really, I just really was determined to not be average.
I mean, that was just a core thing for me. I will never be average.
I will never be mediocre.
I will be somebody. I will be somebody. I'm going to prove everybody wrong.
So I had that kind of sassy fierceness about me just kind of in my DNA and who I was.

(10:20):
And yet, I had sort of like that conflicting thing going on where it's like I didn't feel like I had.
Value. To an extent, I was very insecure and I was very naive.
I was very trusting. I'm a, I'm an empathetic person.
And so that personality right there can be someone that can be very easily preyed
on by people who, you know, I'm sure this podcast is about broad awareness and things like that.

(10:44):
And there are certain personality types that hone in on people exactly like me.
They make the perfect recipe for coercion and manipulation and different things like that.
So I was the the walking poster for probably anybody who wants to zone in on
someone like that because I was insecure and I was naive.

(11:06):
I was very sheltered and I was just empathetic person.
I was very sensitive and those are beautiful qualities.
Those are absolutely beautiful qualities and I've learned to appreciate that
part of myself and be able to retain that part of myself even though I have
endured enormous amounts of trauma that could have potentially been avoided

(11:27):
had I understood the dynamics of what was happening.
So anyways, I got married very young. I was a young mother. I got married at 18.
I had my daughter just after I turned 19.
I ended up a single parent for the first time when I was 21.
And my husband at the time, what turned out to be a criminal,
He ended up incarcerated.

(11:48):
And so there was a lot of, I mean, you imagine like 21 years old,
you're typically maybe graduating from college.
You're kind of just starting and maybe you're partying and all of that.
I was someone who found myself a single mother at the age of 21 with a two-year-old.
So it was, my life started out being completely different than what I had ever
dreamed that it would be.
I had all those aspirations about being, you know, a successful singer and I

(12:10):
wanted to be an Olympic ice skater and I had all these dreams like little girls
do. but yet I found myself at 21 already in a state where I was completely.
Not in accordance with what I had imagined for myself. And so fast forward two
and a half years later, I ended up getting married for a second time.
And that marriage was one of those slow burn situations where going into the

(12:36):
relationship, I had no idea that who I had married would become who that person ended up becoming.
And I also didn't understand the things that
I understand looking backwards it's like that thing where hindsight is
always 20 20 so I can look back
and I've learned so many different things from that relationship where

(12:56):
a lot of women who have been in situations like this with toxic dynamics and
and who experience the relationships where it's very much there's a lot of gaslighting
you're always the problem all those things you don't even realize that's what's
happening and there's a lot of women who would say to someone like me me,
oh, I would never, you know, I would never be in that situation.

(13:18):
I would never let someone talk to me like that. I would, you know,
it's like you say those things, but like I said, or maybe I,
maybe I didn't say this, but you, you think you would know what you would do in a situation.
You truly believe wholeheartedly that you would know what you would do in a situation.
And I have said those same things where I would never do this,
or I would for sure do this, or I wouldn't put up with that.

(13:38):
And it's like, until you are actually living that exact same same situation
as someone else, which is very hard to do because we all have our own individual life path.
Unless you're walking those exact same circumstances, I have learned to keep
my mouth shut because you just never know.
You can end up in a situation and you thought you knew what you would do and
it would be something completely different.
So I found myself in a slow burn relationship where it transcended from being

(14:04):
something that was, I guess what you could say say, from an external view,
a fairly normal relationship,
a fairly normal marriage.
But it took on forms over time that developed.
It's kind of like that frog in the water analogy.
You don't even realize what's happening because it's happening so slowly.

(14:26):
Because I was someone who would never be put in a situation where somebody would
tell me hateful things or be overtly abusive or whatever.
I was someone who it's like, I was so stubborn and headstrong.
You can't treat me like that. Even though I didn't have a healthy self-esteem
that I did have certain boundaries, but that type of person understands exactly

(14:49):
how to manipulate every single personality.
And so for, in my case, the way that it was handled with me was manipulation through my compassion.
So there was always this underlying victimness where I needed to be the one that was helping.
It's like, he always had problems. I needed to be the one that was helping in

(15:10):
the problems, solving the problems, fixing the problems.
And so I thought, and I, in my insecurity and also being someone who loves to
help people at my core, I love to help people.
And so it was like, ooh, it turned into what I now recognize as having a little
bit of that savior complex where I just really wanted to help and I was benefiting
this person and I was making a positive difference when in reality,

(15:32):
I didn't understand some of the underlying psychology that was happening where
I was being positioned and I'm getting very deep in this and I am not meaning
to, I want to kind of just kind of go over some basics, but there was conditioning that was happening.
So in this process of the totality that I was married to this person for approximately,

(15:53):
I think by the time I am divorced again, I've been married twice, divorced twice.
And that marriage, my second marriage lasted approximately 12 years.
And in that time it it
took on so many different was like a chameleon it
took on so many different identities in that
relationship where I would have

(16:14):
never from the day one that I began that relationship till the time that it
ended it it was not even recognizable anymore it was completely different my
second husband also ended up being a criminal he also became incarcerated and
so there There was a lot of that. I mean, if you can...
Even put yourself in my shoes, or even there are people that are listening to

(16:38):
this that I'm sure are already having judgmental points of view towards me.
Lightning strikes twice. Really? You married two criminals?
I mean, I had this poured into me all the time saying, you know,
you're, you clearly, your picker is broken.
You don't know how to pick a guy. You know, why are you attracting people who are criminals?
And it's like that my first husband was a theology major.
He was a pastor before I, an assistant pastor before I met him.

(17:01):
My second husband was somebody who was our, our friends were family.
I'm saying that backwards. Our families were friends. Our sisters were best friends.
This was not like it was some rando person that, you know, I,
I, lots of people successfully meet people online.
So I'm not trying to knock that, but I'm, I'm just saying that there was no
way there was no way that I would have known that the people that I had married

(17:23):
would end up being the people who I had married.
And so a lot of people cast judgments when they don't really understand,
because these things are not easy to explain.
They're extremely complex. They're psychologically complex.
And now I have this awareness because of everything that I've learned about
it. I've studied up a lot on these things.

(17:43):
So my story, like I said, my second husband did end up in prison in 2016.
I found myself a single parent again for the second time.
And at this point, we had had two children in this marriage.
So I now had three children and my youngest two at the time were,
I believe, four and five years old. So it was completely and utterly devastating.

(18:07):
They lost their dad overnight. There was no explanation that I could give them
in a way that they would understand it.
That was one of the hardest conversations I've ever had to have of your this
person is gone and not coming back. And it's like a death for them.
So I navigated all of these things and I had went through my own depression
in all of this where I was the problem constantly and I was an emotional eater.

(18:29):
So I put on an enormous amount of weight. I was almost 300 pounds and I had
a lot of negativity attached to that because from a young age,
I was told I was knocked about being a pig and all these kinds of things.
And so I had associated failure as my identity and that I was like,

(18:51):
look at the life that I have created.
Even while I was married, I was absolutely miserable.
And because I was constantly told that I was the problem. And like I said,
this was a slow burn situation.
It did not start out that way. but over time little
by little by little by little your your confidence starts
to get even worse and you start to
start to sort of take on some of these beliefs as as maybe they're true or you

(19:16):
start to second guess yourself because they're very very good at twisting the
truth in a way that you can't even really tell what's true anymore they're very
good at being masterful with their words and with their manipulation techniques.
And I didn't see it at the time, but I was convinced to go to therapy so that I could fix my issues.

(19:38):
And so I was seeing multiple therapists. I was tried on multiple different medications.
And it was actually during my therapy that my therapists were actually seeing
some of the dynamics that were going on because obviously they have been doing
these things for a long time.
And even though therapists typically typically aren't meant to give you advice.

(19:58):
They're more about asking questions and helping you find your own answers.
They saw some things happening and they were starting to help me see that there was a lot of.
Of threats going on. I was having threats of, you know, he would get a gun and
he would carry the gun and he would talk about how he would do something to himself.

(20:19):
He didn't know if he could take it anymore. His life was so miserable and he
would disappear from the house with the only vehicle that we had and send me GPS coordinates.
And, you know, I don't know if I can make it, but here's the GPS coordinates
to the car so that you still have a car.
You know, it was all this kind of thing. So I lived in this paranoia of something
might happen and I would worry about would I come home sometime and find him somewhere.

(20:43):
Or it was like I lived in this constant state of I need to keep everything okay.
I need to keep everything peaceful.
I need to make sure that the home environment is not going to be something that makes him snap.
And he was also on medications and seeing therapists and different things.
So the therapists were the ones that really started to to help me understand

(21:04):
some of what was going on and to say, you know what, you're actually being manipulated.
A lot of people are giving empty threats and, and, you know,
it would be really interesting if you kind of, I forget how they put it,
but basically they were like, call his bluff, which I know can be not something that's recommended.
I'm not telling you what to do. I am not a therapist. I'm not giving any official,

(21:25):
don't hold me accountable for any of this. I'm just sharing my own personal story.
But what happened was before, like I said, the manipulation was more happening
in the case of being the victim.
It's like where I was sympathetic and, you know, my life is so miserable and,
and you're helping me so much.
And, and, and, you know, he went through physical pain, so I'd have to,
you know, deal with some of that and, and got addicted to pain meds and having

(21:48):
to help him get off of the pain meds and going through withdrawals and all that.
So I was the one that was essentially kind of needing to be the.
I was always the one that had to figure it out. I had to figure out,
you know, the financial problems.
I was the one that had to figure out whenever our house was foreclosed and had
to figure out the new place to go and had to figure out where the money was gonna come from.
And so it's almost like I was now seeing this person as another person I had to take care of.

(22:13):
It was like having an additional child and not a relationship where I felt supported.
And it was very opposite.
So I built a lot of strength, I will say that.
I was already a strong person, but I built a lot of strength just because of
the dynamics of the relationship.
But I also felt completely bitter. I felt worn out.

(22:33):
I felt, you know, it was very imbalanced, very imbalanced relationship.
And I had a lot of depression because I felt like I had gotten myself into a
situation that I didn't feel like I had any possibility of getting out of.
Because when I did start getting to the point where I pushed back,
where I was more apathetic about the threats, threats where they weren't impacting

(22:54):
me so much, then it did shift from more of that, you know, victim me,
like I, I, you're helping me, you're making such a big difference.
My life is better because of you, but I'm still struggling, blah, blah, blah.
It shifted to definitely more of the actual threats of, if you think you're
ever going to divorce me and get away with it, I'm going to make your life a living hell.
It, it really turned more into the actual threats and, you know,

(23:17):
carrying the gun around.
He worked from home, so he had the gun on his desk and, you know,
just, It turned more of a fear-based situation.
And this is a time where I didn't even have any knowledge of any criminal activity
that was happening on his part.
This was just the dynamics of the relationship itself.
So I'm trying to think of where I know I've said a whole lot of stuff here,

(23:40):
but there's a lot that I've navigated and a lot that I have realized as I've
reflected back over over what did I learn from these situations and how was
I able to rebuild myself after all of this?
Because a lot of women can slip into some different things. They can't,
a lot of women, for one thing,
to identify themselves. It's like they connect themselves to the situation as women.

(24:05):
We take personal responsibility for a lot of things that we actually aren't
meant to take personal responsibility for.
As I look back, I would have a
lot of frustration towards my past self and like, oh, how did you do this?
How did you put up with this? Why did you put up with this? How did this happen?
I did a lot of that sort of self-analysis and doing an audit over myself and

(24:28):
my life because even though I could have never known that I would have married
the people that I married or who they would have become or what would have happened,
I do not take responsibility for that. That is not mine to own.
However, when you see some commonalities happening, you have to sort of ask
yourself the question, how did this happen?
How did this happen to me twice? And it's rare that a person ends up with someone

(24:50):
who has that, you know, a criminal, a criminal, we'll just say that.
And for it to happen twice for me. So I did start to look back and I did start
to see, were there any common themes?
Is there a way that I could have recognized some of these things, knowing what I know now?
I did not see it then, but looking in retrospect, I clearly see red flags.

(25:14):
Red flags were everywhere from the beginning, but I didn't have the emotional
intelligence back then. I didn't have the understanding, the wisdom, the education.
And so one thing I want to say right here is there's a quote that I saw one
time and I can't remember.
I'm going to botch it up, not do it any justice. But the quote said something
like, forgive yourself for not knowing the things that you didn't know back

(25:39):
then when you were going through what you were going through.
And I feel like that is so important because I would have so much shame about
myself and and who I was, and the path that I had walked, even though,
like I said, I wasn't personally responsible for the decisions that they made,
that my ex-husbands made, there was still...

(26:00):
I was still like, how, why I was so frustrated with that past version of myself, you know?
And it's like, I realize now that I was holding myself accountable,
my past self accountable for knowledge and life experience and emotional intelligence
that I had now, but I didn't have that back then.
So it's like I did the best that I knew how with who I was at the time,

(26:22):
the support that I had at the time, the confidence that I had at the time,
the resources that I had at the time,
the knowledge that I had at the time, everything that I had at the time was what created.
And you can look back and say it was a huge flop, failure, whatever.
But that is, I made the best decisions that I knew how with all of those factors.

(26:42):
So for anybody listening right now, that's so important for you to give yourself
some grace, give yourself some compassion, because life is messy.
And we all have stuff that we go through. You have your own stuff.
I have my own stuff and you might not be able to relate to mine exactly,
but we all have stuff that we go through.

(27:03):
And what I have learned is that in this process, it's been one of the hardest
things I've went through wave after wave, after wave, after wave.
These are just touching some extremely, you know, highlight details about the
whole thing. Very surface level.
There's a lot more depth to this. I mean, I've lost a baby late in pregnancy.

(27:25):
And I mean, there's been so many different things.
And I used to see all of those as massive failures, huge mistakes that I had
made, things that I was embarrassed about. I'm like, oh, my gosh, I have kids now.
I don't want them to know all these things about me, whatever.
Now, this is the importance of being able to reframe things,
which is a huge part of what I'm here to help other people do,

(27:47):
is to understand things from a different context.
I do not see my past life and the things that I have been through as things.
From a negative standpoint, what I mean by that doesn't mean that things that
happened weren't negative.
Of course, there's trauma, there's drama, and I'm not trying to dismiss that
or anything that you might be going through.

(28:08):
However, I see all of those now as tools that I have in my tool belt that I
can now be able to speak towards something with authority and conviction because
I've been through it. I've lived it.
I understand it. And especially being someone who's very sympathetic,
empathetic, I can exceptionally emotionally understand those on a deep level,
even things that I haven't actually lived out because I have that level of ability

(28:31):
to put myself literally in someone else's shoes and feel what you feel,
think what you think, think how it must have felt to be that person.
So I now see all of that as huge benefits.
Anybody that you read about in history books, the people who are legends,
you look at their lives and I guarantee you, I don't think any,
nobody that I know, who we know as a very impactful world changer,

(28:55):
somebody who has made a significant impact on this planet, none of those people have had easy lives.
You look back and they've had piles and piles and piles and piles and trails,
like longer than you could possibly even trace of failures and massive mistakes
over and over and over again.
So that's one of the things that I have learned is that my story, when I look back.

(29:18):
I was designed to be a freaking badass.
Like my story, I'm not here to play small.
And my story is a story that can have a tremendous impact if I share it.
And your story is the same. And I'm not pressuring or shaming or trying to put

(29:38):
anybody in a situation about sharing their story.
That's up to you. You can do it however you want to do it or not do it.
That's completely up to you. But what I do want to say is that I am who I am.
And I absolutely love who I am, even though, and I don't say that from an inflated
place or from a pious or I'm better than anybody else. It's not that at all. all.
I love who I am from a place of, I have so much compassion and so much grace

(30:04):
for the person that I was and the life that I have lived.
Because as much as I used to have negativity and frustration towards the past
version of me, I now see that as, you know what, that girl.
That 19 year old, that 18 year old, that 21 year old, that, you know,
that person who was going to to that therapist's office and who was being tried

(30:25):
on medications and who was going through all of those years of yo-yoing on diets and,
you know, all kinds of eating disorders and all of those things, that girl,
she somehow,
even though she felt so hopeless and so helpless,
she went one more day.
She went one more day and then she went one more day, even though she had the suicidal thoughts,

(30:49):
even though she thought about being someone who cut herself because it That
was the only way that she could think of releasing pain and frustration and
all the inner turmoil that she was feeling without hurting anybody else.
She showed up one more day.
And that girl is who walked me to who I am today.
I can't begrudge her. I can't be upset at her for any decisions or choices or mistakes that she made.

(31:14):
She actually is how I became who I am today.
And it is the circumstances and all of the things that I have navigated, all of the tears.
All of the betrayals, all of the rumors that have been spread about me,
all of the criticism, all of the people who have walked out of my life because
they made assumptions or believed lies that were completely not even anything close to the truth,

(31:39):
my worst fears, I have lived my worst fears, and I stand here before you,
someone who is more confident, more powerful, more impactful, more inspiring,
stronger than ever before, and it is because of how I have chosen to view and
to perceive the things that have happened to me. That part is a choice.

(32:00):
We can't always, always have complete control over the things that have happened
to us in our lives, but we have a thousand percent control over how we choose
to perceive those things and what we do with those things.
And there's a story I'll say really quick about twin brothers that were raised

(32:21):
by an alcoholic father who was in and out of prison.
And the boys one of them became a
massive success business just you
know like trajectory was completely opposite of what his dad
did the other the other son when he grew up was just like his father the alcoholic
in and out of prison and there was a reporter that was so fascinated by that

(32:41):
how how they could be so dramatically different they were raised under the same
environment the same conditions and all of that how one turned out so dramatically
different than the other one.
So he interviewed both of them and asked them that question.
And both of them had essentially the same response. And the response was with
a father like I had, how could I have turned out any other way?

(33:02):
And so what I have found, and this is going to be a little bit of tough love.
And if you know me, I am so big about love. I love humans.
I love, love, love humans. And I love encouraging and I love supporting people.
And I have been someone who is the victim and I was in the victim mentality
and I had every right to be honest and it's okay.
You know, I wallowed for a while and I had the self-pity and all of that.

(33:24):
But I also think that there is a time for us to take some stake and to have
an honest conversation with ourselves. selves.
And I want to send so much love and infuse you with so much love right now,
because this is actually a very empowering thing that I'm going to say to you
is that you absolutely get to choose how you move forward from here.
The reason why I'm standing here today as who I am today with the success that

(33:48):
I've had, I built a successful online business.
I'm not even here to promote anything about that.
I really am here just to share my story to help inspire and uplift. lift.
But I am someone who has walked this path and who has proven that good,
beautiful things can absolutely come from brokenness. Brokenness is one of the most beautiful things.
People resent brokenness. They don't want to talk about brokenness.

(34:11):
The word brokenness already has a negative connotation. Not to me, not to me at all.
I can tell you all day long how beneficial brokenness can be and all the reasons why that is.
So I want to be someone that shows you that the way that you perceive what has
happened to you and the way that you choose to reframe it as all of this,

(34:33):
even though I would never wish it on anybody else.
And it was absolutely horrifyingly painful numerous times in numerous ways.
It has, I have chosen.
I say that differently because I don't want to give credit to the thing or to
the person who created the trauma. There's no credit there.

(34:54):
But I will say that how I have chosen to navigate those things that have happened
to me or in my life is what has been the thing that has changed the trajectory
of my life a thousand fold.
I am not the same person today that I was. my life looks nothing different than nothing.

(35:17):
Like it looks completely different. It looks nothing like what it used to look like.
And that all comes down to when I say, when I'm talking about changing your
perception and, you know, choosing how you want to see things,
you might be in a situation where you're like, but how, but how,
but how, but how, and I really don't have time to go into all of that.
But what I will say is that the biggest thing for me.

(35:38):
Is that I put a enormous intentional focus.
This does not happen by happenstance. You can't just live your life reactively
and it just works out this way.
It took intentional focus on my part to,
and this term is thrown around a lot, but, and a lot of people have,
you know, whatever perceptions about it, but the mindset, your mindset will

(36:02):
absolutely make you or break you.
And when you're able to take take complete self-responsibility and take complete
self-leadership in your life where you are no longer, I was someone who was
looking for everything on the external.
I needed other people to validate me. I needed other people to help, help show my value.
I needed people to help see my worthiness and to be able to help see that I

(36:25):
was, you know, I don't know what, whatever I, my point is that I needed,
you know, I needed the money to be able to show me that I felt solid and unstable.
I needed the career to be able to, you know, make me feel like, okay, I'm successful.
If you are needing anything on the external, in order for you to feel whatever

(36:45):
the thing is, whatever the feeling is, in order for you to feel loved,
in order for you to feel safe, in order for you to feel stable,
in order for you to feel successful, in order for you to feel valuable,
that puts your, that holds you hostage.
Because what I have found that the truth is, and this is why you can get to
a state of almost being invincible and I will tell you you can absolutely be

(37:06):
your own superhero because when you get to the point where you're not looking
there's no circumstance that you need orchestrated in order for you to,
know that you are valuable know that you matter to know that you are worthy
if nothing on the the external is attached to that, you are unstoppable.

(37:30):
You are absolutely limitless. There's nothing that can be taken from you.
You could lose it all because believe me, this has happened to me numerous times.
I've completely lost it all. I've been the person that's sold plasma to be able to get groceries.
I've been in line at the food bank. I mean, I have been at the absolute lowest
of the lowest of the lowest of the lowest of the low.
I was homeless for three months when I was a single parent.

(37:52):
So I mean, I've been through all all that stuff. And I've gotten to the point
because I lived it, that's the thing, because I lived it, that is why I'm able
to talk to you from a position of conviction and authority on these things because I've lived it.
And I got to the place where I realized, you know what? None of it matters.
None of it made my value any different than it is right now.

(38:13):
My status, my income, my relationships.
It can feel good. It can feel nice to have, but I'm at a place now where I am
so solid and so stable that,
take away the money, take away the relationships, take away whatever it is,
and I know that I am still completely and utterly worthy, and you are too.

(38:35):
That's the biggest message. If I could get one message across to every single
woman or human being on this planet, it would be to truly understand and own
your worthiness, which is a process.
Process that is a process that is a process of undoing
the conditioning the the belief systems
which beliefs are just thoughts that you keep thinking a

(38:56):
belief just because you believe it isn't actually doesn't the truth has nothing
to do with that you can believe something that is completely not truth because
it's just a thought that you repetitively think and now you think it's a belief
and it's not actually you can undo your belief systems and that's what I had
to do and I I did that through enormous amounts of personal development,
I prioritized, I intentionally focused on my personal development continuously.

(39:21):
Whether that was listening to podcasts, I have a whole list of podcasts that
were super impactful to me in shifting my mindset.
And so when I was doing laundry, when I was driving, when I was cooking,
cleaning, whatever, I would listen sometimes hours a day.
You think you don't have hours a day? What are you doing with your time?
You know, I'm not trying to shame you.

(39:42):
I'm just saying I knew that I had an intense situation in my life and I knew
that it called for intense amounts of shifting my belief systems because my
belief systems and how I viewed myself was what was actually attracting the
dynamics that I was living,
the people that I got in relationships with.
All of that had to do with the beliefs about myself, how I viewed myself.

(40:05):
That's how I was able to even get into a relationship with someone who turned
out to be the way that they were.
So that's why I'm so, so, so passionate about sharing specifically with you about your mindset.
Even though it sounds so simple, it is so powerful.
Mindset, personal development, I read books, all kinds of books on failing forward

(40:30):
and how to shift your mindset about different things.
There's so many incredible authors that will help you see that failure, mistakes.
Imperfection creates connection. Why are we trying to be so freaking perfect?
Perfect when I see the person who shows up as a hot mess, not in a like deprecating
or victim way, but when I see someone who's like, oh my gosh,

(40:51):
you know, like I'm, I'm a hot mess, but I'm showing up today.
And you know, they're there, whatever, whatever the thing is,
I'm like, that inspires me because it makes me feel like, okay,
she can show up. She's not doing this perfectly.
I can show up. And, and then me, someone seeing me doing that,
when I saw people people who were, when I saw other people, when I was in my,

(41:13):
you know, my days where I was,
very morbidly obese and literally hurt to exist, walking hurt,
couldn't tie my own shoes.
When I would see other people who would be doing workouts online,
you know, or, or somewhere, and they didn't look like those perfectly in shape,
you know, six pack abs type people.

(41:34):
I was like, that is so inspiring that, that I love to see people just being
authentically who they are.
So whenever you're feeling, you know, like somehow the stuff that you've been
through that people, yeah, there might be people who have judged you.
I've for sure had that. Yeah. People might, I for sure had that,

(41:57):
but you know what? It's made me more resilient.
I it's made me more more thick skinned. It's made me, I have so much more mental
fortitude because I've navigated those things and I've come out on the other
side and I've chosen how I'm going to handle those things.
And I'm going to use those things to empower myself and not to disempower myself.
Cause I get to choose that. You get to choose that because of all that.

(42:20):
Oh my gosh. My life has taken on such an incredible, it's not perfect.
Nobody's perfect, but that's my point. tonight, be your imperfect self,
be your authentic self, share the parts of you that might feel a little bit of a stretch.
And you might be like, Ooh, this feels a little bit scary. And somebody out
there, even if it's, it doesn't have to be on a big platform,
like, you know, me doing these podcasts.

(42:42):
It doesn't have to look like that. It doesn't have to look like my social media posts.
I'm like burying my whole self out on social media. I had no idea who all sees
it, you know, fraud awareness, whatever.
She's probably like, yeah, you're probably sharing too much, but but I share it.
I share stuff and, but share what, you know, my advice would be to start sharing your.

(43:02):
Things in a format. Maybe it's in a Facebook group that's small.
Maybe it's with one person. You go out for coffee and find some way to be able
to open up a little bit to practice being vulnerable just a little bit.
And it doesn't mean you have to tell your whole life story like I'm doing,
but sharing parts of that. It's incredible.

(43:23):
First of all, it's very healing to you.
It adds additional layers of healing to yourself as you do this because whatever
you keep in the dark stays in the dark and whatever you expose to the light
can actually be healed and you can shift it out and it doesn't impact you in a negative way anymore.
So I feel like I've said a whole bunch of stuff and hopefully it made sense

(43:43):
and it was constructed in a way that kind of landed in some form or fashion,
but I'm going to pause there and see if there's anything you wanted to say or ask me specifically.
Excuse me, Mindy. First of all, this episode I feel like is one of the best,
if not the best, episodes I've ever done.
Oh my God. Simply because it's a real story, number one.

(44:08):
Number two, you've made an amazing and excellent analysis of the situation and
the trajectory and the path you went through.
And not only that, but you added to it how to move forward from something difficult
that you've been through. And that's amazing.
That in itself, to me, is a wealth of knowledge, is an educational piece,

(44:35):
because now you're offering great analysis of difficulties someone could be
potentially going through to one degree or another in their lives.
But also how to navigate through that and move forward away from it and what
kind of lessons to learn and how not to lose yourself.

(44:57):
Because, hey, the life we live is only one. We are not cats.
We don't have nine lives.
Excuse me. So having said that, I think it's incredible what you're sharing
with us today and with the listeners. I, of course, do have questions for you.

(45:18):
For example, from the perspective of fraud awareness, I know you spoke about
manipulation, you spoke about gaslighting.
And with that, I'd like to mention here fraudulent situations when scammers
are trying to present themselves to people as being a regular person,

(45:41):
trying to establish a romantic relationship online with someone and then starting
to manipulate them into performing criminal acts,
such as investing into cryptocurrencies or using stolen financial information

(46:01):
in order to purchase high-end expensive items online and many, many other things.
So that in itself is a similar type of manipulation, even though it's not in
a real-life relationship, but it still affects people terribly psychologically and emotionally.

(46:22):
With that, I'd like to ask you, from your experience and the analysis that you've
made being in difficult relationships with some personalities that are manipulative,
what kind of red flags you would recommend people to watch out for now from
the perspective of someone who has the knowledge and the experience of recognizing those?

(46:48):
That will be one question I really love to ask you.
And lastly, of course, I'd like to ask you for some advice again.
I know it could be repetitive, but it's always good to hear an advice how to
remain resilient when you're going through difficulties in your life.
Thank you. Well, thank you for that. Beautiful.

(47:10):
I feel so appreciated.
So thank you for that. So yeah, the red flags thing, I feel like those are all
All over the place. And yet...
Something I want to say is that some things that in looking back are clear red
flags because things happened the way that they happened does not necessarily

(47:33):
mean that you can apply those exact same things to any situation and have that be a red flag.
Because there can be some things that could be actually very normal behavior
for someone that I know I'm not going to I'm not explaining this the right way.
I guess basically I'm just saying I'm sharing with you my experience,

(47:54):
but you I can already hear people, you know, because you're always anticipating
what you know, how could people interpret this or what could they say about
that? Or, you know, some professionals get on here.
That's like, oh, I'm a professional in the in the world of narcissism and all
this stuff and say, oh, she's completely off base or whatever.
I am just sharing my own experience.
I am not by any means claiming to be a professional or a psychologist or anything.

(48:18):
This is just a human being who had a life experience and I'm sharing it.
And so whatever you can extract from that that could potentially benefit you, awesome.
But try things on for yourself. And if it doesn't feel like a match,
throw it out the window. I always feel like people should tune into their own personal.
I'm a very spiritual person. I I really am very spiritually connected.

(48:40):
So oftentimes, if you follow me in my world, I talk about spiritual guidance.
I really filter things through my own intuition, my gut instinct,
and my spiritual guidance to really have understanding to get the clarity about
how to navigate life and just how to understand certain things and certain dynamics.
And that is one thing that I do want to point out right there is the gut.

(49:04):
Gut because these types of people do not want you to have a strong connection to your own identity.
They do not want you to be confident. They do not want you to,
to, to listen to your gut, right?
So I was learned, I was conditioned to not listen to my gut.
And then also depending on what your experience is in the toxic relationship,

(49:27):
a lot of times people can, can start to misinterpret.
There, well, I guess you could say your, your gut, you know,
you feel like, oh, my gut was telling me this or whatever.
And, and sometimes you can actually be conditioned for your gut to, to kind of misfire.
It's kind of like some, it's kind of like how a lot of women who are drawn to,

(49:51):
abusive men and they, they're in this continuous pattern.
It's like this rut. Why am I always attracting this type of person?
And I feel like I have so much clarity on that now.
Now. So when they will have genuinely felt like, no, I thought this and he was
so good to me and he was this and he was that.
And it's like, I can see it from the beginning now, but that's because of what I know now.
And you could apply those same things to, you know, like if I was to tell you

(50:14):
the red flags that I noticed,
that does not automatically mean that someone else who may be exhibiting the
same types of behaviors is automatically a criminal or is automatically a narcissist.
That's what I'm trying to say.
It is not exclusive that every person who shows up up in this way is a psycho,
you know, that's not what I'm saying.
Okay. So I want to kind of put that little disclaimer there first,

(50:36):
but my certain thing, I guess, patterns that I have noticed,
at least in my case, like I said, these people are experts.
They are brilliant.
Usually have very high IQs. They are. And that's not to, I am extremely smart.
So you, that's one thing is that that a lot of women, you know,

(50:59):
or a lot of other people looking at people who have been victimized will look
at that person's like, how could they be such an idiot?
I would never, nothing like that could ever happen to me. I would have clearly seen through that.
Well, that's what worked for that person. I went to, in one of my therapy sessions,
they, you know, I was trying to work through some things and like how to even

(51:22):
explain certain things to my, my younger children, because they were too little
to understand the concept of anything that had happened, the criminal activity and all those things.
So I was kind of like, how do I even explain these things? And what was wrong
with me? You know, kind of like trying to understand.
And I remember the therapist saying that with this particular type of person,
they said, we brought in an expert who had interviewed these specific personality

(51:46):
types for like 30 years, studied these people.
So that person was absolutely an expert.
And what they said was, they said, how can women protect themselves from this
type of person? You know, how can they recognize?
And that expert who had interviewed and worked with and studied these personality

(52:10):
types for, I believe it was about 30 years, said, there's pretty much nothing
you can do because they are master manipulators.
They know every personality type and they know exactly which way to work with you specifically.
So some people are more easy to manipulate in a demeaning way.

(52:34):
And then there are some that they know that that isn't going to work with you.
And so they know to work more on your sympathy side,
your empathy side, you know making you go
more into the people-pleasing zone making you feel like you're a bad person
if you don't you know if you don't help or you don't support
or giving you all kinds of praise because you're making such a positive difference

(52:56):
that they know that you're somebody who loves to help and who loves to serve
and who loves to you know make a positive impact there's a lot of you know building
building you up so it can it can be so that's what I'm saying these are super complex plex things.
These are not easy things. You cannot easily label something and be like that
person was an idiot because they got manipulated or scammed.

(53:19):
It's not like that. There are situations that we could look at and place judgment,
be like, okay, yeah, I would never have whatever.
But that does not mean that you could not be someone who could be subject to something like this.
But, you know, this person said, yes, it's pretty much you really can't because
they know how to manipulate every Every single personality under the sun,

(53:39):
like they're masters at this. They study it.
They know it. But there are common themes where...
Someone who is confident, who is self-assured, who is a very,
very strong, how do I say this?
You give off a certain energy. I'm big on energetics.

(54:03):
And you give off a certain energy where you will literally repel people like
that because they can just sense that you are not an easy target.
And easy targets, I'm just going to say this real because I was this person.
And I'm not judging anybody who falls under this description because I was that
person, even though I didn't realize that I was an easy target.

(54:23):
But I'm just saying traits that show up as criteria for easy targets for people like that.
And I mentioned this, I touched on it before, would be people who are insecure,
people who who are codependent, people who are naive, who haven't had a whole

(54:47):
lot of life experience, who are very trusting, easily trusting.
And, and I want to say, I did not become a cynical, I could have been cynical,
you know, being very men like, Ooh, I need to put everybody through a fine tooth comb.
And I have done a beautiful job of maintaining my heart, my,
my empathy, my kindness, my desire to help people without becoming a cynic and

(55:11):
someone who's like, ooh,
you know, because I've had these relationship issues, like I'm trying to catch
the guy and whatever, you know, how might he be manipulating me?
Because I'm telling you what you focus on.
Where you focus, energy flows. If you're always trying to catch someone in manipulative
behavior, you're going to attract people who are manipulating.
It's how it works. So I really don't put a lot of focus and energy and attention

(55:32):
on those types of things because that's not the dynamic, first of all, that I want to attract.
But anyways, to get back to my point, that even though they do know how to manipulate
every personality, they know how to stroke the egos of the people who are,
you know, the more egotistical ones.
They know how to really be be able to amplify and help you feel uplifted and
help you feel like you're the most incredible human being on the planet.

(55:54):
You're the most beautiful person.
They're able to see the insecurity. They're able to see how to capitalize on
the insecurity and how to make it work to their advantage.
But they also can tell through little things. They'll do little sort of like
testing the waters to see how this works with you on a small scale.
And then over time, it can build up into bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger,

(56:16):
bigger things to where you literally have zero idea how you ended up in that
place because you know that you had never chosen that for yourself.
And then now you find yourself in a position where where you actually don't
know how to get out because it's so complex.
It's so there's so much depth and so much woven into it that,

(56:41):
you know, I've talked to women and women will come And they'll be like,
you know, there have been women who are literally afraid for their lives.
There are people who, you know, their stuff is being tapped,
they're being watched, their phones, their electronics.
I mean, it gets extreme. And I dealt with some of that too.
So there are, of course, you know, the deeper answers of, you know,
how do you even navigate a situation like this?

(57:03):
And I know that there are women, it's like, if you're even listening to this
podcast, there are some people who would, who would be trying to delete their
search history or, you know, like they could get in trouble just for watching something like this.
And I, you know, I'm mindful of those things too, because yeah,
it, it, it can be a very scary world, but I will say without getting into all
the nitty gritty about, you know, the mechanics of strategies and how this, this can work.

(57:24):
The common thing that I would hear from women, and I know I'm getting a little
bit off base, but clearly this is meant to come out is the common theme that
I hear from a a lot of women is that they don't know how they can make it.
They don't, they're afraid that they'll, you know, they'll lose the financial support.
They're afraid of how their life will be impacted, what their,
you know, social status, their, there's just a lot of fear. The bottom line is fear.

(57:48):
But the majority of the fear is usually personal safety and financial security and housing. closing.
So I would just say, because I mean, I was literally displaced when my ex was put in prison.
We were immediately, we had to be out of the house immediately.
So for three months, we had to float from place to place to place.

(58:13):
You know, if somebody had a guest bedroom, I'll pile in the guest bedroom,
you know, sleeping wherever we could until I could get a place for ourselves.
But I mean, I was a stay at home mom at the time. I wasn't working outside the home at at the time.
I mean, basically what I'm saying is every fear that you could possibly be like,
how, how is this going to work out? How, how, how, how, how?
And so you're not doing anything about it, even though you know that this isn't

(58:37):
the best scenario for you.
If you have children, you know, a lot of people stay in situations because they have children.
And in reality, it's like, but what is this actually showing your child by continuing
in this type of dynamic that can also be extremely detrimental,
but then, but like how there's all these things.
What I will will say is that from my own personal experience, there is nothing wrong.

(59:01):
That you will have every support that you need. Whatever your fear is,
there are so many organizations that this is exactly what they do.
They will help you find the safety. They will, I mean, it can go as extreme
as it needs to get. Witness protection.
I mean, like there are things, there are solutions.
You don't have to, the finances, you know, the medical care,

(59:24):
the the anonymity, all of those things, there absolutely is support and solutions for.
So I wouldn't want any woman out there to not make a decision that she feels
is best for her, her family and her safety because of those things.
Because you absolutely, yeah, it might be bumpy.
Yeah, it might not be the most ideal situation that you would,

(59:48):
you're not necessarily going to be like in a palace or something, but you can absolutely,
there's so many resources that can can help you be able to have food in your
bellies, a safe place for your family and help you be able to get reestablished
and back on your feet again, regardless of whatever you're being told,
regardless of whether you're being threatened, regardless of if you say something,

(01:00:08):
because believe me, I had stuff like this too.
If you're being told these things, you know, if you say something and you're
like being told that you can't and you'll never make it and I'm going to find
you and I'm getting all those things.
I don't know. I don't want to, you know, I don't want to to be someone that
is personally accountable for the decision that you make for yourself.
I just want to tell you that there is support.

(01:00:31):
There are so many places that are specifically for this reason.
And in my case, it was tricky for me to even get away from the house without being tracked.
I had to keep the same patterns, the same behaviors, go the same places.
I could not talk to anybody on my phone. I couldn't text anybody,
couldn't look anything up on my phone.

(01:00:52):
I understand there are complexities to these things and it can take some creative thinking,
and kind of just being able to see things from an outside perspective of,
you know, if you are having these dynamics where you're being tracked and traced
and calls and, you know, spying, all these things that can make things a little bit,

(01:01:12):
definitely did make it challenging for me, but you,
there's nothing, I mean, look at me, I'm standing here.
I'm telling you that it's possible. Anything's possible.
So let's see. So you were asking about the red flags. Big red flag would be
any victim type of thing.
Because, and this is probably going to sound like I'm being sexist.

(01:01:35):
People can accuse me of that, whatever.
But from my perspective, we all go through stuff, okay? I'm not saying that
men do not go through stuff. I know men go through stuff.
And I have every compassion for that. that.
What I also will find though, is if there is, is a consistent thing where,
where, where someone, not just a man, men go through this stuff,

(01:01:55):
the abuse stuff, the coercion that all this stuff with women.
So this goes both ways, but you know, we're kind of talking about women's empowerment
and I'm just sharing my story, which happened to be, you know,
where the man was the person that was causing this.
So if, if there's any pattern of,
you know, like what I was was experiencing where it was constant he
was constantly the victim constantly like

(01:02:16):
I was the one that was needing to provide the support I
was needing to find the solutions I was needing to and this is
just one aspect of these are tiny built up things that happen over
time and then if it was if
if there was a consistent thing where
they're very intelligent and one thing that was always thrown
in my face was if you don't agree with me you're wrong

(01:02:37):
because this just is the way that it it is there is no other way so I it's like
my I couldn't even have my own views about things if I did have a view about
something that was different than the way that he perceived it it was for him
it wasn't even a perception it was this is the truth this isn't my perception this is the truth.
And so if you don't see it this way then you're you're you're being stupid because

(01:03:00):
you're you're literally saying you don't I think he said that one one thing
the one time I was like I do not.
Subscribe to believing what you the way that you see this and he was like so
what you're telling me is that you are willingly saying that you believe a lie.
Because this other way is actually the truth.

(01:03:23):
And you're saying you refuse, you refuse to believe that. So you're saying to
me that you, you willingly believe a lie. How smart is that?
And so it would be things like that where you, they would paint a scenario where
you almost can't even get out of it.
It's like, they think of every possible thing that you could possibly say.
And they're, you know, 18 steps ahead of it. They've already figured out how to respond to it.

(01:03:45):
And there's almost no answer that you can give that would make any sense.
And then you just feel like an idiot for even saying something.
And so you learn to like start not even saying things because you see what what
problems it ends up creating when you actually do say something.
So your voice starts to get quieter and quieter.
You're not saying things as much. And in my case, it happened.

(01:04:06):
Certain things like, you know, our marriage problems, our marriage problems
don't be talking to other people about our marriage problems like that's that's
a sacred thing between you and I.
If we have a problem that we need to work it out between the two of us,
if we get counseling or whatever if we need to, but we're not going to talk
about our stuff to other people. Well, that's an isolating technique.
I respect that things are sacred, marriages, whatever, but that's why I'm saying

(01:04:29):
you can't always apply these things to every situation.
But me looking back with what I navigated, I understand now that that was an
isolating technique that was training me to not be talking publicly about things
that were happening inside the home because we would be discovered.
There's certain things might be discovered if people knew do some of the stuff,
people would start to understand that some things were going on and would raise

(01:04:55):
some red flags with people and say, okay, that doesn't make sense.
You know, I was very involved in our church community.
And I remember one time the pastor, you know, so here's another thing that a
lot of women I think experience is that he was very, very charismatic,
very, what I would perceive to be very well liked.

(01:05:15):
He had a prayer list of 200 hundred some people that he would text every single
day and let him know let them know that he was praying for them so people would
think i was crazy if i was to ever say anything.
It's like, no, that makes no sense.
You know, this is the person that prays for me every day. You know,
he had established relationships. And so you can't just go and say stuff.

(01:05:39):
So I know a lot of people will be, you know, they're married to cops or they're
married to people who are prominent.
You know, some people who have high status positions in companies or organizations
or politically or whatever.
And that alone, that being held over somebody, that is a huge red flag.
There are so many huge red flags but
we're we're conditioned to not see them as red flags

(01:06:01):
because it's like no you're actually the crazy one so
i'm sparing you embarrassment from other
people because you're the crazy one and they're so well liked and and and it's
like you you can't say anything because they're the one that people are if you
say anything who are they gonna believe they're not gonna believe you so it's
things like that it's it's when when you're also being being demeaned constantly,

(01:06:25):
if you're being made to feel less than,
if you're being,
I mean, emotionally,
financial abuse where people are literally making it impossible for you to do anything,
turning off your credit cards.
And I mean, of course, there are extremes to this because some people just have
really irresponsible financial behavior. So I'm not saying that this applies

(01:06:48):
in every single situation.
But I have known women who the husband or a significant other could sense that
she was possibly, you know, wanting to leave.
And so they would shut down, take them off the bank accounts,
shut off the credit cards.
And, you know, they were a stay at home mom. So they had no way of earning their
own money and literally made it impossible for that person to to leave.

(01:07:10):
So that's another thing. So it's like I've just learned from my experience looking
back at all of these things that are so obvious to me in retrospect.
And I would absolutely be the person that would be like, what in the hell, Mindy? How?
Because I know that that's not me. I know that I'm a smart person.
But I also know that I have gained what feels like you talked about a cat having

(01:07:32):
nine lives. I feel like I have gained nine lives of experience going through these things.
And that's one of the reasons, even though I do not like talking about these
things, do you think that I don't have thoughts about who is going to see this?
And, you know, what if my ex gets out of prison and sees these things?
Like, of course, I have fears like that. that but
I'm also very spiritually connected I also
know that when you it's kind of that I learned

(01:07:55):
a quote that says when God is for you who can be against you and I
just trust that I went through these experiences not because I I keep my my
little you know story hidden and you know I'm not going to say anything about
it I really believe that one of the reasons why I have had the experiences that
I've had and why I am someone who feels this innate,

(01:08:16):
just passion and almost like not even a passion.
It's like, it's like, I have to do this.
I have to do this. And, and for that, for me to have this story and to be who
I am as someone who needs to say these things, even though I do not like talking
about these things, I don't like even thinking about these things.
I don't like reflecting on my past.

(01:08:37):
I don't like any of that. I would much rather just Just leave it behind me and not say anything.
But I think about the woman out there who was like me, who was isolated and
feeling hopeless and helpless and not knowing what to do, feeling like she was
she was so stuck that, you know, I couldn't bear the thought of my my husband at the time.
If I did somehow get divorced, I couldn't stand the thought of of him having having shared custody.

(01:09:02):
I was so in fear about that, even though people could say, well,
what what fear would you that's crazy. You have fear. What are you talking about,
Mindy? I see how good he is with the kids.
So I understand what it feels like to feel stuck and like you can't do anything.
And if you did do something, what would happen?
I personally was fearing a, a, what do you call it? A murder suicide situation

(01:09:22):
for my, in my own dynamic. That's what I was fearing.
And so I knew for my own self that it was going to be a matter of like me needing
to have the kids, everybody out of the house and safe before anything went down
because, because I was, I was afraid that it would be hostage,
murder, suicide, like it was going to be a hot mess.
And I feel like I was given sort of like that insight so that I could know how

(01:09:46):
to get everybody outside of the house safe before, yeah, before he was put in prison.
So those are some of the red flags that I've noticed.
I could give you gazillion examples more, but when I compare it in contrast
to a healthy relationship.
And a healthy relationship is not perfect.

(01:10:08):
I'm not trying to draw a perfect scenario, but a healthy relationship that I've
learned now because I have done it myself.
I have put myself through the healing. I have put myself through therapy and
through the self-analysis and taking personal responsibility of the parts that are mine to take.
And also being able to release myself of the shame and guilt that I was attaching

(01:10:31):
to my circumstances and the things that had happened into me.
So, and I've done the work. I've done the work on my mindset and it's constant.
It never ends. I'm always going to be evolving into, you know,
more expanded versions of myself.
But because I have done that now, I recognize I'm like, you know what?
I have so much to bring to the table now. I know who I am. I own who I am. I love who I am.

(01:10:54):
And, and now, you know, I am a single, I am single at the moment.
I'm very picky, not from a cynical standpoint. I just know what I I bring to the table.
And so now it's more about, you know, when I see a man and, or a relationship,
you know, I'm not saying whatever your flavor is, it's, it's,
I know how to detect when something is healthy.

(01:11:16):
And I know how to be able to see that healthy, what, what does healthy look
like? What does healthy mean?
Because some people have never been modeled a healthy relationship when they
were growing up and what they witnessed with their parents.
So they, they never experienced it that And they also haven't experienced it,
maybe perhaps in their own personal life.
And a lot of times we don't even know how to understand that the relationship

(01:11:37):
we're in is unhealthy because you just make all these justifications. Nobody's perfect.
And then you think of all the good times where, you know, oh,
there's all these good behaviors and oh, they do do these things and those things
feel good. So like the other stuff isn't really that bad.
And you start to rationalize and justify and talk yourself out of it.
But now, because I understand none of that. would I ever put up with now?

(01:12:01):
Like none of it. And I'm not saying perfection, but I understand healthy means,
here's how I would show up in a relationship.
I would be someone who is, who owns who I am, who owns my faults,
who owns my flaws, who owns my flaws.
But I am not codependent. I allow people to be who they are,
to be their authentic selves.

(01:12:21):
I'm not trying to stifle anybody, not trying to change anybody,
not going into it thinking like, oh my gosh, this is an amazing person.
He could be that much better. No, no, no, nope.
I allow people the freedom of their own process. I understand that everybody has their own life path.
I don't have any attachments, not because of any disdained thing of where I'm
saying, well, you know, this is probably not going to work out.

(01:12:42):
So I'm not being attached to it. It's not like that at all. It's a healthy detachment
of I just trust the flow of my life and I trust that people come in,
people leave, that people stay. Some are there forever.
Some are there for a little bit of a season and then they drift out.
And I always trust that that is for a reason and a lesson and a blessing. Somehow it works out.
So I very much have this detachment towards any specific outcomes or needing

(01:13:07):
anybody to give me anything because I have learned to stand on my own two feet.
That's one thing I've loved about being single as long as I have,
even though it wouldn't have been my preference necessarily.
I just haven't found the right person.
But one thing that I've loved is that I have learned that I really don't,
it's not a matter of needing a relationship. I'm a relationship person.
I do desire a relationship, but I am not willing to, to make,

(01:13:31):
I'm not willing to settle. I'm just going to put it very, very easy that way.
So learning how that I was able to support my family by myself.
I mean, I'm not saying, you know, I've definitely had state assistance.
I've had the food stamps. And, you know, I'm not saying that it was like every
single thing was 100 percent me.
God's helped me. You know, I've had people rally around me and help me at times.

(01:13:52):
And then there are times where it was like ain't nobody around.
It's like I felt completely isolated, completely by myself. But I learned that.
I am resilient. There is nothing, there is nothing that I can't make it through.
And so I don't need anything in a relationship. I don't need a man.
And I don't say that from like that women's, you know, trying to whatever bash men or whatever.

(01:14:13):
It's not that I don't need no man. It's not like that.
It's, it's that I don't, it truly is something that is adding to me and,
and the, the beautiful life that I already have.
It's not that I'm needing someone to financially support
me or I'm needing this relationship because I need to
feel loved and validated and I need it's it's because
of no neediness and that's that's to me the

(01:14:36):
the I'm not perfect but I feel like that is the more I'll just say a higher
level way of entering in a relationship so if you're in a relationship where
there are codependent dynamics and there's a lot of neediness and there's like
attachment and and you know you're you're feeling lost if If you don't,
it doesn't even have to be an abusive relationship or a quote unquote toxic relationship.

(01:14:59):
It could just be something where there are two people that, you know,
haven't really maybe done the internal work and they haven't really done some
of the healing work within themselves.
And so it's manifesting. There are a lot of people who are adults playing in
a playground who have all kinds of woundedness and you're just wounded people,
you know, playing in the playground with other wounded people.

(01:15:21):
And so that's going to produce an environment in a relationship that is,
there's a lot of wounded dynamics.
There's going to be, you know, it's like that thing where hurting people hurt people.
And it's like, if you don't heal what hurt you, you're going to bleed on people
that didn't cut you. It's like that.
So healing yourself, doing that self-work is the best.

(01:15:43):
Like if you were to give your gift, a gift to yourself. Yeah.
And a gift to your significant other, anybody else. Really start with yourself.
Learn to be more self. This sounds contradictory, but you need to learn to be more selfish.
We have been conditioned to be way too selfless to the point where it is so
detrimental to ourselves and to other people.

(01:16:05):
So for yourself first, if you were to give one gift to yourself,
it would be do the work for you.
And what that can look like can actually look like you're going in reverse.
It can look like you are losing ground.
It's one of the things where sometimes it has to get worse before it gets better.
Sometimes it be like that. It just is. And sometimes that might mean,

(01:16:27):
especially if you're in a unhealthy relationship that isn't for your highest good,
so many times when a woman is starting to do these things, it will end up making
things really crunchy in the relationship. Who do you think you are?
You think you're better than me or, you know, they're going to try and put you
down or they're going to try and bring you back because it can make people not

(01:16:48):
just in the relationship.
This can happen in friendships. This can happen with coworkers.
This can happen with anybody. I have lost so many people in my life as I have
up leveled myself as a human being,
because either the person will calibrate and they'll be able to kind of like
grow alongside you, or it will create so much such a big gap,

(01:17:11):
there'll be too big of a gap for you guys to even really connect anymore.
And some people will because they don't want to lose a relationship.
They'll go back into being that old version of themselves because they don't
want to lose that person.
And I mean, do what you want. Wouldn't recommend it.
I always recommend the growth because what you have access to on the other side

(01:17:34):
of that healing and that growth, oh my gosh, the relationships,
the beauty, the richness of life, the confidence that's unconditional,
that's unshakable because you know who you are, you own who you are,
and you're not needing anything from anybody. buddy.
I'm telling you that is, that is true, true power.
That is power. That is being your own superhero. And you don't need anybody

(01:17:55):
else in order to do that for you.
So realize that along with the healing process comes a lot of things that can
feel painful, but just know and trust and listen to my voice,
turn this podcast on, listen to me and say that it promise you it gets It's better.
It's worth it. Whatever pain you have to endure, whatever people walk out of

(01:18:17):
your life, whatever people try and tell you that you're not all that,
that this isn't you, you could never be that. Don't listen to those voices.
Tune them out. Even yourself, when you're telling yourself those things,
be like, okay, just because I'm telling myself doesn't mean it's true.
Just because I believe that doesn't mean it's true. Just because I feel that doesn't mean it's true.
You are so powerful. You are so much more powerful than you realize.

(01:18:40):
You are so much more beautiful than you think. And if anybody is trying to dismiss
that or is trying to minimize that in you, that is not someone that deserves
a place at the table of your life.
Thank you so much, Mindy. This is wonderful insights that you shared with the
listeners today, and I'm sure they will appreciate it as well when they listen to the episode.

(01:19:03):
I think it's a full, all-inclusive package.
There was a lot in there. yeah but
but but again i think it's it's wonderful to make
it this way rather than sharing you know a five minute
story and saying goodbye right exactly yeah
thank you for allowing me the time to to share what was on my heart i really

(01:19:25):
appreciate that yeah i i really appreciate your time and and your energy and
all of your advice provided today in this episode and and i I hope that the
listeners will be enjoying listening,
but also learning a lot from your perspectives and from your insights.
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much for being our guest today.

(01:19:48):
Yes, my pleasure. Thank you. And thanks everyone for listening. Stay healthy and happy.
Music.

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Dateline NBC

Stuff You Should Know

The Nikki Glaser Podcast

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Manipulative Tactics in Relationships and Scams with Mindi "The Fenyx" / E31

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}Dateline NBC

Stuff You Should Know

The Nikki Glaser Podcast

All Episodes

Manipulative Tactics in Relationships and Scams with Mindi "The Fenyx" / E31

Dateline NBC