May 9, 2024 • 45 mins
Welcome to the podcast!
Both girls are feeling very sleepy today Sara's not sleeping and Anna's in tax season. Fingers crossed for the podcast today.
Love Desk: Short and sweet quote today but hopefully, inspirational.
Hot Topic: Do you have 37 personalities in your relationship?
In this engaging episode, we delve deep into how personal needs, emotions, and misunderstandings get communicated and managed in relationships. Exploring the fluctuation of our personalities, affected by factors like personal growth, past experiences, work pressures, health concerns, and other life changes. Learn the significance of effective confrontation and how understanding and embracing our various personalities can lead to relationship growth and a stronger bond.
Get insights from our experienced relationship experts about different attachment styles, their manifestations, and their origins from our relationship with our primary caregivers. Discover how these patterns from past relationships can trigger certain reactions and influence attachment styles. Learn about the harmful effects of unpredictable behaviour and why comprehending our actions is as crucial as understanding our partner’s.
Question: "My girlfriend wants us to get matching tattoos and I hate them, what should I do."
Also, join us for a lively and thoughtful discussion on matching tattoos in relationships. Can tattoos signify deeper elements of a relationship like courage, vulnerability, and commitment? Or do they represent a misunderstanding or mismatch? We dive into a real-life story of a couple considering tattoos. How fair is it to request permanent symbols of love, and how much do these symbols matter in the relationship?
Till next time!
Get in touch
Geordie Lass & Doc Sass
Email - info@geordielass.com with your relationship hot topics or questions. All questions are fully confidential.
Sara Liddle
Email: info@inflori.co.uk
Website: www.inflori.co.uk
Relationship Reset: www.inflori.co.uk/reset
Anna Stratis
Email: coachdocanna@gmail.com
Website: www.coachdocanna.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Music.
(00:28):
Hello, how's it going? It's good, it's good. If I'm hallucinating a bit today, just don't mind.
It's, well, it's tax season, everybody, and some of us are pulling all-nighters,
and I have pulled an all-nighter.
If you've been a regular listener to this podcast, you will know Anna always avoids doing her taxes.
(00:48):
What can I do? But she does always get there in the end.
You know what I realize, like every year, because you have to be in the zone,
right? There's this zone of focus because every year you forget what you did
last year and you're like, how did I make these calculations? That was ridiculous.
So you have to get into the zone and I think you have to pull an all-nighter.
You have to get in and not get out until it's done.
(01:11):
So I went into this sort of retreat.
There's no taking a break, is there? Because then you can't remember where you left off.
You can't remember, did I do this bit? Had I calculated that?
And then you have to go back and rework it.
Oh my God. like literally that was like yes exactly
those are the hours of my night so it was
insanity and i came out at around nine in the morning after an all-nighter finally
(01:35):
sent stuff off so yes well i hope you hope you've had some good day time maps
today then you know and it's funny when you have i haven't been able to sleep
all that much so that's where this podcast is gonna be a bit squirrely It's
going to be very primal, let's say.
But I will say that I have remained a law-abiding, tax-paying citizen,
(01:57):
and we can all be pretty happy about that.
Well, I'm glad to hear. I'm glad to hear. For another year. I think I must have
been coming out in sympathy with you because I woke up at quarter four this
morning and could not get back to sleep for loving the money.
Oh, that is a terrible time to wake up. It is. It's quite big.
Oh, no. No amount of meditation was getting me back to sleep. No, it's not.
(02:18):
I hate to say it. It's that four in the morning waking like you're pretty much.
Yeah. And then you just it's just best to get up and not fight it.
It feels terrible. I think I managed to live out.
Or I tried to resist it until about sort of 4.30, quarter to five.
And then I was like, nah, this is not working. Yeah.
(02:38):
So I embraced the day nice and early. Oh, yeah, yeah.
Well, okay. So you've been up for a lot of hours. All right.
So this is going to be an interesting podcast.
We can do this. We can totally do this. We can rise to this challenge. Oh my gosh, totally.
If there's some strange content, you'll know why. That it's coming from the
(02:59):
back recesses of our mind.
We have no frontal lobe functioning this is going to be raw and untethered.
Oh gosh good times should we start with the love desk oh let's go to the love
desk and see what the sleepy love uh correspondent is saying so the sleepy love
correspondence has a nice little quote for you that i spotted this morning when
(03:23):
i was doing some very early morning scrolling Oh, oh, nice.
Okay, so it's a lovely, it's actually quite a nice picture I'll describe it for you.
So it's two thumbprints that are kind of crossed over so it makes the shape of a heart.
Oh, oh, yes. And then the comment below says, it's not about having the perfect relationship.
(03:45):
It's about finding someone who matches you and will go through everything without giving up.
Oh, oh my gosh. Yeah. That just gave me lots of pause. Yeah.
Pause and reflection. Yeah. We've got this kind of unrealistic view that relationships
(04:06):
are not a good relationship if there's any sort of conflict.
As human beings, we're trying to actively avoid any sort of disagreement,
unsettlement, unhappiness.
And we just wanted to be kind of all the kind of roses and just lovely,
happy, cherished times together.
But, you know, the reality just isn't like that. I think this is why we love reality TV.
(04:31):
Because it's great to see inside other people's houses and see some of the challenges
and issues that other people face.
And it makes us feel normal to go, actually, I thought it was just me.
Or I thought that we were seriously dysfunctional.
But I realize, actually, other people are having arguments and unhappy times, too. Oh, yeah.
(04:53):
Yeah, totally. I mean, gosh, what do I think about that?
At the same time, though, like the drama of constant chaos, of fighting and
punching below the belt, that isn't functional either.
And I think that there's people who sort of, let's say, fight more than others.
But I will say that we
(05:15):
should not be afraid of the fight within which is
messy feelings that come up to us messy feelings
of expectations like you can always be shocked at just how we misunderstand
each other we think we're on the same page and our partner does something that
is so out of this world ridiculous that you're like are you doing this on purpose
(05:36):
but no no they just literally did not get the memo they didn't get your brain
waves they didn't understand.
So really, the fight is within. And that's, yeah, the fight is within.
And there may be some sort of raised voices, conflict, etc.
But yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there is always going to be this kind of,
(05:56):
as you say, times when we don't understand each other.
We really can't seem to connect.
And we can't understand, like,
why is it that you just don't get how I'm feeling or how I'm thinking?
I think the struggle is then how do you communicate that in an effective way?
So there's always going to be a time when we've got to communicate something
(06:17):
that's different or isn't necessarily going to be received in the way that we
want it to be. and it's then down to us to try and find a way to communicate that in a right way.
Yes, yes, yes. Yeah. Fight right, fight fair. But yeah, you're still going to fight.
Yeah. Yeah, that's very, very true. Because kind of rolling over and not sharing
(06:38):
your views also isn't kind of the right answer.
No. That's when you get into, slip into artificial harmony and all you're doing
is storing up some problem for later on in life.
Oh, you completely are. Later on in life?
Try next week. Yeah, for sure. For sure. Tomorrow.
Yeah, yeah. No, I've gotten nowhere by not explaining my needs.
(07:01):
Absolutely nowhere. Yeah, totally.
I was a lovely friend reached out, hey, how's it going? And I realized the last
time I talked to them was like, you know, six, eight months ago.
And so much has changed. I've learned so much and I've grown so much.
I've been been so humbled.
And it was so crazy to kind of correspond and to say, wow, like,
I have mellowed, I have gotten braver, I have gotten more vulnerable,
(07:26):
I have gotten less anxious, I've gotten less avoidant, less insecure.
I've faced a lot of internal demons, I've come out the other side.
So, gosh, yeah, don't be afraid of conflict.
The inner stuff too and wow in in
a relationship oh gosh a good relationship
is one that just oh my gosh that you learn and
(07:49):
get your butt kicked and you grow and
you develop you get stronger so cool yeah yeah absolutely
yeah and I think you know it talks to
that point around how much you can develop a
relationship by just taking some ownership and
some responsibility for yourself and and doing
some of that work as you say to really look at what are
(08:11):
the feelings that are coming up for me what is it that i'm doing
how am i influencing the dynamics in our relationship and that's something that
we talked about when we discussed you know relationship resets common question
is well what if my partner won't do the work like that comes up a lot whether
it's coaching or you know embarking on some kind of you know solo mission but i think it's always
(08:33):
possible to affect some positive change by just moving, making some very small adjustments.
You'd be surprised how far they can go. Oh yeah, yeah, you've got it. Yes. Ah, nice.
All right, guys, get your big girl pants on, as they say.
Yes. Shall we take our topic? Yes, let's go forth. Okay. Boldly go is no...
(08:57):
Music.
Do you have 37 personalities in your relationship? Yes.
(09:18):
I love this. Like, where did the number 37 come from? It's got to be one of
the most odd. It's a number that I never think about.
I don't even think I spent much time thinking about, like, myself at the age
of 37. It was just a year that just went by.
Hannah loves my random WhatsApp messages. I love it. You have no idea.
What do you think? Oh, my God. I love it. I was like, 37, that's amazing.
(09:43):
What an odd, as a mathematician, if there's a mathematician out in our audience,
I'd love to know, what is it about this odd number that is so special that it's
just so odd? Anyways, yes, 37.
There was that film, wasn't there? What was that film? 27 Dresses or something,
where the girl was just a bridesmaid 27 times and was never a bride.
(10:05):
Oh, God, that would be an expensive venture. Until she was, obviously,
because that had to be ending.
That's how that happens sorry did you spoil it yeah spoiler
alert i got into
trouble the other day for spoiling a program that my daughter was watching this
is the problem with catch-up tv isn't it and on-demand tv i guess people are
in different stages and phases of the same series right right she's back in
(10:29):
uni now and i managed to spoil a program for her i was like i'm so sorry Sorry,
you were like well ahead of me.
I don't know how I'm sitting in front of you. Which program? Was it a big one?
It was my favorite guilt-fleasure program out of us. Oh, yes.
Wait, how can you be a spoiler? Isn't it just, oh, oh, now I understand.
(10:51):
About what happens to the PC.
Oh, I see. Oh, ooh. Oh. Because people can kind of choose to leave the experiment.
Oh. And some of you did, and your daughter didn't know? No.
Well, I can't say anymore now. I can't say anymore. I literally feel like I'm already in trouble.
(11:12):
Isn't it funny? I just have to say, before we dive into our hot topic,
I just have to say, how many hours of labor were you in with your daughter?
I think you're allowed to spoil a program for her.
Yeah, I think 21. Oh, yeah. It's like a full day.
Oh, yeah. I don't even eat as well. That's the thing that's a bit disappointing.
I don't have anything to eat. got to a certain point and yeah
(11:34):
you eat then well i mean honestly she's still
paying off that debt if i may say yeah get
back to us when you know yeah absolutely we have we paid off our 14 not even
oh my gosh all right we are massively derailed now we need to get back on back
on track with this hot topic girl yes indeed focus okay so 37 personalities in your relationship
(12:00):
okay i have at least half of those
so i am curious about
whether we have the right interpretation of this hot topic because
i may be thinking something a little different where what does your mind go
when it thinks about 37 you know personalities i can tell you where mine goes
straight to perimenopause oh oh have i been having conversations about that
(12:22):
although some of that might be because i was having a conversation with somebody
today about that very subject
ah I think there are certain times in your life especially I'm going to speak.
As a as a female with hormones that yeah
fly around especially now to say
that yeah I think there are I think there's but even
just kind of everyday life you know when you when you're faced with
(12:44):
different pressures in your relationship or in
life in general you are going to end up I
think you do kind of often take that out on your nearest and
dearest and you're kind of there and there and you know
that you know you've got that kind of love and support sometimes you
could probably get away with a bit more than you maybe would
kind of test with a
(13:05):
friendship and because you're there like if you live together
then you're there and you've got kind of ready access
to be able to just kind of see everything that does happen so I think there
can be times whether that's you know something to do with health or hormones
or life changes having babies all of those things work pressures all of those
things can present a different facet of who we are as a person so that's how I interpret it.
(13:30):
Oh very cool okay all right I think also the things that have happened in our
past can influence so a lot of those whether that's small t or large t traumas
that come back to visit us where we forget that we're safe we're here now this is the present.
Taken back to the past we were put into a fight
(13:50):
or flight mode we're put into a defensive mode we're brought back
to our 12 year old selves that that i
i would say more than anything that's
where it's still the past uh selves
the less well-adjusted past selves that
come and visit my relationships yes yeah
yeah i think it's interesting what you're
(14:12):
saying before about that kind of reflection and having that conversation with
your friend and saying and kind of like you know over the last
seven or eight months like what has happened and I
look at our relationship which spans longer than seven or eight months and you
know I look at some of the kind of changes that we've been through and or things
that have affected us or outside influences kind of whatever it is and you can
(14:36):
really see kind of yeah there's been some definite kind of,
personality changes or kind of moments of who we are that have come out in you know some of
those situations that we've been through together oh how cool
is that so you run us through some
of the personalities or sort of how does your the personality that's coming
(14:57):
up whether that's yours or his or sort of a you know the the dual of different
you know how does that make you show up to situations differently and show up
to conflict differently or create conflict.
Yes, I think, you know, like you're talking about, you know,
lots of the stuff that's happened around, you know, from our childhood,
we all kind of have things that have come up.
(15:20):
I'm saying we all, you know, some people have perfectly secure,
happy childhoods and haven't really kind of, you know, they're not bringing
a whole host of stuff to deal with into a relationship, but they may have had
maybe a previous relationship.
So I was working with a client recently and we were doing some stuff around
kind of attachment styles and so the primary attachment styles are secure,
(15:41):
anxious, avoidant and we were doing some work around that and what it meant
and she couldn't resonate with the fact that,
you know, the study would suggest that most of the time this comes from your
relationship with your primary caregiver then indicates how those relationships are in future.
And I and I knew that she wasn't going to resonate with this so we kind of had
a discussion about it and but for her where it had come up had been previous
(16:04):
relationships so there'd been one or two significant relationships in her life
that had then kind of caused this this kind of.
More unsettled and less kind of secure attachment styles so I think there is
that element that you then take into a relationship which then can cause you
to show up in a different way so you know
(16:25):
let's say that you know you're displaying an anxious
attachment style because you've been in a relationship where somebody
has caused you not to be able to trust them so and
this you know if it happens in childhood it's often the
case that actually your parents could be quite kind of up and
down in terms of you know one minute can really there for
you the next minute kind of you know almost leaving
(16:47):
you to fend for yourself and not being able to tend to
your emotional needs and help you to kind of
self-regulate those sorts of things but this can
happen kind of if you've had a really traumatic relationship you know in with
a kind of significant person that as a result of that and in that kind of trust
is being broken down and eroded you can start to display some kind of anxious
(17:11):
attachment styles that then come out in your relationship.
And then reinforce each other by creating the very loss of a relationship potentially that you fear.
Yeah. Reinforcing the insecurity. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.
I think what this kind of topic really makes me think about is because I think
(17:33):
often, you know, we need to look at self.
We need to look at who we are, how we contribute into a relationship.
It's all well and good saying our partner's done this. They just need to change.
They need to look at themselves. you know they need to examine
their 37 personalities they need to go for
coaching yeah yeah but you know we will
have things that are happening for us we
(17:53):
will have ways where maybe we're not that predictable in
a relationship and this can cause that may cause anxiety
and others it may cause avoidance withdrawal you
know we do get this chain reaction that happens
and this is why you know we talk about relationship dynamics because
it isn't nothing's happening in in a vacuum is we're
kind of having these reactions with each other sometimes they'll
(18:16):
be positive sometimes neutral sometimes negative but if
we can take a step back and say well actually you know what have
i do i show up consistently in the relationship do i
you know if my if my partner kind of
wants to have a conversation with me am i always there do i always turn
towards them do i always give them the time of day or
sometimes am i a bit shorter with them
(18:37):
do i kind of you know or ignore them or just think they'll kind
of stop talking in minutes fine you know what how
is that reaction what what is it that
i do how do i respond to my partner so it
could be just something like that if you take a step back and examine that and
say well actually maybe sometimes i am a bit snappy or sometimes i haven't got
(18:58):
the time or sometimes i don't acknowledge that they want to have some attention
and you know i'll brush it off
and i'll and i'll just walk away and carry on doing what i I was doing.
Oh, yes. Going through flashbacks. Guilty.
Oh, yeah. I think, I mean, okay, 37 personalities, yes.
(19:19):
But I would like to kind of just imagine, okay, there's kind of two dominant ones.
One of them I'm really proud of. It's the way I show up. It's very optimistic.
It's very loving. It's very nurturing.
It's really showing up. It's It's bringing the energy. It's a building anabolic energy.
My dominant personality that I'm not proud of, which has shown up in past relationships,
(19:44):
the reason why it's so important is because I, when I'm in that mood state,
let's just say, it comes from a place of hurt and fear, like absolute terror.
And I think I am so easy to read when I'm running with that personality and
so easy to soothe. It makes me wonder, like, and what it is,
is it's a shutdown, a total shutdown, quiet.
(20:08):
I withdraw affection. I withdraw eye contact.
It's like I can't say something. I'm not trying to punish my partner,
but I just, I'm so hurt and terrified that I'm kind of waiting for them to come
to knock on my shell and get me out of my shell.
Yeah yeah yeah and you know you're not alone in that you know
i think if all of us if we're honest you know we'll say
(20:31):
well yeah i've done that i still do it i need to
work on that and it could you know that could be
a starting position is just to say all right if
i have spotted that as being something that's a
tendency that i do when i'm hurt and i'm
suffering i mean it's down to
me to try and break that cycle and i may ask for some
(20:51):
help with that you know you don't have to do it on your own you know
you could say look do you know what I'm really trying
to work on this area and I can see that it's not
good for me it's not good for you I want
to get a bit more consistent than this and I want to try and address it you
know could could you help me you know would you be able to do and then you know
make a request I'm going to really try and do this could you do that and then
(21:15):
maybe between the two of us we can start to kind of break some of that down
because Because it's learned behavior. You've learned how to do that.
We've all learned this in the past.
We've learned that that is the best way to kind of cope as we see it at that
time, you know, when we're learning those patterns.
But the more you can kind of unpick it and create some new patterns of behavior
(21:37):
and start to create those connections in the brain.
Then the more you can kind of not react and show up that way.
I think so. Yeah, no, absolutely.
And I think it's a two to tango. I will say, though, that in unpicking this
particular personality type, like whenever somebody withdraws or stonewalls,
(21:57):
I think the like, I have to imagine and I've only been doing this recently,
hopping over the proverbial side of the fence to look at myself when I'm in that state.
And I assume that I'm just a little teddy bear, just a little quiet teddy bear
like, oh, she's just sad.
You just need to give her a hug. Ask her what's wrong. I'm terrifying.
(22:19):
I'm absolutely intimidating and terrifying. terrifying yeah no no no average
human being would poke the bear so and i have to understand that i'm not in
a lovable state i see that sounds like a challenge to me yeah yes totally,
yeah i'm not saying in the moment you're going to be able
to have those conversations and do that the the
(22:42):
work happens before you get to that point it's saying okay
i know i have this this pattern right how
do i shine a light on it how do i then get some sort
of strategy to help me get out of that quicker and then
the shorter you can make that time to the
point that eventually you know you just stop going into it because you just
think there's no point here and i'm not saying that's easy right like no eight
(23:06):
years in still working on my relationship oh gosh yeah yeah and i think i think
though i i own the vast the big share of this because like i gotta pop my own self out.
When I'm feeling terrified and shut down and I'm avoiding eye contact,
I'm terrified the other person is going to abandon me and leave me.
The last thing that I want to do is show a gesture of love or communication,
(23:30):
because what if that person slaps me away and rejects me, right? That's the big fear.
At the same time, because I'm so freaking terrifying, I have to make the.
And I love that you say that it is a two to tango and you can bring your partner
in to say, could you help out?
(23:50):
At the same time, I own 90% of the effort.
Like maybe what i can say is that if i've
been if i'm feeling like really kind of in my shell
and i make a little gesture that you know if my partner
could really kind of yes and that scene as an improv artist i'd be like yeah
i see you getting out that girl here's some here's some love to add to that
(24:12):
recipe because often we don't do that we go well you're not trying hard enough
you know in this is a conversation that goes on well you really hurt me so you
need to do more than that That little tiny gesture that you've just done there.
Cup of tea is not going to cut the water. Oh.
So, OK, this is the thing. And there starts the negative dance.
(24:32):
You got it. So here's the thing.
And this might be your cup of tea.
If your partner does something particular that is meant to chill the ice or
to thaw the ice, this is a wonderful ask to be like, if it is that cup of tea,
maybe it is the special. Maybe it's like the special blend of tea.
Maybe you've put some ginger in it or made a little special effort because you've
(24:56):
been in this shitty personality all day and you're just wanting to break the ice with your partner.
Is that when you're bringing out that tea that your partner is like,
oh, this is the specialty.
Whatever that tea is for you. Yeah. And you're right.
Like we, gosh, we punish our partners and then we kind of give them these prison
sentences like, oh, no, you still got to start.
(25:18):
Keep paying off the debt not there yet yeah
we do i mean we'll punish punish ourselves as well in
the process so oh yes yeah the
one thing i would add to this discussion is it's okay to have personality ah
okay yes because there's a danger isn't there that you try and neutralize yourself
(25:39):
so much that you've just got nothing left of you right yes yes hold on i don't
know know what that's like.
No, but it's true. No, it's true. I just can't show up as anybody else.
But no, I mean, it is, I think to your point, actually doing the relationship
desk, which is not sharing what you need can turn into this,
I'm okay with anything thing.
(26:01):
And that is, that's a very, very, that's a very dangerous precedent to set. Mm-hmm.
You don't want to become like totally vanilla as a person you know
you love the fact that there's so many different dimensions to human beings
that's what makes us so fascinated yes you know about each other and yeah that's
what makes it so interesting yes and it's a tutor tango so here's the thing
(26:24):
i what i realized and i'm still learning i'm sure i'll look back on my current
self and be like, wow, she didn't know anything.
But not only is it where you like,
it is up to me to be able to manage my personalities and not be shitty.
I'm thinking of my lovely friends, just don't be shitty. So I can minimize being
(26:48):
shitty. That's what I can bring to the table.
But I have super realized that not everybody gets my secret sauce.
And I shouldn't be with somebody who doesn't get at my secret sauce,
if they don't like my sauce, if they don't like barbecue and they want honey
like mustard, go off and find honey mustard.
I should not get married to somebody who doesn't like barbecue sauce.
(27:09):
But if they like barbecue sauce, it's amazing.
I just, all the ways in which I was just used to being really a drag on somebody
because they just didn't like my sauce.
You know, when I met my current man, he was delighted.
I was like, what? You like barbecue? he was like oh love it love it
and he just it was not even it was just a natural thing it didn't try very hard
(27:33):
he just was delighted by my quirky personalities yeah and so i can strive to
not be shitty but i also need to like find somebody who likes what i cook in
the kitchen yeah absolutely Absolutely.
I mean, be you, but just don't be a dick with it. Oh, yes.
(27:55):
Yes. And certainly don't try and punish a pot.
We do all the time because hurt people hurt people and we, misery loves company.
And we just love people to feel sad along with us. It's true.
It's true. Yeah. Okay. All right. Well, that should put the personalities to bed for a bit.
(28:19):
Go and dig out your 37 personalities and see which ones are working for you
yeah right exactly all right i am gonna move us to a question oh yes.
Music.
My girlfriend wants us to get matching tattoos, but I hate them. What should I do?
(28:44):
Okay, can I be honest? Yes.
When are you not? When are we not? Three years in.
I know, right? Right? Like, Sarah, can I be straight up with you?
And you're like, when have you not let your fight play? I haven't seen this
side of your personality.
Honest Doc Sass? What? It's not in the name? Come on then, hit me with it.
(29:07):
If anybody wants to make some money in the next 20, 30 years,
it is to set up tattoo removal parlors next to all these tattoo parlors.
Because it is so cool to see everybody with their arm sleeves and their tattoos
across their shoulders in foreign languages and all this stuff.
And it's a really amazing form of self-expression when you're young. But, man!
(29:33):
You know there's a program, it's called Tattoo Fixer. or
something like that and it was never kind of like a
watcher but sometimes you stumble across something on
tv so i started watching it and there
were these two girls that had been to i don't know some kind of teen hot spot
in europe and um where they do actually still tattoo people late at night who
(29:58):
have been too much to drink oh which i think should not be allowed but anyway oh these two
girls had two things tattooed on their feet,
that you would need both of them to be stood next to each other to make sense of it.
So one had chicken and the other had nugget.
(30:21):
Oh my God. Oh my God. I'm just thinking of like being...
Being a 65-year-old grandmother, like, you know, out in a summer day and our
grandkids are like, nugget, what does that mean?
Why have you got chicken tattooed on your foot? Oh, my God.
Seemed like a good idea at the time when you were in Lisbon. Yeah, exactly.
(30:44):
Exactly. Oh, my God. So, yeah. That's crazy.
You know, and the thing is, and it's a beautiful form of self-expression.
I think everybody should be able to like live at large for the most part,
with the exception of like very hard drugs that does take a toll on the body.
And I as a physician, I'm like, oh, please just don't. But anyways,
other than that, like tattoos, everyone's allowed to be a silly young person
(31:08):
and do things that, you know, they kind of would not do if they were older.
Older but tattoos are hard because they do take quite a bit to remove not impossible
but they do take it quite a bit to remove but at the same time like there's
people who like myself who don't get tattooed because I just saw myself at 50
(31:28):
and didn't think there was anything that I would care.
Much at 50 that I really cared at 22 at the same time it really is a powerful form of self
-expression so i think it's important and and for some
it really there's people who will use tattoo
as a form of grief or memorializing a
loved one perhaps a child or a very or somebody who's passed on and there's
(31:53):
others who really love tattoo as a form of symbolism sharing in relationship
and so i do take this seriously even though i'm like oh god if you want to make
money open up a tattoo removal parlor but this question comes from like it sounds
like this is not a frivolous ask this this guy's partner really does want.
(32:18):
Matching tattoos. I don't know. I went to a different space.
I was like, oh, this is your girlfriend. Like you're not even married.
Oh. Why would you even contemplate this?
Oh. Oh, you're like, yeah, no.
Right. Prenup and a tattoo. Yeah. I get what you're saying.
You know, this kind of like expression of love. Oh, we love each other.
(32:40):
We're going to get matching tattoos. How romantic.
Right, right. What happens in two or three years time when, you know,
if you're not together anymore, you've got to find another Christy to replace
that with? With the spelling of Y on the end, not IE. I know.
Totally. Oh, my gosh. Okay.
(33:00):
Very good point. Well, but actually, this is a great question.
It's a proxy question to how serious is this relationship for me?
Yeah i think it's a good it's a
real opportunity to try and practice some strong communication isn't
it because there's a few things you know one is you've
got a difference there now the difference could be i
(33:21):
don't know what color do you paint it will be a living room wall but it's
not you know the difference is i want us to have
a permanent reminder on our bodies of each other and
you don't so it's quite a strong difference then
there's very personal preferences I think about kind
of tattoos I think you're either in the yes camp or you're in
the kind of no camp when it comes to your personal
(33:43):
choice about what you want to do and they are firmly in different
camps yeah so it's a good opportunity to really practice some kind of communication
skills and understand things from each other's perspectives because you know
you might change you might shift your view on it based on what your partner's
going to tell you but I do think The other side of it is kind of,
(34:03):
you know, how realistic is it,
how sensible is it to get a tattoo to somebody who you haven't,
you know, just declared a kind of full permanent commitment with,
which is what we do when we say we're going to get married. Yeah, no, that's true.
And also, like, the cool thing about this is that...
(34:23):
This person, whether they will even get a tattoo ever, it's very clear this
is not a decision they take lightly.
Some people get tattoos like they wake up in the morning and they're like,
and for them, it's a very easy choice.
But it's the same as like moving in together. For some people, no big deal.
I've known you for two weeks. We'll move in. Other people are very same as marriage.
(34:46):
Some people will elope. Oh yeah, I've just known you for two months.
Others are petrified at the the magnitude of the choice.
So whatever it be, the cool thing is, this is actually coming headlong into
who are you in my life and where do we stand on the road together?
Is this a choice that we may make one day? Is it the choice that we will make today?
(35:11):
And so I think what's really important is to, it's never just the tattoo.
I don't think this is about a tattoo.
I think this And it could even be the partner's bid for a conversation about where are we?
Oh, let's go get matching tattoos. And maybe the subliminal thought is it'll
make this guy think, like, how serious am I? Where are we going?
(35:33):
I definitely opt for just asking the question in the first place.
Ah, yes. And not going down this route of kind of, if it is that, that's driving it.
You know going down this route of kind of that you know the
subtle art art of kind of trying to get the information
that you want with asking a completely different question
i think it's really important to be like you know what this is a great opportunity
(35:56):
let's uh hold off on the tattoos and have some long conversations about yeah
where we are in life where we're going and do we see this as a long-term commitment
yeah wonderful segue because the tattoo was a long commitment i mean Honestly, it kind of is.
It's one of the biggest, I mean, as my lovely friend says, is that marriage
is the most financially risky thing you'll ever do in your life. And it's true.
(36:19):
But a tattoo is kind of up there in terms of permanence and potential consequences. It really is.
Yeah. So no matter what, it should never be on your face. Just saying.
Just don't get face tats.
You know the other thing too if it is just a
tattoo if if all this is if they have a talk
and they're like if she's like oh no i don't want to get married anytime soon
(36:43):
i just want to get a tattoo with you it's like all right all right well maybe
then that tattoo is something small so i mean if you know whatever whatever
it may be is that you can always find a compromise zone But yes,
recognize what this bid is standing in for and what the question really is.
(37:04):
And sometimes there will be things that you just both disagree on and there
is no compromise. And this may be it for them.
Yes. Yeah. And that's okay.
And that's the thing, too. Like, we shouldn't be scared of conflict.
We shouldn't be scared of finding out there's a values clash.
And ultimately, we shouldn't be scared if we find out something,
(37:24):
which is the trial period, right?
Like, dating is we're not sure yet.
And so if we find out that there's something about a tattoo that represents,
or not even just the tattoo, but the way of approaching this sort of decision,
or philosophies on life, if these are fundamentally different,
(37:45):
maybe this is not a relationship that has long-term legs, and that's okay.
Yeah. You know, it's much better to discover that, you know,
one person being a tattoo, loves motorbikes, loves like taking risks and so forth.
And the other person is like, no, more measured and likes a good book and so forth.
Like maybe those two people, they may be able to find common ground,
(38:08):
but maybe there's just fundamental differences.
And the conversation starts with the tattoo. What do you think of tattoos?
Time to get some talking done. Yeah. You know what? But like this would be a
great, you know, those intimacy cards.
There's several kinds that you can get, ones that are meant to really spur on conversation.
Conversation starters and initiators that are beyond like, how was your day today?
(38:31):
Because we do so much silly talk about like transactional. What did you do? What did you eat?
I could see this card being in that deck of 50 intimacy cards.
Like what's your view on tattoos?
It's a great one. Yeah. I mean, there's a whole host of stuff that questions
that we can ask that just go kind of a little bit deeper.
(38:52):
Shouldn't be afraid to ask them. No, gosh.
What would you recommend as a compassionate, open, curious and welcoming response?
If you're like a hell no tattoo at this point in time, but you want to,
you know, honor your partner for bringing it up.
Like what's something that you would respond with? I think
(39:13):
it's just getting curious and really exploring it you know what
is it about tattoos that you you know would
be interested in what what would that mean to you what
sort of tattoo are you thinking of you know really get some understanding get
some kind of perspective some insight from them directly rather than just kind
of making it up and you won't mind or going back with a kind of hell no that's
(39:36):
not for me yeah I think the thing too and when I coach I think
what's important is asking curious questions but i think the person
who said hey let's get a tattoo they've made a big
brave step probably probably because there's
something about like i i really give a lot of points to the the the partner
here who ventured this because somewhere along the line she's actually saying
(39:59):
you're important to me i want you on my body forever there is something you
know so it's really vulnerable they're just making a kind of You know, as you say,
some people are very impulsive and just think, oh, this would be a great idea.
Right. She could be. But let's just give her the benefit of the doubt and say
she's actually bidding to try to say something.
(40:21):
When you're responding to this, she's gone way out on a limb.
I think there's a possibility.
I think it's important to kind of really show your cards effectively.
Curious questions are great, but I think it's really important to put part of
yourself out there when you're responding to this.
You know, asking, well, what do you mean? Like, what kind of tattoo?
What were you thinking? Et cetera. You may say, like, wow, I've never thought of having a tattoo.
(40:44):
I've been terrified of them before.
And I'm also terrified just to put something permanently on my body.
So I'd love to hear more from you. But, like, I find that scary.
I think it's always important when you go into a conversation like this,
when somebody has been vulnerable, for you to be vulnerable a little bit.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. But I think if you go straight off the bat and just
(41:05):
kind of say, well, no, that's not for me, or I feel terrified by them,
or the danger is then you instantly get into kind of battles that one straight away,
because then they get really defensive about why it is such a good idea.
So I think that that's the potential danger by not kind of starting gently,
easing in, just having a conversation and asking for their perspective first before you offer yours.
(41:31):
I think you absolutely should offer your position, but it's how you do it.
Right, right. Okay. And if you go straight in with that message of kind of,
no, even if it is done softly, you can still then end up getting into that kind
of battle zone where you didn't really want to be there.
Yes, yes, yes. Okay. All right. We see eye to eye.
(41:56):
It's complicated business. It is. It really, really is. Yes, it is.
Not everybody makes it. That is true. Yeah. Yeah.
Oh, okay. So, I think that rounds us off nicely for the podcast today.
I have to say we did really well on a combined, what, four hours of sleep between
both of us last night? I think we did well.
(42:17):
Probably. Yeah, and I think I got most of those.
No, I mean, honestly, well, I should say I probably napped for an hour in the
midday. But yeah, no, I think we're doing pretty good. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Jordi Lass and Doc Sass can be sleep deprived and still running strong.
I'll bet you will listen to this. I'll edit this and I'll be like, well, that was weird.
(42:38):
But that's the cool thing about our podcast. It's not exactly polished.
We are who we are when we are. That's why people tune in. It really is.
Absolutely. Never a dull moment.
All right. So what does the rest of the week hold for you? Oh, good question.
You know what's interesting, and I'll maybe bring this up on future podcasts. I am...
(43:02):
Investigating the history of my family here in Greece, and I do have to say,
talking of love, I found a record in Cardiff of my 19-year-old grandmother who
wrote this letter of declaration to the Greek Orthodox Church saying,
I want to marry this man and that's why I want to get baptized.
It was a huge surprise. I thought maybe she was baptized as a young person,
(43:25):
And she was baptized in order to marry her man.
Oh, now that is romantic. See, that's going above and beyond. Right?
I know. I know. And to see her cursive writing in 1941 with this,
like, innocent love, Lauren.
Oh, my gosh. It was just so touching to see that. So I'm going down the journey
(43:48):
of the love and the loss of my grandparents' journey and hopefully finding patchwork
my family's history here in Greece.
Oh, nice. That's a nice thing to do. I know. I know.
And I will ask the same question, like, what is the week hold for you?
Maybe it's a bit different. Nothing as glamorous as that.
(44:11):
Oh, my gosh. I am back on my fitness trail, so I'm trying to get back in shape again. Oh, yes.
Oh, yeah. And avoid the wind and the rain on the hill. That's supposed to be heading our way.
Oh, my gosh. Okay. Okay. Because bathing suits are upon us soon, kind of.
Well. It doesn't feel like it. I literally don't think that's ever going to
(44:35):
happen this year. I know. I know. I bet it will. It will.
It seems gray. It seems rainy. but these are
all feeding the flowers they are indeed yeah oh beautiful well good luck on
your health journey and there are many people alongside you waking up from the
winter being like oh my god you
know coming out of the sweatpants and the sweatshirts like what meaning my,
(44:59):
form-fitting jeans don't fit what yeah yeah exactly yeah all right.
Music.
Music.
(00:28):
Hello, how's it going? It's good, it's good. If I'm hallucinating a bit today, just don't mind.
It's, well, it's tax season, everybody, and some of us are pulling all-nighters,
and I have pulled an all-nighter.
If you've been a regular listener to this podcast, you will know Anna always avoids doing her taxes.
(00:48):
What can I do? But she does always get there in the end.
You know what I realize, like every year, because you have to be in the zone,
right? There's this zone of focus because every year you forget what you did
last year and you're like, how did I make these calculations? That was ridiculous.
So you have to get into the zone and I think you have to pull an all-nighter.
You have to get in and not get out until it's done.
(01:11):
So I went into this sort of retreat.
There's no taking a break, is there? Because then you can't remember where you left off.
You can't remember, did I do this bit? Had I calculated that?
And then you have to go back and rework it.
Oh my God. like literally that was like yes exactly
those are the hours of my night so it was
insanity and i came out at around nine in the morning after an all-nighter finally
(01:35):
sent stuff off so yes well i hope you hope you've had some good day time maps
today then you know and it's funny when you have i haven't been able to sleep
all that much so that's where this podcast is gonna be a bit squirrely It's
going to be very primal, let's say.
But I will say that I have remained a law-abiding, tax-paying citizen,
(01:57):
and we can all be pretty happy about that.
Well, I'm glad to hear. I'm glad to hear. For another year. I think I must have
been coming out in sympathy with you because I woke up at quarter four this
morning and could not get back to sleep for loving the money.
Oh, that is a terrible time to wake up. It is. It's quite big.
Oh, no. No amount of meditation was getting me back to sleep. No, it's not.
(02:18):
I hate to say it. It's that four in the morning waking like you're pretty much.
Yeah. And then you just it's just best to get up and not fight it.
It feels terrible. I think I managed to live out.
Or I tried to resist it until about sort of 4.30, quarter to five.
And then I was like, nah, this is not working. Yeah.
(02:38):
So I embraced the day nice and early. Oh, yeah, yeah.
Well, okay. So you've been up for a lot of hours. All right.
So this is going to be an interesting podcast.
We can do this. We can totally do this. We can rise to this challenge. Oh my gosh, totally.
If there's some strange content, you'll know why. That it's coming from the
(02:59):
back recesses of our mind.
We have no frontal lobe functioning this is going to be raw and untethered.
Oh gosh good times should we start with the love desk oh let's go to the love
desk and see what the sleepy love uh correspondent is saying so the sleepy love
correspondence has a nice little quote for you that i spotted this morning when
(03:23):
i was doing some very early morning scrolling Oh, oh, nice.
Okay, so it's a lovely, it's actually quite a nice picture I'll describe it for you.
So it's two thumbprints that are kind of crossed over so it makes the shape of a heart.
Oh, oh, yes. And then the comment below says, it's not about having the perfect relationship.
(03:45):
It's about finding someone who matches you and will go through everything without giving up.
Oh, oh my gosh. Yeah. That just gave me lots of pause. Yeah.
Pause and reflection. Yeah. We've got this kind of unrealistic view that relationships
(04:06):
are not a good relationship if there's any sort of conflict.
As human beings, we're trying to actively avoid any sort of disagreement,
unsettlement, unhappiness.
And we just wanted to be kind of all the kind of roses and just lovely,
happy, cherished times together.
But, you know, the reality just isn't like that. I think this is why we love reality TV.
(04:31):
Because it's great to see inside other people's houses and see some of the challenges
and issues that other people face.
And it makes us feel normal to go, actually, I thought it was just me.
Or I thought that we were seriously dysfunctional.
But I realize, actually, other people are having arguments and unhappy times, too. Oh, yeah.
(04:53):
Yeah, totally. I mean, gosh, what do I think about that?
At the same time, though, like the drama of constant chaos, of fighting and
punching below the belt, that isn't functional either.
And I think that there's people who sort of, let's say, fight more than others.
But I will say that we
(05:15):
should not be afraid of the fight within which is
messy feelings that come up to us messy feelings
of expectations like you can always be shocked at just how we misunderstand
each other we think we're on the same page and our partner does something that
is so out of this world ridiculous that you're like are you doing this on purpose
(05:36):
but no no they just literally did not get the memo they didn't get your brain
waves they didn't understand.
So really, the fight is within. And that's, yeah, the fight is within.
And there may be some sort of raised voices, conflict, etc.
But yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there is always going to be this kind of,
(05:56):
as you say, times when we don't understand each other.
We really can't seem to connect.
And we can't understand, like,
why is it that you just don't get how I'm feeling or how I'm thinking?
I think the struggle is then how do you communicate that in an effective way?
So there's always going to be a time when we've got to communicate something
(06:17):
that's different or isn't necessarily going to be received in the way that we
want it to be. and it's then down to us to try and find a way to communicate that in a right way.
Yes, yes, yes. Yeah. Fight right, fight fair. But yeah, you're still going to fight.
Yeah. Yeah, that's very, very true. Because kind of rolling over and not sharing
(06:38):
your views also isn't kind of the right answer.
No. That's when you get into, slip into artificial harmony and all you're doing
is storing up some problem for later on in life.
Oh, you completely are. Later on in life?
Try next week. Yeah, for sure. For sure. Tomorrow.
Yeah, yeah. No, I've gotten nowhere by not explaining my needs.
(07:01):
Absolutely nowhere. Yeah, totally.
I was a lovely friend reached out, hey, how's it going? And I realized the last
time I talked to them was like, you know, six, eight months ago.
And so much has changed. I've learned so much and I've grown so much.
I've been been so humbled.
And it was so crazy to kind of correspond and to say, wow, like,
I have mellowed, I have gotten braver, I have gotten more vulnerable,
(07:26):
I have gotten less anxious, I've gotten less avoidant, less insecure.
I've faced a lot of internal demons, I've come out the other side.
So, gosh, yeah, don't be afraid of conflict.
The inner stuff too and wow in in
a relationship oh gosh a good relationship
is one that just oh my gosh that you learn and
(07:49):
get your butt kicked and you grow and
you develop you get stronger so cool yeah yeah absolutely
yeah and I think you know it talks to
that point around how much you can develop a
relationship by just taking some ownership and
some responsibility for yourself and and doing
some of that work as you say to really look at what are
(08:11):
the feelings that are coming up for me what is it that i'm doing
how am i influencing the dynamics in our relationship and that's something that
we talked about when we discussed you know relationship resets common question
is well what if my partner won't do the work like that comes up a lot whether
it's coaching or you know embarking on some kind of you know solo mission but i think it's always
(08:33):
possible to affect some positive change by just moving, making some very small adjustments.
You'd be surprised how far they can go. Oh yeah, yeah, you've got it. Yes. Ah, nice.
All right, guys, get your big girl pants on, as they say.
Yes. Shall we take our topic? Yes, let's go forth. Okay. Boldly go is no...
(08:57):
Music.
Do you have 37 personalities in your relationship? Yes.
(09:18):
I love this. Like, where did the number 37 come from? It's got to be one of
the most odd. It's a number that I never think about.
I don't even think I spent much time thinking about, like, myself at the age
of 37. It was just a year that just went by.
Hannah loves my random WhatsApp messages. I love it. You have no idea.
What do you think? Oh, my God. I love it. I was like, 37, that's amazing.
(09:43):
What an odd, as a mathematician, if there's a mathematician out in our audience,
I'd love to know, what is it about this odd number that is so special that it's
just so odd? Anyways, yes, 37.
There was that film, wasn't there? What was that film? 27 Dresses or something,
where the girl was just a bridesmaid 27 times and was never a bride.
(10:05):
Oh, God, that would be an expensive venture. Until she was, obviously,
because that had to be ending.
That's how that happens sorry did you spoil it yeah spoiler
alert i got into
trouble the other day for spoiling a program that my daughter was watching this
is the problem with catch-up tv isn't it and on-demand tv i guess people are
in different stages and phases of the same series right right she's back in
(10:29):
uni now and i managed to spoil a program for her i was like i'm so sorry Sorry,
you were like well ahead of me.
I don't know how I'm sitting in front of you. Which program? Was it a big one?
It was my favorite guilt-fleasure program out of us. Oh, yes.
Wait, how can you be a spoiler? Isn't it just, oh, oh, now I understand.
(10:51):
About what happens to the PC.
Oh, I see. Oh, ooh. Oh. Because people can kind of choose to leave the experiment.
Oh. And some of you did, and your daughter didn't know? No.
Well, I can't say anymore now. I can't say anymore. I literally feel like I'm already in trouble.
(11:12):
Isn't it funny? I just have to say, before we dive into our hot topic,
I just have to say, how many hours of labor were you in with your daughter?
I think you're allowed to spoil a program for her.
Yeah, I think 21. Oh, yeah. It's like a full day.
Oh, yeah. I don't even eat as well. That's the thing that's a bit disappointing.
I don't have anything to eat. got to a certain point and yeah
(11:34):
you eat then well i mean honestly she's still
paying off that debt if i may say yeah get
back to us when you know yeah absolutely we have we paid off our 14 not even
oh my gosh all right we are massively derailed now we need to get back on back
on track with this hot topic girl yes indeed focus okay so 37 personalities in your relationship
(12:00):
okay i have at least half of those
so i am curious about
whether we have the right interpretation of this hot topic because
i may be thinking something a little different where what does your mind go
when it thinks about 37 you know personalities i can tell you where mine goes
straight to perimenopause oh oh have i been having conversations about that
(12:22):
although some of that might be because i was having a conversation with somebody
today about that very subject
ah I think there are certain times in your life especially I'm going to speak.
As a as a female with hormones that yeah
fly around especially now to say
that yeah I think there are I think there's but even
just kind of everyday life you know when you when you're faced with
(12:44):
different pressures in your relationship or in
life in general you are going to end up I
think you do kind of often take that out on your nearest and
dearest and you're kind of there and there and you know
that you know you've got that kind of love and support sometimes you
could probably get away with a bit more than you maybe would
kind of test with a
(13:05):
friendship and because you're there like if you live together
then you're there and you've got kind of ready access
to be able to just kind of see everything that does happen so I think there
can be times whether that's you know something to do with health or hormones
or life changes having babies all of those things work pressures all of those
things can present a different facet of who we are as a person so that's how I interpret it.
(13:30):
Oh very cool okay all right I think also the things that have happened in our
past can influence so a lot of those whether that's small t or large t traumas
that come back to visit us where we forget that we're safe we're here now this is the present.
Taken back to the past we were put into a fight
(13:50):
or flight mode we're put into a defensive mode we're brought back
to our 12 year old selves that that i
i would say more than anything that's
where it's still the past uh selves
the less well-adjusted past selves that
come and visit my relationships yes yeah
yeah i think it's interesting what you're
(14:12):
saying before about that kind of reflection and having that conversation with
your friend and saying and kind of like you know over the last
seven or eight months like what has happened and I
look at our relationship which spans longer than seven or eight months and you
know I look at some of the kind of changes that we've been through and or things
that have affected us or outside influences kind of whatever it is and you can
(14:36):
really see kind of yeah there's been some definite kind of,
personality changes or kind of moments of who we are that have come out in you know some of
those situations that we've been through together oh how cool
is that so you run us through some
of the personalities or sort of how does your the personality that's coming
(14:57):
up whether that's yours or his or sort of a you know the the dual of different
you know how does that make you show up to situations differently and show up
to conflict differently or create conflict.
Yes, I think, you know, like you're talking about, you know,
lots of the stuff that's happened around, you know, from our childhood,
we all kind of have things that have come up.
(15:20):
I'm saying we all, you know, some people have perfectly secure,
happy childhoods and haven't really kind of, you know, they're not bringing
a whole host of stuff to deal with into a relationship, but they may have had
maybe a previous relationship.
So I was working with a client recently and we were doing some stuff around
kind of attachment styles and so the primary attachment styles are secure,
(15:41):
anxious, avoidant and we were doing some work around that and what it meant
and she couldn't resonate with the fact that,
you know, the study would suggest that most of the time this comes from your
relationship with your primary caregiver then indicates how those relationships are in future.
And I and I knew that she wasn't going to resonate with this so we kind of had
a discussion about it and but for her where it had come up had been previous
(16:04):
relationships so there'd been one or two significant relationships in her life
that had then kind of caused this this kind of.
More unsettled and less kind of secure attachment styles so I think there is
that element that you then take into a relationship which then can cause you
to show up in a different way so you know
(16:25):
let's say that you know you're displaying an anxious
attachment style because you've been in a relationship where somebody
has caused you not to be able to trust them so and
this you know if it happens in childhood it's often the
case that actually your parents could be quite kind of up and
down in terms of you know one minute can really there for
you the next minute kind of you know almost leaving
(16:47):
you to fend for yourself and not being able to tend to
your emotional needs and help you to kind of
self-regulate those sorts of things but this can
happen kind of if you've had a really traumatic relationship you know in with
a kind of significant person that as a result of that and in that kind of trust
is being broken down and eroded you can start to display some kind of anxious
(17:11):
attachment styles that then come out in your relationship.
And then reinforce each other by creating the very loss of a relationship potentially that you fear.
Yeah. Reinforcing the insecurity. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.
I think what this kind of topic really makes me think about is because I think
(17:33):
often, you know, we need to look at self.
We need to look at who we are, how we contribute into a relationship.
It's all well and good saying our partner's done this. They just need to change.
They need to look at themselves. you know they need to examine
their 37 personalities they need to go for
coaching yeah yeah but you know we will
have things that are happening for us we
(17:53):
will have ways where maybe we're not that predictable in
a relationship and this can cause that may cause anxiety
and others it may cause avoidance withdrawal you
know we do get this chain reaction that happens
and this is why you know we talk about relationship dynamics because
it isn't nothing's happening in in a vacuum is we're
kind of having these reactions with each other sometimes they'll
(18:16):
be positive sometimes neutral sometimes negative but if
we can take a step back and say well actually you know what have
i do i show up consistently in the relationship do i
you know if my if my partner kind of
wants to have a conversation with me am i always there do i always turn
towards them do i always give them the time of day or
sometimes am i a bit shorter with them
(18:37):
do i kind of you know or ignore them or just think they'll kind
of stop talking in minutes fine you know what how
is that reaction what what is it that
i do how do i respond to my partner so it
could be just something like that if you take a step back and examine that and
say well actually maybe sometimes i am a bit snappy or sometimes i haven't got
(18:58):
the time or sometimes i don't acknowledge that they want to have some attention
and you know i'll brush it off
and i'll and i'll just walk away and carry on doing what i I was doing.
Oh, yes. Going through flashbacks. Guilty.
Oh, yeah. I think, I mean, okay, 37 personalities, yes.
(19:19):
But I would like to kind of just imagine, okay, there's kind of two dominant ones.
One of them I'm really proud of. It's the way I show up. It's very optimistic.
It's very loving. It's very nurturing.
It's really showing up. It's It's bringing the energy. It's a building anabolic energy.
My dominant personality that I'm not proud of, which has shown up in past relationships,
(19:44):
the reason why it's so important is because I, when I'm in that mood state,
let's just say, it comes from a place of hurt and fear, like absolute terror.
And I think I am so easy to read when I'm running with that personality and
so easy to soothe. It makes me wonder, like, and what it is,
is it's a shutdown, a total shutdown, quiet.
(20:08):
I withdraw affection. I withdraw eye contact.
It's like I can't say something. I'm not trying to punish my partner,
but I just, I'm so hurt and terrified that I'm kind of waiting for them to come
to knock on my shell and get me out of my shell.
Yeah yeah yeah and you know you're not alone in that you know
i think if all of us if we're honest you know we'll say
(20:31):
well yeah i've done that i still do it i need to
work on that and it could you know that could be
a starting position is just to say all right if
i have spotted that as being something that's a
tendency that i do when i'm hurt and i'm
suffering i mean it's down to
me to try and break that cycle and i may ask for some
(20:51):
help with that you know you don't have to do it on your own you know
you could say look do you know what I'm really trying
to work on this area and I can see that it's not
good for me it's not good for you I want
to get a bit more consistent than this and I want to try and address it you
know could could you help me you know would you be able to do and then you know
make a request I'm going to really try and do this could you do that and then
(21:15):
maybe between the two of us we can start to kind of break some of that down
because Because it's learned behavior. You've learned how to do that.
We've all learned this in the past.
We've learned that that is the best way to kind of cope as we see it at that
time, you know, when we're learning those patterns.
But the more you can kind of unpick it and create some new patterns of behavior
(21:37):
and start to create those connections in the brain.
Then the more you can kind of not react and show up that way.
I think so. Yeah, no, absolutely.
And I think it's a two to tango. I will say, though, that in unpicking this
particular personality type, like whenever somebody withdraws or stonewalls,
(21:57):
I think the like, I have to imagine and I've only been doing this recently,
hopping over the proverbial side of the fence to look at myself when I'm in that state.
And I assume that I'm just a little teddy bear, just a little quiet teddy bear
like, oh, she's just sad.
You just need to give her a hug. Ask her what's wrong. I'm terrifying.
(22:19):
I'm absolutely intimidating and terrifying. terrifying yeah no no no average
human being would poke the bear so and i have to understand that i'm not in
a lovable state i see that sounds like a challenge to me yeah yes totally,
yeah i'm not saying in the moment you're going to be able
to have those conversations and do that the the
(22:42):
work happens before you get to that point it's saying okay
i know i have this this pattern right how
do i shine a light on it how do i then get some sort
of strategy to help me get out of that quicker and then
the shorter you can make that time to the
point that eventually you know you just stop going into it because you just
think there's no point here and i'm not saying that's easy right like no eight
(23:06):
years in still working on my relationship oh gosh yeah yeah and i think i think
though i i own the vast the big share of this because like i gotta pop my own self out.
When I'm feeling terrified and shut down and I'm avoiding eye contact,
I'm terrified the other person is going to abandon me and leave me.
The last thing that I want to do is show a gesture of love or communication,
(23:30):
because what if that person slaps me away and rejects me, right? That's the big fear.
At the same time, because I'm so freaking terrifying, I have to make the.
And I love that you say that it is a two to tango and you can bring your partner
in to say, could you help out?
(23:50):
At the same time, I own 90% of the effort.
Like maybe what i can say is that if i've
been if i'm feeling like really kind of in my shell
and i make a little gesture that you know if my partner
could really kind of yes and that scene as an improv artist i'd be like yeah
i see you getting out that girl here's some here's some love to add to that
(24:12):
recipe because often we don't do that we go well you're not trying hard enough
you know in this is a conversation that goes on well you really hurt me so you
need to do more than that That little tiny gesture that you've just done there.
Cup of tea is not going to cut the water. Oh.
So, OK, this is the thing. And there starts the negative dance.
(24:32):
You got it. So here's the thing.
And this might be your cup of tea.
If your partner does something particular that is meant to chill the ice or
to thaw the ice, this is a wonderful ask to be like, if it is that cup of tea,
maybe it is the special. Maybe it's like the special blend of tea.
Maybe you've put some ginger in it or made a little special effort because you've
(24:56):
been in this shitty personality all day and you're just wanting to break the ice with your partner.
Is that when you're bringing out that tea that your partner is like,
oh, this is the specialty.
Whatever that tea is for you. Yeah. And you're right.
Like we, gosh, we punish our partners and then we kind of give them these prison
sentences like, oh, no, you still got to start.
(25:18):
Keep paying off the debt not there yet yeah
we do i mean we'll punish punish ourselves as well in
the process so oh yes yeah the
one thing i would add to this discussion is it's okay to have personality ah
okay yes because there's a danger isn't there that you try and neutralize yourself
(25:39):
so much that you've just got nothing left of you right yes yes hold on i don't
know know what that's like.
No, but it's true. No, it's true. I just can't show up as anybody else.
But no, I mean, it is, I think to your point, actually doing the relationship
desk, which is not sharing what you need can turn into this,
I'm okay with anything thing.
(26:01):
And that is, that's a very, very, that's a very dangerous precedent to set. Mm-hmm.
You don't want to become like totally vanilla as a person you know
you love the fact that there's so many different dimensions to human beings
that's what makes us so fascinated yes you know about each other and yeah that's
what makes it so interesting yes and it's a tutor tango so here's the thing
(26:24):
i what i realized and i'm still learning i'm sure i'll look back on my current
self and be like, wow, she didn't know anything.
But not only is it where you like,
it is up to me to be able to manage my personalities and not be shitty.
I'm thinking of my lovely friends, just don't be shitty. So I can minimize being
(26:48):
shitty. That's what I can bring to the table.
But I have super realized that not everybody gets my secret sauce.
And I shouldn't be with somebody who doesn't get at my secret sauce,
if they don't like my sauce, if they don't like barbecue and they want honey
like mustard, go off and find honey mustard.
I should not get married to somebody who doesn't like barbecue sauce.
(27:09):
But if they like barbecue sauce, it's amazing.
I just, all the ways in which I was just used to being really a drag on somebody
because they just didn't like my sauce.
You know, when I met my current man, he was delighted.
I was like, what? You like barbecue? he was like oh love it love it
and he just it was not even it was just a natural thing it didn't try very hard
(27:33):
he just was delighted by my quirky personalities yeah and so i can strive to
not be shitty but i also need to like find somebody who likes what i cook in
the kitchen yeah absolutely Absolutely.
I mean, be you, but just don't be a dick with it. Oh, yes.
(27:55):
Yes. And certainly don't try and punish a pot.
We do all the time because hurt people hurt people and we, misery loves company.
And we just love people to feel sad along with us. It's true.
It's true. Yeah. Okay. All right. Well, that should put the personalities to bed for a bit.
(28:19):
Go and dig out your 37 personalities and see which ones are working for you
yeah right exactly all right i am gonna move us to a question oh yes.
Music.
My girlfriend wants us to get matching tattoos, but I hate them. What should I do?
(28:44):
Okay, can I be honest? Yes.
When are you not? When are we not? Three years in.
I know, right? Right? Like, Sarah, can I be straight up with you?
And you're like, when have you not let your fight play? I haven't seen this
side of your personality.
Honest Doc Sass? What? It's not in the name? Come on then, hit me with it.
(29:07):
If anybody wants to make some money in the next 20, 30 years,
it is to set up tattoo removal parlors next to all these tattoo parlors.
Because it is so cool to see everybody with their arm sleeves and their tattoos
across their shoulders in foreign languages and all this stuff.
And it's a really amazing form of self-expression when you're young. But, man!
(29:33):
You know there's a program, it's called Tattoo Fixer. or
something like that and it was never kind of like a
watcher but sometimes you stumble across something on
tv so i started watching it and there
were these two girls that had been to i don't know some kind of teen hot spot
in europe and um where they do actually still tattoo people late at night who
(29:58):
have been too much to drink oh which i think should not be allowed but anyway oh these two
girls had two things tattooed on their feet,
that you would need both of them to be stood next to each other to make sense of it.
So one had chicken and the other had nugget.
(30:21):
Oh my God. Oh my God. I'm just thinking of like being...
Being a 65-year-old grandmother, like, you know, out in a summer day and our
grandkids are like, nugget, what does that mean?
Why have you got chicken tattooed on your foot? Oh, my God.
Seemed like a good idea at the time when you were in Lisbon. Yeah, exactly.
(30:44):
Exactly. Oh, my God. So, yeah. That's crazy.
You know, and the thing is, and it's a beautiful form of self-expression.
I think everybody should be able to like live at large for the most part,
with the exception of like very hard drugs that does take a toll on the body.
And I as a physician, I'm like, oh, please just don't. But anyways,
other than that, like tattoos, everyone's allowed to be a silly young person
(31:08):
and do things that, you know, they kind of would not do if they were older.
Older but tattoos are hard because they do take quite a bit to remove not impossible
but they do take it quite a bit to remove but at the same time like there's
people who like myself who don't get tattooed because I just saw myself at 50
(31:28):
and didn't think there was anything that I would care.
Much at 50 that I really cared at 22 at the same time it really is a powerful form of self
-expression so i think it's important and and for some
it really there's people who will use tattoo
as a form of grief or memorializing a
loved one perhaps a child or a very or somebody who's passed on and there's
(31:53):
others who really love tattoo as a form of symbolism sharing in relationship
and so i do take this seriously even though i'm like oh god if you want to make
money open up a tattoo removal parlor but this question comes from like it sounds
like this is not a frivolous ask this this guy's partner really does want.
(32:18):
Matching tattoos. I don't know. I went to a different space.
I was like, oh, this is your girlfriend. Like you're not even married.
Oh. Why would you even contemplate this?
Oh. Oh, you're like, yeah, no.
Right. Prenup and a tattoo. Yeah. I get what you're saying.
You know, this kind of like expression of love. Oh, we love each other.
(32:40):
We're going to get matching tattoos. How romantic.
Right, right. What happens in two or three years time when, you know,
if you're not together anymore, you've got to find another Christy to replace
that with? With the spelling of Y on the end, not IE. I know.
Totally. Oh, my gosh. Okay.
(33:00):
Very good point. Well, but actually, this is a great question.
It's a proxy question to how serious is this relationship for me?
Yeah i think it's a good it's a
real opportunity to try and practice some strong communication isn't
it because there's a few things you know one is you've
got a difference there now the difference could be i
(33:21):
don't know what color do you paint it will be a living room wall but it's
not you know the difference is i want us to have
a permanent reminder on our bodies of each other and
you don't so it's quite a strong difference then
there's very personal preferences I think about kind
of tattoos I think you're either in the yes camp or you're in
the kind of no camp when it comes to your personal
(33:43):
choice about what you want to do and they are firmly in different
camps yeah so it's a good opportunity to really practice some kind of communication
skills and understand things from each other's perspectives because you know
you might change you might shift your view on it based on what your partner's
going to tell you but I do think The other side of it is kind of,
(34:03):
you know, how realistic is it,
how sensible is it to get a tattoo to somebody who you haven't,
you know, just declared a kind of full permanent commitment with,
which is what we do when we say we're going to get married. Yeah, no, that's true.
And also, like, the cool thing about this is that...
(34:23):
This person, whether they will even get a tattoo ever, it's very clear this
is not a decision they take lightly.
Some people get tattoos like they wake up in the morning and they're like,
and for them, it's a very easy choice.
But it's the same as like moving in together. For some people, no big deal.
I've known you for two weeks. We'll move in. Other people are very same as marriage.
(34:46):
Some people will elope. Oh yeah, I've just known you for two months.
Others are petrified at the the magnitude of the choice.
So whatever it be, the cool thing is, this is actually coming headlong into
who are you in my life and where do we stand on the road together?
Is this a choice that we may make one day? Is it the choice that we will make today?
(35:11):
And so I think what's really important is to, it's never just the tattoo.
I don't think this is about a tattoo.
I think this And it could even be the partner's bid for a conversation about where are we?
Oh, let's go get matching tattoos. And maybe the subliminal thought is it'll
make this guy think, like, how serious am I? Where are we going?
(35:33):
I definitely opt for just asking the question in the first place.
Ah, yes. And not going down this route of kind of, if it is that, that's driving it.
You know going down this route of kind of that you know the
subtle art art of kind of trying to get the information
that you want with asking a completely different question
i think it's really important to be like you know what this is a great opportunity
(35:56):
let's uh hold off on the tattoos and have some long conversations about yeah
where we are in life where we're going and do we see this as a long-term commitment
yeah wonderful segue because the tattoo was a long commitment i mean Honestly, it kind of is.
It's one of the biggest, I mean, as my lovely friend says, is that marriage
is the most financially risky thing you'll ever do in your life. And it's true.
(36:19):
But a tattoo is kind of up there in terms of permanence and potential consequences. It really is.
Yeah. So no matter what, it should never be on your face. Just saying.
Just don't get face tats.
You know the other thing too if it is just a
tattoo if if all this is if they have a talk
and they're like if she's like oh no i don't want to get married anytime soon
(36:43):
i just want to get a tattoo with you it's like all right all right well maybe
then that tattoo is something small so i mean if you know whatever whatever
it may be is that you can always find a compromise zone But yes,
recognize what this bid is standing in for and what the question really is.
(37:04):
And sometimes there will be things that you just both disagree on and there
is no compromise. And this may be it for them.
Yes. Yeah. And that's okay.
And that's the thing, too. Like, we shouldn't be scared of conflict.
We shouldn't be scared of finding out there's a values clash.
And ultimately, we shouldn't be scared if we find out something,
(37:24):
which is the trial period, right?
Like, dating is we're not sure yet.
And so if we find out that there's something about a tattoo that represents,
or not even just the tattoo, but the way of approaching this sort of decision,
or philosophies on life, if these are fundamentally different,
(37:45):
maybe this is not a relationship that has long-term legs, and that's okay.
Yeah. You know, it's much better to discover that, you know,
one person being a tattoo, loves motorbikes, loves like taking risks and so forth.
And the other person is like, no, more measured and likes a good book and so forth.
Like maybe those two people, they may be able to find common ground,
(38:08):
but maybe there's just fundamental differences.
And the conversation starts with the tattoo. What do you think of tattoos?
Time to get some talking done. Yeah. You know what? But like this would be a
great, you know, those intimacy cards.
There's several kinds that you can get, ones that are meant to really spur on conversation.
Conversation starters and initiators that are beyond like, how was your day today?
(38:31):
Because we do so much silly talk about like transactional. What did you do? What did you eat?
I could see this card being in that deck of 50 intimacy cards.
Like what's your view on tattoos?
It's a great one. Yeah. I mean, there's a whole host of stuff that questions
that we can ask that just go kind of a little bit deeper.
(38:52):
Shouldn't be afraid to ask them. No, gosh.
What would you recommend as a compassionate, open, curious and welcoming response?
If you're like a hell no tattoo at this point in time, but you want to,
you know, honor your partner for bringing it up.
Like what's something that you would respond with? I think
(39:13):
it's just getting curious and really exploring it you know what
is it about tattoos that you you know would
be interested in what what would that mean to you what
sort of tattoo are you thinking of you know really get some understanding get
some kind of perspective some insight from them directly rather than just kind
of making it up and you won't mind or going back with a kind of hell no that's
(39:36):
not for me yeah I think the thing too and when I coach I think
what's important is asking curious questions but i think the person
who said hey let's get a tattoo they've made a big
brave step probably probably because there's
something about like i i really give a lot of points to the the the partner
here who ventured this because somewhere along the line she's actually saying
(39:59):
you're important to me i want you on my body forever there is something you
know so it's really vulnerable they're just making a kind of You know, as you say,
some people are very impulsive and just think, oh, this would be a great idea.
Right. She could be. But let's just give her the benefit of the doubt and say
she's actually bidding to try to say something.
(40:21):
When you're responding to this, she's gone way out on a limb.
I think there's a possibility.
I think it's important to kind of really show your cards effectively.
Curious questions are great, but I think it's really important to put part of
yourself out there when you're responding to this.
You know, asking, well, what do you mean? Like, what kind of tattoo?
What were you thinking? Et cetera. You may say, like, wow, I've never thought of having a tattoo.
(40:44):
I've been terrified of them before.
And I'm also terrified just to put something permanently on my body.
So I'd love to hear more from you. But, like, I find that scary.
I think it's always important when you go into a conversation like this,
when somebody has been vulnerable, for you to be vulnerable a little bit.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. But I think if you go straight off the bat and just
(41:05):
kind of say, well, no, that's not for me, or I feel terrified by them,
or the danger is then you instantly get into kind of battles that one straight away,
because then they get really defensive about why it is such a good idea.
So I think that that's the potential danger by not kind of starting gently,
easing in, just having a conversation and asking for their perspective first before you offer yours.
(41:31):
I think you absolutely should offer your position, but it's how you do it.
Right, right. Okay. And if you go straight in with that message of kind of,
no, even if it is done softly, you can still then end up getting into that kind
of battle zone where you didn't really want to be there.
Yes, yes, yes. Okay. All right. We see eye to eye.
(41:56):
It's complicated business. It is. It really, really is. Yes, it is.
Not everybody makes it. That is true. Yeah. Yeah.
Oh, okay. So, I think that rounds us off nicely for the podcast today.
I have to say we did really well on a combined, what, four hours of sleep between
both of us last night? I think we did well.
(42:17):
Probably. Yeah, and I think I got most of those.
No, I mean, honestly, well, I should say I probably napped for an hour in the
midday. But yeah, no, I think we're doing pretty good. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Jordi Lass and Doc Sass can be sleep deprived and still running strong.
I'll bet you will listen to this. I'll edit this and I'll be like, well, that was weird.
(42:38):
But that's the cool thing about our podcast. It's not exactly polished.
We are who we are when we are. That's why people tune in. It really is.
Absolutely. Never a dull moment.
All right. So what does the rest of the week hold for you? Oh, good question.
You know what's interesting, and I'll maybe bring this up on future podcasts. I am...
(43:02):
Investigating the history of my family here in Greece, and I do have to say,
talking of love, I found a record in Cardiff of my 19-year-old grandmother who
wrote this letter of declaration to the Greek Orthodox Church saying,
I want to marry this man and that's why I want to get baptized.
It was a huge surprise. I thought maybe she was baptized as a young person,
(43:25):
And she was baptized in order to marry her man.
Oh, now that is romantic. See, that's going above and beyond. Right?
I know. I know. And to see her cursive writing in 1941 with this,
like, innocent love, Lauren.
Oh, my gosh. It was just so touching to see that. So I'm going down the journey
(43:48):
of the love and the loss of my grandparents' journey and hopefully finding patchwork
my family's history here in Greece.
Oh, nice. That's a nice thing to do. I know. I know.
And I will ask the same question, like, what is the week hold for you?
Maybe it's a bit different. Nothing as glamorous as that.
(44:11):
Oh, my gosh. I am back on my fitness trail, so I'm trying to get back in shape again. Oh, yes.
Oh, yeah. And avoid the wind and the rain on the hill. That's supposed to be heading our way.
Oh, my gosh. Okay. Okay. Because bathing suits are upon us soon, kind of.
Well. It doesn't feel like it. I literally don't think that's ever going to
(44:35):
happen this year. I know. I know. I bet it will. It will.
It seems gray. It seems rainy. but these are
all feeding the flowers they are indeed yeah oh beautiful well good luck on
your health journey and there are many people alongside you waking up from the
winter being like oh my god you
know coming out of the sweatpants and the sweatshirts like what meaning my,
(44:59):
form-fitting jeans don't fit what yeah yeah exactly yeah all right.
Music.
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