Elisabet Raquel García: Finding & reconnecting to your roots

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Going back to the theme of feelinglost, the reason why I felt so lost
and the reason why I was striving toget the heck out of here was because
in my personal life, I've had a lot oftrauma and a lot of drama and like in
my personal household and family, and Iwould always ask myself, like, why me?
Why my family?
Hello.
Hello.
And welcome back to the I'm lost.

(00:20):
So what podcast?
This is Cassandra Le.
And I am super excited for today'sepisode with Elisabet Raquel Garcia.
She is a global education DEI specialist.
So let me share a little bitabout Elisabet so you all can get
to know her a little bit beforewe dive into the conversation.
Elisabet was a first gen lowincome student from the outskirts

(00:40):
of East LA who was able to studyabroad during her undergrad studies
four times for nearly for free.
Yes, for free.
Her experiences abroad changedher life for the better forever.
Since then, she's built her careeras a global education DEI specialist
on a mission to support historicallyunderserved students in accessing more
equitable education opportunities throughher company, Access Equitable Education.

(01:03):
Her and her work have been featuredeverywhere by companies like Go
Overseas and Diversity Abroad, togovernment organizations such as the U.
S.
Department of State and the MexicanSecretary of Foreign Relations.
So in this conversation, we are divinginto what it was like for her to find her
roots, what it was like for her to reallydocument her family's history and become

(01:23):
a family historian, and of course, whatglobal education DEI specialist actually
does, and all of those good things.
So I am super excitedfor this conversation.
So let's just dive in.
Hello, everyone.
I'm Cassandra Le, and you'relistening to I'm Lost, So What?
The podcast exploring betweenbelonging and carving your own path.
For all the peeps out there who kindof know what you're doing, but still

(01:45):
question what the fuck is going on.
Yeah, I'm with you.
Hey, Elizabet.
Hello.
Hi, Cassandra.
How are you doing?
Hi, Good.
How are you?
Good.
Tired, but good.
Um, I feel like that answer is verycommon whenever we talk to each other.
We have different time zones, but youknow, we're both happy to be here.

(02:09):
This is actually like an okaytime for both of us, right?
Yeah, this is like a great time.
Um, for all the people listening,we are nine hours apart.
So finding a good timeis always Difficult.
Um, but I'm super excited to have youhere and to have you on the podcast.
Um, I feel like this conversationis going to be really awesome.
So let's just.

(02:30):
Dive into it.
The first question that I alwaysask folks is what does being lost
mean to you and can you describethe feeling of being lost?
Oh, yeah, so that is a great question.
It's also a big question Wowwhat is being lost to me.
I mean, there's that quote unquote cheesysaying, you don't know where you're going

(02:53):
unless you know where you're coming from.
And yeah, that is a trope, you know,that we see time and time again,
especially in like literature.
And in movies, it's, it's thatcommon, that common theme.
You don't know where you're goingunless where you're coming from.
And in my case, I believe that'smy definition of being lost.
And, um, that was the definitionof who I was for many years.

(03:17):
I had no idea where I was going becauseI had no idea where I was coming from.
So I spent many, many years lost.
So as cheesy as that saying is, Ifind it to be absolutely true and
understand why it's a universal themein literature and movies because it's
true and it just, it makes sense.
Yeah.
And we'll dive more intoit in a bit, but yeah.
I know I'm like.

(03:37):
Oh, this goes into like everythingthat we're talking about right now.
So I guess if you are ever feeling lost,where is that feeling like in your body?
What does that actually feel like for you?
Um, because yes, I I agree.
I feel like a lot of the times, and alot of the other guests that have come

(03:58):
on, they've always described being lostas either really anxious feeling or, you
know, they are lacking self confidence.
Some people are like, Oh, it's actuallyreally exciting because I get to explore
and it's almost like an adventure.
I don't think anybody has actuallysaid like, Oh, being lost is.
It's basically not knowingwhere you're coming from.

(04:18):
So what is that feeling like?
Can you, I guess, contextualizeit, intellectualize it?
I feel like my therapist wouldbe like, we're not supposed to
intellectualize our feelings.
You're just supposed to feel them,but you know, for the people.
Yeah.
I would say that feeling glossed for me,um, where it feels in my body or where
I have a sensation of feeling lost.

(04:39):
Definitely for many, many years, I feltvery lost in my head and also in my heart.
So those were the two main places whereI felt the impact of being lost and
not knowing where I was coming from orwhere I was going in the head space.
I definitely felt like overwhelmed,anxious, scared, unsure of
what I was doing and why.

(05:00):
And you know, it felt very, um, what'sthe word chaotic up in here, very
chaotic, all up in the head becauseI had no idea what I was doing or why
I was doing the things I was doing.
And in my heart, the sensationis just a feeling of emptiness.
I've had that feeling ofemptiness for so many years.

(05:21):
Um, and anytime I feel lost andor alone, those, those two same
sensations come back either.
There's a lot happening up here.
I'm feeling overwhelmed in my head, butI've got the head part under control
now, but every now and then I will stillfeel like that emptiness in my heart.
It's kind of like an aching feeling,um, and it doesn't feel good, but

(05:42):
it still happens to me time to time.
Oh my gosh.
Thank you first for likesharing so openly about that.
And as soon as you said emptiness,I was like, Oh, yeah, was I think I
was talking about this with somebody,I think it was Chloe on the podcast.
I was saying like thisfeeling of yearning.
Actually Spotify classified me as somebodywho listens to music that Represents

(06:05):
feelings and emotions of yearning, butthere's like yearning feeling, which to
me is almost like the emptiness becauseit's like I'm looking for something.
And it's like.
I'm trying to find it, butit's just like this longing.
So, yes, I, I feel like everythingthat we're going to talk about, um, and

(06:28):
all the questions I have prepared, um,is going to definitely explore that.
So let's just dive into it.
So I wanted to go into finding your roots.
And I know when you studied and livedabroad, you reconnected with your
family in Chile, uh, Mexico, I believe,and then a couple other countries.
And for other people who don'tknow, Elisabet lives in East L.

(06:51):
A.
So what was that process liketo reconnect with family there?
I don't know if you have met them before.
You had never met them.
You knew about them.
Yeah.
What was that?
What was that like for you?
Yeah, reconnecting with my family andmy lost loved ones abroad was a huge,
I don't know how to, how do I say?

(07:12):
It was a very intense experience.
So much happened and I didn't knowmuch of my family from Chile at all.
Um, my family from Mexico, Igrew up around more or less.
I've, I've always known about themand have been in contact with them.
And, um, most of my familyfrom Mexico lives in the
United States, here in East LA.
But a lot of my other relatives who stayedin Mexico, um, I still, you know, saw

(07:36):
them once every year, once every coupleof years when they would come visit.
And I went to Mexico when Iwas like five to go visit.
That was my first, first and lasttime for like, whew, 15, 16 years.
So reconnecting with my familiesand my, particularly like my
long lost families in Chile wasa very intense experience for me.

(07:57):
And yeah, I didn't know that theyeven existed, my family in Chile.
Oh, wow.
Yeah, because I guess this tiesinto the theme, like you don't
know where you're going until youknow where you're coming from.
But interestingly enough.
For folks who are listening who don'tknow, I decided to study abroad, um, when
I was in college because I was having areally, really rough time living on campus

(08:19):
as a first gen low income student and Ifound myself in a super unique opportunity
to study abroad, basically for free,um, from a great financial aid package
and, um, I won 25, 000 in scholarships.
And I needed to get away from campus,so I decided to first study abroad
in Brazil because I was enamoredby Brazilian music, particularly
Bossa Nova for years, years, years.

(08:40):
I had this fascination withBrazil and Brazilian music.
I really romanticized it growing up.
And then when I got there, I was havinglike this existential crisis and I got
to the point of, wait, why am I here?
Why am I learning Portugueseif I don't even speak Spanish?
I don't even know my family.
And you know, I think the universeworks in very interesting ways, but

(09:02):
around that same time when I washaving those thoughts, my mom found out
that she had a sister who was livingin Chile that she never knew about.
Yeah.
To add some context, my mom was born inBolivia and she also knew nothing about
her family in Chile because she had neverbeen very complicated history there.
She had never been, she didn'tknow that she had siblings.

(09:22):
And then she found outthat she had a sister.
And when I was in Brazil, that's when Idecided, okay, you're in South America.
You didn't spend any money whileyou were here because you were
too busy crying in your apartment.
So, you know, you can use that moneyand go to Chile and meet your family.
And so I did.
Um, yeah.
So did they know that you existed?
I guess they did because shereached out to me on Facebook.

(09:43):
Wow.
Yeah, like I guess I knew I had some likelong lost relatives in Chile because I,
you know, you have the tias on Facebookwho comment on all your like photos.
But again, I didn't speak Spanish.
So I was like, okay, these tias,I have no idea who they are.
Love them.
Thanks for the support.
Yeah.

(10:03):
Wow.
Oh, okay.
So as someone who is like LatinaAmerican, how important was
it for you to find your roots?
And what was that feeling likewhen you actually discovered that
you have like long lost family?
I think the experience of finding myroots was really grounding for me.
And it really brought me back to whoI am the essence of who I am, because

(10:27):
I spent a long time trying to getaway from, how do I say, I spent a
long time faking and I spent a longtime trying to fake it till I make it.
I've spent a long time, likeI'm talking about like my whole
adolescence, striving for whiteness.
Hmm.
And trying to get away from myneighborhood, from my family,

(10:50):
from my culture, from my language.
Like I, I did the most to try to get away.
And it really impacted myhealth and wellbeing, my mental
health, all those things.
I went through a wholeZooey Deschanel phase.
I was that adolescent teenager.
I rode the beach cruiser to schoolin the little, um, baby doll dress,
and I listened to Bossa Nova 24/7.

(11:11):
Like, I was that girl.
Uh, haha.
Oh my god.
I was that teenager.
And I do have photos from that time.
I looked fantastic, butlike, what was I doing?
Um, I was really trying to beanybody who I, you know, I was really
trying to be anybody who I wasn't.
Um, to try to, You know, make a lifefor myself, but a life based off of,

(11:32):
I guess, anything other than who Ireally was and where I come from.
Oh, that is so interesting.
Um, mainly because like, as an AsianAmerican, Vietnamese American to
be more specific, like I rememberI had like a similar situation.
So back in, maybe not in elementaryschool, because I think it was like too

(11:54):
young to actually understand that I was.
other different or, you know,whatever else, but definitely in
middle school and high school.
I also wanted to be white.
Like I really wanted to be white.
I wanted to be cool.
I wanted to be popular and I couldnot be cool or popular being Asian
American or Vietnamese American.
Of course, there are like the coolAsians, but that's like a whole

(12:17):
other conversation for another day.
There's like the baby girlAsians, Asian baby girls.
I don't know if you know that.
Okay.
That's like a whole other separate thing.
But I definitely tried my hardest tolike, you know, wear the same clothes.
I did not have a ZooeyDeschanel face though.
Um, but I definitely went to likeHollister Abercrombie and Fitch.
I wanted to wear like the skaterclothes when that was like really in.

(12:40):
And I just like, I remember askingmy parents for like certain things
that they were like, what the heck?
And I remember one time my dad.
Um, actually walked into my roomwhen I was maybe like 14, 15.
And he was, I don't know if this islike the nicest thing to say to your
daughter, but I think he said it becausehe was like, what is going on with you?
He was like, you're a banana.

(13:00):
And I was like a banana.
And he was like, yeah, you are yellowon the outside and white on the inside.
And he was like, that's weird.
Why are you trying to be a banana?
And I didn't realize that it was somethingthat when he wasn't like happy about.

(13:21):
And then also something that like,I think other people could use
as like a derogatory term towardsme, but I totally understand.
And just now, like, I feel like I'mreally getting into or trying to learn
more about like my roots as well.
So that takes me to my other question,because I'm sure there are a lot of

(13:41):
people who are listening to this podcastI hope, um, hello, uh, who are part of
the diaspora, whatever diaspora you,you are part of, um, or they're like
multicultural and maybe they also areremoved from their roots, whether that is
because of like colonization, colonialism,choice, whatever it is, um, but they

(14:04):
are curious to actually dig back intotheir roots and see where they come from.
Do you have any recommendations forpeople to start digging into your roots?
Because I also feel like this couldbe a process that, um, I don't want
to say is triggering, but I do feellike it could be a healing process.

(14:26):
It could be quite uncomfortable.
It could bring up truths that maybeYour family doesn't want you to know.
I'm just thinking about likean Asian American family.
We're very taboo and likewe don't talk about things.
So, you know, things kindof get swept under the rug.
Um, and I feel like that's verysimilar to other like black
indigenous people of color families.
Um, so yeah, how would yourecommend somebody get started?

(14:50):
With digging into their roots, or doyou even think like people should?
Yeah, that's a really great question.
I recommend that all people getin touch with who they are and
where they come from, first of all.
So I definitely think that peopleshould, I will say, you know,
there's different approaches anddifferent levels and different layers
to reconnecting with your roots.
And there's many barriers that so manyBIPOC have when it comes to reconnecting

(15:15):
with their roots, particularly Blackand Indigenous people due to histories
of, you know, genocide and colonizationand enslavement and all these, a lot
of like laws that ripped people awayfrom their culture and their families.
And so that can be really complicated anda very, like you mentioned, triggering
and tender subject to touch on.

(15:37):
So I want folks to keep that in mind, youknow, as you are digging for your roots.
And I just say that because I knowwhat the different approaches like
I took an approach of becoming afamily historian and like going to my
country of origin and meeting theselong lost family members and sitting
down with them and, you know, askingquestions and recording our history.
And that's a privilege thatnot many people will ever have.

(15:59):
And so on the flip side, I know that,you know, with capitalism and with
commercialization and an issue that Ireally have or that I'm not a big fan
of is the fact that I feel that there'sso many cheap ways that companies try
to sell our cultures to us and try tosell like reconnect with your roots.
Yeah.
Um, buy our stuff and where are, you know,where this certain type of clothing, um,

(16:24):
you know, enroll in this certain kind of,I don't know, you know what I'm saying?
Yeah.
There's a lot of them.
Yeah.
There's so many different avenueswhere, you know, companies will
try to resell you your culture.
And unfortunately in the United States,um, for so many people who have these
barriers, when it comes to accessing,you know, where they're from and the
people that they're from, sometimes theonly thing that is accessible to them is

(16:48):
that, you know, cheaply, you know, soldor marketed stuff that these companies
are trying to shove down our throats andsaying like, here, this is your culture.
Like now you can embrace who youare because you bought our clothes
and you bought our products.
The necklace!
Ummm yeah so, um, but I do want to saythat while, you know, I have an opinion

(17:10):
about those companies and what they'redoing, I think that whatever anybody does
to reconnect with their roots is valid.
I think that's totally okay.
And I speak from personal experiencebecause I have a sibling who also wants
to reconnect with her roots and we doit in completely different approaches,
completely different understandings.
We identify completely differently.
Um, it's very, very fascinatingand interesting, but you know,

(17:33):
it's her journey and, um, I wantto honor and respect that because
again, it's at the end of the day,it's not about the destination.
It's about the journey.
And like, I can't just give her everythingthat I learned from my time abroad,
like I have all my notebooks upstairswith all the data and all the stories
and all the information and she wantsto start from scratch and do it her

(17:54):
way and that's totally okay becauseit's about her, her discovery, right?
Of herself.
So that's fine.
Everybody has their own way of doing this.
That's super interesting.
So that just kind ofreminded me of my cousins.
So on my dad's side of the family,he is one of, I think, 12, I
think, I think, yeah, one of 12.

(18:15):
And then, uh, my grandparents, theyhad two other children who were born,
like, even before the 12 now, um, butthey pass away in young age in Vietnam.
And when I started digging into moreof like my cultural heritage and
like just our past and our stories,it opened a channel for my cousins

(18:35):
who had never really thought about.
anything like that to also kindof dig in in their own way.
And I was doing it through like, Oh,I want to read more books written
by like Vietnamese boat people.
Um, I want to read more like articlesthat just don't talk about like
the Vietnamese American who cameover and lived the American dream.

(18:56):
That's like the story that I grewup with because that's like the one
that my parents lived, but I wantedto understand a little bit more.
I wanted to also seedifferent perspectives.
Like I consume or consumed a lotof content from like first and
second generation, um, VietnameseAmericans, people who like.
have a similar story to me.
So I, I'm familiar with it.

(19:17):
And there's like always this,you know, the same rhetoric.
And then I was like, but whatis it like for a parent or what
is it like for a grandparent?
And once I started doing that, that kindof like helped me have, like, I think.
a fuller picture of, um, my roots and alsohelped me, I think, empathize a lot more,
even though maybe I will never talk tolike my grandma about this because this

(19:40):
is something that is like so sensitiveto her that like, even if I bring it
up, she isn't ready to talk about it.
But at least it gives me like,Oh, she's not just my grandma.
Like she lives this entire life, like.
before I ever existed, not, maybe noteven thinking for me in the future

(20:01):
because she maybe didn't even realizethat she was going to have grandchildren,
but just this, like, you know, herthought process or an idea of what her
thought process could be, which is wild.
But, um, something that you mentionedabout is being a family historian.
So I am super curious tolearn more about that.
We've talked about this briefly when weworked together like a few years ago.

(20:22):
Um, but what.
Does a family historian do?
What do they, like, whatdoes it actually entail?
Or, like, you mentioned it before,you, you went to Chile and Mexico
and sat down and, like, recordedstories, but is it just stories?
Like, what are you, what are you getting?
Yeah, um, you know, what a familyhistorian does, Honestly, I, I can't

(20:44):
say, you know, I feel like I'm not anofficial family historian, or I guess like
if you were to ask me to define what afamily historian does, I feel like again,
everybody has so many different approachesand they can do so many different things.
And I guess what I've done as a familyhistorian is what I imagine, it, it
just makes sense to me of what somefamily historians might do, but that is

(21:06):
like sitting down with family memberswhile tracking them down, sitting
down with them and asking, um, justquestions about their history, guiding
conversations along the way, tryingto look for whatever information or
stories you're looking for and justsitting down and recording it all.
And on top of being a family historian,I also picked up the practice

(21:27):
of genealogy and ancestrology.
Wow.
Yeah.
Whole different, a whole differentthing, but they compliment each other.
So for genealogy, I did, um, sit downwith these, with my family members and
log all of the family data as well.
In addition to their stories.
So like I was sitting down witheverybody and like making maps and

(21:48):
saying like, okay, what's your full name?
What's your partner's name?
What's your kid's name?
Um, when were you all born?
Where?
Do you have any medical history?
How many kids do you have?
Like, all the questions.
Yeah, where were you born?
Where did you move?
Where are you currently living?
All the questions, and I havethat upstairs in a notebook.

(22:09):
And this sounds like reallyhigh level work, but I honestly,
like, I didn't plan for this.
Didn't Google anything.
Like I did not know what I was doing.
I showed up to Chile with a notebookfrom the 99 cent store, um, and a pen.
And one day I was just talking tomy Tia and she's very like lively

(22:29):
and she has a lot of stories.
And so she's just started talkingand I was like, wait a minute.
I got to write all this stuff down.
So I took out my little 99 cent storenotebook and she just kept talking
and I kept asking questions and Ikept scribbling in my notebook and
then little by little she kept on, um,she started introducing me, you know,
to other family members and I would,you know, meet them and do the same.

(22:50):
And it resulted in me, you know, travelingall throughout Chile to connect with these
long lost family members and meeting.
A lot of family for the firsttime they knew I existed.
I had no idea they existedthroughout Chile and Bolivia.
So that was amazing.
And then I went to Mexico later and didthe same with that side of my family.
Oh, my gosh, that sounds like, likea movie, to be honest, um, but so I

(23:15):
have like follow up questions that Ithink I've like three, let's see if
I really can remember all of them.
So the first one is, what was itlike for your family to recount
all of these stories to you?
Because I know sometimes like, I thinkI tried doing that with maybe just like
some of my closest aunts and uncles andthey were like, okay, these questions

(23:39):
are like fun for a little bit, butI don't want to answer them anymore.
Um, and they were also kind ofthinking, like, Oh, why are you asking?
Like all of these questions?
This is not like super important.
Like our life is now.
I think one time I asked my parents, like,what was your identity before I existed?
Like before you became aparent, like, who were you?

(24:00):
And I think they both laughed at me andthey were like, that's not important.
Like I'm your, I'm your mom and dad now.
Like, you know, that's all that matters.
Like, it doesn't matter who I was before.
So what was your family's reaction liketo actually open up so vulnerably to you.
I mean, I don't even know if theyrealize like that could be vulnerable.
Maybe it's just, you know, partof who they are, but I would love

(24:21):
to, I guess, hear about it becausemy experience was not like that.
Yeah.
I would say it variedfrom person to person.
You know, I had some people who are moreclosed off than others, some who are
very open with sharing very vulnerableand very touchy topics with me.
I guess for me, like I came inwith the mindset like this is
my one and only opportunity.

(24:42):
I got to make it worth it.
And then for some relatives, Iknow that they knew the same.
For some relatives that I met outthere was the first and the first,
the only and possibly the lasttime I would ever see them again.
Um, since.
You know, since I've done thiswork, I think at least five of
the people who I interviewed died.
Wow.
So, yeah.

(25:03):
Yeah.
I went in with that mindset.
It's like, it's now or never.
This is a once in a lifetime opportunity.
And some people also approach me with thesame, while others, like you mentioned,
were saying, like, the past is the past.
I don't want to talk about it.
But then they would still share anyways.
Um, yeah.
Wow.
Um, okay.
So the second question to everything thatyou said before, uh, so you said that you
didn't know some of your family members,but majority of them knew about you.

(25:28):
So what was that like that realization of?
I have people who maybe they don't likeactively keep tabs on you, but they like
think about you because you're family andyou don't even know that, that they exist.
Like sometimes I'm thinking, Oh mygosh, I could have like a cousin
who knows about my existence.

(25:49):
We were never connected.
I don't even know their name.
But they know me and they likejust keep tabs on me and maybe,
you know, they're wishing me wellwishes from wherever they are in the
world or whatever stage they are.
And that is wild because I thatjust like reminds me of one how
vast the world is and then also.
not only how big it is but how wereally are so interconnected to each

(26:13):
other without actually realizinghow connected we are to each other.
So yeah, what was that like for you?
Yeah.
So, um, really interestingly, I guessan important part of this story is
the fact that my, my grandmother fromChile, She was the one who kept in
touch with everybody back home, andit's, it's such a fascinating story.

(26:35):
Like you mentioned, it's movie status.
The book is coming soon.
I promise.
I just gotta work on it.
Wow, I have so many things to do.
But it's, it's so interesting because mygrandmother, she was from Chile, and she
Lived here in the United States with us.
And, um, she kept in contact witheverybody from Chile and Bolivia.
And it was so fascinating because everytime I met a new family member, they

(26:57):
would, you know, I was busting aroundChile and knocking on random people's
doors, messaging them, calling them.
And in chile, because of the dictatorship,people are, um, what's the word?
Like no tienen mucha confianza.
They don't trust everybody becauseof the dictatorship and they're,
they perceive strangers as danger.
But with me open arms.

(27:17):
They invited me over to theirhouse, you know, no problem.
And I know actually family members withinthe country who they wouldn't do that for.
Um, so so many things there, youknow, dictatorship trauma, but also
my privileges, you know, I'm that girlfrom America that, um, that great grand
niece from America coming to visit,you know, people love that, but it

(27:40):
was fascinating because my grandmotherwould keep in touch with all of these
people and they all had photos of me.
So they knew exactly who I was.
Wow.
Yeah they had photos of me and myfamily and letters from my grandmother
and everybody adored my grandmother.
They loved her.
I loved her so much too, even though wehad a language barrier, which was really

(28:01):
sad, but she would keep in touch witheverybody and people would always tell
me your grandmother is the only personwho ever cared about me in this family.
Wow.
She's the only person who ever checkedin on me because my family is so, what's
the word, the reason why we're splitup is because a lot of like trauma,
a lot of trauma and a lot of drama.
Um, yes.
The two usually go hand in hand.

(28:23):
Yeah.
But everybody would say yourgrandmother is the only person
who ever cared about me.
And, you know, I'm honored thatyou're doing this work in her name.
So it's kind of like I waspicking up where she left off.
Um, yeah, cause she would write letters,she would send photos and postcards.
She would call people all the time.
She would, um, she only went backto Chile one time before she became

(28:44):
sick with cancer and then she died.
Um.
But everybody loved her and I guess theywere so receptive to me because they
saw me as her, as an extension of her.
And I feel the same exact waybecause that's the spiritual
woo woo part of this story.
Yeah, it's because I, I'm a strongbeliever that when my grandmother
died, you know, some of her essenceor her spirit really stayed with me.

(29:08):
And, um, I have a strong feeling thatshe's the one who sent me on this
journey and guided me the whole way.
So it was really beautiful.
I love - I love hearing this.
This is first just like thank you forsharing all of it because I feel like
you know, this is a lot of stuff likea lot of your own family history.
And okay, so from all ofthis, more questions came up.

(29:30):
First one is what were some ofthe questions that you asked your
family when you decided to kind oflike record your family history?
And then the second question is,do you feel like this is, I don't
want to say your legacy, but I don'tknow how to phrase this question.
I guess, like, is this like thewhole legacy of your family?

(29:52):
What does legacy actually mean to you?
Because In marketing terms right now,everybody's talking about legacy, they're
talking about brand legacy, you know,everybody's talking about, um, Beyonce's
legacy, although that's very valid.
But you know, sometimes people aretalking about like building brand legacy,
and they're using it as a way to sell.
And I don't think we take the timeor we don't have the time to actually

(30:17):
consider like the breadth of legacybecause right now it's like one of those
commodified words that like capitalismand marketing really is driving into us
like, you know, legacy, legacy, legacy,legacy, but nobody really understands
maybe or really thinks about it.
At least in my circle.
I don't know if a lot ofpeople think about it.
So yeah, those were the two questions.
So what questions did you ask your family?

(30:38):
And then also, whatdoes legacy mean to you?
And do you think like being a familyhistorian is part or building that legacy,
remembering that legacy, whatever that is?
So I'll start with yoursecond question first.
Okay.
Um, because I'm a strong believerthat this is my grandmother's legacy.
This is the legacy of, um, You know,all the women who have come before

(30:59):
me, so this work is very sacred.
I do believe that, like, I'm a part ofthis legacy and my work is an extension,
you know, of the legacy of all ofthose who came before me, particularly
the women who have come before me.
I do think that I play an important rolein, you know, capturing this history
and continuing on this legacy work, um,but I don't think it started with me

(31:22):
and I don't think it'll end with me.
It might.
I don't know.
Um, that's terrifying to think about,but that's why I want to write a book
about it because that's how, you know,ideas and legacies live on forever.
Just a side note here forpeople who are listening.
I may or may not havekids because I'm gay.
So like, what's going to happen now?

(31:42):
Oh yeah,
maybe we should mention
that.
What's going to happen now?
Yeah.
And also like in my generation,in my family, There's not a lot of
people who are interested in thiswork, and as the generations go
on, you know, so much gets lost.
So that's the legacy question, but goingback to your question about what kind
of questions I ask people, I mean, Inever sat down with somebody and asked

(32:05):
them like, very curated questions.
It's like, tell me the story of your lifeor, um, tell me about who you were before.
Like the question that you asked,or tell me about, you know, how
the dictatorship impacted you.
Like I never asked any of those questions.
It was very much like I would show up, wewould have onse, which is like tea time.

(32:25):
And they would just start reminiscingabout mostly about my grandmother
and about how much they loved herand how, you know, she was the
only person who cared about them.
Um, and then they would,I'm very receptive and I'm
a very good communicator.
So they would say somethingthat piqued my interest.
I would like feel somethinggo off in my brain.
Like, Ooh, that's interesting.
And then I would justask a follow up question.
Like, Oh, tell me, can youtell me more about this?

(32:47):
Or like, can you tell me, you know, Iwould ask a complimentary question to
whatever they were already talking about.
And then I would just like writeeverything down, scribble it out.
And oftentimes it resultedin people telling me like.
Some of their deepest, darkest secretsare, you know, some of their deepest,
darkest secrets, some of theirfavorite stories, some of their not
so favorite stories, some of theirtrauma, some of their histories.

(33:09):
Like, yeah, I never went in like withthe intention of like, oh, I want to, you
know, ask this particular question so Ican figure out this particular answer.
In some cases, I did like whenI wanted to know like, Oh, what
happened to this family memberwho just kind of like disappeared?
Like my grandfather?
Like, what happened to him?
Why?
Why'd he?
Why'd he leave?

(33:30):
I would ask pinpointed questionswhen necessary, but that
wasn't usually what I led with.
So more like organic stuff?
Yes.
I do feel like maybe I'm notvery good at that, because
I'm just like, Yeah, tell me.
But I, I do feel like it requires maybetwo, whoever's there, two, three people to
come in with that openness and willingnessto kind of just share so honestly as well.

(33:56):
And kind of like share, not ina way to like teach a lesson or
to, I don't know, whatever it is.
It's more just sharing because.
I want to kind of bring you intomy circle, and I want you to
understand, like, my own context.
Like, where I'm coming from.

(34:17):
Which is really, really different than,oh, I'm going to share because I want
to teach you a lesson, or like, youknow, this is a piece of advice or
something which, I mean, could comefrom, like, the stories and stuff.
But it comes differently, I guess,when somebody's trying to teach you a
lesson or give you a piece of advice.
When they're just like,hey, uh, you're here.
I trust you.
And I would like to.
really give you this piece of me sothat you can also understand who I am.

(34:39):
Absolutely.
Oh, that's amazing.
So what are some, if you are likecomfortable sharing, uh, what are
some of the stories, lessons, history,and one of our other people that
we interviewed for the podcast,Sheba talked about ancestral wisdom.
So these are things that like yourancestors passed down that basically,
um, help you or whomever the communitylive better together, I would

(35:04):
say, listen to Shiva's episode toactually get the definition that was
like a really paraphrase version.
Um, but do you have any stories,lessons, histories, ancestral
wisdoms that you're willing toshare with some of the listeners?
Well, the listeners and some thatyou're like, just collecting and
saving for yourself that you wantto pass down to whatever your
legacy or ancestry will look like?

(35:26):
Yeah, in my case, in particular, Ilove that some people are able to
access ancestral wisdom and my casein particular, I don't think from
what I collected, I was able todocument much of that at all because
again, most people wanted to shareabout their trauma and their drama.
Yeah.
It was, yeah.
It wasn't much about like here, here'sthis ancestral wisdom regarding like

(35:48):
our culture or our cultural practicesor anything like that or how to
live better together as a community.
My family is so complicated and it's a lotof like, I hate this, I hate these people.
I don't want anything to do with them.
How dare they?
Like that is very much my family.
So much trauma because dictatorship,politics, poverty, complicated.

(36:08):
But.
I will share like, I guess some, I guesssome of my favorite family stories.
They're not very fun.
They're not very uplifting.
They're not very happy, but I guess themost impactful, you know, person that
I met, um, whose history, you know,impacted me the most was my Tio Lalo.
Um, he is my long lost great uncle.

(36:30):
He is my, he's my mom's cousin.
No, he's my grandmother's.
Nephew.
Yes.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So he's my mom's cousin, buthe had been separated from
my family for like 50 years.
50?
5 0?
50 years.
5 0.
Wow.
Um, because he, um, he's great.
He's fantastic.

(36:50):
Love him.
He's a fisherman.
He lives off of the coast of Valparaiso,which is the coastal region in Chile.
He's a fisherman.
He built his own house onthis hill from scratch.
But my family kind of lost connectionwith him during the dictatorship
because he became an orphan.
He became an orphan and um, Youknow, after his parents died first,

(37:11):
his mom died and later his daddied after he became an orphan.
He didn't like the way that hewas being mistreated by my family.
And so he left and he was likea hippie living on the streets.
And this story is fascinating too,because I think it's important to
recognize the faults in memory andmisunderstanding and misrecollection.

(37:32):
Because when I first met him, youknow, and my Spanish was not perfect,
and I didn't really understand all thenuances and complications of my family.
Like, I truly believe that he was anorphan, and that, um, he was abandoned,
and he was kicked out, and that he livedin the streets, and all these things.
Like, I I have it written down in mynotebook upstairs, like from interviews
that I have with him and from otherthings that my family has had said to me.

(37:55):
And then I went to Chilethis year, actually, for the
first time in five years.
And I asked him again, more abouthis history, and that's the second
part of what I just told you abouthim being an orphan and leaving
because he didn't like the way that.
The family was treatinghim for being an orphan.
Like that's the truth.
So it was very complicated forme to come to terms with that.
Like, huh.
So all that stuff I had recordedbefore, where did that come from?

(38:17):
Because obviously I have a writtendown, there's different, I have
different accounts of it from differentpeople, different perspectives, even
from my own uncle, like how did Iget that he was kicked out of the
family and lived in the gutters?
Well, he did live in the guttersand he did live in the ship.
So that's actually howhe became a fisherman.
He left when he was like 14.
Wow.
But the way he explained it to methe second time around gave me a

(38:38):
better understanding of what reallyhappened and kind of gave me what
I feel is, I don't know, how doI, how do I say, gave me a better
understanding of the quote unquote truth.
Because what I apparently whatI had written and understood
before wasn't the full picture.
Yeah, I don't know how I got there.
But that's just one of themany stories that, you know, I
captured while I was out there.

(38:59):
And he's my favorite uncle.
He is so cool.
One of the most open minded, kindheartedpeople out there and I went to Chile this
year because he actually has cancer nowand I went to go help him gain access to a
surgery for his tumors and stuff But yeah.
Wow, which I mean that makes a lot ofsense because One, I do think, you know,

(39:20):
memory, we all remember things fromlike what our point of view, especially
when there's trauma and drama involved,then communication things get skewed.
I love that, like, you were ableto actually interview him twice.
The first time when your Spanish was,you know, not fully there to understand
all the nuance, and then the second timeI believe your Spanish has improved.

(39:41):
So you are able to understand like morenuance and like more, and he's able
to also even share more like detailsbecause you are able to understand
more, which is just wild because like,how many people get that opportunity to
like interview a family member twice?
And then also like, ask the samethings or hear the same story and
then kind of piece it together again.

(40:02):
This is like a detective mystery thing.
Oh yeah, absolutely.
I definitely felt like adetective when I was out there.
Wow, that is so wild.
And I'm just thinking about like allthe people who are part of the diaspora
or who are multicultural and maybe wedon't speak like our family's language
or we have like a lower level ofcomprehension or of like speaking and

(40:25):
how, I don't know if you would havethe answer for this, but is there a way
that we could still connect with people?
Do you have, like, a suggestion?
It's okay if you don't.
I mean, that was kind oflike, just a question.
Yeah, um, do you mean if Ihave a suggestion for people
who can't communicate?
Mm hmm.
I guess, like, speaking the same language.
Oh, yeah, absolutely.
And, um, this kind of dives ina little bit more into, like,

(40:47):
my history with my grandmother.
I mentioned that, I think Imentioned that she grew up with
us here in the United States.
And I had a language barrier with her.
She only, she spoke Spanish and Ispoke Spanish growing up, but then I
kind of lost it as I went to school.
And again, I was on my, like, what'sthe word trying to escape everything
and anyone, like everything that,of who I was trying to get the

(41:08):
heck out the neighborhood X, Y,Z, but she and I were actually.
Close, even though we couldn'tcommunicate, we didn't have many
conversations, but we would spend timetogether, and she also, she had cancer
too, so I would be at the hospital, Iwas like in 7th grade, 6th grade, like
at the hospital visiting her, you know,I, I spent quite a bit of time with
her, I also shared a room with her, andas silly as this sounds, Um, and how

(41:32):
cringy it sounds to me or as I'm lookingback, I'm like, wow, if I can go back
in time, I would change so many things.
But, um, how I started spending so muchtime with my grandmother is because
I live in a three bedroom condo.
We, we all had to share a room, so Iwould share with her and my sister.
But also, at some point, my, I waslike 13, this was like, what, 2006?

(41:54):
Seven?
Eight?
Somewhere in that era, or Ithink I was like 10, 11, 12,
somewhere around those years.
But my grandmother got a computer, andthis was in the era of Facebook, and I
wanted to be on the computer all the time.
And so I was just in her roomall the time, like next to her.
But like, so enveloped in like thecomputer and, you know, the internet

(42:17):
while my grandmother who holds hisancestral wisdom, this whole complicated
history, so much knowledge, you know,I was in proximity with her, but not
connecting or communicating with her.
And, you know, it's because we had alanguage barrier and because I was a
teenager and I, you know, was so caughtup in the socials, just like how,
you know, teenagers are today, but I.
For folks who have a language barrier,I think that, um, at least spending

(42:41):
time with somebody is important.
And even if you realize thatyou're spending time with them or
not, I don't know how to explain.
Like passively?
Yeah, passively, likethat was very much me.
I was just like all the timeon the computer and she was
in her room, like watching hertelenovelas or like hanging out.
But, um, that's how wespent time together.
And also before, beforethe age of the computer.

(43:02):
And when I was a kid, she wouldwatch me after school sometimes.
And she worked at a beauty parlordown the street from my house.
And so I would go with her to work and Iwould just read the magazines all day and
like sweep up the hair and, you know, shewould buy me an ice cream and we couldn't
communicate, but we still hung out.
And yeah.
Again, even though I couldn'tcommunicate with her, I was hanging
out when she got sick, I would visither, you know, I try to be by her side.

(43:25):
And when she died too, I wasalso there holding her hand.
So even though we didn't, we weren'table to communicate and I wasn't able
to gain this rich history from her.
I had to go all the way to Chileand look for all these people
just to piece together the past.
And I could have just learnedSpanish and talked to her.
You know, there's so many different ways.
to do this.
And I don't think that peopleshould necessarily be ashamed

(43:46):
of a language barrier.
And if folks do have a language barrier,know that, you know, you can work on
it, but also in the meantime, you canstill spend time with your loved ones and
communicate across the barrier throughgestures, through spending time with
one another, just checking in and beingthere when people, when people need you.
Yeah, that that's my recommendation.

(44:06):
I love that.
I do have a similarsituation with my grandma.
So my grandparents on my dad's sideof the family, they have passed,
but my grandparents on my mom's sideof the family are still with us.
And I, my grandpa speaks, um, English.
Well, he like spoke moreEnglish when I was younger.
I don't know how much English he speaksnow, but he's a little bit easier to

(44:27):
communicate with because we don't havesuch like a large language barrier.
Um, with my grandmother, shedidn't really learn English.
And I remember one time I went to govisit her just to see how she was doing.
We just sat in her apartment.
I think she tried to give us a lot ofcookies and she just kept asking us,
like, do we want to eat something?
And she actually told me, and Ithink she also has dementia now.

(44:48):
So this, I think confessionthat she basically gave was
because of the dementia.
I don't think she would have saidit otherwise, but she did say like,
Oh, I have all these grandchildren.
I have my kids.
My kids like barely speak Vietnamesebecause they came over when they were
like, my mom came over when she was tothe United States when she was a teenager.
So most of my aunts and uncles onmy mom's side of the family also

(45:11):
came over when they were teenagersor a little bit, even younger.
They've now spent most of theirlife speaking English and in the U.
S.
So she was like, okay, I've got my kids.
They like kind of ish speak Vietnamese.
And then she was like in the, and nowmy grandkids, like we can't even talk.
And I remember like when I wouldtry to talk to her in Vietnamese,
my Spanish, since I've been livingin Spain now for a longer time.

(45:33):
My Spanish overtook the Vietnamese part soit like filled in the gaps where I didn't
know the words in Vietnamese so I wouldstart off in Vietnamese and then it came
out in Spanish and then I had to translatein English and then I had to go look for
the word again in Vietnamese because I waslike the heck is going on here and I just
saw how I think sad she was because I feellike she wanted to share so much more.

(45:58):
Maybe not like super intense storiesand like history because she might not
feel comfortable, but just share moreof like, Hey, I want to talk to you.
I'm sad that we can't talk.
And I'm sad of like the circumstancethat, you know, we're here and
like, we really can't communicate.
And then I also think she was potentiallyreminiscing and thinking, Oh, but

(46:18):
I'm also happy because we're here.
And like, Look at how well mychildren have done for themselves.
Look at, like, my grandchildren.
They're, like, so old now.
They're driving.
Like, they're pickingme up to go to Target.
I don't have to, like,I'm not fully alone.
But I'm alone becausenobody can talk to me.

(46:39):
So, I don't know.
It's like this duality.
I do feel like, you know, spending timewith her and just, like, being there.
She also appreciates, even thoughwe can't actually talk, even though
sometimes I think she's lookingat us like, What are you doing?
She just doesn't say anything, who knows.
So okay, other question for you,more around like, uh, being a family
historian, um, what do you hope topass down to others by recording your

(47:01):
family's history and what actuallycounts as family history to record?
Oh, let's see.
In my personal life?
Like, my hope in passing down this familyhistory is that people, you know, in
my family, uh, who come from, you know,our same, our shared origin, know, like,
okay, so this is what happened, and thisis why things are the way that they are,

(47:22):
because I have a lot of family, and we'reall -everyone's in the same situation.
We all feel alone.
And like, we have no family and we'respread across throughout all of Latin
America and now like it's expanding to theworld, but we all feel alone and we don't
understand like what the heck happenedor like, why don't we have any family?
For example, my mom is the only onefrom her family, like in California.

(47:47):
That's it.
It's me.
Like, and her, herchildren, that's her family.
And that's it.
Everyone else is in Chile and Bolivia.
Yeah, and I know I have, like, whenI met my cousins or, like, my uncles,
they would all tell me the same thing.
They're like, I feel so alone and Ihave no family and I don't know why.
I'm like, I have 200 names here, and Ihave all the data for all of our family,

(48:08):
like, what do you mean we're all alone?
And we all feel the same way because ofall the trauma and the drama that happened
to my family throughout the past forever.
It feels like forever now since Iwent as back to like 1900s so much
-wow.
-Trauma and drama there.
So that's my hope in my personallife that, you know, people who
I share an origin with, like theyunderstand like what the heck

(48:31):
happened and how we got there, becausethat's how I originally started.
I felt like going back to the theme offeeling lost, the reason why I felt so
lost and the reason why I was strivingto get the heck out of here was because
in my personal life, I've had a lotof trauma and a lot of drama and like
in my personal household and family.
And I would always ask myself, why me?
Why my family, what the heck happened?

(48:53):
Like, how did we get to this point ofso much dysfunction and pain and trauma?
Because it's been real.
It's been really real.
The level of pain that my, that I'veexperienced, that my siblings have
experienced, my parents have experienced.
And I'm, you know, I was always curious,like, how the heck did we get here?
Because I will share, listeners,like I'm a survivor of child abuse.

(49:16):
Um, you know, my parentis a recovering addict.
Well, one of my parents is arecovering addict and the other one
is, you know, committed child abuse.
Like, um, but that's okay.
This sounds very strange and to anyand all the people out there who,
you know, share the same historieswith either having addicted parents
and or who are survivors of abuse.

(49:36):
I want to let you all know that thisis just my personal experience and, you
know, it doesn't have to be okay for you.
But when, it doesn't have to be okay foryou and I hope that, you know, we all find
the healing and Um, that we deserve andin our own paths and journeys and ways,
but for me, I've come to a level of peace,um, with, you know, my family history

(49:57):
and have actually been able to come backand help heal a lot of my family trauma.
And I've since having, um, well firstgoing away to college and I'm studying
abroad and doing all this work, like I'vecome back and there's been huge, huge,
huge transformations and healing for allthe individuals in my immediate household.

(50:18):
Um, we've worked together pastso much of the past dramas and.
Um, traumas and dramas and, youknow, we're healthier than ever.
You know, we still have our bumps inthe road, but there's been so much
healing and so much peace and so much,what's the word repair of relationships
with ourselves and with our parents.
So it's been reallybeautiful to, to witness.

(50:40):
And be a part of this journey.
Okay, that's amazing.
Thank you for sharing that as well.
So, what counts as family history then?
What would you record?
Um, family history canbe very complicated.
And there's like a socialresponsibility aspect.
back to it in my personal life.
Like, uh, like I mentioned in Chile,everybody has drama with each other.

(51:02):
Everybody has trauma with eachother, everyones like I'll interview
somebody and they'll say like, don'ttalk to this other person, they suck.
And then I'll go interviewthe other person.
I'll be like, don't talk to this person.
They suck.
And then they will tell on eachother, like this person did that to
me and this person did that to me.
So everybody, you know, I've cometo understand that people are
very multifaceted and complexand complicated human beings.

(51:25):
And they're allowed to be, you know, oftentimes people who are, how do I say, people
who, like in my personal family dynamic,like people who have committed abuse are
also in, what's the word, they've alsobeen survivors of the same hardships.
Um, and I don't want to excusethat for anybody, but it just
puts things into perspective.

(51:46):
Like, okay, people are, alltypes of people are doing all
types of things to each other.
Like not, not one person is perfect,you know, everybody's complicated.
Everybody has their flaws.
Everybody has their moments.
So when it comes to recording thisfamily history where, you know, it's so
complicated and messy and everybody'stelling on each other but nobody
wants other people to find out aboutwhat, you know, what has happened to

(52:08):
them or what they've done to others.
I feel like it's my social responsibilityto hold on to this history in a way that
respects, honors, and recognizes thecomplexity of who these human beings are.
Well, not villainizing them and it'scomplicated because as a family historian,
like I have all the raw data, all thejuicy, juicy stuff in my 99 cents store

(52:33):
notebooks upstairs, but the family historythat I would publish and share with the
world might have to be a little bit.
I don't want to say like my personalfamily history, like with my family
members, I think I would be ableto give them a little bit more
of a deeper dive or authentic.
authentic account, um, while havingto shape and mold and preserve

(52:55):
certain aspects of stories.
Yeah, but on the other side, like, Iwant to publish a book featuring this
incredibly beautifully sad transformativejourney of, like, my family.
But in doing that, publishing that withthe world, I know it's going to have to
come with some quote unquote censorship.
It's going to have to come with mereally doing my part to be I don't

(53:17):
know what, what I would consider, quoteunquote, like socially responsible,
so people aren't villainized, um,for what they have done and, or
like, um, what has happened to them.
I don't know how to explain it.
It's very, very, verycomplicated, but yeah.
Yeah.
That's how I would go about sharing thefamily history and what is family history?

(53:39):
What is there to record?
But I think what's most importantis the, the stories of how
we all got to where we are.
I think that should be like thefocus and every good story focuses on
transformation of character and person.
So if I can capture that, that's what'smost important to me because I don't
want anyone to be, um, perceived asa one dimensional being and being

(54:02):
villainized and or, um, what's the wordbeing villainized and or being written
off as the one thing that they wereonce, you know, I want to focus on the
expansion of who they are, the totalityof who they are, is complex human beings.
So complicated, but yes.
No, this, this actually reminds me,I don't know if you've read the book,
The Seven Husbands of Evelyn Ugal?

(54:22):
No, but I've heard about it.
Okay, everything that you just described,I will not add spoilers, so if you
all are going to read it, I highlyrecommend because that book was so good.
But the book basically recounts,uh, Evelyn's- the main character,
Evelyn's story, and at the end ofthe book, it's like this culmination
of emotions you feel as the readerof like, I want to hate this person.

(54:48):
I can't hate this person because I justunderstand what you were saying, like the
totality of their human experience andwhy they made the choices that they made.
And it gives you this, like, thisfeeling of duality that most people,
like most of us, we don't know what todo with duality because it's like, how

(55:08):
can I be happy and sad at the same time?
Like, how can I love and appreciatethis character or this person
and also be so upset with them?
And I feel like if you are going toexplore family history, it's holding that
duality and not trying to like shape andmold it like you were saying to villainize

(55:29):
somebody or to make somebody the heroor, you know, in Western literature,
there's always like the underdog thatcomes out on top or the Cinderella story
like these are true human experiencesthat just are so multifaceted, so
multilayered and they make you questionbecause that is, I personally, this

(55:53):
is getting very deep and like metanow, but it really makes you question
like, I, what is good, what is bad.
I mean, there's, you know, don't be racistand don't be sexist, uh, and among other
things, don't be, you know, those stuff.
Um, but, you know, like I made choicesthat I maybe aren't like the best,
but I stand by them because X, Y,Z, or, you know, something else.

(56:14):
And I, I love just like everythingthat you shared and it just
really reminded me of, again, theseven husbands of Evelyn Hugo.
I highly recommend anybodyto read if you have not.
Okay, so moving on from FamilyHistorian, because I feel like we
could talk about this for forever.
I do want to talk about like youractual work now, which is being a
global education DEI specialist.

(56:34):
So can you share what a globaleducation DEI specialist does,
and maybe some of like examplesof what you do for your clients?
Sure.
So, um, what I do for work is verymuch tied to, you know, the whole
history that you all just listened to.
Yeah.
So, I'm a global education DEIspecialist, like, on a mission to support
historically underserved students.

(56:55):
Because I was a historically underservedstudent, like I mentioned, having
a hard time living on campus atuniversity, being a first gen low income
student, and I needed to get away.
So I studied abroad and thenI kept studying abroad and
it kept going and going.
And it allowed me to become a familyhistorian and meet my family and heal
a lot of trauma, you know, withinmyself, within my extended family.

(57:18):
And I think the greatest giftof all has been the ability to
come back home and help heal andrestore my family here in East L.
A.
And that has been thegreatest gift for me.
And I do the work that I do in supportinghistorically underserved students
because I recognize the immense valuethat education opportunities can have

(57:40):
for historically underserved students.
Students and everybodyhas their own journey.
So while this was my journey, my journeywas to go study abroad and learn all
these things, become family historian,come back, help heal my family.
For other students, it, it could bethe same case, could be similar, or it
could be something completely different.
What I know like point and blank period,is that equitable education experiences

(58:02):
are a catalyst for transformation forhistorically underserved students.
Like had I not gone to college, Idon't think I would have gone through
the, such a huge transformation thatI have in this short period of time.
Right?
I haven't, I wouldn't haveexperienced all the things I did.
I wouldn't have changed and transformedand grown in the way that I have.

(58:23):
Yes, and that's not to say thatpeople who don't go to college
don't have these experiences.
I just think that for me and forhistorically underserved students who
are oriented towards school, like thecollege experience and or study abroad
experiences and or other experientialeducation experiences are the catalyst.
Like, how do I say, it'sa way of concentrating

(58:46):
opportunity for transformation.
Mmmmmmm.
So that's why I do what I do.
But what I, what I do is I mostlywork in international education.
That's why it's a globaleducation DEI specialist.
Global is a more inclusiveway of me framing that
international education aspect.
But what I do is I provide consulting.

(59:06):
I train teams and I create contentfor institutions, organizations,
and companies who are looking tobetter support their historically
underserved student populations.
Um, and this all goes back to me andmy experiences, you know, studying
abroad because it was the best oftimes and it was the worst of times.
And if you ask a lot of people abouttheir study abroad, particularly

(59:30):
historically underserved students,especially like BIPOC, LGBTQ plus
students, low income students.
We'll tell you it was the best of times,but it was the worst of times because
yes, you know, I was able to, you know,study abroad in Brazil and Mexico and
Chile and travel and meet my family andlearn languages and all these things.
Like I was also hungrybecause I had no money.

(59:50):
And I also, you know, experiencedall these health issues.
And I was also like, sad and depressed.
Yeahhhhh.
Like best of times, and worst of times.
So I'm on a mission to better supportthese students so they can have a
better, more successful time abroad.
Because, you know, as much as a great timeI was having, it could have easily gone.
a lot more self than it did becauseI did experience, you know, issues

(01:00:14):
with like food insecurity, mentalhealth issues, health issues, X, Y, Z.
So that's what I do.
And that's why I do it.
And it's all ties back tomy personal experiences.
And in case anybody's wonderingglobal education, DEI specialist,
that's a title I made up by myself.
Yes I remember.
Yeah.
I actually, with Cassandra, Cassandra wasmy, um, marketing and messaging coach.

(01:00:36):
It was fantastic.
Without Cassandra, I wouldn't bewhere I am today because what I
do, I do it as an entrepreneur.
I'm not affiliated with the collegeor university or institution.
And I've been working atit for three years now.
And it's been, Oh, It's been a lotof work, but it's been so worth
it, um, because I know how much,you know, education and educational
experiences, particularly studyingabroad, changed my life and I know

(01:00:59):
how it can change others, too.
Yeah.
Oh, okay.
So, uh, follow up question to all of that.
Um, what is something that mostpeople overlook when offering
international education fortheir students or their teams?
Um, what do they overlook?
I think what a lot of professionalsin international education overlook
is the nuanced experience of peoplewith marginalized identities,

(01:01:22):
which is why I do what I do.
Um, because everybody I guess themainstream people who have historically
studied abroad, particularly like whitewomen who have made up the majority
of study abroad for the past decades,you know, they'll describe it as like,
or, you know, white men who are themost privileged on these programs
might say like, it was totally awesome.

(01:01:42):
I had no issues.
It was amazing.
I got to travel.
Oh my gosh.
Cheap beer.
Yeah, it was so quote unquote cheap.
I was able to do all these things.
Yeah, without taking and you know, thesepeople may be the ones who go on to be in
charge and, you know, set up more programsand things like that without taking into
consideration, like, okay, well, whatis it like for first gen, low income,

(01:02:04):
BIPOC, LGBTQ people with disabilities?
Different, very different.
Very different.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, um, You know, those were myexperiences abroad, and I did, you
know, have to navigate a lot ofchallenges, um, due to who I am, and
the different identities that I hold,and the lack of resources that I had
as a first gen, low income person.

(01:02:26):
The food insecurity was rough.
So not being able to eat was rough.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So yeah, that's why I do what I do.
So, okay.
So going from that and like,just like the nuance of it all,
because I love exploring nuance.
And actually that is, um, one of the lastquestions that I will ask you after this.
Uh, so this is like the thirdto last question, I guess.

(01:02:46):
How do you think your identities impacthow you navigate your day to day, this
is something that we talk a lot about onthe, on the podcast, just like identity
in general and like culture and belongingand just like exploring identity.
But how do you thinkyour identity impacts?
Not just like, I guess your work,but how you show up and what
you do and all of that stuff.

(01:03:07):
Because like you mentioned,you are low income or you
came from a low income family.
You are first gen who arequeer, you are disabled.
Well, I have chronic health conditions.
Yes, you have chronic health conditions.
Sorry, you have chronic health conditions.
That's okay.
Thank you for catching that.
I also can qualify, you know, it dependson how people want to, um, I guess
identify and or label because people withchronic health conditions can totally and

(01:03:29):
absolutely do qualify as being disabled.
Just wanted to say that one,but I don't like to say that I'm
disabled, just out of personalpreference to honor those who have.
severe disabilities, but that couldalso, I got some things to work.
We'll come back to that.
Yeah.
Okay.
You were saying?
Um, yeah.
So how do your identities impacthow you navigate your day to day?
Yeah.
My identity is definitely impactthe way navigate day to day.

(01:03:51):
I'm still first gen andI'm still low income.
I'm still queer.
I still have thesechronic health conditions.
Yeah.
It's been really roughin my day to day life.
I just do my best.
Like I'm taking this podcast meetingfrom my kitchen that's falling apart.
In my low income housing, um, I put onthe little screen so nobody can see the
background, you know, not having resourcesas a first gen low income entrepreneur

(01:04:17):
for the past three years, I've made very,very, very little money, like I'm talking
little money, like $5, 000 last year, sowow, it's been it's been really rough.
So not having resources like again,you know, Like, um, nice places to
do meetings can be rough, especiallybecause I meet with important people.
I meet with, you know, presidentsof universities and CEOs and fancy

(01:04:39):
people from all around the world.
I'm like calling in from my kitchentable in my kitchen that's falling apart.
Um, being low income, nothaving access to, you know,
purchase essentials like food.
Can be really rough sometimes.
Um, I'm on the up and up though.
Shout out to EBT last year.
Oh my God.
Food stamps.
Ooh, helped save my life this year.

(01:05:00):
I decided to get off of them becauseI'm actually making more money.
Yay!
I can be off of food stamps, but again,um, making that money work for me can
also be, you know, kind of a challenge.
Um, I have to cook all my meals at home.
Hardly ever eat out.
Don't buy anything ever.
It's really rough.
Um, so.
Yeah, that's being low income, beingLGBTQ It can also be complicated,

(01:05:23):
especially in my neighborhood.
Um, with the people that I livewith, may or may not be quite open.
And I'm, you know, sometimes get a littlebit, you know, nervous or worried about,
you know, being able to walk around.
So my partner, she comes around, soshe's been a little bit more visible.
And I really don't know what myneighbors think about me, but we'll see.

(01:05:44):
Um, yeah, all that, all that to say on,again, Lastly, with my chronic health
conditions, that definitely impacts myday to day, like I'm oftentimes like in
a lot of pain or chronically fatigued,and that impacts my work and my ability
to, to show up in a way that feels good.
Um, but I work through these thingsevery day, and I think that holding

(01:06:06):
these, um, identities helps me showup in a way that's more authentic.
Now that, you know, I'vealways been this person, right?
I've always been the first gen, lowincome, multicultural, queer girl
with chronic health conditions.
But if you were to have asked mefive years ago, I wouldn't have
been able to tell you any of that.
I would have been like, uh, I don'tknow, I'm just me and I have no

(01:06:27):
idea who I am or where I come from.
But now I've, you know, going throughthese experiences abroad, I've been
able to learn these things about myself.
You know, it's put a lotof things into perspective.
Yeah.
Like being able to learn like, oh yeah,you're really, you know, relative to,
um, other folks at university, youare so low income, you know, Oh, you
were in the closet for so many years.

(01:06:48):
Oh, you are sick.
You have chronic health conditions.
That makes so much sense.
Um, before, you know, I didn't try toaddress or try to understand who I was.
I just kept masking and like-
Yeah.
-working and going toschool and all those things.
So yeah, all that to say, those arethe ways that my identities impact
the way I show up in the world.
But now that I know exactly who I amand where I come from, it allows me to

(01:07:13):
show up so much more authentically in myeveryday and in my professional life too.
I love that.
And just like understanding like thehistory too of it all I think is amazing.
Okay, so I know we are wrapping up.
Um, so I have two last questionsfor you before, um, you can
share how people can connect with
you.

(01:07:33):
The first one is, what is anuanced conversation you think
we're not having enough of?
And then the second one is, um, ajournaling prompt, but I would love to
hear the nuanced conversation that youthink we're not having enough of first.
A nuanced conversation that we're nothaving enough of as a culture or as a
society here in the United States, I thinkis what we were talking about earlier.

(01:07:54):
The complexity of the, of humanidentities and human experiences.
I am, um, what's the word?
I am in rehabilitationfrom cancel culture.
Um, not, not me being canceled,but rather me being the counselor.
Um, that was very ingrained from, in me,from high school and college, um, like

(01:08:17):
those years of my life, but going on theseexperiences or having these experiences
and, um, you know, being able to connectwith and meet really complex human
beings and understand their complexityand their, their nuanced experiences has
helped me understand like, okay, it's notokay to cancel people based off of like
this one interaction is one experience,this one image, or this one imagined,

(01:08:43):
um, narrative we have about them.
Yeah, because there have definitelybeen, you know, small moments here
and there in my life, particularly,like, my professional career, where
I'm like, Oh, dang, this person mustthink I'm awful, because, you know,
this one interaction we had where I,you know, was having a rough time.
Or a hard day or, um, I said somethingthat, you know, I didn't intend to

(01:09:07):
be harmful, but it was, you know,and you know, those thoughts stay
in my head and they, they kind oflike live there like a haunting me.
Cause I'm like, Oh my God, whatdo other people think about me?
But then I remember like, I'm an awesome,amazing human being with so much love.
I approach everything Ido with love and kindness.
You know, and we're all human, weall, you know, have our days, we all

(01:09:29):
slip up and we all make mistakes.
And that's okay.
So as much compassion as Ihave for others, I'm trying
to have for myself as well.
But I think that's a conversationwe're not having enough of because I
do see, I still, I do still see thatcancel culture is very prevalent.
And you know, I think that it'simportant to hold people accountable.
And I think it's important to havea more socially responsible culture.

(01:09:54):
But I don't think that cancel cultureis the solution to doing that.
Um, yeah.
Especially coming from like anabolitionist perspective or like a
transformative justice perspective,like, um, again, it's about
understanding the complexity of,of people and their experiences.
And.
Tracking or trusting their transformationand helping each other along the way.

(01:10:15):
I think that's what life is about, right?
We're all in this together.
We're all in this playing a rolein each other's transformation and
we should be lifting each other up,you know, and helping each other
transform and grow and learn, um,rather than shutting each other out.
But it, you know, eventhat answer is very nuance.
Yeah.
Because there are definitely situationsin which, you know, it's also not,

(01:10:39):
especially not marginalized people'sresponsibility to be helping these people
transform, if that makes sense, right?
So it's very complicated.
I just tried to approacheverybody with grace.
And kindness, and um, what's the word?
Not make any assumptions, and if they'refumbling, and you know, making a fool

(01:10:59):
of themselves, I will let them do that.
And um, I will step inand educate as needed.
But besides that, I'm kind of lettingpeople have their own journey and
self discovery and trying to assistthem along the way, rather than
being punitive towards them and likepunishing them for making mistakes.
Yeah.
Yeah.

(01:11:20):
Love that.
And nobody has brought up cancel cultureyet on the podcast, but I feel like
that's definitely a nuanced conversationthat we're Not having enough of.
Okay, so before we wrap up thisconversation, um, do you have a
journaling prompt or exploratoryquestion for the people listening?
Um, I always like to end eachpodcast episode with a journaling
prompt, something that people cankind of like think or reflect on.

(01:11:43):
Um, it could be related towhat we talked about today, or
it could be something totally
different if you want to.
Yeah, I mean, It's a super cheesyjournaling prompt, but I think a
good one to start with could be,Who am I and where do I come from?
And there's so many different ways tostart answering that and exploring that.

(01:12:06):
And as, and as you're working on thisprompt, if you feel stuck, Or you come
to realize, like, like how I did backwhen, before I started this journey.
I was like, hey, I don't know anythingabout who I am or where I come from.
Maybe that can inspire youto do a little digging and go
on your journey to find out.
And even like, I mean, I've I've beenworking on like that question for a while.

(01:12:29):
I don't think I've ever answered thequestion of where do I come from?
I feel like I'm always lookinglike, Oh, this is where I want to
go, or this is who I want to be.
This is who I am.
Um, I'm stripping backlayers, blah, blah, blah.
But I never think back to, Hmm,where am I actually coming from
and who am I actually coming from?

(01:12:51):
Like, yes, my mom and dad,but even like their layers.
They're multifaceted history.
Uh, my grandparents layers that likemy grandparents multifaceted history.
So I will be exploring that.
Okay.
So thank you, Elisabet, for being here.
This conversation has been amazing.
I love like hearing more about yourfamily and just about your journey.

(01:13:13):
Um, is there anything that you areexcited about in the upcoming months
that you'd like to share with people?
And then also where canpeople connect and find you?
Sure, some exciting thingsin the next couple of months.
For all the listeners here, I,after I saw the Barbie movie, I was
like, wow, I'm, I'm also Barbie.
Um, because I, I'm a global educationDEI specialist, I'm a family

(01:13:36):
historian, I'm a genealogist, I'man ancestrologist, I'm a writer.
I'm also an education researcher.
Um, I do so many different things,but, um, regarding like the, the
things I'm looking forward to, um,I'm doing some education research
work actually on genocide education,um, and I will be going to Germany
to learn about the Holocaust in-
Wow.

(01:13:57):
-October.
So in a couple weeks, I'll be in Germany.
I'll be in Germany.
So, oh my gosh It'll be myfirst time coming to Europe.
Never been.
I've only been in Latin Americaand the Americas So first time
Cassandra, you're in Spain.
I don't know-
If you wanna pop on by?
I would love to.
Um, but yeah, that's what I'mlooking forward to in October.

(01:14:19):
And I possibly might go to Chileand Argentina with my partner.
I'm, you know, have Chileanbackground, family, and she has
Argentine family background.
So, um, this will be our firstinternational trip together.
And also, you know, going back toour places of origin to hang out
and be with each other's family.
So it'll be so fun and so cute.

(01:14:39):
So I am-
oh, that'll be so fun.
I can't wait to see the Instagramphotos if you share about them.
And then how can people connect with you?
Where can people connect withyou and all of that stuff?
I am a LinkedIn girly.
Yeah you are.
You can find me on LinkedIn.
Yeah.
I will put that in the shownotes for the people who want
to connect with you on LinkedIn.
Yeah.
You can find me on LinkedIn,um, at Elisabet Raquel Garcia.

(01:15:03):
Um, that's me.
Elisabet is spelled,um, with an S and no H.
Um, yes, so I will be there.
Um, I do have other socials as well,but it's interesting because I've
had to silo some of my identities.
So some of them just will have to bekept secret until, until further notice.
Um, but yeah, if you want tostay connected with me for now,

(01:15:25):
you can find me on LinkedIn.
Awesome.
Um, and I was just like, wait,what's siloed identities and
was like, Oh wait, I know.
I think I know.
I have a pen name.
Okay.
So that will be for anotherconversation, but thank you so
much, Elisabet for joining and forsharing so vulnerably about your
family and your like history and justabout like your identities as well.

(01:15:46):
I love talking to you.
Um, and I think this is like thefirst time that we've had the chance.
Well, I think for me to actually listento like the whole thing, uh, when we were
working together, I got like a littlebit of it, but not to like this extent.
So this has been such a treat forme to like learn more about you.
For everybody else listening, if youhave thoughts, questions, comments,
wanna just dive deeper into whateverElizabet shared, feel free to message

(01:16:09):
me on Instagram @CassandraTLe.
But other than that, I willsee you in the next episode.
Stay fierce, fam.
If you're hearing this message, that meansyou made it to the end of this episode.
Yay.
Thanks for listening.
If you enjoyed this episode andtalk to yourself, whoa, it's me.

(01:16:29):
I'd love if you couldshare this with others.
Post about it on social mediaand or leave a rating and review.
Don't forget to subscribeto, wanna hang out with me in
other areas of the internet.
You can follow me on Instagram at@CassandraTLe for brand message and
content marketing tips and resources.
Check out my business@TheQuirkyPineappleStudio.
Thanks again and seeyou in the next episode.

(01:16:51):
Stay fierce fam!

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