July 5, 2023 • 53 mins
This podcast episode is the first in a series focused on trust. They dive into the topic of accelerating trust and how vulnerability plays a crucial role in building trust within high-performing teams. The hosts share actionable tips and personal experiences, offering value to their listeners. They also mention a digital download available on their website for the "Five Be's of Trust" and encourage feedback from their audience. Overall, this episode aims to ignite leadership potential by emphasizing the importance of trust in leadership.
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https://tinyurl.com/5BEsOfTrust
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Wanted to kick off this episodewith a quick disclaimer.
We mentioned we're probably notgonna have the perfect audio and
video set up these first coupleepisodes, and you'll hear that a bit.
It was not nearly badenough to scrap the episode.
We think it's still a hundred percentlistenable, but there's a little bit of
drop off in the second mic, and you'llnotice that at a few different times.
(00:24):
That said, still felt like you get aton of value out of this, and we decided
to push forward and post it ratherthan going back to the drawing board.
We hope you'll understand.
Today's episode's all about acceleratingtrust, how vulnerability is a key
piece of it, and how intentionallyfocusing on building trust is.
Going to set a strong foundationfor all high performing teams.
(00:47):
We'll give you some actionable tips,some of our own experiences and
things that we've put into practiceand experience with our clients.
And there's a digital download forsomething called the five Bs of Trust
that you can get@cultureshock.comin the press and media section.
Or a link to it in the descriptionsanywhere that you're listening
to or watching this episode.
So if it's something you wanna be ableto refer back to so that that way you can
(01:09):
take some of these actions and form habitsaround them, or if it's something that
you just want to use as a conversationstarter with your team, I would encourage
you to go ahead and do that download.
Let us know if you have any feedback.
And as always, thank you fortuning into Into The Storm Leaders.
I hope that you'll subscribeand that you'll get some
real value out of this one.
(02:17):
Hey folks, this is Joe Jurec.
Pete Honsberger we're your hosts ofthe, into the storm leaders podcast.
We did the introduction episode that youmay or may not have already listened to.
But this is the first time we'regoing to get into one of the topics.
That we care very deeply about.
And we're excited about this one.
We definitely are.
We hope the first episode gave youa good overview of what we plan to
(02:38):
cover through the entire series.
As well as some tidbits into, you know,some of the things that we believe,
some of the books that we love,but today is really diving into one
specific topic and, you know, where'sthere a better place to start, Joe,
at least from what we do then trust.
It's funny how everything comes back to.
Trust.
(02:59):
And how it's not something that justhappens naturally as people think.
Right.
So I want to open it up a little bitin this episode and talk about some
of the things that have influenced us.
Some of the different principlesand exercises that we got.
Some of the things that you'vedeveloped, Pete, that we've worked with
clients on and how important it is tohave that into the store mindset of.
(03:21):
Intentionally charging into situationswhere it makes sense to build more trust.
Right.
Because it's not always just aboutthe time you've known somebody.
So.
I think there's a lot to unpack hereand we'll probably talk about this in.
Quite a few other episodes as well.
Definitely.
Yeah.
But in our programs that we havefor emerging leaders and executive
(03:43):
teams, While it hits on things likecommunication and accountability.
We always start with trust.
I want to talk about why absolutelymean we've talked before about.
You know, everything.
Everything that we do boils down toestablishing trust as a foundation.
(04:04):
And you know, when we get contactedby entire teams, when we work with.
Leadership teams or we work withthe mid manager, emerging leader
teams, even one-on-one relationships.
There's always an element ofbuilding trust with that because
from trust comes good communication,more likelihood of accountability.
Healthy conflict.
(04:25):
You know, conflict, like yousaid, the ability to, to.
You'll feel comfortable, delegatingto somebody to asking people for
help and offering help as wellas making sure that people are
comfortable asking questions, beingcalled out and everything in between.
All those things contribute topositive workplace environments.
And to be honest, Positivepersonal relationships as well.
(04:49):
And you know, it all comesback to this concept of trust.
And you said that.
You know, just a minute ago, Joe, that,you know, it's not about necessarily
knowing somebody for 20 years, , that youhave to wait that long to build trust.
You know, we think that, that you cannotfake it, but you can accelerate it.
And, and anything that we talk aboutand what we work with clients on.
And a lot of times specifically whywe're hired is to accelerate trust.
(05:13):
To try to speed up the process,you know, think about brand new
people coming onto your team.
Think about relationships thateither haven't existed, not that
they're negative, they just,people just don't know each other.
Don't work that, that closely together.
Think about department bydepartment, within companies.
There might not be anythingnegative necessarily.
It's just, they haven't takenthe time to purposefully.
(05:34):
Build trust.
And then you had the situationswhere trust has been eroded.
Trust has been brokentrust needs to be rebuilt.
So all those things are factors.
Within organizations and you know, whatwe found is to try to attack trust.
Head-on just like anythingelse and do it on purpose.
I think so often things are just surface.
(05:54):
Right.
And most organizations.
You might have some, some watercooler talk it's gotten even harder.
With definitely hybridand virtual workspace.
Like you need to beintentional or deliberate.
About building real trustwith people and it's simple.
But not always easy.
Like a lot of the thingsthat we talk about.
(06:15):
Right.
But.
It's something that we wantto give you some different
techniques, some approaches.
And hopefully give you a tool or twoas well, and a chance to use this
episode as kind of a clarity break.
For you to do some reflection orjust an honest self assessment
about the levels of trust.
In your team.
(06:36):
So at that way, you've got a planof attack, something that you
can do to strengthen the trust,because we're what we argue.
And many others that, you know, we kindof subscribed to argue is that with a
high trust environment, You're goingto get productive, healthy conflict.
That's a good thing without that,you're not going to get real commitment.
(07:00):
And therefore you're not goingto get the accountability.
That's 360.
It's going to be hierarchical.
It's going to just comefrom your leadership.
And we, we talk about that a lot.
Cause that's Patrick, Lencioni's fivedysfunctions of a team model, which I
already mentioned inspired us quite a bit.
Well, in our experience backs upto that healthy conflict is an
indicator of a high trust environment.
You don't just have to takeour word for it either though.
(07:22):
We looked at a number of studiesleading up to this podcast.
But not only that, I mean,we're looking at things like
that on a regular basis that.
Backup the claims that trust does lead toreally good things within organizations.
And, you know, I know you have some rightat the, at the top of your head, Joe.
But you know anything from, from workplaceproductivity to innovation, those things.
(07:42):
Those things tend to happen when you,you know, when you have a high level
of trust and we'll talk even moreabout, you know, how do you know if
you have a high level of trust versusa low level, but, you know, we can.
We can share a couple of facts rightnow with you, that, that are going
to further tell the story of, youknow, Why trust is so important.
It's not just a feeling that you have,you know, it's not just that we've seen
(08:02):
it work with a lot of our clients, but,you know, There have been hundreds and
thousands of people surveyed as well.
That that will tell that story as well.
Yeah, and I kind of want to argue a.
Almost contrarion point about trustin this episode as well, because.
Th there's a lot of.
A lot of things that I see with differentsocial media channels and even some
(08:26):
that I subscribed to and follow and.
Where it talks about beingguarded or don't share too much.
Don't put yourself out there.
That's not a how it's notpowerful or how you get ahead.
And I just disagree.
I think that vulnerability and humility.
Are things that, especiallyas you become more senior.
In your career.
(08:47):
Really differentiate you and yourorganization and changes the culture
entirely instead of it being this macho.
You know, kind of mentality aboutnot being too open and honest it's
like at least in my experience,those are some of the things that.
You know, led to the best relationships.
The best results are when my executiveswere very sharing of themselves
(09:09):
and they admit their mistakes and.
Kind of made room for othersto also make mistakes.
One of the stats in particularthat we were looking at prior
to this, there was this researchdone by Edelman intelligence.
And it said that.
In a high trust work environment.
79% of employees.
We're likely to.
(09:31):
Innovate more readily and toembrace creativity, to take
a chance by speaking up.
Versus only 40% or less.
If the organization had a low trustenvironment and that's because
people fear speaking truth topower, they don't want to look bad.
They don't want to sound dumb.
And when there's high trustpeople know like, Hey.
(09:53):
We're we're all in this together.
I don't always need to beright, but people take chances.
Right.
That's when innovation occurs and thatthat's more important now than ever.
Sure.
And it had this all,we're all in it together.
Mentality.
You know, there's pretty much nolimit of what you can achieve when
that happens, you know, versus the.
You know, the boss is the onlyone who has the right ideas.
I'm not asking for anyone's opinion.
(10:15):
Those types of things create, this issort of me versus you wedge, or it creates
the traditional hierarchical structurewhere you just need to listen to whoever's
above you in the chain of command andnot question them, not ask, you know, not
push back when you feel like you need to.
And so from, from that standpoint, youknow, some other indicators we've seen.
(10:35):
All the high trust environment orwhen people do ask a lot of questions
and when that's okay to do so.
When there tends to be a lot of chatterin meetings, if you notice meetings
being lively and people are either jokingwith each other or pushing back on each
other, or even calling each other out.
That tends to mean ahigh trust environment.
You know, even in the gaps betweenofficial meetings, segments.
(10:56):
You know what we noticed sometimeswhen we take breaks with clients,
if there's chatter and people arestopping at each other's desks.
When, you know, on the way to thebathroom and chatting about things,
if there's a little bit of you know,busts in each other's chops that tends
to indicate a high trust environment.
We also noticed that.
You know, from an innovationstandpoint, people are, are taking
these intellectual risks to bring upan idea that they might even think
(11:19):
is kind of crazy or off the wall.
But they're doing it anyway becausethey know that they're not going to get
punished for doing so, or they're notgoing to get laughed out of the room.
Somebody might in a good natured way.
Talk about how that's not going to work orthat's crazy, but then someone else might
take a shred of that idea and they mightturn it into something that's workable.
But the comfort level or the levelof okayness to bring that stuff
(11:41):
up, that indicates a high trustenvironment from, from our standpoint.
We've versus me.
There's not that self-serving.
Yeah.
Or even self preservation wherepeople are afraid to speak up
and say the wrong thing, right.
It's when you take a little bit more risk.
Or, or when you minimize the risk byhaving a higher trust environment, stuff
(12:03):
just flows and you, you get stuff done,you figure things out and you come up
with new ways of doing things, right.
Does.
And there's not, there's not that walkingon eggshells mentality, which we've
seen when there's tension in an officetension in a, in a home environment, you
know, people are walking on eggshells,afraid of not saying the wrong thing or
not saying the right thing, afraid ofsaying the wrong thing that can create.
(12:26):
You know, it can stifle anysort of creativity, innovation.
It can make it just not fun to besomewhere not interesting to be somewhere
in that goes back to what we talkedabout in the last episode about, you
know, I get to be at work versus Ihave to be at work or I get to go to
this particular place versus I haveto enforce to, I have no other choice.
So, you know, We've talkedabout some indicators.
(12:48):
Now we, I want to move us into basicallywhat we think you can do about trust.
How do you, how do youactually accelerate it?
You know, and we have something we'vecreated over the last few years.
That we call the five B's of trust.
So we think if you can be these thingson any given day, and you can encourage
your team to do that as well, especiallyif you're a leader and you had that
(13:10):
position of authority right now, whereyou can create this type of environment.
Your team is going toaccelerate trust consistently.
You're going to make new people feellike they're part of the team quicker.
You're going to make your current teammembers feel like they can bring up
issues, questions, ideas, concerns alot faster instead of sitting on that
information that that could either reallyhelp or really hurt the organization.
(13:31):
If they don't say it, or if they dosay it those are the types of things we
want to cover in our five B's of trust.
And we're hoping thatyou can take this away.
And, and and actually put something intoaction as a result of this conversation.
Or you can reach out to us afterthe fact and we'll continue
that conversation with you.
It's just a differentway of looking at it.
So yeah.
I want to break these down because it.
(13:53):
Even like I for a long time.
Looked at trust is something thateither happened or it didn't.
And.
If it didn't, I thought, well, maybe I'vejust, I've not had the opportunity yet.
I've not had enough time.
And it think from this, some ofthe actions you can take from
it, just being more mindful.
Right.
Be being aware that it'ssomething you gotta work at.
It doesn't always just come right.
(14:14):
Organically or naturally.
So Take us through a man.
Go through.
There's there's thoughts.
What's the first oneyou want to talk about.
First be of trust.
We have is very simple and it's Be aBuffalo and it's not necessarily the,
you know, identify every objectiveand opportunity charge into it in
this case, it's specific to trust.
So we believe if you want tohave a high trust environment, we
(14:37):
have to figure out what head-oninto that means and then charge.
And we need to be accountable to.
To those actions that we plan ontaking, but this shows up in a lot
of ways, both big scale and smallscale, you know, on a small scale.
You know, being a Buffalo towardtrust could be identifying one person
that you don't feel like you havethe type of working relationship
you should have with that person.
(14:59):
And then making it a point to talkingto that person, to either scheduling
official conversations with them,or just more in an informal way.
Taking it upon yourself to getto know them as human beings
instead of just as coworkers.
Not that you have to knoweverybody's deepest, darkest
secrets, or be best friends withyour coworkers, but identifying
(15:21):
that one person, in some cases, wecall it the high ROI relationship.
Yeah.
There would be a return onyour investment return on their
investment of time and energy.
If you spend some time togetherand get to know each other.
So that's the small scale on a largescale, you know, being a Buffalo would
just be throwing it out there to yourentire organization and saying, look,
I want to create a higher level oftrust within this entire organization.
(15:43):
Here are, you know, three to four thingsthat I plan on doing as the leader of
this organization over the next monthor the next quarter to make that happen.
Sometimes it's bringing inoutside speakers or facilitators.
Sometimes it's just gettingpeople together more frequently.
Sometimes it's you as theleader, setting that tone.
And having a vulnerability.
Like you talked about.
You know, to familiarizeyourself with them and to
(16:05):
humanize yourself a little bit.
And, and, you know, those are a couplethings that come to mind as far as
how do we be a Buffalo to trust?
What does that storm look likeand how do we charge into that?
What about just, I think for.
A lot of people, the storm couldjust be initiating that conversation.
So what about the one-on-one dialogue?
Like if you are thinking toyourself, These are the one,
(16:26):
two or three relationshipsthat are too important to wait.
Or too important not togive them some attention.
To increase that level of trust.
Like.
How do you start?
What would you ever encouragesomebody to say like, Hey.
I want to build more trust withyou or how would you go about that?
I think you have to find your ownlanguage to do that, but I think
(16:48):
it's, it's initiating a conversation.
However, it feels right to you.
And you're going to have toget a little bit uncomfortable.
That's what being a Buffalo is all about.
But it could be stopping by a coworker'sdesk and saying, Hey, you know, I want
to make sure that we're on the samepage about this project coming up.
You know, can we, can we spend sometime talking about it and then and then
through those conversations, Sprinklingin a little bit of information about
(17:11):
yourself outside of work and askinga little bit of, of information of
that person as well, so that youcan better relate to each other.
You know, that's just one example.
You know, if you're in a hybrid or aremote work environment, It might have
to be a little more formal than that.
You might have to send somebodya teams message or an instant
message and just say, Hey.
You know, would you, would you beopen to scheduling a half hour?
(17:33):
You know, on a teams meeting ora phone call sometime between
now and the end of the week.
And then if, you know, makesure that you have something
to talk to them about as well.
But then trying to encourage thatto happen on a somewhat regular
basis is an example of doing that.
I think you also can start if it'smore comfortable do it this way you
can start into in a meeting setting.
(17:53):
So you can sprinkle in at the beginning,middle or end of a meeting, a couple
of questions that have nothing to dowith work that just get people talking
potentially laughing as well as findingconnection points amongst one another.
You know, we ask a lot of questions like,Hey, just tell us about your first concert
that you ever attended in your life.
That doesn't take that long in a meetingsetting, you know, on the EOS process.
(18:17):
In their pulse meetings, they talkabout, you know, business best
and a personal best, something.
You're proud of something you'reexcited about from a personal and
business standpoint over the last weekor the last month in the last quarter.
So you can go that route aswell, but there's a number of
different questions you can ask.
They're not related to work, butdo give some insight into who
these people are as human beings.
And we feel like the more we knowabout each other as people, not just
(18:39):
as coworkers, the more likely I am togive somebody the benefit of the doubt,
if I expect them to be at their desk.
And I don't.
I don't see them at their deskrather than making an assumption.
I might say, oh, I knowthis about this person.
It's, you know, they have kidsthat have soccer after, after work.
So on Thursdays, they playtheir games and they're out of
the office a little bit early.
So therefore now I'm not gettingresentful of that person.
(19:02):
I can relate to them.
And I'm understanding sort ofwhat they're going through.
And I, and I'm more likely to, to givethem the benefit of the doubt or cut them
a break in some S some circumstances.
So that's, those are the thingsthat come to mind for me.
Any, anything to add on that, Joe?
I think it's.
It dovetails in with that meetingsetting where I guess just, you can
(19:24):
be a Buffalo when building trust byrealizing that everyone has this need.
And for some reason, we're all kindof wired to feel uncomfortable.
Telling people or addressing it openly.
That we want to get to know somebodymore, that we want to build a
better relationship with them.
It's I think we build it upin our heads to seem a lot
(19:45):
creepier than it actually is.
So being a Buffalo, you, you canbe that person for your group.
If you come to a meeting with a fewof those sorts of questions and you
even, you don't just launch into them,but you, you announce or express.
Hey, I want to start doingthis so that way we can.
Kick off our meetings in a different way.
(20:05):
So we can get to know some belowthe surface stuff about each other,
because in my assessment, we canget better at trusting each other.
We need to work on this as a group.
And, you know, come up with five or 10questions where you ask one or two of
them, each meeting something as simpleas, you know, How many siblings do you
have and where do you fall in that line?
(20:26):
What's, what's something hardthat you went through as a kid
that, that shaped you in some way.
There's a whole myriad of them andyou can find some, some more like,
well, we'll put them on our socialchannels and things like that as well.
And you can find them on culture,shock.com, but we'll do these energizers.
Where it's a two minute exerciseat the beginning of a meeting just
to get everybody loosened up and.
(20:48):
One of the ones you, youintroduced me to in particular.
Is this a commonalities Energizer?
Where, what does it, you have two minutes?
Yeah, two to three minutes fora group to figure out as many
things as they have in common.
Like everyone at the table has incommon with each other as possible.
And it gets ridiculous.
(21:08):
It's usually like, oh,we all have shoelaces.
And maybe we all have a sibling or,or brown hair or whatever, and that
is the surface stuff, but it justgoes to show that in two minutes,
when you're deliberate about buildingtrust, you can find out more.
About people.
And find more things thatyou have in common with them.
(21:28):
Then you typically would over 30 daysor even a year with all of the water
cooler, talk about weather and sports.
And I love sports.
I love talking about it, but to mixthat in with some real questions
where you show some genuine interestthing really goes a long way.
Well, that makes me think too, youknow, none of these things cost
(21:48):
any money to actively build trust.
You just have to, you have totake it upon yourself to make.
It happen.
And you know, some of what we'retalking about is related to some
of the other BS of trust as well.
You know, but on the on the surfacelevel versus getting below the surface
concept, you know, Joe and I have both.
Led in the last two monthsnow, something we call the zero
(22:09):
smalltalk happy hour as well.
And so if you want to be purposefulabout getting below that surface a
little bit you can do this and youcan label a certain number of topics
off limits, like the weather, like theweekend, like you know, what your job
is and then encourage other topics like.
Hopes and dreams and goals, things thatpeople are interested in outside of work.
(22:30):
And if nothing else, that builds familiarfamiliarity and, and connection points.
And it does require a littlebit of vulnerability because
you're opening yourself up.
So that other people can come walkinside your world a little bit and.
You know, there's hesitation fromsome, some people to start that.
But what we notice is if you can easepeople into those types of conversations
(22:52):
and say, look, I'm not asking you aboutevery secret you've ever you've ever told.
I don't need to see, youknow, embarrassing high school
photos of you necessarily.
You don't need to dance likea chicken in front of us.
But if you're willing to share a littlebit about yourself, you know, we're just
trying to get to know each other so thatwe can have a better working relationship.
And so that I can have better insight andsort of what your personality is like.
(23:13):
How you prefer to be communicatedwith, and, and those types of things.
Come to the surface, themore we we asked those.
You know, below surfacelevel conversations.
So that'd be a Buffalo.
Right.
figure out who those people areand don't wait for it to happen.
Charge into it, come up with aplan and do something with it.
(23:33):
That's where we start.
You can even tell them you wantto build more trust with them?
Yes.
As weird as of my feel, try it.
Probably not going to bethat, that weird or creepy.
We'll probably want to be, you know, Butyou want to be on the receiving end of
somebody saying that, look, I think weneed to have a good working relationship,
or I think we're going to work togetherquite a bit over the next few years.
We're going to do great things.
(23:54):
If we can get to knoweach other a little bit.
It's different.
You appreciate when there'ssomething that breaks routine.
Right.
And you're not in autopilot havingthat conversation with somebody.
If somebody says that to you,they clearly care enough.
To do something that felt alittle uncomfortable or odd.
And that's often where some ofthe best relationships come from.
Right.
(24:14):
And speaking of you never know whatyou're going to learn about somebody
until you ask that's number two , wecall it Be Interested Not Interesting.
And there's a simple distinction there,but being interested to us is focusing
more on questions and getting to knowother people, then having to be the most
interesting person in the room yourself.
(24:35):
You know, we find in a lot of one-on-oneconversations and even in some.
You know, broader workplace cultures.
If there's a culture of everyonetrying to sound like they're the
smartest person, like they'vegot the best ideas all the time.
They have the right answer.
Everyone's talkingprimarily about themselves.
There's not a lot of back and forth.
Yeah.
There's not a lot of true learningabout each other when that happens.
(24:56):
It's it's, you know, it's just, youknow, me trying to, to, to stand on
top of someone else and then tryingto stand on top of me, but the
flip side of that being interested.
Is, you know, what we find is thatit turns into some really good.
Mutual conversations where, you know,you don't just ask one question as
somebody, you might stack a secondor a third question to get a little
(25:17):
bit deeper into who they are.
Or even in what, you know, what theissue is within the organization.
What, you know, what the realmotivation is, not just what
somebody says the first time.
And so that's be interestedmore than your interesting.
If there's one.
Thing that you pull from this.
It stuck with me personally, bemore interested than interesting,
because I think it's againhard wired in so many of us.
(25:41):
Too.
Listen.
With the intent of respondinginstead of listening with
the intent of comprehending.
And usually when we do ask a question,When somebody is talking, we're thinking
about what we're going to say next.
So that being more interested insteadof interesting, kind of goes against.
(26:02):
A lot of what you see.
Nowadays I got, I'm constantlyseeing ads for this masterclass
on be the most interesting personin the room and command attention.
And, and look, I get it.
That there's some importancein having that confidence.
Where you can command a room and you'rea good storyteller don't get me wrong.
(26:23):
But that's not going to be the fastestor the most effective way of building.
High trust relationships or ahigh trust environment, right.
You have to show that genuine curiosity.
So.
Yeah, it's a paradox for me.
Is that the harder I try to beinteresting the less, I think
people want to talk to me.
But the more I focus on.
(26:44):
Other people and asking questionsto other people and digging
into what's going on with them.
The more they actuallythink that I'm interesting.
Right.
I've found that to be the case.
You know, I, we have you and I have anumber of stories or examples of this,
but, you know, I sat with a client atdinner a year ago and somebody who's,
you know, somewhat well-known around thearea, who's done some pretty big things
(27:05):
from a real estate development standpoint.
You know, I asked a couple questionslike, Hey, you know, are you working
on any interesting projects right now?
And 30 minutes later with a coupleadditional followup questions he had
given me all this really good insight intointeresting things that were happening.
And at the end of dinner, he said,it was really good talking to you.
Here's my card.
Let me know if you everneed anything right.
And I maybe said 15words, the entire dinner.
(27:28):
I just was interested in what he hadto say and, and found it, you know, he
found me to be a good conversationalist.
People want to share.
Yeah, and it, and it does.
It creates.
More opportunity for futureconversations and, you know, Like people.
You know, they tend to want to helpif they know that you're interested
(27:48):
in what's going on with them.
And then now they're looking foropportunities to connect you with
other people or other opportunities.
Just because you asked some goodquestions and tried not to focus so much
on yourself, because that is, I think,I think natural tendency for all of us,
myself included is, you know, you want toshare as much as you can about yourself.
And if you're selling somethingyou want to share about your
(28:08):
product, as much as you can.
But, you know, one thing Ron told me yearsago Ron Kaminski here at CultureShoc.
Was that.
You know, the depth of our relationshipsare really determined by the quality
of the questions that we ask andthe depth of the questions we ask.
And that's to me goesback to be interested.
Yeah.
You interested in.
Be vulnerable enough to, to share when.
(28:31):
When it comes up, but not so programmed.
That if you ask somebody how their weekendwas, when you see them on a Monday.
And they tell you, oh, I went toa baseball game with the kids.
Not just jumping into, oh, the lasttime I went to this ballpark, it was
like this, or I actually watched thegame, but I couldn't go this week.
As we so often respond with.
(28:52):
We're trying to one upthem in some way, too.
Right?
I went to three baseball games.
I think we do that.
We're trying to relate.
We're trying to be interesting, but alsofind that common ground when really.
It's more effective in myexperience at least to instead
say, oh, who'd you go with?
Was that the first gameyou went to this year?
Right?
(29:13):
Did ya, did you just do hotdogs or didyou try out any of the new ballpark food?
Before the game after the game.
How'd you get down there.
Like those types of things don't seemlike they're significant, but then
you start to understand the, the.
You know, a more full pictureof what someone's interested in.
It demonstrates that you give a shit.
When you're actuallyasking follow up questions.
(29:35):
And showing some positive bodylanguage and then asking additional
questions or banking that information.
It just, yeah.
Care enough to listen.
You care enough to ask.
And boom, the trust and your relationshipstarts to very quickly accelerate.
And I've had almost exact conversationssimilar to that, where you ask,
oh, what'd you do after the game?
Anything someone talks about goingto a restaurant that you've never
(29:58):
heard of that maybe is brand new.
And you're saying, I didn'teven know that existed.
I should, I should try that.
And then they say, well, actually, youknow, my brother-in-law or sister-in-law
are, is the manager of that restaurant.
They could get you in sometime,even though it's hard to get in.
And now you're.
You know, they're, they're trying to helpyou out because you show that you care
about what they have to say, and, and nowit's benefiting you because, you know,
(30:20):
Because just because you asked right.
So, yeah.
That's to us as be interested in,in, you know, we want to keep moving.
We're going to be on to, to be numberthree of the five B's of trust and,
and that to us as being intentional,and we've already hit on this in a few
different ways in the conversation, butbeing intentional around building trust
to us is not only having that Buffalomentality to charge into it, but it's
(30:44):
actually setting an objective or a goal.
Or, or a muscle that you want tomake sure you're growing on purpose.
Yeah.
When it comes to building trustso that it could be, you know,
I want to pick out one person.
And I want to build trust with themand I'm going to intentionally do that
by setting goals, you know, weeklyconversation or a monthly conversation.
I'm going to put on my calendarthat I'm going to check in
(31:05):
with this person in particular.
On a regular basis.
I'm glad you said the calendar.
Yeah, because I think that's so many ofus live and die by what's on our calendar.
True.
And if it's something that's importantto us, We calendar the time for it.
So that's something that I'vepersonally benefited from, and I've
seen a lot of other people as well, assimple as touch base with this human.
(31:27):
Right.
And maybe it's what you put on thecalendar is get them out of the office or,
or get them out of their typical workspacewhere you make a point once a quarter or.
W once a month, whateverfrequency works for you.
The more often, probably the better,but to do something a little different
to show them again, that you care whereit's not just picking up the phone,
(31:49):
or maybe it's going over to theirdesk and saying like, Hey, you want
to walk around the block really quick?
Or.
Maybe if all you do is emailand teams with somebody that you
actually do, pick up the phoneand talk to them for a moment.
Calendaring it.
So keep yourself honest and on track.
Like that's the intentional aspect, right?
You map out or set a plan.
(32:10):
Of what you want to do.
And then you give yourself away to follow through on it.
I'm writing down or capturingwhat those goals are.
Right.
We have some clients that, especially in,you know, campuses where there's multiple
buildings for your company, or we've seenthis in manufacturing plants where it's a
large square footage amount of plant wherethe leadership team member or the CEO.
(32:34):
Or the plant manager sets as an objectiveintentionally that they're going
to walk the floor every day betweenthese hours, or they're going to go
visit the other buildings on theircampus X number of times per week.
And that's a way to be intentionalabout making sure that you're not
missing opportunities for those,those little moments where you
can walk by somebody, ask them howthey're doing, ask about the family.
(32:56):
They might have something to tellyou or sometimes, you know, we're
not sending an email, you know,for every little thing that pops.
Into our mind, but if we wereto happen to walk by somebody.
I might say, oh yeah.
What about this?
You know, tell me about this projector this this, you know, new robot
robotics piece that you just got in.
How's it working?
And vice versa.
You being visible.
(33:17):
Not only when things go wrong as aleader, but when things are going
right, and just in general, that takes alittle bit of the intimidation edge off.
When people see the boss,quote, unquote, walking around.
If you're only walking aroundwhen things are going wrong.
You know, then everyone's going to bea little uptight when you're walking
around, but if you're doing it allthe time or on a regular basis,
people know they have access to you.
(33:38):
They're probably going to be more likelyto bring things up and say, Hey, I
got a quick question about this, or.
You know what I have an idea.
I think, you know, if we, if we shiftedthis line 90 degrees from where it's
at right now, it might make the flowof work, go a little bit better.
We can get this thing out thedoor a little bit quicker.
And so, you know, we've seen exampleslike that from a number of quiet
clients and it just takes beingintentional to build that trust.
(34:00):
Sometimes it's, it's even as simpleas intentionally being visible.
Right.
That's a huge factor is when there's that.
Accessibility.
Of a senior leader.
That.
Demonstration that, Hey, I want tobe available for open and honest
dialogue because quite frankly,there are so many blind spots.
(34:24):
That executives develop over the years.
And a lot of times it's with the bestintentions, but they just don't keep a
pulse of how people really feel what'sreally happening in the business.
And they think they've gota damn good idea of it, but.
They've not made a set of very clearexpectation that, Hey, I want you
to feel confident telling me things.
Without fear of repercussion.
(34:47):
And often just your presence.
Around your willingness to go asksome questions and, and to have
some human dialogue with somebody.
You'll be surprised how much you learn.
About like what's really happening.
Sure I can keep a better pulse onthe culture, then you know what to
fix and where to focus your efforts.
(35:07):
Well, and on that notetoo, you know, that.
Whenever we get involved in aconference or an association hires
us to facilitate some networking.
That that's just an opportunityfor people to build trust.
And it, it helps a lot in businessdevelopment standpoint, or if
you're looking for new vendors orsuppliers what we do is we encourage
people to set a goal or objective.
(35:28):
I want to, I want to meet five people.
I wanna meet 10 people throughoutthis two day conference, and
we'll encourage people to do that.
And we'll sometimes requireit slash facilitate it where
we'll say, all right, everybody.
At your tables right now.
I want you to take five minutes, gofind two people you've never met before.
Shake their hand, introduce yourselfand answer these two or three questions.
One question might be aboutwork, but two questions might not
(35:51):
have anything to do with work.
Now you've created a connectionand you've met people in that.
You know, at least builds alittle bit of familiarity.
So if you're interested in.
And networking or building trustintentionally when you're at a conference
or at a meeting setting or in any sortof somewhat awkward networking event.
Give yourself an objective and now,you know what you're working towards.
So you're not just aimlesslyfloating around, sticking with
(36:14):
the people that you know, thebest and not challenging yourself.
That's also part ofbeing intentional that.
We've helped a lot of clientswith, and I found value myself.
In setting a little bit of a goal,walking into a potential situation
like that, and then executing it.
Let me throw this your way though.
I don't have enough time for that.
Right.
It comes up all the time.
We're busy.
(36:35):
Sure that sounds nice.
It would be great if I could do that,but I just don't have the time to.
Put that stuff on mycalendar to walk around.
I need to get stuff done.
Like w what do you, what do you mean.
Yeah, that's a tough one.
I think.
Anyone can legitimatelytalk about being busy.
And I think most peoplethat we know are busy.
If we it's, it's almost like thatpaying yourself first concept.
(36:57):
If you're not carvingout a little bit of time.
To build trust with people.
It's, you know, it's going to.
It's going to hurt youa lot in the long run.
On the flip side of that, thepossibilities are so vast.
If you are intentionally spending10 minutes a day, even just
sending out a quick message to.
(37:18):
Just looking at your calendar and saying,Hey, it's this, this person's been
with the company for one year today.
Like, let me send them a quick message,just doing a five to 10 minute walk.
It's good for our health anyway,to get around and see everybody.
If you're at a conference ornetworking event, you're there anyway.
Like, and I say that to a lot ofclients, actually, if, you know,
if we get hired for a team buildingevent or something where I know some
(37:39):
people are going to be skeptical, youknow, do I really want to be here?
Do I really want to devote,you know, three hours in my day
for this outside person who.
I don't even know, I'll say rightup front, look, we're going to be
here for three hours anyway, let'smake it a great use of our time.
And so there is this element ofjust intentionally carving out time
that, you know, we can either makean excuse that we don't have time.
(38:02):
Or we could, we could use the time wisely.
I think that that's one ofthe biggest differences.
That I've seen in effective leaders wherethey've realized that's so important.
That.
They commit and find ways to make time.
That's a part of why they're busyis because that's so essential.
Right.
And if you see the value, if youunderstand the why and the benefit of it.
(38:26):
Then you don't see it assomething you need to do.
It's something you get to do andsomething you want to do, like leadership.
Is a service.
To others.
And I think so often.
People take managerial jobs because it's.
Better for their livelihood and wellbeing.
It's more money.
Without necessarily thinking about allthe responsibilities that come with it.
(38:49):
And we'll talk a lot more about that whenit comes to accountability, conversations
and stuff, but even this sort ofthings like how you spend your time.
You've got to commit someof it to your people.
And I think one of the biggest, likethe, the way that you've demonstrated
or, or share the value you see from it islike the concept of the speed of trust.
I don't want to deviate too much fromthe five BS here, but I think that
(39:11):
kind of fits with be intentional.
You talk a little bitabout that real quick.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
And we, we don't want to rush toomuch through the last couple of
B's of trust, but we're going tospeed it up a little bit for you.
When it comes to the speed of trust,you know, it's a book by Stephen, Mr.
Covey, and you know, somethingthat, that we believe a lot in it.
To me.
It's a simple concept where.
(39:31):
You know, if we have ahigh trust environment.
Things tend to happen fasterand they cost less money.
And when we have a low trust environment,things happen slower and they cost more
money because there's more micro-managing.
There's less peoplebringing things up quickly.
More people sort of play in thebehind the scenes politics game
where I don't know if I say thisas it gonna bother somebody else.
(39:53):
So maybe I'll, I won't say it yet,but then I'll tell somebody in the
back channel, so on and so forth.
So it's high trustenvironments can speed up.
Speed up things to happen.
Speed up innovation you'llend up saving money.
Whereas low trust environments,the opposite happens.
It pays you over and over and over again.
Right.
I heard you say high trust isthe dividend low trust the tax.
(40:14):
Absolutely.
I, I definitely took that.
Recommend that book as well.
The speed of trust.
Which brings us to the fourth, beof trust, and that is be helpful.
And this one is not rocket science.
None of these are, butwe've developed this after.
Just understanding through ourown careers and client experience
that anybody can be helpful toanybody else within an organization.
(40:35):
Anybody can be helpful to any customeror client or supplier you have.
We just have to think about how can webe helpful or how can we be more helpful.
So I kind of think about it in three.
You know, can I be helpful inthree different directions,
one to my customers or clients?
How can I be more helpful thanI already am being rude to them?
And there's a number of different waysyou can do that, but it builds trust too.
(40:58):
To show people, not just say it, but showit that you truly want to be helpful.
Number two is how can I be helpful topeople that are not necessarily clients,
but their vendors, their partners.
They're the people that aredoing construction on your
office, they're your it partners.
How can I be more helpful to themwhich will build trust with them
and they'll want to reciprocate.
Deprecation as well.
(41:18):
And then number three is howcan I be more helpful to myself,
to my own personal development?
You know, reading books, maintaining,you know, physical and mental wellness
you know, pursuing development, pursuing.
Training that's similar to thingslike CultureShoc offers, you know,
can you be more helpful to yourself?
To better trust yourself, to better,you know, build your confidence.
(41:38):
Build your own skillset.
And so if we can focus on any of thosethree areas or hopefully all of them,
you know, we believe that whetheryou're an intern who just started
yesterday, we think you can be helpfulto anybody within the organization or
whether you're, you know, a 30 yearemployee, a CEO or anything in between.
You know, I want to focus on howcan I be as helpful as possible.
(41:58):
And we can be intentional aboutthat by picking out one way or two
ways that I can be more helpful.
To my coworkers, to my clients andcustomers or to myself if I can
do that, then I'm going to get.
I'm in good shape.
I think this is the one that probablyaligns most closely with what a lot of
people think of when they think of trust.
And it's the integrity piece, right.
(42:20):
That doing what yousay you're going to do.
That's what's helpful to peopleis if you commit to something that
they know they can count on, you.
I always find it important that when wetalk about this one, we talk about the
flip side, because of course there's.
You know, it can betaken in an extreme way.
And you mentioned behelpful to yourself as well.
(42:43):
Like setting boundaries.
Knowing when to say no.
I think that needs to be coupledwith this because otherwise.
You you're trying to be helpfulto everybody and you burn out
and then you aren't helpfulbecause you can't follow through.
On the commitments that you made.
So that's a great point.
Right.
Something that has helped me.
(43:04):
And I think I shared thiswith you a while back.
On my desk.
At home or right behind it, Ihave something written down to the
effect of what, one extra thing.
Can I do to be unique and memorable.
So when every interaction that I'm having.
I think.
Before I hit send, before I pick up thephone, before I go meet with somebody.
(43:25):
What one little unexpected thingcan I do to be more helpful?
That is going to catch somebody off.
The guard that they'renot going to expect.
That does stick with them.
A little bit, and I thinkthat's something that.
And even as simple as that, Isa way that you can intentionally
build trust by being more helpful.
I think about what, one little extrathing that's not going to derail.
(43:50):
My life and all it's that I have.
We're going to be in a holistic expert.
But the
Yeah.
If we over commit, are youreally helping somebody?
Right.
You know, if I, if I say to somebody,Hey, I'll hold you accountable
to this, but I never follow up.
I'm, I'm not even really being helpful.
So you bring up a good point and Istruggle with this from time to time cuz
I wanna help as many people as I can.
Uh, just about every keynote orconference speech that I do, I'll put
(44:13):
my email address on the last slide andsay, look, if anyone wants to follow
up, if anyone wants me to help you.
Beyond today.
Feel free to email me.
You know, and the reality is if there's300 people in the room and all 300 of
them email me, I might be in trouble.
You're probably gonna, yeah, I knowyou though, you're, you're gonna
follow up with all of the 300 peopleand put yourself out in that way.
But, but, but you're, you wannahelp, you are rolling the dice a
(44:36):
little bit with something like that.
Now that, that typically doesn't happen,I might get one or two or five people
that reach out and, you know, wanna,wanna have a quick chat after that.
But in, there's a part of me thatthinks that would be a great problem
to have because then that would beokay, a lot of new business, um,
now we can scale up and continue toscale our operation accordingly, but
the setting of boundaries and beingrealistic with people and letting
(44:58):
them know that, look, I can help you.
I just might not be ableto help you right now.
Like there's some power in that as well.
Yeah.
So the open and honestaspect is big, right?
Yeah.
And I know we'll talk more about thatafter the five Bs, but it's just.
Coupling that be helpfulwith Be realistic.
Yep.
Of what you can actuallyhelp with cuz Sure.
Again, I think it's very unhelpful ifyou express wanting to, and then you
(45:20):
can't follow through on that and deliver.
Right, right.
All right.
Take us home, which I'm sure, yeah, I'msure both of us have made that mistake
before and then not followed throughbecause things just got too busy.
But I do notice that with.
Um, some people that you know, thatI, I talk with or you meet somebody
at a conference and they say, ohyeah, yeah, I'll follow up with you.
I'll send you an email sometime, andthen you just never get that email.
(45:42):
That erodes trust a little bit.
So we wanna make sure that wemaintain that building of trust,
uh, keep it at a high level, whichbrings us to, you know, well so far.
All right, we've got the ideaabove be of self-awareness.
If, if you're not doing whatyou say you're gonna do,
we've hit on Be a Buffalo.
We had be interested, be intentional.
Be helpful.
And the fifth one you said isbe self-aware and self-awareness
(46:05):
shows up in a couple ways froma trust building standpoint.
Number one is, Am I aware of,of whether or not I'm following
the other four Bs of trust?
So can I have that awareness toactually ask people for feedback?
Can I ask people if I'm doing thingsthat, that are bothering them?
If there are, if there are things that Icould be doing better for my teammates,
(46:25):
uh, for my customers or clients.
Um, it also shows up in, you know,do I, do I seek out, you know, The
reduction of my own blind spots.
Do I, am I self aware enough?
Am I opening myself up to otherpeople and being vulnerable?
Um, do I essentially, do I look toother people the way that I think I do?
(46:46):
You know, am I perceived the wayI wanna be perceived or the way
I think that I'm being perceived?
Um, cuz one of the things that buildstrucks quickly is when you can line
up how you wanna be perceived withhow you actually are perceived.
Um, and one of the things thathurts trust significantly is if you
think you're one way, but you're,you're truly a different way.
Um, and, and you'reoblivious to that fact.
(47:08):
And we've worked with someclients that, that fits that bill.
Yeah.
Um, and so, you know, if we can work onbeing self-aware that we're executing
on all four of the other bees of trust,but then also, you know, think about
from, from, you know, my own standpoint.
Like auditing myself.
Am I really, you know, if I want to befriendly, am I coming off as friendly?
(47:29):
And if I'm, if I wanna be interested, amI coming off as interested or am I all
just talking about myself all the time?
So that's the last B of trust for us.
That sort of brings it all home fromthat standpoint and, and obviously
today we're just scratching the surface.
Of what these are.
We've got a number of other examplesand client examples that we'd love to
talk about in more detail after this.
But, you know, I'm curious on yourthoughts, Joe, before we wrap it up.
(47:52):
Yeah, co a couple things there just tohelp make that one actionable for people.
Cuz self-awareness, everyone feelslike they're pretty self-aware, right?
And then every once in a while youget kicked in the, kicked in the
stomach and you're like, holy shit.
I had no idea.
I thought I was really good at that.
And this was where, uh, I, I thinkI mentioned in the introductory
episode, I, I'd worked.
With Liz Weissman at, at a conference,and she has this concept called
(48:15):
multipliers, where there's all of thesethings that w we perceive as strengths,
that have unintended consequences andaccidentally diminish the intelligence
and capability of those that we leadand those that we are surrounded by.
And it, it's so important thatwe're doing something that we
(48:38):
have some sort of habit of.
Doing a gut check of an honest selfassessment to say, are we perceived
the way that we really think we are?
And you, you probably aren'tgonna like the answer.
You're it, it's not gonna becomfortable, it's not gonna be fun.
But it's how you grow.
It's how you learn.
You've gotta ask and makesure people know it's okay to
(49:00):
deliver that kind of feedback.
Uh, it, it's, I think peopleare actually more comfortable.
Delivering that feedback to others.
Then setting the tone of, Hey, I wantyou to critique me in that way as well.
And what I would ask you is when you thinkof your peak leader, like in, in your
(49:22):
lifetime or your career, the person who.
You emulate most because they,they made such an impression
or had such influence on who?
Sure.
We alluded you are weed this alittle bit in the last episode too.
So think of that person andthe characteristics that that
make them your peak leader.
And then ask yourself, are youthat peak leader for somebody else?
(49:45):
Right?
And are you emulatingthose characteristics?
Are you emulating those characteristics?
Do you think somebody else if askedthat same question, would name you?
Yeah.
And what do you need to model?
What do you need to do, uh, to tobe that person if you're not today?
And then having this kind of dialogue,having these conversations and uh, having
people do some honest ratings is somethingwe've found can be really uncomfortable.
(50:14):
And we've leveraged for almost conflictmining when we realize there's.
A low trust environment orartificial harmony with a bunch
of resentment under the surface.
We'll pull different ways to saylike, all right, let's do a rating
on the level of trust in this room.
And this is something we talkedabout before this episode actually
(50:35):
encouraging, uh, to kind ofround things out here, right?
When you're thinking about the fiveBs of trust, when you're thinking
about trust in your own atmosphere,use this as a clarity break.
Think to yourself honestly for amoment, And one to 10, how would you
rate the level of trust in your team?
(50:56):
Yeah, that's a good place to startand, and there's hopefully a number
of actionable things that, thatcame out of this podcast for you.
Feel free to reach out to eitherJoe or myself after the fact here.
Feel free to reach out to both of usafter the fact or, or either of us if
you'd like some more actionable ideas.
But, you know, we hope you likethe, the five Bs of trust today.
Again, this is just the beginningof not only this podcast, but of the
(51:20):
depth of trust that that's out there.
Uh, and again, we'd recommend thefive Dysfunctions of a team book.
We'd recommend the, the speed of trust.
And uh, it's been a pleasure justhaving this conversation with you,
Joe, and just talking trust cuzit is one of our favorite topics.
Yeah, I have a feeling we're gonnabe talking about this one again.
Uh, pretty soon we do a workshopcalled Establish Authentic Trust.
(51:42):
That's a part of ourinto the Storm Leaders.
Uh, development program.
So there, there is a lot more on this one.
And it's the foundation, right?
Uh, it's, I, I can tell youthat I have some relationships.
Pete is a great example where we've knowneach other for a little bit over a year.
Yep.
I have much more open, honestdialogue and trust with you than
(52:06):
some people I'm friends with andhave known for five or 10 years.
That are just much moresurface level and Right.
I really do think it's about the numberof vulnerable moments you've shared with
that person and the willingness to havesome uncomfortable conversation, uh, to be
communicative, right, and to, to kinda layout a plan and, and apply those five Bs.
(52:27):
So hopefully that helps.
Look forward to continuingthe conversation on this one.
Hopefully you got somethingoutta this episode.
As always, you can, uh,subscribe to, we'd love if you
subscribe to the podcast itself.
You can also follow and check out someother, uh, content that we put out
there on YouTube, on TikTok, Instagram.
Connect with us on LinkedIn.
Uh,
reach out and have a conversation.
(52:49):
All 300 of you or 3000 of you.
We'll, we'll follow up with allof you cause we try to be helpful.
Uh, we'll, we'll do our best and we'll,we'll tell you if we need to reset that
expectation, but, Thank you much, Pete.
Appreciate you as always, man.
Wanted to kick off this episodewith a quick disclaimer.
We mentioned we're probably notgonna have the perfect audio and
video set up these first coupleepisodes, and you'll hear that a bit.
It was not nearly badenough to scrap the episode.
We think it's still a hundred percentlistenable, but there's a little bit of
drop off in the second mic, and you'llnotice that at a few different times.
(00:24):
That said, still felt like you get aton of value out of this, and we decided
to push forward and post it ratherthan going back to the drawing board.
We hope you'll understand.
Today's episode's all about acceleratingtrust, how vulnerability is a key
piece of it, and how intentionallyfocusing on building trust is.
Going to set a strong foundationfor all high performing teams.
(00:47):
We'll give you some actionable tips,some of our own experiences and
things that we've put into practiceand experience with our clients.
And there's a digital download forsomething called the five Bs of Trust
that you can get@cultureshock.comin the press and media section.
Or a link to it in the descriptionsanywhere that you're listening
to or watching this episode.
So if it's something you wanna be ableto refer back to so that that way you can
(01:09):
take some of these actions and form habitsaround them, or if it's something that
you just want to use as a conversationstarter with your team, I would encourage
you to go ahead and do that download.
Let us know if you have any feedback.
And as always, thank you fortuning into Into The Storm Leaders.
I hope that you'll subscribeand that you'll get some
real value out of this one.
(02:17):
Hey folks, this is Joe Jurec.
Pete Honsberger we're your hosts ofthe, into the storm leaders podcast.
We did the introduction episode that youmay or may not have already listened to.
But this is the first time we'regoing to get into one of the topics.
That we care very deeply about.
And we're excited about this one.
We definitely are.
We hope the first episode gave youa good overview of what we plan to
(02:38):
cover through the entire series.
As well as some tidbits into, you know,some of the things that we believe,
some of the books that we love,but today is really diving into one
specific topic and, you know, where'sthere a better place to start, Joe,
at least from what we do then trust.
It's funny how everything comes back to.
Trust.
(02:59):
And how it's not something that justhappens naturally as people think.
Right.
So I want to open it up a little bitin this episode and talk about some
of the things that have influenced us.
Some of the different principlesand exercises that we got.
Some of the things that you'vedeveloped, Pete, that we've worked with
clients on and how important it is tohave that into the store mindset of.
(03:21):
Intentionally charging into situationswhere it makes sense to build more trust.
Right.
Because it's not always just aboutthe time you've known somebody.
So.
I think there's a lot to unpack hereand we'll probably talk about this in.
Quite a few other episodes as well.
Definitely.
Yeah.
But in our programs that we havefor emerging leaders and executive
(03:43):
teams, While it hits on things likecommunication and accountability.
We always start with trust.
I want to talk about why absolutelymean we've talked before about.
You know, everything.
Everything that we do boils down toestablishing trust as a foundation.
(04:04):
And you know, when we get contactedby entire teams, when we work with.
Leadership teams or we work withthe mid manager, emerging leader
teams, even one-on-one relationships.
There's always an element ofbuilding trust with that because
from trust comes good communication,more likelihood of accountability.
Healthy conflict.
(04:25):
You know, conflict, like yousaid, the ability to, to.
You'll feel comfortable, delegatingto somebody to asking people for
help and offering help as wellas making sure that people are
comfortable asking questions, beingcalled out and everything in between.
All those things contribute topositive workplace environments.
And to be honest, Positivepersonal relationships as well.
(04:49):
And you know, it all comesback to this concept of trust.
And you said that.
You know, just a minute ago, Joe, that,you know, it's not about necessarily
knowing somebody for 20 years, , that youhave to wait that long to build trust.
You know, we think that, that you cannotfake it, but you can accelerate it.
And, and anything that we talk aboutand what we work with clients on.
And a lot of times specifically whywe're hired is to accelerate trust.
(05:13):
To try to speed up the process,you know, think about brand new
people coming onto your team.
Think about relationships thateither haven't existed, not that
they're negative, they just,people just don't know each other.
Don't work that, that closely together.
Think about department bydepartment, within companies.
There might not be anythingnegative necessarily.
It's just, they haven't takenthe time to purposefully.
(05:34):
Build trust.
And then you had the situationswhere trust has been eroded.
Trust has been brokentrust needs to be rebuilt.
So all those things are factors.
Within organizations and you know, whatwe found is to try to attack trust.
Head-on just like anythingelse and do it on purpose.
I think so often things are just surface.
(05:54):
Right.
And most organizations.
You might have some, some watercooler talk it's gotten even harder.
With definitely hybridand virtual workspace.
Like you need to beintentional or deliberate.
About building real trustwith people and it's simple.
But not always easy.
Like a lot of the thingsthat we talk about.
(06:15):
Right.
But.
It's something that we wantto give you some different
techniques, some approaches.
And hopefully give you a tool or twoas well, and a chance to use this
episode as kind of a clarity break.
For you to do some reflection orjust an honest self assessment
about the levels of trust.
In your team.
(06:36):
So at that way, you've got a planof attack, something that you
can do to strengthen the trust,because we're what we argue.
And many others that, you know, we kindof subscribed to argue is that with a
high trust environment, You're goingto get productive, healthy conflict.
That's a good thing without that,you're not going to get real commitment.
(07:00):
And therefore you're not goingto get the accountability.
That's 360.
It's going to be hierarchical.
It's going to just comefrom your leadership.
And we, we talk about that a lot.
Cause that's Patrick, Lencioni's fivedysfunctions of a team model, which I
already mentioned inspired us quite a bit.
Well, in our experience backs upto that healthy conflict is an
indicator of a high trust environment.
You don't just have to takeour word for it either though.
(07:22):
We looked at a number of studiesleading up to this podcast.
But not only that, I mean,we're looking at things like
that on a regular basis that.
Backup the claims that trust does lead toreally good things within organizations.
And, you know, I know you have some rightat the, at the top of your head, Joe.
But you know anything from, from workplaceproductivity to innovation, those things.
(07:42):
Those things tend to happen when you,you know, when you have a high level
of trust and we'll talk even moreabout, you know, how do you know if
you have a high level of trust versusa low level, but, you know, we can.
We can share a couple of facts rightnow with you, that, that are going
to further tell the story of, youknow, Why trust is so important.
It's not just a feeling that you have,you know, it's not just that we've seen
(08:02):
it work with a lot of our clients, but,you know, There have been hundreds and
thousands of people surveyed as well.
That that will tell that story as well.
Yeah, and I kind of want to argue a.
Almost contrarion point about trustin this episode as well, because.
Th there's a lot of.
A lot of things that I see with differentsocial media channels and even some
(08:26):
that I subscribed to and follow and.
Where it talks about beingguarded or don't share too much.
Don't put yourself out there.
That's not a how it's notpowerful or how you get ahead.
And I just disagree.
I think that vulnerability and humility.
Are things that, especiallyas you become more senior.
In your career.
(08:47):
Really differentiate you and yourorganization and changes the culture
entirely instead of it being this macho.
You know, kind of mentality aboutnot being too open and honest it's
like at least in my experience,those are some of the things that.
You know, led to the best relationships.
The best results are when my executiveswere very sharing of themselves
(09:09):
and they admit their mistakes and.
Kind of made room for othersto also make mistakes.
One of the stats in particularthat we were looking at prior
to this, there was this researchdone by Edelman intelligence.
And it said that.
In a high trust work environment.
79% of employees.
We're likely to.
(09:31):
Innovate more readily and toembrace creativity, to take
a chance by speaking up.
Versus only 40% or less.
If the organization had a low trustenvironment and that's because
people fear speaking truth topower, they don't want to look bad.
They don't want to sound dumb.
And when there's high trustpeople know like, Hey.
(09:53):
We're we're all in this together.
I don't always need to beright, but people take chances.
Right.
That's when innovation occurs and thatthat's more important now than ever.
Sure.
And it had this all,we're all in it together.
Mentality.
You know, there's pretty much nolimit of what you can achieve when
that happens, you know, versus the.
You know, the boss is the onlyone who has the right ideas.
I'm not asking for anyone's opinion.
(10:15):
Those types of things create, this issort of me versus you wedge, or it creates
the traditional hierarchical structurewhere you just need to listen to whoever's
above you in the chain of command andnot question them, not ask, you know, not
push back when you feel like you need to.
And so from, from that standpoint, youknow, some other indicators we've seen.
(10:35):
All the high trust environment orwhen people do ask a lot of questions
and when that's okay to do so.
When there tends to be a lot of chatterin meetings, if you notice meetings
being lively and people are either jokingwith each other or pushing back on each
other, or even calling each other out.
That tends to mean ahigh trust environment.
You know, even in the gaps betweenofficial meetings, segments.
(10:56):
You know what we noticed sometimeswhen we take breaks with clients,
if there's chatter and people arestopping at each other's desks.
When, you know, on the way to thebathroom and chatting about things,
if there's a little bit of you know,busts in each other's chops that tends
to indicate a high trust environment.
We also noticed that.
You know, from an innovationstandpoint, people are, are taking
these intellectual risks to bring upan idea that they might even think
(11:19):
is kind of crazy or off the wall.
But they're doing it anyway becausethey know that they're not going to get
punished for doing so, or they're notgoing to get laughed out of the room.
Somebody might in a good natured way.
Talk about how that's not going to work orthat's crazy, but then someone else might
take a shred of that idea and they mightturn it into something that's workable.
But the comfort level or the levelof okayness to bring that stuff
(11:41):
up, that indicates a high trustenvironment from, from our standpoint.
We've versus me.
There's not that self-serving.
Yeah.
Or even self preservation wherepeople are afraid to speak up
and say the wrong thing, right.
It's when you take a little bit more risk.
Or, or when you minimize the risk byhaving a higher trust environment, stuff
(12:03):
just flows and you, you get stuff done,you figure things out and you come up
with new ways of doing things, right.
Does.
And there's not, there's not that walkingon eggshells mentality, which we've
seen when there's tension in an officetension in a, in a home environment, you
know, people are walking on eggshells,afraid of not saying the wrong thing or
not saying the right thing, afraid ofsaying the wrong thing that can create.
(12:26):
You know, it can stifle anysort of creativity, innovation.
It can make it just not fun to besomewhere not interesting to be somewhere
in that goes back to what we talkedabout in the last episode about, you
know, I get to be at work versus Ihave to be at work or I get to go to
this particular place versus I haveto enforce to, I have no other choice.
So, you know, We've talkedabout some indicators.
(12:48):
Now we, I want to move us into basicallywhat we think you can do about trust.
How do you, how do youactually accelerate it?
You know, and we have something we'vecreated over the last few years.
That we call the five B's of trust.
So we think if you can be these thingson any given day, and you can encourage
your team to do that as well, especiallyif you're a leader and you had that
(13:10):
position of authority right now, whereyou can create this type of environment.
Your team is going toaccelerate trust consistently.
You're going to make new people feellike they're part of the team quicker.
You're going to make your current teammembers feel like they can bring up
issues, questions, ideas, concerns alot faster instead of sitting on that
information that that could either reallyhelp or really hurt the organization.
(13:31):
If they don't say it, or if they dosay it those are the types of things we
want to cover in our five B's of trust.
And we're hoping thatyou can take this away.
And, and and actually put something intoaction as a result of this conversation.
Or you can reach out to us afterthe fact and we'll continue
that conversation with you.
It's just a differentway of looking at it.
So yeah.
I want to break these down because it.
(13:53):
Even like I for a long time.
Looked at trust is something thateither happened or it didn't.
And.
If it didn't, I thought, well, maybe I'vejust, I've not had the opportunity yet.
I've not had enough time.
And it think from this, some ofthe actions you can take from
it, just being more mindful.
Right.
Be being aware that it'ssomething you gotta work at.
It doesn't always just come right.
(14:14):
Organically or naturally.
So Take us through a man.
Go through.
There's there's thoughts.
What's the first oneyou want to talk about.
First be of trust.
We have is very simple and it's Be aBuffalo and it's not necessarily the,
you know, identify every objectiveand opportunity charge into it in
this case, it's specific to trust.
So we believe if you want tohave a high trust environment, we
(14:37):
have to figure out what head-oninto that means and then charge.
And we need to be accountable to.
To those actions that we plan ontaking, but this shows up in a lot
of ways, both big scale and smallscale, you know, on a small scale.
You know, being a Buffalo towardtrust could be identifying one person
that you don't feel like you havethe type of working relationship
you should have with that person.
(14:59):
And then making it a point to talkingto that person, to either scheduling
official conversations with them,or just more in an informal way.
Taking it upon yourself to getto know them as human beings
instead of just as coworkers.
Not that you have to knoweverybody's deepest, darkest
secrets, or be best friends withyour coworkers, but identifying
(15:21):
that one person, in some cases, wecall it the high ROI relationship.
Yeah.
There would be a return onyour investment return on their
investment of time and energy.
If you spend some time togetherand get to know each other.
So that's the small scale on a largescale, you know, being a Buffalo would
just be throwing it out there to yourentire organization and saying, look,
I want to create a higher level oftrust within this entire organization.
(15:43):
Here are, you know, three to four thingsthat I plan on doing as the leader of
this organization over the next monthor the next quarter to make that happen.
Sometimes it's bringing inoutside speakers or facilitators.
Sometimes it's just gettingpeople together more frequently.
Sometimes it's you as theleader, setting that tone.
And having a vulnerability.
Like you talked about.
You know, to familiarizeyourself with them and to
(16:05):
humanize yourself a little bit.
And, and, you know, those are a couplethings that come to mind as far as
how do we be a Buffalo to trust?
What does that storm look likeand how do we charge into that?
What about just, I think for.
A lot of people, the storm couldjust be initiating that conversation.
So what about the one-on-one dialogue?
Like if you are thinking toyourself, These are the one,
(16:26):
two or three relationshipsthat are too important to wait.
Or too important not togive them some attention.
To increase that level of trust.
Like.
How do you start?
What would you ever encouragesomebody to say like, Hey.
I want to build more trust withyou or how would you go about that?
I think you have to find your ownlanguage to do that, but I think
(16:48):
it's, it's initiating a conversation.
However, it feels right to you.
And you're going to have toget a little bit uncomfortable.
That's what being a Buffalo is all about.
But it could be stopping by a coworker'sdesk and saying, Hey, you know, I want
to make sure that we're on the samepage about this project coming up.
You know, can we, can we spend sometime talking about it and then and then
through those conversations, Sprinklingin a little bit of information about
(17:11):
yourself outside of work and askinga little bit of, of information of
that person as well, so that youcan better relate to each other.
You know, that's just one example.
You know, if you're in a hybrid or aremote work environment, It might have
to be a little more formal than that.
You might have to send somebodya teams message or an instant
message and just say, Hey.
You know, would you, would you beopen to scheduling a half hour?
(17:33):
You know, on a teams meeting ora phone call sometime between
now and the end of the week.
And then if, you know, makesure that you have something
to talk to them about as well.
But then trying to encourage thatto happen on a somewhat regular
basis is an example of doing that.
I think you also can start if it'smore comfortable do it this way you
can start into in a meeting setting.
(17:53):
So you can sprinkle in at the beginning,middle or end of a meeting, a couple
of questions that have nothing to dowith work that just get people talking
potentially laughing as well as findingconnection points amongst one another.
You know, we ask a lot of questions like,Hey, just tell us about your first concert
that you ever attended in your life.
That doesn't take that long in a meetingsetting, you know, on the EOS process.
(18:17):
In their pulse meetings, they talkabout, you know, business best
and a personal best, something.
You're proud of something you'reexcited about from a personal and
business standpoint over the last weekor the last month in the last quarter.
So you can go that route aswell, but there's a number of
different questions you can ask.
They're not related to work, butdo give some insight into who
these people are as human beings.
And we feel like the more we knowabout each other as people, not just
(18:39):
as coworkers, the more likely I am togive somebody the benefit of the doubt,
if I expect them to be at their desk.
And I don't.
I don't see them at their deskrather than making an assumption.
I might say, oh, I knowthis about this person.
It's, you know, they have kidsthat have soccer after, after work.
So on Thursdays, they playtheir games and they're out of
the office a little bit early.
So therefore now I'm not gettingresentful of that person.
(19:02):
I can relate to them.
And I'm understanding sort ofwhat they're going through.
And I, and I'm more likely to, to givethem the benefit of the doubt or cut them
a break in some S some circumstances.
So that's, those are the thingsthat come to mind for me.
Any, anything to add on that, Joe?
I think it's.
It dovetails in with that meetingsetting where I guess just, you can
(19:24):
be a Buffalo when building trust byrealizing that everyone has this need.
And for some reason, we're all kindof wired to feel uncomfortable.
Telling people or addressing it openly.
That we want to get to know somebodymore, that we want to build a
better relationship with them.
It's I think we build it upin our heads to seem a lot
(19:45):
creepier than it actually is.
So being a Buffalo, you, you canbe that person for your group.
If you come to a meeting with a fewof those sorts of questions and you
even, you don't just launch into them,but you, you announce or express.
Hey, I want to start doingthis so that way we can.
Kick off our meetings in a different way.
(20:05):
So we can get to know some belowthe surface stuff about each other,
because in my assessment, we canget better at trusting each other.
We need to work on this as a group.
And, you know, come up with five or 10questions where you ask one or two of
them, each meeting something as simpleas, you know, How many siblings do you
have and where do you fall in that line?
(20:26):
What's, what's something hardthat you went through as a kid
that, that shaped you in some way.
There's a whole myriad of them andyou can find some, some more like,
well, we'll put them on our socialchannels and things like that as well.
And you can find them on culture,shock.com, but we'll do these energizers.
Where it's a two minute exerciseat the beginning of a meeting just
to get everybody loosened up and.
(20:48):
One of the ones you, youintroduced me to in particular.
Is this a commonalities Energizer?
Where, what does it, you have two minutes?
Yeah, two to three minutes fora group to figure out as many
things as they have in common.
Like everyone at the table has incommon with each other as possible.
And it gets ridiculous.
(21:08):
It's usually like, oh,we all have shoelaces.
And maybe we all have a sibling or,or brown hair or whatever, and that
is the surface stuff, but it justgoes to show that in two minutes,
when you're deliberate about buildingtrust, you can find out more.
About people.
And find more things thatyou have in common with them.
(21:28):
Then you typically would over 30 daysor even a year with all of the water
cooler, talk about weather and sports.
And I love sports.
I love talking about it, but to mixthat in with some real questions
where you show some genuine interestthing really goes a long way.
Well, that makes me think too, youknow, none of these things cost
(21:48):
any money to actively build trust.
You just have to, you have totake it upon yourself to make.
It happen.
And you know, some of what we'retalking about is related to some
of the other BS of trust as well.
You know, but on the on the surfacelevel versus getting below the surface
concept, you know, Joe and I have both.
Led in the last two monthsnow, something we call the zero
(22:09):
smalltalk happy hour as well.
And so if you want to be purposefulabout getting below that surface a
little bit you can do this and youcan label a certain number of topics
off limits, like the weather, like theweekend, like you know, what your job
is and then encourage other topics like.
Hopes and dreams and goals, things thatpeople are interested in outside of work.
(22:30):
And if nothing else, that builds familiarfamiliarity and, and connection points.
And it does require a littlebit of vulnerability because
you're opening yourself up.
So that other people can come walkinside your world a little bit and.
You know, there's hesitation fromsome, some people to start that.
But what we notice is if you can easepeople into those types of conversations
(22:52):
and say, look, I'm not asking you aboutevery secret you've ever you've ever told.
I don't need to see, youknow, embarrassing high school
photos of you necessarily.
You don't need to dance likea chicken in front of us.
But if you're willing to share a littlebit about yourself, you know, we're just
trying to get to know each other so thatwe can have a better working relationship.
And so that I can have better insight andsort of what your personality is like.
(23:13):
How you prefer to be communicatedwith, and, and those types of things.
Come to the surface, themore we we asked those.
You know, below surfacelevel conversations.
So that'd be a Buffalo.
Right.
figure out who those people areand don't wait for it to happen.
Charge into it, come up with aplan and do something with it.
(23:33):
That's where we start.
You can even tell them you wantto build more trust with them?
Yes.
As weird as of my feel, try it.
Probably not going to bethat, that weird or creepy.
We'll probably want to be, you know, Butyou want to be on the receiving end of
somebody saying that, look, I think weneed to have a good working relationship,
or I think we're going to work togetherquite a bit over the next few years.
We're going to do great things.
(23:54):
If we can get to knoweach other a little bit.
It's different.
You appreciate when there'ssomething that breaks routine.
Right.
And you're not in autopilot havingthat conversation with somebody.
If somebody says that to you,they clearly care enough.
To do something that felt alittle uncomfortable or odd.
And that's often where some ofthe best relationships come from.
Right.
(24:14):
And speaking of you never know whatyou're going to learn about somebody
until you ask that's number two , wecall it Be Interested Not Interesting.
And there's a simple distinction there,but being interested to us is focusing
more on questions and getting to knowother people, then having to be the most
interesting person in the room yourself.
(24:35):
You know, we find in a lot of one-on-oneconversations and even in some.
You know, broader workplace cultures.
If there's a culture of everyonetrying to sound like they're the
smartest person, like they'vegot the best ideas all the time.
They have the right answer.
Everyone's talkingprimarily about themselves.
There's not a lot of back and forth.
Yeah.
There's not a lot of true learningabout each other when that happens.
(24:56):
It's it's, you know, it's just, youknow, me trying to, to, to stand on
top of someone else and then tryingto stand on top of me, but the
flip side of that being interested.
Is, you know, what we find is thatit turns into some really good.
Mutual conversations where, you know,you don't just ask one question as
somebody, you might stack a secondor a third question to get a little
(25:17):
bit deeper into who they are.
Or even in what, you know, what theissue is within the organization.
What, you know, what the realmotivation is, not just what
somebody says the first time.
And so that's be interestedmore than your interesting.
If there's one.
Thing that you pull from this.
It stuck with me personally, bemore interested than interesting,
because I think it's againhard wired in so many of us.
(25:41):
Too.
Listen.
With the intent of respondinginstead of listening with
the intent of comprehending.
And usually when we do ask a question,When somebody is talking, we're thinking
about what we're going to say next.
So that being more interested insteadof interesting, kind of goes against.
(26:02):
A lot of what you see.
Nowadays I got, I'm constantlyseeing ads for this masterclass
on be the most interesting personin the room and command attention.
And, and look, I get it.
That there's some importancein having that confidence.
Where you can command a room and you'rea good storyteller don't get me wrong.
(26:23):
But that's not going to be the fastestor the most effective way of building.
High trust relationships or ahigh trust environment, right.
You have to show that genuine curiosity.
So.
Yeah, it's a paradox for me.
Is that the harder I try to beinteresting the less, I think
people want to talk to me.
But the more I focus on.
(26:44):
Other people and asking questionsto other people and digging
into what's going on with them.
The more they actuallythink that I'm interesting.
Right.
I've found that to be the case.
You know, I, we have you and I have anumber of stories or examples of this,
but, you know, I sat with a client atdinner a year ago and somebody who's,
you know, somewhat well-known around thearea, who's done some pretty big things
(27:05):
from a real estate development standpoint.
You know, I asked a couple questionslike, Hey, you know, are you working
on any interesting projects right now?
And 30 minutes later with a coupleadditional followup questions he had
given me all this really good insight intointeresting things that were happening.
And at the end of dinner, he said,it was really good talking to you.
Here's my card.
Let me know if you everneed anything right.
And I maybe said 15words, the entire dinner.
(27:28):
I just was interested in what he hadto say and, and found it, you know, he
found me to be a good conversationalist.
People want to share.
Yeah, and it, and it does.
It creates.
More opportunity for futureconversations and, you know, Like people.
You know, they tend to want to helpif they know that you're interested
(27:48):
in what's going on with them.
And then now they're looking foropportunities to connect you with
other people or other opportunities.
Just because you asked some goodquestions and tried not to focus so much
on yourself, because that is, I think,I think natural tendency for all of us,
myself included is, you know, you want toshare as much as you can about yourself.
And if you're selling somethingyou want to share about your
(28:08):
product, as much as you can.
But, you know, one thing Ron told me yearsago Ron Kaminski here at CultureShoc.
Was that.
You know, the depth of our relationshipsare really determined by the quality
of the questions that we ask andthe depth of the questions we ask.
And that's to me goesback to be interested.
Yeah.
You interested in.
Be vulnerable enough to, to share when.
(28:31):
When it comes up, but not so programmed.
That if you ask somebody how their weekendwas, when you see them on a Monday.
And they tell you, oh, I went toa baseball game with the kids.
Not just jumping into, oh, the lasttime I went to this ballpark, it was
like this, or I actually watched thegame, but I couldn't go this week.
As we so often respond with.
(28:52):
We're trying to one upthem in some way, too.
Right?
I went to three baseball games.
I think we do that.
We're trying to relate.
We're trying to be interesting, but alsofind that common ground when really.
It's more effective in myexperience at least to instead
say, oh, who'd you go with?
Was that the first gameyou went to this year?
Right?
(29:13):
Did ya, did you just do hotdogs or didyou try out any of the new ballpark food?
Before the game after the game.
How'd you get down there.
Like those types of things don't seemlike they're significant, but then
you start to understand the, the.
You know, a more full pictureof what someone's interested in.
It demonstrates that you give a shit.
When you're actuallyasking follow up questions.
(29:35):
And showing some positive bodylanguage and then asking additional
questions or banking that information.
It just, yeah.
Care enough to listen.
You care enough to ask.
And boom, the trust and your relationshipstarts to very quickly accelerate.
And I've had almost exact conversationssimilar to that, where you ask,
oh, what'd you do after the game?
Anything someone talks about goingto a restaurant that you've never
(29:58):
heard of that maybe is brand new.
And you're saying, I didn'teven know that existed.
I should, I should try that.
And then they say, well, actually, youknow, my brother-in-law or sister-in-law
are, is the manager of that restaurant.
They could get you in sometime,even though it's hard to get in.
And now you're.
You know, they're, they're trying to helpyou out because you show that you care
about what they have to say, and, and nowit's benefiting you because, you know,
(30:20):
Because just because you asked right.
So, yeah.
That's to us as be interested in,in, you know, we want to keep moving.
We're going to be on to, to be numberthree of the five B's of trust and,
and that to us as being intentional,and we've already hit on this in a few
different ways in the conversation, butbeing intentional around building trust
to us is not only having that Buffalomentality to charge into it, but it's
(30:44):
actually setting an objective or a goal.
Or, or a muscle that you want tomake sure you're growing on purpose.
Yeah.
When it comes to building trustso that it could be, you know,
I want to pick out one person.
And I want to build trust with themand I'm going to intentionally do that
by setting goals, you know, weeklyconversation or a monthly conversation.
I'm going to put on my calendarthat I'm going to check in
(31:05):
with this person in particular.
On a regular basis.
I'm glad you said the calendar.
Yeah, because I think that's so many ofus live and die by what's on our calendar.
True.
And if it's something that's importantto us, We calendar the time for it.
So that's something that I'vepersonally benefited from, and I've
seen a lot of other people as well, assimple as touch base with this human.
(31:27):
Right.
And maybe it's what you put on thecalendar is get them out of the office or,
or get them out of their typical workspacewhere you make a point once a quarter or.
W once a month, whateverfrequency works for you.
The more often, probably the better,but to do something a little different
to show them again, that you care whereit's not just picking up the phone,
(31:49):
or maybe it's going over to theirdesk and saying like, Hey, you want
to walk around the block really quick?
Or.
Maybe if all you do is emailand teams with somebody that you
actually do, pick up the phoneand talk to them for a moment.
Calendaring it.
So keep yourself honest and on track.
Like that's the intentional aspect, right?
You map out or set a plan.
(32:10):
Of what you want to do.
And then you give yourself away to follow through on it.
I'm writing down or capturingwhat those goals are.
Right.
We have some clients that, especially in,you know, campuses where there's multiple
buildings for your company, or we've seenthis in manufacturing plants where it's a
large square footage amount of plant wherethe leadership team member or the CEO.
(32:34):
Or the plant manager sets as an objectiveintentionally that they're going
to walk the floor every day betweenthese hours, or they're going to go
visit the other buildings on theircampus X number of times per week.
And that's a way to be intentionalabout making sure that you're not
missing opportunities for those,those little moments where you
can walk by somebody, ask them howthey're doing, ask about the family.
(32:56):
They might have something to tellyou or sometimes, you know, we're
not sending an email, you know,for every little thing that pops.
Into our mind, but if we wereto happen to walk by somebody.
I might say, oh yeah.
What about this?
You know, tell me about this projector this this, you know, new robot
robotics piece that you just got in.
How's it working?
And vice versa.
You being visible.
(33:17):
Not only when things go wrong as aleader, but when things are going
right, and just in general, that takes alittle bit of the intimidation edge off.
When people see the boss,quote, unquote, walking around.
If you're only walking aroundwhen things are going wrong.
You know, then everyone's going to bea little uptight when you're walking
around, but if you're doing it allthe time or on a regular basis,
people know they have access to you.
(33:38):
They're probably going to be more likelyto bring things up and say, Hey, I
got a quick question about this, or.
You know what I have an idea.
I think, you know, if we, if we shiftedthis line 90 degrees from where it's
at right now, it might make the flowof work, go a little bit better.
We can get this thing out thedoor a little bit quicker.
And so, you know, we've seen exampleslike that from a number of quiet
clients and it just takes beingintentional to build that trust.
(34:00):
Sometimes it's, it's even as simpleas intentionally being visible.
Right.
That's a huge factor is when there's that.
Accessibility.
Of a senior leader.
That.
Demonstration that, Hey, I want tobe available for open and honest
dialogue because quite frankly,there are so many blind spots.
(34:24):
That executives develop over the years.
And a lot of times it's with the bestintentions, but they just don't keep a
pulse of how people really feel what'sreally happening in the business.
And they think they've gota damn good idea of it, but.
They've not made a set of very clearexpectation that, Hey, I want you
to feel confident telling me things.
Without fear of repercussion.
(34:47):
And often just your presence.
Around your willingness to go asksome questions and, and to have
some human dialogue with somebody.
You'll be surprised how much you learn.
About like what's really happening.
Sure I can keep a better pulse onthe culture, then you know what to
fix and where to focus your efforts.
(35:07):
Well, and on that notetoo, you know, that.
Whenever we get involved in aconference or an association hires
us to facilitate some networking.
That that's just an opportunityfor people to build trust.
And it, it helps a lot in businessdevelopment standpoint, or if
you're looking for new vendors orsuppliers what we do is we encourage
people to set a goal or objective.
(35:28):
I want to, I want to meet five people.
I wanna meet 10 people throughoutthis two day conference, and
we'll encourage people to do that.
And we'll sometimes requireit slash facilitate it where
we'll say, all right, everybody.
At your tables right now.
I want you to take five minutes, gofind two people you've never met before.
Shake their hand, introduce yourselfand answer these two or three questions.
One question might be aboutwork, but two questions might not
(35:51):
have anything to do with work.
Now you've created a connectionand you've met people in that.
You know, at least builds alittle bit of familiarity.
So if you're interested in.
And networking or building trustintentionally when you're at a conference
or at a meeting setting or in any sortof somewhat awkward networking event.
Give yourself an objective and now,you know what you're working towards.
So you're not just aimlesslyfloating around, sticking with
(36:14):
the people that you know, thebest and not challenging yourself.
That's also part ofbeing intentional that.
We've helped a lot of clientswith, and I found value myself.
In setting a little bit of a goal,walking into a potential situation
like that, and then executing it.
Let me throw this your way though.
I don't have enough time for that.
Right.
It comes up all the time.
We're busy.
(36:35):
Sure that sounds nice.
It would be great if I could do that,but I just don't have the time to.
Put that stuff on mycalendar to walk around.
I need to get stuff done.
Like w what do you, what do you mean.
Yeah, that's a tough one.
I think.
Anyone can legitimatelytalk about being busy.
And I think most peoplethat we know are busy.
If we it's, it's almost like thatpaying yourself first concept.
(36:57):
If you're not carvingout a little bit of time.
To build trust with people.
It's, you know, it's going to.
It's going to hurt youa lot in the long run.
On the flip side of that, thepossibilities are so vast.
If you are intentionally spending10 minutes a day, even just
sending out a quick message to.
(37:18):
Just looking at your calendar and saying,Hey, it's this, this person's been
with the company for one year today.
Like, let me send them a quick message,just doing a five to 10 minute walk.
It's good for our health anyway,to get around and see everybody.
If you're at a conference ornetworking event, you're there anyway.
Like, and I say that to a lot ofclients, actually, if, you know,
if we get hired for a team buildingevent or something where I know some
(37:39):
people are going to be skeptical, youknow, do I really want to be here?
Do I really want to devote,you know, three hours in my day
for this outside person who.
I don't even know, I'll say rightup front, look, we're going to be
here for three hours anyway, let'smake it a great use of our time.
And so there is this element ofjust intentionally carving out time
that, you know, we can either makean excuse that we don't have time.
(38:02):
Or we could, we could use the time wisely.
I think that that's one ofthe biggest differences.
That I've seen in effective leaders wherethey've realized that's so important.
That.
They commit and find ways to make time.
That's a part of why they're busyis because that's so essential.
Right.
And if you see the value, if youunderstand the why and the benefit of it.
(38:26):
Then you don't see it assomething you need to do.
It's something you get to do andsomething you want to do, like leadership.
Is a service.
To others.
And I think so often.
People take managerial jobs because it's.
Better for their livelihood and wellbeing.
It's more money.
Without necessarily thinking about allthe responsibilities that come with it.
(38:49):
And we'll talk a lot more about that whenit comes to accountability, conversations
and stuff, but even this sort ofthings like how you spend your time.
You've got to commit someof it to your people.
And I think one of the biggest, likethe, the way that you've demonstrated
or, or share the value you see from it islike the concept of the speed of trust.
I don't want to deviate too much fromthe five BS here, but I think that
(39:11):
kind of fits with be intentional.
You talk a little bitabout that real quick.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
And we, we don't want to rush toomuch through the last couple of
B's of trust, but we're going tospeed it up a little bit for you.
When it comes to the speed of trust,you know, it's a book by Stephen, Mr.
Covey, and you know, somethingthat, that we believe a lot in it.
To me.
It's a simple concept where.
(39:31):
You know, if we have ahigh trust environment.
Things tend to happen fasterand they cost less money.
And when we have a low trust environment,things happen slower and they cost more
money because there's more micro-managing.
There's less peoplebringing things up quickly.
More people sort of play in thebehind the scenes politics game
where I don't know if I say thisas it gonna bother somebody else.
(39:53):
So maybe I'll, I won't say it yet,but then I'll tell somebody in the
back channel, so on and so forth.
So it's high trustenvironments can speed up.
Speed up things to happen.
Speed up innovation you'llend up saving money.
Whereas low trust environments,the opposite happens.
It pays you over and over and over again.
Right.
I heard you say high trust isthe dividend low trust the tax.
(40:14):
Absolutely.
I, I definitely took that.
Recommend that book as well.
The speed of trust.
Which brings us to the fourth, beof trust, and that is be helpful.
And this one is not rocket science.
None of these are, butwe've developed this after.
Just understanding through ourown careers and client experience
that anybody can be helpful toanybody else within an organization.
(40:35):
Anybody can be helpful to any customeror client or supplier you have.
We just have to think about how can webe helpful or how can we be more helpful.
So I kind of think about it in three.
You know, can I be helpful inthree different directions,
one to my customers or clients?
How can I be more helpful thanI already am being rude to them?
And there's a number of different waysyou can do that, but it builds trust too.
(40:58):
To show people, not just say it, but showit that you truly want to be helpful.
Number two is how can I be helpful topeople that are not necessarily clients,
but their vendors, their partners.
They're the people that aredoing construction on your
office, they're your it partners.
How can I be more helpful to themwhich will build trust with them
and they'll want to reciprocate.
Deprecation as well.
(41:18):
And then number three is howcan I be more helpful to myself,
to my own personal development?
You know, reading books, maintaining,you know, physical and mental wellness
you know, pursuing development, pursuing.
Training that's similar to thingslike CultureShoc offers, you know,
can you be more helpful to yourself?
To better trust yourself, to better,you know, build your confidence.
(41:38):
Build your own skillset.
And so if we can focus on any of thosethree areas or hopefully all of them,
you know, we believe that whetheryou're an intern who just started
yesterday, we think you can be helpfulto anybody within the organization or
whether you're, you know, a 30 yearemployee, a CEO or anything in between.
You know, I want to focus on howcan I be as helpful as possible.
(41:58):
And we can be intentional aboutthat by picking out one way or two
ways that I can be more helpful.
To my coworkers, to my clients andcustomers or to myself if I can
do that, then I'm going to get.
I'm in good shape.
I think this is the one that probablyaligns most closely with what a lot of
people think of when they think of trust.
And it's the integrity piece, right.
(42:20):
That doing what yousay you're going to do.
That's what's helpful to peopleis if you commit to something that
they know they can count on, you.
I always find it important that when wetalk about this one, we talk about the
flip side, because of course there's.
You know, it can betaken in an extreme way.
And you mentioned behelpful to yourself as well.
(42:43):
Like setting boundaries.
Knowing when to say no.
I think that needs to be coupledwith this because otherwise.
You you're trying to be helpfulto everybody and you burn out
and then you aren't helpfulbecause you can't follow through.
On the commitments that you made.
So that's a great point.
Right.
Something that has helped me.
(43:04):
And I think I shared thiswith you a while back.
On my desk.
At home or right behind it, Ihave something written down to the
effect of what, one extra thing.
Can I do to be unique and memorable.
So when every interaction that I'm having.
I think.
Before I hit send, before I pick up thephone, before I go meet with somebody.
(43:25):
What one little unexpected thingcan I do to be more helpful?
That is going to catch somebody off.
The guard that they'renot going to expect.
That does stick with them.
A little bit, and I thinkthat's something that.
And even as simple as that, Isa way that you can intentionally
build trust by being more helpful.
I think about what, one little extrathing that's not going to derail.
(43:50):
My life and all it's that I have.
We're going to be in a holistic expert.
But the
Yeah.
If we over commit, are youreally helping somebody?
Right.
You know, if I, if I say to somebody,Hey, I'll hold you accountable
to this, but I never follow up.
I'm, I'm not even really being helpful.
So you bring up a good point and Istruggle with this from time to time cuz
I wanna help as many people as I can.
Uh, just about every keynote orconference speech that I do, I'll put
(44:13):
my email address on the last slide andsay, look, if anyone wants to follow
up, if anyone wants me to help you.
Beyond today.
Feel free to email me.
You know, and the reality is if there's300 people in the room and all 300 of
them email me, I might be in trouble.
You're probably gonna, yeah, I knowyou though, you're, you're gonna
follow up with all of the 300 peopleand put yourself out in that way.
But, but, but you're, you wannahelp, you are rolling the dice a
(44:36):
little bit with something like that.
Now that, that typically doesn't happen,I might get one or two or five people
that reach out and, you know, wanna,wanna have a quick chat after that.
But in, there's a part of me thatthinks that would be a great problem
to have because then that would beokay, a lot of new business, um,
now we can scale up and continue toscale our operation accordingly, but
the setting of boundaries and beingrealistic with people and letting
(44:58):
them know that, look, I can help you.
I just might not be ableto help you right now.
Like there's some power in that as well.
Yeah.
So the open and honestaspect is big, right?
Yeah.
And I know we'll talk more about thatafter the five Bs, but it's just.
Coupling that be helpfulwith Be realistic.
Yep.
Of what you can actuallyhelp with cuz Sure.
Again, I think it's very unhelpful ifyou express wanting to, and then you
(45:20):
can't follow through on that and deliver.
Right, right.
All right.
Take us home, which I'm sure, yeah, I'msure both of us have made that mistake
before and then not followed throughbecause things just got too busy.
But I do notice that with.
Um, some people that you know, thatI, I talk with or you meet somebody
at a conference and they say, ohyeah, yeah, I'll follow up with you.
I'll send you an email sometime, andthen you just never get that email.
(45:42):
That erodes trust a little bit.
So we wanna make sure that wemaintain that building of trust,
uh, keep it at a high level, whichbrings us to, you know, well so far.
All right, we've got the ideaabove be of self-awareness.
If, if you're not doing whatyou say you're gonna do,
we've hit on Be a Buffalo.
We had be interested, be intentional.
Be helpful.
And the fifth one you said isbe self-aware and self-awareness
(46:05):
shows up in a couple ways froma trust building standpoint.
Number one is, Am I aware of,of whether or not I'm following
the other four Bs of trust?
So can I have that awareness toactually ask people for feedback?
Can I ask people if I'm doing thingsthat, that are bothering them?
If there are, if there are things that Icould be doing better for my teammates,
(46:25):
uh, for my customers or clients.
Um, it also shows up in, you know,do I, do I seek out, you know, The
reduction of my own blind spots.
Do I, am I self aware enough?
Am I opening myself up to otherpeople and being vulnerable?
Um, do I essentially, do I look toother people the way that I think I do?
(46:46):
You know, am I perceived the wayI wanna be perceived or the way
I think that I'm being perceived?
Um, cuz one of the things that buildstrucks quickly is when you can line
up how you wanna be perceived withhow you actually are perceived.
Um, and one of the things thathurts trust significantly is if you
think you're one way, but you're,you're truly a different way.
Um, and, and you'reoblivious to that fact.
(47:08):
And we've worked with someclients that, that fits that bill.
Yeah.
Um, and so, you know, if we can work onbeing self-aware that we're executing
on all four of the other bees of trust,but then also, you know, think about
from, from, you know, my own standpoint.
Like auditing myself.
Am I really, you know, if I want to befriendly, am I coming off as friendly?
(47:29):
And if I'm, if I wanna be interested, amI coming off as interested or am I all
just talking about myself all the time?
So that's the last B of trust for us.
That sort of brings it all home fromthat standpoint and, and obviously
today we're just scratching the surface.
Of what these are.
We've got a number of other examplesand client examples that we'd love to
talk about in more detail after this.
But, you know, I'm curious on yourthoughts, Joe, before we wrap it up.
(47:52):
Yeah, co a couple things there just tohelp make that one actionable for people.
Cuz self-awareness, everyone feelslike they're pretty self-aware, right?
And then every once in a while youget kicked in the, kicked in the
stomach and you're like, holy shit.
I had no idea.
I thought I was really good at that.
And this was where, uh, I, I thinkI mentioned in the introductory
episode, I, I'd worked.
With Liz Weissman at, at a conference,and she has this concept called
(48:15):
multipliers, where there's all of thesethings that w we perceive as strengths,
that have unintended consequences andaccidentally diminish the intelligence
and capability of those that we leadand those that we are surrounded by.
And it, it's so important thatwe're doing something that we
(48:38):
have some sort of habit of.
Doing a gut check of an honest selfassessment to say, are we perceived
the way that we really think we are?
And you, you probably aren'tgonna like the answer.
You're it, it's not gonna becomfortable, it's not gonna be fun.
But it's how you grow.
It's how you learn.
You've gotta ask and makesure people know it's okay to
(49:00):
deliver that kind of feedback.
Uh, it, it's, I think peopleare actually more comfortable.
Delivering that feedback to others.
Then setting the tone of, Hey, I wantyou to critique me in that way as well.
And what I would ask you is when you thinkof your peak leader, like in, in your
(49:22):
lifetime or your career, the person who.
You emulate most because they,they made such an impression
or had such influence on who?
Sure.
We alluded you are weed this alittle bit in the last episode too.
So think of that person andthe characteristics that that
make them your peak leader.
And then ask yourself, are youthat peak leader for somebody else?
(49:45):
Right?
And are you emulatingthose characteristics?
Are you emulating those characteristics?
Do you think somebody else if askedthat same question, would name you?
Yeah.
And what do you need to model?
What do you need to do, uh, to tobe that person if you're not today?
And then having this kind of dialogue,having these conversations and uh, having
people do some honest ratings is somethingwe've found can be really uncomfortable.
(50:14):
And we've leveraged for almost conflictmining when we realize there's.
A low trust environment orartificial harmony with a bunch
of resentment under the surface.
We'll pull different ways to saylike, all right, let's do a rating
on the level of trust in this room.
And this is something we talkedabout before this episode actually
(50:35):
encouraging, uh, to kind ofround things out here, right?
When you're thinking about the fiveBs of trust, when you're thinking
about trust in your own atmosphere,use this as a clarity break.
Think to yourself honestly for amoment, And one to 10, how would you
rate the level of trust in your team?
(50:56):
Yeah, that's a good place to startand, and there's hopefully a number
of actionable things that, thatcame out of this podcast for you.
Feel free to reach out to eitherJoe or myself after the fact here.
Feel free to reach out to both of usafter the fact or, or either of us if
you'd like some more actionable ideas.
But, you know, we hope you likethe, the five Bs of trust today.
Again, this is just the beginningof not only this podcast, but of the
(51:20):
depth of trust that that's out there.
Uh, and again, we'd recommend thefive Dysfunctions of a team book.
We'd recommend the, the speed of trust.
And uh, it's been a pleasure justhaving this conversation with you,
Joe, and just talking trust cuzit is one of our favorite topics.
Yeah, I have a feeling we're gonnabe talking about this one again.
Uh, pretty soon we do a workshopcalled Establish Authentic Trust.
(51:42):
That's a part of ourinto the Storm Leaders.
Uh, development program.
So there, there is a lot more on this one.
And it's the foundation, right?
Uh, it's, I, I can tell youthat I have some relationships.
Pete is a great example where we've knowneach other for a little bit over a year.
Yep.
I have much more open, honestdialogue and trust with you than
(52:06):
some people I'm friends with andhave known for five or 10 years.
That are just much moresurface level and Right.
I really do think it's about the numberof vulnerable moments you've shared with
that person and the willingness to havesome uncomfortable conversation, uh, to be
communicative, right, and to, to kinda layout a plan and, and apply those five Bs.
(52:27):
So hopefully that helps.
Look forward to continuingthe conversation on this one.
Hopefully you got somethingoutta this episode.
As always, you can, uh,subscribe to, we'd love if you
subscribe to the podcast itself.
You can also follow and check out someother, uh, content that we put out
there on YouTube, on TikTok, Instagram.
Connect with us on LinkedIn.
Uh,
reach out and have a conversation.
(52:49):
All 300 of you or 3000 of you.
We'll, we'll follow up with allof you cause we try to be helpful.
Uh, we'll, we'll do our best and we'll,we'll tell you if we need to reset that
expectation, but, Thank you much, Pete.
Appreciate you as always, man.
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