046. Busting Common Grief Myths with Shea Wingate, Part 1

Let’s bust some common grief myths today, my friend! We’re chatting with Shay Wingate. She’s a Licensed Therapist and Grief Coach, and a fellow griever just like me (and probably you!). She has actually graced the podcast in the past, and I’m super excited to have her back for this little series that we're doing on grief myths we constantly hear about as Grief Educators, and grievers ourselves. We wanted to make these episodes as bite-sized for you as possible, so this little series is going to be split into three parts. Today is part one of three—stay tuned for more coming soon! Shea created this awesome Grief Myths Mini Series (details are linked below!), but with that in mind, we thought this would be an awesome opportunity to come together and dispel some of these. We’re having like a fun, light-hearted, high level conversation and covering these myths today:

• Everything happens for a reason
• Time heals all wounds
• There are 5 stages of grief
• Your loved one wouldn't want you to be sad

These myths are things that can really get us stuck in our grief, so I think it's really worth talking about! Let’s dig in…

Connect with Shea: Grief Myths Mini-Series: https://www.thegriefgirlie.com/grief-myths Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thegriefgirlie Work with me: Explore my Intentional Life After Loss membership: https://lossesbecomegains.com/membership Work with me one-on-one: https://lossesbecomegains.com/work-with-tara Connect with me further: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lifewithgriefpodcast/ Website: https://lossesbecomegains.com/ Shop the LBG Daily Journal: https://lossesbecomegains.com/journal By accessing this Podcast, I acknowledge that the entire contents are the property of Tara Accardo, or used by Tara Accardo with permission. Except as otherwise provided herein, users of this Podcast may save and use information contained in the Podcast only for personal or other non-commercial, educational purposes. No other use, including—without limitation—reproduction, retransmission or editing of this Podcast may be made without the prior written permission of Tara Accardo, which may be requested by contacting [e-mail]. This podcast is for educational purposes only. This podcast is not intended to be a substitute for any necessary therapy or counseling to address deeper, past-focused traumas. We don’t attempt to give answers, fix, diagnose, or treat grief. The host claims no responsibility to any person or entity for any liability, loss, or damage caused or alleged to be caused directly or indirectly as a result of the use, application, or interpretation of the information presented herein.

Episode Transcript

(00:01):
This is the life with grief podcast.
The podcast that talks about and normalizes the complexities of grief life after loss and all this entails and so much more.
I want you to think of this podcast as a safe space, where I'm a friendly face, and we're just journeying through this together to figure out how to live life with our grief in tow.

(00:22):
I'm your host, Tara Acardo.
I'm a grief and transformational life coach, and I'm here to serve you.
Guidance, support, tangible coping tools, inspiration, and some laughs along the way to help you cultivate a more meaningful, intentional, and beautiful life.
But grieving or not, we're getting into countless topics here on the podcast from coping with loss to self-development and so much more.

(00:46):
I'm so grateful.
You're here.
Let's dive right in.
Hey guys, before we get into it, I just wanted to pop in and introduce today's guest.
We are chatting with Shay Wingate, who is a licensed therapist and grief coach and a fellow griever just like me and probably you.
And she has actually graced the podcast before.
And I am super excited to have her back for this little series that we're doing here.

(01:10):
So she created this awesome grief, myths mini series.
All of the details are linked in the show description, and we are going to talk all about it in this episode today, but we thought this would be an awesome opportunity to come together and just dispel some of these and just have like a fun.
Lightening round high level conversation about each one of these.

(01:31):
So we wanted to make these as sort of bite sized for you as possible.
So this little series is going to be split into three parts.
So this is part one of three.
And I really hope you enjoy it.
We had a lot of fun with this one and these myths are seriously, no joke, but they are some of the things that can really get us kind of stuck in our grief.

(01:53):
So I think it's really worth talking about today.
I am super excited to get into it.
So without further ado, let's do it. 26 00:02:00,476.66666667 --> 00:02:02,636.66666667 Shay, welcome back to the podcast. 27 00:02:02,666.66566667 --> 00:02:13,261.66666667 I am really happy to have you back on and to dig into these topics with you today, because we're I feel like these can never be talked about enough and we are long overdue to address this here on the podcast. 28 00:02:13,261.66666667 --> 00:02:14,861.66666667 So I want to get right into it. 29 00:02:14,861.66666667 --> 00:02:22,541.66566667 And I'm really happy that we're having this be more conversational today, as opposed to me just kind of like going off on these topics by myself. 30 00:02:22,551.66566667 --> 00:02:30,791.66716667 So and I'm just really excited to have your kind of like knowledge and expertise, not only with what you do for a living, but like your own experience as a griever. 31 00:02:30,791.66716667 --> 00:02:33,21.66716667 So I think it's going to be an awesome conversation. 32 00:02:33,461.66716667 --> 00:02:33,991.66716667 But. 33 00:02:34,381.66716667 --> 00:02:56,201.66716667 As I mentioned in the intro, you have created something really amazing and really valuable pertaining to the topics that we're going to be getting into today and in this series, so do you maybe want to just touch on that first a little bit before we even start and then we can get into it? Yeah, I am so excited to be here, to be back, to be talking about this grief myth mini series. 34 00:02:56,451.66716667 --> 00:03:09,551.66716667 The reason I created it is because personally I had so many grief myths and professionally I see these in my clients all the time and if you had asked me before I experienced grief Like, do you have any grief myths? I would be like, no, no way. 35 00:03:09,551.66716667 --> 00:03:14,411.66716667 I know exactly what grief is like, especially since I'm a therapist and I had studied grief. 36 00:03:14,691.66716667 --> 00:03:19,931.66716667 And I really thought I like understood, but they're so sneaky and they really trip us up. 37 00:03:20,231.66716667 --> 00:03:25,971.66716667 And that's why I created this mini series because I wanted people to be able to kind of spot them in their own lives. 38 00:03:26,331.66716667 --> 00:03:28,421.56716667 And also it's a great tool to help us. 39 00:03:28,421.76716667 --> 00:03:31,798.03989394 And I'm going to talk a little bit about grief literacy and how it can help us be more educated about grief and our grief literacy. 40 00:03:31,798.03989394 --> 00:03:34,48.03989394 So it's 13 modules within each module. 41 00:03:34,258.03989394 --> 00:03:38,258.03989394 I have a video for me, a journal prompt, and some really practical self care activities. 42 00:03:38,548.03989394 --> 00:03:39,668.03889394 This is self paced. 43 00:03:39,728.03989394 --> 00:03:40,998.03889394 It's only 30. 44 00:03:40,998.03889394 --> 00:03:43,108.03889394 You can go back to it as many times as you want. 45 00:03:43,328.03889394 --> 00:03:44,948.03889394 It's a paid page on my website. 46 00:03:44,948.03989394 --> 00:03:46,408.03989394 So you don't need a special app. 47 00:03:46,428.03989394 --> 00:03:54,388.03889394 I just wanted to make it so easy for people to access some really good information and to have some tools that they can use in their life. 48 00:03:54,388.03989394 --> 00:03:57,458.03989394 So, you know, we're going to talk about the different myths that I cover throughout. 49 00:03:57,838.03989394 --> 00:04:00,548.03989394 Our time on this episode and then some future ones. 50 00:04:00,548.03989394 --> 00:04:05,638.03989394 So people can get a sense of some of the things that I see all the time coming up for graver. 51 00:04:06,823.03989394 --> 00:04:08,113.03989394 Yeah, amazing. 52 00:04:08,113.03989394 --> 00:04:30,793.03989394 I seriously, like, I just as a griever myself and like someone in this space, I'm so grateful that you've made it like so easily accessible because like it's crazy how some of, you know, these grief myths are things that we hear, but then sometimes like when they happen in our lives, we like, they can really trip us up and they can, like you said, and make us feel like we're kind of doing things wrong or like, it just makes our grieving journey so much harder. 53 00:04:30,843.03989394 --> 00:04:33,773.03989394 And so I think it's worth, it's worth talking about for sure. 54 00:04:34,213.03989394 --> 00:04:34,543.03989394 Awesome. 55 00:04:34,613.03989394 --> 00:04:34,993.03989394 Okay. 56 00:04:35,33.03989394 --> 00:04:36,233.03989394 Well, let's get right into it. 57 00:04:36,243.03989394 --> 00:04:38,563.03989394 So I love this first one. 58 00:04:38,603.03989394 --> 00:04:39,323.03989394 I love it. 59 00:04:39,333.03989394 --> 00:04:39,743.03989394 I hate it. 60 00:04:40,43.03989394 --> 00:04:44,123.03989394 But first grief myth, everything happens for a reason. 61 00:04:44,753.03889394 --> 00:04:48,943.03889394 I have a love hate relationship with this sentiment, but I want to hear your thoughts. 62 00:04:49,663.03889394 --> 00:04:49,883.03889394 Yeah. 63 00:04:49,883.03989394 --> 00:04:51,223.03889394 I had to tackle this one. 64 00:04:51,223.03889394 --> 00:04:51,973.03989394 Oh my gosh. 65 00:04:51,983.03889394 --> 00:04:54,313.03889394 Like we hear this one all the time. 66 00:04:54,743.03889394 --> 00:04:57,723.03889394 It's so interesting because grief myths can be external or internal. 67 00:04:57,763.03889394 --> 00:04:59,103.03889394 So we have to be careful about that. 68 00:05:00,143.03989394 --> 00:05:30,613.03989394 I mean, if someone was saying to me, everything happens for a reason, I would be immediately able to like spot that, but like what I wasn't able to spot sometimes was my own internal version of everything happens for a reason, which is like, I need to find a way to figure out how to like, use this experience, which of course, like, I have grown from the experience, I am changed from the experience, but it wasn't Some like karma or some like lesson I had to learn in life. 69 00:05:30,613.03989394 --> 00:05:35,193.03989394 It was something that horrible that happened and suffering is a real part of life. 70 00:05:35,193.03989394 --> 00:05:49,308.04089394 And if, if we think everything happens for a reason, sometimes we can be you know, Like, pushing down, like, the pain that we need to feel during grief, and, and really it's, it's not necessarily true that it happens for a reason. 71 00:05:49,308.04089394 --> 00:05:59,648.04089394 Yes, I can make meaning from my loss, I can grow from my loss, but it's not some sort of, like, punishment for me and it's not something I need to, like, dose with toxic positivity. 72 00:06:00,163.04089394 --> 00:06:02,193.04089394 Yeah, beautifully said. 73 00:06:02,253.04089394 --> 00:06:30,313.04089394 Yeah, I think, I think that, yeah, the toxic positivity is an important thing to bring up because, yeah, it just, I feel like it just sort of invalidates things that we're feeling like you've alluded to, and it's so funny, I used to be that girl, that everything happens for a reason girl, and I, and in a way, there's like, parts of me that do believe that, or like, you know, like, There's kind of no coincidences in life, but I have such like a weird on off relationship with it. 74 00:06:30,313.04089394 --> 00:06:35,383.04089394 I think now more after my parents died, like you might be able to relate to this. 75 00:06:35,383.04089394 --> 00:06:45,743.04089394 Like, you know, there's some people that believe that everything happens for a reason, you know, gung ho, and then something super profoundly Tragic happens and you question all of that. 76 00:06:45,743.04089394 --> 00:06:48,733.04089394 It's like, you know, your whole belief system can be questioned sometimes. 77 00:06:48,733.04089394 --> 00:07:02,933.04089394 So this was like a big, a big one for me, like, especially I feel like in the beginning, but I think like really where we could almost like, I'm not gonna say leave this one, but like, I think the biggest like takeaway that I've also personally taken away is what you said. 78 00:07:02,933.04089394 --> 00:07:07,3.04089394 Like, it's not that our parents died for a reason. 79 00:07:07,23.04089394 --> 00:07:11,563.04089394 It's not that we have these losses because this was like, you said, like some karmic. 80 00:07:12,328.04089394 --> 00:07:16,98.04089394 Journey or whatever, although some people could argue that that's the thing and that's a whole nother conversation. 81 00:07:16,128.04089394 --> 00:07:23,618.04089394 But but yeah, it's like I, I don't know that touches me because that's really the premise of losses become gains too. 82 00:07:23,618.04089394 --> 00:07:29,948.04089394 It's just like, it's not that our losses had to happen for a reason, but it's like, okay, but they did happen. 83 00:07:30,178.04089394 --> 00:07:31,462.94089394 So what do you then. 84 00:07:31,863.04089394 --> 00:07:32,493.04089394 Make of it. 85 00:07:32,493.04089394 --> 00:07:34,543.04089394 And that is entirely up to you. 86 00:07:34,543.04089394 --> 00:07:36,733.04089394 And sometimes that can be intimidating and really scary. 87 00:07:37,73.04089394 --> 00:07:44,363.04089394 Or we feel a lot of pressure to like, you know, do something big or not even big, just like, you know, make something of it. 88 00:07:44,463.03989394 --> 00:07:52,13.03989394 But it can also just be the ways in which that we care for ourselves or others or whatever growth or learnings or whatever that come out of it. 89 00:07:52,13.03989394 --> 00:07:53,723.03989394 And it's not something we need to put pressure on. 90 00:07:53,723.03989394 --> 00:07:55,593.03989394 It's just like, wow. 91 00:07:55,613.03989394 --> 00:07:55,963.03989394 Okay. 92 00:07:55,993.03989394 --> 00:07:57,493.03989394 Like this happened. 93 00:07:57,998.03989394 --> 00:08:15,908.03989394 This sucked, but my, my life doesn't have to, you know, end here, so to speak, like, not literally, but just like, you know because, you know, I just, I don't know, you probably see this too, like, I see comments all the time on social media, like, I'm sure people do that you, you know, You know, maybe work with say this too. 94 00:08:15,908.03989394 --> 00:08:24,368.03989394 There's like, I just don't, I feel like my life isn't the same or like, you know, whether or not they mean it, they're like, I don't feel like my life is worth living. 95 00:08:24,368.03989394 --> 00:08:25,478.03939394 Like it's lost all meaning. 96 00:08:25,478.03939394 --> 00:08:26,288.03989394 It's lost all value. 97 00:08:26,288.03989394 --> 00:08:28,798.03889394 Like, and people can really spiral with this. 98 00:08:28,808.03889394 --> 00:08:32,198.03889394 So you know, it's just those baby steps every single day. 99 00:08:32,208.03889394 --> 00:08:47,533.03889394 It's not like, you know, think that there was a reason for something, but just, You know, how, how can we, I don't know, move forward with it as a part of us and something that we can, you know, redirect our energy. 100 00:08:48,618.03889394 --> 00:08:50,128.03889394 Good, I guess, for lack of a better term. 101 00:08:51,358.03889394 --> 00:09:09,948.03889394 I think one of my big things with this one is like, if I need to believe that everything happens for a reason, then I can't do that kind of questioning that you were mentioning, like that you would want to like question things and like dive deep and, and that's, I don't want people to not be able to do that because that's such an important experience and getting to know their grief. 102 00:09:10,178.03889394 --> 00:09:18,468.13889394 But if I think it has to be for this like positive reason, then I can't like Look at some of these like painful sides of the grief and it really like limits me. 103 00:09:18,758.13889394 --> 00:09:25,518.13889394 So not that we can't make meaning or we can't be like, you know, gains from this loss, like your whole premise. 104 00:09:25,528.13889394 --> 00:09:36,618.13889394 But like, I need to maybe put that belief aside for a moment and allow myself to look at this and to not be afraid to do that. 105 00:09:36,618.13889394 --> 00:09:41,748.13889394 And if you're afraid to like kind of look at the, the You know, dark side of grief and feels overwhelming. 106 00:09:42,378.13889394 --> 00:09:46,448.13889394 Totally understandable, but like, let somebody help you and guide you in doing that. 107 00:09:46,468.13889394 --> 00:09:52,933.13889394 So, I think, And that's sort of my concern about this myth is that it stunts the process a little bit. 108 00:09:53,653.13889394 --> 00:09:55,373.13889394 That's such a great point. 109 00:09:55,393.13889394 --> 00:10:00,943.13789394 Like I had thought of it that way, I guess, but like to, to really frame it in that way is such a good point. 110 00:10:00,983.13889394 --> 00:10:09,713.13889394 And I, yeah, I know people struggle with, with facing that head on or whether it's head on or just at all and whatever capacity they can. 111 00:10:10,63.13889394 --> 00:10:16,583.13889394 But it is something that we, like, inevitably have to warm up to, because it's gonna kind of hunt us down one way or the other. 112 00:10:16,643.13889394 --> 00:10:22,543.13789394 And there's, like, a lot to learn there, in those really, you know, hard places. 113 00:10:22,543.13889394 --> 00:10:25,923.13889394 And you don't have to go alone, and in fact, nobody expects you to go alone. 114 00:10:25,923.13889394 --> 00:10:29,63.13889394 So, if you're afraid to go to that place, like, I get it, I was too. 115 00:10:29,73.13889394 --> 00:10:31,533.13889394 But, like, let people support you and guide you. 116 00:10:31,998.13889394 --> 00:10:32,348.13889394 Yeah. 117 00:10:32,728.13889394 --> 00:10:33,128.13889394 Yeah. 118 00:10:33,288.13889394 --> 00:10:34,18.13889394 Well said. 119 00:10:34,68.13889394 --> 00:10:34,548.13889394 Oh my gosh. 120 00:10:34,568.13889394 --> 00:10:35,638.13889394 I love this point. 121 00:10:35,868.13889394 --> 00:10:40,368.13889394 And by the way, I should preface, I should have prefaced this episode with all of these things we're talking about today. 122 00:10:40,698.13889394 --> 00:10:57,691.68007041 Obviously we could get into much bigger conversations about each one of these but because this is sort of a quicker round shorty episode today, we're going to touch on these high level, but again and I think that's where you can really get more into the nitty gritty with this and like further on how to cope and all those good things. 123 00:10:57,701.68007041 --> 00:11:00,881.68007041 So I just want to, yeah, grief is so unique. 124 00:11:00,891.68007041 --> 00:11:07,611.67907041 So yeah, like losing on these very high level, but yeah, it's still good to talk about. 125 00:11:08,191.68007041 --> 00:11:08,611.67907041 All right. 126 00:11:08,651.67907041 --> 00:11:15,601.68007041 So myth number two, another good one, like my one liner about this one, so I don't talk about it for an hour. 127 00:11:18,761.68007041 --> 00:11:20,651.68007041 Time heals all wounds. 128 00:11:21,511.68007041 --> 00:11:24,331.68007041 Another one I have thoughts and feelings about, but yeah. 129 00:11:25,91.68007041 --> 00:11:25,721.68007041 Yeah. 130 00:11:25,721.68007041 --> 00:11:26,271.68007041 Oh my gosh. 131 00:11:26,281.68007041 --> 00:11:26,661.68007041 Okay. 132 00:11:26,661.68007041 --> 00:11:31,871.67957041 So my high level thought on this is that healing is an active process. 133 00:11:31,871.67957041 --> 00:11:33,321.68007041 Like I can't stress that enough. 134 00:11:33,611.68007041 --> 00:11:53,11.68007041 And we think, or we like to think that the passage of time will make things better, but that's not necessarily true because like I said, healing is an active process and like you're learning how to carry this grief and Over time, you can learn how to carry this grief, and that could be stress, anxiety, anger, you know, jealousy. 135 00:11:53,21.68007041 --> 00:12:10,226.68007041 So, if you're not actively, like, moving towards it, you're carrying your grief into your new normal, but, like, if you don't have an active role in shaping that grief and getting to know it and guiding it, then you will be carrying it into your new normal and maybe a way that you're, it's not so empowering. 136 00:12:10,686.68007041 --> 00:12:12,176.68007041 Yeah, it's heavy. 137 00:12:12,316.68007041 --> 00:12:14,346.68007041 And like you're carrying such that burden. 138 00:12:14,346.68007041 --> 00:12:14,656.67957041 Yeah. 139 00:12:14,656.67957041 --> 00:12:20,596.67907041 And I think I realized like, at least this is, I'm only speaking for myself, my own journey, like time. 140 00:12:20,736.78007041 --> 00:12:25,166.68007041 And I think that the grief alone certainly does not heal, right? It's exactly what you said. 141 00:12:25,166.68007041 --> 00:12:44,396.58007041 Like, if you don't put in, sort of, if you don't get the right support, or if you don't you know, just get the right coping tool, and you find the things that work for you, that inspire you along the way to, to make living with your grief more, like, digestible and, like, easier I, I do feel like, you know, there are certain parts of our grief that will, you know, heal. 142 00:12:45,76.68007041 --> 00:12:51,516.68007041 Like be less intense with time because just inevitably we get a little bit further away. 143 00:12:51,546.68007041 --> 00:13:03,396.68007041 But that being said, and I definitely feel this way, like going through a phase in my life recently where I just had my daughter, there was a lot of like chaos around her birth. 144 00:13:03,426.68007041 --> 00:13:03,796.68007041 And. 145 00:13:04,121.68007041 --> 00:13:09,611.68007041 That really brought up a lot of things for me, but that can also happen on a daily basis. 146 00:13:09,881.68007041 --> 00:13:12,201.68007041 It's in the little moments and it's in those big moments. 147 00:13:12,201.68007041 --> 00:13:22,261.67907041 Like, we don't necessarily have to have these huge milestones to, you know, have our grief kind of brought up to the surface and in familiar ways or completely unfamiliar ways. 148 00:13:22,671.68107041 --> 00:13:28,641.68007041 And so you're kind of like regrieving certain things or you're just like, Ooh, okay, haven't had to approach it this way before. 149 00:13:29,86.68007041 --> 00:13:36,96.68007041 You know, how do I do that now? So yeah, and there's obviously such a I see, I see this with certain comments. 150 00:13:36,106.67907041 --> 00:13:46,806.67857041 I have had people kind of imply this to me you know, sort of like, why aren't you over it by now? Like, I feel like that's sort of a subset of this, like, time heals all wounds thing. 151 00:13:46,806.67857041 --> 00:13:50,576.67907041 It's like, not that, you know, like it's, it's been a while. 152 00:13:50,576.67907041 --> 00:14:08,636.67907041 Why can't you just be happy? Like, Those types of like very minimizing comments that just makes me so sad Because and it's so interesting too because like i've seen them from people who have also lost some some big People in their life or you know, they've seen loss and they know grief yet. 153 00:14:09,166.67907041 --> 00:14:22,56.67907041 They still Have those beliefs so I just think it's so interesting and it's you know I feel like everyone just kind of has their own like Belief about time and grief and how it Heels or whatever. 154 00:14:22,56.67907041 --> 00:14:22,846.67907041 So I don't know. 155 00:14:22,846.67907041 --> 00:14:47,111.67907041 I would love to hear like whatever closing thoughts you have on that but that is definitely something I've I've witnessed and I've had to Navigate in my own grief journey is like the imposing thoughts of other people on my own grief journey I'm like, yeah, well if they need to like comment on your grief journey, like why don't you look over more positive? I would wonder like How that, like, how are they doing, honestly? Like, yeah. 156 00:14:47,831.67907041 --> 00:14:47,961.67907041 Yeah. 157 00:14:48,291.67907041 --> 00:14:54,431.67857041 So maybe they were hoping that maybe it's like a projection to, like, that they were hoping time would heal their wound. 158 00:14:54,431.67857041 --> 00:15:03,581.67907041 But you know, like Grief could be like a trauma, like a, depending on like how you lost someone, you know, how they died, who died, when they died, like all of these different factors. 159 00:15:03,971.67807041 --> 00:15:08,461.67907041 And it doesn't necessarily, like, traumas don't necessarily heal with time. 160 00:15:08,471.67807041 --> 00:15:14,751.67807041 We have to learn how to, like, become safe in the world again and process what happened. 161 00:15:15,81.67807041 --> 00:15:16,311.67807041 So you know, it's important. 162 00:15:16,721.67907041 --> 00:15:20,681.67907041 For listeners to think about like the, the grief that they experienced. 163 00:15:20,681.67907041 --> 00:15:33,281.67907041 And, you know, if it was like, especially if it was like a traumatic loss, then I would really encourage them to get help because over time that trauma and that loss and like those symptoms can turn into something in that gets even bigger. 164 00:15:33,291.67907041 --> 00:15:42,91.67907041 So like time doesn't necessarily heal wounds, but it can like make whatever is there like more normal for you or become bigger as time passes. 165 00:15:42,91.67907041 --> 00:15:48,66.67907041 And if that's anxiety, That's not really what you want to grow in your life, right? Right. 166 00:15:48,516.67907041 --> 00:15:50,516.67907041 And can affect your body and everything too. 167 00:15:50,516.67907041 --> 00:16:03,786.67807041 I mean, just like physically and mentally, like, you know, just, and I don't know, I always joke, like I can feel when I'm kind of going through something in my neck and my shoulders, which I think is common for a lot of people, of course, but yeah, and it just, it can manifest itself in so many ways. 168 00:16:04,126.67807041 --> 00:16:10,786.57907041 So I think, I don't know, I just giving ourselves all the grace in the world with, with this time thing. 169 00:16:11,261.57907041 --> 00:16:16,201.57907041 And also understanding that this is so overset in the grief space, but it is going to ebb and flow. 170 00:16:16,231.57907041 --> 00:17:16,456.5790704 The intensity is going to Win a little bit and just I just embrace that because like that sucks, but like old space for that and and I did not be surprised when I have it like it can catch a soft guard for sure, but I think just knowing it is an inevitable part inevitable part of the grieving process that certain things might come up, it might shock you like a couple of people I've worked with and membership and one on one like They're surprised when they're randomly crying about something and then we're gonna get into this in another myth But like there's there's something wrong with me Like I don't understand where are these coming from and then they're just like, oh my god, is this ever gonna end? And it's like well, maybe yes, maybe no, but if grief never really kind of stops like we just have to be diligent about Having ways to cope with it Yeah, and like when time the past When time passes, like people are learning how to cope with it, even if they're not like realizing that. 171 00:17:16,456.5790704 --> 00:17:20,666.5790704 And the way they're learning how to cope with it is like, I'm drinking a lot more. 172 00:17:20,696.5790704 --> 00:17:23,166.5790704 I am avoiding my life. 173 00:17:23,196.5790704 --> 00:17:27,196.5795704 I am stressing out and you know, turning to something else to help me cope. 174 00:17:27,196.5795704 --> 00:17:34,66.5800704 So the reason I don't like that myth of time heals all wounds, because it just sort of says that like healing is like, just not an active process. 175 00:17:34,86.5800704 --> 00:17:35,146.5800704 Something just happens. 176 00:17:35,396.5800704 --> 00:17:50,871.5800704 But really you're, you're just, Even if you don't realize that you're trying to find ways to cope and I would rather people be more empowered and self directed about how they're helping themselves rather than just being like, Oh, I'm feeling better, but also I'm having these other problems in my life because of how I'm trying to cope with the grief. 177 00:17:51,181.5790704 --> 00:17:51,571.5790704 Yeah. 178 00:17:52,31.5800704 --> 00:17:52,391.5800704 Yeah. 179 00:17:52,451.5800704 --> 00:17:53,731.5790704 It's such a crazy balance. 180 00:17:53,741.5790704 --> 00:17:54,511.5800704 Like it really is. 181 00:17:54,811.5790704 --> 00:17:56,321.5800704 There's so much gray area to it. 182 00:17:56,321.6800704 --> 00:17:57,941.5800704 It is a day by day thing. 183 00:17:57,971.5800704 --> 00:18:00,381.3800704 Say it all the time, but yeah. 184 00:18:00,381.4800704 --> 00:18:00,821.4800704 Yeah. 185 00:18:00,821.5800704 --> 00:18:02,331.3800704 Yeah. 186 00:18:02,591.4800704 --> 00:18:04,131.4800704 I'm going to bust everyone's bubble with that one. 187 00:18:07,791.4800704 --> 00:18:17,301.4790704 I'm sorry, but that is like, that is truly one of the biggest myths, but it's, that's probably one of the ones I have the biggest issue with because there's just so many people with their opinions on it and stuff. 188 00:18:17,301.4790704 --> 00:18:18,151.4800704 And I'm like, Oh my God. 189 00:18:18,151.4800704 --> 00:18:18,531.4800704 Okay. 190 00:18:18,581.4800704 --> 00:18:19,151.4790704 Well, yeah. 191 00:18:19,486.4800704 --> 00:18:22,866.4800704 Let's just be nice to ourselves here, okay? Yeah, absolutely. 192 00:18:23,76.4800704 --> 00:18:28,105.6637439 Oh, Real quick interruption here, and then we'll get back to this episode. 193 00:18:28,495.6637439 --> 00:18:39,185.6637439 If you are someone who is experiencing some form of loss and are trying to navigate the complexities of grief, which you likely are in some capacity, if you've stumbled upon this podcast, then this message is for you. 194 00:18:39,595.6637439 --> 00:18:46,825.6637439 If you haven't heard about my intentional life after loss membership and community yet, this is truly something you need to check out. 195 00:18:47,245.6637439 --> 00:18:53,855.6637439 This membership is here to guide you into living a deeper, more meaningful and full life after experiencing loss. 196 00:18:54,645.6637439 --> 00:19:01,825.6637439 Who doesn't want that? Right? I created this membership because I know what it's like to navigate and cope with grief on a daily basis. 197 00:19:02,155.6637439 --> 00:19:07,305.6637439 I know how hard that can be and I know the tools and support it takes to do this effectively. 198 00:19:07,875.6627439 --> 00:19:12,75.6637439 I've done the work myself and I've coached people just like you to do the same. 199 00:19:12,740.6637439 --> 00:19:32,230.6637439 It comes down to having impactful, effective resources and tools at your disposal, having the right support around you from people who can understand and empathize with your grief, and having encouragement and inspiration around you consistently to not only elicit and spark change, but to keep it and keep the positive momentum going. 200 00:19:32,940.6637439 --> 00:19:35,280.6637439 Enrollment opens once a month for a limited time. 201 00:19:35,620.6637439 --> 00:19:37,570.6637439 Check out the details linked in the description. 202 00:19:37,860.6637439 --> 00:19:38,990.6637439 And I hope to see you in there. 203 00:19:39,600.6637439 --> 00:19:43,589.8474173 Oh, All right, grief myth number three. 204 00:19:44,99.8474173 --> 00:19:45,209.8469173 This is another good one. 205 00:19:45,209.8469173 --> 00:19:46,509.8474173 We're hitting so many good ones today. 206 00:19:46,889.8474173 --> 00:19:47,569.8474173 We really are. 207 00:19:48,239.8474173 --> 00:19:50,329.8474173 There are five stages of grief. 208 00:19:51,404.8474173 --> 00:19:53,544.8474173 Although I heard somewhere that there's like seven now. 209 00:19:53,564.8474173 --> 00:19:54,684.8474173 I don't even know what those other two are. 210 00:19:54,684.8474173 --> 00:19:58,454.8474173 I don't know if that's a thing or whatever, but I want to hear your thoughts on this. 211 00:19:58,494.8474173 --> 00:20:14,919.8474173 Okay, so the five stages of grief is a great way to think about like categories of feelings or emotions that we could experience and then within each category there's a lot of like It's going to be really a personal experience. 212 00:20:14,929.8474173 --> 00:20:20,489.8474173 So it's not like five stages, like stair steps, like linear, and this is how it's supposed to go. 213 00:20:20,819.8474173 --> 00:20:38,939.8474173 This research was done to understand and give people who were dying a voice and to help them like to help the society, understand like, what are some feelings that people who are dying experience? It was never meant to be translated into all kinds of grief or this, like, you know, very specific path. 214 00:20:38,939.8474173 --> 00:20:38,979.8474173 Yeah. 215 00:20:39,524.8474173 --> 00:20:40,454.8474173 Yeah, blueprint. 216 00:20:40,454.8474173 --> 00:20:41,84.8474173 Yeah, absolutely. 217 00:20:41,84.8474173 --> 00:20:49,424.8464173 But we have to remember that the time this research came out like no one was talking about grief or death at all, so it really caught on because nobody was speaking about it. 218 00:20:49,424.8464173 --> 00:20:50,764.8474173 We didn't have any language at all. 219 00:20:50,764.8474173 --> 00:20:53,4.8474173 So it was really very, very helpful. 220 00:20:53,344.8474173 --> 00:20:56,994.8464173 And and so now I, I, I don't like this myth. 221 00:20:57,524.8474173 --> 00:21:03,124.8474173 Because first of all, that's not even what the research said, but you know, I don't want people to be very rigid about their grief. 222 00:21:03,124.8474173 --> 00:21:08,414.8464173 Of course we would like for things to happen in five easy stages with like a blueprint, but that's not going to be realistic. 223 00:21:08,414.8464173 --> 00:21:13,64.8474173 And you know, you shouldn't try to be like beating yourself up or forcing yourself into these certain stages. 224 00:21:13,84.8464173 --> 00:21:17,14.8464173 If you want to think about it as categories, like I might need to look out for anger. 225 00:21:17,24.8464173 --> 00:21:18,154.8464173 I might be experiencing that. 226 00:21:18,194.8464173 --> 00:21:22,444.8474173 Maybe I'm having like bargaining or depression, like, Sadness. 227 00:21:22,444.8474173 --> 00:21:27,284.8474173 Like these are the things I could be looking out for, but they don't have to be happening in a certain way. 228 00:21:27,284.8474173 --> 00:21:31,904.8474173 And if you really want a roadmap for your grief, then create one with a grief professional. 229 00:21:32,54.8474173 --> 00:21:41,254.8484173 That's something you can do, but you know, trying to put your experience onto some research or someone else's experience isn't going to work because your grief is so unique. 230 00:21:42,524.8484173 --> 00:21:42,894.8484173 Yeah. 231 00:21:43,234.8484173 --> 00:21:50,804.8484173 This is one I was interviewing grand Gary on the podcast a little while back and he had such, he was like, he was talking to somebody. 232 00:21:51,289.8484173 --> 00:21:54,869.8484173 And they were like, Oh, I think it was like in the film that he had done. 233 00:21:54,899.8484173 --> 00:22:05,399.8484173 And he was like somebody was asking this, this person he was interviewing, like, you know, have you experienced the five stages or have you gone through the five stages or whatever? And the person's response was, yeah, this morning. 234 00:22:06,809.8484173 --> 00:22:10,594.7484173 And I loved that because whether or not that's accurate, you know, it's more. 235 00:22:11,134.8484173 --> 00:22:23,954.8484173 A little light hearted, but it's so true because like, you know, and it's funny too, I've had even family members that are just like, do you think you found like acceptance or what is acceptance? Anyway, I think I actually said this in a recent episode. 236 00:22:23,954.8484173 --> 00:22:46,189.7484173 I literally was like, What is acceptance of the fact that I've lost my entire media family, as you can certainly relate to this, you know, like, it's just, I guess I'm resigned to it, like, I've come to terms with the fact that my parents are no longer here, that doesn't mean I don't have moments where I'm like, I cannot believe they're not here, like, it's not about them. 237 00:22:46,549.8484173 --> 00:22:54,609.8484173 And in my mind, I don't know if that's acceptance or what, but I also, I'm like, you know what? I'm not beating myself up about this because however I'm feeling in the moment is how I'm feeling. 238 00:22:55,69.8484173 --> 00:22:58,999.8479173 And I think what you hit on I think like awareness is such an important part here. 239 00:22:58,999.8479173 --> 00:23:02,479.8474173 And it's why I always talk about, like, I talk about breathwork and meditation and things a lot. 240 00:23:02,479.8474173 --> 00:23:16,754.8484173 And whether you, anybody listening has like a specific breathwork or a specific meditation thing, it's, I'm not necessarily saying you need to start one, but I like that because It's just checking in with yourself and like, I love what you said, like about anger. 241 00:23:16,794.8484173 --> 00:23:21,244.8484173 Like if that's coming up for you, like, you know, I don't know what you'd recommend here. 242 00:23:21,254.8484173 --> 00:23:25,604.8484173 Like, you know, feeling that, but just, just being aware that it is coming up for you. 243 00:23:25,944.8474173 --> 00:23:41,849.7474173 And kind of like we alluded to in one of the last myths, like holding space for that and digging deeper into that and being like, okay, why is this coming up for me today? And it's not like we have to like rack our brains about it, but just allowing that almost like learning process. 244 00:23:41,849.7474173 --> 00:23:42,989.7474173 I don't know how you would describe that. 245 00:23:42,999.7474173 --> 00:23:52,254.7474173 So just to happen and like, For me, that's like the essence of getting to know your grief and understanding it and, and living with it in a way. 246 00:23:52,374.7474173 --> 00:23:53,554.7474173 Like, yeah, absolutely. 247 00:23:53,564.7474173 --> 00:24:09,114.7474173 Even though I knew that the five stages of grief was like bogus before I started grieving, I remember Googling it in my kitchen and being like, what are the five stages? It was just helpful for me to have some sort of like, it just helped me to have some sort of language and start piecing things together for myself. 248 00:24:09,114.7474173 --> 00:24:12,249.7474173 And To feel like like other people were out there grieving. 249 00:24:12,249.7474173 --> 00:24:18,649.7474173 It just like, was a nice, like entryway into some connection and some information or like about myself, my grief. 250 00:24:18,669.7474173 --> 00:24:22,69.7474173 But it did, you don't need to stop there and try to fit into these categories. 251 00:24:22,69.7474173 --> 00:24:24,909.7464173 And there's just so much in each category. 252 00:24:24,919.7464173 --> 00:24:34,459.7474173 Like, you know, like you spoke about acceptance, acceptance might mean for me that like, I, I'm not going to be making a meal for someone who's not here. 253 00:24:34,844.7474173 --> 00:24:37,164.7474173 But I don't have to feel good about that. 254 00:24:37,194.7474173 --> 00:24:41,264.7474173 And I don't have to, you know, stop thinking about them and. 255 00:24:41,894.7474173 --> 00:24:45,954.7474173 And I'm like glad that they're gone while I'm making the meal for the other people that are here. 256 00:24:45,954.7474173 --> 00:24:49,234.7474173 I can be thinking about that, that person that died and talking about them. 257 00:24:49,234.7474173 --> 00:24:55,404.7474173 And I'm, I'm logically, I know that they're not here, but that doesn't have to mean I feel like super great about it. 258 00:24:55,414.7464173 --> 00:24:58,494.7474173 So I think that's some of the problems we have with these emotions. 259 00:24:58,494.7474173 --> 00:25:02,64.7474173 It's like anger feels this way and acceptance feels this way. 260 00:25:02,64.7474173 --> 00:25:05,974.7474173 And it's just like, no, like, it's just so much more complicated than that. 261 00:25:06,389.7474173 --> 00:25:07,429.7474173 Yeah, yeah. 262 00:25:07,659.7474173 --> 00:25:14,569.7474173 And also too, like, I think there are some people that, well, okay, I don't want to, I don't want to I don't know, project anything. 263 00:25:14,699.7474173 --> 00:25:22,699.7464173 I personally, like, I don't, looking back to, cause you know, hindsight's kind of 20, 20, but like, I don't even remember going through like the bargaining process. 264 00:25:22,729.7474173 --> 00:25:24,259.7464173 Like that wasn't really a thing for me. 265 00:25:24,629.7474173 --> 00:26:15,739.7474174 And so I think that's just like, it's just an example, but I think that's just a testament to like, You know a lot of people agree very uniquely and agree very differently and so that's just another thing which again, we're gonna touch on this later on but like Like you said it's we don't want to be so rigid with these five stages if we feel like we need to be that way because like first of all It's it almost like doesn't allow ourselves to feel other things that are coming if we if we can't like Define it, you know in one of these five, but then like, you know, if I had been so rooted with myself like You Why aren't I bargaining with the God or the universe or whatever, like, am I grieving wrong, like, am I moving backward in my grief, like, you know, what's, what's happening, and I've, you know, spiraling can happen, I'm like, Well, it's helpful to know that, like, these stages were created when the psychologist Elizabeth Cooper Ross was interviewing people who were dying. 266 00:26:15,739.7474174 --> 00:26:22,24.7474174 So, if you are terminal illness, there's this, like, I'm going to be a better person. 267 00:26:22,24.7474174 --> 00:26:23,4.7474174 I'm going to eat right. 268 00:26:23,14.7474174 --> 00:26:27,664.7474174 If I can just, you know, so like a person might not grieve that way. 269 00:26:27,674.7474174 --> 00:26:28,224.7474174 Right. 270 00:26:29,124.7474174 --> 00:26:29,394.7474174 Yeah. 271 00:26:29,394.7474174 --> 00:26:33,724.7474174 Cause I think she, she had interviewed like doctors or something too. 272 00:26:33,724.7474174 --> 00:26:38,986.0912031 Like there was like people that were dying, but then like professionals at the end of space. 273 00:26:38,986.0912031 --> 00:26:41,644.7484174 And I don't, that's, what's so interesting about the five stages. 274 00:26:41,704.7484174 --> 00:26:46,564.7484174 I don't know if people know some of the detail like of it's on death and dying or of death and dying. 275 00:26:46,584.7484174 --> 00:26:48,984.7484174 What's the book? I think it's of death and dying. 276 00:26:49,584.7484174 --> 00:26:52,354.7484174 But yeah, like it was just so taboo to talk about. 277 00:26:52,354.7484174 --> 00:27:04,869.7484174 So I think that's why people like love it and we like these like really Specific roadmaps, but like you might not experience that bargaining create or you might experience it, but it doesn't look like what you think bargaining would be. 278 00:27:05,79.7484174 --> 00:27:05,139.7484174 Yeah. 279 00:27:05,349.7484174 --> 00:27:10,269.7484174 Maybe there's some bargaining with yourself of like, I'm not gonna allow myself to like really literally lose my shit. 280 00:27:10,274.7484174 --> 00:27:11,589.7484174 Like I'm gonna keep it together. 281 00:27:11,594.7484174 --> 00:27:11,734.7484174 Yes. 282 00:27:12,369.7484174 --> 00:27:16,89.7484174 And it's like, great point with that you see? I know. 283 00:27:16,89.7484174 --> 00:27:16,659.7484174 Seriously. 284 00:27:16,659.7484174 --> 00:27:17,709.7484174 And not to go down a rabbit hole. 285 00:27:17,709.7484174 --> 00:27:18,489.7484174 This is all I'll say. 286 00:27:18,669.7484174 --> 00:27:23,674.6484174 I what show? Was I, I can't believe I'm saying this. 287 00:27:23,674.7484174 --> 00:27:28,764.7484174 Was it love is blind? There's so much I was watching recently where they were like, be strong. 288 00:27:28,774.7484174 --> 00:27:29,294.7484174 Don't cry. 289 00:27:29,404.7484174 --> 00:27:29,874.7484174 Don't cry. 290 00:27:29,904.7484174 --> 00:27:30,804.7484174 Don't lose it right now. 291 00:27:31,184.7474174 --> 00:27:33,894.7484174 And I was, I literally was like, no, lose it. 292 00:27:34,494.7484174 --> 00:27:34,804.7484174 It's okay. 293 00:27:35,94.7474174 --> 00:27:37,264.7484174 If you have to, or maybe it was like Vanderpump rules. 294 00:27:37,294.7484174 --> 00:27:37,644.7484174 I don't know. 295 00:27:37,644.7484174 --> 00:27:42,884.7484174 It was, but it was, and it was constant. 296 00:27:42,924.7484174 --> 00:27:44,354.7484174 It was just like, no, don't lose it. 297 00:27:44,354.7484174 --> 00:27:45,14.7484174 No be strong. 298 00:27:45,854.7484174 --> 00:28:02,58.5921396 So this is like a little bit irrelevant to the stages of what we're talking about, but you know, it's just like, I don't know, allow those emotions to come in because it could be more than one of those, those five, right? Like it's, you know, that, that digging deep we've kind of been talking about. 299 00:28:02,58.5921396 --> 00:28:09,267.5368618 Yeah, getting to know your specific grief and how it shows up for you, because how it's going to show up for you is not going to be how it shows up for someone else. 300 00:28:09,267.5368618 --> 00:28:17,157.5373618 And even if you like, in theory, like lost the same person, right? Like, or if you like both lost a parent or both lost their sibling, whatever. 301 00:28:18,77.5373618 --> 00:28:21,467.5373618 You had different relationships with them, they meant something different to each of us. 302 00:28:21,467.5373618 --> 00:28:25,867.5373618 Like, you know, there's, yeah. 303 00:28:25,897.5373618 --> 00:28:28,657.5373618 It's just not black and white and that's what we want it to be. 304 00:28:28,657.5373618 --> 00:28:30,57.5373618 And it's not. 305 00:28:30,467.5373618 --> 00:28:30,647.5373618 Yeah. 306 00:28:30,647.5373618 --> 00:28:31,667.5373618 And that's okay. 307 00:28:31,787.5373618 --> 00:28:34,607.5373618 You know, I find a lot of like like healing in that too. 308 00:28:34,607.5373618 --> 00:28:38,857.5373618 That it can be both and it doesn't have to be black and white. 309 00:28:38,917.5373618 --> 00:28:41,137.5373618 And of course at the beginning that could be really scary. 310 00:28:41,517.5373618 --> 00:28:41,877.5373618 Yeah. 311 00:28:41,967.5373618 --> 00:28:42,267.5373618 Yeah. 312 00:28:42,297.5373618 --> 00:28:44,67.5373618 'cause you're just like, oh my God, is this like. 313 00:28:44,692.5373618 --> 00:28:45,12.5373618 I don't know. 314 00:28:45,22.5373618 --> 00:28:45,862.5373618 I'm just spitballing. 315 00:28:45,902.5373618 --> 00:28:57,632.5373618 Is this ever going to end? Like, am I ever going to feel normal? Is this ever going to like, stop popping up randomly? Like, am I ever not going to be a mess walking through the grocery store? Like, come on, like, this is exhausting. 316 00:28:57,792.5373618 --> 00:28:59,52.5363618 And it is exhausting for sure. 317 00:28:59,212.5373618 --> 00:29:06,952.5373618 But all the more reason to, like you said, work with someone if you need to find the right support, you know, it will, there's, there's ways. 318 00:29:09,82.5373618 --> 00:29:13,952.4373618 around it, through it, whatever you want to use. 319 00:29:13,952.5373618 --> 00:29:14,812.5373618 That's the moral of the story. 320 00:29:15,142.5373618 --> 00:29:15,522.5373618 Yes. 321 00:29:15,522.6373618 --> 00:29:16,972.5373618 All right. 322 00:29:17,2.5373618 --> 00:29:21,792.5363618 So last myth here, this is another really good one that I think is really important. 323 00:29:21,792.5373618 --> 00:29:26,722.5363618 And this is another one that I, I think can be imposed on us from some other people. 324 00:29:27,102.5363618 --> 00:29:31,442.5373618 And I also, I, I want to obviously, of course, first hear what you have to say on this one. 325 00:29:31,522.5373618 --> 00:29:37,562.5373618 But it's Interesting to me how people feel like they can speak on this. 326 00:29:37,562.6373618 --> 00:29:39,572.5373618 I'll leave it at that. 327 00:29:39,682.5373618 --> 00:29:42,892.5363618 And this one is, your loved one wouldn't want you to be sad. 328 00:29:43,252.5373618 --> 00:29:47,152.5373618 Yeah, this one feels like a cousin to everything happens for a reason for me. 329 00:29:47,362.5373618 --> 00:29:55,627.5373618 Like, they are These grief catchphrases that people love to say and also we love to say them to ourselves as well. 330 00:29:55,627.5373618 --> 00:30:16,732.5373618 It's a ton of pressure Yeah, if other people are saying that to you, I mean that's something that I heard a lot Especially if my mom died it wasn't exactly your loved one wouldn't want you to be sad So I want to tell this story so that like people can kind of understand that these myths might not be word for word but I remember saying to a family member after my mom died, like, I'm all alone now. 331 00:30:16,992.5373618 --> 00:30:18,112.5373618 And they're like, no, you're not. 332 00:30:18,112.5373618 --> 00:30:19,32.5373618 You have your brothers. 333 00:30:19,572.5373618 --> 00:30:22,622.5373618 And I was like, no, I'm so glad you brought that up. 334 00:30:23,842.5373618 --> 00:30:27,442.5373618 He's like, I'm just, let me wallow in my alone for a second. 335 00:30:27,582.5363618 --> 00:30:32,302.5373618 And like, I'm laughing about that and joking now, but seriously, I felt the exact same way after my parents died. 336 00:30:32,532.5363618 --> 00:30:34,72.5363618 I'd be like, you know, I'm kind of by myself. 337 00:30:34,192.5363618 --> 00:30:35,802.5363618 I still do this by the way. 338 00:30:36,152.5363618 --> 00:30:38,912.5373618 And some people, many people are like, no, you have a support system, honey. 339 00:30:39,102.5373618 --> 00:30:40,12.5373618 We're here for you. 340 00:30:40,737.5373618 --> 00:30:41,837.5373618 I understand that. 341 00:30:41,867.5373618 --> 00:30:42,307.5373618 Yeah. 342 00:30:42,467.5373618 --> 00:30:47,207.5373618 Not the people that you're not my mom, you're not my respectfully, like, yeah. 343 00:30:47,377.5373618 --> 00:30:47,807.5373618 Right. 344 00:30:47,907.5373618 --> 00:30:48,287.5373618 Right. 345 00:30:48,637.5373618 --> 00:30:50,337.5373618 Guys, just let me feel this. 346 00:30:50,677.5373618 --> 00:30:51,517.5373618 Absolutely. 347 00:30:51,967.5373618 --> 00:30:52,67.5368618 Yes. 348 00:30:52,67.5368618 --> 00:30:52,707.5363618 Yes. 349 00:30:52,907.5363618 --> 00:30:58,87.5363618 And like, what I was really saying is like, I don't have my parents and my sister anymore. 350 00:30:58,137.5363618 --> 00:31:09,187.5373618 And that those pillars in my life are gone, you know? And so, So yeah, so I think that people are really in a hurry to make, make us cheer up, to feel good. 351 00:31:09,997.5373618 --> 00:31:15,797.5373618 I, you know, I can assume it comes from a great place of like, wanting to do the right thing and be there for us. 352 00:31:16,17.5373618 --> 00:31:24,217.5373618 But I think really what it comes down to for me is that people are uncomfortable with sadness, and when we express our sadness, people need to shut it down, and it feels super invalidating. 353 00:31:24,667.5373618 --> 00:31:29,367.5373618 And I feel like I see this a lot with clients from like, spiritual families in particular. 354 00:31:29,877.5373618 --> 00:31:31,197.5373618 My friend said this thing the other day. 355 00:31:31,207.5373618 --> 00:31:34,677.5373618 He's a therapist and he said it's called spiritual bypassing. 356 00:31:34,987.5373618 --> 00:31:40,87.5373618 It's like, you can't be sad or ungrateful because there's a higher power. 357 00:31:40,117.5373618 --> 00:31:40,477.5373618 Yeah. 358 00:31:40,787.5373618 --> 00:31:41,887.5363618 And I was like, oh, that's good. 359 00:31:41,887.5373618 --> 00:31:43,247.5373618 I need to remember that. 360 00:31:43,357.5363618 --> 00:31:44,257.5363618 Probably like a real term. 361 00:31:44,257.5363618 --> 00:31:45,427.5353618 I need to learn some more about it. 362 00:31:45,437.5363618 --> 00:31:49,367.5373618 But but yeah, I think it just can be emboweling for ourselves or for others. 363 00:31:49,367.5373618 --> 00:31:50,967.5373618 Like we need to put a lot of pressure on ourselves. 364 00:31:50,967.5373618 --> 00:31:55,77.5373618 Or when we say that to other people, it's like we are uncomfortable with their sadness and they need to wrap it up. 365 00:31:55,77.5373618 --> 00:31:59,402.5373618 And that feels really bad when we We get sent that message Totally. 366 00:31:59,442.5373618 --> 00:32:01,432.5373618 Yeah, and it's just like Yeah. 367 00:32:01,432.5373618 --> 00:32:07,942.5373618 Sometimes we just, I say this all the time, but like, we just need to be heard and seen and validated in a way. 368 00:32:07,962.5373618 --> 00:32:15,562.5363618 And sometimes it's, you know, it's like, it kind of goes along with like those things of like what to say to a griever and sometimes there's just nothing to really say. 369 00:32:15,852.5373618 --> 00:32:26,612.5363618 It's just been like, you know what I, you know, however you want, I'm paraphrasing that, you know, I, I can only, I can't even begin to understand, like, I just, I'm giving you the biggest hug. 370 00:32:26,672.5363618 --> 00:32:27,362.5363618 I see you. 371 00:32:27,822.5363618 --> 00:32:30,2.5353618 I can't imagine how hard it is, you know, whatever it is. 372 00:32:30,12.5363618 --> 00:32:31,722.5363618 It's just almost. 373 00:32:32,447.5373618 --> 00:32:33,577.5373618 It's such a delicate balance. 374 00:32:33,577.5373618 --> 00:32:39,537.5373618 And I'm curious your thoughts on this, but, and I'll, I'll mention one other kind of like indirect example of this too. 375 00:32:39,547.5373618 --> 00:32:42,467.5373618 Cause I'm curious on your thoughts, but like, it's just. 376 00:32:43,57.5373618 --> 00:33:10,467.5383618 like allowing them to be Sad and like i'm gonna use the word wallowing again because i don't really have a better word for it right now It's sort of like allowing them to just sit with that But it's you know, we have to be careful like it's a slippery slope maybe But this another example of this came up for me recently, I mentioned my my daughter's birth and how that was Quite traumatic and so for those who don't know or haven't heard this yet She was five weeks early, but not only was she preemie. 377 00:33:10,467.5383618 --> 00:33:17,972.5383618 She had Transcribed some very severe issues with blood loss and she, I mean, she very painfully close to not making it. 378 00:33:18,902.5383618 --> 00:33:23,622.5383618 So, a lot of people had heard, like, oh, she's, she's a preemie. 379 00:33:24,92.5373618 --> 00:33:25,812.5383618 Preemies make it all the time. 380 00:33:26,52.5373618 --> 00:33:28,462.5373618 Oh, I know so and so are my cousins. 381 00:33:28,932.5383618 --> 00:33:35,732.5383618 You know, Kid was a preemie, and she was even more preemie than yours, and, you know, and all of these comparisons. 382 00:33:36,52.5383618 --> 00:33:38,572.5373618 And actually, this could totally be another myth, too. 383 00:33:38,612.5383618 --> 00:33:40,172.5383618 But, it's Yeah. 384 00:33:40,537.5383618 --> 00:33:50,27.5383618 It's just one of those things where I'm just like, I, I appreciate that because like, I understand it is coming from a place of love, just like, I think this year loved one wouldn't want you to be sad. 385 00:33:50,27.5383618 --> 00:33:52,927.5383618 Kind of because people also made that comparison with my parents too. 386 00:33:52,927.5383618 --> 00:33:55,347.5383618 They were just like, you know, your parents are with you. 387 00:33:55,507.5383618 --> 00:33:58,127.5383618 They just want you to enjoy this time that you have right now. 388 00:33:59,27.5383618 --> 00:34:00,847.5383618 First of all, please don't speak for my loved one. 389 00:34:00,867.5383618 --> 00:34:04,467.5383618 You're probably, but please don't speak for my number two. 390 00:34:05,27.5383618 --> 00:34:06,97.5383618 It just completely. 391 00:34:07,322.5383618 --> 00:34:10,822.5383618 It really invalidates like what we're feeling, what we're going through. 392 00:34:11,292.5383618 --> 00:34:16,112.5373618 And I understand why people were saying those things to me in the moment. 393 00:34:16,142.5383618 --> 00:34:18,622.5383618 Like, Oh, so and so's kid was absolutely fine. 394 00:34:18,632.5383618 --> 00:34:20,302.5383618 Like they're happy and healthy now. 395 00:34:20,692.5383618 --> 00:34:22,832.5383618 And I'm like, first of all, you don't totally understand. 396 00:34:23,192.5383618 --> 00:34:41,912.5373618 Because you don't know the details of what we've been going through, you don't understand her specific health issues, how close she was to not surviving the checkups that we're going to have to have, like all of these afterward things, like even some of my best friends were not understanding, they kind of just coming at me with like, Oh, well, she'll be totally fine. 397 00:34:41,932.5383618 --> 00:34:43,132.5383618 Don't worry about it. 398 00:34:43,132.5383618 --> 00:34:51,747.5383618 You know, just all of those like, super minimizing phrases and stuff like that, you know, like, you know, just, just be grateful. 399 00:34:51,747.5383618 --> 00:34:52,387.5383618 Just be grateful. 400 00:34:52,387.5383618 --> 00:34:53,767.5383618 She's doing okay right now. 401 00:34:53,767.5383618 --> 00:34:54,747.5383618 And like that kind of thing. 402 00:34:55,917.5383618 --> 00:35:03,302.5383618 And I'm like, in the moment, even amidst like the, the, you know, chaos of that, like, Grief happening right then and there. 403 00:35:03,302.5383618 --> 00:35:05,462.5383618 'cause she's still in the NICU or whatever was happening at the time. 404 00:35:06,2.5383618 --> 00:35:14,152.5383618 I knew that they met well and I knew what they were saying was out of love and it was to like get me to worry less or whatever they were trying to accomplish. 405 00:35:14,152.5383618 --> 00:35:14,902.5383618 Yeah, whatever. 406 00:35:15,112.5383618 --> 00:35:21,402.5383618 But really for me, I was almost like, you're not even taking the time to like cure me. 407 00:35:21,462.5383618 --> 00:35:27,402.5383618 Are you really understanding this, what I'm explaining to you in this text message? Or are you really hearing me when I'm talking to you about this on the phone and how. 408 00:35:28,197.5383618 --> 00:35:29,977.5383618 Our situation is unique to us. 409 00:35:29,977.5383618 --> 00:35:31,447.5383618 Like, please don't compare it. 410 00:35:31,447.5383618 --> 00:35:36,337.5383618 And so that's a whole, again, subset, I feel like of this myth. 411 00:35:36,337.5383618 --> 00:35:37,237.5383618 That's a good point. 412 00:35:37,277.5383618 --> 00:35:50,617.5373618 Cause I mean, that's a grief that you had to, you have to go through all this, that your daughter's birth and these follow up appointments and the first like weeks of her life weren't what you like expected and planned. 413 00:35:50,617.5373618 --> 00:35:54,497.5383618 And, and that it is like invalidating for someone to compare. 414 00:35:54,817.5383618 --> 00:35:55,767.5383618 and to downplay it. 415 00:35:55,767.5383618 --> 00:36:06,647.5373618 And really what I have found for myself and with my clients is if like, I just let myself or someone lean into that sadness, it like, it comes, it peaks, and then it goes. 416 00:36:06,687.5383618 --> 00:36:11,277.5378618 And then like, naturally, we just sort of get to the other side of it and feel better. 417 00:36:11,277.5378618 --> 00:36:18,17.5383618 But like, if you're not letting me have that experience of getting it out, then I, I, It just builds up. 418 00:36:18,17.5383618 --> 00:36:18,807.5383618 It doesn't get better. 419 00:36:18,807.5383618 --> 00:36:20,7.5383618 I have to, like, push it all down. 420 00:36:20,7.5383618 --> 00:36:34,532.5383618 That's why it reminds me of the first everything happens for a reason myth because, like, this, like, I'm avoiding, like, the pain and really you are helping by letting me get it out and by, like, being there with me when I cry and, like, letting me be upset. 421 00:36:34,542.5383618 --> 00:36:40,222.5383618 And I think that we need to get better at being comfortable with that for ourselves and for the people that we love. 422 00:36:40,222.5383618 --> 00:36:45,512.5383618 And, and realize like when someone I'm working with starts crying, I'm not worried about it. 423 00:36:45,522.5383618 --> 00:36:51,992.5383618 Like I know it's going to like resolve, but like, and they're going to feel so much better on the other side of it. 424 00:36:52,12.5383618 --> 00:36:54,372.5383618 And I don't have to do anything except be there while that's happening. 425 00:36:54,372.5383618 --> 00:36:57,612.5383618 Talk about it, cry, let them release it, whatever. 426 00:36:57,612.5383618 --> 00:36:57,972.5383618 Yeah. 427 00:36:57,972.5383618 --> 00:37:07,887.5383618 I, I think So well said, like, I feel like the, the crux of this one is like, just getting comfortable with sadness. 428 00:37:07,887.6383618 --> 00:37:15,227.5383618 And, and, you know, and I feel, and a lot of us, I understand why people put a bandaid over it, right? Like they're not well with that themselves. 429 00:37:15,717.5383618 --> 00:37:17,917.5373618 So why it makes them uncomfortable to see it in others. 430 00:37:17,967.5383618 --> 00:37:22,917.5383618 And I get it in a way, you know, especially our loved ones and our friends and family, they don't want to see us sad. 431 00:37:22,927.5383618 --> 00:37:54,632.5383618 Like, so while I understand it definitely, I think work to be done and just being like, You know what, I, I, I can only imagine what you're going through right now, or you know, whatever people want to say about it, but just ultimately letting them have their moment, feel the feels, and not just, like I said, try and put kind of like, That's so interesting, you know, I just thought of something that I hadn't really thought about before, it's, and I, I'm just like kind of, Figuring this out now, but it's an honor to see me sad because I'm not sad with people that are not safe. 432 00:37:55,112.5383618 --> 00:37:59,522.5383618 So like, if I'm not safe with you, I'm not going to be sad with you. 433 00:37:59,822.5383618 --> 00:38:05,492.5383618 And I have learned, I've been sad with people and I have learned that they're not safe and I will not do it again. 434 00:38:06,92.5383618 --> 00:38:06,992.5383618 Tourists, I'm very stubborn. 435 00:38:07,352.5383618 --> 00:38:11,312.5383618 You know, once I know you're not gonna be safe, I'm not doing it again. 436 00:38:11,642.5383618 --> 00:38:14,162.5383618 And so I protect my. 437 00:38:14,912.5383618 --> 00:38:17,872.5383618 Sadness, and take it to people I know who are going to be gentle with it. 438 00:38:17,882.5383618 --> 00:38:25,862.5383618 So, if you are my loved one, and you're getting to see me in that intimate, vulnerable space, like that, that's really meaningful. 439 00:38:25,862.5383618 --> 00:38:29,262.5383618 I'm not just like, blah, sad to everyone all the time. 440 00:38:34,787.5383618 --> 00:38:43,617.5373618 I literally got chills when you said like, like the feeling safe, like when you said, Oh my God, I hadn't really thought about that too before. 441 00:38:43,667.5373618 --> 00:39:06,687.5383618 So I think, I feel like that's even, That makes it even harder going to people, you know what I mean, and then so you're being so vulnerable and then to have them kind of, well, you know, it might be out of love, like, you're fine, it's gonna be okay, this is a blip in the radar, you know what I mean, whatever the grief looks like, it's a loss of a loved one or just a difficult time you're https: otter. 442 00:39:06,927.5383618 --> 00:39:16,467.5383618 ai Positive affirmations, whatever you want to call them, like, you know, thrown at us. 443 00:39:17,227.5383618 --> 00:39:19,167.5383618 Like, you're just like, wow. 444 00:39:19,167.5383618 --> 00:39:19,607.5383618 Okay. 445 00:39:19,607.5383618 --> 00:39:23,677.5373618 I felt kind of safe with you doing this, but now you reacted that way. 446 00:39:23,677.5383618 --> 00:39:24,927.5383618 So now I don't even feel safe with you. 447 00:39:25,287.5383618 --> 00:39:25,637.5383618 Oh my God. 448 00:39:25,637.5383618 --> 00:39:37,407.5383618 Who do I turn to? And I think this is again, just such a testament to getting the right help or just finding the right, whether it's a therapist, whether it's a grief coach, support group, whatever, like. 449 00:39:37,962.5383618 --> 00:40:05,487.5383618 I say this all the time, you can have very loving people around you, you can have support systems, like, it sounds like both you and I do, you know, and our partners, whoever, but if they don't really get it Or they're, and kind of of no fault of their own, not the best at like, just seeing you and letting you be sad and validating that or whatever, and they're maybe not comfortable with that, which is okay, we can't force anybody to be that way, you know, we can try and get them to open up to it, but that's not our job. 450 00:40:05,837.5383618 --> 00:40:30,507.5388618 All the more reason, I think, that finding the right people around you, or just, and honestly, sometimes it's almost like, Sometimes it's almost more comfortable going to strangers with it or going to people who are almost like a little more unbiased, but they've, they've seen loss too, or they've been through loss and like, they can empathize with it in a different way or give you that sort of like third party perspective on it or whatever. 451 00:40:30,507.5388618 --> 00:40:31,447.5383618 So I don't know. 452 00:40:31,447.5383618 --> 00:40:38,952.5383618 I know some people are uncomfortable with maybe getting help or talking to a stranger, so to speak, but like, There are some blessings. 453 00:40:38,952.6383618 --> 00:40:58,812.5373618 I did therapy myself and it was like really therapeutic at the time because I was like, I don't, oh my god, no one can understand, in my life, even though I have a lot of love around me, nobody can understand what it was to lose two parents, be the only daughter of Greg and Lori Jordan, and lose my dog a year later, you know, all the things. 454 00:40:58,842.5373618 --> 00:41:02,602.5383618 And so you're just like, kind of out on a limb by yourself, but you don't have to be. 455 00:41:02,642.5383618 --> 00:41:07,492.5373618 And so it is sometimes, you know, comforting, finding other people that can. 456 00:41:07,492.5373618 --> 00:41:07,922.5373618 Yeah. 457 00:41:08,342.5383618 --> 00:41:09,212.5383618 Absolutely. 458 00:41:09,692.5383618 --> 00:41:10,442.5383618 I like what you're saying. 459 00:41:10,442.5383618 --> 00:41:16,182.5383618 We'll definitely address this later in Smother Miss about like getting some like a neutral party and bias support. 460 00:41:16,482.5383618 --> 00:41:25,342.5383618 But also like if you are the person who's saying my loved one wouldn't be, wouldn't, wouldn't want me to be sad, like you're not even safe with yourself to be sad. 461 00:41:25,772.5383618 --> 00:41:31,597.5383618 That's really a sign that like, You might need some support because, and it's no fault of yours. 462 00:41:31,597.5383618 --> 00:41:34,567.5383618 Like we have been like brainwashed in a way to be positive. 463 00:41:34,567.5383618 --> 00:41:38,277.5373618 And if there's, if you're not happy, you need to buy this product to make you happy. 464 00:41:38,277.5383618 --> 00:41:40,87.5383618 And it's your, it's your fault that you're not happy. 465 00:41:40,87.5383618 --> 00:41:51,697.5383618 So like, you have to remember that all these messagings that we get, and that's why I wanted to talk about these myths, because we do get all these messages about grief and sadness that are really not helpful. 466 00:41:51,707.5383618 --> 00:41:57,597.5383618 They're like counterintuitive because we need to move towards, you know, It's the pain and sometimes we don't even know how to start doing that. 467 00:41:57,607.5383618 --> 00:42:09,407.5383618 So like this mini series is a great way to just even open the door a little bit and start looking and start exploring with yourself, like writing some of these journal prompts out and start just getting to know your grief and getting to know yourself. 468 00:42:09,407.5383618 --> 00:42:13,942.4383618 And like we have kind of illustrated, there's some different ways that these myths show up. 469 00:42:14,352.5383618 --> 00:42:30,662.5373618 And so it's important to take some time and sit with them and ask yourself, like, what am I believing that could be, you know, hindering me in a way, or like increasing my avoidance or, you know, putting a lot of pressure on myself or not allowing myself to go deep. 470 00:42:30,662.5373618 --> 00:42:34,112.5383618 So I think just getting to know your grief is so important. 471 00:42:34,727.5383618 --> 00:42:36,567.5383618 Yeah, beautifully said. 472 00:42:36,567.5383618 --> 00:42:40,107.5383618 I think that's like a perfect place to end this at least for this episode. 473 00:42:40,107.5383618 --> 00:42:43,597.5383618 I feel like we covered a lot in a short period of time. 474 00:42:44,177.5373618 --> 00:43:00,787.5383618 Like we said, all of these we could go into so much more detail about but I really do hope for anybody listening today that these just helped at least scratch the surface and just first of all make you just feel a little less alone and that all of these things that we're talking about in today's episode and the rest are are very very common. 475 00:43:00,837.5383618 --> 00:43:03,507.5383618 They're seen a lot, there's a lot of complexities to each one. 476 00:43:03,897.5383618 --> 00:43:06,287.5383618 There's different relationships that you have to have with each one. 477 00:43:06,287.5383618 --> 00:43:11,207.5383618 And so it's just, you know, being so gentle with ourselves, you know, and other people too. 478 00:43:12,147.5373618 --> 00:43:12,537.5373618 Right. 479 00:43:12,547.5383618 --> 00:43:22,267.5383618 This is also great for people who want to increase their grief literacy, because like, they are an HR professional, a teacher, you know, or their best friend is grieving. 480 00:43:23,322.5383618 --> 00:43:25,732.5383618 It's just helpful for us to kind of know about these myths. 481 00:43:25,732.5383618 --> 00:43:30,682.5383618 You know, we're so good at talking about all these different things in society today, all these like once taboo things. 482 00:43:30,692.5383618 --> 00:43:36,292.5373618 So I think that grief is sort of the next hurdle that we can do together as a society. 483 00:43:36,292.5383618 --> 00:43:46,92.5383618 And I'm hopeful that this would help and that people can just start to get to know themselves, whether or not they're, they're grieving right now, you know, because like loss is inevitable. 484 00:43:46,142.5383618 --> 00:43:53,682.5383618 It's not like, if you go through a hard loss in your life, but like when you go through a big change, a death, a loss. 485 00:43:54,272.5383618 --> 00:43:55,702.5383618 illness in your own life. 486 00:43:55,702.5383618 --> 00:43:59,52.5383618 Like this is something that you're going to go through. 487 00:43:59,82.5383618 --> 00:44:01,982.5383618 And so having some literacy around it, it's going to be really, really helpful. 488 00:44:03,32.5383618 --> 00:44:03,512.5383618 Amazing. 489 00:44:03,822.5383618 --> 00:44:04,152.5373618 All right. 490 00:44:04,192.5373618 --> 00:44:07,722.5383618 Well, your mini series is everything's going to be linked in the show notes as well. 491 00:44:07,732.5373618 --> 00:44:12,267.5373618 Really quick, where can people find you on social media and all the good things? Yeah. 492 00:44:12,267.5373618 --> 00:44:16,577.4373618 So Instagram, Tik TOK, the grief girly, I'll send my website, the grief girly. 493 00:44:16,577.4373618 --> 00:44:16,867.4373618 com. 494 00:44:17,477.4373618 --> 00:44:17,987.4373618 Perfect. 495 00:44:18,197.4373618 --> 00:44:18,637.4373618 Amazing. 496 00:44:18,637.4373618 --> 00:44:18,957.4373618 Okay. 497 00:44:19,277.4373618 --> 00:44:23,797.4373618 So we will see you all again in the next iteration of this series. 498 00:44:23,827.4373618 --> 00:44:29,437.4373618 We have some other really good controversial, but also juicy topics to get into. 499 00:44:30,57.4373618 --> 00:44:32,807.4373618 I'm super excited, but Shay, so much for your time today. 500 00:44:32,807.4373618 --> 00:44:33,477.4373618 This was. 501 00:44:34,112.4373618 --> 00:44:35,22.4373618 Weirdly fun. 502 00:44:36,482.4373618 --> 00:44:37,42.4373618 I am glad. 503 00:44:37,42.4373618 --> 00:44:38,422.4373618 I love how positive you are. 504 00:44:38,422.4373618 --> 00:44:40,862.4373618 That always, like, helps when we're talking about these heavy things. 505 00:44:42,82.4373618 --> 00:44:43,522.4373618 I always joke, we can laugh about it now. 506 00:44:44,152.4363618 --> 00:44:44,902.4373618 Yeah, for now. 507 00:44:46,702.4373618 --> 00:44:47,342.4363618 so much, Shay. 508 00:44:48,192.4363618 --> 00:44:48,862.4373618 Thank you. 509 00:44:50,512.4373618 --> 00:44:54,112.4373618 I am sending you a huge thank you for tuning into today's episode. 510 00:44:54,142.4373618 --> 00:44:54,622.4373618 My friend. 511 00:44:54,982.4373618 --> 00:44:56,242.4373618 I'm so grateful you're here. 512 00:44:56,242.4373618 --> 00:44:58,732.4373618 And for the steps you were taking to heal your heart. 513 00:44:59,92.4373618 --> 00:44:59,932.4373618 Open your mind. 514 00:45:00,202.4373618 --> 00:45:08,392.4373618 Fulfill your soul learn, grow, and evolve and move through this crazy thing called life in big, beautiful, impactful ways. 515 00:45:08,962.4373618 --> 00:45:10,822.4373618 Visit losses become gains.com 516 00:45:10,822.4373618 --> 00:45:11,602.4373618 for my blog. 517 00:45:11,872.4373618 --> 00:45:21,112.4373618 Ways to work with me to shop my daily journal and so much more, and be sure you're following along on Instagram and Facebook at life with grief podcast. 518 00:45:21,512.4373618 --> 00:45:26,402.4373618 I love seeing new faces, meeting new people, hearing your stories and supporting you. 519 00:45:26,432.4373618 --> 00:45:27,392.4373618 However I can. 520 00:45:27,902.4373618 --> 00:45:29,312.4373618 Be sure to hit that subscribe button. 521 00:45:29,312.4373618 --> 00:45:33,602.4373618 If you haven't already, if you haven't left a rating or review, please do so. 522 00:45:33,602.4373618 --> 00:45:34,862.4373618 I would so appreciate it. 523 00:45:35,162.4373618 --> 00:45:40,472.4373618 Or if you feel so inclined to share this episode or this podcast with someone who could use it too. 524 00:45:41,162.4373618 --> 00:45:42,692.4373618 I'll catch you in the next episode.