March 26, 2025 • 27 mins
In this deeply moving episode, Lisa Sugarman and Gretchen Schoser dive into Gretchen’s powerful story of survival, sharing the events that led to her breaking point and the path she took to reclaim her life. Together, they explore the importance of boundaries, community, and speaking up—even when it feels impossible.
🎥 Watch the Video Podcast on YouTube
A video version of this episode is available here:
👉 https://www.youtube.com/@TheSurvivorsPodcastChannel
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💬 Episode Summary
In this raw and profoundly human episode, co-host Gretchen shares her emotional journey through depression, grief, and survival after a life-altering series of events in 2022. From early retirement and her spouse’s illness to a terrifying car accident, being catfished, and enduring multiple personal losses, Gretchen found herself on the brink—until a freezing Christmas Day pushed her to reach out to the 988 Lifeline.
What followed was a transformational healing journey powered by therapy, boundary-setting, and the bold sharing of her truth. Now a thriving business owner and host of two mental health podcasts, Gretchen’s story is a testament to resilience, community, and reclaiming your voice.
🔑 Key Takeaways
Extroverts Can Be in Crisis, Too: People who always seem “okay” may hide intense struggles. Don’t overlook them—ask more profound questions.
Healing Isn’t Linear: Growth comes in waves. Gretchen’s journey shows that recovery takes time, tools, and constant learning.
Boundaries Are Life-Saving: Saying “no” and protecting your emotional space is essential—especially for empaths.
✅ Actionable Items
Save & Share 988: Add the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline to your phone and share it with others: https://988lifeline.org
Check on Your “Strong” Friends: Go beyond “How are you?” Ask intentional, caring questions and create space for honest answers.
Protect Your Peace: Audit your emotional energy regularly. Gretchen uses a mental “black box” to keep out unnecessary drama.
⏱️ Episode Chapters
00:00 - Intro & Content Warning
00:24 - Gretchen’s Mental Health Spiral
07:03 - Rock Bottom on Christmas Day
08:33 - Finding Support & Starting Therapy
10:50 - Sharing Her Story Publicly
13:20 - Creating a New Purpose
24:55 - The Power of Community & Visibility
26:40 - Final Thoughts & Resources
📚 Resources Mentioned in This Episode
(00:32):
I'm alive today because of my story.
So my whole mental health journey started the last quarter of 2022.
And so much shit happened.
And my little 411 body, I just didn't know what the fuck to do.
(00:52):
This all the things were happening.
So in September of 2022, I got the opportunity to take an earlier retirement from my job.
I know when you looked at me, I looked all of 12, you know what?
I did it.
I'm very fortunate that I looked 12.
And unless I go and buy beer and then they want to see my driver's license.
(01:16):
Whatever.
But I had decided to take an earlier retirement and then share roles October.
And I'm not told where my wife got shingles.
And if you ever met anybody that has had shingles, you know, if there's nothing you can do
for them.
And I've never seen her in that much pain.
And I'm a true empath.
(01:39):
So when she was hurting, I was hurting and trying to deal with the fact that I'm taking
an earlier retirement soon work, which in itself sounds like a really great idea.
But at the time, I was 59 and a half.
And we all know that there's a little age as well in the workforce.
And so I was a little concerned about getting a job because I let my blusiny toys.
(02:03):
It do like your proof.
I do love my blusiny toys.
So we progressed through my wife had shingles.
We had decided to take a little like a day road trip to Letchworth Falls, which is in
upstate New York.
And we had rented a car and we were just driving along and out of sucks and nowhere to
(02:27):
the deer, right?
But like literally like I had a meet see the car driver behind us to see it and takes out
the whole passenger side of the rental car.
Do you know I don't even know this story?
You have never told me this story.
So we're standing on the side of the road in this like, um, sucks, nowhere, right?
(02:50):
Like if you've, if you've ever been to upstate New York, like there's a lot of these little
towns that are like this big, like super tiny, right?
Standing on the side of the road, I'm shaking my to leave.
It's late October and you know, kind of cold and the driver behind us said she had
(03:11):
to leave and see the deer.
And so we were standing there and my saison humanity came back that day because there were a couple
of drivers like old red necks that were driving down the wrecked.
Are you ladies okay?
And we're like fine.
And so that whole thing put me in such a state.
And here I am still worried about my wife right?
She's like in so much pain.
(03:32):
We had a friend in the back of the car and he didn't know what to do.
So like we went along with the rental car back to Rochester and like things are compiling
right?
So I already like started to leave my job.
My wife has signals now I hit a sucking gear.
We get to the rental car.
Why something?
(03:53):
Always something right?
So we get to the rental car place and I'm already freaked out right?
Like we're lumping along going like 20 miles an hour on the highway and people are like
honking at me and I'm like, fuck I can't go any faster.
I go right side of my car is gone.
Get to Rochester, go to go get a new rental car and the guy was such a dead right?
Like I'm already like a state.
(04:15):
He's like well do you have a police report?
What the fuck now I don't have a police report but dear's dead.
Kay like I didn't get a report.
There's a report okay?
You like it's here.
Dear dead.
He was like so adamant about this.
Like in the police report.
You know I'm still like really from all this life's in a lot of pain.
(04:36):
You know the guy that was in the back seat.
He was like all freaked out and I'm like trying to like maintain semblance of like
tame okay and okay and I like I self like my chest height.
So we get home after getting a new rental car and then during all of this I got chaffished.
(04:57):
Thankfully.
Were you dating?
Were you cheating on your wife?
I was cheating on my wife.
I was like an emotional attachment right?
Because as my wife was like dealing with the shingle stuff I was trying to figure out my wife.
Thankfully I got to the point where I didn't spend any money right?
(05:19):
Like I.
But you knew that scammed.
I totally got scared.
You didn't get cat fished.
No I got cat fished.
Did you?
Yeah.
And a whole bunch of shit.
Yeah.
It was crazy.
So you know still have all this like depression and like negative self talk and shit going on
in the head.
And then we had a really good friend of ours who passed away unexpectedly unexpectedly.
(05:43):
And so you know still more shit still trying to figure out what my next.
Well my next place that I'd be for work and things like that.
And you know being 59 and a half you know I was taught not to talk about what was going
on inside my head.
Number one I didn't understand what it was.
Number two I didn't really know how to talk about it because I didn't understand what
(06:04):
I was.
So then I you know our friend passed away and then right close to Thanksgiving my father
don't want passed away.
Now throw in a little bit of seasonal depression and a little holiday depression.
And it's a perfect storm.
And it was a perfect storm.
And so if you go back and go to shit that goes on our heads go list of the season one episode
(06:29):
three.
Maybe not listen with small children because I showed the word fuck like 47 times.
Or the first time that she says it in this podcast.
Just saying.
And by that time I should have known that something was really wrong.
I ended up getting really drunk.
I lost my cell phone in New York City.
And then here comes Christopher stay and I Christopher stay in I've seen New York.
(06:54):
He was minus 22 outside.
My display.
And I just wanted to know for a drive.
I got my car.
My car doesn't start.
And now I'm just completely defeated.
Like I was mad.
I was sad.
I was angry.
(07:16):
And I just didn't know what to do.
So I came back in the house and I didn't even tell my wife.
I just went upstairs to my bedroom and I was like crying and so.
And all these pent up emotions in my head.
And I had remembered that I had read an article like in November of that year about the
(07:37):
98 crisis.
Mine.
And I just needed to talk to somebody again.
I wanted to talk to my wife.
But I didn't know what to tell.
I didn't have the words.
I had my flinting.
So I ended up contacting the 98 crisis fine because I was ready to end my wife right then.
Thank God for 988.
(07:57):
And so woman on the other end of the line was the most repassionate woman I've ever talked
to.
And she gave me some tips and she gave me some information that contacted Sarah Prost and.
You know, told me that it was going to be okay and that you know, she would hang on to
hang on the phone with me as long as I needed to just kind of get some footing.
(08:22):
I get off the phone with her and before I get out search to my wife, I contacted the
therapist and made an appointment for the very next day.
So now I like getting the courage and I went down and I talked to my wife.
Now at this time, this point, nobody knew how depressed I was.
I went to complete, I'm 100% extra rude.
(08:46):
And I would show up work every day with smiling face.
I would talk to friends with a smiling face.
I, you know, so on the outside, I looked perfectly fine.
And the inside, all I wanted to do was die.
I was totally in such a bad.
And so what happened after I talked to my wife, I mean, she was mad that I couldn't tell
(09:08):
her what was going on.
But I didn't know how to tell her what was going on.
It's hard.
Like when you don't know yourself, what you're feeling and you don't, maybe you've never
had a panic attack and you don't even know what, what the signs and symptoms are when
you're dysregulated like that.
Sometimes you just have not got the words for it.
(09:29):
Yeah.
And like there were no podcasts.
You were mixing them and I could listen to like I tried to drown out the voice just from
my head with music and now I know why I was born through because I'm writing my book.
I kind of do towing out like what happened and what I would have done differently.
If he's never written anything like it's super cathart and you learn a ton of lessons
(09:54):
met yourself.
One of the things that you know, people could have picked up on is like I was foodfully
checked the fuck out.
But I didn't want to join the decorations.
I didn't hang out with anybody.
But sit in my recliner and just let them badge out.
I was like so tapped out and one of the things that happened with my job is that once I decided
(10:16):
that I was taking my earlier tire length, it took all my responsibilities away from it.
So now I've felt even more worthless.
Like there was nothing, nothing left for me to give.
And that accent like I would just push to side.
In mid-December I had gotten a new job.
I wasn't going to start until July of 2023 because I want to meet in each way so my retirement.
(10:39):
So I like that was like another small glimmer of hope.
But because I was so depressed, I couldn't even, I couldn't sadden what was going on.
So the day after my suicide attempt, I guess I think I'm here today.
That woman was a thing amazing.
I decided to share my journey on social media because I have a ton of friends.
(11:04):
I'm an extra word.
I have a party or a bed like so.
Hang out with me.
So you're very adorable and you're very fun to talk to.
So it's for those who don't know G.E.
She's all four eleven.
Powerhouse.
You're like a little garden gnome.
I am the garden gnome.
So the next day I share my journey on social media and people were terrified.
(11:29):
They didn't know what to do, what to say because they didn't realize how depressed I was.
My one point I want to make is if you have an extra word or friend, take the time to really
check on them.
Like ask crowding questions.
Ask the question that knows that they have to answer.
Because that's one thing that people didn't ask.
(11:50):
They would ask me what to do.
How should I do it?
I'm like, hey, you know, live in the drain.
You're in the inside of like, fuck, I'm done.
I couldn't take any more pain anymore.
Any more angst.
It was all a lot.
So as soon as I share my journey on social media, about 200 people reach out and thank me.
(12:15):
Because now they didn't feel so terrified in the world of their own journey.
And that was kind of like my answer.
Number one, a lot of people know what was going on.
Number two, to let people know that they're not alone, that there are people like me, like
the least of like nobody expected that to be extremely depressed.
So then I started talking to my cocos from shit that goes on our heads, which is dirty
(12:39):
skittles.
Now, dirty skills that I worked together for like seven years.
And at the time, she was my manager.
I used to curl superwereously because I retired in April.
But we would call each other every day and just laugh about shit.
You probably should laugh about it.
But it helped set the subject rate for the day because even if I was one through something
(13:01):
bad, my endorphins were up.
And I sound like my two healers were sharing my journey and laughing.
So one day during our conversations of laughter, like sits of laughter, like there are a couple
of times actually what might pants.
You know what?
I'm not ashamed to admit it.
It shows your humanness.
It shows your human side.
(13:22):
I'm my human side, right?
You know what?
My pants.
But she's like, hey, we should do a podcast.
So we ended up doing a podcast.
We released our first episode on February 14, 2023.
We got stuck to your mental well-being with Calmary, trusted online therapy platform that
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(13:45):
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And the reason I chose that day is that I had buried my mom in February 14, 1997.
So I wanted to change the trajectory of that day.
And healing was not easy.
(14:07):
There's no easy button.
But I sound like each day got a little better and a little easier.
And my wife and I started having deeper conversations and figuring out what were the things that
gave me a lot of angst.
One of the things I started to do was set boundaries.
(14:28):
As an empath, that was the best thing I've ever done in my life.
I have this, I have a black box, right?
It's an imaginary thing.
Imaginary black box.
And it smells like drama.
Like I really have to think about letting that drama into me because sometimes they don't
know how to turn it off.
So started setting the boundaries.
(14:52):
Life changing.
Like if you haven't done it yet, set those boundaries.
That was my biggest thing this year.
It was setting boundaries.
My therapist, my kids, they're all so proud of me because it is where I have worked the
hardest.
I totally get it because you're your co-host and I'm pointing to myself is a fellow empath
and it is man is hard work to think about yourself.
(15:14):
It is.
And so like once I started doing that, things got better.
But I will tell you that I had to, and I'm going to coin this phrase from Journey Skittles
who is the co-host on Shadyo's on our heads.
I just speedate my therapist.
So I went through three different therapists before I found one that really worked for me.
(15:38):
So then let's fast forward to July 2020.
I get this job.
I'm working for a really small group of small people because when I left my corporate job,
I thought I don't want to work for a big company ever again.
And things went along smoothly.
I was very simple.
Once they had found out I had award-winning podcasts, they asked me why I came back to work
(16:01):
for a time and I was like, well, I need benefits.
So they offered me 30 hours a week and benefits.
So I did that for a year and a half.
And then fast forward to November of last year, 2024, they got acquired by Urszmi out.
And if you know anything about Urszmi on their huge consulting firm, and like, I don't
(16:24):
want to do that.
And I went back into my kind of my old ways.
I was wasting up every day with anxiety attacks and I just couldn't do it.
Like I couldn't cite it as a lead to do that.
So I knew in my heart that's not what I wanted to do.
And I made them make self a promise too.
And it wouldn't compromise anymore because in '61 I've compromised my entire life.
(16:52):
And this time I wasn't going to compromise.
So my wife and I had been in New York City and she said, hey, why don't you quit your job?
And I'm like, ooh, okay, it's kind of scary, right?
I worked because I want to work now because I have to work.
(17:12):
So we're sitting down the plane coming back from New York City.
And I realized how long it takes to do this guy's plane.
But yeah, I love to quit.
It's not quick.
It's not quick.
But it gave me time to like, I had my resume on my phone and I had Chachi PT on my phone.
And so I put my resume into Chachi PT and I'm like, hey, designed it into Pseonatio, it's
(17:34):
all to go from based on what my life experience was done on the podcast.
I spent two minutes later and spent some time on that.
I was like, oh, this is kind of like what I want to do.
So I tweaked it down.
And I had also gotten some really nice with, should it go on her head.
I had had a couple of big sponsors that were interested in our podcast.
(17:59):
So if you've ever worked for like Air Sv'A or any of the big consulting firms, they have
these independent closets, meaning like if they've done any audits on these clients on
these customers, you can't do business with them.
So that was sign number two that it was time to live on.
And then with my book, I've had a couple of publishers that are shunks of interest.
(18:22):
And I've like, I really wanted to dive into that.
And in between all of this is when I had my chat with Lisa and I was like, wait.
We signed.
We signed.
It was hard.
So hard.
So on January 2nd, I gave my two weeks notice that same day I formed a company called Shows
(18:42):
Your Talent in Wallace.
And I'm now like a month and a half into my business and pressing it.
And I've never been happier.
But that like I turned my horrible pain into purpose.
And I just want people to see me as a story of hope.
(19:04):
And I will tell you, it was not easy.
I still like my emotions still, but as well, just like everybody else was.
And now I have better tools and better things to help me get from day to day.
And I don't ever want to get to a point where it was on Christmas day 2022.
And I don't want you to get to that point.
(19:25):
You're talking about it, does he?
Like, that's the thing.
That's like, that's the secret sauce, right?
And we talk about what's going on, how you could talk to your wife in a different way, in
a deeper, more powerful way, more honest and authentic way, how you were feeling and what
(19:46):
was really going on.
And it's about being honest with ourselves too.
And kind of understanding the signs and signals that our bodies are sending us and that
our brains are sending us when we're not okay.
We're like so in tune with all of those things now in a way that you weren't.
So you kind of, you know, you kind of rode the wave to this point.
(20:10):
That's the way of you rode was, you know, learning how to navigate talking more, being more
open, being more vulnerable, asking questions, sharing information about yourself.
And you know, that's what got you to hear.
But it's so important that you remember you like, it is not an overnight thing.
(20:33):
It's not.
It's no quick fix.
There's no quick fix.
It was like, think of like being on a beach and like body surfing and getting cracked in
the head, 87,000 times with a wave.
And then just getting back up.
And I really struggled.
I mean, I've probably been depressed my entire life, but having that much happen in such a
(20:57):
short period of time, literally crushed myself.
What I change it?
No, because I wouldn't be where I am today.
Sometimes you have to go through some really hard shit so that you can find your true past.
You know what else you have to do?
(21:17):
You have to sit in that shit.
Yeah.
And sitting in it is so big.
And there's no like I said, there's no easy button, but I get to be like through south.
I get to be vulnerable.
I'm still an empaths.
I'm still an extrovert.
But I will say when all the shit went down in November of 2024, this time I didn't keep
(21:41):
it silent like everybody knew where I stood.
Not only here at home, but also social media.
I worked with like, you could only hide restroom bitch face for so long before they tell you
to come off camera.
It was so funny during that time, not funny, but like, I guess it was kind of funny that you
(22:03):
would get off these calls and then you'd get on a call with me and be like, they all saw
my bitch face.
Like, you could see it from space.
It was so prominent.
I couldn't get away from it.
I couldn't get away from it, but I felt so proud of myself that I knew where I had been and
where I was now and that I could be honest about my emotions and that people would understand.
(22:28):
Have I lost some friends in this process?
Yes.
But you know what?
There's a reason in the season for friendship.
But at the same time, I took my little podcast shit and it goes, "Hell, I'm going to
go on our heads with dirty skills."
And we were able to over mask a million downloads in December of 20, 20th work and we're
(22:54):
listening to an over 60 tonne each.
It's just amazing what you've been doing.
You're an East like this and telling our stories have a ripple effect.
And I hope that I can, I hope my story touches somebody else's life and knows that they're
not alone and that they are worth it.
And that will and flimmer of hope.
(23:17):
Hope should make that full call.
Like I said, "My N88 is free.
You can call, you can text.
This people are amazing."
Yeah.
There, you know, look, there are less to be learned through everything that we go through,
right?
Like the good stuff, the bad stuff, you know, we can't avoid both sides of it.
(23:38):
It's life.
It doesn't matter whether, you know, you're dealing with your own mental illness or someone
else's or you've lost a job or you're, you know, you're grieving someone or something.
Like the things that you and I talk about and the things that you and I have been through
are things that like everybody.
If you are a human, you are touched in some way by these things.
(24:03):
So why in the hell are we not all talking about all these things all the time?
That's the point.
What we're doing here.
I'm sad.
And, you know, people are like, you're so crazy to be doing another podcast.
Well, you know what, we're still doing shit that goes on our heads because we, in that
podcast, we talk with different individuals that are going through some mental health journey
(24:29):
or have got through some really crappy stuff.
But I wanted to do a podcast that really focused on suicide, not only from a survivor,
but from an attempt, a suicide attempt plan view.
Because it's our stories that usually get shamed and are not heard and need to be heard.
(24:52):
Now more than ever, these stories need to be fair.
And we need, we need to come together as a community and help each other.
There's things, times are really tough and just like one other thing to touch on is the
LGBTQIA+ tunity.
(25:14):
I know we're all suffering, but please know that there are crisis lines like the Trevor
Hawaid 9/8.
There are resources out there.
The world needs you.
They cannot shut us up.
They can't.
And I think that's a perfect opportunity for you and I to talk about, there's so much intersectionality
(25:35):
with the two of us and what we do.
We have this intersection of mental health challenge that we both had to navigate and
suicide, loss and grief.
We're both part of the queer community.
I am a crisis counselor for the Trevor Project and we are a marginalized community right
(25:55):
now.
There are so many marginalized communities out there, but you and I happen to be part of
the LGBTQ community and that's, you know, we're getting hit into the head and to the gut
every, you know, every single day now.
So if you're listening and you're part of our community, not just the survivor's community
but the queer community, like we are here for you.
(26:17):
We are there to show you the way, help you connect to the resources that you need because
you're not alone.
You are not alone.
And we can't wait to talk to you guys next week and thank you all for tuning in and please
remember, you are enough, you are needed, you are wanted in this world.
(26:38):
You help reach out.
Hey, man, love you, gee.
I mean, we are whatever your name is.
Jack.
Well, love you, Jack.
Bob, just call me Bob from now on.
Okay.
Thanks for joining us on the survivors.
For no matter how tough things feel, you are enough and the world means you're just the
(26:59):
way you are.
You're not alone in this journey.
There's a community here and every step forward counts.
We're so grateful you took the time to listen and we hope they'll take one day at a time.
Just know there's always more light ahead.
Thanks for being here friends.
Just remember, help is out there in so many different places.
So if you or someone you know is struggling, please call 988 and a trained crisis counselor
(27:22):
like me will be there to help.
You can also find an inclusive and comprehensive directory of mental health resources, tools,
and content at the help hub dot CEO.
Just remember that help is always just a call or a click away.
We'll catch you next week.
In the meantime, keep surviving.
- 988 Suicide & Crisis Lifeline – https://988lifeline.org
- The Trevor Project (LGBTQIA+ Youth Crisis Line) – https://www.thetrevorproject.org
- Sh!t That Goes On In Our Heads Podcast – https://goesoninourheads.net
- Calmerry – Online Therapy – https://calmerry.com
- Schoser Talent and Wellness Solutions – https://schosersolutions.com
- The HelpHUB™ – https://www.thehelphub.co
- The Survivors Podcast Website – https://thesurvivors.net
(00:32):
I'm alive today because of my story.
So my whole mental health journey started the last quarter of 2022.
And so much shit happened.
And my little 411 body, I just didn't know what the fuck to do.
(00:52):
This all the things were happening.
So in September of 2022, I got the opportunity to take an earlier retirement from my job.
I know when you looked at me, I looked all of 12, you know what?
I did it.
I'm very fortunate that I looked 12.
And unless I go and buy beer and then they want to see my driver's license.
(01:16):
Whatever.
But I had decided to take an earlier retirement and then share roles October.
And I'm not told where my wife got shingles.
And if you ever met anybody that has had shingles, you know, if there's nothing you can do
for them.
And I've never seen her in that much pain.
And I'm a true empath.
(01:39):
So when she was hurting, I was hurting and trying to deal with the fact that I'm taking
an earlier retirement soon work, which in itself sounds like a really great idea.
But at the time, I was 59 and a half.
And we all know that there's a little age as well in the workforce.
And so I was a little concerned about getting a job because I let my blusiny toys.
(02:03):
It do like your proof.
I do love my blusiny toys.
So we progressed through my wife had shingles.
We had decided to take a little like a day road trip to Letchworth Falls, which is in
upstate New York.
And we had rented a car and we were just driving along and out of sucks and nowhere to
(02:27):
the deer, right?
But like literally like I had a meet see the car driver behind us to see it and takes out
the whole passenger side of the rental car.
Do you know I don't even know this story?
You have never told me this story.
So we're standing on the side of the road in this like, um, sucks, nowhere, right?
(02:50):
Like if you've, if you've ever been to upstate New York, like there's a lot of these little
towns that are like this big, like super tiny, right?
Standing on the side of the road, I'm shaking my to leave.
It's late October and you know, kind of cold and the driver behind us said she had
(03:11):
to leave and see the deer.
And so we were standing there and my saison humanity came back that day because there were a couple
of drivers like old red necks that were driving down the wrecked.
Are you ladies okay?
And we're like fine.
And so that whole thing put me in such a state.
And here I am still worried about my wife right?
She's like in so much pain.
(03:32):
We had a friend in the back of the car and he didn't know what to do.
So like we went along with the rental car back to Rochester and like things are compiling
right?
So I already like started to leave my job.
My wife has signals now I hit a sucking gear.
We get to the rental car.
Why something?
(03:53):
Always something right?
So we get to the rental car place and I'm already freaked out right?
Like we're lumping along going like 20 miles an hour on the highway and people are like
honking at me and I'm like, fuck I can't go any faster.
I go right side of my car is gone.
Get to Rochester, go to go get a new rental car and the guy was such a dead right?
Like I'm already like a state.
(04:15):
He's like well do you have a police report?
What the fuck now I don't have a police report but dear's dead.
Kay like I didn't get a report.
There's a report okay?
You like it's here.
Dear dead.
He was like so adamant about this.
Like in the police report.
You know I'm still like really from all this life's in a lot of pain.
(04:36):
You know the guy that was in the back seat.
He was like all freaked out and I'm like trying to like maintain semblance of like
tame okay and okay and I like I self like my chest height.
So we get home after getting a new rental car and then during all of this I got chaffished.
(04:57):
Thankfully.
Were you dating?
Were you cheating on your wife?
I was cheating on my wife.
I was like an emotional attachment right?
Because as my wife was like dealing with the shingle stuff I was trying to figure out my wife.
Thankfully I got to the point where I didn't spend any money right?
(05:19):
Like I.
But you knew that scammed.
I totally got scared.
You didn't get cat fished.
No I got cat fished.
Did you?
Yeah.
And a whole bunch of shit.
Yeah.
It was crazy.
So you know still have all this like depression and like negative self talk and shit going on
in the head.
And then we had a really good friend of ours who passed away unexpectedly unexpectedly.
(05:43):
And so you know still more shit still trying to figure out what my next.
Well my next place that I'd be for work and things like that.
And you know being 59 and a half you know I was taught not to talk about what was going
on inside my head.
Number one I didn't understand what it was.
Number two I didn't really know how to talk about it because I didn't understand what
(06:04):
I was.
So then I you know our friend passed away and then right close to Thanksgiving my father
don't want passed away.
Now throw in a little bit of seasonal depression and a little holiday depression.
And it's a perfect storm.
And it was a perfect storm.
And so if you go back and go to shit that goes on our heads go list of the season one episode
(06:29):
three.
Maybe not listen with small children because I showed the word fuck like 47 times.
Or the first time that she says it in this podcast.
Just saying.
And by that time I should have known that something was really wrong.
I ended up getting really drunk.
I lost my cell phone in New York City.
And then here comes Christopher stay and I Christopher stay in I've seen New York.
(06:54):
He was minus 22 outside.
My display.
And I just wanted to know for a drive.
I got my car.
My car doesn't start.
And now I'm just completely defeated.
Like I was mad.
I was sad.
I was angry.
(07:16):
And I just didn't know what to do.
So I came back in the house and I didn't even tell my wife.
I just went upstairs to my bedroom and I was like crying and so.
And all these pent up emotions in my head.
And I had remembered that I had read an article like in November of that year about the
(07:37):
98 crisis.
Mine.
And I just needed to talk to somebody again.
I wanted to talk to my wife.
But I didn't know what to tell.
I didn't have the words.
I had my flinting.
So I ended up contacting the 98 crisis fine because I was ready to end my wife right then.
Thank God for 988.
(07:57):
And so woman on the other end of the line was the most repassionate woman I've ever talked
to.
And she gave me some tips and she gave me some information that contacted Sarah Prost and.
You know, told me that it was going to be okay and that you know, she would hang on to
hang on the phone with me as long as I needed to just kind of get some footing.
(08:22):
I get off the phone with her and before I get out search to my wife, I contacted the
therapist and made an appointment for the very next day.
So now I like getting the courage and I went down and I talked to my wife.
Now at this time, this point, nobody knew how depressed I was.
I went to complete, I'm 100% extra rude.
(08:46):
And I would show up work every day with smiling face.
I would talk to friends with a smiling face.
I, you know, so on the outside, I looked perfectly fine.
And the inside, all I wanted to do was die.
I was totally in such a bad.
And so what happened after I talked to my wife, I mean, she was mad that I couldn't tell
(09:08):
her what was going on.
But I didn't know how to tell her what was going on.
It's hard.
Like when you don't know yourself, what you're feeling and you don't, maybe you've never
had a panic attack and you don't even know what, what the signs and symptoms are when
you're dysregulated like that.
Sometimes you just have not got the words for it.
(09:29):
Yeah.
And like there were no podcasts.
You were mixing them and I could listen to like I tried to drown out the voice just from
my head with music and now I know why I was born through because I'm writing my book.
I kind of do towing out like what happened and what I would have done differently.
If he's never written anything like it's super cathart and you learn a ton of lessons
(09:54):
met yourself.
One of the things that you know, people could have picked up on is like I was foodfully
checked the fuck out.
But I didn't want to join the decorations.
I didn't hang out with anybody.
But sit in my recliner and just let them badge out.
I was like so tapped out and one of the things that happened with my job is that once I decided
(10:16):
that I was taking my earlier tire length, it took all my responsibilities away from it.
So now I've felt even more worthless.
Like there was nothing, nothing left for me to give.
And that accent like I would just push to side.
In mid-December I had gotten a new job.
I wasn't going to start until July of 2023 because I want to meet in each way so my retirement.
(10:39):
So I like that was like another small glimmer of hope.
But because I was so depressed, I couldn't even, I couldn't sadden what was going on.
So the day after my suicide attempt, I guess I think I'm here today.
That woman was a thing amazing.
I decided to share my journey on social media because I have a ton of friends.
(11:04):
I'm an extra word.
I have a party or a bed like so.
Hang out with me.
So you're very adorable and you're very fun to talk to.
So it's for those who don't know G.E.
She's all four eleven.
Powerhouse.
You're like a little garden gnome.
I am the garden gnome.
So the next day I share my journey on social media and people were terrified.
(11:29):
They didn't know what to do, what to say because they didn't realize how depressed I was.
My one point I want to make is if you have an extra word or friend, take the time to really
check on them.
Like ask crowding questions.
Ask the question that knows that they have to answer.
Because that's one thing that people didn't ask.
(11:50):
They would ask me what to do.
How should I do it?
I'm like, hey, you know, live in the drain.
You're in the inside of like, fuck, I'm done.
I couldn't take any more pain anymore.
Any more angst.
It was all a lot.
So as soon as I share my journey on social media, about 200 people reach out and thank me.
(12:15):
Because now they didn't feel so terrified in the world of their own journey.
And that was kind of like my answer.
Number one, a lot of people know what was going on.
Number two, to let people know that they're not alone, that there are people like me, like
the least of like nobody expected that to be extremely depressed.
So then I started talking to my cocos from shit that goes on our heads, which is dirty
(12:39):
skittles.
Now, dirty skills that I worked together for like seven years.
And at the time, she was my manager.
I used to curl superwereously because I retired in April.
But we would call each other every day and just laugh about shit.
You probably should laugh about it.
But it helped set the subject rate for the day because even if I was one through something
(13:01):
bad, my endorphins were up.
And I sound like my two healers were sharing my journey and laughing.
So one day during our conversations of laughter, like sits of laughter, like there are a couple
of times actually what might pants.
You know what?
I'm not ashamed to admit it.
It shows your humanness.
It shows your human side.
(13:22):
I'm my human side, right?
You know what?
My pants.
But she's like, hey, we should do a podcast.
So we ended up doing a podcast.
We released our first episode on February 14, 2023.
We got stuck to your mental well-being with Calmary, trusted online therapy platform that
supports you through life's challenges, connect with licensed therapists and reap the
(13:45):
benefits of traditional therapy enhanced with digital tools whenever you need it.
Visit calmery.com to get started.
And the reason I chose that day is that I had buried my mom in February 14, 1997.
So I wanted to change the trajectory of that day.
And healing was not easy.
(14:07):
There's no easy button.
But I sound like each day got a little better and a little easier.
And my wife and I started having deeper conversations and figuring out what were the things that
gave me a lot of angst.
One of the things I started to do was set boundaries.
(14:28):
As an empath, that was the best thing I've ever done in my life.
I have this, I have a black box, right?
It's an imaginary thing.
Imaginary black box.
And it smells like drama.
Like I really have to think about letting that drama into me because sometimes they don't
know how to turn it off.
So started setting the boundaries.
(14:52):
Life changing.
Like if you haven't done it yet, set those boundaries.
That was my biggest thing this year.
It was setting boundaries.
My therapist, my kids, they're all so proud of me because it is where I have worked the
hardest.
I totally get it because you're your co-host and I'm pointing to myself is a fellow empath
and it is man is hard work to think about yourself.
(15:14):
It is.
And so like once I started doing that, things got better.
But I will tell you that I had to, and I'm going to coin this phrase from Journey Skittles
who is the co-host on Shadyo's on our heads.
I just speedate my therapist.
So I went through three different therapists before I found one that really worked for me.
(15:38):
So then let's fast forward to July 2020.
I get this job.
I'm working for a really small group of small people because when I left my corporate job,
I thought I don't want to work for a big company ever again.
And things went along smoothly.
I was very simple.
Once they had found out I had award-winning podcasts, they asked me why I came back to work
(16:01):
for a time and I was like, well, I need benefits.
So they offered me 30 hours a week and benefits.
So I did that for a year and a half.
And then fast forward to November of last year, 2024, they got acquired by Urszmi out.
And if you know anything about Urszmi on their huge consulting firm, and like, I don't
(16:24):
want to do that.
And I went back into my kind of my old ways.
I was wasting up every day with anxiety attacks and I just couldn't do it.
Like I couldn't cite it as a lead to do that.
So I knew in my heart that's not what I wanted to do.
And I made them make self a promise too.
And it wouldn't compromise anymore because in '61 I've compromised my entire life.
(16:52):
And this time I wasn't going to compromise.
So my wife and I had been in New York City and she said, hey, why don't you quit your job?
And I'm like, ooh, okay, it's kind of scary, right?
I worked because I want to work now because I have to work.
(17:12):
So we're sitting down the plane coming back from New York City.
And I realized how long it takes to do this guy's plane.
But yeah, I love to quit.
It's not quick.
It's not quick.
But it gave me time to like, I had my resume on my phone and I had Chachi PT on my phone.
And so I put my resume into Chachi PT and I'm like, hey, designed it into Pseonatio, it's
(17:34):
all to go from based on what my life experience was done on the podcast.
I spent two minutes later and spent some time on that.
I was like, oh, this is kind of like what I want to do.
So I tweaked it down.
And I had also gotten some really nice with, should it go on her head.
I had had a couple of big sponsors that were interested in our podcast.
(17:59):
So if you've ever worked for like Air Sv'A or any of the big consulting firms, they have
these independent closets, meaning like if they've done any audits on these clients on
these customers, you can't do business with them.
So that was sign number two that it was time to live on.
And then with my book, I've had a couple of publishers that are shunks of interest.
(18:22):
And I've like, I really wanted to dive into that.
And in between all of this is when I had my chat with Lisa and I was like, wait.
We signed.
We signed.
It was hard.
So hard.
So on January 2nd, I gave my two weeks notice that same day I formed a company called Shows
(18:42):
Your Talent in Wallace.
And I'm now like a month and a half into my business and pressing it.
And I've never been happier.
But that like I turned my horrible pain into purpose.
And I just want people to see me as a story of hope.
(19:04):
And I will tell you, it was not easy.
I still like my emotions still, but as well, just like everybody else was.
And now I have better tools and better things to help me get from day to day.
And I don't ever want to get to a point where it was on Christmas day 2022.
And I don't want you to get to that point.
(19:25):
You're talking about it, does he?
Like, that's the thing.
That's like, that's the secret sauce, right?
And we talk about what's going on, how you could talk to your wife in a different way, in
a deeper, more powerful way, more honest and authentic way, how you were feeling and what
(19:46):
was really going on.
And it's about being honest with ourselves too.
And kind of understanding the signs and signals that our bodies are sending us and that
our brains are sending us when we're not okay.
We're like so in tune with all of those things now in a way that you weren't.
So you kind of, you know, you kind of rode the wave to this point.
(20:10):
That's the way of you rode was, you know, learning how to navigate talking more, being more
open, being more vulnerable, asking questions, sharing information about yourself.
And you know, that's what got you to hear.
But it's so important that you remember you like, it is not an overnight thing.
(20:33):
It's not.
It's no quick fix.
There's no quick fix.
It was like, think of like being on a beach and like body surfing and getting cracked in
the head, 87,000 times with a wave.
And then just getting back up.
And I really struggled.
I mean, I've probably been depressed my entire life, but having that much happen in such a
(20:57):
short period of time, literally crushed myself.
What I change it?
No, because I wouldn't be where I am today.
Sometimes you have to go through some really hard shit so that you can find your true past.
You know what else you have to do?
(21:17):
You have to sit in that shit.
Yeah.
And sitting in it is so big.
And there's no like I said, there's no easy button, but I get to be like through south.
I get to be vulnerable.
I'm still an empaths.
I'm still an extrovert.
But I will say when all the shit went down in November of 2024, this time I didn't keep
(21:41):
it silent like everybody knew where I stood.
Not only here at home, but also social media.
I worked with like, you could only hide restroom bitch face for so long before they tell you
to come off camera.
It was so funny during that time, not funny, but like, I guess it was kind of funny that you
(22:03):
would get off these calls and then you'd get on a call with me and be like, they all saw
my bitch face.
Like, you could see it from space.
It was so prominent.
I couldn't get away from it.
I couldn't get away from it, but I felt so proud of myself that I knew where I had been and
where I was now and that I could be honest about my emotions and that people would understand.
(22:28):
Have I lost some friends in this process?
Yes.
But you know what?
There's a reason in the season for friendship.
But at the same time, I took my little podcast shit and it goes, "Hell, I'm going to
go on our heads with dirty skills."
And we were able to over mask a million downloads in December of 20, 20th work and we're
(22:54):
listening to an over 60 tonne each.
It's just amazing what you've been doing.
You're an East like this and telling our stories have a ripple effect.
And I hope that I can, I hope my story touches somebody else's life and knows that they're
not alone and that they are worth it.
And that will and flimmer of hope.
(23:17):
Hope should make that full call.
Like I said, "My N88 is free.
You can call, you can text.
This people are amazing."
Yeah.
There, you know, look, there are less to be learned through everything that we go through,
right?
Like the good stuff, the bad stuff, you know, we can't avoid both sides of it.
(23:38):
It's life.
It doesn't matter whether, you know, you're dealing with your own mental illness or someone
else's or you've lost a job or you're, you know, you're grieving someone or something.
Like the things that you and I talk about and the things that you and I have been through
are things that like everybody.
If you are a human, you are touched in some way by these things.
(24:03):
So why in the hell are we not all talking about all these things all the time?
That's the point.
What we're doing here.
I'm sad.
And, you know, people are like, you're so crazy to be doing another podcast.
Well, you know what, we're still doing shit that goes on our heads because we, in that
podcast, we talk with different individuals that are going through some mental health journey
(24:29):
or have got through some really crappy stuff.
But I wanted to do a podcast that really focused on suicide, not only from a survivor,
but from an attempt, a suicide attempt plan view.
Because it's our stories that usually get shamed and are not heard and need to be heard.
(24:52):
Now more than ever, these stories need to be fair.
And we need, we need to come together as a community and help each other.
There's things, times are really tough and just like one other thing to touch on is the
LGBTQIA+ tunity.
(25:14):
I know we're all suffering, but please know that there are crisis lines like the Trevor
Hawaid 9/8.
There are resources out there.
The world needs you.
They cannot shut us up.
They can't.
And I think that's a perfect opportunity for you and I to talk about, there's so much intersectionality
(25:35):
with the two of us and what we do.
We have this intersection of mental health challenge that we both had to navigate and
suicide, loss and grief.
We're both part of the queer community.
I am a crisis counselor for the Trevor Project and we are a marginalized community right
(25:55):
now.
There are so many marginalized communities out there, but you and I happen to be part of
the LGBTQ community and that's, you know, we're getting hit into the head and to the gut
every, you know, every single day now.
So if you're listening and you're part of our community, not just the survivor's community
but the queer community, like we are here for you.
(26:17):
We are there to show you the way, help you connect to the resources that you need because
you're not alone.
You are not alone.
And we can't wait to talk to you guys next week and thank you all for tuning in and please
remember, you are enough, you are needed, you are wanted in this world.
(26:38):
You help reach out.
Hey, man, love you, gee.
I mean, we are whatever your name is.
Jack.
Well, love you, Jack.
Bob, just call me Bob from now on.
Okay.
Thanks for joining us on the survivors.
For no matter how tough things feel, you are enough and the world means you're just the
(26:59):
way you are.
You're not alone in this journey.
There's a community here and every step forward counts.
We're so grateful you took the time to listen and we hope they'll take one day at a time.
Just know there's always more light ahead.
Thanks for being here friends.
Just remember, help is out there in so many different places.
So if you or someone you know is struggling, please call 988 and a trained crisis counselor
(27:22):
like me will be there to help.
You can also find an inclusive and comprehensive directory of mental health resources, tools,
and content at the help hub dot CEO.
Just remember that help is always just a call or a click away.
We'll catch you next week.
In the meantime, keep surviving.
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